The Sevan Podcast - #487 - Who's on PEDs?

Episode Date: July 12, 2022

Brian Friend joins us to help navigate the flood of people testing positive for banned substances following the CrossFit Semifinals. Tests are coming back from the last weeks of semifinals, but an official list has not been released from the CrossFit Games team. Sign up for our email: https://thesevanpodcast.com/ ------------------------- Partners: https://www.paperstcoffee.com/ - THE COFFEE I DRINK! https://www.cahormones.com/ - CODE: SEVAN for a FREE consultation https://thesevanpodcast.com/ - OUR WEBSITE Support the show Partners: https://cahormones.com/ - CODE "SEVAN" FOR FREE CONSULTATION https://www.paperstcoffee.com/ - THE COFFEE I DRINK! https://asrx.com/collections/the-real... - OUR TSHIRTS ... Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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Let's go seize the night. That's the powerful backing of American Express. Visit amex.ca slash yamex. Benefits vary by card. Other conditions apply. Bam, we're live. Is there a C on, Brian? Yeah, I can turn it off if you want me to.

Uh, yeah. I was thinking about it anyway. Let me go turn it off. Okay. Susan, what's up? Good morning. Good morning, man. I called the about it anyway. Let me go turn it off. Okay. Susan, what's up? Good morning. Good morning, man. I called the audible this morning.

I saw that. It's not, the thing is, it's kind of like my least favorite subject. I was looking forward to some good rants this morning, but in due time. I know. My notes are so awesome. i was kind of peeking at him earlier when you had sent him over i'm tripping on the um i'm tripping on how much the right is being manipulated to attack joe biden it's funny now all of a sudden he's a bad guy but i brian um this is my least favorite topic good morning good morning hi um you know

why this is my least you know i had i was thinking yesterday do you know why all the steroid shows are so popular like do you know why hillar had 600 people on uh live like when i go live i get 30 people on you know why he had 600 i can't acknowledge that he's better than me or harder working or cuter or smarter. Never. You know why he had 600? Because those are all the people who want to do steroids. I came up with this theory yesterday. Everybody, everybody wants to do performance enhancing drugs.

There's levels to your commitment. But everybody wants to do them. My mom wants to do them. Your mom wants to do them. Everyone wants to do them. My mom wants to do them. Your mom wants to do them. Everyone wants to do them. The people who hate them, the people who talk shit about them, everyone wants to get juiced up and feels like what it is to be Superman or super woman. There's just these crazy levels of, uh, of ability to acknowledge it, to be attracted to it. And those shows are so popular because everyone wants to get on it.

Yeah, yeah, here it is. We all want to be jacked. Yeah, we all want to be jacked. It's the ultimate, as I get more and more into learning about testosterone replacement therapy with our work with California Hormones, it sounds like it's the ultimate antidepressant

with no side effects. No side effects? I mean, maybe the people who are getting super juice but just to elevate your testosterone levels a little bit i mean no negatives i haven't heard any negative side effects from uh getting on a little bit of the juicy juicy i was surprised how many people i know that were actually taking it unless yeah they started talking about it they're like i've been on that yeah but i feel great yeah what are you have you ever taken testosterone brian susan how many of those small little cups do you have lined up there oh dude i bought a pack of 300 off amazon for like four bucks

no i've not taken any testosterone someone but but do you see what i'm saying about how everyone wants to be like that's why those shows are so popular it's under the guise of maybe half the people are there are there to damn you know phil toon to judge him but the other half are just like i wonder i want to learn a little bit and get juiced up yeah everybody has gone and looked at purchasing it before why wouldn't you want to be a better version of yourself yeah and if you're saying you haven't gone on there and checked them out at least scope the interwebs to see what's available, you are lying. I feel so naive. Is everyone on them, Brian?

I feel so naive, too. I feel like – This guy tells me I can throw discs farther if I start using PEDs. Now I'm interested. The only negative thing I've heard is that you can't have kids, which would suck. Some people would say no, and some people might disagree. people might disagree my mom's in denial look at seven's mom does not want yes yeah you do yeah you do i don't believe you i don't believe i don't believe anyone anymore everyone wants to judge you stop why not why not why why not what are you scared why not why haven't you done it brian why haven't you done it

i don't know i haven't uh i guess i haven't been pursuing any of that that degree of athletic career yeah it but but it's not because like it's not because you think you're going to go to hell if you do it oh no i've i'm sure i've crossed that line a couple times how uh my notes are worthless today because i have my life calling notes all right on the back um i i saw the morning chalk up um you you went on yesterday with uh the calise uh lauren calil and you went on with justin lefranco and i think the title of the piece was uh 13 athletes can we pull up brian's um instagram do you care if we look at your story for a second uh, Lauren Khalil and you went on with Justin LaFranco. And I think the title of the piece was, uh, 13 athletes.

Can we pull up Brian's Instagram? Do you care if we look at your story for a second, Brian? No, it probably very relevant. Okay. Can we go through every single person, um,

today? Just even give like a note. Do we have the list of the names of all the people who popped? Yeah. Do you feel bad for them? And I know this, I know this is a factual show who gives a fuck about feelings, but do you feel bad for them and i know this i know this is a factual show who gives a fuck about feelings but do you feel bad for them uh i feel horrible no but do you feel bad for the

people who have failed their drug test yeah i feel horrible why is that because i know that they probably have like a huge pit in their stomach they're all they're all tore up i know people don't like that they're like i know i had hunter on and my dms filled up with hunter schooled your shit that like hunter's perspective is is they're fucking cheaters i and i get it i mean i i'm i don't think hunter mcintyre yeah i don't think he's schooled me i agree i agree they're fucking cheaters too but still it doesn't mean i don't feel bad say that again brian well hunter williams is one of the athletes who's failed the drug test let me just throw another name let me just throw let's play a game let's

play a game i'm gonna throw a name out there and you tell me if that one if someone popped pedro do we have a pedro in the house do we have a pedro pop hey we should do we should just bring up that list and you when you were having everybody say hey are they gonna be lower or higher on the leaderboard? Now we change it. Have they popped or have they not? Yes, yes, yes. Still in the contention or no? Brian, this is a fucked up question.

I'm sorry. Hey, you know, I know what I'm doing coming on here. Okay. Okay. How many have taken supplements that are not legal according to the rules of the CrossFit Games that haven't been caught? Impossible to know because they only test a certain percentage of the athletes. Even within the team division, in most cases, they only test two of the four athletes. And, you know, everyone who's done any amount of research knows that there are ways to take those supplements and then take masking agents that'll prevent you from popping on a test anyway.

So it's always going to, that will always be a mystery. The California Hormone Games are getting stacked, Sevan. Have you sent invitations out yet? No, we with tourism i know it's getting interesting right are the california hormones games the same as the major competition in brazil that's going on in a couple weeks in which there's no drug testing oh is there what's that one called i'm not exactly sure what it's called but i've heard people refer to it as the equivalent of guadalupalooza for south america so just wadapalooza doesn't do any testing but but i guess the games will send their testers there to nab you there's there is testing that happens at wadapalooza it's i'm not sure if it's um random by crossfit or if it's affiliated with but it's not thorough or there's

not a like guarantee if you finish within these placements. Actually, that might not be true. They may test the podium. I'm not 100% sure about who all gets tested at Guadalupe, but there is some level of drug testing that happens there. Maybe there's someone listening who knows more than me about that. But Phil Toon competed at Guadalupe. He took sixth place there, and I don't think he was drug tested there. Carlos Romero is as bold as to call it Juicypalooza. Hey, maybe that should be the name of the California games,

hormone games, Juicypalooza. It's nuts. It is. I'm just struggling with my own naiveness. Are you naive to it, you think, Brian? Yeah, I kind of intentionally am. Yeah, maybe that's what it is too. And why?

Because we don't want the guys we like to be cheaters? That's good. No, just the same thing that you said at the start of the show is I don't like doing these shows. I don't want this to be the focus of the thing that we're talking about. But when you're approaching, I think now there's up to nine or ten in the last 48 hours that I've become aware of. That's a pretty staggering number, and it's hard to ignore. On one hand, you have to really compliment CrossFit. You have to be like, holy shit, they're really doing their jobs.

They're weeding these guys out. And all we've asked for is fair competition, honest and open competition. And this appears to be fucking doing it, right? It's like a comb that you put through your hair when you have lice, it's like those really tight tight bristles and it pulls the lice out that's what they're doing right now right they're pulling the lice out on the on the other hand even a better analogy because you always miss some in the first pass through right i thought you were gonna make fun of me sorry Sorry, seven. I've never had lights. Um, and then, uh, but on the other hand, we are so many of us are disappointed.

We're not going to get to like see Phil tune go. Like, couldn't they just have like a bunch of lanes? Um, couldn't they just have a bunch of like, uh, they, they make them all wear special shirts.

I'm a cheater, but we still get to see him go out on the floor and compete. Like they have their own, like five lanes off to the left, the cheaters lanes. I mean, we want to see Phil compete, right? Don't we want to see him go? I mean, he's like the remote control car in your, we want to see him go. Yeah.

I mean, there's definitely a, uh, you know, there's a, there's a group of athletes. I mean, look, like I said, there's been maybe 10, uh, in the last 48 hours alone. And Phil tunes, the one that stands out, right? Because most people of that group of 10 athletes, they were most excited to see him. He was the most recognizable or he had done the best in other competitions, namely in Guadalupalooza, you know, and we've been kind of looking at him since last year. We had him on, you know, maybe 12 to 14 months ago. He was, you know, and seems 14 months ago he was you know and uh

seems to be a very likable guy hard-working guy he was in with a good coach and camp down there in naples so everything was trending in the right direction for him he did very well at semifinals going toe-to-toe with perennial podium contender and fukowski so yeah you know his stock was really high and people were excited to see him um whereas most of the others who have failed are either team athletes or just uh you know more out of nowhere games qualifiers that have don't have maybe the track record that he did in the last 12 months uh john that's that'll be 20 burpees for you how dare you please please refrain um okay i want to start really big picture. Where are we at? Where we are in the season is in terms of the sport. Everyone's been told they can come, but the drug tests haven't come in and athletes are coming out ahead of time before CrossFit makes an announcement.

Can you paint that picture like where we're at in the season? What, what, what, what the fuck is going on right now? Yeah. I mean, I think that this is one of the most, uh, probably frustrating parts of this process for everyone who's involved in it from the, you know, the, the athletes, their families, coaches, uh, and obviously to even to even in CrossFit's perspective. And then of course, for the fans, is just the delay between when competitions end and when we find out meaningful results associated with them. So it started with the quarterfinals, which took 39 days to finalize rosters after the end of quarterfinals, which I think is excessive and unnecessary. And especially in the context of

all those people I mentioned that are trying to make plans for the next stage of the season, which is semifinals, which most people have to make travel plans, hotels, planes, if their coaches are going to come, families are going to come, if they have to get time off of work, if they have to get sitters for their kids or whatever it is, the longer, the less amount of time between the end of, or when you find out where you're going to be for semifinals and when you have to go there and compete is more inconvenient for everyone involved and now we're on the in a similar situation here with um the time frame from semifinals to the games where you know the first semifinal week ended on may 22nd and the last one ended on june 12th but right now we're in july 12th and we're just now finding out about Nasser. I believe is the guy from Asia that's failed his drug test,

which we can get to later on. Holy shit. He failed too. Yeah. And when did that come out? Sorry. When did that come out? It's not,

it has not come out that Nasser has failed his drug test yet. I just believe that that's the case. Arthur Seminoff, who is third place in Asia posted on his instagram this morning that he did receive an invite to the crossfit games from oh so it's either why you might not roman it's either roman or nasser because of the people i've been in contact with i have not heard from nasser or any of his team directly but i've heard from some people multiple people that have said that's likely the one it is and i've heard from multiple people that said roman has not received

anything from crossfit his beard looks like it is. And I've heard from multiple people that said Roman has not received anything from CrossFit. His beard looks like it's undone. And here's the thing that people should understand. When an athlete, my understanding, when an athlete passes a drug test, has a negative drug test, CrossFit doesn't notify them of that. When they get a positive, they do. And so we can reach out to Roman.

He said, I haven't gotten anything from CrossFit yet, but that doesn't mean necessarily good or bad. However, if they've already extended an invite to Arthur, then we can assume that they've notified the person that's not being invited that they failed the drug test. I mean, if they're not doing it in that order, then that I would say is pretty poor order of operations on CrossFit's end. Anyway, the point being that competition ended on June 5th and we're

a month and a week later than that now. And we're just now finding this information. So on the one hand, you have Nasser and his whole family who maybe have been planning to come to the United States, getting visas in line, organizing everything from their end. And this is not CrossFit's fault though. Well, hold on. This is Nasser's fault. Well, if it's true, right? Well, of course, of course there's a, there's a blame hold on. This is Nassar's fault. Well, if it's true, right? Well, of course. Of course, there's a blame on the athlete that's taking the PEDs. The question that I want to ask is, you know, from a timeline perspective, has CrossFit set up the season to be successful in this regard? Because if Nassar's just now finding out that he's failed the drug test, that means that Arthur is now just finding out that he's eligible for the games.

But Arthur has already done the last chance qualifier. And that's, this is the case for other athletes as well. And he's, you know, he's in Russia. I don't know how easy it is to get from Russia to the United States for, for, you know, just anyone who wants to come here. I don't know what his financial situation is. I don't know what his, you know, training has necessarily been like, or if he has any other competitions he was planning for or anything like that so it's a it's a fairly tight timeline he has a month now i guess to figure that out oh look at that body um brian brian i i hate the thought of suggesting though that this is in any way crossfit's fault like i don't think that they should they should make a timeline for the season to accommodate um a backfill well then they should i agree with you they should accommodate the

athletes i agree with you some of the stuff you've said about semi-finals and smooshing it in but the backfill and the cheater shit is like no no but every year there's people who fail their drug tests right so you know we've talked before about potential different timelines for semifinals. So let's just say, for example, that they were quicker on the turnaround from quarterfinals to semifinals. The semifinals weeks were the two middle weeks of May and that they would tell athletes, Hey, you know, from week, well, let's just say week, there were only two semifinals and week one was going to be, you know, three weeks later from now, you'll get an email either confirming that you've passed your drug test or not. And then after that three weeks, everyone knows, yes, all the athletes from week one are in except for this person, this person, and this team.

You know, whatever. And it's done. And then one week later, we'll get the results for week two. And then we can move forward. Because right now, it's getting so close to the games. We still don't know what's going on in many of these cases that we're going to get to later. And so for, you know, people that are trying to, even people that work for CrossFit that are trying to prepare relevant stats,

data packages, information, headshots of teams and athletes that are competing there, like we were doing all this work and then we have to go and redo the work and reorganize it. You know, we, I've, I've like done this, um, work with six experts in the space to do a composite power rankings of all the male and female athletes in the field. And now we have to go back and rework that, that article. And it's like, you know, so all of these things are, you know, they're, they're kind of fallouts of that. And so it's just begging the question, is there potentially a way to set ourselves up better knowing that this is going to happen?

Well, not if there's people like me and you who are naive about the people popping. Hunter McIntyre just commented in the comments, this sounds like a Conspiracy 3 podcast. Yesterday, Hunter's been telling me about the juicy, juicy, the juicy, juicy that goes on in CrossFit for a while. And yesterday, he sent me a tub of Vaseline to get me ready for our next show I didn't appreciate some rubber gloves I didn't appreciate that uh yeah did the last chance qualifier people were they tested Brian so in theory all of the last chance qualifiers would have been tested at their semiifinal. The semifinals that I went to, the athletes were briefed at the opening briefing by the competition director. For example, in North American Europe, where they have five qualifiers, they test down to the eighth spot.

And for teams, they would test down to the seventh spot. So they were projecting this forward. However, in some of the continents that are not the United States and Europe, I'm not sure if they tested all of the last chance qualifier spots or not. I've heard conflicting information that that has not happened in South America and Africa, at least. Is this a lot of people who've tested positive this year is this more than normal it's it seems like a lot and that's and especially yesterday when you know so many were coming in all at once but i did um find out that in 2018 there were 17 either team athletes or individual athletes from regional regionals who failed the drug test and so basically we're approaching that number so no it's not necessarily that out of the ordinary okay um but yeah is the media covering it more

is it better media now is that what's going on it's either you could say better or just a different style of media like there's there's a let's go with better let's go with better there's definitely seems to be a higher level of scrutiny from the media about everything. And therefore things like this become more obvious or well-known. It's more into the microscope. I got a question, Brian. Who do you think they're intentionally, if they're intentionally not testing anybody? I hate this fucking question. If we were to see the, like a, like a behemoth fall or something like that.

Like what if one of the bigger named athletes. He's saying, are they protecting anyone? Are they protecting F fukowski i have no idea here here's the here's the thing here all i was so close to the games and i i i would fucking bet i'd bet fucking all everything i own um that adrian and curtis bowler would never ever in a million years fucking do that and that it's actually quite the opposite that the mood there when Dave was there was to catch people. That being said, I'm hearing some crazy shit about some shit that's happened in the United

States this year with, with, with some of the teams. And unfortunately there, it does sound like that. There's some people not on the games team, but some people at HQ that may have been involved in some of the shenanigans. But they're not on the games team.

It is not people on the games team. I want to be super clear about that. And we are trying to get to the bottom of that. Yeah, and you're also referring to a time when there was accountability when Dave was at the helm of it. Like we've seen this crumble since he's left. So, you know, has that changed anything internally there with the interaction between crossfit games and in the athletes speculation speculation maybe but those guys curtis bowler and adrian bosman are not um nice people they are thorough people like those

are thorough those aren't like those are just thorough motherfuckers like like sticklers like curtis bowler is not a uh you know what i mean like you don't graduate to overhead squats in his gym until you master the pvc same with adrian like these guys these are a fucking uh i mean who smiles more curtis or jr howell good question curtis doesn't even own a smile he doesn't he has to borrow check it out from the library yeah i mean these are i i just um i i hate to i hate to speculate on that kenya says jr yeah curtis um i have you have you guys heard anything we received the reason why and i'll tell you what we received because i hate to be ambiguous we received an an email from someone who painted out a whole cover-up to us that's going on for a particular games athlete.

And I'm trying to get to the bottom of it before – it's a team athlete. Sorry, a team athlete. Yeah, I don't know much about that. Okay. Anyone else before we start? I want to start going down the list. There's some things that are really weird. The South Africa thing really just boggles my mind, what's going on over there with that girl.

But is there anyone else besides Arthur that's breaking or have any other invites been put out that we know about where we don't know who's been accused or who's getting pulled out, but we know there's been a backfill? No. So in terms of the individuals, Austin Spencer did receive his invite from CrossFit this week. So he's in in place of Joyal. As far as I know, Nick Matthew has not been contacted yet. Who would be in line for the backfill from Phil Toon? As far as I know, Augustine Raquelme has not been contacted yet who would be in line for the backfill from Phil Toon. As far as I know,

Augustine Raquelme has not been contacted yet. He would be in line for the backfill for Pedro Martins. But those things are kind of weird in the context of we know who's failed the drug test and the next in lines have not received invites. But in Asia, we know the next in line has received invites, but we haven't seen anything confirming the person who's failed. The reason that that is, is because CrossFit hasn't announced any of these. It's just the athletes have chosen to announce it. So Pedro Martins addressed it. Phil Toon addressed it. And then Arthur addressed it. And Joyelle.

And Joyelle addressed it. Anyone else? That's a good question from Wes Colbert. And I'm hoping to find that out. I have a thought about that, but I'm not 100% sure that they may have been doing blood testing this year at semifinals. I just don't know if they've done that in the past or not. So I'm hoping that CrossFit will have an opportunity to answer that at some point. Sorry.

What are the implications of what Ethan's saying here? I saw a proven post thatthews is going what nick matthew has said that he if he gets his backfill he will go i just don't know for sure that he's received the backfill invite yet let's say he has i saw proven posted nick matthews is going can you go to proven suza and see let's say he is what would what would then that allow us to speculate that some would make you see from him? Phil Toon. He would be replacing Phil Toon. Okay.

Okay. Okay. Yeah. This is like once again resurfacing another bad issue, though. Nick Matthew has been, he's kind of like Austin Spencer in this regard. He's been fighting for this game spot for a long time. He's been close multiple times. Last year he missed by a couple points to Mertens. This year, he missed by a couple points as well. He was fourth place in the last chance qualifier, which is obviously very

good. But lurking a few points behind him on that leaderboard is Matt DeLugos. And everyone already knows about the grievance that DeLugos and his team has with the pull-up bar height. And just now he's only four points away from Matthew, and it's even looking more like, oh, man, if that pull-up bar was just a little bit higher, would Matt be getting this back, Phil? Wow. When we look at Nick Matthews here and we see a congratulations,

does that mean that Phil Toon has passed on having his B sample tested? Congratulations. Does that mean that Phil Toon has passed on having his B sample tested? Even so, my understanding here, and again, I wish we had something from CrossFit to confirm this stuff. But my understanding is that even if the B sample is being tested, he won't be eligible to compete at the games. And we don't really. Is there anything that we're upset at CrossFit about for not being transparent with us? What if their reasoning is like, hey, what they're doing is they're being transparent with who needs to be transparent with, meaning the people who popped and the people who are going to be backfilling, and they do this in the fastest way possible, and they let them leak it at their own pace? I mean is there any – is that bad for us, or are we just crybabies because we're the last to kiss the girl? We're the last to know. No, I mean, that's kind of the MO, right?

We've talked about it before with master's workouts where someone asked CrossFit privately, hey, it says I may do this exercise. Does that mean I have to do this exercise? And CrossFit chose to respond to them privately instead of addressing the matter on a large scale. CrossFit chose to respond to them privately instead of addressing the matter on a large scale. And so again, here, while they're communicating these things individually, that's not inappropriate. But when it's now, you know, what I'm just seeing is so many, there's so many so fast coming out that people are getting angry, they're getting frustrated. So I just think that at the very least CrossFit might want to say like, hey, we understand that there's a lot of these that are coming out right now. This is our process and we will communicate to you the final list when, you know, so that

people, so we're not just in the dark, like right now there's just like speculation and curiosity. And there's a lot of people that just aren't as aware as you and I are about what's going on and what the process is that are probably unjustifiably. So getting angry or frustrated or accusatory, but if CrossFit just came out and said something to that effect of, you know, we're on top of it, we will release a list with all of this stuff when it's finalized. Oh,

okay. They don't have to tell us anything, but it'd be cool if we could get a date for when. Yeah. Just to check in and say, Hey, we'll put something out. We have to wait for the appeals process to finalize.

And we want to publish all of these at once. Just, you know, checking with the community, that, and put the minds at ease. What if they made a post on the game's Instagram and says, don't worry, your favorite athlete might still be going to the game? Well, it'd be super weird. I mean, it's super weird what's going on on their Instagram. They had a very focused thing on Nassar on there, and that's been removed.

Oh, that's not cool. And they also had a V a thing that was celebrating all the Brazilians that are going to, it was posted a couple of days ago, which now are not. And that's still up there. I liked your post on that, Brian. Uh, I was just, yeah. That's they should leave that stuff. I want to say something a little off subject here, but, but I promise I'll tie it in.

Those of you who interchange the word sex and gender, it's like interchanging the word boogeyman and God. It's two totally different things. And those of you who are interchanging it are just part of the problem. And I mean this in all sincerity and kindness. You're fucking morons. What does this have to do with anything? I'm going to tie it in. I'm going to tie it in. You're fucking morons.

Yesterday, my kids were watching a show on on lizards and the guy you know like david attenborough he's never like the gender of this lizard is no he's like this lizard sex is a male and that's why he has that that plume hanging from his throat this sex is if the sex of this lizard is a lizard is a female you never hear anyone in biology or talking about the animal kingdom using gender. Never, ever, ever. That being said, I want to be very clear when I ask this question. Why is it that the sex of most of these people popping are males? Well, that's not necessarily true.

Okay, great. Even better. That's even a better answer. I mean, on the female side of things we've had uh i think three confirmed team athletes so it is still more men than women but you know that if there are more men than women it probably just speaks to the thing that i've always said about men and women is just there's more competition and the depth of the field on the men's side is is more difficult and therefore you know the margins

are smaller and it's more tempting to maybe do it fair i like that analysis and in in in this country i don't know if it is in other countries men's car insurance between the age of 16 and i think 25 is higher than women's yep statistically they crash more dude dumb shit it's isn't that weird that that you can be openly sexist like that i approve of that too by the way i totally approve of that uh and so and so there might also be that that too the psychological component that men are willing to take more more risks with that and then it may i wonder if it's more obvious when women take performance enhancing drugs than it is with men like like women start to grow a mustache or something.

Competing with the beard this year. Brian, is Phil Toon the biggest star in the history of CrossFit who's ever popped? Is there anyone? I mean, of course, it's still Ricky because of what he did. Oh, right. Third place, too. Yeah. And then, you know, there are some others like Sean Ramirez, who is three-time games champion in the Masters Division

before he failed the drug test that I would say is probably unfair to say that Phil Toon is a smaller star than him. It's just that there's more spotlight on the individuals, and especially this year, it's been a really popular sport, I think, coming out of a couple of years where we didn't get to see a lot of athletes. And, uh, who's the biggest woman to ever pop?

Are there, I can't think of any big names. Uh, I mean, I don't know. I think Ellie from Ellie from mayhem. Yeah. Whatever.

Maybe that Laurie Kuhn highlight last year, depending on what part of the world you're from was a pretty big letdown. I would say, obviously she proved us, uh, contaminated supplement, but has anyone gotten off? Has anyone ever said, wasn't me and cross it's like yeah you're right it wasn't you contaminated supplement has been proved but this you still get a two-year ban for

that okay so if if you put every single person who's gotten that email from crossfit oh yes thank you emily abbott's probably is. She might be the biggest name, period. Like I said, depends where you're from. I definitely liked her excuse the most. What? Where was I going with this? So if you get the email, you're toast the across it's bat and and and whoever they use for the drug testing is batting 100 no one's ever been like oh wait a minute because

and the reason why i bring this up is i want to go straight into africa because that's the most interesting one for me um oh here we go here we go because you just don't know enough about south america oh okay austin hey what's up, brother? Not much. How's it going? Good. Good. Congratulations. We wanted to bring you on the show this morning just to, just to see how real this story is because as we report on it, it's always just feels like it's so ambiguous and surreal. So you're going to the CrossFit games. I am. Yeah. I got my email yesterday. And how do you know, how do you know that you, you got the email? You And how do you know that? You got the email. You're sure it's not like some sort of scam trying to fish for your credit card number or something?

Well, either way, I paid them, so somebody got money. Do you have to pay something to go to the CrossFit Games? Is there a registration fee? Yeah, there's a registration fee. How much is that? Like $300. No shit. Okay.

Yeah. So it's not free swag. When they say you get free swag, that's shit you paid for. Yeah, you pay for pretty much all of it. You pay for that, Noble. Can you tell us what the letter is? Does it mention why you went, or does it use the word backfill, or do they throw some Joyal under the bus, or what happens?

No, it was very straightforward. All it said was, congrats on your performance at Atlas Games. You've earned a spot for the CrossFit Games, blah, blah, blah, all that kind of stuff. So there wasn't any like extra information or reasons or anything like that. And before you get that, do you know that you're going to be contacted? Like does someone call you and be like, hey, check your inbox or is just, it's there? I got a text like after like all that information was kind of out on social media. I got a text from a guy from across the game staff.

Um, and then, uh, he ended up like I texted him back and he called me that night and basically told me without telling me that I was, that I should be going. Like he's like, book your travel, you know, maybe keep training, stuff like that. told me without telling me that I was, that I should be going. Like, he's like book your travel, you know, maybe keep training, stuff like that. I can't say anything official, but, but just be ready. That's all I needed to hear. Yeah. Brian, I like this. Yeah. Well, that's what you were talking about earlier is that they informed

those that need to know. Yeah. Yeah. And then do they also tell you, hey, let's not talk about it publicly yet. Can you please not talk about it publicly? Yeah. He basically just said like, don't make any like big posts or anything about that until you get the official invite

just in case, you know, something goes wrong. So then of course, like the next couple of days, I was like having dreams that I wasn't going to get to go and just random stuff that might change. So I definitely still needed that email just to like ease my own nerves. But it was enough to like, you know, get things booked and squared away and and have my coaches help me with my programming and training again. So you did the last chance qualifier. Yeah. Does, does that, is any part of you bitter or are you like, no, shut up,

Sevan, who cares? I'm going. Or is any party like, no, that's because I had to do that. I'm not better at all. Honestly, like in a way, the last chance qualifier was a blessing because I kept training after Atlas games. Um, so if I hadn't done that and then I was invited, like I would have been in a deep hole trying to get back into some volume. So it was definitely kind of helpful in that sense. So I'd really only had like, since the last chance qualifier ended, I had probably four days before I found out that I was going, something like that. So a nice three or four day off season for me and then back to it.

Can you tell me where you were when you heard the news about Nicholas Joyal? And when you heard it, did you right away put the pieces together? I didn't understand what was happening. I was at home, and I was by myself at home. My wife was at the gym training, and she texted me. Or no, she called me and said, put your phone on speakerphone and go to Instagram. And I was like, all right, whatever. So I went to Instagram.

Bossy, bossy, bossy. She's bossy, she's bossy. In a good way. Yeah, yeah. But yeah, so she's like, go to the search bar, type in like NYCK and like Nick's account shows up. And I was like, okay. And she's like, click on Joyal's account.

Like, all right. And then I saw it and the post was kind of weird because, like, there was an English version and a French version. And I had actually seen those posts before she called me, but didn't look into it. Right, right. It looked boring. You're like, I don't read. Yeah, I didn't. That's how I feel about it, too.

Long capture. I'm not going to read the capture. Me no read. So, yeah, she told me to read that. it even reading it i was like i i don't understand like is this what what does this mean like is this real and so all my coaches and like some of my friends are like on the other line and everyone's just freaking out and i figured it out finally and i don't know still didn't it. It still feels kind of surreal at this point, but it's happening. Did you speak with Joyelle at the event?

No, not really. No. Okay. How many points behind were you at the event? At the end, I think it was like 10, 10 or 15 or something like that. So it was close when they made the announcement, you thought that there might still be a chance. It was, it was 10. No, I knew, I knew he had beat because he beat me in the last workout it was 20 it ended up being 25 points and half of those points he gained on him in the last workout yeah oh yeah okay yeah because i he the the fifth workout on sunday or like the first workout of

sunday he he beat me in that one. And that he, so he took his lead over again. So I basically would have had to beat him and then get some help. And he crossed the finish line like a couple of seconds before me. So I knew that was three seconds and three places. Yeah. Wild. That workout was crazy. How many years have you been trying to go to the CrossFit Games? I mean, when I started CrossFit at the end of 2012, I started because I wanted to go to the CrossFit Games. That's why I started doing CrossFit in the first place.

Ten years. Yeah. So essentially ten years I've been – I had this goal. Wow, you must be tickled. And is your wife going? Yep. yep yeah this is her second year qualifying second in a row crazy and what's her name austin uh caroline spencer now she was caroline connors so we got married in may i think they are updating it because they they sent her an email about changing it and then there was there was

some like things that they weren't going to change it because of her license and different things haven't her name hasn't changed yet but then they said that they would so i think they are you guys would like it to be changed though right yeah i'm going to change that and everything i've published from now on uh this could be this could be a good uh are you doing were you when i met you you were with misfits are you still with them yep i've always been with them maybe it's time to break away and start your own um programming and john sheets has a name for you nwpo it does eventually i guess my my last question for you is this does any part of you wish that you you would have taken that route like like like during these 10

years were you ever how many times were you tempted to be like okay i'm just gonna do this in the off season i'm just gonna i'm just gonna everyone else is doing it this is the way to do it how many times were you tempted zero literally zero i it's never once crossed my mind to try anything like that i i can't you're fucking up the beginning of the show i said everyone wants to do it even my mom what are you screwing everything up i i honestly let me guess you're a christian let me guess you're a christian huh no i, I'm not. I'm not religious. You have some moral code, but go on. You have something. No, I don't know. Good mom and dad.

Yeah, that's what it was. My parents are amazing. But, no, I don't know. I just, I've never understood people that can, like, rationalize that. Like, I don't know. You know you're cheating. um like rationalize that like i don't know you know you're cheating you know even if you do you know get by the system that it's still going to be in the back of your head and it's got to affect you in some way but i don't know it it's that's a tough subject like for me it never crossed my mind but you know i i did listen to like like, your podcast with Joyal and, like, just listening to his mindset behind it.

I don't know. It just seems like he's just lacking confidence in himself and got desperate. And for me, like, I just enjoyed the process so much that whether I was ever going to qualify for the games or not, I was going to keep trying until I started to see the decline away from the top um so it it just never crossed my mind like i just wanted to keep doing it no matter what i could be wrong but i remember at the regionals in albany you were very emotional when you didn't make it yeah did you ever cry when you didn't make it like go home and cry or in the car ride home no i don't think i cried but it was definitely emotional because it was like, like my friend Cody had made it.

Yeah. And it was just like a weird, it was a weird year because I wasn't necessarily expecting to be that high up on the leaderboard. It was only my second year at regionals. But when it was all happening it all happened so fast and it was it got pretty emotional um but yeah uh ed al says barney not many people like sebon you know what's fascinating about that barney's all those people's moms love me which is just it's just weird awesome was a small part of it makes you what it makes you know why they don't like me you would hate it if your mom loved me too, if she was in my DMs.

Okay, sorry. Go ahead, Susan. Is a small part of you a little bit bitter about the way that it played out? Because, I mean, after 10 years and being so close to make it, did you feel like you were robbed a little bit of that experience on the competition floor rather than just getting an email? Or does it not matter because you ultimately met the goal? Ultimately, like, I'm okay with it. Like, if it had come out that he tested positive after the games,

like what happened to Ricky or something, that would have been a whole different story. But since I get to go, like, ultimately it's fine. Obviously, it's a bummer that I didn't get to, like, be on the podium and, like, share that moment with Caroline and, like, my coaches and everything. Like, she, I mean, she was crying, like, while it all kind of went down. I feel more bad for her than myself. I can't help but be happy

and grateful that it's all worked out and I've finally done it. My friend Gabe was like, this is the most Austin way for you to qualify for the Games. Of course it happened this way. Via email. Yeah. Do you have any questions for Mr. Austin Spencer?

Brian? I guess maybe like, you know, considering just what you said is that you've put 10 years of work into this and, you know, to see, and obviously not just the guy in front of you who's failed the drug test, but like, you know, a dozen drug sanctions come down within a week or something like that. Is that discouraging at all? What's your perspective on that?

I don't know. It's crazy. Seeing all these different people pop, it's just kind of, I don't know, it's wild. It's just showing how people just want it in this sport. It's just like every other sports, like people are going to keep trying to, to like blur the lines or, you know, do whatever they can to get there without just putting in the work. So, I mean, obviously they still have to work hard, but like, I don't know. It's crazy to me. I really just don't understand it. Man, you're a fucking good dude. Man, you're a good dude. You're going to have kids?

Are you guys having kids? Eventually. We plan to, yeah. Yeah, you're going to be. They got a little bit more business to take care of in the competition first. Yeah, we got a couple years. We want to live a bit before that happens. We'll let Wad Zombie get to the last question here.

When you're competing against these guys, are you suspecting them? No. No. Not at all. That's just excuses pussies make right i it literally had never crossed my mind that like any anyone in the top five like i was like i knew i thought i was done like i was like all right they've qualified like on to next year i was actually like this wasn't the best year I've ever had, regardless of qualifying for the games. And I was just excited to get back to work and try it again for next year. Awesome. Austin, you were tested at semifinals? Yeah. And then CrossFit doesn't notify you if you have a negative test, right?

No, I haven't heard anything back at all from them. So in your case, the communication that you've earned your spot is probably an affirmation that your test was negative. But I think for most of the athletes that like originally earned the qualified spot, there's no communication. Yeah. We, you know, just so you know, you passed your drug test. I think that.

Yeah. It must be weird. It's like a different order. Like you get invited and then you could potentially have that taken away. We're like, I get invited because i was right i tested negative or whatever but uh well thank you for coming on you're awesome i'd uh matt matt will get with you uh very shortly the next couple days and we'll schedule you to hopefully to come on and get a whole hour and a half with you and pick that giant brain ears awesome that'll be fun i can't wait

all right dude thank you so much awesome for joining us this morning. Thanks. Thanks, man. See you guys. Bye. Have a good workout. That was real. So people's lives are being changed. I mean, it's interesting to see the balance of that, right? I mean, we see Joyelle who's struggling with getting caught. And then we see on the other end, you know, a scale to it right i think it was you step on that said like a lot of the people that were getting upset and being like you know hating on some of these people that are are coming with failed drug tests and it's like hey the people that actually got affected by it most were the ones on the competition floor like awesome that didn't get to have that experience with his wife to be on the podium to celebrate there with his coaches i mean ultimately they were the ones harmed the most right and like most affected by it um so i just thought that i was curious

about that question because we've heard pat velner talk about it when he received his third place for the games via email too it's kind of like you're just alone in your room and you're like oh cool you know as opposed to they work so hard for that brief moment on the floor right at its sex 10 years that guy's been trying to go to the cross again is 10 years yeah uh so uh we're we're when we started the show we were at 413 athletes now we're at 14 right including arthur if we throw arthur on the list well arthur didn't that fail sorry sorry sorry sorry uh uh nasser is what we think nasser and why do we think why do we think nasser instead of uh well i already answered that it's because everyone i've talked to has said that romans received nothing and that other people i've talked to have said that it's nasser okay okay. Okay. This is why,

this is why we're speculating. No, I'm just kidding. I may have to ask you a five more times. Sorry, Brian, you're dealing with an old man on this end. Okay.

Uh, let's go to South America first. What, what has happened in South America? Is he still going to the CrossFit games? Now that is the question everyone wants to know. So, uh,

so what I know so far, Guy has not received anything from CrossFit, so he's still good to go. The guy who placed second there, Pedro Martins. And it's not because we suspect Guy, it's because there's so much fucking noise in South America.

Okay, sorry, go ahead, Brian. Yeah, so Pedro Martins did receive an email from CrossFit that he had failed the drug test. He went live on his Instagram last night and addressed that. It was in Portuguese, I believe, but there's a brief write-up on Morning Chalkup about it. And then Augustine Raquelme, who is in line to receive the backfill, as I said earlier, as far as I know, has not received any communication from CrossFit about anything yet. So, you know, if I was was in his camp i would be preparing as if i was going to get a backfill unless he popped too and like yeah well he you know he hasn't so he's either

going to receive an email that says you failed the drug test or he's going to receive an email that says you're invited to the crossfit games right but he hasn't as far as i know he hasn't received either of those yet which would be out of so, so, but, but we don't know that. So, but since, um, did that,

did that semifinal happen after the semifinal that, um, Austin Spencer was in? No, same week, but it happened a week after the one that Nasser and Arthur were in. Okay. So that's what people are.

People are always saying this thing. Oh, well, we're just now hearing about week three. So that means maybe week four. Well, actually we've heard more about week four than we have week three so far. Okay. We may have Nasser's thing right now.

Okay. One, two minutes ago. Are you, okay, here we, does he speak English? Okay, let's see. No. Okay, let's see. No. Okay, pause. Just click this.

Okay, so we did hear him say email and CrossFit. We did hear that. Okay, go on. Oh, yeah. He's still asking. Okay, you can skip this. Let's skip to the next post. Yeah. One, one. Keep going.

Okay, here we go. Unfortunately, I have some bad – this is from Nassar Al-Ruwayeh. One minute ago, Tim. So this is in real time. Now we're up to 13, 14. Now we're up to 15. And we're going to get to 16 before the show's over. Unfortunately, I have some bad news to share. I got an email from CrossFit saying I've tested positive for the substance GW1516, which I did not use. From my discussion with the specialized lab, they mentioned that this substance can be found in supplements and medicine and not declared on the label.

We're working with a lab in the USA to identify the source so we can appeal this decision. For this reason, I will not be competing. Okay, so when he says appeal, other people have been caught and they still got a two-year suspension even after the appeal. And he's already stating that he's not going. Which is what I was saying about Phil Toon earlier, is that you can appeal, you can have your B sample, but this is, Nasser, like Phil,

will not be at the CrossFit Games this year. I'm telling you, give them their own fucking lane. Give them a special shirt. Well, I'm sure there are a lot of people that would enjoy watching both of those guys yes okay uh so let's go over to roman's instagram account just let's just check over there real quick and see if anything weird is going on over there okay so now we have okay let's go back to south my favorite post from roman recently was

i'm already here let's check okay looks good everything looks fine yeah i'll tell you what it doesn't look fine if you're another male competing in the field the more the closer we get to the games the more I'm excited to see this guy out there. I think he is in serious contention this year. We shall see. We shall see. He doesn't have to go against Joy Allard and Nassar or Phil Toon. So that helps him.

Was Phil Toon a top 10 guy, Brian? A sneak preview of our composite rankings that are no longer valid. No, he was not a top 10 athlete. Okay. CrossFit does not deserve you, Sevan. You shine a light and give a voice to all athletes. Real media only deals with athletes who bring them clicks and views, and Brian is lucky to know you.

I fully thank you, Clive. Just to put things in perspective perspective as excited as we all were about phil toon the highest any one of us ranked him against this men's field was 13th the lowest was 25th and his composite rank came to 18th that's like i'm you know i've been saying it this men's field is so brutal even with guys, new guys coming in and these other guys out, it's going to be an absolute blast at the games on the men's side. I think Justin Medeiros is natural. Me too. Okay.

Let's go back over to the South America semifinals list. Man, this show is fucking dragging along. My goodness. I guarantee you. If you're not having fun, we can stop. I'm totally having fun. Someone else is going to pop here in just a minute. Hang tight, people.

We have eight minutes until we get to the top of the hour, and someone else is going to pop. Okay, so Pedro popped, and we suspect August. So what would be normal here, what Brian was reporting is Augustine Raquelme, which some people have said to me in my DMs, this guy looks like the Brian of South America. Have you heard that Brian? No, no, I have not heard that,

but you'll take it. Augustine was at the games last year. So, you know, you have to, he he's passed a drug test in the past. So that would be a positive sign in South America needs something positive right now, because when we get to the team side of things we're going to see just how

crazy this situation is becoming okay let's look at the women uh brian or uh suza and i want to ask brian to see how the women are doing on the um on the leaderboard here yeah yeah we'll get back to augustine it does look uh this is the sevan PED special I know it sucks I hate a PED special okay how is Victoria Campos doing is she going to the games so far same as Guy she's heard nothing from CrossFit

which is a good sign and Julia Cato Julia come on what I said Julia okay I am concerned for Julia Cato? Julia, come on. What? I said Julia. I said Julia. Okay. I am concerned for Julia Cato, but there's been nothing yet. And why are you concerned? Does she have a vein that runs from her toe up to the top of her forehead or what?

I know. It's devolved into nastiness. I'm sorry. I'll clean it up. We'll see. But so far, I've not gotten a confirmation one way or another on her. But you've heard something that you're not willing to tell us at this point. Yes. I'll clean it up. She has nice legs. Okay. Okay, let's go over to the teams. We have some concerns about – yeah.

The teams at Copa Sur, which is everything south – it's basically everything south of Mexico, right? It includes all of Central America and South America. Yeah, I think so. We have CrossFit K21. That's a Q. Sorry, Q21. Are they going to the CrossFit Games? No.

They posted that Sabrina Del Agostina failed her drug test, and they kicked her out of their team training environment. Too little, too late. Okay, so they're not going. How about CrossFit Ribeirao Preto? They posted on their team Instagram that someone on their team failed a drug test. They are not going. Okay, so what I'm told about these drug tests is that there's four people on the team, and only two are tested, and it's random.

Can you confirm that? In most cases, yes. In Africa, that was not the case. But we're not in Africa. Okay, we'll get over there. Okay, so does that mean that CrossFit Barini, Team Treta, and King Bull CrossFit Paraguay, I love that name, King Bull, are going? No.

Click on CrossFit Barini, Sousa. There's a couple problems with CrossFit Barini. First of all, you see where it says departed there next to their name? That's not normal. That means that their affiliate's not in good standing. There was a post on a different... Oh, shit! There was a post on a different Instagram account

called CrossFit Black Sheep, which I'm also not sure is a legitimate affiliate, that said that this team will not be going to the CrossFit Games. They're denying their invite, if they were to even receive one because they're not prepared. They don't have visas and whatever else. But the fact that it's that – have you ever seen that before?

No. No, that's awesome. So there's several problems with this team, and I'm not sure if they would have passed their drug test or if they did or didn't, but they have said they are not going, so they're out. Is this true right here? Let's take a – Walmart does sell GW501516.

What part of the country is this person from who's asking? Fuck. Amazing. Okay. This is fascinating. Okay. CrossFit King Bull, please tell me they made it. That name is –

No. Oh, fuck. They have a woman on their team named Ines Alviso. She posted on her personal instagram that she failed her drug test she's not going shit they're not going hey so brian all these people are getting four-year bans basically uh well definitely the girl from q21 i mean unless they unless they appeal and prove contaminated supplements but i don't think that's likely so the girl from q21 someone from crossfit ribero and this girl from crossfit paraguay will be getting bans yes this is like the tour de france where like every single

person is is like popping now the problem in south america is those were the only four teams tested wow and in crossfit's rule book it states that if you don't pass your drug test, you cannot advance or collect prize money. Obviously, none of these teams can also collect prize money because they failed a drug test. So they would need and I think they're they pay out five teams. So I don't know why the fifth place team wasn't tested to begin with. But either way, they would in theory need to test teams five, six, seven, eight and nine before paying them. Either way, they would, in theory, need to test teams 5, 6, 7, 8, and 9 before paying them. I don't know. That's open to interpretation the way you worded that a little bit. I can see it both ways. Okay. CrossFit, so as of now, we don't know if CrossFit – and let me go back a second.

Sorry. How are we getting this information if we haven't got it from CrossFit? This is all from personal Instagram accounts. all four of them posted something on instagram there's an article on morning chalk up that is in my story this morning on on my personal instagram that uh has links to all four of those announcements from those four teams wow so no teams are going to go from brazil is what it's looking like can't the women on the team just say that they're in transition and they're men and they get a pass? Oh, no, but then they wouldn't have enough women on the team. There's got to be some woke way around this.

Find the loophole. I feel like our South American people are being oppressed. So South America may not have a team. You're not going to be surprised if there's no South American team at the CrossFit Games this year. have a team you're not going to be surprised if there's no south american team at the crossfit games this year well look based on what's going on in south america this year i'm not just i'm not sure they deserve to have any teams at the games it's not crossfit to luca's fault or vittoria um you can't punish them no scroll down to six place seems to be more of a systematic problem in that part of the world than anywhere else this year. So Toluca and

Vittoria, more reps? I don't know. I mean, in theory, I guess they should be hearing from CrossFit. This is where the situation from Africa becomes relevant. Because we know that in Africa, the top place and only qualifying team was tested at the competition and the second place team and everyone below them was not tested. We know that there was a, we can talk about it if you want to, but we know that there was a complication with the drug proceed failed drug test on that team. Give me one second here, Brian. Sorry. Cause I want to go over there to Africa, but I want to leave this page first. I want to go, I want to go back to what directly correlated with you. Okay. Sorry. Go ahead then. Go ahead. Sorry. Go ahead. So it's like, you know, we have to go there to address this because they didn't test the second place team in Africa at the competition that ended on May 29th.

But they did test that team on July 3rd and have since then extended an invite to that team. team. So there is a precedent that has been set that teams like CrossFit Toluca and Vittoria more reps could be tested now and also extended an invite to the games as Tizer Valley was. If you're in the comments now, or if you're, if you're watching the show now, all 963 of you, I know that you guys all want to get juiced up. Here's the other thing that's interesting about South America. And I think this is what Tyler Watkins is referring to in the comments. If the top four teams have all failed drug tests, you know, usually like people have asked us this after Joyelle. Well, what does it do to the leaderboard? Does that mean Vellner actually won?

Did Spencer actually still retain the sixth spot? And we ran all the numbers and they did. If you remove the top four teams from competition, that could potentially have an impact on who finished five, six, seven, eight. So you're saying, wow.

I don't know if that's the case or not, but like the case, we're not looking at real data, right? Okay. No, but the case that Vellner alluded to of Ricky in 2017, he said,

no, they just crossed his name out. They didn't move us all up and down placements on a leaderboard. But when the top four teams or the top four contenders in a division all become disqualified, well, that's a dramatic effect on a leaderboard. Brian, are you serious when you say that you don't think that those other teams um uh should get to go the south it really is not their fault it's like saying it's like it's like um letting a chinese dude into an engineering uh degree at mit just because he's chinese he's still got to take the fucking test it's racist what you're saying oh man we can't we can't punish all of them. We can't we can't. I want to ask you one more question, too, before you answer that one. Did any of these teams I saw one of the teams in in South America had a man competing as a woman. Did any of those teams are they in the top four?

about that but this is but it's not that it's i've been saying this about uh asia too it's you know and i'm hopeful this year that all of their athletes will be able to come to the us and compete but there was you know a lot of years and examples where the qualifiers from asia just weren't able to make it the team the men the women whatever and it's like why are we reserving spots for parts of the world if they're not going to show up to compete i just want a full field of athletes at the games that are that have you know proven themselves on the competition floor and pass the test that they need to off the floor and if south america can't produce teams that can do that this consistently uh as we're seeing here it's you know okay i'm gonna put a question mark next to these four teams because we don't know what's going on why do these teams still suck so bad if they're all juiced up?

Which? Just why does South America suck so bad if everyone's all juiced to the gills? How come they can't even – like, do we know why? Well, in general. Because everyone else is juiced up. Oh, man. I'm like a boy who lost his virginity this week you know you can listen to someone like austin spencer who tell you that he's been pursuing

this for 10 years and i don't know how many crossfit boxes in brazil have been open for 10 years okay fair i like that that's nice that keeps my dream alive yeah someone's saying maybe katrin makes it yeah i mean you never know and anything's it goes i don't get that joke well who is shooter mcgavin is that a guy from toy story or something okay uh let's let's talk about south africa so so so far just so you guys know we have a pedro uh isn't going we have concerns about julio Cato and four teams from South America. So that's where we're at. And we're hoping Agustin Raquel May is good to go.

Okay, let's go into Africa here. I want to start with this female. Okay, let's cruise through the teams first, and then we'll save that female for last. CrossFit Comet Okongbongo. What female? The female the female is liza burns is that you're talking about yeah she's a team member of crossfit commit okavango oh even better then let's do it uh so this tell me this story again this story fascinates the shit out of me So there are two stories up on the morning chalk up about this one. I've put both links in my story this morning as well.

If anyone has missed those, the first one is basically an account of what the correspondence was between Liza Burns or, and her team with CrossFit HQ. And then the second one is a followup based on a communication that we had with the competition organizers at Fittest in Cape Town. I'm sure some people also had a chance to listen to Liza's interview with Andrew Hiller on his YouTube station. And that would be a good place to go to get more details about her side of the story of what happened there.

It's a pretty complicated story and situation where, you know, she's, she or they, her team are saying some things that are pretty concerning. The competition director is acknowledging some of those things and denying others. And CrossFit has made some comments along the lines of the fact that what happened in South America, as far as drug testing is concerned is not normal based on what the procedures are supposed to be at semifinals. Okay. And I think this is the first time this competition director has run this event in Africa. I think I had just heard that the guy who normally ran the competitions was fired.

I'm not sure about that. Their country manager was just fired. The person who I believe is in charge of running this is the same person that I had contact with in 2019 for the sanctional that was run there. Like Katrin Davidsdottir and Cole Sager and a bunch of other athletes, Sean Sweeney and X were at. Was it Tion? Is it Tion? Yes. You think Tion ran this this year also?

Yes. Oh, okay. Because I know he was the country manager. He and his group, and there's a group of people that he's with, but yes. Yes. You think Tian ran this this year also? Yes. OK, because I know he was the country manager and his group and there's a group of people that he's with. But yes. OK. All right. So so I want to go through some of the inconsistencies here. So here only one team was going and only one team was tested. tested yeah and this was um and basically you know that seems strange because all of the semifinals that i went to or knew people that were you know that were they were closely with they were at it was briefed at the start of the competition that um you know two teams beyond the qualifying teams would be tested so we saw that in brazil where they tested teams three and four we saw we've seen that in other places, the MAAC,

Granite Games, Atlas Games, Low Lens, where they tested down to seven because they have five qualifiers. So it only makes sense that they would test one, two, and three here. But there was a miscommunication. It sounds like CrossFit, the original directive from CrossFit to fitness in Cape Town was to only test the top team and to test all four athletes on that team, which is also contrary to the way that it was done at other semifinals. And then there was some kind of a secondary or follow up communication that was saying, no, you need to test the second and third place teams also. But by the time that that communication was received, those teams had left the competition floor unsupervised

that communication was received, those teams had left the competition floor unsupervised and were missing for an hour, at which point Tien and his team went to track them down and bring them back. And there was a conversation that was had and they decided against testing them because they'd already been gone unsupervised for so long that it was, it wouldn't be a valid sample anyway. Okay. And can you tell me exactly what happened to this? Can you click that open? What's her name? Levy? Liza or Liza? I'm not sure. Yeah, Liza. Can you tell me what happened to Liza?

This is the part that tripped me out. So Liza and her three other teammates that won the competition were tested that day. My understanding is that two of the four of them received something called a DCF, which is a document control form, that day. My understanding is that two of the four of them received something called the DCF, which is a document control form that, that day, a copy of it. And there's the DCF is basically you signing that this wasn't in fact, your drug sample was that basically. So it's like, yes, I peed in the cup, the sample on the label matches the sample on the form. And I'm acknowledging that that sample that matches this number is my sample. That's what's supposed to happen.

And then my understanding is that the athlete receives a copy of that. Right. From what I can tell, two of the four of them received copies of that, and two of them did not, including her. However, later on, I think it was, so that competition ended on May 29th. I believe it was somewhere around June 18th to 20th that she was contacted by CrossFit saying that she failed the drug test. And she was, one of the things she immediately asked for was for the DCF form. And when she received the DCF form that they provided,

asked for was for the DCF form. And when she received the DCF form that they provided, she saw that it was labeled as S a male athlete three. Hey, I wonder how many athletes have ever asked for the DCF form after they test positive. Well, I think most of them already have it. Right. Okay. But again, I'm learning a lot about this as we go. So I'm just kind of telling you what I've know and have learned and have heard. And then I'm learning a lot about this as we go. So I'm just kind of telling you what I know and have learned and have heard and then I'm assuming. Okay. So anyway, the DCF form that she received from them says SA male athlete three and she's contesting. I would never have signed a form that listed me as a male athlete. And as athlete three, right?

Because she was athlete two. Well, there are four, you know, there are four athletes on their team that were tested. So in theory, you know, they didn't test any other teams. I believe the team competition ended before the individual competition. So those should have been SA female one, SA female two, SA male one, and SA male two. So there shouldn't have been an essay male three in her group. CrossFit has said this was a clerical error. Well, whatever that means. So they're acknowledging that there was an error,

but they're still contending that the sample on essay male athlete three's form is her sample that she signed for, and therefore it's still a relevant failure of a drug test but her signature is not on it her there is a signature on it but it's not hers don't know it's it would be great to see if it was if she's if it said someone like if it Liza Burns, but it's not her handwriting. I have seen the signature. That would – you have.

And I've seen another signature of hers from an official document. And do they look like they're the same? No, but they're not – but it's not convincing necessarily either way, but I'm skeptical. Skeptical that she's telling the truth or that it's the same person? The one on the form only is signed as Burns. I don't know of any women who would take their husband's name and have their signature only be their husband's adopted name, that they wouldn't at least put a first initial or a first name accompanying that, especially if you're on a team with your husband who is also taking a drug test,

and especially if they give you a form to sign that says male athlete and you know that your husband's a male athlete that's also on the team. Damn, you're good, Brian. So there's a lot of question marks that are arisen here that do give a lot of validity to her concerns. This drug testing is not done by crossfit this is an outside agency i believe it's an i believe it's drug-free sport wow this is so weird and um could we assume um and and i and i that if it that the sample if it was positive and it wasn't hers that all that means is that someone else on our team popped.

That's what CrossFit saying is that even if it was a mistake in that regard, S.A. male three form would still have been someone from your team. And so it's you know, that's an I don't think you can use that excuse. I don't think you can use that. I think you can say that, but I don't think you can use that excuse I don't think you can use that I think you can say that but I don't think you can use that to keep them out of the games because here's the problem who the fuck are you going to give the four year ban to you can't give it to this chick

where did they say this Brian where did they say that last comment you just said is that which one the one you're saying that crossfit's response is i'm sorry i know i'm putting you in a tough spot to speak for crossfit but you're saying that crossfit said hey um it doesn't matter whose it was someone on your team still popped i'm not sure but the oh like the overarching thing is here is that crossfit standing by

the um where where areFit standing by the. Where, where are they standing by it? Did they put out a press release? They've invited another team. So they're standing by the fact that that team is disqualified from the games. Okay. By inviting the second place team. Show me that list again, Mr. Sousa.

Wow. And on the flip side, the main contention that Liza and her team has is that the procedures that happened for the drug testing at Fitness in Cape Town were not up to standard. And CrossFit has also acknowledged that. Yeah, what a mess. I hope CrossFit gets its money back from this drug-free sport. Get a refund on that shit. CrossFit, this is cool. is here's the thing too this isn't just good this isn't just good to uncover um just to be like na na you guys fucked up this is we have to

uncover this so like this shit doesn't happen again like let's just learn like someone just needs to learn from this this is any i'm gonna ask something just completely ridiculous here any possibility any accusations that any of this was done on purpose or malicious like that there's like like evil people behind the scenes trying to trying to fuck this team trying to get liza like does she have any haters well i mean this is uh i didn't watch the hillary interview i guess no no but in but in in general i think there are you know there are a you know, there are a lot of things that happen in CrossFit, like any other industry that are political. And one of the

things that's noteworthy about the, you know, the semifinals is that, you know, we'll just take a country like Asia, where I don't really know a lot of the politics. But if South Korea gets to host that competition, then probably the event organizers and therefore the programmers and also the judges are mostly from South Korea. And there's probably a dozen to 20 different countries that are represented there. And so there's a huge, you know, there's a potential for things to be sued in the favor of the South Koreans. And you could apply that to many different countries. Okay, a little home cooking. Whether it's intentional or not, there could home a little home cooking whether it's intentional or not there could be a little home cooking sure and i don't know what the solution to that is on all fronts

but one solution to it is to have standardized programming that's done by someone who's you know not affiliated with any country in it just just crossfit man this is this is great okay um oh that's nice someone just sent me a mock-up of the new nwpo shirt yeah he liked that yeah that is really nice can you pull it up and show that let's let's go with that i'd like i'd like one of those i don't think fraser i want to say something else real quick sorry this is totally off subject yesterday there was a post on morning chalk up about some article that matt fraser was in in for the USA Today. And I guess he said something along the lines of he chooses his athletes with discretion.

Then someone made a picture of me and wrote, I choose my podcast guests with discretion, and I posted it. And some of you thought that I was making fun of Matt. Not in the fucking least. I was making fun of the people who were making fun of Matt, just to be clear. I mean, if Matt wants to be made fun of too i'll make something for him but um how the fuck wouldn't matt fraser use his utmost discretion and anyone should be fucking honored to fucking work with him he won the fucking games five times he's not going to pick some schmoes and and and i and i say to uh with all love and kindness to people like sammy and um o'keefe and

in the gayest uh weightlifter i mean you guys don't have to ever defend matt the vast majority of people out there know he's fucking the man he can pick whoever he wants if he wants to go over to the mayhem empire and put an hwpo shirt on rich froning himself he can't he won the fucking games five times let him pick whoever he wants those of you who are judging him for it fuck off i'd pick mal and jason hopper too that being said i'll have anyone on my podcast i'm a world-class podcast slut okay um brian uh so we did south america and we did um africa and we did Africa and we did some of North America. Is there anything else going on in North America besides Phil Toon and Joy Al?

And I want to honor Nick Matthews and Austin Spencer. You know, that post that Proven put up that you showed, like Proven, I don't think that they would put a post up that says it's official unless they knew it was official. So, you know, we've got to maybe try to find out more, but it's possible that maybe Nick has heard something at this point. Don't you think that just seems like something they would want to do? Yeah, they absolutely yeah they absolutely and and you have to assume that people like tia who are so valuable to the sport that they know that they she has someone who she can call there you know what i mean i have to assume that in her phone she has uh curtis bowler's phone number adrian's phone number anyone over there's phone number james hobart's number even though he's

nobody um she she can call whoever she wants i mean shit she could probably come again tonight she can probably call this yeah that's the highest ranked person we can get at crossfit these days james hobart we're fucked hey i'll take hobart any day he helped me a lot last year what is it what's my cat what's ligma i pop for ligma what's ligma ligma someone looked at it okay um anyone else anyone else in north Ligma. I popped for Ligma. What's Ligma? Ligma. Someone looked that up. Okay. Anyone else in North America? I don't think so, but like I said, the Granite Games and the Atlas Games, which happened the last two weeks,

I'm still not convinced that we haven't heard the last from those. Who are some of these other guys that pop we had we had a jaylen pop um we had a toby toby mcguire toby toby johnson jaylen franklin jaylen toby and there was another guy wallace hunter williams wow mike catris all on teams i'm not hearing any girls I'm not hearing any girls just juiced up dudes has any don't fall for

Linga is made up of disease and internet hoax claims to have killed I don't want to know that kind of vernacular anyone else come like yeah I did it besides Joyal has anyone just been like yeah i did it like besides joe joe joe joe al has anyone just been like yeah i'll fucking take this i don't think necessarily to that degree you know most of them are are acknowledging ownership um but not in the same way that he did yeah jaylen eventually came around right or was it toby one of them eventually came around right after a couple

denials uh if i'm being honest like once they're officially removed from the season, I kind of stopped paying attention. Yeah, I don't blame you. I don't blame you. I've always done that. Like as soon as in the past when regionals would happen, before I was doing this in such a grand scale, I would pretty much unfollow everyone that wasn't the 80 athletes that made the games. Anything going on in Europe? Do we have anything substantial? Can we look at the European leaders?

I just want to pull it up and go through them with Brian. There's been only the one team out of Strength and Depth, which was in the last week, and that came out earlier than the stuff from Granite Games with Phil too, and earlier than the stuff in Asia with Nasser. But that's what i'm saying is like which team which team here popped down aylesbury in fifth wow the fifth place team

so does that mean that the sixth place team will you scroll down a little bit suza does that mean the sixth place team will be um going a little more a little more a little more all the way to six we'll cross the six place team is CrossFit Nordic Original, which is somewhat comical considering everything that happened with them this year that they'd get the backfill like this. As far as I know, and this is another thing that's kind of strange. That's the team that we had on where they had the – Yeah.

So they're not juiced, but they had a dude who was living more than 100 miles or didn't train at the affiliate enough or something? Didn't train at the affiliate enough days. So as far as I know, they have not been contacted by crossfit and again this is weird because catris came out you know last week nasser came out today and before nasser even came out arthur had gotten an invite this is now like you know five to seven days later from when mike made his announcement and nordic has heard nothing so there's not there's not a lot of consistency in terms of the process at least from what we're able to see on the outside once again um what we see from the outside is only what athletes have decided to leak for us correct and words like and words like departed like that

thing that departed that that's trippy on the south american site so i guess that is something from crossfit right we can't go to their game site and we saw in parentheses departed yeah but what does that really mean we don't know that's a thing i was thinking we need a legend down at the bottom telling us what that means i don't i don't know what that means i don't i don't know i mean speculating wouldn't it be that means. I don't know. I mean, speculating wouldn't it be that they just – they're departed. They're no longer part of CrossFit and then therefore no longer eligible. What would – when were the announcements made last year officially from CrossFit, by the way? How close to the games?

And did they backfill like this last year? Do we see any consistency between last year and this year? I'm not sure on the announcements with the date and the timeline. And as far as the backfills, I think there was an addition to the semifinals to test teams outside of the top five this year at semis because of something that happened last year. Not 100% sure, but I believe that there were teams that were invited via the backfield process last year that were not tested at semifinals. And then they were tested upon arrival at the games to make sure that they were still tested within the competition season. And again, so that would leave another out for CrossFit in the terms of South America. So they could do what they did in Africa, which is just test them now. And then they'll have that sample some back at some point,

or they could test them if they accept their invitation and show up in Madison. And then obviously they would just have to wait for the sample before potentially paying out any prize money. Last year at the CrossFit games, were there any places that were not backfilled? Like when the, when the, when the show started, were we 40 and 40? No.

No, but the two- Am I right on those numbers? It should be 40 and 40, right? It should be 40 and 40. But in the case of the women, Larissa Cunha received a notification that she failed a drug test a day or two before the games. So it was probably too late to backfill. And in the case of the men, Roman was unable to show up. And despite the fact that the next person in the last chance qualifier,

which would have been Tyler Christoffel, was on site and had trained and was prepared to do the games, and it reached out to CrossFit telling them as much, they did not give him that opportunity because they were holding the spot just in case Roman showed up and in this lady who you said tested um a positive a couple days before the games was her test given to her a couple days before the games or that's how when the the results were released that's when she was notified I'm not 100 sure of when the test took place she was the one that ended up going on to prove supplement contamination and has since gotten her sentence reduced from four to two years. And which semifinal did she come from?

South America. Fascinating. Okay. Well, so it does seem like things are moving faster this year. How many days away are we from the games? Well, August 3rd, I think, is the first day. Well, August 3rd, I think, is the first day. So that's 14, 15, 16, 17, 18, 19, 20, 21, 22.

22 days away? Is that right? August 3rd is 22 days? Yeah, 22 days. Okay. Do we have a full men's field and full women's field at this point, Brian? Assuming that they continue backfilling, yes. And the people that they have backfilled, the people we know.

So we know that Arthur has been backfilled. We know Austin Spencer has been backfilled. It appears that Proven believes Nick Matthew has been backfilled and then we're waiting on the South America. So far, I haven't heard anything from Raquel May that he's received an invitation. I wonder if we could get Nick Matthews on right now.

That would be cool. He's similar to Austin Spencer in a lot of ways in terms of the time that he's invested, how close he's been in the past, and then obviously making it in the same style. Oh, I follow him already. Nick Matthew. Oh, it's Nick Matthew or Nick Matthews. I want to make sure it's the right dude.

Matthew. Matthew, Nick Matthew. Have you ever called someone on Instagram? Yeah, we did. Remember remember it was actually the three of us i i can just push this video button right here uh yeah does he yep yeah i don't know if it'll work okay it says i'm calling him as if he'll answer it remember we i think we called like oh this is a nice sound oh no answer should i report a problem i love it every time i get a post pulled down says do you want to report do you want to protest this or and i can never protest it there's nowhere to protest it but when nick matthews

doesn't nick's matthew doesn't answer i can um uh brian is there anything else um is there is there is there anything else we'd like to cover in regards to PED use? Any stones we haven't turned? No, just I don't think that it's quite over yet. I think there's probably a couple more still to come. Um, Why do you say that? Do you have insight into some stuff? Maybe. Okay. You know, and then I'm hopeful that, but I, but I am hopeful that.

Anything good. Like you think Adrian Bosman is going to pop? Like he's going to pop the head judge, the pop for Adderall. He was taking Adderall while he was doing the programming. He'll pop for Adderall. He was taking Adderall while he was doing the programming. Well, you know, you need to be very detail oriented to do that job. Any big names going to pop, Brian? Any big names?

Any top 10 guys? Any shockers? I don't think so. Okay. But, you know, it's one of those situations where if you're in the last, I would say if you're in the last two weeks, yeah, you know, I would be kind of nervous still because things are still coming out. Um, yeah, but I'm hopeful that this will end soon and, uh, CrossFit will have a statement and, uh, and release a list of all of the things fairly soon as well. And then we can hopefully move on and, you know, focus on the athletes that did make it through both the qualifying process and the drug testing.

Um, because I, you know, I still think this is going to be a great year at the games. Brian, should they have an all inclusive division juiced athletes? D signed hobbies, the DEI guy for all of Saudi Arabia Javi uh

I I want to get I want to get your opinion on this just your on your your your your yeah we have one minute left I want to get your opinion on this 90 seconds if you're an athlete and you test positive and you know you did it what do you think the best what do you think what do you think the best way to handle that is i mean you've already screwed up many points to get to that stage and so i'm i'm always a fan of eventually doing the the next right thing, is what I would say. So probably, even though it's, you know, not commendable the path to get there, you know,

what Joyelle did is probably the best thing to do. Just come out. Just say, yeah, man, I was feeling the pressure. I made bad choices. I competed with guilt, you know, whatever it is. That's the thing that's really hard for me is to imagine, look, it's totally possible that some of these athletes are taking things and not aware of it. That's their fault still. But for the,

but if you know you're taking it and you're showing up and competing and staring down these men and women on either side of you, like, yeah, you know, I'm like that, that's, I don't know if I can do that. Um, but yeah, after the fact, I think that everyone will appreciate the person just says, yeah, man, I screwed up. Uh, I feel bad about it. I'll own the consequences because, but you know, all the other stuff is kind of getting sick and tired of hearing it. And you get to set yourself free. It's not, it's not a lie. You have to to protect or anything you have to justify for the rest of your life. I'm just thinking if there's – and I can't think of any financial reasons why you wouldn't just come clean too. I'm guessing at the end of the day that it works out for you to benefit you in every single way.

Probably. All right. Thank you very much. Great show. I'm glad we were able to keep it only to 30 minutes that i could do the rest of my live calling show today that was cool um brian great brian friend matt souza austin spencer thanks for coming on the show we will see you guys tonight tonight we will have james hobart on and we will be discussing uh my second favorite subject after peds masters athletes