The Sevan Podcast - #465 - Dale Saran

Episode Date: June 27, 2022

Former General Council for CrossFit and Lead Attorney in U.S. Military Anthrax case. Sign up for our email: https://thesevanpodcast.com/ ------------------------- Partners: https://cahormones.com/ - CODE "SEVAN" FOR FREE CONSULTATION https://www.paperstcoffee.com/ - THE COFFEE I DRINK! https://www.hybridathletics.com/produ... - THE BARBELL BRUSH https://asrx.com/collections/the-real... - OUR TSHIRTS https://www.vndk8.com/sevan-podcast - OUR OTHER SHIRT https://usekilo.com - OUR WEBSITE PROVIDER ------------------------- Support the show Partners: https://cahormones.com/ - CODE "SEVAN" FOR FREE CONSULTATION https://www.paperstcoffee.com/ - THE COFFEE I DRINK! https://asrx.com/collections/the-real... - OUR TSHIRTS ... Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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What are you playing behind you, Dale? Is that a music stand? Oh, yeah. Yeah, yeah. Piano? Guitar? Piano, I think. Yeah.

Bach two- and three-part inventions. I'm not there yet. I'm not there yet. God, you're a bold man. God, you're a bold man. I was looking at this. Are you following this Title IX thing at all? A little bit, yep.

I was looking at the definition of the word bigot. Uh-oh. Did you see my picture? No. I cannot believe the bigotry coming from the left. Isn't that their favorite word? How are they doing this to women? All you have to do is say you're a dude, and you can compete in any woman's college sport?

It's funny. We're having having this i had a conversation yesterday so my my mom my sister and my niece are in town and i was talking to my uh my daughter rachel i don't know if you're my youngest one of course i remember dale you have four daughters right yeah yeah okay so my youngest one is working for me on this lawsuit as a paralegal oh cool yeah so she did a year of law school and she's i'm not sure it's for me and so she said she thought she you know might want to be a paralegal so she's uh we were talking at the lawsuit and some other things and the title nine thing came up and uh it was funny because she was like i had to remind her about i'm sure you remember but when i was at crossfit the uh chloe johnson lawsuit right right right with you

know which was and she goes she said it was kind of a funny line she goes how come you were involved in all these hot button issues like five years before it ever right before long before joe rogan you know came out and it was cool or i said long before dave chappelle was running his mouth i was i was in court over the chloe johnson lawsuit you know competing in the crossfit games and yeah i'm not it's nothing against chloe or any you know anyone who's i got a friend a person i was in the marine corps with i don't know what to say without getting myself in trouble but when i knew him he was a guy and um and then later i found out you know i got like a friend request on facebook and it was the

same last name of this guy it was kind of unusual name and but it had a woman's name in front and so i had to you know i was like who's this i thought maybe is this i'll just say his name was bob his name wasn't bob but i'll just say i was like, oh, is that, you know, Bob's wife or something, you know? And I click on it and I'm like, holy shit, it looks like Bob in a wig, you know? And so he had, you know, transitioned and gone male to female. And of course, you know, whatever he wants to do with his life, you know, I don't, whatever he wants to be or whatever, dress up, I don't care. And, um,

but it was kind of a weird thing because then you find yourself like I was having this kind of struggle with the whole long before people were talking about my preferred pronouns and all that. I was in the, I was in that kind of internal, like, what do you do with this? You know, how do you, how do you manage it? You know? Cause it's like, I, I remember when, do you remember, uh, you follow UFC when Tamika Brents got the Fallon Fox, Tamika Brents, when she got her face caved in by Fallon Fox. That happened in the UFC?

Yeah. Why did Dana allow that? You know, I don't know if you'll remember it. When that all went down, there was this moment of. What year was that? Because recently I started looking into that. 15 or 16-ish. Okay. That may have been right around when I started getting into the UFC. Yeah, I think it was.

My recollection is it was right around that time. Because when I was getting... I got kind of dragged a little bit for coming out and saying, hey, look, it's nothing personal, but there's a huge advantage, uh, in, in athletic competition. If you've gotten the chance to go through puberty as a male, it's just, it's unquestionable, undeniable. And I was called every name in the book for pointing out what I always took to be a basic fact of biology, you know, in, in, uh, at least in warm blooded mammals, the male is almost always bigger than the female. You know, there's a few oddball things here and there.

But generally speaking, you know, you the praying man is the black widow. Right. It's a couple of and it doesn't end up so good. Right. But it's a crazy thing. So good. Right. But it's a crazy thing. And I got four daughters and I try to explain to people, you know, like you get called names for suggesting that. You know, like I'm a bad guy because I'm a dude saying it. But, you know, here I'm trying to defend my daughters or at least, you know, preserve for them. Like, I mean, God forbid my daughters did jujitsu and then you're going to have somebody who's a dude. You know, says I feel like a woman now. I'm going to, you know, get on the mat and start pounding the tar out of my daughters did jujitsu and then you're going to have somebody who's a dude you know says i feel like a woman now i i'm gonna you know get on the mat and start pounding the tar out of my

daughters that's not that's not going to be acceptable so so here's the definition of a bigot a person who's obstinately or unreasonably attached to a belief or opinion or faction especially one who is prejudiced against or antagonistic towards a person or people that people would be women so let's say let's let's we're going to make the presupposition in this in this conversation that women are a real thing the way this podcast is real based on their reproductive organs are you cool with that yeah okay so and taking this towards a person or people on the basis of their membership so they're members to this group, and I think membership is a broad use of the word because they have vaginas and ovaries and fallopian tubes and all that stuff. Right.

Equally, on the other side, there's another group, and they're called men. This Title IX thing was supposed to make it so when you go to college, both of these groups, which encompasses everyone based on their genitalia and their reproductive organs, they have a place to play sports. Now, they're going to let the ones with penises and testicles go play with the women. I'm tripping. It seems like the, the, the, the classic definition of, of bigotry.

They're just fucking destroying this other membership. Yep. Yep. I'm just, how is anyone, how is anyone who knows a woman? I mean, I guess if you're,

if you just hate women as a whole, I'm tripping. I can't even like, I can't empathize with that at all. I don't even know what they're doing. It's hey, it's you know, I don't know that there's they and it's a monolithic group. I mean, it's it's weird. But what do you mean by that? You think like maybe it's just no one.

There's like 10 people and I'm just blowing it. It's just like media. No, no, it's bigger than that. I mean, obviously, you know, you see the blowback culturally. I mean, people are losing their, you know, losing their livelihoods. And you look at what happens to anybody who stands up against this. But it's the you know, you take anything far enough. Like here's a great example of it in California, you know, in your in your homeland and where I lived for a while, I love California, but man, that place is gone. But the California prisons are allowing male prisoners who decide they identify using their male organ to engage in forced sex with actual women in in the California prison system.

And you can't get anybody to there's some lawsuits kicking around just starting up right now. I mean, there have been women raped in female prisons by male prisoners who say identify as female. And then they come over and go – I mean it's – I mean the whole thing is kind of farcical at some point. Wow. So California forces transgender belief system on female prisoners housed with biological males. So dudes who claim to be women were then put in the women's section, and then they raped the women? Yep. Hey, dude, isn't that what Red Riding Hood is?

Red Riding Hood? The story? He dresses up as the grandmother? I wouldn't have got that poll, but I guess. It's a real-life Red Riding Hood. You dress up as grandmother and then you go inside and eat the kid yeah it's um it's going on and i saw i knew about the lawsuit and i what the fuck yeah it's crazy man you get to a certain point you're like wow i can't believe i you know you look around like for me and it i mean we're about the same age so you know it's

hard to imagine how we got from you know to to this point from say you know for those of us who grow up like i was you know a teenager in the 80s and so it's hard to be like think of you know the country just as a whole in the culture from say 1988 to where we are now but i guess you know it's 30 years but man that seems like it seems like we're a long way from you know what what what do you think i have this way of understanding um the mechanism in the human brain that's causing so much confusion um that there's a conflation of thought and reality and and part of the thing is is that the i put a huge huge amount of the blame on the people on the right because of their refuse of the um to fight for definitions of words so for instance gender and sex they're being conflated everywhere but gender is something that's in your

imagination and sex is something that exists in the outside world and when you conflate the two then you and i can't have a conversation anymore well it's interesting you'd say it's on the uh you know you blame the right for the definition but i i'll say they refuse to stand by it they still they they refuse they use the word gender and sex interchangeably and when you do that you're playing their game yeah well that's it's always been you know cultural i'll call it cultural marxism what i think we're witnessing and what's going on is the marxism has always been about um uh control of language and so there's always been a a war for control of language but language is an evolving thing you know i mean languages change and word usage change

and you know uh that's all inevitable and i think in that sense the the the right uh team red whatever they're always kind of behind because they're they're always in in a sense they're always conservative so they're trying to conserve language as it was or you know hold things as they were but they've always lost that because the u.s has has always been such an evolving culture you always have new slang new words you know people are always at the kids are always you know changing the way the language and the way we speak but you could have a mental faculty dale that requires you you could teach the uh uh an idea that all human beings and you and i i, I think, agree on this, that before we start talking, we have to agree on the definition of words.

So before I tell you I'm going to meet you Wednesday at 10 a.m., you and I have to agree on some – on what Wednesday is and 10 a.m. is. You can't tell the judge in a court, hey, my Wednesday and Thursday are backwards. You're wrong. And what's amazing is Wednesday and Thursday are arbitrary, but man and woman isn't. Right, right. How come we can agree on Monday and Wednesday and Thursday when it's just made up bullshit, but we can't agree on something that's not made up bullshit? I feel like I'm in a loony bin trapped with the loonies yeah yeah it is man where i've said people are like what's going on you're asking me what's going on in the world like what you're witnessing is mental illness being played out

on a large scale you know the people who run the country are mentally ill too i mean largely you're watching it play out in in large you know in a large part on a societal level we've got you know the inmates are running the asylum it's kind of things that you can say things now that used to be considered i it's a great example this is a great example of it um you know i always uh i said i wonder when they're going to come for do you remember the show mash remember the show yeah yeah yep hugely popular and yeah hugely popular and my i didn't like it i didn't like it but but it was hugely popular and everyone said that i remember seeing that smart smart kids like mash and dumb kids like this other show like

gomer pile and i like gomer pile i was well my parents were big mash fans you know yeah and so um and it's set in the korean war and what's great about it is there is this at least relevant to this topic is there was a main one character this main character was played by jamie farr was the actor near big honking schnoz i don't remember jamie farr i do i know exactly where you're going with this i like it yeah so the whole bit in that show was that jamie farr is trying to get out of the army because he doesn't want to be in the war and so he dresses as a woman the whole time and it was considered it was considered like a i mean it was one of the great running gags of that whole of that whole show is he's constantly in women's clothing like he'll show up in a like there he is yeah there's a good one of them right and like in these and

he's such a it's a great visual gag too because he's i don't know what nationality is but he's got that big schnoz and hairy arms and all that you know he's i mean it's a pretty good chest hair and then he'll be in there and he was trying to get what's called a section eight which is in the army the section eight is the the part of the army code lebanese lebanese american i thought he might be armenian but yeah yeah yeah um but uh yeah so i mean it's a great it was a great bit and it worked for the whole show and it turns out everybody knows he's just bullshitting that he's not that he's not a woman obviously he doesn't even really believe it that it's just a bit to try and get himself out of the army but it's you know the whole basis for it was that he was going to prove that he was

crazy by pretending you know by claiming that he was a woman and i always wondered and alan alda was you know known he did a lot of writing for the show particularly after the original i think couple seasons and he's a big left and i always thought it was funny like when nobody's called out alan alda and you know how problematic mash is and are they going to get rid of that but i mean the whole the whole premise of that bit it was like the longest running bit on that show was that he was trying to convince the army he was nuts by dressing up as a woman and they all knew he was bullshitting.

So they just let him do it. And I mean, it was a wonderful kind of plot device, you know, but I mean, that's gone. Like you couldn't put that on TV today. You know, that's done. It's over. It premiered in 1972. That was the year I was born

and ended February 20th, 1983. It had an 11-year run. The final episode had 125 million. Yeah. I remember the final episode was like a big people were like, couldn't believe it was over. I mean, it had a great run. Up until that point, I don't think there was anything,

you know, maybe Seinfeld's done better than that now and a few others, but at the time, maybe Cheers. But at the time it was, I mean, it was an anything, you know, maybe Seinfeld's done better than that now and a few others. But at the time, maybe Cheers. But at the time, it was, I mean, it was an American, you know. Yes. Well, we had like three channels back then. Right. ABC, NBC, and CBS. Right.

You could watch the, each week you could watch a new episode on like whatever it was, Monday or Tuesday nights, I forget. But the reruns used to run on UHF. So I used to watch them late at night or i'd catch them after i watched the hockey game or something on channel 38 uhf was the dial that you kind of had to like spin around to find the station yeah yeah yeah tweak it in hold up the get the tinfoil and hold on to the thing and like okay there's am i getting a picture you know you could for people who don't know it used to actually really work to just hit your tv yeah hit the tv and the station would come in yeah that was a legitimate technique yeah sure uh mash it went for kids too at least my old man seemed to think it did

right wrap them on the head and they started working better mash has lasted three times longer than the korean war it depicted yeah the series yeah it was great but you know it's um we were having this conversation there's some there's some interesting things i think that the biggest flaw is that people i tell you what's going on is that the reason the right or anybody seems unable to to stop the onslaught is we don't very few people have what i'll call uh clarity and i call it moral clarity but it's not really moral clarity it's not maybe the right term but people are afraid i mean god forbid somebody calls you a bigot you know or somebody calls you a race tells you some name and now

you're now you're you know people are just uh fearful and the other thing is the education system ill prepares people for the rhetorical battles that we all have to wage in adulthood. I think it does a piss poor job of preparing people to be able to defend their own positions and their own beliefs. We're not a people who spend enough time asking ourselves hard questions about what we believe and why and what's the basis. No one's – that's just gone from from the entirety of the the education process it's unfortunate was it ever there um it was probably i would say you know uh you know how i am about education but there was a time when there was an education uh called the trivium that was really the middle ages was something called the trivium and it was grammar and i'm trying to think what the third leg of the trivium. That was really the middle ages was something called the trivium and it was

grammar. And I'm trying to think of what the third leg of the trivium was, but it was the idea that a liberal arts education, we weren't trying to teach you, um, what to believe so much as, or what to think so much as how to think. Right, right, right, right. And so that you were equipped, no matter the context that you found yourself in, you had all the tools necessary. But then the information age and the 70s, you remember this, you know, we were about the same age. And I remember when education really shifted, it was like everybody's going to need to go to college and everybody's going to need to learn computers. And it became less about learning how to think than it was. We're going to teach you a body of knowledge.

Of course, I now think about that and i laugh because it seems so foolish but how could you ever think that teaching a kid in middle school some substantive thing like he's not going to graduate from high school for another four years by by that time whatever substantive knowledge you taught them in the sixth grade is going to be useless it's already going to be it's already going to be too late. It's six years past. There's two words that everyone should know and look into a little bit. Epistemology, the theory of knowledge, especially with regards to its methods, validity, and scope. Epistemology is the investigation of what distinguishes justified beliefs from opinions.

It is a – if you don't know about epistemology this is going to be so harsh you don't know about epistemology you probably should never talk again you probably never express your opinion ever fucking again i mean it's almost because you have to know you have to know how this works you have to understand the mechanisms of the brain and it's like i ask people you have a tattoo i asked oh i'm gonna you're gonna love this story and then ontology is the other one you have to know these two words yeah you have to read a little bit about these things yeah ontology the branch of metaphysics dealing with the nature of being a set of concepts and categories and subject area or domain that shows their properties and the relationship between them you have to know relationship you have to understand context

and relationships because without that there is no world yeah hey you'll love this right what do i have sitting on my shelf do you remember when when greg went through this phase where he had all these yeah yeah oh yes yes tell me um share share with people what those books are these are great books. I've got it on my shelf too. But this very short introduction series were put out by the Oxford press. And it's, I forget how many there were total, but it was a few hundred and Greg bought every one of them. Cause he read one or two and then he had the whole series and he got me

into it. And so I got a bunch of them, but there are these little books in the Oxford press that are like a short, you know, this one right here on metaphysics is only, it's not even a hundred pages. And most of them run about that 100 pages 115 pages and it is short nicely um oh not overly nice but nice little books

and they give you like a whirlwind tour of all these subjects and like i have metaphysics there's another one a very short introduction law you know what is law what's you know what does it mean philosophy i got one you know philosophy of law and so a very short i don't want to one of my favorites is a very short introduction on knowledge and of course it's one of the thicker ones but it's you know how do we know what we know how do you how do you claim to know something you know and those are those are deep questions i think that's i might say the the big problem biggest problem in education and maybe society broadly is nobody's asking the the big questions anymore like everything's small we've gone small in every way you know no give me an

example can you give me an example oh before you give me an example that you got to see what someone wrote up here there's a great uh someone says something about russell burger oh let's listen to this did russ burger have moral clarity before he was fired why does it have to be before why can't it be before during and after he was fired why does it have to be no but i get you i get i get what you're doing jason you're a good dude hey i listen yeah he had moral clarity sure i mean yeah russell berger might be one of the and also by the way a great we went through the uh russ berger and i went through the uh what was that public speaking course we all took together oh yeah russ and i took that course together competed against each other in that and uh russell berger is a great rhetorician. He, Russ Berger is a trivium guy.

He would, he would absolutely, he would agree with me a hundred percent. You know, it's the greatest public speaking course. Reed Buckley. Yes. Yes. Yep. Wow. Yes.

Wow. Yep. Of course. Wow. Yeah. I forgot you guys did that. You guys did that at the Grand Del Mar, right? Yep. Wow. Yeah, that's I got you guys. You guys did that the Grand Del Mar, right? Yep. Yep. Me, Russ. I forget who else was in that door. There are other my deputy at the time. Marshall did that a whole bunch of us. Marty say, yeah, I think so. Yeah. Yeah. Do you remember? I'll never forget. Russ's talk was on basically on basically raising children and being too nice to children and what you do to children.

Yeah. Yep. Marshalls was on childhood obesity. I don't even remember what mine was. Marshalls was or Marty's was? I think Marshalls was because Greg said that's when he had that epiphany that nobody actually gives a shit about childhood obesity i remember that i remember that he came away from that he was like you don't care nobody cares about this he realized for the first time he's like look if you have kids who are obese it's a problem but if you don't it's not your problem you don't you're not worried about it you know it's always somebody else's problem not not yours. I was every day I post something on Instagram that causes a fight because of my strong opinions on kids. And I'm preparing this thing at the end of the day.

If you died, would you want me to have your kids or would you want the person you're defending? That's what I'm'm gonna start saying to people oh yeah like because because at my house they're gonna play in the yard they're gonna be free to think who they how they want dress how they want they're gonna be free to do whatever they want but there's gonna be discipline structure and boundaries and i'm gonna love them and no one's gonna hurt your kids in my watch nobody yep yep i'm gonna die trying to protect your kids from the fucking bear that lives in the fucking trench at all costs yeah so who do you want watching your kids and your kids aren't gonna fucking be on computers in my house and they're not gonna be eating fucking twizzlers

and i'm gonna love them and i'm gonna tuck them in every fucking night and tell them how much i love yeah it's it's a um it's funny to your point about the uh about language you know that's the other part of it is the kids will have an understanding their their understanding will be grounded in a reality you know not not just in their own theories about the world in their own head the term you're talking about by the way you when you started this you were looking the term i love and this is it's something we're all uh i think it's wired into us to make this mistake is reification is the term you're looking for what is it reification reification yeah r-e-i-f-i-c-a-t-i-o-n reification reification is the i'll tell you the best story i have about reification was when i was at infantry

school can i can i read i'm going to read the definition here before you go okay let me read So reification is the – I'll tell you the best story I have about reification was when I was at infantry school. Can I read – I'm going to read the definition here before you go. Okay, let me read the definition. Reification, the act of treating something abstract such as an idea, relation, system, quality as if it were a concrete object. Defining home as if it were just a roof over one's head instead of the center of a web of relationships leads in turn to the reification of homelessness okay so reification the best the best explanation i had ever heard for reification was when i was at basic infantry school so all marine officers once i got commissioned you go through this 26 26 week basic infantry course And so the guy we had for, um, uh, map reading and, and, uh, land navigation took us out.

We're out in the woods and he holds up the map and he goes, reification. He said, does anybody know what that is? The word man, but I couldn't, I didn't really know where he was going. And so everybody's just like quiet, you know, 200 lieutenants all sitting around are like, where's he going? And he goes, it's about... You're breaking up. You got to start over. You're breaking up so bad, Dale. I think something's wrong with your internet.

That's okay. I look good. He held up the map and he said reification. He held up a map and he said, reification is confusing this, the map, and then he stomped on the ground. He said, for this. And he's like, don't ever do that. And so it was this funny thing

because I looked into it. I was so fascinated. I love new words. I'm a word nerd, you know, professed word nerd. And so I had to look into reification. I realized it's wired into all of us. We have models about the world. We develop these mental pictures of how the world works. And then what we do is we project that map of the world. Damn, you're breaking up so bad. With reification, you get an idea in your head about, you see things on the map and then you're navigating and then you get to a point where you think like, oh, there should be a road intersection here. Now you're standing here and you have all these clues and the ground doesn't look like what

your map looks like. And so what you'll do is you'll choose the map over the ground. The map is not the brain. Teddy Williams knows. Yeah. The map's not the dirt, man. The map is not the dirt, Map's not the dirt, man. The map is not the dirt. And that's a good concrete example, but I like giving self on a new vocabulary word. Hey, I am going to tell you I'm tickled. I am so excited.

I almost want to just end the podcast and run out into the world, the real world, and use my new word. That is dope. We all do it. We all do it. You develop mental models of how the world works and the difference between people. Money is a classic one, how money works. People think money is dope. We all do it. We all do it. You develop mental models of how the world works and the difference between people. Money is a classic one, how money works. People think money is real.

Right, right. Exactly. Fiat currency is a good example. And by the way, this comes back to this is how people get hoodwinked. And I love this notion because, you know, I'm in the middle of this vaccine litigation. And the great thing about it is I, whenever I see examples of it, like really good examples, I love seeing paradigms get kind of used against people. And I give you, I can think of some great examples, but.

Please, please. I just want to say something really quick. Dale, I met Dale because Dale was the general counsel of CrossFit. What is the general counsel of CrossFit? That means you're the big, you're the, at the top, you run the media, uh,

the, I like, I ran the media department. You run the legal department. So he had this, uh, not only does he, he had a bunch of lawyers internally working with them,

but you're in control of the whole legal plan of CrossFit. What does that mean? That means, um, if someone sues us, they get bit by a dog. This means keeping, um,

uh, women out of the men's side. This means making sure the trademark in Mexico is good. It's,'s massive it's fucking it's it's nuts and then um before that he was in the military um and i know him as a helicopter pilot he also worked in some of with some of the three-letter agencies and then i mean his his story is massive. He's a practitioner of jiu-jitsu and other nutty fucking manly crazy shit, the night thing. And then, of course, he's a lawyer and he's been involved in some of the most fascinating cases, whether they be murder, vaccine, et cetera, while being in the Marine Corps. Okay. Sorry.

That's all right. Thank you. Okay. That pretty much covers it. Yeah. In fact, Dave and I, and he has four daughters and he's a dad, which is hugely important. Okay. Go ahead. Sorry, Dave. So you were going to give examples of. So you were talking about like, how is it, you know, on the issue of men and women and what a woman is, but I, another issue, similar kind of thing where people hijack language. And so I'm a huge language nerd. I started out as an engineering major in college.

My first two years, I was in aerospace engineering. I didn't need to build them to fly them. Once I got my flight guarantee, I switched over. I always wanted to be a writer. And so I switched and became an English major in Shakespeare, of all things. Wow. Yeah, so language is hugely important. I'm a huge language nerd. I love it. Love language. And, um, wow. Yeah. So languages is hugely important. I'm a huge language nerd. I love it. Love language and not just my own. I speak a couple other languages

fascinated by language because you know, it's how we communicate. And the thing about it is in the, in the current kind of regime, what you see is language being hijacked all the time, whether it's the term bigot, racist, you know, the terms lose all meaning. But I give you a great example. The entire vaccine program is a giant, a giant way of hijacking language because those mRNA shots, those, you know, Moderna and Pfizer, the BNT-162b2 or the BioNTech or the Comirnaty, those aren't vaccines. They have none of the characteristics that we traditionally associate with a vaccine. But they intentionally called them vaccines.

They're gene therapies. And SEC filings say that they're gene therapies. And the company that makes them has said that they were gene therapy. And some of the documents they filed in other countries with other regulatory agencies say they're gene therapies. But they intentionally called them vaccines here in the United States to hijack a paradigm reification. People have a paradigm in their head about vaccines. And there's a legal regime. Often gene therapy is a technique that's used to prevent or cure disease or medical disorder often gene therapy works by adding new copies of a gene that is broken so that's what they did

as opposed to as opposed to a vaccine introduces a dead a dead virus to spark the immune system to work and start the inoculation process bingo so traditionally the word vaccine comes from the term comes from this guy edward jenner uh and it was over smallpox but if you look at the word vaccine it comes from vaca which is the latin for cow okay and so they had discovered way back when vaccination came from the scourge of of uh smallpox it was all the way back. I mean, there's ancient, you know, texts about smallpox and the horrors of it. But the idea was some folks figured out that milkmaids wouldn't get smallpox because they had been exposed to cowpox. And so vaccination, the process of becoming vaccinated was to be, to get this cowpox, they would kind of cut your arm and then put this cowpox.

They would kind of cut your arm and then put this on there. There's all different techniques. Originally, it was called variolation, and then they moved to vaccination. But the idea was always that- Yeah, the process was around before the word. Yes. Yes, variolation before. But the term vaccination was coined by this guy roughly at the turn, I want to say the late 1799, I think it was.

And so we've always had and there's a famous case in the United States from 1905 called Jacobson that basically said the state can can force them to make you pay a fine if you don't get vaccinated. But that they state Massachusetts was Cambridge, actually, who had put this mandate in place. And if you didn't get vaccinated, you had to pay a fine of $5. And so the Jacobson case has been around for, you know, a hundred plus years and leaned on. And so what the, what the government authorities did was they, they knew they had a gene therapy they wanted to use for this virus, but they called it a vaccine. The regulatory authorities did to play with the notion in everyone's head that, oh, well, it's a vaccine. None of the traits of a vaccine. It's not the only thing it has in common with a vaccine is the route of

administration that it's injected in your arm, but it's not a vaccine. Any more than a woman, any more than a dude who says, I want to be in the women I identify as thing. That's a, that's a gene therapy that identifies as a vaccine and so it's so so it's just word fuckery yeah yeah and why why um why is the left more predisposed to word fuckery than the right conserving if you're a conservative you want to keep things as they are as a general matter. What is the mechanism in their brain? I'm going to go even deeper than that outside of those words.

By the way, $5 in 1905 is worth $166 today. So if someone wants to know how much that fine would be today in its equivalence. But I just used something called the inflation calculator. Nice. use something called the inflation calculator um how come i can look at a red light and know that it's an agreed upon lie that it means stop that it's just but but some people can't they really think that it means stop how come some people how how come in in england the queen one time took two weeks off the calendar and there was a uprising because a huge chunk of society thought that they lost two weeks of their life? These are true stories. Where does this inability to – what makes me so special that I can know the difference between my thoughts and the outside reality?

There's two answers to that. Or am I wrong and they're right? I mean I should. reality. There's, there's two answers to that. Or am I wrong? And they're right. I mean, I should, you're right, but there's two answers to that. Number one is if you look at it, I'm sorry, you broke up. What did you say? I'm what I said. It's that because no, you said I'm right.

I said, you're right. Of course. Oh, you want me to repeat that? Do you want me to record that for Haley too? Please. Got that. Whenever she corrects you. Like Dale said, I'm right.

But there's two answers to that. One is it goes back to that reification. Some people can't let go of the map. They just can't let go of the map, man. They can't let go of their mental model. And that may be tied to my second answer, which is if you look at a bell curve, a distribution of IQ among the human population, you know, it's get that nice bell curve, you know, and the average is right there in the middle. And you just have to remember whatever that number is, it doesn't really matter that 50% of the motherfuckers are on the left side of that. You know, like no matter what that number is, if average iq is 102 105 110 doesn't matter what

you set that there's 50 of the humanity that's left of that man and you just have to be you know like okay it's why the matrix um like the blue pill red pill thing works so well they just refuse there's something that the blue pill people are refusing to see yeah it's an it's an emotional attachment to the model that you have in your head it's unwillingness to you know it's an it's an emotional attachment to the model that you have in your head and it's unwillingness to you know it's that listen have you ever have you ever been driving right and you think you are but you're a little bit lost and then you come up to an intersection and you are 90 degrees out from where you thought you were and you get to the intersection and you're staring at it and you don't recognize it. Like you don't fully, you're like, this is all fucking wrong. The Dunkin' Donuts is in the wrong place.

The Starbucks. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And you can't, it just doesn't compute. You're like, this is all fucked. Something's, and it takes you like, how long it takes you to get your head, to let go of the mental model of, no, I know I was coming from the North.

And it's like, actually you were lost and you were coming from the East and you're having trouble. Yeah, that used to happen to me as a kid way more. I knew I was going on the freeway the right way, like I'd be 18 years old driving. I'd be like, how the fuck is the ocean over there? Something in my brain is not computing.

But that's an emotional attachment? That's an emotional attachment? That's an emotional attachment? It is, man. It happens. Yeah, sure. So it would be like if I found out the Turks really didn't kill the Armenians, but I was raised that way, and it's part of my identity. And I actually somehow was able to go back in time and see that the Armenians were the ones who were killing the Turks. So fuck me all up.

Hey, here's a great example of it and you'll appreciate this one how many how many times do you have a friend or someone you know who you love and care about and they're in a relationship and you're like hey man she's cheating on you and he's like no no no that's bullshit you know you don't know what you're talking about and how many times have you been like man this is going to end like a just a train wreck and there's nothing you can do for that person you know or if you how about yeah how about like um it's funny some if you if you say to someone the earth is flat they'll'll have like a violent reaction. Like you're a fucking idiot. Or if you say, um, nine 11 was a,

uh, a plant inside job. You're a fucking idiot. Or if you say the, the moon thing never happened, you're a fucking idiot. So basically, and those people might be right that you are a fucking idiot for thinking that,

but the reason why they have such a violent reaction is because they're so attached to their reality that it would fucking be like giving them a hundred hits of acid. If they saw, if they found out the Us government actually brought down the world trade center right wow they're so scared yes yes yep yep it's it you you can tell the and by the way that that you know hundred hits of acid things are great because i'll tell you part of you know a uh you do a little hallucinogenics and i remember talking to somebody in the crossfit community i want to say him but he had i had done some hallucinogenics for the first time and it was

a really profound and revelatory experience and i was talking to somebody about like they were like i'm not saying yes or no to your experience but i'll just tell you that my experience was after lsd many many times i realized whatever you believe about god or not god or whatever they go i just i realized that i wasn't as certain about anything anymore because there's a perspective that i realized like there's a way of perceiving this universe and it can be perceived in a very different way and like i'm not i'm a lot less certain about anything and so i don't you know i don't discard anything anymore i'm open to all of it you know wow you really touched on on something

so that's another thing that people just can't get their head wrapped around, and I'll tie this back to the science thing. Nothing is true. All beliefs are fake, but it's okay to believe things. You want to believe the thing that makes you most successful. So like we used to use Newtonian gravity because it was the most successful understanding of how objects were moving around. And then eventually Einstein came up with the relative theory of gravity, and that became more successful. But that doesn't mean that now this one is true and that Newtonian gravity is false. It just means like a new – that ideas are always going to be evolving.

But it takes a very special man, I guess, to realize that none of what we know – sorry, none of what we believe is true. We're just trying to hold on to the best theories that allow us to predict what's going to happen next. How do I get this cup of water to pour into my mouth and not onto my fucking shirt? And it's so crazy that people can't. And once again, I'm dying to know, I guess maybe it's fear. What is the mechanism that refuses people to be humble enough to accept that?

It's okay. It's okay. Not not it's okay like we don't know sebi when i was a kid growing up my my dad and for a lot of us you know your old man's like god you know when you're a kid and my old man was so and i love him and we're still we're close and have a great relationship how old's your dad uh 70 he was born 47 so 75 wow okay he's young yep yes yes mr wayne there's some there's some great stuff on this i'll tell you there's two i have so many thoughts i want to hear the story about your dad don't forget that one but so anyway but he was a guy who could god bless him you know i loved him But when he was when I was young, it was clear to me that my dad could not and would not ever admit that he was wrong, no matter how blindingly obvious it was that he was wrong. He was a guy who couldn't he couldn't admit that he was wrong, you know, and it was one of those things that I was like, that's not going to be me. like that's not going to be me you know and yet like most things you kind of emulate your parents you model what you see you know but and it was a it was a concerted effort to be like i'm never i

never want to be unwilling to admit in the face of obvious evidence but it's a it's an ego thing is what it is you know so you ask like what is it in people that makes them like that you know my dad also couldn't stand to be hated to lose you know and so like he couldn't i i played him in chess i beat him when i was young in chess and i loved chess but after i beat him and it was clear i was better than him my dad never played me in chess again ever we've never that's interesting you're not like that no wow it was a concerted effort to not be like that yeah that's a hard bullet to dodge yeah i i made i was we're yeah it's a you know she's got it done miss fazo lahi she's got it sima's got it right yeah it's it's trying to give meaning.

And it's hard to be like, because at the same time you do that, you also have to have some anchor. You have to have some sense of self and some like, hey, my feet are on this ground and this is meaning and this is real. But it's hard. You get out into the world and your beliefs are constantly being buffeted. you get onto the world and your beliefs are constantly being buffeted. I'll tell you that, you know, to tie this back into what we've been talking about, a lot of people are in for, and this, and society is broadly in for a rough go because reality doesn't really give a

shit about model. You know, like if, if your model's faulty, it doesn't really reality will steamroll you. You know, if you're like, I can fly and you jump off a bridge, I have bad news for you. You know, I know how that ends from my experience on the planet um all discomfort comes when you argue with a reality your windshield's broken on your car and you're pissed about you can't accept it and you're pissed and you're angry that you're fucking and you're arguing with reality and every time you argue with reality you are fucking miserable and're arguing with reality. And every time you argue with reality, you are fucking miserable. And the whole thing about happiness is just flowing with reality. Yes.

And, and some people are like, well, what's reality and what's normal. And a great example of what normal is, is you plant a seed in a cup and you set it by the window and the plant grows towards the light. It's there is fucking normal.

Don't fucking, maybe there's not words for it, but just fucking be observant and be open to it. There is fucking normal. Get on the fucking normal train flow with normal. I don't care if you want to jerk off dudes or suck dick and you have a dick. I'm totally cool with that. If that's the way you're your north is, I'm that's not what I'm talking about. I'm just saying, find your normal. Stop fighting with reality, arguing with reality. And so what you're saying is, is that there's a group of people who are fighting.

Will those people just be miserable, those people you're describing? They're just going to fight reality? Their whole hundred years on the planet, they're just going to fight? God, that sucks. God, that sucks. You know how many people you know? Man, they need a podcast. Man, that sucks. I would hate to live like that. Sebi, so many people. Once I found this, once I kind of got to my point of Zen, you know what I noticed was like everywhere I went.

I'm sorry. One second. Your mom is my North. Thank you, Rich. That's perfect. The perfect opportunity. I love Rich. Like I walked into that one come on um you're better than that but uh the uh the thing is that how many people do you know like you see constantly and i i don't want to i don't want to pick names for my own life because i got to live with them but how many people like once you kind of find your zen how many people do you know who are addicted to their pain i hear people talk all the time. And when I hear people constantly, like all they're doing is bitching and moaning and

blah, you know, and I'm like, the Stoics had this right. And this is my definition. It happens to the best of us, Rich. You, you know, discomfort, emotional discomfort is just the difference between what you are expectations and what reality is. Like when you're uncomfortable or, and you go back to that thing, like why people react virulently to this idea, like, Hey man, I know you, you identify as a woman, but you, you went through puberty and you have a penis and you know, I don't bum you out, but that makes you a man. And, and Hey And if you want to go through the process and change and go through that, great. But you can't expect to export that reality onto all of us. But there are there are a ton of people, man, who are addicted to their pain and they can't give it up because their pain identifies them.

How many people do you know who tell you who will define who they are by the tragedies they've suffered in their life rather than by the great accomplishments or or other things you know rather by the than by the love or you know the things like that there's a whole bunch of people man who are way attached to their suffering and all that and they don't realize all they have to do is just drop it it's just a whole group whole groups of people armenians yes how about the demand on black people to embrace their suffering? The demand. Yeah. It's fucking nuts. I was demanded to embrace the suffering of the Armenian people. That's how I was raised. And now and now white liberal America is demanding that all black America fucking embrace their pain and carry it.

It's fun. It's you. Wow. You nailed it. What do you think the mechanism is for an individual to let go of that? I know some good drugs that'll help with it. I mean – How about 100 burpees? I think that the oxygen deprivation that we put ourselves through in CrossFit forces a meditative state and a stillness of the mind that allows you to start slowly. I used to bring this up to lauren and greg and they would laugh at me but i think crossfit's a spiritual movement i think or or or psychological movement yeah we were i mean they they would have shunned that back then certainly lauren would have greg would have known and smiled and he would have appreciated it but he would have poo-pooed it but

he knows i mean he's not yeah yeah yeah yeah you'll it gets awfully quiet man when you're on burpee number or you're on like you're in minute 38 of murph yes yes you don't have enough you don't have enough left in your arms to do a single push-up you know you're like it's all the rest is all bullshit man your your reality narrows down to to just that moment the next breath you know that's uh you know you served 20 years in the marine corps uh 20 it depends on how you count it you know i was in razzi for four years that doesn't count for like towards retirement but then i did another 27 years after that but that was a mix of active duty and reserve. So I don't know, 30, 25,

whatever I managed to get. Are you still in the reserve? No, I'm out. I retired in 2018. Okay. So including the reserve, like 30 years? Yeah, 31, something like that. I was commissioned in 91. So 27 from 91 to the thing, but 87, I joined Ronald Reagan's military, which is crazy. When I signed my induction documents in 87, when I graduated high school it was wrong i know that was ronald reagan's military i was joining his was at the bottom of the thing why did you do that why did you go into

military you're so smart why not why not go to uh mit with that ajkanazi brain ears hey it's funny you say that i i was on i had a scholarship to uh i had a full ride to carnegie mellon for physics. Wow. But you want to – this is funny and topical too. You know what ruined my life? I don't want to say ruin it. I mean I say that jokingly. Your penis.

Your penis. Well, that. Everybody knows. Zardoz knows that the penis is evil. But the – no, it was Top Gun. It was 1986. And Top Gun came out, and I was like, oh man, kissing Kelly McGillis, riding a motorcycle, going to Miramar, you know? And so I wound up, I applied for and got an RRTC scholarship.

And I wanted to be, Tom Cruise almost caused me to get caught up in all that faggotry. I think I can say that on your show. You can say whatever you want. And yeah uh yeah yeah so you'll love i love but by the way um there was this this is totally off subject but there's this guy in my dms who's uh he makes money on fan fans only only fans oh yeah yeah and uh and he just basically dudes pay him to show his asshole to them. It was fascinating. It was fascinating. And I go and I said to him, I'm like, hey, do you ever like so someone will call in and someone will DM you and say, hey, I'll pay you $150 if you let me watch your girlfriend suck your dick. And he goes, dude, I did that once.

And all my subscribers were like, that is fucking gross. We never want to see that again. Please just show us your butthole. I was like, wow. Hey, know your head. Have you seen this? Yeah, we just, I went to see it last week. How is it?

I haven't heard one person say it's bad. What do we have here? It's that good, huh? Yeah, Miles Teller, they did a great job. He's a dead ringer for Anthony Edwards in the original. And he's a good actor anyway. He's a talented kid. But it's good.

I mean, I laugh. You know, I wanted to be Top Gun. I wanted to be Tom Cruise, you know. And I went, I joined the Navy. I had a Navy scholarship. And then I showed up and i met my first marine i didn't know anything about the military you know my dad was in the air force for three years during uh 65 to 68 right before i was born and i think he really did that to avoid getting shipped to vietnam it was like the best odds you know he graduated high school right in that he was right in the fat you

know right in that big group of dudes so he joined the air force and was only in three years got out i was born in texas but so i didn't really have any discharge how did he only do three years back then that was the enlistment three-year enlistments okay by the way by the way caleb's in the air force hey what's up oh he's in the air force caleb dale saran dale saran caleb nicean. Caleb. Nice to meet you, Dale. Nice to meet you, Caleb. You're an Air Force guy? Yeah, I am. All right. Okay. Thanks for showing up, Caleb. You da man.

It'll work out. No, just kidding. I've got most of my clients right now. I've got 540 plaintiffs, and it's probably going to get up to 750 here shortly. But we've got about 750, most of it's Air Force folks a shit ton of pilots in fact so I'm going to get us to switch gears here a second so basically you had a scholarship to Carnegie Mellon

you could have gone anywhere instead you saw Top Gun it's funny similar to the Dave Castro story Dave Castro saw some movie and became a Navy SEAL I think some Sean Connery movie and then and then and so I'm going to have to have you on again. Of course, there's so much to talk about, but right now you represent somewhere between 500 and 750 members of the United States Air Force in a class action lawsuit.

Total, I actually, I have spread across the services services but i've got grand total of the suits i'm involved in i probably have closer and i've got some people waiting to join the suits i've got to amend the complaint all that but i've got my poor paralegal my daughter is get is overwhelmed i'm turning people away probably have close to a thousand who want in who are like banging on the doors like please help us you know they You know, they're going through hell. They're being put through hell. It's horrible. The American people knew they'd be horrified.

And can you start from the beginning and tell me what the fuck is going on? Tell me about this case you're doing. By the way, Dale was also involved in the anthrax case against the United States government. And I was reading in the Epoch Times you won that case. Sort of. I mean, I represented, I was a, so I was flying helicopters and then I put it through this funded law program and became a, I got it. There are a handful of us who were selected for this program where the

military will actually send people who were previously in different MOSs, military occupational specialties, doing different jobs. Like you could be a ship driver. They pick a small number of those people and they send them to law school, put them through Naval Justice School, and then send them out to the fleet to be judge advocates. So I left flying. I had to give up flying, went to law school, but the military paid for it. And then I graduated, passed the bar, go to Naval Justice School, and then out to okinawa japan i went as a defense attorney so i was defending marines and sailors out in okinawa

and some of my first cases were the anthrax vaccine cases and then you you represented a one sailor and two marines uh who refused the vaccine uh in okinawa in 2000 the anthrax vaccine and then one of my clients got i got an i got a stay from an appellate which led to sorry which led to you writing a book which is available on amazon written by dale saran united states versus members of the armed forces the truth behind the department of defense anthrax vaccine immunization program yep okay sorry and that led me that all kind of let it's funny how kind of things come full circle in your life so i went through that it was a bitter part of my life because i worked behind the scenes. My, one of my clients testified before Congress. And so I

went up to the Hill and met a lot of people and, and, uh, it was an enlightening trip. And then, um, it, it looked like it was, and then nine 11 happened. And like, I was so pissed off at the Marine Corps. I got myself passed to get out and then wound up, you know, working, doing some other government agency work in Afghanistan. And, and then. Were you recruited for that? Or did you lean, did you lean into it? I leaned into it. Okay. Okay. But there's a. So you still wanted to work for the government, even though you got pissed at the Marines, you went over to, you leaned into some other stuff. Yeah. Yeah did and and i thought i had the illusion that well it'll be better because it's smaller and more elite and you know it'll be much better if i go do

that and and then of course once you get there you realize it's just as broken and fucked up as anywhere else you know and you're like oh shit now what did i do right but you know it took me until 2006 but hey the great part about that was what did it do it that's where i found crossfit 2005 i was in afghanistan and a lot of the the guys where i was were doing crossfit and so i found that and by 2007 i was at the first crossfit games uh mr uh no not that one no No. And other government agency, Bruce, and other government agency. The other, one of the others. Okay.

A lot of those folks co-located and worked together. So then, so, so tell me about this. So tell me about what, how did you get involved? So tell me about this case that you have with this, this, this cohort of nearly 1,000 people. I had filed another case. Some folks reached out to me and heard that I had worked on this federal case, Doe v. Rumsfeld, which actually shut down the anthrax program in 2003, 2004. I didn't start working on that.

So that's why they say you won because the program got shut down, but the, but the soldier still got fucked. Yes. Okay. Cause I've, the article said you won, but I've talked to you personally and you said you lost. And that's because close to your heart, you really wanted to get fucking vindication for these guys. Yeah. And I worked for years behind the scenes. So like, even when I was working for CrossFit, you know, Greg was pretty, pretty easy going about me still doing stuff.

Like, and on my own time, I would moonlight and do stuff. Like I represented a guy who was trying to get his records corrected who had been court-martialed and so i worked for behind the scenes uh hey ken send me an email and i'll we'll talk we'll talk there's a lot of people like yeah i heard it was closed and yeah i mean we're working around it be a motion to intervene down the road, but I'm trying to get people together, protect as many people as I can. They're my folks. But yeah, so some some folks, when this vaccine program was getting ready to be launched, some people, one of the guys who was the main DOE plaintiff, he's a he's a Air Force colonel. And he was he fought this thing.

God, the guy's my hero. He's an Air Force Academy grad. He just never gave up, never quit, you know, always holding the military to its own standards. But he's, um, some people had reached out to him and he said, Hey, the guy you need to talk to is Dale Saran. And so a bunch, some other lawyers reached out to me and kind of dragged me in and it wound up costing me the, I was in a different job. I was working in tech.

You know, this was just last year. I had a different, completely different job. I was helping a startup company doing some stuff in payment systems and all that. And then this kind of landed in my lap. And the thing was, it was funny because that part of my life, that anthrax vaccine fight was like this bittering experience because it looked like this loss of years and it led me down this rabbit hole. And I was like, what a fucking shit show that was and then this all came up again and you know and i was fighting it hard and then i lost my job my boss kind of found out i was moonlighting and he fired me like on one day notice that was a little lawsuit

i mean i dude i didn't you know i didn't know where the next paycheck was going to come from and i had this moment of like i just stopped fighting you know and i realized like dude this is right back in your lap like what, what do you think? You know, just training was just training for this shit. It was just the training setting. It was just training for this. And so it was good training, right? Oh, great training. Great training. It put me, it makes me in a unique position to be litigating this one. I mean, I, a lot of people have reached out to me other attorneys you know i've

been like hey i'm looking at your filings what the and then dug in on me and they were like oh shit and so i've had lawyers reaching out to me like hey will you help us will you you know help us with our filings and all that so i have no lack of time and you know i'm i mean i'm plenty busy you know i got a lack of work and all that so it's it's funny that's full circle to not arguing with reality yes and that's what's funny about it is i kept saying i was fighting it so hard i was like fuck this you know i wanted i was like why you know why am i back in this place and my wife i finally said like why don't you just like you just stop you know stop stop trying to run away except you're calling except you're good it's

it's exactly what it was here it is and now it's i'm doing better than ever stuff the universe has opened its abundance to me and i'm like wow i was a moron for so long you know this is kind of a weird question to ask a lawyer but are you having fun yeah yeah yeah i mean i try and tell the people i feel bad because my clients are suffering. And but every day that I get up, man, I've got energy and I've got cause and I've got, you know, purpose. Yeah. You know, yeah. Every day that I get up, I get something to do. And it's on behalf of people I care about, military folks, you know, veterans. And so I'm like, yeah, I'm jacked every day I get up. I got shit to do and it's got to get done.

And but like I'm energized, you know, all the time. It's fantastic. What's the premise of the case? Is your group suing the government or are they defending? Okay. And what are they saying to the government? What are you guys saying? Well, we're waiting.

I mean, we're waiting. You know, I'm in, we're kind of in the early stages of it. But I mean, we're getting ready to file a motion basically to shut the whole thing down. To say that these aren't vaccines. And then we've got a bunch of other claims, about five or six different claims, but ultimately that you can't force someone, you can't mandate somebody to take this. There is no authority to do this and that they're ruining people's lives in the meantime. And I've got another 115 client or ish Coasties. So I'm going to drop another suit on behalf of Coasties because they've been left out in the cold. And I have Coasties or Coast Guard dudes. Yeah. Yep.

So I've got another hundred and something Coasties that I'm going to do this for and in a different jurisdiction. And then, you know, you just take on a hundred thousand people. Like, why do you have to shut it why do you have to shut down how many people can sign up i my i got one paralegal you know my daughter and you just to to to manage a herd of people that big i think i'm the only attorney doing anything this big i just can't someone doesn't jump on board how come there's not some patriot out there with fucking a hundred million dollars who won't just throw a half million at this you know there's some people out there with fucking $100 million who won't just throw a half million at this?

You know, there's some people out there. I mean, there are other groups doing that, like raising money, like defending the republic. Sidney Powell, she's got kind of Trump ties, and now you get into politics and everybody's, you know. But I'm working with one of her attorneys, a guy named Brandon Johnson, who's fantastic. He's a bright guy. So, you know, I've allied myself with people who can write because ultimately you got to be able to write to do this. You need, you need good writers, you know, people and good legal writers showing and who are kind of bright and quick on feet. But, you know, the government answer is

basically like to lean on that vaccine paradigm, you know, to lean on that vaccine map. Oh, we can vaccinate you. And, oh, you want to kill grandma? You know, it's the same thing as the bigot thing. You know, as soon as you say something that, you know, challenges the prevailing notions, the answer is, oh, why do you use emotional appeal like that? They use emotional appeal. Yeah, yeah. All of it is. Yeah. They lean so hard on the troops, you wouldn't believe.

Hey, check this out. When this first military made people who are unvaccinated wear different colored wristbands at some basis than those who are vaccinated different colored wristbands what does that sound like yeah and they wouldn't let like i had clients who allowed to go to the chow hall they weren't allowed to eat with the with the unvaccinated weren't allowed to eat with the vaccinated. I mean they're treating these guys like some other people treated some dirty people back in the day. It's crazy. In the Epoch Times article, there's a distinction that they make between it being constitutional to force troops to take a vaccine but unconstitutional for the to force gene therapy you also mentioned earlier in the podcast about a law that passed

in 1905 jacobson it's a case it was a case jacobson was a suit where a guy didn't want to take the smallpox vaccine he was like this is a tape and the supreme court said that tough shit you got to take it it but where in the Constitution what in the Constitution allows the US government to force people to take drugs fuck you, that's why clause yeah, that's listen, we're a long way from

that document, man, which is the hard part about being a lawyer I have to be dealing with reality a long way from home now you kind of have to work with what you got you know and but that's it's fun it's a challenge intellectually yeah so you dab so um do the do any of these crazy people who can't distinguish the difference between reality and their thoughts are any of them judges do you see judges like that occasionally sure yeah oh yeah oh my god oh yeah yeah i've been on the wrong end of a few of those man that's rough yep yep oh my goodness oh my goodness oh my goodness hey do you think everyone is like that? You know this statement that we're brought up with as kids? If you're not a Democrat as a young man, you have no heart, and if you're not a Republican as an adult, you have to travel through that um

do you think you have to travel through does everyone do that does everyone travel through that process is that part of being a human being or no some people can just be born red pills already uh no i think i think most of us travel through it but just maybe in different um in different subject matters like in a discrete area but i you know the the other joke we're all caterpillars and some of us turn into butterflies and some of us don't yeah some some caterpillars just spend their life chewing on leaves man you know no cocoon no chrysalis no coming out the other side you know dale there was a um there was there was a teacher who put a a note on the door of their of their classroom and it says if your parents don't

respect if your parents don't accept your identity i put it on my instagram if your parents don't accept your identity i'm your mom and and then there were a bunch of rainbow flags over it and a bunch of, and I posted it and a bunch of people. And I said, Hey, like if you come between me and my kids, you should expect all the gloves are off. You should, you should not expect it. And I give anyone who, no matter how they respond to this, a pass. I accept accept i accept no one becoming in between their parents and their kids nobody for any reason and people turn this in so what's crazy is is that people turn this into a gay a gay thing they're like they started talking about homosexuality gay i'm like this they turned it

into that i don't care if my kid's gay or straight. I care about you trying to come in between my kid and me. And once again, it's that conflation again. You see this conflation, right, of coming between your kids. And people are jumping in who don't have kids. And that's why I would say to you, you would – if you were to die, let's say you're Jewish and the Germans were taking you and you had your baby. Would you throw your baby at that teacher to catch or me? All of you who fucking hate me would still throw your baby at me because at the end of the day, you know your baby is free and safe with me. But it's not free and safe with that person.

It's indoctr safe with that person it's indoctrinated hey that person and fucked a lot of it's just like it's so crazy that you think because i posted that that i'm against gay no i'm against people getting they're conflating the issues of course but that's intentional that's hey it's the same kind of reaction it's it's an intellectual coping mechanism rather than deal with the the real issue that you're talking about is we'll change it to an issue that I can feel strongly about. And again, it's people, a lot of people like, man, they're addicted to their victimhood. You know, they just can't. Everything has to be cast in a way that they're victims. You know, it doesn't matter. And by the way, this is a big, a big reason for this is that said, we live in an era of,

of plenty. We live in such wild wealth and excess and all that. This is what you have to do. You, you gotta like people who get bored and this is what you wind up with first world problems, you know, like people screaming about pronouns and shit is like, yeah, that's, it's, it's wonderful to have the, the wherewithal and to, to be and to be able to bitch about pronouns, you know, because like I spent 15 out of 21 months in Afghanistan. You know, that's that we used to call it the time machine, because when you would land there, it was like going back 800 years in the past. It was like going to the 12th century you know just in terms of what's their infrastructure you know they're still living in mud huts on the side of mountains you know and so all of that first world bullshit really gets you know goes away in a hurry i mean yes yes yes you

know so and it used to be the weirdest thing for me because i would be like the that i used to see they get smacked in the face with that so i was in the far reaches on the eastern edge of afghanistan on one day right and then i'd get a helicopter this blacked out helicopter i'd fly into kabul get on a chartered jet fly back land at dulles and so and i was asleep and half you know trying to get some rest and like so one minute you're awake on the far edge of the planet you know in afghanistan and then the next time i wake up um um at the airport coming home in my car you know and it was the the disconnect was like whoa it was really weird

like it's covered with flies versus kids 100 pounds overweight eating cotton candy at the airport yeah i'm in the i've been standing in in Starbucks and people are bitching and moaning about the waiting. Cause they didn't get their Pacino and it didn't have the right, you know, I said three pumps and I'm like, I can't like is three. Like,

is this fucking like, what the fuck is going on in the world? You know, it's a weird thing. Seema. I am not assuming that all parents are good. You're, you're missing the point. You're reading into it. It has nothing weird thing. Seema, I am not assuming that all parents are good. You're missing the point.

You're reading into it. It has nothing to do. They could be the worst parents in the fucking world if that's directed at me. They could be the worst parents in the world. You don't post something that's fishing that comes in between parents and their kids with – you don't do that. There's different ways to do that. And you sure as fuck don't write, you you there's there's there's different ways to do that and you sure as fuck don't write call them i am now your mom you don't do that there's other you don't you don't no you don't do that that's not um you just don't you don't do that kosher yeah i can get into

more but i'm not assuming they're good parents there's tons of shitty parents there's tons of kids that need to get away from their parents. I shouldn't say tons. There's a small, tiny fraction of kids that do need to get away from their parents. And I'm all about that. You don't do that by putting a sign with the genitalia flag on it, the flag that symbolizes people who like other people with the same genitalia to have sex with. That's what that flag is. If you believe in the definitions of gay and homosexuality on a kid's door and conflate it with calling someone else your mom instead of your real mom, it's fucking batshit crazy insanity. And any healthy parent won't tolerate that.

Any healthy parent won't tolerate that. They don't accept that. It's insane only because for those of us who came through, like, you know, my dad had flaws and I could certainly talk about them and all that. Right. He loved us, you know, and he was great, loving, funny, big hearted, you know, for all his flaws or whatever. I don't carry any of the baggage over, you know, getting smacked or any of that stuff because the most important thing you can

do, in fact, it's, I think it's, it, it truly does conquer all that. If you love your kids, you can be, you can be a heaping baggage, be an alcoholic, you can be a drug addict. You can be, but if you love your kids truly, truly it, that's, that's really, that wins, you know, that's the, they'll be all right. They'll figure it out. They'll love you back. You know, you'll always have a chance, you know, but you gotta love. The girl we had on yesterday was raised by two alcoholics, all of fucking you know crazy shit with the police and stuff you know what she

said my parents fucking love me they were never like bad to me like they love me and she turned out fucking great she's a 20 year old superstar yeah but she had to see crazy shit with cops come you know yep see child protective services cops taking mom and dad away but the parents were fucking they loved her yeah my my mom was like that you know she didn't know who her father was growing up she was briefly orphaned you know raised um all her brothers and sisters had different moms and dads and stuff and and uh she found her stepfather dead you know the alcohol finally killed him you know he was a savage alcoholic and all that but like my mom's most loving you know the alcohol finally killed him you know he was a savage alcoholic and all that but like my mom's the most loving you know she's a saint an absolute bona fide saint you know it's love does really truly conquers all it really does when you look at the president of the united states

um joe biden do you do you have an opinion on his mental faculties? I want to say something really positive about him real quick. Do you think that maybe everything is fine upstairs? It just is scrambled when it comes out of his mouth? Like that would be the best case scenario. Yeah, I don't think that's the case. That's not the case. I shook his hand once when I was doing the anthrax stuff at

the committee on government reform i think he was right so a bunch of politicians you know like names you'd know because they never leave they're like syphilis you know you never get rid of those fucking people but um when i was there like it's really interesting when you meet politicians and shake their hands and i've had we had some politicians come out to my uh base i've had that happen several times you know congressional visits and all that stuff and and you see these are people you see on tv right and you have this idea of what they are and then you actually shake their hand and you look into their eyes and my impression of like every politician and the ones you know names i could i'm not gonna but names you know every time i'm shaking their hands i'm like i

don't know what it is ma'am my bullshit detector is like then i look into their eyes and i'm like this is a doe-eyed dope like this person knows is a complete moron and they always do that oh that like charismatic like love you and pat you on like and you can i just like i'm like this is such bullshit like it just is so fake and so obviously fake and they've got all these sycophants around them you know i anybody who wants to be in politics i look at it this way anybody wants to be in politics is immediately disqualified from the job and and it's because of this i have enough trouble like just taking care of myself controlling my own appetites desires being a good father being a good lawyer you know doing the right thing making sure i you know being a good father, being a good lawyer, you know, doing the right thing,

making sure I, you know, being a good teammate, you know, all the things that I participate in. To be a politician is to engage in the conceit that I know better than you do how you should live your life. Because fundamentally, people who go into politics just want to tell other people how to live, how they're supposed to live their lives there ought to be a law yeah you want to sit down and shut up but it's it's the idea that i know better i know what's better for other people than they know what's better for themselves you know that's the kid that wants to be the hall monitor greg had the greatest line about that he's like do you ever notice that you remember when he said that do you ever notice that all the people in hr are the people who wanted to be hall monitors when you were a kid and he said that right in front of our hr person i don't know if you remember that but i do i do

i think he said it many times yes he was like that's true i mean kind of kind of unfortunately so you you think something might be really wrong with him you think that we might actually have you think he's gonna make it to the end of his presidency? Boy, they're going to drag him there probably, kicking and screaming, yelling at the rest of us. Is it abusive what they're doing to him, do you think? Oh, hell yeah. Oh, how much do you have to hate your – how much do you have to not love your – dude, would you do that to your wife? Would you stick her up in front of no american public to no just to make a great question it's a great question okay great question i would not do that

to my wife and i would not want my wife to do that to me no how are they justifying it that it's the betterment for the country and the people that they know better or everyone is it really just as simple as they're just trying to keep their jobs they want their next paycheck no no it's the it comes back to what i said before there there are people who are who this is my psychoanalysis of of the of the situation is there are people who are so uh afraid of the stillness inside they can't face the silence with themselves and so it gets projected outward man man. And you wind up, I got to control others. Think about all the people you know. Wow. Wow. They're so afraid of themselves that they have to control others. Their own inner voice. That's some scary shit. it dude that's all that is is it's all it's all outward it's you know they can't stand i know people who like can't they can't be alone with themselves they can't just sit in silence with

someone else you know they can't they have to be talking they have to be doing it you know the silence is like they're terrified of it you know yeah i remember a friend in college who said hey man i just spent a couple hours at home alone. I was like, and? And they were so impressed. You take your seat. Biden's note card has step-by-step instructions for everything, like walking into a room and sitting down. Yeah, I saw that. I saw that.

Here's what I said. Is that bad? Is that bad, though? I mean, do you need a card to tell you? Did you need a card to tell you to sit down, introduce yourself to guests? Did you need a card to tell you, did you need a card to tell you to sit down, introduce yourself to guests? Did you need a card to do that? Uh, uh, no. Um, but no, but, but I'm not, but I'm not, I'm not seventies. I would hear Einstein would go on walks and get lost when he was in his most brilliant part of his life. I just want to give him the benefit.

was in his most brilliant part of his life i just want to give him the benefit of that so i wonder caleb can you look up and see is that a standard tactic for like someone who has dementia like if i started to get dementia and i told my kids i wanted to go to the coffee shop would they give me a card and be like and then it has like my name and phone number on it on the bottom but also it says okay go there ask for a starbucks and then come home. Like maybe, maybe that's just a standard protocol. Maybe that is indicative or a clue that he is losing his shit. I've never had, no, I've never had, I don't think I've had syphilis. I had two venereal diseases in my life. I had crabs, which was fascinating.

Oh, really? Fascinating. Crabs are fascinating. I had a buddy who did. I don't have experience with it. Only through others. They're real crabs and they eat your pubic hair yeah and then they and then they sit in the follicle and you can scratch it off like and you can look at it this is what this is this i got to tell this story sometimes but i collected them all and i put them into an altoids

container and i did that for like i did that for look at look at caleb's face oh you can't see kim and i collected them into an altoids container and i had a thousand of them in there and they can't get out no they can't get out they're they're just scrambling around on the bottom and then finally like i just couldn't scrape i just couldn't get rid of them so i i one of my i had a homeless guy living in my backyard and he would use my shower and he had dreadlocks black dude and uh he had lice shampoo so finally one day i just took some of his lice shampoo and put on my cock and balls and and one time caleb you ready for this story i had crabs i had crabs oh i had crabs bad right and i was in college and one time i came home and there were like

fucking 15 people um i had this king-size mattress that sat on the time i came home and there were like fucking 15 people um i had this king-size mattress that sat on the ground in my room and there were like 15 people sitting on it and they were smoking my weed and i was like oh now steal my weed and now you got the crab it was amazing smoke a man's weed wind up with his crabs yeah that'll teach you i used to sit in front of the mirror every like couple times a day naked and with my legs open and i'd be just picking crabs off my pubic hair you're always asking people these questions so i'm gonna put you on the spot did you ever have sex with someone when you had crabs and not tell them? Come on now.

I, I, I can't imagine. I went a month. I mean, I had a harem at the time. I can't imagine. I can't imagine. I can't imagine.

But I'm a very, I was, I'm a very honest guy. You know what? I want to get you a t-shirt, your own t-shirt that says Savan Matosian, super spreader. You're your own super spreader.

Hey, if you're going to have a venereal disease, that's the most benign one. I mean, they're just bugs just hanging out. I mean, it's just- My mom is a nurse. Well, retired now, but she's a nurse and her great curse of people always used to be when I was a kid, like she really,

she wouldn't say anything. She's not a bad word for anybody, but if she was like really mad at somebody, you would know because she'd be like, I hope he gets syphilis oh shit why that in particular and then she explained the course of the disease my sister and i were like oh shit don't get mom she'll put a curse on you and then i think i had i think i i think i had a yeast infection once and i thought it was a venereal disease i think that was the other thing hey i guess there's basically mold growing on my penis yeah it was fucked up it was the military

little spores all over the helmet oh yeah i took antibiotics that's what happened i had i had i took antibiotics and it gave me a yeast infection on my cock and balls on my cockings on the helmet of my cockings yeah okay no not true i don't think that's how it works yeah sure well that's what they said happened they said basically i killed my my flora and my fauna on my on my cock and and it caused a yeast infection so i had all these little and then i had to take something to get rid of that and it was yeah it's 30 years ago my cock's perfect now in case of course i haven't, I haven't seen a crab in 30 years. It appears to have taken care of itself. Hey, I saw this, you know, the whole like, oh, it's common.

This is a gaffe. You know, like, look, I don't care what anybody says. If I were I told I tell people this, I get asked this. It's weird. People ask me, like, do you think Joe Biden's like does he, you know, is he all with it or whatever? And I, and my answer is a legal answers. If I were a lawyer and somebody who's in his will, when his will, you know, eventually gets probated when he croaks and, you know, passes on the fortune that he's acquired during his time in government service, when that happens, if I were a lawyer, lawyer i the first thing i'd be looking for is the date on when the will was done and if it was during this presidency man i'd be filing the i'd be filing them you know if i were a disgruntled member of the of the family who might take i'd

be well non-compos mentis man he i mean you've got you've got at least a a colorful argument that this guy doesn't he doesn't know what he's doing. Insider is a complete shithole of a publication, by the way. I mean that in the – like I want to give Biden the benefit of the doubt, but anything they say is a fucking lie. They're horrible. We don't have independent media anymore, man. You're independent media. You're real media. We don't have that anymore.

We have – I call it American Pravda. The major media organizations are just fundamentally where it's like we're living in the Soviet Union circa 1983. That's a really good thing you brought up. If I saw my wife do – is that a word he just used? Definition of non-compostmentous, not of sound mind. I know Dale is so smart. Good catch, Caleb. Nice. Gail, so smart. Good catch, Caleb. Nice. If I saw my mom or my wife do some of the things that I see Joe Biden do, I would take them immediately to the hospital to get checked for a stroke. He's already had two.

Oh, he has. Okay. So that's what it looks like. And I would hope someone would do that to me. If you guys ever see me, please call. Someone text my DM, my wife, and her Instagram. Be like, hey, we saw Sevan have a stroke on the fucking show. Please. I'll just put you out of your misery. I promise you, I won't let you suffer.

It's like something's getting stuck in my medulla oblongata. I mean, like, I need a fucking, I need some liquid Drano. Okay, so it is like that. Because that's a great way to think of it. That's what I tell people whenever they get mad at cops for shit they do. I go, what if that was your dad or your brother or your son? Like you got to see them as like those people. And yeah, if Joe Biden was my dad, I would take him. The shit I see him do, I would immediately get, put him in a car and take him to the hospital, get checked a stroke are there any doctors listening is that correct is that what you would do i wouldn't i wouldn't let's put it this way i wouldn't uh if i were dr jill biden i certainly wouldn't be uh parading i wouldn't have my my loved one not a chance on earth in the in the shape that he's in there's not a chance on earth i would be – I mean, it's abuse. Seema, Seema, you're on fire today. By the way, Seema, you look like the lady who used to run HR for CrossFit.

Yeah, a little bit, a little bit. If you are having a stroke, I heard you're supposed to start reciting the alphabet backwards and say Z is for zebra because it keeps the mind working. I'll have to ask my mom. She's worked with a lot of stroke patients. She started out as a nurse's aid in in uh like a nursing home you know she started you know cleaning bedpans from the very bottom and then worked her way up to be a surgical or nurse and all that but this this how long before this case that you have this current one the covid vaccine one the covid gene therapy one excuse me um, comes to an end. Is this like

five years? Is this 10 years? Is this six months? Like, how does this play out? You know, it's funny you asked that. I just had some conversations with the Department of Justice attorneys about like, we want to litigate the issue. Let's not play games, you know, and all that. And so they seem amenable, but I would think that we're going to get, we want to get an answer by, from the judge about, you know, our claims. We want to have times to brief it, have a hearing, you know, bring witnesses. So the fall, we should get a ruling, I think sometime in fall. And then neither of us is going to take no for an answer. So like, if we, if the judge says rules against us i'm taking an

appeal i'm already i'm already asking my clients to basically bank money in advance because we'll need an appellate attorney because if the government loses they're not going to accept that i mean there's no chance the government's going to go ah you know what you were right it's not a vaccine we were just kidding really so why won't won't there, is there someone over there who really cares? Do they get support from pharma? Oh dude. Is it corrupt as fuck over there? Oh man.

Oh man. You don't, you don't want me to open that can of worms. You don't want me to. So that is basically what's going on. It's really not you against the United States government, you and your, and your clients. It's you against. An agenda to keep pushing the sale of vaccines. The last two directors of the of the administration, the last the from 2017 to 2019, the guy who ran the FDA was commissioner was a guy named Scott Gottlieb. He now sits on the board of directors for Pfizer.

Oh my goodness. And then FDA to Pfizer. And the guy who, the guy who replaced him was a guy named Steve Hahn. He's the Trump guy, Trump guy. And the Trump guy, Steve Hahn now sits on the board of directors for the company that owns

Moderna. He went, he approved Moderna's, he approved Moderna's vaccine while he was commissioner of the FDA. His agency approved it. And then I think it was 90 days later, he's sitting on the board of directors for the company that owns Moderna. I put it on our filings. I mean, to me, it's so, it's like, at what point do we, it's so obviously wrong. So clearly, you know, the conflict is so blatant and so obvious. I mean, do we have to, what, 90 days is a sufficient cooling off period? I mean, if he had, I'm going to argue anyway, if he had, if it had been the next day, if

he had approved Moderna's, you know, BLA application on Thursday, and then on Friday, he's working for Moderna, wouldn't you say there's something wrong with that? Yeah. Does the fact that there's something wrong with that? Yeah. Does the fact that it's three months later, I mean, Moderna was a $60 million company, then became a $600 million company, then became a, and they've never put out, they've never, they've never had a product.

This is the first product they've ever made. That's ever been licensed. They've never made anything. And by the way, they were a, they were a DARPA funded defense advanced research project agency. They got a bunch of money from DARPA. So, dude, if you want to go down the rabbit hole, it's a lot worse than you think. I'll give you another one. There's this algorithm called BLAST. It's a joint. a joint, it's run under the NIH, I think, but it's a joint government and industry system to track, because now we're manipulating genes, you know, we're down to the level of, yeah, basic local alignment search. So thank you, Caleb. So BLAST, what it allows you to do is check, since we're doing gene modifications now, you have people who get patents for gene modifications. And so how do you know

whether you are infringing on my patent? Well, what Blast does is Blast is this place, it's a repository of all these different gene sequences that people have patented and the tool uses an algorithm to search to see what the odds are that a particular strand of a dna sequence are random or if it was like suppose you and i were both doing working separately in two different companies and you developed a gene patent and i developed a gene patent and we stuck them into the blast system. And then blast looked, it was like, Hey, they match. It would be like, well, okay. Is that a coincidence? And then blast has provides a mathematical output of like what the odds are that that was random. So you're going to love this. Somebody ran the, uh, ran the uh ran the once the virus the covid virus they they ran that that gene sequence through blast and wouldn't you know it popped up a moderna a 19 character strand of the virus matches a 19

character strand from an old patent that moderna has from like 2016 or 17. And the odds of it being random chance, according to blast are one in 3 trillion. Oh, geez. So, oh, geez.

So I don't know, man, you do what you want with that. Who owns blast? No, it's a joint, it's a government system, but I can't believe that they weren't shut down after that the people who who did that the people who did that they can't shut it down it's how it's how people are

researching patents to decide whether there's a patent infringement or not i've got to get a patent attorney that's my next thing is to get a patent attorney to tell me if you had a one in three trillion hit would you would you be willing to sue someone for patent infringement over that? God, that's amazing. Yeah. Hey, um, uh, what about VAERS? Oh, oh yeah. Hey, I'll tell you, I got some great data on that one. I was just writing. So you catch me right in the middle of this, but so, uh, Teresa Long's a Lieutenant Colonel in the army. She's a flight surgeon. She's one of my, she was a witness in one of my cases, and she might even be a plaintiff in this case. But Lieutenant Colonel Teresa Long was an Army – Sorry, one second. For those of you who don't know, VAERS is the Adverse Reporting System. It was developed in 1990. What doctors or anyone is supposed to do is if they have an adverse event after taking a vaccine, you're supposed to report it to the VAERS it is a voluntary place um Harvard did a study on VAERS prior to the COVID vaccine and Harvard decided that adverse events were being

underreported by 90 percent and the reason why the biggest reason why they were being underreported by 90 percent because doctors weren't paid to report um uh the adverse events so they believe the doctors weren't doing it and harvard came out with a study well what's funny is is now they're saying well yeah so it's it's normally underreported let's just say that and now there's been more reports to vaers around the covid vaccine than all other vaccines in the history of fucking mankind yeah that's correct did you see the two two uh basketball player who died last month and then the football player who died yesterday? Yeah.

Hey, I've had people in my family, my cousin, you know, and I don't even ask anymore. I don't want to know. I tell everybody, don't do it. Don't take it. Hey, if they can ask you if you're vaccinated to eat at a restaurant in San Francisco, every single person who dies, we should know whether they were vaccinated or not. I don't want to know anymore, man. I just keep my head i can't the the it's only going to get worse it's only going to get worse i wish it weren't so but before we talk about there do you think they're going to be able to hide it or eventually it's all going to fucking just come out and be like oh shit they poison the

world i don't know i don't know you know it's okay it's one of those how many how many people denial emotional denial again they don't want to get don't know. You know, it's, it's one of those, how many, how many people Denial, emotional denial again, they don't want to get a dose with a thousand hits of acid. I mean, there's a lot and couple that with couple that with how many people who took it, who were just like, oh, it's, it's a fine, you know, trust, trust, trust. How many of those people don't want to know either? You know, there's a lot of people who have a lot of good reasons to like, man, I just don't, you know, so's not. So I don't know. I don't know if the, but I always thought that Greg had a great point that eventually that I thought this was a beautiful analogy that the truth is like a beach ball, you know, and that like, you can hold it underwater, but it takes

an incredible amount of energy, but that ultimately it's, it's going to pop up. I mean, it may not be in my lifetime, but I, I would imagine a hundred years from now, man, this is not going to be looked back on fondly. This is people will not be pointing to this as a we should do it like that again. Yeah. At least if there's going to be the human race is still around. I don't think this will be looked back at as the golden era. No. I don't think that will be the case.

No. But so this I had a bears bears bears so she she did a query in february of uh 2022 because she got curious she's got a you know she's a flight surgeon doctor she's got a master's in public health and all that stuff and her specialty is the defense medical uh database where the dod actually tracks like emergency all the dod hospitals they track all you know everything all the icd9 or whatever codes for people so they have some sense of what's going on in the military medically and that system's been around for about 10 years well she got what's it called again dale uh it's called well it's got two names it's the dmed d-m-e-d

dmed database or dmss or mdss i sorry, but they're both two parts of the same system. Okay. But so Teresa Long did a query. She sent a request to the Centers for Disease Control and asked how many people in the military had died according to VAERS. So how many people in the military did the vaccines kill? And VAERS, the CDC came back, gave her the VAERS report. I got it over here somewhere, but 119 military folks died from the vaccines from the time the vaccine program rolled out, which is roughly September 1st of 2021 to February 11th of 2022. That's not even six months.

So in less than six months, 119 military folks, according to Veyers, died from the shots. Un-fucking-believable. And so then I pulled, I have the declaration from another colonel, the government's expert, Tanya Ranz, uh, in a different case in March of 2022. And she was talking about how deadly this is, how horrible it is. The disease is terrible and why we have to have this vaccine program and blah, blah, blah. And she said, it's so deadly. It killed 31 members of the military, 31 active

duty service members since the start of the pandemic. So from March of 2020 through February, end of February of 2022, which is 23 months, almost two years, the virus killed 31 active duty service members. So in six, less than six months, the vaccine, the solution, the vaccine killed 119. And by the government government so this is all the government's data and the disease i just saw another report this morning for the entire world in regards to that and it's fucking nuts how many people it's it's nuts but go on yes yeah so i look at i'm like imagine if you had a virus that you were like oh it's deadly and it killed 31 people in two years and you're like so we we rolled out a vaccine program that killed four times that many in six months, four times as many in in one one fourth the time.

So in a quarter of the time, we killed four times as many people using the vaccine as the disease we're treating. Hey, hey, it's the exact same thing. If you assume I don't remember if it was 2020 or – that those 12 unarmed black men who were killed by cops, if you were to assume that they were all killed illegally and they were innocent and they did nothing wrong and they did not deserve to be shot at all, if you make that assumption, and then you look what's happened over the next two years to the reaction to that from the public, that and the hostility towards police officers this year there was a 34 increase in homicides on black men so to save those two so we beat down the cops for 12 guys we're not even sure if what they did and now thousands of other black men have died because cops are refusing to engage black men in the streets it's the exact same fucking thing right the the cure the cure kills more people than the fucking problem yeah that's always the way it's always the way hey i how come that's another thing everyone wants to be like hey let's get rid of guns in the united states you guys have a gun problem all the european fucking idiots who live in these countries that are 16 000 square miles and then i say to them okay but what's on the other side of the scale

what's on the nice what what's on the other side of scale so we get rid of guns and what are well no kids will get shot in schools okay cool let's let's assume we can get all guns no kids get shot now what what like no one wants to talk about – even in your most common sense thinking, if you have to administer one billion injections, someone's going to die. A needle is going to break off in them. Someone's going to drop a needle on their foot. Someone's going to – there's going to be a rotten batch somewhere. You can't administer – the truck driver driving the needles is going to die. But more – at least 20 people are going to die just in the making of it they're going to fall into the blender that blends the vet i mean people have to die like there's but no one thinks like this

no one's like thinking about what the great no one is thinking the greater good the upstream the downstream it's because it's not no one but just the people in charge Not no one, but just the people in charge. Ken's like, hey, Ken, how do you know I don't have something? Oh, you got. Oh, that's a good looking. This just this just lives here as a prop. I don't smoke this shit.

Did you grow that yourself? Yeah, I have bags and bags of it around. Oh, I need to send it to someone who wants me to mail this shit to them. I do. Can I put my hand up? Oh, that's some great great looking buds did you do that outside or inside outside it's like three years old i remember you gave me a bag of weed one time and i was like i could like how do you have a bag of weed you had like you had that jar and you were like oh it's all dried and shit you had a jar of it and i was like this could last me the rest of my life. Right, right. Of course, it only lasted like six months.

I was in the Army when it first started and worked directly with the new trainees that came into basic training and were diagnosed with COVID. And from there, I could see that it wasn't as bad as they said. Yeah, of course. Of course. It's what my Italian friends in the neighborhoods i grew up in used to say it's fugazi it's fugazi it's all fugazi it's all fake man so what do they say about the vers report 119 guys dead um we'll see that's in my filing we'll see what happens it's in the motion i'm writing right now i just highlighted highlighted it. I'm going to file that probably today, tomorrow.

I got to get back to writing. How did Jacobson justify in 1905 the original forcing? Well, it's interesting. They didn't say, you know, what's really funny about it was the procedural posture of the case was not that they said they could actually force you. That's the interesting thing. They didn't say you could force. They just said that he's going gonna have to pay the five bucks because he so if you don't take the vaccine in 1905 and you're in the military oh so you could opt out if you paid the fine yeah so that you were you

were gonna pay the five bucks he actually refused to so he was in what happened was he refused to pay the fine so they threw him in the clink but he did it on purpose because he wanted to challenge the the whole program and so ultimately they said you're gonna have to pay the fine. So they threw him in the clink, but he did it on purpose because he wanted to challenge the whole program. And so ultimately they said, you're going to have to pay the five bucks. And so it's interesting. They never, the DOD, it's only a recent thing that the DOD has taken the position that, Hey, we can hold you down and stick you if we want to. Here's what it is. The department of defense takes the position that if we're now in the, you know, the bio chem, bio warfare, the the dod thinks the battle space is your immune system and they own the battle space and so they they believe they

they'll they can hold you down inject you with whatever they want they really think that your property you're just u.s government property yeah that's their that's their view of the world that's their man and and and are the soldiers property u.s property no not at all not in a volunteer military they're not hey i hope sebi whether i win or lose if i do nothing else i'm kind of at the point where i'm like if if this breaks the military and i think it might i think it i think this might be we might be watching the end of the the u.s military's dominance and maybe we already did maybe afghanistan the afghan withdrawal was the writing on the wall and nobody just wants to acknowledge it but u.s military

superiority like that's we've lived under that and been comfortable with that and people have you know gotten used to that like the u.s is the world's superpower you know that that may not be the case anymore. I don't think people realize, and I've even said this to some of the attorneys on the other side, they think the military is all the regulations and all the orders and all of that stuff. They think that's what the military is.

Reification, is that our word? That's reification, man. Reification, reification. They think that's the military and they don't understand it's the relationships and the trust and the it's the being able to depend on the other guy, you know, all that stuff. And so it's it's almost nothing to do. The brick and mortar of the military is the trust that exists laterally and then vertically. And the vertical trust has been destroyed.

It's been destroyed. I got people I got a client who's a, you know, imagine this, the guy's an F-35 pilot, you know, the most high end, he was selected to be a squadron commander. I mean, one of the best of the best, you know, F-35 pilot, that guy has always been very religious. He said, Hey, I can't take this. You know, I'm a religious guy. They took his squadron away. They put, he's sitting around, he's not flying. They grounded him. You know, most of my pilot friends, I told them this and my clients, I told them as soon as they said they weren't going to take it i go you understand the first thing they'll do is they'll go after what you love that's that's how they get people

to cave that's how they got as many people in the military to cave as they were this was wildly unpopular wildly unpopular is the u.s military unable to fight right now uh no well it depends on what you mean by fight you know is it compromised is it compromised right now sure yes absolutely no question no question they're not meeting recruiting goals i see things i mean i don't want to share too much because i got like you know i've got confidential stuff and i got attorney class privilege but let's just say this people know who i am and so things appear in my inbox yes yes people mail me things i got a letter and it was like unmarked and i

opened it up and it was you know one of those like ted kaczynski letters but you open it up and it's got you should check this look at that look at i mean i get stuff that you know i get that on a much smaller scale everyone the employees of crossfit inc are always sending me stuff. I like it. Not the U.S. government, but the employees at CrossFit Inc. Dale, when you were general counsel, is that when the NSCA case started? Or was it after that? I wrote that complaint. Yeah. Man, we got to do a whole show on that.

Yeah, that's a fascinating one. Do you know what happened there i know they sealed the case but do you know that was you know and i i wish i did i mean i have a pretty good theory let's say based on all that i know about the case and even the stuff that wasn't reported you know i know a lot i mean i followed that since i initially filed it um given everything that i know i got a pretty good idea of why that all went the way it went but and why why it's sealed and the affiliates can't be told what what happened in there yeah i mean look the fact that it's sealed and the affiliates can't be told how

to tell you everything you need to know about what's in there there was a there was a there was a you know the obviously the crossfit journal and g, the first three years it was out, Greg wrote everything in it. And then Mike Workington, who we both love and fucking respect the shit out of, he put together a list of 30 must-read articles that Greg Glassman wrote. And I was thinking about when Eric Rosa took office and he was in a meeting and someone used the term GPP and he didn't know what it meant. And I was tripping the other day. I was like, what were we even, what was any affiliate or anyone thinking that you had Greg Glassman, the guy who invented fucking CrossFit and you replace running the company, the vision, the direction, all that. And then you replaced him with a dude who does. And I wondered,

do you think like how he would probably have to read those articles um uh all 30 of them every single day for a month to get to the five yard line of where greg is and then but but i bet you the current ceo doesn't even know those 30 articles exist i was i'm just tripping on how anyone is still on that boat oh that boat's sinking hey speaking of which i thought dave was going to be the new ceo i mean if they're smart if they're smart they either make him or nicole the ceo it's looking more and more just i'm just tripping i'm tripping so hard that anyone with the brain thought that eric rosa could run that company it's it's like it's like i'm having an f-35 it's like having me

try to fly uh an f-. I just have no business. I have no business. Maybe, except did you ever think, it's only because you have the thought in your head, you have the paradigm that the people who bought it wanted to succeed. Well, right. And it is, it does look, yes, yeah. I mean, you know, maybe that was whatever the price, whatever the asking price was. Maybe that was just the money to let CrossFit float into an iceberg.

Of course. And whether that's true or not, it's a very logical. It's a workable model. Yeah, if you like algebra and you like balanced equations, and if you have $200 million on this side, you might as well put $200 million on this side. And, yeah, I know. and you like balance equations and if you have 200 million on this side you might as well put 200 million on this side and yeah it's i know uh dale i gotta have you back on again i didn't even get to any i took so much i'm sorry i took up all your time man take up all my time this show is gonna be huge i love you i need to have you on as a regular you're you're the best man i love you i do it anytime you want any subject man you know. You know me. I love to talk about anything.

Caleb, thank you. Caleb, peace, brother. Hey, did you get forced? Did you take it? Yeah. Did you get the shortness of breath afterwards? No, I had no problems with it afterwards. He's not allowed to say because if you say – Yeah, that's right.

Guys in the military DM me all the time, and they're like, if you say something's wrong with you, you lose your position. Like if you say like – Yeah. Most of my class lost their jobs. So they were pilots. I mean butchers, bakers, candlestick makers. Yeah.

All right, brother. Thank you, Dale. I will – I'll stay close contact with you. We'll talk soon. Yeah. Thanks, Cade. Appreciate it, Matt, everybody. You guys are great.

Bye. Later. Later. Damn, that dude is smart. Definitely. I got to head back to work, actually. Oh, well, thank you. No problem.

Good show. Good dude. All right. Bye. See you. Hour and 49 minutes, guys. Great show with Dale Saran, former general counsel of crossfit inc hardcore crossfitter we didn't even get into any of his crazy crossfit numbers homeboy's got some skills

uh and uh he's not he's no spring chicken anymore uh tomorrow it says tomorrow at 7 a.m i have a live call-in show can that be true that would be awesome i need to get Yevgeny back on. Then Sunday at 7 a.m. I have the Hiller Fit Review Show. That's where I look at all his videos from the week. And I beat up on Mr. Andrew Hiller and talk shit to him about, hey, you said this, you said this. I got some great shit talking to do videos from the week. And I beat up on Mr. Andrew Hiller and talk shit to him about, hey, you said this. You said this. I got some great shit talking to do to Andrew this week.

And the humble Mr. Hiller, the human tornado, always is fun in his responses. Okay, so the next two days are fun. We have a live call-in show. I can't believe I have a live call-in show tomorrow. Those are my favorite. I wonder who I should have on, if I should invite someone on. I've been missing Rich Froning. I wonder if he'll come on for a few minutes grace me with his presence all right guys thank you uh bruce wayne you boss uh what's her name se, you were great today.

Thanks for all the interaction. Kenneth Dunlop, Mr. Rich Holton. Thanks for being part of my mom joke. Matt Burns, Heidi, always. Please check out the Fake 7 podcast, even though Heidi's getting soft. Victoria Stump. Thank you very much. Seema Vizola.

Seema. Let's just call it Seema. stump thank you very much uh sima visual visual sima well this is called sima uh who else is in here in the comments uh jessica pearson always good to see you girl eric wise thanks guys okay i'll see you guys tomorrow at 7 a.m um love someone hug someone accept someone learn something new today uh our only value as human beings is our ability to help our fellow man regardless of who what they are spread the love smile someone today love you guys bye