The Ringer NBA Show - Victor Wembanyama vs. Scoot Henderson: WILD First Matchup Reaction

Episode Date: October 5, 2022

The Ringer's Kevin O'Connor and J. Kyle Mann give their instant reaction after attending the G League Ignite vs. Metropolitans 92 game in Las Vegas featuring the two top prospects in the 2023 NBA draft, Victor Wembanyama and Scoot Henderson. They break down why Wembanyama might be the best NBA draft prospect since LeBron James, how Scoot Henderson is already exceeding early expectations, and debate just how far teams should go to try to land the top pick in next year's draft. Hosts: Kevin O'Connor and J. Kyle Mann Production Assistance: Dylan Berkey & Brian H. Waters Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Mac Jones is ripped. The Celtics may actually trade for Kevin Durant and The Ringer has a new Boston show. I'm Brian Barrett, host of Off the Pike, the show covering all things Boston sports. I'll have shows multiple times a week covering your favorite teams

and with your favorite ringer and local guests. Plus, maybe Bill will stop by to rant about the socks. Follow off the pike with me, Brian Barrett, now on Spotify. Hey, this is Kevin O'Connor. We have a special edition emergency podcast with me and Jake Halman following the debuts of Victor Wembeñama and Scoot Henderson. We were in the building tonight, fired up seeing these guys exceed expectations.

Victor Wenbaniama with 37 points on 7-11 from 3. Scoot Henderson with 28 points, 9 assists, 5 rebounds, led the ignite to the victory. But, man, Kyle. Victor Wembegama is definitely the guy tonight that I want to talk about first because I came away tonight after watching him drop 37, 5 blocks. dominate on defense. I think it's official. Victor Wenbenyama is the best projected number one picks since LeBron James. Whoa. I mean, it's going back a long way. You start to kind of round and look at what the high kind of spike points are of like can't miss guys at that level.

And it's hard to think back about those players and think about like the expectations. When we tab somebody as being generationally special, you know, for some people, they are, circling around and finding more about Vic, finding out more about Vic right now. But we, he's not a new commodity. He's been on the radar for quite some time. There's been a lot of like whispering about who he is as a player and how exciting he is. How long ago was that clip where he's playing one-on-one with Rudy Gobert? I feel like that was kind of a kick the door down kind of moment. Sure. We've seen, I think maybe last year or the year fire, it's all blended together. Sure.

We've seen those flashes, but we haven't seen it on this stage against this level of competition or at the level that he's doing it. I mean, this dude hitting step back three-pointers, you know, in transition, sprinting off the catch, finishing inside, coming from weak side blocks against like speedy guards like Scoot Henderson blocking his jump shot multiple times throughout the game. We should get to the defense. I think totally, like starting from. your thing about like the best since lebron yeah yeah yeah so that me that means better than greg o'd and kevin durant either of them projected his ones anthony david better than ad better than zion at seven foot four with his eight foot wingspan barefooted barefooted yeah yes barefooted seven foot four eight foot wingspan skill level intelligence good head on his shoulders works hard great

kid, wants to be coached, all those intangible things on top of what we saw tonight with him just dominating. Like you said, defense, that gives him a baseline, right? Like, where he can be one of the best defenders in basketball. I had that thought a lot as we were watching it. I mean, like, offensively, what he did was, if you look at it in the raw, simplest kind of like crude way, you could just say, well, he just hit jump shots. He did, but jump shots are not all created equal, as we know, there are a lot of different separators between the types of shots. There are some guys who can literally just catch and shoot, like Davis Bertans, like pretty much just going to catch and shoot.

Guys that can kind of get to theirs quickly, hit it fluidly in transition at his size. I just don't know how many, like, coordinated, skilled guys there are at his remarkable measurements. If he could just be a rim protector and that, that's enough to be like a dominant, like, all NBA. type player. To your point, you mentioned Bertons. Carl Anthony Towns came to mind as you were saying that Cat is one of the most skilled big men in all the basketball, but from three

point range, he's typically a stationary, three point guy. He can come off some action, some off-screen actions. He can hit an occasional off the dribble jumper, but Victor Wenby. We saw him tonight sometimes ripped down a defensive rebound, go coast to coast, and he had an air ball

at one point. It was kind of a heat check. But the fact is, is for Wenban Yamma to be in a position where he can fluidly get into some side dribble three pointers. He hit one from the corner. That was a side dribble. Stepbacks. He has a range of ability to hit shots from the perimeter. And never mind if you move him inside the arc. We saw tonight the post moves, high post, low post, some of the turnarounds that he can hit. He has that all on his bag. He's shown for years, like you said. But tonight we saw like this guy in clutch moments, in big moments down the stretch of that game

because Metro was down at half. Down big. Down big. They went down 20 at one point? It felt like the G League Ignite might run away with that game and we might not get a close one.

But that was close down the stretch because Wenban Yamah dominated both ends of the court. And he said after the game, he said he talked to the team at halftime, 18-year-old kid. Since he talked to the team at halftime, he's like, I don't want to lose this game.

We get a step up. And they did, led by him, and his efforts on both ends of the court. I thought it was just an absolutely magnificent, memorable performance. One of those things where it's like, where were you when you saw this? We were there, Kyle. We were there. We were there.

And we had a lot of conversations about, we didn't know what this was going to be. Sometimes these can be you trot the guys out there. It's just kind of ho-hum. And it was making me think back about the times in my life as a basketball fan when I can remember watching a showcase. you know, sometimes you'll have guys come up against each other in college and it'll be a matchup. Maybe it doesn't quite deliver. But just like having two guys that are like bona fide for sure going to be or they're projected to be the top of the draft. And not just that like a strong

draft that like evaluators are like these are like superstar level players. How often does that really happen? I was trying to think back. I mean, you think about like Carmelo and LeBron play Oak Hill played St. Vincent back in like 2002 speaking of LeBron. But just those head-to-head matchups, we saw like Chet and Palo, but it didn't really deliver. Like today, this, and to be fair, this wasn't like a competitive, like, college environment where it was like winning, you know, winning was like the most important thing. It is important. You like to see it. But, man, there was just something in the air immediately.

You know, we heard earlier in the week, we had, and Dylan was, Dylan was, Dylan Berkey, our producer where I was sitting next to during the game was telling me just that like the Victor quote that went. viral about like if I hadn't been born, you'd be the number one pick, which I'd heard that it was a little more jovial like like hearted than maybe people let on. It definitely was. But Scoot came out like, you don't want to like overvalue this, but you definitely want to keep it in mind. It's like guys that shrink from the moment are are tough. You kind of have to keep your eye on them as they develop it. But Scoot definitely came in here tonight to prove a point. I think it affected how he played a little bit.

bit. We could talk about that. But they just together rose to the occasion, man. I mean, it really, one of the more incredible, like, draft-driven events that I've ever been to, especially for an exhibition. It just blew my mind. Well, the crowd was filled with GMs, scouts, evaluators and media everywhere from, you know, across the entire country, across the world, right? Some international scouts in the crowd as well. So, like, atmosphere-wise, like this like tonight i thought it was about moments like you said it wasn't about the results it was about those moments that we saw and there were so many from both of these guys like even at the end of the game a moment that sticks in my mind with victor wemagnama was his teammate tremont waters threw the ball

out of bounds and i look straight to victor wemoremban i'm i turned straight to victor wemaniama he's clapping his hands cheering on his teammates next play mentality then he blocks a shot then he hits a big three continues talking, communicating on defense, showing leadership. I'm like, yo, this dude's 18. And those are the little things in addition to the big highlight plays that are going to stick in my mind when I remember this game. What is like the one moment that's going to stick with you, Kyle, from Victor Wenna?

If you have to pick one, is there a sequence, a play, a block? I went into this event, and this is something that Dylan and I were talking about that like we I really wanted to be eye level for this because normally with basketball if you want to see it's kind of the thing you want to have the right angle to kind of see what's going on in certain situations but for some athletes I choose to get you know down an eye level and Wimbunana yeah sorry Wimbunyama is the is one of those guys that I really really wanted to see and I'm serious I think the thing at the beginning of the game was just like he I think he came from the weak side and just erased a drive.

I think it was screwed. I can't remember the exact. I need to go pull the highlight up. But it was just breathtaking. And that was something that I kept thinking about a lot is when somebody's that big, we enjoy them just like in terms of like the entertainment of like you get excited about what this person might do. But on some level, it's kind of like he's used to being as big as he is, I'm sure.

But like the reaction from the crowd when he came. out. It was just incredible. Like a lot of just grown adults filming him with their phone. But I think that like that was the most memorable moment was when he blocked that shot. And I think he hit a three not long after that, but just the functionality of his size. I think it really made an impression on me in that moment. Who does Victor Wenbanyama remind you of? And the reason why I asked us is because after the game, I asked him, I was like, hey, there's a lot of bigs nowadays. including you who are doing perimeter stuff.

Who were the players when you were first falling in love with basketball that you liked watching that you searched for on YouTube? And he didn't give any names. He's like, oh, I've always played like this. I don't really, I can take things from people's games, but I don't yada, yada, yada, model. I came out fully formed with no influences. No influences at all.

Anyway, Kyle, when you watch Wormanyama, which players from the past do you see in his game? Who would you compare him? Does there anybody you would fuse together? to make Victor Wenbanyama. The thing that's really interesting about him is that the physique is so unique and special and the coordination is so unique and special.

We've had some guys recently. Like, we kind of thought Porzingis might be this, but he's more talented on both ends than Porzingis. Hopefully far more durable. That's another conversation. You kind of reach back, man. I mean, like, I was telling somebody tonight

that, like, I spent some time for a project I did where I was watching a lot of like young Kareem. And Kareem was like a legit 7-2 with really long arms but could really move what's fluid and coordinated. Man, I mean, sometimes I get that vibe when I watch. Yeah. I can't say his name of night, but Wimby. And the other one that people bring up is.

Victor. Yes, Vic, we'll call him Vic. The other one is Ralph Samson. Yeah, broadcast mentioned that tonight. Yeah, yeah. Samson is a guy. And you're talking about like, you know, the way that we play today, obviously affecting those things. Those two players, I think, definitely could have played based on their skill sets and their coordination and things like that.

Those are two guys that come to mind. Do you have any that kind of pop off for you? I mean, for me, like I think this somebody he's probably searching for on YouTube when he was younger, has to be Kevin Durant. I know. That's who you can take your life. It's got to be Kevin Durant. And even if he's never nearly as skilled as Katie as a score, which, by the way, that's not an insult,

Katie's one of the greatest, if not the greatest score of all time. High bar. It's clear just the way he moves in the dribble package that this is somebody who's watched KD with his long limbs and his ability to still create his own shot. I just see that comparison like a bigger form. And it's just going to be a matter of

when Manyama at lower levels has shot, you know, sub 20% from three. That's what I wanted to bring up. Like we saw him crush tonight from three point range. what level is he really as a shooter is going to determine whether this guy is 7 foot 4 worthy of even being mentioned

as like a KD influenced player or whether this is just a hot night for him and he's going to be a 30% 3 point shooter throw to square even you mentioned poor Zingas in passing there KP's like a 34% guy

it's not like KP has ever become 39 40% from 3 Kat is that guy Carl Anthony Towns is that guy if when Benyama can reach cat level in terms of percentages as a three point shooter like it's over it's done if this guy can be dirt cat

whatever as a three point shooting big with that dribble package like yo there's nothing you can do nothing you can do to stop him nothing because he by the way we haven't even mentioned that he can pass a little bit too a good bit I think that it's the point

about his percentages is a good one I think that you kind of like he's great from the line these are the positives if you wanted to believe it. He's great from the line. He looks the part. For a guy with hands, his size,

I mean, they have to be 11-inch hands or bigger. They're just gigantic. Like, every time he would follow through, I've never been so fixated on somebody's follow-through. His hands look like that. What's the cover of that tool album, whether they have those long, is it schism? No, I'm talking about it?

That might be, yeah, yeah. That's a pool. No, but like, he's, he looks. looks the part as a shooter. So I would lean towards believing in it. You know, Carl was a little more, like, consistent in terms of his percentages from level to level as he was coming on. But, I mean, geez, dude, if you're going to get, like, a departure from who Carl is

as a player is that, like, if Vic is going to be able to be, like, a freelancing rim protector at all levels like that, he's quick to the ball. He really surprised Scoot on one play on a pull-up. Jumper. Scoot adjusted to his credit. But there was a moment early in that game where you could tell Scoot was just like, oh, like, this dude is like longer than anyone I've ever. And I'm pretty sure he got one later in the game too. Like he gets his hands on a lot of jump shots. He's disruptive at the rim. I even think there were some foul calls that weren't great on him throughout the night. But that's just not a combination that you typically get from a player. That kind of room

protection and that kind of shoot. At a baseline, he's got, you know, Gobert-esque, level defense potential. He doesn't roll to the rim that often. He's picking, pop in a bunch. But if necessary, with a dominant, you know, perimeter guard that he's paired with, you're going to see him roll into the room getting lob opportunities. He's going to be shooting 70 plus percent in the paint, you know, off roll opportunities, cutting opportunities. He's going to be productive from the posts. If the three-point shot comes along with his handle, like there's no stopping Victor Wenbenyama. Let's talk about Scoot Henderson, Kyle. Scoot Henderson on the other side of this game tonight

led the G-League Night to the victory, 28 points, 9 assists, five rebounds. Scoot Henderson came away from this game. I'm feeling even better about him personally. I interviewed him earlier in the week, and he told me that his jumper has improved. He worked on it. Granted, it's just one game.

I thought he looked good as a shooter. What do you think? What's your takeaway from Scoot Henderson tonight? I mean, for both of these guys, I think the shot making was a little bit out of body. different times. I mean, like, we saw, like, what a high watermark can look like for these guys. I think the most important thing, and this is what I come back to a lot, is that, like, if you think about the benchmark for what these really hyperathletic point guards,

because Scoot is probably 6-2, I've always said that, like, I legitimately think he has the athleticism of, like, an NFL corner. Like, I mean, he has that type of, like... He played safety in corner growing up. Yeah. He's got that sort of, like, tight core strength. his pace for his age and for the tools that are available to him. I think I talk a lot about like when you have crazy physical tools when you're younger, a lot of times that can affect when you're playing at the youth level. You're going to be able to go to that whenever you want. I think the maturity to like hold back and show restraint is really impressive.

So if you see somebody like Scoot, I just thought tonight he played with a lot of pace. I mean, I like that just purely in the, we can talk about like, like his personality, which I think we will. But he just looked under control a lot. He was really looking to score more, I think, motivated by things that are obvious, I think. But got to the rim. I thought he handled the ball really well. The at-room finishing was gorgeous.

Like he gets blocked by Wenbenyama a couple of times. But the at-room finishing, like this dude's putting so much English on the ball off the backboard to, you know, go up and under, finish around. Wembe Nama's long, eight-foot wingspan, I thought he did a sensational job going against the longest player that he's ever faced. To me, that bodes really well for what he can become in an NBA environment when he's going against, you know, a Chet or Robert Williams, a Rudy Gobert, whoever it might be. Like, he might be shorter and he might be speedy and he's athletic, and he's athletic, and he's athletic, and he's athletic, and he's athletic, and he's athletic. But he's also got, you know, body control and skill and finesse around the rim.

In addition to that, just pure athleticism and explosiveness. Yeah. And I think as a finisher, I don't know that he's necessarily like an elite in terms of like craftiness. Like in terms of like... Not Kyrie level. No, he doesn't, but he doesn't really have to. It's like he's like accessing the square in a way that like those guys don't necessarily do. Kyrie more below the rim.

Yeah. And he can be above the room. He did test when Mianama. He went for it. adult and what we have a dot com. Yeah, Vic seemed put off by that suggestion. But I think their back and forth was just the really fun part about that. Like I thought that Vic came out was just like, you're talking about the moment.

I mean, he missed a couple, unfazed. What's really hilarious was like being in the gym, Scoot had a family contingent there, contingency there. Going wild. Hilarious. I mean, like the back and forth, I'm sure it was all good-natured. But I mean, they were just kind of like jeering at the, I sound 80. They were jeering him.

No, just like yelling at the opposing play of the Metro players. And it was just kind of a back and forth all night that amused me. I mean, it was a competitive game. It definitely wasn't a like just, you know, like it didn't turn into like one of those runout all-star kind of like this game means nothing. It was competitive. They were trying to play. Tremont Waters was a little bit frustrating for me as a pick and roll partner for Vic.

But other than that, I was just impressed that like throughout the game, they would have these lulls that were clearly defined by times when they weren't going to Vic as much as they should have. Yeah. With Scoot, I thought throughout the game, you mentioned how he was definitely trying to score.

He had a score first mentality with a lot of the jumpers that he was taking and getting to the rim really attack mode from him. But he also did have nine assists, no turnovers, limited mistakes, and made some really great reads. I remember one he had, I believe it was in the second quarter where he attacked the paint, Vecta Weh Mannyama rotates over, and he just made a gorgeous kickout pass to the left corner

for a three-pointer. And I believe that shot missed, if I remember correctly, the one that I have in my mind. But this guy throughout the night, I thought did a great job of toggling between scoring and playmaking. And Scoot Henderson, even though he's somebody who talks trash, you know, at one point, like, he's giving a stare-down to the opponent bench just, like, really gave him a long stare-down while shaking his head. Like, you can't stop me.

He's not a ball hog. And he shares the ball and he distributes. And so I think the best players are able to go between those modes. No one to score. No when it's time to facilitate. and he seems to have at 18 years old a really good instinct for that. Like, do you, do you see that level, a high level of playmaking in Scruton Henderson? Or do you kind of see him as maybe a tier below some of those top level playmakers,

assuming like Chris Paul is number one, you know, Jaws up there as well. Yeah. For young guys. I actually do Jaws a little more creative than CP3, honestly. In terms of like craft and like passing vocab. The types of passes that he can make. Also, like, different types of things are available to him. So we're to screw rank out with him.

But think, yeah, not to over parse that part of it. I don't know that I would put him in that, like, elite creativity. Past a certain hour of the day, my, like, accent just started. Just let it out. Let it out. Let it out. Let it out. No, I think that's, I wouldn't quite put him in that tier.

I think, but I do think he's willing. And we're also kind of at the early stages of that part of his life as a basketball player. I think you made a good point about so long as he is aggressive and toggling wisely between when and picking his spots between, you know, because if he was like a bullheaded, like I have to score all the time player. He's not Colin Sexton. That was the first name that came to mine. Yeah, he's not that. And like the comparisons there, you know, smaller, you know, bulldog guards. But Sexton's not a playmaker like Scoot.

No, no. He doesn't quite have that in his best. I would just say that he has a sense. For point guards, a lot of times you want to see them have an understanding of when they've done their job, you know? Like if you get in the pain, it doesn't necessarily mean you have to, you know, it's like a shot call doesn't mean a shot taken, kind of like they say in football sometimes. It's like he got in the lane and made the kind of right kind of like kickout reads and things

like that. And that's good enough for now. You know, we saw Donovan Mitchell make huge leaves over time on that one. in terms of learning to flip the floor, learning when to make those cross-court reads, things like that. Those things can come in time. You don't have to be a lamello level creator

to be effective. So Scoots a couple notches below them, in your opinion. But I mentioned the shooting up top with him and how much that looks like it's improved just one game, small sample size, blah, blah, blah, blah, blah. But I thought the shot looked good. He's always shot well from the free throw line. It's always had great touch around the rim.

To me, like, that's all translatable for him to eventually someday become a very reliable perimeter shooter. As somebody who, you know, he loves Russell Westbrook, as somebody he likes to model his game afterwards, you know, like it's clear to me, you know, that influence is there, including like with the intensity and then the emotion. But he's going to be a more efficient shooter than Russell Westbrook ever was. Yeah. Like with Scruton Henderson is his upside best guard in the NBA?

Do you see that upside with him? How high are you on Scoot Henderson as a point guard prospect of the NBA? I'm not ready to totally go there. I don't know that I'm totally. Are you even locked in with him at number two? It's so early to say, man. I think that like the two-way impact of Wembe is significant enough that like he will have to be unseated for me. And there's number two though with Scoot.

With Scoot, that's what I'm saying. I say I'm sure about that. past that, like, I need a little more data to come in. So no falling for Scoot then. You don't see a Thompson twin or any of the college guys surpassing Scoot. I could see the conversation kind of evolved. We saw the best version of his like Drewill Pullup tonight. Like we saw that.

And if you think about like in terms of that class of guys, like I was talking about like the incendiary nuclear athlete point guard guys, like in terms of that on the shooting side of the spectrum, he's ahead of a lot of those guys. but he's not quite like the passer. Like you think about Jaws, a similar kind of thing. He's not a passer like Jah, but he's also a better shooter probably long term than Jha. There's some things that I think need to shake out

that before I make a call, I mean, he was just super impressive. He always looks poised. I was making the point when Charks and I were here in December when we saw the G League showcase and Ignite played, he looked like the most poised guy then on my team with Dyson Daniels and Jaden Hardy. He's just, he's in a good spot for his development, is what I would say.

The argument against him will be the fact that he's six foot three and how that can influence him on defense. That's generous. I think he's six one or two. However, the effort is there on defense, the intensity. He can lock in, getting a guy's grill man-and-man situations. We did see him really compete tonight. What's your evaluation of Scoot Henderson on defense?

I don't know how firmly I want to go on the rest. record here with this one yet. I mean, in terms of he's still learning the game, I mean, in terms of his athletic tools are off the charts and caring goes a long way. I think that that's a crazy good starting point. You don't want to over evaluate guys at this age defensively either, but he's had an advantage of like getting into advanced kind of scheme scenarios, whereas a lot of guys would be kind of messing around in high school. If you watch scoot in high school, it was a lot of just kind of wild freelancing and things like that. So he's, I think that the upside is super high.

I mean, like he could become with his tenacity and with his physical tools, he has the potential to become an incredible on ball defender. What do you think? I agree. I think Scoot Henderson, right now I'd have him locked in it too. Maybe that changes throughout the year. We'll see how some of these college guys develop. Are you a Nick Smith guy?

Like Nick Smith. You know, we'll see how his year goes. It's a great start for Scoot. Is this with Wamban Yama and Scoot Henderson, is this the best one-two that we've seen since Katie Odin, since Zion Jha? Where does this one-two rank up, you know, less than a year from the draft right now? Still early in the process, but not that early. We're here. It's October. Oh, man, let's think back about our one-two's.

I mean, Zion Jaws is a pretty, pretty good one. That's a really great one. See, who's two in that LeBron draft? Was that... Darko. Yeah, Darko. Famous week. Let's go one three.

Let's go one three in that one. Yeah, I mean, you think back about, like, I will defend Greg Oden as a prospect. I love, though, to the rest of my life. He, his body broke down. He was not a bust. I think that was a pretty, that was a pretty good one. I mean, it could be a lot of things... I think it's going to be Odin Durant since then.

Probably is. I just hope Vic stays healthy. That's another thing too, because he gets banged around a lot. Scoot, too. Scoot, too, you know, like athletic guards sometimes, smaller frames. A lot of torque on those joints. I mean... We've seen the scares with Jha.

What do you think about... His is sort of a thing about, like, landing and being so, like, bendy. It always makes me nervous. What do you think about Vick's frame filling out? Do you have an opinion on that? From what I've, you know, gathered, talking to some NBA people and just, you know, looking at the wider shoulders. I think that leads to some optimism for his ability to put on some healthy amount of weight. He's not going to be like Janus, who is very wide, even when he

was lanky coming in. He's not as lean as chet. You know, so I think he has the wider shoulders, wider hips, where he's going to have, he does have a frame to put on some more weight. The question is that his height, considering the durability issues of seven plus footers throughout end, NBA history, that in and of itself does raise concern about how healthy he's going to be able to stay throughout his career. Like, if there's any argument against Victor Weniam as the number one, picket has to be due to a team being freaked out about some medical issue that we don't know about it this time in October, but may arise in May or June.

That's about it, I think, you know, for Victor Wenbeyan not to be number one. Like, would you agree there? Is that it? Is there a basketball argument against it? I don't think so. It is contingent on some of the other parts of his game evolving. I mean, like, we didn't really see much in-between game other than like he had those like post-fades where he was. I mean, that's pretty good, Kyle.

It's pretty great. I'm just kind of thinking about like what, you know, you're nitpicking. Like what else do we see? Are we going to see him be? Because we saw him last year if you watched his games. I mean, there was a lot of like he would wander the perimeter and things like that. I mean, he was just so skinny. The physical part of it.

How much of that is the lack of a great point card to get him the ball? It makes a big difference for some of these younger. It's center prospects. The guys that aren't showing the ball. NBA spacing with heavy pick and roll makes a huge difference and opening that up. Yeah. He definitely needs to figure in, like, getting with a better pick and roll partner, I think other than Waters, because, like, we know Waters is just sort of like a journeyman.

All due respect. Right, right. He's not on the NBA. He had his chances. He was a draft pick. He's a scorer. He is definitely. He's not necessarily going to elevate Wembe in the ways that are going to help him out.

Not like Scoot could. But you're right. Imagine seeing Scoot and Wemby on the court together? They'd be a heck of a team. I mean, is there a team that interests you the most that you could see like man? For Wembe Niyama? Yeah. He helps everybody.

I mean, it's like he's a floor raising player. I think defensively. I mean, the clean slate would be Utah. That'd be the clean slate where it's a new franchise, that they need a star, they traded everybody else. San Antonio, you know, they have the Duncan aspects, right, replacing, you know, a legend, another number one pick. That'd be very cool.

How about just throw them onto Oklahoma City with Chad? It's almost the funny to take. We just want to see it. Yeah, I just love to see it. We got excited enough about, See Chet, you know, Chet and Poku do the arm to arm thing. I would, yeah, it would be fun if we could. How about Houston?

Houston with Jalen Green, Taitai Washington, the back court that they could be growing there. You get Jabari Smith Jr. A long 610 versatile defender. Imagine that front court with those guys together. That'd be nuts. Yeah, Tari. Tari actually did a lot, I think, defensive. Tari actually did a lot, I think, to kind of shift the potential, like kind of defensive

character of that team. I think that you're still a little skinny in the back court. With Houston, we're talking here? Yeah, you'd still be a little bit skinny, but I think that, I mean, yeah, that would be a heck of a team because Jabari is so defensively, like, positionally mature for his age. Are teams like Charlotte, Sacramento, Portland, New York.

Are those teams making a mistake not tanking? That's a good question. What should New York be doing right now? Is New York, they obviously... They sign it. Like, it's not Jalen Brunson a mistake for them. Sure, sure. You know, like, should they just be trying to be like, you know what?

Let's try to get some 14% draft odds, baby. I don't think that their fan base is going to have the stomach to, like, reverse course and go back. And then what if you miss? Well, how about this? How about this? Like maybe they shouldn't be tanking, but did the Knicks fall into the category of a team or fan base where actually you should be happy that you missed the playoffs? Because even if you don't have the top odds, if you have the seventh best odds or the eighth best odds, still pretty good. You know, you get a solid chance to land a number one pick.

You want a reverse course for the chance to get a solid pick or I don't know. I don't. Not reverse course as much as the East is just so good. You just missed the playoffs. and you end up with the eighth, ninth, ninth, worst record. Yeah, he would do a lot to kind of, I mean, he's going to help any team in. I mean, it is like, if you're going to talk about a player who is that generationally special, you're going to talk about a guy who is an instinct context changer.

And Portland's an interesting one. Yeah. They chose to dig in and kind of stick with their guy and try to make some moves here in the short term to be competitive. That's one I would think about. That's one that I would think. Trading Damien Lillard? That opens a whole can of worms of just logistically, how do you do that? I mean, I think the other thing that's sort of ominous and that is in the air, though,

is just sort of like Portland's history of sinners. Like, I would be absolutely terrified if I was a Portland fan. What's with the water up there, Dylan? What is it about Portland that the bones just don't seem to? to endure up there. I don't know. Probably didn't have an answer for it. Poor Brandon Roy. Yes.

It's not just bigs. It is. Tough place to have an athletic body. I mean, we're gonna have a bad, there's four teams in the West, Utah, San Antonio, Houston, Oklahoma City. They're not gonna make the playoffs. You know, we'll see who ends up 11, whether it's Sacramento, Portland, whatever. Or Lakers, I don't know, who knows, whoever falls to 11. But those four teams are gonna be at the bottom.

In the East, it's a little less clear. Are there any teams in the NBA that you could say need to be reversing course? For sure, 100%. Time to stop trying to make the playoffs. Time to stop middling. Tank for Victor Wenyama or screwed Henderson. Now get it done. Tank.

A team that's trying to win that shouldn't be trying to win. Is there any team that comes in mind? That's in that category. that even Kyle, mid-season, they're the five-seed, the sixth seed, or the seven, they're in the playing bubble. Is there any team that you're like, you know, pull the plug? Is it Portland? Do we already, you know, is it then? Is it somebody else that we haven't mentioned?

Yeah, I was thinking about it. Because these guys, like, Victor Wenbanyama is a franchise altering talent. Yeah, yeah. He is that level of guy. So even if you only have a 14% odd chance with the worst, you know, with the number one, you know, odds, or a 7% chance or 9% chance. chance. Like, I would love to have those chances to draft Victor Wenyama rather than have a 0% chance of winning the NBA finals. Like, which is there a team that falls into that category this year? Or is the championship race so wide open that, like, it's almost hard to feel that out?

It is wide open. They're just so, I mean, the talent level, as we've talked about, it's extremely high. I mean, they're just so, so many companies. Even the bad teams in the league have interesting players on there. I mean, if you think about the teams in the east, I mean, like, the Pacers don't seem to have any kind of illusion about what they're doing. They're bad. They seem like they're interested in being bad. I was thinking that if they trade Turner and Healds, then they for sure are wanting to

be bad. I've heard they want to win, but like if they do that trade, they're trying to lose. Who said that? Sources say. Okay. Right. Source to say. Clearly rolling out a winning roster there.

I mean, they always try to win, though. They always have. That's true. They thread the needle. They do. I'm trying to think of... Indiana is a good one, though. Indiana falls under that category.

Portland is one. I don't really... The Kings were another one. Washington? Washington is... How about them? They assigned Beal to a five-year. Supermax, no trade clause.

Should they be trying to push him out? Are they bad enough? That's the thing. Are they like... I mean, Chris Staps is going to play 20 games. Right. What does that even mean, though? And like, is he going to...

I don't know. Is he going to make them so good that it's going to be a problem? I don't even know. Do we want him not playing so that they'll lose more? What do you think with the Wizards is that? I mean, I'd be pulling the plug for damn sure. It's well, well, yeah, yeah. Annoyingly competent is what I would say if I was a Wizards fan. Just bottom out.

Will this go down as the most untradable first pick in the draft ever? Like no chance anybody would move it. I don't even know what would be the value that would be equal. Is it like 17 first round picks from O'CCC? and Chet. I don't know. And SGA. Like I'm O'KC and I have the third pick. And I offer SGA,

Chet Holmgren, and like 12 or 13 first round draft picks. Is that the price? Is that even acceptable? The health risk of it would make me ill. With Webanyama. So if you have number one, you would at least think about it, right?

If OKC calls you and offers that. Offers be Chet and, well, Chet has his own. Chet and SGA and like 12 first. And 12 firsts. Like that's got to be the price, right? New Orleans calls up.

They got a bunch of first. Utah has a bunch of first. Yeah. Somebody's going to make that offer. You'd need a franchise player. That's, I mean, that's the level of thing we're talking about here. I mean, and like, Chet's a potential franchise player. Yeah.

Yeah, I was just trying to think of like stars that would be equal. But I mean, I would have really. real hesitancy about it mainly just because the health thing is the only thing. If I was for sure that he was going to be healthy, no, I've been very much on a like kick lately, something that we were talking about with like young cores that Zach Graham and I were talking about for this thing. That like, man, you can have a bunch of quarters and it still won't equal a dollar. We were talking about like the best young cores in the league.

It's kind of teasing something we're talking about that. It's just like, would I rather have five pretty good young players? or would I rather have Luca? The dollars are just so hard to get, man. And, like, Wimby is, strikes me as a dollar. Like, it's just a super, super, super special player. Potentially, I mean, I don't want to get struck by lightning by the basketball guards here, but, I mean, like, he's potentially, like,

defensive player of the year level type player, MVP, potentially. So, I mean, it's like, you imagine the defensive impact of somebody, like, Rudy Gobert with the fluidity from three, dude. I mean, it's just like short circuit. Your brain just can't compute what you're seeing. It's wild. And that's the other side of it, you know, the international wave. It's continuing.

Another potential MVP candidate coming into the league, Luca, Janus, Embedde, Yokic, and Victor Wenyama coming next. Insane, dude. It is. Do you ever think that we kind of over at, we like, overstate how weird it is though that like the international players are coming in because it's like

kind of a numbers game where it's like there's only so many million people playing the game here the game's bound to get better because just so many millions and millions of people are playing throughout the world um yeah like you said I think it's encouraging that it's just going to keep snowballing I mean Vic is he's incredible he really is Kyle this is a special night it was I can't believe we saw it in person and I debated about coming because I was coming home from vacation. I was like telling my wife, I was like, I think I got to go to this.

And I was elbowing, dealing throughout the game. I was like, I can't believe this is happening. Like, could you? Yeah, you were on the broadcast, I heard. I had people text me. I guess I was behind some cameras. And so they showed me a couple times. I'm not sure if, like, my reactions could be seen on camera ever.

You're making O face behind the, a lot of O faces. And like my arms behind my head, arms in the air going crazy. I was a fan in the media section. I don't care. Caring in the media section should be allowed for a game like this. And I damn well let it out. I was screaming at the refs when they called the six follow in Webben, Yama.

And they had the reversal. They reversed it. Thank goodness. Well, I was saying they should have done the summer league rules for that. They should not be falling out in this game. No. Even if only Scoot Henderson and Wenban Yama aren't allowed to fall out, I'd be okay with that. Right.

Fowl all the other players out on one. I don't care. Fow them out on purpose. That's what I would. I would Donahy to do that. On that play where he got called for the sixth file, Wembeanyama called for the switch early. He was yelling for it, switch, switch, switch.

And they did. And he reached for the ball almost immediately using his arm. It's like he knew he was going to go for the steal even before the switch happened. It happened so instantaneously. I love Victor Wenbeniama. Well, both. I love him. I like him.

I like his personality. Oh, he's intense. He doesn't always show it. He can be stoic out there, but he's definitely involved. He talks, communicates, as does Scoot. Both of those guys seem like highly intelligent,

intense players. Yeah, Vic can run a little hot sometimes if, like, things aren't going his way. That's something I've noticed with him in, like, international plays that, like... I think he's gotten better at it. Yeah, he could kind of take himself out of the game if he got frustrated or something,

but I'd... I, from the small sample size that we've seen, he, he hit that like no dribble fade. And I think it was in the fourth quarter. He hit that just like feet in front of us. I mean, like we had a really good look at it. And you just kidding. I don't know, man. I can't think of another physical.

I was trying to think of the people that I've laid eyes on in person that have just arrested me. Like just the awe-in-spinal. likeness of their frames. Zion is one. Zion is but Zion is more we were talking about this like once Zion gets moving you're like holy shit but like Vic just standing there I'm trying to think like I saw Rudy Gobert in Vegas a few years ago and I'd never seen him in person. Boban Marjanovitch and I was just like couldn't believe it yeah I was going to say and then like I've never seen Yao in person but I'd imagine he's similarly imposing yeah he makes Shaq look small. Vic is an inch shorter than Yao.

So that's... I hope he stops growing. I don't want him to get any taller because then it gets into like, uh-oh. Real, yeah. Then the real where it begins. Don't know about it.

I saw after the game. His mom is like 6'4 3. His dad looks like he's like 6 9, 610, something like that. Tall family. That's for sure. I just hope he stops growing. Yeah.

But I hope he keeps getting better. And Scoot Henderson too. And there are a lot of good players in this class, man. This is a fun class. So it's a lot better than last years, I think. I'm excited for the next handful of months coming up, Kyle. Last question. Should Victor Weniyama shut up down?

I'm glad I came to the first game. I have to fly home tomorrow. It's going to be hard to top what he did last night. Should he shut it down and not play? Yes or no? He's the number one pick. What is there to gain besides what's a wrap some experience? That was an incredible.

showing. There's a lot more guys on the G-League night that can show off. There are even some guys on the Metro team that could get some attention to. I mean, we got what we came for. You know, let's not get greedy. Let's enjoy and savor this guy. Don't take a chance. Sure, shut it down. Why not? What do you think? Yes, he should shut it down tonight. I mean, from a business sense, yes, he should. But I want to see him play on Thursday. I want to see him play throughout the whole season. I want to see him get that experience. I want to feel the satisfaction

and the joy of seeing him get better and better as the months go by. I want to see that happen. So I want him to play selfishly, but from a business standpoint, if I'm his agency, if I'm his parents, if I'm Victor myself,

like what is there? Why play more? You know, why I play more? There's everything to lose from having a major injury. And granted, there is stuff to gain, experience reps,

you get better. Like, you would. I'm still going to get better by not. playing by playing in a control environment. Like we saw that dude's get fouls on three-pointers a lot. He gets fouled on those. So I hope Victor Wenband Yama stays healthy. And I hope these next, you know, this next year leading up to the draft is as exciting as tonight was because this is special, Kyle. It was. It was. And also, I just want to like say kudos to g-league and to metro for doing this,

man. I mean, like these types of events are just a treat. Like I want to see the G-League. the young players go and play international teams more frequently. I know overtime elite has dabbled in that. With the Indialia, we have the Australian League. It's nice to see this crossover events. It is. Crossover events are fun. I wish we could get college teams more involved more frequently.

That's next, I hope. I hope so. Can Kentucky beat? Kick that door down. The Kings? Like that, I want those conversations. The Sacramento Kings? I'm not saying the Karen Kings.

I'm saying that is what people used to say. Right. That when they were the Kang. The gangs. That's what I want to see. Yeah, I loved this event. I hope they do more stuff like it. Me too, Kyle.

Kyle, this is fun. Nice chatting with you tonight. Always, buddy. Always. Thank you so much for listening to today's episode. That was a lot of fun. I'm excited for all the ringers NBA draft coverage we get coming up. Throughout the coming months, we'll have the NBA draft guide coming at some point later in the year.

I'm fired up. I'm pumped in Jack, baby. Victor M. Benyama, Scoot Henderson. Enjoy.