The Sevan Podcast - #670 - Analyzing Zelos Games Programming ft. Friend, Howell, & Self

Episode Date: November 11, 2022

Support the showPartners:https://cahormones.com/ - CODE "SEVAN" FOR FREE CONSULTATIONhttps://www.paperstcoffee.com/ - THE COFFEE I DRINK!https://asrx.com/collections/the-real... - OUR TSHIRTS... Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

Make your nights unforgettable with American Express. Unmissable show coming up? Good news. We've got access to pre-sale tickets so you don't miss it. Meeting with friends before the show? We can book your reservation. And when you get to the main event, skip to the good bit using the card member entrance.

Let's go seize the night. That's the powerful backing of American Express. Visit amex.ca slash yamex. Benefits vary by car and other conditions apply. Bam, we're live. Someone called into the live calling show today and said, hey, I'm a street parking member, but because of your show, I also signed up for an affiliate.

Wow. I'm like, yeah, I know, I know. I mean, thank you. That's awesome. Brian Friend, J.R. Howell, Taylor Self, you guys, a big apology. I'll be running the back end today. Brian, what do you think you're doing? What do you mean?

What do you mean, what do I mean? You know what I mean. That caterpillar on your upper lip, boy. Trying to be like Taylor. That thing is crazy. Looks good. Kenneth High, Corbano High, Jeremy World High, Bruce Wayne High, Kenneth DeLapp High, Elisa Carr-Riddow High, Jessica Valencia.

Do you know this girl's a Masters athlete? Did you know that, JR? No. Makes me feel better. Oh, here we go here we go said hot said hot this guy's from one of those countries that ends in stan turkmenistan or something said hot kalkan it's a fucking strong name isn't that that's about as strong as it gets sir there's a uh there's a new a new baby in my gym and his name is roman ferrucci i think that's pretty strong yeah that's good roman ferrucci sir hot uh tj i'd love to hear what it sounds like uh when that guy's mom

yells at him sir hot she fucking he gets hit with a stick patrick clark about to board the plane entertain me always it's too bad i hope you're going to be able to contribute and save the show like you always do cory pulido exciting hey cory and his parents have sent care packages to caleb beaver wherever he's on my program wherever he is yeah cory smtp uh chase brian hi you guys the zealous games is going to be saturday and sunday we are running oh i knew it i knew it kurdistan kurdistan glad to have you brother um uh jamie latimer oh maybe she's the one who is the games athlete do you know her maybe i got valencia and jamie latimer all fucked up or she's a one who is the games athlete. Do you know her? Maybe I got Valencia and Jamie Latimer all fucked up. Or she's a Masters athlete.

High level. Like maybe 22nd in the world in Masters or something for whatever age division she's in. I looked it up today. Did you just make her Eastern European Latimer? I think it's just Latimer. Right or wrong. It's hilarious. I feel a little better, but today's workout just about kicked my

ass okay uh vindicate in the house for all your gear seven on podcast gear two bins of seven gear on palette headed to charlotte tomorrow oh that's cool my competition uh when is your competition not this weekend next weekend oh okay um you weren't for sure were you Okay. You weren't for sure, were you? Me? Seven. I had no fucking idea.

35 to 30. I get all my news from 10. You guys are like, you guys don't tell me when any of your shit is. So I don't know. Or maybe you do. And I'm just like, I need it like constantly beat into my brain. Hey, have you ever asked Chandler Smith to come on? I have.

Oh, he says no. Yeah. But so cool. So cool. Like, hey, I don't think, you know, my grandmother doesn't like swearing, and I just don't think it's right at this time. I mean, it's like the nicest no of all time. It's not even a – I feel flattered that he answers me. You know what I mean?

He's a good dude. Yeah. Zealous game Saturday and and sunday we are trying something pretty wild i'm pretty excited uh we went over some of the gear today when matthew souza the executive producer of the seven podcast was at my house and uh all of us will be participating in the coverage of it uh we're gonna use this exact same format when we go to the show and you watch the show, the broadcast, it'll look like this, but instead of it being this card, it'll be the event. And we'll be the little pinheads on the side, uh, talking.

We have an all-star cast of the Motley crew of them all. Everyone's scheduled. Brian spin from the barbell spin tyler watkins from the fantasy fitness league john young from just hate the haterade camp uh taylor self jr howell i know i'm forgetting something mike halpin the guy just talks in numbers he doesn't use the alphabet he just uses the uh numerical system uh myselfelf, we would have and Caleb Beaver will be running the back end. Matt Seuss will be down on the floor talking to the athletes. Brian Friend will help commentate from the venue. And Andrew Hiller will be the head referee. How did we get into this mess? the head referee head referee and here's here it is dude there's this guy who works for crossfit inc named drake and he is the head judge for the rogue invitational and he's going there to to be to work as a judge but really i think he's there for quality control

god do you think do you think uh do you think any of these judges are are hoping hillar falls on his face i hope he falls on his face the ratings would be amazing i think this dude drake is like i can learn from anyone in any situation so i want to come help okay cool that's good i i hope i just hope the thing is if hillar does fall on his face he'll lean into it he'll grab some dirt and rub it on himself. He's so good. I don't think he will, but I think they're – I mean, gosh, he's so polarizing. I think he's going to crush it, but I think a lot of people are watching in anticipation. Heidi, seven, why aren't you going there? I do not leave the three-plane brothers compound.

Patrick Clark, Drake's a great dude sometimes you do if gavin newsom gets re-elected did he are you staying in california would you he did i don't know if i'd move i don't know i went to costco for the first time in 20 years it was enough for me i was like holy shit i went there a couple weeks ago it's crazy i hate going there was costco around 20 years ago yeah um their stuff is so cheap i can't believe it but the people there what was it like 20 years ago it's all obesity it's just fucking packed it's so packed do you have a craving do you have a craving for some of those sieto cassava flower chips tortilla chips i wanted to buy that like that 5200 bottle of whiskey they had in the glass case whoa what yeah they got some weird stuff there it's like

really did someone buy this here i like their leg i took my kids there with my dad took my kids there and i tagged along and they got legos you can get a college degree there have you ever seen the movie idiocracy sorry i have i have tell me tell me i want to hear it's in the movie he's like oh i got my costco degree there the guy uh and how fudruckers morphs into butt fuckers over like the it's one of my favorite movies wow wow wow it's a good movie none of that none of that seems like a stretch the only thing I remember is that people can't figure out why the plants aren't growing because they're watering the crops with Gatorade. With Brondo? Yeah.

It's what the plants crave, man, electrolytes. It has electrolytes. Good movie. Costs obesity. For workouts, there are going to be some interesting things here. I think Tyler Watkins' Z-score system is going to be put to the utmost challenge and maybe even exposed of where it can and can't be used. That's some of the topics we'll be talking about today. We'll be looking at each individual workout.

I've asked the boys not to tear the workouts up and to just look at them for how the athletes are going to perform and keep it positive since we're trying to promote the event. And then afterwards, we'll bend Jared over and hammer him a few days after the event. But this show is going to be basically talking about the workouts, what the stimulus is, what athletes we think are going to do well,

what kind of athletes, what kind of bodies, um, uh, who we, maybe we even get into some podium picks, although Brian, uh,

pretty much killed that a couple of days ago hello gentlemen brian can i ask you a question do you like to fuck fuck fuck oh you don't want me to talk to you like that do you know that song utfo rap music from back in the day can i ask you a question quite no okay nope someone does someone in the comments knows. Okay. I don't know the field, the men's field. Is there someone who you have as like a pretty clear front runner? Or should I not ask that? I think we can probably talk about it as we go. All right. Fair enough.

Hey, I don't have that up here, and I'm all alone here. So someone – Where do you – Shit, that's here, and I'm all alone here. So someone – Shit, that's not good. No, you have it. Go into the search history. I sent you an email with it yesterday. You're good. You're good, bro.

It's in a spreadsheet? Yeah. Live athlete, not podcast schedule that's yeah that should be it okay uh can i pull that up and show everything that's on there well uh or you could go to the article that we used yesterday and where is that article if you search uh brian friend bar bend on my's page, it should be the last one that I've published. Bar Bend, Brian Friend, author's page. Is Colton going to be there in person?

Competing, you mean? Yeah. Oh, you really don't know the field at all. No, he's not. Okay. It says four impressive performances that flew under the radar. That's your last one, CrossFit. Oh, my God.

I'll sell it. Okay, thank you. I appreciate it. I want you to know that when the bar bend thing popped up, usually I block notifications, but since you worked there, I accepted them with a smile on my face. I was like, yeah, I'd love to get notifications from barbend uh barbend is the new home for brian friend and patrick clark formerly with the morning chalk up now if you want

to see their work you go over to barbend they are building a robust a catalog of uh up-to-date news in the crossfit community it's a pretty big site they got a ton of stuff on there i'd love to see the crossfit stuff get a little more love you should have gotten an email or be getting one in a moment okay did you did you really still haven't gotten your instagram back formerly crossfit crash what are you talking about oh yeah that little guy yeah that's crazy you you haven't gotten it back still waiting yeah fuck them dude fuck instagram what did you post he posted a nudie and they are like no he can't have that um posted some of our heroes that we're doing workouts for this week of veterans day and that's about it i have a

theory because they they did it to me when on my account when i first opened it and i was like i'm an addict and that's why they shut me down for a second yeah because i was sending a lot of messages to like people who are just jumping on my program they're like oh you sent too many messages we think you're a bot i think jr is just on full goblin mode in his dms like he dms like hours a day way to say can you send a dm to everyone at once and you're in your who follows you or you follow? You could probably – no, no, no. I was like going to different accounts, and I don't know.

I think it's an activity thing. Who knows? These are the women. Take a quick look. Brittany Weiss, Andrea Nessler, Devin Kim. The list goes on. We'll periodically come back to this. The men, sprague tutor magda peter mason uh mike mcdonald wow mike mcdonald's gonna be there that's awesome uh matt delugos

and uh let's dig right in to uh workout number one two workouts on saturday two workouts on Sunday, 12 men, 12 women. By the way, I'm supposed to make sure that you guys all know that you should be registering for this event. I don't know how you do that, but someone will put a link in the chat over there. Hey, I'm useless. I'm just a fucking mouth. JR, do you think these are enough workouts to give away this much money i guess the open kind of does it wow good question

it's kind of a backhanded compliment well it's well yeah i guess it is well it's just yeah i mean they're giving away a fuckload of money which is cool are you talking about for the online competition or in person about both yeah, I think this is, it is something very similar in feel to the open where you're briefed on a workout right before you do it. You have minimal time to warm up and you do that twice for two days. So it's pretty cool in that respect. Um, I think a lot of these athletes are going just because they're really pumped about being in this kind of atmosphere to do it in Vegas. I think the money is just kind of a plus. And it's a unique opportunity. You know, there aren't that many opportunities, especially to only compete in a heat of four, you know, three other people at a

time to be broadcast on a live, a live stream. So, you know, this is a probably one of the better opportunities for some of these athletes will ever have to have the spotlight most closely on them. athletes will ever have to have the spotlight most closely on them and and i think uh um uh i think a lot of people are also going to be watching to see the uh debut of my new affiliate commercials i think that's for large most of them probably are gonna watch you yeah uh workout one why 1.1 why not just one 1. Why 1.1? Why not just 1? You got me stumped. I think it's maybe just

I think it maybe is just like homage to the open 20.1, 21.1, 22.1. But wouldn't it be Is this the first in-person iteration of Zalos Games? Correct. So maybe that's it. Zalos Games 1, Workout 1.

No, it's the second iteration, and I believe last year that it was just 0.1, 0.2. They didn't do it in person last year, did they? No, but they were – I think I'm checking this now. I think that that's how we did it. At least it shows up that way. It's a Google search. You can find them. I think last year the workouts

were 0.10.2 etc okay cool here we go uh three minute amrap as many rounds as possible uh 26 18 on the echo bike 14 this particular case it's reps, as many reps as possible. As many reps as possible. Thank you. 26, 18 on the Echo Bike, 14 dumbbell box stepovers. I guess that means you're holding the dumbbells in your hands. Correct. And max ring muscle-ups. I'm impressed I knew what RMU was.

It was concerning that you didn't know what DB was. In three minutes. Rest one minute. The same thing for three minutes. Rest one minute. Four minutes. How do you tack this workout? Do people game this?

Just in case anyone's not listening, do you want to tell them the weights and the box heights at the bottom there? Yeah, thank you. Dumbbell weights, 50 for the boys heights at the bottom there. Yeah. Thank you. A dumbbell weights 50 for the boys, 35 for the girls box height, 24 inch for the men, 20 inch for the women. Excellent.

Yeah. To answer your question, I think there are some people that are go about it a little different ways. Taylor could maybe give some insight of how he would attack it as someone who is good on all three movements and really good at ring muscle-ups. Do you want to just be hurting really bad when you get to the rings because that gives you more time? And over the course of the three rounds, if you have more time, you know you could win? Or are you someone who knows that if you're blown up,

your grip, your breathing, when you get to the rings that you're not going to be able to do a whole lot of work when you get there. And I think like a lot of interval style workouts, it's not about round one. It's not about round two, but that third round that has an extra minute of work. I think that's really, really, really valuable in this workout. And just to clarify, I got a question. So the winner is whoever has the most ring muscle ups correct from all three rounds you add them together okay go ahead taylor well how i would attack it yeah um i think maybe to jr's point on a workout on a workout like this to me i don't think getting to the rings super early is as important as getting up to the rings for a big chunk. Um,

I personally think that once you come down from the rings, especially in a short AMRAP like this, your rest is going to be way it's, you're probably going to be forced into a longer rest than you want to waste in a three minute AMRAP. Um, so I don't think to me, I would try to get the bike done.

I wouldn't try to get the bike done in a minute, and I would go straight to the dumbbell stepovers, and I think the dumbbell stepovers would probably take 40-ish seconds, maybe a little faster. I think my goal would try to be between 15, probably between 15 and, I don't know, maybe 18 muscle ups in the first interval. I definitely, I definitely could do 11 to 12 unbroken and then probably a quick rest and then times really running down. And then I would just try to get a few more. Um,

I think, I think for me personally, it's probably more of a grip workout than anything else. I don't, I think with a minute of rest, I recover pretty well. I also recover pretty well, um, from like machines on the ring muscle ups. So I think it's more of a grip thing. I think I'd probably be looking at a minute on the echo bike, 40 seconds on the step overs, and then try to get 15 to 18 muscle ups round one, probably 15 ish round two um and then i would hope for 20 on on the fourth how many did you say in the first round how many muscle-ups 15 to 18 so 15 15 20 um you guys are gonna tear me up for this why is it why is it a grip why is it grip aren't these aren't they going to be in the false grip and then as they kick the bottom slip out no not false grip they'll have grips on yeah they'll

have a regular grip and just from the dumbbell stepovers i think a lot of guys will get the bike will crush them some guys will try to go out a bit hot on the bike um other people probably go too slow and not give themselves enough time um Um, but I think more than anything, the bike is, the bike is just there to fatigue you, um, and to make you push pretty hard. But I, I recovered pretty well on dumbbell stepovers. Like I can get my heart rate down, especially with fifties and same thing on muscle ups. Like I don't, I wouldn't say I'm recovering on muscle ups, but muscle ups aren't going to blow me up unless I'm going for a true max set, not enough to where I couldn't recover in a minute. Taylor or JR, what do you guys think about intentionally breaking the stepovers?

Maybe like 10, put them down for two seconds, pick them back up just to get the grip ready for the muscle-ups. I think you're either someone like Taylor who's like, there's no way I do that, or you're someone that's doing it from round one. Need to do it. Because they know that they're going to be limited by grip endurance more than anything else. Let me throw this out there real quick. This is a 12 minute workout. What, how many muscle-ups

can you do in 12 minutes? Can you do 50 muscle-ups in 12 minutes, Taylor? What's it, what's 10 minutes of work? 10 minutes of total work. Right. What's 10 minutes of work? 10 minutes of total work. Right. He's just asking in general, but I mean, Savan, two years ago in the open,

there was a workout that had 40 muscle-ups and 80 calories rowing, was it, and 120 wall balls. And, I mean, people were finishing that entire workout in like eight minutes, I think. Or maybe it was 10 minutes. 10, 12, 10 minutes. Well, 10, 12, 10 minutes. Well, either way under, under 12 minutes. Yeah, for sure. For sure. Can do 50 in 12 minutes. I think more,

I think more than anything, it's how can you do big sets and get quick reps without coming down and wasting a lot of time. I mean, you think about this when you're forced into a break on ring muscle ups, you're not jumping down for a couple seconds then hopping right back up. You're coming down. You're probably fucking sitting on your heels, grabbing chalk.

The rings are swinging everywhere. So I really think the workout is more about getting to the rings with the ability to do a big set out front. And if you can get a big set out front, then anything after that is kind of like icing on the cake. But people who get to the rings and are doing like a set of five and a set of six, they're not going to be the ones who are winning this workout. Yeah. And, you know, who can get to the third interval and take advantage of the fact that they're not gassed when some of the other guys, maybe in their heats or in previous heats or in heats following them, are going to get to that third round and think they have juice and then they don't have anything left.

I'd imagine that you can use grips on the dumbbells, Jamie, but I personally just hook grip. I think hook grip still is gives me better grip endurance than, than trying to fuck with the grips, especially in a workout that fast. I mean, it's a pretty cool workout too, because there's a lot of, there's a lot of places that you can, that you can game the workout and suit your abilities. I mean, I think on the show with uh hillar and brian the other night um someone from zelos commented that there'll be athletes that get the cows done in 30 seconds ah that's fucking i think that's stupid so i mean if you have people that are going to attack it that way and they're going to maybe rest for 10 seconds to do seven

step overs break do seven step overs and then go to the rings. I mean, maybe you'll have people come out of the gate super hot. Yeah. You know, the other thing is it's the nature of this particular competition is there's three heats of four and someone's going first in that workout. Now we've set it up so that each of the four, three groups get to go first once, second, once, and third once. But if you're in the third, not get to go first, right? Have to go first. Yeah. To go first. Hey, maybe you want to, maybe you want to set the tone, but, uh, in this particular case, if you go in the last heat, you'll, you'll have an idea of, you know, what you need to hit. And if, if you're close in the, you know, or feel like you have it in the last interval,

you may see people make a change of plan based on what they know they have to do. I agree. I also think that with this field, particularly, there's a higher chance of someone to heat one, just being really good at muscle ups and putting up a score that no one else can beat. I, I, I feel like there are a lot of outlier, maybe not outliers, but it doesn't seem to me like it's a relative, like it's a very close together field. Like you would see at the games where the people in the last seat really do benefit from seeing

someone going first. Like, I think there are going to be people in the last seat who see someone do a score that they know they can't really touch. Um, I also think personally, especially with a three minute time domain, you shouldn't approach a workout where you plan on taking rest. You're the rest is in, it's built in, you get a minute of rest. So I think if any athletes are watching this, you should, you need to approach the workout in whatever way keeps you moving the entire three minutes and allows you to build an intensity throughout the three minutes. You are guaranteed rest. You can't bank on rest in your three minute window if you do then you're pushing too hard somewhere and not utilizing that energy

somewhere else and brian have you seen like floor plans like will the in-person competition you know will it be laid out where there'll be five feet in between the rings in the box and all that stuff oh yeah they have uh the zealous games has already put out floor plans for every workout i think and also the standards and floor layouts for all those workouts. I think they're on their Instagram. But we, I mean, yeah, I've seen those. But Taylor, because of the Z score, it's not just the top score that's necessarily being chased.

If you're a person who thinks in your mind, I think 30 to 35 ring muscle-ups is realistic for me. And you see that there's a bunch of guys aggregating towards the top of that or the bottom of that then coming you might say like man like i know if i gotta get 30 and if i get anything above that it's pushing me past half the field like that that could matter too staying towards the middle in the z score is good if you if you're not winning it. I'm trying to pull up. So just do it in your head, Taylor.

Do you think 50-plus wins it, or do you think multiple people will be over 50? Looking at the workout right now, I just have to stare at it. I think. If you go 15, 15, 20, there's your 50. That's 50. Do you think a lot of people are going to be capable of that? I think. Man. go 15 15 20 there's your 50 that's 50 do you think a lot of people are going to be capable of that i think i man brian do you have any information about the test athlete i know mitch tested like most of them right before he jumped in last minute to compete do you know what he got on that i'm

sure he doesn't want i'm sure he doesn't want everyone knowing but no but this um i did i think mitch tested two of the workouts is what jared what Jared had told me after we did that show the other day. And he did the demo videos for all of the workouts. I'm not sure if he did this one or not. I do know that it was tested. And actually, I tested it along with a buddy of mine at the gym. We didn't do the RX version of the workouts, but we were testing for, is it RX or Elite? Whatever the second division is,

we were just trying to test some stuff out for that. And everyone had a similar experience. You know, maybe the reps would change, but basically to what Taylor was talking about, where the least, the least, the number of ring muscle-ups were accumulated in round two. So, you know, you'd start up high, you have a little regression. And then with that extra minute, you would push back to either where you were in round one or slightly beyond it and that was uniform across the board with the three people that i know who tested jeremy how many muscle ups did you get well hold on he's never mind he's competing he signed up i can't ask him do you guys form a coup or something what happened here dude i don't know he's rebooting you guys you guys just you

guys just booted him off yeah we fucking mutiny didn't dude we walked his ass off the plank i just got back i actually thought he i thought he just moved himself off the screen on purpose to try a different setting. But then when we were talking about something that he definitely could have pulled up a graphic. Yeah, I just walked in from driving back from his house, actually, and saw it was just you guys and saw his thing, so his stream was down, and I was like, oh, shit.

I said you guys were geeking out over equipment there earlier today. Yes, yeah, I got a bunch of goodies. So you guys are just finished up the talk of the first workout? We're talking about how many reps we think wins it, and I think that probably the more I think about it, more than likely athletes are going to need to jump up and knock out a big set, and they're probably not going to have a ton of time to come down, rest, and even jump back up and get another set so i think 50 probably wins it i think any yeah yeah it's

interesting too like over 50 wins it well we often you know we often talk about and ring muscle workouts when they're for reps should we have a different number for men or women obviously we've already uh scaled the echo by calories. Given that and that the box stepovers are probably a little bit easier with the 35s on the 20, how close do you think the women get to the men on this? On the muscle-ups? I don't think. That's all that matters for the score.

If 50 is winning for the men, what do you think is winning for the women? I'm looking at the field right now. I've got to pull the women's field up to even. I would say like seven to eight less. Take a stab at that. So someone getting over 40 would be a 45. 40 to 45 is going to be up there. Do we know, do we have a list of women that are going to be competing?

Who's the best in the field at muscle-ups for the women, Brian? I'll tell you the women. Alex Kazan, maybe. muscle ups for the women brian um i'll tell you the women up alex kazan maybe alexis johnson should probably do well on those nistler i don't think any women are getting over 40. susa do you have the um yeah let me see i think is it that email you sent me the other day right we were using the article i thought was the best place to that's right pull it up and this workout too i mean it's it's it's really well programmed in the way that you are pushing the pace so anyone that thinks they're just going to cruise the bike is going to have like 30 seconds on the rings and it's going to be terrible so they're they're being forced to bike hard which

is cool and then who can rest a three two one and pick the dumbbells right up and do their 14 at a good cadence? You know, you think about like some of the really big guys, the tall guys like Tola and Matt DeLucos that are going to be there. You would think something like the box stepovers and the bike are going to be a huge advantage in a competition with a one rep max snatch essentially. But the ring muscle ups are there to kind of equalize, which I think is good. It's a really well-programmed workout in that way. I also think that speed of muscle ups are there to kind of equalize which i think is good it's a really well programmed workout in that way i also think that speed of muscle ups are going to matter i mean it comes down to a few reps this reminds me of that last chance qualifier workout with the bar muscle ups and the thrusters where there were ties at reps and one rep was the difference you know between potentially qualifying or not i think i don't know i solo

looked pretty looked pretty smooth on the rings and some of those clips that she was posting on instagram that you guys pulled up brian maybe she's the best in the field adam her alexis or i mean i yeah i think kazan and this will do well on this too though i think it taylor's right and that's why i said it you know it could matter being the last heat if you know if you go out there and set 42 and you know that you know and i come up right behind you knowing i have to beat 42 there's a little bit of incentive if i'm close yeah i think women probably are i don't i don't think any women go over 38, and I think the guy who wins, it'll go over 50. Look at Yvonne Matosian down there. You're back.

Wow. What happened? The internet in the whole house went out. Did your Faraday cage fall off? I actually tried to hotspot my phone and log in to see if I paid my bill to my bank account. That's honestly what I ran and did. You fixed it pretty quickly. Thank you.

Thank you. Oh, what did I miss? What did I miss? Are we on workout one? Who can update me? You guys just keep talking and Jeff Baco update me in the comments? Who can update me? You guys just keep talking and Jeff Baco update me in the comments.

We've been talking about this workout for the most part. It's kind of honing in on numbers that we expected might win it. Taylor thinks upper 30s to low 40s is going to be the upper end for the women. But some of the men will be pushing past 50. Did you answer my question? You were going to make fun of me. Something about an open workout, max muscle-ups in how many minutes or something what was that you asked if i could do 50 muscle-ups in 12 minutes yeah that would just mean i did uh five a minute right now four a minute five a minute yeah between four and five a minute so yes no problem. What is the most you could do in 12 minutes?

I feel like I could probably come close to 90. Okay. Okay. I think 100 is probably outside the realm of possibilities. That'd be like nine a minute. But I know I can hold EMOM eight for, I don't know, maybe I could come close to 100. I know I can do a 10-minute EMOM of eight. So 12 minutes. I could do 96 maybe maybe i don't know if i can do 12 minutes at eight how long does it take to do 15 muscle-ups 45 seconds on the fast end okay so if you said it

was going to be one minute to do the uh um echo bike yep 40 seconds to do the the box yeah let's give them 20 seconds for transition so that means it gives you one minute left do people stay on for that entire minute i i think people come down i really think an unbroken set for the best people at muscle ups in this field is going to be between 15 and 18 on the first interval and that's why i think that puts me there and then you have like a at least for me when i'm thinking what I could do unbroken after the bike and the dumbbell stepovers is probably between 15 and 18. And then you've got like 10 to 15 seconds to maybe get one more. So what does someone have to do?

Go ahead, Brian, go ahead. No, I think that in some variation, if people have a minute worth of time, you're going to see them do two sets, a big set, whatever that is for them, some amount of rest, and then however many reps they can squeeze into the last set. And what do you have to do to stand out in this workout? Stand out?

Stand out. Well, the thing that Taylor said at the beginning of this whole conversation is really important. You have to understand what's realistic for you. You, if you, you can screw it up on the bike and really cut yourself short in terms of potential. So you have to set it up for yourself so that you can maximize the first round of muscle-ups, do what you can in the second round, and then just go for broke in the last round. It's the first round though. I think you can make the mistake that can, that can ruin your whole workout. Yeah. You know, there's an old saying in any workout with a machine,

they say, you know, whoever's the first one off the machine is going to end up doing the worst of the workout. But in, in a, in a workout like this with only four people in your heat and three heats, someone's got to get off the bike first. And I think that's something good to watch from the beginning. Watch the first interval. Who's the first person off the biker? Who's the person that does the 26 cows in 30 seconds?

By the end, how do they look in the workout comparatively to the person that wins? What about DeLugos? Any concerns about his feet hitting the ground on this one? It's his home floor, right? Yeah. You'd think. It's at Camp Rhino,ino right maybe they'll make him practice

with uh figuring out a way to miss so his feet don't hit is that what you're saying taylor yeah i was just talking shit like i think they'll probably raise the rings for him okay uh were you guys over looking at the athletes to see who you think is going to be the standouts uh we hadn't done that necessarily well we talked about the women i guess yeah pull the man up who was the woman that you guys thought would be the the beast on this sola and i agree with jr i mentioned that i thought alex kazan may also do well on this one and you know you you look at people like alexis johnson you know she's been with Misfit for forever. She's done crazy amounts of fan bikes, sprints. Someone like Andrea Nistler, super powerful.

It may end up being more about the bike for the female than the males. I think that probably will be the case as far as time on the rings go. Fair. Can we bring the man up? How are Nistler's uh ring muscle ups i mean they're pretty good i'd say you know she's not going to give away very much on the rings scroll down scroll keep scrolling i think i remember watching her do the last open workout and i'm sorry the um the last quarterfin workout for teams, you know, the ascending

thruster and the ascending type of pull-up that ended with the ring muscle-ups. And I don't think that she went on broken on that. That was 12 at the end, correct? You probably know better than us. You probably took some teams through those workouts. I think Dennis is going to win this. I do. He's got the right body for it are you gonna pick him on every workout yes because he has the right body for it yes all right i don't know i can't i can't make any judgments on this field i don't know enough about him tell me tell tell

taylor would you like to take a break and get a cup of coffee um um who who's who's gonna be dennis tell me that this is i mean i don't think dennis is yeah i don't think he's gonna be in the top he's just not fit enough i think several people will be dennis on this workout but i do think it's challenging to pick the winner something that's not not everyone maybe knows about Tolomore Aquino is that his gymnastics are really good, but I think that fitness is going to matter on this. And when he hasn't done an individual competition this year, so I'm not entirely sure where his fitness is for an execution on a workout like this. The good thing for him is that in team competitions, there's a lot of work and work to rest stuff. So three minutes work, one minute rest, maybe something that they practice in a team environment.

If he's able to just maintain his heart rate and get to the rings, he can do as big a set as some of the smaller guys. And with being a bigger guy who can do muscle-ups like that, he may end up doing well in this workout. I think just to – I will say this. I think a lot of athletes do work rest intervals, at least the good ones do. I don't know. I mean, I want to look at Tudor just because he qualified for the games,

but I don't know enough about his muscle-ups or his fitness right now, to be honest. Rich Froning did 113 minutes and 20 seconds uh good good little bit of info there will this workout affect someone affect the event as severely as we were talking about the snatch workout might meaning is there someone who's really good, but that the muscle-ups are going to just put a massive hole in their game, expose them? I think this one has the potential to do that on the other side. There'll be some really good scores, but I think there's going to be a huge grouping of scores. Maybe six of the men are between 40 and 43 reps somewhere.

If you're on the bottom side of that, that's where you get hurt on this workout. Meaning you think that there's going to be a gap, there's going to be a group at the top and then there's going to be a gap. And then there's going to be these other dudes. Yeah. There's going to be no middle class. Let's just say for example, if Matt DeLugos finishes in the bottom half or bottom third of this workout,

even though it might not look egregious on the scorecard as a snatch, that's 50 pounds heavier than the third place person or fourth place person uh being on the bottom side of that big group in the middle in this workout can still cost you a lot of points who's the gymnast in this group is there a gymnast in this group sorry sorry go ahead uh jr oh no i was just gonna say that's just that opens up a good conversation about z score in general with a competition of four workouts so you have something like a snatch ladder and of course you know someone like tola is coming so can someone like him separate from the field by 20 25 30 pounds possibly so he takes 100 points and then the second place person maybe takes 78. Are the other three workouts programmed in a way

that the same amount of separation can be had comparatively to the field? That would be an amazing indicator with how good the programming is, is if all the workouts spread, if you were able to gain a huge advantage on the field. Now, that's really dependent upon who's there, though. So we know Tola is there.

Okay, well, then it may just end up making it look as though, oh, well, yeah, Z-score screwed up the competition because he was able to gain so many points on the field. But in these other workouts, everyone was so close. Well, that just means that there wasn't an outlier on these other three workouts to separate from the field i don't see someone it to me to me out of these athletes i don't see anyone there that is good at ring muscle ups to the degree that tola is good at snatching in my opinion yeah on any can we see all the athletes and that's i agree with that completely taylor and that's why

i said if you're one of the guys who thinks you can contend for first or second over the course of the four workouts, you can't afford to be in the bottom half of this one. Just being in the middle of the pack is fine here because you're not going to give away tons of points. But once you get to that bottom third, you might only be scoring 20 to 30 points relative to 100. And can you climb back from that? And in the same respect, James Bragg may be looking at that chipper and saying, I can beat everyone in this field by three minutes and I'm going to beat everyone by three minutes so that I can get that same point differential. And that's, that's the really cool thing about Z-score is it, it incentivizes taking risks, but it, it, it leaves you no other choice,

but to try anyway. And it's, and especially in a format like this, where there's only four workouts, just a couple of them are pretty short, we will see people go for it. And we'll probably see some really impressive times here. And then, of course, we'll have two weeks to find out if anyone can beat them online. Can these people redo? There's going to be people who get fucking smacked by the online competitors. Maybe. I mean, maybe. Charge straps, a little quick echo bike. You know, you got that bike that counts a little bit faster than all the online competitors. Maybe. I mean, maybe. Charge straps, a little quick echo bike.

You know, you got that bike that counts a little bit faster than all the other ones. They have a, well, yeah. I got one like that in my gym. You have an echo bike that counts faster than the other one? It's my personal echo bike. Go ahead. I guess what I'm saying is that, you know,

Tola was going to do fine on the snatch against the field online or in person, and Sprague is going to do fine on the snatch against the field online or in person, and Sprague is going to do great against the field on that last workout either way anyway. These might have been some of the best scores. Yeah, yeah. I've got an echo. My personal echo bike counts faster than everyone at the gym, and I know that because I was doing a workout with a friend of mine, and I got off the bike like 30 seconds faster, and it wasn't like, okay, I shouldn't be good on the bike compared to this person, but it was like not by 30 seconds

and not at this amount of calories. It was crazy. And so I started keeping an eye on it when we programmed bike workouts at our gym and everyone who got on my bike was like, they, they would always be like near the top. So it was the opposite of the center judge. It's older. Yeah. It's the opposite. It's older. It's just an older bike, I think.

And I don't know why it counts faster, but, um, uh, what about, uh, Christine, uh,

Colin Brander? We had her on the show level 10 gymnast. Does that play a role in this? Christine Colin Brander. Yeah. She may, she may do well on this workout as well. Women gymnasts never touch rings though

in gym didn't have she was also a pole vaulter she was also a pole vaulter strong she was crushing that legless rope climb workout until she hit the wall that one year too all right uh any anyone gonna any anyone gonna get just fully exposed do you think are we gonna see people just standing around in the third round, three muscle-ups? I think for sure. Yeah. I do. I think so.

All right. Should we go to workout number two? Yeah, let's do it. Same day, workout number two will happen. I think that everything at Zealous Games moves fast. I think they go through all the competitors. They do event one. And I don't think that there's downtime, right?

Is there one hour between the events? If that. Maybe one. Yeah. And then workout two will come. This one is for time. 579, power clean. 165 pounds for the men, 115 for the women. Bar-facing burpee, thruster, bar-facing burpee.

Wow, that's going to hurt. Yeah. The original programming for this was 975. They tested it. It's a little bit fast, but wanted so i flipped it 579 and they were happy with that uh taylor um this is just a full-blown sprint this is uh like it could be won or lost even in transitions um it's a sprint it's a sprint i don't know that i think for some guys it's full sprint. It's a sprint. I don't know that.

I think for some guys it's full blown. Um, but I think the nature of the rep scheme means that you have to account for that finishing on a bigger set and it's fast, but it's managed. I think it's, it's not like a 400 meter Fran sprint, but it's close to an 800 meter run and intensity wise and i think it's one of those workouts too that i mean we know i think in general in the sport a much closer critical eyes being placed on the judging and the athlete movement quality so who can move at maximal speed and not get called for dropping the bar a little bit early on a power clean from the top

or not get called for a soft lockout on the thruster when they're trying to sprint the last set of nine little things like that could end up mattering in this workout i i'm not seeing i'm not seeing where people are going to slow down at all where where do you think people are going to slow down on the last two thrusters in in the set of nine the last yeah not the i mean i think people for sure will start to slow down on the round nine bar face and bur yeah not the i mean i think people for sure will start to slow down on the round of nine bar face and burpee after the power cleans i think you'll probably see some guys who maybe can't even hold on to the nine unbroken for the power cleans uh if they go fast enough on the five and seven um and i think you see some people who inevitably fail a thruster in the

round of nine no way no. No way. Does anyone break up the power cleans? No, you have to go so fast that you're going to be pushed to the point to where you may potentially fail. I mean, we'll see. Yeah. When I look at this workout, I look at the last 27 reps. No one wants to go all out for nine, immediately pick the bar up, go on broken for nine and then drop and go really hard for nine more. So the last 27 reps, 18 burpees and the nine thrusters, I think that's maybe where you see all the separation in the whole workout. I mean, it's a lot of burpees and a lot of thrusters to do at the end of the workout.

And you also have to remember, Sevan, go back to the leaderboard. Matt Fraser isn't on the leaderboard. I hear you. But I just can't see any of these guys showing up here and doing any breaking up the power cleans at all. I think it'll be a testament to the programming with how innocent this workout looks and how devastating it is when you see people do it. Oh, it's going to fucking destroy people. He was very proud to name this one royal flush and he put it at the second workout at the end of the day one on purpose and

i think all the no excuse but to go for it because you know you have the rest of the evening and all night to recover to go again and you have nothing to hold back here i also think yeah brad in the comments commented what i was thinking that's cumulative grip fatigue especially after the muscle ups from that first workout uh i i guarantee you you're gonna see people who don't do the nine power cleans all in one go no guaranteed let's make a bet on it fuck that you're rich i need some money yeah fine three dollars oh fuck you hey let i i i will um i will uh petition i will start a petition on change.org to push out any athlete out of the community who if the only place you're allowed to fail is on those last set of nine thrusters and

i better see you fucking crumble like a snail and fall on the ground you know at the bottom i better see you just get smushed at the bottom you ding dongs just push 165 jared puts on this event for you and you're gonna set down a take a break on the power cleans so you do how many people do you think are going to break up the power cleans actually let go of the bar can we pull can we pull the leaderboard back up the men's leaderboard oh i'm so sorry someone's going to get called out hard i'm so sorry i can i can speak more to the men and the women i'm not going to be able to speak to the women on this but pull the men up you think that's heavy enough for the women 115 no probably should be 125 i told you guys not to talk shit he they want him to go fast though so it's like you know if it's a little bit

if it's a little lighter they just go faster i mean i'm not i really i didn't look at it and was like oh it should have been 125 i'm just like that could have been uh oh oh suza's not there yeah i'm waiting for you, man. Suze had to leave. I'm like, where's the women? We just see Suze's. JR, how much thought have you given to realistic time on this? Not a lot of thoughts, actually. Like, counting it out when I could. Let's do that, and then I'll pull up the men's.

Let's do that, and then I'll pull up the men's scores. Or the men's names. Anyone? Time? I'm counting. Ryan, you think everyone will make the time cap on this? Yeah. It's not a matter of making the time cap. It's just a matter of how fast.

I would say... 4.30. Wins it? the time cap it's just a matter of how fast uh i would say 4 30 wins it no i don't think wins it i don't know i was just looking at it and i think like probably a median time is 4 30 for men i think like 3 30 low threes wins it that sounds fast to me but mate but like i said people are going to people are going to be going for it. And I do think that, again, there's going to be a congregation of times, you know, half the guys within 15 seconds or something. Where do you think that happens? Time domain? Yeah, I think like 415 to 445 probably.

That's what I feel like median time is. And the worst ones being just over five, for the men at least. Can we pull the leaderboard up? I would say to that 3-3 three thirty comment just remember the field like i i agree i would say i would say three thirty i'm still confident in that i would say wouldn't you say the round of five and seven are done in two minutes taylor the round of seven and five are done in two minutes are done in two minutes yes but then i think so then you're giving them another then you're giving them 130 for the third i don't think there's anyone in this field that's fit enough to do the round of five and seven in two minutes and not pay for it

a little bit in the round of nine okay yeah i think i think 330 wins it around that faster time men or women women women i think so too all right so we got the men's field let me see i think people who are going to break the last nine power cleans i'm not going to name them but i'm going to count one just name them two in his head he's going that person's a, that person's a pussy, that person's a pussy. Three, four. Definitely four, but probably six. You think Mitch McClune, Ethan Hellbig. No, actually not him. Logan Ewing and Leo Franco.

I'm not going to say it out loud, um but i don't think ethan hellbig will he's like 250 pounds he's just gonna just smash it 150 pounds i don't think he's gonna smash it because i don't know what his fitness is like but i don't think he's gonna i don't think he's gonna need to break up the barbell i think if anything he'll just be slower on the burpees brian how many people how many how many boys do you think are going to have to stop? The power cleans are going to make it so they can't touch and go. Two to four. I think probably Mitch, Dennis, Logan, Leo, and Jack Rosema

potentially break it up. Maybe Peter Mason. I don't know enough about him on a barbell. I think Ethan Helbig doesn't break it up, and I don't think Tola breaks it up maybe peter mason i don't know enough about him on a barbell i think ethan hellbig doesn't break it up and i don't think tola breaks it up but i don't know that tola did really good at that snatch burpee box jump over workout so i could see him winning this i don't think ethan has fast enough burpees to win it i don't think matt uh matt delugos is i was gonna say so you got yeah so you got so you got tola won the 963 and then3, and then DeLugos, if I'm not mistaken, won it the next year.

Yeah, they're both, I don't know, those are both good picks. Can you do it on broken, Taylor? Yeah, I can do it on broken. JR, who do you think is going to have to split up the power cleans? Take a break. Take a breath. I would also fucking pin the burpees just floor pedal to the metal i really don't have a i really don't have

i think that a lot i think this workout can be won and lost on the burpees actually especially one on the burpees laura knolls want me to start an only fans sorry you're gonna have to pay for that i'm not hailer bro oh sorry i didn't mean to so even if you're doing burpees really really fast the time per repetition is still going to be a little longer than a fast power cleaner fast thruster and you have 42 burpees 21 of each of the barbell movements so the burpees are really really important so important uh tom they have to step on the new youtube update made it impossible to navigate your channel page everything is buried in clips vids and no option to sort by release date very annoying they're gonna have to change that right i yesterday when i had uh aaron cairo on i was trying to

organize videos by date and i couldn't it's got to be on there somewhere and we just can't spot it that would be fucking insane if they if they got rid of that option this is from a guy who just did it and i i would i would agree but i i do think i don't think going singles in the i think this means burpees are the crux as long as with the prerequisite strength what do you think that looks like you mean someone someone doing the burpees slow or someone actually stopping yes no someone's stepping up on the burpees and taking a breath before they go into the next rep versus jumping up with both feet and jumping over okay like like a half a second to maybe even a second per repetition on the burpees

so they just went so they just went really hard on the echo bike they did a lot of step overs i would keep an eye on the best finishers from the first workout and how they do on the second workout comparatively. Explain. Just recoverability. So you have a lot of localized leg fatigue. And I know someone mentioned the grip, which I think is true. But I think this workout is going to be all like lactic in the quads. And that's about it.

But I would also say i think that there are going to be two people who don't do great in the muscle up workout tola and matt and i don't think that that has to do with why they're going to do so well in this event they do well on either way i think they do well on either way yeah we will then go into sunday where we will start event number three see if i can do this uh event number three what time does this start do we know what time in the morning dude you're the one who's streaming it oh i don't have the schedule up with me. It's workout number three.

It'll be Sunday morning every minute and 30, every 90 seconds until failure or completion. 30 double-unders, three snatches at 185, 125. 30 double-unders, three snatches, 205, 135. 30 double-unders, three snatches, 225, 145. Both days competition starts at 10 a.m. Thank you, Brian. 30 double-unders. So explain to me what's going on here.

I'm not following this work out. It's a ladder. It's a ladder, and it's basically a last man standing ladder. They're all going to have their own barbell. Three, two, one, go. You've got 90 seconds to do 30 double unders then three snatches at 185 as a guy and then whatever you have and then whatever you have left over you just stand around you just chill then at the next well not necessarily because

you have to change your own weights yes you change your own weights okay at the 90 second mark you got another 30 dubs and then after your 30 d, you got three snatches at 205. You just put the weight on. You finish that. You get to go to the next round, 30 dubs, 30 snatches, 25, three snatches. Sorry, not 30. At the four and a half minute mark, then you've got 30 dubs, two snatches, weight increases. And you just keep going until you fail. Somebody fails to complete it within the 90 second time domain, they're out.

If you make it past the 265 bar you get three minutes to keep snatching until you find a one rep wow that's harder than then i think that this workout even for good snatchers is a lot harder than a lot of people are going to read three and hillar did hillar hit 275 pretty easily if i'm not mistaken i mean so he made it through this whole thing it looks smooth yeah but i think he just i don't think he worked up to a max i think he just hit 275 and then he was done so so if you finish if you get to the 30 double unders one snatch steroids at 265 and 170 um you wait till the remainder of that 90 that 90 seconds is up yeah and then another clock starts a three minute clock starts

okay i'm digging it and this is the workout you guys have been talking about that may be the one that jacks up the z scores because of tola because z score and tola because his snatch is such a massive outlier against and what is his one rep 340 jesus is it really yeah that's crazy but can he do that under after under this fatigue well then you've got to this is the thing we never you would never have had to before he would have literally just had to beat the next best guy. No one in this field has ever snatched over 315, so you could just do 315 or 320, take the points and walk away. Now he has the incentive to go for it, especially, you know,

Taylor and I disagree about how he's going to do in the first workout. Well, I say he has a chance to do well. We just said, don't know. Either way, if he doesn't do well, then he's going to have to send it here. But regardless, why wouldn't he? So I think like, I think Tudor's got a 300 pound snatch. I know DeLugos has hit 315 before, but who knows where they're at in their training right now. Yeah, I think that'll be a huge question. What the spread is going to be. People are going to assume he's going to win, but can someone get within 15 to 20 pounds of them? And is maybe one of the people that we think are a contender that aren't going to snatch a ton of weight. Can they still be close to that median? Can they still be close to the average and not take 20 points on the first workout?

Cause it'd be really hard to come back from that. Is most of the field recovered from the first day yeah i would say it's a pretty light training volume day for them intensity intensity high but volume low right so uh what would something like total strategy be with three minutes left he looks around he tries to get two lifts in let me look here so i think with three minutes he's probably making three attempts yeah three i think this is right and i i actually think that he's in the first heat for that workout so he won't have you know at least to the field's advantage he won't have any of the numbers coming in you know everyone and uh delugos i think is in his group also not 100 sure on that but they'll let the schedule i'm looking at here and if he snatches first it's different than if he snatches last i think and and they were seated based on their

open performances uh well not necessarily because there were some latent changes so this the groups are just kind of whatever they're they're not're not, but they're not, uh, no, I don't think they're even seated. I think they're just random groups. Cause the whole point is that everyone, it's, uh,

you're only seated for the final. Everyone gets one, two, and three. And you're just with the people that you're with. I would like a disclaimer from Brian F that's you, uh, that he works for a sponsor of the show

he is commenting on. Who's a sponsor of the show that he's commenting on? A sponsor of what show he's commenting on? What the fuck? How come I can't find it? I think he's talking about Bar Bend, but Bar Bend isn't a sponsor of your show. Oh, but are they a sponsor of the Zelos games?

about barbend but barbend isn't a sponsor of your show oh but are they a sponsor of the zellos games no there's just their what their name is on there somebody fucking wrench jeff again you mean just kick him to the curb yeah fucking oh he says barbend is is sponsoring the games good oh they're not uh he has a coi what's that mean conflict of interest my goodness good and then he's landed at the perfect home the podcast i want everyone to have a conflict of interest uh the ladies um 185 seems like a big opening weight especially since you guys don't respect the women in this field uh i think the women 185 that's the male that's the male opening weight yeah i think the women are probably have a stronger field here than the men jr i would agree with that i would think it's uh christine's to. I would think it's Christine's to lose.

I would think she's a clear frontrunner in this workout. And Cole Brander. And Andrew Slayer is also going to do really well. By the way, the Heats I was looking at were incorrect. They are on Zellos Games Instagram. They've already announced the Heats for workout one. And Tola and DeLugas are in heat one for that, which means they're going to be in heat two and then they will be the last to snatch on the snatch workout. I think, uh, I bet Rose Scott, Christine Cullen, Brander, Kyra Milligan, and Andrea Nistler probably top four in this workout.

The snatch. Sounds fair. Paper Street Coffee, I guess Gabe's on an airplane right now. Is he going to Vegas? Is he coming out there? He's a sponsor. I think he is coming out there.

All orders at Paper Street Coffee. Copy? Paper Street Coffee. P-A-P-E-R-S-T-C-O-F-F-E-E. Use code SEVON. Get 20% off between now and Thanksgiving. CrossFit Corey. Rose Scott gonna do good for woman. Sorry.

I'm just reading that like Rose Scottott gonna do good for women she does she has the second highest snatch in the field behind colin brander which is what what is colin branders 215 207 for scott 200 for nistler did colin brander beat tia in some sort of snatch workout one year? At the games the year they did the snatch event, both Colin Brander and Tola did a demo in the Coliseum, and they both snatched more than the winning weight was in the actual competition. She won the snatch at the MAC, and they were both there. Oh, maybe that's what he's talking about. Wow.

Okay. Well, that's maybe that's what he's talking about wow okay well that's fun that's cool uh i'm also hearing that um the female tested the ring muscle at workout and got 40 oh wow who what female email cannot divulge why because i was asked to uh jr if you're coaching a taylor assuming he ever heals up and you were coaching him and give him to advice would you say to um just take it really slow and maximize every 90 seconds so that basically at 80 seconds, you're finishing your third, your last snatch, you gently go over, slap on the weights and just chill. I think, I think every athlete's a little bit different in the snatch comparatively to like the clean. And I think someone like Taylor, who's like, that's his best lift that you don't try to overcoach it. You put the rope down, you take one breath. If you're ready, go. You don't try to say, Hey, just wait 15 seconds, or I want you to do one snatch every 17 seconds and then walk back to the rope and do your 30 and then take a five second break and get chalk. I don't think that's

necessary. I think for some of the athletes, the easier barbells are just to get a little bit of a groove going. And then by the time they get to the two 45 to 55, they're in their rhythm and they know when to go i want to disagree with mike here i don't think the double unders i would disagree i don't think the double unders are going to help athletes i think maybe oh but you didn't hear my story about when i did this workout taylor i mean look i i've programmed the workout i programmed this this is a spin i actually talked to keifer on instagram this is a spin off of actually talked to Kiefer on Instagram. This is a spin off of the 2012. Was it the 2012 snatch ladder where they did 20 double unders, a snatch and they added weight. That's different than doing three snatches and having to change your own weights.

There's the 30 double unders just take up time and add pressure, especially in a 90 second window when you got to change your own weights. I don't think it's helping athletes. I think it's going to put a lot of pressure on people who are average or not the best at snatching. Seven, I want to tell you about this now, even though it's not going to matter. And when it happens, you're going to forget that I told you this. Expect someone to start missing a snatch early, like a second or third round. Someone misses a snatch and ends up crushing the workout.

I think it's like, you know, as you're warming up, you'll see people improve their technique. So don't be shocked if someone that ends up clearing the ladder and having a good snatch misses an early one. So, so that's a good to hear that because that's a good segue into what I'm about to say here. Uh, you have to have a buffer because the snatch is such a technical lift. You can't time it to the last second. You will, even if you're a great snatcher, you have to assume, hey, what if I miss one, right?

It happened to both of us when we were doing this workout. Obviously, we scaled the weights down to something that was reasonable, but we both missed what we thought would be a fairly routine rep, I think, in one of us in round two, one of us in round three. Who we? Who's we? My buddy and I that tested this workout. And then went on to clear the rest of the snatches without any incident.

Does anyone go touch and go? I mean, only if they're showing off. First couple rounds. Yeah, you're not banking any time, so it really doesn't help you. Does it add to fatigue? It gets your heart rate up yeah unnecessarily so I bet you someone does it but there's

no need to do it they're just laying their fucking dong out for no reason and I bet whoever does go to I don't know maybe I'm no judgment the thing is like we don't really understand how easy 3185 snatches are for someone like told

true understand how easy three 185 snatches are for someone like tola true uh okay uh anyone anything else you want to say about workout number three i'm always excited to go to the next one this one was brought to you by grip bishop barbell ace of spades bye-bye workout four final workout uh there's a good chance here the boys are oh this is an old version of this workout by the way can you zoom in oh this is not what's gonna happen this one no that they we've made a change since this was posted and And what was the change? The wall balls don't have to be unbroken. And is it still 35 reps?

I think so. It's on their Instagram for sure. JR? Ask your... I think the unbroken requirement would have been really cool. I have a feeling that Brian maybe can speak to us. That would probably become a judge athlete communication issue. If there was a no rep given,

then did they just go to 36 and 37 and 38? I think it would have been cool twist. So yeah, we really wanted to include some unbroken element of this workout we talked about doing it with some of the gymnastics we talked about the wall balls we talked about with different rep schemes um we ultimately decided not to because of the online component of the workout so that you know much in the nature of the wall ball um what was it the wall ball ladder the death by wall ball and the masters were like, if you did 10,

you know, 10 reps in round one, but you actually did nine. And when was a clear, no rep, did you ever actually advanced through the round? So we didn't want to have any. Yeah.

That makes sense for the online online. And because the live scores count for the online, we have to do the same workout. The name of the workout is full house presented by reebok and goruck it's four time 150 foot handstand walk in 25 foot sections meaning if you fall down you go back to the last 25 foot section it has 25 across turn around 25 back so yeah if you don't make it across you have to go back to the start of whatever that segment was uh 50 40 cal on the rower 35 wall balls uh 20 pounds and 14 pounds to 10 foot target 50 chest to bar pull-ups 10 devil press

with 70 pound and 50 pound dumbbells maybe performed as clean and jerk 50 toes to bar oh i like this 35 wall balls same weight finish uh then the rower and then another 150 feet uh handstand walk wow this is savage 22 minute time cap and the really uh cool thing about this because you know we've talked about the process for organizing athletes through the first three workouts we reseed them for the final so you'll have the bottom four middle four and top four going in that order for both the men and the women so it's the first time that the top competitors are competing against each other. Whereas in most competitions, the top competitors are competing against each other for days in a row. This, and you usually wouldn't have a long workout at the end. So this is an opportunity to see the

best go against each other over a long period of time in one workout to finish out the competition. James Sprague tears, James Sprague tears this up, right? There's a lot of gymnastics. I don't know. How's Tola do? I don't think he beats anyone by three minutes in it. Not everyone, but I, but I think there, you will easily see a three minute spread on this work.

Oh, for sure. But I don't think he beats the next closest competitor by three minutes. You think people get time capped on this? What's the time cap? I'm pretty sure it's 22. Yeah. Let me look through.

Tudor may lap folks on the handstand walk mike alpin yeah and like uh to mike's point if you if you just play with the order of movements a little bit and let's say you put like uh five double press to start and five double press to end but you put the 300 foot handstand walk in the middle then maybe you can have some separation that Tudor could create, but because everyone's starting fresh with the one 50 and everyone's doing the one 50 at the end, when everyone's relatively as tired, there isn't going to be as much opportunity for him to separate there. I agree. I I'm, I'm looking at it and I think like around 17 or maybe a little bit faster wins. Um, and then I'm sure there will be guys that time cap. Can we go to the guys?

Yeah, I just don't know enough about women to know how they'll do with the time. I definitely think men in this field will time cap without a doubt. Dennis wins this one too. He will not even come close. He has the body for it, Taylor. He has the body for it. Even though the wall balls isn't a mandatory requirement for 35, the fact that it is still 35 will encourage people to just go ahead and do it unbroken.

I don't think many people are going to break it. Well, Ryan, do you know just from a number standpoint why it reads that way? We had a I think that the original had also had 50 wall balls on both sides. And then we and then we went we were going to do it as the unbroken. So we dropped it down to 35. We tested it at 30 and 40 and settled at 35. And then we, uh, when we decided to take it away, we decided to leave it for the same reason that JR just said, just to see, just to tempt you because 50, probably everyone's

doing two, maybe three sets, setting themselves up 35. You could do it in one for sure, especially on the way out. But are you going to get to 30 chest bars and wish that you'd taken a break? I will see the chest of bars by the best guys in two sets. I don't know about that. I think so. I don't, I don't think so. I think that, I think three sets will be just fine here for the best.

I think the more important question is, can you do the toes-to-bar in three sets after the double breast? I don't think. I think those are more important than the chest-to-bar. I also wonder why, Brian, could you answer why they're allowing them to perform it as a clean and jerk? I think this was more. I think they would have not done that if it was only the live competition,

but it was more to make it just a little more accessible for a bigger population online. Wait, isn't it devil's press? Just a burpee with dumbbells? And a snatch overhead. Usually, it would say that you have to drive it to overhead in one continuous motion he's saying that you can get him here and go overhead and we also tested it both ways and definitely easier with the clean and jerk and i think almost everyone will do that there are a lot of people yeah i don't know that's way smarter for judging way smarter for judging yeah smarter

for judging i don't know that i would consider it uh it depends i don't know that i would consider it necessarily easier depending felt a lot easier you did all these workouts brian all four of these no i the only one i didn't do was the five seven nine gotcha i made the other guy do that uh who do you think going to win this guys we'll start with the women andrea andrea nistler yeah no doubt i think that's who i picked also in the article that i wrote previewing it and i think you know i think whenever you see chunk, so like sets of 50 would be chunk, and whenever you see chunk calories, females tend to be able to separate a lot more comparatively to the men. And someone like Andrea, who can probably row most male paces, I think she'll be able to separate even on the machine. Do you think she's going to win the whole thing, Jer?

I think so. Taylor? I agree. She just came into town, clean up some money and leave. There's nothing. I mean, these workouts are a little bit, there's enough variety here that you'll definitely see athletes who do well on one or two of them and struggle on one of them and middle pack on the other one.

I don't think she's going to struggle on any of the workouts. So she's probably gonna be top four, maybe five at worst on all five or four of them, which should be enough to win. What is she doing next year? Has she, do we know? No,

I've heard, I've heard a couple conversations conversations but ever since they announced the team uh the new team rules i've heard so many different possibilities for so many athletes in the world that it's i'm just not gonna count anything until they sign up all right but a lot of a lot of people are having conversations because the options are a lot more open than they were you know six weeks ago. Explain why. Because you don't have to live there starting on a certain date and log a certain number of hours and training receipts and everything else.

You can just show up and do the workouts on the opening quarterfinals and you're good. Are we doing a show before we pick the men here? Are you and Halpin and Young and myself and Tyler doing a show to review the last Hopper email? That was fun that last time we did that. Just break it down line by line. Yeah, I mean, I wanted to do that, but I don't know when we're going to do it because we're pretty busy the next three days. And that's just part one of them notifying basically the road to the games, right? The method that athletes have to, the protocol for getting to the games for the athletes.

The original one that we did that for a month or so ago was probably part one. This is like a addition to that, but then there's still more to come. So, you know, we could also just wait and see because there's a ton of questions that are unanswered. we could also just wait and see because there's a ton of questions that are on the unanswered. Like this, the thing about this email that was, I don't want to say upsetting, but you know,

frustrating is that it just created more questions than answers. Like they gave us a little bit, but then as we see by people talking about it, there's a lot more that we want to know now. And there's a lot more speculation about if, ifs when we don't have any facts. And this came out three days ago, yesterday, I think. Okay. Uh, for the dudes, about ifs when we don't have any facts. And this came out three days ago? Yesterday, I think.

Okay, for the dudes. Mr. James. I'd be surprised if anyone beats him in this. Taylor doesn't respect the James spray. No, I think it's probably between James and Matt Lugos. I picked Tudor in my article for this workout. But as I talked about a couple of days ago, it's just a huge wild card. It looked really good at the semifinals.

It looked really bad at the games. So I'm kind of banking on him looking good here. Yeah, that'd be interesting to see that too because at the semifinals, he was able to, you know, to dazzle the crowd and everyone on his speed and handstand walking. We saw in that workout with 400 feet that speed really did matter,

and it can make up time on the wall balls and the ski cows so in that type of live atmosphere with the long test this one's much different i think this is a lot more aerobically demanding so we'll see yeah it'll be interesting to see if you can log another good performance on a longer workout that's maybe not as heavily leaning on the handstand walk. Halpin had a comment here. There may be a Lauren Khalil bottom line tomorrow. I think that's in reference to getting some clarification on the hopper. I do know that Talking Elite Fitness guys got to talk to Dave Eubanks, and Chase also spoke to him. Did you watch both of those, Brian?

I haven't. I'll probably listen to them tomorrow while traveling. You're going to Vegas tomorrow? Yeah. Oh, a gentleman named Giannis. Brian and Taylor look like two hot gay dudes with those mo's. Thank you. Thank you.

What are mohawks? Mo oh mustaches respect okay uh jeremy uh jeremy world is choosing colton mertens colton would have done well on some of these workouts for sure i think he's going to do it online so we'll see we'll see uh if you can win one or two of them. Um, so, so basically the way this works is these, these 24 athletes are going to do these workout workouts on Saturday and Sunday. They're going to put up their scores. They're capable of redoing them again, right? I believe so. There's, uh, I can't remember if there are windows that some of them have to be done by. So let me go back a second. So when I said Andrea Nistler was just coming to win the money and go home, there's actually no money to be won this weekend.

I think it's $1,000. I think you can win money in the live, and you can also win money online. Okay, but the big money is online. So basically everyone who watches this can then go do these workouts, can register for the Zealous Games, do these workouts as many times as they want and try to beat their scores. And whoever's at the top of the heap gets to loot. Yep. I understand it correctly. All right.

This is going to be exciting. Any final words for you guys? Any thoughts, comments? It's a different format. It's, you know, it's we rarely see four workout competitions for high level. When you say rarely, you mean never? No, we saw it for last chance

qualifier, but we never get to see a competition actually take place before our eyes in a four workout test. So, you know, there can be big opportunities for point swings, especially with the scoring system and a small number of events so it should make it exciting i think that the nature of how the workouts are designed it is uh like you'll see people that will go for it in each workout

even the short compared to the long the heavy compared to the you know the cyclical and uh all of those things can bet you know combined, great opportunity for the athletes who were able to make it to Vegas to do this. And I think probably going to be a pretty exciting weekend. I'm pumped for it. Any final thoughts, Taylor? No, I like the workouts. I'm excited. It'll be fun to watch.

Are you depressed you're not there? No, I'm not depressed I'm not there. Okay. What are you depressed you're not there? No, I'm not depressed. I'm not there. Okay. What are you depressed about? Mr. Howell, any final thoughts? Yeah, I think the workouts are really well-rounded. I think it's really difficult to do that with a four-workout competition, but it looks like these are really well-balanced.

So I'm interested to see on the last day, by the last workout, kind of where everyone's at. And you used the Z-score at the last event you put on the crash crucible? We did. And would you use it again? Yeah. Are you going to use it again? We'll see.

All right. Brian, were you happy with the Z-score at the crash crucible? For the most part, yeah. score at the crash crucible for the most part yeah i think that that you know the really the cool thing about it is you know i've mentioned before you can apply it backwards but you need to do it you like you need to try it out and they definitely learned one or two things uh doing it at crash that you couldn't have learned if you didn't do it oh so so it was nice to use it as as a sort of a test for uh tyler then yeah it wasn't even i think it was a it was more of like a learning because it's basically what we learned is that

you know the the programmer needs to be conscious of the scoring system and this should always be the case and then because it's a new scoring, there's some elements of it that we maybe didn't, didn't predict. And we've tried to think about a lot of different, uh, elements. The fallout of that is that Tyler's had, you know, more thoughtful and high level conversations with people who are taking an interest in this. And so instead of being, you know, it's for most of the time, it's just been him. And I've tried to help him out with ideas relative to workouts, but on the math side of things, I don't have the same capacity that he does, but he's met some people who do Alexis Johnson being one of them. And he's been, you know, I think making some improvements since

then. I think that like you mentioned earlier, this, this style of competition, small workouts, small field is going to be another opportunity for him to learn and evaluate and say, is this an appropriate spot to use the score with such few workouts and so few athletes uh jr has been his instagram account has been suspended which is just bizarre there's there's like i mean he posts pictures of people doing pull-ups and doing skier maybe they thought the skier was like someone jerking two people off or something maybe it was that uh double overhead kettlebell overhead squat from taylor that he posted the other day it's the most g-rated uh very provocative it's the most g-rated instagram account you can see the outline of my penis in that picture everybody in the comments don't go

look at it you can't you can't look at it it's gone you gone. You can't pull up the page. My helmet is gone forever. Someone sent me a video. I wonder if I saved it. It's Jason Hopper blacking out. Oh. Have you guys seen this? Oh, he did post that?

That's from my surveillance. Is it on Jason? Is it on Hopper's Instagram account? No, I think it was on his story. Was that the most recent Jason Hopper thirst trap? Has that ever happened to you guys? Any of you guys? I've never fallen down, but I've had to grab the bar and support myself. Only on Front Squat, too, which is what I think he was doing.

Me, too. Front Squat. bar and like support myself only on front squat too which is what i think he was doing me too front squat yeah i think it's just the way it puts pressure on where all that blood fucking goes into your joint you know to to be uh i think i i think i think people i think you vagal down like you bear down that's called a vagal and i think that you should not be doing that. And when you vagal, that's when blood pressure drops. It doesn't have to do, I don't think, with blood flow. What's the thing in the back of your throat called? The uvula? The uvula. Dude, my best friend was in town and he told me a joke about the uvula.

Let's hear it. No, I can't repeat it. Sorry. Vagal maneuvers are techniques to increase vaginal parasympathetic tone in an attempt to diagnose and treat various arrhythmias. They're often utilized first in an effort to abort episodes of stable supraventricular. Yeah, SVT. Yeah, tachycardia is very fast.

Yep, all tachycardias. So the Valsalva maneuver is one of those. Bearing down like you have a bowel movement. Oh, shit. So when you do that, it'll make you feel really lightheaded if you do it for too long.

So I think a lot of times when people brace to squat like that, they're actually bearing down as opposed to tightening. What do you mean by bearing down? Won't that give you hemorrhoids? Can you articulate that more? Like pushing down in their abdomen? Like you're having a bowel movement. Like you're taking a shit.

Like they're pushing the musculature downward got it like what nick matthews did in the sandbag uh event did he actually shit himself he shat a pellet yeah no what i've done that deadlifting he shat a pellet a little yeah yeah uh types of types of vagal maneuvers uh bearing down like you're having a bowel movement. Oh, I like it. And they even put the word pooping in there for people like Taylor and myself. What's diving reflex? What's that?

I don't know. It has to do with your uvula. God, I love that word now. Is that what makes you have a gag reflex? If something tickles your uvula? So there's a reason why you'd want to do that? Why would you want to do that, JR? Why would you want to do a vagal maneuver? To brace.

You're bracing your midline. Some people, that's how they brace. I can do it without the shitting piece. Then you probably know how to properly brace yeah that's the point i think i think people um it's just like when women give birth right and they're told to push but oftentimes they'll defecate it's because the two feel it's because the two feel the same don't use that word bro defecate all right b Brian's getting pissed can we move on we gotta stop talking about shit and babies

push a baby out and you'll know you have to talk to Taylor like he's a 5th grader that's cool okay do we have a show tomorrow night pre-show oh okay so I will tell you show tomorrow night? Pre-show?

Oh, okay. So I will tell you this. Tomorrow night we will be doing a camera test. We will go live with it. Sousa will get there. We'll set up some cameras, and we will do a live test from the venue tomorrow. It's not a time. It'll just pop on.

There's a chance we'll get to see Brian there and some of the athletes there, and we'll roam around and be doing some tests. We'll be doing it live. We'll take questions from you in the comments uh as uh susan walks around and tests out the cameras and the audio and then saturday morning we'll basically be up and running from 9 a.m pacific standard time till it's over which is about 4 p.m pacific standard time and the same thing on sunday i'm excited for all of you guys to uh be here watch us try to pull this thing off uh and thanks everyone for their support anything else boys gentlemen nope guys bye