The School of Greatness - 234 The Power of Hustle to Create the Extraordinary with Lisa Messenger

Episode Date: September 30, 2015

"From being selfless and doing things with integrity, extraordinary things happen." - Lisa Messenger If you enjoyed this episode, check out show notes and more at http://lewishowes.com/234

This is episode number 234 with Lisa Messinger. Welcome to the School of Greatness. My name is Lewis Howes, former pro athlete turned lifestyle entrepreneur. And each week we bring you an inspiring person or message to help you discover how to unlock your inner greatness. Thanks for spending some time with me today. Now let the class begin. Welcome everyone to today's episode. I'm very excited about this, but I have a very

special guest today. Her name is Lisa Messenger. And I found out about Lisa on Instagram probably like, I don't know, six to seven months ago, maybe even a year ago, because I was doing research for a magazine that I was doing. And I saw how incredibly talented she was and how beautiful her design was for a magazine that she has called The Collective. And I'm so impressed with what she's created. She's going to tell you all the numbers she's created, how she's got distribution throughout these airports and Barnes and Noble and bookstores. And she's got global distribution, how she's crushing it, both print magazine and digital magazine, and how she built a business as an entrepreneur in Australia to bring it to the big dogs here in the US. Her whole story or journey of building this from scratch with just an

idea and a dream, having zero clue of what she was doing. I think you guys are going to get really inspired by this. So make sure to share this with your friends. It's lewishouse.com slash 234. Share it out with your friends who want this inspiration. And without further ado, let's go ahead and dive into this episode with the one, the only Lisa Messenger. Welcome back, everyone, to the School of Greatness podcast.

Very excited about our guest today. Her name is Lisa Messenger. Thanks so much for coming on, Lisa. Fantastic. It's so great to be here. Thanks for having me. I'm very excited. I think you're the second or third Aussie who's been on the show.

So congratulations for making it on. There's not many of you. Oh, I'm impressed. Thank you. I feel very special. Now, I want to read a quick little part of your bio, then talk a little bit more about you. You have a new book out called Money and Mindfulness about living in abundance.

And you have, you know, you've got this magazine, which is really interesting to me. So I'll talk about that in a second. But you're a vibrant, game-changing CEO and a creative director of the Messenger Group. And as well, you're the editor-in-chief of the Collective Magazine, which is where I found out about you. And it's an entrepreneurial and lifestyle magazine distributed in more than 37 countries with a mandate to disrupt, challenge and inspire. In addition, you have worked globally in events, sponsorship, marketing, PR and publishing. You've written or co-authored over a dozen books and your group has published more than 400 books for companies and individuals. So I'm very excited to connect

with you. I think I found out about you probably six or seven months ago. I believe someone tagged a photo of yours of The Collective magazine on Instagram. And I'm an Instagram whore right now, just loving it. So I was instantly attracted to the design and the intention of not only the images, but your language that you use, whether it's you using yourself or your team, but just the way you guys put out great content. I was really inspired by it. And I'm inspired by that lifestyle type of message.

So thanks for being here. And I'm excited to kind of dive in to learn more about you and how you've become so successful. Thank you. Well, success. I'm just on the – it's the very beginning of a very, very big vision. But let's see where that goes. Of course.

Now, I'm curious. Let's start with the magazine. Why did you start – when did you start this magazine? Why did you start it? And what was your vision for it? So it's a good question and it's a completely crazy story. your vision for it? So it's a good question and it's a completely crazy story. So I had been publishing accidentally books for years and that's because I decided to write a book about 10 years ago on happiness because I was incredibly unhappy. Right, we teach what we need to learn.

Absolutely. That was kind of the beginning of my quest for kind of self-development. And, you know, I've since trekked the Western Ghats in India and done, you know, raw food, vegan communes in Costa Rica and all sorts of crazy things. And so I self-published a book about 10 years ago on happiness, which was really just a compilation of what happiness meant to a whole pile of people in in my own eternal search for it and um and since then we've published a lot of books but they were quite one-dimensional and so about nearly three years ago I just came up with this idea for you know why don't I I felt like I was living in this bubble and I thought I've got access to all these extraordinary inspirational you know amazing people and I wanted to really take that out and give it a bigger voice and platform. And I'd never worked for a magazine. And at the time, I had three staff all under the age of 25, none of whom had worked for a magazine either. And so we had no idea what

we're doing at all. And then decided to go into this industry that people said was either dead or dying. So it was a real recipe for disaster. But I knew nothing at the time about the digital landscape. So it was largely born out of naivety. And I think naivety can be a really helpful thing sometimes because, yeah, I didn't know what everyone else was saying couldn't be done. And it just seemed sort of a logical platform for me. Had I have known just how big it would get or how hard it would be, and I think that's the case for many entrepreneurs, it would have maybe been a different story at the time. But my vision was and still remains to tell inspirational stories

that are accessible and attainable and relatable. I'd been on the other side of the media for so many years and people would ask me the same old questions and I'd give the same old answers, which was great for our spin and hype, but it didn't really help the reader, I didn't feel. And so I wanted something that would talk about, you know, extraordinary people, but also give the kind of how-tos. How did they get there? And what were the tough times? And what's the real story and so it just um it just took off and and yeah and now it's as you said in 37 countries and we've got like about 18 different revenue streams and but it's all about empowering people to be the very best version of themselves and that is my

only mandate and you know we'll interview anyone as long as they're prepared to be real and authentic and vulnerable and courageous so yeah i love that and when did you say you launched it originally so two and a half years ago it was launched um yeah and uh and it's sort of just been growing since then and and it's it's been and continues to be an absolutely crazy journey it's crazy i mean you have like every celebrity on the cover i feel like like how do you get all this? How do you get them all to commit to coming on the cover? Are they all custom shoots or they stock images? Or are they the relationships you built up over the years? Yeah, so I knew nothing about anything. Like literally, I can't even tell you even though we'd published a lot of books. I mean, putting books together in comparison to a magazine, and I know you've

just written well, and so you will know. I mean, writing, it's kind of a labor in itself, but then really it's just about editing, proofreading, design, and print. And it's relatively, you know, seamless in comparison to a magazine, which in every issue we have between 50 and 93 was our largest issue. It's different stories, and I've always said we will never syndicate anything. So every single story in the magazine we interview other people ourselves. Now the covers are interesting because the magazine itself is essentially a business and entrepreneurial magazine. But in Australia alone there's over 5,500 print magazines. And so I had to play the game a bit.

And I always talk to people about, you know, the finding that fine line between, you know, doing good in the world and having commercial acumen. And it drove me nuts that I decided, yeah, early on, I decided, well, I kind of have to put celebrities on the cover to be able to get cut through to sit next to the Vogue's and the Vanity Fair's and the Tatler's and all the big guys and to get noticed. And as much as it killed me to put celebs on the cover because I was like, I just want normal entrepreneurs and extraordinary people on the cover. I knew that I needed to be placed there in newsstands so that people would actually pick it up. And I thought, well, if they pick it up and they realize that this magazine is all about inspiration and doing good in the world, then I've kind of done my job.

Now, that's a long way of answering your question. So I'll answer it because it's quite a funny story. The first three issues, I had the biggest kind of names of people that I knew personally in Australia on the covers. And then I thought, well, this is kind of ridiculous because I'm going to run out of friends soon that are well enough known to be on covers and also I thought well you know my vision was to take it to the rest of the world and I thought well these people aren't going to make mean anything to anyone in the rest of the world and so and then I decided after three issues to um

to take a punt and I flew to um toronto which is where they were having the global um what was it the magazine distributors conference essentially and that's where i did a lot of the deals and i thought well i can't fly over there with these aussie covers like no one's going to take me seriously and i had no idea like no idea at the time how to get you know celebrities or nothing i'd never been in this world. So I noticed in Australia that, you know, a lot of the big brands were, you know, they obviously have celebrity endorsements and they pay them a lot of money to be a part of it. And I was kind of desperate.

And it was like two days before we went to print on issue four. And there's a brand called Oli Lingard, which is out of Denmark. And they had Helena Christensen as their, you know, pin-up girl at the time. So I contacted them and said, do you have a shirt that's, you know, that you're not using as part of your campaign and is there any way I can use it for a cover? And they were like, of course, she's wearing our jewellery.

We'd love you to. So I went to the States for this cover with Helena Christensen on it. And then I realised that, you know, people started taking notice and then I just started really forging relationships with publicists in mostly LA and New York, to be honest, and, you know, convincing all of them that we were worthy of, you know, having actual celebrities that wanted to be in the magazine on the covers. Wow.

And, you know, and then it's complex. And, I mean, this may not mean much to people who are listening, but I always say, you know, don't listen for kind of my world, which is now magazines and entrepreneurialism, but listen to, you know, what's applicable because there's always parallels with whatever anyone's doing. But, yeah, so we started forging these relationships and, you know, bigger and bigger people started saying yes

to being interviewed. And I think, you know, bigger and bigger people started saying yes to being interviewed and I think, you know, success builds success and hype builds hype and all that kind of thing. Yeah, and so, but it's complex. I mean, I don't know how much you know about all of this. I'm assuming a fair bit, but it's, you know, you get someone to agree to an interview, but then most of the celebrities are shot by, you know,

photographers who often have nothing to do with the publicist. And so then you have to contact them separately. And so, yes, a lot of it is, is buying images that, you know, we have exclusive rights for, and then they have to be approved by the celebrity. I mean, yeah, no, I get it. I mean, it can be like six months to a year. Oh no, I get it. I mean, just, you know, working with celebrities for my podcast is a lot of work. Just making sure,

cause they want to listen to everything. Their PR team, their legal team needs to listen to it first before they can say that it'll go live. And it's just like a, you know, I have to edit video and all these other things constantly. It's just a, it can be a hassle sometimes.

And I tried to launch, and I know a little bit about the magazine world, not even in a fraction as much as you do but i tried to launch a digital magazine through itunes yeah uh about a year ago and yeah just the process this isn't even a print magazine yours is print and digital correct yeah yeah yeah this is printed yeah and i'll talk yeah and i'll talk a bit more about that as well like why we've got so many different layers now so i i try to launch a digital one and i've i've got three issues that are beautifully designed i mean they're incredible looking and i spent a lot of time and money on them but just the whole landscape of working with itunes and

trying to launch it uh it took like three months of technical issues with with just launching it that I decided to put it on hold because I've got this book coming out that I was like, I'll do it another time if it makes sense. But essentially, six months of time and energy for not launching something. I learned a lot about the process and that it's extremely complicated and it takes a lot of moving parts. It's so complex. There's so many moving parts. And for an instant gratification junkie like me who moves very fast it's kind of like does my head in luckily my team deal with all the data which i'm hideous at and i kind of just swung in at the end of the process and say whoopee but um you know it's kind of interesting because we um we got ryan gosling for a for a cover and

it was kind of interesting. Once we got him, kind of the world was our oyster and publishers started contacting us, which was interesting. And I think for anyone in business or indeed life, there's all these catalysts and turning points and aha moments and it's just hanging in there long enough and also trying to stop and cliche smell the roses and remember you know where we came from and all that kind of thing go okay because

it's tough every day is tough but it's also you know it's exciting and it's full of high-fueled adrenaline and it's yeah it's a big journey yeah it's the same you know it's similar with my podcast once i started to get these a-list celebrities or influencers, it became a lot easier to get anyone else I wanted to. And they all agree to come on afterwards. Once they see the reach, once they see who else has been on there, it's just kind of getting those few people early on to believe in what you're creating. And the thing I love about your magazine, it's designed so beautifully and it's so inspiring that who wouldn't want to be on the cover? It's designed so beautifully and it's so inspiring that who wouldn't want to be on the cover? That's the thing.

Because you do a great job of delivering it so that people can receive it in an inspiring way. It's so lovely. So I'm curious. Thank you. Yeah, you're welcome. I'm curious. Do you have distribution numbers as well? Because two and a half years is not that long for a magazine to be out. Can you give numbers on circulation with print and also digital and

talk about some of the revenue streams that you bring revenue in from? Yeah. So, yeah. So we, yeah, let me start with the different revenue streams because I think this is an important one. When I get asked, and you probably get asked this a lot as well, I do a lot of public speaking now and the similar themes in the questions are kind of like, you know, people say to me, where are you going to be in five years? Or, you know, and I'm like, I don't know where I'm going to be in five days. Now that's not to be facetious or complacent. But what I mean by that is I think so many people get attached to a specific outcome or, you know, they don't surrender to a process they have. This is what it's going to look like and they spend, you know, they might

write a business plan that's 100 pages and it sucks up all their time, energy, money and everything else. And then, you know, they're destined for a huge failure if indeed at the end of it all there's no market. And so what I say is my, what I stand for, my vision is unwavering and it is absolutely 100% resolute until the day I die. And that is now to be an entrepreneur for entrepreneurs, living my life out loud and showing that anything is possible. And with the collective platform, it's all about showcasing inspirational brands and extraordinary individuals and empowering people to live their best life. So that will never change.

But what I really talk to people a lot about is the platform now is completely irrelevant. It doesn't really matter if we're delivering a print magazine, if I'm doing a podcast with you, if I'm doing a speaking gig, if I'm writing a book, if we're, you know, yeah, it's social media. We do a lot of events and all that kind of thing and what i looked at and i mean i think again don't for listeners don't think about magazine land but think about how this applies to you but i looked at the traditional magazine model and luckily i mean doing books i'd never had any advertising dollars in my life so while

traditional magazines were reliant on ad dollars, I was like, ad dollars were just a bonus for me. So from the very start, I thought very differently. And I was like, I just had no expectation about ad dollars. So I came at it from a different angle. Most people, that's the 90% of the income, right? A hundred percent. And so like our, we sell a page in the magazine for $8,000, but I thought, and you know, a lot of the time you have to discount to $5,000 or whatever. And so the print magazine in Australia alone costs me $350,000 an issue. So each month to put it out.

So I was like, well, if we're selling individual ad pages at five to eight grand a page, that's going to take me a long time. And as you said, when you're an unknown, why are the Chanel's and the Nike's and all the big brands of the world even going to come near us? So I thought about it from a very different perspective to start with. And I went instead to big brands like big banks and people. And I said, I want you to give me $50,000 a month. So it's kind of like so counterintuitive. But I said, for that, you know, you can have 5,000 copies of the magazine that you can use as premiums, incentives, gifts, rewards,

get them out to your community. And you know, I pre-sell everything. I never ever do anything until I pre-sell. That's what I preach all the time for entrepreneurs. When you want to create an online course, which I've done many of them, I always say, do a webinar, sell it first. And then if people buy it, then give it to them in the next couple of weeks, but never spend three to six months developing something unless you know people are going to buy it. Yeah. And that, we sound like we're from the same gene pool. We're from different parts of the world but the same mindset. I love it. I love it.

Yeah, so actually, I mean, I talk about this in my first book, Daring and Disruptive, but I actually probably knocked on 80 doors. And I'm sort of from the Lisa Messenger school of fail fast. That was kind of like not failing fast. But also when you know you're onto a good idea, I just really believed in the magazine so much and finally i went to australia's largest bank and they had a campaign at the time called can it's all about you know you can so i thought well they can't

possibly say they can't that was my irrational logic and i met with the chief marketing officer after stalking him for about three months. And I said to him, you know, this is my vision and everything. And luckily, he was still a big advocate for print and also for entrepreneurs. And so he said, how much do you need? So that first deal, I mean, I had a couple of, you know, indicative pages of what I thought the magazine would look like. And it has iterated many times since then but

I just said look I need 200 grand and it was 50 grand an issue for the first four issues which just gave me a bit of you know financial help but also what it was was that someone outside of me believed in me and I was suddenly accountable to someone else and I felt like I really needed to deliver and so you know that's how it kind of all started. Yeah. But we have many, many different revenue streams now because I realized that, you know, we need to be where our readers want at a time they want, you know, in a format they want. And so some people want to come to events and interact with people

from the pages of the magazine. Some people want to, you know, go on the website and get their daily feed. Some people want to sit down with a magazine once a month. Some people would just want to scroll through Instagram. So I'm very aware of that. And it's something also that helps us to be an integrated platform to bring all our partners on board. And yeah, so it's kind of working and we're still keeping our head afloat somehow. Yeah, that's cool. So what are like the, what are the maybe the top three to four revenue streams? Maybe the main ones

that people know about and then maybe what are two or three that are like creative, interesting ones that you didn't know were even possible until you started doing it

and then you realized, well, that's pretty cool. We're making money there. So, I mean, the print magazine is definitely the leader and, you know, people often say, I mean, it sucks the most money and resources by far.

It's the least profitable by far. In fact, it doesn't even make a profit. It makes a loss still two and a half years in. But it's so important because in an age where, you know, there's so much and you will have experience, This is hard to get cut through online because there's so much noise. And so for me, having something physical and tangible and a lot of what we've done is we do a lot of sampling and I have three people now who purely work full-time on non-monetary partnerships.

So we look at, you know, what big conferences or events for entrepreneurs and creatives and designers and all that kind of thing can we partner with. And I realize now that a lot of my currency is content. So we can do stories on all of these fabulous people as long as it fits with the integrity of the magazine. But in exchange, you know, they can sample magazines, all sorts of different things. So we're always looking at who are like-minded, non-competing partners that we can collaborate with. So the print magazine is definitely, you know, a leader and a really important part for us.

Events, absolutely. We just did a big one yesterday in Sydney and they're good for revenue because now we, you know, we often do a contra with a venue. So, again, thinking differently and rather than paying for the food and beverage and things we'll say well can you you know can you host the event and cover all the food and bev and the venue hire and things and in exchange we'll do a story on you so that kind of helps and then we we make money from the the ticket sales and then now we attract pretty big sponsors to those events as well. So the events are doing really well and they're also a way

for our community to actually, you know, interact. Come together, yeah. Yeah. Online I definitely think is where our biggest share of revenue will come from just because there's, you know, no boundaries in terms of what we can do. Pardon me, that's still something that we're, you something that we're working on and trying to figure out. But collectivehub.com is kind of where it's all happening at the moment.

It's a beautiful design. Oh, thank you. Well, as I said, whilst really the platforms are all about business and entrepreneurialism, I wanted to, you know, I think it's funny. People kind of a lot of the time think, okay, we're a business magazine. We have to look really dry and boring. And, you know, and I just thought, well, I want it to look beautiful and have an incredible design aesthetic and make it look like a fashion

and design magazine. So it's this kind of weird morph of the two. Yeah. And my books, I mean, they have just gone nuts. Really? And I think it's because I'm quite insane. Like, I just, I did a pre-launch for Money and Mindfulness, which doesn't come out till the 1st of October. And yeah, on day one, we did, I think, 1600 copies just online on our own

website. And I love that now because my deputy editor, Mel, was my first employee over 10 years ago. And then she went and had kids and came back. And she says to me, you know, it's nice having someone who's been around you for that long because she says to me, we have to remember, you know, there were so many years where we would sell maybe three books a month, if that. And so it's really beautiful now. And I think it's because, well, you'll see if you read my books, I'm very sort of self-deprecating and I talk a lot about, and which is true, I have no idea what I'm doing half the time

and I'm very honest about this is the journey, this is how much it costs, this is how I'm doing it, you know. And I think people have kind of gone, oh, my God, well, she's just like kind of a nobody. If she can do it, we can do it too. So I think that's why they like it. Yeah, you have what I call, I talk about in my book, a principle of greatness called hustle. And for me, you're just constantly, you don't know what to do, but you're willing to figure

it out. You're willing to dive for what I say, the loose balls in life. The athletes on the sports teams, they're always going to have a starting spot or on the team if they're willing to dive and sacrifice for the ball when everyone else isn't willing to. The coach will always play that player because those loose balls are what matters the most in every single game when they're close at the end. And it sounds like you're willing to pull your neck on the line, sacrifice your, your body or mind or,

you know, whatever it takes, you know, by not going, you know, by staying up late some nights and, and, you know, building relationships, those types of things. Um, and doing whatever it takes. And you're, you have this art of the hustle that I call and, uh, you go for it and it's, it doesn't have to be perfect and everything you've done doesn't sound like it's perfect, but it's purposeful. And that has been, uh, kind of the guiding light for you. Yeah, absolutely. I think, um, yeah, it's, you've got to get your hustle on every single day and sometimes it's tough and you are, you know, paving new ways and doing things differently And yeah, it's – yeah, but you just got to do it.

So what are – what's bigger right now, the digital circulation or the print circulation? And are you able to share some of those numbers? I'm terrible in terms of numbers. That is – I'm not terrible in terms of numbers. I've just written an entire book about numbers. I know all the sort of top-level numbers. What's the reach for both? So the print magazine, we print at the moment 140,000 copies.

So it's pretty sizable. And mostly in Australia, right? Most of that is in Australia. And then we ship out to the other regions at the moment from Australia, which is an extraordinarily expensive thing to do. Yeah. So, for example, in the U.S, we're in every single Barnes and Noble store and now all Hudson. Yeah. And all Hudson and Hudson News. But the tricky thing about that is, you know,

I'm not on the ground over there. So all the other 36 deals outside of Australia are distribution deals. So, you know, a lot of it is organic growth at the moment. But thanks to you and, you know, many people in the U.S., we've had a lot of incredible support. So it's definitely kind of growing over there. The ideal scenario would be to, you know, move over there for a while and actually, you know, print in the U.S. and put some real kind of rigor behind it rather than letting it kind of grow organically.

But you can only take on so many things at once. Of course. So I've got to kind of maintain focus where I can. But as I said, I will be spending an increasing amount of time in the U.S. I was there twice two months ago, twice in a month I was in New York and doing lots of stuff over there. So, yeah, the U. the US is definitely our second market and probably will, in time, become our first market. Right.

Well, I'm curious now, two and a half years launching a print magazine, how do you get into Barnes & Noble and Hudson bookstores and airports? What's the process for that? If someone was launching a magazine, what would you say is the best way to make it happen? You get your hustle on. That's it. Look, I think the thing is a few things. So I launched in March 2013 and then I think it was October 2013. So the first year I did the magazine bimonthly and then we went monthly. So as I said, you know, on the fourth issue I flew over. And what I did was before I went to Toronto,

I went to the World Magazine Congress in Rome because I thought, okay, you know, I just did it purely out of naivety for a while and I thought I better actually go and see if I'm on the right track. And it turns out I was. You know, when you start to listen to speakers and you're like, yeah, okay, okay, I'm kind of doing that. And so it was good. But, you know, I'm a big advocate of investing in yourself. And it's funny, you put yourself out there and often things that you don't expect to happen, happen.

And the first night that I was at that conference, I sat next to this guy, Philippe, who was the global syndication manager for the New York Times, which was just the most extraordinary contact. And it's funny, having published books for so many years, every single author has said to me, I want to be on the New York Times bestseller list. But they have talked about it like it's this unrealistic thing that's sort of on the moon and it's unreachable. And so what was interesting in meeting Philippe and us talking to him about our model in the magazine, he said, look, I love what you do. If you're going to be in New York, I'd love to set you up to go and sit in on the page one editorial meeting, which is extraordinary, where the 18 divisional editors of the New York Times come together every day and talk about what's going to be on page one. And I said to him, well, actually, I'm going straight from Rome to New York in three days' time. So he set that up for me. And on the same night in Rome, I met Martha Stewart's vice president, Ruth,

and she said, oh, if you're going to be in New York, you should come into the offices. Shut up. It was that. So within three days, I was in New York, and on the same day, I went through the Martha Stewart offices and met all her team. And it was the most extraordinary experience. And then Martha ended up, I did an interview with her, and she ended up being on our issue eight cover, which was amazing.

She's phenomenal. And then on the same day, that afternoon, I went and sat in the New York Times editorial meeting, and the editor of the New York Times sat there and held up the magazine. I couldn't believe it. What? This was the Helena Christensen issue, right? And they held it up and said, look at this. This little Aussie is doing this thing.

Anyway, I went back and was invited back to that New York Times page one meeting a year later. And I don't know what issue we were on. It must have been 4 plus 12. I don't know, issue 16 or 17 or something. And it was gorgeous. They held up the issue again. And everyone gave me this huge round of applause and was like, wow, look how far you've come.

So it doesn't really answer your question. The answer to that is I just started putting myself out there and getting in front of the right people and as i said i flew to toronto and um every year or every two years i'm not sure it's called distro press and it's where all the global magazine distributors come together and i think the majority of um people who went there it's one of those things where you have a meeting every half an hour with a different distributor. And we managed to set up on day one 13 meetings with all these distributors. And I took my marketing director, Claire, over there with me.

And we kind of were sitting there thinking, well, maybe no one will turn up, you know, where these little Aussies who know nothing about anything. And all 13 people turned up to the meetings. I think they were fascinated. And I think we did 13 deals with 13 different distributors from that fair. And I think the reason is when you truly believe in something and you speak from the heart and, you know, so many people go into meetings and have PowerPoint presentations and speak to the slides and I just speak from my heart and tell people what I'm doing. And I think they all just were like, whoa,

these people have come all the way from Australia and most other people there are like big publishers who actually know what they're doing. And I think they all just kind of fell in love with it and were like, we'll give you a go. And also I've done a lot of, you know, we were talking about pre-selling before. I've done a lot of weird deals and it's constantly, you know we were talking about pre-selling before i've done a lot of um weird deals and it's

i'm constantly you know let me give you an example in australia uh and this happens all over the world you have to pay you know to be ranged in newport news sorry um airport news agencies you've got to pay a lot of money to you know be in there and have a placement and things and it was something like with magazines or books uh both both yeah yeah but depending on countries and um and different outlets and things but let's just as an example in australia in one news chain alone you've got to pay about four thousand dollars a week or something ridiculous to be just our placement in the airports you're not even gonna sell enough to make it back properly. No.

But the thing is, and they all wanted it up front. And then you have these floor-to-ceiling light walls, and again, you need to pay up front. So I had to do a lot of hustle early on and convince these people because I knew I didn't want to grow really slowly. I wanted to grow pretty slowly. I wanted to grow, you know, big splash. So, and so I convinced them that, look, I don't have the money. I mean, I didn't have the money to pay for those things up front. So I said, I will guarantee you profit. Like I will guarantee that I'm going to pay this on the back of it. And so we need, and so people were

like, she is nuts. Okay. We're going to give her a go. So I got all this amazing placement and then I just had to back it up, you know. And that's where social media has been extraordinary. I think people, I'm a big believer when you give a community, when you empower a community to feel a sense of belonging, they will do anything to help you. So I've always said whilst I'm the, you know, I'm the only financial person involved in the collective at the moment, I don't own it.

It's the community who owns it. And because I've kind of empowered them to do that and I make it very much about them, they just carry the message for me and they amplify and share the cover and they shout it from the rooftops and they tell their friends. And I've never experienced anything like it and I'm just so incredibly grateful every single day. So yeah, I've taken a lot of crazy harebrained risks where I've promised people that I'd pay them like, you know, ass about and somehow it's just worked.

But I talk a lot about, I mean, money and mindfulness is really all about those strategies because I don't know if this is so prevalent in the US, but I hear continuously people saying, I can't do this because I don't have enough money. And this notion of finance and self-sabotage and things and fearfulness around it holds so many people back from reaching their full potential and their greatness. And so I kind of write a lot about how there's so many other ways and cash isn't the only currency and there's so many other ways to do deals. And that's when business becomes very exciting. And I also believe that, you know, doing good in the world and having money don't need to be mutually exclusive. And in fact, they go hand in hand and money buys freedom and choice. So I talk a lot about that. That's great. Yeah, I love it. I feel like you're my long lost sister who has the same experiences. And it's interesting. I have some fun facts about you. And maybe you are my long lost sister because you were born in Central West, New South Wales. Is that right? Yes. How do you even know that?

Well, I am a quarter Welsh. My grandmother is from Wales. And I believe my name is Welsh, which is house. I believe it's from Wales or Scotland or England. One of those. I've always tried to look back into it and I always see Welsh descendants. Really?

Yes. So we have something in common there. Also, another fun fact I heard about you is that you went to boarding school. Is that correct? Yeah, I did. I was so naughty. See, I went to boarding school as well.

Did you? But I begged my parents to send me. They didn't even know about it. I just asked them because I wanted to get school as well, but I begged my parents to send me. They didn't even know about it. I just asked them because I wanted to get out of the house and away from the madness at home. And boarding school, how funny, because I actually begged my parents to go as well, although I'm sure – I think my mother was very happy to see me go. She kind of had my bag packed and waiting at the door for me. Amazing. I love it.

Yeah. and waiting at the door for me. Amazing. I love it. Yeah. So I'm curious, to go back into the magazine, I'm curious about the digital distribution and how that's been. Do you feel like the digital is more powerful for you because more people are online now and now with the newsstand app,

the new news feature? I mean, are you seeing an increase in that or is it bigger in print? a new news feature? I mean, are you seeing an increase in that or is it more, is it bigger in print? So the print sales, in terms of the actual print magazine, so we sell the physical copies and then we also sell it across Zinio and MagShop and PressReader. And the print physical sales are much higher.

However, when we go to our online portal collectivehub.com um the traffic i think is starting to you know way exceed the the circulation of the print magazine which is really interesting because the print magazine so i have 23 full-time staff at the moment and we have close to 80 freelance writers that we just pull in from all over the world depending on you, you know, industry and specialization and where they're based and who they can get access to and all that kind of thing. And that's been a very specific strategy. But what's interesting about that is, you know, until recently, as I said, the print magazine costs about $350,000 Australian dollars a month to put out.

And the digital, you know, we've been putting probably, you know, with salaries, et cetera, about $12,000 a month, yet the advertising across online is starting to exceed, you know, in Mac and all that kind of thing. So I've had to really do a lot of re-education with my team recently, kind of looking at the numbers and crunching and going, this makes no sense. Imagine if we put the same level of resources into online.

Like it would just be insane, I think. So we're really trying to, you know, I am trying to sort of teach myself. My team are far better at all of the digital stuff than me. But I'm kind of getting there. But I think that's where there's a, I think that's where there's an enormous opportunity for us, you know, because, well, A, the print magazine comes out once a month. So it's, you know, we try and make all the stories

so that they have longevity. And, you know, the mag is very much like a coffee table read and all that kind of thing. And people can dip in and dip out and it's kind of timeless. But, you know, with online we can do, the moment, we're doing sort of four to eight feeds a day with, you know, content. So it's a fair bit. But, you know, it's, yeah, there are no boundaries in terms of what we can do online, I think.

I love it. I love it. Well, the thing that's cool about you is, you know, in regards to your business with the magazine and everything you're doing there and your, the book money and mindfulness, you know, the thing I love about it is you essentially said, I have a dream, I have a vision and I'm willing to do whatever it takes to make it come true because you believed in it so much and you were able to make, you were able to make a lot of money from that, that belief and that mindset. Uh, can you talk to me a little bit? I want to ask a few more questions,

but one of them is about the book. If someone has a dream and just doesn't even think it's possible because they don't know how to make it happen to start just making a little bit of money, a few thousand dollars a month, but they want to start going after it. They want to start doing something. I know you cover all this in your book and I want to make sure everyone goes and gets it at collectivehub.com. It's right there on the homepage. You can go check it out right there. I believe that's the link, right? Yes. Yes, it is. Thank you. Of course. Yeah. What do you think, would you tell someone, what's the piece of advice to get them started that'll get them a jumpstart before they get the book on what they can do?

that'll get them a jumpstart before they get the book on what they can do. Yeah. Well, I think, um, for me, it's all about really feeling deeply into what your purpose is or what your why is, you know? And I think, um, you know, that's, that's the best place to start because, you know, once you, once you understand that everything, the sort of serendipity and the synchronicity, it all starts to kind of fall into place. And then the other thing is, is you know you've got to have an insatiable self-belief because if you don't believe in yourself no one else will you know because as you keep I love that you're

a hustler as well because I'm a serious hustler you've got to be out there and you know I'm probably it's so weird pardon me for anyone who me, they would say I'm an extra, well, from an external perspective, they'd say I'm an extrovert. I'm actually quite introverted. Like I love, you know, being home on my couch or going for a run or, you know, being in the outdoors and kind of just being with a really close group of friends. That's kind of me. And yet now my life is, you know, being on the speaking circuit three

or four times a week and like being out there and being really vocal about everything and kind of putting my life on a platter and that is not my natural state but um but i've learned that well i'm not going to make a difference or do anything great in this world by not putting myself out there and so i i do that um and then the other thing is you know to to fail fast i mean as we were talking about before, I think people get so caught up in limiting beliefs. And I think, I mean, I've done years of, you know, therapy and reading and all sorts of things. So I kind of can talk a lot about that. But, you know, we all have these limiting beliefs that are, you know, handed from generation to generation or things that have happened in our childhood and whatever else.

And so I think the sooner people get comfortable and have a true understanding of what holds them back and why and all of that kind of thing, then all that sort of starts to fall away and life becomes much more seamless and in flow. and in flow. So I think, you know, it's all about then, you know, once you realize what your purpose is or what you're wanting to do, don't worry so much about the money. Like actually just go out and pre-sell and, you know, there's plenty of money and there's so much abundance out there and start to, you know, start to tell people about your vision and people will start to come to you and, you know,

provide you with money and think about what, you know, what's your currency and what tangible saleable assets have you got? You know, is it your intellectual property or is it, you know, whatever it happens to be? I mean, there are things that you can sell before you actually have to make them. And I mean, I fail at least 20 times a day now, like quite seriously. And I love it because what I mean by that is they're just small, quick failures and it's because I'm well-networked now. I've got some great contacts. I've been building that up over many, many years that I can, you know, ping an email off to someone in HR or a marketing director at a big corporate

and I can say, hey, I've got this idea. It might be for an event or it might be for a new product or it might be for all sorts of other things. And they can quickly come back to me and say, no, that's not going to work or, you know, or I can then I can iterate or pivot or change or whatever. But I'm going to pre-sell the idea and before I actually make it essentially. So I think they're kind of some of the tips. And the one question I ask myself every single day without fail is why, why am I doing this? Because I think as well,

once you start to have a level of success and you know, if my life were a book and it is now turning into several very good books, but I mean, I wouldn't say I'm on, you know, chapter one, but i mean i would say i'm on you know chapter one page one paragraph one really like i have so much more to do and so um so there's that fine line all the time of not letting your ego get in the way of you know the bigger picture and so whilst extraordinary things are happening and amazing opportunities are opening up for me every single day i go why am i doing this and the reason i'm doing this is to help other people and empower them. So I go, that's what I'm doing. And, and does everything I'm doing fall into line with that and do the people that I'm doing deals with share similar values and beliefs. And if so, then yep, let's move forward. Um, yeah, so, so it's just, um,

I think it's a lot of self-reflection and really understanding who you are and what your purpose is. And then things just start to happen. I love it. I've got three final questions. I want to make sure everyone – we'll have this all linked up in the show notes. So I'll tell you guys where to go to get all this information in a few moments. But make sure to follow Alisa Messenger and at Collective Hub on Instagram. That's where I first found her.

And I'll link everything up for you guys here in a second. But three final questions. One is what are you most grateful for in your life recently? Oh, my goodness. I have a gratitude diary. I mean, in the world I live in now, that sounds so kind of cliche because so many people have these things, I think. But I'm grateful for so many things. But really, I'm grateful for our community. They're the people who just carry us along and lift us higher every day and help me to be a better person. So that I'm extraordinarily grateful for. I love it. These last two questions are something I ask everyone at the end. One is, if all of your books that you've ever written, all the magazines you've ever published, all the things you've ever said online have been erased and it's the final day for you.

And you have a piece of paper and you get to write down three truths that will be the last three things that you get to share to the world about what you know to be truth about your experience so far. What would you say are your three truths? Oh my goodness. Okay, here we go. Get real Lisa. I would say anything is possible. That I know it should be a hundred percent true now and that we are all

equal. That's something I know to be sure. I mean, I could go on and on about why. And I'd say, gosh, you're really, I mean, there's so many things. But, yeah, what else would I say? There's so many things. You've got me. So the first one, what was the first one so yeah what did i say i said

anything's possible and you know and that everyone is everyone is equal and um i think you know be selfless i would say i think from being selfless and doing things with integrity uh extraordinary things happen so i think that's kind of what I know now. It's so easy for us to be selfish and to get caught up in our own, particularly in this sort of narcissistic world. Like there's so much. But if you can kind of wind it back and think about why you're doing this and if it's for sort of the greater good and for other people,

I think the rewards come back in so many ways. I love that. Thank you for sharing that. Okay. Well, I have one final question before I ask. I want to acknowledge you for a moment, Lisa, for your passion for living your dreams. And I believe that not enough people have enough passion for their dreams. So I want to acknowledge you for that passion, for the ability to tackle whatever it takes, knowing that you're going to fail and getting

back up every single day, because that is a very scary thing for most people to do, specifically when you have no money coming in. So I want to acknowledge you for your joy, your passion for your dream, and for being committed to your vision every single day to serve and inspire other people. So thank you for all you do. Thank you. You're welcome. You're welcome. And I have one final question.

I'm scared this is going to be about kangaroos or something crazy. I can feel it coming. Okay, I'm ready. it's what's your definition of greatness oh my definition of greatness um oh i think um my definition of greatness i think I think uh probably being truly on purpose and being able to live with freedom and choice every single day so whatever that means to you um people often say to me now oh now the corrective's had some success I you know I still laugh at that as I said at the very beginning but I they say to me when are you going to exit? What's your exit strategy? And I go, well, if someone gave me $100 million today, I would not sell it for any money in the world. I've spent my entire life

searching for what my purpose is, and I finally got it. So yeah, if I had $100 million, great, but I'd still be just sitting there going, what's my purpose? So I think, you know, having the freedom and choice to do what you want in the world, I think that's greatness and inspiring others. Yeah. I love it. Lisa Messenger, thanks so much for coming on and sharing your wisdom. Thank you, Lewis. It's been an absolute pleasure. I've loved it. You're a fantastic interviewer very easy thanks so much appreciate it and there you have it guys this is again episode number two three four make sure to share with your friends lewishouse.com slash two three four if you enjoyed this um tell a friend Lisa it was

such a pleasure having her on make sure to follow her over on Instagram and Twitter and Facebook and check out the collective the magazine because it's an inspiring magazine and she is just cool what she's done to build this business from really from scratch and take it to where it is now such an

inspiring story make sure to check it out share this with your friends thank you guys again for being here, for showing up each and every week, for listening to this message about greatness, for inspiring yourselves, and for sharing this with your friends to inspire them as well.

You guys know what time it is. It's time to go out there and do something great.