The School of Greatness - Why You're Still Playing Small (And How to Stop) | Emmanuel Acho

Episode Date: May 29, 2026

Not everyone is going to like you. And that is okay. Emmanuel Acho built one of the most meteoric rises in media in recent memory. Former NFL linebacker. Fox Sports host of Speak for Yourself. Author of multiple New York Times bestselling books, including Illogical: Saying Yes to a Life Without Limits, published under the Oprah imprint. He has done things no one outside of Oprah herself has done. And still, the criticism came. This conversation is about what you do with that. How do you hold your identity when the world tries to hand you someone else's version of it? Emmanuel turned down comparisons to Michael Strahan because he understood something most people miss: you cannot become the greatest version of yourself by trying to become someone who already exists. He stopped setting goals. Not because he stopped caring, but because he realized goals create a ceiling. Instead he started moving toward objectives, things that stretch beyond what logic says is possible. He fell and got back up. He didn't fail. There is a difference. If you have ever achieved something and felt emptier than you expected, or gotten harder on yourself the more successful you became, this episode will crack something open in you. Emmanuel’s books: Uncomfortable Conversations with a Jew Amazon Ebook Audio Book Illogical: Saying Yes to a Life Without Limits Amazon Ebook AudioBook Uncomfortable Conversations with a Black Man Amazon Ebook AudioBook Uncomfortable Conversations with a Black Boy Amazon Ebook AudioBook In this episode you will: Understand why reframing failure as falling, not losing, can keep you moving when everything feels like a setback Explore the self-love scale Emmanuel used to assess himself at a six and a half, and what it takes to grow that number through success instead of despite it Discover why Emmanuel Acho stopped setting goals and replaced them with objectives that remove the ceiling on what you can achieve Learn how to protect your identity when success brings comparisons, criticism, and pressure to become someone else Hear the story of how a call from Oprah Winfrey led to Emmanuel becoming the only person outside of Oprah to have multiple books published under her imprint For more information go to https://lewishowes.com/1934 For more Greatness text PODCAST to [phone] Follow The Daily Motivation for essential highlights from The School of Greatness More SOG episodes we think you’ll love: Lewis Howes Solo [Everything You Want In Life Comes When You Let Go] Kevin Love Amy Purdy TOPICS Emmanuel Acho, Illogical, goals vs. objectives, self-love and success, public criticism, identity and comparison, reframing failure, Oprah imprint, mindset and limiting beliefs, breaking through barriers Get more from Lewis! Get my New York Times Bestselling book, Make Money Easy!Get The Greatness Mindset audiobook on SpotifyText Lewis AIYouTubeInstagramWebsiteTiktokFacebookX Hosted by Simplecast, an AdsWizz company. See pcm.adswizz.com for information about our collection and use of personal data for advertising.

What's been the biggest lesson in the last couple of years of taking your shot, of putting it out there, being on a limb, and then learning about how to handle the opportunities of success, the fame, the recognition? And also, how have you learned how to say yes and no to certain things that might be big, but not right for you at the right moment? Two lessons. Yes. I'll give you one pre-success, one post-success. I'll start with the post-success lesson because that one I'm learning right now as I'm talking to you. Everybody will not like you, and that is okay because you don't like everybody. And you know, I've had to realize, like, yo, people don't like me, man.

Like, this person's mad at me. A black person's mad at me because I'm too nice to white people. A white person's mad at me because I'm a race baiter. Why don't people like me? And then I came back and I said, wait a second, I don't like everybody. So how can I expect everybody to like me? It was something, dude, I've had a hard time to reconcile. with because you're a nice guy right you want to be liked by people that's it at least i try to be a

nice guy and in the midst of trying to be a nice guy i'm still like why are so many people upset daily and i have to reconcile with that pre-success i think it's you know the old phrase no it didn't wait till it started raining to build a boat uh-huh right like we don't wait until things get crazy to start building and I think what you've learned what I've learned what I hope people learn through this conversation it's what you do in private and in silence that ends up getting praised in public it's the wood that you're chopping when nobody's looking it's the paintings that you're drawing when nobody's buying it's the words that you're saying when nobody's listening it's the character you're developing when nobody's watching like what you're doing in private is ultimately what

ends up getting esteemed in public and what I've learned now where retroactively, it was the work in private that ended up getting praised in public. And you worked for years on developing these skills and everything. Everything. Well, what I've learned, dude, in talking to you and watching you, my own life, studying from brilliant minds that have come before us as we try to achieve our own, the greatest creations individually and collectively are the synthesis of different creations. I think about Velcro.

Velcro was created, and I'll paraphrase, but Velcro was created was somebody was walking through the wilderness if I'm not mistaken, and those little annoying pricklies, those little prickleys got stuck to a sock. And they were like, well, if a prickly can adhere to a sock

as an adhesive, why can't I create something? So you take the concept of a prickly and the concept of a sock and you create Velcro. And my life was the synthesis of NFL law. locker room, predominantly a white private school, a predominantly urban NFL locker room, synthesize those together and create content. Perspective.

Here's a perspective. Bingo. Yeah. So everybody just has to figure out what two things can they combine together to become that greatest version of themselves. Yeah, you really became a bridge for a lot of people that didn't see the other side of the river. Correct. Right.

separation of ideas, thought, understanding, whatever you want to call it, connection, and you were able to see different sides and bridge the gap. That's it. With your own Velcro. Now, for someone who has a gap in their imagination, they see a future that they want to create, they see an idea, a vision, a goal, whatever you want to call it, but they don't know how to become the Velcro and bridge it to get to the other side. what has been your your thoughts or your philosophy and your advice on how to accomplish set and achieve goals?

Man, I love that question. I love that question. Dude, I don't believe in goals. Okay. I no longer believe in goals. Crazy because I know we're told for so long, set a goal, write it down, live by it. True story, y'all, maybe one of the most depressing moments of my life. after my junior year playing football at the University of Texas,

Texas is a top flight college football program at the time, I submitted my name to go to the NFL draft. I wanted to go professionally after three years. But I got back from the NFL a report. Emmanuel, you will not be drafted in rounds one through three. You will be drafted in rounds four through seven. There are seven total rounds in the NFL draft for those watching and eventually listening. I'm not going in the fourth through seventh round.

I'll come back from my seat. year. Oh, it's a junior year. Junior year. Gotcha. So what I said was this. I took that sheet of paper that said a manual, you won't be drafted in rounds one through three, and I highlighted that line, you won't be drafted in rounds one through three, and I hung it above my bed, and I put one of those

little sticks through the wall and the paper in my bed. I looked at it every morning I woke up and every night before I went to sleep. You know what they say about goals. Look at them, commit them to memory. Well, while at the NFL Combine, I'm running my 40, at the conclusion of my senior your year. The NFL combine, again, for those watching, listening, it is the ultimate job interview

if you want to go to the NFL. I'm running a 40-yard dash, which will dictate essentially where I will be drafted. What rounder in, yeah. Exactly. As I'm running, I'm running, I hear this. Boom, boom, boom, boom. I thought my heels were clicking. They weren't. My quad was tearing off the bone. I clutched my squad. Oh, man. I fall to the ground in sheer agony. During the 40? during the 40. When every scout and coach is watching. Everyone watching. I still have the picture.

NFL TV is filming. It's on ESPN. Bones blowing up with text. Are you okay? X, Y, and Z. It's terrible. I clutched to the ground. I'll save you all the rest of that,

details of that story. I end up getting drafted in the sixth round. I learned a valuable lesson that day. Stop setting goals. Here's why. At best, if you set a goal, you will achieve it. But what if you could have achieved more?

At worst, if you set a goal and you don't achieve it, you ruin your self-esteem and your self-efficacy. My self-esteem and my self-efficacy or your self-worth, how you look at yourself, we're ruined that day, we're undermined that day. So instead of setting goals now, Louis, I have an objective with no limitations,

small difference, but that small difference will make a huge impact on your life. A goal by definition is an end towards which energy is aimed. An objective is simply directing energy towards something. So why, if I'm going to have a goal, would I focus on the end when I'm at the beginning. Instead, I direct all of my energy towards something.

I start my book, A Logical, which you and I are going to get into, imagine a life without failure. Why? Because when you don't set a goal, you can't fail. Right. And so many of us combat failure in our life. So many of us are trying to figure out how can I become the best version of myself, but we can't become the best version of ourselves because we're still mourning our

former self. We're still mourning our failures from our past. We're still mourning our defeats from our past. We're still mourning our scars from our yester years. I'm done mourning my scars. Now it's all about having an objective with no limitations similar to that quote. If you shoot for the moon, even if you miss, you land amongst the stars. So as opposed to creating a goal then, what are you creating? Are you not creating something? You're creating an objective? Correct. I'm creating an objective. So what would it look like then? Beautiful. People would always ask me when I got in the TV, hey, Emmanuel, you want to be like Michael Strayhan, right? For those that aren't familiar, Michael Strayhan, hosts, Good Morning America, co-hosts, NFL Hall of Fame, he's that guy. I said,

no, I don't want to be like Michael Strayhand. Because if I say I want to be like Michael Strayhan, I might just be like Michael Strayhand. And while that's great for Michael Strayhan, he's already taken. So why would I want to be like this man who's already taken? It's great and as great and as great as he is, Michael Strahan's already taken. I got to be a manial locho. So when people ask me, what do you want to be? I just say I want to be considered one of the most creative people the industry has ever seen. My objective is subjective. My objective is subject to people's opinion. It's like art. Bingo. It's exactly like art. Bro. And let's let's think of art. Little Wayne. One of my favorite verses, he says, when you mentioned pot Biggie and Jay-Z,

just remember Weezy Baby or when you mention Pock, Biggie and Jay-Z make sure you mention Weezy Baby essentially saying when you mention

the greats of all time just make sure you mention me too you're not saying I want to be the greatest you know what I'm saying he didn't say the best rapper alive

all that but his objective was subjective when you mentioned Tupac when you mentioned Biggie when you mention JZ

just make sure you mention me too and where I am now at with my desires in life, I don't have goals anymore, bro. Because if you have a goal, you can fail. And I'm done failing.

While people say, yo, Acho, that's crazy. Remember, our greatest accomplishments in life are typically crazy. They're not rational. They're completely irrational. Yeah. They're completely irrational. And a quote that I'm hung up on now. I'm hung up on it.

Will Smith said in his latest book, he said, remember when somebody gives you their advice, it's just that. It's their advice based on their limited life experiences. You and now are a unique combination of which has never occurred before. That's true. By which you are the best metric of success. You and now. Unique combination never occurred before.

You're the best metric of success. So me and this present moment and this conversation with you, it's never occurred before. Right. So how this conversation is going to go is dependent upon you, dependent upon you, dependent upon me, me and writing a book. This new book has never occurred before. So why would I be limited by someone else's standards? It's kind of like what you and I discussed off camera. We can bring it on camera. I know you wouldn't mind. Don't let insignificant people have such significance over your life. Yeah. And that's often what we do, bro. Why do you think so many people

focus on the insignificance of other people's thoughts and opinions? Because we all want to be liked, man. And, and, and, and. And how have you learned to let go of that feeling of being light or loved or thought in a positive light when people say things that you don't like? Well, my favorite quote, maybe for the last decade,

top three favorite quotes, because I'm a huge quote. One of my favorite quotes. And those who were dancing were thought to be crazy by those who didn't. hear the music. Oh. Imagine, and we've all been in this situation before, imagine walking on the beach, biking through the city, and you see somebody just dancing, you'd be like, yo, what the heck are they

do? Exactly. But maybe they're not crazy. Maybe they just had headphones in and you couldn't see. Those who were dancing were thought to be crazy by those who didn't hear the music. What I've realized, there's come a point in my time in my life where I'm dancing and people think I'm crazy, they just don't hear the music yet. You're dancing. You start your 1,200 episodes in now. People think you're crazy. They just didn't hear the music yet. So many people watching

this are dancing. And people think they're crazy. No, the people that think they're crazy just haven't heard the music yet. So we have to understand we're not crazy. They just haven't heard the music. And that is what keeps me going, realizing, yo, I'm not crazy. I'm on my path to greatness and eventually they will catch up. Yeah. So when you see someone saying something negative for whatever reason or anything, how do you handle it internally and then how do you handle it externally? Do you reply to certain things if someone's saying something maybe it's true or it's inaccurate? Do you take the energy to defend yourself or respond or you just say, you

know what? Okay, this is their opinion. I'm gonna focus on my vision. It's really good. I sometimes I do fall into that cesspool if you were on social media it's the worst tough man at times it can be the worst social media does great things

it clearly has for you clearly has for me but it can be the worst I think about this in the jungle not all animals want to be petted some just want to roar it's true

and Twitter is the jungle social media is the jungle in the jungle not all animals want to be pet man some just want to roar and you have to understand when you log on social media and when you are in those spaces some people just want to roar and then i also remember and this is from a movie another quote um a person is smart but people are dumb angry animals individually collectively you and i are smart but when you get amongst the crowd then all of a sudden you have that um you

You have that crowd chaos, if you will. And I said this because I've been thinking so much recently that cowards turn courageous when they can remain anonymous. Cowards turn courageous when they can remain anonymous. Oh, wow. And so often on social media and in life, people can remain anonymous. In group settings at stadiums, people can remain anonymous. Say it to my face. Come say this to my face and let's have a conversation.

We don't need to fight. We can have, we can talk. Bro, I reached out to somebody the other day because, you know, he reached out to me and he was like, he didn't reach out to me. He tweeted at me, this was a clown take and not surprising considering the source. I'm like, you got a million followers on social media. We used to work at the same company. You can get my number.

Right. I called him up. Oh, man, my bad. I regretted it as soon as I said it, man. I shouldn't have said it. I should have it's on me. And I'm like, do we got issues? Just let me know.

but I think people get in the midst of that mob mentality and it's sheer chaos. So I will say to your point, it's been hard, as you know. Like that journey up the mountain top, and I'm still trying the journey, but it's gonna be depressing. How do you manage it emotionally?

And manage your emotions when you see something that maybe is seeming unfair or just mean. Man. And maybe you're not doing it the best way yet, but you're on the journey. Sometimes you just got to step away. Yeah, don't respond.

Don't respond. And honestly, log off. I think we have such a mental health crisis right now in society, in large part because of social media. We are seeing things we were never meant to see. We're hearing things we were never meant to hear. And we're reading things we were never meant to read. And we're seeing hearing and reading them in a very elaborate manner with a lot of, I don't know, emotion. You know, it's like we used to read or see things

or hear stories without watching the news in such a way that was dramatized to its worst point to get the attention. This is one of the reasons I don't really watch the news ever. I want to be informed and educated, but I don't want to be entertained or captivated by my emotions overwhelmed by watching information as entertainment. And so I try to step back and say,

tell me the facts, tell me the data. so that I can have a rational thought around it. Otherwise, I'll get tied into just watching the news and be like, the world is ending. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And I think we all have to do a better job of protecting our own minds, our own spaces, what we can take and what we can't take.

Because you only get one mind, dude. And I know you pride yourself on your mind. I pride myself on my mind. Dude, we only get one. And I think we all have to do a better job of protecting our own mental health. I grew up in a religion called a Christian science and the founder as a female. Our name is Mary Baker Eddie and she had a quote that said,

Stan Porter at the door of thought. Don't allow these thoughts to enter the mind continuously because then it'll damage everything in your life. So Stan Porter at the door of thought, be a guard at the thought, at the mind. And don't just allow anything to be consumed by it. So what has been the biggest struggle then for you mentally and emotionally in the last couple years. The biggest struggle is trying to ascend to the mountain top. And the reason I say that, bro, is to get to the mountain top? Yes. Trying to climb. What is the mountain top? I think the mountain top is different for everyone. Is that a goal? For me, the mountain top is checking boxes.

Okay. Right? Like, it's checking boxes. Give me an example. Okay, great. Now I host my own show on sports. Speak for yourself. Check. Oh, Craig, great. Now I've partnered with Oprah on a book. Oh, another book. Oh, a third book. Yeah.

Check. Okay, but the book has to best sell. Check. It's just like, it's just trying to ascend, trying to do and not being dejected when you don't. And then bro, I also think trying to figure out our place on this earth. Yeah.

I think we're all trying to do that. When we remove the masks, and the makeup, figuratively speaking of our life. We're all trying to figure out what value am I providing to the people I'm interacting with? What value am I providing to society? Where is my place in life? And I've been constantly,

my biggest struggle the last couple years is trying to really figure that out. And now that it appears I figured that out, trying to sustain the heat, excuse me, and the hate that comes with that. The heat and the hate. I don't think people understand that once you have audience and attention, there will be heat and hate.

No matter how pure your intentions are, no matter how kind you try to be, there'll be hate. You know what I've realized, man, and my co-host, Marcellus Wiley says this. Criticism is the cost of praise. It is. We don't realize that enough. Like recently, for those watching sports news,

Naomi Osaka, number one tennis player in the world, just a couple years ago. She tried to stop a tennis match because somebody said you suck. Somebody yelled you suck and she went to the judge and went to the end and was like,

yo, can we stop the match? Like, can you get them kicked out? Is this recently? Recently. I didn't see this. Two days ago. Wow. She tried to stop the match

and say, kick that person out. Correct. And at the end of the postgame press, her tears came into her eyes for different reasons. And I was just like, criticism is the cost of praise. And when you are...

If you don't want criticism, don't play the game. You just, you... It's like, you don't have a choice. choice. Don't play. Don't show up. You can't play if you don't want criticism. It's not even like you were advising don't. It's like, yo, criticism comes with it. Here's the funny thing. Not to cut you off is that you're going to be criticized at the top or criticized for doing nothing. She wants to do something you enjoy. Because if you're sitting on the couch and you have all this

potential but you don't do something, the people closest to you're going to say, what are you doing? This person has so much potential. I give me their potential. I could do something great with this, but they're just sitting on their couch depressed, worried about people's thoughts or opinions. There's a price either way. You got to pay it either way. You got to pay it either way. Maybe it's greater price as you're climbing

and dealing with the more attention, but there's a price either way. You know what else, man, and I've realized this too, and it's hit me in the face. You can't call for attention and hang up. Yeah, so look at me. Oh, but always say nice things about me.

You can't. You can't. And whether we intentionally call, for attention or we don't. You can't call for attention and hang up. Like the boy who cried woof, like us in our friend groups, like a child in a house cries and cries. Mother asks, what's wrong? Father asks what's wrong? Nothing. And what are you crying for? You can't call for attention and hang up. And so I think there's just a lot of learning and discovering that I'm doing on this journey. Yeah. The emotional regulation is funny. I was just interviewing a

scientist slash brain surgeon. He's an expert in both areas. So he studies the brain and the mind, right? The thoughts. And after this two hour conversation, the whole thing came down to, the number one skill to have is the ability to emotionally regulate your feelings.

And how thoughts, the brain, and the mind are connected to feelings. And the ability to emotionally regulate them. Not saying that you're not gonna have wide range of emotions, but the ability to regulate under pressure, under stress, so that you can get into flow, that you can get back to your mission, your vision,

and not be in chaos mode. You can defend yourself rationally, essentially, in times of chaos. And he said, that's kind of what it comes down to. If I could teach a skill, it'd be the skill of emotional regulation. And I think the farther we try to strive to unlock our potential, the more we need to learn that, because the more people are going to be coming at us, it sounds like.

Yeah, yeah. One, I think that's a phenomenal thought. I think it was Michael Jordan's trainer who said, emotions are dangerous, but control danger. Or it's like a controlled aggression is like the most dangerous of all. Yeah, yeah, yeah. Is that Tim Grover? Yes, Tim Grover.

It's like the most dangerous of all. Because being emotional and reacting, you're going to fell out. Deng! You're going to do something stupid. Correct. Which I did many times in multiple sports. and then you learn the lesson, oh, my emotional reaction gets me on the bench or it hurts my team. And you know what's interesting.

We're talking sports, but this is a life. Life, man. Yeah, it's life. Because while you can say foul out literally, figuratively speaking, if you're at the grocery store and then you get upset and then you get emotional and then you get into it with the cashier emotionally fouling out, if you're talking to a friend and then you say something you shouldn't have emotionally fouling out, relationship. oriented if you're talking to somebody and you're dating and then you get into it so we're talking a sports conversation but it is the controlling of your mind but to me bro everything starts with the mind both our greatest limitations and our greatest accomplishments to me it's all up here absolutely well what has been the biggest you talked about living a life without failure or fear of failure

living a life without failure what is the biggest fear for you in the last couple years and and now that you've, let's call it broken through, right? You were already really successful. I mean, you're NFL player and had a career in sports TV and all these things, but broken through to a different level, what is now the greatest fear? Ooh, that's why I like talking to you.

I'm saying, man. I like talking to you. My biggest fear is becoming complacent. My biggest fear is not realizing I'm living inside of a box that is around me. My biggest fear is not realizing, hey, there's a door you haven't yet opened and what you think is a world

is actually just a locker that you are inside of. One of my greatest, one of my favorite scenes of any movie, it's the end of Men in Black, I believe it's Men in Black One. And at the end of the movie, they open up a locker and they open up the locker and they realize there's an entire another world out there. They thought they were living in their world,

but there's such a bigger world out there. And my, Greatest fear is not pushing beyond a boundary because I don't even realize the boundary is set because I didn't set it because somebody else said it and I've been living inside of somebody else's box or somebody else's boundary The reason we don't achieve our highest highs bro Isn't because we're not skilled. It isn't because we're not talented. It isn't even necessarily because we don't want it It's because we don't realize how high we could achieve right. I think that's the biggest limiting reaction into realizing our eyes. One of my favorite stories, if not my favorite story,

story of Roger Bannister. Four minute, mile. For those that aren't familiar, Roger Bannister, scientists believed it was physically impossible, impossible to run a mile in under four minutes. Quick history lesson for everybody. That's my favorite story. Scientists believe it's physically impossible to run a mile

in under four minutes. May 5, 1952, it had never been done in 2000 years, but by May 6th, Roger Bannister, Oxford, England. Oxford, England, runs a mile, three minutes, 59 seconds. Within two years, 10 people ran a mile in under four minutes. Now, the world record for the mile, three minutes, 43 seconds, and roughly 1,800 people have done so. Why? Because one man, Roger Bannister, remove the barriers that other people set around him.

One man said, you know what, I'm not going to subscribe to that barrier. One man said, I'm not going to subscribe to goals. One man said, I'm not going to subscribe to that. And he broke the damn open for everybody. And after that damn was broken for everybody, the whole rest of the running world proceeded to run through it. So my biggest fear, bro, is living inside of a box that somebody else set before me.

So if you don't have goals to break or reach, what are you reaching for? Like what's beyond a barrier that you're not trying to accomplish? For me, I'm reaching for movement. Okay. It's all it is. I'm reading for progress. Yeah.

Moving forward. Uh-huh. I'm moving forward. So it's not reaching an end goal. No, it's moving. Yes. It's moving forward, man. Like you, you're going to do another episode tomorrow,

and hopefully it's better than the day, and then the next tomorrow, and hopefully it's better than that day, and then you're just going to keep moving. Like, let's not get so bogged down by, but I didn't get this. Oh, but I got that. just keep moving forward. When you go to a beach and you end up standing in the ocean, eventually after about five minutes, you'll look back and like, yo, I don't drifted way far away.

And you just drifted further than you ever thought. That's where I'm at now. Let's keep moving forward. We get so caught up in, I want to be married by 26 and I want to have two kids and I want to have bought my first home by 29 and by 35, I want to be done having kids, and I want to have four kids, two boys, two girls, preferably twins, because that would be easiest. Bump all that. Forget all that goal setting.

Goals lead to failure. I want to live the most impactful and significant life I can possibly live. And if I happen to live that life with somebody else, great. And if I don't, great. And at 35, I want to see where I am. And at 30, I want to see where I am. And I want to just continue to move forward and make progress as a human being. But at the end of the day, bro, the reason we have these goals isn't even because of us.

It's because of other people. This blew my mind. This blew my mind. And you're a sports guy, so this may as well, this might blow yours as well. This truly blew my mind. We often debate LeBron James, Michael Jordan, greatest basketball player of all time. Who do you say, sir? I mean, I'm from Ohio, so I go for LeBron.

Go for LeBron. I just saw LeBron last night to play. So, right, let me blow the. this Michael Jordan, LeBron James debate open for a second. For those that claim Jordan's the greatest basketball play ever, they claim it primarily for this reason. He went to six

NBA championships and he won six. But outside of those six NBA championships, Jordan never went back to an NBA finals. He went six times and he won all six times. LeBron, on the other hand, has gone ten times and he's only won four. He's more like Tom Brady.

Gone ten, one four, Jordan went six, won six times. Okay, great. Now let's talk about the same exact sport, basketball. Let's talk about the same exact result, first place and or second place, Jordan and LeBron. But now let's talk about a different measuring system, a different metric system, the Olympic Games.

In the Olympic Games, Michael Jordan would have six golds, no silvers. LeBron would have four golds and six silvers. On an Olympic scale, four golds and six silvers is abundantly and clearly greater than six golds. than six goals. But in the NBA scale, six golds is better. So the question simply comes down to

whose metric system are you using? And the problem is, we let other people's metric systems dictate the happiness in our life. Because in the NBA, you finish in second, you leave the court crying and weeping, devastated. The Olympic Games, you finish in second,

to a degree you're elated, depending on what country. Why? Why? Because somebody else dictated how we should feel about a certain situation. based upon their metric system, not even our own. Absolutely. And I'm just done subscribing to other people's metric systems.

I go to the Olympics, that's an accomplishment. I go to the Olympics and get a bronze. I'm like, I'm meddled, you know. One of the three best in the world. Exactly. And what I do. Exactly. But in the NBA, you get third.

In the NFL, you're finishing third. In the MLB, you're finishing third or fourth. You're like, you're petrified. You're distraught. And I've realized, bro, we just subscribe to other people's metric systems. And we let it dictate our happiness. Now tell me, okay, I love this approach. I love the philosophy and the mindset.

But for someone watching or listening, it was like, okay, but I really want to accomplish some goals to feel like I'm accomplishing something because I wanted to build my, because it's always built my confidence when I do accomplish. But I hear you say, but if you don't accomplish this,

they're going to hurt yourself esteem. So how do we, if someone's like, I want to write a book this year, do I set a goal to write a book or is it a journey of writing the book? Do I create micro goals on a weekly basis? and have accountability, you know, there's going to be deadlines, or, you know, how do we think about the process of like completing a project,

launching something we want to launch, doing our artwork, creating our music, whatever it might be. How do we then set these things and make them happen? Right. So I got my master's in sports psychology, and I dedicated my final thesis paper, if you will, for my master's degree to this concept. I elaborate and expound on this concept in a logical,

but I will give you a snippet. Because I studied goals so long, I understand. There is a use for goals. When you are talking about the micro in order to accomplish something, there is a use for goals in a relay race to stick in Olympic sport of track and field. It does not matter how fast we run if we do not get the baton around. So the micro goal needs to be to get the baton around. When I say don't set goals have an objective with no limitations,

I'm talking about a larger principle of life. Yes. When you're talking about macro things such as, hey, I just want to write a book, right? In the macro of writing a book, sure. Say, I want to finish a chapter on Monday and I want to finish my, I want to write a chapter every week, every Monday. If you have a employer who's like, hey, we need this done by this date. Well, within that stance, there is a means to set a goal. You talked about talking to the neuroscientist.

You mentioned this pivotal word flow. in order to achieve flow flow, flow is simply when you no longer a conscious of time in the midst of a task in order to achieve flow, you need automatic feedback, autonomous feedback. In order to get that feedback, you need to set goals. So there are

principles, objectives, in life within micro constructs where goals have value. I'm talking about the macro look of life where goals will do more damage than they will success. Or at least goals will just be a limiting reacted.

Gotcha. Because I always think, what if Roger Bannister wasn't just trying to break the four-minute mile? How much faster could he have gone? You never know. He went 359.8.

He broke it barely. There's literally two-tenths of a second was the difference. How much faster could he have gone? Maybe no faster, but maybe. If my goal, Lewis,

was to write a book, I would have wrote a book. I wouldn't have wrote the second one. And I might not have written the third one. So that's where I'm thinking, like, bigger picture, I just want to see people be the best version of themselves. So how do we, I mean, people are going to fail,

but you're saying to reframe failure or to not even look at failure as an option because if you don't set the goal, you can't fail in that sense. Bingo. I thought about this the other time. I don't think people fail. What I say is this, and I thought about this.

I didn't fail, I fell. And as long as I get up, I win. Ooh, yeah. Like a child. A child falls hundreds and thousands of times and they never think to themselves, maybe this walking thing isn't for me. To do. They fell, they fall and they get up.

We didn't fail. We fell. As long as you get up, you win. The winning isn't getting up. So many people think they failed. They didn't fail. They stopped. You stopped.

You didn't fail. You just failed. And you just never got up. That's it. A relationship didn't work. You didn't fail at that relationship. You didn't fail in that relationship. Job, you got five.

You didn't fail. You fell. Get up. You'll look back. You win as long as you get up. So when people keep talking about failure, I don't subscribe to that, but I don't subscribe to goals

because ultimately to fail is to put a period where a comma belongs. I ain't doing that no more, big dog. Or a dot, dot, dot, dot. Exactly. To be continued. I'm putting periods where commas belong anymore. And then we do that too often in our life.

It's like, ah, this relationship ended, period. No, this relationship ended. I found somebody who was more suitable for me, who I am more suitable for, and I now ended up significantly happier than I was. That's a good way to look at it. You know, looking at, I mean, I feel like it took me a long time to learn how to walk in relationships. I was just falling and wobbling all over the place.

You know, I just needed some coordination sooner. But it took me a while to be able to look back and learn a lesson. And I feel like I'm in a much more stable place. You know, you know, I've coordinated. nation with my body now in relationships in terms of walking. And some people learn faster in certain areas of life. But it's not about giving up on love, giving up on your career, your books or your message or your art.

Yeah. It's about learning. A friend of mine posted this video, his name's Devin Rodriguez. He got big on TikTok. I think he's got like 30 million followers in the last two years. He started drawing people on subways in New York City. And he would just see them, he would draw them, and he would hand them a sketch, and people would blown away. He did a video recently where he started learning in 2010 how to draw.

And he posted a photo from 2010 to 2020 every year, his work. And it was ugly the first five years. I mean, you'd throw it away. It was so bad, right? It was like a five-year-old sketch. It was like something I would do right now. It's about how I draw. But now it looks like you take a photo of someone and he could.

and draw it perfectly. But it took him 10 years to master the skill. He didn't fail the first five years, seven years. He fell forward by kept improving. I think it's a beautiful lesson you're talking about. Don't think about it as failure. Think of it as falling. Bro.

And so many people in our life, even our loved ones, want to tell us that we failed. And we begin to believe them. And that's the problem. We've all committed to believing the lie that we have failed. in life. We failed in our school. We failed in our relationships. We failed in our jobs. We haven't actually failed. But if you believe and listen to a lie long enough, you will be convinced that it's

the truth. Yeah. And what I now practice is detangling so many of the lies that we've been told over time, deconstructing so many of the thoughts that we've believed over time. Because it's those thoughts and it's those lies that bog us down. And bro, this also blew my mind. The Mona Lisa. I went to Paris last summer. I went to Paris. I went to the Louvre.

And bro, you've been to Louvre? I think I went to the outside. I didn't go inside. Yeah. So I'm in the loop and there's art everywhere. There's art on the ceiling. There's freaking art on the walls, art on the left side. There's art everywhere.

As I'm walking through this, you know, hundreds of acres seemingly. I see a huge long line. For the Mona Lisa. I don't know yet, though. I don't know. So I'm like, what in the heck is this line for her? It's art everywhere, y'all. Why are you standing in the line to see a piece of art?

Just look left. I turned a corner, huge line for the Mona Lisa. I was like, I ain't waiting to the line, so I'm just walk by and see. I look at it. It's nice. It's a painting. It's a painting. It's a painting.

It's a painting. It's somewhere from 1503 to 1518, I believe, historians suggest. You realize if the Mona Lisa were painted today might go to GarageTale for 20 Yeah, maybe. Maybe. But why? Because the Mona Lisa back then depicted a pale woman with thin lips and a large forehead. And that was the depiction of beauty back then.

Depiction of beauty in 2022. Sun kissed skin, you know, thin waist, nice build. But why, bro, do we subscribe to a definition of beauty that somebody else set? Because you can never catch it. The definition of beauty in the 15 months. 100s vastly different than the definition of beauty now. What was beautiful then, we don't value now. What we value now, we don't value then, but either way we didn't even set it back to,

why do we let such insignificant people have significance in our lives? And man, I'm just like, what all are we believing that we just don't need to? So what would you say people can do to build self-confidence if they're doubting themselves? What are some things, if it's not setting and accomplishing goals, What can we do to build it? Well, like you just said, self-confidence starts with self. And I think, and this is what I will tell, I will share, I believe you and I have had this conversation either off or on or off the record. June 9th, 2020, get that call from Oprah.

And when Oprah calls me, she says these words. Well, okay, true story. Let me not lie to you. I missed the call. Yeah. Oprah and I did a conversation on Apple TV. uncomfortable conversations meets the Oprah conversation. I missed the call. Oprah's right-hand woman rushes in. Hey, great job, Emanuel, but I think Oprah called you. I scurried to call her back.

I call her. This is what she says. You have the thing, my friend, you have the thing. And coming from someone who had the thing and has the thing, you, my friend, you have the thing. So I'm like, yo, Oprah just told me I have the thing. She's an anointed me with the thing. So what is the thing? She said, you have an ability to communicate with people, difficult truth, and they still want to hear you. So what would my advice be to people who are trying to get that confidence without setting goals?

I would tell them what Oprah told me. You have the thing. The question is, what is the thing? What is the ability that you are uniquely skilled, gifted, and or excel at? We all have it. I promise you you have it because we all do. Your thing might be an incredible painter.

Your thing might be simply being a servant, a great listener. Your thing might be being great with kids. Your thing might be being great with animals. You might be great with secretarial task. You might be a skilled mathematician. But you have the thing. So for those that are lacking confidence, you don't need a set of goal to know that you're skilled.

You just need to believe that you're skilled. And you need to figure out what is it that you were skilled at. I shared this story today on my social media, but you my boy, let me share it now. 2014, I'd been released by the Eagles for the fifth time. By them or by the Eagles? Holy cow. How do they keep bringing you back? They cut me, they would sign me back.

They cut me, they would sign me back. Oh my gosh, man. They cut me, bro. The Eagles cut me for the fifth time by the age of 24. When I got cut this time, my coach, Southern Draw accent, he said this. He called me E. He said, he. Ah, yeah, I wish I could buy stock in your future.

I was like, huh? He said, I wish I could buy stock in your future. I said, coach, you wish you could buy stock in my future? You all just released me for the fifth time. That's crazy. In the last two years, and I'm not even 25 back. Fast forward, seven years, eight years. I realized what he was saying.

He saw in me what I hadn't even seen in myself, not as a football player, but as a person. My coach texted me about three months ago, and he said, stock price is too high now. Oh, that's pretty cool. And so what I would just tell people is like, man, I wish I could buy stock in your future. Because my coach saw on me what I didn't see in myself. And I think sometimes it's our job to see in people what they don't even see in themselves.

You know, what's interesting is we should be reinvesting in our own stock daily. And like pouring back into ourselves, buying into ourselves so that we appreciate over time. The more we do that by acquiring skills or learning out of heal, traumas of the past or mending friendships or forgiving people or, you know, being consistent with the habits that help us live a better life, we will ultimately be more valuable in the future. Correct. So start investing now. That's it.

Like investing in yourself and learn to fall in love with yourself. Absolutely. On a scale of 1 to 10, 10 being the highest form of self-love. one being the lowest form of self-love. Where are you on that scale? If you stripped your ego away and the shell, and you looked within your heart, and you said, I love myself,

unconditionally this much on the spectrum of one at ten. Where would you be at? Six and a half. Where were you two years ago? Huh. Pre-encom. Pre-un-up. And eight?

Okay, so you loved yourself more before you love yourself now. Now. Why, I believe that, this is interesting. Expectations minus reality equals disappointment. Expectations minus reality equals disappointment. You didn't have the expectations before that. No, man. Before uncomfortable, there was no expectations.

Not by the world. I had my own expectations, but the world had no expectation of me. Now my expectation are freaking through the roof. Now you're number one bestseller. You've won an Emmy. You got to show. sit down with you. Expectations are through the roof.

So now I've gotten harder on myself. Because you and I spoke about this and our off-camera combos is just as good as our on-camera combos. It's so hard to maintain excellence. It will keep you up at night. It will take years off of your life. It will cost you to burst blood vessels in your vocal cords, which I have.

it is so hard, unbelievably hard, to try to maintain excellence. And that is why I'd say instead of six and a half, because I'm just hard on myself now. Wow. And I'm hard on everybody around me. Now, I believe that the fun isn't winning. You know, my coach told me the fun isn't winning. I've never met too many happy people that don't win.

You say the fun is or is not? Fun is. My coach, linebacker, coached bag of tech. No one's having fun losing all day. Nobody. And so it's at a six and a half because I'm just... But you're winning. You're winning more than two years ago.

Yes. But, bro, and again, Will Smith. You've got three books in two years, an Emmy, massive press over the world, massive social media following, you're changing lives, you're impacting people, you're spreading your voice to the world. The biggest fear, and you love yourself less. The biggest fear, dude, isn't in non-attaining, and not attaining. the biggest fears in having it and losing it.

So how do we let go of that? How do we let go of that fear? Well, to let go of that fear, what are you going to lose? What could you lose? And theory, reputation or like... Right, you could lose reputation, you could lose emotional comfort, you could lose financial stability, emotional stability, and thus you could ultimately lose spiritual stability.

And then what? Lose it all, then what? Honestly, Probably wouldn't be all that bad. Where were you five years ago? Where was I two and a half years ago? Exactly, man. You were fine.

You were at eight. You know, honestly, here's a thing now. Now, what you're saying, this is a powerful conversation, what you're saying is with success, you love yourself less. Yes, twist. I would say that my highs are high and my lows are low. My highs are significantly higher and my lows are lower. Okay.

And I think that is what land you. Bro, two and a half years ago, just chilling. Yeah. Not much good, no much better, it's here. Yeah, yeah. Now, Emmy. There's more at stake. Volitude.

Number one bestseller. Isolation. Oh, man. You know, it's just, it fluctuates. So how do we become the Tom Brady's of life? You know, where it's just more even keel. Well, here's what's interesting. Let's not be bamboozled by Brady.

Oh, yeah, he could be emotional, Tom. Well, here's why I say, let's not be bamboozled by Brady. If you are married to someone for 22 years and then you file for divorce and you go back within two months, there's an issue either internally with you or you didn't think through your decision. Tom Brady was married to the game of football for 22 years. Right. Divorced the game of football. Now he's coming back. And then within two months was like, you know what?

Give me this football back. It makes me wonder like, how happy was Brady without it? Clearly not. Maybe he just wasn't done. Sure. I mean, he can still play at the highest level. He's still one of the best in the game. But the question that you just asked me is what I would ask him is like,

what you still, okay, what happens if you don't play? What happens if you lose it? Right? Like, yeah, I think Brady's greatest accomplishment was walking away playing at the highest level. No top five or top 10 player in the history of American sports has done that. none. The late great Kobe Bryant, one of your best interviews

on this show. The late great Kobe Bryant, his last year played 60 games at 82. Second to last year he played 35 out of 85. His last game, however, went crazy.

Was a bang. 60 points on 40 shots. He went out on top there. He went crazy. But nominal. But the Kobe's last three years wasn't a championship, yeah. He was just hurt.

I mean, think about our greatest of greats, Peyton Manning, albeit his team won a Super Bowl, he was hurt. So I think you go out on top. But I think, back to the crux of this combat that conversation there's a dichotomy of success and I love what Oprah says and I believe she says it best you can have everything but you

can't have it all at once yeah can't have all of what though because I feel like you can be healthy mm-hmm you can be fulfilled you can have love in your heart you can have a beautiful relationship mm-hmm and you can be on your journey of a fulfilling life mission? Yes. So what does it mean you can't have it all? I mean, I can't... I don't know, what is this all?

I think all is, in the context of which he's speaking, is like, there are no... There are no... What's I say? It's like, okay, having it all is like, if you want to be the best media mogul. Yes, you can't also be... You can't full-time traveling musician

or something or like an athlete. Or even like you, Tom Brady, you can't be the greatest quarterback of all time and also be the greatest husband. Something got to get on 24 hours in a day.

Right. So the time you're, you're putting towards football, you're taking away from your kids. Time you're giving your kids are taking away from football. Like, something has to give. And so when I think about it,

it's like, something's got to get. Well, I mean, if you've been trained, I mean, just, I don't know, I don't know Brady's life or what it's going on there, but if you've given so much

to one thing, for decades and you've built momentum, you don't ride on it, but you've laid the groundwork. So maybe you can have more time for family or other things, downtime, once you've done 20 years of effort to master your skill. So there might be, you know, at a certain point you can transition into, okay, now I have more time with friends or family or whatever it is. Again, I don't know, his personal life, but... So maybe not all at once, but I think...

Correct. But it's an interesting exploration. Absolutely. It's an interesting exploration as so many people when they hang it up, retire from their profession. I just want to spend more time with my spouse and my kids. I mean, Oprah hung it up, right? I mean, she stopped her show and transitioned into different shows and projects. Correct.

And now, you know, she'll do three, four conversations a year. She'll produce a couple things. She's got her Apple show, right? She's like, whenever she wants to do it, I guess. But she, you know, when she was banging out her show 260 days a year, I mean, just going, going. But I think even she would admit, like, and her and I spoke last week, I think even she would admit, like, didn't have the same level of downtime, didn't have the same peace about life, didn't have that same tranquility. Absolutely. Even you're grinding away,

dude. I'm in the grind phase right now. You're in the grind phase. You're in the grind phase. You're just finished one conversation, you're having another conversation. But at one point, at one point, I see a evolution, you know, and it's been evolving over the last nine years, and I see a, evolution of when you bring in an amazing team and you're able to systematize and you're able to create other parts of a network and shows it doesn't have to be you grinding in the same area correct you can evolve i can't wait for that you know it's like if you wanted to do 10 more books you're not going to be the one that has to write them all yourself you can have support a ghostwriter to help with you or an editor or something so it's not just all you you can evolve beyond it correct but there is a

period of time, but we must go all in on something. Absolutely. For years. If you want to do anything at a high level, you've got to obsess over something, you know, an instrument, your art, your craft, or whatever it might be. So 100% agree that you can't have it all. I can't be the greatest public speaker in the world and a media host and this and playing the guitar on touring around the world or whatever.

It's like, but I feel like you can have your all. So then it comes down to if people's all, like my all, All right now is significance. People say, Emmanuel, how'd you get so successful? I don't care about success. I care about significance. What does that mean? Impact.

Yeah. Service. Impact. But significance, I feel like, when I think of significance, it's me being significant, as opposed to being of service and creating significance in the world. I say they're the same. Why would I say they're the same is you being of service

is significant to you? Sure. Like, for example, It was 2014. I'm laying in my bed in Philadelphia, Pennsylvania. I'm playing for the Eagles at the time. And these words came into my head, and I never was able to shake them.

And I literally, I end illogical with this. That's the last thing in the book. My desire is to inspire those to go higher, past the required. So those I admire can also admire whom they've inspired before they expire. That's beautiful.

And it was like, wait a second. I was laying in there. And it was literally what you just said, impact, significance. My desire is to inspire. those to go higher past or required so those they admire can also admire

whom they inspire before they expire I was like that's my life I didn't come up with it it was imprinted onto my heart my true desire I just want to inspire people to be a better version of themselves so that the people who admire me

I can admire them before I get up out of here that so you mentoring or supporting others you can go. Yeah, exactly. Dude, one of my favorite things is when people are like, I saw your uncomfortable conversations

and I use that and we've now built a curriculum around it at our job. I'm like, y'all admired me for sitting down and having these conversations. Now in turn, I'm admiring you for having conversations based upon a conversation I have.

That's cool. I'm like, that, bro, is my deepest desire. Now, here's my, I'm going to get back to this because I want to put a bow around this topic of self-love. What's it going to take for you or anyone as they start to break through certain levels of success or accomplishment or whatever they might be looking for?

What's it going to take for people to increase their level of self-love with criticism, with the weight of gold, as the Olympians call it? I don't know if you've seen that documentary, the weight of gold. Powerful about how Olympians, not all, Some of them get extremely depressed after they accomplish the gold medal or the Olympics. Some even commit suicide in these different things because what's next? And I'm living from this past now as opposed to something greater for myself. So how can we, when we accomplish, when we succeed, when we get recognition, significance,

develop deeper sense of self-love as opposed to you go from an eight to a six and a half. I'm not saying it's bad or something, but how do you stay at an eight or improve as you make more impact in the world, as you accomplish more and have more that you've received. That's my question for you on how you can do that personally and how we can support others in doing that as they accomplish.

I think it's a constant journey. I'd be lying if there was an answer. I think it's a constant journey. And again, I've referenced it so many times but I felt so seen in reading Will's book because he was like, I was my own drill sergeant, his own drill sergeant. And I think it's a constant journey, man,

of trying to say like, hey, it's okay to fall. Yes. It's okay if one of your books don't best sell. Absolutely. It's okay if a conversation doesn't go as great as you thought. It's okay if this date didn't go as great as you thought. It's okay if this relationship ends. It's okay as this job isn't for you.

It's okay. And I think it's that constant exploration of saying like, you know, it's okay not to be okay. Yeah. And what you just said is like, dude, what happens if you lose it all? You're back where you were? Two years ago. Yeah.

And I think... Where you were in that. Self love. I think it's reconciling that. I think it's reconciling like let go of that fear. Yes. Failure. Because I've let it...

That's why I stopped setting goals is to let go of that. But now it's like now that you've achieved, it's okay. Just to me again, it's just a matter of like, hey, you've... You've made it. Yeah. But if we're being honest, there's just the dichotomy that I'm figuring out along this. I think this would be powerful for you over the next few years or whenever you figure this out to share with me or share with your audience how people can accomplish, achieve, and have the responsibility of success and continue to have immense self-love. And I think it comes to, for me, what I've learned is,

letting go of the expectation of the accomplishments. You know, my last book, my first book was a New York Times bestseller, and then there was an expectation. I gotta make the next one of the New York Times best seller. Probably same for you, I gotta make this just as big, if not bigger. And I remember going into it saying, my last book, I was like, you know what, I'm writing a book

that's probably not gonna be the biggest thing ever, because it's talking about how men can be more vulnerable. And it came out right when Me Too happened. So I was writing this a couple years before, and it came out during it. I was like, this could either be the biggest thing in the world or this could be like the last thought people have is how men can heal their hearts.

And it did well, but didn't hit New York Times Best Star List. And I remember for a day, I was like, if I'm being honest, I was upset and angry and frustrated. That it didn't hit the numbers, but it didn't hit the list. And then I said, what was the reason why I wanted to write this in the first place? It was to be able to help one man who might be going through mental challenges or struggles to heal and improve the quality

of their relationship with their partner, their friends, family and then their community and the world. And it's been doing that. It's been continuing to do that year after year. And I'm just like, I gotta keep focusing on the impact and the significance, like you call it, the service to one human being or thousands or millions, whoever wants to listen or read or consume. And when I, it took a few days to kind of let that go, my ego go of being hurt or

frustrated or angry. And when I did that, I just said, okay, I'm gonna just really appreciate. The people that are reading it, they're messaging me and take it in and be like, wow, that was impactful to that person. And that's been a big game changer for me. It still doesn't mean I don't want to accomplish goals and all these things and, you know, succeed in my own right. But it letting go the expectation of it needing to look a certain way has been extremely helpful for me still loving myself,

even with the success. And I think it's hard to do, though, because the big you get, people expect it, you expect it. That part. It's the expectation. People expect it. And they'll look at you differently, oh, why didn't it get in New York Times this time? Or why didn't it do a million copies this time if it did half a million last time? That video you got five million views.

Why did this one get a million? To me, there's such a fear of, in life in general, in my mind, of other people's expectations of you. Gosh, so how do we let go of that? I've journeyed with it, and at times I do well with it, at times I don't. I'll say it in story form. Mortuous Q is phobia, the fear of ketchup. True thing.

Sixth grade, bro. Sixth grade, I'm at my friend's house eating a burger. And his older brother walks in and he throws something at the table. My friend runs and hides behind the chair. I'm like, what the heck just happened? I look at what his brother threw at the table and I see it was a ketchup packet. After checking on my friend, I bust the packet open. I finished eating my fries.

And I was like, wait a second. I really thought about that story and learned a lesson. we can't be afraid of other people's fears. And so often in life we're afraid of other people's fears. Imagine if I would have ran and hid because of a ketchup packet like my friend did. The friend was afraid of ketchup, mortuous churias phobia. I am not, but I'm not going to hide because he was hiding. And I think what I've done at times is being afraid of other people's fears.

So we all do. Like we're afraid of getting into a relationship because our friends are afraid of commitment. We're afraid of getting out of that toxic relationship because our friends are afraid of commitment. We're afraid of getting out of that toxic relationship because our friends are afraid of being single. Well, we've never left a small city in Texas. Our parents haven't. So we're not going to. And I think the only way to get rid of that is to let go of other people's fears.

Let go of other people's expectations. Because truth be told, it's other people's expectations that kind of dictate the weight of our own imagination. Absolutely. When you think about one hit wonders in the music industry. their one hit wonders because we called him that. We called him a wonder, and we said that song was a hit. So I think it's a matter of not being afraid of other people's fears and letting go of other people's expectations, which dictate our own, man.

If you could go back, when was the post you did, the first post, two years ago? It was June 1st, 2020. June 1st, 2020. If you could go back the day before June 1st, and have a conversation. with yourself from where you are now to that day and you're about to go in and do this thing or maybe it's the morning of and you're about to put this video out that you've been thinking about and you wrote the script to or you didn't write the script I think it was all off the cuff But you've been organizing in your mind for a period of time and Sit down if you were going to literally stand face-to-face and have a conversation with yourself almost two years prior What would you say before you jumped in and did this video with everything you know now? What would you say? I'm gonna say? I'm gonna say? I'm gonna say? I'm gonna say? What would you say?

say? I would say two things. The first would be breathe. It's going to be okay. Because I couldn't eat that morning. I didn't say anything. I'd say breathe that's going to be okay. And then I would say buckle up. Your life is about to change forever. Wow. Because when I recorded that video, I lived in Austin, Texas. I now live in Los Angeles, California. When I recorded that video, I worked for another sports network. I've since switched. When I recorded that video, I had no team outside of a broadcasting agent. I now have a team of like five to ten people. When I recorded that video, I wasn't in partnership with Oprah.

I now am. I would say buckle up, man. Your life's about to change forever. And I'd say prepare yourself because it's about to be a roller coaster of good and bad. What did you need to prepare yourself? How could you have prepared yourself more? Emotionally.

Emotionally. I could have let go of my desire to please all people. I think it's Abe Lincoln. You either please all people some of the time or some people all the time. I could have prepared myself. Nobody prepares you in my mind

for how to be well known unless you're the son of somebody famous. Right? And fame is, you know, and famous relatives. That's why I said well known. Nobody prepares you for that. And nobody prepares you for the constant opinions of other people, bro.

hard. I had a depth of loneliness after I first saw you maybe a month later. Really? In December of 2020. Just depressed. Really? Yeah. Because thousands of people, I love you, thanks for the conversations. But then I'm sitting in my house in Beverly Hills just by myself, just, you know, no friends, middle of a pandemic, just isolated. Nobody prepares you for the constant comments, Acho, you're a sellout. Constant comments, Acho, you're a race bait. You're a race grifter. Nobody prepares you for that. So I would have told myself, buckle up.

It's going to be tough, but it'll be worth it. And if you are sitting in front of yourself right now, your two-year-old self, older than today, what would you say to prepare you for these next two years? So now... Your future self. Yeah, what would it say to this self? Yes.

And with everything that you've created and learned and are going to going to learn and you have this experience now your future self what would your future self say to you enjoy the process enjoy the process I think the biggest thing I've forgotten and I think the biggest thing so many people can forget we forget to enjoy the process we forget to enjoy the journey yes the fun isn't winning but you can still find joy in the journey win or lose and at times I don't enjoy the process because I'm so focused on moving that I don't enjoy where I am. When you have an objective without limitation, it's all about movement, man. It's all about movement. But you got to enjoy the journey. These

conversations, enjoy them. Your third book. Dude, I'm the only person not named Oprah to have multiple books under the Oprah imprint. Right. It's crazy, man. Enjoy it. Enjoy it. I didn't know. I didn't know Oprah 17 months ago. She'd walk right by me. Now you got three books. No, I got three books. So enjoy the journey, enjoy the process. I think everyone needs to hear that for sure. Illogical. Saying yes to a life without limits. Emmanuel Acho, this thing is going to be inspiring. Lots of great lessons, wisdom, stories. Yeah, don't let other people's fears become your own. That's what I just opened up. So the first thing I opened up right there. So don't let other people's fears become your own. Powerful stuff, man. I got a couple final questions for you. I asked these

same the last time. Before I ask them, I want people to follow you on social media. You've got great content over there. If you love sports and life lessons, you always have these great moments when you're out the sports desk sharing your life lessons, which I love that stuff. Get the book, Illogical, saying yes to a life without limits. Make sure you guys check this out, get a few copies of your friends, share with people. And if anything, when you're reading it, you get a handsome smile on the back of the book. So make sure you spread the light and love. with your friends. This is called the three truths.

I asked you last time, and I've got your three truths here. I'm curious if it's changed. This was your last day, and you've accomplished everything you want to accomplish. And you've lived as long as you want to live, but eventually you've got to turn the lights out, and you can't leave anything behind.

Your message, your content, your books, there's none of this behind. So all of your words and content goes with you somewhere else. But you had three things you could share with the world, three lessons. I'd like to call three truths. What would you say were yours? Ooh, it's so funny, because it's been about 18 months

and I don't remember what I said last time. I can't wait for this. I think my most important truth, love God, love others. I think I'll never flinch a waiver on that. Love God, love Jesus, love others. That's just, that's me as a man of faith. I can't waver from that.

I think my second biggest truth. Man, and I love this and I forever loved it. You're worth getting to know. You're worth getting to know, man. I think that's hit me more now than ever, bro. It's like people don't realize they're valued and people don't realize like you are worth getting to know. Absolutely. My third biggest truth.

Where would it be right now? If I could only leave a truth. you have the ability to change the world you truly do and I just wish people would believe that changing the world looks different for different people but you have the ability to change your world

those would be my three what were my three last time if people want to know they have to go listen to the few of them you had Two, the three, identical. So if people want to know what they are, they'll have to go check that out.

We'll have it linked up to you to listen to that. Before I ask the final question, Emmanuel, I want to acknowledge you, man, for your constant growth and your commitment to service. I think people can get scared of success or they get scared of the growth as fast as you've had it, and the fact that you keep showing up,

keep delivering, and I think learning about yourself in this process is really beautiful and keep serving. It's really cool, man. And I just am excited to know that you're continuing on this journey, that you're going to keep showing up. I don't see you stopping anytime soon. No matter what happens with books and projects and other stuff, just keep serving. And I really acknowledge you for being authentic to who you are.

I mean, it's a beautiful, beautiful thing to witness. My final question, what's your definition of greatness? That's definitely changed since my definition of greatness. Oh, my definition. of greatness would be stepping outside of the box that others have built around you and constantly

becoming the greatest version of yourself. I don't like using a definition to definition. So stepping out aside of the box that others have built around you and constantly becoming the best version of yourself, constantly evolving. We have to constantly evolve and learn to fall in love with the

evolutions of ourselves. So now step outside of these boxes, bro. Because there is a box there. Step outside of it, let's evolve, and let's just become the best version of ourselves, man. My man, appreciate you. My freaking brother. I hope you enjoyed today's episode, and it inspired you on your journey towards greatness. Make sure to check out the show notes in the description for a full rundown of today's episode

with all the important links. And if you want weekly exclusive bonus episodes with me personally, as well as ad-free listening, then make sure to subscribe to our greatness plus channel exclusively. on Apple Podcasts. Share this with a friend on social media and leave us a review on Apple Podcasts as well. Let me know what you enjoyed about this episode in that review.

I really love hearing feedback from you and it helps us figure out how we can support and serve you moving forward. And I wanna remind you if no one has told you lately that you are loved, you are worthy, and you matter. And now it's time to go out there and do something great.