The Sevan Podcast - #82 - Who is the best female CrossFitter of all time?

Episode Date: July 20, 2021

The Sevan Podcast EP 82 - THE BEST FEMALE CROSSFITTERS OF ALL TIME @JAMESHOBART @BRIANFRIENDCROSSFIT @SEVANMATOSSIAN Sevan's Stuff: https://www.instagram.com/sevanmatoss... https://app.sugarwod.com/marketplace/... Brian's Stuff: https://www.instagram.com/brianfriend... https://morningchalkup.com/author/bri... Support the show Partners: https://cahormones.com/ - CODE "SEVAN" FOR FREE CONSULTATION https://www.paperstcoffee.com/ - THE COFFEE I DRINK! https://asrx.com/collections/the-real... - OUR TSHIRTS ... Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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I was just looking. I was just looking at my Instagram, looking at the drama between the new California recall election. So we just went through the top 10 best, best male CrossFitters in the history of CrossFit. And now we're about to do the women. We're going to start at number 10. This is the official list of the greatest CrossFitters of all time. Brian friends, best of 10. Yeah, and I'm a little bit more apprehensive about the women than the men.

This is tough, but I feel confident. Did you put a lot of time in on this or did you just whip this out last night while you were sipping on some tequila? No tequila, but, uh, I, no, I, I made a list when you asked me to do, I had a list. And so when you asked me to, if I wanted to do this, I put together kind of a skeleton list. Um, and then I went and did quite a bit of research and digging. I just wanted to make sure that I didn't forget anyone. Um, you know, there's some people that have had a lot of years of experience at the games that just

don't necessarily come to mind when you think of top 10. And so I wanted to be sure that I wasn't unjustly omitting someone from it. And then once I narrowed it down to, I really only, in the men's side, there were only 11 people I was really considering out of the top 10 and for the women, maybe 12. So I wanted to make sure I had the right 10 and then getting the order for the women, I'd say five through nine was pretty tough for me to put in the correct order. Um, but I'm happy with where they are right now. I wonder if you're going to struggle with this later. I wonder if we're going to be like a week or two weeks out, you're going to accidentally see some comments. Someone's going to fucking punch you in the face at the games and, and you're going to accidentally see some comments someone's going to fucking punch you in the face at the games and and you're going to be me no i mean in two the thing is two weeks from now we're

going to have a whole new set of data right because seven of the top 10 women are competing at the games this year and i think it was how many of the men, maybe six, one, two, three, four, five, and five of the men are competing. So there's like definitely an opportunity. We talked about on the last show, how I really think that this year is critical for some of these athletes who didn't necessarily have the best performances in the last two years, or who had their best performances in the last two years and need to basically to prove to someone like me that those weren't products of the oddities of the test, but that actually their fitness is that good. Just a quick do a little house cleaning here. I know James Hobart is an accomplished CrossFit

Games athlete, one of his many accolades, and he didn't make the top ten on your last male list. Did James make the top ten in the female list? James, yeah, he would have been inside the top ten against these women, yeah. No, I wouldn't have. As he wipes a tear from his eye. No, I wouldn't have. I've trained and competed against some of these. It's like. No, I wouldn't have. I've trained and competed against some of these. It's like, no, I wouldn't have.

I think you could have at least snuck into 10th. That's really nice of you to say. You can't walk back from the injury you've already given me. Okay, Brian and Ryan, let's start off. Brian, thanks for doing this it's about time someone made the official list um you are the man i think you've taken all the air out of the room on who knows what about crossfit so let's fucking let's celebrate let's celebrate these crossfitters but more importantly celebrate your giant brain number 10 10. We'll celebrate the CrossFitters. So number 10 is a person with a relatively short games career, but a very impressive games career.

In four years, she competed four out of five years at the games. And her finish at the games were fifth, fifth, second, and third. And that's an average of 3.75 placing out of four years at the games. She did win four events over those four years. seven, five, placing out of four years at the games. She did win four events over those four years. She's maybe lesser known now, um, in terms of a competitive athlete and more known for some of the stuff she's done in the medical and health community and setting out on her own with that podcast that she has. Um, her career was kind of cut short by an injury, uh, ruptured her Achilles during regionals in, I think, 2015. And, um, she kind of famously did that handstand walk with the boot on

to try to compete as much of the weekend as she could. So people may remember that. But when I'm just looking at her competitive history, four times to the games, four times in the top five, I had to have her on the 10th spot, at least for now. I mean, obviously, there's still people that can come up in the sport and have great long careers and bump her out. But for now, she still deserves this honor.

That picture is incredible. And the one part of her body that I just cannot stop staring at are those wristbands. I can't believe I don't have my wristbands on today. But that is an incredible picture. Even the CrossFit logo in yellow with the yellow wristbands and the yellow top all she needs is like maybe like a sunflower a little dandelion in her ear or something yellow like in her hair and that thing would be perfect even even the weights behind her the yellow and green i it's a great picture i do not i would have never thought

she made the top 10. That being said. I mean, that was one that was kind of surprising. I wasn't too familiar with her career, but when I just stacked it up against the other ones, I mean, there's some girls, but maybe later on we'll look at some of the girls I just barely missed that people could make arguments for, but, man, four times in the games, four times in the top five, two times on the podium, four career event wins. It's pretty impressive in a small time domain. And for now, I think that it's okay still to have her here.

She's a doctor. Can we talk about that for a second? We used to call Julia the human weapon. Yeah, she was basically in residency or going to school or doing whatever you do, medical school, whatever you do to become a doctor. She was doing that while training and competing. Isn't that correct? Yeah.

Yeah, next level. What was her first year, Brian, showing up at the CrossFit Games? I think she competed in 2011, 12, 13, or 10, 11, 12, and 14, I think. Okay. So legitimate years. Yeah, she was 10 and 11. She was fifth, second in 2012 to Annie, and third in 2014 behind Camille and Annie. And it'll be very interesting to see who number 11 is after we get to number one to see if number 11 is Jamie Hobart.

Who? You don't know the athlete, Jamie Hobart? Okay. This joke has maybe another half mile on it, and then I think it's totally dead. But I'm glad you're drawing so much pleasure out of it. Absolutely. That's why you're on the show, for pleasure. So anyway, yeah, it was a little tough well we can talk about 11 and 12 later on and i felt like it's if anyone

wants to make an argument for those two i could see it but i'm gonna go with can we see 11 real quick uh no let's wait till the end hobart oh come on come on let's wait let's wait and by the way someone just wrote in the comments i thought hobart was buying a mic nick i thought hobart was buying a mic too i've only sent him the link at least two times it's supposed to be here today we just did this podcast too early but whatever you're right nick sorry if i get invited back next time i might have a mic you will always be invited back number nine that's the only nice thing i'm going to say to you for the rest of thank god so number nine getting So number nine, getting into some modern era CrossFitters here. So we have Carrie Pierce.

Carrie Pierce will be competing in her seventh CrossFit Games. In the previous six times she's been to the Games, she's been inside the top ten five of those times. Her rookie year, she was 21st, and she had a fifth, tenth, sixth, fifth, and third. That third, obviously, was last year in stage two of the CrossFit Games at the Ranch against five female athletes. She's won three events at the Games, and she's been pretty good in the, as we talked about in the men's conversation,

2019 and 2020 are a little bit different. So when we're talking about these modern-era athletes, we have some who have done really well at the games in those two years relative to the other performances and some who have not. Carrie's one of these that was fairly consistent in all of the recent years, obviously. And she was consistent in the sanctional circuit. She took second and third two years at Wadapalooza against really good fields. I think it was Tia and Sarah Sigmundsdottir who beat her there. And then she was sixth at Rogue Invit and Sarah Sigmundsdottir who beat her there. And then she was sixth at Rogue Invitational the year she competed.

So she's clearly up there amongst the best in the world right now, very consistent over the last five years, and comes in here at ninth on the list with an opportunity, obviously, to improve as she's still competing. Hobart, Nick just sent you $5 to put towards your mic through YouTube's donation option. Well, Nick of time, you got a great handle. Thank you. Uh, keep it coming. Brian, how far apart are, are, how far apart are Carrie and Julie Foucher? Like I'm guessing they're not even close. Like basically you've, by putting Carrie Pierce at number nine,

the first thing that pops in my head is, is that number nine is significantly better than number 10. Yeah. I kind of had groups of athletes. And so in the case of the women, basically five through nine is one tier of athlete for me right now. And there was, it was very difficult for me to distinguish between those.

Like I said, Julie was kind of in the next group and I just had her at the top of that group. I have a question. What if Carrie didn't finish third last year where she finished, does that make her, does she stay in ninth place? I mean, assuming that it was somewhere inside the top eight or nine last year, I think she would still be in this position. Yeah, I think that there is a gap here between 10 and then the rest of the field. Huge gap. And she also, I mean, when she won Mary, she beat everybody. Like, she didn't just beat women in her field.

She beat every, right, every CrossFit Games athlete, including the best male of all time. Yeah, that's true. And in the case of both Noah and Matt, what I'm about to say could be relevant, but it's less relevant than the fact that she beat a Brent Fikowski. That's a range of motion workout. Obviously, you have to have a tremendous capacity to do that. But when you're talking about 600 plus repetitions of a workout, and you're three or four inches shorter than the when you're talking about 600 plus repetitions of a workout and you're three

or four inches shorter than the person you're comparing them to, or eight or nine inches shorter than the person you're comparing them to, it's going to, I don't think that someone who's eight inches, I mean, how much better does your capacity have to be to make up eight inches over 600 body weight reps, pistols, handstand pushups, and pull-ups. I mean, if seven and I were exactly the same fitness and I'm five inches taller than him, I could never beat him in that workout. I just blocked everything out, Brian said. That was devastating. I just blocked it out.

It's nonsense. Let's cut that out of this. What Kerry did, what you said that Kerry did is like people really get your head wrapped around that. Yeah, at the games with a judge. Yeah, go ahead. Go ahead, James. No, no, you go. You go.

Let's double team him right now. Like you were saying, at the games with a judge, she beat every single male CrossFitter in the world in that workout. And that is really a CrossFit workout. And she is a complete savage. Brian, could you say that she's the fittest American ever to grace the floor of the CrossFit Games? Let's hold on that question. Actually, this gave me an idea for another awesome top 10 list. Don't share it. Someone will steal it. I won't. Actually, you can share it because Brian already explained to me

that Brian and I have this talk. Even if someone someone steals it there's no one more relevant than the three of us yeah i said it i said uh most number okay i'll tell you after let's go real quick i'm sorry to to focus on two outfits now but what do you think about that top she's wearing i feel like um that that is that really puts a lot of stress on the camera's ability to process when you get things striped like that, that are black and white and the lines so close to each other. So, athletes, just so you know, you're challenging the media's technology when you wear clothes like that. That's all I got to say about that. That was great. Thank you.

Yes. Number eight. Oh, man. number oh no way wow man and she's like one of the oldest competitors in the field you're brian all right just go you think she's too low on the list yeah but i but i don't know seven through one so i you know do your thing where you convince me and well so actually the decision between holta and pierce was razor thin for me um their performance at the games uh mirror each other pretty closely in the sense that uh kristin has one more this will be her eighth year it'll be carrie's seventh year kristin has a second place finish carrie has a third place finish each Each of them, it's their only podium

finish. Carrie's actually career average at the games in terms of finishing placement is one placement higher, 8.3 instead of 9.5. That's Kristen's. Kristen's won five events at the games. Carrie's won three. Again, each of them have only made the podium in their last two years they kind of bounce back and forth at the games in terms of beating each other by the way kristin will beat her one year carry will beat her another they're very close on the podium a lot of years but um in the off-season competitions from the past two years um kristin's performances are you know it's it's it's really razor thin. She's got a fourth, a first, a fifth, a second, and a ninth.

Opposed to carry a second, sixth, and third. Both of them are competing at pretty good competitions for the most part. So I have Kristen slightly ahead of carry here, but this was one of them that I was almost like a coin flip between the two of them for me. Brian, I'm going to break some really bad news to you um hobart has jumped ship and now is lobbying people in the chat room to um to attack you this is some real uh woke shit you're doing hobart and i'm a little disappointed in you um jumping ship james

you're jamesart II? Yeah. I had no idea. Learned something new every day. I just think Kristen Holte's performance of getting on the podium in 2019 through a tougher field, I bumps her up to a seven. But, you know, and I just – I've worked out with her before. I just think she's a savage. And I think – Bumps her up to a seven.

You don't know who's in seventh. Well, you're going to tell me hopefully eventually so look and that's number seven finish is phenomenal but again that's in a year where you know a bunch of very relevant athletes missed the cut by small margins and didn't have a chance to finish

the competition the way that I think they deserve to have the opportunity to. Obviously, I'm not in charge of running the games and making those choices, but I think that her finish might have been quite different that year had even 20 athletes been allowed to finish the second half of the test. Have you trained with Carrie Pierce, James? No, but I've met her a handful of times. So that was nice of you at least to reveal your bias.

Yeah, 100% bias on this one. Yep, 100%. Okay, Brian, number seven. Seven, again, this was a tough one for me to place, but I'm going way back here and giving credit to Kristen Clever. Wow. James doesn't like it. So Kristen's, for those that don't know, she's been to the games five times.

The last time she competed at the games was kind of just a shell of who she was prior to that. She took 32nd. But in the first four years she competed, she was 1st, 2nd, 4th, and 4th. 4th, 1st, 2nd, 4th in order. She has six event wins at the games, which I think one, two, three, four, five, six, makes her seventh best all time. And I don't really have a ton to stay here. If you haven't ever watched the 2010 CrossFit Games with battle between her and Annie Thoreau's

daughter, it's one of the most epic back and forths of all time. I think they won like eight or nine of the 11 events that year between the two of them. of all time. I think they won like eight or nine of the 11 events that year between the two of them. Kristen's a bit of an outlier in a lot of ways on this list. She hasn't competed in a while. She's a bit of a smaller athlete, but she was phenomenal for the year she was there. I expect that she'll obviously just slide down the list as time goes by, but for now, I still think similar to Julie Foucher, but better. She deserves some credit for now. What do you think about this idea that Kristen Clever kind of changed the sport?

She kind of showed women what they were capable of, and then everyone kind of took hold of that and ran with it and kind of left her in the dust. But I feel like the year she won the games how much did she win by i feel like she really like took the women's division to the next level and then and then the next year after that it went even one level higher um that year was basically her and annie were pulling way ahead of everyone else there was some small margin over Annie, big margin over third place. And then the next year it flipped. Annie was able to beat her.

And then she was fourth year after that as well. And then that was basically the end of her career. One more appearance for a 32nd place finish. So similar to Josh Bridges. We're just at the last year or two that they were competing. They weren't in that conversation. But I don't know, four years, four top four finishes, six event wins. Yeah, she was early on in the sport, but I definitely agree that she four years, four top tour, four finishes, six event wins. Yeah. She was early on

in the sport, but I definitely agree that she helped to forge the way ahead. I also feel this, this is kind of off subject here, but once you start placing like 30th and below at the CrossFit games, it's really basically 30 through 40th. I always picture sort of as a, as a tie, a 10 way tie, because when you start getting into the people who finished at the bottom, the injuries start take coming into account people pulling out of events there's just so it becomes more circumstantial than really how well you did i could be wrong on that i think it's just the way i think about it like when i think about at the games the closer you get to the top the more each place matters so like i think there's a big difference between first and second

second and third, fourth and fifth, maybe similar. Then you can say like, okay, six through eight, maybe nine through 15 is kind of like someone in there, you know, and then the gaps get bigger and bigger or the groups get bigger and bigger.

I don't know. What's the deal here, Hobart? Are you having kind of the same thing? I am that you think she's sort of a relic and that she wasn't even really competing in a mature sport? And so she shouldn't be on the list? Because I sort of had that with Julie a little bit.

But with Kristen, it definitely even comes in more. I'm not going to call Kristen Clever a relic just because I agree with you. No, I do. I agree with you on what you said. Like athletes like her and Annie, I think they forced – they spearheaded a huge change in what was possible from the female athlete field and just like their attitude, demeanor, training approach. But I just think that I think the more current competitions and performance and more current competitions weigh so much heavier in this like i don't know if i would keep her in the top 10 i think but not seven not ahead not ahead of carrie and um kristen holt there but i also haven't looked at the data but i would have put graham ahead of dan bailey in the men's list

because he has a chain he has a championship right yeah but you know poor brian poor brian i'm just here to take punches you want to talk about graham and dan no no no let's do that on the next show we have hobart on we'll have hobart on later this week and we'll bring up that look i i hear what i hear what you guys are saying about kristen clever and um you know if kristen holta and carrie pierce like their best performances come in years that is just hard for me to wait extremely heavily. Their podium finishes relative to other years. If they come back this year and place in the top five, then I will not bat an eye and I will move them ahead of Kristen Clever easily.

But if they come back this year and finish 15th, I don't know. Fair. Number six. you want to finish 15th i don't know fair uh number six six this was probably the most difficult person for me to place on the list because she's had so many things happen to her off the competition floor she's in some ways it's similar to fukowski and velner's situation so she shows up to the games i have the wrong thing pulled up here yeah she shows up to the games. I have the wrong thing pulled up here. Yeah, she shows up to the games 2015. Is that right? 2015 was her first year?

Yeah. Third, third, fourth. And then things kind of start falling off the rail for her. And she has, you know, obviously the 2019 season is kind of weird, but she doesn't make it through the cuts. She finishes 21st. She comes in the 20, or sorry, the 2018 game.

She had to withdraw due to injury. The 2019 game, she finished 20, or I guess 20th and then 21st last year. So when you look at these three performances on the heels of a third, a third and the fourth, now we're sitting here wondering like, well, who is this athlete? And what is her real potential in this sport? The other thing is, relative to everyone inside the top 10, she has the least number of wins at the CrossFit Games. She's only won two events, Fibonacci Finale,

that event that James was talking about earlier, and Heavy DT. But this is the really weird part. In the midst of having bad performances in the last two years at the games, she competed at eight sanctionals. She won four of them. She was second twice to Toomey, and she was third twice also both to Toomey and one time Jamie Greenbeater before she changed her last name and one time Carrie Piercebeater.

So she's almost untouchable in these off-season competitions with the exception of Toomey, who obviously is heading shoulders ahead of everyone else, and yet she's been bad at the games. Why has she been bad at the games? Go ahead. She won the Open three times, right, Brian? And she's a three-time Open champion.

I don't put her on the list. Wow. I don't really consider that very relevant. But, yes, she's won the Open. By the way, I disagree with brian 100 on that i disagree can i ask you why you don't we're attacking him can i ask you why you don't consider that the open that relevant i'm because i think it's super relevant and i just want to hear your your insight there yeah i mean i'm assuming you're going to say it's relevant

because she has to beat a hundred thousand people to win that that award um I don't know. I just don't think that the best athletes in the sport are always really investing in the Open. So for me, my assumption is that the last five years or four years or so, Tia Kertoumi is just doing those workouts as one of her training pieces on that day. And Matt Fraser is doing the same. You disagree? I disagree.

And Rich Froning is just casually doing the Opening and finishing 10th. And that's the point. He could invest in that and potentially do better, but he's just doing it at the end of a training day, 20 minutes after the announcement's been made and posting a score and moving on with his training and his life. And I think that there's a lot of people that do that. Whereas at the CrossFit Games, as you look, if you're following the athletes that are preparing for the games right now, they are preparing in every single way and focusing every detail of their life to be an optimal physical and competition performance for the CrossFit Games. So your performance at that event trumps any open performance to me.

To me, it's a negligible conversation, but you guys are free to disagree. No, I just wanted to have you say it because it sounds more legitimate coming from you. Do you think Sarah is an athlete who suffered from peaking too early? Because she performed so well in those outside competitions, regionals, the Open. And she performed really well at the games, but I always thought she had more in her at the games. I mean, a lot of people, and I'm one of them, think that if we could just figure out how to get her to perform at her best performance, that she could be the one to challenge Tia. She seems to have all these things, and it just hasn't come together at the right time in the right way. And to be fair to Tia, even if that was the case, maybe she couldn't challenge her. I don't know.

But it seems like she's never been able to get everything dialed in at the right time to show us what the true limits of her potential are. And that's why it's hard to place her on the list. I thought she was going to be the next Rich Froning in 2015 or 2014, whatever her first year is. She showed up at the games. I think I even say it in the behind the scenes. She was so dominant. And going back to the Open, I disagree. I don't think it's even relevant what our opinion is of whether people give it their all or not.

There is such little room for error in the Open. There is so little room. You take 2,800th place in a workout, and you are fucked. And so I think the Open, if you win the Open, you are – I think it's – me personally, I think it's tantamount to winning the games. I really, really do. No, that's completely – that's totally wrong, dude. How many times has Tia won the Open in the last five years?

It doesn't matter. Even the fact that she – No, it matters. She's been the fittest. She has not lost a live competition in five years, and she's won the Open once. You can't tell me that Sarah winning the Open makes her fitter than her in any of those years. Well, you could argue that Tia didn't try her hardest, or you could say that she's just not as good at the Open. She's just not as good.

I could flip the argument and say that, hey, when you have 100,000 people in there, she can't stay at the top with all of those people. I think that those people are trying their hardest. I don't buy that argument. There's too much variability. You can have the option to redo the workout as many times as you want. You can be cutting reps, range of motions marginally, and they may or may not penalize you for it. There's a lot of different nuances and variables that don't exist in live competition that just doesn't hold water for me. I'm not arguing that either. There's tennis that's on clay court, on grass court, and whatever that other third court is. And just like there's competitions

with their different CrossFit competitions with different variability, I still don't think it takes away from the profound statistical odds and the level of competition in the open. I think the open is – Matt, you shut it. Matt Souza just said Brian is on. I don't want to hear your opinion. You just get us people to be on the show. And to be fair to what you guys are saying, it's a small group of people who have won the open.

Matt and Rich have won a majority of them. For the men, Noah's won one, Dan's won one, and maybe there was one other person. It's really hard to win the Open. So I don't want to take that away from her. I just don't think that it's one of the things that I'm factoring in here when I'm comparing her to the other women on this list. Okay. Huh, that's cool. That's all I got. Uh, Sarah, we all agree. You're good. We want to see you do better. Number five. So, uh, yeah, number five, um, Sam Briggs, this, I mean,

Sam Briggs is 39 years old and she's still competing with the elite level open individuals at the games. This will be her ninth time competing there. She was a champion in 2013. That's her only podium finish, though. So that's kind of a little bit of a knock against her when comparing her to some of the others. And obviously we're getting into this like the best of the best here. She's got she doesn't really have any terrible performance at the games, but her three worst finishes are 19th, 18th, and 25th. Again, those 18th and 25th are from the last

two years, though, and 19th is a rookie year. So in between there, and she didn't make the games every year. She had a couple years where she missed, including 2014 due to handstand walking, so she wasn't able to come back and try to defend her title that year. But her finishes were 4th, 1st, 4th, 4th, and 9th. so five consecutive years in the prime of her career inside the top 10 four of those inside the top four and sam briggs comes in fourth all-time currently with 11 event wins at the games um she's also been incredibly impressive in recent off-season competitions again we have to be of course know that she's usually competing against girls that are 5 to 15 years younger than her in these events.

She won Dubai two years ago. She won the Australian CrossFit Sanctional. She was third at Dubai the second year she competed there. She was fifth at Filthy 150, and she was 12th at the Rogue Online event. So phenomenal in every sense. She's been around forever. She's got incredible proficiency to win events. She has great performances at the game. She has a championship under her belt. And I said that it was like, she was still in this group with Sarah and Kristen, Kristen and

Carrie that I was kind of debating between, but I don't know if this is – what the exact word is for this, but in 2014 or 15, her because it really changed the games that year in terms of the validity of that win for those of us who were watching it closely. Validity's a little strong, but kind of like that was changing the landscape that Matt's not in it this year. That was the same year. So Sam would have been a defending champ. She didn't qualify. And then Cara was up there battling with Camille for the title that year and she had to withdraw. So potentially, potentially the two fittest women that year weren't able to finish the competition or even start it. Wow. Talk about having the stars aligned for Camille. So that means Camille's not in your top four. Very good call. Good call, Hobart. And also, I just want to say real quick.

Does that mean she's number 11? Does that mean Camille's number 11? Is that your guess for number 11, Hobart? 11 or 12, yeah. Okay. Sorry. Go ahead, Hobart. Nick from YouTube says that uh how many people do well in the open then end up last in the games yeah see so so that's really revealing that comment because they're they're different they're different competitions but but they all are still in that crossfit um ecosystem in in terms of where the test is coming from. And the test is coming from the company that defined the fittest or the man that

defined the fittest, Greg Glassman. Brian, who has the most triple crown wins? So like win the open in the year, win the regional, win the games. Wow. the open in the year win the regional win the games wow uh man um well tia's only won the open once and i think it was was it was it this year or did you did you win it last year so i've i'm trying to think of any women maybe i don't know if any woman has ever done that actually maybe but i think matt and rich have done that a couple times, right? Oh yeah, on the men's side.

Rich won it probably three times in a row 2012, 13, 14 and Fraser he didn't win the Open every year. He didn't care to the couple years. But I think he did maybe do that in 2017 and 2018. So I'd say Rich probably has three and Matt has two, but I'm, I'm not,

I'm just guessing. Is Samantha Briggs top, top three in the most mentally tough or slash disciplined athletes? I mean, like has anyone competed harder for longer? Not a soul. Maybe. I mean, there's only three athletes in the history of the games, men or women, with more games appearances than her. Wow.

Who are they? Annie Thorisotter, Ben Smith, and Rebecca Voigt. Wow. That's rarefied air. That's cool. And I'd like to argue this for sam briggs uh if she was at the game she deserved to win the spirit of the game so any year that you see someone won the spirit of the games and it wasn't her you know that there's a political bias because i'm telling

you from being down there on the field with her there is nobody who compares to her in terms of camaraderie, presence, attentiveness to her fellow athletes, attitude. She is in a league of her own. Yeah, Spriggs is awesome. That's cool. I like that a lot, five. You got one out of ten right so far, Brian. Oh, shit.

But you got to weigh the ones at the top more heavily yeah yeah we'll see we'll see what happens here if you get the next four right brian uh james will let us publish this show with his picture on it well we'll see then hey and by the way um why is the why is the hot link to watching this show live not a picture of me and a picture of hobart i know and it's it's not a picture of me and a picture of Hobart? I know, and it's not a great picture. I'm going to send you guys some different pictures. It's a great picture of you.

What are you talking about? I mean, that came from Torrin, Emmy winner. Yeah, great. Torrin Simpson, that's a great photo. Okay, Brian, number four. Number four is the person I think is the fittest to have never won the CrossFit Games. It's Kara Saunders, formerly Karma Webb, and Kara Gordon. So if you're trying to look up the totality of her competitive career, you need to check those things out.

Three names? She was Saunders, Gordon, and then what was the order her names went in? Gordon, Webb, Saunders. Okay. I didn't know that. i didn't know she was a gordon um anyway um okay so uh she's been this will be her ninth time competing at the games she did have to take a year off two years ago to give birth to her child and she came back last year and competed in the online version but she didn't make it to stage one she just missed

by like five points advancing to the final five last year so she ended up taking eighth first years of the games were okay 19th and 12th then she had a fifth seventh second and fourth she also had that year in 2014 that we already referenced where she would have finished first or second um right up there with camille if she was able to finish the weekend ultimately she had a pinched nerve in her shoulder and wasn't able to see it through after a couple push pull and then the midline madness workout was just too much for her she couldn't couldn't go on so she's had a couple of unfortunate um like close calls that being one of them and then obviously in 2017 she only lost by two points

to Tia. It was that epic finish on Fibonacci finale. That was a pretty heated and controversial workout because there was a 2-2-2-3 competition because the 2-2-2-3 intervals were earlier in the day where her judge had said she could go ahead to finish, but she still had three more reps to do. So she thought she'd done this in a workout. Then she had to wait for a scoring review. And at the end of the day, it came out at two and it's not i mean it's i'm not sitting here and trying to say she was fitter than tia that year i mean tia you know is a worthy champion obviously was her first title also but like that's how close she's been to winning a couple times um she's comes in right behind sam in terms of number of event wins at the games having seven

and in the few off-season events she's done in the last year, she took a first and a third. Third was at the Rogue Invitational. The year was online competition, where she was competing at two and three in the morning, doing those workouts against girls from all over the world. So again, I think that Kara is, you know, she's a little bit up and down. There's a little bit of misfortune in some of the years for her to not be able to maybe have even as good as her resume is. It could be better. But she's, she's made it her way over to the U S you know, she's got a couple of weeks to get ready here. And I think she's poised to have another good performance at the games this year

that could only, you know, only potentially bolster her resume. only potentially bolster her resume. The little bit I know all of the athletes from my interactions with them, she is, I don't know what the words are for this. Her competitive nature is crazy. It is so intense. She is, she's a winans-necessary kind of gal. When Brian and I most recently interviewed her, were you on that podcast where we interviewed her, Brian? Yeah.

She presents a little more happy-go-lucky than I think she really is. This lady is a warrior. She doesn't mince words. She's not worried about making friends out there. She's a killer. It's really... Something is definitely unique about her. I agree. And, uh, you know, it was, I didn't feel like I could

make any case to move her higher up on this list. I did. I, and, um, honestly, I was talking to you guys about Sam. I, I, if someone wanted to move Sam ahead of her, I wouldn't probably dispute it too much, but overall I think Cara just has a little bit more um potential like uh across the full scope of the test i know sam has more event wins in her but i feel like sam's more of that up and down performance whereas cara has a capability to win events but there's really few events over the history of her career where she's done poorly relative to the competition field and she's challenged in more recent years, you know, Tia in ways that few have,

and that holds some merit for me. She also crossed the finish line unconscious one year, and that deserves a standing ovation for sure. That was insane. I think that was in Murph, rightph that was murph in 2015 yeah okay do you respect that hobart oh hobart's muted that's my perfect no wonder we haven't heard him talking oh i like this placing a lot number two number three number three should we skip number three and just go to number two

well there it is number three catch and david's daughter so now we're getting into the realm of multiple times games champions um and catch and comes in third here she this is also going to be her ninth year at the games so that's the same number of Games appearances as Cara Saunders and Sam Briggs, all of whom are still competing, obviously, in the sport. She had a rough start her first two years at the Games where she was 30th and 24th. But when she came back in one in 2015, she's been inside the top five for six consecutive years. First, first, fifth, third, fourth, second. And I don't really know if there's...

There is more to say about her, but that alone is enough to keep her inside the top three for now. She has 13 career event wins, tied for second most all-time amongst women with Annie Thor's daughter. You know, she's... She's really good, she's really good. She's really consistent and she's done it against some of the best competition in recent years.

Um, she's earned her spot here at number three. Uh, one of the most charismatic athletes, I think, I think she's taken, um, what she has and run with it in terms of all categories, her fitness, her personality, her presence in the space, always super easy to interview behind the scenes, always available, doesn't seem to be caught up in her head when she's, you know, when the events aren't going on. Yeah. And she's taken a leadership, when the events aren't going on. Yeah. And she's taken a leadership position amongst the girls.

I think amongst that women's class, her presence is for surely, for surely felt. She has incredible presence when she walks onto the floor or in the corral. Sorry, Brian. No, no. or in the corral. Sorry, Brian. No, no. Unlike a couple of the other girls that are still competing in the space, despite the changes in the season the last two years, she's continued to find ways to get into the top.

And if you look at that 2019 season in particular, she's a great example of this thing that I've been talking about because she barely snuck into the top 10. I think she was either 9th or 10th, and Annie was like 5 points behind her, but missed the cut. And so Annie did not get to continue in the competition, and Katrin did. Katrin rose all the way up to 4th place over the course of the weekend. And that's what I'm saying, is we could have expected people like Annie Thor's daughter, who just barely missed the cut, or Brooke Wells, or Laura Horvath, or Pat Vner, or a Cole Sager to make similar moves on that weekend, but they didn't have the chance. And if not for 30-ring muscle-ups being in the final event,

she might have even been able to overtake Jamie Green and get on the podium that year. So her case study from 2019, her barely getting in the top 10 and then rising all the way up to fourth is exactly the reason why I think that this year we're going to have a much better reflection of where these athletes, I said there's seven women still competing this year who are in the top ten and five guys. And I think we'll watch as the weekend unfolds, the game's coming up, athletes continue to move up the leaderboard and ultimately settle into spots

that are most reflective of their relative fitness. Has Katcher never beat Tia at the games? Well, yeah. In 2015 and 2016, Katrin won the games and Tia was second. Yeah, that's incredible as a feat, but it also gives Katrin something that probably the other women don't have. In her mind, Tia is still beatable because she's done it twice. Sure.

And if you look at those two years specifically, one of the things Katrin is well known for is her ability to fight. And in both years, it wasn't a runaway victory. 2015 was incredibly close between her, Sarah, and Tia coming down the stretch. And she just was, you know, was able to pull it out given the context of the rules that year. And in 2016, we had one of the most, maybe the best exchange of blows that we've ever had, especially in the women's field. In the morning on Sunday, they had three back-to-back workouts, the handstand walk, the plow pull, the sled pull, whatever it was, and then the sprint. And I think it was Katrin took the lead, Tia took the lead,

Katrin took it back to her, and then we went to the tennis stadium for the finale, and Katrin was just barely able to fend her off. But again, Katrin beat her on the rope chipper, and then Tia beat her on the final event, and it wasn't sure how it was going to settle. And they were just, like I said, exchanging blows all day long, and ultimately she had pulled ahead of how it was going to settle. And they were just, like I said, exchanging blows all day long. And ultimately she had, you know, pulled ahead of her by just

enough to win. And that's what Katrin's known for is fighting till the end. And she's, um, you know, six top fives in a row, this in this day and age, it's hard to look, look beyond that. Uh, and Brian, will you explain that, what the, the smart strategic move that Katrin did that year by there wasn't a cap on the event. Will you explain what what the the smart strategic move that katrin did that year by there wasn't a cap on the event will you explain what happened there uh 2015 was the first year we saw the pegboard and then pedal to the metal one a lot of the women were unable to climb the pegboard and so once that event finished there were 12 girls that had at least done one pegboard and everyone else in the field tied for 13th which earned them i think it was either 54 or 56 points. And Katrin was one of the girls who was unable to do the pegboard. Tia was able

to do it. So she got more points than that, obviously. And those 56 points, I think Katrin's total margin of victory that year was like 52 points. So she would have lost the games if she received zero points for that event. And I always And I kind of think that in that scenario, because it was a new implement, Dave did not brief that they would have to do it before the games as we talked about with some other things. I think it would have been more appropriate, not to say that they should have been disqualified from moving on in the competition, but it's just like, okay, you accomplish zero reps in this workout, you get zero points. This year in the quarterfinals, I could not do the 185 pound snatch, but I couldn't enter a score of zero. I had to enter dash dash because I couldn't even complete the first rep. And so I think that that makes sense, especially when you go back in history and think about the 2010 CrossFit Games, when the story

goes that Dave Castro was there on the sideline saying, if this dude who happened to be Rich Froning can't climb the rope, we're not going to give him the championship. We're not even going to let him go on the podium. And you fast forward five years, and the CrossFit Games champion is someone who could not do the pegboard. Not only that, but while all the girls were struggling for the entire duration of the event to do the pegboard, she, because there was no minimum work requirement,

so credit to them for knowing the rules here, chose to not even try in the back half of the event, get her forearms loose and warm and then ended up killing pedal to the metal too but yeah but i think also that speaks to why catrin's always been such a threat because she looks at the totality of the competition like she's always been someone who's like yeah she's super fit and she prepares but she doesn't just look at like what can my fitness do in this workout like she's thinking about every aspect of the weekend to grab points. And that's why you see her like sneak into not sneak, but climb into the 2019 games and then continue to, or 2020, and then continue to push to the top of the leaderboard.

Right. And it's not taking anything away from her and Ben's ability to strategize that they may very well could have set up to the set and said, well, this event might not get a pegboard. If you fail it three times, there's no minimum work requirement. They didn't tell us that you have to continue to try throughout the thing. So if you're not going to get it, just accept that. Accept whatever your placement ends up being and get ready for the next one. And if that's the conversation that went on

and they executed that accordingly within the rules, then I would say that that's not a problem with what Ben and Katrin did. That's a problem with the fact that CrossFit still decided to give all those athletes 50-something points for doing nothing. Bam. Do you think there should be a minimum work requirement on all workouts? Not necessarily. Like, I didn't think that there was needed to be a minimum work requirement in that example. I just don't think you should get points for doing nothing.

And especially if you don't try. I like that a lot. I think there should be a minimum work requirement. Number two. Oh, sorry. You want to say something, Brian?

No. Number, number two, number two, Annie Thor's daughter. So she's, you know, in some ways she's Katrin's mentor. She was the one that Katrin first saw on the TV in Iceland that motivated her to get involved in this sport.

She went to her gym and started training with her and obviously has come up and been, in some ways, Annie was the face of the sport a long time ago. And Savan, you said that Katrin has become kind of a leader forging forward for the women in the space now. It's kind of cool that they both come from Iceland. And Katrin's not just following in her footsteps on the floor but also off the floor. This will mark Annie's 11th time competing at the CrossFit Games. Wow.

She's two-time champion in 2011 and 2012. She's got two second-place finishes, one third-place finishes. That gives her five total podium finishes on the Games, which is second all-time for the women and tied for second all-time overall. She has 13 event wins at the Games, ties her with Katrin for second most all-time. It's really incredible. Like she's only about 12 or 13 months post giving birth to her child. And she's qualified again for the games this year, um, via some, again, some different formats. And I think against even her own expectations,

she is remarkable in every single way. And, uh, it was an easy choice to put her number two. Oh, that's good to hear. You mentioned it. She just had a baby and then she's back at the games. And same thing with Kara Saunders. We didn't mention that. And for anyone who's had a baby. We mentioned it.

Oh, we did. Okay. For anyone who hasn't had a baby, like the three of us, we can only imagine how hard that is. But that is a very noteworthy. Also, when Annie came onto the scene in 2009. 10. 2009. 2009, yeah.

She was at the CrossFit Ranch, and along with Miko Salo and herself, they were probably the first two. This is a little bit maybe of a gross exaggeration, but, but I'll go with it. Her and Miko were probably the first two superstars of the sport. They both had incredible aura. They both,

the fans love them. Miko continued to maintain that fandom and that appreciation from the community, although it didn't have the success Annie had in the games, but Annie took off like a rocket ship. And she sort of embodied everything that there is about CrossFit before it was known for the CrossFit Games, meaning she showed up there, she did the unknowable,

and she struggled in front of the crowd even to get one muscle up in 2009, and the crowd got behind her. And it wasn't necessarily just her abilities that made her a superstar but her inabilities and to um take her lumps with humility so she is a remarkable and unique character of the likes we'll never ever see in the sport ever again just because people won't show up uh and be i don't think anyone will ever show up and be as exposed as she is in front of the crowd. And the,

and the community did a wonderful job and embrace that. Nowadays, if you show up exposed at the games, all the pundits jump on you and they're like, wow, should I can't believe they can't do muscle ups. We're back. Yeah.

And they got behind you. Not, not only were her and Miko so likable back then, but they were the first real prominent international athletes in the sport. And even to this day, Europe has continued to excel in the way that other non-North American countries have not. I mean, just on the women's side alone, half of the top 10 that we have here are from Europe. And three of them are from Iceland. And Annie gets a lot of credit for that.

And on top of that, she comes from a nation. I think the country of Iceland only has 300,000 people. It probably has more CrossFit gyms per capita than anywhere. There's probably no second place anywhere even close. And she brought this great lifestyle methodology to her country and probably single-handedly changed her country's health on top of Greg Glassman's methodology more so than any one person has done to a country and of course that's relative to the fact they only have 300,000 people and they're all related

and you know there was one year that she had to withdraw from the CrossFit Games but other than that 13th or better 10 times or 9 times I mean it's pretty impressive over a span where the games has continued to grow and evolve and the fields have gotten stronger and deeper she's continued to be relevant just an incredible career I'm disappointed

that neither of you cracked a smile when I said in a country where everyone's related that really sucks that that fell on deaf ears. Yeah, I wasn't going to give you that, man. Thank you. Okay, Brian, number one. Number one, not just the fittest female ever,

but making a very strong case for the fittest human of all time, Tia Claire Toomey. She came onto the scene as a very, very unknown. Maybe some people in Australia knew her when she first showed up in 2015 and she narrowly won the games that year. If not for maybe a scoring decision by the administering company, she would have won the games that year, but her career might have unfolded quite differently had that happened. She came back in 2016 and it's well documented, especially in the documentary from that year, the CrossFit Games documentary, that mentally she wasn't sure if her result in 2015 was really indicative of

what she could do in this space. And she was still questioning if she'd belonged in the conversation with some of those women. She seemed to overcome that hurdle in the offseason that year. She showed up to 2017. I think it was perfect for her because she had to go against Cara Webb, who was the forerunner in Australia as the standard and gold bearer and athlete to beat there. They'd traded some blows at the regional level, but doing it at the games was a different story.

And the fact that it ended up being Cara that was pushing her right to the edge in that competition and the fact that she won it so closely now she's got a second a second a first and from this point forward it is basically as dominating as anything can be not only has she won the games 2018 2019 2020 she's competed in five sanctionals she's won them all and her margins of victory continue to get bigger and bigger. I told you that Katrin and Annie are tied for the second most career event wins for women with 13. Yes, Tia had 13 event wins alone last season at the Games, and now she has 24 total. So she's continuing to just put herself ahead of everyone in every

statistical category. And like you mentioned a while ago, Savan, that is mentally very intimidating for the rest of the athletes too. How much pressure is on her? We always talk about how much pressure she puts on everyone else. Is this pressure that's put on her? Can she maintain this? I mean it kind of sucks to go somewhere and everyone know you're going to win, right? Because then all you have to do, all you have, the only place you have to go is down. And then maybe people aren't even as impressed by your victory. Yeah. I mean, in, in the buildup to the games this year, um, obviously it's very fun on

the men's side because Fraser's retired. So we can talk about all these different guys who have a unique opportunity to win the games. And on the women's side, basically when anyone's asked me, I'm like, okay, well, I think we should basically not talk about Tia until the games. And then let's talk about what she's doing there. Is she continuing to dominate? Is she dominating by more? Has the field caught up to her? Is she sliding back? And then after the fact, there's plenty to talk about. But yeah, because it's, I think, I can't remember to talk about but yeah because it's it's i think i can't remember which one you guys said it it's like almost a foregone conclusion like if she shows up she's gonna win because she has for so long that's a great question of how that affects

her and her coach and her team's preparation how do you handle that just like knowing that the whole world expects this of you i'm hoping she blocks it all out. Because we shouldn't take anything away from her. It's not like people wouldn't give five years of their life to beat her. I mean, people want to beat her. There's no question. Oh, yeah. I mean, all the girls that are competing there that have podium finishes, top five, top ten

performances and have been to the Games five, six, seven, eight, nine times before, they'll certainly feel like they have the experience and the fitness and the capacity to win the CrossFit Games. But you have to go through this person to do it. And so far, you know, since 2016, no one's been able to stand in her way. And you know what is good? The fact that she is still doing it, and this is the women who are still competing should appreciate this. If you beat Tia, that will be amazing, and it will catapult you. Whereas opposed to whoever wins the CrossFit Games this year in the men's division is going to have a little bit of that shadow on them. Everyone's going to say, yeah, that was the first year Matt retired. So as much as you might hate her, the fact that she's in there and so dominant,

it also is a tremendous opportunity to really catapult yourself and really state claim that you are the best ever, even with one win. As long as she doesn't shit the bed or something, like drink some pond water in Madison and shit herself the rest of the week. That's always the thing with CrossFit is you get one chance at the games. It's one weekend. And if you happen to be sick, if you happen to tweak an ankle early in the competition, food poisoning, who knows what it could be.

All those little things could offset the whole weekend. But despite any of that, look at the success she's had. James, he actually asked me a question earlier in the week. He's like, what if Mallory O'Brien beat Tia this year? How high up on your rankings would she jump? And I didn't really know how to handle that because one of the things that I first looked at when I was making this list is everyone who I'm including here has been to the games at least three times. If you've only got one appearance, two appearances, I didn't even consider you for this list.

Damn. Hobart's stunned. He's either judging us or he's stunned at how incredible the two of us are. No, I'm just thinking about this. I'm still thinking about the Annie Katchard thing, but I definitely think Tia's number one i'm just i'm a huge i'm super biased toward tia and shane i think they're awesome i think her dominance poise demeanor in the sport is like

unparalleled i mean um you know she's as physically dominant comparatively as matt is but like energy she brings into the into into the games is amazing. I'm a huge Tia fan. So super biased here. She's one plus. The good, the good thing is Hobart, if you are struggling with the,

the placement of Annie and Katrin, that all of these girls are in the games this year. So when we review this list after the games, those second, third, and fourth place, Annie, Katrin, Cara, there could be some movement there. Yeah, I just think Katrin has a much better games. I feel like Brian just has a soft spot for CrossFit legacy. But I think just Katrin's overall finishes at the Games edge her out into that.

And she's beat Tia twice, which Annie hasn't done. Edge her into that second place spot. No, I mean, if you look at the average finishes at the Games over Annie's career, which is 10, well, I don't count the year that she withdrew from the Games. But of the nine times she finished the competition, her average finish at the Games is 5.5. And if you look at Katrin's, it's 8.75. But if you discount the first two years that she competed, then it's much better than Annie's, yes. So I can see where you can make that argument.

So I can see where you can make that argument. And in the years that Annie and Katrin have competed against each other, especially after Katrin's first two years, Katrin's beat her a bunch of times, sometimes by small margins. But Annie did beat her in 2017 against – I mean, in that field was – to me that was the best women's competition of all time, the 2017 games. Those finishes went Tia, annie sarah catrin so that's pretty impressive list and then uh several other athletes were in the top 10 that you'll recognize to neil berline as an outlier but then kristen holt to jamie green sandberg's

carrie pierce alessandra pocelli so that was a really impressive year and annie was able to do that to be catching that year um i think catching she's still pretty young too i think she's 28 and she's got the potential to certainly um overtake any on this list but i didn't feel comfortable making the move yet what do you think hobart did he convince you that he slapped his shit at you no okay he did he beat me with that q-tip again but okay the other thing is you you know... He's not done. No, they both have two titles, obviously. And while, you know, Catrons did come against Tia, to me there was a little bit of... I just don't like that decision by CrossFit in 2015.

It seemed to me to be against their MO based on the prior history at that time in that particular event. And Annie's win to me are completely untainted. Like there's nothing that questions the fact that she won those two years. That's a better argument. I don't want to give that to him right now. And look at the year Annie didn't win, her first year at the CrossFit Games.

It was all around ring muscle-ups. It was the Rich Froney, Matt Fraser phenomenon. They collapsed on one event. That if she would have had just a little bit of practice on, maybe she would have won. How close was she to – You could use that same argument for the pegboard thing related to Catrin. I don't think that's like –

But Catrin, it's how she dealt with it, I think, is what Brian is saying. Not to blame her, but how Cross it's how she dealt with it. I think is that Brian saying not, not, not to blame her, but how, how CrossFit allowed her to deal with it. Okay. I'm glad that you brought that up though,

James. It is, it is a good conversation. I thought those were the clear top three, well, one and then two and three was pretty obvious, but like I said, I'm not,

I wasn't ready to move Katrin ahead of Annie yet. If Katrin podiums this year and Annie finishes lower than that, then maybe I would. Is Tia a better CrossFit athlete than Matt? Fraser? Yes. Ask me that when Tia retires I don't know I don't know how to answer it yet

it's you just choose one of the names Brian I'll help you you say either Matt or Tia and we'll know what you mean by that yeah I can't do that though I need to be able to give you a solid reason and I don't feel like I've investigated enough to do it yet.

What's your response? I think the— Matt or Tia, that's how you do it. Matt or Tia. Statistically, it's Matt. In my heart, it's Tia. Tia is just—it's crazy. I don't even like to talk about how good she is. Cause I feel bad. Like it, it takes away from her future,

from her future wins where it puts too much pressure on her, but she is, she's something else. And then of course, man, I don't know. I'm not as smart as Brian, but there's also that last event that Matt Fraser did for the entire CrossFit world, the one where you talked about Hobart, where he said, should I turn it on now or whatever? I mean, that one event, what he showed the world, I mean, he didn't have to do that. And he still crushed, like, yeah. I'm going to say Tia, but I'm open to being wrong. If she doesn't win this year,'s Matt Yeah that's how I feel

Do you want to see the girls that just barely missed Yes let's see number 13 How close were number 11 and 10 Before we see number 11 I had her in there There you go Camille I had her in there. There you go. Told you. Camille. I had her in there and bumped her out at the end, the last moment.

Okay, so that was hard. That was hard. And why is that? What was the deciding factor? Who has longer hair? No. I mean, you look at Julie only competed four years. Fifth, fifth, second, third.

Camille went to the games nine times, which is quite substantial. But outside of that first place finish, her other eight finishes were all worse than Julie's worst finish. They both won four times at the Games. Yes, Camille won that one year, but we've already talked about how that year was the perfect storm for her to win. Cara had to withdraw. Sam didn't make it. I mean, she still beat Annie that year,

and Julie finished third that year. So it's not like it was a completely void field. It was an incredible year for Camille, but it's an outlier relative to the rest of her performance at the Games, whereas Julie's performance at the Games were very consistent and overall better. Isn't that punishing, though, Camille, for the fact that she went to more CrossFit Games? No, because let's just take out her four best years out of nine. She was first, sixth, eighth, and ninth. Julie's only four years.

She was second, third, fifth, and fifth. Damn. So it just depends on if you take longevity or excellence over a small period of time. But even if you pull out, Camille, we've given her nine chances and her best four finishes, only one of them is better than any of Julie's top four finishes. I know. That makes me feel like there's some flawed thinking in that,

but I'm not sure if I can articulate it yet. It depends how highly you weight the championship, James. I'll give you that and in this case i'm waiting at less than the second third fifth and fifth performance yeah i can tell 12 is someone who definitely can break into the top 10 depending on performance in the next couple years she's still super young she's already got this will be her seventh games she has three event wins at the games and one, two, three top 10 finishes. And out of all six years, she's finished the competition.

Nothing worse than 16. So she's still got a big chance to move up. This is her seventh games. Yeah, it's crazy. So her first game, she was 19. So 19, 20, something like that. Yeah. She might be 27.

Someone wrote, can Sevan make a list of the hottest CrossFit athletes of all time? And then someone else wrote, he only has two people on the list, Rich Froning and Travis Mayer. Am I that transparent? Yes. I'd put Brooke Wells on there. When I did the CrossFit podcast, I tried to say her name in every podcast in the beginning. Like I say, Travis Mayer's now.

I think Brooke Wells is absolutely stunning, and there's something quite angelic and peaceful and fun about her. She's awesome. Ryan, scroll through some of the rest of the list. Let's see if anyone catches Savan's eye. Number 13, Becca Voigt. Yeah, real quick. Let's stop at Becca Voigt real quick. Number 13, Becca Voigt.

Yeah, real quick. Let's stop at Becca Voigt real quick. This girl, Becca Voigt, this lady is in a – I would put her in a unique category. Her and Ben Smith deserve their own category I feel like of CrossFitters. They've really bridged the – they've been there for the rest of the best athletes in the world to beat up on. And they've given us continuity throughout the years. And they are unique. I'm not sure how to – do you want to jump on that and help me at all? No, no.

You say that, and it's great. And the thing is Becca is still competing. She has 10 individual appearances, but she has a couple of Masters appearances too. But Annie's got 11 individual games appearances, which is actually more than Becca. And Katrin Davies, Zara, Sakara Saunders, Sam Briggs, all are going to make their ninth appearance. Camille has nine.

So there's a bunch of girls that actually have a lot of experience here. And even if you go further down the list, there's girls like Alessandra Pacelli and Stacey Tovar who've been to the games eight times each. There are a lot of girls with a lot of games appearances to their name. Was Becca the first? Well, thanks for fucking up my story. Let's go on to 14. No. Was Becca the first person to be in 10

games, though? I think she was the first. It was her or Spiel, right? No, Spiel didn't make 10. It was either her or Ben. Okay. Anyway, I respect the shit out of Becca Voigt. Number 14.

Well, yeah, we don't have to pause and talk about all of them here. I just thought you might like to see some of them because there's a few throwbacks for you on the list. Some girls that are obviously still competing. Here's an old school one for you. I was actually wondering where she was in the list. Yeah, that's good.

Oh, let's stop at Laura Horvath for a second. Can she do something at the games this year that brings her into the top 10, Brian? Yeah, I mean, if she took second again this year, I'd have to give pause for that for sure. You know, she's only got three games appearances. She was second in her rookie year in 2018, then she was 15th and 24th in the last two years, which were kind of, like we've said, some different strange years.

So I don't know, maybe, maybe. But definitely she's still super young she's I mean I would expect her if she wants to to continue to compete at you know five to eight more crossfit games and really really make a case to move up this list okay

Michelle LaTondra Lindsay Valenzuela. Wow. Is this the, is this the youngest person to be on this top 20 list? Yeah. And by, by youngest,

I mean, I don't mean youngest in age, but youngest to the scene, newest to the scene. Yeah. I mean, but we'll, we'll see.

I almost didn't include her at all. Cause she hasn't technically met the minimum requirement of games yet, but I didn't want to forget about it when I looked at it afterwards. Sixth and fourth so far in two years of the games, and she's only 20 years old. Alessandra Pacelli, number 21. Chyna Cho, number 22. Hayley Adams, how quickly, like, what is the lowest she could place this year for her to rocket up toward the top 10? I think another top five finish.

Yeah, okay. Like, I feel like she jumps the most spots by the end of this year. China Cho, Amanda's incredible, man. Amanda Barnhart, number 23. Now we're going to get into some old stories. Wow, Michelle Kinney. Holy cow, yeah. Yeah, she was a freak of nature.

She was pretty awesome. I think she's still an affiliate owner, too. Christy Phillips, Christy Adkins. How many games did she go to, Brian? Do you know off the top of your head? Seven. Yeah, that's incredible. And another old school athlete, Elizabeth Akinwale.

How many games did she go to? Five games, six event wins. A very, very impressive number of event wins at the games. Wow. And very, very, very stoic during competition week. Very, very, very stoic. Okay. Go on.

Stacey Tovar, number 27. Eight games appearances. Margo, six games appearances. Wow. What happened to Tennille? I thought she was – this was a bona fide – this was more than a – this was a bona fide athlete. This was a – I'll throw her in the category as Carolyn Parivo.

She – this is – she was something special. Is she still around? She actually qualified for semifinals this year and chose not to compete. I didn't reach out to her to ask why, but three years she went to the game, she was 11th, 6th, and 12th and won one event there. She was, yeah, she was, you know, poised to be very good, but I think she had a kid and then I just don't know if it's her focus anymore. Gotcha. Wow. Wow. Wow. Did she beat Annie? Go to Carrie Kepler, number 30. Did she beat Annie? Is that who won the games in?

She was third in 2009. Okay, third in 2009. Incredible. Incredible. Tonicliff, Anna Tobias, 31, 32. Carol Ann Reason Tebow. Oh, wow.

Brian, I am surprised. This is one of your favorite athletes, right? Well, I don't know why I say that, but I mean, the whole point of showing the rest of the list is just to see how many good

athletes there are. And it's difficult to distinguish between some of these, but it's, it's notable how many of them have good careers and good resumes. And again, it just gives ultimately, it just gives value to the top 10, even more so to say how many impressive athletes they have to be better than to get up there. I say she's one of your favorite because when her name came up, I don't remember what region she was in, but she, I just remember you being emphatic about how good she is and how impressed you were by her and you thought we should

get her on the podcast and talk to her, that there's incredible potential in this athlete. Yeah, I think she's poised. I mean, she finished 8th in 2019, but it was like a soft 8 because of the way that that 2019 season was. And her other games finishes are 22nd, 16th, and 20th. I think she'll have a breakout year this year. Bethany Shadburn, can she break the top 10? With the all-time top 10?

Yeah. She needs like three more years of top 10 finishes at the games at least. Wow. I think, Bethany, if you're listening, I think if you beat Tia this year, you make of top 10 finishes at the games at least. Wow. I think, Bethany, if you're listening, I think if you beat Tia this year, you make the top 10. Number 34, do we have a 34 and 35? Emily Bridgers, yep. Ma'am, crazy to see her that low on the list.

She's insane. Thuri Helgadoter. What a great list, Brian. Thanks for doing this. This is awesome. Well, you're welcome. It was a good idea, and it was fun to do. I think it's a living list. We'll have to obviously make some amendments to it in the next couple weeks even. Thank goodness. in the next couple weeks even, but I understand some of the – like I said, I felt like the women was more difficult inside the top 10 than the men. I'm happy with it for now, but I fully expect to make some changes

based on this year's games. Cameron, I don't know where Michelle LaTondra was. She was in the top 35. I'm going to guess 23 or 33. I can can't remember but i did see her on there um uh james hobart i'd like to speak to you directly right here there's going to be a lot of people on the internet talking shit about brian after this for a little while and it'd be nice if you didn't contribute to that but you have this look on your face that you're already jumping on red to smash them. And so, Oh, heck no. Brian, I got your, I got your back, man. I could, you know, I don't think there's anybody out. You're the preeminent, um, CrossFit statistician slash know

it all. So when it comes to the games, I got your back, man. And usually know it all has negative context, Brian. But in this case, I think I heard it used in positive. Well, I mean, look, I understand that no matter how objective I try to be, there's still some subjectivity that creeps in. I try to do my best to be recognized and acknowledged for the great accomplishments they have as the sport ages those people will you know descend further and further into the rankings and into the history books but for now I still think what they were able to do early on holds a lot of value and is a high accomplishment. So I wanted to make sure to include them in the list where I think they deserve to be.

Thank you guys for listening to this. Thank you guys for tuning in. We know that Brian's having some, it's not his fault. For some reason, he's having some audio issues. We will make a clean version of this. If you want to check it out again, we'll upload a clean version where Brian's audio is perfect. And then soon we'll be posting on the Internet somewhere.

I think we're going to launch thesevonpodcast.com, and on there will be Brian's official top ten best of all time in both categories. And it's really, in my opinion, and I think anyone with a brain's opinion, the definitive list for CrossFit rankings, the best in the world. So there is that. James Hobart, thanks for giving us time on Sunday. Brian, thanks for exposing yourself to the world. I know it takes a lot to put that kind of stuff on the line

for everyone to talk shit about. Peace. Oh, we have two great podcasts coming up, by the way, in the next couple days. We're going to have Jason Hopper and is it Taylor Self or Tyler Self? Taylor Self on a show coming up this week. We have Patrick Vellner coming up. We have Brandon Luckett. And I'm trying to think if

there's anyone else. And we have Jason house, the CEO and sports agent from Iridium sports agency. And I think he represents more MMA fighters than anyone in the world. We have him coming up on a podcast also. Ryan, thank you for everything. Matt Sousa. Thank you. You guys did great.