The Sevan Podcast - #70 - Emma Tall

Episode Date: July 9, 2021

The Sevan Podcast EP 70 - Emma Tall and Brian Friend @SEVANMATOSSIAN @BRIANFRIENDCROSSFIT @EMMTALL The Sevan Podcast is sponsored by http://www.barbelljobs.com Follow us on Instagram https://www.instagram.com/therealsevanpodcast/ Sevan's Stuff: https://www.instagram.com/sevanmatossian/?hl=en https://app.sugarwod.com/marketplace/3-playing-brothers Support the show Partners: https://cahormones.com/ - CODE "SEVAN" FOR FREE CONSULTATION https://www.paperstcoffee.com/ - THE COFFEE I DRINK! https://asrx.com/collections/the-real... - OUR TSHIRTS ... Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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Let's go seize the night. That's the powerful backing of American Express. Visit amex.ca slash yamex. Benefits vary by car and other conditions apply. I hear the chatter. Yeah, do you? I do, but it's not bad. It's not bad.

It adds a certain ambiance. It makes it real to hear a little chatter in the background. Okay, because I have closed the door, but maybe it goes through. It's people getting excited because they got their first pull-up. Are you at the gym? Yeah, I'm at the gym. Emma, do you know Brian up here? A little bit, but I never met him in real life.

Okay. I've met David a couple of times. Yeah. We know who you are we've made a uh we've made it our favorite pastime to watch the crossfit games and to watch the athletes and to judge the shit out of them that's what uh we do and we we sit on our high horses and critique and talk shit and decide who's gonna win decide who's going to win and who's not going to win and who has the best outfit, et cetera. And, uh, man, you, you've, you've, you've skyrocketed into the limelight. So congratulations. That's a good thing, right? Yeah, I guess so. It is, it is, it is. Um, when I was, uh, I uh i dug to your instagram and um i i just kept having this one thought

um over and over i used to go to the i used to live in santa barbara california do you know where that is uh yeah roughly okay it's between san francisco and los angeles on the coast of the north american continent very perfect weather there. It's just a beach community. So for 10 years, every day, I went to the beach, basically. And before I would feel comfortable taking my shirt off, I had to have a beer, or three, or sometimes four, depending on how I felt.

And as I'm going through your Instagram, I noticed that it looks like, and correct me if I'm wrong, your career, somewhere in your fitness, physique, moving, heavy objects career, you used to get on stage, right? And you'd be wearing a tiny little bathing suit. And it's basically the beach, but in a public setting. And people, I don't know how bodybuilding works, but then people would critique your physique and you would put yourself in this situation right yeah it's they don't just like create a critique your physique like it's everything like how you look what makeup you wear and everything so everything about you yeah okay like like so how many beers do you need to do that

what do you what how many beers do you need to do that? How many beers do you need to get on stage? Because I didn't even want... At the beach, everyone's critiquing your physique too. But they're kind of pretending not to. But here, you're going up there. So how many beers is that? Well, it was zero beers. But you actually had a bit of liquor before you went up just to dry you out even more.

Oh, really? Yeah. And how – see, Brian? I know Brian, when I was bringing this up, thought I was absurd. He goes, here's Sevalon saying some absurd shit again. And now look at it. I've nailed something. You have, but mostly I was thinking there's probably just a difference between her body and your body.

There is a significant difference. So mine was for my mental game and yours was to actually enhance your physique. Does that really, how, what liquor would you drink and how soon before and how much? This is six years ago, so my memory is a bit vague. But I think it was Bayley's. And it was not a lot like I've ate so little that week. So it I didn't need a lot. Would you ever drink so much that you felt like but because you're I guess you were dehydrated and you hadn't eaten in a while. Would you ever drink so much like you take one shot and I guess you were dehydrated and you hadn't eaten in a while, would you ever drink so much, like you take one shot and you're like, oh shit, I'm buzzed? No, I don't think it even was a shot.

It was so little. I only did two competitions, so I didn't do it for a very long time. Was your first one terrifying? Yeah, a little bit and i also never really enjoyed to compete and go on the stage at all like i enjoyed the journey and the challenge but not the actual competing parts it's um it's basically you putting in a ton of hard work and then and then and then showing your hard work right it's like um doing a painting and then hanging it up in a coffee shop yeah yeah basically you're scoped in your own body and you're like and do you scope when you do that do you scope that based on what

you like or based on what you on some sort of um um manifesto of what the body should look like? Are you like, man, I really want to, I love my lats. And so I'm going to just do tons of pull-ups and I'm going to go up there on stage and show off my lats. Or is it basically on some manifesto? Like, hey, these are the criteria they're going to be judging me on. Yeah, it's more like the later part, like what they judge you on. And so there are like so many different classes you can compete in. And then you just have to look at what you have to look like to compete in that class and then try to look like that. And how old were you when you started that?

22. Okay. So young. And then basically as I got older, now that I have kids, any insecurities I have about taking off my shirt, I have to push them away because I don't want my kids ever to see my insecurities. Right. Because I don't want to share them with them. Not that I'm embarrassed or shy about them, but now it's like, I, I re I realized that confidence comes from in here right like if you if you if you're a fat peacock but you're still a peacock then it's okay you can still strut your shit and people be like damn that's a peacock so do you know what a peacock is yeah okay okay i don't know if that was one of those words that translates so well

you're you and what's the first language you spoke uh swedish and then what's the second language you spoke english and how old were you when you learned that oh we start quite young maybe 10 years old like you start to learn and then like, yeah, you probably studied in school for another seven years, seven, eight years. And when I was at the beach, I played a lot of Frisbee, a lot of Frisbee. So I would go down there at 10 in the morning and I would play Frisbee till six at night. And once I would start running around and throwing the Frisbee and I was really good at it. Like really good at it. I can make the Frisbee do all sorts of crazy tricks. I didn't care what my body looked like

anymore because any insecurities I would have, I'd be like, Hey, there's no one here at the beach. You could throw the Frisbee harder than mine. I'm getting a pump. And like, now this is really the show me playing Frisbee. And I bring this up to you because it must be something like that for you as opposed to staying still on the stage and letting people judge your body. Now it's like, you must feel just free and incredible to go out onto the field, like somewhere at a CrossFit event and be like, yo, this thing, look what this thing can do. Like, it's, I mean, is it like substantially more fulfilling? Yeah, definitely.

But before I did fitness, I spent 12 years competing in swimming. So the fitness was more just like of a sidetrack, I I would say like swimming was what I did for the longest time and then when I decided to stop swimming I still wanted to uh I still wanted to train I still wanted to have a goal and because I've always had so easily to put on muscles that That was my first choice. And then I didn't really enjoy it. And then I found CrossFit, which I enjoyed a lot more. So, yeah, it's a big difference. It's such a – and I don't mean to take a dig at bodybuilding or physique,

like to each his own. By no means am I putting it down. But it's just a – it's such a difference to showcase the moving body as opposed to the still body. And I think as the – you don't even have to worry about your body when you're doing CrossFit, right? Like it's a mental game. You've done all the preparation for the body. You don't need to worry about it anymore, right? No, the body is just a machine and your brain is in charge.

So tell me, how did you find CrossFit? I actually found it in the Netherlands. I lived in the Netherlands for two years, worked at IKEA, and I just found the box there and started to do CrossFit. And how did you find it? Did one of your coworkers work out there? It was actually one of my swim coaches that told me for two years, like, oh, you should try crossfit i think you do well i think you really like it and uh i was away uh traveling in uh in australia

for a year so then uh i didn't do it for that year and then after that uh yeah i decided to look into it because he was like really eager He continued to send me a message like, oh, yeah, you should really try CrossFit. Were you intimidated going into the box? Was there any fear? Yeah, a little bit. Actually, I went there first and I was just outside looking in. You're like, where's the pool? You're like, where's the pool?

You're looking in the window. I don't see a pool in here. Yeah yeah and i didn't dare to go in so i went back home again and then i went back the next day that's a great that's great that you said that because i think a lot of people who are deconditioned have that same experience with crossfit but someone who's already an athlete coming there and still having that mindset, that's kind of cool to hear. Yeah. I've heard that story many times. Gym owners were telling me they'll schedule an appointment and then it'll be a few minutes past the appointment and the client won't be there.

And they'll look out the window and they'll see the client sitting in the car. It's like the same story. It's like you were saying, Brian. And they'll walk out to the car and they'll be like, yo, what are you doing? Come in. Come on. So you walk in there and you went by yourself? Yeah.

And you didn't know anyone in the gym? No. And so tell me about that. So you walk in and you do a workout that first day you're there? I can't remember if it was the first day or if i

like went back the other day to just try a class uh but yeah i did try a class and i absolutely loved it and yeah do you remember the first workout you did no not exactly it was a lot of lunges a lot of uh i think front rack lung, but I don't remember exactly what it was. And were you sore? Yeah, I'm pretty sure I was a bit sore. You said you swam for 12 years. Who got you into swimming? I think it was myself. I enjoyed being in the water a lot when I was a kid.

So no one in my family swims. So I think it was just myself. I think, if I'm not mistaken, Finland has a big swimming culture. Does Sweden have a big swimming culture as well? Yeah, I would say so it's uh yeah i'm just trying to think if any of the other like swedish athletes have really stood out you know like for example jonah koski is like such a such a good swimmer and i think amelia is a pretty good swimmer too and i know you've done really well in swimming events but i can't remember if the other Swedish athletes like Camilla or anyone has shined in the water like that. And, sorry, go ahead.

No, you go. When you swim for 12 years, did you have a goal? Was it like to get a collegiate scholarship? Was it to go to the Olympics? Did you have a goal? Was it like to get a collegiate scholarship? Was it to go to the Olympics? Did you have a goal? Yeah. So in swimming, you basically have like times. So to qualify for a competition, you need to swim on a certain time.

So the goal, it was really easy to have a goal because, you know, if I swim at this time like then i qualified uh and um the goal was to uh to go to college uh but i actually stopped swimming uh before that um so the the highest level as aam at was like the Swedish championships. Just out of curiosity, I used to swim as well. Was there a certain stroke or event that was your favorite or best? 200 butterfly. That would make sense for the strong lats.

Yeah, that's exactly what I was thinking. And why did you quit? Was it abrupt? Was it like, I'm done? Or was it just life, there was a smooth transition into something else? So I had a shoulder injury. And it had been bothering me for three years. And it went better, but it just never went away and I really really enjoyed

the training and I enjoyed competing a bit less than I enjoyed the training so I started with just like I'm gonna take like a break from competing and I'm just going to train because that's what I enjoy the most. But then it's like the shoulder injury got more of a problem because the motivation for competition disappeared. So then the motivation for training actually decreased as well. And then I decided to quit. well and then I decided to quit I still I still swam a bit but before I decided to quit it was like five to six hours of swimming a day and then he went down to maybe just like one or two hours three three days a week. Is the butterfly stroke known?

Do you know what stroke hurt your shoulder? Was it a particular stroke? And is that stroke known to put a lot of stress on the shoulder? I think it was just, I think it wasn't butterfly in general. It was just the volume. I also went from, so here in Sweden, like you go, you go in school until you're 16 years old. And then you choose to continue for another three years. And then you can choose like what subject you want to study.

So when I was 16 years old, I moved away from home to go to a swim school where I could basically swim as one of my subjects. So I went from not so much training to almost the double in time per week from like one day to another. And after one year of that, like then, then it's when the shoulder started to complain. So I think I just made a mistake in training to just like put too much volume directly. Yeah. So at 16 years old in Sweden, if you wanted to, you could be done with school and just move right into the workforce? Yeah, you could. done with school and just move right into the workforce yeah you could it's not uh it's not so uh common i would say that probably 95 percent does another three years

and then after that you can do go to uh university okay gotcha there's a there's a theme here now between the two so when you were doing the bodybuilding you really enjoyed the training but the but the stage wasn when you were doing the bodybuilding, you really enjoyed the training, but the stage wasn't like your favorite. And then in swimming, you really enjoyed the training, but the competition wasn't your thing so much. It seems like it's not like that in CrossFit, but I could be wrong. In CrossFit, do you like the competition? I would say I've learned to like it.

Did that come with age? Is that because you got older and more mature? Or what do you mean? How have you learned to like it? I think with age, but also just with working with myself and find out more like why I like to do what I do and why I want to compete because I say that I like training more than competing

but when I take the competition away the motivation for training still decreases so I think it's just like I've been working with myself and I got older. It's funny because people like, if we didn't have any listeners, we wouldn't do the podcast.

Right. And if you, if, um, there weren't any movie theaters, people, I bet guarantee you 99.99% of directors wouldn't make movies. Like there's a part of it that you're, you're due for yourself, but like, if you didn't have a place to showcase it, or if you didn't have anyone to listen, you might not do it. Right. And ideal world, you would say, no, I'm going to do whatever I do. And I don't care about the outcome, but, but you, you, you, um, you talk about it very well. It's the motive. It's the motivation. And I think that whatever it takes to be motivated, to be the best version of yourself is valid.

Who's to say it's not? This year was a – obviously you were thrust into the spotlight for not only your performance but the debacle that happened around you having to go through the last chance qualifier. Is that all behind you now? And we'll go back and talk about that a little bit. But is that like when you made it, Brian and I got on the phone, I said, well, you kind of reminded me, when I pictured you in your head, I pictured, do you know who Tupac is, the rapper? Yes.

There's a famous picture of him where he's flipping off the camera like this, and he's got the Thug Life tattoo. And I just pictured you like this. As soon as you got the results from the last chance qualifier, you were like this. Like a remake of that Tupac photo. So let's go back to the beginning of the Open this year and we'll kind of walk our way up to this. But before we do that, are you over it now? Like, will you go to the Games with a clear head? I will go to the Games because I want to be there

and compete with the best people in the sport. And, uh, I, uh, yeah, I would say it's a clear head, but I still, I still think that what happened wasn't, uh, wasn't good and it wasn't very well handled. And, uh, that could be better and with everything that then happened around it like it was our way to get feedback out and it's like everyone can make mistakes and like that's how it is but if someone continues to make mistakes and they never get feedback like they would never change right so with everything that we did after was more because we wanted we want to see a change we don't want it to happen again, like to anyone else or to me again. And I think that's still where I stand.

I'm not, I'm not happy with what happened after. Because nothing has really happened. But if I go to the games, I will still go there, like for me, and compete against the best in the world. And sorry for people who don't know what happened and we will get back to that we'll fill some of the holes but i guess my question is is will you go there with a clear head like is there any energy inside of you that is still dealing with that debacle with those with those hiccups that got you here or will you go have will you use it as motivation or is it just a fresh start will you go have will you use it as motivation? Or is it just a fresh start? Will you go to the games? But I'm guess I'm just wondering is I would think you would I would think

you would want to go there with all of this behind you and just be present for this. Is it possible to do that? Or was the journey so had so much drama that it scarred you and you will bring it to the games. Does that make sense? Or will you go there with all of that behind you and just be like, here I am and be able to be able to not deal with that? Like after this podcast, will this be the last time you ever talk about it? I don't not talk about it, but that's not fair. I don't mean to put that on you like that.

Not talk about it, but that's not fair. I don't mean to put that on you like that. My thoughts for you are that it is that I would want you – it would be a shame if it was like hindering you in any way of performing at the games, I guess is what I'm saying. And I do not think that I will. I don't think that I will put everything behind me either, but it won't hinder me. The only thing it would be is then motivation. And it's not that I will go there and have any enemy or anything. It's just I still haven't got an answer or an explanation for that.

It won't happen again. Right. And I think until I get that, it will still be with me. Right. But it won't hinder me. I guess it's kind of like if you were in a relationship with someone and then you found out they were cheating on you. And then that relationship is over and you go into the next relationship. How much will that burden you in the next relationship?

Will you never be able to trust someone again? You know what I mean? So I guess I'm just drawing a parallel. There's nothing for you to say that. But I'm just trying to draw an analogy to what it's like moving forward. So let's go back to the beginning of this year. So tell me about the Open this year, and then we'll work our way up to your extra workout you had to do because I have a lot of questions about the last chance qualifier.

So did you know that you were going to do the Open this year? That was the plan all along? Yeah, that was the plan all along, definitely. And how did you do in the open uh for myself i did not do well uh so the plan was to do the open the whole time uh but uh the training uh leading up to the open uh was a bit too hard like both me and david my boyfriend we increased the volume a bit and the intensity and we just both ended up being a bit overtrained we both got a lot of knee pain just before the open which then we ended up not being able to squat. I wasn't able to squat until just before semi-final. Obviously, I did squat during quarterfinals, but nothing in between.

And I had to pay for it after. And it was also before every Open workout. I was just so mentally overt trained like I had a mental breakdown and I started to cry because I didn't want to push so I was not in a good place during the open or during the quarterfinals but we handled it and we took down the volume and And by semifinals, it was better. So I had a very tough start to the season. But I decided to stick with it. Davey was also going to do the Open. But his knee, I think, and his elbow and hamstring got injured.

So he couldn't even do the workouts. That should be a kid's song knee elbow hamstring yeah i have three little boys knee elbow hamstring it's it's a trip to me that both of you had a knee problem do you think that that is indicative of the training you were doing or that was just coincidence no it was the training it was both the volume of running and squatting was very high. And it's something that we both wanted to get better at. But we just did it way too much for what our bodies could handle. Are you guys competitive with each other? You and David? Yes. so so it's interesting that that's another interesting thing right because i'll hear top athletes say yeah you can't train with a top another top athlete every day because you guys

will just run each other into the ground that you'll just go 100 every day every day will be a competition is there a little bit of that going on between emma and david uh i would say both yes and no because we are competitive with each other, but it's still male filmer, which makes it, I think that makes it a bit easier, because you can compare, but it's some things you can't compare. But

definitely, every workout and stuff we did together, you pushed a little harder, because you know what you're good at, and I know what he's good at. Brian, do you want to say something about her open? By looking at her numbers, do you see anything that makes you go, oh, that explains that?

She must have been crying between pull-up seven and pull-up eight. Well, the open was a little different this year. There wasn't actually a ton of squatting in it. They had some thrusters in 21.3. But other than that, I don't think there was any squatting really required. So she might have got off the hook a little bit there. But what I was curious about is, you know, last year, David, he had made the games. And so I'm sure you were very supportive for him.

And I know when he kind of announced that he wasn't going to go forward with the season this year due to injuries he made a big i think he made a big effort to really be there for you and to try to be like all right this is kind of emma's turn this year and i'm going to be there so i just was wondering kind of what his role was like as he had to maybe back off his training and invest a little bit and more in you as a coach and support system. Yeah, definitely. He started his off season and did stuff to make his body feel good again. But he was also there to support me a lot more than what he could have done if he would compete as well.

Which obviously made it a lot easier for me uh because if we both would have done all of these online competitions i i don't even i don't really know how we would we would have had to hire someone or something and i mean it sounds like it's pretty good for you do you think it's been hard for him this year or do you think that's a role that he's kind of enjoyed being able to do for you uh i think both uh for the last chance qualifier he was a bit sick of it and a bit sick of me but uh he was there and uh i would not have been able to do what I did without him. He has helped me a lot. And also during the semifinals, when things didn't go as planned in the beginning, he was there and supported me

so I could still continue to do as good as possible. So obviously that has been very helpful for me. And I think that he has enjoyed it. But I also think that some part of him is missing out because he is a competitive athlete. And if you don't compete then and you watch other people compete, I think you will always feel that you miss out a bit. He's a bit of a giant, right, David? How tall is he? Or he looks like a giant when he stands next to you at out a bit. He's a bit of a giant, right, David? How tall is he? He looks like a giant when he stands next to you at least.

Yeah. He's 189 centimeters. Oh, yeah. He's pretty tall. He's like 6'3", I think. Okay. So I don't need to ask Google how many inches that is. 6'3", yeah, okay.

So do your parents follow what you're doing, your mom and dad? Yes, they do. And did you explain to them – it was the semifinal workout, correct, where we had all the notoriety and discussion where the whole CrossFit Games world started focusing on Emmental, although you have a pretty large following even without this debacle. Did you explain it to them what happened to your mom and dad? Yes, yeah, I did. Could you explain it to us like you explained it to them? Oh, I don't even remember half of it, you know. Fake it, fake it, fake it, fake it. Fake it, fake it.

For the sake of the show, fake it. We'll put a little asterisk by it. Like, actually, my mom is very up to date. She's following everything. So she basically knows what has happened before I got to tell her. Wow, that's awesome that's cool yeah i think there's i think that before she says that like we should kind of just set the stage in case anyone doesn't doesn't recognize like the women in europe are extremely good and the the top

echelon of women there are it's difficult to break into that group and there's but they're all they're all getting a little older and so the girls that are five to ten years younger which in this case i mean you know 22 to 30 years old range in europe i think they're all starting to feel like we we really have a chance now like we've been doing it long enough also and these girls are just not they're getting older that's how it is that we can start to make an in inroads here to be relevant as competitors top competitors in Europe, but they only get 10 spots at the games five and five. And if you look at the field,

like the girls that are six through 10th in Europe, they're, they're not like, there's a small margin for separation between those top spots. So everything is going to matter in this online competition. So I'm, I'm pretty sure that Emma and David and every other pair of athlete and coach or team that's looking at the semi-finals is reading through the rules very closely and deciding this is what we can do in each workout to maximize our performance is that fair emma yeah yeah definitely that's how it was brian who are some of these are all the top? So you're saying only five can go, but you're saying the top 10 are all game-level athletes?

You know, they're knocking on the door. So there's, you know, for example, in the competition that Emma was in, because it was split into two, you have girls like Kristen Holton, Katrin Davidsutter, and Sam Briggs, very well established in the sport. But then you have girls like Emma and like Amelia Lepinen and Jacqueline Dahlstrom and Matilda Garnes, and we could say there's actually several other Swedish girls as well that are just right there. They're very good.

They've been competing in off-season competitions, and they're looking for every edge they can to get that chance at the games. And like you were saying, we were saying yesterday when we were talking to Carolynolyn prevo the women's competition not only does europe have some of the biggest savages in the sport but the women's competition could is could very easily be argued as being more difficult than the men's that it is a it is where all the heavy hitters are starting to pile up i mean there's a lot of depth on both sides but uh if you think that the men's competition is more difficult than the women's, it's at least equal.

Okay. All right. So, Brian, what was this workout? Can you tell me the rep scheme and what it was, the semifinal workout? Well, the last workout was Gretel, and it's 10 rounds of three clean and jerks and three bar-facing burpees. So it's pretty straightforward. The weight's not too heavy. So you knew that. Is Gretel a Swedish name? Do you know any Gretels? That sounds like some European name.

Like, I don't know a Gretel. You don't know? That's not like a Gretel. No, you don't know any Gretels either. Doesn't that sound like a Swedish name or something? Not that I have any idea, but like I've never met it. We know. What are Hansel and Gretel? What are they?

Those are the kids that got lost in the woods, right? Yeah, but in Swedish that would be Hans and Greta. Oh, so it is Gretel. I'm just saying it wrong. It's a German name. Gretel's a German name. I'm from California. There's just Europe.

There's no Sweden and Germany. It's just Europe. Okay, so is that true? Did Brian paint it well that you guys looked at the rules very closely and you're like, okay, these other workouts say that – what was the distinction between them, Brian? You were telling me that four or five of the first four workouts said you can't do this, but it didn't mention it in the sixth workout. Yeah, basically that you can't have anyone other than the athlete touch the equipment. So did you look at that ahead of time and be like, okay, it's not in this one. That means you can do it. Like, did you think that?

Were you that meticulous? Like on the last day yes but it wasn't like uh i always read like everything that crossfit sends you like all the standards and i went into even like google and read the rule book and stuff and because of what happened the first day with that when i got a penalty for the last day i climbed up the leaderboard and i was in sixth place and that's all I know. So on the last day, obviously I did everything to push everything I could to get into that fifth place. So before I was gonna do Gretel and the event six, I read all the standards and I watched the video and David did the same as he was gonna judge me and we saw that it wasn't stated that no one can touch your equipment.

So I went in and I read the rule book and the rule book only said that the event organiser, which was the CrossFit, are the ones that are supposed to give you the standards and the movement standards and standards for every event. So we thought about it and because it wasn't stated anywhere and I was in sixth place, we decided to then we're going to do that this way. And because it was stated in other workouts, we even thought oh either they miss it out or they have they have taken it out by purpose because it's everyone got different plates and different floor so maybe that's why they're taking it out and we decided to do it like it was a decision before we started

of course it's not like David started to do it in the workout without me approving it. So one, it's a very strong point that it was omitted in this workout, but not omitted in the other workouts. That's a very strong point. And then also you mentioned that it was because you were in sixth place. You knew that you needed to do everything to your ability to make sure you stayed in the bubble. Yes. And Seven, I don't know if you lost there in the middle, but she had also received the penalty on workout two from day one of that competition. So she was already aware of the fact that they were very closely scrutinizing the videos and assessing penalties.

So I don't think that someone who already received the penalty would be trying to do something to induce another penalty. She was trying to avoid that. She knew it was real. Don't speed down this street. They'll give you a ticket. She'd already gotten one ticket. She wasn't trying to get a second ticket. But she also knew that she was outside of the bubble

and that this was going to be a tight workout where seconds and tenths of seconds could be the difference between moving up that one spot and not. How close were those fifth and sixth place points going into the final workout? Do you see? Sorry, I know that's a little... Do you remember how close they were, Emma? No, I don't. Okay. But you knew close enough that you were in control of your own destiny. Basically, if you killed it, you go. Yeah. So you do the workout, and the piece of contention is that on the – No, no, we should.

What was the movement? This is my understanding. Please help me if I'm wrong here. She done the workout with plenty of time left in the window to submit the videos, and she submitted her video, and that she actually heard back from CrossFit, we got your video and it's good, and you still had time to potentially do the workout again if they had said otherwise, correct? Yes. So I actually did event 6 before event 5, as you could do. So I did Gretel before the rope climb event. And even though I read all the standards and the rulebook and everything, obviously it was...

I also wanted to send the video in fast to get it approved or not approved if that would have been a problem. Because even though we read everything, we're not stupid. And so I sent it in hours before the deadline. And then I was sitting and waiting to do the workout again if it would be a problem with the video. But then they approved the score on my video one and a half hour before the deadline to send in your score.

Just out of curiosity, I want to go back and ask what was the contentious movement for people who are leaving, but listening, but did they approve your sixth workout before your fifth because you sent the video for your sixth in first? Yes. Okay, that's cool. So what was the movement that was in contention? Where was the dispute? Why I got a penalty in the workout? Yeah. Yeah, so it was because my judge

touched my barbell. And what was the movement? Sorry. Because some people might not know who are listening so it was a cleaning jerk and i dropped the barbell and then my judge like kept the barbell to the floor and your judge was david yes my judge was david he's a good dude he's a good dude does he yell at you during the workout at all what's he do to motivate you does he yell or does he whisper or does he tell you you're going to have to sleep outside? Like what is the... No, I think there is more yelling than whispering. More yelling. Okay, good. And basically, it's not like the bar's flying all over the place.

He's just settling it down so that you can quickly jump over it. Yes. Okay. And do you think that that really made a significant impact on the workout i don't think it made 20 seconds of a difference but maybe made some difference like we still decided to do it to if that would have made one second difference like that's what we what we felt that we needed or i think it was also i didn't want to sit after and watch other people do this well i didn't do it and then they would qualify because they did it and because i didn't if if that is a one or two second difference that could be if you qualify or not is that your penalty 20 seconds yes by the way i your your honesty around all the details is –

Refreshing. Yeah, it's more than noteworthy. Like you actually – you said before this that you're like, hey, the best outcome of this could be that this doesn't happen again to anyone else or myself. And the only way that that can happen is when there's transparency, and God knows there's not a lot of transparency in the world right now. So thank you. And you know what, Savant? She wasn't the only one who did this little strategy and she wasn't the only one who got it.

Brian loves you, by the way, Emma. Brian loves you. Brian loves you. I love Brian too. Yeah. And she wasn't the only one who got a penalty for it. There was a total of six athletes who were penalized for that. But two of them were penalized on what CrossFit calls the preliminary review, and four of them were penalized on what they call the secondary review process.

And what process was Emma penalized in? The third? Well, it feels like— And I wonder, do we know if they penalized those guys before or after her? We do. And is it the same judge critiquing all the videos? How does that work? We do know when each of those six athletes were penalized with regards to the second or third thing.

So it sounds like someone saw her video before the submission deadline was due and responded to her and said, score is approved, good to go. So she chose not to redo it at that point. Why would you redo it at that point? Then some time passed, and Emma might have more of the details of exactly when because the athletes basically received this communication, and then as athletes release it to Instagram or wherever they post it, that's the only way that people like us can find out.

CrossFit didn't make a big announcement about it. But basically they said, this is the leaderboard following the competition. And then they said, these athletes have made it to the CrossFit Games on their Instagram. These athletes have made it to the CrossFit Games on an article that they published. And then another day passed and they said, oh, actually, one of those athletes didn't make it. And it was Emma. Two questions before we get to that. Did those other athletes get penalized before Emma? It was my question. These other five or six athletes, did they get penalized before or was it simultaneous?

Two of them were penalized before. And then Emma plus three others were penalized before and then emma plus three others were penalized after the announcement of the games qualifiers was made during the secondary review i wonder if that's um people tattletailing i wonder if that's people uh tattletailing is a little harsh i wonder if that's people um outsiders um making sure the validity of the sport stays tight as opposed to tattletale. And, um, I wonder if there's different people at CrossFit HQ reviewing the videos or if it was the same person that let some slide in and didn't let others. And I'm not suggesting that there would be a bias. I'm just suggesting human error.

I don't think there is a biased over there. I've never seen one. Um, when I worked there, but, but, but obviously we know there can be human error. I don't think there is a bias over there. I've never seen one when I worked there, but obviously we know there can be human error. Well, I think maybe Emma can give some insight into what the, if she knows what the process was to initiate a secondary review, but this is what I know is that there's a really big field of athletes competing that week. There were three different virtual competitions going on. There were three different divisions in each competition, the men, the women, and the teams. And so I think that they were using a majority of their resources in terms of online judges

to watch as many of the videos as possible in a timely manner. And what happens is, let's say that you're like the overseer of the judging protocol, and I'm just one of the guys who gets the first video. So I look at it, and if I see something, then I flag it. And if I don't flag it, then it just goes through. But if I do flag it, then I go up the chain, maybe not even to you yet. Maybe there's someone between me and you, and then they'll look at it. And if they see something that's also flagged, then they'll send it to you, and you're kind of like the last voice and say,

yeah, both of you guys are right. This is not something that was within our standards, so we're going to assess this penalty accordingly. And that's where I think some of the time delay might happen, why we don't see immediate results. So that's kind of what I know about that process. Emma, I don't know if this makes you feel any better, but I used to work there, and whoever did do that to you,

who let it slide through, I guarantee you they feel absolutely fucking horrible because every single person on the games team is a diehard games fan and they take their job seriously although i do think that i've always known uh man i i don't know if i have any place to say this but back in the day there was always a shortage of hands, right? Especially during the games. It was like it was all hands on deck. But anyway, I know it doesn't make it right or wrong, but I guarantee you that person feels horrible because they really do want to do what's right. So Emma, did you find out that the leaderboard switched places because someone called you or sent you a text and said, hey, this is going to change?

Or did you just find out in real time with the rest of the world? I found out in real time. I actually... You kind of want to know your mom died first before you read about it in the paper. Damn. Okay. Wednesday morning after the semifinals, I woke up and I was looking in my trash for an invite.

But there I found the secondary review and the penalty for the workouts. And it wasn't a personal email to you? It was like a generic email to the world? Like it was some sort of games email? When you say the trash, you mean the trash in your email account? Yeah, exactly. It was just like, oh, during a secondary review, basically you got a penalty for event six. Like your score is still on the leaderboard,

but you got, I don't know if it was a major penalty or yeah but but was this directed um was this email like dear emma or was it an email that the whole world received like all the games athletes received saying hey we've changed some things on the leaderboard it was that it was to me but it was the same email you get for any video review. Okay, okay. It's the same. When your video got accepted, the score on your video submission had got accepted. Okay, so as soon as you read that, do you quickly jump over to the leaderboard and be like, oh, shit.

Is that the order that it happened? You found this email and then you clicked over to the leaderboard? Or did you see the leaderboard had changed first and then find the email? I found the email first and then I saw the leaderboard. Oh, man. Well, at least they reached out to you. And then so what was your first, so you must have been so excited that you qualified for the CrossFit Games, right? And then you see. Yeah then yeah yeah i was uh just one thing with the penalty and stuff before we move over please please please uh yeah so there were people getting penalty first and then there were a secondary review uh but there

are still people on the leaderboard that has done the same thing and they haven't got a penalty so it's just the inconsistency with that that i'm also still how far how far down are those people uh i'm not sure exactly but they wouldn't i'm not sure if it would change like the game spots but maybe it would change other stuff. Maybe it would have changed the last chance qualifiers. Oh, so, okay. That's huge. Because once again, I don't work there anymore. But when I worked there, if there were people in the thousands and thousands of places,

there wasn't the manpower to review all of those videos, right? So basically what would happen is people would either say, we basically relied on the public to tell us, right? If there's 3,000 video submissions, there's no way you can review them all. You would review the top 100, right? And then if anyone had any complaints about ones down below, like, hey, that wasn't Emma Tall doing the workout. That was Brian Friend wearing a wig. Then we would go down and look.

Oh, yeah, that's not Emma Tall. Brian's doing the workout for her. Yeah, of course but like i don't know exactly was it 30 athletes in each semi-final and uh then male and female but we also even if we did it online we still uh paid as much as the people that got a chance to go to live competition right so it should it should i understand it's, but it should still be enough manpower to review all the videos correctly. Because obviously it takes a lot more manpower to arrange a whole competition than an online event. And Savan, you asked about the potential of someone.

Emma should be a lawyer. Emma should be a lawyer. This isn't her first rodeo. She's just beating me down. Go ahead, Brian. You asked about why did the secondary review happen? Did someone alert CrossFit and say, hey, have you guys watched this? She's touching the bar,

he's touching the bar, whatever. And when she brings up this concept of a live competition compared to a virtual competition, in virtual competitions, if you want to dispute your score, you can. And then there's several things that can happen from that, but you're not allowed to dispute any other athlete's score. You can't come to the stage and say, I know she only did eight muscle-ups and she had to do 10. You can't do that. So if that happened, I have no idea if that happened or not, but that would be another thing that would be an inconsistency

from a live competition to a virtual competition. In fact, at most live competitions now, they'll say, if you dispute the score and we have to go to a video, we're not going to use any other video from your phone or anything else. We have a camera that's on the floor, and we'll use that camera. So there are specific rules about that, disputing sports for live competition that are pretty clear. And in the virtual setting, I don't know how clear it is compared to a live competition.

Okay. But if you're in the stands and someone's doing muscle-ups and they're not locking out, as a fan or anyone on the floor could yell, Brian Friend isn't locking out. And the judge can hear that and look and be like, oh, shit, he's not locking out. And it could affect his scrutiny, right? Sure, but we've talked to other athletes about this.

In that competition setting, you have your communication with your judge and you're getting immediate feedback. So if they say no rep, you immediately know it's a no rep and then you have to either ask them why or respond and correct it as it's happening where they're getting that information to decide the no rep can vary sure but in the virtual setting it's risky like emma said you know you do these movements and maybe she can talk about workout two also i'm sure that when she did workout number two she felt like she was meeting all the standards. Her judge felt like she was meeting all the standards.

She wouldn't try to short reps on that. She wants to have her score be validated, but you don't get that immediate feedback. And maybe it's just one of those things that we can't avoid with virtual competition, but I think that in terms of the review process, hopefully that that secondary review wouldn't have been initiated by someone telling CrossFit you need to look at this, and instead it came from an

internal process that they have. The two points that are kind of, and help me out here, Emma and Brian, the two points that are the most, I don't want to say egregious or contentious, but the two things that are really going on here is the fact that you did follow the rules and you did have time to do it again. You turned it in early, right? Just so I'm following the story. So you kind of have it buttoned up on both ends. Like, hey, I would have done it again and I actually did follow the rules. Okay.

So you get the – and then, of course, then there's the secondary things where it's not consistent. Sorry. I don't mean to – I want to be able to make sure I see the whole picture. Then the second thing is it's not – it wasn't consistent across the board for all the athletes. We still have some people out there who the bar was being held for. Okay. So then do you – as soon as you see you're in sixth place, you just pick up your phone and you're like, yo, Dave, what's up, man?

Can we talk about this? Not sixth place. She dropped from fifth to ninth place. And so then how did she make the last chance qualifier? She was actually a tie for eighth place. And in that particular region, there was one woman named Hema Rader who was supposed to compete in a different semifinal, but she couldn't travel there because of COVID restrictions.

So she was placed in the competition. So therefore, the women at that competition got nine. The ninth spot got into the last chance qualifier. Holy shit. This is a great story. This needs to be a movie. Okay. So you just called Dave up, and you're like, hey, Dave, what's up?

This is Emma. Can I come over to your house and talk about this? And he's like, sure, come on over. I'll be outside shooting hoops. What happens next? Because that's what I would do that's what i would do he only lives 11 miles from me i would just be like yo dave i'm coming over you should have called me i would have gone over there and talked to him for you yeah yeah i will call you

next time then yeah um so what what's the next step so you see this and then what uh i think i'm just in shock for a while. And then obviously, like, we tried to do something about it because we did not agree with the decision and we do not think it has been, like, handled right. So we do, we write an email with an appeal and just, like like a lot of questions because if they came to this conclusion we at least want to have like a full explanation like yeah

but they didn't accept the appeal and we didn't really get any answer on any questions either. It was more like you should have understood that your judge can't touch the barbell and the penalty would stand. I don't want to miss any part. So if I jump too far ahead, let me know. So then basically, at that point, are you like, okay, this is where we're at, and I'm going to do the last chance qualifier, and I'm going to get in? Or are you just like, fuck this, I'm done, let's go to the bar? Yeah. I mean, they're both valid.

Yeah. I mean, there's a part of you, right? I felt sorry for anyone who had to do the last chance qualifier. It's got to be like the hardest competition. It has the fewest workouts. It has everyone, the most hungry people in it. And only two of you get to go. I mean, it's, it's, it's horrible.

It's, um, it's, uh, so, so how did you, was there a moment where you're like, okay, I'm not even going to do the last chance qualifier. I'm done. Yeah, definitely. I decided the last day that i was going to do it so uh for a long time i was not going to do it and i was done with everything i was wondering about this i told savon last week i said you know who the last person to sign up or at least to show up on the leaderboard was emma tall holy shit so what's it like at your

house like you wake up in the morning you're eating with David and you're like fuck these guys I'm not doing this I'm not doing this and it's he agreeing with you or is he like is he just stay quiet and he knows that this is just part of your process and that you're gonna show up to the start line no he agreed with me he was like because he was so invested in me and my performance and everything as well and obviously like he was in the video and he touched my barbell uh it was my decision so it's nothing but obviously it's very difficult for him as well uh when like it turned out how it turned out uh so he agreed with me and uh he did like absolutely

everything for me to stand up for uh what we believe in and what we believe is right and what we believe is wrong uh and uh i don't i think like without him i don't think that this would have gotten so much attention uh And I'm very happy. Yeah, because you didn't really post anything about it. It was mostly through his Instagram that you guys are putting out your feelings and sentiments. Yes, and that was all him. Like I said, I was shocked for a while and then I was very sad for a while

and I didn't want to post anything. And I wanted to give people a chance to explain or communicate with me. And at least tell me what has happened. And that they are sorry that this is the way it turned out. But I think I made my post a week after. And then I have heard nothing. So then I just felt that I need to get the feedback out from me and my view of what happened as well because if if I'm just quiet like

then maybe nothing is going to happen uh but yeah like I said David was the one who got most of the story out uh and yeah I'm'm very happy to, to have him with me because he, he really like he stands up for me and he stands up for what he believe is the right thing and how athletes should be treated. Just to everyone who's listening, and you guys tell me if I'm wrong here, but no one wants to deal with this. Like Emma didn't want this to happen to her. No one's like, is like excited to fight back. No one wants to push back on the machine. Everyone just wants to do the same thing. We all want to swim in the same direction together and get along and be happy. And like, like don't misconstrue anything. I think that, that she's

saying like, this isn't like fun. This is like, you're driving down a road and part of the road is washed out. And now you have to go back 20 miles the other way and choose another road. No one wants to do this, right? I mean, this just sucks. And I appreciate you reliving it for us. So hopefully we can build our podcast. So let's move on. So David speaks up. You're okay with that. And you're not going to do the last chance qualifier. And have you started – are you still training at this point? Or are you just eating cookies and hanging out by the pool?

Or like what's going on in those days? How many days between the, the, the notification and the last chance qualifier? Uh, what was that? Two weeks. Was it?

I think it was. Did you cry a lot? Did you cry a lot? Uh, yeah. For two days straight. Okay. Makes sense.

That's good. I just pictured you crying like once a day for like 15 minutes, but two days straight kind of just, that sounds like a CrossFitter. Just get it out of the way. But it was also because, you know, going to the games is like the biggest thing you can do as a CrossFit athlete. It's the biggest competition. And that's, I want to say everyone's goals, but most people's goals to go there and to win. And it's just, it's taken away from you. And it was more the way it got taken away from me.

That just, it just questioned questioned my whole my whole goal like am i supposed to spend my whole year training for this competition and then i get treated like this then then i just rather train and go to maybe go to other competitions or do something else because yeah yeah i think you you want to evil you want to know what you're getting yourself into. You want a level playing field. But I think what she's saying there is actually the critical component. She mentioned a while ago that everyone makes mistakes. What do you do when you make the mistake? Because Emma's not the only one who qualified through the games

and was extremely happy about that when they got the announcement. We've been featuring some rookie uh, some rookie profiles on morning chalk up. And for example, this guy from Denmark, Andre who day he's had a bunch of hardships in his life and in his family life. And he qualified through the games, just like, um, we got this announcement celebrated with his family. And if that had happened to him two days later to have that taken away from him, his whole, his whole team would have been devastated by that because all of them had been working with him, pushing towards that. And that's the case with every athlete. Obviously, the athlete has to excel, but there's a big support system. And it's just as important for them and rewarding for them to get that news.

So to give that to someone and then take it away from them a day or two later, regardless of the reason, that's what bothers me. Yeah, you get all those congratulations message, and then you just, it just makes you feel a bit, I know it's not right, but it makes you feel a bit like a fool. You get all those, like everyone says congratulations, and everyone's so happy for you, and then it's just not the case anymore so so before we talk about the last chance qualifier do you think is the thing here that you just wish that they would have said sorry or and given you an explanation and you would have gotten a personal reach out

and been able to talk to someone or do you think that they should have left the leaderboard the same and just added sam briggs like do you have a solution that you think that they should have left the leaderboard the same and just added Sam Briggs? Like, do you have a solution that you think would be more just? I think there are many more solutions that would be better than this one. Like, I feel this one is almost like the worst possible. The simplest solution would just be that they do reach out and they explain. They said, like, this is our mistake but we are very very sorry and this is what went wrong and we're going to do this for not to happen for not for it not to happen in the future uh and the other might just be that they accept that they

made the mistakes they missed to put it in the standards and they said congratulations to the game spot and now they have to pay for it and just let me go anyway i think i i'm i think you've changed my opinion i think i agree with you i came into this thinking hey the most important thing is just to get the best person in but and and maybe maybe letting you go in it does both it's the most fair thing and it does get in the best person how just out of curiosity, how many – what was the time difference between Emma and the person right below her in that workout? In Gretel? Yeah, in Gretel. With her first score or second score?

What do you mean? Well, she had originally done it in 12.5050 which i think would have placed her tied for sixth and then the the penalty dropped it down to 19th and and that was with a 22nd penalty yeah and so the difference in man that competition is so tight all the way down to 34 points oh yeah i think i think you convinced me emma i think you convinced me, Emma. I think you convinced me. I came into this not convinced. I'm like, yeah, whatever. Who cares? Like just, it's fine. It's just one person. It's funny when you look at someone in the eyes for an hour, how your opinion can change, right? You're a real person who worked really hard, who has real feelings, who put in real work.

So what was the, what was the, then the then the final decision like okay fine i'm gonna do the last chance qualifier uh so after a week off uh i decided to go back to training again just because i wanted to train and the same weekend as the last chance qualifier they uh they have a big competition in like the city next to where i live and it's the owner of the box where i work and train that arranged that competition uh and there were a lot of good athletes there like some of the best athletes in sweden and it's a like it's a very good competition because like very uh how to got very big events, long and hard events. So I decided I'm either going to do that competition

or I'm going to do the last chance qualifier. But I don't want to finish my season here. I'm not done yet. And I don't want to finish it like this. I'm not ready to go on off-season just yet. My body has just recovered from from before and I'm not injured anymore so I don't want to stop now so I started to train again and on the Friday when this other competition started and when I had to register

for the last trans qualifier I decided I was going to do the last chance qualifier because I felt if I do the other competition, I have a great weekend. I get to do in-life competition, but I will regret to not do the last chance qualifier because I don't know what would have happened if I did it. Was that hard on your ego at all? Like, oh man, I want to do this because I want to go to the games, but if I don't make it, and God knows it's such a hard competition, we all know the last chance qualifier, that your ego is like, okay, I'll be exposed, and everyone will say she didn't deserve to go. Did you have any of those head games going on?

Yeah, I had that a little bit. If I do the last chance qualifier i have to win and i told david that and he said no i don't think it's like that at all like he he said that i've already proven that i am good enough to go to the games and the only reason i would do the last chance qualifier is for me uh to not question what i could have done is for me to not question what I could have done. And you did it. Yeah, what he's saying is true,

but the ego is like, no, fuck you if I don't make it. I mean, it's kind of like you either, yeah. I mean, the pressure on you must have been enormous. I can't imagine. It would have been so much easier to do this other competition and just kick everyone's ass. It would have been so much easier to quit. And then not only that, but the path you chose really exposes you. Because let's say something would have happened and then people would have started speculating, well, she didn't deserve

to go anyway, which isn't true, but people like me would have been saying that and Brian would have been telling me I'm wrong. People on their high horse like me would have been talking shit and Brian would have been like, no, no, no, no no no well so you do it and and you make it are you were you just tickled like what's the like how do you feel now are you and are you going to be able to come can you leave sweden and come to the united states like is it all done are you going to be in madison well i'm working on it nothing is easy for you tell me about that are there issues with coming I think CrossFit has done

what they can and I can't remember what they called it but you could apply for something which makes it able for you to then apply for ESTA which should but you could apply for something which makes it able for you to then apply for ester uh which should make you uh able to uh to travel to the states but i think uh you don't really know until you're there so either you just go with it and you hope you hope that it works i? I can't remember.

I think it was Sweden that I went to. And it was actually the easiest country I've ever entered to from the United States because – and this was probably five or ten years ago. I can't remember when. It was either Sweden or Switzerland. I can't remember. But when you fly into the airport, there was nothing. There was no customs. There was nothing.

Like as a U.S. citizen, we had some deal with that country. It definitely wasn't Finland because I've been there a few times. But the relationships between Sweden and the United States are amazing, right? There's never been an issue before about flying back and forth? No, I don't think so. This is all related to just COVID response? Just people's fears? Okay.

And so you don't know if you're coming 100% yet. Holy shit. What a journey. What a journey. And when you finished the last chance qualifier, did you feel amazing about it? I know that you couldn't see anyone else's scores and you were just waiting for the leaderboard to pop up.

And is it official yet? Or it's not even official until... Oh, it's not even official until tomorrow. Oh, official it's a it's official they they gave themselves an out so this is where what emma was saying is that they hoped they would learn from this they and so they said the neck even the next week when the second round of virtual competitions came out they said we're still this is the leaderboard but we're still going through a reviews process and they did the same for last chance qualifier. So they gave them until Saturday. They gave themselves until Saturday.

But I think yesterday they sent you guys the official invitation. Yeah. And originally they said the scores wouldn't be official until the 10th, though. Is that correct? Yes. So do you believe it? Do you believe it? Yeah, go, go.

Say it. On another note note they also learned with the standards so they did change it for the last chance qualifier and they mentioned like on every a workout that the judge or maybe not the judge but that like no one can um can help you with the equipment unless that's stated so they have clearly taken the feedback without admitting that they've done anything wrong. I think that maybe we should call this the Emma Talk clause or something. Like you should get some sort of historical note there.

Like, hey, Emma Talk clause, Emma Talk clause. Yeah, just so it's like you're forever etched in the history. I'm not sure. That'd be some honor, a little bit, maybe. Second best thing to winning the games. Okay, so, but your intention is to come, and you would be heartbroken if something happened. I'm having trouble reading you here a little bit. You seem just like, yeah, if I go, I go.

If I don't, I don't. But it's not like that. I'm misreading you, right? Like, you need to come to madison and you want to get back on your horse uh honestly i do have a bit of mixed feelings still i am i'm happy that the last chance qualifier went as well as it did and i'm happy that I've got the ticket but I'm still like I still think that what happened was wrong and I still feel like it hasn't I haven't got an explanation or a communication or it hasn't had any consequences and I feel like I still I still don't know if the feedback went through and that it won't happen again which still make me have a bit of mixed feelings because

if I then go to the games and accept the invites and play their game have I then accepted that what happened is okay because I feel like I haven't I don't expect no accept it and I don't think it's okay but then I also really want to go because I feel like I have had uh not so good season so far it's been like a lot of obstacles and i feel like i deserve to go there for me to do what i love is there any like additional feeling or an adjacent to that because you've been to the games before you were there two years ago in the in the 2019 season but you it wasn't probably the games that most athletes want to experience where you get to to really test yourself for the whole weekend, the total competition against the entire field.

So is there, is there any piece of you that's like, I mean, it's not my first time, but I also kind of want to see what I can do in a full weekend of tests against the best girls. Yeah, definitely.

And that's the reason why I want to go still. And does David help like reassure you of that same way as Last Chance Qualifier? We might not agree with everything they're saying, but this is something that you're doing for yourself just as much as anyone else, or maybe more so? Yeah. I think it would be healing for you to go. Yeah.

I don't think it admits that you think that you're playing their game at all. I think you would go there, you would show up, you would get a very warm response, and it would be part of the healing process. And when you see Dave or whoever you you want to you could just walk up put your arm around them and be like finally you know you could you can just you can take the the highest road you could you know be like Dave selfie bam slap him on the ass and be like you know I could beat you in any workout out here right and and just just, you know, just let the crowd cheer for you.

I mean, they know who you are. People want to see you come out there and compete. It's a, as much as you may not like the story, it's a fun story. It adds a lot of energy to the sport. You made it end the way it would end in a Hollywood movie. I mean, like, you're're just you're doing it. You know? And so

I yeah, I mean, I'm being biased. I just want to see you go out there and kick some ass. And I know the crowd's going to cheer. They're going to love it. People love this drama. This is what we live for. It would be fucking boring if we

didn't have this shit so uh and there's not a lot of athletes who get that opportunity to walk the high road right there are these athletes that haven't won the games but they shine in the public's eye they they they have other attributes about them that make you want i mean i i hate to just stroke my buddy but but like Josh Bridges, right? I mean, like, what is like, there's these other people that is Sam Briggs is another one, right? Well, I guess Sam did win the games. Sorry, Brian, careful, careful. But there's these athletes that, you know, they kind of transcend the, the winner, the loss, and you're doing that you're what you're walking, you had this opportunity. Someone threw you a really bad pass and you jumped and caught it, which made you a great receiver.

Right. And without a bad pass, you can't be the star who jumps the highest and catches the ball. Oh, there's the, there's the hunk. I saw him walk behind you. There he is. There's the hunk. There's the hunk. Every good CrossFit Games athlete needs a hunk. So, yeah, I just, you know, I always get in trouble for throwing in my two cents, but that, fuck it, it's my show. I throw in my two cents. I'd love to see you go there and just be like, yeah, I did it.

I think it would be great for you. It would be great for the community. And it's so hard to get here. You should stay a couple extra weeks and drive around the country yeah what do you what do you think brian i completely agree i think everyone would love to see her there do do uh so obviously you haven't you know figured that all out yet that's in the process but um just kind of knowing you guys i have a feeling that if you're able to come, you guys will come. And I think that mentally you can start thinking about that. It's only a few weeks away.

And you've seen the first workout. We've already found out some semblance of the first workout, and I'm assuming that that's exciting for you because there's not that many competitions that you go to where you get to do the thing that you've done your whole life, which is swim. Yeah, that is very exciting. I think that you did compete in france one year they and they had paddle boarding there that the that year as well but they gave you the option you could stand up lay down get on your knees you could do anything you want in france yeah and what what did you choose to do i was standing up what was were most of the athletes standing up uh yeah i would say so it was just a few that were sitting on the knees but i think they were mostly just afraid to fall

in the water yeah but it was uh it was a good event but it was quite like the 500 meter paddle boarding like went very fast and then it was a 9.5k run so it was almost just running but well you could you win the swim event if you come to the games well you have to wait and see then i think let me my my guess is you would prefer the swim the longer the swim the the better, right, for you? Yes, definitely. Emma, whenever I hear things people say when someone doesn't show up to a competition, they say, hey, why did they do that? They took someone else's spot. Do you have – and once you earn the spot, I think that's a little bit of a harsh thing to say to someone.

Hey, you earned it. You should be able to decide up until the last minute. But do you have any thoughts on that? The fact that maybe if you didn't go that someone else could have gone? Like they could have backfilled? Who would be next? Is that part of your concern or is it like, no, it's my spot. I earned it.

I'll decide when I want to. Yeah, maybe normally I would agree with you. I've heard that they won't backfill anything. Okay. I'm not sure if that's the truth, but that's what I've heard. And yeah, normally I would agree. And I think like if you got your spot and someone else could have it, if you choose to not go, like, obviously you should say that as fast as possible but i think i'm just in a bit of different uh position right now uh both with what happened but also regarding travels like i feel

like i have to make sure that i can get there before i accept to go it makes perfect sense um can i can we can i ask you one other thing just about what happened during the semi-finals because i've been curious was there like did that there's a new thing within the past 12 or 15 months called the like the athletes association did they reach out to you guys and talk and talk to you and say hey we're going to try to communicate with crossfit and like on behalf of the athletes did you hear from any other athletes or people in that organization with regards to what happened so we saw that I think it was morning show cup talk talk to them and they basically said that oh like we believe that Emma has a case here

but then we didn't hear anything so David actually reached out to them and asked if they could do anything or bring it up so it wouldn't happen again. So he wrote a long email describing the whole scenario, and I think they had a meeting with CrossFit two days ago, but we haven't heard anything back yet. CrossFit two days ago, but we haven't heard anything back yet. Because I think, you know, that that athlete community committee exists now. And this is a great, in my opinion, this is a great opportunity for them to have some influence. And it happened to you. But like you have said, we don't want it to happen to anyone else. So they need to hopefully step up, not on just your behalf, but on behalf of all the athletes and say, you know, what are we going to do to make sure that this doesn't happen again? So it's great that that process seems to be happening, and it might be a better off-season topic and conversation, because obviously there's a lot that CrossFit needs to do to

prepare for the games, especially in a year where so much is unknown, who can come, who cannot come, whatever else. So that's good that that's happening, I think. Emma Tall, man, thanks for sharing the story. I'm a different, more compassionate, kinder human after talking to you and meeting you. Seriously. Thank you. Yeah.

Brian and I have argued back and forth about this a little bit over the last as we watch your situation um and uh it's a it's a good testament of what communication and looking at someone in the face and hearing what they say and hearing all the details it makes a difference who would have thought right i think there's another important component here is if we had talked to her a day or two after it happened we probably wouldn't have gotten this version of emma and this is a good lesson for people in general you know you let you got to let sometimes time is needed to get a perspective on things and it's pretty clear here that emma and david and all the people around them have spent time with this process it emotionally intellectually they've done

what they can do it's and she's been super honest it's still affecting her it's still something that she's thinking about but she can clearly now now a couple weeks removed from it can articulate it very clearly and tell the story in a way that's actually productive instead of just having that initial emotional response yeah you're crazy honest and transparent and convey the story perfectly i i didn't feel any charge from you just given given it it's good i feel like you have to be if you if you want anything to change like you kind of have to be and uh maybe one thing that i would have wished for like in a perfect world would have been like the more fellow competitors will also like stand up for this is not how we want to be treated

and this is not how we want the sports to be but I also understand why why they don't and why is that why don't they just because they're doing their own thing or because they don't want to feel repercussions or they don't want to get mixed in the drama or they're saving their energy for the games or what why what what part do you understand i think it's a mix of everything obviously like. They're doing their own thing. They want to focus on their competitions. But I also think that they don't want to be part of the drama or have any of the consequences, if there would be consequences. Yeah, I'm going to say something nasty here. And I think that whatever, for a lot of the athletes,

and I apologize to you who aren't like this, they just want to be on the winning side. It's not even the athletes, it's people in general. They don't care what's right or wrong. They just want to be on the winning side. So they don't want to take the risk to say what's right. They just want to be on the winning side. But that's my cynicism based on watching society's current trends.

Thank you. I actually have a bunch of more questions for you, but we're running into an hour and 24 minutes, and it sounds like David's vacuuming in the background or he's making the world's biggest smoothie. Do you hear that or something? No, I don't hear it. Oh.

Maybe Brian's's computer fan. Oh, yeah. Brian just muted his mic and all that sound went away. Amazing. I think it's a lawnmower service outside the buildings. Okay, thank you. Is there anything you want to ask Brian? Any stats or statistics or numbers

you want to know what place you're going to finish in the game so he can tell you so you don't even have to go if you want to know no I think I'm good that's not true