The Sabrina Zohar Show - 77: Reframing negative thoughts, self-love, and communication for healthy relationships with Jason Goldberg

Episode Date: May 24, 2024

This week, Sabrina sits down with Jason Goldberg, a speaker, coach, and author, who emphasizes reframing negative thoughts and consistent action to challenge a fixed mindset, particularly in dating. He shares his experiences with anxiety and depression, advocating for grounding oneself in physical sensations before cognitive reframing. Jason and Sabrina share about loving oneself independently of others' validation, recognizing personal insecurities, and understanding that not being liked often reflects others' issues, not one's inadequacies. Jason highlights the importance of intentional communication and managing anxiety in relationships, sharing his own experience maintaining long-distance connections and handling uncomfortable conversations. Ultimately, he and Sabrina promote self-love and resilience as foundations for healthy relationships. Want to work with Sabrina? HERE! Stuck After the Podcast? Master Implementation in 8 Weeks with Sabrina's Foundation Course Join the Make It Make Sense: Getting Through a Breakup course HERE! Get Ad-free episodes and 2 Bonus episodes a month HERE! Dont forget to follow Sabrina and The Sabrina Zohar Show on instagram and Sabrina on Tik tok! Video now available on YOUTUBE!  Disclaimer: The Sabrina Zohar Show, formally known as Do The Work, is not affiliated with A.Z & associates LLC in any capacity. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hello, hello, hello, and welcome to another episode of Do the Work podcast. My name is Sabrina Zohar and I am your host. I know I'm a broken record, but I love the YouTube world. I love that video is now part of this. I've been adding also some more 10 to 15 minute videos on YouTube that are longer form content that are not seen on any other social or podcast. So guys, check it out. Don't forget to subscribe, follow, follow along in all the socials.

There's Do The Work podcast on Instagram and YouTube and then Sabrina. dot Zohar on Instagram and TikTok. So welcome to the fun world, my friends. And guys, we have a very special guest. He is a very good friend of mine from Venice. I met him a few years ago and just instantly knew this is somebody that I had to have in my life for a long time because he's just a breath of fresh hair. And it's Jason Goldberg. So he's an amazing speaker and coach. And he's just he's just one of my favorite humans. So I'm very excited about this episode. And today we're talking about reframing those negative thoughts, how to take consistent action and how to challenge your fixed mindset. It's so, so important, especially when it comes to dating. You might not think it's a big

deal until all of a sudden you start to realize how your thoughts and words really are impacting the future that you're having. So I'm so, so excited. And guys, as always, thank you so much. If you need anything, the link in show notes will have my new website's up, Sabrinazohar.com. You can just check it out and take a peek. But also the course is out. So the foundation course is out. It's an eight-week course that you take at your own time, but you do only get to go once. It only opens up a new one every week because it's not about a lack of information. It's a lack of implementation. So I am here to give you guys all the tools and then give you the time to implement those

tools. So it's super exciting. I'm just so stoked. So grateful to have the community that I have. If you guys need anything, you want to work one-on-one, ask a question, free guides. Everything is in that show notes or at Sabrinosohar.com. So guys, without further ado, let's get right the fuck on into it, shall we? I am so excited to have you here, Jason.

Thank you so, so much for joining to The WorkPy. I would have done this just to catch up. I mean, can we, like, not make this a podcast, just make it a catch up and then people can listen to that? I would honestly, I think they would actually tune into that specifically. For anyone who does, so I met Jason at a dinner party a couple years ago in L.A., and that was to me, talk about, like, that kismit. Like, I felt like we met each other and we've known each other for years. And when we don't speak for even months and we talk again, it's like we had never had any time. So I'm so excited to welcome you to the community and the community to you.

So if you could just start us off with like, give us a background, who you are, what you do, what is so amazing and why do we love you so much? Oh, jeez, my God, this is like my only person I would agree with that is my Jewish mother. So for me, I am, God, who am I? It changes all the time. I guess who I am, hopefully who I am, is some kind of joy activator in the world. Like, that's what I care about. Like, do people feel more joyful after an interaction with me?

That's all I fucking care about. Everything else is kind of whatever. That currently takes the form of coaching and speaking. I do leadership and mental performance coaching. Typically for people in entertainment, actors, directors, writers, people like that. or CEOs of small businesses, I do speaking, I wrote a book, all those kinds of random things. But essentially it's just like, I just want to help people have a more joyful experience of life. And relationships are obviously a huge part of that.

So I'm excited to have a conversation about the intersection of all those things. Me too, because I know that you're also like in a new relationship. And not like not a new new, but it is newer. So I'm super excited to like hear for anyone listening. It is long distance. So we're going to get some snippets and some really great insight. But I think first off, can I just say the way you described yourself is perfect because you do bring joy? And that's like the perfect way you light up the room.

So I'm excited for us to share this with everybody. But of course. One of the main reasons I really wanted to have you to talk specifically. Like you and I can talk about anything. But very specifically is I think one of the bigger issues is mindset, and reframing and challenging the fixed mindset and action. And I know that like that's something that you love to kind of talk about is like how to take consistent action, things like that.

So I wanted to kind of just kick this off to really talk about. the mindset in dating, and I think a lot of the people that are listening, just so you kind of have a bit of an understanding, are highly anxious and feel like that scarcity, that fear, that somebody's always going to leave me and they're going to abandon me and I'm never going to meet anybody. So if they meet one person, it's that attachment to the outcome. And I'd love to even just talk about even some highbrow understanding of like mindset and how that really plays into like manifesting the reality that we live in and how that can impact our dating world. Yeah, 100%. Well, good. I'm at home. because I am highly anxious as well. So I'm anxious and secure by default, 100%. And for me, you know, when you think about the scarcity, the abandonment, I was raised by a single mother and I'm an only child. My dad left my mom as soon as she found out, she was pregnant. He was like, I'm out. I was make the joke that he was a professional magician, like as soon as she said, I'm pregnant. And so, so I came into the world and half of the people that were involved with

creating me said, I don't want to be there with you. You're not enough for me to be there. Of course, that's not what it is, and you don't have language to really process that. But you're not, the person's not there that's supposed to care for you. And so abandonment and like needing to attach and needing security. That was like, that's my MO for life. It's like, how do I make sure? How do I bring people into my life? And then how do I make sure to do whatever I can so they do not leave me?

Because I can't take more abandonment given what I've already been through. And so all the stuff you just said completely, I thought you were just talking about me. I didn't realize you were talking about the community. So it's a big thing. But the interesting thing about anxiety, and this is anxiety in general, is I've had to learn to deal with that. My mom has always had issues with depression, anxiety, and whether or not that's hereditary or genetic or it's pass downable.

It hit me very well. And so, again, I've always had that same thing, anxiety, depression. I had suicidal ideation into my 30s, early 30s. I was at 1.330 pounds, just like all these things that were just kind of really weighing me down literally and figuratively. And so I had to really learn how to navigate anxiety, too, inside and outside of relationship. And so the whole notion of, like reframing, for example, like you said, really, really powerful thing to do.

It's super exciting to be able to sit there and be like, what else could I say as an explanation for this? And there's a level deeper than that, right? And a level deeper than that is to say that if I'm reframing, that I'm playing into this story, that there is a way that I can be enough by having a person or that I need to reframe not being enough by not having a person. And I want to go beyond that, right? Because if that's where I'm at, then I'm constantly having to reframe back.

and forth. Does that make sense? Like to have to do that, right? So, so there's a different way to approach anxiety. I don't know if you want me to kind of share how. Please. I think what's great about this is that you have so much, you have personal experience, which is invaluable. And like you said, we're not snowflakes. What we're experiencing this anxiety isn't super unique. So I would love to hear more about the anxiety and like let's dive into a little different sector. Yeah, 100%. Yeah, great. Okay. Awesome. So, you know, one of the big things here is that if you're somebody like me, and I don't know, I feel like you may be this way too and probably a lot of your audience.

We think that the way to solve things that are unsolved is through cognitive means, right? Like reframing, right? How do I get my mind to tell me the things that are not going to make me feel anxious? And unfortunately, the smarter you are, the harder it is to get through healing using cognitive ideas because your mind will always say, yeah, what about this?

No, no, but you don't know about this. No, but this happened too, and the mind will never let it go. And so the first thing is, what if we switched from living by narration to living more in sensation, right? Really being with what does anxiety feel like? Not what does anxiety say. We all know what anxiety says and it's really helpful, but what does anxiety feel like? And so one of the practices for me is when I'm getting really sped up and I'm feeling really anxious is I'll sit there and I'll close my eyes

and I'll just repeat to myself, sensation, not narration, sensation, not narration. And I can feel things in my body. And as soon as a thought comes up, I just remind myself, sensation, not narration. I'm not like, no, you shouldn't think that. Or let's reframe that to be something positive. It's just not, I really want to get back into the body and see if I can center and ground myself in this moment first. And then cognitive stuff is super helpful once you can ground yourself, but sometimes cognitive is not the place to start. I'm actually so fucking happy that you brought this up because that is my, so for years, I was in that same school of thought of like, I need to intellectualize. Let me talk my way out of this. And I think that talk therapy model for so long,

people, that's why I think it can get a certain amount done, but then we need to go under the hood. And for me, I can totally relate what changed the game for me was saying, wait a minute, instead of what's my mind saying, it's saying worse things than any other person on the planet can say about me. What I really started to focus on is like, where is this in my body? What am I feeling in my body? Where is this coming up? Is there a color or shape? Like, can I make this an external aspect of me. And then by doing that, then like you said, once that part is done and we've gotten in our body and we start to understand that, then I can start to say, well, okay, what's that narrative that was playing? So I, the guy didn't text me. Like, this is a huge one. Oh, the guy didn't

text me. So I knew he didn't like me. He must have found another girl. It's like, we'll come up with everything so that anxious brain can say, see, told you, they don't like you. Reaffirm a core belief. But instead, I started to sit with that feeling and then start to say, well, wait a minute, when do I remember feeling this? And it usually always led me back to, I was six years old and my dad was leaving, kind of same, like, always being, feeling that person was always going to leave. And then by doing that, I was able to be like, okay, cool, this is nothing to do with them. This is actually something that has to do with what's happening internally for me.

So that means that that's kind of the fun part. It's like, we have control over that. But I still think, like, reframing is one of my favorite exercises because I think what's so beautiful, obviously once we've, like you said, feel in your body. But I think what's so incredible about the reframe is like, if your mind can even entertain that thought, that's neuroplapelial. You're starting to expand the brain into a different direction. And I'd love to know, like, personally, too.

Like, you experience this anxiety. You were an anxious dater. What did you find helped you besides just the sensations, but really with reframing? Was there certain reframes that you had? Were you always just trying to figure out, you know, some type of maybe just like a different thought process? Like, let's talk a little bit about that because I think reframing is such an important aspect. But like you said, it can't just be forced.

Right. Exactly. 100%. So the first thing I want to do there is. I want to, and it's going to sound like a weird question. I was just a dinner with my girlfriend and her friend and the other night and we were talking about this. And she was saying something about how she has kind of this fear of committing for a few different reasons, right? And the, she was asking the question of like, yeah, but what if, what if I, what if I'm not happy in committing?

What if I'm settling? What of all these things, right? And the question I asked her was, who's asking that question? And she knows, I'm fucking asking the question. What do you mean? No, no, no, but which version of you is asking the question? Because if it's the version of you that believes that marriage equals settling and not having freedom in your life, then what do you think the answer to that question is going to be when you ask it to yourself, right? And so the question becomes, how do we upgrade that identity to ask the question from a more empowered place? Right? How do we ask the question from good with, good without, as opposed to, I need to find the exact perfect person or I'm never going to be happy?

And so that's a lot of the work that I do with myself and my clients. and this is not like a one and done thing. I do this with myself almost every day, is questioning who is the identity that's dealing with this thing right now? And so the practice that I have for myself is I have this thing, and I'll give you, oh, so the way we met was through our friend Chris Pan. And so I have my little, my intent bracelet that I wear. Yay!

As a matter of fact. And so I have my little bracelet, and this bracelet is to remind us of things. You can put whatever word you want on there to kind of remind you to anger you in. And so there's this practice I have that came out of one of my clients is somebody who was one of the female leads and one of the Batman movies. And so we were talking about identity and shifting identity.

And this idea came up that I shared with her and I said, okay, imagine that you are the director of Batman, right? You have now been cast as director. And we're going to say Michael Keaton is the Batman because I don't fuck with like Ben Affleck and Christian. Michael Keaton is Batman. There's nobody better, though. Let's be honest.

There's nobody better. Thank you. Now we can continue the conversation. Had you disconnected this call immediately. So you're directing. Batman's doing his thing. doing his Batman, karate chop, whatever the hell the Batman does. And then you yell cut.

You're getting ready to go to the next scene. You're talking to your crew. And you look over and you see Batman pacing back and forth in the set. And he's your star. You want to make sure he's okay, right? So you walk up and you go, hey, what's going on, man? You look stressed. And he goes, Sabrina, I don't know, man.

Like, what if I'm not powerful enough to beat the Joker? What if my, what if my tech is not strong enough? What if the people of Gotham die and then their blood's on my hands? How am I supposed to live with that? And you're look at him thinking like, what the fuck is he talking about? We're filming a movie, right? But you don't say that because you want to be supportive, right?

So you have two options now. Number one, you can say, okay, Batman, let's figure out how to make your tech strong enough for you to beat the Joker and save the people of Gotham. Or you can help him to see that he's Michael Keaton playing the role of Batman. And that Batman's problems don't have to have the same level of significance to Michael Keaton as they do to Batman. And so this bracelet that I wear says,

not Batman to remind myself, right, that at any given moment when I'm stressed or when I'm anxious, I am playing a role that I am confusing myself to actually be, right? If I am cast in a movie as a bank robber and I forget that when they yell cut that I'm not actually a bank robber, I'm going to kick in the door of my family home and wave a gun in my family's face. That's not okay for anybody, right? And so the practice for me is when I'm getting really sped up, I'm getting really anxious again, I close my eyes and I say, I'll say it out loud sometimes because it could be more powerful than saying it in my head. I will say, today I am playing the role of Jason, the super anxious dater,

who can't believe this chick has still not responded to my text three days later. And I can play that role every single day, Oscar award winning. I know exactly what he says, what he does, how he thinks about himself, how he thinks about everybody else. I know how to play that role perfectly. And then I say, okay, given that I know that's the role that I'm playing today, How does it feel right here, right now, in this moment, in my body, in this experience, without an attachment to that role.

Not saying the role doesn't exist. I'm not saying that there isn't a text that wasn't responded to. I'm not saying there isn't a relationship I'd like to create in some way. It's just right here right now without an attachment to that role. They've yelled cut. I've taken off whatever the costume is. I'm sitting back in my trailer, looking in the mirror at myself. How does it feel right here right now?

Does it feel more stressful? Does it feel more peaceful? How does it feel? And 100 times out of 100, I feel at least some sense of peace in that moment. And just like they tell you not to go grocery shopping when you're starving because you make stupid fucking decisions, I want to get back to this grounded place and then say, and then say, okay, what's my experience now of this person not texting me back? Oh, I'm realizing I really wanted them to like me.

And I'm realizing I felt a connection. And maybe they didn't feel the same connection I did. And I can see how that hurts. But that's a different experience than anxiety. 100%. And what you're described, like you're disregulated. When you're in that fear of they're going to leave me, da-da-da-da. And it's like, like you said, I love that question of what age is this, kind of like,

what version of you is this? Like, we're same, same but different to understand. It usually revolves for me. I'm like, I always see a child. I always see a kid because it's like the pinch has to match the outch. It's the amount that we're putting into this has to add up. So if you had one date with this person and they just didn't text you. And it's like, listen, to the adult, to the, if your friend, I was like,

if your friend came to you and said that, you'd be like, okay, hey, what are you going to do? You had one date, it didn't work out. But I think what ends up happening, similar to your analogy, is like so many of us put ourselves as the main character. And we are. I'm the main character of my movie. You're Batman and your movie. I'm Batman. Like, I'm the main actor.

But the reality is, I'm an extra in yours. You're an extra in mine. I'm an extra in all these people. And it doesn't mean that I disrespect the extras. But what that means is that they don't hold as much weight in my life as maybe my co-star. Like your girlfriend, my partner. That's now a co-star for me. And that's now somebody that's going to get more energy and more attention.

But it's like, I think there's this, there's that scarcity, that fear, that deep rooted. I don't know if you had ever experienced that in dating of the like, am I ever going to find anybody? Is this ever going to be? And it's like, I'd love to know kind of, is it the same practice that you have for that scarcity? Because I think that's a very like specific fear of just, you know, the sayings of like men ain't shit.

And I'm never going to find anybody. All girls are crazy. Everybody's going to do this, those sweeping generalizations. is there a way to really start to shift going from that scarcity? And like maybe it's even something as simple as like gratitude, but whatever the fuck it is, to be able to see things a little half full as opposed to half empty. Because I know for me, I was always used to the half empty because it kept me safe.

100%. Yeah. It's really, to me, it's a matter of what I was kind of, I just started briefly mentioning is this whole notion of good with, good without. Yeah. If your entire happiness stakes on you finding a person, you are screwed before you start, right? Because you're essentially saying, I'm coming from lack.

I am not complete without another person. And I get that it feels that way sometimes because we start projecting out. Then the time horizon stuff starts happening, right? So instead of it being a localized experience of, I am not in a relationship and I'd like to be in a relationship, and now gets expanded to, I'll never find anybody and I'll be alone for the rest of my life, right? And so while planning and visioning can be really helpful in some areas of life, it can be detrimental and others, right?

And so for me to be in the place of, and this is going to be in the place of, place of, and this is going to, some people are not going to be happy when I say this. I have to be in a place of if life never gets any better than this moment right now, can I be okay? And if the answer to that is no, you're not ready to be even dating at all, right? So get to the point first where if life did not get any better than it doesn't mean you don't strive for more. This is not about giving up and succumbing, but it's about saying if I can't love what

is, as Byron Katie, one of my mentors would say, if I can't love what is, I have, I have no possibility to create what's next. It's just not going to happen. And so there's a lot of different things you can do with that. One of the things that I try to do, and again, this is difficult, but the more you practice it, the more it works, is to not take things personally. And so one of the things I do all the time is I ask myself, and this is not just in dating, it's in everything, but especially in dating, if I knew this had nothing to do with me, how would I act in this moment? Yeah. And that's a hard pill to swallow because me, me, me, I, I, the ego, fucking, we're the center of the universe. Like you were saying, we think we're everybody's main character.

but what if I was certain this had nothing to do with me, how would I show up differently to this experience? I'm so glad you brought that up because it's like, it's funny, my mama has always said, you were good before them, you'll be good after. And I'll get people that'll go, but I wasn't good before them. I'm like, so then you'll be worse after.

I'm like, they're in addition to your life not instead of. And it's like, I don't love those sayings. Like, if you don't love yourself, no one can love you. It's like, no, no, no, no. People can still love me. It's just going to be hard for me to receive that love. What I do think is important is to your point is, you need to love yourself more than the need to be loved by other people.

Because if my main focus, and you know what, I'm not going to lie. When I first moved to L.A., that was my mindset of like, no, if they validate me, then I'll be okay. Like, I had complete limerance with somebody in our circle that I went on like two dates with. He didn't do anything. He was just like, he didn't do anything. That was the point. It was like he was kind of low effort. I created this entire validation by if he chose me, I was finally cool.

People would respect me. And it was this whole narrative that I, created as opposed to then understanding like I could if I'm going to create myself into a thousand different versions to have somebody like me if I don't stand for something I fall for everything. So then I'm just a chameleon. Then I would imagine too like that's how depression can start to set in when you're wearing all these different masks and you're not actually even being authentic to yourself and you self-abandon so heavily in order to connect with other people. It's literally like a fucking game over.

It is. And if it doesn't happen now, it'll happen five years from now. Like it'll just continue to compound until one day you just explode. And so I think it's, I think that's a really important thing. And I think it's also recognizing that what most of us are looking for in relationship is, well, security short to an extent, but intimacy, right? Intimacy is what we're looking for. And I think one of the things that worked for me. And of course, this is like super cliche and I never thought I'd be the one to say it,

but it happened. As soon as I stopped looking, that's when my girlfriend popped up, right? Yeah, exactly. And so, and it was funny because right before I had met her, I was doing the thing where I'm on the apps, off the apps, on the apps, all the things that we all do. And I had gotten in this place where I said, you know what, I'm done. I'm done being on the apps. I'm done like looking for a person.

But it was the first time it wasn't a defeatist, I'm done. Right? In the past, it was like, I'm fucking done. I'm sick of this shit. It sucks. It was fun. Like, you know what? I'm done searching.

I'm done forcing this thing. And if I'm meant to meet somebody, I will. But I'm okay. I'm good with, good without. Now, one of the ways I got to good with, good without is because I asked myself that question about, okay, what are you looking for in a relationship that feels so. like that you were so in need of and it was intimacy it was connection yeah I started asking myself well where else in my life can I feel into intimacy and

connection now it may not be sexual intimacy it not be it may not be all the different forms of intimacy you get with a partner but can I find that in other places and when I really allowed myself to receive a lot of the things I thought I could only get in partnership from like my community of friends I stopped feeling as needy for that connection and that intimacy with a romantic partner which I think also opened me up energetically to somebody coming into my world like my girlfriend. 100% because it's like, I know, I don't know about you, but like every time I talk to,

usually like more the avoidant kind of folk, the minute I'll be like, do you know if someone's anxious? They're like, but when you walk in the door, it's like, you're not hiding it. You're like, I can tell you're anxious. I can tell the anxiety. And it's like even my partner, he's like, I could see that you were. He was like, but you were super secure with me. And I was like, oh, no, no.

I had worked on it. Same to you. I used to hinge passively. I said, you know, somebody wants to match with me, sure. And he just stood out in a way where I was like, hey, fuck it. I'll give it a try, right? Release control to the outcome. I remember, we're the cliche, like, love story of 2023, like a very modern. We met on a dating app. We hooked up on the first date, and I left thinking I'll never see him again. And so it was like the very like, yeah, it wasn't this like,

oh, they met and like, no, this is very attainable to most people. And the reason it didn't, the reason it actually did work, kind of to your point was like, I released control to the outcome. I surrendered. I said, listen, I need to show up authentically as myself, because for so long I've been showing up for what these people want. And I don't even know what they're. they want. I can't keep up with it. So instead I'm going to show up as me and I'm going to welcome in the people as a projector that want to be in my life. But you said something earlier and I brain farted and then it came back because I think it's something really fucking important to hit on, not taking things personally. Those to me changed dating, not taking things personally and not

attaching to the outcome. And I actually had an experience. I was on live this morning and people ask hundreds of questions. I'm talking like hundreds at a time. So it's like obviously I have 500 people in the room. I can't answer every question. I'm talking, I'm going on. And somebody said, I don't understand. Why are you specifically ignoring my question? And I had to stop and I said, I'm going to bring out something to your point. I said, if this is how you act with everybody in your life, this potentially could be an area of opportunity for you to look at what's happening in your dating life.

I said, because you're taking this personally. I didn't answer your question because I, what, I don't like you? I said, let me ask you, do I know who you are? Is there any validity to this? Can we challenge this a bit? And people were like, oh, wow, like, that's a great thought. And it's like because we're so used to, you know, you go on a date, you think you have a great time. You don't hear from this person again.

And to the, you know, the more secure person, it's, you know, what are you going to do, right? They didn't like me. It's okay. I'm not going to. But to some people, they take it so personally of like, I knew it must have been because of this. It must be because of this. And I'd love to know, like, how did you start to separate that taking things personally

because I actually think this is going to be really helpful for people to be able to, like, for me, it was even just adding a contrary thought of like, maybe this person doesn't like brunettes. Or maybe this person doesn't have the same religious background or political of view. Or I had one guy when I asked him, he said, I don't have the same sexuality as you. He was like, I don't need to have sex very often. It sounds like you do. I don't think we're compatible. I could have created a narrative.

But I'd love to hear anything that you can, anything's like tips or things that people can help when we're trying not to take it so goddamn fucking personally. Yeah. Yeah. It's really interesting. So what I think we do is there's a level of arrogance here. And I mean this very lovingly, but there's a level of arrogance here that I saw in myself a lot. was that it's not only, there's the whole thing about, like, you know, if somebody cuts you off the traffic and say, oh, but what if they were racing to take

their wife to the hospital? And then, like, you know, so that's, that is, how do I reframe in the snapshot of a moment and time of life to get a different perspective? Totally valid. And I want to expand that even further. So it could be that you went on the first date with somebody and the way you have your hair parted reminds them of a woman who treated them terribly in middle school. And they don't even know it, but there's something about you now that they don't like.

Okay? So now let's say it's literally you. They did not want to go any further with you because of you, because of the way your hair is parted. I am arrogant to think that it's actually because it's the way my hair is parted, because I now negate the 25 or 35 or 45 or however many years they brought with them into this. So let me say that, yeah, let's say there's something about me they didn't like. I am arrogant to think that I am the first experience ever of them not liking that thing. and that's why they did not choose me.

Everybody has preferences that predate anything I could possibly think of. And so I have to remember that. People are bringing in all of their preferences, all of their traumas, all of their desires, all of their irks, all of their everything, into this experience. And if there's anything about me that might trigger something about that in them, that is their shit literally. This is not like a bypassing like, don't worry, girl, it's their shit. It's literally their shit being brought in. And for me to take that personally is ridiculous.

She knows. How? Did you blam? No. The Devil Wears Prada 2. He's the movie event 20 years in the making. Honestly, can't with the secrets anymore, so I think we just should tell her. Will you two please spit it out already?

This Friday, be the first to experience it only in theaters. In light of the recent scandal, I'm here to restore your credibility. Oh, because we're a team now. That's a nice story. The Devil Wears Prada 2 in Theaters Friday. And I love that because it's so funny. actually did date a guy that stopped dating a girl because of the way she parted her hair. Not even kidding. And I remember, and he was, he was the, and like, I remember when we, when it

ended, I wasn't even as upset because I knew that these were his limitations. Like, I knew that he was fearful dismissive. Like he wanted the love. He didn't. He was, it was the worst fucking experience I had. It was so push-pull. And there was so much of this volatility back and forth. And I was just like, I can't handle this. But instead of attacking myself, what I had to look at was also, taking accountability in a different way and not like in a bad way where I was like, okay, so I showed up authentically, I showed up with a lot of depth. I may have scared this person because they don't, that's, that's a lot to them. Like they know this guy had been single for like eight, nine years, like one of those

super attractive guys in his 30 that you're like, there's a lot of fear. There's shit that's holding you back from really connecting with people. Now, most people would take that personally, I must not have been good enough. And if I were good enough, then he would have like the whole if he wanted to, he would. And I fucking hate that saying. because what that's taking away is like, I now look, guy has been single for the last two years since we met. Like, still single, only has his little month or two monthers.

I don't think he's a bad person. But what I could do was I could remove myself from the situation to say, maybe my intensity of what I bring to the table, like, and not in like a cheesy high value type bullshit thing, but literally, like maybe the type of relationship I want and the kind of communication that I bring, maybe to that person, that triggered him. That made him uncomfortable.

Now, is that still something? about me. Yeah, but I'm not embarrassed about that. I'm not going to be ashamed to say, you know, the big say of like, oh, if I say something, I'm going to scare them off. And it's like, are you kidding me? I'll hold the door open for them to make sure that they get the fuck out and safely. Because I think taking it personally, what I kind of equate to is like, those are your core beliefs. And you're now trying to reaffirm those core beliefs by picking out. Because I go on one date. I spend all of two hours with somebody, unless I'm literally fucking and trauma dumping all over them and like sharing my life story and crying about my ex and

telling them about my daddy issues, anything short of that, maybe that person just doesn't want a relationship, doesn't want one in the way that you do. There are so many other aspects of things. And so I think being able to even just entertain another thought of like, maybe this guy just wasn't picking up what I'm putting down. Yeah. And that's okay. There are preferences.

Everybody has preferences for something. I mean, I have preference for like how spicy I want my food. Of course I have fucking preferences for who I'm in a date or who. who I'm going to marry or anything else, right? And so just like noticing, like there's a difference between somebody not being into you because they have a preference and somebody not being into you because you're not enough, right? And it's like, I apologize to cut you off.

Let's go more into that because even the not enough thing, once I started to really think about it, I'm going to ask you a question. Every girl you've ever dated. Anybody, we're talking every, every girl. Have you ever left going, she's not enough for me? Nah, she's not deserving of my love. You know what I mean? And like, that is such an, to this, like, maybe too needy.

I think that one I could see people saying because that could be like a yikes. But like really, that not enough or I'm not this. That to me, like that sounds like a core belief. 100%. Yeah. And that's the thing, like we were talking about before. That exists before you go out dating, right? There's nobody who's like, I'm 100% enough except when it comes to relationships.

Right. Nobody has that. Either you kind of feel it full stop, I'm not enough and it shows up in all these different areas or you have a level of security. Now, having a level of security doesn't mean you don't have insecurities. It doesn't mean you don't still hope that you look nice on the date or hope that, you know, the person enjoys your company or whatever. That's fine.

That's just kind of normal human interaction stuff. But to have that be some kind of a measurement of your worth as a human, right? There was a woman I was friends with who since passed. It was a coach named Michelle Bauman. And she used to say your self-worth is not on a dimmer switch, right? So it can't be moved up. It can't be moved down no matter what anybody does. You're not more complete because you found somebody who,

loves you, you're not less complete because you haven't. You're already complete. I know it sounds cliche, Southern California, but third eye, chakra opening, bullshit. But it's true. Like, you, you were enough when you came out of the womb and it was believing your own thoughts and believing your own limitations that has now put you into a place where you're trying to catch up and pass a test that doesn't exist. I love that. And I was, I'm like, where'd you learn this from? Because we all learned it, like you said, you came out having the situation with your family. And so you learned certain things. Now, that's kind of the beauty of kind of doing all this work that we talk about is that all of this can be changed. You know what? Can't be changed? Personality disorders. Like, okay,

so if you're like a, if you have a, if you're an npd, if you're a narcissistic personality disorder, you are diagnosed by a therapist or, you know, you have all the traits. Yeah, you know what? That probably more often than not is not going to be something that's going to be able to be changed because those people aren't going to be seeking the help because they don't even see a problem. You're bipolar, things like that. That's a personality disorder. That's chemical, whatever. that requires a different set of tools. But if you're just having some fucking attachment issues, you're having mindset stuff,

that's the beauty of it. It's like neuroplasticity is a very real thing. And I'd actually love to talk a little bit more, not like I need you to give me fucking science on the neuroplasticity, but really like, is there a thing of like how, I know it's like you have to do something for 40 days and you create a habit. But like for the folks out there that are feeling discouraged and like, I don't, you know,

wanting to like work on their self-esteem and things, is there like a case? of, you know, if you do this, like do it every day or every week or things like that with neuroplasticity, if you have any, like, kind of thoughts on that? Yeah, I mean, this should be, it's not even like a monthly, weekly, or daily thing. This is a moment-by-moment thing, right? Oh, I love that. And so one of the big things here, one of the core things to understand about our experience

of life, right, anxiety, depression, whatever it is, is that our, the extent to which we are resistant to the experience we're having is the extent to which we will experience it negatively, right? So the acceptance of a negative experience is actually a positive experience. And the rejection of a positive experience is a negative experience. So if I were to say right now, here's $100,000, you'd probably say, oh my God, that's amazing. I'm so happy. The only reason you're happy is because you said yes to the $100,000. If I went to give it to you and you go, no, I hate money. Now all of a sudden you're having a negative experience of this positive thing because you resisted it, right? So the resistance works both ways. And so the kind of the analogy that I

used that I just popped in my head one day when I was sitting in my dentist office was there, I was sitting in the dentist office. There's like these two kids running around going crazy, making the mom wish she had had birth control. And I'm like, I'm waiting there a half an hour past my time. And there's somebody coughing like in my general direction just over and over. And this wasn't even a COVID thing. It's just a hygiene thing. And it's just, I'm just, just my entire life. I'm just like, this is ridiculous. All of this is wrong. Like this sucks. And then I had this image that popped in my head of and I sort of feeling like stressed out. Like it's funny now, like I was feeling stressed out in the moment. And I pictured me sitting.

sitting in like a security control room for this dentist office and I'm watching everything that's happening on video, right? I can name everything that's happening. There's kids running around being rambunctious and there's a guy coughing his ass off and there's people who are queuing up because it's taking forever to get to their appointment. I can see all this stuff. But there's no resistance to what I'm seeing, right? I'm not negotiating with my experience.

I'm not yelling at the screen telling the kids to stop running around doing whatever because it's ridiculous. Why would I yell at a screen? Like they can't hear me. As soon as I can sit there and be an acceptance of all the things I'm saying, I don't negotiate with my experience. When I'm in my living room, my couch doesn't negotiate the experience of me walking into the room. It doesn't say, I'm not sure if I want you to come and sit on the couch. It says, yeah, okay, you're going to sit on the couch.

That's what you're going to do. You're going to sit on the couch. And so understanding that I can be in this place of not resisting the experience I'm having, when the anxiety comes up or the fear comes up or the abandonment issues come up, whatever it is that comes up, I can sit there and just say, can I allow this part to be here right now? Can I welcome that part in? Not even just like, can I allow it? Can I, hey, come in and have a drink.

Like, stay as long as you want. Who told you you had to leave? Who told you weren't welcome here? You're 100% welcome here. And then people say, oh, no, but if I do that, that I'm welcoming in the bad and I'm going to manifest even more bad. That's bullshit. Stop watching the secret.

So this is the time. This is the time to really understand if we can stop being in resistance to our experience, and we can welcome that in as counterintuitive as a, it sounds, it's actually less dangerous when you pull it close to you than when you try to push it away from you. Oh, I again, so happy you fucking said this. I could not agree more. I actually had an experience where I was, when I was met my partner, I was dating another guy. And my partner at first, he was just really hard to get to know. So he was just very closed off. And so I was just kind of date after date, I kind of just kept being like, why am I doing this? Like, oh, he's nice, but like not really

giving it, you know, being anxious and being the like, I want the immediacy. And then I had the guy that was everything I'd wanted on paper. Sure enough, and within a week, my partner ended up being everything I actually wanted on paper. I found out later, obviously, now I'm with him. And the other guy ended up being the typical guy that I kept going for. And for so long, I kept guilting myself with like, stop thinking about him. Why are you doing this? That resistance to this experience.

Until one day I called my mom and I was like, I can't get this guy out of my fucking head. And she started and she goes, fine, then let it. And I was like, what? And I was like, you know what you're right? And I allowed it. Every time he would come up, I didn't look at my partner being like, ew, I'm disgusted. No, of course, I love my partner. I think he's attractive. But when I would have the thought of the other guy, I would just be like, okay, I honor this. You're welcome to

stay as long as you want. I'm not going to attach to this. I'm not going to create a narrative about it, but I'm going to make space. Sure enough, after doing that for like a month, I stopped thinking about him. I stopped mulling on it. Then I saw him on social. You know, he watched something. And my heart like, you know, you get that little flutter when you see their name. But I remember just being like anyways and going on with my day and not even thinking about that. And I think that's such a beautiful, like, practice to be able to learn how to just accept it, to receive it to, you know, if you're going through a breakup or if you're, if you're bummed, instead of fighting it, just allow yourself and be like, okay, I'm feeling sad. That way I can actually grow a resistance

around the feelings like, fucking ice bats. I hate them. But every time I did it, I was like, Sprint, it's not that fucking bad. You're making this so much worse than it has to be versus just getting in the goddamn tub and being like, all right, now you feel better. Yeah. Yeah. And There's a surrendering to that, right? There's a surrendering. And again, it's really important to recognize, because what I love about you and what you do here is you're empowering people to actually take control

of their experience and not be, have it all out there, right? And so there's, there's, you know, it is a practice, but it's something that you have full control over, right? You can actually step into this and say, I surrender, but I surrender doesn't mean I give up. Surrender doesn't mean I succumbed everything. Surrender means I'm not going to argue with this current experience because if I wake up every morning

and I'm given like 10 tokens in my, my hand. And each one of those tokens can be used for some kind of emotion or some kind of experience. And I use nine of those 10 tokens to resist this experience of sadness I have. And then I wonder why I don't have energy to create or to be on purpose or to go spend time with my friends or to go do things in the community or just to hang out and do whatever I want. Well, that's why, because I've wasted all the tokens, right? So if I can just surrender to this experience, then I get to recoup all my tokens and I can actually live the life I want to live. And what you said, too, about seeing their name and still having the flutter, the misconception that you get rid of your

triggers is also bullshit to me. It's how do you respond when the triggers come up? How long is that window, right? Where the first time, when you first happened, his name would come up, it would be like a day or two days where you're just like thinking about the nonstop to the point where you see the name, like, oh, man, that's okay. And that happens maybe in a minute. And that's transformation, right? So get rid of the notion you have to like heal all of your triggers to be in a relationship or like you were saying really, you have to fully love yourself before you can be loved by anybody else. All that stuff is just horseshit

that works really well for Instagram tiles. But when your real experience of life looks like is, I'm going to surrender to what this experience is because I'm not the first person to experience it. Everybody has experienced it. And your track record shows you as a human. There is nothing you've been through that you haven't gotten through

because you are here right now listening to us talk on this podcast. So the evidence shows you that you're pretty good. You're pretty fucking resilient, no matter what the level of crisis is. So just remember that. Jeff versus Taco Truck Salsa, whether it's Verde, Roja, or the orange one. For Jeff, trying any salsa is like playing Russian roulette with a flamethrower.

Luckily, Jeff saved with Amazon and stocked up on antacids, ginger tea, and milk. Haboniero? More like habanier, yes. Save the everyday with Amazon. 100%. I love that. And it's like, because, I mean, I know, like, you also experience, I'm sure, a big change. Like, your partner was long distance.

And so, like, that, I mean, I know for me, like, even just having somebody, even just challenging through differences. And like you said, it's like, you will, I'm so tired of the 140 characters or less bullshit of like, that's why I hate those. You'll know, you know when you know. You're like, no, I didn't fucking know, okay? I didn't know. It wasn't like I was sitting at dinner and all of a sudden I had this epiphany of like, this is my person. It's not clueless of I love Josh. Like, no, we didn't go there.

You know, I didn't. If you wanted to, he would. Well, is it want? You know what I mean? Like, I think we are so muddied right now with these sweeping generalizations. Like you said, it looks great on an Instagram post. But then in practicality, people feel so frustrated of, well, why am I not feeling better? And it's like, well, because if you listen to that, if you chalk up human behavior, psychology, our mental state traumas, all to three words or anything, it's like, I mean, it's like everything happening in the world. It's like the same thing. Stop listening to slogan. start actually looking under the hood, start educating yourself on what's happening with you, what's coming up with you, how can you investigate and get curious?

But I am curious about your relationship. So I know that you were like not expecting to meet her. She's long distance. What did that look like to? Because it's like you said, you're going to be triggered. I'm triggered in my relationship more than I probably was single, to be honest, because single was the same triggers like over and over. In a relationship, all of a sudden you're like, out, out, wait, why is this?

happening to me. One, when you guys met long distance, I have to ask, did you text every single day consistently because you were long distance or were you guys like FaceTiming and calls and visits? Because I think that's a big misconception. People think because they're long distance, they have to be on their phone all the time with each other. But really, how were you able to push through your anxieties? Knowing someone was long distance, what did that look like for you to kind of surrender? 100%. Yeah, it's been a year and a half and it's been some of the most transformative growth in my entire life. And I'm in my early 40s, so I've gone through some growth. But this one has been really, really big. And I think long distance was a part of that. And we met at a mutual friend's

birthday party in Turkey last summer. And then, like, we had known of each other, but we had never actually met. And it just, it kind of clicked in. And it was funny, too, because it also wasn't like the fireworks thing. It was the more feeling of like home. Like, I felt like I had known this person for a long time. It felt like home. And so, it was all fun. And we're, you know, we're all hanging out together for, we were together for a week, like this whole group and everything, which is great. But then, you know, she's going to go back to the UK. I'm going to go back to L.A. What do we do from here?

And so I did kind of call an audible, and she was actually going to Berlin for a few days. And so I was like, I'm going to come to Berlin and to you. And so I just continued the thing. But then we went back to kind of our lives, you know, in general, our normal, our new normal. And it had to be a conversation. Like, what is it that you need to feel connected? We're going to have an ocean between us. We have an eight-hour time difference.

We are going to have to make some sacrifices that should not. feel like sacrifices in order to connect, right? And so for us, we did have a really good cadence. Luckily, I wake up really early in the morning. So when I wake up at 5.30 or six, and it's, you know, the early afternoon for her, I would FaceTime her in the morning so we could chat. And then when my lunchtime would happen, it was kind of her dinner time, and we would chat again. And then we may check in before bed, but then, you know, she's going to go to bed because we had the eight hour time difference. And so for me, and this was from me, I need to see my partner's face, especially if we're going to be long distance. And so I prefer FaceTime over, let's say,

just phone calls. And she was like, cool, I'm down for that. And she liked to be able to text me and get a response for me. And so I wasn't sitting there on my phone all the time. She knows that I'm busy running a business. But whenever I had a few minutes, I would check in because it's easy to do that. I can just send a quick message, right? So for us, and I think it was for me, as much as it was for her, I wanted to have a much more regular cadence of connection. And then what we did was is we made this vow to each other that basically every four to six weeks, we'd see each other somewhere. Now, of course, you have to have the ability to do that. I get that that's not available for everybody. But even without that, the intentionality that

we put into connecting when we were apart and being able to argue when we were apart, which was really hard. And not being able to touch your person and hug them after an argument is really fucking hard. Like there's so many things. But it forces you to emotionally really connect at a level of vulnerability and truth and intentionality that you may not have to do if the person live five minutes away. So when I hear people say, you know, oh, you know, we were joking about this earlier. Oh, I live in Venice. They live in West Hollywood. It's so far away. And for those of you don't live here, it's like a 20-minute drive, but may as well be Egypt to people that live in one or the other. It's possible no matter where you live. Does it take extra work? Falk, yes, it does. Is it take you

really communicating with your partner? Well, 100%, but it's totally doable. What is the biggest key takeaway I had to willing participants that were putting in the work and the effort and the intentionality? That is the biggest thing. Because that's again, going back to like, I think a lot of people that are dealing with the long distance stuff is, like, you had a different circumstance. You actually met this person. Like, that to me, like, I've had that where like I met people in LA that we're visiting, but then we pursue it and we kind of see if we could do it. And then you kind of realize, you know, one person's super into it. The other's not that into it.

And so then you kind of, it runs its course very quickly. But I think so many people get a narrowed with like matching online distance. And then it's chatty, chatty, chaty, chaty. And then maybe they'll see each other once. And then it's like eight weeks that'll go by before they're even. seeing each other again, but they're texting every day, but this person's not. And it gets so muddy where I'm like, what's missing here is communicate with the person. Hey, I would like a relationship. What does that look like to you? What does that look like to me? Like we're a long distance.

How are we going to do this? Do you have the means? Do you have the resources? Do you have the money? Do you have the time? If you're working three jobs and you've got two kids and you can't even find time to go to the grocery store, I would not suggest that you date somebody that lives far from you because then all you're doing is you're in a digital relationship, getting these quick little dopamine hits to make sure that someone still cares about you, as opposed to you and your partner building an authentic connection, even though you had distance? 100%. How was your anxiety through that, though?

Like, what were you, were you feeling that anxiety, or were you able to, like, kind of handle it? This is the first relationship that I've actually felt pretty secure in, which was really nice. And I attribute that a lot to how she shows up and the way that she communicates and everything else. But of course, I had to do my own work to show up in that way. And yeah, there were definitely moments where anxiety was triggered being so far apart, especially if there was like a misunderstanding. And then I go into my like childhood wounding of not doing it right or letting somebody down. And then again, you can't just like reach out and touch that person.

So it required for me to really check myself on the times that I was bringing kind of leaky, shitty, energy into a conversation. But yeah, it was, I had my anxious moments. And I think that one of the biggest things that helped me, and this is kind of a frame that I've used in our relationship ever since, was I can hold space so well for anybody, for going through anything at all, unless it's about me. And then the space holding becomes more difficult.

And so I noticed, you know, she reflected this to me that it felt like I would get really defensive when she would try to bring something up that wasn't working for her. And I knew that was the case. I just couldn't stop doing it. It was just like this natural thing that it's like, oh, mom's telling me it's not enough,

even though I'm doing everything I can to make her happy, this is happening again, right? And so really slowing that down, and I asked myself, kind of like we were talking about a bit earlier, I said, I'm going to listen to her as if she's talking about somebody else. Yeah. Right? Because I'm so good at listening to anybody else when they were talking about their issues and maybe they'd be talking about their partner that's doing or not doing a certain thing. And I'm fine, listening to that and reflecting and being empathetic and compassion and everything else, why can't I do that here? And as soon as I shifted to that, there were a few shifts that I had throughout the relationship, like anytime there was kind of a, you know, like a fight or

disagreement or an argument and then your mind starts going to places of like, well, I don't know if this is the right thing or is it the right thing and all these different things. I noticed that when I purposely shifted my mindset from finding things that were wrong to finding things that were right, that was a massive shift for me also, right? And so between me shifting to what's going right instead of what's going wrong and can I listen as if she's talking about somebody else instead of taking it personally that she's talking about me, those things made the experience of long distance so much more connected. And I think now that we're together in person, we're not long distance anymore, now that we're together in person,

it makes communication so much easier. I was going to say, you guys did such a hard part because, like, I don't know, am I the only one that watches 90 day fiance? We watch married to first side, but we have also watched 90 day fiance, yes. Fucking love 90 day fiance. And it's like, there are so many couples on there that you can see. It's like, one, you start to see that during, of course, during text, everything's amazing. That's what I'm trying to explain to people. Like, do you not think that someone texting or facetiming you is like, okay, it's fantasy. I'm sitting in my bed comfortably, not having a deal. I'm like, how does that person act like when they get angry?

What happens when like somebody fucks up their order at a restaurant? Like what happens if somebody cuts them off? Like you don't really see somebody. But what I love is that you guys got uncomfortable while you were in this and you didn't wait. Because like on 90 day fiancé, you'll see there's like one couple specifically. They were, it fucking freaked me out. They would FaceTime 24-7 because she didn't trust him. And he and everybody knew.

And then when he got there, all of a sudden, you know, now they're doing the tell all and what's coming out, that he's like super verbally abusive to her. That like when he gets triggered and angry, he explodes on her. She got pregnant. She's fucking stuck. She's so anxious now. And even people admitted they were like, you're both so trauma driven that it actually works. You're both so in your trauma that I wish that like what I want people understand is like,

it's okay to have uncomfortable conversations with your partner. Tech guy and I, that's what I call them. We have had so many uncomfortable conversations about like even what we've, talked about before we came on of like differences of understanding what's going on and opinions and things like that, that we've even stopped to be like, are we breaking up? Like, is this that moment? And then he'll be like, absolutely not. Let's talk more. And it's like, okay, we're both two people, I was anxious, he's avoiding, and coming in securely to say, we're a team. I'm not against you. You're not against me. We're a partnership and we're going to co-create together,

which means having really uncomfortable conversations. But I think that communication is, to me, also what can challenge your mindset of like, no, I'm too much, nobody will ever give me space. Then when you're actually able to talk to somebody and it's like, oh, wait, you hold space for me, you listen? Like, this is, you're not going to scream at me or tell me I'm being overdramatic. That right there could even be a contrary belief that next time you can say, well, wait a minute, I have actually expressed myself to somebody and they didn't yell at me. So that could mean that this person, maybe I'm just making an assumption on their ability to do so because I haven't opened up. Yeah. And so that's back to your point of the neuroplasticity, because every

time you experience that, you're now showing yourself, oh, well, maybe it can be safe. Even if it hasn't been safe in the past with certain people, maybe it can be safe with this person, but they have to have a chance. They have to be given a chance for it to be safe. And one of the practices that we were given that was really, really helpful was we would have this practice where it would be only one person is allowed to talk, and we basically have this thing where we're brought, oh, we go over the bridge. We walk over the bridge to join the other person.

We're invited over, right? So let's say my girlfriend invites me over the bridge into her world, right? And it's her own little world and she runs the world. and it's all about her and what she wants. So I come across the bridge and then she gets to say whatever she wants to say to me. And after she says, each thing she says to me, I respond very simply with reflecting back whatever it was that I think I heard and I say, you know, am I with you? And she says, yes, if I got it right, if I didn't get it right, then she'll say it again.

So we really make sure that I understand. And once there's an understanding where she says yes, that I'm really with her, then I say, tell me more. And those are the only things I'm allowed to say, reflection of what she said, am I with you and tell me more? And that goes on until she's done. And then if at that point there are things I want to share, then we'll swap. And now it'll be my turn to invite her over the bridge.

But sometimes it's really tough in those challenging conversations when both people have their own viewpoints, their own perspectives, to even be able to hear the other person. So if you can set up a container where you can really tell the person, listen, you are safe to be heard. It doesn't mean that while my girlfriend's talking inside my head, I'm not going, well, you've got to be fucking kidding me. But I can't engage with that, right? The mind's job is to run. My job is not to run after it, right?

So the mind can run, do whatever it does, but I'm going to stay here, I'm going to listen, I'm going to reflect. And then when it's my turn, I'll share what I need to share. But those kinds of uncomfortable, there are ways to create that container so it feels less uncomfortable. It's always going to be uncomfortable, but it's always worth it. God, I love this. Jason, thank you so much for, like, talk about bestowing wisdom.

This was so fucking informative. I love the other tangents that we went on that can help so many people. And I'm just so grateful for you sharing. Thank you so much for your vulnerability. Thank you. Thanks for having me on. And again, just the opportunity to hang out and chill and catch up is worth it for me anyways. I know.

Now, Jason, I'm going to link everything in the show notes, but where can people find you if they want to connect or talk? Yeah, you can find me at Arawan in Venice. If you know, you know, Balenciaga, really? I was just going to say, that's actually where we had our first lunch, where we went to Arawan and we hung at. When I saw the Balenciaga, I was like, L.A. has lost their fucking marbles. Okay, perfect. So, yeah, if you want to find Jason, just go to the Arawan in Venice. If you go to the third table in the back on the left-hand side, how sad that I know, you can find him there.

That is right. That is one place. Other place you can find me is on Instagram. I'm the Jason Goldberg. Jason Goldberg was taken, so I got the most pretentious name I could. So it's the Jason Goldberg. And I wrote a book called Prison Break. It's all about mindset.

And if you actually go to the jasongolberg. com slash do the work, you can get a free copy. So go ahead and check it out and hope you enjoy it. Oh my God. Okay. No, we're going to link that. And then is it on Amazon as well. But you don't have to buy it.

You can get a free one. Perfect, no, but I'll link it into the store anyways, just so the people can have it. Okay, perfect. This will all be in the show notes. I'm going to get my copy. I can't wait. And Jason, thank you again so much. You're so welcome.

So great to see you.