The School of Greatness - 149 AJ Hawk on Family, Hard Work, and the Heart of a Champion

Episode Date: March 11, 2015

"Whatever morals and standards I have in life, I want to take to the field." - AJ Hawk If you enjoyed this episode, check out show notes and more at www.lewishowes.com/149.

This is episode number 149 with NFL linebacker A.J. Hawk. Welcome to the School of Greatness. My name is Lewis Howes, former pro athlete turned lifestyle entrepreneur. And each week we bring you an inspiring person or message to help you discover how to unlock your inner greatness. Thanks for spending some time with me today. Now let the class begin. What is up, everyone?

Thank you so much for joining me today on the School of Greatness podcast. My name is Lewis Howes, and I'm very excited about today's guest. His name is Mr. A.J. Hawk. Now, A.J. and I met through Aubrey Marcus, who's been on the show and who's the sponsor here. And it's pretty cool how we got reconnected this way. And A.J. actually reached out to Aubrey and said, hey, I'd like to have Lewis on my podcast, on A.J. Hawk's podcast that he's got, which I'll link up here in the show notes. And I was recently on there, had a great time. But I said, listen, man, I would love to have you on my show.

You were actually, you know, someone I looked up to when I was playing college football. He was like the god at Ohio State at the time and was just dominating and an all-American top linebacker in the country, first round draft pick. And he's just been really inspiring to watch his career over the last nine, 10 years. So I said, we got to bring you on. really inspiring to watch his career over the last nine, 10 years. So I said, we got to bring you on, and I want to talk to you about what it's been like growing up, your mindsets, how you trained as a kid, how you got into Ohio State, the journey in the NFL, and now the transition to what's next.

So I'm excited to bring him on. Without further ado, let's go ahead and dive into this episode with the one and only Mr. A.J. Hawk. Welcome back, everyone, to the School of Greatness podcast. We have a legend on today. His name is Mr. A.J. Hawk. What's up, A.J.? What's up, Lewis?

Good to be here. I love your energy in your intro, man. It makes me just, yeah, gosh, I can't match your energy and passion, but I love it. Big fan of yours. Thanks, man. I'm honestly really grateful and blessed to be having this conversation with you right now for a couple of reasons. And I actually just got off your podcast, The Hawk Cast, which I'm going to have it

linked up here below on the show notes. I'll put the link to the video for that one and to your website. But I'm actually really honored to be talking with you. And it's a true privilege and pleasure of mine to be able to interview you because, you know, 10, 12 years ago, you were someone that I really looked up to. And we were graduating the same time in college. And I remember watching your games. I would watch highlights from Ohio State football because I was playing at a capital just a couple miles away from you. And I would go to games on our bi-weeks and I would watch on TV at your night games when I was playing during the day.

And I was so inspired by who you were and your way of being and like your passion and your energy that you brought to the field I was like man this guy's incredible and it's been fun to watch you now I think nine or ten years in the NFL fifth round fifth pick I believe overall in the first round of the draft in 2005 I think that was and we uh you know this is actually our first time talking, but we met 10 years ago. We did. Pro day, Lewis.

Pro day. Pro day. You just snagging balls left and right out of the air. Probably, well, Troy. Did Troy Smith throw too? He wasn't done yet. He redshirted. He was in my class, but he probably threw to the guys.

Who was it? It was another guy. Who was the backup? Was it Zwick? Yes. It was Zwick? Okay. It was Zwick? Okay. Zwick was throwing and it was me, Santerio Holmes, and then the tight end at the time. I forget

his name. It was probably Hamby. Ryan Hamby. Yes. That was him. It was us three running routes. Here's what I remember of you. I remember walking into that I don't remember what that place is called. Woody Hayes Athletics Center. Woody Hayes. The indoor facility. It's like this incredible I don't know what that place is called. Woody Hayes Athletic Center. Woody Hayes. Yeah, the indoor facility.

It's like this incredible, I don't know, $50 million facility or something crazy probably. But a huge full football field in there. I was so intimidated walking into this place because it was like first off, you dream of being there as a kid. And then there's like 10 head coaches from the NFL and like 300 scouts or something on the sidelines and the whole Ohio State football team. And all you guys are there. There's like five first-round picks that year, I think, from Ohio State. And then it was me and like a couple other D2 guys or something. And I was so out of place, so intimidated. And it was just so inspiring to watch how you guys did everything.

And it was crazy. Well, I think it was kind of – it's intimidating for everybody, not just you. Obviously, you being an outsider coming into that, that had to be really weird. That had to be really tough because I remember just how awkward it was. Like getting ready in the locker room and you come out just to like go through some drills and run a 40 and do little drills and bench press. And it's like you walk out and there's just all these older dudes standing there. Stopwatches.

Yeah. And just judging you. And you're thinking like at the time, all right, if I drop one ball, I'm done. They're going to, I'm not,

I'm never going to play football again. They'll never take me and things like that. So it was, it was a weird experience for everybody. Did you really feel that though? I mean, you were, I think two time all American in college and you were the best linebacker that year in college did you feel like any doubts like if i

mess this up i'm not gonna get drafted i don't i didn't have like doubts about myself or any kind of like thing like that but i definitely i think it was a good thing i think back now it was a good thing that i was so young and stupid and didn't even have like the I didn't have yeah like I didn't have the the brain to really think about consequences or think about what was coming in the future I was like yeah I want to go hopefully I run fast today and I I looked at it more just like as a a competition like all right let's do it man I'm excited to get out there and catch every ball but I don't think I thought like oh oh, if I drop a ball, I'm going to not get drafted. But I definitely thought like every single little thing is being nitpicked here. I knew all these old coaches in there were going

to be sitting there kind of nitpicking, going over every single little thing that we do. And not only what we did as far as the drills and our time, but I know they were watching us to see how we kind of interact with the other players, how you interact with coaches and what you do. When I look back now, I think more of that. But at the time, I wasn't really thinking too much of that. But I was like, well, I'll go out there, whatever, be myself and see what happens.

Hopefully run a fast 40. What did you run that day? Well, people get mad ohio state supposedly had like they're all you guys run it downhill 38 and a half yards people always say that because we'd run fast i mean that's the other weird thing at pro days you would you never would get like one official time because every coach thinks that they're the guru of the stopwatch and they all have their time so i had anywhere from like a a mid 4-4 to like a 4-6 basically that day. I remember, man, I went to Houston, Texas

and trained for like two months prior to that at a specific facility with like a lot of NFL prospects and did the whole training thing. And I remember like being – I got my bench up to like 15 reps of 225 for me, which was pretty good because before I can only do like seven, two months prior. And I like got so lean and fast. I was just like a training machine for two months doing everything to prepare for that

one moment. And I remember having everything ready to go when I got there and I was like, okay, cool. I got my cleats. I got the shoes to jump with and everything. And I'm ready to go for the 40. And they're like,'re gonna do it over on this astro turf and i was and all you guys had freaking spikes on like track spikes and i was like no i was so sad because i knew my 40 was my weakest thing i had like these slippery tennis shoes that i had to run on you should have asked

one of us man we would let you wear some of the little our little track shoe things we had bought because i think a couple other guys had had uh their shoes either like ripped or something happened and we we would let guys borrow man you should have asked me oh i was so intimidated i was like just trying to like not get in the way of anyone you know dang it i wish i would have asked now 10 years ago you'd still be playing maybe i'd be playing maybe i would be doing this podcast with you right now i should have i should have looked out i should have saw saw a brother in need thanks for looking out damn i'm sorry about that and i think i ran like a four seven something like and it was just i couldn't get that first step i had no grip and i remember just being like i blew it um and but it

came down then i got to the last moment where i got to run the routes it was me and santonio and we talked about this before but santonio was like falling and dropping balls and i was catching everything and looking clean and i will never forget the giants uh assistant coach i don't know his name he came up to me afterwards he goes i don't know who you are where you came from but you looked a hell of a lot better than santonio out here today and i hope you get picked up and i was like for me that was like oh my god from coming from a d3 school i was like wow that had to feel that had to feel pretty good it was like it was like it just confirmed like even if i don't play in the nfl like i knew i could play with these guys like

maybe they're better than me but i could i could be in a game and be effective you know i'm not the fastest biggest but it was like all right i got here i I'm not the fastest, biggest, but I was like, all right. I got here. I made it to the Ohio State Pro Day. It was a fun experience. But you're an athlete and you're a football player, man. That trumps everything when you get out on the field. Exactly. And I knew I was not good at the 40 speed,

but it's like throw a ball from the air with three guys on me and I'm going to catch it. That was it. So it's all good. I'm very grateful for where I'm at now. And it's been incredible. I'm, I'm very grateful for where I'm at now. And, and it was, it's been incredible to watch your career. And, um, what I'm curious about, since we talked about the pro day, what's the biggest thing you learned about yourself from that moment? I'm always curious

about what people learn about themselves from big moments. And that you could argue was a deciding big moment, um, test to determine where you would end up, some might say. And what did you learn about yourself through that process? Well, it definitely was like a learning moment. I've never really thought like that. That's why you're great at this, man. That's why so many people listen because you come up,

those are questions that you ask guys. And I would say looking back now i learned that like when when the pressure was on and and you should have nerves and anxiety and all this stuff that i could i think that was just one a big step like a big notch in my own brain that i could i can handle this you know because going into it you i probably two weeks before that I was at the combine, and there's a big, like, they make a big stink out of if you're going to run your 40 at the combine. Like, are you going to run here or are you going to wait for your pro day? And like I said, I'm glad that I was dumb, and I was like, I'm running both.

What do you mean? Why wouldn't I run at both places? And so I ran to the combine. I wasn't very happy with my time. And so I was like, of course I'm running my 40 again at Ohio State. But we did like 10 minutes of individual drills that day. I remember that. You and Bobby Carpenter, right?

Yeah, and Anthony Schlegel. So just us three and a linebacker coach. I think he was from the Bengals at the time. It's just putting us through the paces. You guys were sweating. Boom, boom, boom, boom. Oh, yeah, it's 10 minutes straight, and the whole time I was like, all right, I can do anything for 10 minutes.

And so we're just all balls to the walls, you know, thinking that every single step we take is going to be a, you know, we're going to slide in the draft or whatever. And I realized when it was all done, it felt so good. I remember we went out maybe that weekend. My brother-in-law, Brady Quinn, came in. He was still at Notre Dame playing football there, and him and his buddies came in town for something,

and we all went out together. And it just felt good to have that over with and thinking, all right, well, this garbage is out of the way. Now I can play football again, hopefully, with whoever gives me a chance and whoever drafts me. So it was almost like, you know, hopefully there's no moment too big. Hopefully there's no, uh, any kind of pressure. I think that, that especially athletes have you put on yourself and that's my wife and I joke about it. She's like the most competitive person on the

planet. She'll, I tell people she's in a pickup soccer game. She's getting in fights with girls and stuff. And you better say you better, you better kill her because she's going to come back and get you in your sleep. She's not, she wakes up from her coma. She's coming after stuff. And you better – I said, you better kill her because she's going to come back and get you in your sleep. She's not – when she wakes up from her coma, she's coming after you. And I joke with her about that. And that's kind of – I hope the – I warned about myself just that I'm not going to quit. I'm not going to ever give in to any pressure. And sometimes it's easy to not give it 100%. I've learned that throughout being in the NFL that in your mind you can, like,

rationalize thinking, well, I didn't the NFL that in your mind, you can rationalize thinking, well, I wasn't trying anyway. They cut me, but I wasn't really trying. I don't ever want to be that guy. And I've seen it happen with people when they know something bad might happen, so they don't give it their all and they don't try 100%. And then you can rationalize it for the rest of your life when you go into something with that. Why do you think they do that? Is because they're afraid that they're going to fail giving 100%? Exactly. I think it's like a coping mechanism.

It's like a protection thing over themselves because I've had little, like, glimpses here and there of thinking, oh, that's stupid anyway. I don't care. I don't like pool anyway. Like if I get beat by my brother in a game of pool, I've had things like that. Luckily not with football. I've always felt like I need to give it everything I got because I wasn't born a freak like most of the guys I play with. So I have to work for it.

But, yeah, I think it's something when I've seen a couple guys that fall victim to that when they don't give it everything because they might have like an inkling that they might not make the team or they might not be around next year or they might not make the play or might not get off the bench. It's almost like they have this – sometimes they can fall into a trap of having like this attitude like, ah, whatever, man. It's whatever. I'll figure it out after this.

And so if they get cut or it doesn't work out, you can tell your buddies and tell your friends, oh, it's fine. I don't even like those guys. Right. Interesting. When was the moment you decided that you were going to be in the NFL? Like how old were you when you were like, you know what, this is what I want to do? I think from a young age, man, I mean, you know, probably first grade or before first grade. Wow, really?

Whatever that is, like six, seven, eight years old. I played football, baseball, and basketball my whole life. And basketball was my sport, to be honest. People don't believe me now. They didn't see me play. They didn't see me as just a meathead football guy. But I was point guard my whole life. Wow.

Grew up playing all that AAU basketball, travel, and all that. But it's pretty tough to get a scholarship in basketball you gotta score 100 points and be seven feet tall basically and so i i wasn't doing that so i knew football was my path but i knew football was going to be my path probably my freshman year in high school maybe um but i definitely didn't ever think of i didn't ever think of playing the nfl as a reality. I thought of it as like, nah. Again, it's almost like it's a good thing looking back now that I wasn't thinking that far ahead. I honestly was just there. I just went to school, found a way to get through school, graduate,

and find a way to get to practice. I had so much respect for my coaches and everything about the whole program in my high school and then college and the pros that I was just kind of there, I feel like. I never had the thing where I never went to college to go. You hear a lot of guys talking about, well, if you go to Ohio State or Alabama, your best chance of going to the league, go play in the NFL. I never had that going in.

But to play in the NFL, I honestly didn't think of it as a reality until probably after my junior year of college I think what I mean I wanted to you know it was always like a fantasy you know it's always like oh that'd be cool man but I would like when I was a kid I would see guys I would see like every once in a while you'd run into someone and you'd see like an old guy sitting there and someone would tell you, oh, hey, that guy played for the practice squad for the Browns for a year. And it was like this dude was Jesus to us. We just stare at him. I remember this, dude.

We stare and watch his every move. Exactly. We just stare at him sitting there drinking his Budweiser, probably smoking a cigarette. And so it was never like a thing that was actually there for me. It wasn't like, yeah, of course I'm going to go get drafted and play in the nfl that was a like a fantasy you know and i think it uh that helped me i think i'm glad now looking back because it's just so different now just with like recruiting and everything where people are gonna go they're gonna pick their college off of who's gonna get

them better give them the best chance to go to the nfl instead of picking a college because you love it and you want to be a part of a team and you want to win a national championship. And I've always kind of had the weird team mentality in my brain. I'm the youngest of three boys. I got beat up my whole life, man. So if I ever thought I was cool, don't worry. They kill me. That's good. They keep you grounded. When I was growing up, there were really two, I would say logos slash jerseys that I wanted to wear growing up, uh, when I was older. And that was Ohio state Jersey and a USA Jersey. I wanted to represent my country and go to the Olympics

and be an Olympian, but I also wanted to play football at Ohio State. And I've been super blessed and fortunate. After I got injured playing football, I said, listen, I'm still going to chase my dreams. And I picked up a new sport called team handball, which is an Olympic sport. And I've been fortunate enough to represent my country and play a sport all around the world with USA jersey on and sing the national anthem before international competition. I haven't played in the Olympics yet, but I've worn that jersey with USA. I'm curious to know what the feeling was like for you the first time you put on Ohio State jersey. Oh, it was nuts.

I was just freshly 18 years old. Got there. I went up the summer right after I graduated high school, and I would go to the summer workouts in June and July with the team. So I'm seeing these guys, Mike Doss, Donnie, Nicky, Matt Wilhelm, Craig Krenzel, all these dudes, and they're all huge celebrities to me. They're all like – I watched Sports Illustrated and stuff and ESPN, right? Yeah, like you know it's like i watch sports illustrated

and stuff and espn right yeah like i watch these guys like i watch tom cruise on the tv exactly so to see them and then i'm like oh man i'm like wearing the same workout gear as them i'm out here doing drills with them so all you're ever looking for is like a tiny little thing hey good job man or whatever you know they don't know your name they don't know anything i remember i got asked multiple times we had a lot of we had a stud recruiting class my freshman year we brought in four linebackers and so i was definitely the fourth on the list coming in and i remember i got asked by multiple current players on the team at the time like what what are you doing here you're not on scholarship are you like they would ask me why i was no way

yeah i'm in the main part of the locker room like well you are you on you got a full ride i'm like uh yeah yeah i think so i'm pretty sure so i saw that early but then that first game at home yeah are you kidding me just getting dressed like in the locker room so walking out of the tunnel it felt um definitely was uh you know the definition of like a surreal moment thinking uh all these people and you hear about it you know, the definition of like a surreal moment, thinking all these people and you hear about it, you know, over 100,000 people going crazy, cheering for you. Like I said, the guys that were next to me were all huge celebrities to me. Those were the guys that I never thought I'd be there. I couldn't believe it. And even though I just got done going through a training camp with them and battling through the summer heat all for a month but that first game was something uh it was just so weird like just just unbelievable they uh i got it was against texas tech i was playing special

teams and then backing up c grant unbelievable linebacker and a great guy too great great dude still still see him uh every once in a while he's a really good dude from day one he was so cool to me so i gave a lot of uh respect for him But we started – we were killing him, and they put us in – put some of us freshmen at the end. And Cliff Kingsbury was the quarterback for Texas Tech. And he was rolling out on our sideline, and it was going to, like, throw a ball. And he threw a ball away. He threw it just out of bounds way down the field.

And I just killed him with a forearm right in his chin. Like, I have a picture I think my dad has it somewhere where I just like fully launched into him in my right arm elbow I'm actually doing the move right now you can't see me it was up like aiming for his throat like going right after him I would have definitely been fined now ruthless in the NFL they'd find you they would probably flagged me now in college but they didn't have those rules. That was 2002. That felt so good to get that first big hit out of the way in the shoe. When it didn't matter. It was a quarterback falling out of bounds. It's not like I feel tough about it. Anytime you hit somebody, it feels good. When was the moment at Ohio State where you made a play that was so big

and you realized that you were such an integral part of the team? Maybe you've been making a bunch of plays and there was this one moment where you were like, whoa, okay, I've secured my starting spot. I'm now one of the leaders on the team. I now feel confident in my abilities, and I'm ready to take it to the next level. Ooh, another good one. Man. I like these questions.

You're making me think back on things that I've never really given a whole lot of thought. I don't know if there's exactly one play or one moment. Going into my sophomore year in training camp, like, I was, you know, pretty much pegged to be, you know, one of the starting linebackers of the three. But I think even before that, I kind of had moments where I knew, like, okay, I can do this. I belong and I feel good. We played that freshman year.

I mean, you talk about stepping into the right place at the right time. We went 14-0 and won the national championship. I remember this. Maurice Claret, man. Exactly. Me and Maurice were in the same class. We came in together. So it's like what an Claret, man. Exactly. Me and Maurice, we're in the same class. We came in together. So it's like what an unbelievable experience, man.

And I remember on the field after the game, like, yeah, let's do this every year, like talking to all the guys in the field. Why not? It's no big deal. Come back next year. But during that year, we played at Wisconsin, and C got hurt. He rolled his ankle pretty bad, and I played the whole second half. I think we won the game like 14-9 or one of those, you know,

just bruiser games, and their O-line was just monster, just coming out trying to maul me. And I'm all skinny and young trying to play with these grown men. But I got in there and got to make like a decent amount of tackles and got to chase the ball carrier down a few times and take on the center and, you know, headbutt multiple of these big linemen that to me were like old grizzly vet, you know, men. And I felt like a little boy. And I kind of could tell after getting some good shots in on guys, I'm like, all right, this is it. I'm cool. You know, I felt good about it. And then got to start, I think,

the next game. We played Penn State. I usually don't remember games like I'm remembering this, but my freshman year is pretty vivid for me. And I to start the game I got like a tipped interception you know one of those cheap ones and it felt good that was at home and it felt great and we won that game by a narrow margin and kept on rolling and C came back in the lineup and I just played sparingly throughout the rest of the year but I think I kind of had a couple moments my freshman year of it not to say that I was like a leader or anything then or anything. I just felt like I was confident. Yeah, I was confident.

Interesting. Man, there's so much I could talk about about the Ohio State stuff because I'm just a fan and curious about it in general, but what was the best Michigan moment? Oh, there's a lot of them. So I'm 3-1 against Michigan. Should have got that. We lost my sophomore year.

They had a really good team. My senior year, we went there to Michigan. Troy Smith had stepped in, been playing quarterback for most of the year for us. And we were down, had a crazy, unbelievable comeback, and beat them in their house senior year, and it kind of locked us into a bcs bowl and that's where we went and played in the fiesta bowl after that but being on their field after the game just felt great you know we uh there's like an iconic throw and catch from

troy smith to anthony gonzalez and he caught it like on their five yard line and then we ran the ball and you know the rest is history we won there wouldn't like one specific play or anything from the game but just the whole feeling afterwards my good buddy bobby carpenter got hurt in that game the first play first play james larnita steps in as a freshman and and played really well so and then just the locker room after that game was awesome eddie george was in the locker room and it's just like eddie was so pumped like just so excited i'm like why this is awesome why is eddie here why is he so excited and he was just like, Eddie was so pumped, like just so excited. I'm like, why? This is awesome. Why is Eddie here? Why is he so excited?

And he was just, he's such a, you know, it's true for Ohio State people. They understand. Eddie was just loving it, man. And just that whole feeling. I don't know if that ever even wore off. We kind of took that through our whole bowl practice in the next month and a half and went and won the Fiesta Bowl after that. That's awesome.

What are some of the rituals that you used in, and you knew this was coming because we talked about this on your episode, but what were some of the rituals that you applied to your training, both physically and mentally, in high school and then to college and then now into the pros?

On each season, let's say that high school is a season, college is a season, pro is a season, pro is a season. Which ones, talk about the different rituals and training physically and mentally, but also which ones have you kept along through the last 20 years and which, and other things, which have you picked up? Well, I've never been a big superstitious guy.

A lot of people are in sports. They're very superstitious, especially a sport like baseball. These guys have everything they've got to do before every single pitch comes to them. The batters are undoing their gloves and hitting their cleats. They've got 500 routines. I don't really have any specific superstitions where I have to do. A lot of players have things where they've got to wear a certain undershirt. They've got to tape their wrists certain ways I I don't have any of that um I would say

one of the things when I was younger like middle school high school I started you know it's Ohio man I started lifting weights in like sixth grade sixth grade I think exactly I guess I had two older brothers and they were both they played varsity football and I wanted to be them so I would wake up before school and go down in our scrubby little weight room in our basement and do lat pull downs you know so it was just one of those things uh but our school you would lift oh yeah you know like i thought you know i don't know i was such a like i talk about all the time such a meathead it's not like i'm not now i still claim i understand i'm not not big like a lot of these meathead guys are, Westside Barbell here in Columbus. They're crazy, man.

Yeah. Oh, yeah. But like rituals and stuff. So like every morning, did you have a ritual where you're like, I have to eat a certain way or I'm going to work? Did you run every morning? Did you lift every morning? After practice, were you watching game film?

Was there like something you were doing differently that other people weren't doing to help you get to where you are? I think starting at a young age when I was really young. Um, and then when I really amplified it was when I got into high school was like that, that morning stuff. For some reason I was big into the whole, I needed to get my workout in early and I felt it just something about it, like felt good in my brain that, you know, I school, I got to get my workout in early and I felt it just something about it like felt good in my brain that you know I school I got to get on the bus at 7 30 for school you know I'm going to be up at 5 40 I'm going to be down in the weight room and my dad my dad will come moseying down with his cup of coffee in our golden retriever you know when I'm 30 minutes in and super sweaty and doing leg

press and stuff down there so I thought that was like honestly my only ritual type thing that I felt like I had to do and it was that little thing where you're young and you feel really guilty if you would miss one for some reason. So like I remember just sometimes like, I don't care. It's going to happen regardless. I'm going to, I'm going to make it down there. I'm going to lift. I'd be like, you know, it's every once in a while you get the flu or you're super sick and I'm just like, find a way to get down there. Yeah. And I'm not doing any, like, I think I'm lifting and I'm just probably hurting, you know, definitely hurting myself.

But I think that's like my foundation because I watched my older brothers do that. And so I just wanted to be like them. And that's kind of something I've always felt like I need to, I've taken in the mornings. Uh, it depends. I mean,

most times it depends on like with the teams, when, when, when we're working out as a team, it depends. I always lifted the earliest group we have, and I always did that through college. But now, like off-season time when I work out, it depends.

It's not as much a morning thing because I have two kids, and I don't really – it's good for – I feel like it actually helps me to wake up and get them all situated and help my wife and do all that, and it's fun to drop them off at their little school or daycare they go to because they like give me power, man. It's weird. It's a weird thing. I know you don't, you don't have, you don't have any kids, but I've joked about it. Like every kid I have, I feel like I'm getting stronger. I've joked with, I've joked with the people in the media in green Bay before.

Like I was like, I guess I'm trying to get some of that dad strength. You know, you see these guys, man strength, man. Yeah. People have this old man, these big old forearms. And I'm like, damn guys. Old man strength, man. Yeah. People have this old man strength, these big old forearms. And I'm like, damn, I'll never be that big. So strong, yeah. And I still don't feel that, but I was like,

every kid I have, it just juices me up, man. Your bones get a little thicker. They do. It's something about it. I love it, man. My daughter's a little like, she's like a little free spirit singer, dancer.

She says she wants to be a rock star and have her hair she wants to dye her hair purple and be a rock star um that she sings all the time and that like inspires me it's so awesome to see how like free she is and then my son is a little two-year-old little meatball neanderthal who has a sweet long mohawk we cut into his hair and he's just unreal man like he'll sit there and headbutt me and just laugh he heads about head whole head about me so hard and it's like sometimes he'll get me in the right spot where it's you know when you get hit and you're like you have like you have like a natural reaction oh god you want to like punch the guy back i don't have that i don't have the urge to punch

my son ever i want to make sure that's clear but he'll headbutt me so hard and it never phases this dude and it's like and i start saying like that's right buddy his name is hendrix i'm like that's right hendrix this is it's a hawk family tradition your nose your nose is made of granite your head's like concrete you know so you're not gonna uh can't break that thing that's your money maker and so i just joke with him but even though i'm like joking i say stuff like that around my wife and my kids, there's a shred of truth to it always. It's something about it, man.

I don't know. I can't – it's annoying, I'm sure, for people to hear that don't have kids or think I'm just stupid, but I understand that. Trust me. But something about having them – I know I got off on a tangent, but having them, taking care of them first thing in the morning and seeing them and getting – they power me up. I don't know. I don't know how to a tangent, but having them, taking care of them first thing in the morning and seeing them, they like power me up. I don't know.

I don't know how to describe it, but they do. It's just their freedom and their curiosity, I think, does it. That's cool. What do you think is the biggest thing you've learned about yourself over the last, is it nine or ten years you've been in the league now? Nine years. Nine years. What's the biggest thing you've learned about yourself with one team?

You've been with the Green Bay Packers. They just released you recently, and I'm not sure where you're going next. But what have you learned over the last nine years, the biggest, maybe the top three lessons you've learned about yourself? I don't know if I can put it into three, but I would say I've learned that there's no secret pill to making someone successful or making someone have like longevity in the NFL. And, and, you know, as being an athlete, there's, there's guys that are born just absolute monsters, absolute freaks. Like we got, we have guys all over the NFL that if you tried to explain it to, we've gotten like arguments with my mom because my brother played college football too. And he knows

there's some guys like, and the majority of the guys in the NFL are just physical specimens, and they were born that way. Some guys, you know, they'll eat, you know, eat sausage gravy and Fruity Pebbles and not have to work out, and they just have a 12-pack and run a 4-3. There's a lot of those guys around the NFL. learned those guys are around but those guys don't hang around if they don't find a way to kind of take care of themselves and take care of their body and stay with it and not ride the old roller coaster of like the ups and downs that that a season and a whole career can bring for sure because man day to day in football you know it it's a grind oh yeah it's like one day if you let it all kind of get to you it's such the the amounts of highs and lows that happen just in one day, even in practice and meetings, are crazy, let alone a game. When you give up a big play or you miss a tackle or drop a ball, it's like you've got to find a way to rebound and keep your head down and keep going.

And I've had to live that. I've always kind of said that, and then I've definitely learned that i gotta i gotta live that man i gotta i gotta do what i've been telling my kids and telling people i'm you know just stay consistent stay stay the course and keep my plan and my plan it it's always you know it's ever it's ebbs and flows but it doesn't really change the core like principles of how i approach it right what um how important is uh preparing and watching game film for you? And how do you analyze pregame and film? It's really important. It's the thing that people like to talk about a lot. Players, certain players love to talk about how much film they watch. It's like a brag. People like to brag about, Oh, I watched 15 hours of film. Like,

all right, well tell me, tell me one thing. Tell me their top three formations that you didn't read in the scouting report that your coach gave you. You know, that happens a lot. And I've learned from the older guys when I was young. They taught me. You know, they kind of teach you how to study film. And you might be looking for – you've got to go in. The thing that I've learned that helps me the most is I learned this in college.

I've got to go in with some – it's just like life. I go in with some kind of intent when I'm watching a film. Say I watch a game, a full game of a team because you can watch full games. A lot of times you're watching cut-ups of, say, just their first and second down runs like from every game of the season. I'll go in with like an intent thinking, say I'm watching a whole game and it's early in the week for a team we play. I might go in saying, all right, I want to see what they – what it looks like,

what they're going to do second and ten after a first down incomplete pass or something, you know, like some kind of intent. So I have some kind of little thing and then that might – I might use that for 20 minutes and then I'll hopefully change it and think if I want to look up some tendencies, like what does the center do here to give away a snap counter, when he's going to do it? Is this certain receiver lined up only on one side of the ball?

If he's off the ball, are they going to run it? Is it more of a chance of them running and all that? Just find a way to have things like that going in. I'm always writing stuff down. I let you know on my podcast I'm a big writer. I don't write intelligently. My handwriting is bad. But I love to write.

I just love something about the physical act of writing with a pen and paper, and I do that a lot. I have tons and tons of notebooks from Green Bay that have stocked up over the years. So that just has all my notes and what I think. Because, you know, you always come back to – you kind of have to scout coaches as well because I'll always ask. Coaches will bounce around more than anybody, and I'll say, well, who's their offensive coordinator?

And you find out who their offensive coordinator was. They're not going to really overhaul their whole offense they have. So even if they're with a different team and it's five years down the road from the last time you've maybe faced this guy, he's going to have a lot of the same things going on. That's true. So what would you say is your best asset or skill on the field and then off the field?

Well, I like to think they're one in the same. I've butchered a quote that I've read from a Navy SEAL commander one time saying, if I can't trust you in everyday life, I can't trust you on the battlefield. Meaning like, I'm not going to be a bad dude. I'm not going to go out there and I'm not going to treat people, be disrespectful to people. I'm not going to mess around with my wife. Whatever, like, morals and standards I have that I live with in life, I want to take to the field.

So I want my teammates to always trust me, and I want to be accountable to them. And that's all. I've always said that. I just want them to feel like they can trust me no matter what. I'm going to do my job'm not going to hang them out to dry we're all in it for the same cause and I hope that's one of the things that my if you talk to my teammates they would understand and hopefully my friends too you know off the field know that you know I'll I'll die for my for my kids and my wife and my good friends and everybody there's a lot of people you kind of got to you got to know what you're willing to,

what you're really willing to defend with your life. And I have certain things that I live by, and that's one of them that I want to try to make everybody else around me feel good about themselves. I learned that from one of my strength coaches. His name is Mark Lavotte. He's up there in Green Bay. He's really changed everything and how I view. He just has a really good perspective on things and kind of taught me perspective and don't get caught up in everything because the NFL is not reality, man. It's unbelievable. It's the greatest ride ever,

but it's not real life. I mean, we know that. Like, you're playing a game. For nine straight years, I'm driving to Lambeau Field for so-called work. That's where our parking lot was, and that's where our meetings and everything were. So I never let that leave my mind. I wanted to always know that it was a special thing, and it always will be special. What would you say your friends would say is your best asset? Probably my calves. No, I'm joking. I wish. I used to do calf raises in high school. That's another genetic thing you can't change either without steroids probably. Sorry to give you a

terrible answer. My best asset. See, you make me feel so weird, Lewis. I feel like I'm talking about myself. I feel like I'm being like – I feel like I'm just – whatever I say is like feed my own ego. I feel stupid. I feel like my brother is going to – my 320-pound electric – what is brother going to come beat me up when he hears this? But I don't know. I mean I think like anything, I think they can count on me. I think my friends will know that I'm super loyal and learning from guys like you.

I'm, I'm learning to, I have a big problem. I'm like naturally a shy kind of guy that doesn't get involved and doesn't put myself like into situations I shouldn't be a part of. But now I've over time over the last probably three, four or five years and I become aware of guys like you, Aubrey Marcus, just different guys that make you think differently.

When someone, and I teach my kids this, when someone does something that's awesome and I respect it, I tell them, like, this might get awkward. Like, sometimes it is awkward if you, like, it's a stranger. Like, hey, man, I just want to let you know, I really respect your passion up there. If it's like an open night, Mike, at the coffee shop, you know, I okay man i just want to let you know i really respect your passion up there if it's like a an open night mic at the coffee shop you know i like i gotta let them know but then i also try to figure out on the flip side if someone sucks i want to tell them they suck and not sugar so i'm pretty i'm not as good at that as letting people know if i if i disagree or i don't think they're doing the right thing a lot of times i just let them go

but sometimes i think it's good for everybody to let them know that, hey, man. I don't ever claim to have any answers, but I can tell you what's worked for me and what hasn't worked for me. Exactly, yeah. You're just a good Ohio boy. We all come from that same place. Just grew up on a farm, just milking cows and everything, right? Isn't that every Ohio kid? Exactly. That's not me. I did not grow up on a farm you know just milking cows and everything right every ohio kid exactly that's not me i did not grow up on a farm what is um what's your vision for the rest of your career you've had nine epic years uh with

green bay now you're i don't even know what's happened in the last week are you picked up yet or what's i'm a i think free agency starts here soon uh I'm officially a free agent right now, and it's a new world for me. If you could write the last chapters of your NFL career, whether that's one season, ten seasons, whatever it may be, what do you want to write? Well, it's not going to be ten seasons because I won't remember my name if I play another ten seasons, that's for sure. But I would hope – I never want to put like a year of numbers on it because I've been

super fortunate to play nine years so far and I feel good I feel really good healthily my health wise uh my brain feels good which is the most important thing out of everything I can't replace that I can get knee replacements hip hip replacements, whatever. Can't change my brain out. But if I could write it, the only thing that ever comes to my mind, and it sounds like I'm lying, is that I just need more rings. I got one Super Bowl ring. I need more. Like, getting there and getting that one made me realize that everything else sucks so bad.

Like, it's terrible. We got beat in the NFC Championship game in a brutal game this year. So, so tough, man. Yeah, and it's like, it's terrible we got beaten the nfc championship game in a brutal game this year so so tough man yeah and it's like it's so i realize how hard it is to get there and to win a ring like look at seattle they went back to back and then they had that game one oh they blew it yeah one play it's over when they were that like rewrites your whole the whole dynasty they had going on so i know how hard it is um but I just want to get back there so bad. So whatever team that may be, coming up here in free agency, anything can happen.

You can go anywhere. I'm willing to do whatever, man. It's not about, especially at this point in my career, it's not about money. I'm not going to sit there and hold out and try to get a couple extra bucks that I feel I deserve. I don't care, really. I was lucky enough to get drafted to win uh rookies when they gave big signing bonuses yeah rookies didn't have

that they weren't slotted whack when i got drafted so yeah i'm aware of that and um what was your signing what was your signing bonus then it was public right uh yeah like it's split up into multiple things like there's a signing bonus roster bonus but yeah when my where i was at it was like i don't know 12 or 15 it's a nice change right when you're 22 years old yeah i'm sorry i feel like an idiot even saying that um but yeah it's all publics now yeah yeah but yeah don't worry i spent all that on you know i got nothing left exactly i'm just straggling that's why i'm talking to guys like you i'm trying to learn how to make some money online. Exactly. That's funny. Well, okay, so the ring, I feel that. Who has been the athlete that you played against where you're just like, this guy?

Obviously, everyone is a freak in the NFL, pretty much, 90% of people. And there's guys who are just like worked their butt off and made it happen, who have great talent as well. But who is the guy that you're like, this guy is the greatest athlete freak I have ever seen maybe they're not the best person maybe they're not the most consistent but like wow when he wanted to turn it on he is unstoppable well for me there's a bunch of them but it's pretty easy um a little guy by the name of adrian peterson came in the league one year after me he He's played for the Vikings, so they were in our division.

I played him twice a year for eight years. And that guy is an absolute monster. And I tell people I have a ton of respect for this dude, and I understand he was suspended and how he was parenting his child, whatever. I don't even know the whole story. So people will have strong opinions both ways on him. But if it's purely as a football player and how i've dealt with him personally he's always been awesome super respectful and he's like the he's what happens when i was just talking with someone about this

the other day he is what happens when you're born an absolute genetic freak with tons and tons of gifts and skill but then you he also works his balls off man and he works hard off the field and does everything and just loves it absolutely loves it i could feel his passion like you could tackle the dude like you gotta be kidding me there'll be times he's tackled he's on the ground and his feet are still driving his knees he's got this crazy knee drive and he's like i'm not i'm not going down sorry guys like this is happening and then when he does get tackled he's genuinely like pissed every time like damn i was supposed to take that one i was supposed to take that one 100 like every run for him in his mind god he runs so hard

it's just like a train man once it gets going you cannot stop him he lowers his head and he'll if he catch her he'll gore you, man. He'll end your life. You got to watch out. You got to get him first. Amazing. I'm always fascinated by elite athletes and the drive that helps them get to where they are. What do you feel like is the common thread between a majority of the athletes? Obviously, everyone has a different drive of getting there but is there a common thread of the drive of the determination of the motivation behind

why guys get to the nfl and how they make it happen can you can you speak into that i don't know if there's one thing that has like one single thread that goes through everybody but i think i think everybody's motivated in different ways. You can't pretend to, you know, a guy like Ray Lewis is going to motivate some people and other people might be turned off by that, you know, over-the-top, rah-rah craziness. But regardless of what people's motivation are, and the sad thing is that a lot of people now, especially with how kind of culture is, are motivated by fame and money because, you money because you get to the league, you're going to make a lot of money, and people are going to know who you are, the better player you are.

So people are motivated by that, and I've always told teammates of mine, I'm like, hey, man, especially younger guys too. It's just different, you know, the old crusty guys like me talking about the new the millennials, you know, but they're they're they're great kids, too. Believe me, I think I've I've always never shied away from that telling teammates like, hey, man, if if you're motivated by by money and fame and all this, I was like, hey, that's that's fine. I don't have to agree with you, but we're all in it for the cause. And if the team does well you do well so i think just motivation is a weird thing for me man because i i always feel like if you have to get motivated then you shouldn't you're in the wrong job you're in the wrong profession we all need little things here and there where you got to watch a will smith video and listen to him talk about i will not you

know he's got he's not gonna what do you say i'm not afraid to die on a treadmill i love that the greatest slide yeah that's the greatest thing ever, and I love it. And you're like, oh, my God, this guy is amazing. I show my kids YouTube clips of him. But I think regardless of what your motivation is, you shouldn't have to have a guy get up there and tell you every day and give you a rah-rah speech to get going. You need to be intrinsically motivated, I've said before.

And I know I think most players are, to be honest. And if you're not, you're not going to be around very long. Your skills, the talent you're born with is only going to last you so long. And everybody's seen that. They've seen guys that have every physical tool in the world and they just can't put it together because either their heart's not in it or they just don't want to work at it. A couple questions left.

What are you most grateful for in your life, AJ? Well, everything. I think the easy answer is my wife and kids, but that's a boring answer, and it's an easy one I think that anybody would take. As long as they're good, I'm good. That's like this whole situation. I got Packers released me after nine years, and I knew it was coming. They were, they were awesome, super classy and great guys. And I have a ton of respect for them. And people would come to me

like, like if something like I had died and I think I was quoted in my podcast or someone, cause I think my grandma or someone told me, I always said like, it's all right. My wife's all right. My kids are all right. Let's all have some perspective here. It's okay. I had a great nine years. I'm very grateful for that. So I think I'm grateful that I have some – over the years, I've kind of got some perspective on things. And I don't know, like football-wise, it's hard for me to say. I always like – I think everything is intertwined.

There's nothing – I don't separate things. Like I don't separate how I approach football from how I approach life and how I want to be a parent and a husband and all that. It all kind of carries over. But I'm grateful, honestly, that I've grown up enough or I've become aware enough to seek things like listening to, honestly, guys like you, guys like Tim Ferriss, Pat Flynn, Joe Rogan, all these people that I feel like that's a big thing that I've learned

is you've got to have a unique, diverse group of friends because if all my buddies were like me, it would be terrible, man. It would be boring. No one would be salsa dancing like you. It wouldn't be funny. It wouldn't be that cool, man. So I think I just – I don't know. I'm always – always I'm just curious I want to be constantly curious tonight that's cool it's terrible because it comes back to my I keep bringing stuff back to my kids so I'm sure people

get annoyed by it but it's like you listen to like a listen to a four-year-old listen to my daughter why why dad why and what is that why why and I'm like sometimes you can get like frustrated with it but I always then I start to realize, well, no, she's actually right. Like you should question things. You should want to know why things are the way they are. Yeah, definitely. I like that.

She asked Lewis, what about this question real quick? Sorry to turn on. I had to write this one down on my phone. So my wife and I are sitting there. My four-year-old said, she said, dad, how did God create himself? That's a great question. I literally stopped in my tracks and I was like, you know what? That's an absolutely amazing question you asked. I said, thank you for the great, great question. And I tried, I said, someone was like, you know, he just has so much love for everybody and so much respect and he's respectful to his parents.

And he's such a good guy. And he has so so much love that boom there he was come up with something you know to make her like spread love and be nice to her friends and be a good girl and but i was like you gotta be kidding me this four-year-old girl asked the question that i mean i don't know how you top that question honestly that's great i've never thought of that i know that's on like your brain and that's why i always think it's one of my notes i want to want to do some speaking gigs here and there and it's one of my things is to be ask questions like a little kid you know why not i remember doing that asking my dad on the way to basketball tournaments and stuff he would ask me or we would be talking and i would always just kept asking him why why why do i want to know and for whatever reason i'm

i'm definitely guilty of it a lot of times we don't ask questions whether i'm you're scared of being either you don't want to annoy the person or you don't want to be the guy in the room that doesn't know what the person's talking yeah you don't know exactly yeah because you want to call it you're you idiot i knew that one oh did you bud what's uh what's your biggest fear aj biggest fear um gosh this is good you know i should probably like problem was i had you on my podcast so it's not i was preparing for that instead of preparing to answer some of the questions i know that you asked so it's good though it's good i would say my biggest fear just off the top of my head to think about it would be like not having, not having something that I'm passionate to work towards to do, to have like, um, to be chasing all the time. Like

it might, it sounds stupid and anything, but of course sports are, I'm super passionate about it. And that's like, that's my thing. It's been the vehicle for everything I've done. It's opened up a lot of doors. But even like my own podcast, I've really like grown into loving putting myself kind of in these like awkward situations for me, being like a quiet kid and doing stuff like this and hosting my own deal. But I would say if like – if that ever happened to where I didn't get excited for something, then I'd start to get worried. Aside from your family, if there wasn't something on the side that I was like, this is what I'm supposed to be doing. Yeah, it may branch into a million different things just like what you do, but there's got to be something you get excited for, man.

And I have a lot of things going on like that outside of football right now that I just love to do. And other people don't understand it and they don't – you try to explain it to them and their eyes glaze over and whatever. But it's just – to me, it's just – it's what I love. And I think, yeah, if that ever went away, man, you know I probably got the ALS, Lou Gehrig's disease from football and sued the league. I don't know, man. That'd just be terrible, you know.

Like that's when I say people die. Like when a coach retires and they don't know, man. That'd just be terrible. That's when I say people die. When a coach retires and they don't have anything they're working towards, they don't have any common things. They don't have a purpose to wake up for. You're dead then. Why are you here? I don't want to lose that

basically. That's a good answer. God, I had another question I was going to ask you. That was a good one. And I'm trying to remember what it is right now. Oh, here it is. Here it is. I got it. If you have one or two sentences to leave to the world,

everything else is deleted and erased online of everything you've ever said or done. But you get one or two sentences to say what you want to for your family, your kids, the world to know a message for them to know about what you believe in your truth, something, what would you leave? Well, I would, I would put it. This is good, man. That's why you're the best. All this does is make me feel like an idiot about my podcast now, like schooling for me. This is a great education to see how a pro like you does it. But if I had to give a sentence or something. A phrase, a sentence.

Phrase. A something. You know what instantly popped in my head while you were asking that was from Gladiator. Are you not entertained? For some reason I thought that. That would not be what I would leave. Maybe that would be like a side note at the bottom.

Drop the mic. Yeah. Everyone's like, what? What the hell is that? They haven't even seen the movie Gladiator. Gladiator got erased too, so we're all screwed. They all just think I'm a weirdo. I don't know if I could come up with a phrase.

I would try to say I would want to get across the point that maybe a guy like you that, that's a learned writer, everything you do, you could phrase it for me after I give you my thoughts. But like, um, something about like, just be something about being transparent and being authentic. Like it would definitely have to do with just, just be you like be authentic. Well, no matter what that is. That's the thing I talk about on my podcast a lot. Like if you're the biggest dick in the world, who cares? Be the biggest dick. I at least respect the fact that you're a dick. But don't fake it and tell me and act like you're just a great dude and you pray for 14 hours a day and really you're the

most jealous, insecure dude in the world. Whatever you are, just be you. So something about being authentic, I think, somehow how I could have smart guys like you write it down and phrase it so it sounds much better for my kids. But I just want people to be real and be transparent. And we need to see not only like the good and awesome times, but we need to see people struggle. And that helps all the time. I talk to a lot

of military guys on my podcast and they tell the guys that are just these crazy powerful stories about like, hey man, it's not all champagne and roses. There's a lot of bad things that happen and we all can come out from the other side and that's inspirational to me. So I need to, we need to see everything though. Like we need to know the things that Brad Pitt struggles with, you know, like whatever's in his mind. It's not, everything's not perfect for a guy like that or all these people we see on TV we think have the perfect life. They struggle with the same things that all of us do. And let's just all get it out there so we can all, you know, grow a little bit.

All right. What's the main thing you struggle with? I try to, I've felt, see, now I also feel like it's like an ego thing that I don't want to come across like I have a big ego or something. That's like one of my things actually. I actually don't – my dad told me a while ago like when reporters or people would ask me questions, I would just shit on myself the whole time. I don't know, whatever, you know, like just talk bad about it because I just felt weird talking about myself. whatever, you know, like just talk bad about it. Like, cause I just felt weird talking about myself. But, um, I think I would, if I, sometimes I struggle and I talked to Aubrey about this, like I, sometimes I questioned for sure, like, why do, why do good things happen to the supposed

bad people that you see around? You know? And why do on the flip side, why do really terrible things happen to people that I've seen are just the greatest humans alive? Why? Why does this happen? And I don't know if I'll ever get the answer or I'll ever figure it out, but I'm always kind of – it's like a thing that just – a theme that pops up into my head every once in a while. And I hate both sides of it. And I hate when I acknowledge the fact when I do have those thoughts and I just try to figure it out.

Ask smart people like you. What do you think of that? Why do good things happen to bad people and why do really trying to try to figure it out. Ask smart people like you. What do you think of that? Why, why do, why do good things happen to bad people? And why do really bad things happen to good people? Oh man, that is a great question. Uh, you know, the thing that popped into my head when you said that is that the only way I can really justify it is that everything happens for a reason. And I would say that, you know, in our core, we're all good humans. We all have good intentions. Do we?

Do you think we're born – are we all born with good intentions? I feel like we're all born – well, I think 99.9% of us are born with huge hearts. What about Jeffrey Dahmer? Yeah, I mean 99.9%, yeah. Okay. I'm sorry. I'm sorry. I mean here's the thing.

I think we're all born with hearts to love. I think that's like our intention is to come from a place of love, and that's why when we're children we want attention, we want to smile and laugh. And I think every now and then our environment and the things that happen to us and the experience that we go through shape us into not having as much love.

And then we choose what we want to do after that. But I think we come from a place of we have big hearts and we want to experience love, but our fears take us over sometimes, and so we choose to live in fear and hate and anger or manipulation and want to just do bad things. So, you know, I honestly don't have the answer, but that's how I justify it, I guess. That's what I, what I think. Okay.

Yeah. I mean, that's, yeah, that it's one of those things that it's not like nothing's black and white, cut and dry, but it's just one of those deals that it kills me. It breaks your heart to see like, yeah. And you know, i don't know you see parents lose little kids no it's horrible whatever that stuff's different than when you see like a guy who you know doesn't doesn't work and right you know cheats on his wife and messes around and just treats people horrendously and then they pump him up and he's you know it all

comes it all figures itself out yeah yeah it all figures itself out i don't want to wish bad on anybody that's for sure. Exactly, exactly. All right. I feel like I can talk to you. I said we were going to do it for like 30, 45 minutes, but this is like over an hour now, and I want to keep asking you questions. Is it really over an hour? Yeah, I think so.

It's over an hour now. But I want to keep asking you questions, but I want to do it for another time. I want to do it – actually, I want to videotape us doing a workout together or like throwing a football or something. So when I come back to Ohio during your offseason. Come in the spring or something, man. I got nine acres close to where you grew up. Or Dublin, huh?

Yeah, like north a little bit. So I got some space. Got a gate and fence. And we can lock it. I got a weight room in the basement. I got on it. I got on it. Zombie kettlebells. I got primal bells in the basement. I got on it. I got on it. Zombie kettlebells.

I got bells. And we honestly, I'm not joking. These people think I'm joking. When the weather gets decent, I go out and I, I take my ax and hatchet and I did. I was tree lined on three sides.

I chop trees and I dropped the dead wood out of there. And it's part of my work. And I just put them on my back and lunge and squat and run around like Rocky. It just feels amazing, man man and then i take them chop up the wood and i burn them in my fireplace at night with my kids and roast marshmallows so it all it's all being used amazing i'm gonna come and do this one day i promise you that if i'm invited i'm coming you are you have an open invitation please let me know because i'll have a billion questions for you man because i want i got a lot of things that i'm i want to learn from you because you got you're doing it man

you're out there and you're hustling i love it i appreciate it well yeah awesome we'll plan to do another one then um because i have a lot of more questions for you to be honest i want to acknowledge you really quick before i ask you my final question i would acknowledge you aj because this interview for me is as big of a privilege and a pleasure as it was interviewing Tony Robbins and other people like that because of who you are. And, you know, since the moment I watched you on TV for Ohio State to now, everything I've seen about you, heard about you, experienced about you has been like you are living and being what being what your message is to the world, which is to be real and to be you. And whatever you are, own it. And that's what I've seen in you for the last decade.

And you've owned that. You don't try to be smarter than you are. You don't try to act different than you are. You just are who you are. And I also acknowledge, so I acknowledge that first off. And I also acknowledge your willingness to learn. Because I feel like there are so many guys, professional athletes, or people who are at the top of their game in certain business even that feel like they've got it all figured out, feel like they don't need to learn anymore, don't take on new skills,

don't get uncomfortable in something outside of what they're already doing. And for you to start a podcast and you're reaching out to different types of people and doing what you're doing, I think is so awesome and so cool. And I want to acknowledge you for all of that. So it's been a pleasure having you on. I'm going to tell everyone to make sure I'm going to have this linked up in the show notes where you can check out AJ Hawks podcast.

I believe it's called the Hawk cast, right? Hawk cast.com. Yeah, it's corny, but I had to have a name. No, I like it. It's podcast. I believe it's called The Hawkcast, right? Hawkcast.com. Yeah, it's corny, but I had to have a name. No, I like it. It's cool. Yeah, The Hawkcast. And you do good video interviews.

You've got some awesome people on there. You've got Herbstreaker on there. You've got a lot of cool. John Daly smoking cigs the whole time. Yeah, exactly. You've got some cool people on there. Yeah. So I'll have that linked up.

Make sure people check it out. But it's been a privilege having you on, man, and sharing your story and message to the world. My final question this time is, what's your definition of greatness? I thought about this one too, Lewis. But then I

wanted to be spontaneous. And that's the problem when you interview one of your fanboys, they already know a lot of the questions coming up. Not a lot of them, but the ones, I know how you end them. Well, first I want to say thanks for the nice words, man. It makes me feel honored and weird and awkward all at the same time. You know, it's always weird when people, you know, appreciate what you do or how you care yourself or whatever, um, just makes you, makes me feel almost embarrassed, but hopefully someday you can get comfortable with that. But yeah, I mean, it's, uh, like I said,

from, from people that are very open and honest and aren't scared of putting them at themselves out there like yourself, I, uh, I'm trying to, uh, I kind of do that too. I always let people know, um, like, yeah, I remember when I was in seventh grade and I was trying to act uh, I kind of do that too. I always let people know. Um, like, yeah, I remember when I was in seventh grade and I was trying to act like I was the toughest guy in the room when people laugh at me when I tell them that I was, you know, I cried at a movie or commercial or stuff. I don't care. I'm not scared to admit it. I cry all the time, man. My kids did it. My kids did it to me, but it did. And so like, I don't, there's nothing to hide. We have nothing. If you have something to hide, you're doing something wrong that's that's something i've learned from guys like

you so i really appreciate you the nice words you said about me and and um but my definition of greatness man um i uh i don't know like i don't like i said before i don't ever if i ever go speak to a team i've or uh or Ohio State every once in a while, I've gone and spoken to those guys. I let them know right off the bat from the jump. I'm like, hey, man, I'm just going to let you know I don't have all the answers. I don't have any of the answers probably, but I'm going to let you know what's worked for me and what hasn't worked for you

because I hate when people come in and they start preaching to me right from the start. It turns me off instantly. So if I had to like in a roundabout way to answer your question about greatness, you can tell how wishy-washy I am. The fact that I watch your podcast and I listen. I'm like, oh, man, if I ever do this, what would I answer? What would my answer be of greatness? And I have nothing. I mean I do.

I just have like – that's my problem. I have five billion things in my head that I don't know exactly which one. But I would say, honestly, for me, greatness is being authentic, chasing whatever you're passionate about, regardless of how much money you make, if it gives you notoriety, if it does anything. Just having it satisfy any – whatever that hunger is you have. And you don't have to sell yourself, you know, sell your soul to the devil. You don't have to step outside of who you really are to do that. And that would be greatness for me. Not a great explanation, but, you know. Maybe next time I'll write something down.

I don't know. It's all great. Being real. Being real. You're being yourself. That's your message. Trying, yeah. Like I said, I'm just a dumb football player. I don't have a real job. I've never know. It's all great. Being real. Being real. You're being yourself. That's your message. Like I said,

I'm just a dumb football player. I don't have a real job. I've never had to have a real job. That's why I always like guys like you, man. You guys are doing it. It's cool. There you go. To be honest, Jack Canfield, I don't know if you remember listening to that one, he said every time, even when you're sarcastic, and this is something I put myself down sometimes as well,

he said even when you're sarcastic and you put yourself down, you're sending a message to yourself. And you want to make sure whatever message you're sending yourself is positive. I do remember that. It might be something to think about. I'm not saying it's easy. Yeah, I remember that. I just didn't carry it with me when I listened to that two days ago. But, yeah, I say it a lot.

It may be simple, but it's not easy. It's one of those things. You've got to find a way to live it. And we're always on a constant journey. I don't think we ever get there, but hopefully we can take those steps. Exactly. That's all about it. It's progress, not perfection.

AJ Hawk, you are the man, brother. I'm so glad you came on and we got connected. And I'll be definitely coming to Chop Some Wood sometime soon. So thank you so much for coming on on my man. Thank you very much. Open offer out here, nine acres. I'll bring, bring your own apps or I have two of them in multiple hatchets for you. I'm in. I appreciate it. Deal. And there you have it guys. I hope you enjoyed this episode with my man, AJ. If you want to check out more with the links that we had and the information that we talked about on this podcast,

go back to lewishouse.com slash 149. And you can check out all the links back to AJ's Twitter and to his podcast as well. You can see my episode up on there. A little video interview that we did. We'll have that linked up in the show notes. And also, when you go to lewishouse.com slash 149, make sure to subscribe to my free newsletter. I give a lot of great free tips every single week and you'll be up to date on what's happening with

the podcast because we'll send a newsletter out each and every week. So make sure to check out lewishouse.com slash 149 for the full show notes, all the links for AJ. Keep in touch with him. If you enjoyed this episode, please share it with your friends over on Twitter, Facebook, Instagram, all that good stuff. I appreciate you guys so much. And I'm going to have to have AJ back on or we're going to have to do a video doing a workout at his house sometime. So, again, thank you guys for joining me today. This was a lot of fun for me to interview a fellow football guy, someone who's achieved a lot more success than I have in the football arena.

Fun to always connect with Ohio guys and stay connected to my roots. So thank you guys again so much for coming on. You know what time it is. It's time to go out there and do something great. I love you. Do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-do-