The School of Greatness - 703 What We Need Most to Change the World with Dr. Alaa Murabit

Episode Date: October 8, 2018

EVERYONE SHOULD HAVE A SEAT AT THE TABLE. For my whole life, everything has been a competition. You either win, or you lose. I wasn’t intentionally trying to hurt people, but I wanted to be a winner. It wasn’t until I was 30 years old that I learned a better way to live: win/win. It transformed my life. I started looking for ways that I could succeed while allowing the people around me to succeed, too. At the end of the day, we’re all in this together. The idea of creating win/win situations has been mastered by my guest on today’s episode: Dr. Alaa Murabit. Dr. Alaa Murabit attended medical school at the age of 15 and was named one of Forbes 30 under 30, an Aspen Institute Spotlight Scholar, and one of Canada’s 30x30. She is one of the UN’s 17 Global Sustainable Development Goal Advocates and a UN High-Level Commissioner on Health Employment & Economic Growth. She was recently appointed the Executive Director of Phase Minus 1, LLC which provides leadership in conflict resolution, peacebuilding, and more. Dr. Murabit champions women's participation in peace processes and conflict mediation. She approaches conflict in a way that humanizes both sides: by first finding common ground. She is helping everyone in the world understand that when women succeed, everyone succeeds. It’s good for the economy, it’s good for the government, and it’s even good for the environment. Learn how Dr. Murabit mediates the most difficult scenarios and helps women obtain an education, reproductive rights, and health in Episode 703.

This is episode number 703 with Dr. Alam Rabat. Welcome to the School of Greatness. My name is Lewis Howes, a former pro athlete turned lifestyle entrepreneur. And each week we bring you an inspiring person or message to help you discover how to unlock your inner greatness. Thanks for spending some time with me today. Now let the class begin. John F. Kennedy said, if we cannot now end our differences, at least we can help make the world

safe for diversity. Today, we've got a powerful human being on. Her name is Dr. Ala Marabat. She is nicknamed the Libyan Doogie Howser, named by Jon Stewart. Dr. Ala Marabat was admitted to med school at 15 years old. In her final year, she turned her eye to policy, founding the Voice of Libyan Women, a nonprofit aimed at empowering those caught in conflict in her home country. Four years later, she researches health securities issues as the only UN high-level commissioner under 45. If you go to her website, you'll see paragraphs and paragraphs of things about her bio of the boards she sits on and the things she's doing around the world. She's

truly making a massive impact around the world. And in this interview, we dive in deep and it gets pretty emotional at certain moments. So be ready for what might unlock for you. She shares her secrets on the best thing to do when negotiating. She goes into different governments and countries and works with people on negotiating big conflict and how you can negotiate in any situation in your life. Also, why we need to approach religion with inclusivity so everyone is accepted and the challenges that religion face with conflict today around the world. Also, how you can use your own privileges to make an impact and lift your community up. The difference between education and empowerment, especially for women. We talk about gender equality and what really needs to

change. If there's one thing that needs to change that can impact so many other causes around the world, what that one thing is, and so much more. This one goes in deep, guys. Make sure you share it with your friends. I believe you're going to be moved and inspired in a powerful way. And make sure you tag at Lewis Howes and at Alaa Murabit, that's A-L-A-A-M-U-R-A-B-I-T,

over on Instagram when you're connecting with us and let us know what you enjoy about this episode. Again, a big thank you to our sponsors today. And I'm so excited about this episode because we dive in deep on a number of hot topics. I hope you enjoy this one. Again, make sure to share with your friends, text a couple of friends, the link from Spotify or iTunes, just send the link directly via text, put it on Facebook, Twitter, Instagram stories, tag me at Lewis Howes and at Alaa Morabit as well to let us know the parts that you enjoy the most. And without further ado, let me introduce to you the inspiring,

the incredible Dr. Alaa Morabit. Welcome everyone back to the School of Greatness. We have Dr. Alaa Marabit in the house. Good to see you. So good to see you. Welcome to the studio. I'm excited about this. We just had a powerful, probably could have been a 20-minute podcast that we just had conversation already.

Maybe we'll throw some of that in there. But before we dive into things, can you share a little bit about exactly what you do so people understand it and how you got into your profession? So I am a medical doctor by background. Knew I wanted to be a doctor since I was a little kid. My dad is a surgeon himself, so my after school program was going to the hospital and watching surgeries, which a lot of parents might find unacceptable now, but was a really good method for my parents. And ended up going into medical school at the age of 15 in Libya. In my final year of medical school, a revolution broke out. And so I started an organization called The Voice of Libyan Women, which really focused on getting women

included and actually being architects of peace processes and conflict resolutions, because statistically they last longer when they're more inclusive. And from there, our projects ended up changing laws nationally, being implemented internationally. I was asked to advise the United Nations Security Council, which really looks at how we can prevent conflicts or mitigate conflicts around the world. And from there, was asked to be an advisor to UN Women, which is the arm of the United Nations that really looks at women's roles in leadership and how we can prevent challenges and disasters towards women, etc. And then, of course, from there asked to become a UN Sustainable Development Goal Advocate. There's 17 Sustainable Development Goals. They've been

signed on by 196 countries. And really, the purpose of them is we're saying by 2030, we're going to have a vastly different world. So 17 goals that are in debt. What are two or three of them? No poverty, gender equality, reducing inequalities, economic growth, peace, justice, and strong institutions, equal quality health care, quality education. And so really- Around the world. Around the world. and countries have signed up companies have signed up which makes it very important goal 17 is actually partnership for the goals and and you have a huge push i think from everybody at once to have almost this lighthouse that's giving you this pathway where we know that there's challenges daily obviously

there's new political surprises you turn on the news there's always something new a new conflict a new natural disaster new opportunity but these are meant to be a framework for the next 15 years, not to get distracted. So what's your role in that? I'm one of the 17 Sustainable Development Goal Advocates. So some of the other advocates include... There are 17 goals. 17 goals. And you're one of the advocates. Yes. And there's 17 advocates. And so some of the other advocates include the Prime Minister of Norway, Erna Solberg, famous soccer player Messi, singer Shakira, Forrest Whitaker, Richard Curtis, who's a well-known filmmaker, and then Nobel laureates Mohamed Younis and Leigh McBowie,

CEO of Unilever, Paul Polman. So it's a huge mix of different people that all bring a different perspective. And about a year after that, I was asked to be the UN High Level Commissioner on Health, Employment, and Economic Growth, which looks specifically at how wellness and health and supporting health for your citizens or for your employees, for your community, actually leads to greater economic growth. And we see that with companies all the time, where they'll put a gym in because they know it'll decrease sick days and increase productivity. And so our sentiment is if it works in a company, it works in a country. And that's what the data shows.

Interesting. So when do you have time to just relax? I don't, but I'm going to get more. I'm taking some hints from your podcast. I'm going to take more time off. That's good. Planning a family vacation in February, if my family can agree on the minute details. What's the thing you're most proud of? Probably my relationship with my family. There's this Mari Andrews who does these cool cartoons on Instagram, and she does, like she did today or yesterday, metrics of success. And so some people define success based on the number of followers or the number of patients

they have per year or number of, for me, might be like number of negotiations I actually get my zero points in. And lower in the metrics were like, you know, relationship with family, time you spend with the people you love most. And so for me, it would be, I have a very large family, 10 brothers, 10 sisters. And yeah, very independent, very successful, very mobile group of people. But I've dedicated a significant amount of my time to making sure that that is prioritized. And so my relationship with my family, with my husband, with my parents, probably what I'm most proud of. You talk about religion in your TED Talk and reclaiming religion and how it gives people power. What does that actually mean?

Well, I think if you look at organized religion, so I think faith is, for me, faith is what I define as between me and whoever I believe is the higher power. So in my case, Allah Subh'anaHu Wa Ta-A'la. And I think that's a very personal journey. I think that, you know, you can live with somebody in the same house for 20 years and have very different perspectives on faith. And that's fair. And it probably means that you're growing in your relationship with God and probably with each other because you're being open to those different perspectives and ideas. The challenge with organized religion is it becomes a tool for political and economic power. Anything organized does. There's the added kind of bonus of people being able to say, well, God said so. And it's very difficult to argue with God. How do we know God said so?

Exactly, exactly. And so it becomes defined by those who have authority and power, and traditionally, historically, that has been meant. And so you find, even today, in my own religion, there are significant social and cultural issues and challenges I have towards the treatment of women or what is said about women. And that can span in any faith, most major faiths. So if you look at reproductive rights in Texas, or if you look at domestic violence, for example, in the Middle East. And for me, the frustration is these rules and these

social and cultural norms have been defined by men who have gained economic, political, and social power because of how they've manipulated and interpreted and spread the word of God, right? So I think religion, and because of the way in which they've ensured women haven't been part of that conversation. When women did speak up, oh, you know, you're speaking against God, you're dishonorable, it would get into, you know, her character, her honor, her morals, etc. And we saw that here in the United States with the suffragette movement. We see that around the world with different movements. The huge push against four abortion laws in Argentina and Ireland

has brought that out. It's a constant challenge because whether we like it or not, religion has shaped a significant amount of our policies, even in countries that say that state and church are separate. And until I think we as women start saying, listen, we need to start redefining who gets to dictate what religion means and what God, the interpretation of what God has said, until we start doing that, we're always going to be playing catch up, I think. So what can we do to evolve the process? I think a huge part of it, I think it's similar to almost any process where power is up for grabs, right?

Ultimately, religion means power across the globe. It means power, and it means money. Rules, money, regulation, who gets to sit at the table, who gets to define the agenda. That's all what, when I say God has interpreted that you are unable to do this, that automatically means that I'm getting to make the decisions, and I get the benefit of those decisions. So that economic pull or that social pull. And I think a huge part of the way it can change is, first and foremost, we need to start redefining who's at the table. Women should, and we need to be able to create an ecosystem where women can say, listen, we have as much right knowledge, expertise, to be able to define what God has said, to interpret, to be part of this conversation. God is not created in the likeness of men. That's not the purpose here. But then second, we also need men that have positions of authority in those spaces,

much like any other space, to say, listen, I'm going to give up some of my power. I'm going to leverage some of my network, leverage some of my credibility, leverage some of my social capital to ensure that you have a seat at this table and to ensure that we can move this agenda forward. And maybe put my own name on the line and say, hey, I'd like to talk about the representation of women or the interpretation of this verse or the way we've executed this particular notion within our faith community. And it's, I mean, across faiths, you have challenges where a lot of things get brushed under the rug to protect the status quo and to protect those in power. And if the people that are part of that powerful community

don't start standing up, you're never going to be able to push that needle forward. You hear about all the stories from different religions that are dealing with sexual abuse or violence, whatever it may be, or stealing or crime, but they sweep it under the rug. A hundred percent. To protect themselves.

A hundred percent. Even if it's against their faith or their religion. That's why I think it's so important, because to define the difference between religion and faith. It can be a hundred percent against their faith, but it may be in service of their religious institution. So they justify it. Yeah, so they justify it. Like, oh, I'm protecting the institution, right? And I find that very frustrating because if you look, for example, at the sexual violence of children, 90% of kids are abused by somebody they know.

Right? And so oftentimes when we ask, okay, like, what can we do to do things better? In many of these communities, religion still does play a role globally. You have religious institutions. You have religious authorities. And yet when families go to those religious institutions, oftentimes the families are told, this is a familial issue. Let's deal with this internally. Right.

Let's not take this outwards. And it does limit, I think, the growth for that family and their ability to heal, but more so the legitimacy of that religious community. Like, how can you tell me God is merciful and God is open and God is just when this is happening to me and when I went to seek you out and to ask you for what you could do on behalf, you know, what you could do or what God could do, you told me, no, you need to keep this quiet. I think religious communities are going to wrestle with that reality as well. Do you feel like religions create a lot of the chaos in the world? I fundamentally believe the interpretation and misuse of religion causes significant challenges, yes. Because you're constantly in negotiation for peace, traveling 90% of the time, you said,

doing conflict resolution, essentially, different countries and different challenges and religion religion often comes up or the misuse of religion religion and cultural norms so in arabic and i mentioned it in my ted talk there are two key words i always heard when i was growing up haram which means like religiously forbidden and i which is culturally inappropriate and in most cultures around the world, those two cross a lot more than you would expect. Really? Yeah. There's a huge gray line there. So for example, you'll have conversations, and I had them pretty recently actually with friends who are devout Catholics who will tell me, you know, this is religiously prohibited when really it's more socially or culturally not expected or not appropriate.

And the same in Islam, you'll always have these conversations where you begin to challenge them and you say, wait, that's not actually what religion says. But that is what we've been told for a very long time and what we dictate as normal and what we dictate as acceptable and what we then teach our kids and what our kids teach their kids. So, I mean, I always give the example of when I started my organization. My grandpa is old school, like was very old school. He passed away a couple years ago, but was very old school. And when I started my organization, he had a lot of trouble with it. He was like, what are you talking about? Because he said women are empowered. Women can't, you know, sometimes.

He said women are empowered? Yeah, he's like, if a woman wants to do something, she can do it. You don't need organizations for women to move things forward. He was very like, if you pick yourself up by the bootstraps, you'll move forward. But then, in that same token, he'd be like, women are meant to really sustain the community and the family. They don't need to be at peace negotiations. They don't need to be talking about the intricacies of security. It was interesting because having those conversations with him made me realize, and I did it too. I was super arrogant about the way I approach things. When you go to somebody

and want to change their mind about something and you're like, well, this is right. You should do this. This is right. And I'm a data nerd. So I'd be like, statistically, you know, 90% of peace processes fail within five years. When women are included, they're 35 times more likely to last 15 years. And then I go So here's the facts. Here's the facts. And you're not intelligent if you don't agree with me. Like, it was a very, like, this is the way I see the world, and you should see it too.

And the past, I think, first being a sibling of 10 other people, but also the past eight years of this work, nine years of this work, has taught me that most times that's not the best way to do things. What's the best way to do it? To convince someone. Well, it's not necessarily to convince them. I just What's the best way to do it? To convince someone? Well, it's not necessarily to convince them. I just listen to them. At this point, I ask them why.

Because I think my grandparents, probably your grandparents, your friends, your family, most people believe things because that's what they've been taught to believe by the people who they think and they know love them most. They trust most. And so when you go to a woman and say, listen, your daughter needs to get an education. What you're doing is wrong. What you're telling her is everything you've been taught by the people who love you is wrong. And everything

you're teaching to the people you love most is wrong. And you're wrong and bad. Exactly. Exactly. It's an attack on their character and their life. Their life and their growth and their family and their identity. And so, because I'm not going to agree with everybody who brings me data and statistics and facts all the time, right? But what I will do- 90% of the time, statistics are wrong. Well, you terrified me with that. I was like, so listen, Lewis. 90% of the time, every fact is wrong. Well, but facts can be skewed, right? Or conversations can be misled. Just like the Bible and anything else.

Exactly. But depending on who interprets it and who decides the metrics and the norms and the values and who sits at the agenda setting table, right? But for me, it really is, okay, so tell me why you believe that way. Like, if you don't think your daughter should have the same education as your son, tell me why. And usually they'll go into a story about how when they were younger, it didn't matter to them and their mother didn't have an education and look what she was able to do. So it's a lot more personal than I think we give it great credence for. So what do you say when someone says that? When I was younger, this was that.

Well, I usually have conversations with them about... Times have changed. No, not times have changed, but do you ever wish you did things differently? Do you ever wish that you took the opportunity? Where do you think you would be if you had an education? Oftentimes people will point out, so my mom who got her university degree but then had 11 kids, her number one rule in life was that you always sustain yourself. And she had that rule because she was responsible for this

entire family and felt like she had very little self-sustainability, right? She was responsible for a community. She wasn't the breadwinner in the home. She didn't have a lot of the economic power. And even though her and my dad had this wonderful relationship growing up and had each other's backs, growing up, it was always, my sister went into plastic surgery at the age of 22. Like she, that was her plan for residency. And when the rest of the community was saying plastic surgery for a woman, and this was in Canada, but like she could do, you know, gynecology or pediatrics. My mom was like, no, she'll do what she wants to do. And she'll be her own boss. And so I think a large part of why my mom felt that way was because she never felt she had that opportunity. And usually when you ask people what they believe, why they believe,

and if they would have done things differently, you get a lot farther than saying, this is what you should do because I said so or the numbers said so or you're wrong. Even if they don't change their minds, and it's not always my job to change their minds, at least you get to hear a different perspective and they get to hear yours with more open ears. Is there anything about your religion

that you feel like could improve or could evolve to bring more peace to it? I think that my religion, across the board, I think religions, but speaking specifically about mine, I think that without the leadership and interpretation of women, there is very little room for growth. I think anything without inclusive, and I'm not saying unilaterally 100% women. What I'm saying is if you do not have the people most impacted by policy or by religious interpretation all at the table, then whatever is decided will never be representative of the communities it governs.

So if I have a community where it's 50% women, 50% men, and all the rules are being set by men, then it will never be reflective of the people it governs. It will never be legitimate to them. I, as a young woman, didn't often go to the mosque, didn't feel welcome there, didn't feel like it was a place where I found most spiritual comfort. I actually felt a lot more spiritual in hospitals. I feel like the walls of a hospital here are more prayer than any congregation. Wow.

And I think that unless we have that inclusivity, unless we approach religion with that level of inclusivity, religion, it just, it doesn't have the room for growth. It doesn't have the space. Do you think religion, with that much power and that much time that's been around, has the ability to change? I think it has to. I think it has to. I think we're still— Otherwise people will just leave the religion. They're leaving.

And it loses its power. Yeah. I mean, it's interesting because I've been asked this question before and somebody disagreed with me. They said, listen, religion is never going to lose its power. It has all this land and there's all this money and there's all this, like— Buildings and this. Yeah, there's an established power. And that's true.

There will always be an established level of power and structural power and institutional power. But that dilutes over time, especially if people don't adhere to it and if they decide to put their money or their energy or their effort elsewhere. So I think either religions learn to embrace new ideas and new voices or they are going to become less fit for purpose than they are. Are there any women making decisions in your religion? There are. Oh, no, no, there are. There's incredible stories about, I mean, there's Murshidat, which is a group of women scholars in Algeria who do significant work on domestic violence. And there's judges in Morocco that have been able to completely transform laws. And there's, no, there's incredible stories. I mean, Islam has a very rich history of women being very powerful. But as most religions in today's day and

age, I mean, if we look at almost any sensitive conversation as it relates to women across the spectrum, so looking at the United States and the conversations we're having about reproductive rights in a country that's meant to be secular, there is a division between state and church. And yet a lot of the conversations we're having have heavy religious undertones. And that's meant to be secular. There is a division between state and church, and yet a lot of the conversations we're having have heavy religious undertones. And that's the same in the Middle East. A conversation that is not meant to have those undertones, they get brought in. And people are told, well, you should think this way

because this is what religion says, even though it's not a conversation about that. And they get skewed a lot. So education is a good example, where you'll have scholars that lean a particular way, say, okay, girls shouldn't be educated, religiously you know we have the prophet himself saying i will stand between the gates of hellfire for a man who educates his daughters so you have these two different worlds and those those narratives are not getting out there with the same frequency as the more

fear-mongering terrifying like you need to do this or else it's the end of your community and the end of life as you know it and the way of your life, et cetera. So I think it's really about who holds the power and who we need at the table. What do you wish powerful men knew more about powerful women? You know, I actually, I think I wish powerful men knew more about other powerful men, if that makes sense. I wish powerful men, I wish powerful men asked themselves about what, I wish powerful men were more accountable for their actions. That is probably what I wish most for powerful men. I personally, I think you, it'd be tough for me to get through my work and for anyone to get through life if they felt everybody was like malintentioned. So I tend to walk into a room and hope that's not how I view it.

So I assume that everybody, most people, I won't say everybody, I'm not that poly on it, but most people approach work and life with their best intentions. They might not have the same intentions I do. It might be the best intentions just for their family or just for their community, but I assume they're approaching life with intentionality in some way. And I wish that they took that intentionality and they took that perspective and they asked themselves just about accountability. So if this is the best for my family, who is it not serving? Or what is the impact I'm having? Or what could I be doing better? And I, you know, my dad, when we were growing up, always had this incredible quote he would tell us about how God's mercy is greater than his wrath. And so my dad would always tell us, no matter what you do, you can come and talk to me.

And I think. That's comforting. It's comforting. And I think he did that because my dad didn't always do that. When we were, I think when he had like younger first kids. Punished them. It was a lot more about like, I'm your father, you know, because I think when he had younger first kids. Punish them. It was a lot more about like, I'm your father, because I said so. Respect me.

Exactly. And I think as we got older, he realized you can't, it's two on 11. You're not going to win this. This is not a game you're going to win. There's 11 kids. So I think he was like, wait a second. Being loving is going to get me a lot farther than, being their friend is going to get me a lot farther.

And it did because I would approach my dad and I would tell him what I was challenging with. And I genuinely believe, I view my dad in my life and in our community as a person with power. He was privileged. He was male. He had influence. He had power. He had credibility.

People listened to him. They still do. And I recognize his ability to leverage his power to support his daughter so publicly, to support his family, to be so open, to be open-minded, to be malleable, to have compromise. He would say, either you convince me or I convince you. We won't leave the table before that happens. So to be that person, he really did look at the accountability of his power. And I do wish more powerful men, and to your question, even more powerful women would ask themselves, okay, what am I accountable for? Because we can all look at, I can look at my metrics of what I've done today at work, but I'm also accountable for what I'm doing at home. And I'm accountable for who I am when, you know, people aren't watching. And I'm

accountable for, those are all, I think, standards that we need to look at ourselves by. It's funny because my whole life until about five years ago, when I was talking about before, everything for me was a competition. It was win-lose. Because I played sports and that's all I knew. It's like you win and you get the result or you lose. And that was the socially acceptable. You were a winner. Yeah, exactly. And if you were a loser, then you're a loser in your life. Like that was your identity. You always lost, right? So I would, I wasn't intentionally trying to hurt people, I don't think, but I just always wanted to win. I always wanted to be right because I didn't want to feel like a loser.

And it wasn't until I literally learned the concept of win-win at 30 years old. I probably heard it sometime when I was younger, but I didn't sink in. I was like, no, I have to win at all costs. And when I learned that principle, it transformed my life because it made me so conscious of all the decisions, all the conversations, every action. Made you accountable. Very. And it made my, you know, made me more responsible with, like, the power that I do have. Exactly. Or the opportunities I do have.

And it's even farther. It's like, what's the win, win, win opportunity in every decision that I make? 100%. Every action, you know? 100%. It's like what's the win-win-win opportunity in every decision that I make? A hundred percent. Every action, you know? A hundred percent. And I tell people, because when we talk about privilege, somebody asked me, you know, okay, well, a friend of mine actually said, well, how do I leverage my privilege? And I said, the same way I leverage mine. We all have privilege and we're all disprivileged in different spaces of our life.

Some of us have exceedingly more. Some of us have exceedingly less. But there are certain audiences, when I walk in, they're going to listen to me more than when you walk in, right? Because they're going to identify me. They look like me. They feel I have maybe same life experiences, et cetera. And there are some where you have that access and that point of view. So leverage whatever privilege you have to ensure that somebody else is part of that conversation. Or ask yourself, are you being accountable to that community? And when you said, okay, so I was always competitive, I used to, about five, six years ago, two years into my work, so I was 23. And I used to, when people weren't doing something

the way I felt it should be done, or when people weren't understanding my perspective, I would be like, this guy is doing this on purpose. Like, I've explained it multiple times. He's still not getting it. He just doesn't want to listen. What a jerk. I know, what a jerk.

Seriously, I'd be like, I don't like, because to me it didn't make sense. Like, you've now heard this multiple times. I clearly, you know. I told you all the facts. Exactly. That are all accurate. Like, I've laid it out.

I'm pretty sure, you know, like, I've done this for you. I've done your homework. You just need to. And it wasn't until an older mentor of mine was like, it's not that I don't get it. I do. But I'm also walking and thinking of my organization and what my company needs. And so we all walk in. I mean, we can be all part of the same conversation and all have intentions that are good, but that are for you about winning and for me about something else.

And until we recognize that you can win as well, I can too, we can all get there, but we actually just have to listen to each other and have a bit more of an open conversation and then be accountable for what we say and what we do. And I think that when it comes to power and leadership, a lot of people can get intention on board. It's a lot more difficult to be accountable for your actions. It's a lot more difficult. And so that's probably the one thing I would want. So what are some of these conversations that you're having with? Is it mostly with companies or is it with politicians where you're trying to bring peace or how does that work? So it's oftentimes like heads of state,

ministerial level. And then of course, we work a lot with corporations because corporations are a huge part of that engine of peace and sustainability, as I mentioned. Civil society, we have conversations sometimes with military factions or militias, so non-state actors. It really depends on the particular conflict. My personal favorite conversations actually are, and I had been mentioning this, that we did a talk at Merrill Lynch recently and I said, listen, the difference between corporations and governments right now is super interesting to me. Because corporations are, for the most part, younger, more diverse, more bottom line thinking to a degree. You know, there needs to be an actual empirical output for them to make a particular decision or to follow through on something.

And governments have not gotten that same framework to a significant degree. So having conversations with both of them in the room where corporations are steadily increasing a lot of their own political power and their own clout because they now have communication mechanisms they use on their own and they don't rely on governments to be able to have outreach, leverage, or economic success has been very interesting. Wow. When you're working with two different people who have massive conflict or are disagreeing, what's the best way to bring the peace? or disagreeing, what's the best way to bring the peace? I think mediating. Usually just getting our, in peace negotiations and conflict negotiations, the number one rule is always talk about the most common denominator first.

So if you know that one area of the agenda, one area of the negotiating agenda is going to be a lot more sensitive, you leave it a little bit later. Really? Yeah. Usually you can bridge people on something they agree with and they can get to know each other. Yeah. They can get to know each other.

A bit of little whims. A bit of little, yeah. And, well, it becomes a bit more personal but a lot less zero-sum game, if you will. Because people are like, wait, Lewis, you're actually a good guy. I know you. We agree on this. Right, right. And they'll be more willing to have negotiations about other things. Believe in the same things.

Exactly. But if you bring the contentious issue first, people just get up and leave the table. They won't even- Really? Yeah, they won't. Oh, they won't stay. Yeah, they'll leave the table. They'll be like, this is what you don't, you're completely, I mean, I've been in rooms where

they've been like, you're barbaric. I'm not even wasting my time. You're a bad person. Oh my gosh. And they'll get up and leave. So if you can bring something that most people agree on in the beginning, start with some light conversation, get people to see each other as human. You can usually get much farther.

Talk about their kids. Talk about something that they both agree on. Family. Kids is fantastic. Show me photos of your kids. I take photos of, so my niece is three turning four years old. And she has older brothers and one younger brother. So she is the only girl.

And this is a family where the boys play Smash Bros and all those video games, Fortnite, which we've been talking about. Halo. Halo, yeah. And so she has two older brothers who are 19 and 16, and then one who's four. So across the board, she's seeing video games, and then she's seeing, you know, sorry, the five-year-old brother who's now, you know, playing with, what's the game, Zelda? He dresses up as Link and he wants bows and arrows and all of that. So that's what she sees. So she wanted to be Spider-Man during Halloween. And I open up with this story about my niece, Sophia, being Spider-Man and how surprised parents were that she was still wearing her costume three months later and she called it her uniform. It wasn't a costume to her. And I always open up with that story because i don't have kids so i can't use

my own but my sister's kids are totally up for grabs and people people put their guard down or i'll talk about watching reality television and you'll have really intelligent people suddenly be like oh my god me too right and they don't feel like they have to put on a show yeah they don't they don't put on a show so you don't put on a show. So you can usually just talk with people, get them to get to know you, and then they're more willing to listen. Sounds like you've taught your niece well. She understands with great power comes great responsibility. Oh, you should. She actually, I used to. This is the one best story about Spider-Man. So I told her, I was like, I'm going to write a book about this. You're going to be the superhero

in the book. And she's like, I'm not a superhero. I'm Spider-Man. And I told her, I was like, I'm going to write a book about this. You're going to be the superhero in the book. And she's like, I'm not a superhero. I'm Spider-Man. And I was like, okay. We have a bit of like, you know,

we can't really use that. There's copyright issues, but we're going to work around it. So she's very sweet. How many mediations have you done? Oh, a lot.

I mean, over a hundred. On different issues. There's some that are on trade. There's some on health. There's some on economic growth. There's some on conflict. So, yeah, significant amount. Some on the sustainable development goals themselves. Who are the two different parties

usually you're working with? Usually well, it depends. Is it a company and a government? Two governments? It depends. Usually it's governments. So, I work with a lot of governments. That's an area that I tend to do well with. With governments? Yeah, with usually the state actors. So governments, oftentimes corporations, yes. Those are the ones that we

have because most of the conversations in the past couple of years have been about the sustainable development goals and about different metrics. So if we're talking about gender equality, usually that's with governments and then civil society or governments and corporations. How can we move the needle forward on women's rights in your community? What are we doing wrong? The government needs to earmark 15% of its budget on civil society, specifically towards women's rights. Okay, women's rights organizations, what does that mean for you? Because you can get around those earmarks really easily.

So it's really about getting everybody at the table who usually have their ideas and their opinions and their talking points and just making sure that those links are there and then getting them to sign the dotted line. What's been the most challenging mediation you've faced where you felt like, man, this might create a war or create some type of chaos that I didn't want to have? A lot of the gender and reducing inequalities have been...

Those are the most challenging. Yeah, for me they are because they're the ones that are most personal to me. It is a lot more about what you bring to the table as well. And so for me, most things I can distance myself from and I can be like, hey, we can analyze this. This is economic growth. This is what makes sense. This doesn't, et cetera.

But for me, the gender equality, especially as it relates to health, so women's reproductive rights, if I'm sitting and we're trying to mediate a situation where we're saying, okay, this needs to be budgeted, this needs to be approved, this needs to be sanctioned, and I'm not getting the green light I want or I think is necessary, it becomes very personal. Because I know, you know, and the best example I use lately is abortion. I mean, I personally do not care what your personal opinion is on issues. I genuinely don't. I care about the fact that legally, when we're

talking about a legal issue, I don't. Because if I care about everybody's personal opinion, then I keep trying to change their mind. And that's not actually what moves the needle forward. What moves the needle forward is being able to say, okay, here is a substantial legal legislative change that ensures this right. And as a healthcare professional, as a woman, as a minority woman in particular, as a young woman, I mean, I know the data about abortion backwards and forwards. And we can make it illegal, but more women will go and they will try to do self-abort. And more women will die and we'll have higher crime rates 20 years down the line. Oh yeah, maternal mortality increases drastically if you make abortion illegal. Isn freakonomics episode, like when you're allowed to do abortion,

then like the last crime, crime rates decreased 20 years later. Yeah. It's a huge issue. And so, but when you look just at the data for me, so, so when I, when I'm sitting next to somebody who says, well, I don't believe in it and I don't agree with this. And I, for me, those are the most difficult negotiations. Cause I have to really bite my tongue and be like I'm not trying to convince you as a person you and I can disagree on so many issues this is life and death for women around the country around the world and if we don't start looking at those are the tough ones for me because it's really like I can have my own personal opinions I have my own personal opinions about a lot of things but you you feel a lot more accountability and responsibility when you know the decision made at that table will impact women for generations to come and societies for

generations to come. I know we have a long way to go to get to gender equality, but what are a few of the rights that you believe, like if we were able to get to these few things like soon, in the next few years, that it would drastically improve the world. Without a doubt, women's health and women's education. So if you look, if I ask you what are the most cost-effective and practical solutions for climate change, what would your answer be? Cost-effective solutions for climate change? I have no idea. So most people will say like, oh, new energy, reducing emissions.

It's actually girls' education. Recycling, whatever. Yeah, it's girls' education and women's reproductive rights. Why is that? How is that? Because when girls are educated, they get married later. They have less kids. They're more likely to vaccinate their kids. If 10% of the population of girls in a country are educated, they increase that economic GDP, that country's GDP, by 2% to 3%. Wow. If we were to equally educate. Why is that? Because they can work more. Because they can work. They get married later. They work. They join the workforce. Women reinvest 90% of their income

into their local community as opposed to men. Yeah, as opposed to men who reinvest 30 to 40%. They like to buy things, yeah. I know. But they do. They like to buy things locally.

It's a very sustained process, right? And so they create a cycle of education and employment in their community that is unique. And the fact that they're having less kids is important because you can reduce emissions as much as you want.

But unless women are choosing not to have more children because they feel as though they are contributing in other ways, et cetera, you're not going to lower it. And what if more kids in the world just causes more waste? Yeah. Is that what it is? Population is waste, yeah. Waste. Pollution, waste, trash. Exactly.

And the risk becomes, because, again, this is the minority lens I bring to it. We've had, you know, people will be like, well, no, now you're saying that women shouldn't have kids. And that's not what I'm saying at all. What we're saying is women deserve the right to have the choice and the opportunity. And usually when women are educated, they choose to get married later.

They choose to have less children. That's a choice they make because they see their opportunities as being wider. And so, I mean. As opposed to only my role in life is to have kids. Which is what socially, in most countries, is a socially constructed role. Wherever you go, I mean, you could go to parts of the United States. You could go to parts of Uganda, parts of Libya, parts where people say, like, your number one role.

Great, you can be a teacher, a doctor. But your number one role is to sustain this community, right? And to have kids. And so I think, honestly, climate change, security, economic growth, almost anything you look at, girls' education, women's reproductive rights, if we could get those two things, you'll see more women in business because they'll have the education and the capability to go. They'll have cultivated an ecosystem. They'll, I mean, those two things. And I lump into reproductive rights, the ability to have children comfortably. So paid leave, you know, maternity leave, child care. Not stressed

to have kids. Exactly. Exactly. Not this belief that, okay, you can't, like, it has to be a choice, right? So you have the choice to have kids in an organic, healthy way where you have support from social systems. So you have child care, you have maternity leave, et cetera, or you choose not to have kids, but you choose that because you have that education, you have the opportunity to be able to sustain everything for yourself. So it really is looking at those two because they open up the door for everything else. Wow. Are we having too many kids in the world? How many people in the world right now? A little over 7 billion. A little over 7 billion. The world's going to continue to grow. That's not going to change, right? And we're not going to, like, I don't support anything like

the one child policy or telling women that they can we're not going to, like, I don't support anything like the one-child policy or telling women that they can't have kids either. I just, I fundamentally believe that there are a lot of things that happen socially, like child brides, where young girls are forced to do things that they should not be forced to do. And oftentimes families do feel, this is where intentionality comes in, because I used to think, like, how could you give your daughter away like that? How do you sell your daughter? And it makes you really pessimistic about the world. So you have to take a step back and say, okay, so this is what they felt was the only opportunity for them

and their family and their daughter. Because they weren't educated. Or they weren't educated. Exactly. And so it's, okay, how do we bring opportunity to these families to make different decisions, to make better decisions? And it really does start with education. It really does. Education, women's reproductive rights. Give women choices. Give women opportunities. Let them lead. Do young girls not have education?

They not have the ability to go to school right now? What's the challenge? Well, I mean, if you look at 60% to 70% of illiterate youth are women. Women are more likely. I feel like it'd be a lot of boys who just, like, don't want to go to school. I never wanted to go to school. I was like, get me out of here. Well, in many countries, you're legally required though, right?

So in many countries, you have to legally go until you're 16. That's not the same case. Is it true? I don't know. Yeah. And the huge drop-off is actually based on age. So you see a huge change for girls once they hit puberty. So once girls start getting periods in many parts of the world.

They're embarrassed or they don't want to go. They don't go to school. There aren't sanitation. There's not proper sanitation. And obviously when they hit puberty, they also become a reproductive age. Or they, you know, reproductive. And so a lot of families. Having kids.

Yeah, we'll let them have kids. And then in many parts of the world, they do. They do work. They sustain the family. At 12, you've got to come work. Work at their family's tea shop or whatever. And the reason it's actually super interesting, we were in Bangladesh. I was in Bangladesh relatively recently. And we were talking with a family where the young girl did work at

her family's tea shop. And I asked, okay, so why don't the boys? And they said, well, no, no, the boys can go abroad and they can get better education. They can bring more home for the family. They're more able to migrate out and give us something back. Why is that? Because they can take care of themselves. It's less dangerous or something. Yeah. So it's this entire ecosystem where, I mean, if you walk in and ask people why they're making particular decisions, most families will come back to you. I personally believe most of the challenges that face young girls, women today really do root back to family and to community and to what opportunities they had. And it really does come down to education and really their reproductive, their health rights. So if you feel like all women were able to have education up to, what, 18?

Or as long as they wanted. As long as they wanted. But at least up to 18. At least 12 years of quality, safe education. Yeah. Quality education. Yeah, quality. And they had the choice to... Get married, to Quality and the choice to get married, to not

get married, to have kids, to not have kids, to have kids. And the choice to abort if they wanted to. If they wanted to abort, to abort, to have family planning and contraception. Like a safe choice, not like this pressure that you have to do something. No, exactly. If you think those two things changed around the world, then what would happen? Oh, I think you'd see a lot more women leading companies. You'd see a lot more women leading countries. You'd see a lot more inclusive conversations around security and conflict. You'd see a lot more inclusive conversations around religion. Because a lot of the limitations that are most emphasized about women in faith relate specifically to education and women's rights and women's health rights. Those are where you find a lot of, oh, like, wait,

no, let's, women can work. Great. Let's have a conversation about women's reproductive rights. They can't family plan. And you can't have those two things are oxymoron. You can't have them in the same sentence because if you can't plan when you're having your family, it's unlikely you're going to get much farther ahead in work. Or if you can't plan when you want to get married, it's unlikely that you're going to have the independence and the ability and really the ecosystem to thrive in other ways. So we can talk, and I do, I started my organization and my first thing was to push women in political positions and economic power.

And it took me a minute to step back and say, if we don't address the social challenges, we're not going to get to the point where women feel like they have the ecosystem or the ability or the confidence to do things like run for office. If they never got the education, they start at the obstacle. You can't put people in power if they haven't done the work or got the skills. They won't seek out the power because they won't feel like they're qualified or they won't feel like they're capable of it. Or if you've been married at 12, oftentimes without your consent, 12, 11, 13, if that's been something that's been decided for you, it's very difficult down the line for you to say, wait, I'm going to take the reins and I'm going to change my own situation. There's a lot more obstacles. It's

doable. I know incredible women who have, who, I mean, Jaha Dekure, who is a FGM, female genital mutilation survivor, a phenomenal woman who got, you know, married quite young, forcibly married quite young, has done incredible work, has shifted the conversation, started Safe Hands for Girls, is a role model to other women. It's doable. There are incredible work. Has shifted the conversation. Started Safe Hands for Girls. Is a role model to other women. It's doable. There are those women. It's very challenging. It's challenging.

There's so many more obstacles. What's the biggest challenge you face right now? Because you're in your 20s, right? I'm 28, yeah. 28. Do you feel like you get taken seriously when you're going into these high-powered conflict resolution situations where they're like, you have no clue what you're talking about. You're a woman.

You're this. You're that. You're in your 20s. Like, what do you know about business or government? So when I was 23, I went to my first big, big meeting at the UN. And at the UN, they give you this wooden plaque, and they etch your name in white. And they really show up.

And this was like I had a flip phone, and I was still in white. And they really show up. And so, and this was like, I had a flip phone and I was still taking selfies. Like I was committed. I was so proud of myself. And you were a doctor at this time, right? I was a doctor, yeah. Like working in surgery or? No, I was working, I was with BLW. So I was working with my organization and I was on the advisory board for Resolution 1325, which is Women, Peace, and Security. So it's a resolution the Security Council passed to ensure that women have leadership roles in conflict and peace resolution, but also that they're protected because there are often challenges that women unilaterally face in conflict. So I walked into this meeting.

I had been prepared. I prepared nonstop. You did all your research. You knew all the facts. I showed up early. Showed up early because, I mean, come on. I'm an overachiever. It's type A personality, but also a woman and a minority.

So I knew that, you know, I had to show up before everybody else. Had to be prepared to answer everybody's question because I was representing myself. And then, of course, all Muslim women, young women. And so I sat at my chair. I was one of the first. And a young intern a couple years older than me maybe came up to me. And she was like, you know, that's Dr. Moravitsi. And I hear he's quite difficult.

That you were sitting in. That I was sitting in. It's Dr. Moravitsi. and I hear he's quite difficult. That you were sitting in. That I was sitting in. It's Dr. Moravitsy and I hear he's quite difficult. She's like, you can go sit in the back with the rest of the support staff. You're like, that's me. I know, but I had one of those moments, I don't know if this has ever happened to you, where you kind of like watch yourself from far away. And I just picked up, and nobody, when I tell them this story, they're like, you didn't say something back.

But like I just picked up my stuff and I went and I sat in the back. It was like a really weird, it was one of those imposter syndrome things for me where I was like, wait, what, what? And it wasn't until some of my colleagues came in and they said, come back, sit at your seat. So I went and I sat and I spent this meeting that I had prepared so much for, like two hours. And I don't know if you do this when you're in the car or the shower where you're like, oh, I should have said this. Could have said this. This would have been perfect. This would have been the perfect rebuttal. So I did that for a good two hours.

And about 10 minutes before the end of the meeting, one of my colleagues said something that just didn't make sense. So I looked up. And I'm super thankful he did that because as I looked around the room, they were all older men. There was not a single young woman at the table except for me. So when I spoke to the intern after, because we had a wonderful conversation, she came up to me and apologized and was really, really gracious, which made me feel bad about all the mean things I was going to say. She said, you know, I've never seen anyone who looks like,

you know, me or you, like, at the table. And that, I started a women's mentorship program after that for minority women and now men. I really began to think to myself, I always ask, where are the young women when I walk into a room? Where are the young men? Where are the different, where's the inclusivity? And until we start leveraging our own positions of authority and power to bring it in with us, it won't happen. Nobody is asking. I mean, when I walk into a room, I don't think many people are asking, oh, wait, where are people who look like Ella? Or I very rarely will go, like, where are people who look like Louis?

You know what I mean? We always wonder where we are. But I don't think it really crosses many other people's frame of mind to look for inclusivity in the room. And I think we need to start doing that a lot better. What's the skill you think you could learn to improve everything you're doing more? Oh, I think I could be more empathetic. And I think more kind to myself. Kind to myself and kind.

I think a lot of my challenges with a lot of my work is that I am, yeah, yeah. I think I could be more. How often do you beat yourself up? I have five brothers and five sisters. And so if you think you wanted to win when you were young. It's not necessarily beating myself up. I usually think that if something wasn't accomplished, then I am partly at fault.

Or I could have done better. I could have listened better. And I would say that's usually where a lot of challenges come from for most people. So yeah, being a bit more kind to myself. Recognizing I can't do everything I want to do in a day and that's okay. I think I would be a much better leader if, oh, and probably being less, like I'm very type A. I can tell. Yeah. Well, I've been hiding it really well in this conversation.

Yeah, right. But I'm very type A. And I think the two of them are very connected. But I would say being a lot kinder to myself and being a lot more empathetic to challenges that other people face. Oftentimes people I disagree with most. So I can be very empathetic with- You don't have as much compassion for them. Yeah, I don't. And it's a bad, but I've noticed it especially recently as things are becoming more polarized. I will find myself in a meeting being like, you have all the power. You are economically powerful. You have privilege in this community.

Why are you doing this? And my level of compassion for them is very different than, for example, a single mother fleeing from a country. And I find that would be a place I should probably work on because when I do kind of force myself to be like, you know what?

They also have that personal baggage we were talking about. And they also were raised by parents in a particular way. And they're also. Some trauma or fears. Trauma, fears, probably being very intentional about, you know, making sure that they keep the money for their family so their kids can have it. Like if I give them the same assumption of positive intention, the conversation goes a lot farther. But it's so much harder for me to do that. It's hard for me to admit that, but it's hard for me to do that.

What are the things you say to yourself when you're mean to yourself? Probably that if I had, my big one is if you slept more, you probably could have gotten that. Another one is I usually wish that my brothers, like I'd be like, oh, if your siblings were in the room, this would be a family joke. That's a big one. I have a very supportive family, but there's also high expectations. So it's a double-edged sword. Those are probably the big two. The internal conversation. I have a lot of internal conversations, but those are probably the big ones. The big ones are, you know, if you, you could have been on top of this. That's probably the biggest one. Like if you just.

Didn't do enough work. Yeah. If you plan differently, you could have done this. That's probably the biggest one. Like if you just didn't do enough work. Yeah. If you plan differently, you could have done this. And usually as I've gotten older, I've begun to learn. They're usually things that are not necessarily always in my control. That could be true sometimes, but for the most part, I can't change a lot of things. So I've gotten much better at being like, you know what, if it happens, it happens. You know, I did the best I could. I put it all there, but if it didn't work out because of areas out of my control, but that's still very difficult for me. I have a lot of trouble.

So I do think like, oh, if you had showed up earlier, if you had spoken to them before the meeting and told them, for example, about your niece and they had that human connection with you, then when you sat down for the negotiation, they would have completely changed their minds. I write romantic comedies in my head about what I should have done differently. Do you feel like you connect more to people's heads or hearts? It depends on the person. It depends on the person. I think with people like my dad and myself, definitely heads a little bit. I'll throw in a few heart stories. I think hearts change their

minds, but I think heads give them almost the personal permission to listen to me. So they almost assume I have more credibility and then they'll start having real personal conversations with me. So I think it's a mix of the two. And then there are some individuals that I don't need to really get into the statistics and the data. I can have a nice two-hour conversation with them and at the end they'll be like, you know what, I'm going to research that more. So it really depends, but I think it's a good mix of the two though. Who is the most inspiring leader in the world to you? Oh, my mom. My mom raised 11 kids.

She raised 11 kids, moved from a country where she didn't know the language to a very, for her, hostile place. My mom. What's the greatest lesson she's taught you? Lewis, why are you doing this? I don't know, maybe. So I have two older sisters. My oldest is a pediatric plastic surgeon, very successful, very in that way. And the second one is a stay-at-home mom, very successful.

And they are both 100% dedicated to what they do. And I think the single greatest lesson my mom gave me was that she created an ecosystem where two girls, where all her daughters, my other sister's in medicine, my other sister, you know, where all her daughters could aspire to be whatever they wanted to be and feel like, and make those decisions. My mom taught me that you get to make the choice. And she didn't get to make a lot of choices. So yeah. Yeah. It's a powerful mom. It is. She is. She's a powerful, my parents in general, my dad's going to get so mad that I didn't say him too. He won't, but. What's the greatest lesson he taught you? Sacrifice. Easily. Sacrifice what? Sacrifice that sometimes that great leaders

do not put themselves first. That you do what you do for your... And he's probably the person who's taught me most about intentionality. That you do what you do for those around you if you're good at doing sacrifice. Wow. How about you? Greatest leader or greatest? Greatest leader. I really like the way Obama showed up with a powerful and connected energy. I felt like he did a great job of his way of being.

Of his message of hope. Yeah, his way of being and Of his message of hope. Yeah, his way of being and his presence and his ability to connect to people. I really enjoyed watching that, and I think he delivered it well. Is that something you personally learned from? I've never met him, but I mean just by watching. Yeah, but something that you think about?

I'm always thinking about, you know, who are the people that are making the biggest change in the world? Who are the people that are making the biggest impact? Maybe not directly. Who are the people that make the biggest change to you? You know, it's going to sound, I mean, my parents obviously make a huge impact on my life. And they taught me a lot of everything almost.

But I'm constantly learning from people. I mean, I'm learning a lot from you right now. Every time I sit down with someone, I ask questions. And I like to learn from people. I mean, I'm learning a lot from you right now. Every time I sit down with someone, I ask questions and I like to learn from everyone. It doesn't matter if they're a person of power or... What's the most important lesson you've ever learned that you feel like? What's the lesson that stuck with you? The thing that sticks with me the most is health. It's going back to health because without health, you can't make an impact in the world. If you're not fully feeling well, health because without health, you can't make an impact in the world. If you're not fully feeling well, emotionally, spiritually, physically, you're going to be in pain and you're not going to be able to have the energy or the presence to show up fully. Yeah. And so I think health is the key

to a fulfilling life. So that's saying you can't pour from an empty cup. That's it. And I remember when Steve Jobs was talking about it in his last couple months, he was like, I would give all these billions back to have like another year of my life, a week of my life, a day of my life, but the cancer took over. And he's like, I created this, you know, it's like through this, this, you know, engine that he had for his desires. But I think that lesson, it's just why I get up early and work out. It's why I try to get as much sleep as I can because I know that I'm not going to be able to achieve my dreams if I'm not healthy. Exactly. If you're not taking care of you.

That's it. And so it's funny because you said sacrifice, but I think you've got to sacrifice a lot of other things to make sure your health is there for you. Oh, 100%. Yeah. And I'm not necessarily sure that my parents taught me the lesson about health. My dad's a doctor, but doctors are notoriously the worst patients.

Unhealthy, yeah. Oh my God, they're the worst patients. Horrible. Oh, horrible. So when my dad got diabetes, we'd be like, Dad, you have to go

for your checkup. Got it. I went to medical school. But doctors don't learn about nutrition and don't learn about sleep. Oh, gosh. They learn about prescriptions.

Not at all. Well, now there's, I agree with you on that one. I think the previous generation of doctors, even when I went to med school, this generation I'm actually super – It's more evolved. Yeah, because they have more wellness classes. They have more family health classes, which I like. And I think it's part of that connection we were talking about, about health and economic growth.

It's because, for example, I'm Canadian, right? So in Canada, health care is taxed. You pay taxes, and it'm Canadian, right? So in Canada, healthcare is taxed. You pay taxes and it's social, right? So I will, if you get a car accident, my taxes will go to you as much as they might come to me. Who knows where they'll go? And so there's a lot more interest in preventative healthcare. So the medical schools have really been shaped around this notion of, okay, if we want to prevent obesity and all the implications of obesity, the amount of money you're going to be spending on heart disease, the amount of money you're going to be spending on heart disease, the amount of money you're going to be spending on neurodisease, all of those things, then let's

start talking about preventative. Let's talk about family health and let's talk about what kind of fruit you need to buy. And let's talk about, do we even have, I mean, because- Do we move our bodies? Are we walking? Are we working out? Not even just that, but do we have the right shops in the right neighborhoods? Like, can you even buy fruit in your community? And if you can't, why? Let's talk about the inequalities that exist. Because health is so fundamentally connected to the structures and the institutions and the community around you. So that's, I mean, yeah, I don't think,

my parents never taught me the lesson about, like, okay, you take care of yourself first. But it's probably been a lesson I've had to self-teach. My husband is really good at it. He's very, like, he'll wake up at 4 a.m. and go for these super long runs, and he'll be like, it's an investment. Whenever I tell him, like, I'm going to go to this Pilates class. Yeah. Like, yeah, it's good. It's an investment. You should. It'll clear your mind. So that's been better. I have good friends who inspire me to do that. But I think it's a harder lesson, particularly for women, to be like, hey, you need to prioritize

yourself to get everybody else in line after you. you. I think health has been a great lesson, but also just a growth mentality, a growth mindset. And the way that you continue learning. You know, education is so powerful. School, not necessarily as powerful, but education is powerful. Oh, yeah. And that's why it has to be quality education. Exactly. Because education means different things.

It can be vocational. It can be community-based. It can be really dismantling the structures and the norms in your own community that limit you. So it means so many different things. There's two things. My dad taught me a couple things. First, I was raised in a religion that was created by a woman called Christian science, and it was all about mind over matter. And so we didn't take medicine growing up because the religion was all about we are spiritual beings and we can never be harmed physically. So my dad instilled this belief that I am a spiritual being, therefore I can never be

harmed physically. Although it contradicted itself when I was like, why am I in pain? Why did this, you know? I think I need some medicine. Exactly, right? So it was over the top with it. But at the same time, he didn't believe in time. He was always on time, but he believed in like an infinity. He didn't believe that my age. Time is a social construct. He was just like, he never carried a watch. We never celebrated my birthday. And I never understood why. I was like, why are all these other kids celebrating their birthday? Do you not love me? You know, am I not good enough or whatever? And he goes, it's not about that. He said, too many people are held back by how young or how old they are on their dreams.

He's like, I never want you to be held back. I want you to know that you can achieve or go after anything at any age. At any age. And so that was one of the greatest lessons he gave me. That's an incredible lesson. Because when I was in my early 20s, I just never thought that I wasn't able to do something. Because you were too young. Exactly.

And I didn't have a degree. And I didn't have the skills. And I didn't have this. I was like, I'm going to go after it. That's incredible. But have you had like, have you made up on all the birthday cake you missed out on? I've had a lot of sugar. Okay, good. That's my advice. Yeah, that's my advice. As long as long, the one thing I'm, I mean, be a kid of like a kid in 11, birthdays become a thing. Every week you get a birthday. Every week, but no, but my birthday became like, it was a birthday month because you only get one day of the year where you're just, you're the big deal.

So I'd be like, my birthday is today. And from like literally 4 a.m., I'd be like, where is my pancake cakes? Wow. My presents. Well, I wasn't really big on presents. I just wanted people to celebrate me. It was a very selfish thing.

Do a song and take a video of me. Exactly, exactly. So as long as you've gotten to retroactively celebrate all those birthdays, then that's good. If you could solve one thing before your life is over, what would that be? One thing. I'm sure you'll solve many, but if you could solve one. Oh no, we're lucky if I get one thing. I don't know. If you asked me like five years ago, I would definitely say girls' education. I think that would be it that for me is a big not even just education girl like yeah so for me it's a mix of health care and education but probably I'd probably actually go more on reproductive rights now maybe it's because of my age but um ensuring that women

have the choice when they want to to make certain decisions about their bodies and that they know that their bodies are theirs to make decisions about, particularly in the Muslim world. We don't have as many challenges with things like abortion, but we do with things like, okay, so your job is to be a mother. That reproductive mentality is definitely there. So that would be something I would hope to solve

and really be able to widen the conversations there. But to be honest, I actually don't think that would be it. If there was one thing I could solve, I don't know. I don't have the answer to that question anymore. If you could snap your fingers right now and something would be honest, I actually don't think that would be it. If there was one thing I could solve, I don't know. I don't have the answer to that question anymore. If you could snap your fingers right now and something would be resolved. Oh, gosh. No, then if I could snap my fingers, it would be women's reproductive rights.

That women around the world would have reproductive rights and would also be able to have those conversations in their communities and in their families. Because I think that silence and that almost like, no, we don't talk about periods. We don't talk about whatever, makes it very difficult for women to see themselves as healthy and whole and human. And so that would definitely, if I could snap my fingers, that would be it. And what's the difference between education and empowerment? Well, I think so. You can go to, and I did, right? So you can go to school, you can learn math and

science and all of that, right? You can, and the best example here is I'll give you math. You can learn math until you're grade 12. You do your arithmetic, your algebra, your calculus, whatever, and you can be the smartest math student. And then you can get your first credit card and checkbook and you can be in debt because you have no idea how numbers actually work. You're not empowered to understand. You don't understand personal finance. You don't understand it. And you're not empowered to understand what the implications are for you and what your role is in that and the accountability of it. Nobody sat you down and taught you that. And usually, I think empowerment is a combination of, yes, understanding those basics and those foundations and knowing, yes,

how to read and write. I do think those are very important, the basics of education. But also having the space in your own life to learn about the daily reality of life and having the space to make mistakes and the community to pick you back up and to grow and to have people particularly, like I wouldn't be here if it weren't for incredible mentors. I know that. The arrogant half of me likes to be like, well, you know, I got here much, you know, quick. Yeah, I'm a self-made woman. I got here pretty quick. But the reality is a lot of people had to sacrifice for me to be where I am. And a lot more people looked at me and said, I think I have an opportunity for you. Or I see something in you.

Or I can leverage this for you. Or, you know, would you like to go to lunch with me? And these little moments where I got to learn and got to absorb from really impressive, interesting people who ranged from everything from my sister, who is a stay-at-home mom who taught me probably everything I know about time management, as only a mother can do, to women who have led countries and have transformed the world. So, I mean, I wouldn't be here if it weren't for incredible women. And I think empowerment comes with mentorship. It comes with somebody sponsoring you in that growth. It comes with the ability to make mistakes and to have the self-awareness and education. And I think that's where education comes in, to know that that mistake isn't the be-awareness and education, and I think that's where education comes in, to know that that mistake isn't the be-all and end-all. It doesn't mean you're a

loser. You can move forward. You can do better. You can learn more. You can change things. And I think the greatest thing education provides, even, you know, especially actually, that in the school, reading, writing, I think it provides for a child, it provides value to a degree. And it says you are worthy of learning and you are worthy of knowing, and we're going to invest time in you. And we're going to invest effort in you. And I think there are a lot of kids in the world that don't get that feeling. So for me, that's what education and empowerment, I think are two sides of the same coin. Yeah. This is called the three truths that I ask everyone at the end. So imagine you get to choose the day you leave

this earth. Oh, wow. It could be many years, a hundred years away, whatever day you want it to be. You've achieved everything you want. Okay. You've lived your life fully. Oh, that'd be nice. You know, women's rights, reproductive rights, everything, education, it's all happened. Oh, fantastic. Everything you want to happen. You're painting a really pretty picture for me. Exactly. I believe it, it will happen. And you've done it all. And it's the time for you to leave. You get to choose the moment. You know, your whole family, everyone's there celebrating you. It's a great, peaceful moment, right? Okay. But for whatever reason, everything that you've put out into the world, your work, your videos, you know, writings, whatever it may be, it's got to go with

you. So no one has access to your information anymore. Okay. But you get to write down three things you know to be true, the three lessons that you would leave behind. And this is all people would have to have access to your wisdom, right? Let's just hypothetically. Okay. What would you say are your three truths or three lessons for humanity? Read more, like know history. I don't think anybody can make wise decisions without knowing the history of them, without knowing the roots of challenges. So if you want to talk, for example, about when we were talking earlier about population, the nuances of that conversation are deeply connected to colonialism and to a history that is very powerful and very detrimental. So I think

knowing history would be my first truth. Always know the issue and the history of the issue. Never take it at face value would be my first truth. The second would probably be there is nothing better than like a good family. Like not a good family, but a good, and it doesn't necessarily have to be your blood family. It can be friends you cultivate. It can be a community you cultivate. But cultivate a community that is on your side because almost everywhere you go, you'll find people who aren't. And it's great to go home and to have people who say, you know what, you did your best because I talk down to myself sometimes. And it's good to have people whispering in my ear like, no, you shouldn't do that.

You did awesome. You're great. I think we all need that. I think we all need somebody on our side. And the third would be, I mean, it's particularly to women, but I guess it applies to everybody, but never, never belittle yourself because you give other people permission to. Like never speak, I hate when I hear, like my little sisters there in high school, I hate when I hear them say like rude words to each other because I think you give permission to other people to talk to you like that. So never talk down to yourself. Never speak to yourself, I think. Never speak to yourself or to other young

women in a way that is derogatory or negates their humanity because I think you give other people permission to. And I think that kind of sucks. Those would be my three truths maybe. I like those. Okay, good. It was like a pop quiz. I was worried I was failing. You passed the test. See, this is the type A personality. I'm like, I didn't get to study. You didn't give me, like, next time I need to know. All the questions beforehand. Exactly. How can we support you? Where do you connect online with you? You can follow me on Facebook and Instagram at AlamuraBit or on Twitter at Alamura.

And then, of course, visit my website. We're putting together a book. I'm writing a book right now on the economics of equality. So a lot of things we talked about, about how the data and the heart and head really meet up when we talk about inclusivity. And when we talk about things like health, when we talk about education, there's both the empirical evidence, but also it just makes sense. Like it just, it really does for sustaining successful communities and families and prosperity planet, all of it. It really comes down to being as inclusive as we possibly can be. Can we pre-order that book right now? No, no, not yet, but I will definitely send it to you when we can and you can update the link.

Okay, cool. We will. We'll work on it. What else can we do? How can we support you right now? And you can visit the Omnis Institute. It's the institute that we do a lot of our work out of. Where's that? It's online, the omnisinstitute.com. And we do a lot of work with local leaders in the most dangerous parts of Colombia and in the most dangerous parts of other countries where we really focus on actually bringing a lot of this conversation to local communities that don't have access to things like the internet or schools or really the benefits that we get to have.

Okay. Is there anything else we can do to support you? I mean, I think just be nice to each other. I like it. Listen, negotiate with each other. I don't know. Okay. I think that would probably be.

You spend the most time on Instagram, Twitter? What do you spend the most time on? Probably Instagram lately. And it's at Alamorabit? At Alamorabit. Oh, and actually there's one thing I always give a call to action, and this will probably be it. My friend Tara is here, and she's chuckling because I always do it.

But I think the key thing, and I always tell this to almost every group, you know, I am, and I mentioned it, I am where I am, I think, because other people looked at me and said, you know what, this is something we can cultivate, and this is a person that we can support, this is a person we can provide. And yes, there's a lot of work that went into it, but there's also a lot of support. And I think that's probably the same truth for you. There's people who looked at you and said, you know what,

Lewis, you have something or what do you need? Right. And I think my biggest call to action to men and women alike is think of a woman in your life. It can be a woman at work. It can be a woman at school. It can be a woman in your community. It can be a woman that you don't know very well, but think of a woman in your life who you know is capable, who you've seen do the work, who you know could use the support and leverage your networks, leverage your success, leverage your platform, leverage your voice to ensure that she's elevated in that space. So if that means you're at work and you know when you walk into a board meeting that there is a woman who works with you who would be perfect on that board

and there's questions you're not answering, leverage a bit of your power to say, hey, I think we need to open this board seat. Or if you know that you have this amazing podcast, you can say, hey, I'm going to leverage a bit of my voice and my community to ensure that other women can be elevated in this space. And the reason I say that, honestly, is because we can always talk about the amount of work and the amount of effort we put in. But unless we have somebody patting us on the back, that invisible pat on the back in the meeting or that, you know, opening that door and turning on that light and pulling out that ladder, I don't think we can sustain women's engagement. And honestly, I don't think we can sustain

sustainable development just empirically without it being inclusive. So open the door for a woman. That would actually probably, that's my number one call to action. I like that. Then you can follow me on Instagram. There you go, I like that, I like that. Well, I gotta acknowledge you, for how you show up in the world because you're an incredibly human being. I love connecting with you

and I hope we get to connect many more times. Oh, I hope so, I hope so. Hopefully I can bring some of the heart to your head. I'd acknowledge you for the countless work that you're doing right now. I mean, you're constantly showing up, depriving your sleep every single night, which you need to stop doing.

I'm going to stop. I'm going to stop. To serve humanity and to bring peace to conflicts and to help elevate women and help elevate all people who need more support, more education, more rights. So I really acknowledge the work that you're doing. Thank you. It's a mutual appreciation society. I think, honestly, I said it when I first came in, the conversations you're having about the role of men and what masculinity looks like. I don't think women's rights can move forward

if we don't have honest conversations about what femininity and what masculinity look like and how we're shaping these conversations with our sons and our daughters. And that's why I asked, how many times do women reach out to you? Because I know if I ever had a son, I'd be like, Louis, Louis, tell me what to do. He likes to win a lot. Is this an issue? Like, do I buy him the toy kitchen? What do I, come on, give me, give me a heads up here. So, you know, I think it's incredibly important. And, and I, it's, it's definitely something I think is rare, courageous, and takes a lot of personal vulnerability. And I thank you for that too. My pleasure. Thank you. I appreciate it. Final question. What's your definition of greatness? My definition of greatness. My definition of

greatness is probably the same as my definition of success. And it's the ability to know, for me, greatness would be like if that day where I give you my three truths, if I know that I left no harm, it's leave no harm. It's the Hippocratic oath. I'm such a cop-out. I'm a doctor. But it really is. It's leave no harm. It's if I can't do it and I know I can't do it, then I need to get out of the way so somebody else more efficient can do it. It's try to leave a space in the world where either you've done good or you just haven't created obstacles for other people. You haven't created challenges. So my definition of greatness is people who recognize leadership means

asking others for help when they don't know. That's something else Obama did quite well. It means using your privilege, your leverage, your platform, but it also means

if you don't know what you're doing, get out of the way. Don't do any harm. I think that's the bare minimum that you need to do to be great. You're amazing.

Thank you so much. Appreciate it. Thank you so much. Appreciate it. Appreciate it. Thank you so much. There you have it, my friends. I hope you enjoyed this powerful, inspiring, and moving episode. If you did, make sure to share with your friends, lewishouse.com slash 703 for all the show notes in the full episode, the full video interview, the quotes, where you can connect and learn more

about Dr. Alaa Mrabit as well. And make sure to tag this on your Instagram story at alamarabit, at Lewis Howes. Let us know what you liked about this. Give us some feedback. We want to hear from you and share it with your friends. Text a couple of your friends right now that you think they would enjoy this specific episode. Again, a big thank you to our sponsors. And to reflect on what I really

enjoyed about this episode is that I know there's so much pain and suffering and conflict in the world. And there are certain things that we could do right now to help eliminate so many things that are unnecessary. So many causes that are unnecessary that are hurting us. And as John F. Kennedy said, if we cannot now end our differences, at least we can help make the world safe for diversity. So I ask you to be mindful of the conflicts you're creating and ask yourself, is this really worth it?

Or can I negotiate in certain ways to create a win-win-win experience for my life and the people around me so that we can continue to improve our humanity? I love you guys and thank you so very much. You know what time it is. It's time to go out there and do something great. ស្រូវតែរបស់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពីប្រាប់ពី I'm not a fool