The Ringer NBA Show - The Warriors Came to Play (Ep. 121)

Episode Date: June 5, 2017

The Ringer's Chris Vernon is joined by NBA writer Zach Harper to discuss LeBron's fatigue (5:00), the Cavs' chances to right the ship in Cleveland (13:00), the reason to blame Bill Russell for the Warriors' superteam (24:00), Durant playing center (28:00), and Russell's favorite TV show (34:00). Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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promo code Ringer NBA today. Welcome to the Ringer NBA show. I'm Chris Vernon. Joining me today is Zach Harper. You can read them at fanragsports.com. You can follow my Twitter at Talkoops. What's up, Zach? Hey, this series is like kind of over, right? Is it? I don't know. I keep trying to make comparisons to last year, and they're like, well, game three, Cleveland came back and destroyed the Warriors in their home court,

and you just look at all the things that win in Cleveland's favor, even if all those things happen. And this becomes the issue, right? When we saw in the San Antonio series, which got marred by Kauai being out, but Durant and Curry simultaneously are at peak of powers and you figure, I mean, I would have figured one of them can at least be made somewhat inefficient

but instead Durant's been out of his mind the first two games and Curry had a triple double last night. So they have not slowed down either of them a bit and that's the problem, right? No, and you look at that, you look at like, look at how LeBron's defending right now. If he's getting into the second half of these games, he looks exhausted because they can't hide him anywhere. It's not like you need to hide him because it's a bad defender.

You just need to hide him to give him a breather, especially when Kyrie Irving is giving you virtually nothing. I mean, I know he ended up with 19 points last night, but it was one of the most empty 19 points to lepros of the NBA final. He went like 8 of 23. And you look at like, Kyrie's giving him nothing. Kevin Love had a good, you know, first half. And I'm a pretty good game overall. But Tristan Thompson has been almost unplayable in the first two. game. So it means like LeBron has to do even more than he already had to do.

And on top of that, he's got a guard. You know, it's not like you're being like, hey, guard Harrison Barnes. He's hot. He's got to guard Kevin Duran or he's got to guard Draymond Green or he's got to chase curry around on a switch or whatever. And that's just, you know, I guess we're finally seeing LeBron look somewhat human. Here's what I'll say. And I blame Tyron Liu for this.

In the end, LeBron, yes, he clearly, he said he needed like, he didn't need to be. EIVed. He needs food and wine, right? Maybe we can give him food and wine at half-time. But that's not the issue. That's what he needs to do, right? Just get food and wine at high-time. Ben Baker? What are we doing? We can't do that. We can't wait till after the game. Here's the truth. You can't burn him out like that. And the way you burn him out like that is by playing at this absurd pace. They literally have no chance of matching up small and no chance about gunning the Warriors. And that's seemingly how they're playing it. And so, of course, he was going to the basket a ton in the first half. And I just, I sit there in awe. Like, why are you playing it out

this way? There's no way you're going to outscore them. Like, you've got to, you've got to play some half-court basketball against this team. And you've got to get to the foul line. And instead, they're trying to, they're trying to race up and down the court. And then you see this in the second half. Guess what? The Warriors are still racing up and down the court, and the Cavs are, they got their hands on their knees. Right, and like, pretty much outplayed them, right? I mean, they

outplayed them in 2015, and they outplayed them for the first four games of 2016, and then the Cavaliers make this amazing comeback with, you know, a couple of fluky things, and a couple of just really incredible, I was about to say gritty things, but I don't want to

take it. Some really tough things of ways to get back in the series. They went championship, historic comeback, boom, everything's great. But the most part, they've been outplayed over the last two years. And when they were getting outplayed in 2015, they said, all right, well, we got these injuries. You know what, LeBron, just you take the ball, you're going to crawl the ball up the court. Like, we're just going to slow everything down. We're going to make this an ugly, just throw things in the mud and see who comes out of it type of game.

And, you know, Cleveland could kind of survive that way. It eventually died, but they kind of, you know, and survived that way. Now the Warriors have Durant and everyone's healthy. Curry certainly looks healthier than he did last year. You almost think like this full-strength Cavaliers team or as full-strength as

you can be at this point this season. They have to do that. They have to just walk the ball up. There are no transition. You can't be. You get a turnover. You just have to walk everything up and make this as ugly and slow as possible. You've seen it when you saw

Oklahoma City get up 3-1. against the Warriors last year. You've seen it over the course of the past couple of years with teams that have had any level of success against the Warriors, right? You have to play slow. You have to put them into a half-court game, and you have to be the way more physical team. And that's what's even more perplexing.

Cleveland, like, they offer no resistance. Where are, like, the hard fouls? Where are, like, the, we're coming out here and trying to play. Like, coaches always say play with force. it's just like they're they've been willing to get in these track meets with the Warriors and then they get their ass run out in the third quarter and then even it was even pretty deep into the third quarter

and it was still a two possession game but you could you could see blood in the water and that this thing this thing could get out of hand rather quickly especially because like I said when they were going to the foul line and stuff you saw guys are like their hands on their their hands on their knees those guys you could tell they can't make this 10 more minutes playing like this.

Right. And it leaves these moments in each game so far looks like the Warriors are doing layup drills. I mean, you're right. Like, there's no resistance at all. There's no hard foul.

And it can't be that, like Tristan used to be that guy, not the hard foul guy, but he was just, he was tagging everyone when they came to the lane. He was hedging these screens and bumping guys

and being physical and playing defense with his arms. But in a way that, you know, it wasn't getting called so he was able to get away with it. Maybe he feels it's going to get called now. Maybe he's exhausted, whatever it is. But Tristan Thompson has to be the guy that tone.

J.R. Smith has to be the guy that tone. LeBron has to be that physical guy. And Kevin Love, I mean, I didn't realize what I'm saying. But Kevin Love has to be a physical force inside. It doesn't mean he has to be to Kempe Batumbo and start turning shots away at the rim. He's got to put bodies on guys and check them when they come through. And, like, this is going to be the dumbest question I ever asked you. and I feel confident of that.

Is there a certain point where you just need to bring Dante Jones into a finals game early and let him stirs stuff up? Either Dante or like DeAndre Liggins or whoever. Right. Someone like, kid, go earn a contract next year. Hey, this is how effed up this is. I swear, this is. There was a moment last night where I'm sitting there going,

God, man, they really miss Delavadova. I was just, I was seriously about to say that. They miss Matthew Delavadova. That's where I felt like he had some, he was gritty, he was diving on the floor, he was, it's crazy because he is that type of guy. And you have this even in your workplace, right? If you see somebody that's just always working harder than everybody else, it inevitably raises the level of work and or play of everybody else because you don't want to feel like an idiot. Like, this guy's diving on the floor. This guy's giving everything he's got.

I'm taking the easy street the whole way. I see that guy and I go, nope, that guy's a sucker. That guy's a sucker. Delvedova, I honestly had this moment last night. Like, man, they sure could have used. They could use him just roughing somebody up. And if it's not him, Delly, somebody making that type of play, pissing the other team off or diving on the ground or diving at somebody's ankles

or catching a rebound and throwing an elbow in traffic. Like something like that. It's like that edge that, like they have had no. edge in the first two games whatsoever. None. None. And, you know, I mean, the guy that they have on the roster who could actually do that and doesn't, you know, make you laugh like Dante Jones does, is Eamont Chumper. Like, Eamon Chumper can be that gritty, you know, chase everyone around, be a physical defender type of perimeter guy. That's funny. You say that. I thought about this, Zach. You might remember this sequence last night at the game where Curry tried to set like four

screens and this is at the top of the key. Duran had the ball and Curry like trying to set four different streams and Shumper just chucked him out of the way four straight times. Yeah. He just decided. And the reason that that stood out so much is because it was juxtaposed against. Kyrie just like he dies on screens. He just gives up. Oh my God. I mean.

It's unbelievable. You saw Shumper just throw guys out of the way. And I've always believed that's the best way to try to deal. with the Warriors is just try to blow up all those screens. Just stay with your guy. Yes. You have to. And you can't do the switching stuff anymore because, because Durant, there is no guy to switch

off of. And now you, you know, you still have a pretty favorable matchup everywhere. And that's the problem that brings up. And the thing with Shumper, though, why he can't be the Delvedova guy is because Delhi could, like, run a pick and roll and, you know, throw a lot. Lopped Trista, right? Or he had that funky-looking floater. Or, as the great Miles Brown once said, he looks like he's jumping out of a birthday cake when he shoots a jumper. But that jumper would lead to 40% from free. Like, he's a 40%

three-point shooter in Cleveland. And so, like, he had these little things. Shumper looks like a drunk puppy trying to catch a frisbee every time he has a basketball. Like, he's got, like, he has played some of the most horrendous offense I've seen in the playoffs during these first two games. And it's not like he's a high-volume guy, it's just his possession, he's maximizing how bad he can be on those possessions. He's dribbling way too much. His jumpers way off. He's not getting to the best.

He's not really doing anything with the ball. He's not setting guys up. And so, like, even if he's that guy on defense, the guy he is on offense, it's like J.R. Smith got zapped by the monster. He's just, like, he's playing like J.R. Smith should, but without any of the results, you think J.R. could actually have. And it feels like with the Cavs, it was 13 games. in a row that they have played which featured a little resistance and they end up

through those 13 games that they played in the Eastern Conference playoffs with 120.7 offensive rating per 100 possessions which is the best in the mark in the last 40 years and it feels like it was all Fool's Gold and that they bought into it and maybe not fools gold against maybe anybody else but fools gold against what you can do against the Warriors the last thing that the Cavs needed to be was amazing offensively, right? Because now you get to this point, and you ain't going to be as good as them, and they've got a defense that was fantastic throughout these playoffs, and it was like, okay, you ran up

all these scores, and it feels like Cleveland's still playing the way that they did when they were up 70 to 20 or whatever the hell it was against the Celtics. Right? And they just think they can win. Absolutely. They have very good reason to believe they can win like that, right? And it's just not dropping or whatever. But that was all fool's gold when it comes to the Warriors.

Because you try to play like you did against Boston. Yeah, you can be up 40 points at halftime against them. But not against this team. You're never going to be up like that against this team. So you better figure out how to slow this thing down and play some half-core basketball. And I'll admit, I got stuck in. Because I thought, oh, here we go. Me too.

Cavaliers had that one little blip against Boston. They're up 23 in that game. That's a fluky loss. So they should be undefeated. We should have two undefeated teams right now, two highest-powered offenses. Like, this is going to be incredible. I got sucked in.

And now that March the Eastern Conference playoffs, it feels like I'm the fan going, look, I know this team's struggling right now, but do you see them in preseason? Like, they were clicking in preseason. Like, that's what it feels like. All the Eastern Conference playoffs feel like they were just preseason. And then none of that stuff,

and none of it will ever matter. I mean, last night, and I agree with everything you just said about, like, hey, man, like, forget the offense. Their defense is horrendous, right? And this was the thing that was supposed, like, we knew was a question throughout the season. They said they were going to put a switch. They said they had secret and they, you know, plans and all this stuff. And they, they were going to have it figured out. And it looked like at times other than the Indiana series, like they dominated Toronto. They dominated Boston. Their defense looked really good at certain points of those series. But now, like, you, you look. You, you look at, look at it last night and they were minus 30 at the three point line.

They gave up 18 threes and they only hit eight and you can, I mean, you couldn't do that against a high school team. If you minus 30 at a at the three point line, especially not an NBA final game. Well, and I saw one of the things watching it last night, one, I will make an excuse for Cleveland in the sense that there's this moment last night in the maybe third or maybe early fourth where Curry pulls it from 30 feet away. it's like okay what am I going to do

am I going to shit on them for their bad defense like that's just like I guess you could have face guarded him from 94 me we're really like that okay so there's really no defense for that on the other hand the reason that their defense

I think especially in those Easter conference playoffs was not nearly as bad as what the bigger sample size gave us was because they were always scoring the other teams couldn't stop them and so they're always scoring.

And their half-court defense can get by. But that's the issue. Now they've run into a team that they don't score on at will. And so they don't get to play half-court defense very much. Right? When you're not, their offense, and I get it, their defense is no good. It's really their transition defense because they cannot cross-match and they cannot run up and down the court,

especially given the personnel that they have and play. If you put them just in a, okay, we're going to walk it up, you take a possession, you walk it up, we'll take a possession. Their defense is, it's not, it's not abhorrent, but they don't play defense like that much because they can't score the same way that they did. And so now this is all some kind of a reality. That being said, you move into game three. I absolutely think that I would give them credit that there can be an awareness, okay. seeing how we can play. The other thing is you're going to have the home crowd. Psychologically, game three is always the one that even if it's a bad series, the home team

can get because the other team, you know, they don't lose that much. If they lose the first, if they lose game three, it ain't that big of a deal. They'll just win in their minds, game four, and then go close it out at home in game five. I think that's what Vegas thought at the beginning of all of this, which was the, right, the most, the most likely scenario, betting-wise was Warriors in 5. Well, I've got to believe that that was... And then the second most likely scenario was Warriors in 7. So the idea is they can win-gave...

I think they could slow it down, pound it into the ground, and the other thing is they might get a million calls in game 3. Because this is going the wrong, wrong way. And it felt like last night for the first time, the majority of NBA fans were going, okay, we all thought this was stupid last July, but now that we're seeing it all play out, this sucks. And they're mad about it, right?

Right, I mean, they are mad about it. The only redeeming quality here for putting a stamp on this season. And, you know, I'll enjoy anything. I'll enjoy a Hornets game on a Tuesday night, right? Like, I'll watch anything. I love it all. I can get behind all this stuff. But, like, looking at the casual fans' perspective or even, you know, an NBA nerd like me who just doesn't care about elitism as much as others do, you know, I can see it and be like, the only redeeming quality here is if the warrior sweep them.

Because then there is the historic, like, 16 and 0, and this is, and like, if you're going to create this elite, it has to be historically elitist. But then at the same time, like, that justifies the entire thing in a way that it's like, this is a team. team that we will talk about forever. But the problem with that is nobody likes this team. This isn't the 96 Bulls. Like, nobody outside of the Bay Area likes the team because it feels like they stack the deck. So in that respect, you almost think, like, well, Cleveland has to get back in the series to redeem it, but that feels like this hopeful wish.

Like, I am trying to make all these comparisons between last year and this year. And, you know, the point totals are similar. I think it was like 48 points plus 48 points in the last two games last year. or in the first two games last year it's like plus 41 right now. So like you have a similar thing and now they go back to Cleveland and make it to, you know, make a run at that

and try to flip the story of the series Wednesday night. But it also like kind of feels like the 2014 finals where sure LeBron got a game and so like a sweep wouldn't, you know, justify that or wouldn't justify that comparison. But in 2014 there was a certain point

where LeBron just kind of looked like, like he knew. And it was, well, I'm going to look good because my numbers are going to be good, and I'm going against this guy, Kwai Leonard, and I have incredible individual matchup. My numbers will look good, but we're not doing anything here. We're getting blitz. And it kind of feels like a sweet version of that series right now. Like, LeBron kind of seems like he knows during these games, especially in the second half, like, we just don't, we can't weather the storm because Kevin Durant is a constant storm. So even if you get a poor performance from Clay or Dramon Green's in foul trouble or Steph Curry hasn't decided to like go MVP mode yet, you still have Kevin Durant to deal with.

And that's just got to suck. All right, Zach, we've got to take a quick break to hear from some of our sponsors. Today's show is brought to by the NBA Awards on TNT. Live from New York on Monday night, June 26, the NBA Award show begins at 9 p.m. Eastern and will be hosted by Drake. The awards are officially changing this year. In the past, NBA awards were announced sporadically once the season ended, but for the first time this year, the awards would be presented in person to the players and recipients in a brand new NBA awards show live on TNT.

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I want to see these great moments down the stretch. Somebody's got to make a play. At least it being in the balance with five minutes left to go. And it's been a playoffs, frankly, devoid of that for the most part. And now to the NBA finals, which I was just hoping. I was looking so forward to this that maybe we could get some great games. And obviously, we have not had, neither of the two games have been good. And so I'm doing whatever, what everybody else does is to ponder it.

After I get mad, I'm thinking of myself last night. I'm going, do you know how many frigging things had to go wrong last year, Zach, to set this up? Like, A, like eight things. A Duran has to lose, right? He has to lose to blow the 3-1 lead. Like Clay Thompson goes supernova in Oklahoma City or else Oklahoma City is going to win that series. So that has to happen. Then the Warriors who are up three to one have to get Dr.

on suspended four game five, and then who knows what the calves do? Maybe the calves look at it, but Durant doesn't go there if they win that championship. And then, so he doesn't go there if they win that championship. And on the flip side, what about the calves? If they got bombed out four to one in that finals, do they look at it and go, all right, this isn't going to work. We're not just going to run it back. But instead, you had this, you know, confluence of things that took place.

they end up winning the title, and now here we are. And the other thing is the whole cap smoothing, right? The fact that there was no, that it happened at this exact time, right when Durant was a free agent that enabled this to take place. Michelle Roberts negotiated for this, and so it enabled the Warriors to be added to Durant. And so I'm just thinking of myself last night, all the ways that this could have been sidetracked,

but instead it all felt all, the puzzle pieces fell together and now look and you just you sit back and you wonder like all right like you just got to pray for injuries with them it feels like like because if they're if they're gonna keep running this back like this is this is ridiculous yeah and like how many injuries do it's not like it's not draymond draymond yeah like it has to be draymond and someone yep but Draymond has to be the constant in like that Oh, I hope for injury And then you're the fan who hopes for injury

I know Like that's a horrible thing And think about like the You said like these These crazy events that have to happen To set up this there Goes back even earlier than that Like what if Harrison Barnes just goes

I want to be here I'll take that four year $68 million extension I'm not going to go out and get a max I don't need that Like I'm just happy being a part of this team I think we win championships forever I want to be the guy

I want to be Robert Orie I want to be the guy just wins championships year after year. What if earlier that season, at the beginning of that season, I think it was four years, $68 million as an extension. What if you just said, yeah? Then none of this happens. Oh, you're right.

And then what if? None of it is because they don't have any cap room. Well, and how about if Jerry West isn't in the front office of the Warriors to be able to sit down with Kevin Durant, you know, it was chronicled, he sits down and basically says, I left my career with all these regrets. I would have done this, I would have done this. Right.

You only get one chance to do this. And when Jerry West is sitting there telling you this, he's the logo, for God's sakes, right? You're right. And you know who's the blame for this? The great Bill Russell for kicking Jerry West's butt all the time. He's the one that sets this up. We're going to track it back. We're doing like the old Kevin Bacon game.

We're going to track this all the way back. The NBA was ruined because of Bill Russell. Hey, I should put that out. that is of all the scorching hot takes that are being given out, this is the season of the hot take, especially with all the Jordan LeBron stuff and everything else. If I do, if we say from this podcast, Bill Russell ruined the NBA. And then we tie it back to if Bill Russell doesn't kill Jerry West, Jerry West doesn't sit in an office with Kevin Durant telling him,

there are so many things I regret, don't look up, you know, 20 years from now and regret not being on a team that can win it. Hey man, after game three, I may not have any other angle to approach, so unless the ringer throws us out there tonight, like I don't know, I may, I may do this. You're going to sit on this?

I don't know what other angles to take. I wish it weren't so, and I did say, you know, we started the podcast you said, is this it feels over. And you were in that arena last night. And that

environment looks. I mean, when they get on their scoring, when the wave hits, the crowd goes absolutely bonkers. There's the timeout. It just, because of the way it looks on TV, and I'll give Golden State and their fans credit for this, it looks even worse than it really is, right? Because I remember last night, what was it? It was in the first half. Because by the end of the first half, it was less than a five-point game, or maybe it was a five-point game. Right. Okay, but there was a moment in the second quarter where Golden State went on a run and went up by like, I think it was 13 maybe before Cleveland went on a 9-0 run. But they were up 13. It goes to a commercial break.

I go to Twitter. I hit refresh. And there's a, you know, there's a hundred people in a row going, all right, we're done here. Because you're watching it on TV. And it's like, okay, dude, this is, this is over. Right? Crowds on top of them. Someone I was watching.

Someone I was sitting next to a media. remember I was sitting next to. We're like at the seven-minute mark in the earth. And they were just cruising. Like, we're just seven minutes into the game. You can't call the game then. All right. Let's get to Durant.

Miller Light holds true player is Kevin Durant. He, by far and away, would be the front-runner for the MVP through the first two games of the series. He has been otherworldly. And last night, there was another checkmark that he made. which is Draymond goes out of the game. They end up playing him as a small guy, big guy, as it were, almost like a center. And he's got five blocks.

He's got the three. He was this defensive force of nature last night like we've never seen before. And he has been credited this year and even last year as being a much better defender than he has previously been given credit for. But last night he was a forge of nature defensively. And I wonder, as this is all playing out, Zach, is it, do you think that this is greatly enhancing Durant? Or do you think everybody, I don't want to say everybody, a majority of fans, especially from other teams, are going, you know what, F that guy. Of course he's playing great.

He's playing with three other guys. He took the easy way out to a championship. And so nobody's really going to give him credit for being this totally ridiculous. outside of Paul Pierce, who called him the best player in the world last night. Outside of Paul Pierce. Right. Do you think that he's just not going to get his just desserts on this or the accolades or necessary, that his, the perception of him that that's already written because of the decision he made

and that so he's not going to get the credit he deserves for his greatness? Can't be decided in this series. like he's never going to he could drop 80 points next game no one's going to care no one's going to care because that's a little sneaky

feels like a little Lebrani grudge going on from way back in the day kind of does right like yeah now someone's on you now someone's on UMF for like here we go like now you know how it feels

no because because all these performances do and this is the unfortunate thing that Kevin Durant is such a history. Like, we should be celebrating this guy in the way he's playing in the finals, but because of the decision he made and because of the way the Warriors were able

to stack the deck and throw off the league, because of all those things, it is going to take, and it's going to take for people to come around on KD. And I think it's crazy and fortunate, and that's not how I'm going to view him, but that's how most fans are going to view him because it feels unfair.

And that's the one. thing all of us don't like in sports, right, is when professional sports feel unfair. And so, like, I really think, like, not to go LeBron here, but I really think it's like, not three, not four, but, you know, not five. Like, it's going to take an insane amount of championships and probably, like, four in a row, which is going to make this thing even more boring, unless they're challenged in this stretch, but it's probably going to take, like, three or four in a row where people will be like, you know what, Katie, I respect it.

Well, and the other thing is, and we, you know, we're all prisoners of the moment. Let's go back in time, Zach, because I see a lot of this, which is the LeBron haters. The idea that so many people now don't love LeBron, appreciate LeBron as much as they should. And it can all be tracked back. Forgive me, I can't remember who tweeted this, but I saw somebody on a retweet last night say, you know, let's go back in time. And just remember, like, while everybody's now, you know, talking about LeBron being the great guy and crapping on Durant, once upon a time, LeBron James put together a super team and held a sold-out concert event to tell everybody he put on a super team. Right.

You know what I mean? Like, let's go back in time. Like, there is a- To be fair, you throw a laser show in a smoke machine anywhere in Miami, you're getting a sold-out crowd. So, like, that's, you know, that's never been any. I get it. I get it. But that's all, that's what started all of this.

Nobody turned on LeBron until then. Nobody. But he had the humbling moment, right? He had Dirk with him, like, just destroy him in an NBA finals. And that was the thing. Like, he got outplayed by Jay. He couldn't score on J.J. Barreya. Like, that was the thing.

He had a humbling moment after putting that together to where he had to kind of reset everything internally. I'm not going to be this guy. I'm not going to be this villain. I'm not going to be this, you know, this figure like I'm going to find ways to persevere through this. And he did, Kevin Durant. And, I mean, unless we get a turnaround like we had last year, Kevin Durant's not going to have that humbling moment. He's going to get everything he signed for from day one. And that's what irritates people even more.

Right. Exactly. Because we knew this was how it was going to be. That's the thing. It's almost if, like, Miami put it together and kick the shit out of everybody, we would have really super-hated. Durant for it. Or I'm sorry, LeBron for it.

If they would have just come out and blasted Dallas, we'd have been like, this, you know, come on, this is ridiculous. You know, you know what the Warriors are right now

with Kevin Durant? They're an M. Knight-Sharmelon movie. In that, it can be beautifully shot, it can be well-written, it can have great performances, it can have James McAvoy in there doing a great job

as like this split personality person and really nailing that role, but you know an unsatisfying ending is coming. And you know that when that happened, you're going to come back to yourself and go, yep, I knew that was going to happen. Why did I watch it? And that's what the Warriors are.

The Warriors are the unsatisfying ending for everyone outside of the Bay Area. For every non-Warriors fan, like this is, why did I watch this season? We knew this was going to happen. And that's what it becomes. You can't have M. Night Shyamlaan be the star of your industry. That's what it is in the NBA.

right now. That was an unbelievable analogy. I give you a tremendous amount of... I've got to write that one, too. I'm cranking out articles here, man. Bill Russell has ruined the NBA. The Warriors are an M. N.I. Shyamalan movie. You're... I don't want to solely... I don't want to stole the great name of Bill

Russell. I may flip this on Wilk Chamberl. Because Wilk Chamberlain couldn't beat Bill Russell. This led to Jerry West getting dominated. I got to, you know, rest in peace to Will, but like, you know, I would hate for Bill Russell to hear about this. Like, the ghost of Will Chamberlain hearing about it, I could deal with that.

Do you know one of my favorite movies, one of my favorite memories of all time was I got a chance to interview Bill Russell. And I asked him, this is going to shock a lot of people that don't know this, but I was asking him about basically like what he likes pop culture-wise outside of, you know, just regular basketball stuff. And do you know what he told me? He said, please don't tell me. He said, M. Night Shyamalan movies.

No. I think this is going to be more shocking. Bill Russell, massive Trekkie. He loves, he loves Star Trek. Wow. I was floored. Floored. Absolutely for him.

He ended the interview with me, and he said, live long and prosper. That's what he said. What? I swear. I swear, to this day, I'll never forget as long as I live. A massive Trekkie, like knows everything. about it, too. I know. You know how we have these

Instagram videos from Aisha Curry where Steph is like singing along to Frozen and stuff like this? People are like, oh, he's such a nerd. He's so corny. Like, that turns Bill Russell into like the original Steph Curry. Like, he was just this nerdy guy dominating the NBA. Who knew?

Who knew, right? That's amazing. I couldn't believe it. I couldn't believe it. There's a little fun fact for everybody that listens to the Ringer NBA show. That's a true story, though. When I asked him, I was absolutely floored. I am blown away here. That is just not what I expected him to say he was into.

No. You could have given me a thousand guesses. I would have never gotten to Star Trek. It was actually the reason I had got to do an interview with him is he was promoting a book. And by the way, for anybody out there, an amazing book. It's called Red and Me, my coach, my lifelong friend. Great book.

Yeah. great book that Bill Russell wrote about him and his relationship with Red Hourback, which is absolutely incredible. But then, like, at the end of the interview, we just start talking about other stuff, and that's when he brought that up. And I was like, what? Yeah, so probably now that I said that, we'll switch it to Wilt. It's Wiltz's fault.

Or Elgin Baylor or somebody else we can slander, not Bill Russell. Oh, yeah, because I can kind of throw in those things. He was like he couldn't take down the Warriors when he was running the clippers. I could throw some stuff. I don't know. Elgin seems like a nice guy, though. Okay, fine. Then let's do like, Gail Goodrich.

Gail Goodrich can get it. I'll try to bring it back to like George Miken. The target center, the target center having a George Mikan statue in its lobby is the reason the league can't be good. All right. So right now, after two games, I hate to do the grand overreaction, but what in your mind are the chances that Cleveland does not get swept? Do you think they will at least win a game? And I think the lines like three for game three, Warriors Cavs. I said I thought, you know, if they're going to get one, it's game three.

Hell, even you were there, you covered the Utah series. Even Utah was up by double digits at halftime in the game three. And if Durant does it. Yeah, they're up into the third quarter. Yeah, and Durant like went off to another stratosphere in that fourth quarter. Well, here's how tough that is. He didn't just get back in the game. He said, there's your best defender, there's your defensive player of the year, Utah.

I'm going to go take him out. And that's what he did. He just put him in a pick and roll all night long and hit him with jumpers and went to the basket. And maybe the best defensive center in the league couldn't do anything. Couldn't do anything to stop. So, like, I mean, to your point about, like, maybe Cleveland wins, you know, game three, like, that's the one they're going to win. This Warriors team did have problems winning game three the last couple of

years. And that could just be a completely random thing. But maybe the focus, like, I know they corrected that this year because they haven't lost anything. But maybe there is a little bit of focus from the team up to O, to the team coming in desperate for a win. And maybe that does happen. But I got to tell you, man, I'm expecting to sleep at this point. And I'm ready, I'm ready for LeBron to prove me wrong because it's really dumb to doubt LeBron James. I'm ready for him to prove me wrong, but I'm expected to sleep. Well, there we go. Because, I mean, earlier in the podcast, I thought you made a good point, which

is at least if they go 16 and 0, it's this totally historic. They have at least produced what can be argued as the greatest team ever. And at least... Yeah, and I don't know that you're 73 and 9 don't get that tarnish out of this whole run. But at least you come back the next year and you go, yeah, but we went perfect in the playoffs and no one's ever done that. Which at least that's history. Right, at least we're getting some history out of it.

It's history none of us care about. Like the War of 1812. We know what happened. None of us care about it. But at least you got to learn at some point in the history books. He is Zach Harper. You can read him at fanragsports.com. You can follow him on Twitter at Talk Hoops.

Zach, you're the man. Thanks, buddy. My man, anytime. Thanks for listening to another Ringer MBA show. If you did what you're hearing, go give us a rating and review on iTunes. We will talk to you on Thursday.