The Sabrina Zohar Show - 29: High functioning anxiety and how to do the inner child work to heal through anxiety

Episode Date: August 4, 2023

On this weeks episode of The Sabrina Zohar Show, Sabrina is joined by Dr Lalitaa Suglani to chat about high functioning anxiety, overthinking and how to do the inner child work to start healing through it. Want to work with Sabrina? HERE! Stuck After the Podcast? Master Implementation in 8 Weeks with Sabrina's Foundation Course Join the Make It Make Sense: Getting Through a Breakup course HERE! Get Ad-free episodes and 2 Bonus episodes a month HERE! Dont forget to follow Sabrina and The Sabrina Zohar Show on instagram and Sabrina on Tik tok! Video now available on YOUTUBE!  Disclaimer: The Sabrina Zohar Show, formally known as Do The Work, is not affiliated with A.Z & associates LLC in any capacity. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

It's something else here now. Something new. From. Exclusively on Paramount Plus. It's the series Stephen King calls scary as hell. Everything here is impossible, but it's also real. Sci-fi Vision calls it the best show streaming right now. We're running out of time and we still don't know the rules.

Don't miss what the movie blog calls something you need to watch. Saving those children is how we all go home. From binge all episodes exclusively on Paramount Plus. Hello, hello, hello. And welcome to another episode of Do the Work podcast. My name is Sabrina Zohar and I am your host. Guys, I'm super excited. Today I have a very special guest.

It's Dr. Lolita. She is seriously one of my favorite therapists and just such an amazing human being. Our conversation was so incredible and it just filled my cup. And this week we're talking about something that's really requested, which is high functioning anxiety. What does that look like? What are symptoms of it? And doing the inner child work to start to heal.

through that. As a lot of you guys know, if you've listened along on my journey, inner child work is such a huge catalyst for me for healing and for growth. And I'm just so excited to be able to give you guys more tools and more things that you can utilize to actually start to feel better. So I'm really excited. Just as a reminder, in the show notes, you'll find everything for Dr. Lolita. If you want to work with her or ask her anything, I'll put her Instagram and her TikTok. And as you guys always know, if you need anything with me, you want to book a one-on-one, have a tech guy and I do your dating app audits, ask me a question. Everything will be in the show notes, as always, if you need anything. So without further ado, let's get right on into it.

Hi, Lolita. Hello. How are you? I'm so excited. Thank you so much for being on Do the Work Podcast. I'm really excited to be here. I know that it has been a long time since we've been waiting for this moment, so I'm really, really glad that we've finally got it. Me too. And I'm all coming all the way for that accent UK. So I'm super excited that we could make this happen. And I personally, I think a lot of people that are listening, myself included, when I first heard you talking about high functioning anxiety, I was like, whoa, whoa, whoa, whoa, what is this? Because I think we're so used to just, oh, I'm anxious. Like, I self-identified with that. But before we even hop into that, I would love to know a little bit about you and also so our audience can learn a bit about you.

And then we can start diving into all of these amazing things that you talk about. Yeah, perfect. So my name's Alita. I am a psychologist. but the way that I work is very holistic. So I integrate mind, body, and energy and just really deep diving because sometimes we can do all the talking therapy

that we want, but the body has its own memory and I think it's really important just to integrate mind, body, energy. So we all get a deeper understanding of what's going on. So that's the way I work. Oh my God, I love that. I literally, we had an episode a couple of weeks ago

about like you can intellectualize your healing all day, but until you start to connect to your body. and for me it's been a game changer. Let's go first into like what the high functioning anxiety actually is. And then I am super amped. I can't wait to hear your modalities and things that you use to connect to the body. But let's start there. Okay.

So let's just start. So I came across high functioning anxiety because so many people were coming to me and it felt like there was just two different parts of people. There's a part that we put out there. We show the world that we're organized. And I say we because I also connect with this idea of high functioning. functioning anxiety. So we put ourselves out there showing that we're organized, we're structured, we've got it all together, we are high achievers and things just come quite naturally to us.

But behind the scenes, we are a perfectionist, we are overcommitters, we are over-responsible, taking everything on board, we might be feeling very highly empathetic with people and just really struggling to try and fit everything together. So there's like these two different parts and people don't really see the back. It's almost like where, you know, where you see the duck. The duck is like gliding and the water and you can just see it just looks so peaceful. And actually underneath it's like

really just trying to make itself like move forward but no one sees that. So instead we just see this beautiful peaceful gliding sort of like duck but actually underneath there's a lot more going on and that's how I sort of explain how high functioning anxiety shows

up. It's that behind the scenes there's so much more going on and we don't often show or share that part with other people. A hundred percent. I could not relate more to that of people being like, how do you do it all? I'm like, oh, don't worry.

There's anxiety that comes to, don't think that this is just like a boop snap my fingers. Now, would you say, because I'm interested to hear the high functioning anxiety component versus, let's say, just like regular anxiety.

Does it come out and manifest in different ways? Like, is it just in work or just in relationships? Or is this something, maybe I guess for anybody listening that's not understanding, maybe the differentiation of the two. Yeah.

So when we say anxiety, anxiety is the physical sensations that we feel. It always comes up in different places. And we may notice that with anxiety, we may need further support. And even with high functioning anxiety, we do. So it's the same physical sensations that we feel with anxiety, as well as what we feel with high functioning anxiety. Often with anxiety, it can get to a point where it stops you from functioning day to day. Whereas with high functioning anxiety, you are functioning day to day.

and the anxiety can fuel that part of you. So it comes from a place of fear of people are going to judge me. I'm not going to be good enough. I'm a failure. And that's where then the anxiety then drives you to get things done. Whereas on the other side, the anxiety side is that it really stops you from showing up day to day. I love that even anxiety needs two different sectors. Like it can't even just be one thing.

But of course, like anxiety is like, no, no, no, I have two parts to me. Why wouldn't I? But I think it's interesting because I always knew I was anxious. And I'm sure maybe you can relate. It's like we're business owners and moving and grooving and shaking, especially living in New York. I was constantly disregulated. At the time in my 20s, I didn't understand what that meant. You know, like I didn't really understand why am I always feeling on edge or why am I always feeling this?

And so this definitely comes into play. Would you say, though, the high functioning anxiety component, like is this something that you said? I know you had mentioned earlier that you've struggled with personally. as well. Was this something you've always known about yourself or did you discover this as you were doing their work? So as I was doing my work, I was actually lately, well, not lately, but as in my later years, I was diagnosed with ADHD. And ADHD is something that is very closely related to high functioning anxiety and how you show up. And I had no idea. And it's only when I started doing my own research, doing my own healing, that these things started to come up. And I was like,

this is so interesting. And I started putting things out on social media and so many people, people related to it and the amount of messages I was getting in. And I was like, I can't believe how many people are like I finally have something. I finally have a label. And it's not that, oh, I'm going to diagnose myself and that's it. But it's almost like I understand. I finally understand. And this makes sense to why is it that I'm feeling overwhelmed all the time or I'm nearly on the side of burnout, but I don't really fit that or I'm taking on everyone's sort of like work and I don't know how to say no because I'm struggling with these boundaries. Like I don't understand why. I do this. And it's like this idea of high functioning anxiety now makes sense. It's like that makes

sense. And then because now we understand that, it allows us to make sense of the patterns that show up to then just empower us and allow us to then put in the right tools or use the right tools to be able to then manage the symptoms that come up for high functioning anxiety. I'm actually really glad you had even mentioned like feeling almost like scene where you're like, holy shit, okay, this makes sense like something. Because that was my experience when I first even heard. I never knew what attachment styles were. Like I didn't understand what any of that world was until I read attached. And I know, you know, I love that book for just it's what it's done.

I think the pendulum has swung. I feel like attachment styles and things have become kind of like horoscopes where people are like identifying with it and being like, oh, I'm anxious. That person's avoidant. And it feels almost like an excuse as opposed to an explanation. But I know for me, even here when you were talking, I was like, oh, high functioning anxiety. Okay.

because at the very least, it makes me feel not crazy. You know, like, it makes me feel like, oh, okay, there's actually something to this as opposed to, hey, you're making things up or you're creating this scenario in your head. And I think having, because I've kind of become like what you were saying when you put it out there, like when I started talking about how anxious attachment style started really manifesting in my relationships and how my anxiety started affecting every part of my life, career, relationships.

I always thought it was just one. It's not. that's when I realized just sharing that story of how many, I mean, now hundreds of thousands of people saying, wait, me too. I feel so seen. And I think it's such an incredible aspect of social media. So I'm so glad that you're able to talk about all of those components. And for you, did you notice like, because I know we don't talk too much on like ADHD and things like that, but did you notice where there's such a, like, is there a crossover to where do you think maybe some people might be diagnosed ADHD, but it might be a high functioning anxiety? Or are there like specific? differentiations for it for you, or are they very similar in how they manifest? Yeah, I think they're similar in how they manifest and how we play out the same pattern. So often you find people that, for example, perfectionist, it's that fear of judgment, the rejection sensitivity that can come up in both sides. It's the over-responsible as well, but again, being someone who can struggle to say no,

struggle to let people down. And again, when we look at high-functioning anxiety and ADHD, both can also stem from a place of early trauma. So there's research that suggests that. So I think it's also understanding everyone's very different and it's trying to work out how it shows up in your life and which one you relate to or which one you feel you connect with to then be able to help you understand. Because again, like you mentioned earlier, it's not about putting your hand up and say, yep, that's why I'm like that. And that's it. It's like, no, let me understand now. And let me actually put in some strategies or some tools to really help me in this. Yeah. And I'd love to actually learn what are your

tools and strategies that you use or things that even personally that you love because I'm a big I think you know you're in the field I think there are so many incredible people that have a lot of great things to say but oftentimes like when I hear all the bigies you know the Mel Robbins and all those people just being like you know I see a thing of like just stop and it's like as much as I'd love to just be like hey brain knock knock you know what just cut the shit out like we're done okay it doesn't work that way and I feel like so often so many people come to me and they're like I don't have tools. Like my therapist tells me, okay, well, this is the issue.

And it's like, but how can we actually start to chip away at this? So I'd love to hear anything that you utilize that you have seen great success in. Yeah. And you know what? Just adding on to that, people come and they'll say to me, okay, I get it. I understand it. Know what the symptoms are. I know what the traits are.

Like, now what? How? How is it that I now get from here to here? What do I need to do? And for me, the answer is everyone is very different. And I can sit here and I'm like, right, these are things that I do. But I know for a fact that someone else will try them and be like, that doesn't work for me. So say, for example, like doing a gratitude journal or reflecting, writing down triggers that come up,

just taking time out for meditation or being able to take time out for mindfulness, taking time out for structuring and organizing your day, and making sense of like, okay, before, if someone asked me to do something, say, look, can I just come back to you? And I'm just going to go away and check my schedule. also again, we're taking pause in throughout the day. And I think for everyone, it's very, very different. And what might work for you right now? Someone might start off with gratitude and think, yeah, this works. Fantastic. But then they need to shift as they're shifting as they're growing, because that may not then fit them. So just because you have these tools here now, doesn't mean these

tools are going to stay with you forever because we're growing, we're developing. And it's about looking after your foundations. And for me, it is about making sure, am I getting the right amount of sleep? Am I eating well? Am I making sure I'm, I'm, I'm hydrated. Am I making sure that I'm moving like day to day as well? So these are my basic foundations of what is it that I need to do for my basic foundations. Then the next layer is, okay, structure, organization. I know I work really, really well with knowing what's going to happen the next day and feeling like, okay, I know what's going to come. It helps me just to organize my day and organize my week. But that doesn't work for everyone because some people are just like,

that doesn't work for me. I prefer to do it this way and this way and this way. So for me, it's right. We're all unique. We're all different. So just because what works for one person doesn't mean that that's going to work for you. So don't sit here comparing yourself and thinking, I should be doing this because this is what Mel Robbins is doing or this is what Tony Robbins is doing or this is what someone else is doing. It's like, no, focus on going inwards and understand what is it that you need rather than fixating on what everyone else is doing. I agree. That's how I feel about journaling. When I first, like, when I was going through it hard, when I was really like, because I was actually with a narcissist, like back in the day, I married my father. And cliche went straight for like the core, you know, the same thing that was repeating. Journaling was great for me because it allowed me to just get it out.

You know, I just wasn't keeping it in my mind. I never, to this day, I've read a couple of the journals that I've had from that time. And it's almost like, oh, my God. It's great to see the growth. Otherwise, I don't. But I have a journal sitting on my desk. I'm literally looking at it as we talk. And I just don't resonate with that.

Whereas that's kind of how I feel like when people talk about the ice baths. I'm like, I know they're great for you. And I try them all the. time and I'm like, I fucking hate them every single time. I get out and I'm like, you know, my boyfriend will be like, don't you feel incredible? Haven't you seen a change? I'm like, we've been doing this for six days straight. No, I still hate it. Like, I still don't like it. But that's the thing as well, like Sabrina, just sorry to cut you out there. But people will say like, oh, I need to wake up at 5 a.m. I need to be doing this. I need to be doing. And if you're not a

morning person, you're forcing yourself to wake up at 5 a.m. because that's what everyone else is doing. It's like you're putting so much pressure on yourself. But what is it that you actually need. You might wake up at 5 a.m. and procrastinate and not get stuff done and then actually stop work over like one, two o'clock in the afternoon and then the whole morning's gone. But because in your head, you're like, no, but I need to do that because that's what's what's going to make me successful. It's like, no, that's what people are telling you that you need to do. But actually, you have all the answers and it's about going inwards and understanding what is going on inwards to give you what you need. You know what you need. Sometimes it's about just listening,

really listening. Giving yourself like the freedom to be able to say, say, no, I do know what's good for me. I do know what works. But I will say, because you had mentioned and I love that you had brought up in the beginning of getting back with your body. Like, it's not just, or maybe that was just even before we start recording of like, you're more holistic. No, that was. Okay. I'm not totally really harding. But I'd love to know what are your techniques because I think a lot of people, what I hear most and what I struggled for years with was the rumination of like when you're anxious, you know, anxious brain's job, of course, is to reaffirm those core beliefs and it starts to go into overdrive and then it's searching for everything.

What do you normally, like, suggest or something if somebody's thoughts are just racing nonstop for them to actually be able to connect with their body as opposed to, I'm going to listen to all the books and I'm going to watch all the TikToks. I'm going to listen to what everybody says ingesting all this content, but it's not hitting, you know? I think in that moment when we are, like, ruminating, we're overthinking and we're knowing that we're feeling very panicked and our sort of body is going into that sort of survival mode. it's like being chased by a lion.

You're being chased by a lion. And in that moment, whilst you're being chased by a lion, you don't want to be there scrolling through TikTok thinking, what should I do right now? Your body is in survival. Your body's like, run for your life. You don't want to be, oh, let me focus on this. So in that moment, the best thing to do is pause,

pause and just focus on your breath. Come back inwards, and then you can come back and reflect and understand. But sometimes what can happen is you put so much pressure on yourself when you are feeling in like that anxiety, and it just becomes a loop that you're stuck in, a loop of, I need to get out of here. What's wrong with me? Why is it that I always, this always happens to me?

How am I going to get through this? Why does this always happen to me? No one else is like this. And then we just get stuck, stuck, stuck. And we go deeper and deeper down this rabbit hole. And it's like, whoa, we need to just allow ourselves to just pause. And then come back into this after we've allowed just the deep breathing, we've just come out of this state, let us then reflect back and make sense of what was a trigger?

What happened? Was it that my boss just sent me an email? Was it that someone just sent me a text message asking me to come to an event and I know I'm fully booked and I don't know where I'm going to fit this in? So what is it that's gone on that's allowed you to or cause that sort of like overthinking or the rumination to start? Like where is, what's the root of it? Because the overthinking and the rumination is your way of coping with something else deeper that's going on. And that deeper might be that I don't want to upset someone or how am I going to get this done because I don't feel like I'm going to be good enough. And that feeling of feeling of failure is now making me overthinking all these different scenarios of what if, what if, what if. And that then becomes your way of coping. But actually, that's not coping. That's not helping you. It's not supporting you.

And through self-talk, through you understanding, hang on, how do I manage this? And I always say people like, just externalize that part of us where it's the overthinking part. Because often being high functioning and being someone who gets and can hold space for other people. You're so good at giving advice. So imagine that overthinker is almost like an external entity, an external part of you. And it's like you're giving advice to your friend or a family member. And even if you have to just get a pen, get two colours. And write down, okay, what's the overthinking saying? Now imagine that, I'm just going to imagine that that's like my friend just texting me.

How am I going to respond back now to this? So that helps you then just to understand the two different parts of you to then be able to help you manage it rather than it all being muddled up in your mind. It's a really good tool to be able to just cope. And the more you do it, the easier it becomes in distinguishing between that's the overthinking now. That's the fear now that's coming out. And I'm understanding this. I actually really love that idea. That's a great, I love being able to have a differentiating factor, even like you said, with the colors. Because I think it's true. It's like shame and blame. I'm always telling people, I'm like, you can't shame or blame yourself into healing. You can't force. You can't call yourself a moron. I'm like,

because all I ever think about is like there's a little kid in there. There's a little, you know, five-year-old Sabrina that is just this. She's doing this to protect me. This is things that she was taught as a child to protect and to survive in a very different, like different scenario. And like you said, the tiger, it's like, but this isn't a real tiger. I'm like, you're not dating your mom or dad. You're not working for your mom or dad.

So those coping mechanisms, I heard a quote the other day, the coping mechanisms you created in a childhood are ultimately the challenges you'll face in adulthood. And a lot I feel like, especially with high and functioning of just like, you know, at least in my family, it was very much the like, just stop, stop crying. Come on, be strong. Like I have a, I have immigrant parents and they're very, you know, they've gone through a ton of their own stuff. And I get that. And it was always very much of one parent not being able to hold space and saying like, come on, just move on, just get over it. You're tough. You'll be fine. So then that's that. And then, but then I had a very anxious parent.

So it's like, okay, okay, well, I'm super anxious, but then you have the blame and the shame and everything starts to kind of culminate. And I think the blame and shame is really what I see. Anytime I'm really talking to people more and more and more, and maybe if you've heard this as well, it's the one aspect where I'm like, as a child, when somebody shamed you,

it wasn't because they were trying to make you necessarily feel bad. I think back in the day they said shame was used to bring the people back into the tribe, to let them know that what they were doing wasn't part of what people were doing. Nowadays, though, I think what would your suggestion be, is it the same suggestion, if somebody is just stuck in the blame loop of just shaming themselves and blaming themselves, is that, do you think that technique of being able to kind of differentiate the text would be something that would be useful for that?

Yeah. So if we think of being someone who's overcommitting, you're doing that because you don't want to let someone down. You don't want to disappoint someone. If you are someone who's a perfectionist, again, you want to show. people that look, I'm capable, I can get things done and you want to show people that you're, like, not to judge you in some ways because look, you're doing everything. So in some ways, it's like even being a high functioning or presenting with high functioning anxiety, underlyingly, the thing that you lack is self-compassion, is self-love. And that's because growing up, things may have happened where, yes, the people around you, the way that we've internalized that, the beliefs that we have of ourselves are, I'm not good enough.

So we've found ways of functioning where deep down that child doesn't feel good enough. And externally, we've developed a way of feeling enough, feeling enough, but it's all temporary. So I can keep pleasing people, pleasing people. But it only gets to a point where it's temporary. And then I'm like, okay, my void now is still empty because I don't feel good enough within myself. And I just keep filling this void, filling this void, filling this void, filling this void of being enough. but the real work comes from that connection within a child and really integrating the two different sides of you.

So there's this part of you that doesn't feel like you're worthy, doesn't feel like you're enough, and that's the driver of I need to show, I need to get love, I need to claim this validation, I need to feel and prove to myself that I am enough. And that's where then we come from a place of anxiety rather than our intuition, rather than connecting deep with our gut feeling

because we disconnect from that part of us. Because in that moment as a child, it's all about a survival. It's not about, oh, let me just connect and deep dive with what's going on within me. So we lose that disconnection from self. And as we're progressing through life, we know something's not right. We know that we're coming from a place, but we know that there's something more to us, and we just can't put our finger on it.

And when we start deep diving and understanding how high functioning works, like, oh my God, I get it, I get it, I relate to it. This makes sense. And then you can then be able to integrate the two different parts of you where you're connecting the fear, connecting the not feeling good enough, and really integrating into a space of self-love, self-compassion, and feeling that, yeah, I love myself. And I find that people can struggle to say that,

struggle to talk about love, but love is, self-love is respect, how you honour yourself, how you love other people, is how you love yourself. And it is so important because the most important relationship we hold is the relationship with ourselves. And if we are coming from a place of not being good enough, that's everything that we're vibrating, that we're attracting, that we're connecting, and that's where the energy comes in. So when we're healing, we also then heal the vibration

and that then changes everything around us. It's a beautiful journey to go down. It was the best. I'm forever grateful for my ex. I will, to this day, because that broke me down. I wasn't broken, but it broke me down to then rebuild myself. And inner child work for me, because I'll get a lot of people and like, I had a perfect childhood. I had a perfect childhood. Everything was great. And I'm like, okay, the reason I bring up inner child work, we're not villainizing your parents.

I'm like, nobody is saying that they were bad people. Like, I don't even know. No, I'm like, I don't even think my parents were bad. They had their own shit. But what I'm trying to understand is where did I learn this from? Where did I pick up these core beliefs and internalize it? Because I know egocentric age, of course, it's like you look at your parents when you're five,

you can't intellectualize and understand what's going on. So it becomes about you. And I think for me, like, I will scream it from the rooftop. inner child work is how I was able to reconnect with myself. And I think everybody has different tools. Like me, meditation with my inner child has been literally game changing, even at 20 minutes. And I just put it on and I have her in a space and I'm able to go back to the memories, take her out of it, bring her to a safer space, like where my dog is. And, you know, that's kind of, to me, embodies. It's, it's literally, I literally had this the other day where I got triggered and I do

my process. My first thing, like you said, I do, I regulate. So I was like, okay, let me, you know, know, punch the, punch the air, because it was these trolls that were saying things. And I'm like, okay, what can I do to kind of bring myself back to now? You know, you know, it's the internet. And then I went into, okay, what was the trigger? Saw that comment. I'm like, okay, I'm going to sit with my body for a couple of minutes. I started to see where those feelings were. Then when I started to understand the narrative, what's coming up for me? And I was like, failure, fear of failure, imposter syndrome, all that. And I was like, okay, that's coming from a 10-year-old. That's coming from that me. And I was like, okay, what does she need to hear right now? How can

I support her because yes, while I fought the trolls, that's one way of protecting her. But if I turn my back to her, I'm still abandoning her. And I was like, so I have to look at her and say, even if it doesn't work, even if those people are right, I still choose you. I still love you. And I am not going anywhere. That's personally like kind of my practice with reconnecting it. But I'd love to hear what do you do or what do you like to do or how do you reconnect with little you. Another way I do is I go to the Barbie aisle. Barbie's movie. That was great for me. But it was a huge part of my life. So like, I'll just go and just stand in the aisle. and just look around and I'm like, yeah, I see you.

But I'd love to hear like what that journey looked like for you because I think everyone's just so beautiful. It's one of my favorite things to hear. Yeah, no, definitely. And again, it's inner child. In a child work is so beautiful. I remember having one therapy session. And part of my therapy was like, oh, I had to go because of my course.

And I was like, I don't need to go. There's nothing wrong. Like, come on. There's nothing that's happened. I had a really good childhood. I had everything. And then you go, then you're like, uh-huh. Okay.

All these things come up and you're just like, right, I get it. And I remember. once she asked me to draw out my inner child and I was there drawing out my inner child and I drew out and I showed it her and she was like, where are the feet? And I was like, oh, wow. And I was like, this for me was really powerful because in that moment I was like, my inner child isn't grounded. My inner child doesn't have the groundedness or the right tools to be able to ground herself. So that became a real eye-opening sort of experience for me where it just started to, where I fell in love with inner child work. I was like, this is so beautiful because now I'm realizing that.

that when I'm connecting back with my inner child, yes, it's an external part of me, but it's the love that I didn't get. It's the love that I perhaps needed. And it's not saying that my parents didn't do a good job because they were fantastic in their own way, but the way all my needs, my emotional needs, they weren't met in the way that I needed them to.

And rather than me still being in this space trying to crave it from the external world, that's when I started to delve deeper into to try and make sense of what is it that I needed and how does that still portray out in my patterns of behavior right now in life? And I suppose like just like yourself, like when I feel things, because people often think, oh, you're a psychologist, you're a therapist, you should have everything together.

And it's like, I'm human. And I will still have days. Yeah, exactly. I'm so human. And there's days where things come up for me, but I have the toolbox to be able to come back into that and be like, right, what just happened there? I noticed that this had gone on for me. And what's gone on for me?

What's happened? Why did I feel this? Notice it in my body, very similarly to what you do. And really relate it back, going back, where did I feel this in the past? and where is it stemming from? What belief is it that's being triggered? So if I'm around certain people, I may notice that I might be feeling like I'm not good enough.

I might be feeling this like, oh, I better not speak here, but why? Where is this coming from? And if we can really dive and go deeper and deeper into this, it gives us insight. So then moving forward then, I now have insight into not letting that fear overpower me and shut me down because that's an old pattern. So by me understanding that, I'm just like, right, okay, come on.

And again, holding my inner child, holding that whichever, wherever it has happened in the past, holding her and saying, I've got you, come on, we're going to do this together. And almost like re-nurturing and reparenting that child that didn't have the love or the connection that once I craved. And I'm like, right, I'm not letting you go. We're doing this together. Everything that we're doing, we're doing together.

And I think it's such a beautiful journey when you really do integrate with that in a child and take her through life with you, not feeling scared, not feeling that other people or just passing your power over. It's like, no, I'm number three. Like, there's a one, two, three that I tend to use in my therapy process and with myself. And that's where I just said number three. So number three is like my grounding, my adult self. And then I have my number one, which was my younger self who needed the love.

And my number two is the one who developed tools and sort of like these behaviors, like being a perfectionist, being someone who's over responsible. And that version of me is like the one who feels like everything needs to be in control. and that number two tries to or ignores number one. So I'm like, right, okay, let's try and work through this and work through this in my own head to make sense of what behavior, what learned behavior now is coming out as a result of me not feeling enough. And then by undoing all of that, we then redo into a new space

and trying to create new patterns. And it's, like I said, it's a beautiful journey. Amazon presents Jeff versus Taco Truck Salsa. whether it's Verde, Roja, or the orange one. For Jeff, trying any salsa is like playing Russian roulette with a flamethrower. Luckily, Jeff saved with Amazon and stocked up on antacids, ginger tea, and milk. Habaniero? More like habanier, yes.

Save the everyday with Amazon. It really is. I think neuroplasticity is one of the coolest things. The fact that we literally can rewire our brain. I am the poster child of it. Like I, people always look at me now and they're like, but you have this great relationship

and you have all this and all this and oh my God, you're vulnerable and you can talk. And I'm like, you would not have recognized me six years ago. I was not even a version of this, but that goes to show that it's like, just be, I don't like to self-identify.

I used to be like, well, I'm just anxious. And I remember my boyfriend looked at me and he was like, if you continue with that thought process, he was like, you're not allowing yourself.

Because he studied psychology. He did the same thing as you. He was like, I had to go to therapy. And he was like, And then I realized, fuck, I have issues. But he always will call me out on that. And he's like, you want to self-identify because it just makes you feel safer to say,

well, but I'm anxious. And he was like, but if you actually want to make changes, it's like you know that your brain doesn't have to hold on to all of those thoughts. Just like it was taught that, we can teach it new things. And I think I like the way that you've also kind of segmented the inner child because I always like to like for, because a lot of the people that listen in on the podcast, dating. You know, dating is a very big, because I've got people ask me all the time, like, I'm

great in every area of my life, but for some reason, when I date, it comes out. And it's like, well, yeah, because that's the closest relationship that's going to mimic your caregivers. You're with somebody consistently as opposed to friendships or work. And I always like to say, okay, you've been so disconnect. You abandoned little you, just like everybody else growing up. So now we're going to have to reestablish that relationship because I know my little inner me for about five or six meditations when I'd go back. She didn't want to talk to me. She did not want to talk to me. And then I finally went back and I was like, I kept saying, I'm not leaving you. she turned and she said, you left me. And I was like, oh, my God, you don't trust me.

Wow. Yeah. And so I had to rebuild her trust. And now, then when I dated after I was started to do that, I always imagine she was next to me. So when I was about to self-abandon and go, oh, you're right, it's okay. I don't want a relationship. It's fine. Like, we could totally just do casual. I am like the cool girl, right? I don't have any needs. I would literally stop and be like, oh, that's actually, no, I can't leave her. Like, I can't leave her behind because if I do that, I'm sacrificing my wants needs and desires for what somebody else wants that doesn't align. And it's okay for it not to align, but fuck if I will be leaving her behind again. Yeah.

Yeah. How powerful is that? Like, how powerful is that you're realizing and you can see that your younger self versus where you are right now and how easy it is to fall into that rabbit hole and that same pattern of, okay, you go away now. Like, I've got this new thing going on and you're getting in the way. And it's like, no, she's not too much. She's not getting in the way.

It's like, come here, let's do this together. And it's like, that's where then change happens. And you show up as being your authentic self. And being able to say, hi, hang on a minute. If you're after like a situation, if you're after something that's not a relationship, that's not really for me right now. And being able to articulate that rather than falling into, oh, this person wants this, I better give them this because otherwise I might lose them or they might reject me

or they might think I'm not good enough. So let me make myself good enough. And it's like, no, no, no, no, no. let's be true to ourselves. And to be true to ourselves, we need to connect with that in a child. If it were only as easy as, oh, let me just change myself and it'll work. It's like, well, then all of us would be like molding and moving. And I even kind of, I've embodied that thought process, even in life where I'm like, people will always come out. Oh, you need to talk slower. Ew, stop cursing. And I'm like, I don't change who I am to make you feel more comfortable.

I stay true to myself. Because if otherwise, then like that becomes a pattern. Then it's, oh, okay, let me do with this person and this person and this person. I grew up with a people pleasing mother, so I'm very familiar with that. And it's just not, first of all, it's not sustainable. And second of all, it will always feel you,

it will always leave you feeling like you're not fulfilled. Because it's like, if you're not filling your own cup, I always used to say, like, I always thought somebody needed to come save me. And it wasn't until I did an inner child meditation where I saw me and I kept going on the other side of the door. And when I went into with her and she had her suitcase

and she said, I'd just want to be out of here. And I was like, oh, like you had said, come with me. I was like, we're going to get the fuck out of here. And being able, obviously, it's not real that didn't really happen. But to myself, it shows that you can still be there for yourself. And I think it's so beautiful. And I'm so glad you even brought that up of being able to support yourself in different ways.

Because I think so many people, I'd love your thoughts on this because, you know, it's been a minute since I had started my inner child journey. A lot of people I think don't know where to start. I get that question all the time. What do I do? You know, I'm stuck. I'm lost or I feel stuck is kind of the question I always get. I'd love to hear your thoughts on somebody who's maybe very new in this inner child journey and has no idea.

A lot of people repressed memories or I don't have any thoughts. I don't know what happened. What would your advice be to get started on such a beautiful journey? I honestly feel like it's so important to have a safe space to be able to do it because sometimes there's so much information out there. And you could go into different Instagram accounts. You can go into YouTube now. You can like do all this stuff. and it's like, right, I'm going to do this, I'm going to do this.

But actually, when you get a space where it's personalized to you, that's where like real change happens. That's where real, because it's personalized to you. So if you're working one-to-one with a professional who understands and can hold space for you, because I remember going to one therapist and I went in there and the first therapist that I went to, they kept looking, they kept looking at the clock. The clock was behind them and they kept looking. So for me, that was like, I already went in there thinking I wasn't good enough.

I already went in there with these subconscious beliefs of how I felt about myself. So the fact that this person kept looking at the clock, they were just looking because for them, the clock was above and they just were making sure that we were on schedule. But for me, I was like, oh, okay, I better not speak. I better not. So I think there needs to be something about it being a safe space and for someone to be able to be able to hold that space for you. So someone to be able to notice when things are going on or when things are happening,

because again, I can verbalize and I can say, yeah, I'm fine. But then I'm doing like, I'm fidgeting or I'm dishing. something else going on. So when you've got that space and you're working with someone, I think there's a real power in that because you allow yourself to be vulnerable to develop and to bring yourself out in a trusted safe space. And with that, that's where your inner child will feel safe. And for so many different years, your inner child may not have felt safe. And that's why you've developed all these tools. So there's a real process in going in to a safe space, speaking, having time to process, coming back into this space, and knowing that there's consistency

with that. Otherwise, what can happen is we're doing it ourselves. And again, talking from experience, you're sitting, you're trying to journal and you're like, I don't get this. What does this mean? And you're coming from your own awareness. You're coming from your own experience. So if I'm sitting there journaling and I feel like, yeah, yeah, this is fine. This is fantastic. This is good. I'm just going to leave it now. I don't need to do anymore. I'm going to stop. But because I don't have that accountability or that other person mirroring and showing me the mirror, I don't get to see my patterns. So I think it is important to work with someone and someone that you feel comfortable, you feel safe with. And even if initially you don't feel safe, I think it's important

to express your needs and express what's going on for you so that other person then can help you meet because it doesn't happen straight away where your inner child will come out like you said for yourself, it was the fifth meditation. For myself, I know that it took me, I wasn't comfortable with that therapist. I went to another therapist and that's where then I found my voice and I was like, oh my God, this is amazing. But it's, I think you need to know and you will know when you feel safe. So that's what I would say the first thing to do is another thing is just notice your triggers. Notice the point where you notice yourself being a perfectionist or being over responsible, struggling to say no.

Start noticing some of your patterns, making notes of them. And that then can go into the therapy space or into the coaching space with you. You know what's actually wild to me? How many people, because I love, I obviously am not, I'm not a therapist. So there are a certain extent where I'm like, I could talk to you about certain things and we could get to a point. And then it's like, but then there are certain things where it's like, hey, you need a professional. Yeah. First person to say, therapy saved by fucking life. But I was the same. It took me like five or six therapists, if not more before I found. And I went through like three that were instrumental to my growth. Like it almost was like every time one would leave saying like one of mine, you know, she got a new job and different things. But it made me realize like, okay, it's time to level up. Like, okay, now I get somebody new that can give me different dynamics. What shocks me is how many people I'll speak to that'll say, I've asked my therapist to do inner child work and they don't want to. Or they say, no, we don't need to go back in the past. We don't need to talk. talk about that. We just talk about where you are now. Oh, wow. I've never heard of that. I sadly hear it all the time. People reach out like, hey, I don't know where to find a therapist. Mine doesn't want to do that.

Or like a lot of people say, my therapist just wants to talk about this week. And it's like, well, I wonder what that does. Like you're expressing your need, which already is a very difficult thing for you to do. So I'm just envisioning like someone coming in and expressing something. And even with myself, if I remember when I was first going into therapy space and you know, you're very vulnerable, very timid. And for you, you're just like, oh, the heating's on, it's a little bit warm. And what you're really trying to say is, can we turn the heating off? Because it's really, really hot and I'm burning hot in here.

But you don't have the ability to do that. And like, I remember myself, I didn't have the ability to say them worse because I was so fearful of upsetting the other person. Whereas now I'd go in in a very different space. But, like, I wonder what that would do for someone and their relationship with their inner child if they're expressing a need. And then that needs like, oh, yeah, no, I don't think we need to do that. or yeah, how that they feel like that may shut their inner child down.

So don't give up, guys. If you feel like you wanted to read a child, but don't give up, just keep searching for someone. Yeah, that's usually when people come to me and they say that, I'm like, I think it's time to look for a new therapist because I'm like, I don't know. Listen, I get it. There's, like you said, there's a million schools of thought. There's so many. And it's like, I understand. I hear some stuff and it's the same in the dating space.

Like, there's some dating advice from like, you have got to be, you have got to be kidding me. You cannot tell me that you actually think this advice to somebody like, here's a text you can send to make sure the guy wants you. And you're like, oh, my fucking God, you're trying to control other people. But I think it's also personalized, isn't it? Like everyone is so different and everyone needs something different. Like even in couples, you can give generic advice, but it's only when you're working with one to like one to one.

Because even if someone comes to me into therapy, they're like, oh, I think my partner is like this, this. I'm like, I can't share or express or even diagnose someone else because I don't know them. I'm just coming from your experience. So let's sit with your patterns and let's understand what's going on here for you. Because who am I to diagnose someone else I've never met? I think it's really important as therapists and professionals to be able to understand that and to make sense of, okay, when people are coming in, yes, we can give generic advice.

And it's also important to try and understand the advice that you're hearing online, the advice that you're reading because I can read like, oh, yeah, see, this is what's expected in a relationship and go back and say to my partner, look, you should be doing this and this and this, this means that you don't love me. This means that you don't care for me. And it's like, that's not true because their love, my love language might be very different to theirs and vice versa. So there's a real depth in going deep diving and understanding each other and connecting in that way. 100%. That's why I think most of, almost everything I talk about, the minute I get, Why does he do this?

I'm like, I can't answer that question. I'm like, but what's coming up for you? That we can talk about. How is this affecting you? I'm like, you putting it on to them. You constantly asking, do all, like I get the, do all guys come back? I'm like, we can't speak for everybody. We don't need to make these generalized sweeping things.

And again, clickbait of, you know, to me, anytime I see any content of this is why somebody does this. It's like, listen, we can talk about somebody avoidant. These are behaviors you might see or somebody anxious. Those are more. generalized components. But I think anything that's in the self-help realm that is talking about other people and not yourself is doing a detriment because by every time you focus on them, you're taking it off of you. I don't give a fuck why they keep doing it. What I care about is why

you keep allowing it, what's coming up for you on that side. So for, like you said, for anybody listening, if you are not able to find somebody that is satisfying your needs in the therapy department of you are literally asking them to do inter-child work and they are saying, no, it's okay. it doesn't mean you're too much and it doesn't mean your needs don't matter. It just means that this is similar to dating. This isn't a right match. Yeah.

And that's okay. Like even with both of us, it's that we went through different therapists to find the right fit. And that's not saying that they're not good enough. It's not saying that you're not good enough. It's just that that doesn't connect in the way that you need. And that is okay.

And it's okay sharing that with the therapist and saying, look, I don't really feel this works. And then finding someone else that you do. And initially, when you are finding a professional, have a few discovery calls with different people, just to understand and work out, ask a few questions of how they work and what you're looking for in that space as well. So you're just getting an idea of how they work and your understanding that there's different ways of working as well. 100%. Anytime I start with a therapist, the first thing I'll say to them, I'm like, I don't want a yes, man.

I'm like, I don't want you to just sit here in silence and let me talk for 45 minutes or just say, well, how'd that make you feel? I'm like, I want you to either give me tough love, call me on my shit. I'm like, I need somebody that's going to be able to let me know because otherwise I hear this all time. I've been in therapy for 15 years and nothing changes. It's like, well, yeah, because just because you're talking to somebody doesn't mean you're actually doing any work on yourself. You're just, I can talk to a wall. So, and let me, before we kind of end, I'd love to know, you're writing a book. Can you give us a little sneak peek so that people, I know it doesn't come out for a minute, but I'd love to just know your journey with the book so that we can be ready for when it comes out. So this book has been like on my radar for about seven years now.

and it really has been on my own journey, my own journey of healing. So it's full of like psychology, sort of theories, understanding high functioning anxiety, understanding the history behind it, understanding the two different sides of us and understanding how the two sides are formed. But most importantly, the tools, the tools of how do I now manage this high functioning anxiety and moving forward. So it would be a great starting point for anyone who is really struggling with their high functioning anxiety or feels like they can relate because it's a good starting point.

it just opens the door for you into that space and takes you through a journey of healing and going through like the tools and making sense of just giving you a peace of mind of like, I get this now. I get it and it makes sense to me. So I'm really excited. Yeah.

And you said this doesn't come out till next year though? Yeah, it's not coming out till next year. Okay. So by the time everybody, this is going to come out soon. So by the time everybody listens to this, the book is not out yet. But super excited in time. As it comes out on do the work,

I will, you'll have to let me know when it comes out in time. I will post about it. in the stories so that I can link it for you. But Louisa, thank you so much for sitting with me and sharing stories about yourself and being vulnerable with me and answering so many questions. It was an awesome conversation and I learned so much. I'm so appreciative of you being on the podcast.

Thank you very much. And I'm just like, is it over already? I know. I know. I'm glad. I can say you're talking about it all day. But no, thank you as well for sharing and thank you for being vulnerable and just doing what

you're doing. Like you're doing a great podcast where people can just come in and just listen in, feel the run. vulnerability and feel safe and take away tools to be able to just feel empowerment and make big changes in their life. So thank you. Thank you. I know it's a let feel less alone, right? I mean, we're already especially after COVID. It's like we all felt so alienated. It's like, well, hey, we're all in this together. And so if people want to find you, I will link everything in the show notes, but where can they find you in case they don't look for end the show notes? Perfect. So

Instagram at Dr. Lalita. That's my Instagram. You'll find me on there and everything else is connected on there. Perfect. And I will, like I said, it'll be linked in the show notes. If you want to follow Dr. Lolita, if you want to follow her so you can be ready for the book, everything will be in there. And thank you again so much. I'm so stoked for this episode to come out. Thank you. And take care. Bye. Bye.