The Ringer NBA Show - Why the Mavs Defense Is the Key to Their Success, and the Celtics’ Lack of Consistency. Plus, Is Game 3 a Trap Game for the Knicks? | Real Ones

Episode Date: May 10, 2024

Logan and Raja discuss how the Mavs stole Game 2 from the Thunder, why Dallas is the perfect home for P.J. Washington, and why their defensive unit is playing at such a high level (2:44). Next, they talk about the frustrating inconsistency of the Boston Celtics and why their recent play is concerning (19:39). Later, they look ahead at the Game 3s of both the Knicks-Pacers and Nuggets-Timberwolves series (35:35). Finally, the guys close with their Real Ones of the Week (53:57). Email us questions for Mailbag Monday! [e-mail] The Ringer is committed to responsible gaming. Please visit www.rg-help.com to learn more about the resources and helplines available. Hosts: Logan Murdock and Raja Bell Producer: Jonathan Kermah Production Assistant: Kai Grady Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Sure, the weather is getting warmer and you're probably planning your next vacation with your family, but what better way to avoid your family on that vacation than listening to three dudes argue about quarterback tears if you can trust a wide receiver over 30 years old, and if Jim Harbaugh still thinks chickens are nervous birds. Join me, Craig Horlebeck, along with Danny Hyfitts and Danny Kelly every week on the Ringer Fantasy Football Show. What's popping? Breilwood's. Logan Murdoch, dear Roger Bill there. We are talking to you on Friday morning, May 10th, the morning after Mavs Thunder, Celtics Cavs, which was a bit of a, bit of a doozy.

So we were talking about those games and then talking about some of the games for Friday night. A little preview kind of. Also of note, I'm going to be doing the Ringer YouTube live show tonight. That is Friday night with Sirits Sohi. So if you listen to this before the games tonight, just know. that I'm going to be here Friday night and you can just listen and come in and tap in with us after the last game on Friday night. Now that we got it out of the way, hello, Roger. How you doing, pal?

What's going on? I'm great. It's Friday. We ain't got no job. We ain't got a job after this pot. That's what I mean. We ain't got a job. We ain't got shit to do.

Aren't those Fridays the best? Aren't those Fridays the best? Look, man. Yeah, they are. Let's just leave it. Like, I got some games. games to watch tomorrow. Like my,

my daughter's getting it in. Tye's got a few games. Zen's got stuff. It's going to be a little sleepover tonight for Zen and a couple of his podnas. Like, we're, it's going to be a nice little weekend, bedbath and beyond. I don't know if I want to have the time. Okay, for sure.

All right. Well, cool. Before that, let's, let's talk some basketball. That reference flew over your head, the movie, the movie reference.

It did, didn't it? Yeah. Jesus Christ. What was it? What was it? What am I doing out here? Don't act like I didn't watch love of basketball or something. that relax.

That's fair, but this one's a class, this was a classic too. Like, what did I miss? Like, this was old school, man. Oh, old school, the movie with Will Ferrell. I haven't watched that a whole long time. Oh, my God. Just fucking pod.

Let's that. I don't want to start a long time. That's also not in my Will Ferro bag. My Will Ferro bag is, you know, it's, it's stepbrothers. It's, uh, what else? Night at the Roxbury. Yeah. Yeah, okay, Cruz content.

Yeah, I'm in a bag. I do have a, I do have a Will Ferrell bag. Okay. That's fair. This just wasn't in my bag. So anyways, let's talk Mavs Thunder game two, which was a fun game. And I think an indicator of a long series could be wrong,

but one of those games where a game of runs where, you didn't know who had control of the game until the very last few minutes. I thought it was an impressive win by the Dallas Mavericks because any team that can absorb Oklahoma City's runs at home even as that crowd is going. I've been in that arena when the crowd is going crazy. And it's pretty loud.

And I always call it a mind fuck whenever you hear those games. And to be able to have focus and dictate tempo in a game like that and a game of runs, I thought that was really impressive. And also the defensive performance from the maps and spurts was really good. One of the things that did stick out was the play of PJ Washington. And one of the things that I wanted to lock in with you about, he had seven threes on the night. I think five of those threes were the first half. His stat line was 29 points, 11 rebounds, two steals on a night where Kyrie Irving had nine points, only took eight shots, an 11 assist.

When I want to give back to PJ Washington, and when I think about him, I think about a guy, a big change of scenery guy, where, you know, playing in a place like in a program like Charlotte, which I don't know when they're going to. going to see, you know, the end of the tunnel in terms of them as a franchise, staff level, and another fucking crew. But he gets traded, you know, mid-season and immediately is paid dividends. And now he's, you know, a real player on this team. And my question is to you, like, what does that do for a guy when you are, you know, in a bad situation and you're not really playing for anything? And then you finally get something to play for.

What does that do to a player? How does that get them into a stage? because it could go either way, right? It could go, you know, I'm not used to the stage. I'm not going to be able to play well. And then you, but then there's the other side who was like, oh, I'm in a great situation. I'm going to take advantage of this moment.

What is that like for a player on his mental? You might have had the inverse, huh? I did. Yeah, I was pretty blessed because I played in the finals and I went to the Mavs. We were Western Conference finals. And then I went to the Jazz who had kind of just lost Stockton and Malone.

So we weren't playing for much. But then I went to the Suns, and we were on big stages immediately on national TV every night. And so I do have a little frame of reference. Now, the jazz was a very stable organization, and it provided a great platform. So I wasn't miserable with the jazz. We were competing for playoffs as a team that had no business.

So I wasn't necessarily maybe in the same place as PJ was in terms of the franchise itself, but it's just a breath of fresh air. It can be reinvigorating. Like, it could, there's something about performing when, when you've played this game your whole life, you start to understand that it is how much, how much it means to a city, how much it means to a fan base,

how much it means to, you know, the country at certain times a year when like that's the show. You know, we don't have football going on and stuff like that. And this is all subconscious. It's not something you're going over every day in your head like, damn, I mean this much.

But you can feel that. And when you're playing in big games and the energy around a city, like when you leave the arena in in like Charlotte at times you don't you don't feel the pulse of the city kind of hanging on whether you won or lost the game the same way you do in a in a place like Philadelphia let's say or or or even Utah when they're good and they're winning games and so experiencing that the MAVs is a great place I experienced it you know when I played with the MAV and I was with Dirk and Steve and Michael Finley and those guys like it's an electric place to be when their hopes and expectations are high

and the team is one they could potentially deliver on that. And so I think it could just be a great experience for a guy who, you know, we all want to perform on those stages. We don't control ultimately sometimes where we get drafted to or what contract we have to take to try to stay in the league.

And so for reasons beyond your control at times, you could be denied access to those stages. But when you get there, and your plan, it's so fun, man. And it can breathe new life into you the way you prepare your habits, your attention to detail, like everything, because, you know, it's, it's the stage is bigger. The stakes are higher.

There's more of a magnifying glass on your performance, you know, as it relates to whether your team can, can accomplish its goals or not. Yeah. And one of the things that like, I mean, one of the things that PJ puts has on the court, which I love. And I think it's, and I want to transition this into talking about the Mavericks defenses.

The Mavericks have one of those things where they have so many switchable guys, and they also have a, on the defensive end, they have so many guys that can switch. And also they have a guy like Lively and Gafford who are, lively is a guy that could be a shot blocker, but he's also someone that can move his feet. And if there is a mismatch, can still stay with, you know, young little guards and stuff like that. And same with Gafford. How have you seen the Mavericks defense and all top of that you have Kyrie Irving and Luca Dodgant's trying on defense, right? Like I always think about it. I'm in the bay where, you know, the biggest thing that the Warriors needed Steph to do was just

at least try. He didn't have to be a plus defender, but at least just put out the effort. I've seen that with Luca Dodgers. And I've seen that with Kyrie. I'm curious later in the program, we can talk about Kyrie's defense and the evolution of that because I felt like, earlier in his days, he would, that would be somewhere he takes, a side of the ball he takes off, except for like in certain matchups, like he would play against Steph and just be like one of the, like an all-world defender, right? And he had that in him.

Now it seems like he's starting to play defense every possession. I think it affected his offensive numbers last night. But you're starting to see this, this defensive unit from Dallas play at a high level and be athletic with the switchable guys. What have you seen from their defense and how has it been effective against this Oklahoma City team

who was also equally as athletic? And it seems like there was a neutralization at least for one game last night. You've got similar roster constructions in terms of the way they ultimately want to play, which is more perimeter oriented. You know what I mean?

So I think they look at each other in terms of matchups. and while the Mavs would have trouble guarding, like, Shea, for sure. And, and, you know, in some instances, I know I think, you know, Lou Doort's really good and he do a good job, but Luca and Kyrie are always going to be a problem.

The point is they kind of look similar in the way they're built from a guard-oriented kind of standpoint. They're going to do a lot of their work from the perimeter. And quite frankly, like, that's the league in general now, right? except for like the nuggets and a few teams like that that want to go through the Janus's and the Joel's and whatnot. But what I've seen from Dallas, and it's not schematic at this point.

You know, it's interesting in a playoff series. Obviously, we're two games deep, but just getting started in the feeling out process and the and the chess match of strategy. So we're early in that. What I see from them, is just a maturation in terms of mindset from their stars.

And it's to the point you made about Kyrie. He's always been a good defender. I saw him up close and personal in Cleveland. Like, if you were fooled into thinking that he couldn't defend, shame on you. It was just whether or not he would do it. He chose to at times, right? Luca, never going to be a top-tier defender, but seems to care about it in a way. And I talk about this a lot, that feeling that you get as a role player from seeing those guys buy in in a way, it's hard to describe what that does for you, right?

There's a level of security. There's a level of man of the people that kind of permeates through the locker room. Like, oh, shit, like, they're not just going to want to shoot all the shots and have us out here doing the dirty work. Like, they're bought in on this, on this too. And that's an infectious thing. And when you've got that rolling where people are, we're on a string, baby.

Like it's any five that check into this game. We're rocking and rolling. We'll make mistakes, but let's do it aggressively. Let's do it giving them no room to breathe. If we fuck it up, we fuck it up. Get it out of the net, we'll go the other way.

We'll clean it up. But whatever we do, do it, be an aggressive, do it, let us do it setting a tone. Like if you have that mentality, you can be okay defensively. You don't have to be like a defensive juggerna. You don't have to be like the pistons of old or the timber wolves,

but you're so good with your two scores at times that you just got to be above average defensively. And I think that that more than anything is what's changed them. I don't know that the messaging changed overnight from a coaching perspective. Sure, the pieces, you know, around the trade deadline and getting some of those Gafford helps tremendously. But it doesn't work unless you get buy-in from the big guys. And once they started being willing participants on that end, I think that's when you saw the change in their ability to defend as a team. Well, you talked about just the, how we alluded to like what it's like to kind of feel

your way into a series, you know, and I think Dallas has been that more than any team, you know, throughout this postseason. And even during their last couple of post seasons where they, I think they've, I don't have the stat in front of me, but I feel like they've lost every game one. I know they've lost every game one of this postseason. And I think they lost every game one. If I'm not mistaken during the 2022

postseason run where they went to the conference finals, on my real ones check me on that. But I believe that to be true. But when you talk about trying to feel your way into a series, like how long does it take for you as a team to be able to feel your way into a series? And how much do you want to feel your way into a series as opposed to dictating the flow of a series early.

What does that balance like? There are different scenarios, right? If you're a team that's overmatching another team or vice versa, then it becomes the latter of the two. Listen, we're coming out here to just bust your ass. Like, this isn't going to be a chess match because we're going to punch you in the mouth.

And before you know what this thing is going to be a rap. Yeah, it's a rap, right? And that good teams do that, especially good teams that have that have gotten to certain level of playoff success. They're going to do that. Come out and put you to bed. That's what concerns me about Boston. We'll get to that.

But you're not supposed to be out there playing with your food in the way that they play with their food all the time. Forgive me, Cleveland, because I don't think Cleveland is what Miami was at all. Like, if they don't tighten up, like Cleveland could get scary for you if you don't tighten up. But the point is they'll do that with even a team unlike Cleveland, like the heat that they didn't have Jimmy Butler and they'll do that with us as real ones a podcast we might they we might could get a game off of them you right now so you but but the the other case scenario would be

kind of like what we got going on now which is a one one um and in that instance I think you really start to feel a series once the opposition gives you something that you didn't expect or didn't have an answer for or you lose a game. When that happens, it forces you to say, oh, oh, shit, we either, like, it's going to be a lot of film watch. We have to find an answer for that coverage because it didn't allow us to do what we do. Or we have to find a coverage for what they just did to us offensively tonight, because if that keeps happening, we're in a lot of trouble.

Or in a loss could be just like, look, man, um, We have to check all gauges. We got to check every loose nut, bolt, screw. This can't happen. And when that happens to you, and you face a little bit of adversity, it's probably the easier and more succinct way to put it. Like when you see that first piece of adversity in a series,

that's when things start to go. Because now I got to, now I got to get to work. And if you're worth your salt, once I go to work, then you're going to go to work. And then that's when we're playing that back and forth game. Yeah. How do you see this from the Oklahoma City standpoint, right? Because Shea is, I think he's at that level now where he's going to get his.

He's just that type of, he's that level of player right now. And he also has that role on this, on this Oklahoma City team. But I'm looking down the box where, right? I know, Chet Holmgren struggled last night. One of the concerns for me with Oklahoma City was just what you're trying to say right now. Like, I know what Shea's going to do. And to some degree, I'm good with Jalen Williams. I think he's, I think he's, I love him.

I think he's one of my, he's one of my favorite players in the league right now. Just straight up. Personality, game. Yeah. I mean, like some, I love guys that can, that has, have a special relationship with their home crowd. I love those types of guys, right? And also can find energy for the other team. I think of I'm a league monk in Sacramento is another example of that.

But like, I love those types of guys. And he's a, he's a great piece for any team. Yeah, they're endearing. I said this coming into this series, that was going to be the issue, whether or not consistently the guys like Chet were ready, not because they're not good enough players,

but because of where they are in their arc as a player, where they are in their career, where they are in terms of experience, like this is uncharted territory. And there's not a huge margin for error, man, and there's not a lot of time. And that becomes the difference in a series like this. Who's going to get more?

support like Tim Hardaway shows up last night you're going to get Luca most nights and you would like the pencil and Kyrie except he didn't shoot a lot so you give those buckets maybe to to PJ but is there anyone else that shows up and boom last night Tim Hardaway goes off and like carries them for for a stretch of time and 17 points in 19 minutes yeah and like I don't mean to I don't mean to reduce it to this but like that's huge who's going to get that chat do we get it from you or do we get it from someone else or is it going to be someone from the Mavs? Yeah. And the thing is like to your point, right?

Like they have, Homegren is going to be a dude. This is his rookie year, you know? Like, what the fuck could you do, right? And he's still feeling his way out through this process where it's like a guy like Shay is just ready for this moment, right? And like also, it's a difference. It's a difference in responsibility right now, right? Like, Chet Holmgren is expected to be a number two guy on a championship team in his

rookie year. There's a lot of pressure to do. to have. And, you know, he'll have that in a couple of years, I believe. But like this ain't a couple of years from now. We need the Oklahoma City who is in a position where I need this now. That's right. There's no question that Chet is and will continue to be a great player and only get better.

But the lack of experience, that's why it's, you know, that is why when we came into the playoffs, as much as Oklahoma City is a great team, people were saying, if you could draw them, you might, you might think about wanting to draw them just because of the lack of experience. I'm not telling you they don't get it figured out. Shit, Chet might have had a bad game and his learning curve might be that quick where he's like, not going to happen to me again, bro. I didn't prepare right. Whatever that was, didn't work for me.

I'm going to reinvent myself real quick and it's not going to happen again. And in that space, they're a different team. But that is the maybe Achilles heel of a young team. is guys just having to learn on the fly and being inconsistent in what they're going to give you. Yeah, it's going to be an interesting series. I really love, like, I love everybody involved in this series, right? I love Oklahoma City coming of age. I love how their coach.

Coach Daggs has done a hell of a job, coach of the year. Hell of a coach. And, you know, there's just good, I think this is just going to be a real chess match, just from, you know, all the things that we've discussed. So it's something that I'm excited to just talk to talk about on real ones as this series progresses. Let's talk another game from last night. You alluded to it, Celtics Cavs, which is just, I want to make sure that I temper my takes on this subject when it comes to Boston.

But you can look at the, you can check the sound scan. You could check the clips from earlier this season. Me and Raj have kind of been a little skeptical on Boston throughout the season, even as they've been dominant, right? It's more of a personnel thing and not necessarily a record thing and performance thing. But, like, I didn't even really watch this game last night. I watched the highlights of it this morning and last night.

I'll be very transparent. But I think when I first saw, because I'll say this, prior to the series, and I put this in Ruyn's last episode, which is, oh, we're not worried about this Cavs Boston series because it should be a very quick series. I still maintain that because of how dominant Boston has been throughout the season. So, like, I'm thinking, like, okay, it's going to be a sweep, especially after the first game. Boston beats their ass.

This is what it's going to be. It's going to be up too well going back to Cleveland, you know, like, and then I look at my phone yesterday. And I'm like, I see just third quarter calves up 12 in Boston. What the hell? And then it balloons to like 25 by the time I turn the game off. Jason Tatum's on the bench just staring in space right? And then

I'm just like just a continual pattern of these types of losses right and I know there have been championship teams championship teams that have kept their foot off the gas right? But a team like this that's striving for

a title we've been having way too many of these things right and I still maintain that they should beat the Cavs handily in the series. They should. But losses like this are curious, Rajah. They're not good against the team that's beneath you. They're not. They're not good, Logan. Yeah, that's not a good loss. That's a terrible. You got, you got 20, first of all, in a, in a fucking playoff game as, as,

excuse me, like, let me chill out for a second. You're pissed too. You're pissed too. Yeah. You're quite possibly the favorite to win the championship. I don't know what the betting odds are. You probably are. But first of all, they miss Chris Stabs. All right. Like, that they miss that. So let me preface everything I'm about to say with that. I still think they beat Cleveland.

What concerns me about them isn't just what you just said about this particular game or what I referenced earlier as as you know, kind of their propensity to just play with their food. They've got,

I don't know how many games because I didn't do the research on it. Like, sorry. But a bunch of them, that they'll get up in the regular season by like 25 points. Yeah. And have an epic, like, just let go of the wheel. And the team they're playing against comes back and beats them.

When you put all of that together for me, it suggests a pattern of you just not staying focused, not being locked in, being someone that I would have to worry about being consistent enough mentally to win a championship. Now, you have all the pieces, like, especially when Chris Stats healthy, but there's a pattern there of like, we just get a little loosey-goosey. We think it's sweet. We think it's cake.

We think we're supposed to just come out and because we're the Celtics win this game. And the NBA doesn't work like that. Well, you'll beat some teams. Like, don't get me wrong. But like it doesn't work like that when you got to win four out of seven against playoff teams. It's not going to work like that. And so that's what scares me about them. Let me just say clearly missing their paint presence in Chris Stas.

But there were a few things about last night that, and that probably spoke to the rebound and all of that. But they looked like they were convinced before the game that there was no way the Caz could beat them. I talk about this all the time. If you give an NBA player two feet of space, his percentages dramatically increased to accomplish what he's trying to accomplish offensively. If you take one and a half foot, 18 inches of space away from that man,

and he's dealing with six inches, bro, it's a different game. He's got to back up. Before you know it, their starting offense just across half quarter, just across the semicircle. That is a, many people say football's a game of inches. So is basketball, man.

It's just so much different when you, and they didn't have that about them last night. as a defensive unit. They did not. Yeah. They came out, they were letting those guys, no, don't get me wrong.

Donovan, incredible. Like, we've seen this before, which is another reason Boston, you better stop fucking around. Because if he gets on one of those heaters that we've seen when he was in Utah, like, people don't turn that off.

Like, there's no defensive game plan that's going to stop it. He's that good. So they didn't have that level of intensity. They looked like they thought it was a foregone conclusion that they were going to win the game. And the other concerning piece for me is who in the hell is their grit guy?

Who is he? Who is the guy that when stuff like that's taking place, when we are out here embarrassing the fans, fans come there to see you get 20. Like you could lose. Don't get me wrong. You could lose, but you're not supposed to get 20 on your home floor in round two at a play. That's not supposed to happen to you. So who is in that locker room, MF and everybody at halftime?

He's a Cancun somewhere. He's a member of the Memphis Grizzlies at this point. His name is Marcus Smart. Well, that's who it was. It was, you know, like, that's concerning to me. Maybe not for this round, Logan. Do you understand? Like, maybe not for Cleland.

They played a Knicks? But, but, or even if you were able to get all the way out of the east, when you play somebody who, who is going to put you in those situations, foldable situations, metal testing situations over and over again, who is the guy? that is looking at everybody saying, guys, like, tether yourself to me, motherfucker. I got it.

Yep. Yeah. And like, I'll be honest with this. This is a year long, this is year in and year out, this has happened with the Boston Celtics, right? And they are the favorites for a reason. But like, I'm going to be honest with you. I don't believe Jason Tatum's raps.

I don't. When the chips are down, I don't. And you could tell me all the playoff games that he's played in. That means I have such a great sample size of seeing what he is in the biggest moments, right? Like I saw him in the finals and he folded, right? Like, let's be real.

He got injured last year. And that leads me to my next point of who's wraps I also don't believe. I don't believe Jalen Brown's wraps. Because he's supposed to be this guy that can be a number one on another team and

has to be the fife dog of this situation. And, but when it's his time to be the number one and prove it, what does he do? He's not there. Also, neither one of those guys exude to the point that you made about, like, we need a guy that's going to turn it, that's going to light the fire under this shit, right? Who's going to light a finder? I don't. I don't see that in those two people.

I just don't. I see them as passive people, right? And that's okay. But when you have a roster made up of two guys like that, you need somewhere, you need to round it out with some other people. And I just don't, I see a lot of nice guys there, right? I see a lot of nice, cool people, you know, a lot of people that I would just, like, love to hang with, right? But, like, no, we need some, we need people that are going to, and it doesn't always

have to be the starting guys, but when I see the guys that are, the team that is led by the two Js, I'm just, I'm just, I'm just going to put it out there. They are guys that we have seen year in and year out lead teams that crumble when it's, when it's, when it's, when it's, when it's, when it's time to roll, the two Js have crumbled. And the sample size that we have saw, I don't care what you say, it is what it is, I don't care what the record is,

this is what we see. And that's why you have these concern levels when you have a curious loss of the Cavaliers, who, by the way, not even a week ago, was struggling to get out of the first round against the Orlando Magic,

who, by the way, is a really good organization that's going to be good. But you at this point, had Donovan Mitchell, who played really well in game to a week ago talking about, man, it's really tough.

I don't want to lose. lose anymore in the postseason. And you had whispers of him not even wanting to be there in Cleveland anymore. And now you, in game two, like, against you guys, who you guys are supposed to put them in a pack and smoke them. Instead,

he's out here, Donovan Mitchell's out here, embarrassing you on your home floor. Like, I don't get it. You talk about these two Js and what do you have, this weird ass record at home where they're losing all the time and then when they get punked against Miami, right? Like, this is, this is

continual perpetual stuff that we continue to see. And I don't know if it's on the on the coach. I see these two players and I don't see guys that are like, you know? Yeah, that's interesting. I agree with everything you said. I fully expect them to come out against Cleveland. And I think they, I think they popped Cleveland good in Cleveland in game one. I think they, I think they will. That's what they typically do. But that is even furthering my point of why, I'm concerned about their level of inconsistency and an ability to focus as you play, like, really good teams. That's, that's not championship level shit historically, a team that's like, oh, yeah,

we're going to give you a game or two, and then we're going to come out and do what we should have done to you off the bat. You see it with the clippers and why they're out. That level of volatility is hard to kind of overcome in what the NBA playoffs is. and everything you were just saying was, you know, about the two Js. And yeah, man, they have, you guys are the stars, man. I tell you, stars got to be starring in a playoffs. There's no other way around it.

But the guy that I'm talking about is the glue guy, the backbone guy. He doesn't even have to start. He's got to be a rotation guy, though. Now, the heat were, the heat had eudanus that would do it sometimes, but they always had like Jimmy Butler who was on the court. Like, it just can't come from an, it can't, be an old dude on the bench that's not playing. Like that can't be it. He's got to be someone that's

in the rotation. And if all of that is missing, like as good as Drew Holiday is, I thought it's fantastic piece. He's not that guy. Like, it's not, that's not what he does emotionally. And, you know, you think Al Horfer, but Al's kind of chill. And let's say you don't have him. Let's say the

Mark is smart isn't there. The whoever else you want to point to isn't there. You just said something really interesting. The coach needs to have that attitude. That's how you can overcome that. If the coach's DNA and who he is, who he wants to be about,

what culture he's developed is in his own mold, that might let you overcome that sometimes. But this isn't taking a shot at Missoula. But that's why Udoka was good for them. Specifically them too. And because you're going to take on a little bit of who he is. And I'm not throwing shots at Missoula. Like he had his issues, you know, in the playoffs.

well documented, especially on this pod. But, you know, and some of that does have to fall on him for his team being that lacks mentally. But less than a shot and more of a point. Like if your coach is built like that, he could be the person in those moments potentially to deliver the message that someone on the team should be delivering. And then they clearly don't have that person. Yeah. It's going to be. I mean, like you said, they played a Knicks.

next round, right? Who's being, they're up to, I think that's, that's, that Pacers next series is going to go to distance. I think it's going to go to the distance. If they play a tough team, right? Or what if they catch Timberwolves, bro? Like, Anthony Edwards takes over a game and just like, starts talking that shit and gets in their head.

Boy, the Timberwolves had the Denver Nuggets as close to crying as I've ever seen an NBA team. They were out there acting, the full, throwing shit literally on the court. Yeah. Acting like you was eight years old, like, I've been not seeing a team stymied like that. So to your point, they're bringing big problems

when they show up. Oh, they are. And they're talking shit, you know, like, it's going to be a, it's going to be a problem if Boston gets to the finals, it takes, like a Timberwolves or a team like that. Because I see, here's another thing. All the teams in the Western Conference is some hitters and got hitters on their squad. Like,

even if you talk about Dallas going into Boston and just got two guys right there that can oppose their will on a city and a franchise on a road game in Boston, right? Like, Boston needs to get, I know this, people go say, Logan, this is one game. Nah, man, we've watched enough of the Boston Celtics throughout the years to know that this is a problem. And this is something that is going to rear its ugly head, which is why I never picked the Boston Celtics and win the title because I don't think they have it right here. And I'm playing in the mental. I don't think they have it.

I think there's enough of a sample size, even during the regular season. And you've seen enough from their two stars to know that when it gets time to do something, they crumble. So that's what I have. It's all I have for right now. We'll see what happens. I think Boston beats a lot of teams. I think they struggle with the damn Minnesota Timberwolves. Because Minnesota, what they do is they are long, athletic, and very physical.

They are very physical. Very physical. And the absence of the dude, the backbone dude, that's the series that it would be highlighted even more in because you're going to be tested over and over again with them. If the Timberwolves played the Celtics, I got the Timberwolves at 6. I'm saying that right now.

Let's take a quick break. And we're going to talk about the Knicks and the Timberwolves. This NBA playoffs, Fan duel is giving all customers two chances to bring home a big win. with the no sweat same game parlay every weekend of the playoffs. Just place an SGP on any playoff matchup and you'll get bonus bets back if you don't win. Bet on everything from rebounds to assist to three-pointers and more. All right.

Let's check out the slate for tonight. Nick's Pacers. I think I'm going to take the over and overall points for the game itself. The under on minutes played for Jalen Brunson. That's a wild card. And I think I'm going to take the Pacers to win that game. FanDuel is now live in our nation's capital, Washington, D.C. Visit fanduel.com slash ringer NBA and shoot your shout on America's number one sports book.

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com. It's popping. We're back. Let's preview some of the games right here. Let's talk about Nick's Pacers. Shout out to our friend Ben, who's a big Knicks fan out there in New York. Big fan of the pod. Shout out to you.

Big fan of you as well. Shout out, Ben. Shout out, Ben. but it's interesting because we talked about this series, I think before the series even started. And one of the things you said was watch out for New York's physicality. And I said watch out for Indiana's pace, right? And now it's a weird thing right now because they're playing at Indiana's pace

and yet the Knicks are still winning and still like kicking ass. How is that happening, Roger? What have you seen from this series that I can't get a hold on what this series has been like? I know Brunson's been great, but they're playing Indiana's game and winning. How are they doing that? Yeah, the Pacer's defense sucks. I mean, as simple is that. Like, it's, I mean, it was historically bad in game two.

Game one was right there. They had a chance to win that. Like, you just, you know, you caught a couple bad breaks. You did everything you wanted to do in game one. I mean, your star didn't show up, but you did everything you wanted to do in game one. You gave yourself a real legit chance to win the game. And you got out nicked a little bit in game one in the fourth quarter. Jalen Brunson did what he did.

And you, if you're a franchise, like, you're going back feeling pretty good about that. And that's why, quite frankly, I think Rick Carlisle and those guys took the high road as a franchise complaining about the calls in game one. Because you feel pretty good about that. Like, you're, we're all right. And then in game two, yeah, the pace was what you wanted it to be. you just did not defend. Like you didn't defend it. If you led a team of NBA players get up and down the court at a pace that's faster

than they want to play, but you don't apply the right amount of pressure to deter them from making a high percentage, they're going to score a lot of points. They're really good players. The best players on the planet. So your job is to make them play at your pace and then give just, Give me an honest effort defensively. Like, let's give me a good one. T.J. McConnell should have 100%.

I'm sick at a debate about Nimhart of McConnell. McConnell's got putting McConnell on that man and down the stretch. Like Rick Carlisle, you know, I know no one wants to get up in front of the camera and say, yes, I'm going to be doing that because it means like you messed up in the moment. But like, you know damn well McConnell's supposed to be out there. And yes, it's going to slow you down offensively. But he was the only thing, and he was giving Brunson issues. Like Brunson, he was like an irritant for Brunson. and that's what you want.

Brunson is kind of a cool customer. Like a Tyler and Iverson, yeah. Yeah, you want someone out there. So that's what happened. Now, weirdly, you're down 02, but if you remember what I told you about their pace, I said, even if it's not translating into wins or it's not looking successful early,

keep investing in it. Keep going. Keep getting it out of the net. and running because down the line, you're going to get the return on investment. And what that looks like is the Knicks don't have enough healthy bodies now. Yeah.

They could ill afford to lose anybody. And the reality is that pace, those minutes that they have to log, it's a direct, like, that's why OG and Ninobe pulls a hamstring. Yeah, Tom Thibodeau. Yes. Like, well, I'm not taking shots.

Tom, but what I'm saying is the pacer's, like, the pace is going to, it's going to help with situations. You don't want anyone to be injured, right? But let's not, let's not be childish. If you're playing a team and one of their players get injured and it gives you a better chance to win the series, you think you're fucking crying over there? No. No.

So you keep investing in the pace and maybe it doesn't provide a win in game one and it doesn't translate into a winning game two. but we're sitting here at game three, and I'm telling you, the Knicks don't have enough bodies. Jalen Brunson is compromised. And so now it starts to become a concern. A lot of Knicks fans out here scared, Raja. You got a lot of Knicks fans out here scared.

They should be because a hammie, I mean, he's already out for game three. Maybe game four, because hammies are tricky. Well, that's what I was going to say? Game four, I don't know, was it one day in between? Are we on every other day right now? I think so. I think so. Yeah, so you're not, he won't be back for game four.

whatever Jalen Brunson has going on, you know, that's going to be, that's going to be sitting on the edge of your seat TV to see if he ever, you know, pulls up or if it's something that, that can become worse in the midst of a game. And just if they get into your bench in any real way, like foul trouble or anything like that, where are you going? Here's another thing, Roger. Here's another thing around you. So it is every other day.

And they played a night at 7 o'clock local time. And then is it a short turnaround on Sunday? And then it's a 3.30 start. I don't know the thing, but it's like a 2.30 to 3.30 start on a Sunday. It's an ABC game. It's an afternoon game. It's not great for trying to get somebody back off a pulled muscle. Oh, shit.

Yeah, it's going to be, it's going to be a tough. We could see this by the end of the weekend being 2-2. Like, it's not even been a thing. It's going to be. I think that's exactly where we're headed. And, you know, in that space, I would have then been wrong because I also told you, I think that the Knicks could have made easy work of Indiana, and you both told me it was going to be a long series.

So kudos to you guys if that happens. We were scared because you're the NBA player. We were like, well, I didn't foresee the injury. Like, I just didn't, you know, there would be no way. But I think the Knicks, they close better. You got people you trust better. And even if they might not have, like, beat the Pacers up on there.

Like, the Pacers looked like the better offensive rebound team through three quarters of game. one. The Pacers were boxing out. You could see them bodies on bodies, boxing out on the defensive glass, concerted effort to clean it up, not let the Knicks pummel them. And then on the flip side, the Pacers were having extra efforts going to get their offensive rebounds in game one. I was really watching the game like, man, this is like just a complete contradiction of what I thought was going to happen. And then in the fourth quarter, everything changed. And so the Knicks might not out-knick you one through three quarters, but they're going to out-knick you in the fourth quarter.

So that's why I thought. But I believe it to be two-two. And I want to ask you, because I've heard it a few times today about Jalen Brunson, would you contemplate? Would you even mess around with the idea of sitting him in game three? See if you could steal one in Indiana? Ah, maybe, but also like Tom Tibado's not going to do that. I think that would be out.

I don't think that's in his character to do that. But I think I understand what you're saying. And yeah, I mean, you know, with the, I mean, it's not Tibido at all, but with a potential injury. Sure. I think so. Like, why not? You're up too.

Because you know who did that the last couple of years? Milwaukee has done that. Like, during their postseason run, like, and I know that there was real injuries, but, like, there were times where Janus just sat out games. And the question would be as if the Knicks still have the legs to still be able to get a game without them. And I don't know the answer to that. Because 2 is a significant advantage. If you could pull off one win, one win, I'm sitting here telling you,

I don't care who the Knicks play, I'm going to take him to win the series. Yeah. And the only reason, like, I guess for Brunson, it would be for me, I am on record as saying, like, I don't subscribe to the, hey, we're going to lose this game to try to play that team. So in the same light, if we're healthy, I don't subscribe to sit in a dude just to rest him for a better

opportunity at Sunday afternoon. But the only caveat to that would be if Jalen Brunson is hobbled and if that... I could see that though because the math would math right. Even if they go down 2-1, you give them a day's rest and then you get them back on game four

with an opportunity to go up 3-1. And Jalen's playing really well. And especially the type of guy that he... I mean, yeah, I could see it happening. I'd be down because especially the amount of minutes that Jaylen has played is going to catch up with him. He's their number one offensive player, you know? I mean, I could make, listen, I could make a really interesting case, for sure.

For all of those reasons, you are theoretically dealing with something that's sore, playing on it is only making it soarer. The only real antidote for some of those injuries that are, that are playing. playable on, but are just like they're uncomfortable is rest, right? So not only would you be like guaranteeing yourself a more healthy, a more vibrant, a more spry Jalen Brunson in game four. But and this is the I would even say that the percent chance of you winning tonight is not good. It's just not.

All of the injuries, the emotion of winning. two at home, the emotion of the Pacers being pissed because you stole one from them. They haven't got all the calls. Rick Carlisle's been in the media, MF, and everybody. They sent in 79 plays to the NBA. All of that's going to come to a crescendo. Guess when, Logan? When?

Tonight. Yeah. So what if we as a franchise just say, hey, guess what? You could have that. The rope a dope. Yeah, we're not going to let you feel good about that shit at all because we're sitting him. Wow. Wow. So take that. Take all of that hollow emote. You got it. We gave it to you. You ain't win the shit. We gave it to you.

That's some Jedi mine art of war shit that you're doing. You said Jaylen Brunson's injury could be, could be surer, you know, based on this. So I just want to give that an opportunity to shout out to all of my sorority, real ones. You know what I mean? Shout to all our deltas and AKAs. You know, that's what I, we never, there's a random shout out. We haven't shouted them out ever. You know what I mean? Shout out to all our Skitwick!

Hey, they'll kick your ass. You better relax. They will come. By bad. My bad. You better relax. Who says that? Whose calling card is that?

Which one is that? I think it's A.K.A. I went to a wedding. A.k.a. I went to a wedding in Atlanta in September, bro. And the person that was getting married was an A.K.A. And it was a real thing, man. You know, because I'm on the West Coast.

We don't really have that. But they played Ski.E. by Sexy Red and it was like a whole thing and brought the whole shit down. So that's how I know for sure that ski ski ski we is definitely A.k. So shout out to all our sore roars. Only ones

I know right now are Delta's in A.K.A.s. Quick, quick. Quick. I went to Howard Hopecoming one year, bro. And, you know, Howard Homecoming. And I do, we're going to get to Anthony Edwards and the if we feel like it.

Yeah, I do. You know, we're going to get, I just want to ask you one question about that. All right, all right, all right, all right. But I went to a Howard Hope cover, right. And they had like, I forgot, Migos performed. It was one of those, like, big, like, I don't know what the hell it is. I'm from the West Coast. We don't know anything about HBCUs like that, like that.

But, like, they had an assembly there. And all of the sororities and fraternities came out. And I think, like, the A.K.A.s came out. And they were like, they put out a meme was like, Delta's be like throwback Thursday. And it was a picture of A.K.A.s. And I was like, this is gangster. Oh, wow.

It was like, wow. I was like, oh my God, this is lit. I was not ready for that. My parents both, I mean, my mind went to Spelman and my dad went to Morehouse. So like, I know a little bit about it. My grandfather and my uncle and all of them were our capas. So like, you know, that was a, that was a big deal. I got a lot of friends that are cues and stuff like that.

So it's a, it's a thing, man. It's real. It's real. Shout out to all our frat bros, all our sorority sisters, you know, you know, salute if you listen to. Anyways, let's just quickly talk about this Timberwolves Nuggets. I can't believe what I'm seeing. You alluded to it with the behavior of the nuggets right now. Jesus, guys.

to have some, if you're fucking, just, come on, come on. I would just say, if you cry, what's the baby going to do? Hey, dog, you're still numbers-wise in the series. You throw on heating pads and the thing, you know what I mean? What happened to the energy you gave Kevin O'Connor at the beginning of the season when he was talking about, we could be a dynasty and all the, and one, two, three, four, five. You get punched in the mouth twice you over here crying on the thing and stuff and like getting

fine, 100 grand, because you can't, keep your composure against the team that ain't never been there before? Come on, bro. Come on. They beat or tweeted it. I felt compelled to tweet. I was sitting there. I was like, you know, I don't really do that a lot.

Not like live tweeting about things that are happening. I'll put my kid stuff up. But I felt compelled because I was, it was genuine. It was the best defensive half of basketball. At the time I said all year. and I thought I had to think about this. This consumed me for like a day and change. Maybe ever.

Wow. When you take into account who it was, who it was against and just how they had Denver acting, they were across the board, whining, crying, salking, looking perplexed. I mean, I'm not,

I'm not saying that's going to be. be the trend of the entire series. But that night in the first half, that's all that was. And I could, I could not remember another time where I mean the deflections, the, the point blank second chance opportunities that Minnesota defenders were just like swallowing up, just beating that shit, just knocking it out, just, listen, when I tell you, when I mean this, I can't remember a half of basketball where I saw a good team get defended and just stymied across the board like

Minnesota did to Denver. I can't remember a single game ever. Game three hasn't happened yet and I'll just save my like game with your reactions from when I talked to CIRD on the live YouTube tonight. But if the Tiberwolves do what I think they're going to do

tonight, which is beat the breaks off the nuggets, it's going to be they're going to have to, the Nuggets are going to have to look themselves in the mirror because every criticism that they had over the last year has been true.

I need to see something out of the Nuggets, bro. Tonight. If the Nuggets come out and get their tail walked in Minnesota, talk about sneaky places to play basketball

that will, from a crowd, um, Oh, it's popping. It's popping. Whoa. I went there on Prince tonight one night. I just happened to be there

and I went on a Prince night, lit. And they weren't even good. No, they get it in. They will turn up and that place will get electric quick. So if Denver takes their behinds in there and gets whooped, I mean, I was hearing. Dynasty, I was hearing all kind of stuff coming from. You don't, nah, no, we got, nah, too much pride.

And that's the thing, though, like with Denver, as great as they are, man, and they are great. They have some of that Boston in them where they just, we've seen this throughout the regular season where they take nights off. And, you know, the general media and everybody that follows or will say, like, oh, you know, they still have yokeas. And all that is true, man. But, like, you get, teams give clues of who they are during the regular season. You know, if you, you know, like, if you're a championship,

for sure, trying to do things, like, there are some curious losses from the Nuggets throughout the years that have happened, right? And, like, lock in. And they didn't play, like, they haven't, in fairness to the Nuggets. It's not like they, I mean, I don't think anyone would look at them, even their most diehard fan and say they've been playing their best brand of basketball in the playoffs. They were down in every game to the Lakers. So they were willing their way to it. And to some degree and give them credit, like that's what champions do. We're going to figure this out.

It's ugly. It's not ideal, but we beat you. And we'll keep it moving until we figure it out. But Minnesota is a different animal, man. And they are so big and long. and versatile defensively, that it's, you know, look, Yokic is a G, but that's giving him fits right now. He's a G, but what about everybody around him right now? That's the question. One more question before we get to ruin it a week.

Frank Vogel is no longer the coach of the Phoenix Sun's good or bad move. Only move. Yeah. I mean, it sucks for, it sucks for Frank. Do I think he got, do I think he legitimately, like, probably not? I don't think that was like the fairest of shakes for him. But, I mean, what else you, what else are you going to do with that? You just got swept in a playoff.

What are you going to do? I mean, Mike Boodenhoes is a good coach, so we'll see what he does in it with the years worth of work. I don't know who can coach this team. Did they already hire him? Did that happen while we were on here? Well, they say he's a serious contender, so he's probably going to be the coach. I don't know. I mean, they say he's the one.

Anyways, let's get to a real one of the week. I'll go first. It's a co-reel one of the week. Shout to my guy, Josh Gundleman, who performed at, Cobb's Comedy Club in San Francisco, a friend of the show. Okay. Okay, Gundy. Got his stuff right there.

Big fan of the show as well. Also, shout out to my man, I forgot your name at Cobbs Comedy Club, who is a fan of a real ones. He worked the door. Okay. I like that. Bro, it's weird because, like, we do this audio shit and they'd be like, recognize me on the public from the pod.

And I'd be like, yo, thank you, bro. Appreciate it. So cool. Thank you. It's really humbling. It's really, like, it's incredible to me. that people were like, yeah, we listen. I'm like, what?

I said you something before the pod, not going to name names, but I said to you before the pod, and I was just surprised from you. I was like, what the fuck? Who listens to our, it's crazy who listens to our podcast? That was mind-numbing.

That was crazy. Yeah, yeah. So shout out to all the real ones worldwide. For sure. Big love. Sure. Who's a real one of the Uigh, Raw? Let's see.

I mean, there's some candidates. You see the Tom Brady roast? I haven't seen it. Was it live on that? Oh, watch that. Watch that. Okay. All right.

Yeah, watch that. There was some, there was some hilariousness on that. You know what, man? I'm just going to do it, man. I'm just going to have no shame in my game. I'm not. I mean, you guys know me now. I'm not going to fucking, like, it's my son.

It's Dia Bell. Let's go, man. Fuck. He's going to get it because yesterday I was at dinner and he gave me a call. We were with some friends and he said he had been selected as underclassmen to play in next year's Under Armour All-American game. And I just thought that was so damn cool, man. It's usually only, thank you, it's usually only seniors.

They changed the rule this year so that underclassmen could play. And he was blessed enough to be selected to do that. And I know it's always been a dream of his two years ago when he was, I don't know, in the eighth grade, we were out at a combine and stayed to watch the older kids participate in the in in in the all-American game and uh you know i was looking over at him like a ref like i was looking at him watch these players wanting to be out there one day and he got selected for it so he's my real one of the week that's big time man that's big time i don't know that's big time i don't know like you don't normally do that so it had to be a big

deal you never do that it was it was it was a big deal so forgive me guys i'll be better next week but like that one was that one was pretty pretty cool you fucking gave your son ruined of the week, bro. Hey, Kai, print out the certificate. Okay? Put that right next to the All-American. Print that out. Get that handled. Also, sleeper ruin of the week. The chicken strips at Cobbs Comedy Club.

Jesus. Oh, my God. They're amazing. They're so good, bro. Seasoned? They're seasoned. They're just, I don't even know what they do with it, but it's like, it's, they cook it at the club. They're not even like that, you know, the frozen target joints that you get and they just do that. Like, no, these are really good.

They're really fucking good. I'm giving the Cobbs out a lot. I've been there like twice in the last month. So like shout out to the Cobbs Comedy Club. All of my peeps out there, all the real ones out there. We will be back Monday. Real ones, mailbag at gmail.com. Real ones mailbag at gmail.com.

Real ones mailback at gmail. com. Come tap in what is. We will answer your questions on Monday with me, Ra, and Howard, motherfucking back. Talk to y'all soon. All the shit. Bye.

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