The Ringer NBA Show - The Most Intriguing Players at the Trade Deadline. | Group Chat

Episode Date: January 29, 2026

Justin, Rob, and J. Kyle Mann are back to take a look at the most intriguing players ahead of next week’s trade deadline. (00:00) Intro(2:22) Giannis Antetokounmpo(15:09) Michael Porter Jr.(27:19) Nic Claxton(34:20) Joel Embiid (43:02) Simone Fontecchio(46:59) Coby White(55:29) Robert Williams III Hosts: Justin Verrier, Rob Mahoney, and J. Kyle Mann Producers: Victoria Valencia and Isaiah Blakely Production Supervision: Ben Cruz and Conor Nevins Additional Production Support: John Richter and Chris Wohlers Social: Isaiah Blakely and Keith Fujimoto The Ringer is committed to responsible gaming. Please visit ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠www.rg-help.com⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ to learn more about the resources and helplines available. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hello and welcome to group chat. I am Justin Barry. You're joining me, Rob Mahoney and Jay Kyle Mann. A bit of an unplanned absence on Sunday. We took the podcast off. Obviously, I think everything going on in Minneapolis, we were pretty upset and disgusted by what happened out there. And I think we had unfortunately planned a pretty silly episode. We were going to draft mid players. And it just didn't feel like that was appropriate, given, all the situation going on there. And with the snow coming for Kyle, I think the timing didn't work out. So we apologize for not being around on Sunday. I think people expect us to be there no matter what happens. And I take that responsibility pretty seriously, but obviously circumstances beyond our control. Let us take that one out. Yes.

But look, the mid-player's draft will resume at some point. I would only hope, Justin, right? I think so. I mean, it was tied specifically to the midpoint of the NBA season. And as we were actually kind of plotting this out, I was like, what are we actually going to talk about? Because the whole bit is these guys are just fine. Like, they're just okay players.

That's why we were doing it. And I just don't know what to say about just okay players. But I guess we'll find out at a later day. We're not at all. To be determined. Yeah. Just sort of a mid theme. Yeah.

I think inevitably we were going to be creating bulletin board material for certain players. That's what I was imagining was me being. a player and listening to that. What? You know, I could just, it seems like an inherently insulting exercise for players. So I don't know. I was excited to provide that motivation for somebody. Look at you.

You mentioned Hunter Dickinson and I had to look him up. To find out what, Ross. Yeah, that's the thing. Like, what's the difference between mid and bad? Oh, it's a wide chasm. Yeah. I think it's like a no, if you see it sort of thing. I think it's like pornography.

See, now we're getting into an episode we're not even doing today. So let's table all mid-related discussions because we're going to have these definitional debates at some point. That's right. Well, why don't we take a break when we come back? We'll do today's episode. So I woke up this morning and my neck hurt. And so for the next four to six weeks, I might be out of this podcast. But much like Janus in that regard.

But unlike Janus, I'm not ready for a new home, which is what we found out today from Sean Serania. I'm 10 toes down, baby, all the way in Portland. until the mortgage rates drop. I got to say, that was a long walk. From your pains to your home to Janus to wanting a new location. Yeah, it was a meander, but we got there. So today was the first kind of step.

There was a dog next to me. We got the first, I will call it a baby step toward Janus, I think, eventually leaving Milwaukee. We were all waiting for this. Shams is recording this on Wednesday morning. drop this about like 9 a.m. Pacific on Wednesday. So if you're tracking this at home, because I do think, I have two thoughts here, actually. I think one, this is just so silly that we're getting this whole like half step of like, oh, well, now they might start listening or

they're ready to start listening. I've started picturing in my head like John horse waving the Indianapolis 500 flag. And then all of a sudden these guys take off their noise canceling headphones ready to listen finally after two years in the dark. My second take here is that I actually think that this is important. And if anything, this seems like the first step of what is an inevitability, but is actually just a PR framing in order to make it seem like both parties are on the same page and everybody divorces happily as possible. So this non-update update, do you think is an actual update? Yeah, because the way this usually works is they're giving Shams the break, the news break. so that he will frame it in a certain way.

And so I imagine, much like we've seen with Wojj in past years, be like really going step by step to make sure that this is like everyone on the same page sort of thing, but then Windhorst is on the side being like, no, it's actually done what the fuck are you talking about? This is very reminiscent of that. And so I actually think that this is more of a point, like a point into the chart, I guess, of the inevitable conclusion.

I'm pretty fascinated by said chart because I'm trying to imagine something with a dial that has very small, you know, lines of increments that as we were just kind of turning it towards. I'd just be appreciative if someone would like map that out. Maybe that's something we can do for social. You know, we're thinking about being ready to listen. You know, what's the next sort of small step beyond that? I'm with you though, JVA. I can't remember if it was the other day. What was the story that you said you were really annoyed by?

and I acted all high and mighty like it didn't even roll. It was a Janus. Yeah, it was a Janus-related thing, but I can't remember what that development was. I can't either, but we've gotten versions of this before. This is the first close to definitive, like sort of framing that we've seen because he is, in quotes, at least from Shams, ready for a new home, which is different, even though marginally so. It's true. And I think it's also reflecting a difference in if not actual opinion and stance than projection. from the Milwaukee buck side as well, where everything from the bucks to this point has been, we would never trade Janus unless he basically asks us for a trade to now, you know,

being ready to potentially hypothetically listen. That's something. Yeah. What you say and what you feel being two key different things, right? What you say being the respect that you want to pay to Janus for all the years and all the things. And the internal, the systems running below the surface are like, we got to do something here or else we're going to be in a really tough situation. And then, I mean, I would assume that's what it's all kind of driven by is the posturing, right?

I mean, it just all has seemed like that. Like, Janus just not really wanting to betray. I think we talked about this a couple of months ago about, you know, everything, everything about everything about this that would require, that would be required of him to, you know, nudge his way out the door, would require him to sort of contradict everything that his brand as a player has been built on, right? And it's just like, we're always like, Janus says the right thing, salt of the earth, consummate teammate, locker room guy, plays the right way, things like that.

For him to do this, it just would be, it would cause him to sort of go the other direction and behave the way superstars have behaved in the way in the, I guess, in the decision era, right? Which it's just not been his brand at this point. No. I mean, look, life is posturing in a lot of ways, but so much about this, Kyle, you're right, is like, what are the steps that need to be taken so I can actually ask for the thing that I want? without people thinking I'm an asshole for it. And that's apparently been a long process for Janus.

You can see him almost like waffling in real time based on some of even like post-game quotes or like moments of frustration. And I would hope that there's some clarity in this, in his current injury and where the bucks are. Like there is not a resolution to this season that's going to make those parties feel great about where everything stands.

So it makes sense to kind of kick the tires and take some calls and figure out what else might be out there. I also took note that, within the report, it specifically outlines that this could happen in the offseason or at the deadline. So they're keeping open the possibility for both windows. If it does happen at the deadline, which I think we would all probably agree is a little bit trickier, if only because teams are already built, the money's already stacked in a certain way and it's just hard to unspool at that point. Is there any team that you guys like at the front of the line now that the doors are at the

very least like a little bit of crack open? Yeah. I don't love any of the deadline options for exactly that reason. Like I want to open the derby to everybody involved because I think the most interesting Yonis teams are some that are like a little counterintuitive or teams that are already quite good that could completely reimagine who they are around Yonis. And they're just not going to do that with so little left to play in the regular season and everything already in progress. So that's why like the summer outcome feels a lot more likely to me, not just from those teams wanting to get in the race, but for Milwaukee, like that's the way you drum up interest. That's the way you get a competitive market going, that's the way you don't beat Nico Harrison and just talk to

one team and take the first deal that's put in front of you. Yeah, I think that there are some interesting things in play here is that if you're thinking short term and you're thinking, we need Janus, like right now, because desperation obviously is going to motivate some people to do this, there is the calf thing. I mean, and however much you believe in that, I don't know if you guys have an opinion medically on where he is with that, that increasingly becomes a more and more serious thing because if you throw the kitchen sink at this guy who I know bucks fans are always fighting about you guys are wishing his life away he's I'm like okay he's on the well can we at least agree that he's on the other side of his prime on the way like you know he's over 30 and the way

he plays I'm not trying to like you know march him towards the grave or anything saying this I'm just saying he he he's on the downward side I would say of his prime so if you're gonna if you're gonna trade for him you got to keep that in mind the severity and the seriousness of that Achilles does seem like it's going around. Just my last thing on this. But the other thing that I think is interesting, for me, you're talking about teams disrupting what they do. My mind goes to desperate teams more.

And I think about the Warriors. And I think about the Warriors, those 2030 picks, to me, if this is just going to be one last push for them and then they explode, those 2030 picks seem pretty interesting to be if I'm the box. Entirely fair. I just want to push back on one point, is Janice, when he has been on the floor, has been exceptional this season.

I'm not saying he's not. I'm just saying we're projecting. You have to think about these things, Rob. The injuries, I think, are mounting over the past few years. This being his second calf strain, I've taken note of that. He plays so hard that it really is the defining characteristic of his game. Yeah.

I just think in terms of framing what his prime is and will be, I don't, look, the facts are what they are. By age, by injury, his story. Yes, all of those things would seem to suggest that he would be like tipping over into the next stage of his prime. And yet as he does it, he's having his most efficient season to date and has looked dominant every second he's been on the floor. So it's like even a post prime, Janus, if that's what we're in like in line for or what his next team is in line for, pretty fucking awesome player. Yeah, I think I agree with what everyone's saying. And I do think the motivating factors point toward just one team right now.

And that's the team that we were talking about over the off season as the only team that got the phone call, which is the New York. Knickerbockers. They've been better recently, sort of. They won three straight games as we're recording this. But I just think the forces that would have stopped them from really pushing forward on this no longer exist, in part because Carl Anthony Towns is just not the type of guy that, like, it seems like they even want a round let alone like covet as like a critical essential part of what they're doing there. Plus, uh, Dolan going out there being like, we need to make the finals and we expect certain things. Like all of these things point to the Knicks. I also took great interest. And I'm going to prep you in advance. I'm going to talk about the Portland Trail Blazers here. But if you,

if you follow some of the newsy folks out there, Mark Stein in particular, they have started to pinpoint the Blazers as a potential third team in this, in part because they own- I thought you were going to pitch like a Tumani for Yonis straight up. No, I mean, the Blazers would need more. Yeah. Value for value. But because they own a lot of the Buck's future picks, could they get involved? And there's some suggesting, like maybe the Knicks are interested in Drew and Bridges gets rerouted to Portland and some of the Bucks future picks go back to Milwaukee. That makes more sense to me because I never understood it from Milwaukee's point of view. Why would you want Bridges, an OG, or even a cat if you're thinking long term?

You want more future assets. You don't want a pretty good current asset. And so triangulating those three things, like I took note of that. That seems a little more specific than you would get at this stage. Well, this is what we're going to learn, hopefully over these next couple weeks as just even these conversations or listening sessions intensify is what is it that the bucks want? Because I agree with you in theory. They should be taking a longer view, right? They should be looking to do more of a hard reset, invest in young prospects, take chances on guys while the opportunity is there to do it.

I have a sneaking suspicion that might not be the way they go. And it may be a little bit more of like a middle tier veteran near all star level kind of return for them. where they look to be at least pretty good in the interim. And to be fair, like, they could be pretty good in the East still, even without Yonis. If they reshuffle and get good players in return who are ready to go, that might be enough to kind of keep them in the mix, not what I would do. But I could see, especially like an Eastern Conference middle of the pack team talking themselves into that.

Yeah, I think I'm not doing, I'm not threatened it in the middle at all. I don't think, I would feel pretty dissatisfied if I'm a Bucks fan, if we went through all of that. And then we end up with someone that basically his past two teams have been chronically unhappy with with Kat. It's a guy who has just been finicky. And for basketball, he'll look brilliant at one point and then just make you want to pull your hair out the next moment.

You know, and I guess was Bridges the other person. The money there wouldn't make any sense there. And that's, I haven't talked to my Cohen. Yeah. But that's why you need kind of third team involvement to make something like that kind of makes sense.

And I gotta say, Justin, your Blazers do, like, fit that particular bill. They have a good combination of, like, veterans on deals who could move, young players who might be interesting if you want to even expand the deal further. Like, they could be a way station for a lot of different kinds of trades. Yeah, it's unfortunate. I tried to avoid them in our picks for today's episode. But they really do hit all the boxes of a team that, like, probably wants to compete in the here and now, but has all of these different parts that they could either keep or not keep. And it really comes down to preference and choice.

And I unfortunately picked one. So just to prep you in advance for that. I was going to ask you if this segues into what we're doing here today because it seems like inevitably it would. Yeah. Well, let's get to it then. We are doing today our most intriguing players at the trade deadline. We'll get to the teams on Sunday. But we're talking about players that are just interesting to us at this stage about a week out from the February 5th trade deadline.

So it doesn't necessarily have to be the biggest names on the market. We don't have to talk about Anthony Davis for the 19th time, although we can, you guys want. Mine is way off the board. So I think I should go last. We're each going to do like a high profile player and then a less high profile player. Rob, do you want to start with yours? Yeah, I will start high profile with Michael Porter Jr.

A player who I think we all agreed, right, had penciled in for our All-Star team, has had an amazing season for the Nets. And I think it's interesting for a couple of reasons. One, because he has been that good and has taken steps forward. and is kind of ready for a middle ground role where he's doing maybe more than he was for the Nuggets, but less than he is for the Nets.

That could be appealing to a great number of contenders, I would think. But also because Brooklyn finds themselves in a pretty weird spot right now, where the bottom of the league feels catchable in terms of the draft odds for the Brooklyn Nets. And, Kyle, I would love to get your take on this because right now Brooklyn has the fifth best odds to get the number one pick.

my understanding is that this is a draft where the top fourish guys for sure are real catches, maybe five. And is there a bit of a drop after that? Or where do you see kind of the drop in prospects between the first tier and the second tier in this draft? There's been a lot of argument recently about how firm the tippy top tier is, whether or not. I think people are pretty sure that it includes Darren Peterson and Camboozer. There's been a lot of argument recently about DeBanza. But I think that's, I mean, that's a little more.

in the weeds granular. But I think in terms of getting something that could potentially affect the direction of a franchise or just be a high-impact asset, draft player, a draftable player, that line, I think, is hazy, which is really interesting. Like, I think the top of this draft, there are teams that are going to come away with really, really good players, I think, even in the top 10. Like, it's very, very strong. There have been some guys who have come on.

If the Nets even end up in the 7 to 10 range, 7 to 12 range, They could come away with a really impactful player, I think. I was thinking the other day, whenever you all asked me about draft names, I could just, I was contemplating just saying like Bobson-Dugnud or just something, just make it like, because when we get into these, I start talking and I just see you guys nodding. It's a wing from Toledo. I mean, for one, I love Bobson-Dug-Nut, you know.

That's my kind of guy. But honestly, they need that kind of player. Because part of the problem here for the NIC is, they need a Bobson-Dug-N-Nut type, just a real, blue chipper. The Nets don't have possession of their pick next year, right? They owe it in a swap to the Rockets, which I would think. Yeah, in 27, I should say. And so, like, this is kind of the draft pick that they need to use and capitalize on. And so with that, I think there's kind of the dual urgency of who out there is desperate enough and intrigued enough in what MPG has put

together this season as an all-around score, as a creator, even as like a passer, has just been a really effective player across the board. And then how desperate are the Nets going to be? to potentially bottom out in a way that could ensure their ability to get a bobs and dugnut type, to ensure their ability. This is one of those things where we talk about the flat draft odds all the time in terms of what it means for the number one pick. But there's a huge difference in odds if you are the worst record in the league versus the third or fourth in where your bottom is, right? And where the floor of where you will select is? And if you can ensure, I mean, it's planted here all the time.

I'm a very grounded person, Justin. I don't know if you know this about me. But, like, anything the Nets can do to protect themselves from falling out of that elite range, wherever they deem it to be, I think they should investigate. I can just see Kyle processing. No, I just like, I was just processing Rob's quippy answer per usual. And then I was like, what motivated Justin to ask where's your bottom?

Well, you already know what motivated him. He's a man with one thing on the mind at all times. I'm all about the bottoms. So here's my thing with the Nets. I think for a while we were fretting over if they were tanking hard enough. But then the New Year happened and all of a sudden they're like, nah, we got this. Michael Porter Jr. has still been pretty solid overall and it hasn't mattered at all.

Last night's game against the sun, I think was the shining example of it where things got a little messy. At the end, there was like an almost fight, but like watching them trying to create an open look for him on a crucial crunch time possession was just a total mess. they have won just two games since December 29th, and they've won just one game since January 4th. And so I find myself because of the restrictions on next year that there is this weird, like, almost gap year

where they do need to land a pick now and not later, I think they've at the very least created leverage for themselves where they don't have to trade porter, if only because they need something for this draft pick next year and whatever they can scrap together and for agency. It is true. I would just say this, that tanking season, has only just begun, right?

Like the shenanigans in which these teams are really fighting for the bottom spots in the standings, like, we've barely even begun to scratch the surface of what the Utah Jazz are capable of. So you really have to be careful if you're the Nets to just not fall out of that range of, again, it's just

wherever their scouting department thinks that line is between the best prospects and the other ones. But I think there's a real opportunity for them here to get good stuff in return for Michael Porter Jr., a guy who is a definitive helpful player right now, but also not old by any means, but distinctly older than whatever the rest of their core is, and kind of figure out and crystallize around the 2026 pick,

whatever the return for MPJ could be, and whichever of the rookies that they currently have that you like the best between, you know, Yeager and everyone else, what ultimately, like, the basis of the Nets next effective Nets team is going to be? I think what we're looking at when we look at the Nets, I always use the roadmap, kind of comparison of, you know, as a franchise, you want that player that is going to define your map. Like, most, most teams are just kind of when they're not winning, they're wandering in the wilderness. And then you get a Cooper flag and you're like, okay, we have our map now. We kind of know the direction or what we need to build around.

It's a big pod for charts and maps, I got to say. Just topography, huge on this pod, you know, like we're really routing ourselves. Taking Goldsbury's corner. Yeah. Come up as Kirk. I'm just lobbing this one to Kirk. Yeah, I just think that if we look at the Nets, and I was thinking about Camp Thomas, too, which is always a harrowing exercise in and of itself.

But I was thinking about Camp Thomas, and I'm like, I think I'm one of the best scores in the league. I'm paid like $5.5 million. You know, it just seems like they have some guys that they're lacking direction in terms of, if we're just looking at on the court what they need. Somebody does it stir the drink and be a threat off the bounce as a score? Would you say that can also pass? Is that kind of what we're saying? because Porter Jr. is sort of an accessory that you tie on to somebody who can create

offense and draw gravity, right? We know we can make shots off the dribble. Don't necessarily want him making decisions all the time. So it's like there are some guys in this draft to give you some homework, but just really quickly here. I mean, there's Kingston Fleming's from Houston, and there's Keaton Wogler, these guys who have just gone off. Those are two capable candidates that could come in for them and play. But I just wanted to ask you guys, I mean, do you all think that that's what they're lacking? Is it just a approach? a typical idea of a star or is it a specific skill set like that? Like they need somebody who can be a playmaking heavy load decision maker. I just think they need a North Star overall. And I just

don't necessarily. Yeah, I just don't necessarily think that MPJ is that, but I think you're right. I think he's like a good two or three on an already established team. And so for a team like the Pistons, I think the spurs would make sense as something of Harrison Barnes upgrade. I do think that makes a natural swap there because if you get someone, I think the problem with the team like the Nets or any of these teams that are projected to go high in the lottery is you don't want to step on the possibility of what you can get in the draft. You don't want to put yourself into a position where it's like, oh, I have MPJ or I traded for something else. For instance, we talked about the Wizards with Zion, but all of a sudden there's a perfect four. And then, oh, no, we have to

like push them over to the three and like force them to do that. Basically what happened with Cooper flag. And so for the Nets, I would be trained. trying to clear the decks, I think, overall and just provide that player with as much of an open roadway as possible. Yeah, I think they can be open-minded to your conversation here, Kyle, about what that player looks like. There really is nothing in terms of the rookies that they've drafted. Like, guys have popped at different times.

You know, you've obviously had, like, some good moments from Yeager. Drake Powell, finally getting some opportunity is nice. Like, Danny Wolf, in whatever capacity you envision him being an NBA player in the grand scheme of things, like, has impressed. I think, I think as far as, like, a potential contributor to this Nets team, but isn't going to be setting the stage or defining things in the way we're talking about. But you're right, Justin, it's like, as far as the market, I think that's where the conversation gets interesting.

Like, who are the MPJ teams? You mentioned Detroit. You mentioned San Antonio. Milwaukee, I think the Yonah stuff probably rules it out. Maybe there was a pipe dream at some point, but I think we can kind of cross them off the board at this point. Golden State probably doesn't have the same urgency to try. trade for someone like MPJ now that they did before Jimmy's injury. But we've also seen teams

over the last, I don't know, two seasons or so invest in the idea of like, we're going to trade now for the guy that we really need next season and just kind of like make our big move now as opposed to the off season. Maybe the Warriors see themselves as that kind of team. But this is my turn to put on my flannel and to welcome the Portland Trailblazers into this conversation. Because I got to say, I feel like there is a vision of a trade involving like Shaden Sharp going to the Nets and MPJ coming back to the Blazers. And the contract stuff gets tricky because I think Jeremy Grant would have to be involved. And that almost necessitates a third team that would give the Blazers something.

Because Jeremy Grant, while maybe not worth exactly what he's paid, is still a good and useful NBA player. And they would need something in return for that beyond just getting MPJ. But I kind of like what he could be for the Blazers. I like the idea of that kind of space, like a real big time shot maker alongside all of this length and activity and defense that they have at their disposal. Literally anybody who could make an open three-point? It would be nice.

Yeah. I like it in theory. It makes them a little big on the wings. And I can't decide whether or not that's a good or bad thing because it would necessitate that they play MPJ, Denny, and Tumani basically at two through four. I think you could run some interesting small ball units. And I think that they started to do so earlier in the season. But now Denny has a back injury.

And so that complicates things. I don't hate it, but I don't love it. For what they're going to target, I think they need shooting on a lower end as a rotation player, not as like the big swing is what I would say for them. I mean, that really is the pause. If you are the Blazers, when do you take that big calculated risk?

And is MPJ the kind of player you do that for? I think he's earned a place in that consideration. Like having this talk, throwing the things at the wall, seeing what sticks. I don't know that I would have anticipated for that when he left the nuggets, that he would ever become this caliber of player. But it's what makes him such a target at the deadline.

It's what makes him so appealing to so many different potentially winning teams. I think it's what makes him, like ultimately the kind of target that a front office can talk itself into because of what he brings to the table that's like so exceptional in such a specific way. All right. Do we want to move along to your pick, Kyle? I was going to say we need to, you know, release. Denny, Denny's poor back from carrying too much so that he doesn't get overburdened and punked by Keishon George, right?

Oh, I know. That's a tough one. You hate to see it. And by hate us, we love to see it. You don't go back into DC and just get a win, you know? It's a tough time. The fact that I could gain ground in our now ongoing Blazers versus Sun's bed, while the Wizards get a huge win via Keishon George against the Blazers,

I mean, just one of the happiest days in my life, if I'm being honest with you. And then you watch the Suns almost lose to the Nets. Almost being the key word. Oh, God, here we go. Kyle, funny, funnily enough here, I'm sticking with the Nets. I think that Nick Claxton is an interesting player. That's who I was going to bring up. So he's your high.

This is your high profile? I don't know what that says about me or what I value, but Nick Clackson is a really fucking good player, man. He's good. No, I mean, now listen to me, God damn it. I think when you look at across the scope of the league, I think we get drawn to the types of guys that I was describing forward that give us our maps, our star players who are scoring and drawing gravity

and being efficient in their decision-making and things like that. But I think guys that check multiple boxes are really, really important to bolster those types of players. And I think that I don't think that's a radical idea at all. And I just don't think that there are many guys across the league who provide, A, the vertical spacing, lob threat, it's the hoity-to-oity way of saying lob threat, the defensive versatility, and then the passing.

I don't think that you're getting a ton of guys who do those things. This year, Claxton, not a big time score, but he's somebody you don't have to run anything for. He's somebody that just accumulates baskets, but he gives you playmaking in the short role. Four assists per game this year for a guy of his defensive versatility is pretty wild.

One point four blocks and seven and a half rebounds, just an efficient dude who knows who he is. I wanted to kind of just throw this conversation to you guys about, you know, I'm looking at the teams. The Warriors get brought up a lot. People were talking about them. I was like, I don't really think, I don't understand why I would do that if I'm the Warriors. But if I'm the Lakers, I would be really trying hard to get Nick Claxton because I think it jumps to this question also that shoots off of this. What would it take for you to consider getting off of Austin Reeves?

And do you see a future of if we're building around Luca, we did all, we did all. moved heaven and earth to get Luca. What types of players would you want to surround him with? Claxton, to me, feels like a perfect pairing with Luca Donchich. Does he rise to the level of an Austin Reeves, though? I throw to you all. No, he does not. I think pretty definitively, you would have to get a lot more back than just Nick

Claxton. But as a starting point, I love the concept. Justin, are you on board with Nick Claxton as the Los Angeles Laker? Yeah, I would say I am a Nick Claxton optimist overall, because watching him move so fluidly around the court as his size is just like something to behold. And I do feel like there's another level to his offensive game that isn't tapped because he just hasn't been playing with a lot of creators since he started in the league with with Kyrie and those guys. Unfortunately, I just find like because he's so slender and it doesn't feel like he's ever going to bulk up

to the point where he's like beyond that, you do have to marry him with another big in a rotation because he does get pushed around at times. and I do feel like there's some big old boys in the Western Congress in particular. And so if you're the Lakers and you're thinking like, oh, this is going to push us forward. Well, it's like the rockets are out there. Obviously, Yokic is out there. The thunder are very physical. And so for that reason, it's kind of a sticking point.

So it's like if it's Claxton, it's fine. But I need Claxton plus somebody else in order to make it work. And for that reason, I pause at the very least. But I like it just like in terms of a fit with Luca. This is kind of the roadblock you run into with the Lakers, too, where if you want to like just completely turn over their front court. How do you do that when LeBron is still a part of it and playing well? And we don't really know what his future is going to be.

And so it's like he's kind of locked in at the four effectively. Like they can pretend. They can try to plug in other players at that position ostensibly. But that is what it is until further notice. And LeBron Nick Claxton front court for this season is not bad, but is that the kind of alt, is that the athleticism and the size and the physicality that you want at that position. I think that's asking a lot of LeBron. Yeah. Well, I mean, just speaking to the Claxton, the idea of Claxton leaving the nets in general, I mean, do you all think that he's

somebody, let's say they just stand pat, they trade an MPJ? I mean, Claxton would interface pretty well with the types of guys that I was describing that they would be targeting in the draft. He'd be somebody that came in. If you had a guy, let's say you just somehow, you strike gold and you get a Darren Peterson. I watched a ton of Darren Peterson this past weekend. I mean, just seems like he's somebody that it's going to be phenomenal toggling between being on the ball, making decisions, and then toggling off the ball as a movement shooter. He's great. I recommend you go watch him if you haven't. But he's somebody that would, I think, click right into place with the Claxton.

I always think of the Robin Big, the Clack of Claxton. Did you guys watch Robin Big at all? Robin Big fans here. What are you talking about, Kyle? That's a no? That's a hard. I'm completely in the dark. I don't even know what genre of thing you are referencing.

The public will side with me on this. I know they will. Anyway, another thing. There's going to some more homework. But, no, I mean, do you think that they, is he somebody that they're going to decide to keep is kind of my question, ultimately? Well, it's funny. I think it's funny you mentioned Peterson because as I was scrolling through the teams in my head, I was like, oh, Memphis with Jha actually has a nice little synergy. I think actually Claxton's from the Carolina.

So vaguely from the same region. Is that kind of the same region? No, like originally from like Georgia or I know he went to college at Georgia. If he's from the fucking Carolina, I'm going to like get a like a noise maker here and just you just want to get one over on me so bad, right? Yeah. Yeah, you're right. Greenville, South Carolina. You got me.

Let's fight George go. George on the brain. Which for the record is not Memphis, but George on my mind. Well, where is Jha from? Jaws from South Carolina. Okay, there you go. So there's a couple of South Carolina boys. saying you motherfuckers he's he doubted good over there look at that guy i knew where a couple

NBA players were from congratulations uh but no but like jaw having that sort of like short lob thing that he does where he stops right from the pain lofts it up like classing can go up and and get it for them i don't know what they would give up for that but there's some synergy there and like is ja going to still be in memphis i don't know but for that reason i think peterson makes some sense different different uh sort of broadly same types peterson is better than Jah. I just want to be on going the record. He will be better. Right now you're saying? Love that take. He will be better than John Moran. Yeah. I don't think that's controversial at all.

I can't wait to see it. I look forward to getting to know these guys as actual players in the future. But for now, I find the same problem in the Claxon that we've had for, I don't know, four years running, which is he's a very appealing player to a lot of different contexts. And he has been a Brooklyn net that entire time. Despite, I would think, some pretty powerful motivation on their part to move him. You know, like there has to be some. offer that has come through Brooklyn that is enticing. And yet, apparently not enticing enough. Nick Clarkson simply cannot be moved.

I think he's going to end up as their Miles Turner. We're going to put him in trade rumors for the next decade. And then all of a sudden, he's going to have one good year and then go to a different team. Yep. And he can be moved on the court, thus he can't be moved off the court, right? Interesting thing going on here. I like what you did. Thanks.

All right. Let's go to mine who might be literally unmovable, at least in terms of of trades. I don't know if you guys have seen the Philadelphia 76ers of late, but they look pretty sprightly. There's a lot going on there. And as a result, I think it's time to trade Joel and Bede because I can't imagine. What are you doing? His trade value being any higher than it is right now, he catches a lob and to the amusement of everybody, including Embedde maybe first and foremost. like everyone was just fucking thrilled with it I thought at that time at that moment

Darrymori picks up the phone and starts calling around being like you seen him be lately Mori right when that play happened just said hey Siri yeah loudly I just did my trigger my own Siri you call Rob Polinka listen I know it's tough but he's playing pretty well

yes but if you're the six years you're like this is a ticking time bomb his leg might explode at any moment. I think at the very least, he could be in a discussion. I think you have to entertain this. If Barrow-Mory called your organization, you actually have to think about it for a while. Well, where is the line? Like, what is the best team that has to think about it?

Who's the pitch, Justin? You got somebody in mind. Hit me. I have four down here. Okay. Four. Well, here's the thing. Like, would you just trade him to clear the decks, I think, is ultimately.

the question. If the Raptors, for instance, called you and said, we'll give you Pertle, who has five years on his deal, and he's also dealing with a back injury. So this is a similarly injured center just at a different level. R.J. Barrett, just to make the math work, and just like a sweetener, like just another guy, Faji, you're clearing and Bede, we're just taking on the risk for the next four years. Are you interested? I'm open to it. I think the problem we're going to run into is even with everything going on with Embed as far as the persistent injury risk, the massive

contract, which as you said extends three more seasons beyond this one, he's still more hypothetically useful to them than the risk would justify on the other side of a deal. And so it's like, I'm almost loathe to give him up for just that. But at the same time, at the same time

maybe it would be prudent to do it. It's just hard to do. The Sixers are fun to watch, man. I put him on my league pass thing. when we talked about it. And I felt like people were like, I don't know, it's been stewing.

It's been slowly, I mean, PG's looking a little sprightly to steal your word. I mean, it's like back from the dead, the necromancer took a swoop over Philly. I don't know what happened. Kyle,

you should have heard the crickets when I tried to advocate for moving Paul George up our top 100 rankings in the meeting. And it was just like, I would love to have overheard that. I could not whip votes to get Paul George to move up, unfortunately. But he has been good. It's just the fact.

It was from like 97 to like 92. It wasn't a big job. Well, I have a couple other teams down here. Let me see if this, like, what's your appetite even more. So the Knicks, a team he's long been rumored to. Sure. It doesn't work as a straight one for once.

You'd have to attach, like, a little something just to make the math work. But Embed for Towns, who says no? I think the Knicks say no. I just think Brunson and Embed might be fundamentally incompatible. Yeah. Would it be the slowest, pace since like the Detroit Pistons in 2004? It might well.

Like really glacial stuff ultimately. Very, very methodical, very considered. A lot of like jab steps and pump fakes involved. But I don't, I just don't think they would work well together. Yeah. I mean, I think that's a Drew Hanlon's dream. A lot of pump fakes, a lot of jabs, a lot of stepbacks. I just, I don't, I think it's a version.

It's a sort of a basketball facsimile of what they already have, like you were saying. In my mind, I was like, okay, let's trade our mercurial up and down, you know, unpredictable guy. I know those are, those are all words for the same thing for another mercurial guy who likes to shoot. I just think, I don't, I don't think I would pull the trigger on that one if I were the Knicks. And man, Carl Towns in Philly, I just can't imagine their fans turning it.

Can you imagine Rice to Ricky Sanchez going off? I would, I would be all over that list of that daily, but hearing them complain about cat. I have two more here. I'll just give you one of them, which I think is the most return value. and it's from the flippers. It's basically expirings. You get CP just so you can hang out with Daryl

and reminisce about the good old days like five to seven years ago. But Zubotch is really, it's Zubach for NB. Oh, if I were the Sixers, I would do that immediately. Yeah. Interesting.

If you can get Zubach, Collins, CP, and then there's another expiring. They have a lot of expiring money. I would do it right now. I think it's too much. Yeah.

Joel has been really good, but it's, again, it's always just like you're waiting for the floor to drop out from underneath you. And Zoo does not give you that feeling. You know,

he's like he's an imperfect player in certain ways, but ultimately quite reliable. And I think the Sixers, in terms of the broader mental health of the Philadelphia area, would stand to benefit from just like consistency at the five over the next three years. Do you want to throw away or do you want to send away

the one, like the one of the only sources of like warm blood flow in your defensive lineup if you're the clippers. I just don't think I'm doing that. If you imagine getting hardened and Embeddede together again on the court together. I just don't. I forgot about that. Why would I do that? It's compounding Kauai and Embed's injury issues together.

It's just like if two headaches just make a like a crippling migraine, I guess would be the case there. Like the odds of everyone being healthy at the right time are pretty low. But if you get that 777 on the slot, You know, like the jackpot cashes out just the same. See, this is why it's impossible because if we're saying Zubotch is too much, I don't know what sort of value in return you can get for a beat. Yeah.

I have Miami down just because they're in the mix for all of these distressed guys, Wiggins and Roseier. Again, just clearing the decks. Sure. You basically have whatever money left to do with whatever you want, I guess, just look at it. I'm down for like a Kolel-Ware, bam, Joelle front court. Wow. Let's just roll those guys out and see what happens.

But to be very clear, the reason we're talking about Joel and B this way, the injury history is a huge part of it. But like, that dude is owed like $60 plus million over the next three seasons. And it's like we've talked all year long about when you have guys who are making that kind of money who aren't available. It just drags your entire organization down. It's almost impossible to build something sustaining that way right now. 67.4 million dollar player option at the end there. I suspect he will take it. I think so as well.

I would take it if I were him. Yeah. Kyle, we weren't offering it to you. We weren't offering you $67 million. I'm sorry. All right. Let's take one more break and we come back. We'll do the lower level guys.

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Although, Kyle, I think we should start with you because I'm curious what your lower tier entails. So do you want to give us your second guy here? Can we just say before we hit these guys with lower level? Can we just say lower profile? No. They're worse overall. I mean, it's not untrue.

It just seems uncharitable. Lesser. Wow. Wow. The distance between those players and LeBron James is smaller than the distance between you and them, Justin. I just want to remind you of that. Just to quote, Scalibriini's famous quote, do you want me to hit you with my lower tier guys? I have a two-barter because I'm interested in the idea of swapping one for the other.

Okay. The first lower-tier player that I think is interesting is Simone Fontechio, who I think that the Miami Heat could afford to move on his salary. And I think that it would be interesting if they sent him to a team that could use some extra shooting with his size. And that's the San Antonio Spurs. Because the Spurs, I look this up, they generate a high number of spot-up opportunities, but they don't convert them at a high conversion rate. They're eighth in the league at spot-up opportunities and their 22nd and points per possession.

And I think that Jeremy Sohan is an interesting asset. So those are my two guys. I think Miami is the type of team that would look at Sohan, a guy who's not fitting into the log jam, the embarrassment of talent, riches that they have, and athleticism. And I think they'd view him as a prospect and think they can get a lot out of him. The age difference there, you could maybe argue that San Antonio would see him as maybe more valuable. But I think that swap makes a lot of sense, even as a framework starting point. What do you all think about that? I kind of like it.

I love it. I'll go one step farther. Yeah. I love it. I will say, as far as the San Antonio's spot-up stuff, I, I, I will say, as far as the San Antonio's spot-up stuff, I take your point. It's obviously true. I do think there's a bit of a complication there positionally. Because a lot of the reasons... Are you going to undermine my synergy stack grab? I'm going to put an asterisk on it and say...

It's sacred. Part of the reason those spotups are not converting is because they're going to like Dylan Harper. They're going to Seth Castle. Right. So it's like those are the shooters who are taking a lot of those opportunities, not the big tech types if you're going to import him on the wing. I'm glad you mentioned Sohan, though, because he showed up, I believe in Mark's Stein's newsletter recently. He did. And I think anyone, any fan of any team looked at that and like, let's get this guy. Because on the one hand, he does need to get paid. I believe he's going to restricted free agency this off season. But he just seems like the type of guy that would fit around any team, especially a team that has an abundance of shooting so that he could fit into that like

lower level Dremont role. But I thought he'd really popped playing bench minutes earlier in the season, just because he gives so much of a shit. Yeah. And if you can just start for, that base level and then pile on top some of the more nuanced stuff and like take advantage of some of his high feel and passing ability, I would love to take a risk on him. I think that he are probably right at the front of the line of that team, sort of like list of teams. I mean, this is an organization where Udana's Haslam is a patron saint, you know, like someone like a Jeremy Sohan type, although he doesn't have like the mid-range finesse that Haslam did, you would think could really appeal to their sensibilities. And I think the one issue with him in Miami present tense is

he doesn't really fit with their current style of offense, given that he can't really create in one-on-one situations basically at all. Like, he might be kind of a record scratch element that they would have to work around. But also, let's be real. They're running this offense because of the roster that they have. And as soon as that changes, Eric's Bolster will evolve accordingly. So if it's a good value deal and they like ultimately what Sohan could bring them, and I think there's reason to believe that they should.

Maybe you just take a swing and figure out the rest later. Sohan could play next to Calell where, too. But I think with the way Bam is shooting now, I think that makes sense as well. I just think it's interesting. What we're describing, though, I think could sort of allude to and reveal probably what the Spurs are thinking about his value. Because it's an interesting situation of they got lucky with some of their draft situations where they ended up getting more talent. Obviously, you get a gen or a guy who has like a goat arc like Wimby. I do want to talk about Wimby physically at some point.

He does not look right to me. but I just think that he's somebody that his eagerness and his willingness. Usually when you talk about these young guys that are on the move, you're like, well, if he gets his shit together an XYZ way, you know, so it's not like that. Like you all were saying, this is a guy that's going to come in and the odds of him improving and getting better are pretty good. So that might, Fontechio might not end up being the value for that, but I'd call it in today if I were there.

Yeah. Rob, do you want to do yours? I would like to talk about Kobe White. He's on my list, too. A very good NBA player who is due for a contract this summer, and the Chicago Bulls do not seem to want to pay him at all. And we should say I would assume we're also up for a contract this summer. Based on what we've read, it doesn't seem like the Bulls want to pay him either.

So I don't know what it is exactly that they're doing. But if you're not going to pay Kobe White, will this be the one time? And I mean the one time that this Bulls front office gets out in front of a problem before it actually manifests. I'm a little doubtful that that's the case. But maybe this, maybe there's a, enough urgency in this moment given the pay raise that White is due for for them to actually do

something for once. And if they do, I think he's a player of real consequence, especially with some of the Western Conference teams that could be on board to trade for him. Yeah, I'm glad you mentioned him. I considered him for the top tier because I just don't know how he fits in our little binary hierarchy we've established here. But it does feel like that they have kind of moved past him in some odd ways, despite the fact that he looked like their best player by the end of last season. He does seem to fit in particular what the wolves are looking for and what they've tried to get into Rob Dillingham. I don't know if they fit in terms of trade partners, though. I don't know what the rules would be able to send back because of how much they've given up

in draft capital over the years. But I think in terms of like a partner for Ant, I like that. I love the potential wolves fit. And yeah, that stuff has been out there. Like the dots are sort of being connected at this point between teams that could be interested in white. I think based more on need than actual reporting, but that's a clear need. That would be a huge win. And just because Ant can play point guard, doesn't mean he should play point guard all the time. Doesn't mean it's the best use of his skills.

Something like Kobe White would be awesome for Minnesota. If they could possibly get that done, though, I'm inclined to agree with you, JV, that I just, I don't see the assets that would convince a team that loves to sit on its hands in the Chicago Bulls to not sit on their hands. You really do have to kind of win them over because they've been in this position before

with so many other guys and refuse to trade them for all sorts of reasons that do not make sense to me, but clearly they're operating from some kind of internal logic. Were the wolves the only team you had in mind for him? The other one's the Houston Rockets, and that's a team where, look, let's zoom out on Houston before we even get to Kobe White. I think one of two, if not both of these things, need to happen.

Imi O'Doka needs to bite the bullet and play Reed Shepard more than he plays Reed Shepard, despite the fact that he's not a, I agree. I'm with you, Rob. He just needs to play more and be more involved because their offense is in such a bad way and they not only need the organization of more ball handlers, but they can benefit

from his scoring and shooting too. That needs to happen. They also need to seriously investigate trading for players like Kobe White. And if you want to look at other candidates, that's up to you. They obviously should and do a canvassing of every potential point guard that's available. But I think White checks a lot of boxes.

He's clearly getable under the right circumstances. And the question then becomes, what are you willing to give up if you're Houston? I think all of the key prospects for the Rockets are basically off the table. It's much more, are you willing to part with any of the additional draft capital you have at your disposal if you're the Rockets for what could be a rental, I think, for Kobe White? You know, just a couple of months of him on the team, because I'm not sure he makes sense with the Fred Van Fleet returning version of the Houston Rockets. And maybe this is a way where you absolve yourself of that, of like having to keep Fred on the

books and having to continue to, you know, as much as they would love to have him on this team right now, maybe Kobe White removes that need someone. So we're talking about a first for two months of Kobe White? I mean, it doesn't have to be a first. Like, it could be a swap.

In particular, I would say the one option that I think could make some sense is in 2029, the rockets and the I believe it's the Nets have a like, there's three picks involved in a weird swap arrangement in which Houston gets the preferable two of the three. So the nets will get the worst of the three picks. The Rockets will get the two better of those three picks.

What if you traded the middle pick? And so you're protected from it being too good. And those two picks, we should say, it's like the best of Dallas's pick, Phoenix's pick, and Houston's pick. The middle of those three, I mean, it's not going to be that great. Right? Like maybe late lottery, I would think. 2029 is a long way away and a lot can happen. So clearly all possibilities are on the table.

But I don't know, a middle protected first round pick for Kobe White. Again, if you see him being part of your team long term might make sense. If it's just a rental, it might be too, like too tough of a sell. Is 2029 post Kevin Durant with the Rockets? I would think. But Kevin Durant might also be doing 50, 40, 90, and 2050, as far as I'm concerned. So who's to say? I feel like we need a flow chart for any of these picks at this point. There's now a document that I think every podcaster and blog boy uses Unreal GM where it's just all listed out.

Yeah. And goddamn. It's just like even the what if if this happens, but then also this is so confusing that I can't even wrap my reminder on it. We need visuals at this point because I can barely understand what you just said. But I think it's interesting like trying to pinpoint what White's value is. because if the Bulls are signaling that they aren't in this long term, why is anybody giving up anything significant for him?

I guess a piece of a first would probably strike the best balance of it. But if I'm the Bulls, like, is there actually more value in trying to retain him in the offseason, if only to flip him later? Or holding on to his bird rights and hoping more opens up so that you could do something in the offseason. I just, if I see the Chicago Bulls retain a guy to try to flip him later one more time, I think I'm not having an aneurism. So I would like for them to trade one or both of these guys between Kobe and Io. I just don't believe that they will, honestly.

I would like to see Kobe White, though, in particular, freed. You know, freed to a team that's playing for something of consequence, because I really do believe in him. I believe in what he brings to the table off the dribble as a mid-range creator. Like, he's such a savvy, smooth player that I think for a team like Houston could really find the creases in their offense and be something meaningful for them. But for the Chicago Bulls, you're right, Justin, that he's like an accessory to so much of what they're doing. And if he's not essential, why are you breaking the bank to re-sign him?

Like, that's the predicament they find themselves in. And I probably would still resign him anyway just because I think he's good enough to hold on to. I just, I don't know. I just, I don't wish being on the Bulls on anybody. I think the problem with why it's value where it's hard to dial in, and this has always been kind of the thing with him is, he is in a point guard's body with a wing scores sensibility basically, I think. And his game has always tilted that way. And, you know, when you have players like that, it always runs the risk of escaping the boundaries of what you're trying to do and just consuming a lot of oxygen.

And I think when you talk about him going to the wolves, I'm kind of like he and I just wonder, speaking to the wolves in the rocket specifically, I think the rockets are more a lot of. likely to sort of contain and get a lot out of what he does just because the infrastructure of how they manufacture offense, I think with Shingoon, with KD, I think could save him from some of his worst demons in terms of over pursuing his own offense. Whereas with the wolves, I don't, it almost seems like, you know, there aren't a lot of Mike Connolly's out there. I'm just trying to, it seems like a more of a steady deferential type point guard is what would suit them best as opposed to like running him. I can see him pissing ant off is kind of what I'm getting at. And I think that the the rockets, I think, as a candidate for him are interesting, I think.

Yeah. Yeah, more interesting. There's a weird, almost perverse synergy between him and Giddy that really does balance each other out where like Giddy doesn't need the ball all the time. Perverse, you say? Yeah, I would love to get into that perversity. Well, I'm a pretty big perverse. So where's your bottom, JV? All right. Are we ready to talk about the Blazers now that we've done this hour long prelude to get here? We've only talked about them like five times already. So what's once more? So Robert Williams, trade deadline, All-Star, I think for the past couple of years has been involved in rumors, definitely since he's been in Portland. If only because he uses this odd mix of very good when he plays, it's just when he plays is kind of an open question mark.

I will say as we're recording this, he's only missed two straight games. once this year. So it really is just keeping him out of back to backs. And so he has been healthy as much as healthy as he's probably going to be at this stage of his career. I just want to get to a point of my life where somebody's like he's only missed two straight work days once, you know. That sounds ideal to me. That's what I'm saying. Like it's, it's a great bar to set for yourself. We're like, okay, missing one for a load management, injury management reasons is totally okay. But God forbid you miss two. I will see this. His absence is felt when he's not there. Like he is so intuitive that, especially in contrast to the other bigs that the Blazers have, I just think

like, I see why he's involved in so many trade rumors, because I do think he could level up most situations at the center position. The problem is like, you're really leaving it up to risk that he's going to be available there. But I also think you can always go home. I've always said that. And so I do wonder if the Boston Celtics, who are looking for a center, but they don't necessarily need like a Joel Embed for instance like Gamebreaker they just need someone in tandem with Keda because Kater has been

like a kind of revelation he's a good find time so could you trade Rob Williams bring him back to Boston and send out Sam Houser give Portland a shooter what do you guys think about that interesting

I mean Luca Garza doesn't love it I can tell you that you know he's not thrilled about the prospect but supplanting him would make sense. Adding Rob Williams would make sense. I think ideally my only issue for Boston is if I am going to add another big, I'm interested in the rebounding,

almost first and foremost, and Rob Williams is a great shot blocker, a good rim protector, like good playing the weak side, not like the most overwhelming rebounder in the world. And so as far as types of centers you would target, he wouldn't be the first guy that came to mind for me, but if all it takes to get him is Sam Hauser, yeah, like we're having the conversation.

Like I'm clearly on the line for something like that. Interesting. Yeah. Luca Garza was going to say sat next to him in Vegas at a restaurant. Quite a jawline on that guy. Quite a jaw line. Chiseled. Yeah, very, very much.

Yeah. Who, I'm trying to think of the Celtics. What if they could target somebody like Zubach would be an interesting guy, but I don't know how they would go and get him. If I'm just looking at the assets side by side, I still weirdly feel like Robert is worth more than Hauser in a vacuum. Would that just be the framework for something else? Or straight up, the money doesn't work, does it?

It works straight up. I actually do wonder if Hauser has more market value because he is such a dead-eyed shooter at such a low dollar amount. He's making like 10 million a year for the next four years or low teens for a while. I just think that's an immensely valuable player. and I do wonder with Williams, considering his injury concerns, if actually the Celtics would blanchet that, especially because Missoula has his guys and like to give up a steady rotation guy,

like Hauser seems like the type of thing that they wouldn't do. Yeah. I mean, Hauser kind of weirdly enough, given that he is sort of a specialist, gives you a little more ability to stretch out. I think part of the problem with Rob Williams is not only that he doesn't play a ton of games. Like he's going to either mistime by injury or mistime through preventative rest. But he also, when he does play, he's only playing like, what, 15, 16 minutes a game this season?

Like, he's not a huge player in terms of role. And the more you, like, extend that, the more you extend the risk that comes with it. So what are you willing to trade for a guy who will miss a certain number of games basically every season? And you don't want to play too many minutes because you don't want to overtax him. Like that's, it is a very particular market to hit. And that's where I think a role player type like Hauser feels like a philosophical exchange, right? It's like, are we willing to trade the upside of who Rob Williams is when he's on the court for the steadiness of someone like Hauser and what he can bring to the table?

I think bringing up the Celtics, though, is interesting because I don't know, I'd be curious to get your all's opinion on this. I get the sense from talking to people who cover the Celtics or Celtics fans. There's just this quiet nuclear confidence about them. Them at the deadline. No. No, Kyle, no. I feel like. people from the outside are like, Celtics pretty good team. I feel like people who are covering and following that team closely

have this idea that like, we're actually much closer than people give us credit for us, which makes me watch them at the deadline where I'm like, maybe they, I don't know that they're thinking like we're going to lean on Tatum so heavily, but I think they look at the east and think like, this is easily getable for us. And I don't know.

I just wonder if they're not going to make some kind of significant swing at the deadline. I don't know. How close are they to you all think? Well, I'm, I'm, glad you mentioned Zubach because he was a hot name, at least locally for them, when the clippers seemed like they were just going to bottom out, in part because his contract is actually the perfect fit for what they have structured there, where it's like $18 million. It's actually way lower than you think. And I think the biggest sticking point for them is just they got out of the tax, and that was their primary motivation going to the season seemingly. And now things have flipped to where I think

they're in the mode where it's like, could they add? Would they actually go back to where they were before? I ultimately think they don't want that. I don't think you want to clutter your books unless you know you have a surefire home run in that third salary slot. I just don't know what team in this day and age has a long runway but also has two supermaxes plus Derek White's hefty contract plus another in like the 20s to 30s. And so I always assumed that they would just try to split Anthony Simon's contract perhaps into two, maybe get an ant type at a lower value, maybe get a rotation player for down the road. And you think next year. but now I'm kind of confused because you're right. It does feel like if things click right with Tatum,

they might be low-key a favorite, if only because of the institutional knowledge compared to what Detroit has, if Detroit doesn't take a big old swing gets an MPJ or somebody else. And so I'm all over the place with the Celtics, but the opening is there. I think you're right.

And I think the opening is there for this kind of acquisition. They really don't need something super dramatic, just like a little more depth than a couple of key spots, and they're right there with the best teams in the Eastern Conference. And if not Rob Williams, like,

Gogo Patzay is somebody F kicked around a lot of like, especially now that Mo Wagner is back in Orlando, is Goga getable, who I feel like it's just maybe one of the most overqualified third string centers in the league. Go get Goga. Go get go go. Let's print it on a banner. Let's get the word out.

Go get. Does you get the haircut that Baylor Shireman has right now, which I can only describe as like the Martin Luther. Not a great haircut for my guy. I mean, I was going to say, I don't know if you all watch the Piston Celtics game the other night. That was, this is one of the most cliche things that NBA people in NBA Twitter,

give me a seven game series of that. I just think they look at the Pistons and they think, getable. I think they look at the Knicks and they think, come on, man, like our synergy. I just think the Celtics are close. It seems like they're a legitimate potential finals team, which I did not expect.

to say that earlier in the year. Crazy stuff. And I thought to my earlier point about like trading Simons, I thought that was going to be an easy decision for them. They favored the tax over what he can bring, didn't really fit with Missoula. All of a sudden, he seems, if not essential, then certainly crucial to what they have right now. Maybe Tatum's emergence, like kind of like repress, so suppresses the need of like having him around there. But like he's a very competent six man who fits their overall mold of just like getting up threes and, and jacking off. Yeah.

So I don't know. It's a tough one. Justin, does you consider it all the double you can always go home again? Bring Anthony Simons back to Portland and Rob Williams to Boston. Of course I did. I mean, you got at least see if it can work.

I don't know that it really makes sense, but why not? Are you guys? I must bring back. Yeah. Do you guys know if we're sending anybody to Memphis for Jason Tatum's statue unveiling? Do you know if we're doing that? Well, when is that?

When is that dated for it? Do you know? I need to check the schedule, but did you got, I mean, did you guys see that clip? Of course. I saw it. I like most things was like, is this real? Because it did feel like someone like conjured this up in AI. But also like, look, Jason Tatum's great. Tony Allen exists. You know, Mark just all exists. Respect our legends. Yeah. I was, I could see what he was trying to set. Like he was trying to respect the Celtics rather than, but I don't know if he necessarily meant to disrespect Memphis to the extent or, or, or,

The Memphis history, I don't even know how much of that is really on Tatum's radar. That's probably more when he's speaking to it. I was pretty amused by that. You know what? Like, Memphis Mike Conley is better than Bob Coosie. Like, that's just a fact. I'm sorry. Like, you know, the Celtics history is, look, hefty to a point.

And then there's just a lot of other history that's attached to it. And we don't have to pretend that that carries a long shot. Yeah. You're about to get a text from Bill and Isaiah. Yeah. I don't know why we're still doing stats. like to begin with. Like, didn't we just swear these off a couple of years ago?

Have you been to like outside of crypto? It's like a full Sims village because they started giving people statues. Then other good players came around. And now they have like 20 statues. It's like a full fucking family out there. How many statues will LeBron get? Not a Laguer statue, I wouldn't think. I mean, Cleveland for sure.

Cleveland for sure. You want a title with the Lakers. The native part of it. Miami maybe, although given the way the Dwayne Wade statue, turned out, maybe wanting a statue in Miami is not the move? I bet you it's Cleveland and Lakers. Not, but not Miami. No, because I think it depends a lot on the precedent.

It's kind of like Jersey retirements. If you retire just like a sixth man on a title team from a one title town, then you kind of have to do everybody else. Love it one title town. You know, it makes it sound like a little trading post out there in the wilderness. There are bars named after the one year that the Blazers won of titles. That's what I was thinking about. OKC for now, one title town.

It's my offshoot pod, one title town. That's pretty good. It's like that HGTV show, hometown, where they just go and they rehabilitate old homes in a town. That's the whole big? No. That's the whole show? You didn't know Robin Big. I don't know hometown.

No. We're not even problem being it's a classic show. You had us with Love It or listed but hometown that's not a real program.

I'm deep in the weeds on the HGTV. So your bathroom can you see out to exposed air now? What's going on? Give us a quick update on that. On the renovation.

There's a wall that like the house, the side of the house eventually. But yeah, I see exposed beams right now. Does it make you feel like more of a man? It will if I finish it

correctly. but right now I'm in the horror stage where it's like I've exposed beams like oh what's that little splotch right there do I need to get this remediated? Yeah. How do I deal with plumbing? Do I need to call someone?

No, I don't need to call someone. I could do it myself. I watch 20 hours of YouTube. So talk to me in like a week or so because hopefully we'll have taken this stuff. Let us know if you feel like a man a week now. I'm kidding. We'll do period of check-ins.

My guess is no. We might need a little longer from that, but I'll let you know. Let's wrap it there. Thanks, guys. It's always a pleasure. For sure. Thank you, thank you, Justice. Thank you, Justice. Thank you, to Victoria Valencia. Thank you to back to those. We'll talk to you on Sunday.

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