The Ringer NBA Show - The NBA All-Drama All-Stars and the Western Conference Shuffle | Heat Check (Ep. 372)

Episode Date: January 21, 2019

What would the All-Star teams look like if they were selected on the merits of creating drama (3:11)? Plus: Lonzo’s injury, Boogie back, the PG-Russ dynamic, and the Dennis Smith Jr. saga's resolution (?) (33:03). Host: John Gonzalez Guests: Jason Concepcion, Haley O’Shaughnessy Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Today's heat check is brought to you by Brilliant Earth. Brilliant Earth is the global leader and ethically sourced fine jewelry. Create your own custom engagement ring or choose from their unique designs made by master jewelers and enjoy free shipping on all U.S. orders from now until February 3rd, you will receive a complementary pair of diamond studs with the purchase of an engagement ring to see terms on this special offer and to shop all of Brilliant Earth selections. Go to BrilliantEarth.com slash Ringer NBA. Welcome to Heat Check. I'm your host, John Gonzalez. Join as I am every week by my producer, Isaac Lee, who, Isaac, good morning. I said something to you and immediately it went over your head because it was a reference about Top Gun, which is a movie from the 80s. And as we've long established, anything pre-95 is out the window with you. I mean, I have watched Top Gun, to be very clear.

I've watched it, but I was way too young. So I don't remember any of the references. I believe you said, Talk to Me Goose. Yeah, I said, talk to me Goose. and you said, why'd you call me Goose? And I immediately looked for something sharp or even dull to cut myself, because every time I come to the ringer, I'm constantly reminded

by how much older I am than everybody else who works here. But that said, happy Martin Luther King Jr. Day to everybody. We have a full slate of NBA games today as you listen to this. Some of them might have already happened, but we appreciate you listening to Heat Check as always. We encourage you to please rate and review us and all of our

fantastic Ringer NBA shows and pods. And we have lots of great content up on the ringer.com. We've got KOC's picks for the 2019 All-Stars. And he also explains why the selection process needs changing. Amen to that. We've got our staff updating our NBA trade deadline tracker. There's all sorts of juicy rumors and reporting in that that we update regularly.

Plus, I want to give big shout out to the Ringer NFL crew and the Ringer NFL show, Kevin, both Dannies, Mays, Roger, they're all killing it. Respect to them, Ringer shows, recognize Ringer shows. I want to say congratulations to Isaac and everybody else in L.A. for making the Super Bowl, very exciting. I know how it feels. I was there last year, and it was great to watch.

And I want to say, on behalf of everybody here at the ringer, I think I speak for everybody. Yes. Every single person, Go Rams. Yeah. I can't handle it anymore.

There needs to be like an act of Congress where they just say, the Pats have to disband or we're going to sell them to the CFL or something. I can't handle Boston anymore. I want to shudder the whole city, go Rams. I'm all fired up to that.

Don't get fired, bro. Don't get fired. I've got more. Hot takes that might get me fired a little bit later. Later in the show, Haleo Shaughnessy will be here to break down Lanzo's latest thinjury, boogie's return, Russ and P.G's seasons,

and also the ongoing drama with the Mavs and Dennis Smith Jr., who's going to be back in the mix this week. But first, we're going to start off with a little spice, and for that we need the spice maister himself. Boom, Shakalaka. He's heating up. All right, joining me in studio, one of our favorites from binge mode,

from NBA desktop. And now, from the critically acclaiming, taken the world by storm flat circle. Wow, we're acclaimed already? It's amazing. All the critics love it. It's Jason Concepcion.

Hello. Did you solve the mystery yet? I've only seen episode one. Do you already know who did it? No, I don't know who did it, but I have a lot of tantalizing theories about various things. Not really who did it yet. You just want to break everything on heat check right now? I don't want to break it yet.

All right. But I have a lot of theories. All right. We'll save the theories for the flat circle. I brought you in, though, because you're the perfect person for this. So I've been thinking, like, everybody's talking about. votes for all-star games and KOC's got a piece up on the ringer.com about his all-stars and why the selection process needs to change.

Simmons has talked about it. Everybody's doing all-stars. Blow it up. KOC would say. Of course he would say that. And I like that. And I like that. But just picking straight all-stars is not really on brand for heat check.

Of course. So we've decided to switch it a little bit. Let's go. We're going to do our all-drama all-stars. Oh! First ever. Let's do it. It's very spicy.

You're our senior spice correspondent. Thank you very much. So we didn't really decide what the format is here, but what we're going to do is we're going to pick five all-drama all-stars. We're going to have a coach for the team. Yes. And we're going to have an executive or an owner. I can't. And we didn't coordinate beforehand.

We did not. We didn't even talk about, like, do we have to do it by position? I did my by position. You did not. I just did it by heat, by pure heat. I love it. I love it. So you're the guest, so you go first.

You pick your first all-drama all-star. First pick LeBron James. He's been the center of the NBA universe for. for a decade now. Everything he does creates a stir. He can't talk about a player without it being potentially tampering. His predilections for wine become news.

He was recently Instagrammed by his wife baked. Hi, at home. Is that right? I miss this. And it was delightful. We're constantly wondering what he's going to do next, what he's up to,

who he's trying to bring to the Lakers, who he's tampering. I have to pick LeBron James because we're always talking This is a good one. He was at his kids basketball game recently and Simmons was also there. The kids were playing each other. We were getting some heated slacks about LeBron being at the game. It was incredible. He is everywhere and this is good because you're right. He's kind of like the human sounding board for the NBA. Yeah. Like no matter what he does, whether you like it or you don't like it, there's going to be people who pick sides.

Yes. He now has got the shop. The shop helps with that because he had Drake on there. Shots to Tommy Alter. Yeah, there's all kinds of stuff. So I like this one. This is good. He didn't make my list. He ended up on my four, because I broke mine down by forwards. I like that.

I went point guard, shooting guard, forwards and center. And he made my others receiving votes. I like it. I like it. But I'm going to start with a point guard. Let me hear it. I'm going to start with a point guard. So others receiving votes before I reveal mine.

Thought about Markell Foltz. That's an obvious. I mean, Foltz is like, it was really hard for me not to pick Foltz, but I've had so much Fultz talk in my life. He could be back in the lineup any moment. He went to the game, the OKC game. He just materialized out of nowhere. He's unbelievable.

Still not playing. Still out there somewhere. Maybe hurt, maybe not. Russ. Russ is always a good contender for point guard. So angry all the time. So as Embedde pointed out because Embedin, he got into it. He said he's always up in his feelings.

So somebody asked him, hey, are you guys cool after this? Fuck no. He said, fuck no. I'm like, fucking love Russ. Dennis Smith. Junior. Latecommer, he's supposed to return to the team, thought about him. I like it.

You know, power play. Got to force that trade. I guess he's coming back. 12 points of game, three assist three turnovers. Got to have that. He knows he needs to be on the floor. As just sort of like institutions, I had CP and Rondo on my list. That's great.

John Woll, really I could have had a whole team of Wizards for the All-Jama All-Stars. But I didn't. I didn't go that way. My pick for point guard for my All-Jama All-Star. Kyrie Irving. Oh, I did it too. Kyrie Irving made my list. So he comes out and he goes, the young guys are coasting.

Fucking young guys. They don't know what it takes to win a championship. No expectations from last year. It's different this year. They shouldn't be cool with having a five seat. Then he called your guy, LeBron, to say, I'm sorry. You know, it's hard for me to talk about, you know, because I had to call LeBron. It's really amazing how many things he said recently that, like, rocketed him onto this list

because I'm not sure he would have made the cut. And then, like, as Ambide was. say he's way in his feelings lately. I love this. I love it too. I love it because as content producers here at the ringer gives us a lot of things to talk about, I think it's fucking hilarious. I don't play for the Celtics, so it makes it great for me.

Here's what I think was interesting. And this is a don't get fired moment, but I'm going to do it anyway. If I got fired and this is the end for me at the ringer, I had a great run. It's been a lot of fun. So Simmons and House are talking, and Simmons is talking about how he wants Kyrie to stop talking. What does he have to gain? Bill, you run a media company. You don't play for the cell.

We should be like encouraging. We should be sending him fruit baskets to keep talking. It's fantastic. I picked Kyrie as well for all the reasons you mentioned. We're not even really going to get into the flat earth thing, which is like a whole other thing, which he has come out and sort of denied at various times that he ever really believed that.

He believed that. Come on. It's the best. I love when he talks. What does he think happens when you go to the edge? Are we on the edge? This is something I want to know about. Like, what's on the other side?

There's so many questions that nobody has asked him when this has come up. So this is a point of contention in Ringerworld. Yeah. Because I love that shit. I mean, like, obviously I don't. It's despicable, but I love it. Of course, of course. But there are people who we work with that this really aggravates them that Kairi keeps bringing up this kind of stuff.

And when he says stuff like the flat earth stuff, they get actually bothered by. Or I'm just like, no, man, like put another microphone in front of him. Let him spew whatever he wants. Yeah. And his recent comments about the young guys, I personally, this dalliance with LeBron's legacy and taking stock of his time with LeBron in a really kind of self-aware way is really interesting. You'd never see this happen with guys of his stature, with players of his stature go,

I really fuck that up. But more than that, if you really put all the little things he said all together in a row, He had that comment maybe about a month and a half ago when they were in one of their mini swoons about how, you know, what we need is a 14, 15 year vet to really stabilize this. Number one, Al, why is Al Horford? What is Alhorford not doing? Fuck you, Al. What is Al not doing right? And second of all, it's like, so you need LeBron James.

And now all of a sudden here he is apologizing to LeBron. It's all very, very interesting. Are we going to see Karee be like, well, I appreciate it now. I'm going to go back and play with LeBron again. I mean, this has been something that a number of people in basketball media have brought up recently. And I think, like, on its face, I'm like, well, that's just fucking bad shit. And then I go, but the thing is, if you thought about what LeBron could use right now, he could really use a Kyrie and vice versa.

And it's so ironic that Kyrie sounded like LeBron when he was spewing all this stuff. Well, he learned at the feet of the master. And also, I have to say, the reports of the other side of that, phone call came out where it was reported in the athletic that LeBron was with Kevin Love. Yeah, when the call came in. The director of Nike and some other people. It's like, how staged can this be? I don't care.

I like it all. I'd still love it. I love it even though it's staged. But it all makes sense because he learned at the feet of the master. LeBron is the king of these little moments that become narrative drivers that were in fact staged by LeBron James. It's fantastic. I'm here for all of it.

I have a position staked out here at heat check in at the rest. ringer. I am pro drama. That's why we're doing this. One more thing. Kyrie, one of those players that LeBron mentioned, after the whole hull of blue, after the Anthony Davis tampering thing when he was like, ask me about this player. Ask me about Luca Donchridge.

Ask me about Kyrie Irving. Ask me about, you know, on and on. One of those players. So, some mutual attraction there. Let's get the band back together. I'm in. All right. Give me your next one. Jimmy James Butler. Yeah. Come on. Like, you've got to watch him up close now.

You've really got to get the full Jimmy experience. He's already destabilizing the team in subtle but interesting ways, challenging Brett Brown. Yep. But, you know, that was all, that was fine. There was nothing aggressive about that, even though that became a story. And apparently sources within the locker room were like, wow, that was aggressive. Yeah, aggressively challenged. To the point where Brett had to come out and say, well, I asked them for their opinions.

I asked. I open the floor. That's very much, Brett. Brett will take the heat. I opened the floor. I asked them. That's a good Brett. I opened the floor.

I said, does anybody want to call me a son of a bitch and question their role in the offense? I asked for it, guys. I put it out there. I want them to just shit all over me. No, 10 times out of 10, Brett will take the heat. He's like, that's the kind of human he is.

But yes, Jimmy Butler, not surprisingly, also made my all-drama all-stars at Forward. Others receiving votes in that category. I thought about Andrew Wiggins because he's just like, he's not the drama, but the drama swirls around him. Kelly Ubrey, he can't get away from the table. An Otto Porter

previously in Washington. Blake, I thought about Blake Griffin. Blake is good. Because of the Balmer incident where he just like sprinted into the fucking locker room and said it wasn't him.

He just see is also just so salty right now. So. He's just really pissed. Like he went at Yovon. Oh yeah. He did. Shouts to Yovan about reporting that story

and intimating that he like looked off. Steve instead of his stories. I was just going through. my normal warm-up routine. Clearly. So I didn't get to ask you about this. Do you buy any of that?

No, because right after that, another reporter asks him. So if you had seen Steve not during your warmer routine, would you have shaken his hand? And he was like, I'm not going to answer that question. Come on, man. I mean, it can be both things, right? It can be both things. Yes, he does do this for his warmer routine. And yes, he also saw a bomber and was like, fuck that.

And by the way, I'm pro-blaken this. Yeah. We're like, you're a clipper for life. we're going to blow it out for your free agency. Here's the museum that we made of your whole career. You changed this franchise and then seven months later they traded him. I'm 1,000% with you. I love him giving Balmer Heat on that.

You're going to be petty and go into the locker room. I'm 1,000% here for that. I like it. But yes, Jimmy Butler, he was like my number one guy, has to make the list. Because he would have made the list just for what happened in Minnesota. Yes. And now there's other shit in Philly. He's a two-tee.

All-Drama All-Star. Beating Wiggins and Cat in the first stringers with like the janitor, the like the cafeteria person and whoever. That is legendary shit. Yeah. And the fact that he is still making news in that vein is really incredible. He's really amazing. All right. I'm going to go to my next guy to my shooting guard position.

Yes. Others receiving votes in this one. I had Don Mitchell for all his rookie with Simmons stuff. Yeah. I thought about him on Shumper because he wanted to fight Nurk. Oh, wow. He decided he was going to fight Narkch, and Nerkich was like, this guy should be thinking about retiring.

Nice for Amon to get on some kind of all-N-B-A list once it is career. I thought about it. But there weren't a lot of options here until our once and future king reemerged. Dion Waders. Dion Waders comes out of nowhere. He missed the start of the season with an ankle injury. Sure. Put on a significant amount of weight.

A lot of weight. And his fifth game back, he plays 12 minutes in a blowout to the bucks, right? So they're like, hey, Dion, what do you think about this? do you think you need to be patient with your comeback? And his response was, fuck patience. Yeah. I'm going to get back to my regular self. That's right.

My next step is being back in the starting lineup. And they said, oh, well, you know, are you going to bring this up to Spowe? And he goes, I ain't saying nothing to nobody. He was back. He was his fifth game back. He played 12 minutes. And he's like, fuck this. I need all the heat check I can get.

Now, he did end up having his best game after that. But I just love Dionne Waiters literally coming back off of injured reserve and just being like, I'm firing fucking shots up. I'm firing shots, both literally and figuratively. I'm throwing them at my teammates, at my coach, just heat. I'm not saying nothing to nobody except these reporters here with the microphones. You don't get off the island unless you make a little noise. I love Dionne Waiter so much.

You got to get off the island. It's a great pick. I'll pick my shooting guard as well. I had to go with John Wall. You're putting John Wall at shooting guard. I like it. Because I got Kyrie and John Wall. Okay, yeah, double back court.

Yeah, yeah. So I got to go with John Wall because my guy is. He's just going through it right now. He's going through some stuff right now. His teammates hate him with every fiber of their being. The way they play when he, since he has been injured. Yeah. Having his surgery and recovery over surgery and not playing.

It's like Bradley Beale is a man unchanged. A weight has been lifted. It's unbelievable. It's wild to watch him just like free running up and down the court being almost a top tier superstar level guy, really just looking like an absolute. competitor. And then you have John Wall, who is slated to make a zillion dollars. Like the GDP of Bulgaria over the next two years.

So great. I love Washington. Put off surgery is like Instagramming from a hot tub talking about I'm a do what I want to do, which is absolutely do what you want to do because I love the content. I just think it's amazing. And, you know, the Wizards, just an incredible team for the amount of talent they have, which is pretty, they have a decent amount of talent. Yeah. But they can never put it together because they all fucking hate each other.

Hate each other. And John Wall is always at the center of it. They've won six of their last 10. They do seem like they're playing with like a burden that's been relieved. The Ewing theory needs to be the John Wall theory. It's really great. As everybody who listens to Heat Check knows or reads the ringer, I love the Wizards because they're so. dysfunctional. If I were a wizard's fan,

I would be less enthusiastic about it. I am not, however. And that's why, like, it was very difficult for me not to make every single person on my team a wizard. Because you could just pick, like, they are, they are so great at it, and it never changes. Every year's the same thing. It's been like this

for 15 years. This guy's a complete asshole. I hate him. So-and-so's doing what they talk about it on the record. Earlier this year, after a loss in Sacramento, they were thrown shaded. Everybody, everybody was catching elbows. It's just, fantastic. There are kids getting ready to take their SATs that have only known this for their whole life. Yeah. It's amazing. It's fantastic. Never change Washington. All right. So I've got Kyrie,

Dion Waiters. We already talked about Jimmy Butler. So my other forward position, and I talked about the others receiving votes, I thought about Mario Hizonia and Janus because of their nut punching incident. And KD as well. KD narrowly missed the cut because KD is sneaky, Y'D is sneaky, all drama. He wants to pretend like he's not about that, but he's always got stuff going on with somebody.

It's a great point. And it's not just like Draymond and like, you know, it happens with CJ and previously with Russ and like block boys. Like he's always got something

going on. But I ended up going with a classic person. Draymond. Draymond's got to make the all drama team. He got into it with K.D. He got into it with Carr.

He wanted to punch Tristan Thompson in the face. Instead, they ended up who among us. Face mushing each other. Remember last year? with Dennis Smith Jr. where he was like,

you're never going to dunk on me and then he dunked on him, he got pissed about it. He's an all-drama all-star Hall famer. He's got the great Invisaline commercial. I have Dremond on my list

of almost guys. I did pick KD. You did? I love the Dramon. I love the Dremont pick. The KD pick I love because as you said, he's just incredibly passive-aggressive

and he's just always in the mix to be making news. He's just one of these guys where he's bound to come out with a, Instagram or a tweet or a comment within the next few weeks where it's like, y'all don't respect what I do. And it's like, what? You're amazing.

Everybody thinks you're fantastic. Who doesn't respect what you do? What are you talking about? Nobody's talking about me for a defensive player of the year. Listen, Kevin, what did I ever do? Why is nobody talking about me for MVP? That is true. That is an actual thing that is really strange that people are not talking about him, 28 points a game.

Second best player on his own team. I love that. But he is just a very, you know, a very sensitive guy. It's very aggrieved, very easily. We'll get very pissed that people don't respect him and don't respect Kobe randomly. He's just always in the mix and always a threat to come out hot in some Instagram comment thread somewhere. My favorite thing from him being dramatic this year was after the whole Joy Mon thing went down and he was asked about it a lot. he said to whatever reporter that asked him, don't you ask me that again?

Here's just some free advice for athletes. The number one way for you to get a reporter to ask you something again is to tell them not to ask it. It's very tough. It'd be like asking Kevin Durant to stop taking jumpers. It's kind of the job. I would purposefully ask it again for that reason. It is kind of the job. That's the whole thing.

And also, if you don't want anybody to ask you about you fighting your teammate, don't get in an argument with your teammate. Just start there. So was it was it bitch or pussy that he calls you? Call him a bitch. Yeah. That's tough. Yeah. Tough stuff.

That's your five. So then here is my center. A lot of options here. I had Carl Anthony Towns was a possibility. That's a great one. But he's low key also. He's like sort of passive aggressive. Like when you have to have your former college coach call out Jimmy Butler on your behalf.

Yeah. That's unfortunate when that happens. You know, like when you're, oh, can you pick the spite for me? Thanks. Cats been killing it, though. Cats been killing it. He didn't make the last. A boogie.

grandfather clause, he could have been on there, Nirk because he said Shump is just going to retire soon. And then Ambide was really hard for me not to go with. He's incredible. But I ended up going with your guy on this one. I went with Enos Cantor. Oh man, it's like international relations.

So, drama. So he complains to the media about not playing enough. Assassination drama. He complains to the media about not starting. He complains to Nick's GM, Scott Perry, about all of that stuff. And then he says, normal, by the way.

And then he says that Scott Perry said, I'm a very, very good player. Then he says, which was just amazing, he says, I was going to be an all-star this year. That's fantastic. You are now. You're an all-drama all-star. I got to say, look at the East. I mean, it's just like I was like, I fucking love cancer. But when you decide that you're going after the president of Turkey and the president of Turkey

and the president of Turkey comes after you, you call him that freaking lunatic and you can't leave the country. I mean, you've got international. He. Unbelievable. Yeah, all the stuff with like, I'm a good player, I should be playing more. That's all par for the course. The stuff with him being involved in international politics to the point where...

Can't go to London. He can't go to London because forces, the Turkish security forces, could potentially snatch him up and throw him in jail where he would... Or maybe assassinate him. Where we never hear from him again. That is all like a legitimate thing that could happen. And also, like, incredible shouts to our guy. Hidot Turkle, who is now the mouthpiece for a dictator.

Really tough stuff for the Hito fans out there. Hard right turn for Hito. Hard right turn, kind of like little goose step into the fascist laid for Hito Tirkle. Not only endorsing authoritarianism, but speaking out on its behalf, something's going terribly, terribly wrong. But this is real, like, all the other drama we were talking about for this team was like kind of fun, like, wink and a nod. This is real shit that Canter's.

dealing with. I got to say. So the charge is that Cantor, because of his support for the Goulon schools in Fethel Guglan, who is a Turkish national who is currently resides in Pennsylvania, has opened a network of schools across the country and across the globe, because he is accused of helping to foment the coup that took place in Turkey a few years back. And because Cantor supports those schools, Cantor is thrown in as like, a co-conspirator of a coup, which, listen, Aynos Canter, subpar defender, good offensive rebounder, good low post score,

kind of a throwback player, a guy who's going to start a coup in your country, I think it's a stretch. A little bit of a stretch. I think it's personally a stretch that Enos Canter is like a point man for a coup. That's just me. He can't even plot his way off the bench, let alone plotting a coup. Like, I'm with you. I'm with you.

But I love Cantor, and that's, as drama goes, I think, like, hard to beat. Let's do our coach, and then we'll do our GM slash owner. Coach, a recently soft extended coach of the Chicago Bulls. Nice. Jimmy James Boylan. The guy looks like a thumb. I just love this guy. So good.

It took zero seconds for them to mutiny. Zero seconds to the mutiny to the point where they had to, like, form a governing, the players had to form a governing body, a leadership council, which was half the team. I need to understand everything about how it works. Is it bicameral? Are there two houses within the leadership council? How many votes?

Is it just a pure straight democracy? Is there a chairman? Who has a veto? I need to know much more about the leadership council, which was enacted in response to the despotic regime of James Boylan drop and give me 20. Two and a half hour practices was suicides.

Let's do it. And my favorite part about this is a great peck. Comparing himself to Pop like an hour and a half after getting the job. He's like, I'm Popavetch and they're like, you are not. Pop does this all the time.

Pop does this. I was texting with him and he told me he does this. Nobody cares what he does it. Boylan was on my list. Scott Brooks just because he presides over that poor shit show. I really like Scott Brooks. Great dude.

Rick Carlisle's always got something going If Tibado was still employed, he would have gotten it, I'm going to go with Dave Yeager. Dave Yeager, just trying to get fired. It's a salt master. Pickin fights with the front office. The salt lord. My favorite part about that was he talks about how leaking is bad by allegedly, presumably, leaking anonymously to another media outlet about leaking is bad.

It was so fucking meta, it was amazing. My favorite recent Coach Yeager thing is when he was asked about Luca and why the Kings didn't take him, took Marvin Bagley Part 3 instead. He said, well, you know, I guess we thought that there was a ceiling on Luca, which clearly is not the case that's unfortunate for us. Yeah. And it was like, and then later had to come back and be like, listen, did I, what? Do are people saying that like I'm unhappy with Marvin Bagley or something? Why would you even think that? Why would you think that this guy is going to be the next kid?

KD. When you see him as Kevin Durant next to Russell Westbrook, people are not going to be saying that. Wow. Isaac Lee, can I get the Baffling Kings here? The Baffling Kings took back hookah. What are the chances of Marvin Bagley being the next KD? Super high, I guess, evidently. Before we do our GM and owner, while we're talking about All-Stars, it's time for NBA All-Star voting. And this year, it's actually easier than ever for fans to vote because you can vote just.

by searching on Google, just search for your favorite player or team, and you can vote right in the search bar. You can also search on Google to stay up to date with live scores and view upcoming game schedules. The All-Star game is February 17th, and voting runs until January 21st. That's today. Fans can vote for 10 players a day, so go vote on Google. All right. Now we get back to our last one, our GM or owner.

A lot of potential candidates here. A lot, a lot, a lot of candidates. Tell me who you got. Man, this was tough. I initially thought about Ernie Grunfeld, the man who has the most secure job in the United States of America. I'm going to stop you right there. That's mine. It's automatically Ernie.

He's been the GM forever. They haven't won. Forget about this. It's like a Supreme Court nominee. Like he cannot be fired. Who will lose their job first, Ruth Bader Ginsburg? Oh, clearly. Or fucking Ernie.

I don't know. Clearly, Ruth. Unfortunately for the country. I'm not sure. Ernie's been there 15 years. and there's no signs of him ever stepping down from this job. They have not won 50 games during his tenure. In fact, they have not won 50 games in 40 years.

It's absolutely fucking bad shit. Like, he gets it forever for me. Ernie Grunfeld, and that whole shit show with a three-team trade where he's like... That is wild shit. I mean, Chris Wallace could have gotten it as well for this. But Jesus, Ernie, you should go to Ted all the time and just say thank you. Every day you should say thank you.

He could shoot a person in the street. And Ted Leonces would be... I don't know. I don't know. He's been doing okay. He's hanging in there. He's been doing okay for us. I mean, have you seen John Wall? John Wall is still on his team. Over the last 15 years, he's been doing great for it. It's unbelievable. All right. So that's mine. Well, who do you got? So I thought very seriously about him. And I think that's a great pick. I went with Robert Sarver. Oh, you did. Who's been coming on. I thought you would have gone Dolan. Well, listen, Dolan. He gets a lifetime achievement award. He gets a lifetime achievement award. He's been quiet lately, except for that profile that came up in ESPN.com lately. I'm going to know Robert Sarver just simply because he's adjutely because he's adjuncting.

for funds for a new arena. And says he's, oh, I'm not going to move the team. Using much the same language that those of us who remember the battle for Seattle and the Seattle Sonics recall, very, very similar language to the stuff that Schultz and the ownership committee of the Sonics once used. I put them up there because of that and because it's not often that you see someone get absolutely roasted by a senior citizen in a city council meeting. Great. And for that to become news. Robert Sarver got put on... Torched.

Absolutely. He got put on blast. He got raked over the coals, barbecued, flambade, whatever you want to say. He got roasted by an elderly citizen of Phoenix who objects to his plan to use public funds to update the arena. And it's just a thing to behold.

I would urge anyone who hasn't seen it to Google it because, man, she absolutely murders this guy. And was also parted to that three-team trade that was a fucking disaster with Memphis and Washington and Ernie Grenfeld. Really unbelievable stuff. He gets around Robert Sarver. Good for Robert Sarver. He was a dark horse candidate. He was on my list.

Back in the news. I would have thought, you know, like Mark Cuban could, he could get a lifetime achievement award. Glenn Taylor would have been a good one. Glenn Taylor is great. Robert Sarver, that was a good one. That's our first ever. Yeah. He check all-drama All-Stars.

Expert job by you. Thank you. Check out binge mode. watch NBA desktop, which is just fucking fantastic. Watch Flat Circle with you and Chris Rye. Anything else you want to plug? That's at the ringer.com, a great website. It's a great website.

You're the best. Jason, thanks for doing this. Thank you. All right, that was Jason Concepcion. Before we get to Haley O'Shaughnessy, a word from our sponsors. Today's heat check is brought to you by Microsoft Surface. The new Microsoft Surface Pro 6 can help you get things done. Whether you're on the field or running a business,

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And when you join Hotel Tonight's H.T. Perks program, the more you book, the better the deals get to start scoring amazing deals at incredible hotels, go to hoteltonight.com or download the app now. All right, joining me in the studio, staff writer, also group chat. What do you guys call your individual roles on group? You need like a nickname for group chatters.

You should be in content production. That's exactly what it should be. The group chat chatters. Haley O'Shaughnessy's here. Hi. Hello, how are you? You write all kinds of stuff all the time, including you just wrote a piece about Lonzo Ball.

He's out four to six weeks. He's got a grade three left ankle sprained. And as our resident medical expert, grade three, I mean, that's as the grades go, that sounds pretty bad. Sounds like we should lean heavily on the six weeks. He's going to be out. You have a story up. Are the Lakers playoff hopes kaput? You don't see Caput out there very much anymore, but that's in the headline.

That's props to Justin Barrier. Props to Justin Barrier for dusting off the word kaput. You mentioned no LeBron, although he's supposed to be back soon, no Rondo. You tell me, are the Lakers playoff hopes kaput? So right now, they are the ninth seed. As we do this right now, they are just out of the playoffs at 25 and 22, a half game behind your LA Clippers. Right. So let's assume that LeBron and Rondo come back this week. I guess not assume, let's be optimistic. Yeah, I think that there's a chance of that happening.

Okay. For LeBron, I haven't seen him out this long in a long time. I'm not sure if this has to do with exhaustion, severity, or a little mix of both. If it is severity, then he's going to need to be worked back in. Same with Rondo. So not immediately off the bat. I mean, there will be relief. It won't be the same Lakers we've had to deal with since Christmas. But there's still not going to be full LeBron strength.

Right now they need LeBron. They need Rondo for playmaking. Without Lanzo, it's like, let's do Point Ingram, I guess. Which, by the way, last year, that was the best Ingram we've seen, period, was when Ingram was running Point Ingram. Right. But I don't think that's like a good thing to take out of this. I'm not sure you can be optimistic. No, no, I mean, there's just not enough behind them.

No, no, they definitely need Lonzo. And I don't want to make it sound like I'm optimistic that he went down. That equate the contrary. Just to your point about, you know, when Ingram got to run the point, that actually, like, he looked pretty good doing it. Breaking News, Gons hates Lonzo. Right, I hate Lonzo. I will say, and this part is true, right before we started doing this particular segment, and I said Lonzo's out four to six weeks. Our esteemed producer, Isaac Lee's response was, yeah, Lakers missing the playoffs.

Yeah. Okay, but here's my counterpoint to that. Yeah, I got. Of any two players in the league, who do you want leading you back? Second half of the season? Of any two players? Okay, maybe if you pick out of the entire pool, you don't want Rondo. But think about all the times that Rondo has saved teams unexpectedly.

It happened with the Bulls, their forced playoff series. I see where you're going with that. This guy can lead them back. And plus, like, following LeBron, like, he could pick up and take any team lead them into playoff. The Bronner's washed. Jesus Christ. He's not washed. He's not washed.

He's doing with a groin injury. He's washed. I think this has gone completely off the rails. I have been out, yes, I understand that Rondo was good last year. And I understand that he has these things where every time you count him out, he flares up and you're like, oh shit, Rondo's fat. Who else do they have to do that? Who else do they have that as a veteran experience in the playoffs, leading a team back can be the playmaker? Yeah.

Nobody. For me, I just go, it's a very simple equation for me. LeBron comes back equals LeBron makes the playoffs. He doesn't miss the playoffs. They're going to be fine. But how long can you last? How long can you gamble

with him not being in there and you'll still make the playoffs? I think he's going to be back this week and then they're going to make the playoffs. Yes, it hurts that they lost Lanzo. But as with all LeBron teams throughout history, as we've seen, the only thing that matters is LeBron on the court.

And he's going to be back. And the three teams ahead of them are the Spurs, Jazz and Clippers, respectively. And one of those, it seems like, will be shaky enough to fall out. I agree. Before we get on to the rest of our topics,

I want to remind you about the NBA watch of the night. We got a full slate of games on Martin Luther King Jr. Day. I'm going to pick out the Golden State Warriors at the Los Angeles Lakers on T&T. It's the final game of a full day. The Warriors have been in L.A. for five days. I was out there, practice the other day. And Steve Kerr said that he unpacked his bag on a road trip for the first time all year. And Boogie is back, which I think is very interesting.

And we're going to get to that in just a second. And also, like when LeBron went down, Kyle Kuzma has really taken off and played really well. And I think that that's interesting because Dan Devine loves to bust my balls about things. Like I wrote this piece about the Spurs and the cavalry not coming for the Spurs. And immediately the Ringer Curse kicked in and they were like really fucking good. Dan Devine wrote a piece about Kyle Kuzma basically just being a score. And since then, Kyle Kuzma has been like all world everything. So Dan Devine, the Ringer Curse rides again with you this time.

But anyway, be sure to check that game out tonight. He just reads Divine all the time. Maybe he does. He was motivated. He really has a point. He does have a point. Be sure to check out the Warriors and Lakers on T&T. And remember, gang, if you want to watch every NBA game, subscribe to NBA League Pass on

NBA. On MBA.com, Amazon or your local cable or satellite provider. As I mentioned, Boogie is back. I went out to practice. He looks thinner. His movement wasn't crazy great at the practice that I was at or at the shoot-around that I was at. And I didn't think that he looked particularly mobile or athletic in that game, that dunk

and the stink face aside. But he looked good overall. 14.6 rebounds, three assists to steal a block. He had three-threes. He only played 15 minutes in that first game. They got to win over Isaac's Clippers. I think on the whole, it's going to take him some time

to get his athleticism back. But given the injury and the fact that he's a big man, definitely better than I expected. Well, first of all, he's never been somebody's particular spry. Yeah. He's always been a little bit heavier,

and I think that was the main concern when he tore the Achilles. Is how you say it? Achilles. Achilles. I mean, sure, if you want to put a little flavor on it. Paul and Justin were making fun of me the other day. I think it's Kentucky.

Achilles. Okay. When he tore that, I mean, that's a huge concern. Don't let them throw shade of you for that. Like, you got to just like, just run right through it. It's probably like coming on to this podcast. Don't let the other chatters keep you down. You just, you do you.

I think that the way that he plays, how he has multiple options on offense, he's got a unique skill set, especially for a guy his size, will help him out in the meantime for when he's getting back into shape. He can spot up on the three. We saw that right away, which is really exciting. Cram had that stat that Boogie's three made three-pointers in his debut. Before that night, every other starting center for the warrior since 2001 had combined for two made three-pointers. That's just starting centers, but still, that's crazy. So it's nice that they finally have that. He's a good passer. We saw him pass multiple times to cutters. That was good. He's going to open them up still. He doesn't necessarily

have to be like this rim running center. Yeah, I mean, look, he's better than Kavanaugh-Luny, right? Like, it's pretty simple. And I think that So Palo was out at practice with me, and he brought up a really good point because Steve Kerr had said that Boogie would probably be trailing on a lot of plays as he's trying to, like, work back and get his athleticism back and whatnot. And he's definitely not equipped for that as is. Right.

And as Palo pointed out, he's like, well, you know, he can't shoot the three. Maybe this will work. And I'm like, oh, that's a good point because they can play five out with all their guys. and he doesn't have to be, to your point, this rim running center who's like hyperathletic and like throwing down dunks and whatnot, although he did his first basket, he was super excited to get that easy pass

and throw a dunk down. How do we feel about incorporating him off the court? Because that's also an issue too, right? I mean, like, you've got now not just five all-stars on your team in the flow of an offense. You've got to make sure everybody's happy and getting all their touches and, like, what's their usage rate?

You've also got five very different personalities. That's not a concern for me at all. No, you're not. I understand that in the past, he's been very powerful. But I think he totally understands his role. This is a big opportunity for him. They're giving him this chance.

They're saying, you can come in, do this for a year. We can't afford you next year. You should get more money somewhere else next year anyway. Come in, play for us. We'll give you minutes. We'll let you have your image back to what it was, maybe a little bit better because you'll finally be a championship player. We'll show people you're healthy.

But this is very much them giving him this chance. They don't need him to win. Look at what they were doing before. The game before he joined, they dropped 51 points on the number one seat in the Western Conference in the first quarter. Yeah. They don't need him to win, but I think he definitely understands that they are giving him an opportunity to better his image. I, you know, whatever this season is going to be is going to be. But the part about he's going to go somewhere else next year, good.

I hope KD goes somewhere else next year. I want to break up the Warriors in the same way that I've had enough of all things, Boston. Barreling towards the inevitable Warriors championship is like, it makes me. sad and tired. You know, honestly, I just want Kevin Durant to be happy. And part of me thinks that he's never going to be fully happy with the Warriors. Because I think that it really bothers him, this stigma of you had to go to this championship team to win. So I want him to go to the Knicks or go wherever and team up with somebody else and start over and prove that he can do it by himself. JC just roasted him and said he's not even the best player on his team. And I was like, ah, I like it.

Yeah, he's not tough. So that's tough for KD. All right, I want to talk about a couple of other things here. Here's something. All right, who's the best player on O'KC? Oh, it's Paul George. He's having a killer year. He's down.

OKC had a big win over the Philadelphia 76ers on Saturday. PG had a game winning three, and he was foul. He had 31 points that night. He made all 11 of his free throws. He had four of nine from deep. He's a killer on defense.

Let me ask you this, Haley, O'Shaughnessy. Why aren't we having a little bit more PG MVP talk? Oh, I think we were. I mean, it was coming, but it's just kind of quieted by Hardin, which makes sense it should be. I mean,

Hardin's having an insane run right now. I think that the Paul George conversation is most interesting, contrasted with Russ. It is. It really is. Because I do think that he is, should be included in MVP conversations, not necessarily as a front runner. He's real, on basketball references MVP tracker, they have him 10th, which is like. That does seem a little low. They've got, I mean, but then you think about the guys that they have ahead of them. They've got Janus Harden, Kauai, AD, KD, Steph, Yokic, Embed, and Braun. I was waiting for Braun, I was like, wait. Bron just ahead of him. So, but, like, within the team dynamic of, like, I think it's really fascinating that Russ, you know, OKC is Russ's team, right? You know, Katie leaves, Hardin gets traded away previously. Russ is the last musketeer standing.

He has to convince Paul George to stay. He throws the party. Nas comes in. And then all of a sudden you turn around and you go, oh, Russ isn't having a very good season. And Paul George is fucking killing it. I think it can still be Russ's team from a face forward. From a face of the franchise.

Exactly. But that doesn't necessarily mean that he has to be the guy on offense. And it's funny because actually, no, he's not. And he shouldn't be. He went until he inserts himself as. Like, it's funny that four-point play that Paul had to save the game, Russ had fouled out. So he wasn't an option on that last play.

He fouled out with like 15 seconds left. So Paul George was the guy by default. Now when they lost to the Lakers in the fourth quarter, I don't even think Paul George shot it. Yeah, he didn't take a shot in the fourth. quarter when they lost the Lakers and Westbrook went one for eight. And Paul George finally got a shot like a couple minutes into overtime. So you mentioned those two performances and I think they're important because like the season that Russ is having shooting the ball is incredibly bad.

He is the worst deep shooter at the volume he's shooting. It's really bad. And that is a long list of guys. Yeah. So he's scored 21 points against the Sixers on 21 shots. He was one of six from deep against the LeBronless Lakers, which they lost that game at home. He had 26 points. on 30 shots. The time before that earlier this month, when they played the Lakers, he was three of 20 and one for seven from deep. He's shooting 23.9% from three.

You know what's weird? It's incredibly bad. I'm pretty sure they have another three-point shooter on their team is really good. Oh, yeah, that's Paul George. I mean, Paul George last year was their best three-point shooter, both in terms of percentage and volume out of necessity. He's the best three-point shooter this year. He is.

And the problem, like, okay, it's hard for me to say, like, I'm not sure that's the best role for him because look at the way he's playing and how good he has been. Part of that is out of necessity because they need that, right? They don't really have any other marksmen. They don't have, like, a JJ Redick type who the only thing that person's supposed to do is hunt shots. Right. So they need somebody to hit three pointers and Paul George is their best guy at it. I wonder if, like, no, I mean, like, I guess, I guess, like, you know, this season he's having is the season he's having. but clearly part of the function of Russ being so bad at this year,

he's shooting five three-pointers a game and making fewer than 24% of them is that they don't have a lot of other people to take those threes and they need them to. So it's a little chicken or the egg for me with Russ where I go, you know, you need somebody else to help him so he doesn't have to do this, but he's also doing it and he's hurting them.

I understand what you're saying. I don't even necessarily think that that's the conversation I want to have. Okay. Tell me the conversation that Haley wants to have. He needs to be the designation. three-point shooter in crunch time. Yeah, I think

he is, right? Let rush shoot through it the rest of the game. Honestly, I'm fine with that because eventually something has... It can't be 23% the rest of the season. But it's funny that I'm saying that because I was reading Royce Young's recap of the game. And he brought up how... Do you remember those gatorade commercials that PG had

when he was a pacer and it was like, no overtime tonight? Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. They made fun of him for it. Yeah, and he made a budget... Well, that's the funny thing is that he missed so many buzzer beers. He didn't make a single buzzer beater as a pacer. And then all of a sudden not one. It's crazy. Yeah, it's crazy. And then he's done it twice this season and it's funny how I

almost completely have put that out of my mind because Russ has made many buzzer beaters. But Paul George is clearly the guy to take them. So I'm making a face now because this is a good point but I wonder like do you think that Russ would ever like seed that authority to him? Because it's hard for me like

when they're both on the floor at the same time. I don't think it's authority as in like a pride thing. I really don't think it is, and that's why I totally understand all the Rust defenders, and I sympathize with them. I don't think it's Russ saying, like, you don't deserve a shot, I deserve a shot, I'm the guy on this team. I genuinely think that he believes

he is the best option to win, and he just wants to win. Yeah, I think so, too. I don't think it's, like, malevolent, but I do think it hurts them. If you have a choice between Paul George taking a shot, basically at any point in the game, but yes, specifically in crunch time or at the buzzer, or Russ

taking a shot, like, it's a no contest. You need to go with the percentages are pretty obvious here and the numbers are pretty obvious. All right, last thing I wanted to run into with you was the Mavs and Dennis Smith Jr. Dennis Smith Jr. is supposed to return to the team on Tuesday. He's expected to play. After much, much drama, he had missed six games with a quote illness. And during that time, ESPN reported that there was productive communication and that the Mavs were willing to be patient and fix the situation at least temporarily. Rick Carlisle apparently reached out to Dennis Smith Jr.

In a phone conversation and expressed, this is according to the athletic, and expressed remorse over the situation and made clear that he's been a positive presence for them. Are you buying any of that? And this is a weird situation. This whole thing makes me really uncomfortable. Why? Just because we're not really exactly sure where this began, right? I can't trace this back to patient zero because I'm not sure if it was Dennis Smith Jr. being unhappy because those reports came out or was he unhappy because they were sitting him.

Were they sitting him because he was unhappy? Was it because of the trade, which is what makes the most sense that they were looking for a trade? They didn't want to risk an injury. They decided to sit him and then he was unhappy with that decision, right? That's what logically makes most sense. Still, that's all very uncomfortable because now, I mean, his trade value is nothing. You see a young guy who is talented, but you see him and he wants out? If that's the case, you cannot get anything back.

I'm not sure. I'm not sure that that's true. What could you get back for a guy who's obviously not happy? Would you do Fultz for Dennis Smith Jr? I would. Why would you do that? That is nothing. That is nothing.

Wait, nothing for who? It's nothing for the Mazz. I do it for the Sixers. I'm just saying like... Exactly. That's what I'm saying. It's nothing for the Mazz. No, from a Mavs point of view, what are you going to get back? If Foltz, this guy who has not played basically his entire career...

I'm just trying to find a way for Foltz had of Philadelphia. Exactly. Exactly. So the magic and the sons were rumored to be interested in Dennis Smith Jr., which I think would be good for those two teams. If I'm the Mabso, I'm not ready to give up on this just yet. He's only 21. And, like, yeah, Luca does everything he does better with the exception of, like, just

being athletic and being able to get to the rim and, like, super fast and throw down dunks. Like, Dennis Smith Jr. is better than Luca at that. Otherwise, everything else Luca does is better. But I'm not ready to give up on those two as a pairing and a young back court. Like, having Dennis Smith Jr. playing off the ball and just being athletic and being sort of, like, a very poor man's russ. Like, that could work.

Absolutely. Like they shouldn't give up on him yet. I don't think so either. I don't think it's worth dealing him now and trying to, what, like accomplish this win now mission that obviously will still be in play next season. But the point of this all is is that they did decide that or something went down that they were sitting him because those illnesses were bullshit. And so like something did happen. Maybe they did decide to give up on him. I don't think they should have. But now they have to retract that and they're trying to make nice. And it's just all very confusing because. it's like, were you going to trade him? Well, so the Mavs and Carlisle were kind of trying to put it on Dennis Smith Jr.'s camp. So last week on ESPN Radio in Dallas, Carlisle went on and said that Dennis Smith Jr. is a team guy. He loves being with a team. And he said that he thinks that his advisors told him to stay away and that it was a, quote, businessy situation. So are they definitively saying that it was his choice to sit?

They're not definitively saying it, but he said, don't judge him to. this is Rick Carlisle saying don't judge him too harshly for this situation that he was getting bad advice. And I think that's interesting for a number of reasons because Rick Carlisle, as we saw with the New Orleans-N-N-Wel situation, we'll stick a guy in his doghouse and leave him there and be happy to do it. Him apologizing was unique. Very unique. And for him to say, like, we want him back. The matter of organization apologizing was unique.

Saying that there was productive communication that, like, he expressed remorse and apologized. Like, that's not very Rick Carlisle. No, not at all. And it's very strange to me that, like, Rick Carly will go out on a limb for Dennis Smith Jr. But supposedly they're going to try to kumbaya this thing on Tuesday. I just wonder how sustainable it is. You know, it's interesting. Paul and I were talking the other day about which young core we'd rather have.

He texted me about the Mavs or the Hawks. And, like, when he texted me, he was leaning toward the Hawks. I was like, are you doing okay? Are you, like, everything good? But his point was that the Mavericks don't have much of a core. They have 1.5 guys because we're not sure where they are on Dennis Smith, Jr. Right. And it's kind of interesting about what they see themselves as. We definitely know what the hawks see themselves as. A team of the future, maybe like four or five years down the line. I don't even want to say three years. Because they have this core of super young guys who need so much work and still need other pieces, everything. With Dallas, they so clearly have their guy. Nobody's arguing that. But are they like not anymore focusing on getting young guys? I'd still, I mean, for me, it's in a very easy equation.

I totally take them. I don't need to do too much math on this one. I just take the Mavs because they have Luca. Before we let you go, because you have a lot of stuff going on. What about Frankie smokes for Dennis Smith Jr.? Both sides get a new start. I would 100% rather have Dennis Smithjian. I would too.

I feel bad for Frankie. He's a really nice guy. I'm a really nice guy. I'm not in the NBA. That's true. But he's trying to be a good soldier and it's just such a fucking shit show there for him. So maybe like you switch. You switch shit shows. Before I let you go, you did a great piece. You went to, you were traveling, you went to Washington, you spent some time with Tomas Satteranski. I highly encourage everybody to read that piece. But the reason why I brought it up, aside from it being very good, you didn't escape room. I hate escape rooms. They're difficult and weird. Did you like it? Had you done it before? Yeah, I did one before. And that's what gave me the idea because the whole, like, the idea behind Satterninski was that he's a great teammate. And so in escape room, you have to.

to work together. It's all very cliche, but I was like, oh, maybe there'll be something fun on this. But the thing is, is like, with NBA players, they're very busy. Great access. They have a lot going on. So I didn't think he'd ever want to do it. His agent was like, I don't know, he's European. He usually just wants to get coffee. But he was totally down for it, and he was actually really good. And he was like this hyper competitive guy. He brought his wife and his brother, and they were hyper competitive, and they were figuring everything out. And of course, the whole time I'm like taking notes. But halfway through, I was kind of like felt bad about it and kind of pin it.

and kind of pivoted to just helping us escape. Did you escape? We escaped. Nice. Look at you guys. Congratulations on that. Happy ending. Go read that story.

Anything else you want to plug? Not that she's just like blinked at me. Be sure to read Haley O'Shaughnessy on the rear. Everything. Just search my author page every day. And check her and the other chatters out on group chat on Thursday. Haley, thank you. All right.

Thanks to Haley. Thanks to Jason. Thanks to Isaac. I want to remind everybody to please rate and review us on Apple. and don't forget, we got NBA shows all week for you. We've got the mismatch on Tuesday, group chat on Thursday, Corner 3 on Friday. Isaac and I will be back for Heat Check next Monday.

Thanks for listening, Yang. Bye.