The Ringer NBA Show - The Westbrook Conundrum, the Perfect Sidekick for Giannis, and Is Miami a Championship Contender? | Real Ones

Episode Date: September 7, 2020

Logan Murdock and Raja Bell get into the Lakers' Game 2 win against Houston and the role Russell Westbrook plays in swinging Rockets games (2:48), whether Giannis can lead a championship charge on his own in a league of fearsome twosomes, which other star in the NBA would be the best pairing for him (39:33), and playoff predictions (59:18). Hosts: Logan Murdock and Raja Bell Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Hello and welcome to another edition of the Monday Ringer NBA show, part of the Ringer podcast. Network and Spotify. I'm Logan Murdoch staff writer, N.H.T. Steppa, president of the LA Sparks fan club, town representative. And I am joined, as always, by my co-host. I don't even know what he is. I don't know what he writes. Does he write a letter?

Does he write anything? I know he's a curator of vibes. He's also the man that wears open-toed sandals in January. Word. What? I got him on right now. You know the vibes. Roger Bell.

What's good, bro. I'm good. A little sluggish today, bro. You know, the barbecue action and the late games, a little sluggish this morning. It's Labor Day. It's Labor Day. It's 8.30 a.m. Pacific time. Rogers is on the East Coast. He's vibing right now.

I'm chilling. I'm still waking up a little bit. I don't know if you knew. You got the fresh cut, though? You're looking like you... Yo, you... Listen, man. I got a haircut last week for the first time in six months.

I don't think I appreciated how just gratifying it is to get a haircut and how much just like how much of a pep in your step that it gives you, bro. That's a great feeling. It's a great way to describe it too. My hair was so long that I was tasting my mustache. You know what I mean? It just wasn't. It wasn't it wasn't it wasn't, it wasn't good. And I'm happy right now that I'm just good, man.

I'm ready to go. You know what I mean? So we got a lot to get. Get it to, man. We're talking Rockers, Rockets, Lakers today. We're talking Bucks, heat. We're getting into some playoffs stuff, getting into some Yonis. Let's get into the Rockets Lakers, man.

Lakers take game two. I just, my first impression of this game is that the Lakers are a way, way better team than the Rockets. They just love to cat off. They just love to fumble a bag. But you're still, right? You're still scared, though, right? Because it's clear that they look like a better team, but there's still fear in your heart. Yeah.

Well, the thing is that the Rockets just play harder than the Lakers every time. It just play harder through larger stretches of the game. The Lakers got out to a huge lead. They took a 20-point league going on, and then he just fumbled it. They just stopped carrying. And that was the biggest thing. Like in game one, they let the Rockets get so many offensive rebounds. There was LeBron doing the thing where he does where he doesn't even close out on shooters.

He just looks at them and then complains to other people about not playing defense. Then Anthony Davis just stands there and doesn't box out, let's PJ Tucker get all the rebounds. The Lakers did a little bit less of that in game two when they won. Yeah. Look, I go through this all the time when I'm talking to people, and I find myself wondering if people think that I don't know basketball, because what I always fall back on when we're talking about teams,

you know, when you're comparing somewhat like apples to apples in the conversation, it's the team with the better energy, right? And it sounds like you're oversimplifying it, but you're not. When the Lakers came out in game one, Houston kicked their ass all over the court. Like it stuck out in all the hustle stats, the rebounds, the steals.

You know, Houston was the one with the deflections. And then in game two, you know, for the large part of game two, the Lakers had that energy. They were flying around. Rondo was in the building, like, you know, with his hands on everything. You had LeBron making second rotations,

back into place, which is, to your point, normally not like what he does. There's trying to conserve some energy there. AD didn't get completely outworked on the glass. He only got beat by one, which is like, that's a problem for me, but it was only one rebound that PJ Tucker out remounted him by. So it sounds like an oversimplification at times, but it's real. It's energy. The Lakers are a better team. I think if the Lakers were just locked in, this would be a five-game series. If they were just, if they played with as much energy as the Rockets do, You have five-game series, but you touched, you got something to say on that one? I just wanted to follow up because I think what they coupled with that energy was just a little bit of schematics that really highlighted, you know, kind of some of the stuff that Houston doesn't do well.

And I felt like their game playing in game one highlighted their deficiencies defensively, the Lakers, that is. And it really gave Houston an opportunity to do what they do. Get to the rim, like, you know, spread you out, collapse your defense, and then kick out to those shooters. And then that zone type of high trap on Hardin really, really threw a wrinkle at Houston that they weren't comfortable with at least early in the game. Yeah, well, it was like a hybrid zone kind of thing, like a man zone that they were playing. And I think Kelly Eco, the athletic, had a really good column about this about how the rockets don't play well when they're not assertive. The other players do not play well when they're not assertive. And you saw that when they trapped James Harden, he's kicking it out to Austin Rivers and kicking it out to Austin.

all these guys. In game one, they were hitting those shots. They were on it on those. And in game two, they were a little bit hesitant. You know, Robert Covington, he gets his shot in the corner. Instead of just shooting it, he's pump faking. You know, he's passing it away. Daniel House, same thing, passing it away. Austin Rivers did not play well in game two, passing the ball away. And the rockets play better when they are more assertive with their jump shots. That is what it is. And when the Lakers see doubt in there, and when they're giving Westbrook, who we're going to get you in a second,

we've got a lot to talk about with Westbrook, but giving him open threes, just saying, shoot it. They're all doing LeBron close out when Westbrook has the ball beyond the eye. You know what I mean? They're not even caring. It might as well be me shooting.

You know what I mean? And I think that the Rockets need to be more assertive, but the Lakers just need to, they just need to play harder and they'll be fine. Yeah, but it does. So I think the rocket's uncertainty and what manifests itself in looking like their tentative is the uncertainty that the zone presents. And that's why you throw a zone at people.

It's a wrinkle, especially in NBA circles. Like, you know, Syracuse and teams, Baylor, they use it as a weapon. NBA guys don't really use it as necessarily an offensive weapon. They just want you to have some doubt in what you're trying to do offensively. And that is the difference between like squeezing a shot. When you have like, I don't know, three-tenths of a second to get a shot, up, you don't have time to be indecisive. Like, that's got to fly. And if the zone creates just a little bit of uncertainty in your mind, that's all it takes to get you off of that shot. Yeah, in the third

quarter, the Rockets got back into it. And they kind of figured it out. They kind of started, you know, they started making more shots. They started setting the tone a bit more. And that's also when the Lakers kind of took their foot off the gas. But you put up, you brought up, you brought a playoff Rondo. Playoff Rondo bald. He had, he had, he had, he had, he had, he had, he had 10 points, 9 assists, was a plus 28 from the floor. I've been watching the Lakers a long time. We all know that Lager fans, Rondo is a sour subject among Laker fans, especially during a regular season.

But there is this phenomenon of playoff Rondo going back to his Celtic days. What is it about the playoffs for certain players that they just play better? There's a lock-in, there's a focus, is the style of play? Like, what is it going on for Rondo right now? Yeah, I think there are a few factors there. you know, the pace is going to slow down. Like you've seen the underhit in a bunch of these games. Like, and you've seen, what appears to the casual fan is like, you know, the, the, the, the offense isn't what it was.

But really what it is is the defense has gotten a lot better. And when you start really being able to dial into a series and game plan, it's going to slow down. The pace is going to slow down. And I think Rondo operates in that type of game at this point, his career, you know, a lot better, right? That's going to fit his style more than more than, more than, you know, a regular game, which Alex Caruso, because he's got those good fresh legs and he wants to run up and down, like that kind of fits him better.

So I think it's the style of a playoff game. And also, like, there are guys that are just built for moments, you know, and for bigger moments than other moments. And like, I've always talked about it as I coach, like a kid, he doesn't practice well. And you worry about him. And you're like, man, like, you know, it gives no effort in practice or really doesn't really care about it.

But if you turn those lights on and you need a bucket, like he's ready to go and you can count on him for that. I think there's a little bit of that to Rondo too. Like, you know, he's just built for those moments and there's certain guys that you see have that quality about them. Yeah, and Rondo has the experience, but I'm looking at this roster, man. Who else do you have?

If Rondo struggles, who else do you have? Like Caruso played 26 minutes, only scored two points was one of five. You know what I mean? And then you talk, you see Dion Waiters only played three minutes. J.R. Smith has been unplayable during these playoffs. Who do you have? man. I don't see anybody else to play. You're going to have to stick it out with Rondo. I don't know

anything. And also, Rondo had the braids in. He had the real straight back energy. It was really, it was like, it was like a game out of 2005. He was really, he had his swag going. I don't know who else. I don't know who else you put in in that backup guard to be that ball handler. Yeah, well, depth has been an issue for them. Like, that's why coming down to the trade deadline and whatnot. They were scrambling and throwing, you know, throwing the offer. out to everybody because that was something that they were going to struggle with. And they had already seen that. I think, you know, Caruso as a young player is going to be up and down in his role, right?

And you've got Rondo, who at this stage in his career and at this age may be up and down also. You just have to hope that one of them is solid on the night that the other is not, right? And then you've seen the Lakers also. you've got LeBron and AD who you can count on. You just need like supplementation of some sort of good offensive game from any of the other usual suspects out there. Like it could be KCP, it could be Danny Green, it could be Kuzma, it could be Morris, Rondo or Caruso.

Like you just need two of those guys to give you something. And I feel pretty confident. I think Lakers do too that you can get and roll the dice, even if it's not every night from all of them, that two of them on any given night are going to give you something. And if they don't, you're probably going to lose. Another thing I've been seeing, though, is when Rondo has the ball, it takes the ball of LeBron's hands. And LeBron has also talked about how he wanted to be the primary ball handler. And you can see during the game where he's calling for the ball as Rondo has it.

And Rondo's just not giving it to him. Does that help the opponent, though, when Rondo just has the ball and he's taking it? Does that help the opponent when it's not on LeBron's hand and it's in Rondo's hands? No, I think it actually helps LeBron. If the guy with the ball is capable of orchestrating offense. And Rondo is. Like, Rondo might not be an offensive threat in terms of scoring the ball a lot. But he knows how to orchestrate offense.

He's done it. He knows how to control tempo. You saw him do it last night offensively and defensively. And on those Cleveland teams, even on the Miami teams, when LeBron was winning championships, in both of those situations, you had people who would have that ball in their hands. Karee, Dwayne Wade. Like when push comes to shove, you want it in LeBron's hand. But there's someone else that could take some of that off because what happens,

Logan, is like if LeBron is the only player that's ever going to have the ball, defenses can really load up on that, man. They can make it really difficult. So, you know, I think it's good for LeBron. He wants it in his hand. He's great with it in his hand. But having someone else who can orchestrate and set up the table, I think is good for him. I think you need a – I'm skeptical, and I think this is going forward,

and this might be an adjustment. but the fact that Rondo can't score on a regular basis, I think hurts them because then you turn Rondo into what we saw with Russell Westbrook, right? You just put him at the corner and you just say, hey, you're going to have to shoot this and we're just going to live with that result. Even with this great game, he was still 1 of 5 from 3 point range. We know that Rondo can't shoot. He can't shoot.

That's been the bag on him throughout his whole career. I am curious what kind of wrinkle that they put on Rondo to where did they make him, Did they just leave him open and just say, shoot five threes a game? We don't care. I would. I mean, like, it's simple. This is not, like, again, it ain't rocket science. Like, some, we tend to overthink it.

Like, if you can't shoot, I'm daring you to shoot. You know what I mean? Like, and I'm probably, maybe this gets us into the conversation about AD a little bit, because I want to hear your thoughts on, like, on what AD looks like, especially because he's the only, and we talk about this a lot, he's the only player out there that has no matchup. Like, there's no matchup for him in Houston's, like, roster. So, like, he's got to be dominant.

But, like, I would, I would try, like, if I was Houston, I would fly around and, like, I would try to soft trap LeBron if I could at the top. And then I would definitely hit AD on the block. And any, I'm just going to let either Rondo or even Caruso shoot it. And I'm going to close out with the LeBron close out to your point, and we're going to live with the results. I think going into Anthony Davis, he was, he bawled this, he bawled. But he was out rebounded by PJ Tucker again.

And I think in this series, Anthony Davis has to average at least 15 rebounds. He has to. He is, especially when the Lakers go small and you take out Javel, who at Jevel McGee, who was injured. I don't know if he's going to play in game three, but especially when you don't have the two big lineup that the Lakers put out. You've got to have Anthony Davis rebounding a lot more and being a lot more aggressive than he has been of late. We talked about this earlier in the postseason, Anthony Davis is the biggest, he's the biggest X factor for this Lakers team. He just is.

There's no got that can guard him, but he has to have that mindset of, I'm going to have to get 38 and 20 tonight. That's just what it is. I'm going to have to do that. I'm going to have to be aggressive in the pain. I'm not settling for threes. He's settling for threes a lot. And that's the mindset that they're going to have to have with going forward if they're going to win at this level because there's not a lot of supporting cast on this Lakers team. Look, I agree with you 100%.

And we talked about, you talked about them not having the bigs in and AD slide into the five. Like they didn't even really get into Dwight Howard last night. Like they scaled down. They changed the lineup. Morris ate up those minutes. So now it puts AD in a position where, and again, I have. this conversation with people who have sons that are 6, 6, 6, 7, 6, 8 in high school, and they're like, he's a guard.

And I'm like, I don't give a damn. He's still got a rebound. Like, even at 6.8, you can be a guard and have a guard skill set, but somebody's got a rebound a damn ball. Like, so get down there and work. And I think for me, this was my concern about AD. And I don't know that I still have it, but this was the concern coming in, is when you got to this moment, if this series goes to two.

three, three, will he be willing to say, all right, I got this shit? Like, I see a clear advantage on the block. LeBron, with all due respect, I need you to trust me. I got this shit. I'm going down on the block. Let me get 45 tonight unless they double team me. And then I've done my job. I'm making plays for all of you guys.

I can't, I don't, I know you can shoot threes. I know you've got a great pull-up game. But that's not where your bread is buttered in this particular series, dog. It's just not. You sound like there's a real AAU dad, AAU dad energy right now. You know what I mean? Like where you're just like,

you tell the big band just getting the post and just go to work? But listen, all jokes aside, I coached a high school team two years ago. We had a kid. He was six, seven. He was a good score,

but he just didn't embrace any type of work where his advantage was. We didn't try to turn him into a post player, but we explained to him, dog, there are 10 extra points on buckets down there

and fouls because you have such a great advantage. And it opened up his world. So that's all I'm saying. Like, dog, we love that you got this 6-11 freaky skill set. That doesn't mean if you have 6-5 on you that you're not supposed to go down there and just bucket him to death on the block. And there's been a lot of times, and I know that AD stats don't necessarily show this, but it's been a lot of times where he's gotten muscled by Tucker,

just got just straight bullied by Tucker, boxed out by Tucker. He is a bully, though. I mean, he's a bully. Yeah, yeah, yeah. But you are also Anthony Davis. Correct. And you need to ball out. And I think that the thing that, you know, I see this on socials a lot.

They talk about AD and LeBron, you know, the best Lakers duo since Kobe and Shaq. Probably so, right? But the thing that separated the Kobe and Shaq was that Shaq was going to say, he'll text Kobe the night before or call Kobe the night before is just give me the ball. I need that. We need give me the ball energy from Anthony Davis. to close the series out. That's a great point. Yeah, that's exactly what you need. It just, just send that message. You know, when on the whiteboard, you erase everything and just say, give it to me. And we haven't seen that right now. And I think that there was something that you were

saying about LeBron is, LeBron may have the mindset of a number one, but sometimes he just doesn't have just the umph of a number one right now. And I think that part of the Lakers and part of that team was just like, A, D, just take the torch. Just take it. Yes. And I think the bubble, the juice is what you're talking about like in the bronze legs like you know hey he's still phenomenal but oh he's dunking all fools he's still disrespect to people yes but what happens in that's in in in the bubble when you're going every other night they're going to be nights where that body at 35 doesn't respond like it did at 28 and so it becomes even more like necessary for AD to say look I have this because you know I have the young legs and I'll carry us sure I do want to I do want to get into something that

Draymond Green said. He tweeted earlier this week. He said, all big centers not named Joel, Joel NB., Carl Anthony Towns, and Nicola Yolkich should be cheering hard for the Lakers right now. If Houston takes this series, it's going to hurt the value of the big man even more. I put Rudy Gober in there, too.

You put Rudy Gober in there? I don't put Rudy Gober. I think Rudy Gober is one of the guys he's talking about where it says it's going to be extinct, no? Well, he might be, but I would put Rudy Gobert because he's so good defensively, and he, you know, he's just a rim run guy. There's some truth to that.

You saw the Lakers again scale down last night, take the minutes from the Dwight Howard's of the world, give him the Morris, and then slide AD down. So there's, I mean, Dremont's got a point. I do think that there is room in the NBA, today's NBA for a good rim run, like get to the front of the rim type of big, who's really got value defensively,

either in blocking shots at the rim, but more importantly, I think being able to switch and keep things in front of you, you know what I mean? Or at least contain a dribbler, you know, as he's coming downhill at you. So he's right,

but it's been trending that way for a while now where bigs are less and less of a necessity. And I don't even think it's necessarily their size. It's the skill set that's changing, right? Well, I think the biggest thing, and the reason why I'm not putting Rudy Gober in that conversation with Kat and Joel is because he doesn't have an offensive skill set to keep a defense honest. He just doesn't. He has to get set up. He has to, yeah, he has to get set up.

And he has to run. People have to pass him the ball. And I think Drayman's right in the sense that you have to have a skill set to be a threat. There's no longer the days of Omar Ashik where you can just, you're just there and you're getting paid a lot of money just because you're there. Omar Ash, actually, great name. You know what I mean? And I think that, you have to have the offensive threat. And I think that we'll see what happens. I don't necessarily know that they're going to be fully extinct. But I do think there's going to be more of a premium put on skilled bigs after this. I think, obviously, in today's NBA, you're looking for skill.

Even out of your length, you want skill. But I do think there is a skill set in rim running from a high pick and roll. because while you're not having the ball in your hands and command in the double team, you're going to command something to have to rotate over and at least honor your role, which opens stuff up on the backside. But there's also, Ross, there's also an easy fix to that, right? If you're a skill big, run your ass up and down the floor and catch. Like, it's not hard to, I mean, we know it's easier said than done,

but it's not hard to rim run. It's not hard to do that. If you have all the other stuff, all you've got to do is run the floor. You'll be fine after you do that. I've always said, Sean Marion, not your prototypical big, right? But he played the four for us in Phoenix a lot. It's where he wanted to play the three, but his most valued us was at the four. And people ask me a lot why those sons teams, what made you so dangerous offensively?

It had to be Steve Nash, like in his brilliance on the ball or it was Amari. And I was like, well, yeah, all of that. But what I felt made us like the most dangerous was the rim running big. And a lot of times it was Sean Marion because he was so fast. You have to pick your poison if the big is flying to the front of the rim and two wings are flying to the corners and if you pick the dunk

then we're going to shoot these threes and if you pick the threes we're going to get this dunk. It just applies a lot of pressure on defenses. Sure. Let's get into Russell Westbrook. I'm going to read you a stat line and I want to get your

honest take on the stat line. 10 points. Sounds all right. Not decent. No. 4 or 15 from the field. 13 boards 13 boards 7 turnovers to 4 assists

for Russell Westbrook It was pretty ugly Yep You know what that says to me Like what was that said Even if I didn't see the game If I heard that stat line I would say that's a high energy player

Who was playing his like tail off Or trying to at least Like there was no There was no lack of effort there Right like all of those numbers speak to high energy level But it would also sound like you were moving way too fast like seven turnovers and four like four assists it would sound like you were pressing and just

probably playing too fast now it's funny you said that because russell westbrook said after the game he says right now i'm just running around i got to look at film to see how i'm going to be effective and when you look at the game he was basically just getting cardio man he was running around he was he was being the erratic russell westbrook right um the other side of the russell westbrook conundrum, right? Where, you know, he has a great game one. He probably overcompensates to the point where the Lakers is just giving him a three-point shot and he's just taking it. He's bricking it. He's trying to keep them honest, but he can't shoot. But he doesn't, he doesn't acknowledge that he can't shoot. And he loses the game for his team, to be honest, because if, if Russell Westbrook has a

decent game, Rockets win. If he just has a just an average game, If he doesn't have seven turnovers, maybe if he's seven of 15 from the field, I think they win this game. But it was funny, though, that he said he has to watch film because there was a clip that emerged a video from Fred Katz, who was a Oklahoma City beatwriter in 2016. He did this video from a media scrum where Russ basically flat out said, I don't watch film. I play Spades during film. I listen to music when film was on. I just feel the game out. And it was pretty illuminating, to be honest,

because when you watch Russ's game, it doesn't scream guy that just watch his film. It doesn't scream that. It screams guy that I'm just going to take this game over, and y'all are going to have to adjust to me. Yeah. Is that comment into the NBA? Not in today's NBA.

I don't, I think most of your stars want enough of an edge, whether it be personal motivation for like, you know, personal accolades or, or purely winning championships. Like, they are looking for any edge they can get. And my experience, like with Cleveland and LeBron and those guys, is they want to see, they want to know. They want, they want to be able to confirm what their eyes have been telling them is happening or maybe illuminate them to something that is. isn't happening and they missed and that's why they can't get it done. And so, you know, Russell Westbrook does look like a guy. He plays off a high energy. He plays off of, off a passion.

And, you know, you don't want to take that away from a guy by having him in his own head. But you have to pair that with some sort of understanding of what people are doing to you. And so he looks confused. Like when I watch him play, not in who he is as a player, but just in what's available to him against the Lakers. Like you've seen LeBron run down and block a few of his big shoulder. Like he's getting downhill on people and he shoulders him and then he's going up with the layup. Well, they're tracking that. Like they're coming from behind.

It looks like there's a point of emphasis from the Lakers to make that run at him when he's going up. So, I mean, it's just good to know so that you have a counter for. And so I, you know, I've got experience with Mike D. We watched a lot of film. We weren't a two-hour film session team, but we were a team that was going to break down what was happening to us, talk about it and try to figure out the antidote for it. And I imagine that Russ is going to be doing that. Like I think at this point in his career, he'd be doing it.

Yeah. And I mean, that clip was from 2016. That's three, four years ago. But I will say when you do see him in the postseason here, down the stretch when he's throwing the ball away, right? And he's doing those shots, those jump shots. But then he's like, oh, my goodness, he sees something way too late, tries to pass out of the jump shot and passes right into the defender or passes out of bounds.

That screams non-preparation where you don't know where that, like, that's a simple rotation that's going on and you just don't see it. Yeah. I mean, it's like quarterback play. You got to know what's happened. You have to be able to know what they're going to do so you can execute like almost before it happens. So, Roger, during your playing days, though, right?

I'm assuming that you watch a lot of film, right? Where they're dudes, you know, I have to, I mean, you could say names because we could be messy here. but were there dudes in the film room that just weren't paying attention? That just flat out just didn't care. Oh, yes. You know, when the lights off, they're just sleep or something like that. Yeah, I've fallen asleep in film.

Oh, wow. Okay. But this is, here's the, I fall in a sleep in film because I had coaches that didn't understand that you can't sit there for two hours and watch film. Do you know what I'm saying? I got it. Yeah, yeah. And so it's a coach's job to some degree.

I mean, it's got to be, you know, cooperation by the player. But, dog, don't have me in there two hours. Like, we're beating a dead horse at this point. I am falling asleep on you. You give me 30 minutes of good clean, like cut to the point. Like, this is what we're trying to get. I think most guys are engaged in the postseason. Regular season is different, Logan.

Like, anybody that tells you as a player, like, they sat there in every single film session in the regular season and we're locked in, they're lying to you. Like, that's not, you're not doing that. But in the postseason, you know, what most teams I was on, when you get into a series, as soon as a regular season ends and your seating has like sorted itself out, you're going to get a DVD, right? Or at this point, it's not DVD. It's a, you're going to ask you. I was going to ask you to have a loose. At this point, it's going to be some sort of file and you'll click in.

Are you old? Are you old? Am I? Ask my back. Um, but you're going to have your matchup and you're going to have, I don't know, 100 clips of your matchup or your two or three perceived matchups so that you can break down what they want to do, right? And then when you go in the next day, there's going to start to be team film that you're going to watch to start prep. So the unsung heroes in a lot of these teams are the are the video guys, right? They don't get a lot of credit, but they're providing everybody with the information that they need to be successful. So to not take advantage of that would be criminal. I can't imagine Russ is now watching film. And, you know, I think I think you'll see a much better, much more efficient because he's not efficient right now.

it around. Like he looks like he's playing super fast. I would tell Russ, like, and what do I sound like telling Russ how to play, but I'd say slow down a little bit, take a beat, really understand what they're trying to do to you. And things are probably going to clear themselves up for you. The picture will become a lot more clear once you understand exactly what's happening, you slow down a little bit. Well, the fact is, though, Russ had a bad game, man. But the thing is with Russ, it's so polarizing because this, if you're going to take Russ's highs, which they are high, you're going to have to take these low games. games. And I think that we're just seeing that right now. But it's, it's, it's more polarizing

because it's been like this whole career. Yeah, I, you know what I hate? I'm with you 100% and I'm a Russ fan. And so I'm taking the lows. I have no, this is a one-one series. Like, we want to sit here and say, oh, damn, it could have been too old. But it's not. It's a one-one series. That's just the way it is. And so what really bothered me this morning as I woke up and started like meandering around was this, uh, Mike Dantonie's got to be better at getting Russ. No, he doesn't. Like, Mike don't have to be better. Mike's team's doing what Mike's team has done all year.

Like Russ had a bad game to the point you just made. Like, he had a bad game. It happens. It's on them as a team and Russ as an individual to sort that out and come back and be better next game, and I imagine they will. One thing I, we just brought up coach Mike Dan Tony, who you have, who has coached you, not the biggest defensive reputation, right?

Right. But the Rockets are the best defensive team in the playoff bubble right now. I think before last game, they were posting 101.4 off defensive rating. This team does not get a lot. This coach does not get a lot of shine for his defense. Is that fair? I think it's fair because historically,

like the numbers don't support Mike being a good defensive coach. Like, do you know what I mean? And they're playing great defense right now, in part because they switch everything. And they're such a lack of a guy they can go down to the block and just punish you for the switch. Even AD, and we just talked about him, not really going to punish you for the switch.

So if you're still going to rely on chat, like, contested mid-range twos, like, there's a reason why people don't want to shoot those now. They're not, like, analytically great shots to shoot. So his defense is perfect for what's going on in the NBA right now. But I think, you know, that it's fair only because, like, some of the things that our son's team struggled with and didn't win because of,

were defense. It wasn't Mike's fault, though. I mean, we had... Did you guys really put an emphasis on defense, though? Clearly, the emphasis on our offense. Like, we spent a lot of time on offense. That was our... What were your defensive? But what were your defensive? PEP talks? Like, did you guys have any... Did you guys have any adjustments defensively? Or was your first instinct to go, oh, we're just going to change how we play offense? No. Mike did it. We spent a lot of time, like, trying to make defensive adjustments. But, like, as a chef, you're only...

kind of, like as good as the ingredients that you're provided. You know what I mean? And we didn't have a lot defensive ingredients, man. We just, we weren't ever going to be a defensive juggernaut. But Mike would go back to the table and like, let's say we were, you know, covering the turn on a pick and roll, meaning like, I'm going to get over and the big's going to drop back and he's going to hold his ground until I get back in the play. And that was getting us torch. Like Mike had no problem, like blitzing it or doing what we had to do. We just didn't have the personnel to switch and do those kind of creative things. So, you know, it's fair, but Mike isn't just defense-less.

He talks about D. Yeah, and I think what gets lost in this, right, is they're probably not a, the Rockets have not been a good regular season defensive team. They did finish six in the 18th, 2017-18 season. But other than that, they just, they haven't been a great regular season defensive team. However, in the postseason,

especially when they go against the Warriors, you know, in the last couple of years, that heavy switch has done gave the warrior's problems, gave the warrior's fits, because there were a mirror image of that, you know, guys like PJ Tucker who are long guys, not necessarily tall, but long guys who can switch the pick and roll and can get bigs off the floor, right? And for a team that doesn't, if you're a team that doesn't, you know, embrace the mid-range, the Rockets could be a tough out for you, especially defensively. Yeah.

Look, PJ is the, is the engine that makes that defense take. Like, he is the one. Without PJ, none of that works because you don't have the guy that can out rebound AD at 6.5. Like, you don't have that. And so that's the unique piece in the equation defensively there that makes that work. He's the football player that plays at the YMCA. I love that. He's the guy that is boxing you out, playing overly physical, probably fouling you a little bit,

but you're not going to call it. he's talking shit. He's hitting a corner three. He's a very skilled football player playing basketball right now. He got a little sauce. He got his first pair of Kobe fives. You know what I mean? He was like, you know what I mean?

PJ's a real one, man. Like, not to, not to, but he is because what he gets asked to do, you know, my job was difficult. Like I had to go out there and I'd guard your one, two or three. And, you know, I'd have situations where dudes would be like, hey, man, I don't want to guard him, man. Like, you take him in. You, that's just my.

They just say that? I thought NBA players had egos. They like, I got them, no? They say, oh, hey, Roger, a, Roger, bro, get him real quick. Yeah, there are certain situations where guys don't want that all the time. And that's fine. But I rarely had to guard those bigs. And I'm 6'5 too.

Like, PJ has to guard everybody and getting like back down. PJ's bench presses a lot more than yours, though, right? Yeah, he's a big body, but it's still a thankless job. It's a really, like, I just, you referenced my back at 45. Like, you're going to feel that in a few years, bro. What's it like to switch onto a big as a guard? Helpless. Like, at that point, like, because my, I didn't have the weight.

So what I was trying to bait you into doing was, like, I'd try to switch early. I'd start, like, wrestling with you around the free throw line. So, you know, most bigs, like, are like, you know, you ain't fucking stopping me from getting to the post so I'm just going to big body you all the way down well after the third bump I'm falling down so then it puts the ref were you a flopper yeah but but like I mean if you're just going to keep banging into me with 290 pounds like at some point I'm falling down like it's too much and I'm gonna put the ref in a spot where you got called what was the big where you got swiss on you were like fuck um I don't I mean shack clearly but I never had to switch on on on on on on on shack that much I switch okay I switched on to kembe matumbo one day in practice, like with the, with, uh, we were in St. Joe's, Philly when I just got there. And he like,

he turned with one of those elbows, like, and so at seven, whatever it is, like my eye. Yeah. So that thing lit me up just like blistered, like and split my eye open. And, um, you know, at that point, I was like, I have no business. Like first day of practice. Yeah, it was early in the experience. I was like, nah, I'm good. All right. Before we get to the, the bucks in heat, what, what's your prediction on this, man? I had, I had Lakers in five, thinking about six or seven right now. Yeah, I think Lakers in six. I still roll with Lakers in six. I think Houston gets another one.

And look, if Houston gets hot and they can dissect that, it could get dicey. It could go seven, but I'm taking six. Here's a thing, though. The Rockets can get hot as we've seen in the postseason, but the Rockets can also get historically cold and fumble the bag. So they're going to have to prove to me that they can win a full series. Before we move on, let's hear a word from our sponsors. The ringer NBA show is brought to you by Fanduel. We're teaming up with Fandul again this football season,

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and compete for a share of $25,000. It's that simple. All right, scroll on the NFL season this week. See a couple locks, man. I think I'm taking Houston over Kansas City. Taking Seattle over Atlanta? That could be fun. I know there's a little problems,

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That's Squareup.com backslash go backslash ringer MBA. Now back to the show. All right, the next game, Buck's Heat, game four. I'm going to be honest with you, Raja. I wanted this series to be over. You know what I mean? I just, it was just a game four. Yannis gets hurt.

He hurts his ankle midway through the game. I'm just like he just put him out of their misery. The Bucks wanted to show heart. And I'm like, even when the Bucks were showing heart, mind me, he'd had control of the game throughout the most of the game. And they just fumbled a bag. And I'm just like, you'll just beat them. Please just beat them.

We don't need to have another game five. We don't have to play another game. Let's just get the series over with. Yeah, I mean, the heat fell asleep at the week. I mean, I got to give a shout out to Chris Middleton. He was fantastic. But the heat, they definitely fell asleep at the whip. It felt like when, and I don't know if you know this as a player, but like as a media

member, I remember this last postseason when the Warriors played the Clippers. When the war, like a team clearly has it in the bag, they're going to win the series, but then they just fumble it and we have to go to another game. Like you're already thinking about what you're going to do for the next. week that you're going to have off, you know, you got some errands to run and stuff like that. And then the team just, the team are supposed to win loses. And then now you're having to make accommodations to go get on a flight the next day. The good news is you don't have to get on a flight now, right? Like, that would be the only saving grace. Like, you're just going to go back

to your hotel room. Yeah. But then again, you know, you know, probably. Yeah, you're delaying the inevitable here, right? That's what I mean, we are, yeah. The heater going to win this series. Like, Janus, we don't even know if he's going to play in the next round, right? Like that's what you're saying. Like, why are we wasting our time? What are we doing? What are we doing?

Middleton decided to be a real one. I'm like, dude, what are we, what's going on? Is he a real one? He was a real one in game four. Is he enough of a real one to be, is he enough of a real one to be what he would need to be for Janus and him to win a championship? Is he enough of a real one? No. But I want to preface about he did have 36, 8 and 8 ball down the stretch, hit a bunch of big shots.

I think he's a, and this is on the rundown, is he a true number two? Before I get to your answer, I think that he's an over-qualified three, that he just, he outperforms being a three, but when you put him in number two situations, he's just not it. And that's fine. You know, he's an all-star in a week Western, Eastern conference. You know what I mean? I think that I don't see him as a number two guy for Janus. I like that. I would maybe say he's a number two if you had another overqualified number three, right?

Like, I think he could make up for the number two spot if you had a better number three than they have, like someone who's maybe almost as good as him. But I don't think he's a true number two either. You know, but I want to be fair to him. Here's Mike Booneholzer has, like the rest of the NBA, the Janus thing, is really fun to watch. and it's really productive in the regular season, and he's so different than everybody else out there

that you've given him the ball and it's going to produce a lot of regular season wins. The problem is, like, when you really lock down into it and that's the way you play, there's some real things that you could take away, making it really hard for Milwaukee to score. And if you really want to know if Chris Middleton's in number two, I think you probably have to be willing to play a little different

if you're Boonehouser. And I don't know if you can do that. I think the cat's out of the bag. Janus plays the way he plays. And I think to some degree it marginalizes Chris Middleton. I'm taking Janus. I don't mean to like Janice,

I'm going with Janus all day. But I don't think that the way they play really could give you a true, a true like understanding of whether Chris Middleton's a true number two or not. To be fair to Chris Middleton. I mean, Chris Middleton's a really good basketball player. Is he great? Probably not.

But the problem lies, though, is that he's averaging more points than Janus right now. Yeah, that's tough. Yonis is your guy. Yonis is your best player. He needs, I mean, he's injured right now. We don't even know if he's going to be playing game five. Should he have done more, though?

Yonis, with that in mind, should he, I don't think he needs to be averaging, what, 20-something a game in this series, and he's hurt, so I get that. I feel like he should have been averaging about, like, 30 and 15. He should be going back to his regular season average season. I think his team should have done. more. Janus has to be held responsible for that ultimately.

I do think, though, and again, Janice, the Miami Heat came out and watched film. Like, we just talked about that. It was clear that they've been digging into the film and really constructing a game plan that they've been executing almost perfectly, flawlessly. It then becomes on your head coach to help you as the star player.

As gifted as these dudes are, if you're going to throw three people on them. Like, they're going to struggle offensively. Like, it's going to be hard to get to the bucket, especially when you're not Dame Lillard or Steph Curry, who can pull up from, you know, 30-some feet from the bucket. When you're relying on getting to the basket, you've got to help him. Take the ball out of his hands a little bit, man. Like, get that man the ball just on the block. His biggest advantage is on the damn block. They never post him up. Like, they never post him up. He always got the ball at the top of the key or he's in some kind of action at the top. Like, get that man the ball, run some twist action where he's going into DHO and then you're double

screening along the baseline, a la Kevin Garnett, to get him into the post. They don't do anything like that. And so, yes, Yana should be playing better. But Mike Boodenhozer has to do a better job with that. Like, you're not helping him, like, navigate what's happening to him. And Boodenhoes is one of those guys that has a rep too, man. He's a really great regular season coach, but has not, has not coached well. And his teams have not played well in the postseason, right? They have always underperformed to a certain extent. But I think that I do want to get into Mori Annas really quickly, but I do, I have one more question for you. We are both in agreement that the Bucks only have one star, a one bona fide superstar. Can you win in this league with just one star? No, you cannot.

No, you cannot. And two stars is, it's tough. Bare minimum, no. Like, bare minimum, I think you need two stars. I'm looking back, I'm looking where you, that teams that have won a title with one star. We talked, the Raptors are probably the biggest example of this right now. I don't necessarily agree because we know that Seacom has bawled since then and he was, he, he is an all star and he's probably going to be one of the top, I don't know, 10, 15 players in a league. And bro, you had a torn Achilles and a, and a ruptured Achilles and a tour ACL. Exactly. And the Raptors you can make the argument still probably could have lost game seven if Steph doesn't make, if Steph makes that,

that shot in game six. You know what I mean? If they're going back to Toronto for game seven, I think the Warriors won the series. But that's besides a point. The 2019 Raptors, 2011 Mavs, 2006 Miami Heat.

You don't think so? I think that might be a stress. Shack and DeWate? Shack and DeWate, but Shaq did not have a great series in a, 06 series. And I know I'm stretching it. Shack carried that. And like up until that point. But I think that that therein lies

a point that is that you, I'm stretching to find names right now, right? I'm thinking of the 06 sons, which you were a part of, right? Only had Nash to kind of carry that. I just you do need a second star. I don't know if

the Bucks can get a second star right now for Yannis. I don't know what that is. And that goes into the next question. Kevin O'Connor, Chris Vernon, the mismatched, friends of the show, said that Janus is Shaq without a Kobe. I think this is really interesting. With that logic, who could be a good Kobe for Janus is Shaq?

And I have a couple of names for him. I want to get your take. Devin Booker could be a good guy. We're going one by one, or you're going to roll them off? Let's go one by one. All right. Devin Booker, what do you think? Absolutely.

A guy who can handle the ball. get Janice off of the ball and create, like, get anywhere on the floor where he wants. That's what doesn't allow Chris Middleton to be the true number two, if I'm really looking. Like, he's just going to contested jump shots. You're going to, some nights they go in, some nights they don't. Devin Booker's an all-around score. Get where he wants to go on the court. Preserve space.

So, yes, that works. Damien Lillard. No doubt. No doubt. You put those two in some pick and roll action. Like the space that Dame creates, he can, he's another guy who could get wherever he once on the floor. And I think his passing ability with Janus allows Janus to like get some easy buckets, like some easier ones than he currently gets. And Lillard played alongside Lamar

Aldrich early in his career. He knows how to play with a big. And so yeah, I think that also another another name, James Hardin. I'm not really if on this one. I don't think he could because he's such a, he just holds onto the ball so much. Yeah, that's a good. I would, I got nothing to say about that. You're absolutely right. I think that's just a little over-usage right there. All right, let's get messy. Vincent Goodwill of Yahoo Sports said that among the suitors for Janus will be the Toronto Raptors and the Miami Heat.

Before we get to those two teams, also the Mavericks, well, before we get to those teams, what do you think about Steph, Steph Curry and Janus as a pairing? That's a no-brainer. That's a, that's a, that's a, that's a Dame Lillard, but maybe even a little bit better than Dame pairing with Janus.

For all of the reasons, except Steph ain't going to be in the pain as much to Dame. So you don't have to worry about that. Yeah, but he opens the floor in a way that you can't, you don't even, oh, my goodness. Anything. You could talk about on-ball screens. You could talk about just setting off-ball screens and slip into the bucket because you've got to, Janus's man is going to have to help on Steph and there, Janus is at the front of the buck. It just puts a lot of pressure on defense.

And the Warriors aren't slick. I was at this game in TD-Braw. this up. The Warriors had Greek night, the night that Janus came to town. Greek night. I love it. No tampering there. No tampering. Not by name. But, all right, let's get into the Raptors. Let's see. Do you think Kyle Lowry would be a good partner? I don't think the Raptors really fit with Janus because of Pascal Seacum and where he wants to get most of his buckets. Like, I see them as a slight, a slight duplication of skill sets there.

Lowry Van Lee. I think though, if that happens, though, you would have, I'd assume that they would do like a sign and trade and they would get past school.

Okay. Well, I mean, like if that, if that, like, say there's a sign in the trade. You just,

yeah, I could, and Nick Nurse, you know why I think that works, even if, even if I don't, the Kyle Lurie is fantastic, but I,

I think those other two are better point cards, but I trust Nick Nurse. Like, I trust that you're going to do what I don't think Bootinhozer is doing right now is look at what you got, figure out the best way to optimize the skill set and work that out. Last one. And this will be a twist of fate. Jimmy Butler. I'm going to say, this is what I'm going to say. Like on paper. I like it. No, I like it.

All right. On paper at face value, I would say not a great fit, like skill-wise, because he doesn't really space the floor and whatnot. But I'm going to trust Jimmy Butler to work with just about anybody do you put him with, bro, because if they want to win and they got some dog in them, Jimmy figures it out. Real one of the playoffs, Jimmy Buckley. Yeah, Jimmy figures it out. He makes it work.

He's a dog. So, yes, the heat culture in general with all the shooters and Jimmy, that would be super dope. Fantastic. Yeah. All right, so do we expect Janice to play in game five? Boonehouser said that he'll see, you know,

the cliche. We'll see how he does over the next 24, 48 hours before determining the status of his ankle. Does he play? Bubble got you again, bro. I think he plays. Because I think Janus is built like that. If he doesn't play, I think it's Milwaukee saying, like, taking one swing at like, hey, man, we're trying to protect you. We're preserving your future. You mean too much to us to risk you.

I think Janus is going to want to play. The only problem is you're talking about a one-day turnaround in a bubble. So, I mean, if the shit's the size of a watermelon, like, you can't play. Yeah. Also, and this is something that's always. going to be a storyline until Yana signs an extension if he signs an extension. He can be an unrestricted free agent in 2021 if he does

not sign this extension. If Yonis goes up and says, yeah, I don't want to play. I mean, I don't want to play with the bucks beyond my contract. If he goes and tells you just be straight up with you. Do you trade him on the spot? Or you just ride it out and see if I can just like convince him to stay in Milwaukee.

And hope that he gives you a sign and trade. Like just hope by the grace of God, he gives you. that sign and trade. Yeah, I... Because you've been an exec. Yeah, I mean, I don't love the player just dictating right off the bat

how to ask him to go down. Like, you know what I mean? Like, I mean, from a player's perspective, I love it, but from the front of front office, like, I don't love the dictating of I don't want to be here. I'd probably ride that out.

See if I could... You're probably not going to convince him to stay there, but I'd probably ride that out, man. A lot of New Orleans Pelicans and the Lakers, yeah. But no, but A, D, D, you got trade.

though. Adi didn't go, you know what I mean? Not when he first said, though, right? Like, it wasn't like, I want to be out. Like, they ran, they ran that all in the next postseason. No, it was kind of speculative. And then he just said, I request a trade last year. That's basically how it happened. Because it was speculative, you know, like, I don't know, I might sign my extension. He was flirting a little bit.

AD was. And then he was around the trade deadline. He was like, trade me now. And they didn't trade him. And then it went there. So I think a bigger, like, the biggest example of the LeBron in 2010 is where like, hey, man, I don't know if I'm coming back. I don't know. And I just want to preface by saying, Janus has never said, like, straight up, I'm leaving or even, like, hasn't openly flirted with the idea of like, he said. it. Yeah, I want to be in Milwaukee, is what he said. You know, there has been some stories that have leaked that, you know, if he doesn't

win a championship, he's dipping, or if he doesn't, you know, he's not competing for titles he's dipping. But it's all fluid. As a teammate, though, and I don't think you've been a teammate, but do you think you would care so much if this is over the team's head of, like, oh, Yonnas might not come back? He may come back. So I've never been in this situation, but I think it depends on who you are on that team, man, like, and whether your team can win a championship or not, or you guys think you're that close to it. If you guys think you're that close to it, yes, that bothers you, right? Like, you're like, man, damn, we're that close, bro. Like, we don't need the distraction,

you know. I feel like that's more for veteran guys, though, right? Yeah. Veteran guys that have have security and contracts and things like that. Like, you know, my situation, most of the time was like, is my paper straight? Like, I'm good. We're good. Like, I'm paid. Is there's my contract locked in? Then I'll just play my nuts off and we'll let the chip, fall where they made. You know what I mean? I didn't have the luxury or really caring about that. But honestly, like, you know, I wasn't in that situation, so I don't really know. I think it becomes a distraction

if you, like, KD made it a distraction. Right? Like, whether it was, it just became a distraction. KD didn't make it, but that became a distraction. I don't have a lot of other instances of it, if it really distracting people. LeBron, for sure. Which year was that?

What, the, uh, 2010. That was the whole year. Yeah. And he's openly flirting with like, I don't know if I'm going to, Yeah, it did, because Kyrie then wants to bounce, right? Like in... No, no, no, this is 2010. This is the first go-around before he went to the heat. Oh, shit.

And, you know, LeBron's... Yeah, yeah, yeah. No, not when you were there. I got you. We didn't... Even in 2014, we didn't know that he was going to Cleveland, but that was always the big thing. And LeBron is so good that you just ride it out.

And definitely, you know, in Golden State, Kevin was definitely a distraction. I mean, obviously that that's why him and... Drey kind of was at odds. And I don't know, it is a distraction. I don't know. I haven't been a player, but I know for younger guys,

they're just trying to get a deal, bro. They're just trying to stay in the league. I think for more established guys like Draymond, like Steph, like Clay, obviously they want Kevin to stay on the team. Right. You know, but.

Yeah. For the bucks where they are now, it would be a distraction because they're that close to, you know, like in their mind, they're the best team in the league every year, at least in the regular season. They think they can win a championship. Yeah. Let's look ahead at the playoffs.

Is Miami a title contender? Yes. Yes. Like, and I said last week on a Miami station that Miami could represent the Eastern Conference in the finals, but I didn't think that they could beat the Lakers or the Clippers. My gut still says that, but the Lakers and the Clippers have been so up and down in these playoffs that the Miami Heat, absolutely, it's wide open, in my opinion. The Miami Heat are probably my favorite team in the bubble right now. They're my favorite team to watch right now.

At first it was the Rockets. Why? Because there's just so many real ones on that team. Even when they lost in game four, Tyler Heroes is hitting crazy three-pointers. Like, they didn't just die. Right. And then you got Jimmy Butler, who was bona fide. And it's that heat culture.

And Spolster is a Hall of Fame level coach. And it shows every time we see him coach that team. I just really like their grit. I really like how good they are. Damn at a bio is just such a great player, man. He's going to be a star in his league. I just really like how they do business in the heat way, and they're just so tough. I'd be scared.

You know, especially if the Lakers played them and the Clippers played them, because we're just assuming that they're just somehow, some way that one of those teams are going to get out of the Western Conference. If they used to start lollygagging and doing that stuff that they do, the heat are going to blow them out. Yes, they have the potential to do that. They do for those two teams. The problem for them is I don't think that they, the teams that they would have to go through to do that are bad matchups for them.

Like, not that they can't beat them, but I think- You're talking about the Raptors and the Celtics? Yeah. Okay, yeah. Yeah, those two teams are kind of like this, you know, they play more like the heat than either the clippers or the Lakers do. Like, do you know what I mean?

And the matchup is, the matchup is a little, It's a little tricky, but if they get through either the Celtics or the Heat, and also that's it, if they get through the Celtics or the Heat, I mean, Celtics are the Raptors, that's going to be a tough matchup, man. I really like this Heat team. I really like them a lot. And they're going to be good for years to come, man. I agree with you 100%.

It's sustainable down there in Miami, man. When you have everything in place from top to bottom, and you're all on the same page with how you want to work culturally. It's pretty cool. I would say this, though. I think if they make the finals, while they can beat the Lakers and the Clippers, like the Lakers and the Clippers would have to do

what they did in like game one for the Lakers and game two for the Clippers. Like they would have to be luncheon. Like, you know what I mean? I think if they were both dialed in, they'd be a little too much for the heat, but they both shown you that they won't be dialed in every night.

Yeah, who's more, whose lows have been more disappointing between the L.A. teams? Clippers. Yeah. The Clippers. I mean, because they did it all. I mean, they did it to you all regular season, too.

Like, for me. I don't want to harp on the Clippers slander too much. I do think that the Clippers, they just fumbled the bag when they were supposed to go up 2-0, man. You know what I mean? I think that you got to seal the deal when you're about to go up 2-0 when you're the team that's supposed to win. Right.

And they just didn't do that. There's so many lulls on that team. I think that they beat the Denver Nuggets probably. It's probably going to be a longer series than it should be. But I think they'll beat them. Raptors, Boston, right? now? What are your thoughts on that series? That's tough. I think it should be, it should be 3-1 right now. Boston should have won game, what was it, three? I thought. But-

should be a, they could make an argument, it should be a sweep. I'm going to tell you what, they're in for a Doff. I wouldn't be surprised if Toronto won the next one. I wouldn't be surprised if Toronto sitting there's up 3-2. That's three-point, that's a three-point shooting. That one goes by, like, you know, whichever team is making threes in that series, the number is bared out out. Like, whoever's shooting better is probably going to win that. But you haven't even seen a good Pascal Seacom yet. And so that, like, if I'm Boston, I'm like, damn, if he gives me a game, Van Vleet and Lowry or just what they've been over the last couple games, we might have problem. Sure.

Let's get to a real one of the week. You guys are a real one of the week. Let's let's get to a real one of the week, which is a person, an entity that displays all the characteristics if we want in a person. What is yours, Roger Bell? My real one of the week, all right, is coach Mike Malone, all right? Yeah, for coming out the NBA not allowing coaches to have any visitors in the bubble, which is absolutely ludicrous. You've let, I mean, come on, bro.

You have all those teams that left the bubble. All those teams that left the bubble. You're letting players, which is fine. But then you're going to let refs have one visitor, and you're not going to allow coaches to have a visitor and see their family. Like for him stepping up and calling out, like biting the hand that feeds him, so to speak. Like, that's real one for me because he's right. Like, that's stupid.

Also, Mike Malone has been a real one in these streets. Let's keep it a buck. Let's keep it G-Rill. My real one of the week, we're going to go to the WMBA. Okay. Arrique Agumboale of the Dallas Wings, 39 points. Cooking. See, cooking.

Help the wings beat the Mystics and take a game and a half lead for the final playoffs. spot. You know, man, she is balling. She's killing it. And also, I don't know how much you're watching the W right now, but the Dallas wings are a team to watch. They have Satu Saba'i and Bella on that team. They have a really young squad that's going to be in contention for years to come. So, Agumboale, baller, real one certified. Before we get out of here, Kevin loves 32nd birthday today. Shout out Virgo's. Shout out Virgo gang. We're the best sign of all time. No doubt. Any love stories from him?

What's going on? Kevin loves stories. Any Kevin love stories you want to tell? I don't got. Kevin's a good dude, man. I like Kev. Kev was, Kev made the most of a probably uncomfortable situation at first there for him in Cleveland.

And I always appreciated Kev's ability to kind of navigate that. I don't have any specific stories about Kev, but I know that was a difficult transition for a dude to go from being the number one to being number three. and making the most of it, you know? That was a real PC answer, man. Good job. Yeah, I appreciate it. You know what I mean?

Your birthday's coming up, man. We're going to celebrate that some kind of way. It's probably in a couple weeks, bro. Shout out to Virgo's. There we go. And that has been the Monday edition of the Ringer NBA show. Quick disclaimer, though. We still vet names.

So if you want to send Raja a telegram, if you want to send me coming on my mentions and do some suggestions for some names, just holla at us. Big ups to Sasha, big ups to Steve. Even our producers, big ups to TD, our producers. You can listen to us on Spotify and wherever you get podcasts. Make sure you tap in, subscribe, do all that stuff. And we'll see you next week.