The Sevan Podcast - #191 - Dave Castro

Episode Date: October 30, 2021

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What a weekend. I can see you. No. Is that okay, Bill? What a weekend. I can see you. No Bill Henninger, but the Dave Castro. What'd you say? I said no Bill Henninger, but the Dave Castro. You know, many years ago I asked Bill Henninger if he'd be on my podcast, and he said he doesn't do podcasts. Are we live now?

We are. Okay. Henniger if he'd be on my podcast and he said he doesn't do podcasts are we live now we are okay guys we are not gonna get this chance I'm surprised we have this chance if you have any questions you should call in right now and you should ask the Dave Castro I'm I can't believe I got him to do this maybe I didn't get him to do this you know we're live right dave yeah yeah yeah why don't you ask me a question if no one's gonna call it oh i am i am i am but i just want people to know because i know that at any moment you could split and i want people to be like yeah i call it on the sebon podcast you could call in and talk to dave and i did it uh you said um i don't mean to beat a dead horse and i don't know if this annoys you and if it does i'm fine with skipping right over but it's it's kind of like around the steroid thing question

but someone in the dms the other day sent me a dm and it said hey they're talking about all this prevalent steroid use and crossfit and i'm like pushing back no it's not like that i don't think they're talking about how you can get around drug testing and I'm just kind of like learning and asking questions and then they kind of just pushed me too far and they said hey and everyone knows and there's people who talk about it about athletes who've been protected by HQ and

it's just well you you don't respond well to that question because you know me well enough. And you know that, like, I would love to bust Rich. I would love to bust Matt. I would love to bust Tia. I would love to bust any cheater in our sport, regardless of how big or popular they are. The fact is, they don't pop.

regardless of how big or popular they are. The fact is they don't pop. And so I don't, we've tested all these athletes a lot. And when I say I would love to, it's nothing against them personally. It's just for the, that's how much we care about the integrity of our sport and the testing protocol and actually having a clean champion. So this notion of us protecting any popular athlete because of, um, or, or this notion of popular athletes being protected by us is completely false. There's, there's no motivation for, by us, by me personally, by our team to, uh,

to protect anyone, protect any of these athletes. And if there was, yeah, that would be fucked up. And we would be negligent in our role as a, as essentially the caretakers of the sport to find the fittest man and woman alive. And you, and do you trust the testing policy? Well, here's the deal. Like, yeah, it's a third party. It's someone external from us. I absolutely trust it. Truth be told, though, here's the unwind that farther out and let's start discussing. And maybe this is what some of the implications are, but we're not protecting from this. Like you look at Belco and Barry Bonds and during that period, you look at like what those guys were doing.

Belco, Bay Area Lab Co., they were providing Bonds and some of those other guys with steroids. And the term you heard a lot was designer drugs and stuff that was getting around the testing. around the testing. I cannot speak to if any of these guys are doing this super high level stuff that is getting around our testing. And hey, and if they are, and if there's the funding there, like there's limits to the testing protocol, I guess. I'm not trying to degrade or downplay our testing. Our testing, it's a legit organization

and they test at the highest levels. I'm not saying anything against them, but I am saying there has been instances in sports and especially sports where there's a lot of money, money gets you a lot, where athletes are able to get their hands on, call it designer drugs or things that maybe some of these tests don't cover. So in terms of all the things that are more common, we're definitely able, we're definitely catching if someone's doing something that's, or we're definitely hitting and testing for and testing at the complete highest level of what testing agencies are able to test for did you see the movie with the um my point is if one of these guys if one it

comes out that like this entire time say matt or whoever was doing something and and um he probably had a lot of funding and a lot of money if he did to pull that off because to um to essentially be or to not be caught by our services i'm not and don't watch i'm gonna clip that and say dave's saying i'm not saying that he's doing that at all that's not my point but my point is we're doing everything we can to test them and there is limits to the whole testing across all sports. Use Colton Mertens, use Colton Mertens as an example. He's, he's not, he's not very sensitive to that stuff. He has thick skin. Use Colton Mertens as, Hey, um, so this is, this is,

did you ever see the movie with the Russian guys? Um, and it was the Olympics and the, uh, they're talking, they show about the cheating and the Olympics and the Sochi Olympics. Did you see that documentary? No, but everybody told me about it. I never watched it. Okay. Well, here's what's so fascinating about it, Dave.

You know how they cheated? They fucking had to break into the lab, get the samples, break into each individual sample. There was a hole in the wall. And all it really – at the end of the movie the one thing that it told you is is like holy shit the testing is perfect the only way to cheat is to break into the lab and fucking steal and and swap out the um the samples the urine samples or the blood samples that was my takeaway from the movie so many people their takeaway from the movie was like holy shit um you get so easy or

everyone's cheating no it was the exact opposite it was like holy shit it's impossible to cheat unless you have putin helping you because it because then i think we're almost saying very different things who me and you yeah you're what do you mean from that movie it's impossible to cheat you're saying you learned from that movie that it's impossible to cheat you're saying you learned from that movie that it's impossible to cheat what i'm saying is um people like barry bond he didn't cheat that way right they were cheating back then with stuff that and maybe the technology's progressed so much that they are catching everything i'm saying i believe with enough money there's probably still stuff that you can use or get around these tests.

Now, my point with all of this, to wrap it up, is that money and that level of money isn't in our sport yet. million a year or or any of these other major ball sport athletes making millions of a year who can't millions of millions a year who can't spend money on this really high high level stuff and and what i tell people is that there is the level of bureaucracy in crossfit inc at least when i was there was so minimal that if there was cheating on the basis of the company was trying to protect people i don't i mean i don't know how i would not have seen it i mean you it would just have to be you would have had to have had that relationship with matt with rich with you know what i mean like like i would have seen it well here's the thing like and those names I said, almost all of them I really like and I spend time with and I'm friends with. And the thing is, like, that wouldn't prevent me from being professional enough to say, OK, you're busted. We're going forward with it. You have to you have to face the consequences. Of course. Caller, you're on.

What's up, Devon? This is Tom this is tom gearing hey tom what's up brother hey i'm gonna take you in a totally different topic please uh james i'm uh did you watch uh the rogue educational any of the events on tv i did not no okay so but you're my question is more general than that. I'm totally obsessed with this sport, but I'm also a sports fan in general. And the problem with CrossFit on YouTube or on TV or broadcast, whether it's ESPN, is that it doesn't feel like sports. You know what I mean? It's very hard to follow the action. I know you program events specifically for the spectacle,

but I'm curious, what are your ideas to make it more like TV friendly so that we can watch it and make it more accessible to a broader audience? Well, that's a great question, Tom. So thank you. Especially, so in the early years of the games, I really felt that and I really saw that. Like, yeah, it's kind of hard to track the event. So in the earliest of years, like 2008, I was up there and we had three

different things going on at a time. We had, it's funny because I'm talking about this with my team the other day, yesterday, we had a thruster pull-up workout going on, a Fran-like workout, but we didn't call it Fran because they had chest-to-bar pull-ups at the time, and a deadlift burpee workout, and then we had a run. And we had all these people there, and we had fans there, and everyone's watching, and you had

no fucking idea what was going on. You just saw people doing stuff. So at that point, I literally was like, here's the problem, and funny as it is, I'm going to fucking insert and solve it. So what I did at that point was I literally was like, here's the problem. And funny as it is, I'm going to fucking insert and solve it. So what I did at that point was I picked up the mic and I started giving updates on what was happening on the floor with a mic. And that was like, and really, when you look at the commentators now, like I was one of the original commentators at our events and I did it for multiple years. And then eventually, you know, obviously pass that on.

But I started calling the event and I was calling the events for the sake of the fans that were there to see or to understand who was winning. What can lane five as, as let's say, Jason Kalipa is doing, you know, he on his set of 15, et cetera, et cetera, et cetera. Then as the sport started to get bigger and and interestingly the next year when you look at 09 when we programmed the final event the um the chipper for that year you even look at that and that was a down and back chipper it was a chipper that went down and then it ended with a lunge back and forth and even at that point it was like all right we got to start visually laying these out then we ended up going to

madison i'm sorry carson and when we're in carson we started doing a lot of things and there were workouts we'd do where they were just you know still not visually intuitive to understand what's going on. And what I mean by that is, let's use the Fran example again. If you're doing 21-15-9 thrusters, pull-ups, and you're going back and forth on the same bar, pull-up bar, and same thruster, it's really hard to tell who's winning. So I don't remember what year

it was, but normally at the games throughout, at different points in the games, I'll go up into stands and kind of review our work and look at the field of play and look at what's going on and i realized i don't remember what year this was again but i realized i want people to be able to go get a hot dog come back in sit down and be able to tell who's winning that's the the story. That's the visual. That's what you have to see. And the essence of that is in,

now let's take Fran again. Now the way, the direction we went is we ended up having three bars and three barbells. So you do your first set of 21 here, 21 pull-ups. Then you do a set of 21 thr thrusters here then oops i'm going the wrong way let me see i'm trying to get it framed in here we go so you're 21 here 21 here 15 here 15 here nine here nine here and then you cross the finish line and so even though it's a classic workout we're in our gym we do it at one bar we would do it with one pull-up bar, one barbell and one bar, starting to stretch things out and lay them out.

So it's the same test, but they're marching down the field of play. So that early on became a super high priority to me. Then putting lane markers on the floor, putting number or number flip cards. What is that? What is that beeping, Se said? Is that your phone or my phone? That's mine. I just told the guy to call back in five, Tommy, call back, call back in five, Tommy. Hey Dave, I think no matter where you go, Tom, this Tom Geeran is going to say, Hey, but it's not working. I appreciate it. I'm not done. I'm not done. I'm not done. I'm not done.

All right. All right. All right. All right. That was one aspect of it that became a high priority. Then eventually the when we started broadcasting, we started having rep counters on the broadcast, which helped a lot. And so the rep counters help a lot. And, um, and really the next level to all of this for the onsite experience, I think that the physical movement and the laying out helps a lot. It would be nice to have actual digital rep counters on the floor. That's the future level. That's the next level. I think the broadcast is getting really good at laying out the, um, the floor and the marking, or I'm sorry, the numbers and the rep counters and even verbally clarifying who's winning. With broadcast, oftentimes, I've always been a big, I push our team a lot to zoom out.

Zoom out and look at the whole floor. Yeah, that's exactly what I was going to go with that day. The broadcast is a struggle. Your events, everything you've said so far is awesome but the broadcast is bad yes i agree tom it's sexy listen let me let me just say one thing on me i just want to let me just say this let me say this i'm going to say i'm going to talk first it's easy for the broadcast and the teams to get sucked into um getting close up i'm fucking so over the zoom in close up of the beautiful bodies.

Everyone wants to have the rock star zoomed in photo or image, but really, especially in the competition, there's a point where we should pull out. And so you could see everyone and actually see how far someone is ahead of everyone else and see the race. I think we have to do a better job of pulling out more often, pulling the camera out, than we do. I was going to say, that's what your mom said, too.

Hey, not on my show, Tom. Not on my show. Not to my guests. There's two things with that, Dave, and I appreciate what you said because I agree with you 100%. It's just sports, right? Like watching football, you're not just going to look at a close-up of freaking Tom Brady it's like you got to see who where the linemen are if someone's about to sack them if there's a guy coming on the other side of the field like definitely get right and this

other thing this may not be fair but I just this has been my perception I've been around for a few years it seems to me like sometimes the on-air personality, the media guys are just guys that happen to have been there the longest, not necessarily people who are really good at the job. You tell me if that's not fair, but it seems like even

the floor announcers, the people who have just been the same people who've been there since the early days have just kind of been there and are not necessarily professional sports broadcasters does that make sense it does i think our teams come a long way i think we use individuals who are highly trained who maybe not were not in the beginning but then got additional training but yeah you know for the most part we are leaning on people that have been in the community and who are uh from the community and done it for a while and i think um there there's a lot of room for improvement,

and there always is on every aspect of it. So they're doing a good job, and they have training on it. For most of them, it wasn't their initial career path, but they kind of molded into it. So I'm not going to be too critical of that. I'm pretty happy with them. The other thing I want to say about the visual aspect of it with what you're talking about in general. Tom, I'm going to kick you to the curb and let this other person in. So keep going, Dave.

I want to finish this to you, Tom. Yeah, hold on a sec, Andre. Let Dave finish this thought and then you'll jump in here. Go ahead, Dave. and you have no background in it, guess what? It's going to be really hard to understand what's going on. So sometimes people are critical of a sport with that narrative that, hey, someone who doesn't understand CrossFit at all can't tune in and understand it. Well, guess what? That problem exists in all sports. The NFL is impossible to follow if you don't know football. Impossible. If you don't believe me, remember what it was like as a kid,

or try to follow rugby, or try to watch cricket. That shit is impossible to watch if no one's there to help you understand the game. Well, just to say something close to you, Simon, how about tennis and its scoring system? Yeah, yeah, well, yeah. Another, yeah, great one. Very good point. And finally, I just want to say this.

There are some incredible commentators, but be careful what you wish for, man. I like the fact that these guys are rough and rugged and that they speak from the heart. And because when I see these professional guys start coming into the UFC, like Max Kellerman and the guys coming over from boxing and Stephen A. Smith, they're fucking the UFC up, man. Stay over there with that cheese dick shit over at ESPN. I mean, I like them as the cheese dick guys, but I don't want them commentating the fights.

I need it to be Daniel and Laura Sanko. He understands boxing, but sometimes you hear him on UFC stuff, it doesn't sound like he knows what he's talking about. And then you Stephen A. Smith I mean it just in all the combat sports it just feels like he just read an article and he's an expert that day uh Andre thanks for calling brother sorry for all the people who are calling that I gotta keep hanging up on you just call back later look look if fucking someone's talking to Dave don don't call. Wait five minutes. You're not me. You can't interrupt.

Okay, Andre, it's all yours. Sorry, guys. I have two questions. Both are a Dave. Number one, why isn't Tevan back at the marketing department in CrossFit? Who's that decision coming from? One, I've been doing CrossFit for 10 years. I like to say I'm one of the leaders

in the Orlando, Florida community in CrossFit. And he understands the CrossFit story and the marketing side, in my opinion, more than anyone. Why is he that one? And the second one, he has a completely different thing. Why is CrossFit,

in the matter of bad substances, why is it that, for example, like I have an athlete, and she's pumped, right? She's one of the girls that pumped two years in Guadalupalooza, two years ago.

And we got the least amount possible that can be found in a human being with the new machines that are out. And that amount that my athlete had is considered contamination. It's not even looked at in sports like UFC,

soccer with FIFA, NBA, back CrossFit. As soon as something, like, it doesn't matter the quantity, like, it's already banned for four years. So I have those two questions. It's not like, oh, I want to make a drama about it. I appreciate you guys a lot. I love Dave.

I'm not a hater. But yeah, those are the questions. Andre, send me your Venmo account and I'll send you money. The first question, the first question I didn't understand or hear. So we'll come back to that in a second. Don't ask it now. I'll answer the second question. What I did here.

So we're not setting the testing thresholds or we're not setting the minimum requirements. The agency we work with, Drug Free Sport, they essentially do and we recognize them and they work with a handful of other major sports. And so like when they say CrossFit, like we didn't set that standard and there's a myth, like, so, and you said she had a little bit that was over, um, whatever the, the, the lowest limit was, but again, that's not a threshold or that's not a limit we made. And they're basically saying, if you're, and we're recognizing it and we're agreeing, okay, we're going to, we're going to follow this. That's loud. We're going to follow these recommendations and we're going to follow your standards. And so even a little over

by the, by the testing world and by the standards they use is enough to have a penalty for. And so trust me, it's not like we're sitting around saying, all right, well, let's set the limit for this or let's set the limit for that. We don't have the expertise to do that. We don't have the, obviously the knowledge or wherewithal to understand what those are in all cases. And to your second question, the first question, I mean, I didn't hear that. Can you re-ask it? Please. Yeah so thank you for answering i appreciate so i appreciate both of you so much um i've been doing coffee since pat went to the south america chicken and spice um i am obviously i'm on inside her quarters but, it seems to me very few persons, and like,

not because this is a dance podcast, but like, it seems to me that very few persons can do what he did with the marketing department. And it's like one of the big ones, for example, in the sports side, why is he not allowed to do the behind the scenes anymore? He is like, they created this thing, like, why is he not allowed to do the behind the scenes anymore he is like the greatest at this thing like why is he not allowed to do that it's an ego thing and then why is he not allowed to go back

at the head of the marketing department so essentially get him andre get him let's know why the fuck I don't have a job with CrossFit. Yeah. I mean, that's a great question. I'm not going to go there on this podcast. So I appreciate the question. I appreciate the support. But that's a pretty loaded question for me to tackle on a public podcast.

Andre, I will, I will say that I will say this. It has nothing to do with Dave. I am fully, I am 50% responsible for where I stand today. That's for sure. But I appreciate you asking the question. And I, I love the affiliate. I love for sure. But I appreciate you asking the question. And I, um, I, I love the, uh, affiliate. I love the affiliates. I love the, anyone who's pushing the health message. It's really cool. Okay. Brother Andre, uh, I'm going to take this other call. You cool with that? Yeah. Yeah. Okay. Go back to the,, please. Thank you. Bye. Thanks.

Tommy, what's up, brother? Nothing. Hey, two statements and one question for Dave. One, I love that Chad's getting publicity again. The work that you design on behalf of your old teammate. I think you guys served together in the same squadron on the East Coast. Also, I worked with your old boss, Scott Moore, and he said you're a phenomenal operator.

The question I have, though, is Travis Mayer earlier today said, you know, if the CrossFit Games wasn't an entrance to the Rogue Invitational, athletes would peak to it because of the money. Are you excited more that CrossFit is getting more popular, or does it take away from the CrossFit Games? You know, like say if athletes could just go to the road games and win more money. Oh, Tom, hold on. Tom, hold on a second. Tom, hold on a second, brother. Those are – I don't know if he heard any of that, Tom.

He's driving. Dave, did you hear any of that? No, I heard what he said about the first two statements. I heard what he said about Scott Moore talking about me as a operator. And that's the being a respected operator by someone like that is the type of the type of words that mean a lot to me. And why? Who is that guy? Why? Who is that guy? Why? Who is that guy? Why? Who is that guy?

And it's also the reason why I don't post and talk about it, and because I still really respect that community and those people from that community. And then your second piece, I didn't hear what you said. Tom, start over at the beginning of that, because I was having trouble, I could hear you, but I was having trouble following what you're saying.

Something about the Rogue competition and relationship to the games. Yeah, sorry about the Scott comment, if that was inappropriate. following what you're saying. Something about the competition, the rogue competition relationship to the games. Yeah. Sorry about that. Scott commented that was inappropriate. Um, but no, I just want to pass it along. Um, no, no, no. I really appreciate it. Thank you. Um, but no, Travis Merrily today said, you know, if the games were an entrance to the rogue invitational People should just, not people should, but hey, maybe some athletes would just peek for that due to the money and the payout. Do you think it takes away from the games or you like that the sport as a whole is getting so popular?

I don't think it takes away from the games. I like that the sport as a whole is getting more popular. I think it, i think more the more major premier events like this that give athletes opportunity and give the audience to the sport gives an audience to the athletes um and the community ultimately is a good thing so um i guess you know to travis's point well here's what's good about it you're not going to get to well here's what I do like about how Rogue's running it you're not going to get to the Rogue Invitational um and get an chance to compete for that money at least with the current model unless you do the games and so

obviously I respect that and unless you perform at a high level at the games so uh I mean they could have a model which um they don't, obviously, where they're not taking games invites, or not taking games invites, but they're not looking at the leaderboard from the games or this year's top athletes, and they're just selecting others. And then maybe if that wasn't the case, people would, could, might deprioritize the games and just try to compete in that. But I don't think that'd make a lot of sense.

Very cool. Well, thank you for taking my call. Thanks a lot. I appreciate the time. And I appreciate the information that you led with. Of course. Thanks, Dave. Thanks, Tavon. Thanks, Tommy. Who's Scott? Did you, did you serve with that guy, Scott Moore? We'll talk after the call. I'll tell you after the call. Perfect. Perfect. My favorite.

Dave, there were a lot of comments, and I know you didn't watch the games, and I'm not asking you to be critical because I know you respect Bill, but I'm curious what you think about this. All right. We won't go there. What was that? That's a caller. I was going to ask you about the time cap of event one, but stand by. Jim, are you there?

Jim, you're on with Dave. Hey, guys. How's it going? Good. Good, good, good. Hey, Jim. One funny thing first and then kind of a serious question after. I don't know if you guys heard the latest from PETA wanting to outlaw the word bullpen in Major League Baseball.

to outlaw the word bullpen in Major League Baseball. And one of the books he called the arm barn instead of the bullpen. It's one of those woke cancel culture things. It sounds kind of funny. Wait, you're joking, right? No, I'm not. No, it's all on the heels of the whole thing with the Atlanta Braves and the Tomahawk Chop and all that stuff. It's Peter's way of kind of piggybacking on that.

Wait, what's the choice after bullpen? What's it called? The arm barn. Because they're baseball players and they throw the ball and it's a barn. That's where the pitchers warm their arms up. And what the reason says is it's insensitive to the cows. Wow. That's amazing.

Thank you. I appreciate that. That's good. wow that's amazing the sensitive cows are the ones that taste best though i i personally if anyone wants to call me a bull seven on the bull mitosian i will take that as a compliment i i that's one animal i'm going with okay and then the one the one question I had and I asked my level two instructor about it and he didn't have like not that he didn't have an answer but it was like it was one of those things I just couldn't explain

like why it happened but why and when and why did people get away from just straight CrossFit programming I mean you see so many programs out there available you know Pro available, you know, Proven Fitness, you know, all these other things that sell their programming. Why have they gotten away from just pure CrossFit programming?

I know they're doing the CrossFit affiliate programming now and have that available. And I'm watching this on my TV, like, on a little bit of a delay. So I'm going to hang up and answer so I can hear the full question. Sometimes it's hard to hear on the phone. But do you understand the question, Dave? Who's getting away from pure CrossFit programming? Can you give me an example?

I'm just saying it's like all these places that sell, like go on CrossFit.com. When's the last time you saw one of these people offering programming that the workout of the day is a one mile run but the workout of the day is you know a 2k row per time it's always a warm-up let's do a strength piece or a skill piece and let's do a walk why do we always have to get our heart rates up for these workouts why can't we go in and back squat seven by one and have it take an hour with proper warm-up cool down and mobility, and mobility. It's gotten away from that, and I'm just curious. Amen.

I appreciate what you're saying. So I appreciate what you're saying. Thanks, Jim. Yes, thank you. We still promote and teach just one session a day, and even with TAP, they're trying really hard to promote that. For most people, one session a day is more than enough. And also when I say one session, I mean, going into the gym, doing exactly what he just said, warm up, do some skill stuff, and then even hit a seven by one back squat and spend half an hour doing that

and then cool down and then leave. That's more classic CrossFit. I would say unintentionally from the games and the influence of the games athletes early on, I saw this trend where a lot of games athletes, especially because of what happens at the games and because they progress so far in the program and in the methodology, they're able to handle so much volume. They were able to early on do more and do additional, do additional workouts and do two or three workouts in a day and do strength and do multiple CrossFit workouts. and that definitely influenced early call an eight nine ten period a lot of affiliates and even athletes and even just participants in CrossFit and there was a kind of a even a mentality of more is better and so within an hour why just do one CrossFit workout when I can also

get some strength development, strength development and do some strength and then do a CrossFit workout. And you really have your clients doing all a lot of stuff and staying busy for that whole hour. I don't recommend that, especially for especially talking about new CrossFitters and people coming into your gym for the first time, that's just way too much volume. Hey, the truth is, even for an individual like me, because you know, CrossFit for 16, 17 years, that's too much stuff for me. If I'm hitting any one of those single elements with enough intensity, and that's the key aspect, is if it's only a seven by one back squat day, hit that with enough intensity. And that's the key aspect is if it's only a seven by one back squat day, hit that with enough intensity and go at it and take it, put it on a serious

elevated pedestal in your mind of like, okay, I'm going to hit these really hard and go for it. And if you're going to do that, you're going to need a set of rest, two, three, four minutes in between sets. And if you're going into the gym and there's not a heavy day and it's only a CrossFit workout, well, warm up thoroughly for that. Prepare your body for the movement, prepare for the movement, and then hit it really hard as relatively speaking, how you feel that day. You might want to back off a little, but I do agree with his sentiment that the community has kind of gone away from more of that core CrossFit, just one good session a day in an hour in a class approach. Now, the second piece of his question was some of these other programming proven and some of these other things you can subscribe to. All of those are great. All of those are an option. Oh, my battery's low by the way. Okay.

All of those are good options. They're just providing something else for the consumer. And the thing is there's obviously a demand for them. And so for the individual or for, for the programming from these individual athletes and coaches who've, who've made a name for themselves in the sport and excelled, there's a demand for that type of programming. And I'm not going to fault them for that. It makes sense.

And a lot of these guys, some of these guys are making a really nice living off of it. And so that's great, too. I have not dug into any of their programming, anyone's programming enough to look at it or critique it and nor would i publicly that's not my place i wouldn't dig into um frasier's videos max anyone and critique it um but you know and then you look at someone like miranda who did street parking that was such she took the opposite she went against the grain towards what everyone else was doing and instead of doing crossfit for the highest level which most of them targeted with their programming she went crossfit for the um for the for the everyday person and that was such a smart play.

And obviously she has her nice little piece of the pie, place in the world. And she's doing, she's a piece of the pie she's carved out. She's living the dream. She's rich. She's got a sweet piece of Latin ass. Miranda's killing it. Hey, Dave. Okay. she's living the dream she's rich she's got a sweet piece of latin ass miranda's killing it hey dave okay um colin lawrence says every sport has a pre-season regular season and post-season

fix the format or like tennis make it a tournament style i think i think you do have i think crossfit does have a pre-season regular season post-season it's all the other players involved that make it seem like it doesn't which which i think is also fine like look at noah olsen he's not fucking around with the rogue invitational um he's he's for him um i don't know i don't know if he's injured or if it's just part of the fact that he wants to do it like colin said pre-regular post you have a response to that so the uh yeah there's a game the games has a season it's the open it's a quarterfinals now semifinals and then the games and uh there's four stages to that

just because the ball sports the fucking nfl mlb nba have pre-season doesn't mean we need to pre-season like that i mean we don't well well it's just semantics right the open is the preseason it's not the preseason though so i will not contend that the open or will not concede to this idea that the open is a preseason because the open is so it's necessary to qualify for the next stage the preseason in those sports don't really count towards the seasons at all. So the opening season. I guess I'm reading into what he's saying. Understand this. Understand this.

I'm influenced by, I learn from, I know what other leagues and sports do, but I don't try to emulate or replicate or be the other sports. So early on, early on, I i was very much like all right we're going to learn from from a lot of other sports we're not going to try to be other sports we're going to be crossfit and you know what like the season we've made and the way we do it is very much crossfit and i'm proud of that and i'm proud of the team and the 15 years we've been doing it, where we're at now. So answer that thing. It's Andre. The first time he – Andre wants to know why my wife got fired too.

Not just me, but he's calling back. I Venmoed him 50 bucks. What's up, Andre? How are you guys? It's amazing. I have another question for Daveave and this is my second call amazing um dave um i created a bunch of team athletes um and a lot of them well a lot of them two of them i think they obviously think like they're gonna be great in the sport whenever you

talk about cross-dressing sport and stuff like that, and now with the new direction of Avery Grossman and investors and stuff like that, how is the infrastructure in the next three years, five years, seven years, essentially going to look like for these teenagers that are 14, 15, trying to be a pro athlete process. Like, for example, I have a 17-year-old. I'm telling her, hey, I think with this new direction, you can be a pro athlete here. You can make a lot of money. It's going to be probably like a new UFC. How do you guys, what do you think about that? So I think there's a possibility of it and for it but it takes time right and i don't think uh people should come into this at this moment um thinking that they're going to make a lot of

money and be this pro athlete like a nba player or like an nba star the opportunity needs to make a lot of money in this even at at this point, are pretty limited and pretty select. And that is not by our design at all. Meaning that just organically came from this free market of the CrossFit community and from the way this has evolved. We haven't placed every chess piece on the board to make it where these athletes make more money and these athletes, they've had to do a lot of work. But we've definitely provided the springboard and the platform for the growth of.

And really at this stage, if you want to be a top level athlete who's making a living or making a lot of money off of it, you have to be a top level athlete. Meaning you have to be winning at the highest levels. you have to be a top level athlete or meaning you have to be winning at the highest levels. If you're not winning at the highest levels, making a career out of this at this point is, is very challenging. And, and you know what, I'll be honest with you. That might be just okay for where the development is right now. That might be the extent of what's possible. Maybe in two, three, four years, there's enough money in it where you can make a good living off of it and have not even qualified for the

CrossFit Games. That might be the case, but that's also, you know, it's going to happen. It's going to happen organically from the entire ecosystem growing, from the games growing, from more major sponsors coming on board, for maybe some big broadcast deals in the future, from other big interests happening in the sport. But my point of saying all of this is, I can't sit here and tell you, yes, we have a plan for in two to three years, all these 16 and 17 year olds can be saying they're professional athletes in this sport and they'll be making a living because that's just too, it's putting the cart before the horse and it's not addressing, it's not having other pieces that need to fall in place, fall in place. And

now unwind that and you take a look at UFC and tennis and some of these other sports, Seban can probably speak to UFC much better than I can in this regard, but there's a lot of fighters making a lot of money and there's way more not making a lot of money. 1% of the fighters make 90% of the money. 1% of the fighters make 90% of the money.

I think that's the ratio. And UFC is a sport that's been purchased for billions of dollars and has massive media rights. It has massive money pumped into it. And so, like, we still have a long way to go. And that's powerful, what you just said. 1% of the fighters make, did you say 99 or 90?

90. Okay. I think, yeah, I think, like, our our sport, like I think only a top 10, top 20, actually no, top 10 make a lady. The other ones are booth, like,

or figure it out. Well, I'll even say this though. It's not even, it's not even the top 10 anymore because of Instagram and social media. I think they're able to make a comfortable living and make, um, find your niche,

especially if you're female because of the way social media works. Yeah. Leveraging your body and stuff like that. Can I jump in here a second? Yeah. Can I jump in here? Andre, I want to throw some things out there.

I want to talk to you about, I want to name off some games athletes that I suspect are wealthy. Ready? Former games athletes. What's wealthy? Like 200K a year, 500K? Andre, that's a great question. That's a great qualifier.

500 and up. A year. A year. Okay, let's go. Five probably. Miranda Alcatraz. Alcatraz. Ben Bergeron.

Ryan Fisher. Marcus Philly. Wait a second. Wait a second. Wait a second. Alcarez, Ben Bergeron, Ryan Fisher, Marcus Philly. Wait a second. Wait a second. Wait a second. Wait a second, boys. Wait a second.

Wait a second. Jason Kalipa. Jason Kalipa. All of those people I think today probably make $500,000 or more a year. Now I'm going to name off some guys who I think maybe make closer to a million dollars a year. And I could be totally wrong wrong i'm making this up um opt uh matt fraser rich froney now i'm going to tell you the richest former crossfit games athlete by far more money than all of these people combined do you know who it is it's very obvious yeah right uh yeah uh katie modder now what what katie modder maybe maybe one of the maybe one of the richest maybe one of the richest

katie modder uh the owner of rogue fitness maybe one of the richest maybe one of the richest women in the united states when i say that i bet you she's in the top 10,000 richest women in the United States, I bet. Now, listen, that's my guess. Now, how none of those people made that money. None of those people are rich because of the money they won from the games. And all of those people I mentioned that from what I like, Ben Bergeron, workaholic, Ryan Fisher, workaholic, Marcus Philly, workaholic, Jason Kleba, workaholic, OPT, workaholic, Matt Fraser, Marcus Philly, workaholic. Jason Kleba, workaholic. OPT, workaholic.

Matt Fraser, he doesn't have another mode. Rich Froning, my God. And Rich has something special because people just want to be around him and work for him. And Katie Motter, are you kidding me? I bet you she doesn't even sleep. I just want to say a word about them. Yes. I think a lot of what we are, like a cross, like a lot of it's because of those two.

Those two are, they embody the spirit of cross that I think Bill and his wife. Who? Hello? Who are you referencing? Bill and like the road owner. Yeah, yeah, yeah. They are,

it's insane what they represent. Right. One thing you're talking about, like, you're talking about people that use, I'm very smart with sports, like, they use their crafty platform to boost their, I don't know what to call it, like, their money, their money ability or whatever. I'm not talking about that. I'm talking about just, like, a pro athlete. Doesn't exist. It doesn't even exist in pro sports i don't think i don't even think what you're saying exists in pro sports and if it does it's so small by that i

mean um the president of the ufc dana white said the being the ufc fighter is not a job it's an opportunity like i don't think conor mcgregor's may i think 95 of the money money Conor McGregor has made is parlaying his fame. I think it's just like... Well, and here, take the average career of NFL players, like two and a half years being a pro. That's not a career, guys. That's like a short stop in your life. It's a huge accomplishment being a pro athlete for two years, but you're not a professional athlete for your entire life andre i hear what you're saying

there are some i'm not saying there aren't some but i think it's just so much rarer than we think i think these people are just like just i i mean i would guess that shack has probably spent every cent that he's made in the nba and now it's all just you know everything after but I mean I don't know yeah like I laughed on the surprise from more people are calling I don't know if Dave if you watch USB but there is this two fighters from from Dagestan their name are Khabib Khabib he's the one that beat Conor McGregor I don't know if you heard of him and then Islam Makachev he's fighting tomorrow it's gonna be an amazing fight so like okay so if you compare and I'm sorry fight. So, like, okay, so if you compare, and I'm sorry if I'm taking too much time,

but, like, if you compare these two, okay, and you compare them with Conor McGregor, it's like Conor's obviously bringing more people into the sport. And Conor, because of his personality, the way he's telling himself, he can make more money. But, like, I'm just a romantic guy but like i think for usc for like the sport of fighting having islam and having tabib is better when you translate that to crossfit for example let's say i'm a girl if my physical ability like my physical ability

should be enough for me to win and for me to like demonstrate what crossfit can do for the world in terms of the story and stuff like that why do I have to sell my body, why do I have to show my abs why do I have to, like you guys were talking about like the closest and things like why me as a teenage athlete why do I have to sell my body

and be nice and be beautiful all those things for me to be able to pursue these things because i need the money i don't know i got nothing to make sense what's he saying why do girls have to show their ass to become famous but but but hayley adams is just just for shits and giggles hayley adams has got 500 000 followers she's one of my most popular podcasts ever and and man she's not doing the thirst pics i mean but i'm not arguing with you i'm just like she's one of the few that's what i'm saying like wait what are it will be cool

is cross this push somehow for more hayley adams versus versus some other girls that like do the queen story like i, I don't know. But here's the thing, we're going to, but the athletes who excel, it's all not like, we're not choosing and we can't prop up. And that's where like that question about like, do we protect certain athletes? Like whoever's becoming the superstars, whoever's becoming the superstars are becoming the superstars in the sport independently.

And it's all based off of faster times and stronger lifts and that's the beauty of crossfit like it doesn't matter who the strongest and fastest is or what they're like we're going to recognize them because we're looking for the fittest man and woman alive so my point is yeah like that um we're yeah you're talking about like, well, why don't we prop up some other wholesome people like Hayley Adams? Well, I mean, maybe there's a bunch of them that just aren't competing at the highest level yet. And if they were, we would. But like and I'm not saying any of the others are unwholesome either. So I don't want anyone to take that out of proportion. But like we're just highlighting the winners or the best in our and um and how they behave or how they act on their own that's all on them and and again i'm

not being critical of how any of them act or behave but i'm just pointing out like um it's not by our design who's succeeding or it is by our design by exposing them to the methodology but it's at the end of the day the work they put in and how they design by exposing them to the methodology, but at the end of the day, the work they put in and how they've taken the methodology to the next level in the sport is on them. Guys, I'm not sure what's going on, but event two should be starting soon. That's my bread and butter. Thank you, boy. Thank you. Last one. I don't know if you guys talked about this, but...

Andre's on a roll. No, no, that's why. It has to do with money. Dave, what keeps... It's probably a very easy question. It's going to be a yes or no, but... What keeps you guys... Very answerable.

What keeps you guys from matching... Actually, no. very answer but like what keeps you guys um from from matching uh actually no like what keeps you guys from like giving more money into competitions like what's the main the main thing that like oh like we can't give you that that much money this year oh that's a great question that's a great question too bad i gotta go you better answer that quick dave oh that's a great question. That's a great question. Too bad I got to go. You better answer that quick, Dave. That's a great fucking question because I've answered this a thousand times for people. I want to know the metric by which we can expect, hey, next year we're going to have more money or this year we're going to do less money. I have another question. One, two. Andre, there's not going to be time. i'm going to go watch event two very quick very quick very quick

that one of the second one is why the level one went from like not very new every five and now it's every three or two and how come you haven't raised the price on the level one in in 13 years or whatever that's what i want to know so i really why isn't the prize money a hundred million dollars a year for the crossfit games tell me no no not like some simple business there's some simple business decisions ultimately that are made at times in regards to like hey this sport is not cheap. And the things we do are not. I would love to give more money to the athletes. I would love for the prize purse to go up.

But for that to happen, there's some other things that need to fall in place. We're not just printing cash with our event. I know a lot of people think we do, and they think we just kill it. But there's a lot that goes into running the event. What's that? I couldn't see. Nothing. I'm just doing live on Instagram live just so I'm, so I can get more people watching the show. That's I'm just showing the people on Instagram live. You talking, they can't hear you. Okay. Go on. So there's budgetary constraints. You don't have a question. To the second question. Um, I don't think that's a bad thing. I think it's okay to require from our coaches or from our coaching community,

the people who are spreading CrossFit, revalidate every three years. It was five. If it's three now, I don't see that as a negative. I mean, there arguably could be more requirements like a yearly or every two years just to keep the standard of coaching high and that'll benefit um the community and the affiliates and crossfit as a brandon as a way of living for for a lot of people by keeping that standard high getting more people in the door so the the three-year renewal, I support, and it doesn't seem like it's off to me. And arguably, it could be even, it could even be less. It could be a two, a one

to two, it could be an annual year. But if it was annual, I'm not saying it should be renewed with the level one. I think at that point, there could be other options. No, I know, no, but I'm not saying, so what I'm saying is it could'm saying is $2,000 every three years. Yeah. So, I mean, that is, it is a lot of money, but it is what at the current place where we're saying that's our requirement. I know, I do know for a fact, they're looking at other ways to keep the level one valid and current and Nicole Carroll wants to expand the program and give coaches other opportunities to renew, but that's still in development. Roger. They will guys. All right.

Thanks a lot. Thank you. Before they answer the question, um, if you guys, it's a non Greg in the podcast. Very cool. Thank you.

I'm killing it. I'm taking over. I'm taking over i'm taking over for my fucking little office here thank you okay brother have a good day guys thanks andre call back again not today though uh andre was kicking some ass more prize money hire sevan back he was fucking cleaning up i want to hear tdc say let's go brandon someone in the comments someone said that yeah uh denis o'larry i think for the age of this sport it's on it's in the right direction man it's so crazy how fast it's grown it's it's nuts you can't

compare the sport to the other sports i agree with that statement for this, for where we're at, it's on the right track guys. Like we, we, uh, Hey, answer that just to stop it. Oh, they hung up. Sorry. I tried to answer. I went over to answer it. They hung up. You look at like the NFL 60, 70 years, baseball's been around, baseball and basketball, 80, 90, a hundred years, even the UFC. I mean, they had a good decade on us and 10, imagine where we'll be in 10 years. I don't think we'll be as big as the UFC,

but we'll be in a much better place than we are now in the development of our sport. I think we're on the right path and we're doing well. I think people get impatient and want more and they see some having a lot and they want it too. And it's also hard to tell people to be patient with the growth, but it's necessary. I mean, you can't rush this. And that's what I'm learning and having created and developed and nurtured a new sport along, it has to develop at its own scheme. I can't believe this. I'm watching the Rogue event while I'm talking to you.

They're doing a – oh, shit, I lost the screen. Okay, I should go. I should go. This event – Take one more call. No one's calling. No one's calling. No one's calling. All right, calling. Oh, that's nice.

All right. Well, I guess I'm not. No one's interested in. You're not the draw you used to. Call Andre back. Just call him back. Andre, we need you to call. Okay, here we go.

That person's calling back. Stand by. All right. Shit. Hey, hold on. Hold on. Hold on. Oh my goodness. Too many callers. Not too many people are calling in too many people. What's up brother. Who's this? Who's calling? Hey, who dis? My name is Brandon. Let me get a let's go Brandon from Dave for real.

My name is Brandon. my name is brandon that's funny where are you from brandon uh illinois about two hours south of bryan actually okay oh are you down by um are you down by uh mount vernon uh bloomington i'm like halfway between mount vernon and chicago wow okay yep yep. All I wanted to say was I agree with the previous caller. Women sexualizing themselves a little bit too much, but we do need more of the males and speedos like same dancer all the time at the games. Word, word. They're not sexualizing themselves. They, we're, we're just just we're just as men born here to fuck

and like if you don't like that then like i don't know what to tell you and so in the meantime while we're not fucking we should be building homes and in gathering food and in building shelter and in like in getting smarter but like i mean there i mean every single species here is procreating and so there's i mean i don't want to be crass about it but i also don't want to be dance around the subject to the point where it's like we're lying to ourselves i don't want to be woke about it yeah to another point there's a lot of uh i won't get you maybe you're above all that. There's a lot of females that, or a lot of CrossFit athletes that aren't in the top 10

that probably make a pretty good living off their Instagrams or whatever they sell without being sexualized. Like some people think it might have to be that way. Who don't do that, who make a pretty good living? Is that what you said? Yeah, yeah. I don't think that's the only way, like you said, Haley, of course, but I'm sure there's other options out there too. Hey, like three people called just now, um, when you,

while you were talking and I just hit my auto reply, I'll call you back in a couple of minutes, but I'm not calling anyone back. Like, you know what I mean? Yeah. Yeah, for sure. You watching the game or the invitation right now i am i'm watching it on the screen below me uh jason smith the guy from south africa is going i can't really figure out um what exactly they're doing what the protocol here is yeah i'm not sure it looks like a mech or a cleaning jerk complex one at a time. Yep. And of course, Dave hung up without telling me. He's good like that.

Alright, brother. I'm going to go. I'm going to head out. Thanks, everyone, for tuning in. I'm going to go watch the Rogue Invitational event number two. I'll be back in a couple hours. Ciao.