The Ringer NBA Show - The Wolves Finish Off the Lakers, and the Rockets Nearly Blow a Blowout | Group Chat

Episode Date: May 1, 2025

Justin, Rob, and Wos are here to give you their immediate thoughts on the Wolves ending the Lakers' season in five games. They look ahead to the LA's offseason and discuss what the team might look to do. Then, they talk about the Rockets' win at home against the Warriors to keep their season alive (44:22). This episode is brought to you by Degree Deodorant. Grab the original Cool Rush at Walmart or Target today. The Ringer is committed to responsible gaming. Please visit www.rg-help.com to learn more about the resources and helplines available. Hosts: Justin Verrier, Rob Mahoney, and Wosny Lambre Producers: Isaiah Blakely and Ben Cruz Social: Keith Fujimoto Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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and listen to the end of the episode for additional details. Must be 21 plus and present in select states. Gambling problem, call 1-800 gambler or visit RG-Help.com. Hello and welcome to group chat. I am Justin Varyer, and joining me, Rob Mahoney, big Waz. Waz, it looks like you fixed your smoke detector. We're all very pleased. Oh, well, you know, it was a one-day thing.

I thought it was my carbon monoxide joint, which is like electrically built in and not like some battery you can buy, but it ended up being the other one, which was battery situated, and I got it fixed. But you are alive. You survived fires and potential carbon monoxide.

I am alive. I'm good. People dealt with some beeping. Life calls on. What's funny is like, I remember hearing the beeping during the podcast, but like, you know, when you're in the flow,

you don't really get, caught up in those things. If you listen back, it's, it's, it's pretty prominent. So we, we keep moving though, you know, we put one foot in front of the other. It's playoff time. We have no choice but to persist. That's right. Unfortunately, the Lakers will not be persisting past this point.

So in this game in which the wolves closed out the series against the Lakers, we had 40 missed three-pointers from the Timberwolves. We had Rudy Gaubert looking like Wilts, and we had Julius Randall looking like one of the best playoff close-out guys in crunch time on a court with Luca Dodgers was Anthony Edwards

with LeBron James. Rob, what the hell did we just watch? It's all very normal stuff. And somehow this was the less weird game of the two weird games we had tonight. But credit to the wolves who just ultimately Rudy Gobert in particular broke the Lakers.

Like he literally broke their formula. He broke the series open. completely change this game with his rebounding in particular, but also just his ability to catch and finish, which had been in a disastrous state over the first four games of this series. And honestly, it felt like, you know, the Lakers made their big, much Ballyhooed, much anticipated lineup change as far as starters go,

playing the only five guys that JJ Reddick was comfortable playing in game four to begin with as starters in game five. It sure felt like Minnesota was ready for it. It sure felt like they had had film sessions, team meetings about getting Rudy the ball in specific spots, and most importantly, him being positioned to just clean up nine offensive rebounds in this game. And most frustratingly, not a single Laker putting a body on him at any point outside of, I would say, maybe a two-minute stretch in the second quarter where they were actually physical.

And outside of that, they seem pretty content to just let this happen. Yeah, generally speaking, when teams go small, right, the idea is that you're going to spread, the opposing team's defense out and, you know, create driving lanes for yourself. It's this idea, I'm going smaller, I'm going to be better in space, I'm going to be quicker to the punch than my opponent is. However, the Lakers not only went small and got bludgeoned and bruised on the block, you know, and on the boards, they could not dribble past anybody. So they were small with all of the disadvantages

And pretty much none of the advantages They literally Minnesota was like, We have no problem switching our big guys onto your wings And keeping our defensive shape Like they played them straight up They never had to contort themselves Into weird pretzels

Because they were in a bind guarding the lake Because they were like, no, we can guard these guys just fine We never spring any major leagues We never have to panic and put our guys in, like, horrible rotational spots. And on the other end, we get to enjoy all of the blessings and advantages that come with being way bigger, way stronger than your opponent. So, yeah, it was just a terrible matchup for the Lakers, and they got exposed. There's a lot of desperate acts from the Lakers in this game. Oh, my God.

Starting first and foremost with the pregame press conference from J.J. Reddick, where he seemed on edge. Not only to the assembled media, but even it seemed like in the TNT, like, separate meeting they have. Like, even Reggie Miller was like, yeah, this guy, I had to tell him to like kind of calm down a little bit. We got Maxie Claibor out of nowhere. First, like, time he was even eligible to be on a court since January 25th. He gets more minutes than Jackson Hayes, the starter, practically since the Luca trade there. But they were practically like selling out on trying to stop the drive. so much that they were allowing the wolves to take all these threes.

I guess that was the better option when they were missing so many, but then it just let Rudy Gobert get whatever he wanted down in the pain. So it just seemed like they had so many disadvantages here. They were just trying whatever they could in order to dig themselves out. But here they are losing the game that they probably should have won, considering how poorly the wolves played throughout. Totally. I mean, it was a really competitive game down the stretch in terms of the margin.

It just never really felt that way because for the bulk of the game, Minnesota was getting, any open three it could want. And, you know, guys like Dante DiVincenzo, guys like Nikiel Alexander Walker, were not hitting at all. Anthony Edwards, I've been pretty resistant to the idea that Ant was taking too many threes in the regular season.

There is zero doubt. He was settling for way too many bad threes here during some critical stretches of this game. They managed their way around that because of the offensive rebounding. They managed their way around that because they were getting enough stops. And they managed their way around that

because Julius Randall was getting every crucial bucket off of a drive, off of self-created, like, isolation offense. I never expected to be here, but I am a Julius Randall believer. Like, this was an incredible series for Julius as a playoff performer, guarding LeBron, guarding Luca, holding up in switches, holding up in space, creating in a way that never really felt like he was off the rails, or if it did, it would at least be while he was being aggressive going downhill, right? Like, he was driving and maybe got a little off balance, but ultimately in a game like this,

you need that sort of downhill momentum, that's not a bad thing. That certainly beats the alternative of Ant taking and missing his 12th 3 of the night. So to me, Ant had a bad, quote-unquote, game. I don't necessarily see it that way, especially when you look at that second quarter where the wolves put together this nice double-digit margin. The entire point of telegraphing the most basic freaking double team God has ever invented, is that you have absolutely zero confidence that any of you guys could stay in front of this dude one-on-one.

So in order to even avoid the situation, when I talk about the pretzel that the Lakers weren't forcing upon Minnesota, that's exactly what the Lakers were doing on defense. They were literally telegraphing these hapless-ass double teams to Anthony Edwards on the ball. Then two, less than three passes later, they were ending in layups when they weren't ending in outright threes. And, you know, I think the game ultimately came down to the fact that the Lakers could do nothing going downhill.

Like, towards the end of the game, LeBron wanted no parts of Rudy Gobert in the paint. He got nothing, no shots in the paint. Same for Luca. And the wolves, Julius Randall, was living in the paint. And even on that Mike Conley, you know, basically dagger three, it's Aunt Edwards on the ball. He forces this extreme amount of help by the basket from Austin Reeves and just sprays it out to a guy for a wide open shot. Austin Reeves was barely within four feet of this guy when he let go of the ball.

So even if Ants not scoring, you know, efficiently on his own, it's him that's dictating the terms of what the Lakers can't even try to do on defense. Yeah, it was a real tail of two halves, I guess. At first he was just making the right place because they were sending doubles. he was hitting wide open shooters. They were just missing. Yeah. Toward the end of the game when Luca was clearly hobbled,

he obviously had a back issue. Dante DeVincenzo kind of struck him what seemed to be like on the neck region, but that somehow that shoulder. Yeah, kind of tweaked his back. Didn't seem like even LeBron and JJ Reddick were surprised when he came out after halftime. It seemed like Edwards was reticent to attack against him in the second half and was setting for a lot of threes.

But you saw as soon as like they got into the paint, how things opened up. Like Randall, after those, like, I think it was like three offense of rebounds, called for the ball against Reeves, takes them all of a sudden bucket. And then there was another play where Aunt did drive against Luca, caught Conley in the corner for the open three. It's just like that's when things started to flow there. But it just kind of almost underlined how easy things were for the wolves

if they could just get a little of something. Lakers just didn't have any answers no matter where they were looking. Well, just how easy it was if they could get a shot on the rim, because then Rudy was cleaning everything up. Again, it's like all of these decision-making quirks are much more palatable when you're rebounding everything and getting second and third and fourth and fifth chances, frankly, on some of these possessions, where the various wolves were just digging it out of the dirt.

Long rebound, short rebounds, it didn't really matter at all. Just a no-show from the Lakers in that particular regard. And this was something we kind of talked about a bit down the stretch of the regular season with the Lakers' size that for all the size that they have in kind of having a lot of power forward-shaped bodies in their lineup, it's kind of fake size. Like, it didn't manifest as you mentioned was in terms of you're not beating people up inside. You're not crushing people on the glass.

Like it maybe made you more switchable where you can handle different kinds of, you know, pick and roll coverages and things like that. But ultimately, they don't play like a big team. And they certainly didn't feel like it once, Luca was really slowed down. And I think did about as much as a person can do when hobbled with a back injury and was creating a fair bit and taking contact and trying to be like a full participant in this game. But by that point, Minnesota had already kind of set the tone and Luca, frankly, can't do everything.

You know, if you had told me after the Luca trade that this was how the Laker season ended, I would probably be like, well, that probably makes sense. They didn't go out and get a center. They were trying to just figure this out on the fly. We didn't know that Reeves would play this well at the end of the regular season. obviously didn't acquit himself too well in this game and did okay throughout this postseason. But if you just told me like, you know, first round series against a tough opponent, I believe it. Was, do you think like we talked ourselves into the Lakers just because they had such a media success? We absolutely did.

When the trade was made uniformly, everything you read, everything you listened to, everything you watched on TV was like, this was a trade made for the future for the next five years. The roster is now extremely imbalanced, and the Lakers are not, like, materially better, even if we think way more highly of Luca than we do Anthony Edwards. This is what all of us said. And then in the regular season, like, oh, this might be better than we thought it was. And we talked to us. And, you know, we fool ourselves with the little number next to the seed, next to the team name. It's like, oh, they're the third seed.

So they're clearly materially better than the wolves when we knew, obviously, from stuff like point differential, just watching the wolves down the stretch that they were not a meaningfully better team than Minnesota. I just thought they'd be able to get by on Gile and Minnesota just traditionally being a knuckleheaded, not executing ass bunch. But, you know, this goes to shows that playoff experience actually matters. And Minnesota was just executing on a much higher level than they have in previous postseason, just being way. less boneheaded, I think. But like, yeah, just look at their rock. Like, they were playing Moxie Kleber. This is nuts.

Okay? I love that he came in and does what Maxi does with all due respect every time he plays, which is he is an ostensible stretch five. We'll catch at the three point line. Won't shoot it. Just we'll pass it up. Reset with four seconds left on the shot clock. Like, let's just keep it moving.

This is the responsible thing to do, I guess. I was baffled that he was out there. But as we mentioned, it speaks to the Lakers desperation and like trying to find bodies that could be like viable in this game. And, you know, Jared Vanderbilt gave Vincent, they actually got a little bit more burned tonight. You can see why they were kind of questionable in the rotation to begin with and why JJ Reddick basically tried to excise them when push came to shove in game four.

Ultimately, like this isn't a team yet. And like this is kind of why we had to be sold on them down the stretch of the season was. It's like they don't have a fully conceived roster that makes sense. They were leaning on Jackson Hayes as a propped up starting center when he is not that. Not even really a rotation level center on most teams, if we're being honest, but they were able to get by because they have Luca, because they have LeBron. And now we'll see kind of how they get by when they can actually build this team in the image of what it's going to be, which is a Luca-led team at the end of the day.

And one that also features LeBron very heavily, but in a variety of roles. So I want to ask you guys related to the trade and the expectations, on the, you know, the constantly evolving is Nico Harrison a complete idiot who shouldn't be allowed to have the job of dog catcher? Like, he's the electric fence guy. I mean, he might trade your dog. I wouldn't let him catch or walk my dog in any capacity.

What grade would you give Luca Donchich in this series? I mean, defensively quite poor. I would say overall for the series. I would say offensively, wolves were never really that worried about them. Their defense never behaved as if they were. This is true. The wolves are uniquely suited to challenge Luca in that way,

especially when he's not playing his best basketball. He just was not at the level that he was in last year's Western Conference finals, really at any point in this series. He had some hot shooting stretches. He was successful in some stretches relative to others. But like, Jane McDaniels, I think, did a really great job up until tonight when he was in foul trouble held for basically the whole game. Yeah.

And frankly, irresponsibly. Like some of that was Luca baiting him into stuff, but some of it was just Jaden overrunning and swiping at things he shouldn't have been doing. But then in comes to kill Alexander Walker, who's right in Luca's jersey and doing a really good job. I would say grade-wise for Luca, I would give him probably like a beat. I think the creation is still super high level. I think the shot making is still elite.

The defense was not there. Ultimately, as far as like being good enough to carry a cohesive playoff-level offense, he just didn't really hit that gear in this series. What's the scale? Like, are we comparing it to past Luca performances? Yes. Just like normal people. Because against normal people, he had 37, 38.

Like, he still played. He had that one shot where he just kind of took J. I think it was Jada McDaniels like in the paint and scored on him on a stepback with like what seemed like just no mobility whatsoever. And so he could still do that. But overall, yeah, like B minus or so. He just, he wasn't dynamic enough in order to, overcome so many of the issues that we talked about with the Lakers. And they were kind of banking on

him doing everything. That's what we talked about even going into this series. Like, oh, Luca is the Trump card. If he's going to be the best player in this series, if he could make magic happen, then maybe. But the wolves had so many different advantages. And like, you saw this one bear out with the size one. And we should probably talk about Rudy Gobert because like in the midst of this game, I was wondering where I should get Rudy Gober's face tattooed on my body because this guy was just on another fucking level. Was this best playoff game of his life? This was the most dominant offensively. This was the most dominant

offensive game he's ever had. Was he dominant on offense guys? Yes. He dunked everything in sight. Like, I mean, he wasn't Iverson out there, like, just like hitting stepbacks, but like, like, he's a monster. Boss, he had 27.

In the first quarter, he was scoring as much as Luca and LeBron combined. He was dominant on the offensive boards. Wait, what was the front? Dominant on the what boards? Offensive boards. Oh, those. He was.

Yeah. Yeah. And he deserves a lot of love for that. He created absolutely zero offense for himself. And he dominated the game while not creating any offense. I don't know what to tell you. That's what happened. He could barely catch the ball half the time.

So if he got this far, like, this is a fucking accomplishment. He had 27 and nine offensive rebounds. That's a dominant game. He was the beneficiary of a bunch of assisted. Dunks, y'all. Like, like, I'm sorry, a 7-3 guy catching and dunking is not offensive dominance, in my opinion.

Like, with nobody on him. His ability to do that. He's not dunking on people, guys. I hear you. Wide open dunks. You're not wrong, but his ability to catch and finish in that way. So catching the ball.

That's a huge step. This dude cannot catch the ball. I'm like, again, that's what J.J. Reddick, dared him to do and he did it like that's fair enough you know i would love to join you here but even i can't look he was awesome he had a great rudy gobert game but for me to say this guy is dominating on offense i think is a bit you know much for me someone snacking on freedom fries over there and just getting the brilliance of our frenchman yeah was what what can you tell us about the fall of Saigon.

Bro. So interesting. A lot of times we will try to prop up like, you know, these regimes that we think like, all right, they'll be favorable to our sort of aims and demands or whatever.

But what ends up happening is just a dependency. And the second we get out of there, the second we're not doing everything for them, it just completely collapses. And, you know, the V.A. Kong just went in. Those guys actually believed in their cause. And they actually felt like they were fighting for somebody and just kicked these South Vietnamese guys,

asses up and down the battlefield and culminating in their, you know, ultimate defeat. So the Viet Cong are the wolves. Why are you still going on? And our dependency as a media apparatus on the Lakers. Like I'm starting to see the parallels here. Also, if you think this is far afield, I guarantee you it is not. because Waz's home viewing experience is apparently watching this game in real time with a podcast overlaid talking about the fall of Saigon.

What is what are you doing? Yes. Literally, I'm like instead of listening to Reggie Miller who, you know, at times I can enjoy, I was like, no, I really, not really, because I think it was like the 50th anniversary of the fall of Saigon. And so, you know, just text out. I can have that one on my calendar. Do you still call it a Ho Chiman City or are you still calling it Saigon? No, we can call it Saigon.

It's all good. I think the relations have been patched up between Vietnam and the West enough that we can call it Saigon and keep it pushing. What about Myanmar? Are you calling it Burma or? Jesus Christ. Just keep it. We're not touching that.

Well, I'll say this. I think Mark Williams, form. in air quotes, Lakers Center. You would appreciate Ray Gaber's performance. He sent out a very coy smiley face immediately after this one, which I have to say was a nice touch on things. But if they had him, things might have looked differently. I was on the side when the trade got rescinded.

You didn't want to blow your powder on a guy who had some deficiencies. Yes, he was younger, could grow with the team. But we talked at length about, you know, defensively injury history, yada, yada, yada. Definitely could have used them tonight. some ways, yes. Mark Williams also not a good pick and roll defender. And if he had been on the floor, they would have put him through the blender all night. And I think he would have been a foul trouble

all night. Just like anyone who over seven feet. That would certainly help, especially to Waz's point, a lot of these possessions were just like, can you get Rudy Gobert the ball with his arms above his head where no other Laker can reach him? And yeah, like that strategy would have been at least challenged if not foiled.

I don't know, man. Watching the playoffs this year, watching the work that Zubach is doing, obviously Yokic, we know. Like, I think having a serviceable center is, like, really important. And, like, Draymond Green's ability to play center credibly. Like, there's a credibility to his defense, like, all comers. He's going to guard these guys on an island, not need a crazy amount of help,

and be able to, like, switch out on the guard. Like, this is nuts. right like what he's doing i think have incredible play at the center position is like as you know we spent a decade basically poo-pooing the entire existence of these guys these big men and i'm more convinced now than ever that is man it's about as crucial outside of having a guy who can create with the ball man you need a big man who can actually stand up the scrutiny in the postseason like i'm truly a believer in that, man. We're so back.

I love it. We are. The bigs are back. The bigs are back. But, you know, Justin, for the Lakers, how do they get such a big man? Like, what are even the avenues for them going forward in terms of you're going to replace Jackson Hayes? I think that's the natural avenue to try to improve this roster, to make it more

Luca friendly, to make it more balanced. But what do you actually do to get those players? Before we flip to the Lakers offseason, can we take a second to appreciate, Julie Randall just a little bit more here. I would love to. I'm just baffled because even in the first half of the season, we got bad Julius Randall. And then something happened when he came back from injury. He just found the most streamlined version of himself, which is one thing.

But then translated that immediately to the postseason after having just not even a checkered postseason passed, just like a fairly awful run in the postseason with the Knicks. The fact that he was the steady hand so often in this series is a goddamn miracle. And honestly, it pretends so well going forward because it does feel like the wolves have the safeguards in place that you need a round ant when you need them. Am I wrong? It feels like the wolves are like maybe on the precipice of something potentially pretty special in these boasts. Could be. I'm going to pump the brakes just a little bit.

Like you will notice if you go back and watch the tape. these drives were coming up against Austin Reeves and Luca Donchich a lot of the times. Like, look, you beat the man that's put in front of you and he deserves love for that, but I think as the playoffs go on, there's going to be a little bit more resistance to the strengths of Julius Randall,

but I like that you use the word streamline because he's just got no fat to his game right now. He's like, I know the matchups, I can't completely dominate. And I shouldn't say that. Like, he did do his thing against LeBron on some big buckets too. I don't want to pretend like it was all chumps, but like the Lakers presented a lot of chumps

for him the feast on. And when he was creating advantages and the Lakers sent extra help, he's whipping it out as fast as possible. And, you know, he's guarding a hell out of people. Like, you mentioned at the top of the show, just like, that to me is like just making his shot diet so much more nutritious and healthy

and giving you the effort and the physicality on defense and on the boards, like, you know, he deserves his flowers for that. I think the effort is not a small part of that. And that's where, you know, earlier in the season, especially on defense, you could spot so many plays in routine regular season games where he's just kind of standing on the weak side,

kind of on the perimeter, not really guarding anybody, even in crunch time of some kind of close-out games that the wolves were trying to push and finish, just like was not locked in. Then you see him in a game like this, and he's so physical, and he's all. he's flying around the court, he's going after loose balls,

and it's just a completely different player to the point that on balance, and I say this not as an insult to this counterpoint, but as strictly praise for Julius Randall, I think there's a reasonable argument that he just straight up outplayed LeBron in this series.

He may have made more impactful plays than LeBron James in a playoff series. That's fucking insane. Just like for us to get that to that point with Julius Randall, and it's such a high bar, even with LeBron in, I think relatively mortal form by the end of this series at the end of the day,

but still making plays on both sides of the ball still so, like so effective roundly. And there's Julius Randall, matching him glow for blow, going one on one against LeBron, coming up with all these enormous momentum shifting plays in a close-out game against the Lakers in L.A. That's an insane turn of events. Watching the end of the game, again, I've watched so many LeBron playoff games during the broadcast.

I think it was Harlan who was like, this man has played more postseason basketball than anybody in the history of the NBA. And just LeBron's just not, he's just straight up not doing the Julius Randall thing. Matchup hunting, putting his nose down and getting in the paint, getting filed, living at the free throw line. Like the old LeBron, man, or even I would say like 2020, bubble LeBron was still a threat one-on-one against any matchup, any team. You know, you could count on him being, giving defenses problems and having to be accounted for. This LeBron is just like, yo, he's settling for jump shots. He's like, even when he gets, like, Nikiel Alexander Walker on him, he's not, like, backing this guy down and putting him under the rim. Like, he's selling for stepbacks against that guy.

It's just, you know, the guy's 40 years old. Like, at a certain point, it is what it is. But, like, watching Randall and Ant be like, you know what? When we desperately need things, we're going to go downhill. and LeBron just being like, ah, I guess I got to go for a step back three on a Rudy Gobert switch. Like that's just, you know, to me that's emblematic

of what the difference was in this series. This episode is brought to you by Degree Original Cool Rush Deodorant. So remember last year when people got really mad when Degree changed their Cool Rush formula? One dude even started a petition. Well, guess what? Degree listened, admitted they messed up

and are bringing the original Cool Rush scent back. You've got to love when a brand can own its mistakes. And it's in Walmart, Target, and other stores now for under $4. Grab some and find out why it's been the number one men's antiperspirant for the last decade. The original degree, Cool Rush, is back, and it smells like victory for all of us. The LeBron Randall comp is applicable because in a lot of ways, LeBron has aged into looking more like Randall, where a lot of it is getting to where he wants to go based on old man's strength. and just bullying teams and you really can't bully the wolves to a certain extent,

especially Randall, especially McDaniels. There's just so many long, big bodies out there. It's just hard to get where you want to go. So he had to play an insular role, which is just, you know, not what he's used to at this point. I think the question is we kind of flipped to the offseason here is like, what's LeBron going to be now in age 41? And like what might they need to do in order maybe safeguard against that? Like, obviously, Luca, if he decides long term, he wants to be.

there, LeBron, Reeves, there's stuff in place. I guess the question is, is it just the center? Do they need anything more in addition to that one piece? Like, Rob, if we're assembling our war room here yet again. Oh, we're back. Yeah, we're back. We're back in the war room. But we're different people now.

I'm Polina. Saigon has fallen. We'll have green hats with the stars on them here. Who are we targeting here? or what are we targeting is probably the bigger question. I think you absolutely need a big. So there are multiple needs, but you start with the size that just absolutely wrecked the Lakers in a game like this.

And it doesn't need to be a dominant player. It just needs to be one who can withstand some playoff scrutiny and who can make you competitive on the boards and can guard some of these other really high-level bigs on occasion. I think for that, you're like, maybe this is foolish of me in a world where the Lakers just kind of wind up with Luca Dantich. But there's certain players who are kind of in the,

ether that I don't think are realistic for what the Lakers have to offer. And that's guys like Walker Kessler, Anyuka, Kongwu. Like, I think they're probably a little outside of the Lakers range. And so realistically, the guys you're talking about, you want someone who's a lob threat who can play with Luca. You want someone who can protect the rim. You want someone who can clean the glass. Like Luca's former teammate, Daniel Gafford, is sitting right there.

I think you could possibly go get him. Nick Claxton, also featured in trade conversations all the time. a little bit of a different vibe, you know, not as big a body, but more switchable than some of the other bigs you might get.

And so it allows you to lean into that style if you want to. I also wouldn't hate if they kind of leaned in a different way, maybe a more maxi-cleba adjacent direction. And like a Kelly Olinic kind of player could be really good for them. I think that could be a really good fit.

I don't think it's a good fit for the defense that I just watched. Well, no, that part not. Yeah, I think they, but this was an offensive struggle too. The Lakers honestly had problems on both sides of the ball. So to

me, I think a lot of your problems get solved if Luca is able to reach his previous form. Yes. Which I personally think is still in question. Like, I know it's just like, oh, they keep saying he's 26. I'm like,

all right, cool. He don't look it. He doesn't move like he's 26. He's coming back off a weird stilted season, off an injury, off of now a stomach illness. Like, Okay. All right. All right, Nico, relax.

I'm just like to see it. I would just like to see it. I think if Luca is an MVP candidate, you can go with these sort of defensive-oriented kind of pieces because Luca's going to take care of the offense because he can be so dominant. If he's not, then I think we're having a moot conversation. Well, sure.

They're just so far, talent-wise, from being the kind of championship team that, you know, the Lakers and their fans expect to be if this guy's not an MVP candidate. Because the bottom line is, LeBron's going to be 41 years old. At a certain point, it's like, yeah, he could probably be as good as Aaron Gordon is, you know, for the Denver Nuggets. And people might say, oh, that's an insult. Like, bro, he's not creating offense anymore. He's not dominating possession. You're not just like, yo, here, LeBron, take me home. Like, here's the ball, take us home.

He's just not going to do that. He's going to be really good at a bunch of shit, but he's not going to dominate your offense. LeBron by himself is not, you know, the sort of roadmap to offensive efficiency the way that we've known him to be for the bulk of his career. So who does that have to be?

That has to be Luca. And around him, because we know of, his deficiencies, they got to get guys that can really be physical that are athletic and can guard people. That's what they need. Can I be a guy just asking questions on a podcast for a second? Sure.

Always. Are we a thousand percent sure that LeBron is going to be a Laker next year? Like, are we a thousand percent sure he's going to opt in? Are we a thousand percent sure he's going to resign with the team? I'm just saying we're all taking it as a point of fact that he's going to be there and they're going to kind of continue to build

this project with him and Luca that ends whenever LeBron says it does. And we haven't had any indication that he's leaning that way. But I'm just saying like there's a decision up in the air that's in his court that he, like he gets to decide what happens. Well, he was shocked when he was at dinner that this trade went down. He was. He hadn't heard anything about it.

No whispers whatsoever was caught off guard. I, from the scuttle butt that I've heard. Yeah. This is that LeBron is signing an extension. I believe it. In the offseason with the Lakers. This seems like overwhelmingly what will happen. I'm just saying like I'm seeing him on the cap sheet not locked in because he has this option.

Here's the question. What's the other option? I think if we can come up with something that made sense, perhaps. But the only thing on the board, it's like the hypothetical step reunion. And I don't know that just got really muddy with Jimmy there. So. I don't have a alternative. Yeah.

Yeah. No. I think LeBron just straight up, his priority is just getting paid. So I think the Lakers are going to pay, hey, man. I think the Lakers are going to pay him. And that's just going to be that. Now, question, would he take a pay cut?

That's what I'm saying. Is LeBron a max player still? No, but that's throughout his entire journey. I don't feel like the guy that I watched tonight. It was a max player. no but he's been not to do so if only for the precedent it sets for other players behind him

yeah and because he wants to make the most he can because he deserves it I would be shocked if he did but I think that is something that should be broached at the very least it's a pretty fair conversation to have I think LeBron is still a max player like he had an all NBA season

he's one of the 10ish best players in the world like that's a max guy as far as I'm concerned history be damned like present tense, that's a max player. And maybe this was just a bad matchup for him. I do think it was a bad matchup. That's true. I think we're kind of circling the tension point of this entire thing,

which I think is Austin Reeves, because I think if you want LeBron and Luca insurance, we saw Reeves do that in the regular season. And I do think if you're hoping to build track for a post-Lebron future, whenever that is, when it is just Luca, Reeves is the guy that the organization is obviously loved. They love finding him.

He's basically the shining star of the past like five years of team building for them. On the other hand, he is the key to getting a different type of player around all those guys. It's a little complicated because his contract is such a bargain, that salary matching. Like you couldn't go out and trade Reeves for KD, for instance. But if you wanted to go big game hunting or if you just wanted to get a veteran center that you know could run immediately, Reeves is the guy. And so I think the question is, like, would you be willing to talk about Reeves in any of these trades? It has to be pretty juicy. I'm going to be honest with you.

I think Reeves has put himself in a different category of consideration where he's not just like an also-ran on this roster. He's a really capable creator and score, even if he is one that maybe is best suited to being the second or third guy on a team like this. I think between the timeline and who he is as a shot creator and how well he plays in most instances alongside Luca and LeBron, that's not a player. I'm like eager to give up. Now, if you're going to bowl me over with a great big who makes this team feel more complete, that's a conversation we can have. But I think that's going to be a hard trade partner to find. I'm open to trade in Austin.

I'm like, I don't know why Austin Reeves is untouchable. It's kind of touchable. He's just really good. No, no, no. He is really good. But like, yeah, if the right sort of, especially again, if Luca is my offense, this guy is expendable. He's an offense. The goal is that he's not just your offense.

Like if you have Austin Reeves in theory, Luca doesn't have to be your whole offense, right? Like that's another really capable creator from the second side that can make a difference for you. I know, but to me, that's like getting cute, where it's like, oh, I have this luxury outside of Lucas' creation. Meanwhile, playing these two together makes my defense so easy to target, man. And that's why I'm just like,

Austin Reeves can get traded. He can get traded, especially if it's going to make you more athletic, either on the wings or with a big. This was an underrated part of the Kyrie Luca duo as well, because Kyrie just, especially during his time as a Maverick, which is a really credible defender. Did his job, worked his ass off.

Yes, he's small and he's just going to get worked over in some matchups, but he stood his ground in a way that Austin just frankly does not. So, yes, the defensive concessions of very real. And he tries, but he's scrawny and just gets bowled over. He tries, but in that way where he's like more active than effective. Yeah. You know. Kyrie at the game tonight and LeBron at one point just all right pointed at him after like dunking the ball.

Thought that was pretty curious. Although Kyrie has been getting around on some of these games. I think he was at one of the Clippers games as well, but like. It's not that curious. It's L.A. Free agent is this offseason. Well, he's got a long recovery ahead of him. I don't think Kyrie is the answer to any of the Lakers' problems. The flip side of that is like, what about KD?

Are we, that's the other question here, where it's like, are you leaning into the now? Or are we saying, no. Why no? You're not being a helpful assistant GM right now. Cheaping him down. I'm sorry. There's a change of ideas. no bad ideas except for the Lakers getting Kevin Durant.

That is a bad idea. I think the combination of one timeline, like the whole point of getting Luca, is that you now have this long runway ahead of you that makes a player like Austin Reeves to make a certain kind of sense, right, as a long-term fixture in the franchise and make someone like Kevin Durant not.

There's also just like dealing with Kevin Durant is a very unique undertaking that only certain kinds of franchises want to do, and I'll say the Lakers are probably historically one of the kinds of franchises that would, but now that they have Luca, why, like, why would you bother? Like, why would you take on that when you're already dealing with everything that's going on with this team?

So you watch what happened in Phoenix this year, and you're like, what the Lakers need is to hollow out their roster even more than it already is in order to bring KD in there. Well, here's the thing. I don't know if KD's necessarily disruptive, if anything, he's not disruptive enough and assertive enough and like what he wants. If anything, he's just kind of moody and sulking a lot while he's just trying to do his own thing. Now I'm saying what's happening here. Like, it's really you're mounting a self-defense.

And I appreciate the effort, but I don't know. I just suggested that they might trade for a Hall of Famer. And you guys are like, no. No, it's not that. But get out of here. This Hall of Famer. It's this team specifically. Like, they don't have some like,

deep reserve of, you know, the sort of role-playing pieces that we know you need. You know, like, you need Nas Reid. You need Nikiel Alexander Walker. Like, you need these guys.

You need Jaden McDane. Like, you need these type of players to fill out a roster. People that you're like, yo, they're credible on both sides of the ball, right? The Lakers don't have that. So like, what's bringing KD going to do?

I'm just, I just want to have a conversation. Literally what a podcast is. No, okay. I feel it. I just, yeah, I don't like it for the Lakers, but, you know, maybe Houston will fall into that trap. Yep. Anything else here?

Oddly enough, this is a weird offseason of flux, even though the Lakers made their big move at the trade deadline. LeBron, as you guys mentioned, player option. Luca, you would assume that we're going to start seeing signs of whether or not he will long-term sign or if something else will kind of upend that. Or at the very least,

like the Lakers are kind of on the clock to prove to him that there is a long-term runway here. Reeves, we should also mention is extension eligible. And so as cheap as he is, as much as that is a big part of his kind of come up in the value across the league at this point. I do think he's going to get more expensive fairly quickly as a player option

for 26, 27. So that's kind of complicate things. And we should say just more complicated mechanically to trade once he does sign that extension. Yes. So there's actually a lot of wiggle room here, a lot of expirings. So they could get something done here, but you're right. It would kind of gut out their entire depth here. And as we saw, I mean, that was one of the main advantages for the wolves.

I will say just to put a bow on this series. I do kind of like it that you can't easy bake a contender so quickly that you can make a trade deadline trade for Luca Donch. and still win a title. Like, there's too many good teams and too many good deep teams in this league that, like, you're not beating a wall because they go eight deep with guys that are just quality up and down.

Yeah. I think it's important more than ever to bring pieces in, not via trade, not via having had given up a bunch of stuff to bring somebody in. Like, obviously drafting and a shrewd free agent,

signing and, you know, some undrafted guy who nobody thought that you unearthed and developed, like, now more than ever, bro, like you absolutely need to do this. So that, you know, like a Boston who drafted their two core guys, you know, they bring in Derek White on a nice deal and all of this stuff. Like, when they have to pull the trigger on like a poor Zingis

or even bringing Al Horford back or any of this other stuff, it's like, we're not putting together like these. insane packages that drastically change the nature of my team to do so. You know, and like the Lakers, they just don't have that at the moment in terms of a bunch of homegrown, homespun kind of stuff. Like, we love Austin Reeves, but like they needed more like Caruso's and stuff like that in order to have a roster that's more ready to make to content. This is why you see so many younger teams, especially wait and wait and wait before they make their big trade.

Because once you make it, not only are you on the clock with whatever star you get, but the best assets you have as you're talking about, Wazer, like, okay, now we have to improve our team materially every year with the 24th pick in the draft and whatever we can scrounge up using the mid-level exception. Like that's kind of all we have to improve once we make that big jump. The difference with the Luka is, one, the Lakers were already good. And two, this is a once in a lifetime trade that just fell into their lap. And honestly, they were pretty upfront about that as it happened of like, this is the kind of thing you just do and you work out the details later. And now we're seeing what work out the details looks like. Rob Flinga, going to earn that extension, boys.

He certainly is going to earn that executive of the year on her, I'm sure. All right. Let's flip to their potential matchup awaiting the wolves. Rockets, Warriors, probably the dumbest game I've seen in a very long time. Speak on. Tell us about it. So with 234 left to go in the third quarter, Warriors pulled their starters. And Woz tweets out without any accompanying text, a link to a YouTube video entitled,

Why Stir Fry is better in restaurants and how to do it at home? What did you learn? That's my guy. That's my guy. Eric is my broom. And two years. in your defense. It was like Austin, it was, excuse me,

Reed Shepard and just guys at the bottom of the Rockets Bench didn't play Cam Whitmore, which I thought was just the shade of all shade against, frankly guys I had never heard of for Golden State Warriors, Brandon Key? Yeah.

We were like, we got to be a two-way guy. Braxton Key, not Brandon Key. We were a, we were a Braxton Key layup away from this being a real game. And unfortunately, he missed like seven layups.

And that's, That's the other side of this dumb ass game is that the scrubs of Spencer Braxton key, Moses Moody on an absolute terror. Kevin Knox on his 20th team in the past 10 years and Trace Jackson Davis actually stormed back so much that they had to play their starters again. This is unbelievable, but ultimately the Rockets won this one. And so going back to Golden State. This felt like the ultimate veteran like we're not trying this game.

We're up 3-1 on the road. Like, we're going to let these young boys. They don't want their season to end. Good for them. Yeah. But they did not try as ever. I think the Rockets had like 80 points at halftime. They were running it up.

This was not a series in which the Rockets have been lighting it up. And at halftime, they had 80, which lets you know everything you needed to know about Golden State's effort. And the amount of energy they were willing to exert to try to close this thing out. And then Steve Kurt matched the end. energy by clearing his bench with 16 minutes left in the game. And it almost worked. You know, Steph had to put his braces back on.

Buddy Heald had to play minutes at the end of this game from whatever reason. Starter Buddy Healed had to trot back into this game. That was uncalled for. I want to give the Rockets some credit up front about what you're talking about. Because I agree, Golds Day came out flat. They did not come out with a ton of energy. But the Rockets did.

And I think it was it was the kind of. of thing where the warriors see the energy that the rockets are exerting. And they're like, oh, no, I'm not, we don't need to do that from their perspective. And we don't want to participate in that tonight. And so it was this like initial show of force that almost to me warded a bunch of veterans off a little bit, where they then, you know, like Steph's missing some of his early shots. Jimmy Butler, frankly, even energy level of side just still looks quite injured, very immobile, very idle out there. Like in a way that I know we just saw him sky for a clutch rebound. I know we just saw him make huge plays and crunch time.

His ability to do that over the course of a full game is still kind of suspect at this point. And so there's still some things to watch. There's still some concerning areas for the Warriors, I think overall, including their inability to beat a zone defense for long stretches, even as they were trying to be vaguely competitive in this game, but just it was not their best effort by any stretch. I'll say this. I can't wait for the Rockets and that will trade that's going to happen. And not necessarily because of whomever they will get. I'm sure we'll talk about that at length over the offseason. But just to see Emin Thompson do what he's doing now in the context of much higher level basketball,

he had five steals in the first half. In 16 minutes of gameplay, he had five steals. And how many of those were just ripping Steph at half court? It was genuinely bad, like just watching him in that capacity. And I'll say watching him find himself offensively over these last two games, I think has been really reassuring for the Rockets and kind of inspiring as far as as like his arc getting used to playoff basketball, we all know how Golden State is guarding him

and the amount of space that they're giving him and frankly the way they're challenging him with disrespect, right? With that inattention, I think he's really seized that opportunity. And he's found ways to cut, he's found ways to get involved. He's also,

he and the Rockets both in this game in particular, like ran so hard in transition that they didn't always get like easy fast break points out of it, but they created cross matches that then they could exploit. And then there'd be like Fred Van Villeet wide open in the weakside corner. And now all of a sudden

you're getting great shots, right? Like you're getting great, consistent shots for an offense that in the half court is just not going to do that. And amen, and really this team's collective speed and athleticism

is what enables that. Yeah, they came out like they didn't want their season to end, which sounds like, oh, they're professional athletes. Like,

we've seen plenty of playoff series where, you know, they teamed down 3-0, game 4. It's just like, we didn't even try. You know,

it was like, cough, cough, Miami heat. Exactly. One, two, three, Cancun all day. Justin, your face froze on like a really funny

facial expression just now. But, but hey, Cancun can wait. Turks and Kekos can wait. Like, these guys are ready to fight. Like, these dudes all season long, pretty much since last season,

they play like a scrappy bunch, man. Like, these guys play with a lot of pride. And that's what they came out and did in this game. And I'm happy for them. I'm proud of these young. guys to be like, look, man, like we get it. Like, the odds are definitely stacked against us, but that doesn't mean we're not going to come out and give it, you know, 115%. And, you know, they were rewarded with a nice comfortable victory. Yeah. Yeah. We got two good examples of that

back to back because Janus also was ready to die on his shield in that tragic loss against the bases the other day, but he played his fucking ass off. And in this one, we saw Dylan Brooks having to play mediator for a man Thompson because he almost bit Gary Payton the second's head off and then Brooks was the one who had to step in and tell him no don't get into a tussle which was something I don't think I've

literally ever seen that speaking of Brooks though we do have to talk about one thing because it seemed like Steph's finger is becoming an issue I don't know if you guys saw the photos of him getting on a plane it looked pretty old as grotesque honestly yeah

yes and so I think the Rockets also saw it too because apparently the, I want to say the Warriors broadcast maybe was making, was pointing it out that the Rockets, defenders were hitting Steph's hand as he was shooting it, perhaps intentionally Kerr addressed it after the game. He's like, yeah, I think that's what's going on. And actually, we need to weed this out of the league. Brooks basically had a non-answer about it where he was kind of like, oh, if I had an ankle injury, I'd expect people to go at it. I want to decide that one a little bit more. But I think if you have a concern about the rockets

in addition to just the ferocity, excuse me, for the warriors, in addition to the ferocity of the rockets, Steph's hand seems like it's hurt. Like they desperately need him to be more or less fully functional Steph Curry in order to overcome Houston's defense. I think part of that too is another kind of takeaway

I had from this game, in particular in contrast to the previous ones, like Curry at, when he's going, he kind of makes you forget who you are. Like, he makes you forget your team identity because you're constantly scrambling to get after him. To the point that Imeodoku was taking out some of the best lineups the Rockets have, taking size off the floor for the sake of like trying to match up with Steph. And you saw him go back to the too big a little bit more in this game.

You saw him keeping Stephen Adams on the floor even before the game got out of hand. Like things that really matter to the Rockets ecosystem and let them play the way that they play. and if Steph can't shoot, we're all in the mud together. You know, then you're playing Houston Rockets basketball. That's where things can get, like,

if Steph's shot is off because of his hand and Jimmy Butler is hobbled because of his injury, I mean, that's about as dire estate as the warrior's offense could be in. We'll have to see if that's the case, you know,

coming into this next game. But that's a pretty tough sign. That's a pretty bad omen. Stephen Adams, another one of those centers, just bringing them back. In the post season, what if it was,

100 Stephen Adams versus one gorilla. I just assumed Stephen Adams was like in place of the gorilla like 100 people against Stephen Adams how would they do? Yeah, 100 Stephen Adams might be able to do it for sure.

What if it was 100 Robs? 100 Robbs versus the gorilla? We're toast. For one guys, I know I'm toast. I ain't going there no damn gorillas. I already know I'm toast because guys I'm already on the playoff I are. I already broke my hand.

Jesus Christ. the playoffs basically. How did we just see this? Yeah, look, I've been trying to fight through it. I've been trying to soldier through. I played some pickup basketball. You injured yourself playing pickup basketball? Yeah, I tried to play defense.

It was a bad idea. Don't worry about it. It won't happen again. I promise you that. I'm not going to stick my hand where it doesn't belong. Danny Glover, I'm getting too old for this shit. Seriously. For the audio listeners, Rob just put within camera range his hand,

which seems to be in an aircast, just the focus? We're fully hard-casted up at this point. But yeah, the gorilla is just going to prey on 100 one-armed robs. It's not going to go great for us. 100-1-on-robs. It's not ideal. Wow. What we're talking about like a break or what do we got here?

Do you want to... Yeah, just a straight up break right down the middle finger. So wait, you got to have a surgery? No, no, no. It's thankfully very stable, but it needs to be immobilized in a way that, you know, it's not so friendly for us typing professionals. I'm not here trying to take notes and it's not going well.

Wow. I didn't get that injury report. So I was unaware. Look at you. Potting through the pain. We didn't want the Vegas lines to move on it. When people find out about your injuries, the bets swing, the markets change,

we don't want to have that kind of effect on the world. Rob is the Viet Conga podcast. I know. I did not say that. That's Big Wazz, Wazney Lambrey, who said that. Oh, no. Wads, you want to, before we go,

anything about stir fry? Is it better in restaurants? Dude, yeah. So there's a method that they use at the Chinese spots called velveting, which will tenderize pretty much any meat that you throw in there, whether it's chicken breast or even, you know, a more lean beef cut. Like you use egg whites, a little bit of bacon soda, some corn starch, and like, you know, there's like alkaline

and obviously the baking soda and the egg whites and it like tenderizes this shit when you marinated in that mix and that's why you get that smooth like really juicy texture from restaurant quality chicken and broccoli beef and broccoli etc etc

so yeah watch that tutorial you will learn how to velvet your protein for beef and broccoli or chicken and broccoli. That does sound wonderful. I have a counter proposal, though, which is, you know, go go shop at small businesses. Keep your local Chinese restaurants open.

Make sure you keep going and eating over there for sure. It's just, I just like to do just to test myself, like, could I make a banging, you know, beef and broccoli at the house? And, you know, it's just fun like that. To be determined. Your new YouTube series, Waz Cooks? I'm ready. I'm ready. I'm ready.

I'm ready. Would absolutely watch. I'm ready. All right. We'll talk to some mucky mucks and see if we get that off the ground. Tell Uncle Bill, I'm ready. On that note, we'll be back over the weekend. Thank you to Isaiah Blakely.

Thank you to Ben Cruz. We'll talk to you next time. Must be 21 plus and present in select states for Kansas in affiliation with Kansas Star Casino or 18 plus in present in D.C. Gambling problem. Call 1-800 gambler or visit RG-Help.com. Call 1-88-789. 777 or visit ccpg.org slash chat in Connecticut or visit mdgamblinghelp.org in maryland hope is here visit gambling help line m a.org or 800 327 5050 for 24 7 support in massachusetts or call one 8778 hope n y or text hope n y in new york