The Sevan Podcast - #644 - Emma Cary

Episode Date: October 24, 2022

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Travel better with Air Canada. You can enjoy free beer, wine, and premium snacks in economy class. Now extended to flights within Canada and the U.S. Cheers to taking off this summer. More details at aircanada.com. Bam, we're live. Can you hear me, Emma? Yes, I can. Oh, awesome. I got some new computer equipment and it own everything off oh how's that is my voice better now yes that's great oh yes everything's working again holy cow it's a

full house already we barely even started thanks for doing this thank you so much for having me it's been a long time since i've been on a podcast got a lot i'm excited to share oh awesome awesome awesome awesome your dad dm me um yesterday what did he say it just it's just dad talk just code my daughter's going to be on your podcast yes sir that's it That's it. That's all. That's all he needed to say. I know exactly what he was telling me. Yeah. I know exactly what daddy's telling me. I told, I told people on the podcast this morning, I'm going to be on my best behavior.

Good. No plan B. You didn't do the online age qualifier. So you had to go individual. You're like, uh, you're, you're truly already got like this David Goggins, uh, you know, in, in our own world, kind of Matt Frazier thing, uh, Malcolm X by any means necessary. And you even hinted that you would leverage your own fear to push you. Yeah, a hundred percent. Last year was an amazing year. It was just confidence. So sorry, last year, 2021. Yes. Okay. It was like, it was a scary decision. Of course there's fear, but I think like the best things happen when you're afraid, like that fear has to be there for you to perform. Like there has to be something on the line and it was like individual games ticket or no games

ticket. I mean, there was only one option to me and that like, games ticket the way I always wanted to do it. Like, I don't think any teens are training, um, like with their ultimate goal of like just making the team division. Like, even if it's not as big of a part of your life, you have to have that like little dream that maybe you can take it further and like that's how mine started as like just a thought like what if this is possible I know that nobody's ever done it before at 17 um but what if it's possible and then it was like just more confidence and confidence as I worked harder got stronger saw those improvements it was like just more confidence and confidence as I worked harder, got stronger, saw those improvements. It was like a no-brainer. No one said to you, come on, Emma, that's crazy.

Just do both. Have a backup plan. It's okay. No, I definitely got that. I just didn't care. And there's a story I love. I cannot tell it very well. cannot tell it very well. Uh, but there was, um, I believe an explorer who came,

I'm actually not sure if it was to North America, but I want to say that it was, and he burned his boats. Um, so there was like no way to escape, no way to go back. They would fight and they would either win or they would lose and they would die. Um, and they would either win or they would lose and they would die. And like obviously I didn't have that much on the line, but I knew it was a very real possibility not to make the games. But that was how I wanted it. Like I wanted that level of fear. I wanted that level of pressure.

And I think I grew a lot more because of it. Can you tell me who told you that it was a bad idea or who maybe tried to talk you out of it? How about your mom and dad? No, not them at all. They have so much belief in me. They always have like immediately it was like, I want to be the best up until that point. This is kind of embarrassing to admit, but I tried gymnastics for a little while. I wanted to go to the Olympics. Like thought I would. Um, I played tennis for maybe a week and I was like, I'm going to play in the French open because that's what I watched on TV. Like didn't know

anything about it, but I just, I would like like, go back and forth, like, seeing all these new things. I mean, one week it was even Wii bowling. Like, I was really good at Wii bowling. So I was like. That's the video game? Yeah, on the Wii. And I was like, I'm sure I'd be great at real bowling. Like, let's go for it.

And then I played bowling. And I was like, okay, I'm not great at this. So, like, when I said I wanted to be the best at CrossFit it was something they'd heard before uh and I am so grateful that they took that seriously like they never shot that down and they supported me in any way they could and like in 2021 when it was like I'm gonna take a risk um it didn't feel like a risk really because i believed in myself so much they were all in with that um my coach matt was all in with that like he is it is it is it um is it a healthy kind of delusion like like you or or you're nurturing a dream or what, what is this, this? I definitely wouldn't call it delusion. I would just call it confidence and self-belief.

Not, not that everything's going to go perfectly because it's not, but that I was as prepared as I could be and that I could handle my emotions. I could just really manage the pressure when inevitably things would not go great. Um, and like, obviously there's the possibility of like big adversity. Like I had this past, um, where either like you can't get through it or it's not the best choice to get through it. And like, we knew that even that was a possibility. Um, And like, we knew that even that was a possibility. But what I'm referring to more in like the 2021 season was like,

I knew I might, I don't know, get some no reps. But at the time I didn't agree with, but now like I fully agree with that. I knew that I would be frustrated. I knew that like maybe I'd have some bad strategies and I got to do that. And I got to make all of those mistakes at the Granite Games. But because like mentally I was able to, I don't want to say keep it together, but to just be resilient and not even, not even like return to my emotional baseline. But to like have applied those lessons so quickly in the couple of hours I had between events, I trusted my ability to do that. And I was able to execute that very well at the Granite Games.

So it wasn't perfect. And going in, I knew it wouldn't be perfect. I just trusted in my ability to handle the imperfect. What place did you get at the Granite Games? I got third. And they took top five? Yes. And that was actually a very big disappointment to me. Like winning is always the goal. And now looking back on it, I have a lot more perspective that like, I don't need to win the Open. I don't need to win quarterfinals. I don't need to win. I hope they change that. I hope they change that.

Yeah. I hope they put more pressure on you guys. I, like in 2021, I definitely put too much pressure on every stage of the season. Like, I don't regret wanting to win, of course. Like, that's just who I am as a person. But at the Granite Games in the last event I was actually in a tie for first um going in so I just knew who I needed to beat and I took that risk like I tried to go unbroken on the lunges I couldn't completely got to failure couldn't even finish the event before the cap um and as heartbreaking as that

was at the time like I would so much rather live knowing that I took the risk and just physically wasn't capable than that mentally. I'm afraid to take that risk. Um, and like, how cool is it that I got to make all those mistakes, get all that learning so early in my career and still make the games. It was best case scenario. Who are the two, who are the two girls, the two ladies, uh, who took first and second? Ariel Loewen and Mal make the games. It was best case scenario. Who are the two, who are the two girls, the two ladies, uh, who took first and second? Ariel Loewen and Mal O'Brien. And, and the, and which one were you eyeballing being like, okay, she's got to go down. I have to beat her. Ariel Loewen. Ariel Loewen. She's a good girl. Love her so much. You got beat by mama. Yeah.

That's okay. She'll be gone gone she is there last year there's no way what is she doing i always pick on ariel uh so so and then in 2021 you took second place in the worldwide open yes and you won an event. Yes. Nuts. Yeah, that was. And you wanted to redo the workout, too. You were like, that's not good enough. Um, that's that feeling's always there. I've learned that like at that. And that was a cool moment.

Like. That was the moment when I fully believed in myself, like up until that point, I, I trusted in my hard work and like, I knew that I was improving and like, I trusted, I trusted my process because I could see that improvement. Um, but that was coming off of COVID year. That was, that just felt like working in the shadows and not knowing where I was at relative to anyone else. And like, that was the moment that really made me truly believe, um, winning that event in the world. And it wasn't, it was, it was so much more than just an open workout to me. Um, like in the grand scheme of the season, the open is not the most important. Um,

but it just like, it was being tenacious and like aggressive from the very beginning, which like when it pays off, I think that that is one of my biggest strengths as an athlete. And I'm still learning when to use that strategy and when not to use that strategy. Cause sometimes it's definitely not the best way to start a workout. Um, but which is what, which is what to just to come out, just balls to the wall, just full throw out, put your foot on the gas. Yeah. Um, pretty much just sprint from the beginning, like not hold yourself back. I love workouts when I get to do that. And that was, that was for sure one of those workouts, like not most workouts aren't most workouts. There is more of a strategy. But this one was just like, I'm going to go fast and believe in myself and see what happens. And

I loved the result. And that just gave me a lot more confidence and like momentum going into the rest of the season and it's even kind of a similar feeling going into this season that I've kind of been in the shadows like working in the darkness not really sure where I am at relative to the field in a lot of areas um and like obviously it's it's different because I was still able to watch people and learn from them, which is cool. And it feels like almost an advantage that I have that I got to just be quietly building. Kind of felt like where no one could see me. No one could know what I was doing. Very similar to the year that I was able to like make the big transition from like a teen athlete

to an actual elite athlete, which is a big, big job, like so much bigger than I ever expected. But that year was by far the year I made the most progress like ever in all areas. And this year kind of feels like it set me up the same. So I'm super excited. You've just been in the shadows training with the Jesus squad. Yes. As you're affectionately referred to as the Jesus squad. I will proudly accept that. All right.

You're not only the youngest athlete ever to go to the CrossFit Games, but you're the youngest athlete ever to win a world wide open event uh you you're um this is kind of a weird question but what are the just for the sake of like just the feeling of the athletes you've been around are the 14 to 15 year old athletes are those girls are you competing against girls or girls already women like those like when i look at the 14 to 15 year old boys i've seen pictures of james sprague next to um tutor magda and those are boys and now no one would ever accuse james sprague and tutor magda of being boys i guess i've never really thought about it. Like in my mind, they're just competitors. Um, and even when I was like, really, you weren't like, you didn't, you weren't, you

didn't get to the games and be like, Oh shit, these are women. No, not at all. Um, okay. I'm a pony. And then now there's horses all around me. I just really reminded myself that I earned the right to be there just like they all did. Like I don't even really like talking about things that I've done in the past. I don't like resting on any of that.

And I kind of apply the same like view to everybody else. And I have so much respect for what the top athletes have accomplished in the past. So many years of success that I feel like I can learn from and be inspired by, but not intimidated by because it's in the past. And even Tia at the Games doesn't win events because she's Tia. She doesn't win the CrossFit Games just because she's won it before. Like every year that's reset. Every event, like really it starts new. I mean, this is 2018.

How old are you here? That would have been four years ago. So I was 14. That's – I don't really know why I posted that I would never I know why you posted it so we so the all the guys in the room could be like okay what uh I need to contact uh Matt and you're doing your own programming here yes I was yeah send me that please send me that I need to get on that that wasn't the best plan um I just I knew what I was pretty good to me and I thought the approach was to do a lot of that and like the longer I've done this

the more I feel like I truly don't know um I'm so grateful for my coaches who like do know these things and can answer my questions. Like I used to just be so stubborn in accepting that like my way is the only way. And I just really didn't want to give up control. But as soon as I finally did, which I'm so grateful I did, like working with Matt has been the best choice I've ever made. And like, I started asking these questions, learning more and more and like the more I know, the more I feel like I don't know. So it's cool. And that's one of the things I think I love the most about CrossFit is just feeling like

there's always something to improve, whether that's just like learning, whether that's practicing, whether that's going a second faster, like I will always be improving. Like, and I have so many different things I can do that in. And that's, that's one of the big things that drives me. There's a quote. There's a quote you say that you always want to win. But and I'm paraphrasing, but you're also very capable at enjoying your improvements. Yeah. Yeah. That is something that. That's a delicate balance, right?

It is. And that's still something that I feel like I delicate balance, right? It is. And that's still something that I feel like I'm trying to find and trying to balance. Something I've learned pretty recently is that every day can't be just laser focused on winning. And I was given a book a few years ago, and it's called Chopwood Carrywater. And I love to read anything sports psychology. And so I was like, this is cool. And it's written like a children's book, which I was actually very disappointed to see at first because I was like this. I mean, how can I learn from a story?

But it was actually just the coolest thing. And it follows this man named John along his journey to become a samurai. And he has a sensei who guides him. And like one of my, yeah. 2,800 five-star reviews, Joshua Medcalf. But one of my favorite stories is when John is, he's just so focused on the end result and it's like he is gaining all of his motivation from that end result and he's missing so many things he can do in the moment to make himself better like he's making so many mistakes he is i mean so many oversights he's just missing so many things and the sensei tells him when you have one eye on the end result you only have one eye for the journey keep both eyes on the process that that hit me hard um i feel like even at the granite games

kind of going back to the last event when i took the risk of trying to go unbroken on the overhead walking lunges i didn't have to do that to win the Granite Games. I wasn't aware of what was going on around me. I wasn't aware of the pretty sizable lead I had on who I needed to beat. I was just so laser-focused on winning that I didn't win. I made choices that pushed me to physical failure and didn't allow me to win. By the way, people,

that's why this podcast is called the air to the throne has arrived. You just fucking heard it go. Sorry. Darn it. One swear, one swear word. I have to mark it once where we're one down. Sorry, Mr. Kerry, that won't happen again. And I feel like I can apply that in training. We're one down. Sorry, Mr. feel like, you know, you just are under pressure all of the time. You have to go into every workout with expectations to like be the best at this given workout at any given time throughout the season. And like, there's a lot wrong with that. Obviously it's exhausting and it's not maintainable for the longterm. Um, but also it takes away detail.

Like it takes away my attention to detail from the little things. Like I might be trying to get the fastest time I possibly can in this workout when really what I need to do is work on bigger sets of my chest to bar. Um, like maybe I could go five seconds faster in this workout and completely miss the intent. Um, and for so long I made mistakes like that, just thinking like focused only on winning and only letting winning drive me like winning the CrossFit games, like overall winning instead of like winning at the little things in training. Um, cause every day in training, I can't control winning the games, but I can control like making this next snatch, my best snatch of the day. Like I can control being connected to the

bar and staying over the bar or whatever the cue I'm thinking about, or I can control the speed of my transition. Um, so that's, that balance is something that I've really been working on because I do think it's important to be motivated by your long-term goal. Oh yeah. Um, but I, at the same time, I'm not somebody who really struggles with motivation. Like I feel like I always have motivation. I am not afraid to suffer. I am not afraid to sacrifice can as early as I can in the workout like when really what I might need to do is be smarter approaching the workout maybe pace this workout better um so that balance is hard and I sure can't say I get it perfect every time but that's been one of my biggest improvements in the last few months I get a pass from dad. Thank you. Thank you. Wipe that bead of sweat away. Um, uh, I've interviewed a lot of athletes. Um, and, uh, the one that really stands out to me,

that was one of the most confident athletes that I ever interviewed was, uh, Samuel Cornwall over there at Mayhem. And when I, uh, when I was done with the interview, he had convinced me that he was going to win the games. I just, I mean, not that he was trying to do that, but like, I was like, whoa, this, this guy's gnarly. Um, and, uh, when I watch all of your content, um, you, you may, I think you might be the most confident person I've ever, I've ever heard speak about yourself. It's not, there's no, it's not, there's no, it's not braggadocious, but it is a, it's quite profound. I mean, you really, really believe in yourself, your talk. I believe that a lot of the talk that we hear when you speak is not only the talk you're speaking to us, but you're giving us insight into your internal talk.

You're not giving us – like you're letting the inside out, and it's like, holy shit, this is how she talks to herself. And yet you said about – with that probably comes a shitload of trying to be control, and you were saying you gave that – you've learned to give some of that control away, for example, with your relationship with the Brute Strength Camp and Matt Torres. Do you have to sacrifice confidence to – as you give away control? Can you keep both? Are those two related? They seem like they would be really related. Yeah, I have so much more confidence working with Matt. You do?

Okay. So much more confidence working with Matt. You do? Okay. So much more. When I programmed for myself, I thought that confidence was like, I'm doing everything I can, truly everything I can, just because of the amount of volume I was doing, just because of what I could pack into a day of training. And it was like, and I think this is right. But with Matt, I can have full confidence that what I'm doing is right. Right for me specifically. Like it's not a cookie cutter program. It's a relationship of like almost three years at this point.

Wow. It's a lot of lows like improvements that i never thought were possible to happen so fast um and not that speed is everything but everybody's improving so i mean that is how you set yourself apart like that is how you climb up the leaderboard is by getting better faster than other people. Um, and like knowing, knowing the progress I've made in the past and having the trust that like, not only are we doing the same thing now following the same process, like foundationally, it's so much better now that I'm here in Naples, like that working with Matt just remotely is the first best decision I've ever made. Second best is moving to

Naples. Uh, and I mean, I guess, cause I would have to put them in that order, but it's, it's amazing here. I love everything about the training environment. Um, and we've made some just big changes in how I approach training. Like more is not better. Faster is not always better. More suffering is not always better. Like I understand the need for, I mean, zone two stuff in my training now, when in the past, if I saw a zone two written, I would kind of completely ignore it and be like, oh, cool, like a 40 minute time trial run instead of like, like, like almost like that wasn't for people who were serious. Like, OK, go do that in your affiliate. You zone tuners, zone tours. Yes. And seriously, just feeling like I needed to suffer as much as I possibly could to get as much better as I possibly

could. By the way, it makes sense. It's not like you weren't, you were out in left field. It makes sense. I bet you, I think there's a lot of us, as you say that, I'm like, yeah, that's when I found CrossFit at 34. That's what I was doing. Pack in as much as I can and just hurt as much as I can. Yes.

Another big change we have made is the intention that I'm able to lift with now. And it's really crazy that I got as strong as I did, um, working with Matt remotely with some of the habits I had. Um, and like, it's embarrassing to admit, but I just don't want other people to make the same mistake. I remember one day when I missed a snatch 17 times before going down and wait. Like it was almost a badge of that's awesome. Trying as hard as I could.

And I think it is awesome because it shows, it shows that I care. And like, it shows that I don't give up, but it also is dangerous and it reinforces bad positions. Cause I mean, I'm missing those lifts for a reason. And I, it takes so much energy away from the day and the week of training.

Um, so I mean, stuff like that, that I always thought was okay. Like I still had confidence doing that because it's like, well, I'm doing everything I could. But when I got onto the competition floor, it was like, you know, every training day, I probably have, I don't know, two or three times the amount of misses that I have makes. It's so much harder to trust that in competition. I have makes, it's so much harder to trust that in competition. So, and I mean, the strategies I would use in my training, really just kind of in general before coming to Naples, it was like, let's just start fast and see what happens. I remember pretty recently, I've asked Matt like, oh, should I just like start fast and kind of just see what happens, see if I can hold on.

And Matt was like, I don't think you should ever just see what happens. Like, I think you should feel like, you know, what's going to happen. And I was like, wow, like not only am I going to get more out of my training, I will have more confidence and competition because I've seen what happens using that exact strategy with success and training. that exact strategy with success and training. Um, instead of like practicing failed lifts, practicing failed strategies, like failing so often can be good and it can be valuable lessons. But when you refuse to learn from them, like you're getting nothing out of that. So I think those changes, I mean, the programming change a few years ago and then so much more recently moving to Naples, I'm a completely different athlete with a lot more real confidence.

Not just hope, but actual confidence at this point. 2021. And you said, um, people were talking about doing the workout that you want in the worldwide open. People were talking about doing 10 minutes and that was a super fast time. And then you dropped the text in there. I'm going to go sub nine or I'm going to go nine. Yeah. Um, that, how does that fit in with what Matt Torres is saying to not let the wheels fall off the bus? Is it because it's just the open and you could get another shot with it? But in your defense, you did say in this interview that I was watching that you calculated each rep out. You're like, OK, one second. OK, I can do this.

Yes. I had actually done a workout with 24 inch burpee box jump overs. So like a little bit higher. I knew that would be a little slower and a little bit more taxing um and heavier dumbbell snatch so i had a decent idea of what it should feel like um when you wrote that were you like i'm not saying this i'm guessing if she said this so give me a pass here guys were you like oh shit, oh, shit, I can't believe I just text that? Like was a part of you was like, who's typing this? No, I was. No?

Like I wrote in my journal that I was going to win this workout. Wow. And I was like, I just had that confidence and really a peace that this was going to be a very good workout for me. And I mean, ultimately I can't control whether or not my best possible execution, best effort, best strategy leads to a win. And like, that can be hard to accept that I could do everything right and still not win. Um, but sometimes, I mean, you just have this confidence in your ability that's scary. And it's like, nothing can take this from me. And that workout was a feeling like that.

And I remember telling Matt, like, I was going to go sub-9. And I think his text was, I'm excited to watch. And just to know that I had his belief as well was amazing. been a big thing in my life too to be around people who um believe in me and so you throw this dream out there um you know like elon musk says he's going to build a rocket and go to mars and if he people i'm sure poo-pooed him right and you you put this dream out there that that you're that you're going to be you know go to the crossfit games that you want to win what's it look like when someone, and I, and I've surrounded myself with people who believe me, the three that come to

mind the most, um, these days are definitely my mom, my sister and my wife. Um, and, and, and now the team that I have on the podcast, uh, Matt Souza, but, um, what do you, what did you do? I've had people that I've had long relationships with where I I start to sense that they don't believe in me both boys and girls and and and there and there has been a separation between us have you have you experienced that I have like some and they were some long-term relationships yeah and that can be a painful thing, but I have viewed it as fuel to prove them wrong. And like, I haven't always been able to do that. I mean, sometimes you have this like really crazy idea that you fully believe, you know, it's crazy, but you fully believe you can

do it. And like, you have to expect that there will be people who think it's crazy and impossible. you have to expect that there will be people who think it's crazy and impossible. And sometimes, like, not that they're right, but sometimes it just maybe doesn't happen your first attempt. And I don't, I can't think of any friendships that I have had and just because I didn't feel, like, fully believed in. Because ultimately that has to come from me. Like it doesn't matter how much people around me believe in me if I don't believe in myself.

Right, right. And just like reminding myself that like I need to believe in me. I want Matt to believe in me. And like I have trust that he will. I mean, because of like the training we do, because of how we work together, because of who he is, because of who I am. I mean, there are factors that I think you have to earn people believing in you. I mean, like if I, I can't even think of an example, but maybe if I wanted to go

to the Olympics and gymnastics or whatever, and people were like, you know, what have you ever done? Like when I was little, it was like, what have I ever done to make myself someone worth believing in for that dream? And the answer was nothing. So like, of course people didn't believe it then. Um, and I mean, even, even now, if I said something like that, like that would just be unrealistic. But if that was something I wanted bad enough,

I wouldn't care about anybody else's opinions. Um, and like, obviously that's not something I want. That's not a goal I had, but it used to be something that felt important to me, even though I had no idea what it would take. And like, I didn't even do gymnastics. Uh, it was just something, something I viewed as cool. And I think that there's a big difference between whenever you earn somebody's belief in you and maybe, maybe they don't choose to show that belief in you. And like, you just have to be okay with that. Right. Maybe kind of just distance yourself from them. Um, like I have had to do a little bit more, um, or I mean,

it's, it can kind of just be like a check to yourself to be like, okay, like, what can I do better? Like, what does this person maybe see that I don't, that maybe they can help me with? Like, maybe they can bring to my attention. And it's like, if I could do these things better, then I could believe in myself more because ultimately that's what matters. Um, but I think that sometimes there's lessons that you can learn from the doubts that other people have. Yes. Close people. Um, yes. Things

I read in comments or whatever, it's like, okay, like this isn't worth my time and energy, but it can still be a little bit of fuel to prove them wrong. Right. Right. Are you an only child? Yes. And your parents are still together? Yes. And how did your leaving home – your dad gave up his shop 40 by 60 feet. Yeah. To build you this gym.

He designed the bars. I mean he basically built it. It's the – what's your dad's name? Mike. Mike. The Mike Carey version of the Rogue set. I mean it's – he built – and then how do you tell your parents i'm going to florida how does that did that i mean they must be they must have been tripping um i actually or

do they hide it from you you can't tell me they weren't tripping i'll just think they hid it from you i came to a brute camp down here in naples i believe it was december of 2020 how old were you December of 2020. How old were you? 16, I believe. By yourself, you went down there? No, my parents came with me. Ah, smart, Mike, smart. Yeah. And on the flight back, I remember like, I was looking at, I mean, we were sitting on the plane, we hadn't taken off yet. And like, I was looking at colleges on my phone here in Naples. Um, and like, hadn't talked to Matt about this or anything. And like, my dad just kind of glanced over my shoulder and saw what I was looking at. And like, I just remember kind of the feeling of panic that it's like, Oh, like we are such a close family. I don't know how he's going to take this,

but then I look at. You're clearly his everything. I mean, you're clearly his everything. Yeah. But he just like, he smiles so big. And then we spend the flight home just like dreaming about this. And at this point it felt, it didn't feel like the most realistic thing, but it was like, I knew that this is where I needed to be and it was clear so early that I had his support um and like I'm not in college right now I just chose to go all in on CrossFit and I mean that's kind of been another common question I've gotten is like how did your parents react when you said you weren't going to go to college because I always, I mean, prioritized my education, worked very hard, did well in school. And it came as a shock to a lot of family members,

not my parents, but in closer friends. And just the shock on people's faces when I tell them it was my dad's idea for me not to go to college or at least not to go to college right now so I could chase my CrossFit dreams to the very best of my ability like what was it his idea or was he letting you off the hook did he sense like like hey this has got to be a heavy burden on her I'm gonna let her off the hook it was definitely his idea. And he was, he, that means he really believes in you. I mean, that's crazy. Almost had to convince me not to. Um, and it was, I just remember us having this conversation. Like it all depends on how you define success. Because at this point, when we were having this conversation, I wanted to be a doctor. success because at this point when we were having this conversation I wanted to be a doctor um and he was like is that how you define success or is like chasing your passion winning the crossfit games getting to inspire people through doing that like getting to see just how good you

can become just how far you can take this like how do you define success because i mean either one of them are great options like neither of them are guaranteed of course but like which one do you want to give your all in pursuing because you really can't do both and how old how old were you when you When you had this conversation, probably 17. Right. Bingo. Like magic. Yeah. Um, so,

and then, and then you won the CrossFit and sorry, and then you qualified for the CrossFit games and took 16th place. Yes. Um, so kind of affirming, kind of affirming. Oh shit. She made the right choice.

Yes, very much. So I am very, I mean, grateful isn't even a strong enough word for what I feel towards my parents. Everything they've done for me, everything that they've made possible. And I think even getting older now, I see that more. And even just the sacrifices

that both of my parents made for me so I would be the best equipped to chase this dream. They never pushed me to do it, and they really can't push me to do it. At this level, it can't be anybody else's passion, but your own when you take it to such a high level. Like, I think I was around, like just when I was in school, a lot of kids whose parents pushed them to play sports, like they played the sports for their parents, not, not for their passion, not for their fulfillment. Um, and I was never made to feel like that. Like this was a hundred percent my dream. But like the lessons they taught me, the opportunities they gave me, like, that's why I am where I am today. And like, obviously I have worked hard,

but I wouldn't be anywhere close to where I am today without my parents. And like, they deserve so much of this credit. Yeah. The parents are definitely the, the, the soil, right. That the seed and the sprout and the, and the tree grows from. Yeah. And the, and the seed and the soil and the seed and the plant and the tree might have to do all the work to grow, but man, without a good soil, she could get weird quick what what year were you born 2004 2004 holy cow on cinco de mayo may 5th

for those of you who don't know spanish uh lots of lots of boys at brute yeah especially especially in the beginning um when you get there i i saw this picture uh and i'm like holy cow um um no sorry i they say lots of boys, only boys. Oh, that was the camp I was talking about from 2020. Oh, that's the camp. There wasn't another female in that camp? No. Why is that? Did you have to qualify to be in that camp? No, these were just the athletes that Matt coached.

the athletes that Matt coached. And, and so what happened this camp? You, you see it advertised on the internet and you send your check for $569 and then you get to go there for three days and train or how, what is it? What do you mean? What is this? Are the athletes that Matt, these are the teenage athletes that Matt coached, um, at this time. And we were all just invited and we found a date and like that was the weekend that was like i am 100 moving to naples haven't even asked matt but like i just i just knew it was the right choice at that point um just for myself can you tell me who these guys are we'll start at the uh the guy with the beard on the left and move over who's that uh that's coach dom okay i've heard a lot about him and this guy um the picture is kind of small, but I believe that's Cole Grayshaber and he is longer coached by Matt. Okay. Dallin Pepper. Yep. Jimmy. Yeah. Emma

Carey. Yes. Tudor Magda. I'm going to see if I can zoom this in yes that's tutor um and then the next one is ethan tate who um moved here like with the big group um i think he was here about six months and he still works with matt but just remotely um and then this is k. And then the next one is Braden. And I believe. And Matt Torres on the end. Yes. And he's tall. Matt still works with Kyle just remotely. I could be wrong.

Um, and then maybe Dom works with Braden. Is, is the barn at your house. I'm still a gym. Um, no, actually my dad has,

well, it was, Oh shit. You're gone. you're gone you're gone all right bye bye Emma have fun um and he can retire from being a state trooper I believe I think he has been like 28 or 29 years now um in March and then he wants to move to maybe not specifically Naples but somewhere very close to here yeah it'll be good to have him down here oh my goodness oh my goodness it's like a storybook you your dad took up CrossFit first in the family. You were 10 years old. Then was it you or then your mom? Who went second? And then a couple months later, my mom.

Okay. So Mike, Emma, what's your mom's name? Marla. Marla. I wonder why they didn't give you an M name. You know what I mean? Yeah. Like Mike, Michelle, and Marla.

And before we all diverge here for a second, and you're very close with your mom. You trained with your mom quite a bit, right? Not. Or she would watch you train? Often, yeah. Actually, both of my parents were very involved with just being in the gym with me, like being there to support me, cheer me on. She'd always count for me. Anytime my dad's work schedule would allow, as soon as I started working with Matt, he would actually do a lot of my training with me.

And that, like some of my best CrossFit memories just in general are of training with him, just because that was so special. But I can remember so many early mornings when I trained before school, late nights, after school and homework. I was running on four or five hours of sleep, and this was not good at all, but I was like, this is how I get my training. I like it. I like it. was not good at all but i was like this is how i get my i like it i like it and like my mom would wake up early with me she'd stay up late with me and like be over in the freezing cold gym um just just because she didn't want me to chase this dream alone um to give your daughter by the way there's probably no prouder moment for a dad like Like every time you beat him, he was probably so proud. I mean, to see your offspring surpass you is like the greatest thing ever. My kids did it at five.

I know he'll be okay with me sharing this because he shared it with quite a few people. But whenever he first started like just training with me, my weights were so light for him. Like I remember him just making everything look so easy. And like, I was almost frustrated with how fast he could move it. Like he wasn't struggling, but I was struggling. Um, but you were 10. He was a grown ass man. Oh, actually I was 15. This was right when I started working okay okay so this I mean the progress though just happened so fast and like I know he'll be okay with me sharing this but I remember the first time I believe it was a snatch that he failed that I had just hit how

proud he was because he was like you're stronger than me like, in a lot of ways, I am not. Um, he is just, he's got the dad strength going on. Um, let me tell you, he wants you to be twice as strong as him and everything. It's every dad's dream for their, their boys and girls to be, to be twice as strong. But we've just had a lot of cool moments like that. Yeah. It's awesome. And your tenure. So, so at 10, you start at 12, you start doing your own programming and at 15 you run into Matt Torres.

Yes. But before we get in there into Matt Torres, you're 10 years old and you're clearly a girl, right? And you have to pass and now you're, how old are you now? 18, 18. And you have to pass through puberty when, when we, when we think of, and that's sort of why the leap, I think, and correct me if I'm wrong. I think that's why the leap for some reason for boys from the teens to the individual is probably because they go through those hormonal changes later than girls or something. The leap seems to be harder for the boys to make. Some scientist needs to

get a hold of you because there's got to be so few women who are pushing their body so hard as it went through those hormonal changes. And it's kind of hard to ask you about it because it's all, you know, but was there an age in there where you were like, Oh, something like something like where you made your greatest leaps and you're like, okay, something, um, I'm making these massive leaps and I'm turning into a woman. Like there's something hormonal going on. I don't know what it is with women, but with boys, it would say like your testosterone, your testosterone levels would go. Is there a time when window where you're like, okay, I'm so glad I started at 10. I became proficient in the movements because by the time I was 13 to 15,

I was going through puberty and, and, and, and I got, you know, woman strength. Did you kind of see what I'm looking for? Like give any insight into that? Yes. And do you think it happened earlier because you were training? I know it's just you, you can look at, but do you think it affected you hormonally as opposed to like, if you wouldn't have been doing pushing yourself to the outer limits as you went through that, you know, transition? I truly don't know. Like, of course, because I can only look at you. Yeah. Um, but I definitely think like the period of time when I gained the most strength, which was like, right when I started working with Matt was like, it w it was that of course, just better programming like smart programming that is a

linear progression from week to week not just like doing as much as I could um it was having time to just focus on like really only on my weakness which was at this time was strength um because the games were canceled for COVID. Um, this year, like my school was also canceled, um, because of COVID. So like we went, were you stoked? Yeah, I really was. So you could just train, right? Yes. Like online school, I could do that early or late or between sessions, just everything was on my own schedule. So I was getting more sleep. Um, at that point, I also got my nutrition more dialed in. Um, so that was a period of time when I was like, I am getting so much stronger, so fast. Like there were a couple months that it felt like

every time I touched the barbell was like a 10 to 20 plus pound PR. It was like, 10 to 20 plus pound pr it was like just super fast adaptations yes um so i don't i really can't say fuck hormones it's matt torres sorry darn it i did it again how many times have i dropped f bombs my goodness seven you're horrible so i feel like at that point there were a lot of factors that contributed to like a very fast improvement. And my opinion is that the biggest factor was just smart programming finally. And up until that point, it had just been like consistent improvement. How about your dad? Did your dad get better with using Matt Torres' programming? Yes, he did.

I was able to do all of it with me. Yeah, because he's old. He's a dad. He can only do little bits. We can only do little bits. And that too. But he did – I mean his weaknesses are, of course, a lot different than mine. So him working on strength is not – if he wanted to compete, that is not necessarily the route he would take.

Um, and I don't think he has really the desire to compete. Um, you're too nice. Listen, you can beat your dad. Doesn't your dad so proud of you can say anything you want about him. He's us.

Dads are like rubber. Anything our kids say just bounces off of us. Yeah. Uh, but he definitely got a lot better during that time too. Your grandpa made you your box jumps yes nuts yes um i was actually those boxes are here in naples um like we a lot of us brought down like a little bit of equipment for the brood gym um and i was just looking he he

has this little stamp he like burned into the wood and it says handcrafted by Stan Carey, Christmas of 2015. And it's just so crazy how fast that time's gone. So the Christmas day, he pulls the truck up to the house and unloads them out the back and you're like, oh my, you had no idea? I think that's actually what I asked for. You know, you're a weird girl. If you, if for Christmas, someone brings you a wooden box, there's nothing in it just so you could jump on it. Yeah. Um, that was for so long, like my gifts were gym equipment, like rower assault bike. I mean, it was like family members just going together to get me this stuff along with like my parents.

But yeah, there were it was always a funny conversation, like people at school, like teachers. It was like, what did you get for Christmas? And I'd be like a D ball and they'd be like, what's that? And I'd be like, it's a big weighted ball. And like they might be the shitty basketball. I don't know, like a little a little. Oh, how much does it weigh? And I'm like, oh, 100 pounds. And they're like, that might be the shitty basketball. I don't know, like a little, a little. Oh, how much does it weigh? And I'm like, oh, 100 pounds.

And they're like, that's more than you. And I'm like, so like it was it was a fun time, but some awkward conversations at school for sure. there are, um, the, the athletes, there's a lot of athletes that have been through, um, some, some pretty hard times that's put, that's pushed them into like, like they found the pain cave, not through fitness, but through other, other things have put them there. Right. So we know that there's a huge contingent of people who are like former heroin addicts or methamphetamine addicts, and they turn to running. Running seems to be like a good transition for them right triathlons ultra marathons you'll see that they've had these pretty hard uh backgrounds or or alcoholism or they just something bad happened a tragedy in their family but they have a pain cave they have this emotional

high and i always suspect that they to revisit that or to mitigate that or to process that is why they've turned to CrossFit or to these things. Do you know what fuels you? It could even be something as simple as I asked Jason Kalipa, do you know what happened? What are you trying to prove? What are you trying to prove? And he said something along the lines was on graduation day in front of all the families there and all the kids in his class, the principal made a joke about him about not being smart. And he said that really hurt him. Is there anything that you kind of circle around?

There have for sure been some little things um but i don't feel like i feel like any motivation that i've gotten from a comment like that has been short term i mean it's been just like a little spark of like i'm angry not, you're not running from something. Yeah. Like maybe I'm upset at this person or not upset at this person, but just upset that this person might not believe in me or might've said something hurtful about me. So I can just throw all of that rage into a couple of workouts. But it's like, to me, that's something I just move on from. Um, and like, even if I'm kind of try to hold onto that, cause there have been times that I've been like, I need to be motivated, motivated by some sort of like rage or anger. Like, I mean, that was kind of what you'd see in, I don't know, movies or something just like that would be the driving factor,

like behind why people could push themselves so hard. But I quickly figured out that that wasn't really what worked for me. You were forcing it. You were experimenting. Yes. And it did feel very forced when it was like I tried to force a kind of anger. When like in, I don't feel like I train with anger at anybody. I mean, for a while, maybe it was anger at like the situation with a back injury, forcing me, I mean, causing me not to have a 2022 season. Like that was a situation that made me very angry for a very long time.

Um, and whenever I tried to use that, that fire, it felt like it just felt so short term and it felt like it wasn't as strong. Um, but whenever, instead of anger, I started viewing those emotions and like channeling those emotions as a desire to make the best of the situation, like a desire to maximize the opportunity that I've been given of having extra time to work on my weaknesses, like a desire to honestly not let this pain, like this emotional pain and physical pain that I experienced missing out on so much, not let that go to waste. Um, and whenever, whenever I think about purpose and when I think about improvement, like, and winning, I mean, kind of like what I said earlier about, I'm still trying to find that balance, um, of not, not focusing so much on winning that it takes away my ability to do so. But whenever I think about just like my effort, my intention, my passion, like my desire to improve and just test how good I can become, that's what fuels me so much more.

Like, I feel like I'm moving towards something rather than away from a problem or away from an emotion that I've had that, I mean, whenever, even when I think about like some of the things that some of like the short term, like I'm angry that somebody made this comment, I'm going to be a much happier person if I don't let comments people make about me get under my skin. Um, like to a point, I think you can use them for fuel, but it's like, whenever you're reading them, whenever you continue to think about them, I almost feel like you're internalizing that. And like, you don't want that to be how you talk to yourself. You don't want that to start to become what you think about yourself and what you believe. Um, so yeah, like that, that's not what works for me, but I think

I'm getting closer to finding the balance of what does. And that's, those are maybe more positive emotions. Then what, what is the, um, you're, you're, you're crazy goal-oriented, right? Would you say that? Yes. Sorry. You went – yes? Yes. Yeah.

To a point that I think that you said in the beginning of the interview, you can be so goal-oriented that you can forget about the journey. Yes. And so somehow, do you see yourself inside your head winning the CrossFit Games? Yes. You do. I visualize that as much as I can. I remember I competed as a teen in 2019 and won the 14-15 division. And won the 14-15 division.

So even then, I was 100% there to win. Not in a healthy, balanced way mentally. But it was win or fail. Nothing in between. And it worked. That mental headspace is kind of immature and really limiting long term um but it worked because i did win like if i wouldn't have won it would have been very toxic but i like you have to do that anyway and take the risk like you have to take the do you have to climb do you have to create that vision and if it's toxic it's toxic shit, it's the only like there's thin air in Everest and I got to go up there.

I think so. I think I think I'm still learning that. And I don't. Like, I think I'm still finding the level, like the maximum level of, of, of obsession that I can have for my best performance. Um, but leading up to the 2019 games, I would write my visualizations out and I still do this. And I just, I remember like after every sentence I would write because I am the fittest on earth. And like, I still read this sometimes, even though it was a while ago. But, like, I hear my name called.

Because this is, like, for the award ceremony. Like, I hear my name called Blast because I am the fittest on earth. Like, I step up on top of the tallest podium because I am the fittest on earth. Like, I feel the weight of the gold medal around my neck because I am the fittest on earth. Like I feel the gold medal, the weight of the gold medal around my neck because I am the fittest on earth. My face hurts from smiling because I am the fittest on earth. And I try to think of the other emotions, like the other things that go behind that. So like when I see myself in my mind, go behind that. So like when I see myself in my mind winning the CrossFit Games, like I see,

I see the award ceremony moment, but I try to also see like the moments where I might have an event went throughout the weekend or the moments where maybe I don't win the event, but I have like a big personal victory. Or I mean, even the moments when I face adversity in a way that I'm proud of, like that, that's what I'm thinking about the most right now, um, is like when that adversity inevitably happens in competition. Um, like I don't really feel like, I don't know if I will ever get through a competition and be like, wow, I think everything went exactly according to plan and the best it could have gone. Like, I think I or anybody else could win every single event and still not feel like that. Um, whenever that adversity does come, like I try to see myself, I try to just visualize myself and like, think about the emotions and all the senses I will

have in overcoming that in a way I'm proud of. And like what I'm working on now is applying that to training. Because like if I'm letting little things really bother me in training, like if I constantly feel like I've failed in training and I have trouble moving on from that, moving into my next training piece. Well, I'm going to have a lot of trouble doing that competition. And like the clearer it gets what I want to be able to do in competition, the more I know what I need to do in training to be as prepared for that as I can possibly be. You were about to say something about not only do you read these sentences because I'm the fittest, but you were going to say something. Were you going to say that you also feel it emotionally? You don't just say it. Were you going to say something about how when you're doing this, you go there emotionally?

I don't know what I was going to say there, but I try to think about how I will feel. Like those feelings of pride and of satisfaction and just like the fulfillment. Why are you doing this? Who told you to do this? There's some things I think I've read I've done a lot of reading and I think that there's other things that I've just found work for me um and then there's like other habits that I've had that now I'm learning don't really work for me that like that can be hard to let go of but I find that when I'm like connected to a moment that I want to happen, like a moment that I'm working to make happen on a very deep level,

like so much that I can feel it, like feel it deeply before it's even happened. It makes the frustration of training, the pain of training, like the sacrifice so much more bearable, um, in the really, really hard moments. Like I remember not even that long ago, I mean, a few months ago, but being on a rower and not holding the paces I wanted and feeling, feeling that my lower back was just so tired. Um, really because

I hadn't been rowing, um, like the injury made it so it throwing was painful and very aggravating. Um, so, I mean, that was something I took a lot of months completely off of. I felt weak. I felt so far away from where I used to be. It was like the first time I had ever asked myself the question, like, is this worth it? I have. And in that moment, I just felt so overwhelmed because I have so far at, in that moment, I had so far to go to get back to where I was and where I was, wasn't anywhere close to good enough to win. So like even farther to go. And that was so, that was frustrating. That was discouraging. That was like a lot of feelings that probably make people quit. Um, like not quit in a workout,

but I mean, just quit believing in themselves and like, quit even wanting to believe in themselves, like knowing what it would take. Um, and I found like to get myself out of that mind, that frame of mind, which was really negative and like, honestly affected me for like way longer than I should have let it. for like way longer than I should have let it, I had to think about better feelings. Like I had to think about feelings that are so powerful, like feelings of joy, like the feelings I know I will have when I accomplish my goal that make these feelings of frustration and disappointment and just sadness feel so small in comparison you're you're almost like a master manipulator of yourself like it's like

or or maybe you're like a car you're you're like a really advanced car mechanic and you're the car it's it's it's really a trip hearing you talk it's like listening to a self-help car it's it's it's really a trip hearing you talk it's like listening to a self-help book it's it's it's really cool i love self-help books really do appreciate that um i just want to say i'm very much a work in progress like i didn't realize how many insecurities I had until like this injury forced out. Like it, it, it felt like it took so much of my identity away and like kind of turned everything upside down that I've ever thought about myself. And this is really the first podcast that I've gotten to do since I feel like I have changed my thinking or at least I'm like attempting to change my thinking. So like it's I feel like I'm in kind of a very cool part of my life where I'm learning every single day, like kind of in a place like in between two things that I trust are

really good. Like like you are a caterpillar and now you're in the cocoon and you're like, you can't wait to see the butterfly come out. Yes, exactly like that. Like 2021, that was really good. Like highs and lows, lots of disappointment, but a lot of lessons really good. And I kind of thought I had it all together. Like I kind of thought I knew everything there was to know. I knew who I was. I knew exactly who I wanted to be.

And then that was all taken from me. And it was like, who am I now? Like, I don't feel like I have anything left of me. That is good. Um, and like that,

it was, it was honestly months of that. And now it's even like, and you stayed in Naples for all that? Yes. Do you call home a lot when that happens? There were some feelings that I just kind of kept to myself and tried to work through. Matt helped me a lot.

Matt was a very, very patient person. me a lot. Matt was a very, very patient person. And I like, I am not near as patient with myself as Matt is with me. Like, there are so many days that I'm like, I don't understand how it is possible to be this patient. I'm just so grateful. I mean, it was the same conversations again and again, like same struggles, same questions. And like, finally, I think I and like we, Matt and I just kind of had to accept like, I don't really know who I am yet. And I don't even have like the very clearest picture of who I want to be. And like almost do that in an exciting way. That's like, I can develop so much right now. And I hope, I hope I never stopped learning and trying to develop who I am as a person. And I don't think that I will, like, I don't want to let that happen. I want to just

always be a work in progress. But I feel like now more than ever, I'm like, I just am feeling like there's a lot I don't know in general, but also about myself and that I'm learning that. And I kind of have like almost a clean slate to create something better and to think better and to like handle adversity better. to think better and to like handle adversity better. Um, like I always thought I would be somebody who handled adversity, like, like the injury, um, really, really well. And what I thought was well, I now understand is unrealistic. Like, of course you're going to be upset. Of course, of course there will be frustration and discouragement. And I feel like the most mature person would have that. But there were a lot of other things that it was like I wasn't very proud of the way that I handled my emotions in like a moment of feeling really overwhelmed either with like not competing, which was hard to not only watch people compete, but watch people train to compete. Like that was harder was like, cause I love training and to, I mean, be doing like upper body accessory work and biking, like

alternating days of that for a long time. Like that was very hard. And there were a lot of times, like I didn't handle those struggles maybe in the best way. And like for a while I was just like, well, maybe this is who I am and I don't like who I am. And for a while, I was just like, well, maybe this is who I am and I don't like who I am. But then I kind of started thinking about it in terms of like, there was an event at Rogue last year with strict handstand pushups and I got last. I did not know my strict handstand pushups were that bad.

Wow, that's a tough place to find out. Yeah, but I wasn't like, wow, I'm always going to be terrible at strict handstand pushups. Like this is just how they are instead. It was like, wow, it really hurts. I think I dropped from sixth to 12th in one event. Um, I could be wrong on that, but it like that really hurt. That was really painful, but it was like, at least we know now, like how much better to find out now when we have the whole off season to work on it. Um, and like, I started even viewing my mental just shortcomings and failures kind of in the same way, not like my ability is fixed and like, I'm disappointed and I can't do anything about it. Just kind of you using that disappointment to feel urgency to be better,

um, like physically, mentally everything, because even though it felt like competition was so far, just like it almost felt like it would never get here. And now I think what it plays is 81 days away, which is less than three months. So,

I mean, that's, and that, and that's your coming out party. What a Palooza. Yeah. Um, can you,

sorry, go ahead. No, no, no. I like, even, even when competition felt so far away,

obviously I knew it was coming. And it was like, I wanted to use this time to the best of my ability to prepare. And like the deeper into dealing with this injury and like with everything mental that comes along with any injury in any sport, I'm sure like the more that I realized how much of this off season and and very long off-season of improvement needed to be mental rather than physical for me to be the best I could be. Can you walk me – can you talk about your injury, like the 30 seconds before it happened and the 30 seconds after it happened? Can you tell me about that window? Yes. I was in Dubai and that was,

that was kind of when it feel like everything came together leading into Dubai. Um, and obviously like now looking back on it, that was kind of a weird way to feel because, I mean, nothing will ever be perfect going into a competition. Um, but it felt closer to perfect than anything had ever felt. Like I was completely healthy, no injuries, like no, no even recent nagging stuff that I've been dealing with. Um, you were, you were, how old were you at the time? 17. 17. So I just, it felt like that was going to be my breakthrough. I'd gotten 16th at the Games, 12th at Rogue. And obviously, the goal was to win.

The goal was always to win. But I knew I had a very realistic chance of getting on the podium and like, I, everybody knew that. I mean, not everybody I'm sure believed that. Um, but that was like the first time that I saw predictions, which I don't, at the time I did get a little bit caught caught up in what people maybe thought about me. And I don't get caught up in that anymore. But I saw some predictions where people thought I was going to get on the podium. And it was like, I'm going to have my breakthrough.

to have my breakthrough. Like this is where the lessons, like the pain from the granite games, just the lessons from the games of being like, this is my best strategy and everything. I'm just not good enough, um, to do what I want to do. Like, I was very proud of what I had done. Um, and then like the, like, I had some very consistent finishes at Rogue and then I had a couple terrible finishes at Rogue. And it was like good to find those big, big holes in my game. And it felt like all of that pain that I had experienced and the disappointment of the events leading up, this was where it was going to come together.

So sorry, that was kind of long but i felt no it's fine going into dubai and the first two events were running which was a big weakness for me it's something that's gotten a lot better that was on the inside this inside the man-made ski slope okay um i did very bad in both of those events just for my standards, like learned a lot from them. So, I mean, I can't view them only, but I was, that was the event where one of the girls went the wrong way and took you guys on the shortcut. Yes. That was awesome. That was kind of funny. Cause I think they told us it was going to be like a mile or something, but it took us like two minutes and I'm like, I did not base that quite right. Um, but were you the one, were you in the lead? Was that you who did that? No, that would be great. I would love to say I did that. I changed the whole event. I was like,

I was in the front and I just cut it short. But that was like those two events were disappointing, ready to have a better day. The next day started with the clean and jerk. You just got two attempts. I missed my second attempt. Matt did not get to come with me to Dubai, but like we had been FaceTiming a lot. And I'm sorry, I'm sorry, I'm sorry. We need Brian friend on this podcast. Actually, Tony, I was thinking we need your mom on this podcast. Maybe you could DM me your phone number. Okay, sorry. Go on. I apologize. You're good. And Matt, I, so the weights were in kilos, which kind of like, I'm not a hundred percent sure on these numbers, but I was going to attempt two 25 and two 31, two 25 felt so great. I skipped two 31, went right to two 37. Clean and jerk. Yes. Um, and that's, that's a way that I hit it rogue in a complex. Like I

had just practiced a lot of fails and training. Like I talked about earlier, I wasn't, had just practiced a lot of fails and training like I talked about earlier. So I wasn't, I wasn't a very consistent lifter. Um, so I mean, that was a disappointing event. So like I had three performances that I learned a lot from weren't great, but I knew all of, I think all of the events, the rest of the weekend and they were like very wheelhouse for me. Um, so it was like, I was very proud mentally of staying very level-headed throughout some disappointment better than I had really ever been able to do that

before. So it was like, overall, I was in a good place going into the chipper it was a 50 calorie row 40 a jumps um in a weight vest so that was with the block where you like squatted down to it jumped up to it oh right 30 sandbag cleans 20 bar muscle ups 10 deficit handstand push-ups and then back up back down the floor so like 20, 30, 40, 50. Um, and I believe I was first in my heat to the sandbag and it was like, I just, I remember how, how heavy was the sandbag? Um, yes. And one of those hot dog, one of the hot dog shaped ones. Um, no, this was actually like very well to what i used in training okay um and just remember how perfect everything felt in that moment it was like everything perfect this is my event and then it was i believe rep 13 of the sandbag clean when like part of the standard was that it couldn't go all the way over your i don't know why i'm demonstrating that was that it couldn't go all the way over. I don't know why I'm demonstrating that. Sorry.

It couldn't go all the way over your shoulder. And I had some, I was having some trouble stopping it on top of my shoulder because I, I don't think I'd ever even trained that. And like, I twisted weird with one rep and just like felt this pop in my back. And then all of a sudden you felt a pop. It was like shooting pain. I mean, it wasn't, I don't sudden you felt a pop it was like shooting pain i mean it wasn't i don't even know if a pop is right i don't think it was like explosion um

i don't know that's better shooting pain going down my legs and like as the workout went on, I felt less and less in control of my legs, which was very scary. Um, I, I finished, I mean, I got time capped on the last row, but I did continue to work through the workout. And like one of, I mean, it's a terrible feeling and I will like never, never forget how powerless I felt doing that. Like, I don't know if that feeling is a lesson that can be used for good. And I just haven't really found the feeling or haven't really put words to that lesson. Do you think you should have stopped? I do think I should have stopped. I definitely made it worse by continuing. Um, but I was trying to kick up on the parallettes for handstand pushups. And like, I had to try several times to even get myself on the parallettes. Like,

could you feel shit seizing up? Could you feel your back seizing up as, and I just wasn't really in control. And I was on the last set of 30 sandbag cleans and like falling. Um, like it was such a powerless feeling that, I mean, this sandbag was just throwing me around. Um, and that was when I really, I mean, the shooting pain should have been the first clue, but that was when I like really knew something was wrong. Um, and then like on the a jumps, I was, I mean, the block was not very not very tall but I mean I was falling off of it um and then just it was like I was aware that it was serious but kind of in denial about that tried to finish the event like it was not a good finish but I just remember like not caring at all

about the place I finished and like just just, I need to call Matt, like he'll know what to do. And I don't know, like, I don't really know what I was expecting when I called Matt and told him, but he was crying. Were you crying? Um, you were crying. Sorry. I talked over you. No, I was crying. And I remember he had to ask me to repeat what I said a couple of times. Um, cause he couldn't understand me, but he was just, and I was crying and I remember he had to ask me to repeat what I said a couple times because he couldn't understand me but he was just and I was like what do I need to do to continue and he was like I wouldn't recommend it and I was like you wouldn't recommend doing what and he was like you shouldn't go on with the weekend and I was just like what are you talking about like I

hadn't even considered that withdrawing was a possibility. And like as the night went on, it was very, very obvious that was the only choice. Did you wake up stiff as a board? Yes, it was. Like you're like, oh, how am I even going to get home? Yeah, the flight home was really rough after that. Did you break your back? The flight home was really rough after that. Did you break your back?

The MRI was never just the most conclusive, but there was like wedging in there. A lot of things I thought were- What is wedging? Two vertebrae touched each other? Honestly, a lot of it went over my head head and I wish I would have asked more questions. I felt like in shock for a long time after that, but there were quite a few things that the MRI showed and I don't know how many of them were related to that exact moment. to that exact moment. I hadn't been feeling any pain leading up to the event, but I think it's very unlikely that one sandbag clean at a hundred pounds, which I mean, normally I'm training with a 150 plus could have caused something so severe. I think it was years of like bad technique,

bad habits, a lot of misses, just not training smart. And that was just kind of like the last straw. But I don't know that. That's just kind of what makes sense to me. I did what I could for a couple months after that, which just was upper body. Like, sorry, sorry. Um, you, so you're injured, you're in your hotel room and this man who believed in you so much now tells you not to go on.

And that kind of, you, that, that's something weird. Cause he had always believed in you, but now he believes he's, you have to kind of make a little bit of shift. He still believes in you, but he believes he's looking have to kind of make a little bit of shift he still believes in you but he believes he's looking out for your best interest do you how by the time you wake up in the morning you're stiff as a board you can't even i'm guessing i mean i've had some crazy back pain i guess it was even hard to get out of bed and go to the bathroom that morning yeah and that's some scary shit if you've never had that happen before it was it was so scary like i couldn't imagine feeling okay ever again right right it

was like a bad acid trip well you probably never done that but yeah yeah um but i it was that describes it perfectly by the way when your back is that injured you're like oh it's gonna be like this forever i think i heard annie say that too i think we all any was any of us who have really injured our backs like oh i'm crippled it was very much just a matter of trust in matt and like i i really thought i could have fought through and now i don't know like physically if i could have the next event had overhead squat not heavy i don't think um but i would have had to like pull the weight off the ground and handstand walk which I would have been in like a very compromised position to be able to go fast on that so like now looking back 100% I know it was the right choice and like maybe was the only choice but at the time like i just had to know that like

matt had always been somebody worth trusting in the past and like maintain that trust and then it was like i woke up the next day and it was like that was that wasn't just like the right choice that was the only choice um did you change your flights to come home earlier or you waited it out waited it out there um and actually did get to do some really cool stuff in dubai did did they drug you did you take vicodin or any muscle relaxers or i did not i am very scared to take anything uh just because of drug testing even that i know is fine and that I know other people take, I just won't do it. Like I would rather be in pain. Did you do ice and heat? I did ice. Ice is good. It, it kind of felt like a hard balance. Cause it was like ice made it

stiff. Heat made it hurt more. So, I mean, for a while it was hard to like live with it but it it did get to the point when like the pain in my legs was like slowly calming down there were still some positions i could feel it in what's the date on this um i believe december 17th of 2021. Yes. I could be wrong on that exact date, but it was sometime in December. Crazy. And now we're in October of 2022. So it's, it's been a long process. Did you think your CrossFit career was over? Not in that moment. No, not i actually this was like not realistic of me at all but i still wanted to do guadalupalooza which was in like a month

i think less than a month i still wanted you to do it too like i just want to compete like i love to compete of course but i also wanted the learning. I wanted the data. Like, and I mean, I had to say no to that, but it was like, this is all for my 2022 season. So it's fine. And like, eventually I could do more and more. And I feel like we had to move a little bit faster than we otherwise, I mean, faster than we knew was probably smart just so I could still compete in this season like just so I mean my first time dumbbell snatching wouldn't be in the open like it was actually my second time um and like I I feel like maybe I took some risks with my back kind of between like December and February for the open that maybe maybe I wouldn't do again even though like ultimately I see how everything's been used

for good just that weren't the best choice and just that were were very immature and were me trying to rush things that just, I mean, physically healing takes time. And like I started, I was doing, um, just some snatch singles, not even, not even real heavy. I believe the Wednesday before the open started and my back, like I, I've heard people use the expression, my back went out and I never really understood that. I was like, did it hurt? Did it get weak? Right. God being young is fun. What's that mean? But I experienced that feeling. Um, like I was over the bar in the snatch, like my shoulders were over the bar. Um, like they're supposed to be in a good snatch.

And that was whenever I just felt like a sudden weakness and like suddenly my back rounded and I lost any sort of tension in my core. And it was like so much pain that I wanted to hide because it was right before the open. So like I tried to continue with my session. I tried to, I had back squat later. I tried to fight through that. Um, and just like, there were some choices I made along the way that I, I mean, I, I can be at peace with them now, knowing that I thought they were the best choice at the time. And like,

I was doing what I thought was right. But now like, now I know that those choices were very much, very much wrong. And that was Wednesday. So Friday was 22.1. And I hadn't done, I had done dumbbell snatch once, pretty low rep. Um, even wall walks, like as simple as that movement is like the sudden impact had been hurting my back. So I hadn't done very many of those and jumping had hurt my back. So like that wasn't, that wasn't a workout that I felt prepared for. Like my fitness wasn't prepared. And also like my back just didn't feel prepared and and i was flared up from not making great choices with it on wednesday um and that was are you honest with matt torres about that or do you

kind of hide those things from and i i just i think, and I have apologized to him since that, just, like, randomly, because I feel almost like my choices to not be completely honest, like, not always to lie, I mean, sometimes, probably, which I am very much not proud of now. Like that cost me the season, like those mistakes, even though I meant them like I just it was just because I wanted to be ready with everything I had in me. You couldn't you couldn't imagine not going to the 2022 CrossFit Games, so you couldn't imagine. Yes. So I think the first time I was really honest was actually after 22.1. And I, I was actually, I got to go to, so I did the open workout in the morning. At the same time as everybody, it went very well, like surprisingly well for not really having worked on stuff like that. Like it just, it showed me that the work I had done, like the aerobic work, the upper body work, like all that

had paid off. Even if it wasn't like in the exact way I expected it, it was like, cool, this is still improvement. Um, but that night I got to judge Matt at Friday night lights, like his gym, just doing the open workout. And that was super fun and everything. But I was in the most pain I've ever been in that day, like worse than when the injury initially happened in Dubai. And like, I was talking to Matt that night and I was like, I just feel like I should have beaten all the guys that did the workout with me, like Dallin and James by more. like I was disappointed that I didn't beat them by more, which is, I mean, Matt probably wasn't surprised to hear me say that. And he was just like, well, at least like, yeah, but you know, now we can work on it. Like at least

your back feels good. And like, that was the moment when I was like, it's, it's very bad. And that was the moment when not only did I doubt for my season for the first time, it was like I couldn't imagine being OK ever again. Like I was trying to help like pick up weights and I couldn't even pick up a 10 pound dumbbell that day. So I had to wait until people couldn't tell by the way you were moving around. wait until people couldn't tell by the way you were moving around um they could and there was actually actually i don't think i was 100 honest on that day i was just like yeah it doesn't feel good but it'll probably feel better tomorrow um and like i had been dealing with it long enough that it was like this doesn't feel like something that will feel better tomorrow. Um, I, I don't know exactly how this happened, but like the next day,

Matt didn't give me any sort of hinging or like anything that should bother it, but just trying to take dumbbells on and off the racks. Like everybody in the gym knew something was really, really wrong. And Matt couldn't make it to that session for whatever reason. But I remember him like texting me that somebody had told him. I don't know if it could have been Dallin or James or Phil. Emma's broken. Yeah. And I felt very, very guilty in that moment that like Matt didn't even get to hear that come from me.

And like, that was something so major, but like that was, I think I needed to experience that lesson firsthand. Like, I mean, it's, it's easy to be like, yeah, I, I communicate with my coaches. I trust them. I listen to them when everything's going great. Um, but it's, it's, it's easy to feel like you see the importance in that when everything is great. It's like, it's easy to trust. It's easy to communicate. But when it's like much harder conversations about, I mean, like this was kind of when we started talking about like, are we continuing with the season? Like it's a lot harder to communicate. But that was, I think, necessary for me to fully see the importance, even though it took me making some mistakes to get there.

I had to wait until the following Monday. So the open workout was released on Friday, due on Monday to do 22.2. Um, and that was like one, one 55 deadlifts. And I had to do it with a belt, move through it super slow. My back felt okay. Um, like that, that gave me hope. Um, 22.3 also had to move through that super slow, really controlled with the belt. Um, and at that point, like that was when I started getting so frustrated because I wasn't really training anymore. Like I was just flaring my backup during open workouts and then spending the week, calming it back down. And I mean, sometimes I was flaring my back up, picking a dumbbell up weird or something. And it was like, I'm not getting any fitter right now. I think it was just a couple of weeks until quarterfinals that continued. And at that point,

it was like anything just so I can make it to semifinals, like just so I can give myself a shot. Like I, I knew at that point that like, I could, that was really the first time that I felt like I could be doing long-term damage. That was when it was like, it became very, very real to me that if i wasn't smart now i might not have a crossfit career um so like we see the quarterfinals workouts and everything and i am i went to the gym that day like very scared like the day the quarterfinals started um but just like trusting matt and trusting that we could make the right decision together. We saw the workouts and we started talking about what it would look like, best case scenario, if I could have done those even. Um, there was a lot of, or not, not even a lot, but there was some pulling off the ground. Like my back just felt so fragile that there was no way that was the right thing to do, even though I could have done it. Like I could have done

quarterfinals, but I might not be doing CrossFit right now if I had done quarterfinals, which is like very scary that I was at that point. And like without Matt's guidance, I would have pushed past that point. me enough to believe in my longterm, not just to believe in me right now. Um, but to believe in like who I have the potential to be. And like, I mean, Matt genuinely cares about me and he genuinely wants to help me, but he also has a business and like we, the athletes promote the brand by doing well, like by performing well. And like for a while I felt almost like I was letting him down because I wasn't able to do that. And I mean, then we just had a conversation that it was like, I believe in you too much, like far too much to let any of that potential go to waste by not being smart right now. Like I have so much ahead of me that I will be better prepared for because of this. Like I 100% believe that I could not have won the CrossFit Games without knowing what I know now. And like, again, I still don't know that it will be enough.

Like, I still have adversity to face. Like, that is guaranteed. I mean, I don't think that's going to be another major injury. Like, I can't say that with a hundred percent certainty. I mean, nobody can, especially in a professional sport. Are you all healed? Yes, I'm all good now, but I just know that there's so much more to learn and that like,

ultimately this wasn't a setback. It was exactly what I needed. And I just, I feel like i thank matt so often it probably gets annoying but i just can't even sorry sorry sorry every every time i wipe my eyes i'm not gonna cry it was one time in 600 shows i cried the last show some i had to guest on making me cry just wipe just wipe my eyes just wipe a little sleep out of there okay but just just the gratitude that i have for the people i was surrounded by during that time and like i know i've talked about matt

a lot but also like the guys like dallin james and phil and ethan who was down here at this time like i really it would have been so hard to go through this without them. Like, I think that there were a lot of days that I used to hear you say Phil's name. Yeah. Um, Phil was absolutely amazing to me in all of this. Um, he had dealt with a lot of back issues, um, throughout his whole career. And this was the only hug that I ever got from Phil. And I'm a big hugger.

And I just, I didn't get that vibe from Phil. But as soon as like, I told him, like I got to the gym early the day of quarterfinals for Matt and I to talk. But as soon as Phil got there and I told him like, I'm not going to compete in quarterfinals. And he was just like, I hope you know that you just added years of domination to your career. Awesome. And gave you a big hug. Yeah. Um, awesome. And just like, he understood back injuries specifically. Like, back injuries specifically. Like, I mean,

like James has had some knee stuff I know. Um, and he could really connect with me as well in that. Um, and then, I mean, Dallin was just like rational and sometimes it would be like, he would just be so calm about that. I'd almost be like, he would just be so calm about that. I'd almost be like, I want you to be more upset right now. Like, I want you to feel a little bit more right now,

but that was just what I needed. And they were all so good to me. Like in exactly. They seem like great guys. It's those guys all seem the time, a little time I spent with Phil Dallin and James on this show show they all seem like awesome dudes like just warm-hearted loving like dudes you could just hang with yeah very much so and like i needed them to get through that time and like i can't express my gratitude enough to them either.

We're an hour and 42. I could talk to you forever. I really appreciate hearing this journey. I'm looking forward to talking to you again. I'm glad to hear you're healed. Yeah, Thank you. Uh, it's been a long, long process, like a lot longer than I initially thought it was. Five percent, more than 5% of your life. If you think about it, right. You're 20. Yeah. It was like 5% of your life is, was going through this last healing section. Yes. Um, so like, did you ever think you were going to quit?

Were you ever like throwing the towel? No. Um, I mean, like there was the thought a couple of times, like, is this worth it? But it's always worth it. Like there's always something better on the other side of like any struggle. And I mean, sometimes maybe that's just a lesson. And like, I think in this case, there's a lot of things so much better than I could have ever imagined and could have ever achieved without going through this.

So like, it's good to be through it. And I don't even feel like I'm through it yet. Because even though like I am healthy, I am still learning from it. And like, I feel like what's left of like, I mean, it felt like everything just shattered around me for months. It felt like I was just like standing in my shattered life and it was like picking up the pieces and like putting them together the best I could. And I mean, that is very dramatic, but that's how it felt. And now it feels like the pieces that are left are just so positive and they're like still just gifts that I have to build from. Um, and like something that really, this was just a couple of days after, like, making the decision not to continue with the season. It was, like, I want to find purpose in the pain.

And that's been something that has just stayed close to my heart. Like, not just get through this, but be better because this happened. And, like, for so long, that purpose I thought was myself. And like, as I get farther away from it, I think a lot of that purpose was to use it for the good of other people too. So I really appreciate having the opportunity just to share. What do you mean by that? Like, like, like for other people who had back pain or to have an injury to learn from it? Any just kind of adversity, like probably more specific to injury. Um, but I like, it makes me feel a way that I don't even know how to describe

whenever people are like, you know, when I get messages that are just like, I have this kind of injury or I'm going through this. And it's so inspiring to see you just not that are just like, I have this kind of injury or I'm going through this. And it's so inspiring to see you just not quitting. And like, to me, just not quitting is the bare minimum. And some days that's all you can give. And I understand that, but I want to be an example. And I want to be like, I've tried to be more open in this, that I like, I do have struggles and that it wasn't, it wasn't a linear process. It wasn't like every day mentally I'm better physically. I'm better. Like there wasn't even always a clear path to getting better, but I just want to show people like that's okay. And it's okay to have those feelings and those insecurities and, you know, make a lot of mistakes along the way and like.

And learn. And learn from it. Like that is all okay as long as you learn from it. And I mean, not even just okay. Like that's what you have to do and that's how you have to learn. And like, I don't just want to survive like adversity. I mean, I don't, I don't want to get through it and be like, wow, I'm really glad that's over. I want to look back on this time as growth and be like, I am proud of the person that I became during so hard to go on, I want to be proud of being the best Emma that I could be.

When it felt like that athlete identity was just ripped away from me because even though I was still training, it wasn't the kind of training I wanted. It was for a competition that was over a year away. It wasn't for, I mean, it was for a competition that was over a year away. And I mean, that, it was hard to be like, to feel that empty and face the fact that I had been putting a hundred percent of my identity, like defining myself a hundred percent by the sport of CrossFit that can so easily be taken away from me. Um, and I just, I guess like more than anything, I want to be an example of growth and development and constant learning and just seeing like embracing that I'm not there yet. And I need to grow so much as an athlete as, and as a person. And that I hope I'm

never there yet. Like, I hope I'm never satisfied. I mean, I feel like the day I'm satisfied with what I've done in CrossFit, I need to just stop doing CrossFit. Like the point is gone. Um, like Like, any day that I wake up, it's a day to improve. And that's just such a big motivator to me. And it felt like the injury almost gave me less opportunities to improve because it was like, well, I can only bike and do dumbbell stuff. But in reality, it gave me so many more opportunities to improve because it was like well I can only bike and do dumbbell stuff but in reality it gave me so many more opportunities to improve as a person and like in my character and kind of showed me that that's probably what matters a lot more anyway even though like spending so many years of my life as 100% an athlete like that was kind of a hard truth to realize. And something that I still

have to remind myself is that I am more than this sport. And like, I don't want my platform to be like, Emma's really good at CrossFit and she works hard. Like I want to be so much more than that. And I want to, I want to be relatable because we all struggle with something like whatever you're struggling with I want to just be an encouragement because I'm imperfect like it's easy it's easy to look at people who you think have their whole life together and be like they know everything they've done everything everything's going great for them and like the last I don't know probably 10 months of my life since the injury it's been like I know nothing everything's been turned upside down and even though it's been the hardest time

of my life it's also been the best just because of what I've learned from it and I think like the more I continue to learn about that the more more I will, like the more purpose I will find in this. I don't think it's like, you're not going to let it go to waste. It's not like, Hey, I, my, my push press didn't get stronger, but the last 10 months were a waste. You're like, uh, what did I learn in those 10 months? And what you learned is, is that you're not just CrossFit. And I really, I mean, I made so many physical improvements too. Um, and I don't ever want to discount those or the importance of that. Um, but like with the person I was and with how I thought I had so much room for improvement that I didn't even know until like the only thing I knew was

taken away. And like when that happens, inevitably to a lot of people, like whatever it is, that's like your thing, when you feel like you lose that, I just want to inspire people to like make the most of that time and dig a little bit deeper and have the harder conversations and like be willing to admit when you fall short and then just try to fix it because like we our abilities as athletes as people I mean as anything are not fixed and like I believe you can improve anything and like, especially mentally. And like, if I can just inspire somebody not to be satisfied with themselves, like, because I don't, I don't feel like many people would be like, I am completely satisfied with myself.

I love who I am as a person. Like there's really nothing I could do better. And if you are like that, I mean, you've probably gotten complacent and might need to work on that. So I just like, even when it's scary to kind of like take a leap and I mean, it might feel like you're completely changing how you think, but then you might get a little bit more into that journey and see that's the best thing you could have ever done. I think you've, you've always been that person. I mean, just when we started the podcast, just the fact that you took that, you took that risk with yourself, um, with doing, but, but the thing is, I guess the difference is we started the

podcast and you took the risk of doing individuals and not the age group qualifier, but that was in your control. Yes. This was another risk you had to take. It wasn't in your control. The risk of surviving the injury, coming out the other side, being healed again. And you don't, and you don't want it to go to waste. Very much. And even just the risk of like trying to be more vulnerable and open and authentic. Like, I feel like this is kind of the first podcast I've ever done where I didn't feel like I needed to be something that I wasn't. Like, I feel like I maybe need to be a different way around different people, just where I'm learning to finally be more true to myself.

Even if that means sharing struggles I have, just in the hope that it can help somebody, like, that's my platform, and that's what I want to use it for. I've kept you this long. Fuck it. I'm going to ask you one more question. You're good. Do you like the torque tank? Yes, I love it.

You like it. Do you think it's good for competitions? I don't know enough about it, but I would say yes. I never, this is why I don't like it. Competitions about the harder you were, like if you and I are in a race, then you, you run faster than me. You pass me. I run faster than you. I pass you the torque tank.

It just seems like it's just grinding the athletes and there's no excitement around the sport or the competition. I'm like, wait a second, no one can pass anyone. And I heard the harder you push, the harder it pushes back. I'm like, screw this thing. What is this thing? I do agree that the harder you push,

like the harder it feels to push, but you also go faster. You do, okay, okay. So I mean, I still appreciate what it tests. Okay. Point, point, Emma. I respect that. There's, there's three things that you say, God, there's so much here. So many good bits. There's three things that you, that you talk about being aware of while you're, while you're competing, while you're exercising. Effort, aware of how full your gas tank is, and your intention. And then underneath that, sort of in that same category, you had to trust your body and your strategy.

What is intention? When people say train with intention or exercise with intention, what does this word mean? I think – I feel like I use it a lot of different ways. And in training, intention might be one or two specific cues that I'm trying to focus on. Like something that Matt is kind of helping me get past now is not feeling like I need to fix every single thing with every lift, like pick a couple of cues and then do those with like 100% intention on those two things, or one thing, like often, it's just one thing. I am really just like trying to do everything right. Or I mean, maybe it's a really heavy barbell and I'm just trying to make the lift. It's not an intentional rep. So I mean, if it's not focused on something, there's a really good chance I'm reinforcing a bad habit and I want to have that intention and training.

So then in competition, it's like, it's natural because I mean in my opinion thinking is slow and like often more of a hindrance in competition than if you're just almost on autopilot and like there will always be things you need to think about in competition but you can't think about everything all at once so to me intention is just like knowing exactly what you need to do, whether in training, that's like the cues you need to think about to get better or in competition when that's like the cues you need to think about to win. And then just having the ability to like maximize those fully and be present in those fully to the best of your ability. So, so, so one of them might be overhead squats, um, a pulling the bar apart, focus as you're going. Like if that was the cue someone gave you.

Yes. Um, or in competition. I mean, I probably, if, if I practice that in training or like, if I practice a really good snatch technique in training, really efficient, like really consistent, all that is dialed in before I go and go onto the competition floor. I probably don't need to think of any of that stuff because like if I'm trying to make adjustments in competition, I think I'm more likely to fail unless I've already failed and then I need to make an adjustment. But like in competition, that's not where I would put my intention. I might think about maybe getting my hands back on the bar faster between reps. Or my intention might be like not taking a step back from the bar between reps or pushing harder in the transition. So I think there's a big difference between like a training intention and a competition intention.

And I actually tried to use that word in an Instagram caption the other day. And I Googled it and the meaning wasn't really what I thought it was. So like, that's just how I use it. I like it. It's one of the, I've asked a bunch of people that I think you gave me the best definition I've heard. Um, something you talked about also, uh, in one of the podcasts I was listening to was, uh, transitions. And I kind of noticed that there's been a shift in CrossFit from the beginning, like, and I would use Fran as the example, but we're at a place where the best people aren't, like in the early days, the people would rest in the transitions always like that, because that's the way it was written. But now there's like this fluidity to it. Like the people that the best athletes are resting when they want to rest. They're not letting the writing of the

workout dictate where they take their pauses, where they chalk their hands, where they take their shirt off. They just flow. And it seems like, I don't remember if it was you and Matt Torres were having the talk, but basically you've just, you one day had this revelation. Oh, I can just go from this to this. I got to stop fooling around in the transitions. Yeah. Um, it's actually funny that you say that because people in the gym, um, I mean, not, not in a mean way at all, but do kind of make fun of how close I tend to set my equipment together. Um, often it's like not even safe how close i put things together i approve i approve but just because i don't want to waste that time and it's not even so much that i want the best possible

score in training but if you're pushing transitions and training that like little jog between movements and competition feels so much better like you feel so much more ready to go. So I think, I don't know. It definitely depends on the workout, but I think that that is almost an example of like training to a little higher standard than you would compete to because in competition, you're going to be forced to have longer transitions most of the time. Because the stuff's apart. Yes. Apart from each other. Because the stuff's apart. Yes.

Apart from each other. So your schedule is Wadapalooza. Does the Open happen before Wadapalooza? No. So it's Wadapalooza, then the Open, then quarterfinals, then semifinals, and the games. That's the plan. Yes. Awesome.

And I'm so excited. I'm pumped too. I'm pumped for you. I'm excited about you. I've been a fan. Uh, I've been rooting for you. I really do think, um, you are, uh, I'm really excited to see you and Olivia, uh, Kerstetter compete this year. It's, uh, you guys are going to be shot out of a cannon into a field of some of the most, not some of the most, the fittest women in the world, the fittest women I think the world's ever seen. I think it's pretty impressive. And I'll be in touch.

And thanks for your time. Thank you so much for having me. It's been amazing. Yeah, totally. All right. I will be in touch probably around Guadalupalooza to bug you. Sounds amazing. I look forward to it.

Okay, great. Thank you, Emma. And tell mom and dad I said hi. I absolutely will. Have a good night. Thank you, Emma. And tell mom and dad I said hi. I absolutely will. Have a good night. Hi, good night. I think I set a PR for myself tonight. I held the bath. I had to go to the bathroom so bad that I held it for so long that it went away. Ariel Lowen's in here? Wow, look at that. She's in bedtime, aren't you, East Coast gal?

Oh, yeah, I'm excited to have you on, Ariel. I picked on you a little bit in the beginning of this show. Emma was letting us know that you were one of the gals that beat her at the, I think it was the Granite Games. Ladies and gentlemen, I don't know why I'm doing this. You really pissed me off, Heidi. I want to show you something. I had a guest on named Brad Ghost. I had a guest on named Brad Ghost, and he published 123 books in three years.

If you have not heard that podcast, you should listen to that podcast. It was a couple of days ago. Thank you, Bruce. Thank you, Bruce. Thank you, Heidi.

Thank you, Heidi. If I bring on games expert, when I interview people like, um, um, uh, miss Emma,

Carrie, there'll be all games talk. I read, I don't need to know what place she took at the games. I want to ask her. I want to ask her. I want to hear her talk about it games experts on i don't do original podcasts with people when i meet them with anyone else it's me and them building a relationship those are my rules so i'm gonna come on the show.

No. I do wish Susan would have been here, though, or Caleb, so someone could help me run the back end. I had so many cool pictures. Okay. Heidi, since that podcast with Brad Ghost has published a book, I want to lift weights like my mom. I bought it today. How can you guys not? Yeah, yeah, yeah. She's the new Brad Ghost. Mike Hunt is a great author as well. Yeah, yeah. That was a great book.

Forget about me. Forget about Emma. Look at this. I put the assignment out last week. Heidi's like, Heidi's just crushed it. I can't wait to get the book. At first, I thought she was joking. I want to lift weights like my mom by Heidi Krum. You see it there, guys? Just go to Amazon and type in Heidi Krum. H-E-I, wait, D-I, okay, C-U-R-M-E m e bam there it is over here click it get the paper back so stoked for you that you did that yeah yeah crazy after the brad ghost isn't that crazy

i know What a boss. You didn't do it solo with Don Fall so much for real. I told you, Julian Iford. Except for Sousa. There's exceptions to it. I mean with the athletes.

I mean with the athletes i mean with the athletes i mean with the athletes specifically athletes i like to do the affiliate shows and some of the other shows uh with other people i like to do all the shows with other people i just believe no no no i know that the shows are better when it's me with the athlete one-on-one the first time I meet him. Don't die on me. Okay. Now I got to go pee again. Oh, my buddy's calling. I will talk to all of you guys later.