The Ringer NBA Show - The Pettiness of NBA Players, What Tanking Looks Like in Today’s League, and a Quick Rant About the Unreliable Nature of Socks | Real Ones

Episode Date: November 21, 2022

Logan and Raja discuss Giannis Antetokounmpo’s encounter with Montrezl Harrell and the pettiness of NBA players (1:32). Along the way, they take a quick detour to air out their frustrations about socks (22:45). Next, they talk about how the culture around tanking in the NBA has shifted over the years and why the floor spacing of today’s teams is so different from past eras (27:15). Later, Logan asks Raja if Anthony Davis’s play will be sustainable when LeBron returns to the lineup (38:45). Finally, the guys close out with their Real Ones of the Week (42:05). Hosts: Logan Murdock and Raja Bell Associate Producer: Jonathan Kermah Production Assistant: Kai Grady Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

The time has come to get ready for the 2022 World Cup. And what better way to prepare than by revisiting the World Cup's most amazing goals? I'm Brian Phillips. I'm making a podcast about the history of the men's World Cup, told through the stories of 22 iconic goals. The show's called 22 Goals. It's out now on the Ringer Podcast Network, and we're having so much fun. What's popping?

Real ones, slogan Murdoch here, Roger Bell there. A little pre- Thanksgiving real ones in the building we hear. Raja, how you doing, man? I don't know how it is in Florida for Thanksgiving. It's probably like 87 degrees in humans. Like, I'm sure you guys are going to have a good time. What's your Thanksgiving looking like? You ready to go?

Yeah, we got some weather coming in. It's been a wet couple days. But yeah, man, you know, family. My mom's at the age now. I guess, like, she's done enough Thanksgiving. And she's kind of like one of you two do it, me or my sister. But, you know, it's nothing like Thanksgiving. your mom's crib, man. So, like, I talked her into doing another one. So we'll be over there.

There you go. There you go. Way to push the work back to your mother. Good job, man. We'll bring. We'll bring. You know what I mean? It could be potluckish, but we're going to need to be at the crew. The whole family's like, no, we want to go to Uncle Rogers' house where they got the hoop court. But, like, I guess that's not. We'll push that to next year. Next year. Christmas, bro. Christmas is at Mike. You know who wasn't about that holiday cheer? But you are getting so good at that. Who wasn't about that holiday cheer? Who was it about that holiday cheer? Logan. Janice and Mantra's Harold.

And I want to talk about your messy-ass sport because this shit was hilarious and I knew I needed to talk about this. As soon as it went down and just the nuance, just have a conversation about just fucking messy-ass, petty-ass basketball players. So let's put the picture for the people

who haven't seated. So basically, Citchers beat the Bucks at home and what was honestly just a really big win for the Sixers, who've been struggling, you know, to start the season. Injuries from James Hardin and, you know, just trying to live up to the preseason stick your chest out energy that they had. And, you know, they get a big win over the bucks.

And Janus plays like crap. So, you know, he shot like crap. I think he shot four or 15 from the free throw line. And he goes out and he says, you know what? I'm going to go out. Let me get some free throws in, you know. I'm going to go. I'm going to shoot.

I don't know the Sixers practice facility situation. I don't think there's another court that he could shoot at and get extra. shots up, right? He goes out, gets some shots up, and Montres Harrell comes out because apparently he wants to get some shots up too. Him and his guy,

who I'm not sure, I think he's a Sixers' assistant, I don't want to mess up names here, comes out onto the court, sizes Yonis up, and Montres Harrell takes Yonis's ball. By the way, if you guys want to see the recap of this, I don't know the TikTok dude's name, the commentator

Terry is incredible. It's incredible. But anyway, go check that out. Harold gets the ball, takes it from him, and just like, just stands in the corner and just doesn't say a word. Very passive, aggressive, messy behavior. Right. And then Janice is like, dude, what the fuck? It's my

ball. And yeah, and then Harold is not giving him the ball. And then Harold goes to the other side of the court and gets shots up, right? Harold played four minutes in the game. It's like, you know, I need to get warm because for the next thing, if my number is called, I need to lock in, and then he goes and shoots the ball, right? And then, I'm sorry,

I just got to give the play by play. And then Janus goes back into the locker room, gets two balls, and when he returns back from the locker room onto the court, there is a ladder there. And then Janus pushes the ladder after, you know, telling the guy to get out of the way, pushes the ladder. And then there is a big controversy surrounded who was wrong and what's going on. And first of all, I just wanted to ask, Roger, whose side are you on in this scenario, Roger? Where are you at in this scenario? Who is whose side are you on? Because I know you're petty and I know that you got a lot going on with yours, but whose side are you on this? I am petty. I've often said, it's hard to out petty me. I will get down in the muck.

But there's only one side to be on with this. It's the onus. Yeah. It's the honestis. The man is out there trying to shoot some extra shots after the game. He didn't shoot well. He's four for 15. mine in his own business, trying to get some jacks up. And here comes Montres Harrow. Why the fuck you got to be on this side of the court? And if you listen, I mean, this is what Janis said, right? I read an account of the exchange. He said he told them, I've only got, what, three more shots or four more shots to make.

So even if you really, really have to have this basket, which I don't know why you would have to have this basket, because there's another one right down there. then I've only got three or four more shots. So, you know, while we do get after it and, you know, there's a level of competition, there's usually a code. You know, there's a gentleman's code to this stuff. Like, we warm up on any basket. If someone needs a basket, you move over to the other basket.

If it's their basket, like, it doesn't have to become that. So taking his ball and holding it was just all the way out of pocket. I mean, I don't know what that would be about. And then as far as Jan is coming back out to shoot, that's an easy one if, hey man, just move the ladder for a second. I have three more shots. And that's what he said, he said. Now, I want to be careful because I'm a big Philly fan. And obviously, Philly meant a lot to me.

And I'd pull for a lot of Philly teams. But Philly fans got a little bit of shit about him. And I don't know if this was like a Philly worker who had his fan had on. It was like, no, man, look that. man, you ain't about the, like, I don't know. I don't know if they witnessed what happened with him and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and, and he felt it was his responsibility to further the, the disrespect to Janus.

But that's, just move your ladder, dog. And that's, that's, that's an easier one than the Montrez one. Just move the fucking ladder, please. And the fact, please, please, just move it. I'm, I'm, yes, and I know you have a job to do, but just let me finish my three shots. And then I will let you do your job. and everybody can go home and go about their business. But nobody in Philly was there for Yannis shooting some extra free throws.

And so for that reason, I'm team Yannis. Like, it's ridiculous. I will say this. And I have a question for you on the back end of this, though. I'm not sure about this, Raja, but I am a thousand percent sure that that person that was, that had the ladder, was definitely a Philly fan and told him probably, probably told him some sort of sort of fuck off and I got this and don't worry about it. I got a job to do, pal. Sure.

Because if you noticed, if you noticed, they didn't, because when Montreals went over here on the other court, they didn't bother him. They left him beat. They left him beat. Right. They left him beat. Okay, and I don't want to tell a story.

This has to do with Boston during the NBA finals. I'm not telling any names and I'm not saying anything, but I want to talk about just fandom within like arena workers, which is a special fandom, which I honestly can get, I respected. So I was, it was the, shoot around before game six, right? And I don't remember who or what was said,

but it was brought up of like people stepping on Lucky's head, right? On Lucky the Lepricon, right? And it was basically the gist of it was, why can't you can't, how do you, if you're running at the Boston Garden, how do you avoid Lucky's head if you don't know what it's there for, especially center court level, right? And a question was brought up.

Well, Lucky's head is on the, you know, what's the thing, the sticky stuff that you guys have for the shoes? The stick pads. The stick pad, right, has Lucky on it. And the question was raised to this arena worker. So, like, you step on Lucky's head right here. Why can't you step on Lucky's head right here on this park? Where's the consistency? Where's the consistency, right?

This was from an out-of-towner, right? And I loved what the guy said. He said, and this is probably my best or worst Boston accent. He says, that right there, you could step on because that's for stepping on. That lucky, and he points at the lucky on the parquet floor. He says, you don't step on that lucky, though. And I was like, but he said it with the gravitas and the, the oomph of a person that this is my turf. This is my shit.

This is, this is Boston. Yeah. Right? I respected that. Do you respect the arena worker who probably had that same energy towards Yonis? I respect all arena workers. All right. I would rather my arena worker be a non-partial,

um, a piece of this production, though. Um, because once you start becoming like, Oh, Homer, you know, now, now weird interactions can happen with the opposing team.

And that makes, you know, that, that just makes the, the experience poor in some cases, right? And, you know, like, the reality is I'm here playing with Golden State, let's say, in Boston, but Boston could be a destination for me potentially as a free agent in a couple years. But maybe, you know, if, let's say a Boston, you know, usher or someone behind the scenes is a

homer and he feels it's his business that night to give me the business, it's ruined my experience and now I'm not a free agent target, right? So, like, I would rather, for a lot of reasons, the people who work in the building, just be there. Just be there impartial and do your job. Having said that, I got no beef with him. You know what I mean? Like, I know we're all fans.

I got no beef. And there is a difference because what you are describing is tradition, right? You are describing like an old respect. Yeah, this is something that we don't do. Like, this is known. Shooting on a basket, free throws after the game, like no one in Philly has laid down the law that that doesn't take place in their arena. Like, that's not an established tradition.

You know, Montrez Arrow took it upon himself to come out there messing with Janus. I don't know why. But certainly by the time we got to that worker, somebody in that Philly, someone witnessing that, that worked in basketball ops for the Sixers should have stepped in somewhere along the line and said, yo, yo, yo, my man, my man, my man, with the ladder. Slow your ass down, bro. Let him finish shooting those fritos.

Like, give him five minutes. Like, maybe they don't get involved with the, with your home team player and the beef between teams. But certainly once the arena staff started messing with Yon, and someone should have pulled up and say, hey, just chill out, bro. Put the ladder to the side for five minutes, let the man finish going about his business.

I mean, that's the level of respect that's supposed to be reciprocated amongst teams. Do you know what I mean? Like, Joel and Bid might want to be, you know, at FI serve arena and hang out 10 minutes later and get some work, who knows? Like, we don't need people taking it upon themselves to tell a player, no, he can't do that.

He's just lucky that damn ladder didn't hit nobody. I know that. I know, man. I know. That was the big thing. I want to get to the latter part in a second. But we can actually start because the question that I have right now is, and you've been a guy that has played in Philly, how much is this going to galvanize the Philly fan base for whatever, however, you know, wild this is and however, you know, non-nuance their take is, how much is this going to galvanize them in games against Giannis going forward? Because Philly fans don't need much. They don't need much. They do not need much to galvanize around a player or a sport.

What is the next game going to look like when Janus comes to town? Dude, I don't know, man. I've seen Philly fans. Philly fans, I want to, they booed Destiny's Child one year. They booed them at the, uh, they booed Santa Claus one year. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, Kobe just get, heck, he Kobe usually get destroyed by Philly fans when he come to town. So, I mean, Philly fans don't need a lot. And so I imagine Janice is going to have some unpleasant experiences in Philly.

And I'm okay with that. I love Philly fans. I think the level of intensity and passion and support, I think it's great, man. More teams should aspire to be like that. I would just say this one, it didn't. I mean, Janice was in the right. I don't care how you slice it. He's just there trying to get some extra shots up.

We've all done that. And so Montrez could have easily went to the other basket, but let's say he didn't and wanted to be a poop butt about it and took the ball. And then Janice said, then I'll go to the other basket. Arena staff does not need to be involved in that. Hit your ass over there and let that man finish. What if bro would have just been like, what if that scenario happened? And bro would have ran to the other side with that big ass ladder.

Like, no, you actually can't. We're actually working on this one, sir. That would have been fantastic. That boy, I look. He's, I actually applaud Janus because. If it had been me after a game like that when emotions are running really high and you are really angry, you, I've stayed after and shot after games before a handful of times.

Those were at some of my lowest and most disappointed moments in myself, right? Because it's not an every night thing. That's not even a 25% of the time thing. That is a, I don't know. That might like once a year tops. Dude, maybe twice. But so that's how. rare it is. So when someone does that, especially on the away floor, you do it usually at home

when you can go down in your own practice gym that's attached or on your own home court. So when you're doing it, that's the level of frustration and, and anger that Yonis had coursed through his vein. So again, if it had been me, like, I'm not so sure that I wouldn't have got into it. Like me and Montrez would have, that would have been ugly. Janus showed some real restraint. And certainly when Buddy popped up with that ladder, I mean, I don't even think Yonis MFed him in a way that you could see on the video or anything. I would have like that. Or get your ass out of here, man. What are you doing?

What goes into the mind of a player that says, because I want to paint this picture for people that may not get the chance to get in the back. When you're an away player or when you're on an away team and you're about to, usually you're dipping out after that. you guys are trying to get out of that arena and out of that city onto the plane, wherever you're going to go, whether it's back home or to the next city, right? Right. So for any player, specifically a star player to do something like that, it holds up everybody. The whole production. It holds up the bus, the whole production, the whole scheduling, getting to the airport,

all that stuff. But what goes into the mind of a player that has like, that had such a bad game that has like, yo, I got to get shots up to get my rhythm back in the gear or get myself back by any means necessary. Like, what is going through Janice's head when he's going back onto the floor to shoot free throws pre all of this controversy? Well, I had to look at their schedule

because there would be a case scenario where if we're spending the night, then you're not affecting anyone else by electing to stay there and shoot some extra shots. So, you know, that's a different story, right? Like if I'm not affecting the whole production by staying here for an extra 45 minutes, then no harm, no foul. I would just say, again, for someone like Jan is to probably hold the buses up or at least one bus, right? Because there are multiple.

Like, no, actually, there's one. I'm sorry. There's just one leaving. He's definitely holds a plane up by any measure. Yeah, he's definitely holding a plane. You're holding, you're holding people up in a way that your mindset has to be just utter frustration, anger, disappointment, any combination of those three. I don't know to what percentage degree.

But more importantly, I think that the people around you have identified that. And they're probably like, you'll just let him be, bro. Yeah. You know, I get like people new when they know you long enough and they know your mannerisms and they know your affect and they see you after a game like that and they know you put it all on yourself and they might want to come up and the first thing they're going to say is, Hey, yeah. And then they're like, never mind, bud. Just let him be. No, I know that. I know that with Roger. We definitely have a let him be.

Yeah, just let him be. Just let him be. Yeah, just let him cook. And so I think that's where they were with Yanis, right? Yanis, look. And you, and Yonis deserves, Janus deserves the benefit of the doubt way more than I did. I mean, he usually keeps his cool in a way and, and performs in a way that it's, you know, undeniable. But, you know, clearly that meant something to him. And I like that. And I've said this. to you before, bigger picture. I said, early this NBA season, there have been more games that felt like the mean something to the teams participating

in them than I remember in the past few years. Like, they're really getting after each other. Even the first two weeks of the season, I watched a few games where I was like, man, the tenor of these games feels like, you know, pre-playoffs, like, down the stretch. How much fear should Philly have that they may have poked

a bear? That Harold, just to be petty, just may have poked a bear in a way that he probably shouldn't, you know? Because it's one thing if Joel Embed goes out there and does that but for Montres-Herald no disrespect because you know we know about everybody deserves to play basketball

in this league everybody is cold and Montres-Herald just has some great years right like but he is not on the level of Janus in terms of play right what what could this do if Janus goes and

because Janus is going to remember this what does this do going down the line if these two teams were to meet in the playoffs I mean, yeah, Janice is going to be extra motivated, but if I'm Philly, I'm not worried about that. I'm not worried about that at all. Yeah, I mean, what you're going to do? Look, you saw what they tried to do to Janus throughout the game,

which brings me another, if you're Philly, you're trying to prove that you're not afraid of Janus, period, not afraid of the Bucks, and I'm going to let you know that. And so you saw the foul that Mbid took on Janus? I'm surprised that I haven't gotten the level of, for lack of a better way to put it, crying, about all flagrant fouls and trying to hurt somebody

and dirty play. I haven't gotten the level of that that I usually get when someone crosses the line because that was a clear crossing of the line. That boy tried to yore around him and be stopped through the elbow right in his damn ribs.

I'm not beefing. Like I'm not calling for anything, but that is what happened. Like that's not a regular foul. He tried to separate his ribs. And so I think Philly was there to prove from even during play that we ain't afraid of you

and we'll take shots at you and you're going to have to pick your ass up and dust yourself off and shoot these free throws like this is how he's going to get down. So I don't think they're worried at all about how he feels about what Montrez did because Montres just didn't get his opportunity

to do it in game and said I'm a good. Okay, well let me get my little taste. You just made me hell of excited. I'm locked in. I'm locked in. No one's at fault here. Let's just, let's just all place.

Let's just do it. That's who. It's that old school shit. It's that old school shit that we didn't know because it was just in books. Now we got video cameras and stuff like that.

Like now we can see the pettiness and it becomes like, this used to be something that you read like 20 years later, right? Or you read in a newspaper, bro. Now that Auntie Jackie would tell us. Like, you remember when this happened back 85? Like that's,

we're seeing this full time. I love it. Say a quick break. Let's talk about what Raza describes as the tenor of the league. Get more out of your holiday week with Fandual because new customers get $125 in free bets guaranteed when you place your first $5 bet.

All right. So this Thanksgiving, a lot of good games on tap. The one I'm really looking at is Chicago Boston. I'm going to take Boston with the points. I'm also going to take the Jason Tatum over. And I might take threes over made by Chicago. I know they haven't shot it well, but I like them for that. And I might turn all of that into a same game parlay.

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Restrictions apply. See terms at sportsbook.Fandul.com. Gambling problem? Call 1-800 gambler or visit fanduil.com slash RG. That's in Colorado, Iowa, Michigan, New Jersey, Pennsylvania, Illinois, or Virginia. 1-800 next step or text next step to 533442. 1-88-889-7777 or visit ccpg.org slash chat in Connecticut. 1-8009 with it.

In Indiana, 1-877-770 Stop, Louisiana. visit MD gambling help.org in Maryland, Tennessee. That's your red line. 1-800-889-9-9789. Again, that's Tennessee. Visit KSgamblinghelp.com in Kansas, 1-800-2-2-470 in Wyoming or visit www. W.W.W.W.combler.net in West Virginia. Hey, yo, it's Charles from the Ring of Music Show. Midnight Boys Poo-Pew. Long-time Real Ones listener, first-time caller. Yo, this is Faraja. You need to get your boy Logan, man. You got to put it along with some new music, some oldies and shit. You can't keep texting me asking me if I heard the new Don Tolliver. I've had enough. I've had enough.

And we are back. Okay, guys, we had a plan to talk about some stuff. We're going to get to it. But over the break, Roger had a real rant to get off his chest because Ty Bell had to go to practice. And Roger had an exchange. I'm going to let Rosa just explain the exchange and they just go on his rant. Roger, what you got? Okay. You go to basketball. Any hooper knows that when you go to hoop. You don't wear your hoop shoes, right? You don't wear your hoop shoes to the event. You put them on when you get there, right? So typically, you're in slides with your socks, especially in Florida or warmer weathers, right? Like it might be ugs or boots or something else somewhere else. But my son is going in his slides with his socks, but it's pouring outside. And he's got to get an Uber to practice.

So my exchange is, hey, bud, just put some sneakers on or something to that effect. So your socks stay dry. And then when you get there, you can put your hoop shoes on and you got a nice, warm, cozy toes. Yeah, no, I'm just going to wear this slide. Hey, fine. Don't call me halfway through practice telling me you got blisters on your feet because your socks are soaked. It's not going to be my problem.

Bigger picture, Logan, and I'm sorry. Three boys from 10 to 15. Any listener here, please allow me. And if you feel me, shoot me, shoot me something on Twitter. How can I buy socks monthly and no one can ever find any socks? Where'd you go the other day, Roger? I was in Dix yesterday. I swear to God, roughly 24 hours ago

because my son had a two, it was 24 hours ago. My son had 2 o'clock at the league game. Couldn't find socks. Hysterical crying, 10 years old. He didn't have any socks. I'm like, dude, so I run to Dix. I buy six packs of socks, ankle socks. Spread them out here.

Everybody take however many pairs of socks. I guarantee you by next week, Monday, when we pot again, no one will have damn socks. It's crazy. Dude, I don't, listen, I know. I'm sorry. Like, you can't make it. this up. Oh, we're good. I'm like, I check my wife. I said, hey, Cindy, like, you're putting

the socks back? Like, I know, are you? She's like, no, I put it back. I mean, I know, you know, they come in, I put them back. Like, you know, and I put them back when I do the while. I'm like, bro, I know you guys have socks. I buy them and your mom and I both put them back, but don't nobody ever have socks. You know what I hate about socks, bro? Because I've been going through a little bit of a stock journey myself, bro. Dog, I'll be buying the stance socks. I'll be buying the fucking, what's it, the Bonobos, the Bomba socks, bro. The fucking, I even bought, like, some of the NBA socks because they seem to be like, you know, they seem to last, right? I don't, I don't try to barefoot the socks around the house.

And I wear the fucking, I put the crocky poos on all the time over the socks. I kid you not. Every, like, after two weeks, there's a motherfucking hole where my fucking sock is right here. here every two weeks. Raja, what the fuck? Like, how do I get past this? I'm so upset because I try to be, I try to be responsible.

I don't know what to do. I promise we're getting to NBA. It's coming, but like, this is where we're at right now. This is where we're popping up. I used to buy nice socks for them. I used to buy them all kind of like the Nike thick NBA joint.

I used to buy all of that for them. And then, I mean, this is when they were younger. Quickly, I was like, no, we're getting, whatever,

the generic white and black ankle socks, because that's all they really want anyway. So that's what we're getting. But my 10-year-old came home from school the other day in his slides. Black ankle socks, right? Maybe this is where one of the pairs went. Whole heel hanging out.

Like the entire heel hanging out, right? So now I'm like, I said, Zen, you went to school like that, bro? He's like, what? I said, dude, your heel is hanging out of your sock. Like, have you been walking around school all day? That's embarrassing. That reflects on me, bro. Like, you've been walking around with a big ass hole in your shirt?

He was like, no. Did he even go to dicks right now, bro? Because I can go to dicks for. So he said, but listen, this is the, 10 year old stuff. I said, Zen. Hey man. I said, was that hole this morning there this morning?

No. I said, okay, so were you running around the playground with your slides off and just your socks? No. I said, Zen. Now, you know, I know you're 10 and you don't realize that I already know the answer to this, buddy, but I'm going to ask you again because there's no way that there was a hole put in that sock unless you were running around that playground without your socks on. Were you running around the playground without your socks on?

Yes, fine. Don't do it again. And now I got to go buy more socks. let's get back to the NBA, bro. I went on my sock rant. We'll table this discussion in the future episodes. But if you want, honestly, if you're, be your Roger Secret Santa,

just lock in and get us some socks, please, because we need it. It's, it's, it's an, it's an epidemic on socks right now. Anywho, you know who got these socks up and they, and they, and they, um,

and they shoes lace tight? No, but I love, I love how you doing it. I love how you're doing it, but we lock the fuck in. The Oklahoma City Thunder, more specifically,

Shea Gilgas Alexander. Oh, boy, bawling. The dude is balling. Third-Ikeye has the stats for me, so I'm going to read them out. He tied his career high with 42 points this season. He is averaging 31 points a game, five rebounds, six assists, a block a game, and a steal a game. He's currently in the 50, 40-90 club, getting some fake weight MVP buzz.

I just wanted to shout him out really quickly, but it goes to a larger, a larger picture for me. And it goes to what you were saying in the last segment, rah-rah. which is the tenor of this league seems to be, maybe the talent in this league might not be as balanced as in previous years, but the effort level here has been really, really great to see. I was watching Warriors, just briefly watching Warriors Rockets last night. And these two teams clearly have different objectives and different goals for this season.

The Warriors want to win a title, another title. And the Rockets honestly just want to develop and figure things out. you know, undercoat Silas. And they're doing a good job. They're showing spurts, right? But the Rockets last night played their ass off, right? And pushed the Warriors to the brink. Warriors ended up winning, but it was a really, really entertaining game, right?

I'm starting to see this around the league, right? Even, and I know, I know, we'll talk about the factors later, but I'm seeing teams like the Pistons ball, right? Who are obviously, they're trying to build exponentially, but they're not there yet. but they're just trying, right? I'm seeing the Sacramento Kings who have been real one of the weak contenders, right? I have seen other teams around the league

really trying to lock in Orlando, again, also playing, also playing hard. I like what I'm seeing, Raja. What have you attributed this to? And what have you seen from just the overall level of play in the NBA this year? Yeah, this is a working theory.

Feel free to poke holes in it. I'm sure there are a lot of them, but I'm just kind of conceptualizing this as I speak, right? I think that what you're seeing is a league that for the most part trains everyone the same. So, you know, it used to be that if you were a minus, if you were a bad team, and let's say, let's use our Bobcats team, for example, when I went to the Bobcats. And you had, you know, Gerald Wallace was really good. And, you know, but he wasn't like a primary creator.

Raymond Felton was good and he was a primary creator, but at a certain level. You know what I mean? Boris Diyah was fantastic, but not a primary creator on like a championship team. A creator and like probably a really good two or three. But you know what I mean? And then me who was a spot up shooter, you know? So we didn't have any real creator. So it was going to be really hard for us to get buckets.

Like it just was. There were some nights where if one of those guys were missing, guess who your primary creator was on that team? Yours truly. And I couldn't do it. So Larry Brown would have to run me off of a thousand screens trying to get me jump shots. And I do my best to lead us in scoring and try to get us to win. But the point is, you know, I didn't train to be a primary creator.

None of those guys trained to be primary creators other than probably Raymond Felton. And so our team, when we saw, you know, let's say Boston or any other team that had multiple guys that were primary creators, like we were going to be fighting an uphill battle. And you were probably going to get blown out because they had that much more offensive firepower than you did. today's players all trained basically to be primary creators. I mean, yeah, there's some three and D guys. But when you see all these dudes in their offseason work and stuff, we had a lot of specialists when I played.

And you fit, I've talked about this before. Like you fit in your box, boom, this is what you're going to do. You're run the corner, you're shoot three, bomb. Or you're going to come off curls. This is what we're working all offseason, baby. And without the amount of like pure skill, skill guys, like they are so many of them now that can can really work with you. you to mature your game and round out your offensive arsenal.

We didn't have that at our disposal for the most part. So you worked on what you were already, you know, used to working on. I think there are way more teams that have a bunch of guys on it that can go offensively. And so it lends itself, like those teams you mentioned, like they're playing hard, but like the magic have five wins and Houston's got three wins. And so playing hard and a lot of talent that can really go with the ball, they're still going to get beat, though, by better teams, more mature. in the process, just closer

to what you want the end result to be. But I think you're seeing just more parity in terms of skill sets, if that makes sense. It's funny because the way you talk about your Bobcats, it reminds me of like, you know what it feels like, and correct me

if I'm wrong, we're just shooting the shit right now. It reminds me of like an updated version of the Bobcats team that you described seems like the Utah Jazz. You get what I'm saying? Where you have a lot of skills. field guys, right? But there's the evolution of like, I don't know, maybe you're Colin Sexton if the Bobcats are, you know, are the, are an updated version, right? With, like, you were

taught more how to be more of a ball handler, right? Or maybe you're that. And then there's a Lori market. It all goes in, um, in stages, right? Because our generation watched Tracy McGrady and like Kobe and that's what we love to watch, right? And so we, whereas maybe your generation, obviously you guys saw Michael Jordan. But before that, it was Magic Johnson and Steve Kerr, bro. Shout out of Steve Kerr. You know, no, but like somebody like me. Yeah.

You know, I wasn't under, I love Mike. I'm patterning my game. Probably not Steve, but more like Reggie Miller and stuff like that. Yeah. And like what we see is that we want to emulate. Like we have so much of our like our generation to generation after mine. We have so many examples of what is successful in the league. And that is Michael Jordan.

That is Kobe Bryant. That's Kevin Durant, right? That's Steph Curry. There's these wild offensive guys to the point where like even big guys want to be, want to be guards now, right? Even like guys, like Joellen Bede's game is the way it is because obviously, yeah, he has the Elijah on factor, but he also grew up watching like Michael Jordan. So I think that that is also kind of, that's kind of at play where we're at right now

in the game we're at right now. That's accurate. I also, you know, with the amount of space that is afforded to players now because the floor is wide open, you know, it kind of forces everyone to have to be able to play make in a way that we weren't really forced to have to play make because you were running more sets. The paint was more clogged. There wasn't anywhere to really go anyway. Only the only a select few were going to be able to navigate through that. Like the space in your air was nasty dog. Like watching it now. Right. It's like we're in the middle. We're all inside of the three point line and that's it.

You know, there's so much, the court seems so much bigger watching games from like 01 to 08. You know what I'm saying? It just seems like we're just going to pack right here and we're going to just run action in the paint. We're not even going to think about shooting three. It's the mid-range game. Well, I mean, when I got from, it was probably 05, 06 maybe, was the year, my last year in Utah the first time I was in Utah. And we ran jerry's and it was Phil Johnson's offense that they had ran for. for years, right? It was a lot of UCLA cuts, a lot of gaggles on the weak side, and everything was

so tight in terms of its proximity to each other. So all of the passes were like little shovel passes and everything was so tight and congested. And the people who had played for the jazz, like Matt Harper thrived in that. Watch old Matt Harper clips of him just cutting and dicing through the lane and getting these little tight passes, almost like you're running like wishbone offense in football. And it's all. congested and then the next year. Matt Harper used to get on my nerves, bro, because he was so good.

He used to get on my nerves, dog. Yeah, that was a good TV. Matt was my dude. But then the next year, right? So you're talking about how different the game is. I mean, that happened to me overnight. So I leave Utah. I go to Phoenix.

And my first day in Phoenix, it's like, hey, man, do not go down there. Do not get, everything I did in Utah was roughly, like, free throw line extended, or if I'm on the weak side, we're going to be in this gaggle, which is, which is kind of like at the hash of the baseline and like halfway up the lane.

So you're really in a clogged up point of the floor. That's where you're going to operate on the weak side when I was with the jazz. So I get to Phoenix and they're like, yo, number one, we don't want you anywhere near free throw line extended, get all the way into the corner. So I remember stepping into the corner like on my first couple of reps and Mike D'Anne and stopping it after like three, you know, down and backs and being like, Raj, that's not the corner. And I'd look down and I'd be like, well, what the hell do you mean? And he's like, they're like three feet between you in the corner.

Get in the corner. And that's how much he wanted to maximize the space, right? And he wanted you nowhere near the paint. You're running, not for a layup, I'm running for threes. Y'all used to make teams so tired just by doing that. You know what I'm saying? Just like doing it. I guess because you brought this up.

And it makes me think like how much of this spacing and where we're at right now has to do with, the European influence, right? Because you just spoke about Mike Dantonie, who is a revolutionary guy in the way we see offense and the way we see spacing on the offensive in. But his whole game was he was in the Italian leagues and just a lot more free-flowing,

especially back then. How much of that influence kind of influenced the league and just guys that are just in those types of systems? Or was that just a natural evolution of the game as a whole? I think that Mike, being exposed to it. You know, there were other people that were exposed to it. I think that certainly started to help us trend in that direction. But what really happened, I think, was the evolution of the European skilled big. Right? And so- Like Sabonis? Yeah, it opened people's,

it opened people's minds up to like, we don't have to anchor him to the block. Like, they can operate in space. And, you know, once you took that big and put him out on the, the floor and you could play off of him because he could pass the hell out of it and he could shoot and do different things. Well, you know, that just started the dominoes falling because now I need a big that can guard that, right? And I need, you know, they're just different, there's different things that happen. So I think the coaches that, the coaches that were over there and that were, that were used to see in it and then us starting to bring those, those players over to where they could create and make plays out on the floor. And then, you know, that's trend now. That's

where we're training. Like now we see it and we're going to start to train our bigs to play like that and they can be out on the floor and make decisions and be skilled. And so now you've got a league full of super skilled people again. I think I think you're seeing a league that as a whole, this skill level is just so much higher than it's ever been. And so you see that bear itself out from from game to game. Yeah. It's been it's been really, really fun, man. It's been fun to see this. I think I'd be remiss to before we get out of here not to talk about this particular player who was out here balling out of his mind. Anthony Davis, I got to give him a man flowers. Okay. You know, I got to give him flowers over the last three games. All right. He just came off of a

modest performance against the Pistons 38.16 boards, four blocks. Third-a-kai has a question. And I think we're just going to throw this out here. And let's see where this conversation goes before we get out of here. Is this sustainable without LeBron? Roger. I vote yes. I think, Yes. I mean, he has a lot more spacing. He can lead a team. He can obviously lead a team. The question is going to be once LeBron comes back, how he's adjust to this new AD and if AD can be consistent. Is this sustainable without LeBron? Mind you, I've also been like, I've also been listening to a lot of propaganda and group chats from Jomey. So I'm like a little bit more optimistic. Okay. All right. All right. So I should be. We'll just optimistic isn't the right word. You're guest.

Okay. Okay, yeah. So that's fine, though. I mean, it's fine. I think that it is sustainable without LeBron, but the level that you are sustaining is in a championship level, if that makes sense. Sure.

Yeah, they're winning some games. He's playing great. That shit ain't winning a championship. So could he keep it going? I mean, yeah, I guess until he gets injured. But, no, I mean, that's going to happen. Right? I mean, we don't have to debate that.

Do we have to debate that still? No, no. All right. So, I mean, when he was in the put-in. Yeah, he's going. So, but yeah, I think his skill, look, his skill level is, is going to produce. It has to. I mean, you're that size, that skilled. You have those type of, you know, superhuman abilities. It's going to produce. But I don't think it's at a championship level without LeBron. And this goes back to the conversation that we had a couple weeks ago about when LeBron is sitting back watching, his head at in this? I don't have the answer. I don't know. Like, where is LeBron's head at? Is LeBron

strategic about what he does when he comes back so that maybe AD can still feel as comfortable as he does right now, but they can get the supplementation of LeBron? I hate saying that because that's not really what it's going to be, but can they work together in a way? Is there a way that LeBron can figure out how this works where he can come back and do what he does at the level that he does it? And AD can still do this. And, And, you know, that would be your hope if you were the Lakers. I don't have the answer for that.

Okay, you're just not optimistic. That's fine. No, no, no, no. Listen, optimistic about what? Like, what level of optimism do Laker fans, please tap me in? I don't know. What level of optimism?

I don't know. I think at this point, I think at this point, just like get into a playing game or something like that. Oh, I mean, I'm not ruling that out. I'm not saying that can't happen at all. I mean, but I didn't think that's where,

you know, shit. If the Lakers are at that point, then I'm, you know, that's never what I, when I talk about, and I guess this is a compliment to the Lakers. Whenever I talk about the Lakers and LeBron, I talk, I talk in championship terms. I don't really mess around like eight, nine, I don't concern myself with playing games with LeBron. So if that's the case, then I don't see that as a win. That's a, that's not a win. Sorry, bud.

Speaking of winning, let's go to my, to go to my ruin of the week. I've been really hard on this team throughout much of this season, and rightfully so, because they've just, disappointed me at every fucking turn. The Las Vegas, Oakland, LA Raiders, baby. Oh, wow. Got a big win in Denver. A big ugly win against Russell Wilson. A big ugly win.

Just a big old school AFC West win. It was. I was talking to one of my partners the other day. I came into this season with a lot of expectations. And it just didn't happen for the Raiders, right? And I get why. And you can go back to the old episodes to see why I was just pissed at them. But honestly, I just got.

back into my bag because Raja, my team has been trashed for so long that this is the, this is the, this is the, um, just the arc that I go on normal Raiders season. So coming with some expectations, hey, we're going to be better than people think we are, right? Raiders lose their first, however many games. They're clearly out of the postseason. I get upset. I probably take a, I probably just take a few weeks off, because I just know that they suck, right? And then towards the end, when it starts getting a little colder during November, I start locking back in because then they play spoiler to other teams. And then I'm here for it. Then I'm locked in.

I guess that's just the NFL season for me. So to go into Denver, to go into Denver and win the way that they did, Raja, tears down my face. And overtime the way, it's the ugly, nice just November game. Las Vegas, Oakland, L.A. Raiders. My real one of the week. I can dig it. I give two then. Since you went football, I was going to go basketball.

I'll do that last on football. I'm going to go with the Dallas Cowboys. I'm going to go with the Dallas Cowboys and Dak Prescott. I mean, I heard you all out there last week talking about, you know, is Dak going to be the biggest problem with the team and they're not going to be able to win? Yeah, they lost in Lambo to Aaron Rogers and crew, but they came back and popped Minnesota. I think Minnesota's fools gold, but I did like the way they responded. So I'm going to give Dallas, and they're about to get Odell Beckham Jr.

So I'm about to give the Dallas Cowboys. Yeah, real ones at a week. Wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, wait, real question real quick before you get to your second round of the week. So you're from Florida, obviously, right? The Cowboys propaganda is strong everywhere, including where I'm at. I know it's particularly strong in Florida as well, no matter what team or teams are there. Do you succumb to the Cowboys propaganda every once in a while? I'm not a Cowboys fan.

Uh-uh. Okay. No, but I kind of like Dak, and I actually do like the Cowboys. I'm not a Cowboy fan, though, if that makes sense. Like I like the team that they got. You like the spectacle, though. Do you respect the spectacle? No, I'm here for all of that.

I'm here for the good, bad end, the ugly. Shout out to my boy, Tua, like straight up. He should have been, real one of the week, even though they didn't play this week. Put some respect on my dog's name. Okay, Tua is out here. Tua is out here in the MVP, legitimate MVP discussions. Let's go. So sorry, that's going to be three real ones.

Because my real, real one of the week is my young, like, nephew. Jordan Durkak, who came out of Colonia High School two years ago, got caught up into COVID, recruiting thing, had to go to prep school at Spire. A lot of programs slept on young Jordan. He's at Merrimack now, Division 1 up in Massachusetts, came out, dropped 18 and 9 on St. John's his first game. I think he's there. He's averaging like 11 or 12 a game as a freshman, like eight boards.

He's a 6-5 guard. His dad played with me in college. Like, shout out to Jordan Durkak for being out here in these streets, like representing FIU and his and his pops. There you go. There you go. Let's go, man. Hey, man, this is a good little pre- Thanksgiving real ones, man. Everybody, we love y'all.

Make sure y'all have a great Thanksgiving. If you want to know where I'm going to be at, I'm on a flight to Florida because I'm going to my auntie Bill's house. Yes. I'm going to get some food. Let's do it. I'm on a flight to Florida.

Hey. Pumpkin pie or sweet potato pie, bro? Only right answers accepted. I love me some sweet potato pie. Okay. I'm not going to hone you. But I'm not mad at pumpkin pie. I'm not mad either, but you're right.

Here's the thing, no. I love both. I'm sorry. If you put both in my face, I'm going to eat it. You're going to take a slice of both. Okay, that's fair. Because I do not dislike pumpkin pie. By preference is sweet potato pie.

Correct. It's the only right answer. I mean, listen, listen, listen. It's the only right answer. I'll fuck up either one. It's all good. Good for you. All right, man.

Make sure y'all lock in on the sweet potato and the pumpkin pie, man. And make sure y'all save some leftovers from me and Rai, we will see you guys on Monday. Y'all have a great week. Have a great weekend. We'll holl it back. Peace.