The Sevan Podcast - Aaron Ginn | The Truth about AI and Friendship #931

Episode Date: June 1, 2023

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19 plus and physically located in Ontario. Gambling problem? Call 1-866-531-2600 or visit connectsontario.ca Please play responsibly. I wonder if you're going to get warm over there. Bam! We're live. At some point I'm sure I will.

Usually when cameras go on, it warms up. You start warming up? Yeah, I get a little red too. It's weird. You didn't get red yesterday. No. God. I slept like shit last night because I was so high from the show.

Oh, no way. I think. When did you fall asleep? I don't feel like I never did. Did you see the video I made? No. Paulina, good morning. Jay Hartle.

Oh, no. Is it the workout video? It's the workout video. Oy. Is it on your account? See, Jessica just said she just watched it. Oy. Yeah, it's funny.

Why is she laughing? Oy. Mr. Weed, hi. You want to know what's nuts is I tried to do something to see if I could use more popular music and avoid a copyright strike and thus far it appears as if it's working why because were we playing music when I was in there well yeah but I also just mixed a couple of songs up yeah and now it doesn't know which one is which so it's allowed to play in the background and Oh, that's interesting. Play multiple songs and then hope is fine. Mr. Ginn, hey.

Oh, gin or gin? Like drink. Gin. Why can't I remember that? It's okay. The immigration agents in the early 1900s couldn't understand it either when my grandfather came from China. Hey, is it obvious if you know how to read, like if you're smarter than me? Can someone just see that and be like, yeah, I understand the English language, and obviously with the G-I-N-N, it's Jin.

It's not Jin. What are you, a fucking idiot? are you fucking idiot no no i i mean other people who have uh my similar spelling they pronounce it like the i guess not at heart and gin okay good all right all right yeah yeah yeah uh so so yeah it's it's a bit of a because my last time my last time is supposed to be in it's not supposed to be what do you mean supposed to be oh by the way have you guys you guys uh andrew hiller this is aaron uh jen uh um aaron you know how like um a discovery channel has shark week well andrew hiller is also uh a youtuber like myself oh i said it i don't think i've ever admitted that on the air and uh and he's visiting me he's here for a week for greg's broken science initiative so i asked him if he would come in studio every morning so it would be it would be andrew hiller week okay go ahead uh what do you mean he's i think andrew said what do you mean it's supposed to be in yes yeah so my my grandfather couldn't uh speak english whenever

he immigrated and so they just wrote down whatever it sounded like whenever he came over oh that's nuts yeah so actually all of his brothers uh i believe he has seven brothers they all have a different spelling of our last name whenever they immigrated from onto ellis island that way no i went through san francisco my fiance just said something similar about why her name is spelled with a y and not with an i and that had to do with the same sort of process when she was coming over they didn't want people to know she was polish or her ancestors your your girlfriend looks like a crazy foreigner she looks crazy for we were hanging out we weren't hanging out we were in a gas station and someone goes oh you're european looking right at us too we're like uh no we're from the united states as far as we know

yeah she looks like she fell out of like just like right out of helsinki like you take helsinki and dump it upside down and she fell out i'm not sure that's it but the capital she kind of yes she does aaron um tech tech geeks like you hang out in helsinki you've been to helsinki right uh i have not no really i've only done eastern europe all of central europe uh but you've never had a meeting in helsinki come on no no uh i do get invited to go to the uh that uh what is called the human rights event that's in norway every year so i do get invited to go to that but i usually don't go so because it's in the winter and it's super cold there. Summer in the Nordics are great. One year I'm going to do Denmark to Sweden and drive that route.

I'll just through all Europe, Africa, South America, Asia. Not yet the Nordic countries. I'm looking for a picture of Andrew's girlfriend. Sorry, fiance. But no, not yet. Not yet. The Nordic countries. No. I'm looking for a picture of. Oh, there she is.

Of Andrew's girlfriend. So you could. Sorry, fiance. Bro, it's OK. So that you can see what I'm talking about. About panicking that I didn't have this with me. Oh, here. Here's a good.

Here's a picture of her. Everyone needs their shaker bottle for a rate. What are you keeping yours? Mine's got a bunch of pre-workout, like 700 milligrams of caffeine. I just, I have a high ball right now. That's mine. Oh,

I know. I know people who really enjoy that stuff. Doesn't she look like she just fell out of, uh, uh, like some Nordic. Yeah. She looks like she's from that,

that show. Those, those Viking shows. Totally. The Viking. Totally. I've always thought she kind of looks like Khaleesi with this blonde hair it were longer though and i said the viking does she diet or is it that she's so when i met her she was blonde and then she dyed it red and then she went brown and now she's back to

blonde so there's a whole bunch of different colors going on there okay okay um mr jen i i i don't um i don't know how to really describe you i didn't like the way i described you last time you are truly a renaissance man uh art religion tech fitness um uh the the subjects that you write about i don't it feels unfair to pigeonhole you but i do view put you in this rare air that i would also put my friend greg glassman in that it's worth asking you questions about anything um whether it be like the style of high-rise pants or to what you you think the of AI is. I just feel like you have a good brain that could just process lots of different things from the mundane to the future, to the past. Yeah. And you enjoy it.

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, it's a, it comes from, uh, having like a heterodox backgrounds in terms of like, sorry, what's that mean? I just means like Orthodox heterodox. So like Orthodox would be like, you know, wokeism to like I live in Boulder. So like being a Democrat, whatever is like widely accepted. Heterodox means like the opposite of that. So whatever is different. And like I wrote yesterday about courage and I use the reference to tyler durden and so i'm wearing a tyler durden

shirt right now that uh my buddy gave me for my birthday and uh that story of fight club which most people who are like you know christian they see this and i'm an evangelical christian see fight club is bad right they're like oh look at this guy who's like a nihilist and absurdist and is like selfish and a narcissist, but actually like read what he's writing or sorry, what he's saying or it's a comic book, but like what he's talking about is essentially how

systems in culture and society tell us to do things that we have no idea why and other people will pressure you to do those things and they don't even know why and this whole system is developed and just kind of mindlessly pushes you through life right and so his whole point of fight claw like like what is the actual point the point is individuality the point is like to discover who you actually are and you have to break the entire system down to then you find who you actually are and what you actually want to be right so all of these all of these scenes like this scene here right is all about uh how uh edward norton who's the actual

only character right although fight club two durden's not dead by the way durden's alive there's two fight clubs there's a fight club too yeah yeah yeah so was it made into a movie or it's just a comic no no no just the first one um. But the point of like these scenes is basically that Durden is destroying all of the idols that existed as life that prevent him from becoming the man he's supposed to be. And that's everything that happens in the movie. Right. So so he's actually like like Durden is actually really consistent with actually his own philosophy that leads him to do really insane things. Right. Because he himself is insane. Right. That's like the whole kind of arc of the show. But but for me, it was like kind of breaking free of these systems that like I was told to believe. And when I be when I became a Christian really late in high school and start pursuing it more seriously in college,

I basically saw how I was taught all these things in public school. I was taught all these things by my secular family. There were things that were just not true, right? And I had to – That's probably too broad. Keep going. Yeah. But we will get to that though. He wrote an article right before this one where he talks about that.

That's brilliant. Hold that thought, Andrew. Go on, Aaron. That's a great question. Yeah, so basically I decided to brace this path of like you know i have people who i love who differ with me massively on metaphysics right they differ with me significantly on philosophy now i'm like on morality and faith and so i had to basically determine uh how to actually like live my life now right that that that i could actually break free of what was actually established for me,

take things that were actually good to remove things I did not agree with. I thought were bad and build the life that I wanted to build. And that's like what Jordan does. And yeah, so, so no one was nice guy treaties is about this too, that, that I had to like break away so much of like, it was defining about how like men today form their identity, right? They're conflict avoidant. They appease people. They use hidden contracts. They have massive toxic shame. They,

they have a distorted view of themselves. They, they use appeasement approval to get what they want. They're never direct or indirect. Like these are all things that I had to break free of from high school to college. And that's part of that's dirt in and B for Vendetta, Ben for Brothers, like all this stuff I was like

on the sort of mainstream media side, but also like reading books from like early philosophers to like, you know, Rousseau and Augustine to mainstream ones. And this kind of all led to this arc of self-discovery. Right. And, and so, yeah, this series, numerous mass guys actually been, uh, it's been really moving, um, because I'm Dude, this is amazing. You're describing exactly what, like basically what I've been going through the last 10 years. This is exactly how I was raised. Yeah. Kindness over,

kindness over integrity. It is, it is horrible. Yeah. So it rocks the soul and it emasculates, uh, man, it's crazy.

Kindness over integrity. Yeah. Yeah. So kindness over honesty. So, so the, the, the,

the point of like a lot of what men like struggle with today, which goes to like my friendship with today which goes to like my friendship piece which goes to like durden and like the nice guy stuff like it's essentially that they've been like really starved in mainstream society and uh and a lot of that is an expression of like long-term trends that we're just the end result of it wasn't like this was like oh my god obama happened like everything bad happened right like this is not this case right these are like cultural trends that were being established in the 20s and 30s 40s 50s that basically are reaching their sort of culmination uh and and one of them is a significant lack of friendship right and this is something that

significant what lack a friendship yeah lack in front yeah yeah like so like you know you and i know both both know glassman really well right and? And he's like a friend of mine. And his life in his home is like open, right? And it's one of the most amazing things about him and Maggie is that it's just like this like open. I never know when I go to Glassman's house who's going to be there, right? Right. And that's the fun part of Glassman, right? It's like I get to like, you know, I've met you and I've met all the doctors in his life and, you know, scientists and like,

he'll have the guy out who paints his fence over for dinner. Yeah. Hanging out. Yeah, totally. Yeah. The crowd. Yeah, exactly. And, and, and I want to, I don't want to basically like live a life like that. And, and the only way to actually rediscover that is to actually have self-respect. Right. And ultimately the point of all the nice guy series which i'm gonna end here in like two weeks uh and i'm gonna end with jesus wasn't nice uh and kind of destroy the whole like uh as you know i'm a christian and the whole like christian nice guy thing is like totally not jesus at all like so but but the point is like self-respect right and and self-respect is not self-esteem right self-esteem is like a faux

sort of like nice guy thing where it's like, oh, just like believe in yourself. And like, and it's just a luxury picture of like you having this projection externally that I am these great things. Self-respect is like, I'm good at this stuff and I'm bad at this stuff. I don't know who I am.

Like, that's it. It's like, it's very simple, but it's really, really hard, right? Because you have to know who you are. You have to know what you want to do. You have to know what you don't want to do, right? And that's it. It's like, it's very simple, but it's really, really hard. Right. Because you have to know who you are. You have to know what you want to do. You have to know what you don't want to do. Right. And that's like, that's the vulnerable piece you talk about too. Right. Know what you're good at, know what you're not.

Yeah. And, and, and that then goes to like, when you don't have self-respect and you seek approval and appeasement and self-flagellation, self-effacing behavior towards other people, which is what most men are taught to today, that the way they form friendships, the way they find a wife, the way that they, you know, get a job, get a promotion is a self-efface is to say that, like, my expression of like getting approval from other people through being nice and kind and serving and all these things, like, will get me what I want. And I have to like, therefore, like, like these people that are being self-effaced too right have to sort of like imagine you know sort of uh that like this is gonna somehow convince me

right that like through manipulation of getting approval that the that so nice guys will get these uh things that they want right and so the actual way to get what you want is have self-respect be like this is what i need this is what i want uh like i'm willing to negotiate here i'm willing to negotiate here right and you're shocked what happens when like you're actually just direct and you're just honest with other people right and you just say what you want right and of course it doesn't mean like like being the opposite of a nice guy is being a good guy it's not being not being an ass it's not being rude it's not being obnoxious and arrogant you know prick right it's the opposite direction of domineering personality, right?

The actual way is to be a good guy, right? A good guy is direct and is honest and is frank, has integrity, as principled, cares about people that he chooses to care about, right? And this all boils into like the one meaningful way that you can get encouragement to like become a good man is to have friends. And friends are, one of my mentors used to say that like friends are for edification and for enjoyment. Right. And friends push you to be better, right. In ways that is, is very underappreciated in our current society.

And some of that is the way our, like, urban, everything from, like, urban policy has designed that prevents friendship to, like, our media culture to, like, you know, like, there's lots of reasons why we have less friends than ever before. But if you go back, like, 100 years ago, right, our culture was heavily, heavily dominated by these civil institutions, right?

We're talking about, like, you know, Rotary Club and, like, by these civil institutions, right? We're talking about like, you know, Rotary Club and like bowling and like Poker Club and like Gentleman's Club, right? Not the strip club, but like smoking cigars and like reading books together, right? And women had the same thing, right? They had all these other clubs they would go to and they would, they had this,

we had this really, really tight-knit dits culture, right? And- What's the word you use? Tight-knit dits? Dits, dits. Dents, dits uh dents dents like yeah like yeah yeah like so like the social fabric between individuals who are non-familial non-genetic uh attached like a chapter select family was was significantly greater right uh today than than than our story didn't simply great 100 years ago that it is today and if you look at the trends

in terms of loneliness and depression and addiction to substances, divorce, like all of them are also directly correlated to actually the decline of non-familiar ties. And I think that that is one reason we see so much, so many problems here, like death of despair, lack of achievement to men being listless and families being broken apart, is that these actually non-familial, non-generated ties are all breaking down, like really, really severely. And you see this in the reflection of like CrossFit culture, right? And that CrossFit is essentially like a secular church, right? It provided this meeting and connection between non-familial people around one single subject area that they had you know rituals you had common language and common clothing right uh and provided this structure for people to actually meet non-familiar connections and form bonds over each other right and and that's one of the most amazing things about crossfit is that that's like a good thing

because people like need that like belonging to something they can't just exist in this like empty void of like commercialism and making money and like just like just like vote for people who like always leave you alone and like go make some money here at this like, you know, corporate job and shop at Costco and like, you know, have some resemblance of authenticity by going to Whole Foods. You think Costco is still corporate, right? Like all this like devoid of morality and meaning in our society, which is what I was raised with in high school and college, was just transact and everyone will be tolerant of each other. Totally exploded. Everything is exploded. That whole philosophy of neoliberalism has totally eroded and almost nobody believes it, but it created all these factional things of morality in our society that we're dealing with today. The aspect of friendship is one of these like meat and potatoes

of good free society that is gone, right? And if you look at, it's depressing. If you look at those numbers of like people who don't have anyone close to them, right? It is like, it's devastating, right? It is utterly devastating. And the solution to, I think a lot of uh cultural ills is actually like good quality high quality friendships um yeah like look at that like

it's just like oh my god like this is this is devastation right uh and by the way if you go to other countries right let's say go to i've been africa a number of times go to africa these numbers look the exact opposite right oh yeah like the exact opposite like like happiness is directly correlated to also the number of friends you just you say you have if you look at like country scores right uh and and and so we we as a society have forgotten this art um of like forming friends uh we have a lot of buddies right buddies are likeies are like, when I say friends of convenience, these are people who are not like really you're that intentional with. These are just people who kind of just showed up in your life and they kind of will disappear at the same time. Like friends are like, like I would say Greg, like I literally go see Greg, right? I'm intentional with Greg,

right? And Greg and I will text things like the sort of telepathy thing, right? We like to text things we know we like about each other, right? We're honest with each other. We struggle with each other, right? We, we fight on the same mission together. Uh, we, we, we push each other, right? And, uh, it's like a side-by-side thing, right? Like couples, like, um, uh, are you familiar with like the, there's like seven Greek words for love. Are you familiar with this at all? No, go ahead. Yeah. Maybe I am. Go ahead. Yeah. So the main four you think about are Eros, Philea, Agape, and Stork. Stork's family love. Let's say Agape is God love.

Eros is romantic love. And Philea, Phileo is friend love, right? Give me one second. Some of you are asking how can i uh follow aaron he's private on instagram where he's really active where you want to find aaron is over on twitter and uh this is his uh twitter account a-a-r-o-n-g-i-n-n aaron gin two a's one r aaron gin crazy active there. Aaron Gin. Crazy active.

Very thoughtful, fun stuff. It's a fun account. Everything from stuff like this to predicting the future. Like I said, AI, his favorite recipe. It's fucking everything. It's so cool. He does everything with intention. It's well vetted within his giant brain.

Okay, go on. The seven loves. Yeah, so there's seven. Those are kind of the main four. There's playful love and things like that, but those are the main four. So as you know, I'm Christian. So in actually the Bible, there's only two loves that appear, agape and phileo. So as in unconditional love, which is agape, and then phileo so as in unconditional love which is god agape and then phileo which is friend love right and so eros love represents the uh romantic love right uh and and that's the

love of like basically what i describe the love is like face to face right this is like face to face love that you experience about like you know um getting engaged having children right and the design of that love is to create really a strong attachment to a single person to like build the family because like building a family is freaking hard it's like well it's like the hardest thing in life to do right and it's also because that that thing to do about raising children is the ultimate expression of two people to ever have the closest feeling of agape love which is sacrificial love to your children right so you need that eros connection with another person the point of having sex is to make a love child my mom taught me that yeah that's just like

i mean let's be real like both from a religious perspective yeah and from evolutionary perspective right so like it works both ways regardless of whatever your ultimate metaphysics is right so so that so that's like this purpose right and so in our culture we've forgotten the side-by-side love and and that and that's uh phileo phileo, right? That the attachment to another individual to pursue a mission together, right? And this is where you are working together on a common cause, right? And the way that you see this flow out in culture is these really incredible moments that define history that are actually completely independent of Eros. They're almost entirely dependent on their friends.

And I mentioned these in the piece. So my favorite one, which I start with, is Abraham Lincoln and Joshua Speed, right? If Joshua Speed was not alive, like, or say, didn't meet Lincoln, Lincoln would be dead. Like, he would have not survived his early 20s-ish in early in his career.

He suffered from significant depression. He thought, like, he would have not survived his early twenties ish in early in his career. He suffered from significant depression. He thought like he was an utter failure, disaster in life. He could not basically function at all. And he was in Lincoln credits speed for saving his life. Lincoln also credits speed for introducing him to his wife and actually works both ways too. So, so they, they both saved each other's marriages, right? And a lot of his early intellectualism about slavery and freedom

came from these conversations with Speed. There's these famous stories around him walking with Lincoln. They would walk for like all day talking about different things, right? And so there's these like pivot moments in history that are really, really defined by certain people that we like sort of forgotten this,

again, forgotten this art of friendship that can utterly transform your entire life. And, you know, because it's not like, I guess like my point of telling a lot of these stories is that we have plenty of stories of great marriages, great marriages that define history. We have movies and constant, this idea, this elevation of marriage. What I'm trying to do in some of this writing is elevate this other thing that you've forgotten that actually is almost accessible to everybody right now and is also accessible in terms of like the love that you can have between a friend is also shareable that's like one of those amazing things about

friendship right it's like i met you through greg right but it feels additive right when i talk about you with greg he feels like oh great like i have two friends that know each other right right right right so it's like this expansive thing right so so it's like freely available to everybody everyone can have access to it and when when everyone interconnects, it actually expands itself, right? Versus Eros Love is like designed for like one person. So, and that's what, because again, family formation, long-term attachment, right? Like another story is like,

so my favorite founding father, I think his last name is Thomas Jefferson. And he was wrong about several things about how much he loved France and things like that. But, but one of the things he was, he was amazing about, like he was totally a hundred percent spot on on earth is this idea of, of sovereignty of the individual and how that relates to property rights and, and, and faith and things like that. So his friendship with Madison, which originally started with like um madison

basically worked with uh like jefferson lived a really long time like people kind of forget he like lived to his like uh i think like high 70s right which is incredible for that for that time period um so when he was governor madison worked for him as sort of like on a on like a different part of the body of in. And that the most important, as you say, like amendment right was invented by Madison, which is the Statue of Religious Liberty in the early part of Virginia.

So in the Virginia constitution. And that was basically his great achievement. And he did that when he was like, I think 21. And then since then, like Madison kind of plateaued, right? And so he goes like works with Jefferson and starts working on this idea of federalism's constitution and that friendship between madison and jefferson basically is i believe the most important friendship between all the founding fathers that forms the idea of the constitution forms the idea of separation of powers uh the bill of rights right because without madison

and jefferson we would not have a Bill of Rights, right? And that was because Madison pressured Jefferson, basically when he was an ambassador in France. And you read these letters that Madison would write, they would write each other. And basically Madison's like, bro, you gotta get on with this program, right? We have to do this.

Jefferson goes, I don't know, that Hamilton guy sucks. He's always talking too much. He wants him to be king, right? And there's like this battle back and forth right and and the uh the the the final constitution convention because we had several of them before right um and uh and people kind of like a third of the people at our constitution convention actually former constitution a third of the delegates didn't come because this was like oh there's oh here's another one we'll just have another one in a few years right and and like rhode island didn't even show up right like and and so a third huh yeah a third of them

didn't even come wow it was it was mostly like new york virginians um and uh and so jefferson though represented this block of people that like basically weren't that interested uh but through the friendship of madison basically convinced jefferson to go along with it and in fact whenever it finally passed and everything uh jefferson wrote like, oh, that's fine. We'll just do another one in 10 years. It's like, it's okay. Right. And Madison goes like, no, no, this is the actual one. This is going to work. Right. And so like that, that, that friendship, right, that bond is basically pulled in the Virginians and basically created the establishment of the constitution and like in the support of it.

And then Jefferson also has another famous friendship with Adams, John Adams, that formed much later. So Jefferson, and this goes to the power of friendship. So Jefferson hated Adams. They just utterly, because Adams loved England. I've been there. I've had friends that I hate. Yeah, yeah, yeah.

They end up becoming good friends. Some people think that about Hiller and I, although it's not true, but some people think that. So they hated each other for a long time because Jefferson wanted us to be close to France. Adams wanted us to be close to England, right? And then once they both become presidents, right?

Adams didn't have a great presidency. Jefferson had a great one. They basically start this really deep friendship after that. And the later letters of Jefferson and Adams, when they're reflecting on form of the country is, is, is, I think one of the, some of the inspiring things about how great these men were and how much they thought about like what they were trying to do. And in fact,

they die only a few days apart from each other. And they, and they wish each other things in their in their final days they actually share things in their estate with each other um and and they basically regret their behavior that they had before this that they could have this friendship earlier right um and uh yeah and and so so like this this beauty that we have that like i would say previous generations were really great at. And I think our modern culture today is, is this, this may, this may be offensive, but I truly believe it that I think we, I think our, our obsession around the nuclear family

and is, is very constructive around American ideas that is not particularly healthy for children. Because if you look at, let's say 7,000 years of human history, most of the time, children were basically like free range children and the attachment to the family. Yeah. Yeah. Their attachment to the family is basically, you sleep here, you eat here and like, I will protect you. Right. But outside of that, you've got to go develop your own identity because dad's off working and I got

like stuff to do at the farm as the wife. And so today we have this kind of opposite trend, and I just don't know how you can say that children today are better. They're obviously worse. Opposite trend. Aaron, I want to share a story with you. In the second grade, I met a guy named Jeff Holman and he became my best friend and I kept him as a friend for life. And I realized from the second grade forward that the only reason why I ever went to school or did anything, went to work at CrossFit, everything, anything was always for

friendship. So like I do this thing where I cover the games, the semifinals and my favorite thing is coming online live and seeing my friends. It's so much cooler. It's like the coolest thing. Those are my friends and we're going to hang out. And in 2008 or whatever, I can't remember nine, when Greg was going through his divorce with Lauren, I remember saying to Lauren, hey, does, and I didn't know Greg at the time, although I worked for CrossFit. I mean, I knew him, but I didn't know him, know him. And I said to Lauren, I said, hey, does Greg, I'm really good at friendship. That's like my specialty. Does Greg have any close friends? And she goes, you should build a good bond with him. So I basically contacted Greg and I said, Hey, can I come stay

with you? And I went to his house and he was living by himself because Lauren had moved out. And I stayed there for 30 days straight, dude. And, and, and, and I, I went there consciously to become his friend. It weird it was like i'd never really done that like hey i'm gonna go out of my way and just build and uh and then eventually it ended up uh you know we stayed friends obviously very close for a couple years then i eventually me and my wife moved in with him and raised uh avi in his house i lived with him for three years dude i know that whoa yeah crazy right and then finally – and then when he met Maggie and they got married, we lived there for another six months, and then he started growing his family,

so we moved out of the house. But I think one of the crazy things about friendship is that people – to be – you know, I've had friends who I come home, and they're passed out on the couch, like,ding off high on heroin and my bike's gone. And people are like, I'm like, dude, where's my bike? And he's like, I sold it. That's not a deal breaker for me. That's not a deal breaker for me.

I'm not like, oh, you're not my friend anymore. It's not a deal that's not a deal breaker for me i'm not like oh you're not my friend anymore it's just a fucking new dynamic in the friendship it's like okay i get it this dude this particular friend's addicted to heroin you can't leave your bike and i have to figure out how to navigate that maybe i need a break from friendship but yeah there's too much pressure people what i see around me is that people put have too high of expectations on people around them and and people don't want to be used it's like this negative thing and if you're a fucking good friend you want to be used you you see yourself the same way a pot wants to carry water you see you know yeah

you know your value i don't think a pot wants anything and that hillar don't ruin my story i'm personifying and then a lovely story yeah don't bring logic to this in reality to my story hillar and then there's other people who who uh like i was dave castro who they'll use you in ways you didn't know you could be used and so they bring out another side of you but but that's because you have to go into this with like not no expectations on the friendship kind of you know what i mean other it's interesting that people people fuck to step on their own dick all the time and ruin great friendships yeah they yeah so like i i don't agree that a part of like our souls is they will they desire to be connected right and and we and

we we bond over these different types of connections different type of love what do you think our soul our soul is really quick? Can you tell me in a couple of sentences when you say our souls, what that is? Well, I mean, so so from so I mean, I'm a theologically trained Christian. So so like from a from a Christian perspective, it would basically be my head messed up. Oh, yes. Backwards, isn't it? So so from a Christian perspective, like the soul is the conscious attachment that we have to God that exists with every single human being, regardless of their faithful follower of Christ or not, and whether that's redeemed or not. And this is an extension of the garden when we were Amagio Dei, which is the only title given to anything creation that is attached to God. And that connection is existing within us individually in the garden, and that that's that connection is existing with uh within us individually in the in uh in the garden and that was broken by sin and that through reconciliation through christ on the cross you can actually have the redeeming of that soul reattachment to god which is the

holy spirit that like lives within us and is the returning connection there's also like in some christian theology there's like head heart heart, soul, head, soul. Like I don't want to get that in the cartoons. It's the thing when Daffy Duck gets smashed. It like floats away. Sure. That's fine. Or VeggieTales. If you want to make a Christian. Sure. I'm sure that appears in VeggieTales. OK, I'll check. But is it like that? Is it like our battery? Is it like our you know, is it actually something our soul? Yes. So. So, yes. So from Romans one, which is a letter that Paul wrote to the church in Romans, every human being possesses this internal dialogue, which I call is good or evil. And that is imprinted from us from birth.

Like you don't have to teach children to do bad things. They just do it, right? It's not like a parent is like, you know, my child is born tabula rasa. They're just this blank slate. I'm going to teach them how to be selfish and cry on the plane and throw crap at people, right? And have all these problems, right? No, it's just like, it's just in, right? And this is that the morality code that exists within us, which is an extension, I believe, of the connection to Adam and Eve had to God, is that morality imprint. And that's what I believe is a soul. It's a desire, this like infinite desire to be connected and to live beyond the material world.

Like every single human being desires this longing, this longevity, this picture of future, right? Where we desire shalom and and to use if you pull in the uh the jewish tradition i like that infinitely connected yeah yeah you want to be infinitely connected hillary that's nice right infinitely oh okay i have my notifications turned off right now i'm on silent right now i'm on so yeah um so so yeah they they and and then so there's this soul connection uh which i'll tell you like another great story of like a president i didn't really like right so so fdr and and how how is his last name uh henry how so uh so this goes to like lifelong connection a lot of stuff you're telling this be that beautiful story with you and greg and i'd

have a similar story too of uh, of one of my best friends, he got divorced through, in the end was the right thing to do. They were a hundred percent not great. And, and she was very abusive. But I helped repair his life. And like, like, I think it was a couple of weeks after the final full separation, like went to his house helped clean out his house stayed with him uh helped rebuild his life and rebuilt his masculinity and his courage uh and and now he's married to an awesome woman and they have a fantastic marriage and i can't wait for them to do that on purpose help him be built rebuild yeah it was intentional yeah yeah and and i talked to him over like i was in san francisco. And, and I talked to him over the, like I was in San Francisco at the time and I talked to him over the phone

because his cousin actually worked for me at a different company and he goes, Oh, Hey, meet this other CrossFitter. This other guy is also Christian. And then I talked to him and I built friendship and then finally told me he was going through like a really bad divorce. And, and then so after a few months of knowing him, I flew out to him in Colorado and he's actually one reason why I moved here to Boulder because him and I are still best friends after, uh, I think it was like six, six years ago. Um,

and I just invested in his life and, and that trends transformed him, uh, to like being this like awesome man of God, awesome CrossFitter. Uh, it gave him the courage to rebuild his life. Uh, and, and like that, that's what friends do, right? And now we're in a different transitionary phase, which is, again, the power of friendship is that he's married now and new boundaries. He used to live with me.

Now he doesn't. He's down the street from me. And he has a whole other life he's building. And I'm happy to be a part of that and be a part of that as his friend. And hopefully, you know, uncle when he when he has his children. Remind me how that happened as a result of you not liking FDR. And oh, sorry. Yeah. Yeah. So. Wow.

People don't pay attention. I'm just a sponge here. So you just showing off. Now he's just showing off. I'm also trying to know why he doesn't like Costco versus Whole Foods. I want to know his definition of. Oh love costco i love costco uh so so uh hey he just fucked all you guys up in the chat i'm looking at his comments and like he's sleeping i'm like no i'm just i'm just okay sorry so i'll go back to how okay so so how an fdr so soe was essentially FDR's best friend. And they met very early on his career. And he persisted through because FDR served the most administrations ever in the president's reform. Right. So in the in the in the first two, Howe was basically his confidant. He led the kitchen cabinet, which is basically off the record conversations.

led the kitchen cabinet, which is basically off the record conversations. FDR is super famous in the Oval's administrations to basically have these massive debates with Howe in the Oval Office, unrecorded with nobody. And people would say that they would literally just go at it, right? They'd yell at each other, argue with each other, right? But Howe was considered the hand behind FDR. And also famous for FDR is FDR was a massive womanizer and emotionally abused Eleanor and was just completely like they were lived in basically two different homes. A Democrat.

Yeah. Also did one of the biggest completely fucked Japanese Americans. Completely fucked people in the United States. Another Democrat. Throw him in there with fucking fucking the kkk and the nazis yeah truly i mean it's not some massive anti-semite and like he had lots of yes he had lots of issues right so people that's not that long ago remember that's the democratic party that's a lot lock japanese people up still their fucking land and don't

think it won't happen to you because because it will keep keep fucking voting for biden and next thing you know they'll be taking your house so they can put people homeless people in there you just yeah i mean yeah the south was run by dixiecrats the the longest serving uh kkk member was a democrat like bird like and he i mean he like he served until the 90s right oh but he apologized don't worry it's fine it's fine yeah it's like come on uh yeah i got his name right okay go on so fdr and Howe. Sorry, Hillary. So Howe basically held the administration together. And Howe actually ended up becoming really good friends with Eleanor.

And also, Eleanor hated him. And then they started working together. And then he became the confidant to Eleanor to push her agenda. And she was actually quite successful as First Lady. But then Howe basically dies. quite successful as first lady. Um, but then how basically dies, uh, and all of the basically attributed, uh, you know, kind of like failures of the FDR administration and the last two, uh, were basically connected to the fact that he disappeared. Um, and, and, and so that this friendship basically was heavily focused towards accountability and loyalty, and kept fdr in check uh and when he when he basically when they when he died uh a lot of these sort of bad decisions in the later parts of fdr's

administrations uh is attributed to the fact that fdr didn't have any accountability uh because he had to kill his wife because he was almost basically estranged from her uh and he basically kind of was like floating alone right and and so so another great story about like accountability, showing up for each other, persevering. Right. And having like a very deep friendship with somebody, connection to somebody that can create greatness. Right. And I mean, he did this like no one even really knows about this guy. But like he is the main reason why FDR, I mean, from a political perspective was successful, uh, was this random guy. Uh, and, and I, how do you know about him then? And did he also do this consciously the way that you did for your friend?

Yeah. Yeah. I mean, he called FDR his best friend. Yeah. Well, I mean, you said that you consciously tried to rebuild your friend's masculinity and helped him with his marriage. Right. And then you said he also worked with you.

Yeah. Is that something that happened with how-to? Did I miss that part? Yeah. How is there just like, hey, I'm going to do this for FDR? I mean, just being intentional, right? So you're intentional with your fancy head, right? So you're intentional with work.

You're intentional. Like, attention, again, is this function of self-respect and agency and choice, right? And you choose people like, or let me rephrase it this way. The people you have in your life, you should select, right? People that you should avoid having in your life are people who just kind of randomly show up and leave because there's no responsibility and shared responsibility in their relationship, right? And so seeking out people and selecting them, right?

And including them in your life, as Siobivan said with Greg, is like how you create these massively transformative relationships. And it's not white logs. It's an eyeball. It's an eyeball. I'm not drinking it. A hippie Colorado energy drink, Aaron Jim.

So, yeah, so you want, because the arc of, like, being like people's, like, you know, we've all had down times. We've all had these hard times. Right. These moments like the relationships that are really resilient to that are the ones that can transform your life from going to people who are in despair and then who get addicted to drugs and commit suicide. You know, that's the despair in our country or highest ever been highest in the world, basically. Like friends are the things that protect against that. And of course, a spouse can, too. Right. as it's fair in our country or highest it's ever been uh highest in the world basically um like friends are the things that protect against that uh and of course a spouse can too right but that is layered with all these other complexities which is the point of like my articles i i have a

section called the de-romanticization of friendship is that like you there are so many things wrapped up into that one-on-one amazing bond that's so unique in this world that like it makes it really difficult to like add these other elements into it right uh and and like the the the friendship side is basically what what's the bond in this story and like my story right is like you're just showing up for the person and i'm like choosing you and there's no exchange of bonds right like there's no like oh we have kids so we have to do this or like you know you live in my house we have to do this or you're have kids, so we have to do this. Or like, you know, you live in my house, we have to do this, or you're in my family, so I have to do this, right? Friendship is this really like unique thing of like, you just showing up and like, all I'm giving you is my love, right? Or as a bonds thing was, you can pour water into my pot, right?

And, and, and there's, there's no exchange, right? It's just like, it's literally just you, right? That also makes it very uh risky right because the only connection point between you and another person is that relationship itself versus like you know family and marriage you have a contract you have you know covenant you have family genetic ties right the friendship is just that relationship itself that's also why it's so powerful and also why it can be so fragile at the same time um but you should be intentional with all your relationships in your life. You shouldn't just like, you know, you know, have anyone kind of float randomly in your

life because those people will like hurt you in the end of the day because their, their, their fundamental motivation wasn't actually you. It was like, you know, just kind of, you were just there. Right. I'm assuming you also intentionally remove people then. Correct. Yes. Uh-huh.

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You don't want to be like a doormat. Right. That goes to the nice side stuff. Correct. Yes. Uh-huh. Yeah. Uh, yeah, yeah. You don't want to be like a doormat, right? That's goes to the nice side stuff. Right. But, but, but how you end, I think is really important. Um, people are like, people are in our culture, very passive and indirect. And, uh, so for, for me, uh, so a weakness of mine, right. Is that I, my, my pastor would say, I call it microwave relationships. Right relationships right uh and it is a

total weakness i don't i don't think it's an awesome trait what does that mean why is it considered a weakness yeah so so essentially aaron i want to say one thing real quick before you tell the story about that andrew published a video yesterday oh. That has the perfect fucking example of what the difference between a strong, powerful man and a weak man. Okay. It's one in the morning. I don't know what time it is. He's laying down at the end of a hallway in a hotel working on his computer by the fire exit. There's no one can hear him.

He's whispering into his computer making a youtube video okay and a lady and he's just laying there in his boxers or in his shorts and a lady walks up to him who's the manager of the hotel and tries to kick him out he he he's like he's like the fucking dao he's there but he's not there and he stands up to her in the most gentle, powerful way. He's the water. He's the mountain. He's the air. He's everything. I'll send you the clip afterwards.

Whereas most other people, including myself, would have been like, oh, I'm sorry, and got up and left. But he's like, ma'am, I've clearly not disturbed anyone. No one is. I'm here working. And next thing you know, she feels comfortable walking up to him, and he's all big and juiced up and veins popping out. Oh, that's where he worked out. No, actual steroids. Actual steroids, yeah.

And she actually walks away. I would love to interview her and see what she thought. She met an immovable object that was also not there. I'll send you the link. It is truly – when I read your articles about how a man should stand up to things it's exactly how we should all be he's not defensive and yet he's not going anywhere yeah there's nothing he's just it's so great but you could have like picked me up and put me in my room she could have carried me like a baby that would have been interesting he could have been like yo bitch what the fuck

are you talking about it would have been like like I'm not doing anything get out of here like he could but none of that yeah you want to be gracious you know yes so gracious but so powerful go on yeah just i'll send you a link to it it's awesome yeah it's awesome you cannot be gracious or kind without being confident right nice guys are not confident which is why they're never gracious or kind and that's why they're manipulative with their behaviors like appeasement approval like oh i'm so sorry even though right inside inside they know they didn't do anything wrong so like i literally don't say sorry like i i if i'm doing like because that's kind of like a programmatic thing people in the brain like i say sorry for things i actually did wrong that like i own agency of right i did like there's judgment against me

i'm sorry but this whole thing i was told to change sorry with thank you and so i always if i want to say sorry i'll say thank you for us so like always – if I want to say sorry, I'll say thank you. So like if someone's on their bike and my kid's in the way and they go around my kid, instead of saying sorry, I say thank you. I give them the power. Oh, thank you instead of sorry. Yeah, I say excuse me. Or like another phrase is people say to be honest. I don't say that.

I say to be frank because I'm always honest. Yeah. I've said that twice already. What? To be frank or to – Frank. Frank. That's good. That's good. I like the word honest. Yeah. Like it was twice already. That what? To be Frank or to Frank. Frank. That's great. That's good.

I like the word Frank. Okay. The, so the, yeah, I was like, did I say honestly, like,

you know, I've been talking fast, so I'm not telling you guys any more stories where I call the police. Fuck you guys. Hi, Melissa. Good morning. So,

oh yeah. So, so your question then on my question, when's the last time you said sorry do you know uh you said you don't say it really oh i say i do say it but i try not to no yeah i don't say it in these phrases yeah i said sorry to uh he just said it he just said it yeah two or three days ago to uh to uh my actually my best friend about the who went through the divorce because i said i was being too uh i was being too needy uh based on

some things that were going on in my life and that i apologize for for basically applying like too much pressure for him to call me back and to respond to my text message and that that was being like intrusive uh and that i should um and I should like be patient and like not expect something like immediately in return. Right. And that that was me reflecting on my own, my own expressing my own sort of internal anxieties and insecurities onto him and expecting him to fulfill that. In reality, like that wasn't going to happen. Right. And it wasn't malicious. Right. He was just busy. It was working and like it was doing stuff, right? And another time would have been the couple days before that where like my other pastor friend who we're talking about various issues,

I said sorry for him about basically some information that I shared that I shouldn't have. And so I apologized uh about that so uh so thinking about his wife and for thinking about his wife his wife his wife his wife is amazing um so uh so yeah it's just like the sorry in the like colloquial passing like as in you're at costco and someone like you know like i interrupt people all the time and say i'm sorry and the other day dave's on the show and he's like, you're not sorry. I'm like, excuse me, pardon me. Like, so, so when someone says, you know,

I don't understand them. I say, I say, you know, pardon me or say, excuse me. Right. I try to remove the, the, the sorry aspect to it. Or like, you know, when you're just like accidentally crossed someone's path, like at the, at the, in the box. Right. I don't say, sorry, just excuse me. If you say, sorry, I'm like, it's not not there's no like justice needed here because you like accidentally walked in front of me when i'm like trying to you know do a clean jerk or something like that right um but but like language like that i think is is uh it's just like things people say they don't really like uh when people say i don't understand that's not what really they're actually saying what they're

saying is i don't agree right so pulling up, I try to pull those things out and try to be more specific in language. Um, uh, but, but on your thing about microwaving relationships is just quickly about that. So, so I, I microwave. So this means that when I meet somebody, I like become, I super intentional very quickly. And when I want to to talk about very intense things within a day or two of meeting them or within the same hangout. Like Gus. Yeah, because one, I find it interesting. I find other people super interesting about what they think about the world. Why do I think that? Granted, most people have never thought about these things, so I take that in that. The other is that it's a bit

of a safety mechanism for me um because going back to your question your question of like do you remove people well yeah absolutely so by microwaving it i i tend to create it's like a defensive mechanism so that i don't have people in my life who are thoughtless or immoral or don't know what they want in the world because those people are very dangerous i they they're very destructive uh to relationship around like the the blast radius of those people in your life could be emits right very very toxic people so so i i microwave because i'm like if they can stand this pressure which is like i mean i'm not like being rude or mean it's like it's like i'd still be kind in the conversation i'm not being an ass but if they can't stay in this conversation about like, what do you want in life? Like,

what do you believe? You know, what, you know, tell me about, you know, uh, I just casually go into like, you know, are they vulnerable? Do they self-reflect? Do they talk about issues? Do they, you know, we're not talking like if I know somebody is, has some significant trauma in their life and I first met them, I'm not going to like start with that. Right. But you know, you see, do they bring it up? Do they reflect on it? Right.

And do they offer it up? Right. And these, and then it's this exchange, first exchange. And, and that to me is a sign of like maturity of discipline, of self-control, of self-awareness. These are all principles of people who you should be friends with because they'll protect you. I, and cause you want that, you want that mutual exchange of respect. I got it.

Some part of me is thinking you put something in the microwave and there's some aluminum foil on it and you didn't know about it. I love when that happens. That's awesome. And all of a sudden the microwave is going out of control and sparking. And then that's when you go, this person is thoughtless and they're going to be destructive to me and everyone close to me. And then you got to throw out the whole microwave. Yeah, it explodes, right? And it's everywhere.

Whenever once in a while you're like, I got to get this cup of water hot. Yeah. I like this. I'm going to put some tea out of this person. I'm going to throw this really arrogant self-serving story out. Because I haven't done that in my life i've seen shit that no one else will ever see in my life is so much richer than other people's shit for instance i don't throw the guy out who's nodding off doing heroin on my couch in college because i want to see how

it unfolds i don't stop being friends with the bank robber because i want to i want to hear about the bank robbery stories i don't um uh i'll give you even an example in the last five years, I hire a guy to put a generator in my house cause we have rolling blackouts in California. I saw that thing the other day. And, and it's expensive. It's, it's going to be a $15,000 operation, right? So I give the guy $7,000 to buy the generator a year later. I, the generator hasn't even shown up. And I call him like, Hey dude, what the fuck's going on? He's like, dude, I bought the generator with your money and I left it at the store and't even shown up and i call him like hey dude what the fuck's going on he's like dude i bought the generator with your money and i left it at the store never picked it up and they sold it and you lost your money on it i'm like oh dude what the fuck and he goes hey

give me another seven thousand dollars i'll buy another fucking generator and i'll come do it and i'll credit you with the work for the seven thousand dollars and my and so i do it and my wife's like are you out of your fucking mind i I'm like, nah, this is a good dude. We're a total good dude. Total fucking good dude. I found him on his couch and he fucking sold my bike. Dude comes to my house with a generator and starts installing it. But I have to call him every month and he comes over once a month or once every other month and does like 30 minutes of work or whatever and then leaves. And he's installing all of this stuff and he's putting it in and the generator is there. And one day he pulls up to the house and he's got – this is's an old dude this is like a 55 year old dude my age but looks like

he's 100 and he pulls up to the house and and he's like hey can i open this gate when i work and i have this huge sliding gates and on one side of my house can i park my truck here and leave these sliding gates open i said yeah what's up he's i got a baby in the car you got a baby in the car he goes yeah so i go over to the fucking car and i look in the car. I go, you got a baby in the car? He goes, yeah. So I go over to the fucking car, and I look in the car. I'm like, dude, that's not a fucking baby. That thing is fucking looks like it should still be in the womb. He goes, yeah, it was born yesterday. I'm like, where's the lady?

He goes, I got this fucking young girl pregnant. She had the baby, and they 5150'd her. So I got the fucking baby now, and she's in the fucking mental ward. The hell is 5150? You think you're a duck. And you think needle exchanges are good in neighborhoods except yours. And so basically – so this goes on for like years, right? And then finally, the project's at the 85-yard line, and I'm calling him, and he won't return his call.

And I call, and finally he answers, and I go, hey, dude, what's up? And he goes, hey, dude, I'm going to fucking die in a couple days. I can't finish the project. I go, what's up? He goes, I got pancreatic cancer. And he ends up dying. And dude ends up dying and dying of pancreaticcreatic cancer and he's gone and i got to witness that whole thing that whole story took like five years by the way this still

fucking thing is still not installed big thing right over there yeah it's all rusted yeah it's at the 90 yeah that thing that fucking german amazing contraption yeah i wonder if that's the general yeah so so i i so then my neighbor comes over who's a contractor great guy and he, and he goes, hey, do you want me to finish installing this for you? Like he watched the whole thing go down over five years. I'm like, yeah, please. So he started – he's finishing it. But that whole thing enriched my life, and I got a fucking million stories like that going on. Do you know what I mean?

Like I don't – I got a million stories like that going on that make my life so fucking fun that other people – like there's still people who think that homeless people are the problem. That's a great question. Where is the baby? I'll text his buddy and ask him. I think his parents actually are raising it. But do you know what I mean? There's like – say it again. It's a story of boundaries, right?

Okay, okay, okay. Tell me about that because I'm really – I get really – I get triggered There's like, say it again. It's a story of boundaries, right? Okay, okay, okay. Tell me about that. Because I'm really, I get really, I get triggered by when people say they have boundaries. So help me get untriggered by that. Yeah, yeah, so it's- And my wife thinks I'm a little crazy. She's like, motherfucker, we still don't have a generator.

Every time the power goes out, every time the power goes out, she takes her belt off and beats me. Like, so you can think of boundaries as yeah like so the worst type of boundary is when someone says i need to do a boundary right that's like a very scary sort of statement right uh because it's usually confrontation it's usually something or you broke my boundary someone's like you broke my boundaries i'm like what yeah okay yeah yeah so i didn't even touch your genitalia. What are you talking about? Yeah. So, okay.

So think of it this way, right? Boundaries are just rules of the road, right? And when you have a go-bang to friendships, that's what we're talking about. Boundaries between friends, good friends, are just instinctive. They just sort of are there, right? Because you can read what they want, what they don't want, what's accessible, not accessible, what you respect and allow, what you don't allow. Right. And if you know somebody really well, you can just instantly sort of think of it. So as an example, like Greg. Right. So both you and I are good friends with him.

So Greg has this thing where like, you know, sometimes it just won't respond to his text message. He just says, come over. And within some broad space of like a couple of days. Right. So for other, you can go over there and he's not there. He's in another state. Yeah. So for other friends, like that's, that's weird. Right. Like I wouldn't just randomly go to my buddy, Tony's house or something like my best friend, Tony's house and just show up there. Right. Cause his wife will be like, I love you, Aaron, but what are you doing here? Like, you know, we have to go to work at the do these things. Right. But for Greg, he's like, whatever. Right. Yeah. This is just what I do. Right.

And so that's like, that's like a type of boundary that he has allowed people to just show up at his house. Right. Yeah. And, and, and so, so when you have these certain relationships, like the heroin guy or the, or the generator guy, you had boundaries in there because it wasn't like you're going to just have them, you know, stay your house for a week. Right. Right. And those are sort of these intrinsic things, these rules.

And sometimes it is just clarifying like, it's what I want. That's what I need. Like, yeah, the word boundary gets kind of people who actually use it in like real conversation generally don't do it in a very good way. They don't have, they typically don't have self-respect. They don't have agency in their own life. So they create these like, oh, that's my boundary. And then they become super woke and like caring about it. Right. Those are people that are, are kind of like toxic. Right. But people who are half self-respect, uh, and people who are confident and people who

know who they are, they naturally just projected outwards. And, and cause the, cause you can tell, I mean, cause 10% of what you're actually communicating and thinking is actually what's actually going on in communication 90 it's non-verbal that's being processed in the subconscious right so people will see you and if they see you as a confident person they're already immediately going to understand boundaries uh and and that's that goes back to nice guy things and friendships that help form all these all these different aspects andrew andrew has a boundary it's interesting um uh that and i i he i don't have to live by it because he but he he he does a lot of phone recording so in his youtube making he records he uses his phone

to record videos a lot so what he's done is he's made it he's figured out how to make it so his iphone he puts people in his favorites or he does something so only certain people can break in there are four four okay and i don't know how i got on that list but i could i can call and he can be like asshole i was recording you know what i mean like oh okay okay so um but but is that is that a boundary like he said boundaries yeah he's like what what healthy boundary like what i'm trying to think like I would like to know his take on that yeah can you give me some other examples of boundaries the last person I know who did that was that woman who went the identity check

on your show she said that she had boundaries yeah her one of her boundaries was like she didn't talk to men for like a couple years or something wow that's gnarly she has her notifications turned off and I go I don't know if I want to be lumped into that group but I do it because go, I don't know if I want to be lumped into that group.

But I do it because I just, I can't, the phone buzzes and I look at it and I look at it and it drives me insane. I just don't want to know that anything's going on until I do. Yeah. Yeah. So, so like about people who actually use that word in like normal conversation or generally not, I'm going to say something to be slightly off color or not generally people i want to associate with yeah me neither i get i'm like whoa that's something you got boundaries yeah yeah because people who use it it's sort of like so so people who are unhealthy emotionally toxic whatever like narcissistic behaviors they will use that word as like a like a sledgehammer right and they'll just like, boom, you, right? Versus healthy people just project externally, like, hey, like I said, as Hiller just described, this is why I do it. Yeah, he's never used that word with me.

He's never used that word with me. He's telling you why he's doing it. And that's a good boundary. As a healthy person boundary, it's like, this is why I'm doing this. This should be logical to you. And then you respect it because you love me. You'd tell me if it was bad too, right?

You'd just be like, dude, you're all messed up. Yeah, like yesterday, Aaron, he rubbed coconut oil on my arm and rubbed my biceps shirtless on my fucking skateboard ramp in the sun i was just um for uh 20 minutes cupped me i i moved closer to him because i saw he was leaning over and i didn't want him like he was like respecting my boundaries for distance but i had to move closer to him because i didn't want him to like to be he was working on me and it was like so um as i was kind of like having an out-of-body experience because i was like this is so like he's he's completely broken my boundaries and i don't care yeah no yeah like he assessed the situation he's like has anyone ever massaged you before i'm like no no and like my i don assessed the situation. He's like, has anyone ever massaged you before? I'm like, no, no.

And like my, I don't want my wife to touch me like this. What are you talking about? He's like sucking on me, telling me my skin's dry. Even that I'm like, dude, trick or water, man. Yeah. What are you talking about? Excellent. Excellent example. So like rubbing a knife on me, he was like rubbing a knife. I could feel his breath on. Yeah. Yeah. Like, yeah. And I got scared. So I went to Instagram live. So I'd have witnesses. Yeah. So, so you, so like, So as an example of how boundaries work, I view boundaries as fences with gates, right?

Fences with gates? Gates. Oh, gates. Gates, right? So obviously, if you go to a massage, you allow people through the gate because they're there to do something versus if you're at Costco and someone started doing that, that's violating a boundary. Right. So, so like that, that's how they should work. Right. In the sense of like healthy people can establish new norms and new, and new boundaries. Yeah. It's sort of intrinsically subconsciously because I can understand the, the, the, the social and cultural context of like what you're in. Right. And, and I'll, I'll give you another uh maybe off color example look at what he did to me yeah yeah that's good stuff that wasn't me that was

that was your wife she was hitting you that's right why is the generator not working yeah i enjoyed having that boundary broken i was appreciative of the of him trying to heal me yeah because i had a problem in that. So another example of like boundaries that tend to be misused, right? Is I'm a firm believer, and this is going to be, my hand keeps going on. I'm a firm believer that what occurs

in private conversation is very different than what occurs in public conversation. And that you should not judge a person by what happens in private conversations between two people that know each other or a couple of people that know each other. And because I think that violates the boundary that's actually set in private conversation. So the reason why is it's very logical, right? That like why people discuss what they do in private versus in public, the social capital exchange in public between you and your audience,

me and your audience, like, I don't know anybody in your audience. So the social capital is like zero basically. Right. And, and therefore you talk a certain way and you present ideas a certain way between you and your audience, me and your audience. I don't know anybody in your audience. So the social capital is like zero, basically, right? And therefore, you talk a certain way and you present ideas a certain way to establish, build social capital with these people you're interacting for the first time. This is why press people exist, is they're trying to remove the private,

like how you exchange information and talk about subjects privately to public so people can actually understand what you're trying to communicate and can build up that social capital. Between individuals that occur in text or email or whatever, you have so much more social capital creation that forms the bonds where you don't need to go through,

okay, hello, my name is Aaron Jin. I work here. I am the CEO of this and this, right? You just exist, right? You're in this continual formation of relational capital that allows you to exchange information the way you do, right? You're in this continual formation of relational capital that allows you to exchange information the way you do, right? And so I don't judge people by what happens. Like, you know, you always have these scandals and like, oh my gosh, this person said this private. I'm like,

I don't really care. Like, I generally don't care, right? Because I don't know what happened. I don't know what generated that. I don't know if that's a joke. I don't know if that's playful. I don't know if it's in context of a verbal conversation that they went to back to text or went to email. Like, you just can't understand, right? Because you you're like it's sort of like taking a moment, a slice of time between a couple of people and and like opening the door into like, oh, my gosh, all this stuff. Judgment, judgment, judgment, judgment, judgment. Right. And I just don't I don't care. I don't care. I care about like what they say in public, what they actually do. Right. This obsession that people have in our culture is just so destructive to like intimacy between friends and for, for couples and work relationships. It's just so destructive because people can't be honest. They can't.

And so they just lie to each other. And then like, how does that help anybody? How does that help anybody to like, to just avoid anything real and vulnerable in your own heart? Because you're like afraid someone's like watching you and it's going to and is going to like take something out of context or something like that. I have this problem. I'd be curious what you think about this. I will be out with dear friends, right? And they'll have their kids there and I'll have my kids there and I'll see them interact with their kids. there and i'll have my kids there and i'll see them interact with their kids and then i'll think oh i'm gonna tell that story on my podcast i won't give their name i won't but but i'll but i'll say like some shit like dude i can't believe they i was out with this family and they fed their kids

um orange juice i can't believe they fucking did cedars and then my friend yes it was and then my friends hear that and they think that i'm judging them They don't realize that it's just part of my cultivate, and I'm starting to lose friends because of that. Even though I don't use their name, I don't put it in context. I even switch things around a little bit. If it's a boy, I'll say it's a girl, but it's to tell the spirit of the story, and I'm losing friends over it because they're feeling judged around me. I have a saying for that. And it's fucking – it's hurting me a little bit. What if they're standing there? I. I have a saying for that. And it's fucking – it's hurting me a little bit. What if we've been standing there?

I don't want to hurt them. But I also – I understand how they think that I'm judging them, but I'm really not. Like I don't care. You know what I mean? Like I fucked up. I crossed the boundaries with them. I crossed their – we didn't talk about our boundaries,

but it was a nuance that they don't want to be a part of my podcast even if it's not by name and yeah i mean those people sound negative way and it's like we'll say it again they sound insecure like you don't nobody knows that story except you two like and you mention the names like who cares right right and i don't mention the names yeah right they just feel um they feel violated or yeah right yeah i mean like again again there's like afterwards hillar's probably going to put a lock on the bedroom dory stain and after after I told the homoerotic story. No way, dude.

Okay, good. He cupped me, Sevan 2020. So, yeah, imagine that being in a text. But I don't want to do that to people. You think I should adjust my boundaries for that? No, no. I don't want to lose friends for that. You think I'm just doing the nice guy thing again thing again yeah i think that's a nice guy thing because

because like you think of it logically like unless it's like a very personal highly specific story right that like no it would be like hey i was out with aaron jinn and this motherfucker gave his kid orange juice and i watched his kid spin out but i wouldn't say your name i wouldn't say your name i'd say i was out with this guy and then you'd be watching my podcast and be like oh that was me seven was talking about i gave my kid orange what an asshole he's judging me is that yeah so what okay let's like break down i hate i hate people say judging thing so so one is like any form of knowledge creation is a judgment call by the way right knowledge literally means discrimination and like in the core greek right so so to say people have no judgment,

it's like what they're actually saying is like, I disagree with what you're saying, right? And I feel like it's wrong, right? But that itself, that's, yeah, that itself is a judgment. They're judging you in return. So this whole idea of like no judgment culture is so dumb because that's a judgment.

That's like, that's a morality call to saying I'm not going to judge this thing. So really what you're saying is we both just disagree on what with your friend or past friends, as you say. You're just disagreeing on what should be accessible to you to share, but that's also your own agency. That is your own life, right? And what are you going to do? You're going to go message every single encounter that you have with somebody and give them permission? No, that's crazy. Especially if it occurs in public.

Like, again, like if it's non-specific information, just take like a good journalist approach, right? Good journalism, right? It was like 20 years ago when it was like more normal, right? Like they would, if you, if it's quotable, they would have to get permission, direct quotes, right? They go out and get permission from the person. Is this what you said?, direct quotes, right? They go out and get permission from the person. Is this what you said? Yes or no. Right. But for like general facts towards storytelling

or like background information, they never quote that, right. They don't quote people who get background information because it's anonymized. It's just kind of general. Right. And, and so like, yeah, I've, I've had people tell stories about me and my friendship, granted, like I'm, I'm on pretty big open vulnerable book. Like friendship, granted, like, I'm a pretty big open vulnerable book. Like I know who I am. I know what mistakes I made. And I'm really honest about those mistakes. But you know, I find it kind of endearing. And like, and if I find it goes too far, I call them like, Hey, like, I didn't like you shared that. I still love you. Like, you know, just don't do that in the future, please. And then we can discuss what that boundary is. Right. But people who can't even articulate to the boundary, like if they say that back to you, like I felt uncomfortable.

Well, they have said it to me. In their defense, they have said it to me. And then I've apologized and then done it again. Oh, okay. Well, yeah, then that's on you then. So, yeah, if you went through that and then you still saw the ideas on you. So, you know, because if you told, we were going to do it together. You did it.

Well, we were talking about saying sorry earlier. Is this guy autistic? I don't think so. Are you autistic, Aaron? No. I think I'm autistic. Oh, sorry. He meant Hiller.

Yeah, that's me. Oh, you're autistic. That's me. I'm not. I think he's just confident. He's like a stone wall. He's like a tree. I'm just a tree over here.

Aaron, I want to pick your brain on this. We're shifting gears here. Do you mind? I want to pick your brain. No, yeah, of course. Are we done talking about your thing there? Hold on. Yeah, I don't know if we're done.

What do you think about this? This is a clothing line in the CrossFit space. It's called LSKD. And they're putting up flags a bunch of colors which in my it says um a rep with pride takeover has begun sure does that mean when you see that when i saw that inside the building does that mean they support um all kinds of sexual activity except heterosexual sex is that i'm trying to figure out why you would do that. That's a clothing brand, by the way.

Yeah, I never heard of it. Dude, that's the front of the building. It's not the side. You told me it was the side. It's the freaking side on the top. It's the logo, right? It's the logo. It used to be black and white. I meant just a side.

It looks like you go in right underneath that thing and that's the front sure sure front side anyway why are people doing that why are people covering their bit why are people changing their stuff their store signs and clothing why is there this thing of sexual pride all of a sudden what what the fuck's going like i personally won't wear that stuff now because of that for some reason yeah i mean i don't know if i would have before so okay so we can take it to multiple levels do you want like fox news level or do you want like cultural like long longitudinal regarding philosophy and like there's multiple levels we can like this is where the ai starts to come and it's like how do you want to refine your search with yeah no right

you think this is a commercial do you think this is a commercial decision financial decision of course oh okay yeah yeah yeah but but so so do you so okay the i don't know what i want i just don't i just don't get i just don't get it i feel like it alienates people like black lives matter like the same exact thing because of the way the human brain is set up it you're basically saying unless that's internal messaging blacks to blacks you're basically there's going to be a group of people who see that you're saying that all lives don't matter. Can you go through the comments a little bit? What are people saying about it? I can't wait to see Outrage. Who cares who you sleep with? I don't know why they have to do this.

Well, if it truly is who cares, then who cares if they do it too? I know a guy who says that exact thing. I don't care. I just don't want to see it. You know? And to an extent or degree, when I'm in public with Alexis, it's like, it's the PDA thing, right? I mean, people can

assume that I'm with her, but I'm not going to be just making out with her on every corner or something like that, right? Because some people it's kind of similar, I think. I don't care. I just don't want to see it. This thing is so conflated too with all sorts of crazy shit now, right?

I don't see the connection between gays and trans and pedophiles but they're all kind of like rolling together as a group now. And I don't even, I can't even, they've completely lost me. Yeah. So, so, so something you could read, like a, they can help clarify this book called the rise and triumph of the modern self.

I, it's by a guy named Carl, I think Carl something. And, and so he basically describes like what he wrote this i think like 10 years ago there's another book called the the triumph of the therapeutic it's a beautiful sign yeah and and so the the long-term the like why this happened right is that there's a long traditional trend in our in our society particularly america and less so in europe europe thinks the whole like trans stuff is like insane right uh so they're like they're like classical feminists right so they're like they're like classical feminists right so they're they're like what do you mean like you know

this is this this is this right so this is a very unique thing in America that is like kind of like spreading right and so much so that like you know presidents and heads of state in Europe have commented that Americans wokeness and sexual revolution must be resisted particularly

the french president has said that several times and also really that guy yeah macron said it um because i think of him as a fucking doorknob wow that's awesome so because because if you look at it from a philosophical perspective it actually is connected to the french existentialist movement but regardless of that so it is kind of their fault but but you know so country is, is kind of this amalgamation of mostly English enlightenment, a quarter French enlightenment, a quarter Roman, right. And the, the, this combination is what created our country to where like, you know, our, our, our basically civil virtues are like forgiveness and restarting, defining your own future, right. Being a rebel, building a company,

right? That's why our country reflects that into our code, right? Bankruptcy laws, for example, bankruptcy laws in America are very generous compared to in Japan or in Germany, right? And it's because our society is built on this kind of like, do your thing, have fun, right? And like, build the life you want. The problem that happened is during the sort of sexual revolution, as we kind of continue to like detach from where identity is being formed into actual liberation, is where every single norm then becomes destroyed, right? For the sake of your individual identity. And that leads to absurdism. We already knew this because the French existentialists taught us this, particularly Derrida to Sartre to Foucault. All these guys already wrote about this because they basically predicted this sort of behavior that once you become – and they wrote it as a good thing.

I'm so free that I can molest children and kill women and kill women. When there's no boundaries. Just completely absurd level of freedom. So I think a lot of people who are more let's say libertarian conservative moderate confused a couple of things the last sort of 20 30 years where there's a difference between acceptance and promotion and tolerance and promotion right and this is where when you don't have any norms that bind people which is what we were what i was taught growing up in high schools it just exchange and libertarianism

and like no culture, no values, no norms. No one needs to have any commonality or shared norms. George Floyd's a hero. Why not? So when you don't have anything there, ends up is that something fills it, right? And that's where we are today, is that a lot of the, you know, I'm sure you've read the polls, right? That like your, your kid's generation, 30 to 40% identifies LGBTQI to a right, right, right. Right. Like, like 30, 40%. Yeah. Like biologically speaking, that is a hundred percent impossible. Right. That's why Bill Maher has that

famous joke that went super viral was like, and in 20 years, everyone's going to be gay. Right. Because, and he's literally coming from an atheist, atheist liberal, right? And so it's obviously a cultural social phenomenon that's happening. Well, yeah. How would – my kids don't even know that stuff because no one's taught them that stuff. Well, that's good. It's good because you're actually creating their own identity formation, which is what you need to do, right? The problem in our society is that we sort of vacated this ground in the effort of tolerance, thinking that, oh, we're all talking the same thing. We're all in the same playing field. In reality, something came in and was like, no, I'm going to fill it, and that is what the sign represents. Let me ask you this real quick, Aaron. So there's this idea – God, you're going to help me so much here.

There's this idea I've had. So imagine a person is just four buckets for the sake of buckets. And every person is just four buckets. And you're going to fill the buckets, whether you do it intentionally or not. Right. One of them is how angry you are. One of them is how happy you are. One of them is how horny you are.

And the other one is what's your God. And they're going to fill whether you fill them intentionally or not. And with that thing that you're talking about that complete tolerance of stuff people have abandoned the one that's your god and allowed it to be filled so you to be filled with like cnn liberal ideology fox news that they don't even they say they're atheists that there's really no such thing as an atheist in this paradigm of the world i'm talking about everyone based on the nature of who we are we have a god yep everyone's got and so if you don't have a god you're in fucking denial you're not understanding the mechanism of

the brain and then the way the brain functions and that's what you're saying we've abandoned that space but that but but we didn't it is and so we filled it with this fucking what you called absurdity yeah absurdism like like it's basically radical existential sexual absurdism right where because does that work am i understanding that correctly does that paradigm work kind of for like i'm just trying to understand it i'm not trying to stay to truth no no the the i mean yeah you're making a claim but like we, we also have from philosophical perspective, we like, we have known this, like people, when you, I just learned it. I just learned it.

I just like, no, no, no, no. I say that like, like even the quote of like, I, uh, there's a famous, um, evangelist in the early 1900s who said that like, you don't have no God, you just have something else. Right. And, and, and that, that, so that truism about human uh which is one evidence of the soul and non like non-materialism right is that that people are kind of the same for generation through generation they struggle with the same things they they have the same identity crises and they um they want bonds they want love they want justice right so so our society in an effort

to i think at a good faith, basically abandoned the principles that actually created tolerance and freedom and then inserted itself into this like self-destructive attacking type of morality that exists in society, right? That justice became heavily oriented towards vengeance, right? And like the idea of like grace and forgiveness, which the only idea you can have grace and forgiveness is humanization, right? And, and like the idea of like grace and forgiveness, which the only idea you can have grace and forgiveness is humanization, right? No scapegoating, you're a human, I know you did something wrong, but I seek reconciliation. Our new sort of social norms or civil virtue

is no forgiveness, no grace, right? Absolute sort of like tyrannical morality, right? And, and, and it's because we gave ground. We gave ground in a good faith effort, but then from giving ground, the tolerance then was filled with other morality and other forms of justice that are, I think, remarkably evil and satanic and 100% mistreat people

and don't see them as a full reflection of who they are in front of God. And it has created this society that we are struggling with through today, which is we've given ground to these people. We don't really know why. They just sort of stood there, right? And now we're all kind of hostages. And it's still like a minority. It's a smaller portion. The majority of people aren't like this. But a very vocal, a very aggressive, But a very vocal, a very aggressive, a very driven minority wants to own that ground and control what other people say, what they think, what they do and how to behave. Versus the other portion are kind of like what you just said, which is like, which is more my disposition.

It's like, if you want to do that, that's fine. I'm going to love you through that. And God loves you. You can do whatever you want. It's your choice. Right. But the smaller minority are what I call like sin hunters. Right. So they, they, and it's a behavior that exists in human civilization. It's not like new, this isn't like a new thing. Like you can think of the most famous example. This is the acquisition. Of course, like, but there are other examples too, but like that's a more famous one or the Salem witch trials, right. This idea of sin hunting, right. Where the people that exist in around you are only as valuable as righteous – how righteous they are, which is horrible and very dehumanizing.

Tolerance versus – you explained it earlier in another way too. It's cool to hear you say it this way. Tolerance versus promotion. Yeah, acceptance versus promotion. Right, like if you're a Christian and you just fucking hate gays, I think something might be wrong with you, right? I mean just to hate someone? Yeah. I would say Christians are not our problem today in our society. It's actually secular people who hate other people, right? And because they believe they have this possession of this high ground and this control over civilization and society.

And and Christians are actually very on the other side. But but also like we should we should be intellectually honest that the framework of liberty and freedom can only be held to the tradition of Christianity. Like the whole idea behind civilization, democracy, being a republic, human rights, civil rights is directly connected to Christian ideas. And then second to that would be Jewish ideas. And that's built on really strong metaphysical ideas. Going back to what we talked about Adam and Eve earlier, right? Like Imago Dei. Imago Dei applies to every single human. That is a Christian idea, right? Every single human is an imagei. Amagio Dei applies to every single human. That is a Christian

idea, right? Every single human is an image bearer of God that deserves human rights and respect, right? That is in the lineage and that theology of Christendom. And when you reject that idea, right, you fill it with, and this thing is like, we're going through these exercises that like, if you read history, it's like, it's all there right like the the the existentialist movement in germany and france created communism uh which is basically the anti-theology of christian ideas which is like you don't have a micro day you don't have human rights you are not as valuable as as as an individual you're not valuable as individual it votes what you contribute it's what is what's material right this is where our civilization is being pulled towards which i think we'll get out of it because, because America has gone through this

several times before, and we've always kind of escaped it because it's part of just the struggle we are in, in a civilization or as, as a cultural society, I should say. But that when you abandon those Christian ideas that actually create the ability to be free, you, you should suspect that another metaphysical component, another metaphysical framework will insert itself in because humans cannot live without morality. They cannot live without ethics. And that was a failure of the new atheists. That was a failure of neoliberalism. That's a failure of a lot of libertarian ideas is to think that you just live and you're fine, right? No, you need frameworks. What is good? What is bad? Like, like, and laws need to be reflecting

of that. And if you don't have, like, another basic principle, right, is, is the framework around biblical justice, right? Like the idea of being, having a jury of your peers, being able to defend yourself, being able to not say something, right? These are all Christian principles around that you deserve that, even if you did something super horrible, right? And our laws reflect that, which is why all the founding fathers, probably like half of them were actually Christian. The other half, I would say probably not, honored the Bible because they knew this was the only way to be free. I mean, John Adams literally says, John Adams is is an open atheist he literally writes to his wife that he's an atheist he's like i only go to church because it helps other people uh be good but like i'm an atheist like he said that to his wife right in the letter and and actually one of the great stories of like good a good marriage

is like his wife was awesome and i is like she would write these letters back to him being like do you want me to save this because i think you think this is important he goes yeah you should say this so like so we have great collection of adam's letter because because of his wife and uh but adam's has a super famous quote that that is tells you the heart and the orientation of the founding fathers that created the most free country and most prosperous country ever to exist that has expanded freedom to to the point where like you know we we are, we are a benevolent imperial power, right. Where we literally will destroy your country, rebuild it, make you free. And you haven't done, we've done that like six times, right.

We're the only imperial power to ever do that. Right. So, and that's because the, these extension of the, of the religious framework that we had, John says that freedom can get, I'll, I'll, I'll submit because he's more beautiful and poetic than i am uh that only a free people uh uh or sort of religion is the only guarantee of a free people as it's literally said uh that religion provides the internal code the the internal check so that you can be free and you can say that's bad i don't need a law for that i'm just not going to do that because that's what that that those are things that bad people do. Right. And we, and we've, we've vacated that

ground to where we are super obsessed with passing laws and implementing things. And when reality is just like, if the rule was just be a good person and have integrity and have honor and have respect, you don't need to call the police for everything. You don't need to like have a social worker, just like be a good person and reflect those those values. And we sort of abandoned that because we're like, oh, like tolerance and just kind of do whatever you want. Tolerance can only exist, I believe, in a geochristian framework. It cannot exist in any other framework because the metaphysics behind any other framework does not support that, does not believe in human rights, does not believe in equity of like in terms of the value of every individual human life. They believe in these other representative frameworks like, for example, communism or material existentialism. Like that believes in what you produce. Whatever you produce is how you're valued, which is why communism killed 150 million people because it viewed those people as not worth it. Right. And or, you know, there's other ideologies, obviously, obviously that they're destructive listen i don't fucking call the police for everything i need i need a dick in me listen i told one story a dude is definitely behind that account man a dude i've never called

the cops on anything ever would you call the cops the cops? I don't know the story. A car rammed another car and they were fighting each other on the free. And then they got onto the freeway. I don't see the issue. What's wrong with calling the cops about it. You were just trying to do. Hey guys. Yeah.

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Terms apply. Okay. Actually, that's not true. I told another story where I called the cops too. And then another one. No, I told one other one. Where there was a guy calling two young college girls fucking cunts and yelling at them and calling them fat and all this shit.

Yeah, beach guys. Oh, thank you for keeping track of my fucking cop calls. Does she know you or is that? Yeah, all these fuckers know me. These fucking dudes are in my dreams. Okay, by the way, you're fucking so fun to listen to, Aaron. This is good shit.

This is, you are. You are shit, GPT. No, with a soul. You put things in my brain This is – you are – You are chit GPT. No. With a soul. You put things in my brain that I don't – I haven't unfolded that like – that are like folded up nice and neat, and I can't wait to open them later. Like I feel like you're giving me clothes to hang in my closet that I can open later, and I really like it. Okay. I want to show you one more thing.

How are you on time? You okay? Yeah, I'm good. later. I want to show you one more thing. How are you on time? You okay? I want to read this to you. I sent this to some of my friends who love Chick-fil-A. Oh, yeah. Okay, ready? Chick-fil-A is one of America's favorite fast food chains

and it's also renowned as a Christian owned establishment. But what fans just found out on the company's website has many shocked. On Tuesday, many fans took to the social media to post a section of the company's website that reveals food giant Chick-fil-A's commitment toward embedding diversity, equity, and inclusion in everything we do. And basically, those of us who follow what that means is basically it's racism and, God, fascism and Nazism in my mind at the fucking highest level. It's basically not rewarding people for the right reasons and dismissing people for the wrong reasons.

When you see – why are they doing this? I thought Chick-fil-A was like – I thought they were the good guys. I'm not a Christian, but I want to love Christianity. Like someone in here was like, I like the Ten Commandments. I like all that shit. I'm down. I love every – I've never heard anything about Jesus. I even liked it when he flipped the table over. Well, I mean, yeah, he would be flipping the table over DEI for sure. What is Chick-fil-A doing?

I mean, you have to realize that companies are – what's the right word for it? Is that the CEI thing? Is that the CEI thing I keep hearing about? Diversity, equity, inclusion is DEI. No, no, but there's like a rating now that george soros has forced all did you know about this thing is that part of that thing what is that called no i mean i thought that was more environmental focused okay rather than um but but you're right you're right yeah like because the problem is that like and at least in like uh let's say speaking of this from a Christian perspective is that it is good to have a diverse church. And that is both said by Paul and Jesus and Peter and James.

And so what is the context of like what they're saying that right is like I think what they mean is having big chairs and little chairs and stairs and big windows and little windows that's what i think corners for hillar big crosses small crosses yeah when they meant diverse church they meant the actual structure needs to be uh varied so to accommodate yeah so since you know since since chick-fil-a is a christian company like so the context there that they're writing is that and this is how wild like our society has become, that when they're writing about these things, for example, there's a famous Galatians 2 verse that, you know, to a Greek, to a Greek,

to a Jew, to a Jew, to a Samaritan, Samaritan, right? To a woman, a woman. And what Paul is saying there is the fact of the equality of the gospel to all people, right? But the framework of like what they're speaking to is like back in that time right uh so are you familiar with the story of

the woman at the well uh familiar with that at all or um uh the samaritan tell me i like all the bible stories tell me i like the well i want to be a woman at the well so so she uh so it kind of gives i think like a framework i think of how to be healthy in terms of diversity inclusion versus unhealthy so there was a group of people that were called the samaritans that were considered essentially like um uh non-human basically uh and what they were were like uh original uh israel that like inbred with the local Canaanites or Philistines or, or Mennonites or anything like that. So not Mennonites, Canaanites and Philistines.

Right. So they developed a new name for them, which is basically more like half breed. And so Jews did not view them as human. They viewed them as subhuman as in something else. Right. And literally they all like, you know,

more or less look the same. Right. But, but their, but the cultural ethic identity was different because of you know how the the tribe of israel viewed themselves and so you have the story of jesus who basically meets people who are of this and shows grace to them and and that is the sort of radical expression of the gospel is that like imagine for us the most radical like unity. Right. You could ever imagine. So let's say with, you know, Donald Trump and like Joe Biden, Joe Biden. Right. Having a hookah together. Right. And that peacemaking event. Right. And that is actually how the gospel is presented,

is that the people that we view are other than, far from, you can reconcile to, and actually God wants you to, right? And those people who actually divide lines and claim the Lord's name in vain, like what's the story of turning all the tables? Why is that story in the gospel? It's because these people were extracting money in the name of the Lord. So violating the Lord's name, right? Saying the Lord's name in vain doesn't mean swearing.

It actually means to carry. So why Jesus was doing that is people are claiming to be representations of him and they're not. And they're actually abusing people who are coming into the temple and, you know, basically taking their money for no reason. So those people Jesus was very aggressive with, which is why he debated the Pharisees so much and the Sadducees, is because they're claiming his name into things that they don't, that are not true.

Like almost like opening a church to raise as a business as opposed to a place. So they are taking the Lord's name in vain. So for these examples of people who are far from God, like the leopards, the orphans, the widows, right? These are people who don't claim anything and actually are so far from society, right? That he reaches out to them and shows them grace and love and says, actually, you are part of the kingdom of God, right? So the orientation here is like, it is true, the fact of like, humans are innately valuable, independent of their race and their religion, their politics, right? That's all true, right?

And the fact is like that God is diverse. And the fact of like the most orthodox, lovely Christians I've ever met are in Africa or in the Middle East, right? They actually have not been here. The most generous, loving Christians I've ever met were actually overseas, right? Here, we sort of view religion as this like Greek God sort of like imaginary thing. You go to other countries, right. Which is by the way, most of the world, right. Other countries. And you see religion and you see it's like, it's like real, it's authentic.

It's, it's, it's like a serious consideration. Right. And I like going to, when I went to Israel and I was, my tour guide was essentially he was a PhD in archeology. He was part of the special forces in Israel. He's actually in one of his Netflix shows. His character is like him. And he's like, it's a one called Musad, I think, or something like that. And you see like religion there.

It's like a real thing. Because it's not like this imaginary like, oh, like this picture of Jesus, who's like white and Greek and whatever is hanging on the cross. Like you literally walk down, you know, the road that like every historian believes that he like walked down. And so the question there, which is a totally different question that we have in our society is like, do you follow or don't you follow? Right. And the Jews there, if you ask, you know, Israelis say, you know, are you an atheist? They're like, no, that's weird. Right. But their whole lifestyle is opposite of the Torah. Right. And you said, no, I just don't follow God. Right. It's a totally different perspective.

Versus here are like people say, oh, I'm an atheist and I don't believe in God. Like there you go where religion is real. Right. There's literally a building here. Like archaeology says this actually happened. They're like, no, the question is, do you follow or don't you follow? Right. like archaeology says this actually happened they're like no the question is do you follow or you don't you follow right and and i think i think our culture needs to shift back to that rather than believing that we're like this completely free agent that we can define whatever word we want we can be whoever sort of we want and that sort of perspective of like subjectivity to words right there is a question of like there is truth right the question is do i follow it or don't i follow it right that's a much more healthy perspective in terms of freedom than what you have in our society, which is like we're just going to find however we want. Liberty is going to be oppression because I said so. Right. Like wokeism is oppression. Nothing about it is free. It is Marxism at its root. Right. And but they say, oh, it's liberation. You're like, no, you literally bastardize a word to sell your ideas.

you literally bastardize a word to sell your ideas and you are torturing people, like literally torturing people, forcing them to do something to put up a civil expression of your morality, which is like the flags and stuff like that. People aren't doing that freely, right? Like it's just like from, even from an identity perspective of like, let's say the people who actually truly have that identity, it's always going to be super small right like just from a biological statistical perspective it's just true right so so you're literally forcing people to do something right and and and that that's what is like choking our society choking innovation is choking growth is choking culture is choking everything right and and but it can't last right because because it's fundamentally built on truths about humanity and civilization it's just like not going to last either like our civilization will implode on itself because of

this absurdity that we're like we're going through uh or we'll come out the other side most likely we need a war to do that unfortunately it's it's a very unfortunate truth about humanity that we probably need a war or reframe everything or poverty will reframe everything being okay wait we have to reorder things into truths again because reality has hit us we don't have this endless spending spree we don't have endless superpower to to you know to project our our insanity to the world we have to live in reality again right and because right now we're just we're just warring at each other right so much of our culture just hates hates itself and then china is over here just like ho-humming along, right? And taking over the world through economics.

And then we're over here kind of like bickering and hating on each other and completely distracted from actually what the end game is. Like China's very focused on the end game. And we're just like playing around with these like flags and, you know, getting obsessed with celebrities, getting obsessed with politicians.

And China's like slowly going over here, like moving and positioning itself. Because if America, this is how serious the situation is. And this is why like when I first met Greg, so like now even his politics has changed, is that like there's a unity behind people who actually believe in democracy and freedom, right?

There's this unity of like, even like say specifics on policy, all three of us would disagree. But the orientation orientation of society we are 100% aligned on which is this idea of like self respect integrity you are free to do what you want don't impose on me right uh but these other uh entities in our society do not believe that and and so there is a new unity that's forming a new coalition but like the seriousness of the situation is if America disappears or becomes, let's say, an aging United Kingdom,

the world is effed for a very, very long time. We're talking about massive wars, massive death, starvation, poverty. It will be another level of dark ages. So America needs to get its crap together because if we don't fight, there's literally nobody.

Who's going to show up? Who's going to show up to defeat China or or russia or whoever nobody no like we are it we are the last line so we need to be like super serious about like around you know ai being rich being powerful winning again because if we don't and this is this is why so many people want to like what is the expression of trumpism it's really simple it's that America should win. That's all. That's, that's it. That's the only thing he really wanted. Everything else is like secondary, right? Because he was even confused himself about a lot of these ideas. Like what does a border wall, what is this, what does citizenship, right? Like really he ran on America should win and Americans need to get

behind that because we don't, billions of people will suffer, right? That's how serious of the mission it is that's random crap around culture wars and things like that like get out of your own head dude it's like there is a there's a serious conflict brewing and we're distracted with the these other little games that are going on uh that people make money on that people are grifters like they just they take money from the pains and sins of our past to try to shame us and to believe in a history that's not true. Like the 1619 Project. It's totally made up.

Like it literally didn't happen, right? And people – that's a New York Times bestseller. It's false history. It's in schools. It's being taught to our kids. It didn't happen. Like it's incredible. It's like – and then you press the you know, the author and people support it.

I'm like, oh, but it's like my experience representation. What does that mean? Like, this is, you're supposed to be a historian. You can't be like, oh, like Saban. It's the girl that has a penis. It's the girl that has a penis. Yeah. Yeah.

Sorry. Low tangent there. No, dude, that was fucking brilliant. The thing with Trump is very interesting that the goal that it should be just to win i was just thinking the other day about how and and i voted for all these people uh clinton and hillary when i used to hear and i remember hearing uh trump's first state of the union and and i didn't vote for him and i hated him when i listened to it and i remember leaving that state of the union thinking wow that was fucking really good i feel really good after listening to that and then i thought back to all the democrats i heard good state of the unions and it was always

like there's problems aids is looming cancer's looming wars there was never um uh go out and seize the day yeah and every time i heard trump give a speech i was like wow i'm motivated to go out and participate and contribute to society and be a better person and to make life better. And then I was like, oh, shit, those people, that's their whole thing to point at the problems, point at the problems and sort of keep this. Yeah. And I've had to put away my – put aside any of my personal beliefs on Trump's mannerisms oh sure his nuances any of those things to realize yeah like i want to be part of the winning team i want that i want to be part of the winning team that has uh morals and values yeah yeah and it's okay if they're higher than

mine even better yeah like you trump has significant moral issues right massive right but all the politicians do he just is open about it everyone else hides it right oh yeah yeah and i just meant and i just meant some of his like behaviors of like the stupid things like when he was in puerto rico and he was shooting three pointers with the paper towels and like i was like judging for that and it's like yeah yeah yeah that that shouldn't that shouldn't have even entered my i've had to rewire myself it it and that's because like the yeah i mean again this is independent of like his own disposition and his own moral standing but like fundamentally that's like what he ran on was that america can do it that was really it

like he can't have a solution he can fix this Right. It's a weird thing that he ran on, which is which he's running on again, which is this like very negative, but then very like optimistic. Right. It's like a weird kind of thing. It's like it's really bad, but we can do it. Right. And then people are like, yes, let's go. Right. Right. And then people are like, yes, let's go. Right. And and that is in the history of like American politics. Trump is very normal, like like Andrew Jackson, JFK, like Teddy Roosevelt. Like these are all expressions of like Andrew Jackson. Did you know he lost his first election? Right. He his supporters viewed it was stolen. And technically it was he the he lost through a congressional compromise because there was stolen. And technically, it was he lost through a congressional compromise, because there was, I think it was three or four states had questionable voting practices. So it was done through a congressional deal. And he lost, even though he actually gained the most electoral votes, but not to become president. So the congressional compromise picked somebody else, and they moved the votes over, and then that became president. So then he runs again, right,

and wins to, in the second, for when the other guy's running for re-election, and then i became president so then he runs again right and wins to uh in the second and uh when the other guy's running for re-election and then he wins and he wins another term right so andrew jackson uh was always the founder of the democrat party uh ran as a populist he ran his core argument was that we should not be run by virginians and new yorkans like you should be run by the average american right uh and it was, he was running against the founding fathers, basically. The idea that like, we should just continue to have this longevity of people who are a connection

to the founding fathers. So the populism strain in America is real. It's just, it's part of like our ethos. I mean, Reagan is another populist president, right? Jimmy Carter, right? Now, the crazy thing about Trump is that he says the quiet part out loud. Right. That's the thing that really bothers people. Right. And it's independent if it's true or not true.

Like, yeah, stop that programmatic in your face. Don't think immoral and just think in objective lens. He says quite famous people can grab pussy. That's the like everyone knows that's true. But I mean, look at Epstein. I mean, I mean, how it's like like like there are there are all these things that like we know kind of internalizing, you know, dialogue or in a private conversation. He says in private, in public. And what's interesting about that is he also did say that in private and it was recorded, which is interesting. Yeah. And but, you know, like, again, I would never say that. Like, I would never say those types of things, even in private. Right. that like i would never say those types of things even in private right but again like all these people are are in mass i mean is for both parties they're all pretty similar shades of morality so like let's not put one above the other right they're all kind of in the same ilk in circles right and now the question is what they do i'm much more interested in that what's the actual

outcomes right and and to a lot of my christian friends uh they view the morality of the individual much higher i don't because there are really great highly moral presidents that i i've studied or i've met that were terrible right one of the greatest examples is jimmy carter great man utterly great man like loves jesus like real christian has spent his whole life after presidency serving other people. Presidency did one really great thing. Firstly, too. Yeah. Everything was disaster. Right. And that one great thing was the peace deal between Egypt and Israel. And then the second was deregulation of the airlines. And so that's terrible. Right. Versus like you have really great presidents right that were moral kind of

shortcomings like like i think lincoln was a great president from a moral perspective kind of debatable if he was a christian i think he's kind of agnostic uh individually with his family like you know abigail's wife was like uh was had lots of mental problems and he his whole like personal life was really depressing like if you read it of the biography and he his whole like personal life was really depressing like if you read it of the biography like he actually was very jovial like he was he was very funny uh he had a very dark sense of humor uh but his like personal life is so depressing and sad you're like how did this guy even like not commit suicide right um and and so i think like this is where the interconnection of like separating out that the moral failings of the individual in elected office, it should be judged independently of like what they actually do, because people are complicated and you have to be you have to be empathetic to that.

Another great example is Thomas Jefferson, my favorite, favorite founding father, not president, Thomas Jefferson is my favorite founding father, but not president. founding father uh not president thomas jefferson he's my favorite founding father but not president but like as an example right do you know the first thing that he ever co-sponsored in the house of virgins in virginia was the freeing of slaves in virginia allowing it to be legal and he owned slaves so how do you square that right people are complicated right people like have have we can't look at the past and just be like injector morality. Right. People are really complicated on what they're trying to do and how what the goals are trying to achieve. He inserted the end of the slave trade and into his letters to his French counterparts in France. He wrote that slavery was the scourge and the original sin of British colonization.

Right. But he owns slaves. Right. was the scourge and the original sin of British colonization, right? But he owned slaves, right? So like, it's super complex, right? So you have to be, as we ourselves are complex, we all have, you know, relationships that have failed, that we made mistakes on. Should we be judged for those mistakes or should we be judged based on the good deeds we do, right? Like people are immensely complex.

And obviously, like, you know, we have, Sivan, you and I have very famous mutual friends. Right. And they're very well known. They have people said lots of really bad things about. And like, I don't judge them for that, because, one, I have been you should go read all the stuff about COVID and me. I mean, I've been called like I mean, I'm literally like half Asian and people will call me a white supremacist to like you know like everything you're not are you no of course not he is Asian you can tell when I smile you can tell

yeah the but you have to be empathetic and like again going back to even the idea of like Christendom and freedom viewing people as humans that we all have shortcomings. We all have made mistakes in relationships. We've all had mistakes in work and statements,

but you have to view them from a whole person perspective. Uh, and, and try to treat them and see them as how I believe as how God sees them. Do you have any blue haired friends? Do you have any, just like crazy, just off the chart?

I have family members. I have family members that were trans forever was cool and i have you know family members that span all sense of the the acronym people um and i don't mean that i don't mean that i don't mean like real things like like do you have any friends who who um they think that they're doing they're basically woke i'm i'm i i don't consider gay people woke i don't consider trans people woke i mean like they think that they're doing something positive for society when they are at root they're demanding that everyone see blacks as inferior but claiming that the world is racist i don't consider them friends i would consider

them buddies or acquaintances that they want to debate me because I can't be a friend with somebody like that. It's a trip. But what about the part that we're supposed to reconcile that stuff? Well, reconciliation doesn't mean you're going to be friends with them again.

It just means like you're coming to terms with what happened and you have an agreement on next steps, right? Restoration would be like returning back to uh original right and and i by the way you know like i had lots of relationships that have been restored and it's a great example of god's grace and the fact that christianity is true uh because we restore based on on christ and not like our own individual sins our own our own strengths and weaknesses um but like like reconciliation like like in the christian theology perspective we are required to forgive people within the church

uh 100 like there's no there's no uh so what you hear if you're a christian tell you they didn't forgive somebody who was also another christian they're they're living in in an unbiblical manner you're supposed to always forgive people right uh who who wrong you. Now, reconciliation is deeply encouraged, but may not happen to people in the church, right? Is forgive different than accept? Is forgive different than accept? Yeah, yeah, absolutely. Yeah, yeah.

So forgiveness would be like- Forgiveness makes me feel like it's still on the books. I don't want anything on the books. No, no, no, it's not on the books. It means that you, like the way I, sorry to be practical, the way that I express forgiveness is I try to want the best for the other person, right? And I let go of like what wrong was done with me. And I give that to God.

And I want God to treat the other person that has wronged me with the maximum grace and love possible so that they have an awesome life, right? And so then the next phase has become the reconciliation. Reconciliation is where you can begin a new relationship. Right. And that's where you come into terms with things like what happened, why this happened, how do you feel, how do I feel? You don't think that there's a self-righteous thing thinking there's a little bit of self-righteousness every time you think someone did you wrong, someone stole your car and you think it's wrong. And there's a little bit of self-righteousness in there because you're claiming that you know what the plan is well therefore you just you should accept instead

of forgive that's what i mean by accept like like for me i don't i don't ever lend anyone anything if you come to my house and you want something you can just have it or you can't or you can't have it or i just tell you no but but i don't because i don't want anything i don't want anything on the books because i feel like that that that takes energy from me like i don't – because I don't want anything on the books because I feel like that takes energy from me. Like I don't – do you know what I'm trying to say here? Like your girlfriend cheats on you, but then it's about you. And at some point, like I get why it stings at first like that, but like an alchemist, you have to like then not forgive her but accept it. Well, acceptance is just the realization of what happened.

It doesn't address justice right because there still has to be justice because she has to be flogged like no like well i guess depends what she did maybe she flogged you you can flog in return right um but you you you want to have a uh from a christian perspective you want to have like a heart uh trying to seek reconciliation and forgiveness um that as soon as possible uh but whether or not you get you know restored is is the question of like do you have a relationship going forward right uh and how about the guy how about the guy who didn't install my shit and i paid him fifteen thousand dollars i don't i don't forgive him or not forgive him i just fucking

accept it and i'm like and i'm not even upset i'm just like wow that was a fucking crazy five-year trip you know like restoration like like um like you and i have multiple examples in our crossfit friend community where the kobe thing was like division right right yeah and reconciliation uh restoration rest uh restoration and um happens when you basically like bring to what happened i'm probably gonna do this today with all my friends that that um we kind of had a a distant period for a year and now we're back engaged with each other uh in terms of like regularly hanging out and i'm gonna have a real conversation with him he also does crossfit uh and be like, Hey dude, we need to reconcile what happened a year and a half ago.

Like I love you as my friend and you're awesome. And I'm happy like we're, we are like hanging out and like good friends again, but I like, we just need to come to terms. Obviously I choose you, right? Like we're literally hanging out again and all this stuff. So, so it's just like what happened? How do we both feel about it? Do we disagree or don't agree? Or sorry, do we disagree or do we agree? Discuss those terms and then move into restoration,

which is just like, what do we do going forward, right? It may not. It may be like, hey, we don't agree. We're at terms. You guys can start fighting again. Yeah. Have you ever been in a fist fight? Yes.

Did you win? Well, I mean, it was in a m fight? Yes. Did you win? Well, I mean, it was in a mosh pit, so I don't remember. Oh, so it was a group fight. Yeah, it was a metal band. How old are you? How old am I right now? I'm 35. Okay.

I thought you were younger. Yeah, it's the Asian. God, I wish I was Asian. You don't have any gray hair yet, Aaron? I have a little bit. Statistically, Asians start graying late 30s. So I sort of get a little bit gray. Thanks for coming on, dude.

You're fucking awesome. I really appreciate it. No, I appreciate it, man. I'm actually happy we didn't talk about AI because this other stuff is more fun. Yeah, it it it's it's nuts it's uh you can't be pigeonholed you can't be um well i'll pigeonhole him you can't you can't actually i can't i don't think i can you can't be you're right do you know what you have to live more than me for sure you ever seen lord of the rings of course yeah yeah carry on. There's this – you have some ideas that require – so let's say a painting is on a postcard, and it's four by six inches.

You have some ideas that require big canvases, and it's interesting to watch the comments who who will tolerate that and who won't. Right. Like some people just want to be told, hey, I can't think of an example off the top of my head. But anyway, I appreciate your ability to really. For people who have the attention span to paint a full picture and to give lots of data points and different historical stories, anecdotal stories, uh, new words, new signposts to point at your ideas.

I mean, it's, you're a fucking so cool. No, I appreciate it, man. Like, like my,

I've given my heart to, uh, trying to, I don't remember where it'd be like, um, I, I, I guess the remember where it'd be like, um, I guess the way I would conclude with this is that, uh, at the, at the end of my life, when I go home to heaven, I just want God to say faithful, good, good and faithful servant. Right. And that doesn't,

that means living the life that God has designed for me. And, and that's not the life that everyone has. And so like, you know, God's put every single person on their own journey. And something I believe is you like it, your life will become a painting if infinitely more colorful, creative and beautiful when you let God paint it for you. And that means different moments in life that could be really challenging. And he's wearing, it's true.

And that's the proof that you're not married. Not married, no. Dating, but not married. Yes, dating, but not married. So, although, I mean, whatever. I know lots of people who were backwards. Did you go to Catholic school? No, no. i grew up uh

secular humanists and went to public school and then i became agnostic when i was like 16 ish and then i became christian late 17 ish 18 uh and my family is uh i'm the only christian in my entire entire family so all cousins and stuff like that. So maybe one or two, maybe, but like if you're kind of a maybe as a Christian, you're probably not a Christian. So I – What's something – what would you recommend for Christians or non-Christians alike to understand the importance between liberty, the fabric, the foundation of this country and christianity and why it's so important that uh it stays together regardless if you're christian or not it's like yo don't don't don't don't uh throw the baby out with the bathwater like it doesn't

matter that you're not christian you don't have to oppose it or hate it uh probably so there's there are two books i'd recommend so one would be uh why the west won which is written by an atheist uh an atheist historian who basically describes the uh the arc of science culture art and why christendom was very unique to create free society. Probably the other one. I don't know. I see it. Yeah. I think the rise and triumph of the modern self is amazing.

Wait. Say that again. Say that again. The rise and triumph of the modern self. The rise and triumph of the modern self. I think it's just – Let me see the Modern Self. Let me make sure I'm saying it right. It's by Carl...

Yeah, The Rise of the Modern Self. Yeah. Carl who? Let's see. Just Carl. He's got one name. Yeah, he doesn't have a... Carl Truman and Rod Dreher. Or no, Rod Rutherford. So it's got one name. Yeah, yeah. He doesn't have a – Carl Truman and Rod Dreher.

Or no, Rod Rutherford. So it's just Carl Truman. It outlines so much of what has caused our current social situation. Then I would probably do – let me see. So I'd say those two and then i'm looking at my library right now um oh yeah okay one more so do um the gerard reader renee gerard renee gerard all right yeah good stuff i yeah that that's he's a catholic uh Gerard. Rene Gerard. All right. Yeah. Good stuff. Yeah.

That that's, he's a Catholic, uh, uh, sociologist that's taught at Stanford. He does scapegoat theory and scapegoat theory kind of explains most of our psychological patterns in our society now. Um, and he actually is the guy that,

that persuaded Peter Thiel, one of the most famous venture capitalists in the world, to become a Christian. And the Girard reader is so amazing because it discusses these behaviors that we victimize, we blame, we create scapegoats, we try to create unity around scapegoats and that that creates this massive self-destructive pattern um and victimization culture to hurting people who are like uh hurting people who we love uh because we're trying to create new unity between people and scapegoating them right uh and uh probably anything by thomas soul as well oh white white rednecks black black liberals is my favorite uh such an amazing book such an amazing book say the name of that book again is that why red oh yeah yeah yeah i i was just i haven't read that book but i was just listening to a lecture on his about um uh

about redneck culture and about how God it's so good. And he's great. Uh, C. S. Lewis would be a boy boy to the Dawn shredder. I would say my favorite C. S. Lewis is silver chair.

Why don't which in the wardrobe? Uh, no, I would say you can find Aaron on on substack do people actually use substack i mean huge yeah is it big uh i'll probably say i probably say the abolition of man by c.s lewis and then his his his letters about his friendship with with the token are which is in manifesto and friendship um his, his letter on friendship, which I think is called the whole book's called four loves, I think is incredible. Uh, his, his stuff on relationships is, is, is great. Um,

so sub stack pulled, did they pull down? Oh no, it was medium who pulled down your article. Why do you write? Sorry. I want, I'm going to let you go, but why do you write, um, or discipline or what? Why do you write? No, i'm gonna let you go but why do you write um or discipline or what why do you write no it's usually for yeah it's it's it's internal dialogue to um it helps a lot of my friends so example like the the first uh the manifesto on friendship uh it actually got around as i was texting you about it got around on fox news yeah and some people reached out to me saying it's immensely meaningful to me saying,

it's immensely meaningful to me. It's beautiful. It's like, it's like this is the most beautiful things I've read in a long time. This makes so much sense for the nice guy stuff. I've had people like come up to me randomly and be like, Hey, I follow you. And I'm like, Oh, I'm not sure. And they're like, like I read your nice guy thing. And I'm like, Oh, it's great. And they're like, yeah, it like changed my my life like i was just realizing how much identity i was finding and improving from other people and they feel liberated right and and so that's been the motivation for me to like continue writing some of the stuff is that um like like the covid thing like i wrote that article

and then it was wild like greg reaches out to me i'm like holy crap greg just reached out to me right and i was just doing it. I was just doing it for my friends. Like they were like, hey, put this on Medium. I was like, okay. So I did. I was writing it, just sharing on Google Docs and stuff. And so the nice guy thing, the friendship thing,

by coming out one on Jesus wasn't nice. I'm working on nice guy in relationships. That's going to be really brutal. That's going to be really hard for people to read. and this is just all stuff that like either i've gone through or like i'm just personally interested passionate about nice guy in relationships like uh uh like relationships like uh intimate relationships like nice guys and like men women relationships yeah nice guys get fucked yeah and i mean i don't mean that metaphorically either or well i don't mean that literally i don't mean that literally i mean and and and the the problem right with nice guys is that in relationships

right is that they don't view themselves as responsible and that's ultimately the fix to all the all the problems it's like you are responsible for the situation because you can't stop it you have to take control right um and and also to like like I'm going to write something probably on narcissism probably pretty soon. Are you going to have kids, you think? Yeah, hopefully. Yeah, that's the goal. But in the meantime, another, not to go on another tangent before I conclude. So if you want to know, yeah, of course I have. I have. Yeah. Like I know, I know Oz personally.

Yeah. He's an amazing man. He's great. So actually it's all connected. Oh my gosh. That's great. Great conclusion. So Oz Guinness was discipled by a guy named Francis Schaeffer. Francis Schaeffer changed my life. He wrote a book called Christian Manifesto, and he built this kind of commune thing called Labrie. Labrie means shelter in French. He built in the Swiss Alps, and he discipled Askenes. Christendom forever. Almost every major Christian theologian has had some connection to Francis Schaeffer. And what he did at LaBrie was

very simple, but also immensely profound, is people could come stay there for as long as they wanted, be discipled by him and his wife. They just lived on the farm and lived in this house, and they invested in them. So that's what I do until I'm married, is

that I built this house. And on the front range, my window right here faces the mountains. Dudes come here, get disciples, help turn boys into men, and invest in them, help them in their life, help them get married, help them work through their problems. And I love it. Was that the goal when you built that place there? That's the place I visited you at, right? Yeah, that was the goal, yeah. I didn't know that.

And so my heart's for good men to rise up in society and for women to have good men to marry and to make generation after generation and start rebuilding what's gone wrong in our society. what's gone wrong in our society. So I feel blessed to have, you know, over a hundred men now, I have a list of a hundred men that like I've impacted and that have, you know, of course the writings and all that stuff is great too. And I'm deeply thankful for that. But these individual, you know, lives that have had their trajectory shifted and, and, and I save messages, right. I have messages from people who like, you know, walked away from our friendship or something like that. And they came back like

a year later and were apologetic and, and saw what I was trying to do and help them in their life. And I save all those, right. Because, you know, we may not be friends with them going forward, but they, but they, for example, for one of them, he rebels against everything that I taught him. But I introduced him to a girl i was dating uh and i said hey you know we're not gonna work out because my life i just want to have a different life than you do but i introduced them to each other and when they got married they like she thanked me she sent me a letter she's thanked me for helping make him a man wow wow he messaged me and they have four kids now. Wow.

He's running a business. Another guy. Can you hold on one second? I'm sorry. I'm sorry. This is a weird show. Luke, go ahead. Sorry.

What's the problem? What's the problem? Go ahead. I'm just at the park right now. I had a lesson at 930. Okay. But the power wash takes a whole park.

So my box is soaked right now. Okay. Let's pivot. Let's pivot. Okay. Let's pivot. Let's pivot. I have. I have. Hey, could I call you? Could I call you like in 10 minutes? Okay. Okay. I love you. Peace and love. Well, yeah.

Skateboarding instructor for the kids 1030 class. Sorry. It's a weird show, Aaron. I'm telling you. It, yeah. Anyway. Skateboarding instructor. Sorry. Skateboarding instructor for the kids, 1030 class. Sorry. It's a weird show, Aaron. I'm telling you. It's a weird show. Is that why Greg built a half pipe? It was for you to come over?

I hope so. I hope that's why. Yeah. So that's incredible that the guy's wife called you. Yeah. There was another couple that he was my best friend, and he ended up being addicted to all sorts of nefarious sexual things and drugs yeah and so i had to take away his car and his credit card at the wish of his parents and his pastor destroyed our entire friendship uh because he was dependent

on me to do everything and then uh then he eventually moved out he recovered moved on his way we didn't talk various sex stuff yeah and then he uh two three years later he gets married and his his wife get they honor me at their wedding i wasn't gonna go and then my friends encouraged me to go so i did because i haven't talked to them really in years and then they acknowledged me at the wedding saying that like i sacrificed for them that created this pathway and they have three kids now. And yeah, that's, and in the Christian context, it gives me a little choked up in the Christian context.

Like that's what it's about. Right. It's just impacting people individually and being like an actual individual hand of God's in his life. And that may mean something that secularly wise, you know, don't prefer like breaking ties and things like that. But at the end of the day, the ultimate goal is to redeem this world and to help people and to love on them so that they can be a faithful steward of what they've been given. And that's, that's the goal, right? And so, so, you know, in terms of like, yeah, me, me being being married, although, you know, whoever said that's like I date plenty of times. So I would say that I just have a very particular way I want to live my life and invest my resources.

And that's a very externalized thing. Like I want to I want to in the street. I'm on the face of this mountain. Right. That you've been to. Like, I want to buy all the houses in the street, rebuild them, give them to my friends and build like a little, you know, subdivision. Right. And, and like have shared space, like go basketball hoop in the court, basketball hoop. Yeah. Like, you know, and know each other, right. And be in each other's lives and, uh, and like live together because life, life is really, really hard and it's super messy. And people who stay attached to us through that, uh, just as Jesus did, right? Like what, what, what did you say is the ultimate expression of love that a man would sacrifice for his friends, like John five.

So like that expression of generosity and love is both may come full circle is both the expression of like, what can make a free society and what stabilizes a free society. The second is, is, is that power is completely lost in our civilization. And if we just return back to that being like, like what you did with Greg, right.

Which is an amazing story, right. It inspires people, right. Because, because that, that band of brothers thing that exists in all of our hearts, right.

Is there. And it's, he did for me, he let me live at his house rent free. So maybe he did it for me. Yeah. Yeah. But even, I mean, you know what he's building now, right. Yeah.

In Phoenix, you're like, and his current house, which is incredible. It's like amazing. And he's like, this is just my guest house. I was like, right. This is a fricking like, it's not a guest house, but, but he just, he's so generous. Right. He's just so open and like wanting people in his life.

And I remember when he was consolidating, he was like, you want this truck? I was like, Greg, don't give me a truck. I don't want a truck from you, right? Right. I just want to be friends with you. And like, but like that, but that heart is like missing in our society. That it's just like, you know, just, this is just grace. Like, like love it.

Like there's no, there's no requirement here. There's no obligation. It's just love and, and just take it, you know? And, and those strong ties I think could really rescue our civilization and rescue men from, you know, darkness, nice guy syndrome, appeasement, self-effacing, like self-isolation. It's just that, and, and they'll experience this liberation, like courage, like the Tyler Durden thing. Like they'll experience this new self, this confidence to be the man that they, that God wants them to be. And it's incredible. And that, and that, that journey,

seeing so many men, so many couples, like I, I, I've discipled, I think, I don't know, 15 married couples and remarried about four or five people who are divorced is is awesome. It's just so great. And like whatever company I build, whatever, you know, I'm on my fourth company. I'm very blessed with that. I love being an entrepreneur. But it's all with the arc of using my resources to like love on people that they may experience and encounter Jesus in a way that they, that the Samaritan at the well, that this love and tenderness that, you know, still imperfect because I'm not Christ, still make mistakes, still say sorry. Pastor Jen, Pastor Jen.

Yeah. Yeah. Still say sorry. But, but that, that we need, we need more sorries, more love, more grace, but also more truth and more principles and more kindness. Right. So all of that together, not just more anger and more principles and more kindness. Right. So all of that together, not just more anger and hate and division and all that stuff. So. Awesome. Hey, you're welcome on the show anytime. Thank you so much, dude. Yeah. Thanks. Thanks guys. Have a good day. I look forward to running into you soon.

Nice to meet you. Yeah. Yeah. Nice meeting you too. See ya. Bye. So I liked it in the beginning when people were just fucking trying to psychoanalyze you and you had to like, and you had to put a stop to that. I'm just sitting there soaking it up, dude. He's got, he's got many words. So many good ideas. He's he's he's what i see him just connecting connecting dots do you is that what you see him doing yeah oh yeah like you he's a connector he just does it with a different uh canvas yeah different data points more broad

i like the house of men paulina that was cool is paulina coming paulina are you coming are we gonna see hillary i'm gonna see you this weekend are you coming out paulina i got a notification on this computer that tomorrow is the first day of lg t q b plus day oh is that a text that's probably like a default check your text i just sent you a picture thank you great that's probably on every everyone who owns an apple phone that probably popped up on it today i thought that you actually put that into your computer just so you were aware and i'm like dude your computer's telling me your schedule i don't even want christmas in there i don't want a birthday in there.

I don't want any of that shit in there. I just need to know who's coming on the podcast and at what time. You sound like Alexis. Okay. I'm going to call the skateboarding instructor. Do you care if I do that? No. Let me see what's going on.

I have to pee so bad. Do you guys want to hear this or should I just end the show? Hold on. I was calling calling you that was my sister don't don't be nosy okay what do you mean i heard it oh oh shit uh okay here it is this guy's the best fucking skateboard instructor my man my man good morning hi good morning uh we're live on my podcast just so you know oh for sure i had a i had a guest on and you called and i and i interrupted the whole show no it's not your bad at all it's it's my love for you it's the importance of you are in in my life and in my kids' life. My man, dude. I appreciate you immensely. I was just letting you know the Mike Fox city

is power washing it right now. So the park is like half soaked. So if you would like to switch the parks up or whatever works really well. Or bring our surfboards. If it's wet.

I do not have my surfboard. Hey, okay, so should we just go, should we just meet up at Scotts Valley at 1030? Derby, do you want to start with Derby? Do you want to start with Derby? We could do Derby. I'm down, dude. I'm going to be there, so if you guys want to try it out.

You'll be there at 1030? Yeah, I'll be there. Okay, we'll do Derby at 1030? Yeah, I'll be there. Okay. We'll do Derby at 1030, and then we'll go grab a quick bite to eat after, and then maybe go. Are you free? Do you have a couple hours for a big posse? Yeah, it should be good.

My next lesson's at 2. Okay, cool. All right. I'm going to call Greg and see if I'm going to drag his kids up there too. Perfect, dude. Okay. I'll be in touch. I'll text you, and I'll see you at Derby at 1030. Perfect. Thanks, Yvonne. All right. Later, dude. Okay. I'll be in touch. I'll text you, and I'll see you at Derby at 1030.

Perfect. Thanks, Yvonne. All right. Later, brother. A Derby that you might want to come out there, even if you drive yourself, Hiller, and see that. I think it's the oldest skate park in the country. No shit.

Seve, if you'd like, I'll call from the Isle of Man next week. Let me know. Oh, dude. Any time, if you were at the Isle of Man next week. Let me know. Oh, dude. Any time if you were at the Isle of Man and we were live, I would interrupt any guest to fucking send you a link and fucking watch the motorcycles blow by, dude. That would be

fucking awesome. And bring if you do that, bring some AirPods or something, Jake. So we can hear you good. I'd love to ask you some questions about that. Fucking psychos. Your whole island is fucking crazy you know about that that the isle of man oh yeah oh yeah oh yeah nuts right i think you talk about it more regularly than any other topic on the show good i don't want anyone to think i'm a

pervert who's the athlete that's affiliated out of there the female athlete dude uh amy kringle uh vindicate vndk8.com step on your kids ceo shirts are now available in case you missed last night dude first of all i did miss it second of all hillar was there when the package got opened that you sent my kids the kids went they were they were crazy dude it was nuts it was nuts they're they're full uh they're fully into the uh ceo brand they um they fucking love that shit they love that shit god okay uh vindicated peril uh partners heller collection seven pot wow look at all these other people you have now Coffee Pod You're working with Pedro Pedro

I think that's Dave You're working I really want to click this I'm podcasting I'm podcasting Who is that? I can't tell you. They probably don't want anyone to know that they call me.

Got it. I'm going to go with Sevan Podcast. Wait, why? Look at this bullshit. Yours is called the Hiller Collection, and the rest of us are just douchebags. Yours has the word collection. That kind of puts you like...

I was the OG. I got the top of the list. Yeah, and what's this? He was making shirts with you before me. Are you kidding me? Yeah, I'm kidding you. No rep shirt. I think I introduced you to... Travis? Yeah.

All right, fine. I think. Fine. Yeah, I yeah all right i think fine yeah i totally did fine fine fine come on man you had that you had what's the the other come as rx remember and i was like oh yeah this guy's way better i still have as rx well i don't see the kid shirt on here travis travis that's a tank top. Oh, here we go. Is that Travis? Oh, shit. I'm disconnected.

Hold on. Let me Bluetooth you up, Travis. Hold on. God, I have to pee so bad. Oh, it says I'm connected. Oh, man. I'm going to turn. Can you hear me?

Yeah, but no one else can. Hold on. I'm hooking you up right now hello check check one two check check one two wait wait oh it's so bad

jeez disconnect can Hitler hear you no I don't know can you guys hear him bad. Disconnect. No, I don't know. Can you guys hear him? I mean, barely. They said barely. Hold on.

I know this is he refers to me as a day now because I am not a man. This is the day. This is the amateur hour for sure. My pronoun is now day. Okay, I'm going to turn Bluetooth off. Turn bluetooth off turn it back on connect okay here we go this has got it um oh fuck nope i don't i don't know what the fuck's going on. I don't even have the option. Hey, let me call you back. Let me see what happens.

What the fuck is going on here? Nope. I don't know shit. Okay. I just have to take what the fuck is going on. The yellow phone. Okay, go ahead. It's not working, but go ahead. I have you. working but go ahead i have you okay go ahead so what's up i just wanted to find out if hillary was present when you opened up that photo i sent you last night yeah wait photo the photo the photo the photo oh of the uh the clothing line of your new one the one of one oh no no no no I haven't shown that to anyone

nope I haven't shown that to anyone I will show it to him though that's a good idea I forgot and I don't remember what if it was the cart or the horse that came first when it was Hiller and you shut the fuck up damn Hiller's losing his shit

I don't speak things like that unless I know that it's a fact. He swore at you. Travis. I'm pretty sure. He can't hear you. Yes, yes. I did your shirts first, but I used them on first. Knowing of him doesn't mean that you had any contact with him

slash did any of his apparel before it. That was the topic of discussion, homie. You can't hear me. He can't hear you. I'm just raging over here. That's the angriest I've ever heard, Hiller. He's fucking losing his shit. I'm still trying to...

Don't tell me I'm wrong. I'm trying to... You probably knew him. That's fair. If you knew him, that's probably right. I'm going to have to reset the whole phone. I was talking shit about you. Oh, that's fair right. I'm going to have to reset the whole phone. I was talking shit about you. Oh, that's fair, too.

To Savon, before you two were even in cahoots. Oh, good. Mm-hmm. How did you start doing the apparel? Which ones? The Savon podcast. Oh, that was definitely through you. That's what I'm talking about.

Yeah, yeah. All right, rage switch off. Yeah, yeah. All right. Rage switch off. Rage done. All right. Sorry. I've been hanging up on you, Travis, not because of you, but because I just can't hold this phone like this anymore. Okay, bye.

Jessica, that's on my own show. I'm losing my shit. Why do I buy the new shit and then it doesn't even work? I turned the phone off. I'm going to gonna reset the whole phone i don't know if i've clarified that though yeah i don't swear on my youtube channel you do the video i made of you today you're swearing on it i don't even know if i should i don't even know if i should go over to your i should not go to your channel for a month a month i think you're gonna love it i am spicy suza was good yesterday too i was i've never seen him like that ever could you tell could you tell i was drunk yesterday

when i came home if you wouldn't if i didn't know i don't think i would have known right but because i knew there i mean you were just five percent altered which isn't crazy i know people when they drink they become 100 altered i was fucked up i'm going over to your youtube station cool killer hey dude you see how that that hotel thing is fucking brilliant i really do need to send that to him you know what i am going to send that to him i'm going to play this really quick i'm gonna uh aaron jen i think it starts at what uh i'm actually unsure 105 start this at 105 i'm gonna tell him start this start at 105 to see so so basically some of you may not be as impressed with it as i am but i'm so impressed because it's an amazing kind of conflict resolution. And by the way, if anyone wants to like embark on the journey of what Aaron's talking about,

just start saying no to things that you really mean no to that you don't mean yes to. For instance, hey, can I borrow your car? No, you can't borrow my car. Or just tell the truth about things that you normally tell white lies about. Just stop doing that. Like when you get when you get out, when you're on the phone with Hillary and you want to get off the phone, don't be like, oh, my kids are calling me. be like okay i'll talk to you later what if you say no to everything and you've got to also say yes sometimes there's those people too they're too comfortable saying no to everything oh sure sure okay but i'm just talking about the nice guy phenomenon particularly just the nice

the nice guy uh you mean like me like how i just don't want to go anywhere like no and yeah oh god my bladder might pop i might not make it yeah dude i never had to go to the bathroom that bad i bumped do you go just around the corner over there i just go in the in the in the grass right there i ran. That's cool. Someone wrote, Seve's way more fit than I thought. Jesus criminy. Dude, are you going to pull it up or what?

I'm just staring at you. I'm a new man these days? No, I don't want anyone to know I read the comments. You guys are out of your fucking mind. Are you kidding me? Dude, pull that up. I know he was hurting, but that was impressive. What? What? you guys would what the fuck do you guys think i did what i do that editing is a mess as oh you made me look special no i mean you well yeah i don't know you did well i tell you the

truth so you can go over and watch that you can watch over oh you put troy in there yeah you love that movie i love that movie yeah come on man god you're dude play the intro you're gonna you're this is like an armada god you're such a good dude play the intro i cannot fucking believe play like the first bit this is so fun this is a fucking great week i hate having people at my house this is so fun my brothers of the sword rather fight beside you than any army of thousands let no man forget how menacing we are we are lions i think it's gonna take me 20 minutes i look like brad pitt right there we are lions i think it's gonna yeah look at me looking out

at the sea at the big ships coming to war within context i think that's funnier though because it's like what no one forget how menacing you are you are lions this is gonna take me 20 minutes dude it's supposed to take you 10 and less he basically guys listen before anyone starts fucking getting all thinking i'm cool that that workout was supposed to take less than 10 minutes and i said it'd take 20, so he basically cut the workout in half. He basically took off the last 27 reps. Not a half. A half.

Two-thirds. That's enough of that. Worst movie speech ever. Oh, shut it. Get out of your pool. That is not correct. I can find a worse one. I just got to think a little bit harder.

I love that. You ever seen Abraham Lincoln Vampire Slayer? Is that Quentin Tarantino? No, I don't believe so. But I do know that there's a pretty bad speech that people think is decent. I really want to connect this roadcaster up. I want to try it one more time. Let me see if I can.

Troy is a great movie. I think it's pretty underrated. Can you hear that? Very slightly. Oh, damn. I might be able to hear just because you're over there. God damn it. All right.

Well, the phone's completely fucked now. I guess I have to turn the roadcaster off, too. Oh, Bram Stoker's Dracula. Oh, Keanu Reeves. Oh, I really like really like that movie though i really like keanu reeves i gotta watch constantine that's one i know is going to be good but i've never seen it mostly because i've heard everyone just talk highly of it hey again already watched it and loves it he said that guy is a man beast yeah cool yeah how you handled that dude i was gonna sign up for man school but now i don't need to

it's so it's so good all right i want to pee and and uh get ready what are you gonna do today you're gonna come to the old escape park or you need to edit some videos or what are you doing i'm actually kalipa invited me over at 3 30 oh i was gonna ask if you wanted to go but we haven't had a second yet no no no you don't want to go no no no no you go are you going over the hill wherever the hell that is i don't know i don't know where anything is i just said yes i'm coming okay um how far away is that the problem problem is, is coming back. Why?

It's the same way, isn't it? Like a, no, because you're going to come. So all portal, you're going to be going, you're just going to be going with traffic.

It's going to be coming back. Oh, I like traffic. I can just listen to more stuff on the phone. Okay, fine. All right, everyone.

Uh, stay two of Hiller week. Um, uh, look, pool boy. Yeah week look pool boy yeah 40 minutes there 90 minutes back that's fine and I will see you guys I don't know what's going on tomorrow

but it is Hiller week I would love to have you on tomorrow too if you'll have me I'll have you tomorrow's thursday oh wait do i have any more shows tonight no no show tonight uh tomorrow is oh tomorrow's jen thompson she holds the world record for bench press natural done yeah she's cool that's cool okay i have to listen to a podcast with her and get caught up on her in order to watch the show

you can't wear a shirt anybody heidi that means you definitely means you hide it and then and then it looks like oh shit let me see let me call oh i can't call anyone on my phone i want to call jr and taylor and see if they're doing the show tonight dude there's this one guy in the comment section you ever see i wonder if I can find this I'm just going to do this I'm turning off the turn off I just turned off the roadcaster can anyone

can you Can you hear anything? Everything's rebooting. Oh, I'll unmute Hiller too. I can't hear anything. Look at, how's that? Now there's two Hillers. Oh, I can't even unmute you. Two Hillers. Echo. You guys hear an echo. All right. How's that better? Are we back on? I can hear you now. We're good.

You guys can hear now? Tin can? Everything good? All right. Here, there's this guy in the comment section. Whoever did my seed, this is what I think of. No, I think we're back up. You guys can hear us now. Terrible audio, though. What are you talking about? Hold on.

Audio. Oh, okay. Okay, I see. I see what's going on. Hold on. Better? Are we back? Are we back?

Okay, here we go. A quick reboot. Do you see this? Malcolm McDowell. I got to see if I can find the guy who comments. Is Malcolm McDowell from behind the orange, Clockwork Orange? Is that Malcolm McDowell? I don't have an answer for you there.

Have you seen that movie, Clockwork Orange? Mm-mm. Hitler. There it is, David. Andrew. Whenever I see David, this is what I think of. Oh, wow. And then Michael Myers and the Rob Zombie Halloween from 2007.

God, we went from God to devil's eyes. Come on, guys. Everyone can see this, right? Okay. David, that's where you pulled that picture from. Bluetooth. I've never seen that movie, Clockwork Orange. When was it made? The 70s? You tried to show me some comedian.

Clockwork Orange? You have to see that. In a leather jacket. It's like everyone knows. Oh, I tried to. He'd never heard of Andrew Dice Clay. Can you guys believe that? Can you hear that leather jacket. It's like everyone knows. Oh, I tried to, he'd, he'd never heard of Andrew dice clay. Can you guys believe that? Can you, can you hear that? Yes.

Oh, that's awesome. Okay. I'm going to, let me see. Should I call Jr. Taylor to find out if they're doing the show today? Oh,

they're doing one tonight. I want them to, I want them to do the, um, I'd say call Taylor Taylor. Mm. Why, why Taylor? I was going to call jr but i'm gonna call

taylor now because you said that taylor self that's why i said call taylor taylor's gonna be busy he won't answer taylor's pooping oh dude human centipede we should watch that no thank you i saw the trailer almost fucking. We're going to have a camera pointed at us, and we're going to watch it and just live react to the whole thing. It would be great. I don't know why it's not calling. It says it's calling. Oh, maybe Taylor didn't pay his phone bill.

That's the first thing you thought of, eh? Not the roadcaster still busted no oh hello hello oh my god are you fucking kidding me I think this wasn't happening yesterday with Gazanon

but you can hear this yes I don't think this wasn't happening yesterday with Gazanon. But you can hear this? Yes, I can. Okay, I'm going to try calling now. There's a third Clockwork Orange that I need to watch, or the third Human Centipede, Jake. Because I've seen that one too, it's decent. They're all good. J.R. Howell.

Yes, Ken. Yes, Ken. They're probably not answering his phone because they don't recognize the number. Oh, here we go. There it is. Dude, all the human centipedes are worth watching. We should have a human centipede marathon. That's the one, Jake.

I've seen it. Don't worry. Oh, it's fucking gross. Trash. I've seen that video. I've seen it don't worry oh it's fucking gross the trash I've seen that video I've never seen the original then only the sequel like it's just how did that get to be a movie it's a fascinating concept

what the human centipede oh shit did he answer or was that his fucking cell was that his answering machine son of a bitch now there's complaints that the phone is too loud couldn't hear no it's too loud how's that better you can do that that's better let me see i couldn't tell if that was his answering machine or if he answered the human centiped eric i know crickets is his answer machine or if he answered. The human sent iPad, Eric?

I know. Crickets? We should call Brian. Oh, I have to teach Sousa this. Instead of stopping the sound effects, he needs to just lower them slowly. You ever seen this movie? This is a good sound effect.

Hey, and by the way, Pool Boy, it's not called Walrus. It's called Tusk, and I've seen it. If it's what I'm thinking about, Jake. Dude, the movie Tusk and I've seen it if it's what I'm thinking about Jake dude the movie Tusk is legit tell me if that's the one you're thinking about Mike nope it's called Tusk I love that

you tried to tell me to watch a movie and I've actually seen the one and you got the name wrong. I have to call. Oh, shit. My sister just sent a text to the family. Have you seen this video? And it's your fucking video of me. Yeah. Just crying out loud.

Dude, you would love the movie Tusk. Me? Yeah, but I don't think the boys can watch it. It might mess them up a little bit. I would not leave that room the same if I watched that at their age. Oh, man. Well. Should we tell them the story about poker?

well should we tell them the story about poker remember how uh there's a freak out at the the you can't do that at the poker table and just a mental breakdown i was like whoa i'd like to hear your rendition of it go ahead uh that was joseph right ari ari we're sitting there and i think it was he was looking at cards wasn't it something was happening or he was reaching across the table he slapped avi oh he slapped avi in the middle of a poker game seven walks up he goes dude you can't do that the poker table you're gonna get shot and his entire face washes over and you i'm gonna get shot like it was a real thing like like i was sitting there with a gun and i was gonna pop him and he he just couldn't like reconcile the fact that he was not gonna get shot and i went oh this is what it's like

to be a kid and just not know the difference between a figure of speech and reality he had a fucking complete meltdown he started crying he met i had to i had to hold him yeah yeah i mean is someone gonna shoot me i'm like no he walked in he like jumped on her well i'm gonna get shot dude you're not gonna get shot it's okay just don't smack people at the poker table you guys how are these people not sponsoring me? My toes feel totally different after two hours of wearing these. Totally. Yeah, I wore those when I recorded in here, too. You did?

Hey, what do you think about that? Should he be wearing? Should you be sharing? I don't think anyone should show my toes. Should share toe spacers. Toenails falling off and shit. Okay. I have to poop now too.

My shit's all fucking... You're going to pop over there. My shit's in movement. Yeah, I'm dancing. Okay, got the phone fixed. You know, this wall's kind of nice. I leaned against it a little bit. It's pretty soft.

I guess I could call... Let me call JR on this phone and see if he answers. When you look at this on the internet, you think that this is a little bit tougher than it is. It's just foam. It's nice.

It's to make your voice sound deep. I tried to order more and I... Just go to Home Depot, dude. No, it's special. It's like sticky on the other side. I can just stick it on the wall. I got glue.

I want to get some colored red and blue. That'll be cool. Different colored. That will be cool. To meet the DEI requirements. Yeah, a red one, a yellow one, a purple one, green, orange. Hey, this is Taylor. God, you guys suck cock.

It went from them asking me if they could do shows to me asking them if they could do shows. That was quick. Wasn't it one show they did? Two. They've done two. It's like, don't you think they should do a show tonight giving advice to the... It should be just to speak giving advice to the Euros. How to compete this week.

Oh, my toes feel so good. Toe spacers. Why Daniel Brandon's so hot? Because of the toe spacers? Yeah. Oh, God. Oh, my God. Okay, fuck you guys.

Thank you, Aaron Ginn, Andrew Hiller. We'll see you guys uh thank you Aaron Ginn Andrew Hiller we'll see you guys uh tomorrow buh-bye