The Ringer NBA Show - What the NBA’s New Load Management Policy Means for Teams, and Giannis’s Uncertain Future With the Bucks | Real Ones

Episode Date: September 14, 2023

Logan and Raja are back to discuss their thoughts on the NBA’s new policy that punishes teams for resting their stars in an attempt to limit load management and what it means for the upcoming season (4:57). Next, they react to Giannis Antetokounmpo’s public comments over the last few months regarding his future with the Milwaukee Bucks and the uncertainty that surrounds it (28:58). Finally, the guys close with their Real Ones of the Week (52:30). The Ringer is committed to responsible gaming, please checkout ringer.com/RG to find out more or listen to the end of the episode for additional details. Hosts: Logan Murdock and Raja Bell Producer: Jonathan Kermah Production Assistant: Kai Grady Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Yo, this is Jason Gough from the Full Go podcast. Me and the crew, we like to entertain you. And we're going to do more of that this football season because the Bears should be more intriguing. There should be more fascination. Justin Fields, is this the make or break year? Is DJ Moore the piece that's going to put them over the top? You can catch us on Sundays, Tuesdays, and Thursdays,

or when we have an emergency podcast when we have breaking news. Make sure you follow the full go on Spotify or wherever you get your podcast. You hear the music. You know what time it is. was popping. Logan Murdoch here, Roger Bill there. We're starting season four. It's a bit a while since I've seen you, bud. How you doing? How's it going? We're back. I am well. It was a good summer. I'll be it a quick one. Congratulations to you. My brother, I think that is the most important transformative summer for your boy. It was only at that, but it was it was a, it was a

vibe. It was a great summer, man. It's good to be back. There's been a minute. Yeah, yeah. Burgo boys in the building, though. That's what we're at. You know what I mean? What's up? What's up, man. How was your eight weeks? What did you do? What were you at? What was going on? Let's see. What did I do? I chased children across the country, man. It was a big summer for my oldest DIA with football camps and at different universities. So we spent the lion's share of like June flying around to different things. I took TIE with me on a couple. Tie was a live period for basketball. So when Dia was off, you know, I was trying to get to Tye stuff in different places in different states.

And then my younger two were camping and trying to get as much time as we could in a pool with them, dog. And then it was time to go back to school. At what point is a dad, right? Because, you know, I'll hopefully be a dad one day. What point is a dad where it's like, is it like when you're doing these things, when you're on break, what is the cadence? How are we doing this? Is it like, okay, we're off, we're off.

Now we're chasing kids. And then, like, maybe I have two days of just like chill time throughout the whole time that I wasn't expecting. and then we ramp up for school year. How does this work? What was the, what is the, what is summer camp vibe like for Rara? We,

that's a good question. I mean, the most significant part is like you don't have that 6.30 a.m. wake up call for school. You know, like that's, that's the thing that you can really grab onto. The rest of it is kind of,

you know, you fall into a regular rhythm. Like, boom, you're up. You got a camp drop off. Like, you know, you got another camp drop off.

Somebody's got a workout. We got to get him to that. Do you don't drive yet? So, you know, like I get him to a, a practice or a workout. Ties got one. So most of our meet the wife for maybe

a lunch date. You know what I mean? Like by the time the lunch date's over, it's time for the first pickup. By the time you're done with the second pickup, you're on to three and four. Then everybody got practices at night. So we find ourselves basically in the same swing. And the crazy part is the rhythm is like

you get so accustomed to it that when we find ourselves with those days that you're talking about with nothing to do. Yeah. We're like, well, what the fuck are we going to do? Like, what are we doing? I know. Like, wait a minute. I don't know what to do with myself.

It was funny, bro, because I took my first, like, extended vacation of my career this summer, right? Went to, like, Europe and got to see, like, Barcelona and Italy and Greece and all these places. And it was the first time where I didn't have that, right? Where you're just, like, across the world. and that's but that feeling that you have is just such an interesting feeling because you're like I got to go I got to go I got to go I got to do these things and then you sit still and you're like well how do I do that yeah what is that what's going on what the fuck is going on my wife and I was that neither one of us remembers what what a trip like you just described was with with you and and and

someone else like we don't even remember what that was like what we what we have done with literally nothing to do like we it's hard for us to even wrap compromise around that at this point. Yeah. Also, Europe was great, but I need all my European ruins. I'm going to need y'all to, like, fix the practice of, like, putting two beds together and calling it a queen or king-sized bed.

And on top of that, I'm going to need y'all to just, like, because, like, y'all got money out there. Y'all know what it is. Y'all got bread. Y'all can do this. Like, there's no excuse for not having, for having two beds. And the two beds going together sink to the floor.

There's no reason. Like, come on. Like, let's listen. Come on guys. That's all I have to say. We're not even tethering them together. Like, they're just going to slide apart in the middle. That's what we're doing.

Basically, you know, you roll around once you have a, it's like you're on an island. That's basically what it is. Oh, man. Speaking of, you know, resting in load management. Let's get into the first, uh, shape of the new year. Hey, man. Hey, I'm locked there, dog. So, this.

This season, or going into this season, the NBA has put together a new set of rules on load management that affect a plethora of players where, I think it was on Wednesday the board of governors approved a new player participation policy, which will find teams for resting stars in certain situation. How do they determine who was a star? The criteria is simple. if you've been named to an all-star team and our all-N-B-A team in the past three seasons, you are a star in the eyes of the NBA. According to this list compiled by O.G. Kerm, there are 49 stars, players that are designated at stars across the league. And there's a lot of things.

They don't want people two stars to sit out at a time. The league does not want specifically to the Dame Lillard. Dame Lillard, I guess you can call it Dame Lillard rule. I'm calling it the Dame Lillard rule because it happened last year when they sit him out for, the Blazers sit him out for what they deem as a calf injury, but it's

really, everyone knew it, is really just shutting a guy down for the rest of the season, so to improve a team's draft stock. But they're going to discourage that and find teams heavily if these transgressions

happen. Raja, is this a fair system? Do we tweak the rules? How do we feel about this? What is our official stance as real ones about this, Rai? For me, it's TBD, I think. I'm going to have to kind of watch this and see how it affects the product before I could give you a real assessment of the rules themselves.

Like, I understand, you know, I understand that I understand that, that, you know, the impetus and where these rules, you know, the genesis of where they came from, right? Like, and this is always kind of the game that the NBA is playing. Like, it, while it is sport, right? Like, and it is, you know, the best players on the planet. And we're trying to win an NBA championship and winning, win, and winning. But it's, it's also an entertainment, you know, product. And so when you're sitting out people to chase these, these championships and everyone's catching on and now everyone's going to do it to give themselves the best chance at it's affecting, you know, viewership, it's affecting, you know, people that are spending all this money to buy seats at games to see their favorite players and they're not playing. And so now you've started to affect the entertainment value and what you're trying to sell. And so, you know, you do have to put some parameters in place to try to guard against, you know, mass scale, star sitting on nationally televised major matchups that you've sold to these networks. I get it. Um, but as I asked you as I was going through some of them, like I don't know how you, how you can for 100% tell,

Damien Lillard that his calf doesn't hurt or tell the Blazers that that is not a real calf injury. Like, you know what I mean? I've had plenty of injuries where a doctor has said, no, he's good to go. And I go out there and I'm like, I'm not. I don't know what, yeah, I mean, I wish I was, but I'm not good to go. And so there are some gray areas that I'll have to just watch to see, you know, how they play out before I can give you a fair assessment on on what the rules look like. My read on this is pretty simple. I think that this is just a classic case of when commerce.

and commerce and like vibes come together. And there's the fight between that, right? Where obviously teams want to win a title and they want to make sure that their best players are healthy for the times when they need to win a title. But like I'm going to be honest, over the last few years, even just covering the league,

you know, because I don't travel as much as I used to. I don't get to see these players as much as I used to. And as a person who covers a league and a fan of just basketball in general, sometimes it sucks when team X comes and the star that you only see once a year comes to town and they're sitting out. You just happen to be on the back to back, especially for like, you know, being on the West Coast and you're seeing those East Coast teams, right? I remember, I think it was last year or the year before, like Janus, Janus, who we have talked about and we're probably going to talk about under different circumstances.

The next segment, but in this context, Janus is like, we've talked about this over the last, few years, he is on my list of players that I got to see when he's anywhere near, right? And you only get to see him once a year. If you're lucky, I mean, you're in the bay, you get to drive up to sack. Maybe you have a chance to see him twice a year.

But if he, it was a couple years ago, he didn't play, like two or the last three years. When they come to the bay and it's like, damn, like, I want to see him play basketball. And it's, it's tough. It's a tough balance that you need to have. but I get it from the league's perspective. Yo, man, like you guys are the,

you are how we sell this league and how we're able to make these contracts happen. And also, like, that little kid that is in wherever, right? He's in Texas. She's in Michigan. They're in Florida. Like, these people, you know, want to see these teams invest in the league.

But it's really heartbreaking when they come to the arena, no less. And it's announced that their favorite player ain't going to be there. or is just going to be on the bench. That's tough, especially if it doesn't feel like they're actually injured. And I know there's a nuance to that as well, Ra, because these players are human beings and have injuries. And it's just a nuanced balance that is tough to like kind of maneuver through. Yeah, I think that's, it's well put.

You know, there is a responsibility from your stars, the people that drive the league. The people, quite frankly, that are the most handsomely rewarded outside of the owners. there's a responsibility for them to put out the product that the fans want to see and that people expect and the network's paid for. And they've got to share in the responsibility accordingly, right? So that's your job. Not only is it to go out there and play and try to win championships, but it's to be the face of this thing. You know, again, there are just some blinds, but there's some places that this could go that I'll just have to. It will be TBD because, again, I'm a star.

I've missed, I don't know, whatever amount of games. I'm up against it. Like, we have a nationally televised game. And while I'm not injured, I'm saying to you, hey, look, I don't feel great. Like, I don't know what it is. And if you haven't been an athlete, like playing a probably college level schedule in high school, I won't count that, like a college level schedule. And maybe college because there's so much rest won't count either.

Like, like semi-pro, where you're traveling a lot. you're playing multiple games in a week and you know you can feel that your body is not right like it doesn't have to be an injury you can just kind of say I know my body well enough hey something's not right and so like let's say I'm in a situation like that where I'm not injured but I'm telling the training staff and the coach like hey man I just I don't like I just don't feel right no I'm not injured but I got a mandated play that night because of these new rules and I go out there and blow a hamstring or a groin you know what I mean like there this is going to have to you're going to have to probably tweak this, I would imagine, a few times because there are going to be some

things that pop up where you're like, hey, man, that's not in anyone's best interest for that outcome to have taken place. It's an evolution of the league. It's an evolution of the players in the league. And it's also an evolution of just like how we think about just the medical side of the league. Over the summer, I was reading, I read Jeff Perlman's winning time and also read his three rink circus, which was really good. You also check those two books out. But, and in a not winning time, showtime, excuse me. Showtime talking about the 80s Lakers.

And when you read about the 80s Lakers, you see just how different the league was in the 80s, right? Where a guy like Larry Bird, who has chronic back issues, right, just continues to play on these, on this terrible back. Where a career that probably, like, I'm sure Larry Bird looks at LeBron,

who's played 20-some years, it doesn't seem to be stopping. And he's like, damn, I wish I could have those medical advancements, right? And a lot of those medical advancements is like, hey, prioritize rest when you can. Like, if you have to sit out a game that's very much inconsequential on the, you know, I don't have to explain this to you more so to the listenership where guys, a lot of these injuries happen on stresses on the body, right? Where you're just playing so much and your muscles are fatigued, your bones are fatigued. heat and you go out, that's how you pull hamstrings or tear hamstrings or tear certain

things in your body because these, because it's just the stress on your body. Like I think about Kobe's run in 2013 where he was playing like 40-something minutes a game and it was mid-30s and he tears his Achilles like, of course that was going to happen just the stress you put on your body. I don't know, and I'm going to say this, I don't think that this rest policy is the answer, Raja. And honestly, I think the answer is something that people, aren't going to, I know players will agree with this, at least in theory, but I don't think ultimately will ever happen, but is to play less games. Maybe like go down to 75 or something like that and make sure you actually have. And I know that the league has built in parts in the schedule

where you can have rest and days off. That doesn't, you don't really have those days off. It's not a substantial enough amount of time to really, to really, to really, to really, like, reset. I think that that would work. though. But it wouldn't happen because of money and all those things. But I think playing less games on a shorter schedule will actually help the game in the long run. Well, you're right on a few front. Like you're right in that, you know, like, yes, ideally the NBA, you know, schedule is shorter.

You can't do that, right? But 75 isn't the number. 75 doesn't appreciably affect it. It's like 60, right? Like 20 games. Like 20 games like 60, 62, 65, something in there. Like that's a good, that's a good sweet number where you've been. been able to stretch it out and you're getting considerably more rest.

Like, you know, so you're right. But, but that, you know, that can't happen. I think players understand, you know, and the players understand at the root of players what this is all about, right? Like, look, as much as we want to make it about something else, it's just about money. LeBron, KD, all, everybody can tell you it's about championships. This shit's about money. It's a job.

It's a job. Like, you know what I mean? Like, like, once we get to a certain amount of money, then we can prioritize. something else. But the reality is, you know, brothers play the sport, A, for the love, and B, because, hey, man, we just this is a big check at the end of the rainbow if we could get to it. So, so having said that, you understand that to make that go, you know, their responsibilities. Like, we have to be out there. We have to be putting the show on. Like, we have to be accessible to the fans. Now, some people, you know, understand it more and do a better job of it. And, you know,

that's not different than any other walk of life. But the reality is most people understand. that. But what's happened is once ownership, you know, got a sniff of, hey, man, I can, I can increase my odds of winning a championship by 0.7%, you know, and mitigate the risk of injury to my star by 0.7% if we rest him X amount of days. Whoever brought that into the equation and did that math. And then from ownership and the medical staffs, it trickled down to the players. And then it bore fruit. Like, people won the championships. People weren't injured. Other teams who saw the injury happened because they didn't subscribe to that.

Now it's in the players' heads, right? But I think, to make my point, players get it. Like, you've kind of let the cat out of the bag by allowing them to participate in this and showing them that this is the best way to the championship. But, like, you know, at the root of it, I think players don't have a problem participating in making the league as great and as entertaining

and as marketable as possible. But ideally, yes, less games would solve the problem. They just can't do that. Well, here's another thing. And you even just touched on it for just like even a brief second. There's a new TV deal that the NBA is trying to negotiate. And this current deal ends after next season. It's a little also bit, and let's just be honest, it's a bit performative because the league wants to show the people that are going to be buying into this league.

I think there was a report in CNBC a few months ago that they want $75 billion for new rights package. It's a lot of fucking money that'll circle down to these players and all these things. But in order to secure the bag from, you know, as streaming comes into focus, as, you know, these new, even these legacy networks that want to get back in like an NBC or somebody like that. The league needs to be like, hey, man, we're making strides. Like I understand. I know you guys have been pissed off about low management. we are making strides to to mitigate that problem, right? Or even if it's in the short term of doing that, right?

Like, even when we see another thing, what do we see every like three years? The NBA is cutting down on flopping. We're cutting down on this. Every like three to five years they do that, right? Just to shake things up and show like, hey, we're serious about this, right? Like, can you ultimately curtail flopping? Will it? Can you ultimately do it?

Probably not, you know? But you got to at least give the illusion that you're doing something. And I think that the league, more than anything, wants to show the fan base, but also these TV partners who are trying to throw bags at the league, hey, we got this under control. He was raised under David Stern. Like, that's a page right at the David Stern playbook, right? Adam Silver, yes. Yeah. He was his right-hand man.

He was groomed. Like, that's his guy. So, like, that's, yeah, yes, I'm definitely going to come down on that so that I can, you know, sell. but flopping is subjective. You know, that's something that, you know, I could always say, hey, but, you know, you think it's a flop, not really a flop. Like, it's hard to determine definitively whether that's a flop or not, right?

But like, you're going to see when a guy, like, misses a game or doesn't miss a game. That's definite. But don't you think it's a little bit more nuanced, though, with that, Roger? Because we just talked about it at the beginning of this segment where you're asking a question, are you really hurt, which is also a bit more nuanced too. You can also just be like, yeah, I'm hurt, right? Or like, how do you police against that? Well, I don't know.

And that's why I'm, that's why it's TBD, right? Because again, like when, when that happens, that whether it's, hey, you can't tell me that I'm not injured. So I am sitting him out tonight. Like, there's no way that you as a league can determine whether or not he's injured. So I'm going to sit him. And that breaks the, the actual, you know, mandate or rule. You know, now you're into this TBD area from me where how's that handled, dude? Like, because once one of them does it, now are we right back?

Are we right back? Was this all performative? Was it all just for show? Like, are there any teeth to this? You know, and I'm not advocating for that, but I just need to see how it shakes out. Like, I got to see how these rules play themselves out, you know, over the course of a season.

For the most part in my generation, you played, you played 82 games unless you were hurt, right? Like, that was your mindset coming in and I'm playing 82 unless I'm hurt. And then at the end of the season, if we have a playoff position wrapped up and we're seated and that's locked, I might get the last two or three games off. you might you might like in a lot of instances you didn't but that's where your mind was at

like and when when ownership and medical staffs started bringing hey man we're going to rest and i was in offices like i was with the calves when we'd have these conversations david griffin would tell me hey you're going to tell lebron that he's resting in indiana well how was that for lebron it was like because lebron's like tears between both of those eras right like he started in the era where you played 82 games and now he's kind of like helped usher in the this new load management era. Was it like, oh, what the fuck? I'm sitting out.

Or was it like, okay, I got you? No, he was kind of like, yeah, I got it. Okay, Bet. I don't remember exactly how they handled him in Miami, but I do remember how the spurs were handling themselves against Miami, and they were already kind of doing it. So I think, you know, LeBron had just kind of like, he was watching, you know, he was understanding his body.

That year when he came back to Cleveland was the year that he had gone vegan, I guess, in the summer. and his body hadn't responded the way he thought it would. And he came out of the gates kind of slow individually that year. So, like, there were a lot of things that factored into him having, I mean, there was no resistance from his camp. And then, you know, I'm guessing he felt fresher. And his body, you know, withstood the 82 to 100 games better than it had in the past.

So now you're like, okay, well, this is where we are now. So while players, yeah, we're resistant to the change. Like, we didn't start to change. Like, it wasn't necessarily us. You know what I mean? Like, y'all changed it. And now this is. That's so interesting because I didn't really think of it like that, right?

Like, it was, it was, it was, it was a lot of it was the medical staffs too, right? Like, was it wasn't just, because like you guys are creatures. I didn't even think about that. I thought it was just like one of those things. But like, no, it's, it's the rise of analytics. Let's be honest. It's the rise of that. It's the rise of, you know, just like, just more sophisticated ways of being team doctors, right?

And I'm not saying there's anything wrong. There's nothing wrong with that. But it's just, it was a more sophistication to the medical staff. Because I look back at like winning time. There's like one dude. Like there's one person that is like taping and doing all this. Shout out Gary Viti who like held it down for a long. Shout out to Gary Viti.

But like medical staffs were just like one like person. And now it's this whole thing. There's partnerships with hospitals. There's all these different things and how you just even like take care of the players. So that rise has helped as well. Yeah. Your sports science and sports performance like that those components have come just so far. I think I've referenced this before, but

allow me like I just you know, I had been out of the league roughly two years and when I went back to Cleveland. I think two, three years maybe something like that. Not not a ton of time, right? So it wasn't like a decade. And the situation that I had left, you know, a few years before that was Phoenix and we were like cutting edge with like the training staff like Aaron Nelson and company at the time were

rehabbing careers. All got Shaq right. Yeah. When he got traded. This is what that was. And so, you know, when I went to Utah with all due respect, I took a step back from that, right? So like, you know, I had seen the good.

I had seen like somebody that was lagging behind. And so now I'm in Cleveland, like three years later. And I get approached by our sports science guy. He was, you know, an Australian dude who put out all these, you know, spreadsheets up for all of us in the front office to look at. And I was like, what am I looking at? And these were the analytics on everyone's body, everyone's, you know, X, Y, and Z, right? And so I was kind of fascinated.

I was like, this is cool. But I didn't know the depths of it. So I went to ask him, I was like, hey, man, so like, explain to me how this works. He was like, well, here's the plan. Let's say we have Logan and we've got like a four-day break. But right before the break, we had played four games in seven nights. So, you know, from this data that we've taken from this chest strap that he's wearing, and here's where he's at physically.

So from that, we're able to kind of construct a plan for Logan for those four days off that will have him where we think optimum is when it's time to play. So day one might be low volume, low intensity, meaning he's not going to go hard and he's not going to go for long. Day two might be high intensity, so he'll go really hard, low volume, right? So not a lot of work, but we're going to ramp him up and we're going to get his heart rate because we have these monitors and stuff on him and we could tell how fast he, he's moving. You know, day three might be, and, you know, as an athlete, you're always thinking the day before you need to rest, but they've got it down to a science. So day three might be, hey, high intensity,

high volume. We're going to work his ass off and we're going to work him for an hour and a half. Like, and then day four, the last day before the rest might be like medium, medium. And then we think he's going to be at optimum level on game night. I was fucking blown away. I was like, what? Like, nah, man, I just go in and shoot until I feel good. And, and that's how I get ready. like, no, that's not how this works. Nah, no. This is dialed in, brother. I was like, wow, that's crazy.

And that was in a three-year span. And that was, I mean, almost a decade ago now. So I couldn't even imagine where they're at at this point. How do you like Dage being in shape in the league, right? Like, we're going in training campus started in like a week or two, or depending on the team. But how do you, like, determine you're in the right shape for basketball? and like how when you're talking about the process you just laid out,

how do you like gauge that when you're going hard on these other things and these other, and on these one days and then on the other days, you're not going as hard. And then like you're, I'm sure you're a little scared like when I get to game. I'm not going to be ready. Like how do you gauge being in shape as an athlete,

especially around this time of year? Look, all I had to go off of was how my body felt. There was no science. There were no monitors. Like I went off of how I looked in the mirror. like am I losing weight? Am I gaining weight? Do I look heavy in my midsection? Like have I lost some muscle in my upper body? Like man, I got to get back in the weight room. Do my legs feel heavy? Do they feel bouncy? You know what I mean? Do I am I slugging around? Like that's and that's how I based it. Like I had no

idea what the fuel I put in my body, how that affected it. You know, I was I was a willing participant in the weight room, but but I wasn't like dedicated to my body in a way that would have probably allowed me to play for longer. So, you know, I was. was literally just out there like I was in high school or college. Yeah, like, yeah, man, I feel pretty good. If I don't, I'll lift a couple weights. If I, if I do, maybe I'll take the day off. I can only do this. I told you about Cleveland. Let me tell you about my son Dia who plays football in high school now. This is a high school athlete. Like, you know, because of what I've learned, like, these kids diets, like, I'm on top of that. So that's my, that's my realm. So

we're making, we're making sure they get, you know, everything they need. They're taking shit with them to school to supplement, like for stuff they need. He, he, he, gets pulled out of school two times a week, not missing classes, mind you. Like he's got a big gap in his schedule at lunch and he's got an independent period right after lunch. So he's got about two and a half hour window where I could grab him, take him

to get his scraping, his cupping, his stretching, like his cryotherapy, everything he needs. Two days a week, dog. This is a, this is a cat in high school. We didn't even know what the fuck that was like 10 years ago. We didn't even know what cryo and all that shit and fucking cupping. We didn't know what the hell that was.

Didn't even know. I didn't know what the ice tub was. then he'll come home and he'll be like, yo, I could use, you know, an ice bath. Like, so we'll run to the store, grab a bunch of ice bags and put him in an ice tub. I didn't know what an ice tub was until I was a pro. I ain't never seen one.

And it would always be like the thing of where you're like, you're roasting the OG's like, fuck you got an ice bag in for him. Yeah, look at his old-ass dude in the tub. Yeah, exactly. That's it. That was, and then the evolution, five years later, you're the old-ass dude in the tub.

Love the tub. Have a beer in the tub. Speaking of stars that are indecisive, our next segment is going to talk about one of them. And we are back. We're talking about Yanis Adidiccumbo. I didn't think we're going to talk about him. Like, I know he said some stuff recently just about his, you know, his free agency, his pre-agency, whatever you want to call it. I didn't think we were going to talk about, like, much of it until, like, later in the year when he popped off again.

But, like, he's just going on podcasts and he's talking about his future. I believe this is the Believe podcast where he says, I'm a Milwaukee buck, but most importantly, I'm a winner. If there's a better situation for me to win the Larry O'Brien trophy, I have to take that better situation. He said this in a buck's shirt, by the way. And this is after, about a month after, he told the New York Times, I got to get the quote here, there will never be any hard feelings with the Milwaukee bucks. I believe that we've had 10 unbelievable years and there's no doubt I gave everything for the city of Milwaukee. Everything. Every single night.

Even when I'm hurt. I'm a Milwaukee buck. I bleed green. I know this. This is my team and it's forever going to be my team. I don't forget people that were there for me and allowed me to be great and to showcase who I am to the world and give me the platform. But we have to win another one. At the end of the day, being a winner, it's over that goal.

Winning a championship comes first. I don't want to be 20 years on the same team and don't win another championship. championship. That was via the New York Times last month. And I just gave you the quote that came out on the podcast where he says he is a Milwaukee buck, but a winner first. Could you go back to the New York Times quote just the beginning of it and read the beginning of it again? I want to see if he used past tense in like, oh yeah, I will do that again. Mind you, this is Janicea Dittacumbo, who has a, who has two years left on his contract and a player option for the 2025, 26 season is an restricted free ages in 2026. The quote that he said to the New York Times,

there will never be hard feelings with the Milwaukee Bucks. I believe that we've had 10 unbelievable years and there's no doubt I gave everything for the city of Milwaukee. Everything. Every single night, even when I'm hurt. Okay. I think we got the gist of it, right? Yep, yeah. He's moving, he moving like he got one foot out the door, Roger. I'm just going to be honest with you. You don't talk like this, and I will say this, right? He is kind of, Janice in the way, he's kind of going to KD route, right? Where in the beginning of this, the beginning of his career, he had this error of like, oh, I'm going to be at this.

At least he's saying these things of, I'm going to be in this one place for this amount of time. I'm going to be here. I plan on playing my career here. And then it kind of starts to shift every once in a while. But there were whispers back in 2019 that if they didn't win a title, now he didn't outright say it. Like, I think Malika Andrews had reported this after the 2019 postseason.

Got a lot of shit for it, by the way, of saying if Janus doesn't want a title or his team isn't competing for titles, he's trying to bounce, right? And this has always been the threat of Janus. Other teams probably trying to get his services and other, you know, him just not knowing if he's going to be in Milwaukee for that long, right? and there's president for this, right? Like, Kareem Abdul-Jabbar was in the same scenario decades ago, right? Where he's played in Milwaukee. Obviously, it was different circumstances, but he was one of those guys that was a generational talent

and ended up wanting to leave. And it seems like Janus is trying to have a soft landing for an eventual departure from Milwaukee, right? He's already hedging. Like, hey, I did all this stuff for the city. Remember, because I'm about to leave. That's the impression that I'm getting raw. Yeah, he is.

definitely giving off those vibes. I don't think there's any other way to slice that. I just, after I asked you to, like, tell me what tense he used the word give, and it was in the past tense, like, I do have to acknowledge that while he speaks really good English, like, I mean, he could have maybe, do you know what I mean? Sometimes because he's not a natural, like, first English speaker, like, maybe that was just like, you know, the language, like I'm fumbling around just a little bit with it, but, but I read a lot into that type of stuff. Do you know what I mean? Like, you're using past tense, like you're coming out again, just flat out saying, you know, I'm a winner before I'm anything.

There's no other way to interpret that, I don't think. And, you know, most of us go through this arc of like, you know, you feel like you're invincible when you first come into the league. Like, you know, and especially when you're like Janus and like you mentioned KD, when you come into the league and you're an Uber star off the rip and your team is vying for championships. Like you feel invincible in that. that space like yo i i did and i wasn't even a star in the space of we're just going to keep getting

to this point like my first experience was going to the NBA championship so i felt invincible in the sense that we're always going to be in an NBA championship like this is what it's going to be like this is how easy it is to get here and so you know i think dudes can feel like that and that's why they're like yo i'm here forever baby like we're always knocking at the door like i'm a perennial All-Star, we keep being like right at the precipice or winning a championship. This is life. And then you come up and then there's that like sense of mortality as it relates to like, hey, my career is like nine, 10, 11 years deep.

You know, other people are getting closer to the prize than I am. Like maybe we've floundered a couple years or fallen short. You know, I'm closer to the end than I am to the beginning. I'm a competitor. Hey, bro. this is my career and it doesn't last forever. I got to find another situation. And that's natural.

I think everybody, everyone's a strong word, but most people go through that. Like, especially in today's NBA where there's so much, you know, movement and you're not locked into certain situations for an entire career.

So, you know, Janus will learn like most people learn. You think there are no hard feelings with a fan base. Okay. Go ahead and leave them. Especially a place like Milwaukee.

Go ahead and leave them. Now, you'll still have your fans. There'll be a faction of that, you know, fan base that will forever love you. But you will have people acting a fool and turn in their back on you very quickly when you ain't rocking the buck's uniform anymore. And that's okay. But most dudes don't think that's possible because they're so beloved and they're just associated with this team in a way that they could never see it being any different. Go ahead and leave them. Well, it's also just like, Janice is in the unique position where he is seen, he was in the league when K.D. made his move. I'm sure he saw LeBron's decision. Like, who didn't if you're a Hooper, right? And the backlash that came with both of those decisions. And those are the most high profile decisions at this point, right, of just stars leaving a franchise in a city. Like, say if he also, like, if he leaves, because we're, I have a couple of.

of teams that like my wish list for Janus. Well, partially my wish list for Janus. Teams we'd like to see on the real ones of where he'd go. Toronto, I was a pick for me. Miami, just like, hey, man, I'd just be fun. I'd be really cool. The New York Knicks. I mean, you know, yeah.

And this is a third Icai, the Los Angeles Lakers. I mean, we kind of just have to do it. I know. I know, I know. But say if he went to the Knicks, or went to, fuck, he's in Toronto, and he's still in the Eastern Conference. And say all of a sudden maybe like the Milwaukee Butts claw and scratch to like an eight seed,

or they're in the playoffs and they see Janus, they're going to fucking boo the shit out of him. They're going to go at him, bro. Especially if he's in the Eastern Conference, you left us for New York? What? No other way around that, man. us for Toronto? You left us for Miami? Like, do you know the Midwest? They have this inferiority complex and rightfully so, right? They feel like people think they're better than us.

I mean, we saw this, like, how many jokes did Cleveland get? Right? How many, like, at the rest of the, you know, like they got, everybody was making jokes at Cleveland, right? Especially when LeBron left. They're going to make jokes about Milwaukee. It's not fair, but that's the game. and they already have this built in, right? And you also know the Midwest, it's a proud region, very proud. They love a basketball. They love that. And they also get slighted very easily.

The biggest slight will be a generational talent that they don't get very often or have the opportunity to get very often saying, I'm bouncing. And I know, and it's early and we haven't seen the reaction just yet because the Milwaukee Bucks haven't played any games, or best believe, there's going to be people in Milwaukee and the foe one foe that are going to have beef with his comments.

Like they're going to have it. And it's going to be interesting how the fan base is starting to react to this because this isn't one interview. Basically, you know, like Janus has basically been on a media tour talking about where he doesn't want to go. Like where he would or would not go and putting pressure

openly on the front office. There's going to be more reporting that comes out from this as the season goes on. but he's brought a lot of this on himself. He's going to bring a lot of this scrutiny on himself for even saying something like this. And he's going to have a, he's going to, and also the bigger thing, and I want you to touch on this, he has been a darling in the league for so long. I am curious to see how he's going to react to being a villain, because if he leaves,

he's going to be a villain to a certain group of the population for the way it's going to happen. And he's kind of starting to have that heel turn, it seems like that's going to to be interesting, Rob. It's going to be fascinating. There's a lot that goes into why he's, you know, been kind of a darling of the league. Like, you know, he's got a great personality. Obviously, he is who he is on the floor, you know, but I don't think you can discount the fact that he's been in one place and he basically resurrected the franchise and brought a championship and brought it to relevancy for the first time in a long time. Do you know what I mean? Like, and, and, you know, whether, whether you and I put a lot of stock in that, there's still a lot of

people out there that believe in in that, like fanatic fans, right? Like, hey, man, you stick with a team, you come up, like, you know, we weren't good, and you brought us that chip, and you retire a buck or a Laker or whatever it is. And, you know, that's a huge part of it, too. So to be out there, you know, on kind of like a press tour, like saying a lot of things to maybe the contrary of that is really interesting. Like, I don't, I don't know why a Janus would need to use the media to leverage, like, to keep pressure on the bucks. Like, Do you know what I mean? I don't know that you're necessarily.

Like just even just existing, you have put pressure on the front office. Yeah, just go on and talk to those people. So it's it's kind of almost like he's prepping everybody and like little micro doses. Like, hey, man, like just kind of get ready here. I'm letting you guys know this is potential. Even when I read, like I read the New York Times article, right? I read it. And the story is supposed to be about it was written by Tanya Gunguli, the homie.

But it was written, if you read the story, It's basically a story about his relationship with his brothers and his business, uh, his business ventures and how he wants to grow into a global, uh, just a, like, you know, a LeBron James is like this global business person, right? And that's the story, but you do this, you do this photo shoot in Los Angeles. You have somebody, uh, you know, write a really good writer and Tanya. But what's the headline out of this? Janice did a kumba once at all,

even if it's not in Milwaukee. That's the headline of the piece. Right? Like, that's going to be there forever. And it didn't necessarily have to be that way and how you handled it because the Milwaukee fan base is always going to have that headline because you're even just teetering.

You didn't have to be in that way, right? And I understand that. Like, I understand you're asked the question. You've got to answer that question. have been on the other end of the, the vitriol you get when you ask a certain question to a certain player about a certain thing, right? And I get it. But there's a way that you could go about it. And he went about it away. And it's fine. But that's going to be it. You don't, like that's, I mean, I don't know if that's a common misconception or people just,

you don't have to answer the question that's asked to you. You don't. Like, I went through this. You asked me how my summer was. I went through this all summer with a kid who's starting to get press and and trying to explain to him like, listen, man, people are going to ask you different questions. You might not know the motive behind why they're asking the question. So if you're just firing off, you know, hey, I'm going to answer every question as genuine and as forthright as I can be, that can get you in trouble. Like, so let's like, you answer questions the way you want to answer them. Do you understand what I'm saying? Like, I mean, that's, that's media 101, dog. Like, you might ask me something. I know damn well as a headline. I'm not answering that shit like that.

Like, I'll answer it in a way that isn't inflammatory. and that basically doesn't say anything. Or, you know, people do all do the other thing. They'd be like, I'll tell you on background. Yeah. Well, I didn't even get into that because I ain't trust nobody like that. Like, I was, I'm just, I'm going to give you the boilerplate. Like, and yet there is a way that Janus could say these things.

That's why I'm saying, like, I agree with you 100% that it's, that it's just a sideways move. Like, you, he's accomplished enough at a microphone to be able to get up there and not, you know, not provide headlines that he didn't. want to provide. And so then it seems like he wants to provide these headlines for I don't know what reason, but it seems like he wants to do this because it continues to talk about this. Which takes me back to like you don't like some people may need that in a negotiation or in a in a leverage play to keep a team being built around you. You don't. You don't need that. So then you're doing it just because again, sounds like you're just trying to let people know in these

little in these little doses like hey man. You know I love you Milwaukee, but I'm I got to I got to go. I've been trying to tell you y'all wasn't listening but I've been trying to tell you but on the flip side of that like what Milwaukee needs to do like Adrian and Griffin will get his shot at it right I came up with Griff griff Griff is Griff is a class act man Griff has been cutting his teeth for years on benches he's been you know an invaluable part of multiple stats like you know and yonis is looking at this not knowing griff really either and not knowing what griff can really do and so you know just from yonis's shoes you know we didn't we didn't get it done you know the exit was the exit uh We fired a coaching staff. We got an unproven guy in here. Like, you know, I'm watching that too. Just like any other person in a LeBron or Janice or Luca or any of their show, Yokic, any of their shoes, watching it, trying to figure out for myself whether or not I trusted enough to lock back in.

Like, is this the place for me? Because ultimately, you know, those dudes are like Apex, you know, competitors, man. They want to win championships. Their legacies are attached to them. Yeah. The more I think about it, this seems more like when LeBron left. than when KD left. Because it felt like LeBron

and you were in the league and you were closer to it, but it felt like LeBron was basically using this as his last season in Cleveland was just like he was kind of just stoking the fire. You know, he would have, he would sit down with a,

he had like a sit down with Stephen A. He had to sit down with other people and he was like, I don't know what I'm going to do. I don't know. You know, like Cleveland, like all these places, I don't know.

And like, we're talking that way in the same, and like kind of prepping us. Like, it's not really surprising that he left Cleveland. matter how much he tries to say that, hey, I wanted to stay, I could, you could, you got why he left and that he was, he, I am of the belief that he knew that he was going to leave before he even

did it, just the way the moves that he was making. Because if you, if you're settled, you're not looking for other places to go. You're trying to figure out where you're trying to figure it out yet, figure it out. And I see that way, Janus as well, just prepping. Just like, you know, sprinkling little things. We'll see what happens. If you're in a smaller market, you know, the day in the age where, like, your marketability suffers because you're in one of those markets, like, that's, you know, it's probably gone, like with, with the access that we have and stuff like that. Well, I mean, I told you this, I told you this pre-pod.

He, like, when I was in Athens, he has his whole, I did a cumbo bros. I did a cune bros sportswear store. He's doing fine. He's right. But so I guess, my point would be like, like, if you're in one of those towns and you're winning and it's all good and you just, you know, love being there at the time because like, I can attest to this. Winning in a place makes winning in a city and that time spent winning in a city makes it feel like,

like, you know, a certain place. You could leave, come back to that place and be in that same city again and be on a losing team and that city will feel completely different to you. Cleveland. It would be correct. It would feel like something you don't even recognize. And so I say that to say that like you're in Milwaukee. you're winning championships.

Like, you know, it doesn't really affect the fact that it's a smaller market, affect your marketability and you're curating and all of that. And so it's great. But like, if you're not winning and you're not getting your bite at the championship every year, the one thing those cities can't ever argue is like, look, there are places like New York and L.A. And it's not even about marketability. It's just about like what you can do, Miami, what you can get into.

Like, there's, you know, the vibes that are those cities and like a Milwaukee or Cleveland, you know, and they're great places. I lived in Cleveland, but you just can't offer some of those things, right? And so, you know, that's just what it is. All right. You are, I'm giving you the Milwaukee Bucks uniform right now. Roger. You're on the Milwaukee Bucks now, Roger. You started that, you came back out of retirement or whatever. You signed a three-year deal or you're a role player on on the Milwaukee Bucks at this point. How are you, what are you thinking about, how does this affect your future? Or at least how you see your future. If I am a dude in the Bucks locker, room. I am kind of in the mode of

ownership and of the front office and of Adrian Griffin and of the coaches. Hey man, let's get this shit right. Like let's go out and be the best version of ourselves. Like ultimately we don't control what Janus is going to do. So trying to do it is going to drive us crazy. But we could control like what we do and the support that he gets. And if we get that right, there's a much higher

percent chance that he stays. So let's go out there and be great. Let's get dialed in. Let's get locked in. Let's make sure we know what we're doing. Let's come to compete every day. Let's foster an environment of like brotherhood and all of the things that go into making a place special, right? Because there are a lot of components of making a place special. But let's do that in a way that would give us the best opportunity to convince Yanis that this is the place for him long term. Right. And, you know, a component of that is winning. A component of that is like, you know, the locker room and the relationships and so on and so forth. But, you know, a component of that is, like, you know, the locker room and the relationships and so on and so forth. to whatever degree we can control those things, let's do it. And then, you know, as always in the back of my mind as a professional, too, is like, man, I ain't fucking worried about Janus. I'm trying to get, I'm trying to make sure that, that I'm doing my job in a way that allows me to get another contract, too. Yeah, no, like, I think that the biggest thing that, like, with the Yonah situation is

you have to have a balance as a front office of doing what you think Yonis wants versus what's going to be best for the team, right? Don't get, don't, I think there's a thing that the Milwaukee Bucks can go down, like the role where they're, you know, where the Cleveland Cavaliers did this before LeBron left, where they're just thinking, doing things that they think of pieces LeBron James. Like, I'm going to get an aging shack for whatever reason, right? Or I'm going to get this person. I'm going to get this person because we think that's what LeBron's going to want. No, get the best person that suits the roster and who's going to help you win the game. and you've got to balance that with Janus's feelings.

But if Janus is already like, I might, you know, like I might dip. Like I am coming as a front office is we are going to build the best version of this team around us, no matter what the circumstances. Because if these guys play great alongside Janus, then what is he going to say? We put our best foot forward and we're going and it just didn't work out. But you have to tow that line of best for the team versus what Janus wants or does. doesn't want. Because Janice is like, how are, like you're a player, there's only so much you can take on as a player. Yeah. No, that's a slippery slope when you get into, you know, we've got this moment in time,

this window of opportunity where we think, you know, said star is going to be able to bring us championships. And, you know, how do we operate, you know, as a, as an organization around that? Are we going to acquies us to like, you know, his every wish in terms of personnel and people that he thinks can can fit around him or are we going to stay true to our vision and and um you know uh and and how we think we we can build around him to support him like you know that that is a a delicate balance like and like i think there's a sweet spot in the middle like i wouldn't you know obviously i'm not a gym and and uh but but the reality is you know you don't want to just not have them involved at all where you are where you are like yo dude here's what i'm giving you live with it and you're

almost obnoxiously doing it trying to rub his face and the fact that that that that's not his job like shut up and play basketball like you don't want to approach it like that but you certainly don't want to approach it on the other end of the spectrum either where you know you got to run every damn potential target by him in a way that prohibits you from really executing your vision because at the end of the day I'm a professional too you know what I mean like I've I've come up and I think that I have you know vision and can execute so we're partners in this so I'm going to I'm going to target the things that I think can help you. Like, I'm going to go out and, and, and, and try to swing deals and have them in place. And then, you know, I will certainly come to you and say, hey, here's what I'm

thinking. Here's how I think this helps you. Here's how we get this done together. What do you think about this? And hopefully you'll trust me in a way. And we've developed that trust over, over, you know, whatever amount of time we've been together where you're going, where you're going, I trust that, Raj. Like, I could see that. I can see where that's going. And I've articulated that to you. And we've had enough, you know, back and forth where you're like, yeah, I trust you on that. And so let's do this. And that puts us in a space where we're not like mortgage in the future in a way that we can't withstand a loss because I've, I've just bought in a bunch of shit that you've said you wanted. And none of that, I think, you know, is sustainable.

And I haven't turned you off either in a way where you're like, yo, man, they can't get it right around me. And so I'm fucking leaving because they won't even, you know, they weren't work with me. But if it doesn't work, it doesn't work. So you have to go on about your business and our franchise is still in a place where we can take another step, you know, even if you're not here. Yeah. It's a, it's, the NBA is such an interesting balance that we can't wait to talk about throughout the season. That has been our little, oh, damn, hold on.

Before we get out of here, keep all that shit in, you know, a little rusty to start the year. It's Monday. Damn. It's, it's Thursday. Jeez. Thursday felt like a Monday. Felt like a Monday.

Ooh. You know what that means, Roger. We got a crown a real one of the week. Let me go first. I don't know if you did. You want to go far? I go ahead. All right, take it.

Hey, take the rock. I'm my slug. I'm going to, you're on the wing. I'm off the way. I got a lot of candidates for this one, man. Like, I've got a lot of candidates for this one,

but there's one clear-cut favorite for me. And, you know, yesterday I got a chance to go up to Washington, D.C., you know, to visit my grandmother who turned 97 years young yesterday. Actually, she's up in Gatorsburg, Maryland. Marianne champion.

She's my nanny affectionately. I've told this story before. Like my nanny was a ride or die. I was in the USBL playing in Atlantic City. A fight kind of broke out me and I dunked. The guy undercut me. I came down off the rim. He was in my space.

I jabbed him before I knew it. You know, the stands had cleared. And so as I backed up to half court, I bumped into somebody. I turned around and it was my nanny and her sister in there swinging pocketbooks and hitting people. And so my nanny turned 97 yesterday. I got to spend a day with her up up in Gatorsburg, Maryland. I love her, and so she's my real one of the week. Marianne Champion.

The God, that's what's up. That's what's up. Speaking of G's, I'm going to go with one Denzel Washington. Yes, sir. I saw the Equalizer 3, my first equalizer of the trio, just went to go watching. And just like your granny, I know, I understand. I know. That's your first equal.

Did you say it's your first equalizer? It was my first equalizer. It's my first equalizer. Bro, I was like, I saw a couple weeks ago. I was like, the director of the film was doing something with Rich Eisen

I was like on YouTube and I was like, oh, we got to go watch it. So we went to go watch it a couple weeks ago. And like your granny was just like with pocketbooks and shit,

Robert McCall, a.k.a. Roberto, A.k.a. Roberto and Equalizer 3 was knocking motherfuckers down. It was just, just, oh my God. It was so cheap.

Have you seen the film? Have you seen the film? film yet, Rob? Oh, I've seen the film. I saw the day it came out. You saw Equalizer 3? Oh, okay. Are you locked in? Bro, what he puts the fucking, he just finds just different ways to kill people for the good of humanity. Okay, he's like,

when he starts off and he goes in his Denzel bag and he's like, you know, I really like it here. I really love it here where I'm at, and you're not going to ruin that for me. You're not going to ruin that for me, bro. Like, I know why you love this one, because you're, you could be an old curmudgeon at times. I will fuck

somebody up for what you believe in just to have piece. And I really saw that in Denzel in that movie. And he reunited with Dakota fanning. It was great. It was so good. I didn't have no context of what shit was going on. So I was like, we got to watch the first two equalizers. So that's something You need to see number one.

I mean, two is good too, but no, I think number one, number one is worse. Well, on rewatchables, the streets say that two is the best. Really? Yeah, Bill and I forgot who else was doing the rewatchable is that they was talking about how two is the best. But are you saying one is? Okay. Two had a little

bit more like, I think, you know, plot twist type of stuff, like, I guess for movie aficionados. But in terms of like, one was tell. I liked one. Okay. You just like see it. I just love action movie Denzel, bro. Like, even in the part where an Equalizer 3, where he's just showing us that he's steal

him. Like, he's running up a whole fucking mountain to get to the church just to talk to Dakota fanning for like, just to like, you know, lock in and coordinate, you know, compare notes. But he's still running up the thing, right? That's like when you go back to the, to the, to the, to the, to the, to the, to the, to the, to the, LA fitness and just like, you know, I gotta get, it's got to show these motherfuckers. Just real quick. We don't have a court, but I'm

show these motherfuckers real quick. I still got the jumper. Like, you know, it was great. Denzel Washington, ruined it a week. All right. So, we will be back. We are taking, and this is news to Rogers, like, we are going to take a quick break.

Another break. We'll be back on September 25th on Monday for that one. And then we'll be going back on our regular schedule soon. But, you know, we just had to come back real quick, show you guys something. That has been another edition of real ones. We will talk to you guys really, really soon.

Happy to be back in the lab. Talk to y'all soon. A, A, A, A, A, all the shits. Bye!