The Sevan Podcast - BREAKING NEWS ON LAZAR INVESTIGATION AND CROSSFIT GAMES

Episode Date: November 20, 2024

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BAM we're live. Welcome to the CrossFit Games Update Show breaking news. It's gonna be fun. Looks like the game season, the games team is up and running. Looks like there's gonna be a series of announcements. The first one just came out today. The title of the article on the CrossFit Games website is Safety and Procedural Changes After the 2024 CrossFit Games. Of course you can go to the barbell spin. Brian Spin is here to get all the updates and conversation around the announcement. Andrew Hiller from HillerFit is here. Matt Sousa, executive producer of the Sevon podcast has his own show on

Tuesdays and owner of CrossFit Livermore and the curator on the school SKOOL website of the what's turning out to be the greatest kind of curation and culmination and a bucket of affiliate resources from business to marketing to training to all all the aspects of running a gym. All right, so a lot of people have been waiting for this in the immediate aftermath of the 2024 CrossFit Games in August, CrossFit engaged a third-party investigation team to investigate the facts surrounding Lazar's death

on August 8th, 2024. Is this a press release, the format spin when you look at it? It looks like it for sure. I have not received anything, but maybe I don't get up their emails after yesterday. Let's just start really big picture. Why release this? So there's a sporting event, an athlete dies, and CrossFit is doing an investigation. Any thoughts on why it's important to share anything with the public moving forward? Because they were demanded to. Does anyone in the public really like, does anyone in the public really care? Or is it just the, is it just the media cares? Like at the end of the day, who, who cares?

Who's, who's reading this? Is this going to be, is this going to get a lot of clicks? Is this something that's popular? It's definitely popular. Yeah. Yeah. So you're gonna get a lot of clicks and I'm not sure that's why they're doing it. And it's definitely gonna get a lot of clicks. And I'm not sure that's why they're doing it. Don said it.

That's a good point. That's a good point, and it's gonna get a lot of clicks, but you're not sure if that's why they're doing it. Go ahead, Spinn. Don said, he brought it up to himself as like, we're gonna be transparent and share everything with you. And kind of backed himself into a quarter of having to share something.

AnthonyCPA, John Young is the ugliest uggo commentator ever. Uggo? I don't know what that is. Underground Grid League. United. United. Underground. I like uggo better. So they made a... you're saying that like after Lazar died That in Dawn statement spin he let the community know or let the athletes know or somehow made some

Proclamations like hey, just so you know, we're gonna keep you guys up to date On what's going on? Yes. Yep. No, he said full transparency keep us updated throughout Not sure that was fully the case, but we have some answers. And then amongst us, we've known since the beginning that they can't possibly be fully transparent for a variety of reasons. Suzy, do you want to talk about that? Why full transparency would be impossible? Yeah, because I mean, there's still legal stuff pending. There's protection of privacy for the family.

There's all sorts of different things that'll, that'll happen, but it just kind of denotes the reactionary response from leadership at HQ. Everything seems to be reactionary. It doesn't really seem to be a plan or leadership. And they obviously don't want to incriminate themselves. Right. Even if they're not guilty, or even if they are guilty, it's the everything you say can and will be used against you.

And why would they pay for an investigation and share it? Like I don't, I don't see. I don't see any reason. You're done by the border control. Isn't that the, is the sponsor, are they even paying for it? Is it free? No, no. It's part of the sponsor package, third-party investigation for all tragedies

Alright I'm not gonna go through this whole thing But basically it's here for anyone who wants to read the entire thing. It says cross the I do want to share Oh, yeah. Yeah, sure. I'll pull it up. Okay. You got it. Here's the article from the game site. All right. Safety and procedural changes after the 2024 CrossFit games. Then it kind of talks about what happened, the investigation.

And then, and then right here, it says CrossFit CrossFit's actions and steps. Next steps. Next steps. And so there's one, two, three, four, five, six, and then in closing. And we'll go over those with you guys. There is a line in here. We are not publishing the full report based on privacy and legal considerations. The results of the investigation have been reported to our board of directors.

So it has been submitted to the board of directors, the full investigation, correct? Makes sense. Yeah. Makes sense. And our focus is now to move forward with actions that maximize our continued commitment to safety at the CrossFit Games. So this team has put on, I don't know, 17 or 18 CrossFit Games. They had a death. It's caused this big hubble-loo and they did an independent investigation into it.

And based on the independent investigation, they're going to let us know what actions they're going to take. But they're not going to share with us the report. Is that how you guys are taking it? Yeah. Thoughts? Andrew, are you disappointed that they're not sharing the report? Are you surprised? No, I knew what I thought they were going to share the report.

It's an idiot. It didn't spin open with that. Didn't you say something along those lines at the beginning, like why would they share it slash Don cornered him into something that now is evident that they're not gonna be telling anybody about, which makes him a liar. Right, I mean, you gotta imagine this thing's probably

50 plus pages of stuff. So you showed these six points and like this isn't what the report showed. It's what they're doing because of the report. So where's the transparent part? Well, the transparent part is that they're taking action on it, right? They're going to share with us the action. They could have done that without the investigation.

Well how would they have known? How would they have known? How would they have known? What they're doing is they're saying is, is that we had someone come through who's an expert, review our protocol, review the accident. And then because of what they've said and the suggestions they've made, these are the things that we're implementing so that it doesn't happen again. Is that that's how I'm taking it. They really think that.

Yeah, but they all of their focus is around an open water swim. Right. Point number three says they're suspending open water swims. Oh, right. So that doesn't whatever was found during the open water swim investigation during the open water swim investigation, doesn't matter going forward. Creating a new leadership role, creating a safety advisory board, doing more rehearsals, giving mental health, giving athlete council,

none of that is tied to the specifics of what the investigation said as it relates to open water protocols and safety. So you think most people wanted to see the report so that they could figure out Who should hang let's just cut to the chase exactly what people wanted and then even given and they were not people wanted that like hey, Joe blow was put in charge of the swim event and the water was too warm and put in charge of the swim event and the water was too warm and and Lazar Jukic didn't turn in the proper documentation showing that he had medical clearance and that's the fault of CrossFit and

therefore the blood the people wanted a smoking gun to pin blame on something. Right. Yep. Like if you put your dog at the pound and like the dog ended up getting run over by a car somehow, like, and then all of a sudden they're going to tell you what steps they're taking for future dogs. And they never told you what happened to your dog. What happened to my dog? What you told me, you told me what happened. It's like, no, we're not going. We got these steps instead. And so just let me just ask you guys, uh, not to be too lengthy on this, but what do you, what do you, I know it's just speculation, just speculation, but I want to go through

you guys. What do you think happened in a nutshell, Sousa, um, to, uh, at that swim event specifically around Lazar Jukic. You mean like my just perspective on what I saw when I was there and what happened? Yeah. What do you mean? I mean, I still just think that there might be potential information that we may not know, but it just seemed really odd that somebody at that caliber, that close to the finish line would struggle.

And obviously there was a bunch of unfortunate events where people didn't see and some people did and then it was ignored. So I mean, it's just one of those really unfortunate situations. Andrew? ignored. So I mean, it's just one of those really unfortunate situations. Andrew? I think it was probably hot, but I had to guess. But the thing that I would have liked to have known via that report would have been if there was temperature taken, what was the temperature? And those are all things that with what's being stated here It looks like they were all within protocol and you can assume it wasn't a temperature issue

But if you ever swim in hot water that blows And specifically what you're talking about from just the little limited knowledge I know about it if you're already hot and you get into hot water past a certain temperature the body can't dissipate heat and it's like the hot water past a certain temperature, the body can't dissipate heat. And it's like 10 years. And the best part about swimming is you never overheat because the water you get into is usually like 65 degrees at most. My first thing in the morning and like 70 is uncomfortable at a certain point. So 87, and I think it's like 86 or 87.

They say it's unsafe for adequate adequate heat dissipation for competition swimming Spin of the thoughts of what do you do you have any just total speculation not to be held in quartering when I Happens when I read this release They reviewed Operating documents or documents related to the operations of the CrossFit games. They have, what else did they say? They're going to ensure paramedic teams and ambulances are on the site at all events,

even if they are not legally required based on the local ordinances and regulations. That indicates to me that obviously they weren't there at that day. It sounds like they probably were not legally required to have that on site. If I'm going to speculate what the report said, it's that CrossFit had things in place, maybe not to the level that it needed to be.

Obviously not to the level it needed to be. But they met all of the local standards, ordinances. They had stuff in place, obviously not to the level it needed to be, but they met all of the local standards, ordinances, they had stuff in place, maybe not to the level of other competitions, and that it was an accident, right? Like there were people there, they could have had more, but there were people nearby, they failed to recognize it. Go implement things in the future, but there's nothing that was said that was people heads out the role. You have to go fire people, shut it down, etc. So if you're reading through the lines here, complete speculation is that this reveals

that they see places that they could have done more, but they did meet the legal requirements that the state of Texas or any had around running an event. That's the way I take it based on how they've worded some of their action items. Okay. And then in a nutshell, I know this is going to upset some people, but I'll tell you just the take on the big picture thing. Across the games, tests are the fittest human being alive. Human beings are pushed harder than anywhere else in any other competition in the world,

you could argue. There was the best swimmer in the group, his name was Lazar Jukic. On that morning, he started the run. He did the, he had done the event two or three days earlier successfully, not under the pressure of competition, but he had tested the course and he did it earlier successfully, not under the pressure of competition, but he had tested the course and he did it. No problem. He ran out there. He planned to win. He was in pretty much the lead the whole time. And then as he got close to the finish line, there became some weird erratic movements in his swimming,

some changing of strokes and he appeared to drown. Someone in the audience saw him drowning, jumped in the water to try to save him. They were told to go back. And in that time, the lifeguard or whoever was on the paddle board, didn't see him. And that he wasn't retrieved out of the water for like two hours and he drowned in 17 feet of water. And it was very bizarre because 500 people witnessed it firsthand on video cameras and everything. And yet no one saw it or did anything.

Yep. Yep. And so we have this and obviously a beloved Trump supporter supporting athlete that we all love to death. So that's the situation we're in. Is that a fair characterization? I'm not sure about that last part. Yeah, I think the Trump part might have been a assumption. A fair one, but someone made a post on Instagram that was like a letter to Lazar and he goes, Hey Lazar, I just wanted to let you know this, this, and this and Trump won like, Oh, okay.

Okay. I know what I mean. God. Yeah. That was the, uh, that was the, uh, that was a bit, Oh yeah. And David Weed wants to add in 90,000 people saw him drown on the live stream. Oh, was that necessary? Well, it was just, the Trump thing was just, it was just because, uh, someone

had a friend of his had written them like a post what's it called when you die post humiously, uh, a letter a few days ago and posted on Instagram saying, Hey Laz or Trump won, meaning that, you know, anyway, okay. What about Jack Moses comments? I'd like the not negligent because that was a big thing that was tossed around that there was going to be negligence. People are going to be held criminally, criminally responsible. And as you read through this, at least with the information we have, it doesn't, it doesn't

seem that there's negligence at play. Well, they haven't given us any information, right? So we don't know. But if you're reading through the lines, you would say no. And there's so many people have died in swim events that there's so much precedent and that it appears, and I think this is what Spin is saying, that they had covered their bases to avoid any negligent call.

That doesn't mean that his family's not gonna get a big payout, right? But negligence in the terms of something criminal. Do you want to read the last paragraph of the first section? You want to get to that point or? The last paragraph, the investigation process. Well, I was going to say, I was going to read this line.

Tell me if this is it. Cause I just have some notes here. We are not publishing a full report. Is that what you're talking about? No, I was going to go into the actual action steps. Okay. Let me, let me just say some notes here. We are not publishing a full report. Is that what you're talking about? No, I was gonna go into the actual action steps. Okay, let me just say this real quick. Before we get to the action steps, and then I'll hand it over to you, Spinn. We are not publishing a full report based on privacy and legal considerations.

That's what Susa said. The results of the investigations have been reported to our board of directors. Our focus is now move forward with actions that maximize our continued commitment to safety of the games. And then it lists out the steps and their step number one, CrossFit actions, next steps.

Number one, CrossFit creating a new leadership role responsible for safety at the CrossFit games. Is that what you're referencing? Spin? We'll start at the top and go down. No, I don't think that's, I don't think, well, I don't think that's the big takeaway from all of this, but. Number one, what number do you think is the big takeaway?

It's hidden in this first action step Hidden okay Right, you're talking about let me let me pull it up So I read the title of it and you're saying this one's supplementing the sport. Oh this supplementing the CrossFit sports leadership team Yeah, okay What part in here do you see second paragraph? This one, supplementing the sport. Oh, this supplementing the CrossFit sports leadership team. Yeah. Okay. What part in here do you see? Second paragraph.

The leader will report jointly to Dave Castor. Okay, let me CrossFit's creating a new senior leadership role responsible for safety at the CrossFit Games. You have to guess there was someone already in that position, right? Yeah. There was already, I can't remember his name Doc Ray. No there was a Doc Ray. He's been he's been there forever I don't

know if I don't know if that was his official title senior leadership role responsible for safety at the CrossFit Games but there was but Doc Ray was the guy one of the guys. He was great, he was great. He's been around since as long as I've been around CrossFit. Yeah, and he's an ER doc and he's crazy competent and very emotionally, very stable, just stoked as I'll get out. Anyway, and then it goes on to say,

this leader will report jointly to Dave Castro, who will continue to lead CrossFit sport organization. And you will report to CEO Don Fall. They will be expected to provide regular briefings on CrossFit safety plans and posture. We will hire for this role externally and begin to begin the search immediately. We expect to have this role filled before the next CrossFit game season. You think Brent can take that role? Who's Brent? I think Pajkowski. Pajkowski. Pajkowski.

That's why he retired? Yeah, he retired and take the senior leadership role, reporting directly to Dave. Thoughts? Thoughts spin? Apparently, demand number three was not followed through with. The asking for Dave Castro to step down as the leader of sport and they say this leader will report jointly to Dave Castro who will continue to lead CrossFit sport organization. They just baked it right in there. And then eventually when we get to number five or six down here, we'll also see that

they've done something to mitigate the influence of the PFAA with another organization called the CAC. So is that going to be two, just in the first step, one and two, we're talking about two regulatory organizations that are being interjected, right? And it just reminds me of exactly what Greg said, which is they're going to harp so much on the safety that if you do a rope climb, you're going to have to take the rope climb safety course. They're going to have the rope climb organization of safety. They're going to have to check all this stuff.

And so now what you're happening is all regulatories and bureaucracy is starting to move into the games. And then arguably that's going to change the programming so much that you may not even be able to make the claim the fittest on Earth anymore due to the safety concerns. Well, the lack of safety is what caused the problem this year, according to Hiller. Right. Hillary Hiller won't even let him use that title this year. What are your thoughts spin on Dave Stane? I mean, I think half of us wanted it and half of

us didn't. Do you think it's indicative? I'm gonna go 90-10. And the 10 are really, really loud. They created an organization for it. Fair enough. Yeah. Some people are to be very, very upset with this. Oh, Bill said the safest on earth. There you go. I'm going to tell James that he's the winner of the 2024 safest on earth. So maybe that might have been the most you could argue. It's the least safest things. He's the least. He would have to win.

He'd have to win 2025. Right. Then you could be the safest on earth. That's right. Thank you, Susa. He would have to win 2025. Right. Then he could be the safest on earth. That's right. Thank you, Suza. Spint, does this also let you think that they couldn't point any negligence directly at Dave Castro if they're keeping him?

That they wouldn't keep him if he was, you know? I mean, that kind of goes to my point that I was saying with my speculation of what the investigation said is that it didn't point at somebody not doing something so obvious that safety protocols were ignored. Um, things were not in place at all. Didn't follow, you know, local ordinances, et cetera. Um, I think he's been cleared by all of that. And do you think that's because in somebody put this in the comments, they said there was clearly negligence because it happened in front of so many people, but it wasn't gross negligence defined in like a court of law or like an illegal

standard. So do you think that that was like the big, cause like, you can't argue that there wasn't some sort of like negligent thing happening because there were a lot of people there that were in place to prevent something like that They were there somebody even swam out. It's still the events still occurred So like is it because you think that it didn't fit in a legal parameter? That that's not included No, I mean, I've said this the whole time like there were two

Lifeguards next to them right and like we don't know who they were what kind of certifications they had and you can argue they should have had more, but there were two people that were on either side of Lazar when this happened and neither saw it. Now, unless you're putting out blind people out there and have people that have no idea, it's one thing if you saw it and couldn't save them, but nobody saw him.

That was on the paddleboards. So I think again, I think that what was reported is that it was things were in place. It just, you know, things happen. And yeah, humans are human. And it's unfortunate this is what the result was. And going back to the precedent thing, that's the story of many, many, many drowning reports. I was right next to the guy. I was right next to the guy.

No one saw him. There were a hundred people in the pool and no one saw him. I was right next to him. S. Banner's, once the lawsuit is filed, all the real facts will come out. I don't think so. I think that this is the kind of thing that if there is a lawsuit,

it'll just go straight to settlement. I don't think anyone's gonna... Yeah, good call. I don't think this one gets fought out in the court system. Okay, number two, creating a CrossFit game safety advisory board. We're establishing a CrossFit game safety advisory board that will be composed of medical professionals, independent and safety experts and athletes.

As soon as this just for show, this is just lip service or it's just, you think this is some sort of effective method in keeping the athletes safe? Yeah. I think it goes back to what I said earlier, that it's going to be regulated so much, right? Like obviously you can control the environment in a swimming pool so much easier. You could have one lifeguard on each end of each lane. So you technically have two people watching one athlete and you can control that very easily. And so that's kind of what I was saying as far as like, as it gets a no pun intended here, like watered down, um, you'll start to see that

happen more and more. So again, it'll, it's going to affect the programming a lot. Uh, and, um, but do you think that when I see stuff like this, the athlete, uh, or the safety advisory board, I, they had, they had to have had, I know, not they had to have had, they have safety people already. That's what I thought. What is this, just a word for something they have already? And those of us who've been back there,

Dave takes so much feedback. He just sits there and there's these people surrounded at him and these arguments will start and they just pump It's just a giant debate around him all the time about what to do and what not to do and Dave just sits there and listens It almost seems like they're just formalizing something that already exists for the public to see like hey, dude Like this has happened 18 times to perfection. Go ahead spin that and I Would challenge anyone two weeks ago to say that they spoke up about the rogue imitational and jumping over the hay bale.

Right. Not one person said that was dangerous. After the fact, you could say, hey, somebody should have thought of that. That's easy to do. Same thing with this run swim. Hinshaw said it was safe beforehand. What a dweeb. Mazer and Lucas swam that by themselves

in the same temperature water by themselves. No one should forget how much the dweeb Hinshaw made himself look like at that point in time. What a moron. Like, it's one thing to say that you're gonna have a safety team look at this. You cannot foresee everything that're going to have a safety team, look at this. You cannot foresee everything that's going to happen unless you put them in bubble wrap and make this like the safest

on earth. Like there's zero chance anybody gets hurt. And then it's not a competition. Yep. And the two safest guys in the business, Brent and Pat were there at that event and they didn't say anything from what we know. We haven't heard any reports of them saying, hey, this jumping event at Rogue is dangerous. No, they said that it was good on Bill and Katie for switching up to burpee getovers after it happened twice. Not once, after twice. And then I had James on and he said, you know, it didn't even really feel like it mitigated that much.

I mean, he wasn't taking a dig at Rogue, but he said it was still like the component that could blow you out was still there. Yeah, dude. Hey, think about Kevin Ogarr as another example, right? Waits behind him, misses a snatch, bar goes behind him. It fires back into him and hits him in that exact spot that created the injury. Right? And so anybody there would have said, Oh, well, I've listed for years with the weights, not even paying attention where we put them.

Right. And then that one accident occurs and you're like, holy shit, how did we not see that? And so I just think there's just this inherent risk to sport. We just had a guy at a jujitsu place up here, very experienced, a black belt, uh, paralyzed from the waist down and just a normal everyday rolling session with another experienced purple belt, no weird position, nothing happened. It's just when you do stuff like this or sports or, or do anything, you're at risk. And I think that's where those who are criticizing every, all of this failed to see it.

I think they feel like putting more people in charge is going to for to be able to foretell what's gonna happen and you're just not going to. That's right. Not this last Jiu-Jitsu tournament I was at but the one before while we were waiting for my kids to go I saw two kids get taken away on stretchers. Kids these are like under 12. Hey dude remember nobody gets out of this place we call planet Earth or life alive. Oh, I haven't met one person yet. Oh, suspending open water, swimming events. Uh, this one, this one kind of bummed me out.

Uh, we're continuing our suspension of open water swimming at the CrossFit games of a future CrossFit games includes a swim component. It will take a place in a highly controlled environment, such as pools, where safety teams can closely monitor every athlete. I hate open water swims. It's the worst thing about CrossFit. Just in general. But what do you think about suspending all 500 meters again? And now we're going to do a thousand. Like what do you want to get?

But Hiller, do you like swimming in the games at all? Yeah, I do. OK. So what do you think about suspending swims just because there was like basically what we're hearing is is like, hey, it's going to be it's going to be too set. This is what how I read this. It's too sensitive of an issue to have a swim event in 2025. So we're not going to have it.

And I don't really like that reaction. Well, from the way you're putting it, yeah. And from the way I'm putting it, it's a programming thing. Like I'm keen to the idea that they're just going to have a pool. Yeah, then do it in a pool. I think a pool's... I think that's how they're stating it, isn't it? No, they're saying they're going to suspend open water. But it says says and then it will take place in highly controlled environments such as pools. Oh, okay Oh great like the workout from the COVID games is pretty cool with the GHDs and slam balls in the pool and then the ski pool workout was fine, right? Okay, so so oh, okay. I read this totally wrong. Thank you

So you're saying what this is saying is it that there could be a pool swim next year. Yeah. Right. It says such as pools. Okay. And from a programming perspective, I completely agree with Hiller. I actually think that moving it to a swimming pool where you could implement other modalities along with it outside of just like,

2013 or 14, that was great. 2013. Yeah. Then the, and by the way, there was safety protocol there. Remember they had towels. They had the bars all wrapped. The athletes were briefed on the fact that you could slip off the bar. I mean, that was in 2013, but I like the swimming pool.

Like I'm okay with it programming wise because I think you just have more versatility with the swimming pool. I think ones are gay. Like you're rid of them. Uh, uh, open water, swimming events are gay. All right. Mel bizarre CrossFit didn't already have someone, a singular person looking at safety that's going to help the lawsuit. Open water swim events are gay. All right. Mel, Bizarre CrossFit didn't already have someone, a singular person looking at safety.

That's going to help the lawsuit. They did. Not only did they have a singular person, they had an entire team. There is a very robust and qualified safety team there at all times. So maybe this number two creating a CrossFit game safety advisory board is, I don't know. I don't know. And that's going to be different than the PFAA, huh? No, there's something else coming up for them too.

Oh, sorry. It's a number one, supplementing the CrossFit Sports Leadership Team. CrossFit is creating a new senior leadership role responsible for safety at the CrossFit Games. Maybe the nuance here is it wasn't a senior leadership role. It wasn't like somebody that came from an Ivy League school. It was- Thank God for Don implementing this new senior position.

Get that in here, baby. Maybe they've just elevated. Maybe that person before didn't report directly to Dave and Don. But I don't want to speak out of turn on it, but I'm pretty sure there were and are. So I'm not sure what nuance is there that they've changed. Okay have like a Uh a rower in the water. Can they do that like canoes or is that going to be a no-go as well? That's an open water event Is there a wiggle room for that when people get like pissed like how dare you put us in a lake with a canoe? That's an interesting question actually

Number one and six are the replacement of the PFAA making PFAA unnecessary. Good move by CrossFit. Yeah, I agree. We'll get to that. Okay. Are we on number four? Yes. Number four, enhancing pre-event rehearsals, which they do so much of that must be for

the safety team, communication protocols and emergency resources. There did seem to be a communication issue with Lazar going down, right? There were people about a hundred yards off to the right that knew he went down and the communication that felt like it was funneling towards where the brain of the unit was, where Dave was, is that the person who jumped in the water

was just a fan and that caused maybe was the distraction that made it so people didn't realize that it was serious because there was poor communication. Athletes are familiar with pre-event briefings before the games, very thorough. But going forward, we will add a more robust safety-specific section during these briefings. These briefings will ensure athletes are aware

of the risks for each event, the safety protocols and personnel in place to mitigate them and how to access assistance if they need it. Moving forward CrossFit will also ensure that paramedic teams and ambulances are on site at all events if they are not legally required based on the local ordinances and regulations. How do you see that going down? Pre-event briefings where they will have robust specific Instruction you do so like they're gonna do a clean and jerk. Are they gonna tell them before the event? This thing might crush you Just so you know

Everybody will tune out Yeah, well, yeah You'll have a shitload of coaches and agents listening so they could take notes for their athletes who are off eating their mush oats. But I think that, um, they might rehearse it meaning like, okay, we have a down athlete, here's your medical team. Here's the path they take to come grab you. Here's what we do in the event of. So you might just have a more elaborate.

If this then then type scenario being played out with the medical team involved. I would imagine if that is involved with the athletes, they're going to ignore it. They don't want to fill their head with it. Right. And rightfully so you don't want to be briefed on like, you could die a thousand ways. Now have fun out there guys. Yeah. They will.

Well, for the, for the team, it might be like this. Hey, team, if it's a snatch ladder race and everyone's lifting, the commentator will be responsible for saying everyone freeze. We're stopping this event and then show the route the medical staff will take. There'll be some sort of a route that they take to whichever athletes on there. Okay, you got that. But for the athletes, it might be also as simple as saying, hey, this is the signal that you need help.

And medical staff will always be in the right-hand corner of the stadium. So if you need help, you can look over there. Maybe it's something as simple as that. Or yeah, it could be this. Zoltan, yeah. But what Spin is saying is that they're not even gonna want that in their head.

No, yeah, you're just gonna tune that out, especially when it's not an open water swim. They've done this. They've done thrusters and bar muscle ups and yoke carries every other week in training and at the games. They know the risks. They're not going to worry about it. They're going to tune out, not fill their head with negative talk and focus on what they need to know to execute the event.

And you're not saying that as a dig at them. You're just saying that that's the way to, you're not saying that as a dig. As Zuzza said, you don't want to have thoughts of getting hurt in your head. Oh, imagine that before you like the rogue event with that jump over. Do you think they would have even thought of that? Like be sure you're when you're rebounding, you know, the risk of maybe bounding. I mean, from what I understand, people saw Daniel Brandon doing that and then they started doing it themselves.

And like, are they really even going to have that thought beforehand to tell them, hey, if you want to bound, that's up to you. Katie said that they didn't think about it. Yeah. How are they going to? Katie said that and they didn't think about it. Yeah. And without the pressure of competition and prize money, no one in testing sounded like they did the single bound, the single rebound. Thomas Stroud. So they're just covering their asses.

They told the safety protocol and the athletes then have the decision to listen or not. It's really the only thing CFHQ should be doing. Right. So, I mean, and you can't blame them for that, but that is what that is. They're just covering their own ass. Hey, we told them. Logan. Hey, you should pull up that Logan comment. That's from your thing earlier. I'm behind, but it was my post. And yes, Lazer and I talked about Trump needing to win all the time. He was a big Trump guy. Oh, thank you. All right. Yeah.

Take that Jeffrey Birchfield. Validated. Birch. There you go. Validated. Oh, get out of here, Frank. Oh, Frankie. What's up buddy?

How are you, Frank? I'm no, no, no. Fuck. Frank, I want you to know I'm free speech. It was Andrew who censored you. Great. Why did we post on Instagram? A little down to the dumps? All this power has gone to Andrew's head. It's been a little while.

Okay. Frank, we did talk about that no one in their right mind would have ever expected them to release the report in detail. That would be completely foolish. Why would they do that? So there's that. Right here in the middle taking a huge dump sitting there on your iPhone. Imagine spending your entire CrossFit career on social media bragging to everyone, John Wooley, that you have all of this corporate experience and that you've led teams of millions to war and then for some reason you actually thought that they were going to release the report.

You are either, you are completely, especially since you're in the banking industry, which is probably one of the most fraudulent and uh, industries to be in and for some reason you thought for one second that they were actually going to release everything. Makes me wonder if you're just full of shit. Number five, expanding uh, mental health and emotional support resource. This one I guess actually really tips their hand that they're just covering their own ass, right? Yeah. 2025 CrossFit Games season will integrate mental health professionals

into our onsite medical teams. In case John Young says anything about you, we will have a mental health professional ready. Ah! Zing! Mental health professionals will be readily available to assist athletes and staff experiencing emotional distress, whether they feel impacted by competition, pressure, personal issues, or unforeseen emergencies like spin spelled your name wrong on his website. Just entertain me guys. Can you give me an example of how you could see this would be used?

Yes, affiliate money. That's all. No, no, like if you're an athlete, let's say James Sprague next year has a mental breakdown. Like he shows up to the games and right before event one he's like, I can't take the pressure of being the champ I need someone to talk to. We should probably go home. Andrew, are you going to play for me? I'm hired. I'm in.

I'll, I'll, I'll take that position. Hey buddy, just, just go home. This isn't for you. Uh, I don't, I, I might have an unpopular take with that. I don't mind that. Tell me, tell me why. I just don't mind it. Like whatever, it's nothing that's going to hinder programming.

It's not going to change leadership. It's not going to regulate more things. It's just simply a resource. And like Hiller said, if it is my money out of all the different things as an affiliate owner, if it is my money out of all the things on that list, I would be more than happy to donate to five and just rid all this other shit that's going on. Give me an example of so how like somehow yeah, I will now Brian. Hi, I've been locked in HPOs dungeon. I need help. So who does she go to?

Maybe she can reach out to the crossfit games thing and actually get a little assistance, whether she uses them or whether she uses them as a vehicle to find herself some help in her local area. I'm not against that at all. I don't, I don't, I don't like the way it's presented here with, with this tool that locked you on the assault bike for four hours. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, which baggy made you pick up? I This is this is how it would go down though. If she went for help. She would be like Hey, I

Want to go work out with J. R. Howell, but I'll lose my noble contract if I do Okay, so take it from me So I don't know what to do and then and then this is what the DEI team will mental health team will tell her Stop being a fucking privileged white bitch Where did I go wrong tell me where I went wrong That's not the response they would have. They'd probably say, yeah, you're right. They would just make the issue. You're right. You should stay with HWPO. What did your agent say? Oh, wow.

My agent's in on it too. You don't understand. They're all after me. I just don't understand. I guess that one just seems like a cover your ass one to me. I just don't understand that one. Why? I hope that expands to affiliate owners. You're going to use it. I struggle with so much of this from a removing personal accountability from people. Right?

Like they can't think for themselves about whether or not it's safe or not. They can't think for themselves that they want to how they want to jump over a hay bale. They can't bring their own person to help them with mental issues. Like it's not like you can't go find somebody to do this for you, you know, come support you or provide mental whatever. Um, it is why does CrossFit have to have somebody there? Yeah. Like whoever you shower with naked the week before the games, that's your fucking mental health support. And hope it's not to say that whatever CrossFit provides is what you need.

Like go find the right provider for yourself. If you are concerned about this. Right. Don't rely on some third party organization to give it to you. Aren't there some organizations, I think we did this, I think we had this problem at CrossFit one year. I think one year at CrossFit, we threw an event, it was a regional event, and a bunch of people got food poisoned.

So CrossFit was like, hey, we're not gonna provide food next year because it's too fucking crazy because if there's food poisoning, you all get wiped out. And they all eat their own chicken and rice anyway. And so I'm piggybacking off of what Spin is saying. It's like, yeah, like we'll provide you water, but you need to come with your own food and your own emotional support and, and all of those things. To tell you the truth, I wouldn't even want those guys in the back who are body workers

working on me if I was a professional. Yeah. Yeah. I know the guy who does it. Like, yeah, like you bring your own people. I was, I was at the Arnold one year and uh, it was Ron Bath, one of the greatest poolers of all time. And he, right. The couple hours before he pulled, he got his arm worked on. And as he walked up there, he's like, man, I fucked up. And he goes, what? He goes, I got a massage on my arm and whatever the guy did to my arm made it. So I just, I just can tell. I know, I know a guy that with his lat, I was going to say,

Hillary, tell me what happened. Heller was due to water. Palooza is a hell do some work on you. And like, this is my own damn fault Like it's kind of similar how you shouldn't take a different supplement and within a competition I probably should have gotten body work done for this event and then my elbow went out during that event I held a click and then a week later it just popped But it was a bunch of muscle-ups and he worked on my lat

It's like oh, yeah, these things are tight and you just really went to town on it And I never said no, so it's my own damn fault. Right. But look, but now I have this YouTube channel, so it's all good. Yeah, that's a it's a great point you're bringing up spin. It's in the vein of trying to be kind and helpful. You're just opening up more avenues for more injuries making people taking people out of the lane of personal accountability and personal responsibility, where actually truly the most safety is when people are taking care of their own shit. We're in six at the moment. We're talking about six. No, we're about to get six. Six is the one where I like, six is the one where I want to go do shots with fucking Don Fahl. Dawn fall don't do no wrong after me reading six. I fucking love it

Six is good. Oh six is so good Fucking a this is great. I feel like I just took a viagra Here we go. Number six. This is the shit. This is what we've been waiting for now. Remember the um, uh, uh brent and um pat and annee and Dina Swift and some other dude asked for Dave to step down from running the CrossFit Games. Just remember that. That was their demand, their opening demand. And then, and then, and then their other demands is like, Hey, can we be friends and be integrated

with CrossFit? Kind of a weird kind of punch in the stomach and then spend the night at your house. Okay, here we go. Establishing a CrossFit athlete council. This is what CrossFit is gonna be doing. In addition to the CrossFit game safety advisory board, that's number one, we will establish a broader athlete council to ensure athletes

from the CrossFit community can share feedback and have greater influence on CrossFit's protocols for competition. That's a pretty broad term, CrossFit community and athletes from the CrossFit community. That could be dudes from your gym. Safety, broader athlete welfare, and the business of sport. Unlike prior CrossFit councils, this athlete council will be elected by fellow athletes and will represent athletes from all divisions of competition so that means they could have some boards in there and shit and some old like

people Jamie Latimer and yeah, and Tyler Tyler Jenkins to tie Jenkins Hip and shmuel. No, probably not. I mean, probably what they shouldn't. We look forward to opening this process up to our athletes to ensure we have representation chosen by the entire community. We look forward to opening this process up to our athletes. Pretty broad. Or athletes meeting competitors.

Just fucking, I guess every Tom, Dick and Harry in the, in the, in an affiliate. We'll communicate additional details about the council soon and intend to have the first athlete council members chosen by early 2025. I nominate John Young. Oh, clearly. So they have something called the CAC, CrossFit Athlete Council, the CAC. Oh, the CAC's long and it's going to beat you down. The CAC. CrossFit athlete council the cack. Oh the cacks long and it's gonna beat you down The cack now you

The PFAA these guys is Brent Pat Annie fee Dina the other ones are out They they wanted to be right now. They're they're out, but they wanted to be embraced by CrossFit Right and they wanted to be integrated in the functioning of the CrossFit game specifically They didn't give a fuck about the affiliates or the training but with the with the games their opening line was but get rid of Dave the most senior person at all of CrossFit, Inc It's like the least strategic way to do that till the heart and soul for so many fucking affiliates We gotta be fair here that happened with Greg too and a lot of people forgot about that

Which they probably shouldn't have right right area. Yeah, and it was the same people Yeah, and so so so they go they go, they go to Don, they run to Daddy Don, and they say, Hey, we want to, we want to have control over the games, by the way, fire, Dave. They, they should have assumed more power first and then made that demand. They had zero power than they made that demand. It's like the sequencing was so off there. The strategy was terrible. And so now like CrossFit just came and dropped their cack on the table and it's over. And so the only thing, Spend, tell me if you agree that the only thing that they had that they were leveraging was Lazar's death. They obviously didn't have the relationship with

Don to do it. Right. And they didn't, And they didn't have the moral authority and they didn't have the financial incentive. So the only thing they were trying to do use is leverage Lazar's death to get the mob and pressure to get rid of Dave. I feel like maybe Pat in an interview kind of alluded to that like they use that as kind of... I do feel like that. I heard that as well yeah, it wasn't in so many words, but it was something like

we've been trying to do it now they're going to utilize this to Amplify their voice or something like that and then Dave made his own council the council of Elrond consists of Dave You know the council Elrond is Consists of Dave. Yeah, do you know what the Council of Elrond is? No. All right, nevermind.

But I'll tell you what movie it's from. It's from the movie with Frodo. Damn, you're good. Wow. Isn't it? Yeah, you're right, nice job. Not Game of Thrones. Dude. How do you remember Frodo but not the movie?

The Hobbit. Lord of the Rings. Lord of the Rings? The Hobbit? The Hobbit. Lord of the Rings. Thank you. Lord of the Rings. And Dave is an elf that will never die. You cannot take him out. He's been here for generations.

So we look forward to opening it. So they're going to have it. Spim, what's your first thought about this? What does this thing look like? I have no idea. Number six, just take a stab at it. You can't be wrong. Don't worry. We're not going to take any subscribers from you.

I don't know. I don't. I gained subscribers yesterday, so it's fine. I don't. Again, like it's still yes, you're going to add from age group athletes, you're going to bring in hopefully some adaptive athletes. Where's the cutoff? Like I joke, John Young is nominated. Is he worthy of going on that council?

He competes. It says, well, listen, dude, it says they're going to be voted on. It says they're going to be chosen by the entire community. Right. So as long as I think CrossFit's just gonna set the criteria like you have to have done three opens or some shit Right, and you have to belong to an affiliate me. I don't know what it's gonna be and then boom There'll just be a vote of voting and yeah, John could get on on the CAC Substance list and then what are they what are they gonna say? And substance list and then what are they what are they gonna say? yeah

Talked about like what are they gonna bring to the table of running and running a competition at this level this scale When they never have I see what you did there. Oh well, they're Yeah, I made the assumption that they're just running a guard block for the PFAA. Do you know what I mean? Like, Hiller opened a hot dog stand and then I open next door to a hot links, spicy hot links stand and I just take all the customers. No one wants a hot dog when there's hot links.

That's our marmitean crap. Yeah, that's how I... It gives them another way to not have to listen to them. Hey guys, don't let off Frank in the comments. Yeah. Keep fucking Frank up in there. Don't let off of him. Please. It gives them a way to ignore the PFA and say, hey, we have athletes too.

We're listening to them instead. But again, what are they going to tell? Are they going to do anything that actually provides value to? Well hey, they may be going, they may get, what if they go in there spin and they get the optics and they're like Holy shit like like I got this thing is an incredibly well run oiled machine the the the the timing the effort the Professionalism the programming that like what that may be enough

It may be enough just to have people in there and just be like, wow, this is truly incredible. Because what CrossFit's not gonna want is, someone from the neuro division coming out and being like, I know they not listen to me. You know what I mean? They're not gonna, they're gonna want, it's kind of gonna be- They usually don't have appendages. They, you know, they're gonna want, it's kind of, you don't have appendages. They're gonna, they're gonna want,

they're gonna want, it could be just a good smart PR move from CrossFit. I mean, they have nothing to hide. Everything back there is fucking like unbelievable. I think the take is, is they're just bringing it back with under their control. And like, I think spins, uh, what the point spins making is valid in both the CAC and the PFAA. Like what are both of them going to propose, uh, what the point spins making is valid in both the CAC and the PFAA. Like what are both of them going to propose, uh, provide? And I do think, Sevan, what you said, there is some, uh, validity there. Like they might all sit down, look at an event and say, Hey, here's a handful of

things you guys didn't really like think about, but as athletes, we already started popping our head, like how could we shortcut this or, you know, how could we rebound over this? And there might be certain unknowns that'll pop up at that point, but is that valuable enough to spend a lot of money and resources on, and then put here as something that's going to limit exposure to risk, like then I kind of fall on the same side of spin, like, no, I don't think so, but I just think it's a control, it's a control move.

And what can, what can they actually share with actual athletes in the middle of the season? Yeah, nothing. Hey, what's the goal of the CrossFit games? Hold on before you go there. Say that last statement again. What can they spin? What did you say? What can they share with the crowd with this with the CAC in

the middle of the season from a programming standpoint, like right. Unless you're gonna announce the workout. So let me let me let them do it. Like you can't give them the the weeks ahead of time information

what's going to happen. Let them figure out if it's safe or not. And they've got weeks ahead of advantage against everybody that's not on the CAC. The CAC could be tasked with, if they're strong and they're capable, they could be tasked with collecting the voices of athletes, right? And then picking five or six things that seem to be the most important. And fuck, for all we know, it just might be they want better water filtration and more water access points at the fucking games.

Like it might be something as simple as that. And then they bring that and they're like, hey, Dave or whoever they take it to, these are some things that the athletes want. They never wanna use this kind of rope again. They want more water access points. They want one or two more minutes of space in between events. And this will cost the company $82,000 this year.

It might be, I mean, right? Doesn't that seem feasible? But what you're saying, the one part you're saying is, is if they can't see the workouts in advance, they won't be able to address what's happening that particular year. It doesn't address the competition. It doesn't address the safety. It doesn't address the broader athlete welfare and all that. And they have no idea about the business side of running a sport.

Well, I think my opinion is that's tough shit. They shouldn't, no one should have access to the work only as needed. Should people know what the workouts are? What are your thoughts on that spin? I agree. You can't give this limited group information about it and not think that they're going to act on it or share it with others. Yeah, it's going to get shared for sure. Yeah.

They already have a problem with information getting out there. So do you think it's completely pointless? So you think that what goes back to what Susa said that it's just to kind of squelch or put the fire out that is the PFAA? In an attempt to, yeah. It's a cack block. Cack block. Okay. Sorry, Hiller, what were you going to say? The cack block, you know. Amazing.

Could you imagine David Don sitting in a room? It's like, what are we going to do? We got to cock block these guys. I got it. The cat. That's not the cat. I think the boss came up with that one. I can see that. He's very creative. There was somebody in the comments that said something here that made sense.

Sean's was, sorry, I can't bring it up. Sean, I can't find it. Oh, right here. And he said, it's, it's all the illusion of safety. And I think it's all, this is like a lot of this is theater because if you get down to the nuts and the bolts of it, like we were just discussing and, and spin was like going through the specifics of like how they could actually interject and help it's like, really, when you get down to it, there's, again,

we're going to go back to it's a sport. It's a competition. People are willing to do whatever it takes to win. There's an inherent risk to that. And there's not a lot of ways to mitigate that unless you just don't do it. Right. And so I think that this is more or less like a, you know, it's like a theater. It's like TSA when you go to the airport.

A security theater. Hey, so now that you say that, you know, one of the complaints we have is that there's never, there's nothing's ever objectified. So like that girl who was calling John a misogynist, we're all like, okay, show us where he said it. And like, they won't show you where he said it, you what he said that was misogynistic. But there are, there, there was, there were some things in here. So we know we're not going to have open water swims. That's an action taken.

We know we're going to have ambulances at every single event. We know that's an action taken. Um, the ones that are a little fishy obviously are these advisory councils, cause it's an action taken. The ones that are a little fishy, obviously, are these advisory councils, because it's an action taken, but we're accusing them as being pointless action taken, because they're not going to actually be able to do anything. Department of Education. Yeah, and maybe that's why I'm having issues with the emotional and mental health, because I can't touch it. You know what I mean? I want to be like, wait a second, where's the life vests?

I don't feel a life vest in here. So I'm trying to think if there were any other besides the ambulances and besides the Dave isn't getting fired. Oh, Dave's not getting fired. Yeah. They're gonna have ambulances. What was the other one? No more open water swims. No more open water swims. No more open water swims So those are the big takeaways if you came here to find out that like actually Dave roofied Lazar before the event Or or he had a warning that the water was too hot and proceeded to do it anyway Or that there was a shooter in the bushes. They got Lazar like that. That's not we're not we're never we're never gonna get that And I would just like to also put a note with there because we were talking about it that events were known would that mitigate safety?

Clearly not Lazar did the event on his own, right? So right, you know, there's that Someone said a Brent is salty as fuck now, what do you think happens any speculation you think so? Originally Brent was saying that he wasn't going to compete because he was going to do pfaa You think he sees this and he's like shit nail in the coffin These guys fucking nailed it how stupid were we that we asked for Dave to be fired? Um, instead they've doubled down and built the fucking border wall around the fucking athletes uh

You you think that um, uh, you think that he he comes back and competes again this year because of that? How could he? How couldn't he? How could he? I know. And I'm saying, how could he not? I mean, doesn't have to. It's like, I mean, listen, we all know this.

No one's told him yet, but the only value that athletes have is when they're on the floor competing. Is when they're on the floor competing is when they're on the floor competing that's right I mean like if you don't like that It's like say I don't have any value on the floor competing don't feel bad about it The only value I have is when i'm here behind the mic and that's questionable They could go push like the pfa could go partner with the world fitness project the world fitness project Is that is that real is there something called the World Fitness Project?

That's Will's new thing. Will Morad's. Oh, I thought it was a spin off the World Economic Forum and you were making a joke. Maybe. Do they have a website? Yeah, you know, they're also on Instagram. They have more information on their Instagram than they do their website, which is... That's off to a good start Your Instagram is the logo and it's for the athletes by the athletes and there's three total cops I'll give it the program wills fitness project W. I like that

All right Did you want to add something hillar you said something about what's the point of CrossFit or what's the yeah? Like what is the point of the CrossFit games and everyone knows the answer right? Mm-hmm. It's the find the fit affiliate, oh No, it's the find the fit is not a marketing strategy for them But it's like it's a 80% that, 20% the other. Are any of these things helping that? And has there been any talk about how that's being pushed forward?

Because that's what it is. Like, if that's your goal every year is to find the fitness down Earth, I don't see any improvement on that. Actually, it's probably detriments. Yeah, on it. It's like little blocks. Yeah. Do you think, Spin, you think safety diminishes the

validity of the comp? To the extent that I think those in the PFA want to take it? Yes. Like, like, it could be like, evil, Knievel jumping over the Grand Canyon, but before he does, they fill the whole thing out with cotton balls. I think it's one of those things where you look at JR putting out hurdles for handstand walking and that would never be allowed, right? Until it gets done.

And if PFA had its say, JR is not allowed to do that until the CrossFit Games does that. And then it's some allowed thing that then JR can do it kills innovation. It prevents anything that's going to be more exciting, all in the name of trying to avoid. One injury. Yeah. How many people don't compete do you think. I mean seven are things Brentson at Brentson that means everyone's in. I heard Adler and Laura not doing the games this year. Like let me ask you this.

Do you think Adler has, I think Adler has a sheet of paper at home and it has Writ on it, $222,000, Wadapaloo's on it, $97,000, Madrid Classic, $47,000, and he's like, okay, I can win three of these four. Yeah, I was hoping you were gonna say he made a good Venn diagram.

That too. I mean, you guys think that he has that sheet of paper at home? I think he does. I think they all do. I think all the athletes do. I think you're lying. I mean, look at like the NorCal classic and these other things that are now dishing out 30,000 at a time, 20,000 at a time. And I mean, for people like Jeff Adler, who was crowned the fittest on earth, he could go scoop up all that money, right? Because. Because you're going to win. Ariel hinted at that. Right. Like maybe she doesn't do 25 and she goes to NorCal. She goes to what a Palooza. She used to go to rogue.

Now, the question is years down, if nothing changes and the structure is the same, do you still get the opportunity to go to rogue? Do you have to qualify for what a Palooza at some point? Like, oh, those those things are not guaranteed down the road. You're going to be doing all these qualifiers and you're probably fit enough to get in. But if enough people do it, you're not getting into those. So it's not a guarantee down the road. Maybe, maybe 25 it is, but it's, it's not like you can go to rogue every year just because you were once the third fittest on the world.

It's not like you can go to Rogue every year just because you were once the third fittest on the world. Hiller, every sport has measures to mitigate injury. Sure, you're not going to do the CrossFit Games in the middle of the day in Phoenix in the summer. If they don't have these measures, there's the potential to have great physical feats achieved, but the risk is not worth the reward. Oh, that's an interesting point. Well, the risk for our part is up to the individual athlete, not as a board or a committee to

decide. And I would agree exactly what Spin says. If you want to kill progress and you want to kill innovation, overregulate. And just like you said, so think about the 2012 regional, right? You remember the 100 pound dumbbell snatch and then the sprint. And there's multiple game that athlete that's like, I went out and I bought that a hundred pound dumbbell and I went to snatch it and I couldn't even get it up over my head. So if you were sitting there with a board of athletes and people deciding what's

safe or not, and you watch the first take of everybody trying to snatch that a hundred pound dumbbell and feel fail miserably, you all would have been like, okay, we can't have that. That's, that's a too big of a jump from where we were to where we are. We need to have a step in between. But since they didn't have any regulation on it, by the time the regionals came around, every single athlete in there was just snatching that thing like nobody's business.

So I just think that you're going to over, over-regulate will definitely take away from, um, the title fitness on earth, because you won't be able to have the same progress innovation. And it goes to my point of personal accountability is if you don't feel safe, you don't have to compete. Mm hmm. What is this video? This is, I mean, I, I know that women's women's gymnastics has band moves that like fucking will break your neck and shit. Right.

And this like, so like, look at this one, the, the Corbett flip. I don't know what this is but it's the iron lotus in here it's named after her oh because she died or she was the only one that could do it or something right isn't that her name right down there holy shit oh god do any of you guys know the iron lotus? Is that a gymnastics move? So someone in the comments will know the iron lotus. It's if Frank, if the fittest in the world athlete does not compete due to safety concerns, then it's not a test of the fittest. Wow.

Hiller I can't. Oh man. Hiller's sleeping at the wheel. That was just a test of the fittest. Wow. Hiller, I can't. Oh man. Hiller's sleeping at the wheel. I was just a test. And those are the comments. I'll know the, the iron lotus. Yes. Another year and Hiller won't have the fast switch muscles to do that. Frank, can come try again in a year. I'll pull you up. I could read the whole thing. But actually Frank just broke my glasses. Good job, Frank. You can sleep well knowing that Andrew had instant karma. Oh, PFA rep, Brent just sent me a memo asking me to

explore ways to contact Justin Trudeau. He wants Trudeau to intervene while the Biden administration is still in office. Fair enough. Okay, anything, anything in closing? When it comes to like the box jump overs, is that something that they would remove via something like this athlete council, do you believe? I know Taylor's pretty vocal about not having bounding, right? Or is that JR combination of both or neither?

I don't know if that's still a concern. They were all hating on bounding as I remember, because I was hating on them for hating on bounding. I also hate on them for hating on bounding. I think it's actually specifically maybe a combo of a sled push into the bounding. I also hate on them for hating on bounding. I think it's actually specifically maybe a combo of a sled push into the bounding potentially. And I also think that like if it's been a handful of athletes over the course of X amount of time, is that really reason to get rid of it? Similar to the swim. It's like, do you get rid of the whole thing because they messed up one

time forever? But I don't know. And if you don't have open water swimming for the rest of history and it's all in a pool It's like all right. What are we playing pickleball? And we've seen you can your Achilles not bounding to so correct. Yes jumps. Yeah There's no box jump. So I I'm not a fan of The idea of just putting restraints on things because one thing happened one time in the span of hundreds of thousands of people doing all the things all the time. What do you think about Rogue? They had two injuries and then they changed the... I think the way they handled that was great. Yeah.

Even though I hated it, I thought it was great too. I also like the way Katie spoke on it. Yeah, right. And the reason why she can't speak on it like that Right because it's her thing and fucking her she owns the fucking company Yeah, you can like do another competition tomorrow. She can tell someone to fuck off. She's like She it's fucking her. She doesn't answer to a board or private equity. I mean, she's fucking alphas. Fuck. It's like, fuck, she can just be like, fuck you.

What I'm curious about is after Gabby tore her Achilles was their talk about it. Like I want to know what happened between Gabby and, and Henryk. I bet you there was talk about it for sure. Because different between like the CrossFit Games and a decathlon is the decathlon and maybe even high rocks, you know what you're training for all year. And when you say you're not doing bounding box jumps, all of a sudden that's something that you don't gotta be ready for.

And you're removing the unknown and unknowable component, which was the CrossFit Games and finding the fittest on earth. So I just think it's stupid. I've always thought it was stupid to remove shit. Hey within one second We all saw what Danielle was doing But if you were watching like we were talking about instantly. Holy fuck. Yeah We're like, oh shit. She's just rebounding. She's just a spring. She's just loading and recoiling like we saw it right away

We were in the chat like holy shit It was we didn't see other people pick up on to it for a long time let alone the commentators So I don't even know if they knew I Don't even know if they distinguish like right away We're like, okay She's saying to be in a half second on every one that gives her four and a half seconds Then she's losing on the sled. We were like computing it on the side here I don't I don't know if they knew even when what happened to Gabby, what had happened to her. So I don't know. I feel like it took them forever for people to realize

like, yo, Danielle's fucking making up all that ground on that first thing. They were just like, man, she's moving over the box fast. Like, no, motherfucker, she's not, she's just touching the ground and going. Nobody said when she saw Danielle doing it, oh, she better watch out, she's gonna tear that Achilles.

Right. But we did know as soon as we saw the first one that a second one was coming. We're like, oh, soon as we saw Gabby, that's why another one point. Then like, yeah, we had we had a long time in that during the duel. Like, why was it changed, not made right after Gabby? Right. Because there was the thought of inherent risk. They could have changed it right after Gabby, right? Because there was the thought of inherent risk. They could have changed it right after Gabby. I knew I said right away in our text read another one's coming, but I still wouldn't have stopped it until there were two. And that makes sense, right? Like nobody, nobody starts accusing the restaurant if you're

at a table with six of you and one person gets food poisoning. But then when three people have it all of a sudden like shit, I think it was that restaurant food we had. Right. Right. Frickin shellfish. That's a damn shellfish. Hey, you're not the YouTube channel. It no Dave Dave's gone from the public sphere he will not be allowed out the top. Dave is Dave's Dave's gone from having his own freedom of speech. Imagine this Monday, we can review. Oh, that would be amazing. Oh, that would be amazing. Let me read this other line and then you can go.

Hold on, Suze. By the way, it does say, in closing, we look forward to the 2025 season and plan to communicate more important details before the end of the week. So more stuff could come out later today, tomorrow, Friday or Saturday. Helton said it wouldn't be till December. Right? Fucking on his eighth booster. His brain doesn't go to the top floor. We look forward to the 2025 season. Okay, so more stuff coming very soon. It could have come out already while we're on the show. Who knows?

Spin probably would have seen it. But- He's collecting anecdotes from helping about the investigation. Most definitely. Yes. He's got his finger on the pulse. That's why they didn't release it to the public.

Did you know he met with the third party investigators? Yeah, he posted it like every other day for the next, the last two months. You did a little coffee date or something. What were you going to say, Susie? Two things. The first one, when I had Dr. Sean rocket on, and we talked about bounding with box jump, I asked him, I said, Hey, can you train that to like build up, you know, some sort

of acclamation to that? So that way you're reducing your risk to injury when you're rebounding in a competition. And he said, uh, not as far as they've known. So they obviously going from not doing it all to doing it in extreme a manner is going to expose you to a lot more risk. But even if you're somebody that rebounds your box jumps all the time, whenever that foot's in that flex position and you're using it to bounce off of, he says, you're, you're pretty much always exposed to risk and it's, it's depends on

person to person. So like you can build maybe a tolerance to it by training it. And then sometimes you just can't. And if you look at people that are super athletic, like Billy, he'll use an example. Like I bet you that that guy springy as shit. Like I've seen him, he would be fricking dropped from that 15 foot rope and just kind of rolls off like he's fine. Yeah. Yeah

And it happened to him. He can dunk right? Oh, yeah standing crazy With the bounding I don't remember Anyone tearing their Achilles during training all the ones I remember always during a competition It's cuz all their dumbass coaches have them stepping down the whole year and Doug Chapman, Chapman, Chapman. Yeah, from, yeah, from Hyperfit, right? Yeah, and I stepped down. All right. Well, good luck when you got a rebound, your phone. Yeah, because then you really are like, if you don't have any experience with it, or you haven't prepared yourself for it at all, then for sure you're going to be at more, more of a exposure. Radio and don't rebound. Um, this is a great point. You're contracting yourself. Contracting?

Contradicting? Contracting, yes. I think you make contradicting yourself. I wasn't contradicting myself, but I'll let that slide. They didn't make the adjustment because doing would be on the side of too much regulation and because waiting to all that. Jesus Christ shut up and was not a step down. Listen, listen, it's this last line that's important. And because they were waiting to all the athletes would be on the even playing field. Okay, so maybe that's why they reset it. No, that's not why they stopped. They started in the middle of a new round.

So Henrik got hurt on the round of 15, I believe. And so then the round of 10 is when they implemented the burpee box jump overs. They could have done the same thing with during after Gabby, because she had heard it on the round of 15 I believe and so then the round of 10 is when they implemented the burpee box jump overs they could have done the same thing with during after Gabby because she did heard it on the round of 10 they could have done it around a five or two so they were all level playing fields they didn't go to start it when the men started and said hey the men have to do it this way like okay fair enough okay so you had that wrong so Stephen, listen, you're contradicting yourself. They didn't make the adjustment because doing so would be on the side of too much. Listen, you jackass.

Correcting, dude. Listen, there has to be some rules for it to fucking be the game that's doable. You can't be like, oh, you're just going to run through fire. There has to be, okay, there can't be fire on the ground. Right? the floor can't be wet while they're snatching max matches I mean we're not true we saw that tear you can't be completely retarded damn Toby Toby hi I bound my box jumps in my garage gym this morning and the PFA came knocking on my door oh I see this is what he's trying to say

there he was contracted and that was the problem I got it mmm make calf raises great again that's amazing okay um go is'm going to this Noah guy. I was just going to use our football player. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Just one of the homies. I was going to say somebody put in the comments like about what does this have to do with like affiliates and stuff, and it has absolutely nothing to do with it. And as an affiliate owner, it fucking pisses me off because because it's like you they this shit around like I give a fuck like oh, we're gonna have X Y & Z

Like the Hiller used this clip and when he did the um, uh, um, uh, um, uh I'm reactive to everything around me a video and it was from September and they were like, oh well We have some great changes to the game season Let's cut over to the head of affiliates in his fucking car in a parking lot right now. To give us a car map. It's like- With a blurred out background. Yeah, yeah. Hey, I'm in my Range Rover that you make more than in three years running your affiliate,

but here's what we got for you. Fucking information on a sport. You know what I mean? It's like, hey guys, I'm here in my $10 million house and you affiliate owners, ha ha ha ha ha, passion project. But by the way, here's what we got, guys. This year season, we're going to make you give us seventy dollars from your members to join our online competition and what are we going to provide for you?

Fucking nothing. Oh, and by the way, you know who owns the narrative? Oh, is the athletes and they just eat each other up and they destroy the community in the process, not once, once but twice here we go but by the way guys don't worry this is all going to be completely transparent stay alive pay your affiliate fee hashtag it's up to us uh so uh so your feedback is commercial hey that's that's a pretty good line the athletes not only destroyed the community once but twice hey, that's maybe we just Maybe we just put um, what's that thing where you put your head in your arms in it?

It's called bend over kiss your ass. Goodbye. They put No, not the guillotine they put at you in the center of town and you have to you get they don't hurt you but you Get humiliated and kids come by and throw rotten tomatoes at you. I Know what that thing is. Is it a pillory? Anyway they should just put Fikowski in one of those and put them in the middle and just oh yeah it is a wooden medal for public punishment just put Fikowski in one of those things and then everyone in the stadium can throw tomatoes at them. Remember when they did open humiliation. That's the way out Yeah, there it is. He just needs to put himself into one of these and have a couple of people just chuck some crap

And he goes guys, this is it. I want back in I'm sorry Oh, you know what I put him in one and see who gets the most tomatoes I'd buy two buckets. I Just realized something. We got to start this whole thing over. I said, I need you to come out like this. We weren't live. Oh, no. Hey, guys. Hey, guys.

I'm super just distraught over these last four months. And have you seen footage of it? Jesus Christ. I was there all weekend I was there all weekend and I watched the fucking fake fucking I'm sad about everything and I watched the shit that came after and we're sad about everything and by the way, too If you guys are affiliate owners and coaches and you're sick of fucking being broke on december next month I'm going to do a yearly planning thing for you and your gym at school.com Slash media launch and we're going to sit down and we're going to, um, let's talk about constraints on your business and strategies to overcome them.

And we're going to do it with a cross pollination of a bunch of affiliate owners that have all struggled like you. And uh, we're going to get together to have a good year. Oh, hey, look, I've just done more than fucking Dawn has done. Is that what the athlete owner council? What time is that happening? That, um, I literally just, we're doing it, but sometime. I don't know what's the date. What's the date? We're gonna do it in December and I'm gonna be using just to be transparent here guys

How far down your throat can you get that microphone? You don't know how far down I can get it. Don't you know? And you look at it. Fuck, I lost. Oh, to be transparent, to be to be transparent. The stuff for the yearly planning, I've been following what Patrick McDavid has done since 2016 and will be using a lot of those PDFs and different things to conduct the framework for this as well.

So it's not just coming from myself, but we'll have some other stuff there that has a track record of success. You go ahead, Sevan, do it. You know you want to try. You're a little jealous, aren't you? I just stricter sized my mic. OK, overall, I'm pleased with this.

It's good. I don't think it's going to cause any disturbance or debate. I think it's fine. I don't think it's gonna cause any disturbance or debate. I think it's fine. I don't have any issues with this release. I hope we can get past this. The most exciting part to me is that they're gonna release games information later on this week. I don't really care what they do with the games.

I just want to hear about it so we can move forward with our plans. So, matter of fact, I'm going to give it just an automatic A+, because they created the CAC, and the CAC is like a fuck you to the PFAA. So, that's my overall... Yeah, we'll give this one an A+, too. This is good. Yeah. Spin, any thoughts on this release and the announcement of the CAC? I'm just waiting for people to overreact to it. What do you think? What do you mean? I'm going to PFA to put the restatement up cause they can't be happy with it.

Oh, wow. Wow. You think they'll put out a statement responding to that? I feel like you have to, right? Yeah, they have. I don't know. I would just fucking cancel my Instagram account. I would just fuck I was just like and pull everything archive everything and run. I mean they have a new they have a new athlete board

So i'm sure they're Media right now uh suza thoughts on uh on this uh on this response I mean just the whole thing in general or we're just talking cac here Yeah, no the whole thing one through six you can you mean, just the whole thing in general, or we're just talking cack here? Yeah, no, the whole thing one through six, you can, you can give it the whole. I mean, I think it's exactly what we expected. All of us said a while ago, they're not going to be giving us, you know, investigation results, how can they, and then we all knew that it was just

going to end up being majority of it was going to be lip service and, um, you know, regulatory councils and boards that just basically appease nobody except for the loud mob and apparently not even them. So you never, like that never happens ever. Yeah. But I like the fact that they kept Dave. I think if they didn't keep Dave, that that would be a hole in the size of the ship that they probably couldn't come back from. I definitely agree. I would definitely change the landscape. A DB in a bikini would be a great rebuttal IG post video. Mr. Spin, thank you.

Guys, this story will be unfolding. I'm sure even more stuff will be coming out today, more responses and whatnot, thank you. Guys, this story will be unfolding. I'm sure even more stuff will be coming out today, more responses and whatnot, more information. So make sure you go over to the Barbell Spin. It's on Instagram and over on the internet, barbellspin.com. Andrew Hiller, I'm sure we'll be making a video as things unfold to his delight for his editorial view. And if you're one of the jackasses who actually cares about running an affiliate and making money, stay tuned.

First of all, go to school.com. There's tons of information there. Just type in Matt Souza. But also something big coming in December for affiliate owners. Is that free, Matt? Yeah, it's going to be completely free. Well, shit. All right. All right, guys. Talk to you guys soon.

Thanks for joining us. See you later. Bye bye. Bye, Frank.