The School of Greatness - 86 The Crushing Reality of Olympic Silver with Shawn Johnson

Episode Date: August 21, 2014

"I talk a lot about the silver medals because it kind of has defined my life." - Shawn Johnson Learn more about the show and get lots of free resources at www.lewishowes.com/86

This is episode number 86 with Olympic gold medalist, Sean Johnson. Welcome to the School of Greatness. My name is Lewis Howes, a former pro athlete turned lifestyle entrepreneur. And each week we bring you an inspiring person or message to help you discover how to unlock your inner greatness. Thanks for spending some time with me today. Now let the class begin. What is up, everyone?

Thanks so much for hanging out with me on the School of Greatness podcast today. My name is Lewis Howes. I am your host, and I'm super pumped to be here with you today. I've got a very, very special guest and a dear friend of mine. Her name is Miss Shawn Johnson. She is an Olympic gold medalist and a three-time silver medalist in gymnastics. If you haven't heard about her, then you've probably been hiding under a rock because she is basically the main person when it comes

to gymnastics. Whenever anyone thinks of gymnastics, they think of Shawn Johnson. She is like the queen of it right now. So she is an awesome individual. She's here in LA. So I had her on the podcast back on episode number, I believe it was 26 or 22. I'll link that up in the show notes for you guys. I believe it was 26 or 22.

I'll link that up in the show notes for you guys. But we had an amazing time the first time talking about the mindset of an Olympic athlete and kind of her rituals for getting ready to perform on such a big stage at 16 years old. I mean, could you imagine the pressure performing the Olympics as a 16-year-old and having to be at your best when a billion people are watching you all over the world. I can't even imagine it. And the pressure that she was able to overcome was astounding. So very excited about her back on the show. So make sure to check out that episode if you haven't listened to it yet to learn about tapping into the Olympic mindset. And this episode is actually a little bit different. We get a little bit more intimate with Shawn.

She opens up in a way I've never heard her open up before. And we talk about what it's like getting second place and getting the silver. Because she actually got three silver medals first before she won a gold medal. And what it's like coming from a place of second place, not winning. She goes into this, actually this energy that's created whenever someone loses and gets second place. When they get third, fourth, or fifth, or beyond, it's still an accomplishment. And when you win, it's an accomplishment. But getting second, there's something interesting that Sean says that happens when you get second.

So we dive into that. We dive into how to realize your self-worth and your worth and your accomplishments when this happens. So maybe you don't get first in everything. Maybe you don't get the job you wanted. You get the second place job or whatever it may be, or the relationships or whatever may be, it doesn't work out the way you wanted it to be. The way you envisioned, the way it was supposed to be. Again, Sean was supposed to win the gold medal and it didn't happen on those four.

She won one of the four. She was supposed to win gold in all four of those events. So I'm very excited about this interview. I'm super grateful for Sean opening up in such an authentic, vulnerable, loving way. And she's just such an incredible human being. So without further ado, let's go ahead and dive into this amazing interview with the one and only Sean Johnson. what's up everyone thanks so much again for coming on and hanging out in the school of greatness podcast i've got my great sweet dear friend sean johnson on what is up sean oh nothing oh nothing what's up with you oh not much the last time i had you on i have to figure

out what episode that was but we had you on before people loved it and right before we did the last time i had you on i have to figure out what episode that was but we had you on before people loved it and right before we did the last one we did some salsa dancing do you remember that we did some salsa dancing i think i was coming from dancing with the stars yeah probably the shows you probably were and yesterday you just got back in town you haven't been here in like six months i feel like it's been forever it's been forever yes we's been forever. Yes. We don't like that. LA misses you. Well, I miss LA. Yes. But. You live in Nashville now, right? Yes.

With your huge puppy that's now not a puppy anymore. Yeah, he's massive. He's 95 pounds. Golden retriever? Yeah, and he thinks he's 10 pounds. He sits in your lap and he's literally bigger than you. Yes. And he's got too much hair.

It's everywhere. Too much hair. Yes. And a lot's happened since then. Yes. Right? Quite a bit. Quite a bit.

But we also, yesterday, we got to do something new for you, which was some acro yoga. I call it acro yoga. It's cheerleading. It doesn't look like cheerleading unless it's- You say acro yoga because it just sounds manlier. It sounds cooler. Yeah. Yeah.

No, it's cheerleading. It's stunting. Yeah. So basically, i've been learning aqua yoga with my special lady friend who sean says i have to say girlfriend so with definitely with jen and uh for a few months and i was like sean i bet you could do some of this stuff let's try it and we did and sean was so against trying to do it the way i wanted to do it my entire career has been like individual gymnastics.

I control everything. Yeah. How different is it than doing like a normal handstand? Completely different. Well, I'll post a picture in the little video on the show notes here. But basically, I'm holding Sean's hands for those that can't see it. And she's upside down on my hands, doing a handstand on my hands. While you're standing.

While I'm standing. And so why is it different? Tell me why is it different than just doing a handstand on the ground. If I'm doing a handstand on the ground, I'm controlling my own body weight in my center of gravity, I guess. And so I put my center of gravity on my fingers.

Then you come along and you're like, you had to put your center of gravity on your palms I've done this for 22 years and for you to change it it was a little much but first like 15 tries it was like this battle I was like forcing Sean's hands in a position

she was forcing mine in a position and you'd just be screaming I'm like stop it I'm not trying to and we'd hold it for like five to ten seconds but it was really ugly we got it at the end

in the last few yeah it started to get really comfortable so hopefully we can get back out there again I just stopped being a control freak

and let you do it oh let me lead I guess so yeah and hopefully we're gonna get you back out again

before you leave your busy schedule this week that would be fun and play some more so yeah I think you'd be great at it

okay it's funny we should show a video of you trying to get on my shoulders oh my gosh we finally got that done too

you're like twice the size of me so climbing on top of your back is like like a tree pole vaulting exactly

it's fun though anyways that was a good time and we got to talk So climbing on top of your back is like pole vaulting. Exactly. It's fun though. Anyways, that was a good time. And we got to talking about just what's been going on in your life. And we're like, we should do a podcast again. And what you started talking to me about was kind of this whole, someone came over when we were doing acro yoga. It was like a park ranger or something and you were like we were talking about he's like hey aren't you an olympic gold medalist and this

and that and we were talking about it afterwards how you've won one gold medal but three silvers right yes three silvers and then i was like well how does that make you feel about you know is it is it worse to get three silvers and one gold or all bronze or what would be better situation? And you were talking about how it's sucks getting silver and you'd rather get bronze or you'd rather get like no metal. Yeah. Why is that? I say that, but I also have lived it. So I also like the other side. So I like silver. But I think silver is the absolute hardest place to get because if you come in first place,

people tell you congratulations. They say you did it, you deserved it, it's awesome. If you come in third place, fourth, fifth, sixth, all the way down, they still congratulate you because it's an accomplishment. For some reason, if you come in second, people no longer say congratulations, but they say, I'm sorry, or you almost had it, or if you did this a little different, you would have had it. And it's kind of just a societal flaw, I guess, that people see a silver as a failure, but any other place is a success.

So when I was competing at the Olympics, how this all got brought up is people always say, you're the Olympic gold medalist or whatever. And they just completely discount the other medals that I have. And for me, it's kind of like when I went to the Olympics and I got the silver medal, nobody was telling me congratulations at all. They were telling everybody around me.

I remember the first interview I did after I got the silver, my first silver. I'm kind of already torn. Which event is this in? The all-around. So the event that you were supposed to win. Yes. The biggest event out there. The one you had all the pressure on yourself for.

Yeah. And everyone was expecting you to win. Undefeated all-around champion for the world championships national championships and you get some reason i come in silver and i was already kind of torn internally as to how i should feel about this silver medal or second place. And my first kind of public, I don't know, experience with whether I had done a good job or disappointed people or was my first interview right after. And, you know, this is normally when they say you're going to Disney world or whatever. I'm trying to figure out what they're going to say, how to prepare my answer. And they stick the microphone in my face and they say, I'm sorry, but you know, how does it feel to lose oh man and as a 16 year old competing at the Olympics

heartbreak I it was kind of a validation that I had disappointed people and at least that's how I took it yeah so it's definitely a learning experience um coming in second saying that everybody congratulates everybody but you, I had to learn how to kind of congratulate myself and not feel like a failure wearing a silver medal at the Olympic Games, even though it's one of the greatest accomplishments you can get. Yeah. So why is that? Why do people say like, I'm sorry for second place a lot? You know, the Super Bowl, no one remembers who didn't yeah um they remember all the great baby playoff games leading up to it and the teams are like fourth fifth but they won't remember the second place so why is that I think

it's just because so much attention in kind of your whole life you're you're taught that winning is everything and you know they also say that if you try you you've done a good job too so they say they say third place you know and on is is an attempt but in a first place is a win so second place kind of just lives in this no man's land abyss yeah and so when i got to experience that i i got my first silver medal in the all-around and had to experience, you know, the press line of I'm sorry's and how does it feel to lose and everything. And, you know, I remember my first answer, and it kind of just came out of nowhere.

I think I was more in shock and just answered from whatever. But I said, I didn't lose anything. I won a silver medal. Wow. Good for you. Good for you, Sean. I look back at that, and I'm like, I was 16. I don't know anything. I won a silver medal. Wow. Good for you. Good for you, Sean. I look back at that and I'm like, I was 16. I don't know where that came from.

That's great. I think there's something to be said for it. But I did that. And then I went on to compete in the team championships. And we came in second as well. And then went on to compete floor finals. Came in second. And it got to be comical.

So you had three silvers in a row. And then I go for the balance beam. And I'm kind of just, again, already checked out. My games are kind of almost over. Getting three silvers and having to deal with the headlines and everything. When you're supposed to win three golds, was everyone putting on you? I had every prediction for a year out saying I'd go in and sweep the floor to get three medals that are silver and already start reading the headlines

and hearing people talk. It kind of hurt, but it also, I had the validation of my coach that I was doing enough, which helped. But going into the beam, I kind of was like, well, I'm going to get silver no matter what, so I don't really care what I do. And I remember going up for that routine and just not caring anymore. It wasn't about a medal.

It wasn't about anything. And I competed a great routine. Couldn't tell you a single thing that went on. I can normally recite every word I ever thought. And I just was in like a no man's land, just on autopilot. Wow. And got a gold. You were in the zone is what it was. You were in the zone. Finished. And then ended up hearing that I got first. And it was kind of like, again, I didn't care. A gold to me didn't mean anything anymore. I felt like the silver almost meant more

because now that I was wearing gold medal, everything seemed almost fake because people feel like they have to say congratulations and they have to tell you good job and give you a high five. And when you have the silver, nobody does that. So you have to actually ask yourself, did I give a performance that was gold medal worthy,

silver, bronze, where do I stand? And with a gold, it's just kind of assumed. It's almost easy. Wow, lots of questions to come up here. Because one, you're getting judged. It's all based on what how many judges are there five three eight eight judges so it's like okay it's all someone else's opinion on if you want or not so you may have had like thousands of other people think that you

would have won but then if these eight judges have your destiny it's kind of like any team sport as well with like football there's refs there's umpires it's like yes there's uh points but it's kind of like any team sport as well with like football there's refs there's umpires it's like yes there's uh points but it's like up to some judgment calls so man this is interesting how is a 16 year old did you know you really first off get back in the zone after these three silvers which would have been heartbreaking in the first place, but also amazing at the same time. Like if I want to, if I want to metal at the Olympics,

I'm excited. Definitely. So I don't care if you make the Olympics, I'm like, my dream is like complete. Right. So I don't know. Just talk a little bit more about this.

Cause I'm just fascinated by how you were feeling. And then also how you dealt with it moving forward. Um, and how other people can really deal with it because i've gotten so many times where i've gotten second place in big games and it sucks it does suck it's not fun obviously not an olympic level but it's like it sucks so how can people um what should they do like i don't even know how to ask these questions right now what should we do? Well, I wrote a little bit about this in my book. And I travel and do speaker series speeches to college kids. And I talk a lot about the silver because it kind of has defined my life. I've thought a few times of if I went back and if I would have gotten four medals

how would my life have been different? Four gold medals. Yeah, four gold medals. Yeah, how would it be different? And I honestly think the Olympics wouldn't have meant as much to me if I would have gotten four gold. Why not?

Because everything would have been too easy. You know, people everywhere around the world would have congratulated me and I would never have had to force myself to go back and reflect and say, did you really deserve those? You know, how do you feel with your performance? How, how do you rate yourself, I guess, and, and how much training you put in and I guess self reflect on the whole process, but with a silver, when nobody's telling you really anything, uh, you, you have to do that. And for me going back, I honestly don't think I could have done anymore. And anything differently

on your performances? Not at all. And I believe everything happens for a reason but for me how to deal with it i guess yes it's when i when i got my first silver in the all-around i i was devastated i had this huge confliction in my heart of i should be proud and i am proud because i gave it everything i had yeah i left everything on the floor but the expectation I had this little part of me that's like, I should have won gold. And how's my coach going to feel? How are my parents going to feel? How's, you know, what are the signs going to read when I walk off that airplane in Des Moines, Iowa now, you know, it's, it's not congratulations with a gold medal. The hometown hero. I just had all these visions in my head. And again, at 16 years old, going through all this,

I was heartbroken. I haven't really admitted that to many people, but I cried myself to sleep that night. I think more in confusion and disappointment of myself. Like I said, I was beyond proud of my performance and so was my coach but i think i was heartbroken just in a sense of confusion more than anything wow didn't know how to handle the next coming months um but from that i feel like again i've i've gained a lot more self-confidence and courage and learned that it's not about the medal,

but it's about how you feel. And people can buy rewards and buy medals and buy people's opinions, I guess, but you can't buy your own. And I think that's the most important one. Interesting. Yeah, I think how you feel, but also the lessons you probably learned from that.

And since then, what would your life be like right now if you won four golds? I don't know. No idea. Would it be a lot different, a little different? Would everything just be given to you on a whole nother level for the rest of your life

so you wouldn't have to rely on your own wisdom or your judgment or learn new things? What would that be like i i think a little bit i mean i think i think i would value material a little more i mean i i would hope not i i have from the midwest i don't think you would yeah um i didn't experience the four gold so i wouldn't know but again i think it just it humbled me a little bit and knowing like what the most important things were it was a weird experience i mean standing at the olympics being given a silver medal and having the metal bears you know say i'm sorry it's kind of like gosh it's a really hard experience they did not say that to you is that putting it around your neck yeah they say i'm sorry. It's kind of like, it's a really hard experience. They did not say that to you. Yeah, they did. Was they putting it around your neck?

Yeah. They say, I'm sorry. Yeah. They don't even say congratulations. For bronze, they say congratulations. Yeah, for bronze they do. Oh my gosh.

So it was just a lot and just trying to sort through all of those emotions is a lot. As a 16 year old, I couldn't even like put my shoes on. So I don't know how you did it. That's pretty impressive. But I just, I gained't even put my shoes on. So I don't know how you did it. That's pretty impressive.

But I just, I gained a lot of that confidence back and just self-worth, I guess, seeing how my family reacted, seeing how my friends reacted, my coach, just seeing that they were still proud. It just, it kind of broke down the whole Olympic dream that we all have and just kind of said, you know, the Olympic dream isn't about getting a gold medal. It's about working towards a goal and making it there in representation of the hard work you put in. And, you know, whether you have a goal or not, it doesn't define your worth at all. So let's talk about expectations and goals, because obviously for probably a couple of years you didn't lose.

I'm assuming leading up to from like when you're 13 to 16, you probably never lost. No. Right? At any level. And then you finally lose, which is the biggest stage, which is heartbreaking, obviously. How can people going into big events or big goals that they have, obviously we have expectations of winning or we want to win. But how can they set themselves up to win even if they lose or get second? What are some things they can do emotionally or psychologically,

do you think, that you've learned that people can do? Well, I think something that kind of saved me and kept me sane through that whole process is I grew up with my coach and I started training with him since I was or when I was five. And he taught me from day one that nothing was ever about a score. So when I competed, I was never allowed to look at a score. I was never allowed to look at, you know, rankings, scoreboards, nothing. I mean, I studied those afterwards, just learning the science and kind of the math behind the sport. But it should never, or he taught me it should never drive your performance.

And so when I got to the Olympics, having that kind of ingrained in me, the scores didn't necessarily matter, but that final result of the medal, I wasn't used to. So it made me kind of look at the scores and reflect on how I was judged. But that made me go against everything I've been taught my whole life. And so when I kind of learned to push that away and go back to, it's not about the scores,

but it's about how you felt you did, how much effort you put out, your performance, I could go back and look and say, I did the best I possibly could. And my validation as well was finishing my last routine and seeing 50,000 people in the arena on their feet. I mean, it's things like that that mean more than a score or a medal.

You just got chills. Yeah. You know in your heart too, I mean, how well you've done, how hard you've worked. There's no greater reward or judge than your conscience. Sure. Man. Well, how has it affected you in the decisions you've been making since then?

Like, have you been ever second-guessing yourself when you're doing anything? You know, you did Dancing with the Stars. Were you guessing yourself in that? When you went back you did dancing with the stars were you guessing yourself in that when you went back to compete did you second guess yourself and the was that the um london or no what olympics london london olympics i don't think it's changed anything in the way of like second guessing but i would say i feel like i've made every decision differently than i would have had I gotten a gold. Really? Kind of. How so?

Because it's no longer about winning to me. I feel like, and I use the word winning in the sense of like, it's not about money. It's not about being the top at a business. It's not about living in the biggest house. It's just, I kind of took that away from my life because I got there and realized that didn't matter. And so, you know, I, I butt heads with some people sometimes, some friends, some agents, some, I mean, all these people who are still driven by that. But for me, it's about the worth that I feel in my heart anymore, which again is a lesson I learned back then. It's about the balance, it sounds like. Yeah.

The winning balance, right? The winning balance. I've definitely rearranged a lot in my life just over the past few years, just trying to get more things in my life that made me feel good instead of just trying for a reward that didn't mean anything.

Yeah, it's interesting because I think I've talked to you about this before. My own life, I was driven by like the wins, like the goals and making, if I didn't win or achieve what I wanted to, then it was like I would be depressed. Yeah. And it was like, it would crush me if I didn't achieve it. So I was so driven to achieve these things for my whole life. And then I realized when I did achieve it, I would still be crushed and depressed. Yep. I'd be like, I was so driven to achieve these things for my whole life and then I realized when I did achieve it I would still be crushed and depressed yep like what's you know I was not happy well you

get there and you're like well what was that point yeah what's next and why you know it's not that big a deal anymore I had this expectation or I thought it would be something and I realized it took me a long time to figure this out but I was driven by like achievements for so many years of my life and um when I kind of let go of the end result it was more just talking about the journey which you were just talking about and just being grateful for every day and the journey and the lessons i'm learning that's when everything starts to shift and it's like this ease that i feel i don't know if you feel it but it's like no pressure oh yeah definitely it's like this graceful ease it feels really really good. Yeah. It's so nice. It does.

That's interesting. And you've been talking about this with this speaker series for a while. It's kind of like the lessons you learn from getting second and all the stuff we're talking about now. So if anyone's listening who runs a university or a school and you want to have Sean come in and talk, what's the best way to get a hold of you? She's a high ticket item. She costs a lot of money. No. So make sure, contact me on my contact form

at lewishouse.com. Or you can go to my website. Or you can go to seanjohnson.net and there's a contact form, right? Yeah. Okay, so you can contact her there. Just know that she's

extremely pricey. No, I'm not. Just teasing. Yeah, it was a lot. and especially when i go to do these speaker series i don't just focus on the silver medal it's a lot of life lessons i've learned through throughout my life i started in elementary when i didn't get voted into the popular group and you know it's all these different little things but it's about being your own person and being unique and sure, again, just falling into the stereotypical path.

What do you think made you so driven in your first 16 years? Obviously, you're still very driven and, you know, you talk about a lot of different business ideas and stuff, but what made you so driven? Was it not getting chosen in the popular group early on or was there other things? Was it more driven by just family support and your coach support? I'd say, I mean, family support and coach support was a huge thing, but I'd say my drive,

a lot of it came from just my passion for the sport. I absolutely love gymnastics. And, you know, if I learned a new skill, that kind of victory feeling of accomplishing, you know, you feel like superwoman. It's addictive. And you transfer that into trying to qualify to the next level and trying to be the best in the country and the best in the world. I had this passion for being on a stage.

But I also had a few unique moments that kind of made me stand out. But I also had a few unique moments that kind of made me stand out. And it was little things like I remember being in Rio de Janeiro competing in the Pan American Games. And I was 14 years old. And there's a picture of me trying to get the third, fourth, fifth, and second place girls up on the top podium with me. Because I wanted a picture with all of them. Because you won. Yeah. You were first at them. Because you won. Yeah. You were first at 14.

Yeah, yeah. And, you know, being 14, there's this huge article written of like, well, what is she doing? What is she trying to say? And I, and genuinely, I just wanted. You just wanted a photo with all of them? Yeah. I remember just going through my career, again, not driven by outcomes.

I just wanted to have fun and do my best and share it with other girls. And I also grew up around girls though, who were not taught that and they were taught everything is about the outcome. So the friendship, the, you know, sportsmanship, everything's thrown out the window. Yeah. Or it's fake or whatever. Definitely. And for me, that just never made sense. And that's why I definitely got a little alienated from the sport in the sense that I wanted to have fun and I had fun, but I still won. And so that didn't make sense to people, but it's just kind of prioritizing. Well, I think it's like an interesting balance

because I think a lot of us want to win if we're going to compete in something and put a lot of our time and energy we don't want to just go to play and have fun and not oh yeah so the goal is i'm very competitive the goal is yeah right the goal is to win for everyone yeah usually um but obviously it's not putting your energy and focus into that only goal but really coming from a place of like you where like you just wanted to have fun and give your best every time. And if you give your best for a performance, then you can't control the outcome, whatever someone judges you.

Definitely. And I mean, I'm not saying that in your job, in your career, you shouldn't be trying to be the CEO or get a promotion or win in your soccer tournament. That, that's where your hard work goes in. That's what you focus towards. But I'd say the lesson that I learned is it's just, that shouldn't be everything. That should be a result of the work you put in and not, you know, your sole focus and goal. You shouldn't be trying to just beat someone out. focus and goal you shouldn't be trying to just beat someone out you should be trying to beat you and better you and in reward of that you get the first place medal right or you you continue to grow until you do yeah interesting so what would have happened if you got all silvers if i

got all silvers uh-huh um would anything be different right now? I mean, I don't really know. Is it that big a difference for someone that gets a gold medal and someone that gets a couple silvers? Unfortunately, yes. Like in the media world, in the business world, in everything, right?

So if you only got that, would you have as many opportunities, you think? Not at all. Speaking, books, sponsorships with all the major sponsors you have? Not at all. Speaking, books, sponsorships with all the major sponsors you have. Not at all.

Really? I mean, unfortunately, every appearance I've ever done since the Olympics, the title they introduced me with is Olympic gold medalist. Wow. It's not Olympic four times medalist. It's just the gold.

Wow. You know, I unfortunately think, you know, had I not gotten that, I could have been written off very, very easily. Wow. But part of me might also believe that I got the gold because I went through the silver and I learned so much that I was given that final opportunity so I could maybe share this. I don't know.

Interesting. Interesting. Wow. Now, do you feel like you deserve the gold? Which one? The gold medal. The balance beam? You only got one gold medal, right? Yeah.

Do you feel like you deserved it? That's hard for me to say. Because if I'm being completely honest with my heart, I don't feel I gave my best performance. Uh-huh. Um, but I also was mentally checked out. I had emotionally gone through so much. I can only imagine what you went through. By the time I got to that final, final day, I had been going on a four-month run. So this was four months straight of full competition. And that's competing four events every other day

for four months. And it's just, I was exhausted. So I don't know if I can fairly say if I deserved it amongst my competitors, but maybe I did. I didn't even watch their performances wow um but you know you didn't but in my heart i don't feel like it was my best performance your best no okay but the other three you felt like were your best uh yeah really um pretty well then i guess your best is

based on the eight judges it was their judgment of what was the best, I guess. I will say the best performance I have ever given in my entire life. I mean, my entire career to date was the very last routine I did during my all-around competition. And the reason for it was right before I competed, I'm kind of a math nerd. Sure, go for it. So I remember looking up at the scoreboard, even though I was taught not to.

I just had this huge impulse and I don't know why. And quickly kind of calculating scores and stuff, I knew the minimum or the maximum score that the girl before me could get for me to still have an opportunity to get a gold medal because I was the last score that the girl before me could get for me to still have an opportunity to get a gold medal because I was the last competitor of the entire games for this event for the all-around for the all-around what's the last event in the all-around the floor floor so I'm walking up onto the floor to get ready to start my routine and she's walking off and that score flashes up and between the time that that score flashes up and when I have to start, you have 30 seconds.

Wow. Otherwise, you're disqualified. You're chalking up, you're getting ready. Yeah, and so within 30 seconds, I'm standing in the air getting ready to start and I see her score and so my clock starts. And I saw her score and it was six tenths higher than the highest score I had conjured up.

Wow. So before I even started my routine, was six tenths higher than the highest score I had conjured up. So before I even started my routine, I knew that I could not get a gold, no matter what performance I gave. Really? Yes. And so, talk about a life lesson. So you knew on the all-around that you could not get a gold?

Yes. Right before I went up, I figured it out. Even though other people thought you should have won it or could have won it. Yes, because I mean, at the end of the day, it comes down to scores. Yeah. And I knew what my competitors had. I knew the score she was just given. And I knew my absolute like perfection score. A 10.

You couldn't have beat her. And I couldn't have beat her. Wow. So standing there, getting ready to finish my last routine of the all-around knowing gold was no longer my sights that everybody in the world already knew this because they were announcing because they're talking about it um i already felt like a little bit that i disappointed the world because every headline out there said she has to be the all-around gold medalist oh my gosh so standing there it was a

weird confliction of in 30 seconds by the way it's like how do you go forward happy and excited yeah and it was this debate of like well do i just go throw it because like what's the point now or you know do i finish and i remember looking over at my coach and he seemed unfazed even though i knew he knew as well and he gave me the, even though I knew he knew as well. And he gave me the same look and nod that he always did before my performance. And it seemed like everything was normal. And I remember thinking exactly in my head,

something that he had told me. And then that I repeated to myself. And I said, if you can't get the gold medal, at least go out there and prove to the world that you deserved it. Oh God, I just got chills again. Oh, my God. This is awesome.

And so I went out on the floor and no joke. I mean, every performance I've given in my entire life, I've never done something better than that routine. And I believe it's because in that moment, it wasn't for anything. It wasn't for a reward. It wasn't for a score because that was already out of the question. It was just for me, for anything. It wasn't for a reward. It wasn't for a score because that was already out of the question. It was just for me, for fun.

And I felt more kind of like invigorated and free and weightless throughout that routine than anything. And I remember finishing the routine and I was bawling my eyes out just because I was done. And that's when I stood up and I saw everybody in the arena, even Chinese, Russians, Canadians,

everybody waving American flags on their feet, screaming. And it just, that was my gold. So, I don't know. It was a great experience. I just feel like you just recreated that experience and I was in the stadium watching you. That was amazing. Is that up on YouTube anywhere? Yeah. I want to get that video okay do I just search like all around

Olympics Shawn Johnson yep floor whatever yep I want to post that in the show notes um man this is good stuff so that was the biggest that was a big lesson for you gosh I don't even know where to take this because I'm just i have so many things i want to dive into your your mind about all this but let's go back to your heart actually let's get out of your mind and get in your heart oh dear and um i just want to know so much i want to know how what's next for you like with all these lessons you learned what what your like, what's your vision for yourself in the world? Like, what do you want to create? What do you want to be a part of? What do you want to see happen? I know you're doing this speaker series or you've done this in the past where you're really

supporting people that, you know, on this topic and helping people manage expectations and all these things. But what's, what do you really want moving forward? That's a good question. Do you know what you want yet? I don't know if I know what I want in the end result, I guess. I know little things I want here and there. I don't know. I just started college. We had this conversation.

I want to become a nurse someday. And you're like, what? Which I think is crazy. No, I think it's amazing. Yeah, it's cool. It's cool you want to give. I just think that there's crazy. No, you have a huge heart. Yeah, it's cool. I mean, it's cool. You want to give,

I just think that there's some other things that are other plans for you. Yeah. Um, I'd love to be a mentor. I've always kind of had this dream of like having a business where I was actually like that girl that the little girls text every day just to kind of have a big sister. But the girls who are actually competing in the Olympics,lympics really um they don't offer anything like that they don't offer a mentorship and um because i'm studying psychology which is kind of where the inspiration came from being able to have a

professional that kind of knows how to deal with issues but a big sister and at the same time i think just like listen to you and support. Yeah. And why don't you create that then? Why don't you just mentor two athletes? But I kind of need to get a degree. No, so do. You're Sean Johnson.

You got a degree in gymnastics already. I'd like to write a book. Another one. About? Kind of everything we just talked about. Yeah? I like it. Let's see

I want to start a foundation don't ask for what because I don't know yet okay I just want to be able to give back you want to give I do

you're a big lover you got a big heart you want to give so you got the book idea so any publishers listening be aware that there's going to be

a book coming your way soon what's it going to be called The Secret to Getting Silver? Or Silver Sucks. Silver Sucks. But it would be a good message. I don't know. The Success of Silver?

Something like that, huh? I don't know. We'll have to think about it. I like it, though. I like the idea. Okay, the foundation. What else? You're in a relationship now?

Yes. Yes? Yes. And that's going well? It's going very well. Yeah? What's that do for you? What're in a relationship now yes yes and that's going well it's going very well yeah what's that do for you what's having a relationship because you probably couldn't have a relationship when you were in the olympics like you're just training 24 hours a day and i think i actually dated one person before the olympics and i hope he's not listening when you were 12 he's awesome when i was 16 but you're so emotionally detached and it's not like there's no um but what does a relationship do what's it like now being able to have a life outside of

gymnastics and have a relationship you know you remember to have these things for a number of years yeah um so what does this do for you? Having, you know, feeling love from in a relationship, a whole different level, not just love for a sport, but love for a person. Well, it's one of the greatest blessings ever, especially coming from Olympic level athletics. It's, you know, the first kind of relationship that you can have where it's not about a score it's not about working towards something you know no one's judging it's just kind of genuine i feel like a lot of my friends that i talked to and just former elite gymnasts and stuff it's early athletes for that matter you you're kind of ingrained i't know, ingrained in your mind growing up

is this perfectionist attitude. Especially gymnasts, right? Especially gymnasts. Because it's the perfect 10. You've got to get the 10, right? And you're always taught it's just nothing's ever good enough. Jesus.

You know, and when you transfer that into a relationship, it's something that is really hard to break, but I catch myself having that attitude. You know,

I don't feel like I'm ever good enough. I always have to be working to be. You know, I don't feel like I'm ever good enough. I always have to be working to be better for someone. You don't feel like you're good enough? No, because that's what we're taught growing up. You know, especially in our sport, you're, I don't know if I'm actually getting in details. It's like you're never thin enough. You're never strong enough.

You're never powerful enough. You're too emotional. You're never strong enough. You're never powerful enough. You're too emotional. You're too emotionally weak. I mean, it's all these things that you have to work on to be more of a machine. So when your life is centered around that, going into a relationship is very hard. Just try not to sound like a psycho person to a guy.

Of course. It's huge. And then you add into it the whole title of the Olympics that takes on the whole trust issue of can I trust people I meet? Right, of course. But I think I found a good one who is good with everything.

So are you guys competitive? Yeah, we're very competitive. Do you keep scores? Well, he's another athlete. So we compete with a lot of small things. But it's more playful. It's not like this is for real. No.

He's actually, he's a very gentle soul, which I think is really good for me because coming from the perfectionism attitude and the competitiveness, it's just he kind of takes me back to the Olympic thing we were talking about of what's important and what's not. And so getting caught up in the Hollywood lifestyle and the red carpets and everything that I thought I had to do just because of kind of the path they put you on.

He just kind of reminded me it's not important. Yeah. And just to do what I love. So you don't feel judged by anything. Not at all. That's got to feel amazing. It does. The first time you don't feel judged by anything? Not at all. That's got to feel amazing. The first time you've never felt judged. Yes.

It feels amazing. No one's keeping a score and telling you what you need to improve on. Yeah. It's a safe zone. It's a comfort. I'm sure he's probably supportive in supporting you grow and where areas you want to grow, but not saying you need to get better at this or anything. Right.

Definitely. And he's also got that safe opinion of, he'll tell me if something doesn't seem right for me, which I agree with. And it's not a point the finger, it's an actual conversation. Sure. Which again is different from gymnastics because if you do something wrong,

they'll point it out in a very negative manner. Interesting. Now, do you still beat yourself up on stuff if you feel like you're not the perfect person or doing something perfectly like in gymnastics or oh yeah really all the time i mean i'm working on it i i'm i feel like i'm a lucky one that consciously is aware of all of that um you know there's unfortunately people who aren't aware of like yeah the severity of perfectionism but i work on trying not to beat myself up and to let myself be average and normal and not you know well it's not about being average

but it's about becoming the best version of yourself without beating yourself up exactly right it's growing and getting to the next level wherever you want to take it i'll catch myself doing little things where i'm like oh i shouldn't shouldn't have done that. Or I feel like that was the wrong choice. And now what's something that a former gymnast wink, wink could do to, or anyone who's a perfectionist, cause I'm sure lots of perfectionists listening in, um, you know, I'm one of them myself. What's something that we can do to let go of the perfectionism and the beat up phase of conversation of we're not good enough. We're not worthy enough. We're not skinny enough or strong enough.

What's something we can do that you've learned so that doesn't happen? That we actually appreciate what we're creating and continue to get better. Well, to former gymnasts, wink wink. From what I've observed and learned from teammates of mine, from my past and history and many generations of gymnasts that I've been around and worked with, I don't think it can come from them, which sounds weird and probably... What do you mean it can't come from...

It can't come from themselves, which sounds weird. What can't come from themselves? That ability to kind of fix the perfectionism. So you're saying you can't fix it yourself. I think you can make a difference. I think you can i think you can make a difference i think you can actively work towards it but if you if you think about gymnasts you know we start gymnastics when we're three that's normal i mean we're in like a developmental stage crazy so as a kid as a baby

you know when you have these things repeated to you on a weekly daily basis you know that that doesn't just become a thought that becomes your dna that becomes what's your foundation of everything so to put that on a person to say oh if you just try hard enough you'll fix it that's a lot to ask yeah and from my personal experience i'd say the best and easiest way even though it's never easy to kind of change those habits and that kind of makeup is to center yourself around people who can actively see what you're doing but they're supportive in it i mean to have a person that could say you know if you're talking about someone who doesn't, I don't know, I can't think of an example, but thinks they're not perfect enough. You know, truly showing them on a daily basis that you love them just the way they are gives them a worth and a kind of habit to ingrain that in them and not the negatives.

I'm not saying this won't change, but what if that doesn't change over time? Where someone doesn't see their worth, they don't see that they are perfect how they are you know obviously it's like we want to improve on certain things but it doesn't mean you're not perfect if you're not the best yet so how does how would someone start to shed away that habit that doesn't serve them to feel a certain way about themselves. If it's taking years and years and no change, because obviously at some point there's got to be a change or evolution to start loving yourself and start being like, okay, I am perfect where I'm at, but I want to improve, but I can still love myself, you know,

not beat myself up emotionally. So what's, um, that's hard. What have you done? What have I done? Yeah. For me, I've tried to, on a daily basis, just admit, openly admit that I'm not 16 anymore. I'm not at the Olympics. I'm not that person. I feel like a lot of the perfectionism issues I have is comparing myself now to who I was then. Interesting. It was six years ago, right?

Yeah. It was six years ago today. Today? Today. The Olympics were today? My gold medal was six years ago today. Shut up. It was not.

It was. Oh my gosh. August 19th. Shut up. Yeah. How serend Oh my gosh. August 19th. Shut up. Yeah. How serendipitous. I know, right? Wow.

I just got more chills. But that's my lucky number, by the way, 19. Because I won the gold medal on the 19th. I was born on the 19th. And I won Dancing with the Stars on the 19th. Wow, interesting. But you were 16 when you won it. But I was 16.

Yeah, I would say just like what I've done is. Over the last six years. Over the last six years. Admitted that you're not that same place anymore. Yes, and that I never will be. I mean, and that's fine. Never again. And to accept that that's normal and that's good

is kind of been my progress. You know, back when I was 16, every little thing about me back then was, was judged by a coach or someone, an individual. And me now comparing myself to when I was 16, I see those same qualities. I'm like, well, I need to be thinner. I need to be, need to look what I looked like when I was 16 to be able to be accepted by the world which is kind of what your top rock then um so kind of learning to put that aside and admit that past is past and the only thing you can better of yourself right now is who you are right now and who you're going to be tomorrow because you can't change yesterday so it's hard it's a daily battle and i see that with a lot of people a lot of my teammates i guess but i don't know do you have any rituals like in the morning or at night

or throughout the day like if something comes up for you where you're like um you know you realize like you're beating yourself up about something or you're being a perfectionist is there something you go through you're like remind yourself you say to someone to remind you do you write in a journal at night do you listen to music to like kind of support this what do you do i'd say going back to the whole centering yourself around people yeah who can openly see your flaws and help i want to say flaws not flaws yeah flaws is the wrong word things that don't serve you yes things that don't serve you flaws is the old bad way um that's you beating yourself up that's what yeah um i would say my my tradition my habit is i have a girlfriend of mine that i grew up with

we started training together when we were six years old and she's just kind of my go-to and i'm her go-to and if i'm ever beating myself up with anything i'll literally send her a text saying like what it is and then she'll send something back and it's just kind of a reminder of she kind of just keeps me in check yes that's cool and i would say if you're in a relationship and you are a perfectionist and you have the tendency to beat yourself up but don't think you're worthy think you're look a certain way that you shouldn't be looking whatever it may be my request for you guys who are like that is to communicate with the person in the relationship with and say lovingly calmly

and openly like here's what i'm working on right now in my life and this is how I used to be and I've been it's been a progress so if I ever get into a place where I'm beating myself up here's my request of you and give like an open clear communicative request and I would say in my relationship that's also something that I've done I've been very open that's good which is very difficult for me I'm sure you even said that one time you're like i don't think i've met a more guarded person but um i actually was open and shared you know my past and what kind of what i've gone through and stuff but something else that i think in relationships people can do is remind themselves on a daily basis that the person you are is the person you're you know your boyfriend your girlfriend fell in love with it's

not who you were and yeah you know it that's a big reminder i didn't know you when you were 16 no you didn't care no i mean it's probably cool that like you achieve something such a such a big level that he's proud of yeah but he's like he didn't know you then yeah and it's not like people fall in love with people i mean someone else that looked differently when they were younger or older and looked a different way it's just kind of how it is yeah yeah definitely i mean and i would say also you know definitely make the request open be open about it again that's great i mean obviously you know the reason why i probably said that you were so most regarded person ever is because everyone wants something from you.

So you've been used to this, like, everyone wanting something from you since you were 16 and wants a piece of you. You know, we're out and doing acro yoga in, like, a little private park. And people are, like, stopped parking their cars, like, waving at you. The ranger comes over and gets a picture. So I completely understand. But that's cool you're able to let that guard down in a relationship. relationship and i'm sure it feels really comfortable and safe it does and especially it's very difficult because like you said i've been kind of in the public eye since i was 15 and i learned back then to kind of put on my public face and it's not like it's different

than who i am yeah but it's guarded it's It's a face that is appropriate. Put on a smile. For everybody. Say the right things. And, you know, in the public eye, people don't understand that, you know, the public isn't accepting to a bad day. They're not. They're not accepting to a frown. They're going to judge you. Everything.

Talk about you. Yeah. So, I don't share anything personally. I don't let anything below the surface come out. And you know, when you're in a relationship and you have to get past that, that's very hard. It's terrifying.

I don't know. It's, it's also awesome. It's awesome. That's cool. Okay. Well, I could always talk to you forever.

Sean, I love our conversations, and I appreciate your wisdom with the relationship I've been in. Yes, with your girlfriend. Yes, my special lady friend. Girlfriend. Come on, you have to say it. With my lady.

You have to admit this. With my special girlfriend. There we go. Who is a former gymnast as well, so you guys have a lot in common, both incredibly sweethearts. So I'm very grateful for you guys' past. Last two questions.

Oh, dear. The first one is, what are you most grateful for recently? Most grateful for recently? Yeah, what are you most grateful for just recently? This year, last couple months, last couple weeks. What's been on your mind that you're really grateful for this is gonna sound cheesy that's my boyfriend oh okay i like it yeah big shout out to your man yeah what's his name again andrew andrew all right big shout out andrew if you actually listen to this um okay cool and final question which i asked you last time it's what i asked

all the guests so maybe your answer is different. Who knows? Cause you're a different person today. Okay. And what I was going to say before I ask you this is that, you know, we, we get the choice every single day. We have a choice. We can either choose to go back to our default of beating ourselves up, whatever it may be, or we can choose to set a new habit and new pattern and we can always fall back into stuff. But every day we have a choice. And it looks like you've been making some great choices lately so congratulations on

that i still make bad ones like i got working on there you go beating yourself up again no i'm just admitting that i'm not perfect sure yeah yeah yeah of course i mean if i was perfect i don't know where i'd be. But last question. I'm going to videotape it. Oh, dear. So I can post it on the... I feel like this is like pressure. The Instagram.

There's no pressure. What's coming? You already know what's coming. It's what is your definition of greatness? Oh, yeah. Don't start videoing yet because it'll take me forever to figure it out. It's okay. I'll edit it up.

Definition of greatness um having the courage to step outside of society's standards how about that i like it okay sean johnson everyone make sure to go to ShawnJohnson.net. Buy her book. It's called The Winning Balance, right? Yes. I'll have it linked back up on the show notes as well. And I'll tell you where that will be in the outro here in just a second.

You've got a series coming up. It's the nation's only gymnastics series. Four qualifying events, one team championship in Louisville, Knoxville, Atlanta, and Charleston, right? Yes. Am I allowed to talk about that? Yes. Okay, cool.

I'm also making a little debut on a little show here soon. A show on a big network that we can't talk about yet. You can see the network. It's NBC. NBC. NBC. So make sure to DVR every showbc coming out in the next few months and you'll be able to see sean or just follow her on instagram at sean johnson twitter at sean

johnson facebook at sean johnson she's got like millions of followers everywhere and she'll be posting all this stuff uh when the the gymnastics series comes out when the tv show comes out her next book where she's speaking at colleges. So make sure to follow her, check her out, love on her, tell her how much you love her. And,

uh, I appreciate you so much, Sean, for coming back on. You are a sweetheart. You're amazing. You're a gem. So thank you so much.

You as well. Thank you. And I hope you guys enjoyed this episode with Sean. Again, such a sweetheart, such a gem of a human being. I'm very grateful for her opening up and sharing this wisdom because I feel like it could be very supportive for a lot of people out there who have experienced the same type of feelings, the same type of emotions, the same type of pressure on how to still take care of yourself, love yourself, and know that giving your best is what really matters the most and having fun and being playful and enjoying the journey, not worrying about the outcome is really what it's all about.

So thanks again to Sean. She's such a gem. Make sure to say hi to her over on Twitter, on Instagram, Facebook. She's at SeanJohnson everywhere. Post a picture on Instagram and tag her of where you're listening to this episode. I'm sure she would love to see those pictures and tag hashtag School of Greatness. Share this with your friends over on Twitter and Facebook and Instagram and Google Plus and everywhere online that you can.

Get the message out about Sean Johnson and about the School of Greatness podcast. And it means so much to me that you guys are supporters and subscribe to the show on iTunes and listen and leave comments over on the show notes at lewishouse.com. It means a lot to me. So make sure to check out the show notes over at lewishouse.com slash eight,

six. That's episode number 86. I'm going to have the video that we talked about with Sean, uh, right before she's about to do her final performance at the Olympics. I'm going to show some other images and some links back to her. So check out lewishouse.com slash eight, six for more.

I appreciate you guys so much for listening. You know what time it is. It's time to go out there and do something great. you sure i will talk about anything okay you're right you sure i have that recorded