The School of Greatness - Relationship Experts Debate the Hidden Causes of Cheating (5 Signs to Watch For) Matthew Hussey & Sadia Khan

Episode Date: July 8, 2024

Have you bought your tickets to Summit of Greatness 2024 yet?! Get them before they sell out at lewishowes.com/ticketsListen to PART 1 of Sadia and Matthew’s discussion.Welcome back! Today, we dive into the second part of a fascinating and eye-opening conversation with two incredible relationship experts, Sadia Khan and Matthew Hussey. If you missed the first part, I highly recommend you go back and listen to it, as it lays the groundwork for what we’re discussing today. In this episode, we explore the reasons why people lead double lives, the root causes of cheating, and the importance of having honest and courageous conversations in our relationships. We also debate the roles of self-compassion and self-respect in building and maintaining healthy connections. Get ready for a lively and insightful discussion that will challenge your perspectives on love, trust, and commitment.In this episode you will learnThe psychological reasons behind cheating and leading double lives.The importance of honest communication in relationships.How self-compassion and self-respect influence relationship dynamics.Strategies for selecting a compatible partner.The significance of addressing past traumas and wounds before entering a relationship.For more information go to www.lewishowes.com/1638For more Greatness text PODCAST to [phone]More SOG episodes from Sadia Khan and Matthew Hussey:These Dating MYTHS Are DESTROYING Your Love Life (What A Healthy Partner REALLY Wants!) | Sadia Khan – https://link.chtbl.com/1533-podMatthew Hussey's Expert Tips for Attracting and Maintaining True Love – https://link.chtbl.com/1490-pod

Hey everyone, this is Lewis Howes, and I am so excited to invite you to the Summit of Greatness 2024 happening at the iconic Shrine Auditorium in Los Angeles, California. This is more than just an event. It's a powerful experience designed to ignite your passion, boost your growth, and connect you with a community of other inspiring achievers. Join us Friday, September 13th, and Saturday, September 14th for two days packed with inspiration and transformation from some of the most incredible speakers on the planet. Don't miss out on this chance to elevate your life, unlock your potential and be part of something truly special. Make sure to get your tickets right now and step into greatness with us at the Summit of Greatness

2024. Head over to lewishouse.com slash tickets and get your tickets today and I will see you there. I always ask, was there anything before marriage that signaled this person has the propensity to have two simultaneous connections? Nine times out of ten, there's always something. One of the main things that he was in another relationship. Other simultaneous relationships or the person just never was single. It's a fairly dismal view of people. I know. You've just put forward.

Welcome back. Sadia Khan is a psychologist and relationship coach. Sadia Khan. And we have... Dating and relationships expert and coach. The inspiring Matthew Hussey in the house, my man. But I know plenty of very strong women who have been cheated on. Yeah.

When we get into relationships with people, it comes with conditions. Nobody's unconditional. Now, we sign an imaginary contract, but I've seen the needs you have you've seen the needs I have we naturally expect our partners to guess our needs human nature is flawed forgive me if I'm misreading no no but it feels like for you the headline is it was your fault and for me the headline is this was them and I would highly disagree with that because I am truly shocked.

When someone is wearing a mask or living a double life, meaning they have a relationship or a marriage or kids, but then they're going out and trying to seek something else somewhere else to live a different identity, to express themselves in a different way. What is that saying about them that they're either missing or that they need to work

on to overcome? They're unable to have difficult conversations with the people they need to have it with. So instead, they just find a way to release the energy and mask what that need is, rather than actually confront the issue where it should be so whoever they have fallen in love with or started a life with they started it on more kind of on the dynamic that you were describing in your 20s they started it on that dynamic of suppressing who they truly are suppressing their true needs but not having the courage to walk away and not having the courage to end it and as a result they've had to maintain this false identity for the rest of their life which as they get older and they get more disgruntled and they fear like the fear of losing their family decreases as men

age it's not like the sex drive goes up but their willingness to cheat kind of sometimes goes up because they're like they're a bit more brave so they end up then you know engaging in behaviors that they shouldn't be doing and it all stems from if they just had a more vulnerable, honest conversation with the person they love to begin with, they wouldn't find themselves searching for themselves in other people. Wow. When you say men get older and they get more kind of brave about cheating, how do you understand that?

What I noticed is like in the beginning stages, because they're still in the people stages and a fearful state, they don't risk it as much as children come along. And as they feel less and less appreciated, I'm not saying they deserve appreciation all the time. Some men really are difficult. But as they mentally feel like I've spent 10 years being loyal to her and they almost feel like it's a credit, like 10 years being I deserve. So I deserve. So they say i've done this and i i've always been a great husband i've always been picking up the kids and i've always

you know kind of uh suppressed my sexual desires whenever she doesn't want it now i deserve something special i'm not getting what i've needed for the last 10 years or what i wanted yeah and i'm not saying they're wrong or right but that's the mental conversation they have and because they develop this deserved entitlement i'm not saying maybe they do deserve it maybe they don't they then start to probably say it's wrong yeah i mean sometimes what happens and in their defense sometimes what happens is they have clear it is a really good and they have been a good husband for many years but in the process of being a good husband it's been done by suppressing their needs so they sometimes they haven't been courageous in expressing them either that's the main problem it's not that the wife is this evil wife

that deprives them of sex or deprives them of intimacy some men have gone months years without getting that fundamental need met but they never voiced it enough they might say in a jokey way or in a drunken night out that i don't get enough sex but they don't say in a constructive way think men are more willing to cheat than have a courageous conversation and say to their wife or their partner, here's what I really want sexually? Because what they truly desire sexually is going to be met with some resistance with the partner they selected. And they understand that. Or they think it will. They think it will. And they think that it's almost uncomfortable. Whatever they're desiring, they almost, when you have a wife and

you've seen her breastfeed your children and you've gone through that kind of experience with her it almost feels unfair to tell her your fantasy about what you want done and stuff so they have these two kind of compartments when it comes to sexism and then that one almost feels unaligned to the woman they marry but why why are we talking about this just in the vein of men and not women saying that i've put in all of this work i've raised these kids i've been here 20 years i quite feel entitled to a younger hotter man now why are we talking about this just in the context of men in just my experience of it what happens in my experience of women that love their husband and have this connected lifestyle their desire for sex decreases as they feel more connected as they have the kids as they're stable they feel like oh

we had the adventurous sex in the first 10 years like i don't need to do this at 45 years old like i've done my time on their stats though i i can't i don't know the stats on this yeah on their stats aren't the stats actually more damning sometimes for women than men and how many women cheat in long-term relationships i would imagine they are so but I would still say it might be because they had a people pleaser kind of husband that they couldn't get that masculinity out of or they couldn't get those courageous conversations out or they couldn't get that confrontational nature out of him and they found it in a man that would just say I want this from you I want that from you and that meant that make them feel a bit more alive than the guy that's kind of suppressing himself. But again, this is just, like I said, I have a skewed version

of male version of events. So what I have in my experience, if they think they've done 10 years of loyalty, they deserve 10 years of like enjoying their life. Or even one year. Or even one year. They're like, okay, I can just have a few escorts every now and then. Yeah, particularly if they've been deprived of sex. They can always compromise with any other deprivation, but when they feel deprived of sex, they feel like they've earned the right to free sex as they get older. Wow.

But what can men do in that position? Let's say there's a man who's been in a 5- to 15-year marriage. They've got a family. They have kids. And they've tried to do their best as a as a husband and a leader and a father but they are just craving some type of sexual adventure and they and deep down don't think that their wife can give them that or maybe they can't get out of their head what they've seen the last 15 years of their wife breastfeeding and being a motherly

figure and not a sexual figure whatever it is yeah something's the switch has turned off yeah maybe a switch turned off because they're now like motherly as opposed to sexual being whatever it might be what can a man do to communicate what they want sexually without hurting the woman they're with i think the first thing is to watch your habits if you are constantly stimulating yourself with too much pornography and too much social media and stuff that's not going to help your situation by looking at novel situations again and again. So watch what you consume. The second conversation is you've just got to remember what means more to you. Does the thrill of sex mean more to you than the safety of a marriage and kids? Now, if you

recognize that marriage means more, but it doesn't mean I don't want the thrill. I still want that. I still deserve that. Then what it moves on to is having conversations with your wife to understand how you can ignite that sex appeal in her. Perhaps there's something you're doing that's making you not feel like she, you are not tapping into that femininity in her. It's sometimes a dynamic. So ask her, is there something that I used to do or I can do that would make you feel more connected to me and they say oh in the beginning she was so wild but maybe in the beginning you were taking her out more or maybe in the beginning you were texting her a lot more maybe in the beginning you weren't turning to pornography on nights when you were so maybe there was behaviors in you in the

beginning that ignited a part of her that made her more yeah so have those conversations and sometimes some women are just plain difficult. And I understand those circumstances. But until you've tried what you did in the beginning, you can't completely complain that that's gone. Yeah. And before I jump to you, Matthew, do you think from the men that you're working with that you hear conversations with, are you hearing that more men cheat or more women cheat? From my experience, it's more women. Yeah.

or more women cheat? From my experience, it's more women. Yeah, from my experiences, and there are a couple of reasons for that, is women are naturally, in my experience, and being a woman myself, is we're a bit more aware of a man's propensity to cheat. So we're not particularly naive when it comes to when he's gone for too long

and he hasn't answered too many calls and he hasn't been available. We're a bit more attuned to these signs. And we kind of- What's happening? And we ask him, hey, you and you were you weren't saying what was happening or vague we've had friends that have been cheated on that tell us all about it and they tell us all the signs our moms might tell us all the signs and stuff whereas for men that conversation is so sacred they don't really have that with each other so they're also missing so they go in with a little

bit of naivety that women just don't cheat whatsoever. They just think my wife would never. That's their common thing that she would never. And the other thing is they're not attuned to the signs. They're not attuned to the signals. So when she is depriving him of affection or depriving of attention, or when she starts taking care of herself and going out a little bit more or making more of an effort to go to work, they just see that as normal feminine behavior. They just see that as, you know, girls getting dressed up. They don't necessarily see the signs that it's a change in dynamic. They don't pick up the signals as much. They become a little bit curious, but they don't become accusatory the same way that...

Really? Yeah. Were you saying why do women cheat more? I was saying who cheats more based on your experience of conversations you're having and what you're noticing. What are you thinking about why women cheat more? If that's true. In my personal experience with the women that do cheat,

it's not that all women cheat, but the women that do cheat, it's very little to do with the woman herself. It's more to do with the man she selects. Really? Yeah. In my experience, I can look at a couple and tell by the man if she's going to cheat.

Where the men and her have a very strong dynamic, where it's very clear that they know each other inside out and where they can be themselves completely and more so than anything I can tell she feels safe in his company it's unlikely she cheats yeah but where I feel like she's kind of the boss or she feels like she doesn't respect his opinion and it's not necessarily she's just like he's kind of allowed himself to take that back seat where she can him openly, where she feels like she can tell him anything and he just instantly believes it and follows her commands. It sets him in a position where she doesn't have a fear of losing him. And as a result of no fear of losing him, there's an openness to try alternatives because she knows if worst case scenario, he finds out, he's still going to stay.

It's a fairly dismal view of people i know you've just put forward well because what we're saying is that unless they don't have values within right yeah the thing that's missing from this conversation is values on the men's and the women's side is that it's kind of the you know the idea there with women is that they're that if they if they don't respect their man they'll cheat as opposed to if they lack the values that prevent someone but i would imagine their values determines what they select in the process when you don't have when you have those values that open you up to sex you tend to select people who have a kind of agreeableness that allows for that and i would

say the same for men men who know they have a propensity to cheat are probably not going to select a very strong-minded woman who will say absolutely not, I will walk away if this happens. They tend to select, I think their values combine, it affects their selection process and so they select a more agreeable and less secure individual to begin with. But you must know, I know plenty of very strong women who have been cheated on. Yeah, I do know plenty of strong women who've been cheated on. Yeah, I do. I do know plenty of strong women who've been cheated on. But in the process of being cheated on, at the time of selection, they weren't strong.

I would say that there's something in this. Most people who've been severely hurt. Cheating is not something that makes you an evil person. I have to put it out there. I personally have never cheated, but I'm not saying this as a moral. I don't see it as an evil trait. I just see it as a misbehavior. some people are cheaters and have terrible other traits it's just an addition some people are driven in a desperate state or whatever it is but when you've

been severely hurt by somebody you have to look at the day you selected them chances are if you select somebody who's very difficult and treats you badly and then on top of that cheats the day you selected them you were not in a secure place i don't know if i can if i can buy that i that may be true for some or maybe you didn't ask all the right questions you didn't get all the information but i i think there is a kind of um you know there are plenty of people who wind up with people who end up treating them very poorly. Yeah. Where there was just the, you know, they just could not have foreseen that this person was... I always argue the opposite. I say humans, nobody lies. And the reason I say...

Nobody lies? Nobody lies. And the reason I say that is verbally we can all lie. I can sit here and tell you I'm a blonde, but you as a human being are responsible for assessing whether my words and behaviors align. Right, but I don't know if you're going to cheat on me in five years. I personally- I can't. I can't go into a relationship going, I know for sure you won't cheat on me in five years. And if by the rationale that you said men cheat in relationships, which is that they

essentially feel like they've put in relationships which is that they essentially feel like they've put in their service like they're in the army and they've done their time and you know at that point they feel like god you know what I really feel entitled to an escort or to this stage that by that rationale you couldn't have seen it with that guy because back when he was putting in his service he was a totally committed man I would say that even with men i would say there's a couple of things i would say that it's not that i can even with my own husband i can't it's not that i know for sure he's going to cheat or not cheat but you know when somebody has a propensity and how you know they have a propensity is chances are most cheaters have cheated in the past and they've told you something they've told

you something they won't tell you directly but they might give you hints where they might say, oh, and we weren't working out. And so towards the end, I met somebody and towards, they'll use that common phrase towards the end. Or they might say, or you might just notice that they are a hypersexual. They need that as a form of connection all the time. So if you deprive them of that, they might, the key thing is you've got to know what people are like in terms of what they do when they're at their worst if you've noticed that they're worse they can be emotionally abusive at their worst they can be cheaters they kind of show you that in the courting stage before marriage sure but someone can be hypersexual and just be great sex in a relationship how are you to know that hypersexual means they're going to have an inability to be monogamous versus they've just got very high sex

drive that's going to make for a great sex life if i deprive them of that that hypersexuality is not going to go anywhere so i know that if i am dealing with somebody hypersexual no problem but i have to understand with their hypersexuality means when if and when i deprive them of that i open a door similarly i might be hyper i'm a hyper emotional i'm hyper clingy all those things luckily my partner is very kind of responsive. If he deprives me of that thing that is very clear to him from day one, chances are, God forbid, who knows, something might happen. It's when you deprive people what they should do.

You're letting people off the hook so easily. Really? Yeah, because if your husband wasn't giving you attention or time or whatever, I would assume that there would be 200 conversations that would happen prior to you deciding i'm gonna go off and get with a bloke on the side yeah the same is true the other way around you may not cheat you might you might i'm personally not a cheat yeah so i understand if we're taking the guy you're talking about that's hypersexual and the woman who hasn't had sex with him for a period of time yeah there's nothing that

excuses the inability to have the 100 conversations that need that's what most people i would i would love if that was true that's what you're saying i would love that to be true issue with is not not calling out it's it's almost like a calling out of the person who's not had sex with the person yeah as opposed to calling out the person who's not having the conversation yeah i understand what you mean but here's the thing when we get into relationships with people it comes with conditions nobody's unconditional now we sign an imaginary contract that i've seen the needs you have you've seen the needs i have we naturally expect our partners to guess our needs if people are naturally we're in a very,

all praise be to God, privileged position where we understand the importance of communication. The average person who's never done any self-help or who's never done anything will interpret, my wife doesn't have sex with me, she doesn't love me. They're not thinking I need to vocalize this. Similarly, a woman saying, my man's never complimented me. Do I tell him I want more compliments or do I go with the guy at work who naturally compliments me human nature is flawed so instead i get it's totally wrong it's not a justification it's more just understanding that ideally we should have these conversations ideally we should be emotionally articulate and realistically it doesn't happen so the best thing we can do is select people who are values naturally align with us and people show us

our values quite early on but based on what you've just said i would say the best thing we can do is is partner with a good communicator yeah not partner with someone that we just hope to god we always meet their values because they can't communicate and if we ever don't meet them they're going to be running i would agree that's why some people break up is because they get into relationship without communicating their true values and who they truly are. And they get together based on attraction or based on common likes and interests. My greatest fear early on in meeting someone would always be if we can't have conversations. Really?

Because, you know, if you take, you know, a version of what you're talking about that I think shows up in early dating, it's ghosting. What is ghosting? I've decided I don't want you anymore or I'm not getting my needs met in some way or whatever. And I do the ultimate in not communicating. I just disappear. And when that happens, what we have is someone in front of us who cannot communicate. So the answer to that to me isn't how do I figure out how to make sure I do everything right next time so that I don't get ghosted. answer is how do I make sure that I pre-select for the kind of person that when things get difficult or when they don't get their needs met has a conversation with me instead of just disappears

off the face of the earth yeah but have you not seen in your practice sometimes some people have never done like never cheat or anything like that but something in this relationship or something has triggered them and they become a person they don't recognize but I do agree it's down to poor communication because every need can be communicated but do you think it is just a character flaw or do you think it's a flaw in the dynamic of the relationship or have you been yeah or have you been in relationships where that person i could have cheated on this person i can never think of doing do you think it's a dynamic for me personally i would say it's more of a character thing because i've got religious beliefs and blah blah but i do think most people it's a dynamic thing rather than a character thing i mean i don't think the rest of the world

needs religious beliefs to have that character thing yeah i think that's a you know the golden rule is enough yeah but do you think everybody has that or do you think it's a dynamic in the relationship that can ignite a different character i think people are look i think people are capable of all sorts of things and we have to you know there's of course there's a place for real life and i'm not someone who says you know if someone cheats that's an unforgivable sin that's up to the person who's in a relationship with them whether they want to forgive that or not and certainly the person who cheats is going to have to learn how to forgive themselves. Otherwise they're going to have a miserable life afterwards.

So I, but I do, I do think what protects us in relationships is the values that we have, the character that we have. And do you think it's on us to select people with that right character or just expect them to have that character once we select them? Up to 100% up to us to select people with that right character or just expect them to have that character once we selected them up to 100 up to us to select people with that character to to look for you know beyond attraction and say how does this person show up on difficult days how how do they show up when they're not getting what they want whenever they want how do they show up when you know i'm i happen to be the one today who needs more than i can give yeah um how do they show up when you know I happen to be the one today who needs more than I can give.

How do they show up when their needs are deprived for a while? 100% and that ability to communicate is that's where trust comes from and I think the reason I'm pointing this out is because I think that it would be a frightening fate to be with someone where your trust is based on making sure you're always meeting their needs no matter what not in their ability to communicate if they're not needs aren't being met i agree you know trust has to come from you will communicate with me if your needs aren't being met and of course there will be there's gonna be consequences at some point if you keep communicating with me that your needs aren't being met and i of course, there will be, there's going to be consequences at some point. If you keep communicating with me that your needs aren't being met and I don't take that seriously,

there are going to be, of course, consequences to the relationship. If nothing else, you might leave. And what do we do? Because look, I have this very candid conversations with men about this, you know, sexual deprivation, which tends to be a driving force in a lot of people's cheating. And even me being on the therapeutic end of it, even I'm surprised at how important it is to them. And even I'm uncomfortable with the information and it's not directly at me. What advice would you give to women in receiving this very brutal kind of conversations that men may be secretly wanting to have, but they know it's not socially acceptable. They know it's not going to be the nicest way to tell a woman. I'm saying this as somebody where it's not even about me and even

i leave going like oh god is this what men really say it's not acceptable about communicating what you want sexually yeah or like the frequency i would look at that and i would argue that that's a guy who's not been himself for a long time or maybe ever. Right. Because why would a person find out 10 years into a marriage you're a freak? Seriously. Because someone's ashamed of it. Right. That's my point. That's not on her.

Yeah. That's on the guy. It's on her to ask the right questions, though. Yeah. Maybe, but we have to take, just as we wouldn't say, if we were talking about it the other way around, we wouldn't say it's his job to ask every right question to understand everything about her. It's not his job to be a mind reader.

It's her job to make sure that she communicates the blueprint for what really turns her on, what makes her excited, what makes her happy. No one should be asked to be a mind reader in a relationship. And also, you don't just communicate verbally. reader in a relationship and also if you don't just communicate verbally how do you end up how does someone know within six months of dating you that you are a very like you've got a lot of kinks sexually you try them you start like you you start to bring some of them in and you see if you have a part an active uh you know a willing audience but that's that's something someone should find out at that point we've not been being ourselves for a long time if we're saying years into a marriage god how do i communicate these things

that i really want to do to my partner you got to communicate early on and to answer your question i think that the woman in that situation or the man in that situation frankly because i hear from a lot of women who say god i want to do things with my man that he's unable to talk about um you know i think that's that's true on both sides. The number of women who get disillusioned in their sex life because they're like, God, my man won't show up in the adventurous ways that I want. I'm enjoying it. So it happens both ways.

Oh my God, the number of women that are like, I really want to do this kinky thing over here and he's just not into it or I'm afraid because I feel he'll judge me for it. That's huge. I think we have to have a partner that if we're the partner on the receiving end of that information, what we have to be is brave. Because what we receive it as is a threat. It's, I'm not good enough for you. I'm not, you're, you want something other than me. You're not attracted to me. Yeah. You want something else

that I can't give you. You know, you're having all of these fantasies away from me you're watching porn how dare you you're thinking about other women and it's like missing the headline the headline is your partner trusted you and the relationship enough to bring this to you and to have this conversation with you and be and it takes some bravery it's not easy but it takes some bravery to say well they're trusting me with this information and it's interesting information it's actually if i can get past my ego this is valuable information yeah yeah and this if i if i can start to be brave which will require me to break my own patterns because if they really want to they want me to show up like this in the bedroom i'm gonna have to get a little uncomfortable because i've been showing up in my comfort zone for the last 10 years yeah i have to i'm gonna

have to grow here i'm gonna have to like bring a different energy that takes bravery and it takes a growth mindset it really does and if we don't have those two things then when someone brings something to us we're going to get defensive or shame them or judge them for it and then of course you're creating that then you're really hurting the relationship but you know in my personal experience when clients do come to me when they have had some level of betrayal i always ask what was what was your relationship like before the marriage what happened before the relationship got serious? And 99% of the time, the person showed them that they have the capability

to have two simultaneous connections at the same time. They either stole that person from an ex, that person was either dating somebody else, they knew that person was already married. There's always some signal that is there somewhere. It's more when the childhood sweethearts and they turn out together and that comes out of the blue. Or when somebody's lived a double life.

But majority of the time, most people, when I ask them what happened before you got married, they'll be able to tell you. Why there was a cheating? When it ended because of a betrayal. I always ask, was there anything before marriage that signaled this person has the propensity to have two simultaneous connections? Nine times out of ten, there's always something. What are the main things? That he was in another relationship? Other simultaneous relationships.

Or the person just never was single. They went from one person to another person to another person. Then they were using you as a numbing cream to get over the last person. Or there was inconsistencies in the truth. They weren't telling you the truth. And a lot of times you caught them in a lot of lies. And you forgave every lie. You forgave a lot of cheating in the past.

You thought that is done and dusted before marriage. So the reason why I put all the accountability on the person rather than the actual cheat is I always say this. The person who was cheated on. Yeah, I always put myself included. And the reason I put even my own accountability on there is because I'm very aware that there's thieves everywhere. But I lock my doors. I do it on purpose. If I leave my doors unlocked, I can't be totally blindsided if something's stolen. Similarly, when I'm selecting a partner and I've seen these major flags before marriage,

but because I love them or because they've given a green light because I'm so attached to them and I've chosen to ignore it, then I can't be totally the victim in the situation. I was a voluntary participant. And the reason I say this is so many times when people do have the betrayal and the riot is over, they'll say, oh yeah, in the beginning he used to do this. I should have known in the beginning. They always refer to the beginning stages of the relationship. They did know.

There was something that they knew. But they chose to like hope or wish that they would change or maybe they're not going to be this way in the future or give them a second chance. Same thing with abuse. They never come to me and just say, yesterday this happened. Physical or emotional abuse? Yeah.

Abuse and cheating. They never say, yesterday this started. They say, they've always did this and I gave them another chance. They said they would stop. They promised me they would change. Those sentences come up so much suggesting that this person showed you something. But I think that the reason I can't, when I hear this, it really, I struggle with it. Is it?

It's not because anyone who knows me knows for me like I'm as close to like extreme ownership as you'll get and as person, I want to own the ability to change anything in my life. So I'm not someone who, I'm not a, you know, complainer. Blame the world kind of person. Yeah, that's not me. But the reality of so many relationships is that there are people who are extremely convincing there are people who are extremely um their ability to uh to brainwash you into something you never thought you would be capable of accepting the ability to have your reality distorted over time um it is it is profound and it is humbling

and everyone thinks it could never happen to them right until it happens to them and then you go oh my god how how did i allow that for so long and true and it's i feel it's important because forgive me if i'm misreading. No, no, no. I'm sure you're right. But it feels like for you, the headline is, it was your fault. And for me, the headline is, this was them. At some point in the process of helping you, let's definitely get to the question of what's what was happening in you that allowed you to turn a blind eye to this for so long or ignore those signs when they came up and let's

do that work because we need to make sure that no one can ever get in in this way again but to me the headline the the only way to heal is to start from a place of what was done was wrong. Yes. It was them. It was their character. It was disgraceful. And that we are someone that that was done to. That doesn't mean we can't change it.

And it doesn't mean we can't get out. It doesn't mean we can't change the way we approach these things in the future but i just worry that someone listening to this would think that the headline is it's my fault as opposed to the headline is this person revealed who they are showed their character and and did something really really wrong that you deserve compassion for i think you're both right and yeah i'm really glad that you're saying this because i'm sure this is what people in the comments are probably reaching to say here because i can i can relate to like both things like okay here are the signs that i saw even though and this thing happened later i'm responsible because i did see signs yeah but also they did something

horrible and it is their fault so i think it's a both and i think it's it's and what i could say now is like can both of those be true i think they i think they can both be true and what i can say like from seeing it from a different perspective now where i feel like i'm in a healthier place perspective now where I feel like I'm in a healthier place in my own relationship is that when I entered my relationship you know with Martha I entered it from a place of I don't need this relationship not that I like screw you I don't care if this works out or not but I don't need this I'm not anxious to make sure this happens as we started to get to know each other I was like I want this to happen if we're in alignment on our values. If we're not, then I wish you the best.

But I'm not going to enter something if the values are not aligned for both of us because then it's going to be too much friction. It's going to be so hard work. It's not going to be enjoyable for either of us. And therefore, in the dating process with Martha, there was never an inconsistency with her words and her actions based on her values.

So I was able to see words, actions, they matched. And she was able to see that with me. And that means we both had to be extremely communicative to each other. We both had to be courageous with each other on our wants, our needs, the things we don't like and speak those things early on yeah

uh in risking someone the other person not wanting to be with each other right and i think because we entered in that way it feels healthier now it doesn't mean like everything's going to be perfect and work out for you know the rest of our lives or whatever but it feels like i can fully see who she is and if she did something sure it would be out of character that would be hurtful but i'm also okay as well yeah and also another side note here is like i just yeah i mean i'd love that you both share this because i agree my headline is it's your fault and i I really stand by that. The person who was like cheated on her.

Yeah. Well, you also see, to finish the thought here, is you also hear this. When women go through a divorce. Yeah. And you ask them this question on your wedding day, when you're walking down the aisle, did you have a feeling that something was off? Most people would say something was off. Some people might say, no some people might say no everything is a happy day yeah it was perfect and like i had no signs it's like were you really also asking the tough questions maybe you were

yeah but did you ask all these different questions or did you just want to be with that but and that's why i would stand by that i'm not saying it's your fault. But have neither of you ever had a personal relationship, a friendship or a business relationship that really caught you off guard when someone didn't show up and you thought, God, that was a day where I really thought they'd show up for me. And they didn't. And it really caught you off guard. That's never happened to me. I've always known. Oh, there might have been some signals. There was time.

Right, but that's fine, but it's incredibly lacking. But you have hope that which they wanted. But it's so lacking in self-compassion to go straight to and therefore it's my fault. It's not me it's your fault if they don't show up for you. Yeah, but it's also for having the wrong expectations on the wrong, here's what I would say. I definitely stand by it's your fault in life with everything.

Your weight is your fault. Your income is your everything is your responsibility i'm on the extreme those are different things fault and responsibility are very different things but some people you know some people say it's your consequence which is like a positive it's a consequence of choices consequence of right but that and even in consequence consequence doesn't And even in consequence, consequence doesn't to connect all of that with fault is a it's a strange connection to make in a lot of cases. Responsibility makes sense always. Wherever I am today, me taking responsibility for making my life better always and forever makes sense. But I find the worrying, spending this time worrying about where to point the finger to be quite unproductive and also completely devoid of self-compassion. And it is absolutely true that there are people who we may have seen on a lower level some inconsistency in their behavior or we may have seen some things that

we didn't love it is anyone who spends a lot of time in narcissistic relationships will tell you that the ways that someone was able to shock them on when things really hit the fan yeah could that the there wasn't some steady trajectory to like low level grievances to i had cancer and they wouldn't drive me to the hospital yeah no one know until they're they're in that place no one knows who that person is gonna be with that and i would highly disagree with that because very few people who maintain promises then don't show up when you're in the hospital for cancer. So when I'm my husband, one of the reasons why I'm so attached and why I selected is because I never experienced a cancelled date. I never experienced late. It was never a case where he'd say I'm coming at three. He'd come at five. Never. And I remember there would never be a cancelled date.

I'm coming at three, he'd come at five. Never. And I remember there would never be a cancelled date. So when you're dealing with that person, and then I went into hospital for cancer and he didn't turn up, then I can honestly say, well, this may not be my fault, or there's been such a change in his character that I haven't paid attention to. Maybe recently he has been breaking promises, but this is just the final one that I paid attention to. So I would still take onus on that. The reason why I think self-compassion should be replaced with self-responsibility is being compassionate with yourself will allow you to think that you are a victim to other people who are just terrible. But when you realize that selection is more important in determining your outcomes than any other factor, you'll be more cautious of selection.

I am truly shocked to hear you say that self-compassion isn't the answer. No I don't believe that. What is your definition of self-responsibility versus self-compassion? I think self-compassion is forgiving yourself for your mistakes but not ignoring you made the mistakes. So what I mean by self-compassion it's my fault. Everything in life is my fault i might think that mentality but i forgive myself but i forgive myself is that but the other alternative is it's not my fault it's all them and i'm i just need to fix myself i forgive myself

you have to believe that there are situations that people are in that are not their fault i i do i can't imagine that you would say a teenager who goes through abuse it's their fault i would i would say that look outside of your your parents and your siblings most people are self-selection and of course your environment can help that with that selection as well but the okay let's take the adult that goes through abuse that they couldn't have seen coming. That's their fault. Can you give me an example?

Is it like a parent that's abusing them? No, a partner. Relationship. A relationship. Someone they're on date three with. Here's the thing. The gun that's holding you to that relationship is your own self-esteem. It's no one's pointing a gun.

You don't know that they've done anything. The idea that everyone always, always and forever indicates that they are something nasty is a kind of, it feels really naive to me because there are such talented liars out there. And there are some truly talented narcissists who know how to create an impression of who they are and the way they show up in your world. I'm not saying that there aren't many, many situations where if we were really paying attention, we'd see discrepancies in what someone's telling us and what the actions are. Of course.

We get love bombed when we don't see that. But there's plenty of situations where you couldn't, you could not have seen coming just how badly someone betrayed you or just, it's like saying, you know, someone who forgot to pay me back a hundred bucks for dinner last week when they said they would. I, you know, six months later when they said they would um i you know six months later when they robbed my bank account i go i should have seen it coming they didn't pay me back for

dinner there's one there's such a leap between those two things and human beings are capable of those giant leaps in moments that truly shock us when they also think people it's not that they make those giant leaps it's just when i decide to go blind with this person, it looks like a leap. I might have met somebody who didn't pay me back for one fee, didn't pay me back another time. Because I've become blind to it, look, there are very talented liars out there, but they only work with naive people. Talented liar cannot work in my world.

I've not experienced it because I'm attuned to it. There has to be a level of complicit accepting. There has to be because people can't hide character. They can hide behaviors, but they can't hide character. There are people who are able to pull the wool over incredibly smart people's eyes. And it's to label everyone who's ever been through that situation as naive. Maybe it's trusting. Maybe it's just trusting.

I'm not saying naive is a bad tree. If we label trusting as naive, are we labeling trusting as naive now? Yes, when the behaviors and words don't align and you trust regardless. We're saying a liar's behaviors and words can align for a while. For a while is a key word. But then when the other shoe drops, what do I say? It's my fault for not somehow predicting this? Our responsibility as a human being is not to just believe the best in people,

it's to believe the truth in people. But they were showing me the best in them. I was seeing a great person. At some point, nobody can lie 24 hours a day, seven days a week. But I'm not seeing them 24 hours a day. But even in your experience, people will show you they come late, they don't listen to promises, they might be doing different things on social media. But when someone shows up late, I don't think that they're going to, you know, do something horrible to me four weeks later. They're not not that's not necessarily going to lead to that but there's always bigger signs that lead to bigger betrayals i personally have

never come across a client that's been hugely betrayed and this is the first time this person's ever let them down ever in their life i've never seen that you you won't find me saying that there aren't in many cases signs that when we look back we we couldn't have seen. We often do. But I just, I, the scope of abuse that I have seen makes it, and how it can happen to absolutely anybody, anybody. The smartest, strongest people I know have been through some of the worst things. It makes it impossible for me to come to a conclusion that it's their fault. It certainly would make it impossible for me to ever start from a place of saying, you know, self-compassion isn't what you need. What you need is to know it's your fault. But what is the definition of self-compassion isn't what you need what you need is to know it's your fault that but what is

the definition of self-compassion because if it's reading yourself a responsibility i wouldn't but if it's a case of forgiving yourself for your mistakes let me give you i i i with myself, what's helped me so much in life is if some, let's say someone speaks to me in a way that takes me back to childhood. I don't know it's happening in that moment, but some way that this person is speaking to me has like cut straight through to some part of me. is speaking to me has like cut straight through to some part of me and and what i feel in this moment is like my whole nervous system has gone into fight or flight what has helped me more than anything else is self-compassion is not you know i've got this feeling now and i go matthew this is your you know this is your fault that you have this feeling. What's helped me the most is to go, this feeling comes from somewhere way, way, way back. I was not picking, I didn't pick this feeling right now. I did not volunteer for this feeling. I didn't wake up today and go, what feeling do I want to have? Oh, crippling anxiety, feeling like

infantilized in front of this person because of the tone they just used with me. It has taken me back to something, which was a time I certainly didn't choose this nervous system response that's gotten wired in. So what has helped me is not self-blame. What has helped me more than anything else is a tremendous amount of self-compassion that, God, this is not actually, the way, the feeling I'm having right now is coming from somewhere else. Self-blame in that moment is utterly useless to me. Self-compassion is everything. And that, by the way, becomes the building block for, oh God, Matthew, you know, it's actually not your fault that you feel this right now. You've had this your whole life, dating back to a time where you never chose it and and but what guess what Matthew

you can change it you can do something about it in this moment and you can feel better and let's start from this place of self-compassion and also know that it's okay it's not your fault but we can do something about it the combination combination of those two things is magic. But to remove one and say what we need instead is not self-compassion, but just jumping to, it's your fault for getting yourself into this feeling, is a, I don't... Here's what I'm hearing you both say, that when someone has had something wrong to them happen, wrong to them happen. What I'm hearing you say, what tends to happen is we go into anger, blame, and make wrong,

this person hurt me. That's kind of the first shock. Then I think a lot of people go into, oh, how did I, what was so messed up within me where I chose poorly or I didn't see the signs? And then we start to self-doubt. We start to blame ourselves, right? We get angry at others and we keep being angry because we don't want to face ourselves eventually. I'm like, oh, where did I go wrong?

If there was anywhere. And the shame around this happening to us. And that's where it sounds like self-compassion is huge to have at that point. And to be compassionate towards self and say, okay, this happened to me this person did something horrible to me maybe there's abuse maybe there's whatever something tragic happened and the person in me needs some love and some some kindness and some self-forgiveness and

compassion and it sounds like what i'm hearing you say which might be a life-saving thing what about the person that beats their wife because Because when they were young, somebody used to beat them or they saw their dad doing it. Should they say, this isn't my fault and this isn't like, this is a child in me and therefore I have kind of have to forgive, like just kind of understand myself? Or should they say, no, no, no, listen, I understand you've been through all of this. I get it. But you don't have the right to bleed on others. You don't have the right to. Yeah.

But that's not what I'm saying. But you don't have the right to bleed on others. You don't have the right to. Yeah. But that's not what I'm saying. I know, but that mentality, what if it's in the wrong hands? Where for something to be useful, it has to be universally true. I'm not saying that the, but it doesn't, you know, someone who beats their wife should be tried and should be removed from polite society if they can't help themselves. Or the other way, women hitting a man, sorry, to gender it. Either way. It doesn't matter to me.

There's a, you know, someone has to, something has to be done about that. But it doesn't mean that when that person comes, we can, I'm able to hold both truths where I can say that woman should be nowhere near that man that man should face punishment for doing that um it should certainly be removed from any way he can continue to do that but also the root to his healing is still self-compassion it still is it's it's not for her to give him compassion no but it's it is the point he's ready to heal the only thing that will allow him to heal is for him to truly exercise self-compassion forgive himself and to be able to move through that and to choose a better

way of responding because right now his response system to whatever he's feeling is a despicable one um and so the then a better response system has to be developed yeah self-compassion still plays a part what i'm hearing sadia saying though is once you go through the self-compassion and the healing journey you've got to take responsibility for your actions is that yeah i do whether you're the one who is the abuser or the one who got abused, you have to say, okay, where can I take responsibility for what is happening? Because self-compassion is a great thing for those who are mentally stable, but lots of people in the world are not.

And sometimes their self-compassion leads to their narcissism. It leads to, no, this is not my fault. This is not what I did. It's what happened in child. So I think- I think insecurity leads to narcissism, not self-compassion. But excessive self-compassion can come from insecurity. It can come from, I don't mean to do this.

I don't know if the last thing was compassion. I think that's self-aggrandization. I think those are very different things. Yeah, perhaps. But wouldn't anything in excess be, look, when I say self-compassion, something in an excess, the reason I do it is because I recognize the internet is filled with healthy people and unhealthy people so the message is not always landing on healthy

people and i realize this when i get phone calls from people who say to me oh i know that he's just avoidant so that's why he treats me badly or i know that she's just and they kind of make excuses let me ask you this yeah someone a person who has been in a relationship for a long time with someone who has treated them terribly do you think that they are lacking in self-blame or lacking in self-compassion i would say they're lacking in self-accountability i really think it's because if they had more compassion for themselves they they would get to a point where they would no longer want to tolerate that because if you have true compassion for yourself you don't put yourself in harm's way i would say the step that you're removing or saying is not not important or is even wrong is actually the thing that's been missing all along that that

person sometimes the compassion can lead them into thinking i i know i'm so wounded i can't be alone i know i'm like this person has always been alone i can't grow up homeless that compassion for themselves has made them understand how needy they can be and sometimes you want to shift that compassion to okay action i understand this is all the reasons but excessive self-compassion can lead to people being i think that's incomplete self-compassion self-compassion is I understand why I am the way I am I can view myself holistically even on my worst days and contextually within everything I've ever been through and instead of taking all of these things that I do wrong in life my regrets my shame my insecurities the and using them to actually hurt myself which is what staying in an abusive or toxic relationship

is i'm gonna have true compassion for myself which is i'm gonna accept these parts of myself and i'm going to make it my mission to give myself a better life instead of thinking that i deserve this punishment or that i deserve this kind of treatment or that this is all i'm worthy of it's not about deserving or it's all i'm worthy of self-compassion is is both accepting yourself holistically and then also accepting the responsibility for taking care of yourself you know so that i see there's there's to me there's nothing the kind of thing you're talking about still isn't true self-compassion it's more self-understanding is what i'm trying to say what am i i think missing this what you're saying is if someone is uh you're saying i'm excusing myself treating

myself horribly and someone else treating myself horribly because they because of what i've been through but compassion without responsibility leads to stagnation I think compassion leads to responsibility perhaps in the way yeah maybe I'm misunderstanding yeah maybe I'm misunderstanding what true self-compassion means but I genuinely think what will ignite was me personally and I can't speak for everybody and also even sometimes when I speak to clients and I my focus is okay forgive yourself for this behavior. You've grown up like this. This is you're homeless sometimes. Or you had abusive parents.

You forgive yourself for accepting abuse. But now what? And then the now what part says, does that mean for the rest of your life you're going to accept this? Now it's your self-selecting. If your childhood is your self-compassionate parent, your adulthood is your self-selection. So your adult life has to be moving from that compassionate state to that accountable state they're all they always live in hand in hand though it's it's the we're going to need compassion of compassion forever a hundred

thousand more times i'm going to make so many more mistakes and there are going to be so many my my instinct is self-tyranny that's not that is brain self-tyranny. That's not, that's self-tyranny. If you want to say that's like responsibility, it's made me miserable for half my life is constantly thinking that I'm, no, I need to go out and I need to do this and I need to take responsibility for this and so on and never offering myself self-compassion. Self-compassion is something I need a thousand times a day and I give myself twice a week if I'm not careful. So I'm going to need that many more times. And that allied with taking accountability is an unbelievably potent combination. But the accountability

without the compassion is a mandate for self-tyranny would you imagine that taking accountability and making better choices is then create self-compassion because you're leading a life that is more constructive well i i don't i don't think one leads to the other automatically at all i mean i've never in all the days i'm sorry to keep talking about this i don't mean to like this is what you brought i don't mean to keep going in circles i mean it sounds like you both think self-compassion and responsibility are important yeah but maybe the wrong way around what you just said that doesn't taking responsibility lead to self-compassion. It actually doesn't.

I challenge everyone in the audience to tell me if they think otherwise. You leave a comment and tell me. But I have found that I've worked hard most days of my life. And every day I get to the end of the day and it doesn't make me more compassionate towards myself every day I get to the end of the day and I say I'll see you in six hours when I'm going to put you through your paces again and take you to boot camp all over again and every morning my pattern in my life has been waking up in deficit and thinking I need to go and kill myself today working hard so that I've earned my rent. But why do you feel you need to do that every day?

Because I like self-compassion. That's the point, is that without self-compassion, I can put myself then the accountability that can arise out of that is not only something that allows us to solve problems but it's also um it's also then you're doing it from a very healing place you're not doing it from a place of self-hatred of course you can take responsibility your whole life from a place of self-hatred and many people do yeah they how many people get come into adulthood and for the rest of their lives they work hard and they push themselves and they're hard on themselves and they are masters of taking responsibility but they they spend their whole lives miserable and hating themselves and never feeling good enough self-compassion is the is the magic that means that when you are accountable accountability is done from love

not from fear or hatred and i would personally i think i underestimate the power of self-compassion i replace it with self-respect and for me the fundamental ingredient in both your mental health and the way you treat others comes from self-respect and how i gain self-respect is by making accountable and productive decisions in every area of my life whether it's the food i eat whether it's the time i wake up or whether it's a partner i select and it's how i treat them now self-compassion is secondary to self-respect it's first to me let me tell you why it comes first no this is really this isn't a way to say why it goes first i want you to finish yeah so here's the thing because here's the thing i can live a very constructive and treat other people very well when i respect myself but the reason why self-respect

is so important is that not only does it enhance my self-esteem and what i mean by self-respect is responsible actionable actionable decisions, accountable decisions, making good, sensible decisions. Boundaries also included. Boundaries. I respect myself. And in order to respect... Now, is this also loving yourself for all the mistakes you've made in the past? Respecting is more important than loving.

And the reason I say that is loving myself might involve booking a vacation, going to a spa, and eating pizza in the evening. Respecting myself is understanding that those are actually self-indulgence. Better thing might be to do is to wake up early, go to the gym, eat no carbs for the day and have no sugar and sleep early. That's not loving. I don't love doing those things, but I respect myself when I do the same. And the reason why self-respect is so important to me is, I'm not saying I abide by this, but it's so important in relationships. Once we respect ourselves, we're able to respect others and only allow those that respect us into our lives.

Self-compassion makes us not only compassionate for ourselves, it can then make me think, well, he's probably been, I have endless clients that come to me and say, I've been through this, I've been through that, I've been through this. But then he's also had an abusive father and that's why he hits me. Or she grew up in an unstable home and that's why she cheats on me. Self-compassion can lead to you mirroring that in others and making excuses for poor behavior. Self-respect leads to you mirroring self-respect in others and only allowing those that respect you in your life. Okay. See, Matthew, you're like breathing intensely over here. I can feel your breath.

So let's just handle the last point first self-respect yeah absolutely yeah you said compassion can be really dangerous and compassion can be really dangerous in relationships especially in narcissistic or abusive relationships compassion can be weaponized against you but the only way the only way compassion for others can be weaponized against you is if you have no self-compassion what i'm saying is still king because if you can't have self-compassion then you will have an outward compassion that gets weaponized against you what if your self-compassion has you thinking this is why i act toxic so i can understand why somebody's toxic to me? Of course, but that's, you're not going to, being compassionate, that still doesn't mean being compassionate towards yourself means allowing someone to do that to you.

Or you doing it to others. You can also be a hazard to others when you're compassionate with yourself for why you are so flawed. Well, you have to have a compassion with yourself that is i'm not saying compassion is devoid of responsibility you're just saying it has to come first but it's a precursor because it the self-respect point is a dangerous one because if i don't on the days where i don't do things that make me respect myself like let's say i sleep in let's say i forget to go to i don't do things that make me respect myself, like let's say I sleep in, let's say I forget to go to, I don't go to the gym, let's say I eat a pizza. The days I don't respect myself, those are actually the days I need self-compassion the most. Self-compassion actually is the foundation on which tomorrow I do better. There is a bit.

What if that becomes your constant state becoming confused because there's the to me the deepest level of confidence the deepest level of confidence I write about this in my book the deepest level of confidence is unconditional self-acceptance it's understanding you are your human you shouldn't ever wish for another because you don't get another you are the only person you get and your job in this life above all other jobs is to give yourself the best life you can yeah and you start by a radical acceptance of who you are today based on everything you've been through right you? You accept, self-acceptance is different from self-esteem. What you call self-respect, I call self-esteem. Self-esteem, self-respect is built by doing hard

things. Now that's a great way to build a sense of confidence, but it's a separate thing from self-compassion, which frankly is vital on the days where our self-esteem is at its worst. That is self-compassion will actually be the thing that in a very positive and beautiful and loving way will motivate you to do things that build your self-esteem. Can you also build self-esteem based on self-hatred and self-tyranny? Well, you might be able to build some respect of like, yes, I can run a marathon. Yes, I can do this. Yes, I can work 14 hour days. You might be able to build that kind of muscle and then say, I respect myself because I built this muscle.

But self-respect doesn't create self-love. And what you're saying is self-love, which is going to a beach and drinking cocktails or getting a massage or whatever, which you then said was self-indulgence. I agree. It's like, that's a different thing. Self-care is not self-love. Self-love is, do I accept myself holistically? Can I find compassion for myself? And can I take the view this morning that my human is my responsibility to try to give the best life to? And that starts with accepting myself. So it's self-confidence at the deepest level is self-acceptance, which is born out of self-compassion and self-esteem, which is born out of doing hard things. I feel... You can't just accept yourself for being lazy

and making poor choices all the time. Lewis, you have to choose. Who do you agree with? You have to pick one. You can't just accept yourself. Well, I'm just going to keep making poor choices every day. I don't want to be in this situation. Well, that's not self-compassion. If you keep yourself in a place that hurts you,

then that compassion is not actually... You're not really connecting with wanting to give the best life to yourself it's an action towards something then compassion is what actually in a very beautiful way gets the car moving and doing hard things is what builds the self-esteem that builds the belief that you can do more okay pause on this yeah what you know there's a lot to digest i want people to leave in the comments. Yeah. What's resonating? What's opening up?

I think you guys are both right. You're just saying it in a little different ways. Yeah. The audience usually hates me, so I'm sure you'll win that quite easily. So no worries. There's so much. I do like an alternative perspective because I'm a very hard-headed person. I think what I think.

And it's usually the way I am. So I just like the idea of yeah being challenged yeah I love it I want to um I have about 20 questions I wanted to ask around here but I want to I want to finish with try to finish with two okay sorry no this is great I'm loving this this is great don't be sorry about anything um but what I'm hearing in this process is the single dating phase. Why you're single, why people being stuck in single or just constant dating and they're never able to find the right match. One of the most important decisions we make in life is who we select, is the relationship we choose to be with our long-term partner.

It can bring us a lot of joy and fulfillment and peace or it can create extreme sadness and suffering and frustration. And I keep hearing you say the selection process is important. I know you talk about selection being an important process. You know, reason, a lot of big reason why people get divorced is because they choose poorly and they didn't have the courageous conversations that you're talking about and you as well. I want to ask, I'm going to let you start and I'm going to let you add after this. Sadia, what would you say before someone commits to a marriage or even just a long-term committed relationship? before they commit or in the dating process with the person they're dating to see if they they really are setting themselves up for a healthy conscious relationship obviously no relationship

being perfect and it might have some downs but setting yourself up for the best possible chance for happiness in a relationship what are three things that a person should do on their own or starting that dating process before getting committed. Firstly, you would ask yourself, am I going to punish this person for wounds that they didn't create? Is there any chance that I am going to use this person as a punching bag or the opposite,

where I use them as an escalation of status? Am I using this person in any way, shape or form to heal wounds that occurred before their existence? So maybe I was hurt in my childhood or hurt by a previous partner am i using this person in any way to fix that or maybe i suffered from low self-esteem and i'm using this person's appearance or their bravado to help me regain some as a shortcut to status is there any way i'm doing this to this person if i am doing this to this person then there is no way that this this relationship will work or withstand this test of time. So I need to be honest about that to myself. That's number one. That's number one. The second thing is, can I commit to being honest about

my needs with them and be open to receive what their needs are from me? Am I open to have those conversations? If I'm going to simply communicate my needs and not listen to theirs or simply listen to their needs and not my own, the relationship is going to feel incredibly heavy on one direction. So it's going to eventually break down. And the final thing is how am I going to behave if worst case scenario happens? And what I mean by that is if tomorrow we were to get divorced or if tomorrow we had to be co-parents rather than actual loving parents, are we going to treat each other with respect and compassion and do what's best for each other? Or in those moments, are we going to become enemies? If you think that you're marrying somebody that has the potential to become your enemy when things go wrong, do not marry them.

It's better to marry somebody that you can successfully divorce than marry somebody where you ignore that. And what I mean by that is if worst case scenario happened, then you know that Martha would be a good person. Worst case scenario is she'll put the kids' needs first. You'd probably get to see them every weekend. It would be no pulling like years and years of stealing everything you got from each other. Her worst case scenario is still manageable. She's still reasonable. But if you're marrying somebody that if worst case scenario happened my entire life would be a death sentence don't do it wow okay okay so just to recap that uh even i forgot what i said there did it no it was great no i think it was great and you know and you know matthew's got

to come up with three new things well this, this is cheating. I've had time. I've had time. So the first thing was don't get into a relationship where you're going to heal or fix something from your past that you haven't already processed and done the healing work already or you haven't built the self-esteem that you're trying to gain from the other person. They would add maybe but not doing it to fix. The second one is being honest about your needs and if they can accept your needs and vice versa. Can you accept their needs? Really ask them, what else are you going to need?

What do you think you might need? Is sex important? What about this? What about like asking these? What would cause you to divorce me? What would cause you to cheat on me? Those are all vulnerable questions that most people aren't willing to ask.

And so I think having the vulnerable questions about needs, wants, desires early on. And the third is how will I behave or what's the worst case scenario they will behave? And it's an interesting thing you said that because one of the, I mean, all the relationships I was in previously, again, I don't want to say none of them were bad people or anything like that but the reason one of the main reasons why i never felt i couldn't marry any of them was because i didn't feel like if we broke up that they would be able to like handle things peacefully yes reasonably reasonably yeah right can they just be reasonable people reasonable or are they gonna overreact about everything you know that was one of the things are they gonna hold that in them forever and use that i'm gonna suffer the rest of my life yeah it's unbearable so i think those are three great

things um and what about you matthew three things that someone should do before they commit to a long-term relationship um what did i write down there's a i think i think really assessing whether the connection you have with this person is built on fundamentals it's not just built on attraction or you know i just love having sex with this person or i feel like you know it's so exciting it's david brooks said marriage is a 50-year conversation. Who can you have a conversation with for that long? You know, do you feel like this person is someone you can see yourself having a conversation with for that long? I would say accepting, trying to do some of the work, perhaps not all, but trying to do some of the work of accepting yourself before you get there taking the things that you feel most shame about the things that you

beat yourself up about the things that you you know if you weren't careful you would take them into the relationship and constantly use them as reasons to not feel good enough because it's use them as reasons to not feel good enough because it's baggage is only baggage if it's baggage to you if it's not baggage to you if it's like you own it like this is my history this is my life i have made peace with it i have made peace with who i am today and how I got here and the lessons I've taken from it all, then when you communicate that to someone else, you're going to be communicating it from a place of strength and abundance and acceptance. But it's a much harder struggle. It's not impossible because one of the most beautiful things about a relationship is someone can help you accept yourself by the way that they love you. And it's a great sign of an amazing relationship but if we could take a little of

that work off their shoulders and do some of it for ourselves before we get there it means that we they won't have to convince us that holistically you know we are this great package we'll already believe it ourselves. Wow. Go through some hard times together if you can. I mean, I'm not suggesting we engineer them. But, you know, there's, I think, giving yourself the time, if you can, to experience some things together. You know, I think one of the dangers is that we have made a lot of decisions about who someone is and how great they are for us and how great we are for them in very few contexts of having known them. You know, we've, we've done six months of nice dinners and we think we'd be

great together. Well, what about when one of you gets sick? What about when you have a family member who is very demanding and you're having to navigate how to deal with this demanding family member and, you know, figure that out with your partner at the same time who's, you know, frustrated by this family member of yours? What about when, you know, one of you is going through a very busy chapter at work and it's stressful and you're not able to give as much who are you in those difficult moments that gives you a chance to evaluate the team not the romance not the attraction evaluate the team and you only know who the team is when there are tough things for the team to go through um and i think lastly just be be someone who's got into the habit of having challenging conversations in life because your life improves in direct proportion to the number of hard conversations you're willing to have i agree and um everything that you i know you subscribe to

about asking difficult questions and what you've been talking about is really about being willing to have hard conversations uh which is something a lot of people really really avoid because they're afraid of losing a person but you have to be more afraid of someone making you unhappy than you are of losing them or losing yourself or losing yourself process wow i've got a ton more questions to ask but i want to wrap it up here i would add to this just three things that came up for me as one, getting clear on the vision of the relationship you want to have and making sure that vision aligns with the other person. So really communicating hard conversations, expressing values. Do we want kids? How are family involved? You know, we're going to see family all the time, all these different things. So getting clear on the vision of a

relationship you would like to have, although that might evolve and change over time, but doing the best you can and communicating that vision of the person and making sure it aligns. And then I would say number two and three is, number two is fully accepting yourself, kind of like all of you, the back history, the stuff you've done bad or wrong or whatever it might be, the things you've been through, accepting who you are and feeling that love and acceptance and then fully accepting the person that you're choosing to be with. Because I think a lot of people choose someone and then they don't accept them later for all their behaviors, their beliefs, their way of actions, their thoughts. But you chose them. So choose to accept them before entering a long-term committed relationship.

Make sure you have standards and boundaries in place, but you're choosing them, so make sure you accept them before you enter that long-term relationship. Don't think they're going to be a different person on the other side of the vows. And if you have to have a new set of boundaries after marriage, you didn't accept them for what they truly were. Right. Exactly. Exactly. So that'd be what I'd add there. i would love people's response to what opened up what was interesting

for them what um spoke to them the most in the comments below so leave a comment letting us know the biggest takeaway and what you want to hear more from uh sadia khan at sadia psychology.com and the sadia sadia psychology on as well. You've got online coaching. You do live streams. You've got Patreon, YouTube, all this different content online. People can check you out. A lot of interesting stuff and perspective. We've got Matthew Hussey, New York Times bestselling author in the last week.

Congratulations. Your new book, Love Life, How to Raise Your Standards, Find Your Personal and Live Happily No Matter What. Matthewhussey.com for all your content, but the newsletter is The3Relationships.com as well. And we'll have everything linked up below for these two incredible relationship experts and coaches. Is there any final thought you'd like to say

on entering a relationship for this conversation? Anything you'd like to add to finalize this point here we'll let you go matthew first and then sadia wrap it up no i i this has been fun i feel like i think we demonstrated what difficult conversations look like really well i was gonna say i was gonna say i think if if anything it's a fun and lively example of, you know, what healthy disagreement looks like. And I wish there was more of it in the world. Yeah, I really enjoyed that. Thank you. I hope today's episode inspired you on your journey towards greatness. Make sure to check out the show notes in the description for a rundown of today's show with all the important

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