The Sevan Podcast - CrossFit Behind Bars | Part 2

Episode Date: June 30, 2024

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Red Fitness is a program, I want to say a CrossFit program, but it's so much more than that. R.S.E.! I think a big thing with this whole group is just the sense of community. The Redemption Road Fitness Foundation is a CrossFit program that is fundamentally changing the way reform happens in and after prison. fundamentally changing the way reform happens in and after prison. With around 2,000 volunteers and participants in over four affiliated and 11 in-development prisons, RF2 teaches healthy habits through mentorship and accountability, giving participants the opportunity for a better life. Redemption Road is, at its core, a culture-changing program. What we do is we take excellent people that have

demonstrated that for decades or years at a time and we help them by giving them the tools that they need in order to make a difference in somebody's life. I volunteer for RF2 because I found CrossFit in prison and it saved my life. And when I see what they're doing, it is a program in prison now saving other people's lives and not only saving other people's lives, changing the whole dynamic of how prison works. That is something that I'd want to be a part of

because I've never seen anything do that before. Never. There's something to this. It gives them an idea. It gives them a belief in themselves. It tears them down first and it builds them back up into stronger, more intelligent beings by, you know, learning to think under pressure, learning to deal with others on a different level. And you find out in pushing yourself and it changes you from the inside out. The alternative is really drugs and gangs. You know, everyone's coming together,

everyone, you know, they're suffering together, they're putting in the work together and there's that bond that gets created. So I think, you know, just a combination of all those things, I think with the program they're doing, it's going to be life changing. Along with building healthy habits while incarcerated, the RF2 community also gives members the support they need upon release. Our members proudly have a zero percent recidivism rate. They are thriving. They are working. They're part of their community. They're building relationships.

They're living on their own. They're part of their community. They're building relationships. They're living on their own. They're doing everything they should be. And I hope they're happy. I think they're happy. They seem happy. bam we're live yo everybody wow wow wow wow good to see you guys holy cow i was like maybe i shouldn't play that maybe uh youtube will give me a strike then i was like whatever fuck it yeah strike schmike good to see you guys trevor what's up nick what's up audrey what's up taylor i think i the only person i met here before is Taylor. Is that right? Yeah. Yeah, that's right. My camera won't flip to my front camera on my laptop. I'm going back and forth. It's on the back.

Don't worry. It's a live show. There's only 1,200 people watching. Don't worry. They like this part of the show. It's like backwards. I'm like, what the heck? Hey, go to uh there's a little gear taylor at the um yeah at the bottom and i'm changing i'm changing go to camera yeah yeah i'm hitting front camera that's a pretty fancy uh oh try back camera yeah i'm on the rear camera oh are there any other choices you guys want to see my office i guess hey that's a pretty fancy computer that has a front and a back camera yeah i was lucky i got that must be like a pc or something audrey is there any way you, and it's not vital, but is there any way you could turn

your camera this way? Your phone this way? I just flipped it. Yes, ma'am. Now I'm upside down. Maybe your screen is locked. Do you know how to unlock your screen? Okay. Yeah. There we go.

I'm going to, is it okay if I exit and try to re-enter? Yeah, yes, sir. Sorry about that, guys. Technical difficulties while we're live. Yeah, it's fine. They love this part of the show. Crazy.

Last time Taylor was on, he was also holding a computer in his lap. And that was show 72. That was like 2, shows ago which is which is just wild for me kind of a little bit of a reality check for me of how much i've been getting at it um or or it tell tell me the name of the tell me the name of the program uh audrey redemption road fitness foundation or we'll use RF2 for short. Redemption Road Fitness Foundation, 0% recidivism.

That's wild. Yeah. Yeah, congratulations. And Audrey, what do you do there? What's your role there? I'm the treasurer for the board. Okay, so you watch the money. Okay. So you watch the money? Yep. I do all the money stuff. And how did you get involved? What was your connection to it?

What brought you to these waters? So my friend, Liz, who I'd worked out with for a long time, found something on Facebook that they were having an event. And she just kind of made an announcement before our class. And I was, I kind of had an idea that this was going on. I didn't really know anything about it, or even that volunteers were allowed to come in and just kind of on a whim decided to just do it. And that was almost five years ago and still here. Did you have anyone behind bars in your family? No. Your religious woman? No. No. Just, just felt that. Just decided. Why do you think you do it? Yeah. Just do it i i don't know it just it's always i read an article uh in our local paper and i thought it sounded really cool and just

didn't know that there was an opportunity to to go in and do it and had never done anything like that never been to prison didn't know anyone in a prison um and just kind of decided, well, like, screw it. I guess I'll just try this. And I think we had about 12 or 15 people from our gym. And I felt really comfortable going in with all those people. And I had a wonderful time and decided to keep coming back. And has it been five years of fulfillment? What's your, what's your five-year assessment of being involved with the program? You know, at the end of the day, we're all just people. Um, and I just kind of found it really unfair that we judge people by really their worst moments and that people can really

overcome those. And they're not just that one bad decision or those couple bad decisions. And, you know, you can just really make a connection with people and it's always just so fun going in and talking to people and having common ground and a community. And that's really what it's all about. Chris, Beesterfield says you need to be audited.

Okay, we'll get on that after. Trevor, what's up, dude? Good to see you. Hey, good morning. And what's your role with Redemption Road Fitness? Well, originally I was one of the first couple guys who got started with it. It was me, Nick, Damian, Brandon, about six other guys. I've just kind of been doing everything since then.

Right now, I'm on the board, and much of the board members, we have different titles, but we all do just whatever is necessary to keep things going um to think that audrey is simply our treasurer would be a sad understatement of everything she actually does for us liz um she's like our volunteer coordinator but she handles so much more than just that and um so like i i help a lot like, getting our message out, trying to get us some money. But more than anything, it's just continually repping our program, trying to make sure people out here know what we're about and what we're doing, why we do it. And Trevor, how long did you do, how long was your stay in jail?

I did 26 and a half years. Wow, you don't look old enough to have done 26 and a half years. I got locked up when I was young. Wow. How old? 17. And how old were you when you found the program? Uh, so I always kind of started with my own journey. And at the very end of 2016 out of Lyman correctional facility, our chris harris uh who became one of our main uh coaches early on created a team competition and he was in he was in two he was an inmate also yeah yeah he was in he's still in still part of the program um and just uh before the before rf2 existed uh guys like nick and damian and them have been doing some CrossFit.

Me and some of my friends have been doing some strength training with a little bit of CrossFit to it. And Chris Harris created this cool, it was like a two or three day competition. And there was really only like three teams, but it was like three teams of four or five. And it was a real blast. And right after that, Damian and cruiser kind of built up on that and, uh, started developing some stuff that ended up turning into RF too. So that's pretty much where I feel like I got started with it. Um, I think Nick and Damien and cruiser Brandon cruiser might feel like it for them. It started a little bit earlier with some of the things that they've been working on. little bit earlier with some of the things that they've been working on hey trevor so if i did the math right if you were in for 26 and a half years and it's 2024 and you started in 2016 this is very complicated i'm gonna say that you didn't find it uh until you were already in for 18 years yeah um and actually uh um what really got me into it was i read first uh brandon cruiser had a copy of first i read first and uh then we watched the games and

honestly i uh me and my friend john willis who's like my best friend that we worked out with for together forever uh we were so impressed with what the women could do we were like we have to get involved in this because there's something to this the women inmates you were impressed by what they could do or videos no actually just watching the women in the games okay yeah that's crazy

that's what got me into it too I saw a video called nasty girls yeah back in 2006 and I was like what is this this is nuts they're very inspiring it took 10 months to figure out that first muscle Yeah, back in 2006, and I was like, what is this? This is crazy. This is nuts. They're very inspiring. Yeah, and it took 10 months to figure out that first muscle.

Hey, what's the name of the book that you read? I want to see if I can find it on Amazon. It's just called First? Yeah, by Rich Froning. Oh, wow. You read that while you were in prison? Yeah, I read that in like 2016, just before I started getting involved in the actual doing crossfit who gave you that book brandon cruiser had it no shit wow yeah and and i remember brandon from the first time is he still in yeah brandon's still in um he's still doing everything

he can uh our our state prisons have gone through a lot of changes since COVID, and there's been really serious staff shortages. So all of our programming has had to evolve, and they've had to find different ways to stay busy and stay focused, getting things done. But he's still there. He's still working super hard, trying to bring positivity and you know community and inside i i was just

this morning i was watching the first podcast i did with brandon and with taylor and with john and uh he said he said he was going to get he was supposed to get out in 2045 well i mean that might be what the uh sentence has on him right now i don't think brandon's doing that much time yeah it would be nice in in my in california they're just letting everyone out you could pretty much do anything it's just a free-for-all it's a purge maybe they can brandon can get in on some of that he could just he'd be like yo you're good you're good it's fine i would love to see it there's actually a lot of guys inside who have done a lot of really good work and have reformed themselves so thoroughly that um it's a shame that they're still incarcerated at this point.

It's not serving any sociological benefit or purpose. Man, we need to talk about that, too. Nick, what's up, dude? The Prez. El Jefe. Oh, I think you're mute. You might be mute. I think something's off with your mic. Can you guys hear Nick? I can't're mute. You might be me. Uh, I think you're something's off with your mic. Can you guys hear Nick? I can't hear him Sir You see that gear down there at the bottom

Let me see it is there uh You guys big behave behave in the um In the comments, please you guys don't read the, um, in the comments, please. You guys don't read the comments. Do not read the comments. So it's a wily bunch in here every morning, but they're already calling us the Brady bunch over here. No, sir. We still can't hear you. Can you hear us, Nick? Oh, that's good. Well, that's going to be a great show for you. Lesson in listening.

Maybe, uh, um, go to the, you're unmuted. Good. Let me see. Go to the gear and then hit the audio. Did you do that? And then, uh, did you just try any mic? Did you try, you tried a variety of mics, anything? Do you have a phone? Do you mics anything do you have a phone do you want to jump on with a phone you okay and then uh could someone text nick uh taylor could you text nick the link so he has a awesome you demand dude and i'm looking at you guys now and none of you guys are uh behind bars now all you are out no wonder this was so easy to do last time was crazy actually in the last uh two years a bunch of people who've been involved in our program have

gotten out and are doing really really well the crossfit community has been super receptive a lot of our guys if they got their l1s or l2s inside have uh found at least homes in some crossfit gyms if not jobs uh most most of our guys who have their l1s and l2s have found work in crossfit uh since getting out oh taylor is that the posse that's gotten out or is that the crew that's inside right now that is most of the we have we've can you guys hear me yeah great great question. I'm going to go on this whole thing. What? Yeah, we've had like a mass exodus, a great mass exodus from farmer corrections, especially with like some high level members in RF2 that helped started or have been like kind of pivotal in its progression and where it's at right now. So that is a barbecue. We do one of those at our buddy Mike's house. I mean, I've been each year, we only had two years now, but for about

two years, that was this last one that we had. And everybody in there had done probably close to a decade, if not double that, you know, like Trevor, and there's a few people in there. And even the first year was a little bit bigger but because now everybody has jobs and things like that so trying to get the barbecue together is hard taylor the when you were on the show last time you were in and you were the guy in the middle and you had a a laptop what ended up happening with your uh with your sentencing did you get out early did the program help did it play a role in in you getting out and did you get out early okay so the criminal justice system is complicated so i guess i'll break it down as easy as possible to

please that quick as best as possible because of rf2 i didn't necessarily get out early, but I did. So objectively speaking, from like a law standpoint, no. But subjectively speaking, you basically, there's no like, the only way you mandatorily get out, like California is a little different. You were making jokes about California. But when their like parole date comes up, that's their parole date. In Colorado, it is a subjective parole date, as well as community corrections. Therefore, if your community corrections date comes up, they're their parole date. In Colorado, it is a subjective parole date as well as community corrections. Therefore, if your community corrections date comes up, they're like,

yeah, your date came up, but it's up to us still, right? What's the community corrections date? What's that? What's community corrections date? So halfway house. So it's kind of like a transition where you go to a, it's still a facility. It's still a facility. And it is exactly what it sounds like. It's a halfway transition point, right? So you're still in a facility. You have to stay there overnight. You check out, you are still actually a DOC inmate, right? So that being the case, you only have X amount of freedom. And also if you have any years hanging over your head, the moment you mess up at a halfway house, you still have all that time hanging over your head. So at a 28 year sentence, I got out after 11 years. Um, therefore I still had about 17 years hanging over my head. Right. Um, so if I messed up during that period of time, I would have had that whole 17 years to

do still. Right. I think we're getting a little feedback from you. I think that's you, Taylor. Because I muted him and it didn't go away. I think you're good, Nick. Okay. Can you guys hear me now? Yeah, let's see. Let's see.

Taylor was trying to blame you, but we're about to find out the truth here. Yeah. His MO. Did you? Okay, so unmute yourself truth here. Yeah. His MO. Did you? So, okay. So unmute yourself, Taylor. Okay, go ahead. So you, did you go to one of those houses?

I did. And the point with me bringing that up was I did get out first try. And actually the halfway house actually asked me to come to their facility, which is not a thing, right? They were like, hey, would you come to our place and like do some, you know, cause RF2 is how they know about me. Right. I do like, uh, presentations for community corrections, which is halfway houses and stuff like that for our program. And I kind of handled the transition aspect of it, which is just people that were incarcerated, helping just people get out as well as all of us do that. So it's not just myself, but inside I was kind of

trying to coordinate some things. And so they asked me to come to that place, which is their halfway house. And so first try, I was able to exit prison on the first date that I could have possibly left. So yes, RF2 did help me get out. Yeah. Something's going on with your audio. Can you choose a different mic or do you have, it sounds like someone in there is sharpening pencils for a living. Is that someone's occupation? They have an electric you have it sounds like someone in there's sharpening pencils for a living do you someone is that someone's occupation they have an electric

pencil sharpener they're running in there no i got i got nothing going on in here i got no fans going i got no that's weird because you looked at the floor like you had a kid like that's the look a parent gives when they're like what are you doing i got three fur babies but no kids okay all right nice um hey uh what do you think um so straight so you were in there and in your date came up your date came up or the the halfway house knew about you and they forced your date um so my date came up there's nothing that the community corrections people can do uh okay out the legislation of like your time compensation but they still did kind of force their hand and how quickly that happens usually getting out is um a process and they moved me

right to the top of the list um because of rf2 and things like that and hopefully helping get them into get into their facility and kind of run some groups i still to this day run crossfit groups every single saturday and like every other Monday and some Fridays. There's an affiliate called Wild Horizons in Fort Collins. I still hear that feedback. I don't know what is going on. Do you have a phone? Do you have a phone?

Yes. You want to try coming on with your phone? Sure. All right. Awesome. Nick, you're the president. You're El Jefe i am i'm el presidente el jefe how's it going thanks for having me yeah dude my pleasure thanks for doing

this you guys yeah absolutely you know the first show i did was everyone's like hey that was your best show ever and that was like 2 000 shows again and then my sister uh nick was like hey you should have those guys on again i'm like like, okay. And then she said it again. I'm like, okay. And she kept bugging me for like a couple months. So then finally I connected her and my producer. And I'm like, you guys figure it out. Like, I'm too busy at the beach living my life.

And then here you guys are. And I'm stoked. I'm really stoked my sister and Matt did this. Yeah, it's super cool. I remember listening to the first show. I was still incarcerated. And my boss was cool enough. We went up to our office and pulled it up online and got to listen to it.

And, yeah, it was a great show. I really enjoyed it. And I'm out now. Obviously, I'm free. And so I was absolutely super happy to be invited to come back on your show. How long were you in? 14 years. And, oh oh small time so you're like you had it you had it easy i had it easy compared to trevor for sure crazy and how old are you uh 44 and um were you in the same facility that john was in from the first show yeah so trevor john and

i damian and brandon cruiser we we were all together at Lyman Correctional Facility, kind of started the whole program together, working out. We were friends beforehand for years and years. And yeah, we were all together, just kind of all into fitness in our own different ways. And the program kind of just evolved from our friendship. And it's grown so far now that uh um yeah i got out you know i started crossfit in 2000 i would say 2012 2013 is when i started uh really getting into the crossfit world uh i saw i actually saw a reps magazine that had richard

froning on the front and uh yeah i was trying, I was trying everything. I was at the time when I, when I was sentenced, I was like 400 pounds. So I was trying to lose weight. I was trying to, I was trying to just find an avenue of fitness and all these magazines were lying to me about like, you know, six minute abs and all that stuff. That wasn't, you were Nick, you were 400 pounds in prison. Uh, yeah. In the county jail okay and then yeah and so my my friend damien was doing crossfit and i just kind of looked at him and i was like man this guy knows what he's doing it looks like way funner than doing five sets of

five on the bench press so i was like all right well i'm gonna get involved in that and so him and i started just doing crossfit together for a while um i lost 200 pounds and uh yeah richard froning's magazine kind of like sealed the deal i was like these guys and ladies are killing the game and so we started doing crossfit uh strength training um doing all sorts of uh you know different uh exercises we there was a show on PBS called The Fitness Truth, which will always stand out to me because a guy in Chattanooga, Tennessee had a, you know, just a small gym

and he would go over the whiteboard session and then he would go over the workout of the day and then they would just show like, you know, clips of people working out and then they would show like afterwards, everybody kind of laying around, high-fiving each other and we would just go out and mimic there was show like afterwards everybody kind of laying around high-fiving each other and uh we would just go out and mimic those workouts um and it really just became a way of life for me have you guys met rich have you any of you guys met rich you know i met him last

year at the games actually at the airport uh we were on the same flight from madison to chicago and uh you know i got a chance to let him know what he meant to me and the direction my life went just from watching his career from afar. Trevor, have you met him? Have you met Rich? No, I'd love to meet Rich, though. Yeah, I think we're going to be meeting him

when we get back from the game. So it'd be up here at the Leadville 100, but Ben, yeah, Ben Bruss is, I did the mayhem missions podcast and I'm pretty good friends with the guy that runs that. And so I think we're trying to figure out a way we can get him into a

facility and coordinate that right now. Dude, that's awesome. Man. He's a, he is a cool dude. Yeah sure yeah he's he uh you know they say you don't want to meet your heroes but when you meet rich he does not disappoint yeah it it's it's it's truly wild and so so um how long were you in before you found crossfit it must have been early on if you were still in the county jail yeah so well i found crossfit once i got to prison i started fitness when i was in the county jail i

was arrested in 08 i spent a couple years in the county jail just fighting my case i had a large amount of uh burglaries and motor vehicle theft and stuff like that i was thank you for sharing that by the way because everyone's like what's he in for what's he yeah you can google it that's all over uh non-violent theft crimes and uh i was addicted to drugs for a very long time and uh which brought me to a life of you know stealing stuff to get money and uh once i was arrested i came down off the drugs and i just replaced one addiction for another so i started eating a lot and i and i gained a tremendous amount of weight uh and then i knew i was going to prison the rest of my life because colorado had a habitual criminal law where they give you four times the sentence uh once you've been arrested it's a it's a drawn out

process but how many times were you arrested uh 12 or 13 okay all for the same thing like getting caught stealing or drug okay yeah all for the same thing drugs and getting caught stealing or drugs? Yeah, all for the same thing, drugs and stealing. And finally, when I got my 60-year sentence is when – yeah, so I went to Lyman Correctional Facility in 2011, and that's when I met Damien. So I started CrossFit right around the beginning of 2012. And by March of 2013, I was down 200 pounds, which was cool. Hey, I spent several years being homeless, and it was by choice. And of the 1,000 people I met when I was homeless, there were only two of us who weren't drug addicts. Of the other 998 were all drug addicts.

And what's fascinating to me, and this is just a little side of social commentary that the news keeps in politicians keep talking about homeless people and i wish they'd understand that they're not homeless people and i'm curious what your take is on this nick they're drug addicts and the profession of drug addicts is because of the hierarchy of their needs is stealing so therefore their vocation is stealing and they're in there when what they do is drugs and then that causes eventual mental illness along with the paranoia of being a crook and they're not even interested in that we're not even interested in housing or they're they're not they weren't even interested in housing it's basically their job sort of sets them up to where having a home is is a low on the priority like a normal man wants housing and a girl and food.

But when you're in drugs, you kind of kick the girls and food and housing out. And that's why when you drive by those encampments, there's just loads of other people's bikes and tents and you just see other people's shit piled up. Is that kind of your assessment too? I wish they would rename it as like, other people's bikes and tents and you just see other people's shit piled up is that is that is that kind of your assessment too i wish they would i wish they would rename it as is like hey we got to get people off of drugs so that they'll stop stealing and then once they and then once they're off of drugs they'll reprioritize getting their own housing yeah absolutely so um you're exactly

right the hierarchy of needs is way different when you're a drug addict. So your drugs are obviously the very top, like that's priority number one. And then obviously getting the drugs is priority number two. So without like a nine to five, because if you just had a nine to five, you'd probably be sober and not doing those things. So your nine to five is stealing. And so those are your two highest priorities. Yeah. Housing is at the very, like the very least of your concern is like somewhere to do drugs. And if you can just find that on the street, then that's what it is. And so, yeah, I agree with you a hundred percent. I believe that homelessness is a direct cause from drug abuse and mental illness, which should be addressed. I always find it ironic that

every Monday you watch the news. I quit watching the news, but you can see on the news that, you know, like this movie just topped the bestseller and they spend, you know, we raised $500 million on a Friday night to watch Star Wars, the 19th edition. But you can never raise $500 million on a Friday night to combat mental illness or drug addiction. And so those things, you know, you're happy if you get like a $10,000 donation. And it's really sad state of where we're at in the world, like, because it is mental illness. And it is. But once you get clean from the drug like i was addicted to drugs for 14 years and my my paradigm has completely shifted to sobriety and i'm you know i'm obviously the

president of this company i work for another nationwide non-profit called the phoenix which deals in recovery as well um and your life can change your life can switch from uh having that focus of drug being your hierarchy to a regular hierarchy of needs, which is, you know, family, shelter, food, you know, career, a lot of the attitude that you have in the world. The world could be changed, drastically changed if we put in the work. And the problem is that the people who have the means don't have any friends who are homeless. And so they miscategorize it, right, because they're told. So the awakening, I put myself in that world. And when I was in that world, then I was, I was enlightened, but the, but most people don't even know that. Right. Cause they don't even, when they see a homeless person, they don't even make eye contact with them. They don't even

recognize them. Right. You know, it's like, uh, when, when they see the guy at the freeway, stop asking for money. They don't even like, you don't have to give them money. You can just look at them and recognize them as a human being and wave at them be like hey dude what's up man hope shit gets better for you i mean that's all you have to say to them that's what i do that's what i do too i uh i do keep uh ones in my door uh little pocket on the side of my door just to give people that especially when it's raining and the weather's crazy i'll help out um the only kicker i got is when they're smoking cigarettes that stuff's like 10 bucks a pack so if you can afford cigarettes you can

afford some food um but nick but aren't they gonna use that i don't ever get here here's my thought on it and i don't i'm not trying to fight with you i'm just um my feeling on it is i want to i want to reward the kid at starbucks or at the local coffee shop who smiles at me and looks at my kids and i want to give him and says hey how are you today um and i want to give him that dollar when i give that money to that person who's on the on the street i feel like i'm voting i'm i'm i'm you know gandhi said uh uh begging's a profession it's the worst profession and so like i feel like everyone's providing us a service and so you keep those Gandhi said begging is a profession. It's the worst profession. And so I feel like everyone's providing us a service,

and so you keep those ones there. Look at me. I'm about to analyze you, Nick. You keep those ones there, and you give them that money because it makes you feel better, right? Yeah, I guess, yeah. But then aren't they going to just go spend that on drugs, and then maybe you're encouraging them to stand there, or you're like, fuck you.

I don't care. I'm doing it. Yeah, I don't know. Yeah, at the same time i'm still gonna help them out they're still human beings and so fair okay um yeah i'm here to help jake chapman uh gandhi was a uh crook and a fraud all right well thanks for uh destroying one of my heroes uh same with mother theresa charlton well great, great. You guys are really. These comments are great. We're off to a great start.

Judy Reed, I tried to give a homeless guy a granola bar, and he went off on me because I need money, and scared the crap out of my daughter in the back. Yeah, one guy, a homeless guy, said, hey, I just need food, and I went back to my house and made him a sandwich, and I gave it to him and he's like fuck you He wanted money I was like alright I get it

I get it And how did you become the president Nick Mr. Wells Yeah sorry How did you become the president so um yeah in like i said i had a 60 year prison sentence in 2019 uh we put on the first competition ever inside of a colorado correctional facility um well first really crossfit competition ever inside prison and that was with john and taylor and brandon yeah john and taylor and

brandon um we were all there and uh we invited 30 people from the street to come in and compete with us and we got randomly paired up with uh our partners um it was just like any other comp you see out here we had you know three workouts and a floater and the the lady I got paired up with that day her name was Violetta Chapin and she we ended up winning that comp that day uh which was cool I've never won anything in my life not like a you know I wasn't really on sports teams or anything like that so it was like the first thing I ever really won so I was already like kind of uh high on uh you know winning a competition and then about a week later I got a Christmas card from her and about a week after that uh she called the correctional facility and uh my case manager called me into his office handed me the phone and it was her and she uh

asked that well basically she just told me that she had it on her heart to get me out and that she was a professor of law at the university of colorado in boulder sorry sorry nick this is the viola chick you partnered with yeah violetta is her name and uh she yeah so she had called up and she just had been thinking about it since the competition and she asked where i was at in my legal proceedings. And the only thing that I had left was clemency. And so we spent the next two years writing a clemency petition and petitioning the governor of Colorado, Jared Polis, for clemency, for a commute. And clemency, I looked it up. It means mercy and lenience. Yeah. So that's exactly what it is. You're just saying, hey, this is what I've done with my time. This is my sentence. And here is a case like maybe you can reconsider that.

And the only person that really has the authority to do so after your court of appeals is the governor. And so on December 30th of 2021, he granted me a clemency, a commute. And I was ecstatic, obviously. And so I went through the parole process and I got out. I walked out a free person on May 10th of 2022. How many years did that take off your sentence? About 10. I had about 10 before I saw parole, before I could actually go through the parole process. So about 10 years. And what do you think was the critical component of getting the clemency? I think our program, I think the basis of our program of helping the fellow inmates achieve like, well, obviously our mission statement was to change prison culture through

mentorship, accountability, and community. And I think that we've done just that. I think that the guys, the men and women that are in our program, they're mentors, they're leaders, they're changing that prison culture from gangs and drugs to one of friendship and fitness and like-mindedness. And that coupled with a lot of the mental health peer assistance work, and there's a lot of stuff that went into it. I didn't get in any trouble when I was in prison.

I stayed away from the violence, the drugs, and all that. And so RF2 being a huge component of that, our work, Trevor, Taylor, myself john brandon damian um every one of those guys have really just put in a lot of hard work uh extra hours uh from sun up to sun down to make the program what it was and i think that our governor kind of just recognized that um and that you know i had a 60 year sentence. There was no one was hurt. It was nonviolent crimes. And under a regular circumstance, I probably would have got 12. But with the habitual criminal law, I got 48 plus an added 12. So, you know, I think that it was the right thing to do in my mind. I'm free, obviously. And I think there was a lot of hard work that went into it.

It wasn't just like a handout. I think the hundred and twenty people that applied that year for clemency, there was two of us that got it. So, wow. What were the three components? Mentorship, accountability. What was the third thing? And community. Hey. Another question off topic that I'm going to judge you severely on, like the dollar handout. When someone's on the side of the road and they're on heroin, would you agree with me that no one wants to be addicted to drugs? Or for the majority of people, that no one wants to be addicted to drugs or for the majority of people don't you don't want to be addicted like you dabble in a little meth with some friends it turns into a week a month a year now you got your own little kit altoid container with credit cards

and razor blades in it you're smashing rocks um you're not even interested you used to do it just to have sex with a bunch of girls now you're not even doing in, you used to do it just to have sex with a bunch of girls. Now you're not even doing that. And just, this shit just turns, goes sideways quick, right? Just because chasing the drug instead of like a accoutrement of partying. Do you think that, is there, is there value in picking those people off the street and putting them in jail? Like just like two weeks here or a month there so that they have an opportunity to get off the drugs is there any value in arresting the people so because i think if i was an addict i i you know from the outside i think if i was an addict i would want it or if my kid was an addict i would want them to be picked up off the street and i know the the system isn't set up for this but it'd be nice if like one of my kids was on drugs and the cops could pick him up and for two weeks he could be just put in a holding cell and just at least have like a dry cell, you know, a moment to like maybe get some clarity. Is that, am I just in dream world or? Yeah, no, you're not in a dream world. So that's what I was getting at. Like we, we arrest them for their drug use and their mental health

issues. Um, and so firsthand, the only way I got sober was by getting arrested and having that tremendous amount of charges and time because I had been in and out of jail. I'd go do two weeks here, a month there, 10 months here. Would you sober up in jail or would you get high in jail? No, I mean, I wouldn't really sober up if drugs came through. Previously, I would do them. sober up if drugs came through previously i would do them um if but once i got this time and i was like really had this like a pivotal moment in my life where i need to sober up when i got sober um the only reason i got sober was because i went to prison and i had that mindset change um i believe wholeheartedly that going to jail saved my life the person that i was

committing burglaries with was shot and killed by the police not too long after I was arrested. So I know that's where my life was going to go. And that was another huge pivotal moment in my life to keep me sober and to change my mindset. I agree with you 100%. The person on the side of the road doesn't want to be doing the heroin. That's just where they're at. I would, I would love to say that I speak for everybody when there's, there's some out there that are like, this is my life.

This is what I want to do. You know, they get pissed when you hit them with Narcan. I keep Narcan in my trunk. Just for that reason. But you know, a lot of people don't want to be in that situation. They want to have a normal life. They're just addicted to these drugs. And so if we had a system where we could take them to a detox to take them to a place. and deeper and you're digging yourself a hole where you're going to go to prison because of a drug addiction. You're going to do these things. And now it's a huge burden on the taxpayers. If there was a different system where we could pluck them off the street, get them sober, have that mind switch, like, you know, a paradigm shift for them and get them interested in a

different avenue of a different outlet right like i found fitness fitness became my outlet uh keeps me sober every day and so i think that that's what we that that's what's needed for sure yeah it's it seems so easy i'm sure the bureaucracy is so thick but it seems so easy like you do a pass you do a pass by an area where there's like just a bunch of you know like 300 homeless people and you pull the van up and you're like hey anyone who wants to get off drugs jump in and you put them in a fucking two-month boot camp and you try to sober them up and you just fucking drill the military style right and then and then and then you come by and be like hey and if you don't jump in we're coming back in two weeks and we're gonna fucking run all your names for me for vagrancy

and then you grab those guys and you put them in a program for two months and you just start the fucking program and then you let them out and then if they they reoffend you put them in the four-month boot camp and if they reoffend you put them in the eight month boot camp especially the dudes who are just like walking around you know on trank or bent over like just grab these fuckers because there's people sons and daughters and i know they don't want to be same thing with prostitution just those girls aren't those no one wants to be a prostitute just grab those fucking people and put them in a fucking boot camp for a month and give them just a shot to get their own um uh clarity you know and

uh yeah it's it's wild it seems especially when there's people like you guys who, who, you know, with the 0% recidivism, it just seems like a fucking no brainer. Like, Hey, just run extra, just massive exercise camps. Yeah, for sure. I think that's a, I mean, our 0% recidivism is based off of our coaches. So when we take, when people are interested in our program, we have a criteria, Taylor, you probably articulate this way better than me. Uh, but if you want to,

you want to go ahead and tell them, Taylor, let me ask you one question before we get to that. Who was the governor that, that, uh, gave you clemency? Jared Polis. And did you ever meet him face to face? Uh, I have not met him face to face. I have gone back to his office and was able to sit down and talk to him about like Brandon Cruiser and a couple other of our friends.

So I get to, I get to meet his lawyers quite often. I've met all the members of the commute of the clemency board that signed off on my clemency. I've met them individually at functions. off on my clemency. I've met them individually at functions. Um, and you know, I'm actually going to do a CrossFit workout with one of them, uh, coming up on July 4th. Uh, so I'm really excited about that. Um, but yeah, I would love to meet him. I mean, he's got my vote no matter what, what state Colorado. Hey, how cool is that? That you're so that's like probably the biggest gift you can give back to the guys who are in doing the program is going back and be like, look, dude, I'm the product because it makes them feel good, too. Right. You're like, hey, man, I'm the product of what you supported.

So absolutely. So that's why I go back in. I'm a I'm a volunteer for the Department of Corrections. I go into I would say I go into about 10 facilities, one of them being like taylor and i went back and did murph at lyman correctional facility uh back in may and to go back and see the guys that we lived around for you know a decade and a half trevor was there for 20 years 20 something years um to go back and give back it gives the people hope it gives the guys that are just new to our program um like it anything can happen like trevor had a life sentence i had 60 years uh here we are we're back in our regular clothes bringing a group of people in to do murph and that's how it starts uh with a little bit of belief that you can change your your situation and really when it comes down to it like you're the only one that can change your situation.

So anything is possible. Right. Um, I, it's gotta be a pretty inexpensive program as far as programs go. I mean, yeah, except for CrossFit equipment, it's not cheap, you know, like a rowers, a thousand bucks, all that stuff's a thousand dollars. But I mean, relative to the money that's probably flushed down the toilet and big bureaucracies of, uh, you know, military prison. It's just drops. It's penny.

It's pennies on the dollar. If you would, if you, you know, invest in some equipment, they buy $40,000 worth of garbage equipment, like treadmills and that breakdown in a day or two. They put all these weird equipment into the yard.

It's like, I don't even know. It looked like a playground equipment, but they spent 40 grand on it. And I was like, you guys could have spent 40 grand and given me the list and i would have got you guys something that's you know that's gonna actually uh do something for uh the population other than just sit there and rust and so yeah um it's it's relatively inexpensive it's just fitness and taylor uh hi what's up dude what up what up yeah good to see you again man good to see you in your in your situation you're in now instead of with a

laptop in a jail cell with three other dudes yeah yeah it's definitely different congratulations how long have you been out uh so a little over a year what was cool actually trevor had his year mark yesterday um i uh didn't actually realize when my year mark passed. I must have been just kind of busy with my head down grinding. But just a little over a year, about a month or so. So out of the halfway house. So I haven't been a DOC client for about six months. Okay.

And I think you were going to say something about the recidivism rate. What were we talking about, Nick, that I stopped you from pitching to Taylor? Oh, Taylor can talk about it. Like our program, we develop our coaches. And we would love to say that everybody that goes through our program, like all the participants, that we have a 0% recidivism rate. But that's just not the case. But the guys that we develop that do our

coach candidate process that become coaches and that have gotten out none of those people have reoffended so taylor take it away kind of so we actually don't have zero percent zero percent recidivism right either anymore but that being the case that's just a i don't like the statistic being like i love the statistic but it's not going to last right and my point in saying this isn't to say that our program doesn't work i'm just saying that perfection isn't necessarily the goal right but to contrast like it's such a stark contrast so the national recidivism average and this was like i think the statistic pulled from two or two to four years ago so it might not be completely accurate today but it's somewhere probably around there nationally we have 74 percent of people within

the first three years that exit any correctional facility in the united states go back in in their first three years whether that's jail whether that's any kind of justice setting they recidivize within the first three years in colorado i think it's around uh 52 or 54 percent and so even uh our rate is probably like two percent right okay two percent recidivism and that's just a byproduct i don't like that like we're not doing this because of a statistic we're doing it because it works and it changes lives and even the people if say if they do later on down the road, that does change a little bit. We know that we had just like a huge role in their lives

of changing them into a better person. And so that's what usually I like to kind of focus on is saying that that's just like a small piece of just us doing our job and just helping people and continuing to help them. Actually, you could argue that though, of all the programs out there, that it has the lowest recidivism rate by far. It's like this program they have. They have a CrossFit program for juvenile delinquents in Ohio that CrossFit Crave does. And like, I don't think they have zero either, but it's like crazy low. There's no other program that's as low as theirs.

And by the way, the big component to it is that they make the parole, uh, uh, the probation officers work out with the kids. And I think that's gotta be just huge. Yeah. I wouldn't even have to argue that our program has the lowest. I could just, we could just like state that like objectively that I would say that that is definitely the case. Yeah. Yeah. Um, did you know when sorry go ahead go ahead go ahead what were you gonna say no no go ahead go ahead i think i lost my train of thought so you got one right there go ahead take off on it when you i will always lose my train of thought but there's

another thought right behind it always um when you would so so you're in and when you get out do you know that you're going to continue with the uh program like is this light is this life for you now you may not be in prison for life, but this is going to be life helping guys on the inside? So, yeah, I guess I could tell you a little bit about kind of what we do. So you were talking about picking people up off a heroin. I want to go back to this. Please. Yeah, great. I like this subject a lot. Yeah.

So boot camps. You're talking about boot camps, exercise boot camps. So Nick does it a little differently because he works with the phoenix as well so rf2 is just like it's like the roots of us right and the branches and the and like the personality of us we sometimes have to filter into different jobs just to be able to pay the bills right so um nick is doing that fantastic fantastically through um the phoenix right which is which is a that the foundation? I know it's the Phoenix Foundation. They have CrossFit gyms and stuff too, and they help people. If you're sober for 24

hours, you can work out for free. Okay. I've visited some of their gyms. I think they gave Greg Glassman their Person of the Year Award one year or something. I went to a big ceremony. Yeah, for sure. That's the same organization. Okay.

Then me and Trevor work as recovery coaches or peer specialists or whatever you want to call it for the same company. And so Nick was talking about being a mental health peer assistant inside. So we've been doing this work inside people's lives and it's based on our job. Our credential that we actually have is called a peer specialist or recovery coach, right? That's how I pay the bills. And that's the job that I do outside of CrossFit as well, like coaching classes and things like that. So we help people that are in addiction and we create the path that's best suited for them. So instead of having to take a street sweeper and sweep up people into jails and facilities and correctional facilities where I bet the statistic

as far as them re like using again, right? It's very, very high, right? Because that bootcamp is only going to last so long and motivation is fleeting. But to be able to teach people discipline, not discipline, just doing what you don't want to do, or doing what you want to do when you don't want to do it, right? So our job is to work within justice settings, and we take people and we help them if they're addicted to any kind of substance, and they're in the recovery for as long as recovery is, right? They could be on recovery for three years or one hour. And I work with people individually, and I teach workshops to help people stay sober and also kind of acclimate to their new life outside of incarceration. And that I feel is the new way of, instead of locking people up,

helping people find a new path and a new light and teaching them life skills that they probably once knew, but kind of just like reintegrating it into their, like the front part of their brain or like the something that they can use immediately to help kind of guide their, their path away from drugs and give them something to fill that void because too often when people get put in a in a facility they take addiction away it's it's it has to happen unless there's drugs inside the facility

and even then that's a little more expensive than people can probably afford when it's in a facility right so the addicts get sober but they get sober and there's a void there and that void only gets filled if they find something passionate about it so our job is to kind of fill that that that void with either fitness or crossfit or some kind of passion like that so that they're not just saying hey i'm not using anymore they're instead saying i don't have to use because i have this new fuel this new passion this new light for life and um that's kind of what we do as recovery coaches and then we bring the rf2 banner into that and so uh i work with an affiliate here in fort collins it's called wild horizons and the guys um the guy that owns it the affiliate owner his name is ryan garcia wow and he's the it's not the

ryan garcia is it not like the fighter yeah no he sends me memes and stuff all the time and says gosh he's making my name look bad. It's hilarious. It's hilarious, yeah, because there's some silly videos of Ryan doing some funny stuff. But the other Ryan, right, he has been involved in CrossFit for, I think he's had it as an affiliate for 12 years, 10 years, something like that. So he's been around for a while. He's a little bit of an OG in the game. And he, I got out. I met him as well as one of our other coaches got out

and we created a connection. We're like, hey guys, we're just getting out of prison and we really want to do CrossFit. Is it cool if we come here? I don't have any money, but I would love to like clean the gym and do whatever you need so that we can just get some wads in.

And I actually got it out in the middle of quarterfinals or right before quarterfinals started. And this was last year. And he's like, yeah, dude, I'll coach you and judge you for quarterfinals. I got to do the third open workout there as well. But then I qualified and he's like, he's like, anytime you want, because I had a pass system because I was still in the halfway house, right? So I could only leave at certain times. And nobody on level one is usually allowed to leave to the gym in a halfway house. But I just talked to the people in there. And I was like, Hey, I qualified for this competition. It's like top 10% in the world, which is kind of cool. And I would,

I would love you guys as permission if I could go to this gym. Um, and this, this gentleman's willing to come in outside of his work hours at random times so that I could complete all five tests. And he did that. And I was able to go there. And then ever since then, um, he created this program where we raise money for anybody getting out of prison within their first three months that they have three months free affiliation inside the CrossFit gym. And then after that, we'll see where their financial stability is, right? If they can afford it, cool. If you can't, we'll still work to donate. And we raise more than enough money, more than enough money. Yep, there it is. There's the gym. And you'll see all my Instagram videos probably filmed there. I like to make some cool workout videos.

That's the background of that. But that's the affiliate. And we try to do that everywhere we can, right? I know Nick has a fantastic establishment in Colorado Springs with Decimate. And I know Trevor with Mock in Aurora is doing the exact same thing. So this is not like just unique to me. This is just our team members getting out, creating the connections. And when people hear about this, they're, it's like almost undeniably like, yep.

Okay. I got to help here because like, this is a calling. This is what CrossFit is. This is the community aspect of what CrossFit is. And Ryan's done a fantastic job of allowing people to get out and create continuity of care by allowing them to do the thing that they loved inside and keeping that passion alive, right? Even though it's a different landscape, they keep that passion alive. So that way they don't like get back into criminal thinking,

continue to use, you know, blah, blah, blah, fill in that blank, whatever they were doing, you get complacent or you get into a new uncomfortable scenario. You usually go back to your old way of thinking, right? If we can create a smooth transition process from exiting incarceration into being able to fall into exactly what you were doing inside, right? I'm coaching people squats. I'm saying, right? Right. Okay. With a hinge right here, I want to keep your barbell on the legs. This is what I know. This is how I communicate with people. And this is how I've established these healthy relationships that don't want that, that make it so that I don't want to use anymore. Right.

Let's do that again. Right. And so all these gyms that we work with, all the owners are like absolutely you guys can come in here and keep doing that. This is fantastic. I love you guys as program. You guys are doing fantastic things. And then they feel loved and they feel welcomed at a, at a point in which their life, they don't, they're not too sure of me getting out after 10 plus years.

I don't know if the society that I hurt originally is going to accept me, right? But then when I go into the CrossFit community and everybody's just as welcoming, accepting as they were inside, if not a little bit more, maybe, right? I feel welcomed and I feel secure in like my new environment. And then I'm like, okay, cool. I can keep progressing i can keep striving to be a better person i can keep teaching people how to deadlift well and you know that transfers to their life hey what what a great explanation you're right nick uh good job uh

recognizing that and taylor so um they they your the your lives overlap so if you don't have if you don't have this program in prison, you have this really isolated, unique lifestyle that occurs in prison and you get out and it's like, the only thing that you do the same as maybe you eat, but then and breathe, but you come out and now it's kind of, there's an overlap and there's a place where you recognize, okay, I did this here and I can do this here. And it's a place to get your feet grounded. Hey, you're telling me that you sent an email to this dude, Ryan Garcia at wild horizons and was like, Hey dude, I got out of jail. I'm in a halfway house. Can I come over and use your gym? I'll clean your bathrooms. No, we just showed up me and my friend, David. No, he showed up to the gym. What up we do crossfit too right and uh when i showed

up i was in the middle of the open so i was like hey is it cool if i do like the third workout here like the third uh point three and your buddy didn't work out there either your buddy didn't work out there either no he got out just just a little bit before me wow and was was ryan looking at you sideways and shit like take a step back and look at your corner of your eye? No, not at all. He was very accepting. He's a man of few words. He doesn't say much. He almost just grunts as a yes. He's like, very burly. And he's military, right? Okay, okay. So I feel like he understands a little bit of it, even if he doesn't in a certain sense, because some people come from the military.

There's a captivity component to that, too, to the military. Yeah, exactly. And he's just like a person of high character. So he looks at somebody and they're, you know, they make a lot of money. They might drive a Mercedes Benz, but their character might be trash. Right. And then there's an individual that only has one t-shirt to his name. Maybe not me. This was the other individual I was with because he met him first. He sees this individual.

He only owns two pairs of shorts and a t-shirt. He needs to borrow Ryan's Noble Lifter so he can do some Olympic lifting correctly because he can't. Ryan looks at him and says, oh, yeah, this person's about it. No matter where he comes from, no matter what lifestyle he had before, he comes in, he makes sure that, you know, everybody's well taken care of in the gym. Like we go around, we high five, we don't clean up until the whole workout's done. Little stuff like that.

Whereas the other person who might not seem like somebody that you would side-eye, those are the people cleaning up, not even saying later, peace, taking off before everybody's done with the workout and then kind of doing their own thing. Whereas like I look at this as like my own escape not even saying later, peace, taking off before everybody's done with the workout and then kind of doing their own thing. Whereas I look at this as my own escape and just a way to continue to keep a healthy mindset and then bringing other people into it

because everybody's fighting their own demons too, right? Just because they didn't come out of prison, they're in that class and you're doing thrusters and burpees for 21, 15, nine, there's something wrong with you. You've been through some stuff and you've been hurt. You know what I mean? So if I can be there for you too, right?

You got your own demons that you're fighting. Even if you work at CSU as a professor or whatever the case may be. Brandon Lecoq. Nick was great. I competed Colorado Springs event last year. So this guy, this guy, this guy ran into you,

Nick. Yeah. So we hosted a fundraising event. We always call it redemption road. And the owner of the gym I managed for a while and coach at CrossFit Decimate in the Springs,

we hosted it there. And we brought people from all over the state. And HWPO came in. They programmed the workouts for us. Jake flew in for the event. And it was great. Jake Marconi? Jake Marconi? Yeah, Jake Marconi. He flew in for the event and uh jake marconi jake marconi yeah jake marconi yeah he came in for the event uh it was a lot of fun but uh yeah brandon was there competing which

was super cool i saw that in the chat um yeah i would like to also shoot a shout out to alex escada he's the owner of crossfit decimate west and east now we have a new location in saint pete uh florida but he hired me before i even got out of prison uh he sent me a jpay letter basically telling me that i could put him down as a parole plan for my work wow and gave me a place to go the day i got out and you know i started just like fixing rowers and painting walls and stuff and then I started coaching and then he actually moved to Florida and left me as the manager there's a lot of trust there that goes into a 250 member gym with 8,000 square feet and you know it was in my mind like it was exactly like there was no better avenue between the Phoenix and decimate. Like I had a community of people that were like-minded and it that's the

transition that we're trying to establish in all of our communities up and down the front range of Fred Dayton from mock nine 83. He's a welcome to our coaches as well. The owner, I think her name is Michelle from Park Hill CrossFit. She has our coaches up there as well. John Brown, seminar staff. He is just at an L1 at a gym up in, well, at a rifle correctional facility and is hiring our coaches for his gym, CrossFit Agogi, out in Montrose, Colorado. But without these affiliate owners stepping up to the plate and giving our guys a chance, like here at Decimate, Rudy, folks, he's one of our coaches.

He's coached there now. Everybody at our gym knows our name and knows our program and loves it. And it's it's from the affiliate owners who really take a chance on our coaches. But we also develop some of the best coaches in the game. So we got to give a shout out to our coaches and our teams inside for, for developing the coaching that we, that we do have. And well, we continue to get out and continue to make strides and letting people know that we are developing great,

great coaches and great human beings. Hey, Audrey, you've been doing this five years. Yeah, it'll be five years in October, I think. Is it an emotional job being that you were never on the inside and watching these stories filter around you? It can be. You know, it's just, it's really cool to just see the capacity for people to change and just the accountability.

I've met numerous people who are some of the strongest characters that I've ever met and these are people who don't even have the opportunity to ever get out. And that can be really hard because I feel like I have worked with several of these people for years. And, you know, you get to know them, you talk to them, you just get to know them as a person. And you know in your heart that if they had the opportunity, they would thrive. But that door is just closed.

And that can be really difficult to deal with. And when you mean thrive, you mean get out from behind bars and be a contributing member to society? Yeah. There's several people that I feel very strongly if they had that opportunity, they could get out and they could get a job and have a community and a family and do very well. But that's just unfortunately not an option as it stands. Is redemption growing at a fast rate, at a slow rate? What are some of the obstacles for redemption, Audrey, that you see of its growth? Well, I think part of it is, you know, we do have to work with DOC.

So there are some interesting hurdles there in terms of getting into facilities. And fortunately, now we've kind of gotten the momentum uh when i first started there was only two we were only in two facilities and now we're in 10 so all at the beginning all in colorado yes okay yeah so you know the beginning i think they were you know maybe a little there's a little bit of side eye of like you want to do what I think they were, you know, maybe a little, there's a little bit of side eye of like, you want to do what? I'm sorry. Like, no. And now that we're, we've kind of proven ourselves and we're in a lot of places and they're seeing, you know, that our program and how it works and how it changes the culture, even for even outside of the program, they're a lot more willing to do so. And we've gotten interest from other states and even other countries in terms of wanting to start similar programs. And I think we just need the manpower and the funding to do it.

So, so there, there, the, the bureaucracy is significant. Yeah, it can be. It definitely was in the beginning. I'm sure Trevor and Nick and some of us, our founding guys, can talk about trying to get that first program off the ground and the interesting hurdles they had to overcome with that. hurdles they had to overcome with that. Has your perspective on, I'm guessing that you never knew anyone who was ever in prison, had no association with prison or crime, that you were just an outstanding citizen living your life, and now you're just fully immersed in the whole system, whether it be the inside culture and the, and the, the world that circles around it, you know, in terms of like finances and government and bureaucracy and the commercialism

of it has your, if that's true. And even if it's not true, could you tell me, but has your perspective on, on life changed? I mean, I think I definitely feel like my compassion has grown in my understanding of, you know, I think a lot of people will see things and think, okay, well, we'll just like, lock them up and throw away the key. And that's the solution. But it's really not and it doesn't have to be. And if you give people the opportunity, and the support, a lot of people do want to change and they just don't have the tools to do so. And if you just give them that little bit of time and that little bit of compassion and some resources, they can go very, very far. Is the prison system in Colorado privatized or is it run by the government?

Is the prison system in Colorado privatized or is it run by the government? It is. I think we have two private prisons in Colorado and the rest are government run. And do you guys work in just the government run ones? Correct. Yeah, we are not. We haven't been able to get into those private facilities. And is there is there is there a reason for that for the private ones is there anything you could share with me about the politics of getting into a private one versus one that's run by the state um maybe maybe any of the guys can talk here but from my understanding is they're just not really interested in bringing in programs um and they're so they've just kind of shut the door on that um

but i'm not sure if you know taylor trevor nick want to add in on that it might help nick do you have any thoughts on the difference because in in i have some presuppositions my thought is is that if you have a private system well anywhere there's money changing hands um then all of a sudden you guys have become the product, right? Yeah. So there's probably some resistance to lose product, right? So, yeah, that's exactly it. Colorado did a lot of headway on getting rid of private prisons, which is I'm all for.

I think private prison is a horrible ordeal when you're capitalizing on somebody else's incarceration. You have no desire to have those people stay free you want them to come in you want that revolving door and colorado's done away with all their private prisons we actually have a ton but they are uh alaska inmates arizona california they're all housed here which has to be horrible as well uh for those guys that are living in those prisons uh we do have because because their families can't visit them right yeah no i mean what what's the incentive of being good because so the state of alaska would be like hey we are we're full we have 10 guys we're sending them down there here's 10 guys and five million dollars there is a facility north of denver called

hudson that's completely full of alaskan inmates so wow um but uh the two that are open it's a long drawn out thing you need to watch a pbs special on like the the two that are open, it's a long drawn out thing. And you can watch a PBS special on like the water rights in Southern Colorado. It's kind of an, it's interesting, but the only reason they kept those two alive is because it beats like Southeast Colorado. Uh, those two prisons are main, the main, uh, employer, uh, of the, the people that live in those areas. And so, um, it's a really, you're right.

So you nailed it. It becomes economics. It's economics. Not about how to treat humans. Look, at the end of the day, it's really long and drawn out. But yeah, Colorado sold their water rights to the Arkansas River, which basically destroyed that sub-southeast Colorado. And they have two prisons, bent county and um crowley county that basically serve

as the source of income for the folks that live down there instead of now agriculture and which would be its top producer but they sold the water rights um but yeah getting into those private prisons has been a challenge starting an initiative inside it because we're inmate-led programming like we didn't have any uh outside help aside from like our foundation um pushing for us but getting getting the the staff and the administration on board to letting us buy the equipment start the program and mentor other guys uh has just been a really hard feat there's still guys doing crossfit style that have been transferred to those prisons in those prisons. We just can't have our, we just don't have our program up and running like it is in all the other

facilities. Do they have to stop doing CrossFit if they go somewhere where there's not the program? They're not going to stop no matter what they're going to go out on their rec poles and still do CrossFit and do that. And like, they're going to have a group of guys doing it with them they just don't have the time slots and the classes like you would see at any of our other Redemption Road affiliates and to speak well Aunt Audrey was saying earlier you know we did start with two facilities we had four affiliates

we're up to seven since I've been out we've added three and we're about to add another three affiliates. We're in the process of putting in the paperwork to come up to 10 affiliates that are operating classes every single day inside the Department of Corrections, which is outstanding. You know, the goal is to have all 18 facilities on board, but you know two of those are private and so if we could get right now we're we're exceeding um any expectations that we had when we first started this program are the guards do the guards participate nick do they work out uh yeah absolutely so we started training staff um well it all started when we we brought uh veterans into our program we did a veterans event at lyman where we invited every veteran for either incarcerated and or staff and

we kind of did like a hero workout for them um and then individually i think like trevor was writing a lot of programming for staff members just to do on their own. And then we did our very first WODFest competition. The one I was speaking of earlier, we did at Lyman Correctional Facility to raise money for a staff gym. And so we donated all the funds from that program or from that event to raise money to build a staff gym that they can go work out at separate. And then we started hosting a class at night where at Lyman, where we could bring in staff members that were getting off shift or coming on shift. And it was from like basically nine 30, 10 o'clock at night till midnight.

And we would just run them through programming. But a lot of the nurses staff members, you know, a lot of these rural towns don't have a CrossFit gym and everybody wants to do CrossFit, so they just utilize our gym as their own home CrossFit box, which is really cool. Trevor, you ever worked out with guards or staff there? Definitely. We were able to do some. The early days at Lyman, before I left there to go to Fremont, where I met Taylor and we got a program started up there um I was doing a lot of programming uh me Damian John

we were writing a lot of programming for uh some of the staff uh they weren't quite allowed to do things with us just yet um before I left I think I did get to do a couple workouts with some of the staff over there at Lyman then when I got to Fremont and we got the program going it was kind of becoming established as a practice. You got transferred? Sorry, you got transferred to a different prison and started a program over there? Yeah.

So I had to leave Lyman. I didn't want to. But part of my transition to get out, I had to go to another facility. And, I mean, it worked out great. It got to meet Taylor, which was totally worth it. So when I got to Fremont, there were some guys over there already doing crossfit uh as much as they could and they knew about our program and they've been trying to get it going uh they just didn't have like the the access and the traction that we had developed at lyman yet

you gravitated to those guys like how soon like you go there and your first night there when you wake up in the morning you're like where are the fucking crossfitters is it like that yeah yeah that's a trip that's such a trip okay you knew those were your people you knew those were your people yeah absolutely um and so uh when i got over there uh taylor and about four other guys michael bb michael clark uh glenn worley um evan lawler these are like really good, really good friends of mine still. We got together with the staff. We created a proposal to get Redemption Road Fitness Foundation

started at Fremont. One of our former main volunteers came in, Chris Dong, who is a major in the sports. That's the guy's name, Chris Dong? Yeah, Chris Dong. That's a great name. Sevan Dong. It is a great name, right? Oh my God, I changed my last name to Dong. Chris Dong. Yeah. Chris Dong is a great name. Oh my God. I changed my last name to Dong. Sorry, Audrey. Sorry. Sorry. Sorry. I have a little bit of a 14 year old boy in me.

Sorry. We all have that. But with Chris's help, that program flourished. And right away it was there were staff members and there was a heavy presence of correctional industries, which is like a for-profit jobs that exists for inmates to go work in during the day. And then it's like for-profit, so the facility gets a benefit, and then the industry gets a benefit. So the facility gets a benefit and then the industry gets a benefit. But there were guys, staff members from the industries that would come work out with us or GED teachers, some staff. So we had kind of a mix of people who would show up to work out with us. And like you've heard it mentioned a couple of times about community. One of the biggest things we've always tried to do is break down the barriers that split people up inside and kind of out here now as well.

to do is break down the barriers that split people up inside and kind of out here now as well but uh race politics gangs um the green and blue uh we wear green in Colorado as inmates so uh the green and blue barrier we were trying to cross all those and help everyone see um it doesn't matter what race you were um what your crime was what uh you work. Like if you want to come be a part of this, you are super welcome. And then when you sit there and suffer through a CrossFit workout with someone, you feel their pain and you feel very connected to them in a different way than just seeing them, you know, in passing or in a professional setting. You saw relationships change between inmates and guards through the workouts? Oh, absolutely, yeah.

Very significant culture shift happened during those days. Isn't it amazing? Yeah. Yeah. It's a magic. I think Glassman said it's a magic. It's crazy. It's just like you're working out next to someone,

and prior to the workout you haven't even done nothing but shake their hand and meet them and but afterwards you're laying there and all barriers are down what are you doing afterwards what do you what's your you know you start talking about their family it's just nuts that's exactly it's beautiful were you gonna say something taylor yeah i remember the first episode that we had um john said something he said that you know back in like the jurassic period if we're running from t-rexes i don't care uh how what race you are you know what i mean what what you know what your whatever right your preferences are like we got to get to safety and we got to find food right like all that other stuff is just like um it's uh up to luxury to be you know have your prejudices and things like that.

And so when we're on the floor sweating together and both of us are doing the same workout and, you know, that relative intensity makes us suffer the same. It doesn't matter if you're wearing blue. It doesn't matter if I'm wearing green. same thing. And that kind of breaks down like that, that divide or that line in the sand that you quite literally almost always feel other than when you're on that gym floor together. And then it kind of dissipates after that, right? Now there still is professionalism and things like that, that you need to keep in consideration, but it makes it easier. Say if there is an instance or a situation outside of the gym that takes place, makes it easier for you to be a mediator for the situation because you know this person is a person even though they're wearing blue and then they see you as more of a person now right they see you as oh man this dude taught me how to deadlift well

right he showed me what a thruster was which was super cool i didn't know what that was because all i do is you know five sets of five on the bench before i met you guys um and i'm still a fan of five sets of five on the bench don't get it twisted but being able to teach people all the above is fantastic and it kind of helps the situation break down the like the tension that is almost always there and so it makes this ease of of like your life and their life a little nicer when we have this affiliate that's running classes for staff as well as GP and general population and stuff like that. So it's cool. It's sincere conversation. Also, it's not forced. It's like real. It's it's, you know what I mean?

Like if a guard making small talk to you or you making small talk to a guard, probably people's spidey senses are up. What's he doing? What's he manipulating? What's the point? As opposed to dude, how do you, how did you last week? You couldn't bench 200. Now you bench 225. What are you doing? And then, you know, like the guy seriously looking for a tip, right. On where to put his hands or, and so right away, you have a, some form of sincerity. What happened to John, uh, Taylor? Um, I know when he was on the show, uh, he was doing life and, and I was fascinated with how a human being could get their head wrapped around accepting that. Is there any chance of him getting out or what's he up to?

So I tried to email and get Brandon and John on this podcast, but sadly, the climate sometimes is just hot and cold. And right now we just hit it at a time that it's a little more cold so they weren't able to make it but john's doing his thing so is brandon um brandon will eventually get out john does have life and i don't know if i'm able to answer that question as far as how to wrap my head around that like trevor could possibly do that or even nick because both of them had closer i had had like a 30-year sentence. So I knew that one day I was going to be out, which was nice. And John is one of the coolest people in the sense that he still does what he needs to do and looks at his environment in the best paradigm possible.

And he just states that, you know, God placed him here for a reason. And, you know, if the time comes where he's able to get let out, then he will do what he needs to do when he gets let out. But until then, he's going to do the work that he needs to do while he's in there. And so he just keeps doing the work. You know, there's good days, there's bad days. But he he actually explained the process on the show of how he did it. And I was like, man, man, you should write this down. And then I was like, hey, does the corrections department give you any tools on how to? And he said and i'm like well since you figured it out you should formalize that you should write that down or make an audio tape or something so guys who get life can be like hey

this is how i did it this is how i was able able to you know manage the psychological component of of you know you know, being held captive, uh, for the, for your remaining days on earth. I mean, uh, is there, is there a chance of him getting out? Do any of you guys know anything? Is there hope? I mean, there's hope there's clemency like mine. So my attorney actually has taken up, uh, representing both Brandon cruiser and John

Willis. Oh, awesome. So she, you know, she went and met those guys. Brandon's going to get out eventually, no matter what, but she's really focused on John's, you know, there's a, there's timelines there's before you can apply for clemency, you have to do 20, 20 years straight. When with the first degree murder or a life without a charge, you have to wait the 20 years.

And so that's coming up next year for him, I believe. And so they're, they've been working tirelessly on his clemency petition right now, but have to wait to file it until that 20 year mark. Brandon's been up. I went to the governor on his behalf last year, went to their, we've met with their attorneys. Matt Frazier went to bat for

him on his instagram wow he has a he has a really good relationship with matt they talk like weekly wow he's offered him jobs at hwpo and to train him for the games he's a really uh he's a really great athlete um and so they they do really have good chances. Uh, Brandon, um, has a really good chance, maybe even a higher chance than John. But at the same time, I believe, uh, what John's done with his time will, will shine through and that he'll get it as well. But I'm also super optimistic. Uh, I, I know these guys through and through, and that's the thing, right? When you look at someone's crime and you can say, Hey, this person did this, this, and

this, you don't know that person. When you live next door to that person, like I, what I explained to the governor on Brandon's behalf is that I've seen Brandon on his good days and bad days. Like I'm not even going to sugarcoat it. Like I've wanted to like, you know, beat up Brandon myself, but, uh, he's, we've lived next to each other. We're like brothers, you know? And so I've lived next door to him. I've seen his good days. I've seen his bad days. I've seen Trevor's good days, his bad days. And they've also seen mine, you know, and we're the ones that can give you the best representation of what that person's like on a day-to-day basis. And they both deserve to be free. They both at this, like, I think

Trevor hit it best when we started this conversation that there's a ton of guys and ladies doing time inside prison that have totally transformed their life and have had that paradigm shift and are actively seeking uh better and bettering the men and women around them uh and so at this point holding them is just a burden on the taxpayer but also it's just about punishment it's not about correction anymore and so there's got to be a fine line. And so one of our case managers, Mr. Milburn, he's the one that got helped me get out. He's really focused on, there's an aspect in our government where the governor can give you a different parole date. He has the absolute power to do that. And so it's not like a clemency it's just changing your parole days and so we're trying to work a process where you can get a rep get a hearing for that like you

get a five minute fran time and you get a hearing yeah you get sub four minutes on brand you automatically get clemency no yeah um so no it's uh there's a process um that we're trying to we're trying to figure out and that he's absolutely trying to uh figure out um and he's retired now but he's dedicated his time to try to to to make that a formal process um but yeah so john and brandon are great i think that they deserve to be out um i would stake my freedom on it uh that they would never reoffend and um i'm sure every guy who taylor and trevor would do the same here uh but yeah i mean i i believe that they will get out um i believe john will eventually get clemency as well um taylor has my phone number uh taylor feel free to pass it around um uh i probably get like 500

texts a day i'm not great at returning them but i would like to any events you guys have any way you could leverage the podcast anytime you guys want to come on for like just five or ten minutes the show isn't like a normal podcast it's more like sesame street people come on people come off and um it's it's a it's a it's a fun place and and as you guys know the crossfit community is great so anytime you guys have something upcoming or you want to share it or you want to tell a story like you got you know we their shows were like you know i'll have like five or six people parade through here and so please uh yeah it was too long to be separated uh from these this story it's probably the most you know one of the most compelling veins that runs through this podcast people bring up the show all the time and so yeah don't hesitate to text me ryan garcia memes or or just whatever uh yeah stay in contact

this shows every morning at 7 a.m. There's also a phone number that usually runs across the bottom. You can call in or you can text me and I'll send you a link and you can pop on and be like, dude, we're doing this event in Colorado on this day and we can just shoot the shit about it for five minutes. It doesn't even have to be a full-blown show like this.

I'm going to hop on and get on this chat. I've been watching the chat the entire time. Oh, they're savage. I apologize. No, it's cool. I love it. They're all closeted stand-up comics. Yeah, for sure.

Everybody's a comedian. I wish I didn't have to switch to my phone because I would have been hitting them back right away this entire time. The one guy did ask, though, if I was at the Purple Mountain Throwdown this weekend. And absolutely, I was at the purple please throw down this weekend and absolutely uh i was there um the entire time my two workout partners i train with these ridiculously uh fit chicks which uh they are they keep me fit right there oh do i know them do i know them i don't know are they a couple are the girls a couple they're not a couple uh ash ashlyn slovak and gabby mclellan but they ended up taking first over the weekend and um yeah so i was there cheering them on we had uh we had about 12 athletes from decimate perform um at that two-day comp and it was a lot of fun

so to answer i think it was jake's question yes i was there cool all right well yeah please were you gonna say something tay, before we jump off? Yeah, yeah. I was going to say that I will text you because we're going to be. Are you going to be at the CrossFit Games, of course, right? We'll see. We're going through the media process now. And like I have, I'm like a prima donna.

Like I have really special needs to, to, in order to go there. And so I'm not sure if they're. I just need. No, i just need no i just need access to everything i can have no limitations okay well we're gonna be there okay i'll text you yeah i hear in the comments that you never uh return a text message which is totally cool but i'll save your number nonetheless and please and please and please share it please share it with nick and trevor and audrey seriously, I love having people on. I love knowing that someone's only coming on for 15 minutes or 10 minutes.

It makes me feel so good that I don't have to deal with them for longer than that. So you guys are always welcome for five or ten. And I would like to just plug all of our emails are nick at rf2.org, taylor at rf2, audrey or trevor at rf2.org. If you have any questions, especially if you want to donate, I'm not even shameless. We need money to produce our program. And so if you feel like giving five bucks, send us. We have Venmo and PayPal, so hit us up.

And our website is RF2.org. I was just going to give the website as RF2.org. Oh, yeah, RF2.org. And so that's really how I'd like to support you guys like anytime you guys have an event just let me know and I'll start chattering about it or you guys can come on and shoot the shit about it

yeah that's awesome alright guys thank you so much for coming on have a great day great to see you all again thanks for your time you guys are all really cool cats right on thanks man thanks for having us yeah cool cat too man i appreciate it thank you ciao ciao there he is caleb there you are buddy i don't know why as soon as i see you pop on the back, my butthole and clinches.

I could see it visually. Oh, you could, you just, I saw you pop on the back. I'm like, ah, a great show.

Seven. Uh, thank you. I have to, uh, I wish we had time to start a poll. I'd be like, uh,

which, uh, how many of you think David's done prison time? That's a good poll, right? That is a good poll. I'm going to be in the yes column for that one. Me too. Me too.

All right. all right no i wanted to ask that guy what was his favorite part about rich froning's book oh yeah i forgot that he that rich wrote a book so when he talked about how he uh read first i was like what who's what is first i didn't know what he was talking about i read that book too actually how is it it's pretty good i it's pretty generic you know like i think somebody probably helped him write it and they were just like yeah i won the games and it was great and i worked really hard does how many books does he have um i think um maybe two so so you so you basically learn about them but it's kind of like there's there's no there's no like crazy thread in there the whole there's no tension not really it's like a giant wiki article on rich i need to listen to the book

yeah pretty much. There you go. I'm pretty sure I bought the audiobook. 4.5 stars. That's pretty good. Yeah. I mean, it's a good book. It's just what you kind of expect. Look, Marissa Hinojosa.

Hinojosa. She has the book. She didn't say she's read it she just has it it's on the shelf uh caleb uh why are you allowed so much scruff aren't you active on the class great question uh it's it's called a shaving waiver gotta get really yeah do you really have a shaving waiver? Hell yeah. If I bust open your file. Like Caleb Beaver, 6'3", shaving waiver. That's right. Damn. Got to, right?

Can't just be shaving every day. Did you apply for that? Hell yeah, I did, dude. That's awesome, dude. Hell yeah. As soon as I was like, damn, I'm getting some crazy. Like I would get really bad, like I shouldn some crazy. Like, I would get really bad. Like, I shouldn't say really bad, but I get some, like, razor burn and shit under my neck.

So finally, plus I worked in the med group. So, like, they would see it every day. And they're like, you want to you want a shaving waiver? Like, hell yeah, dude. Hey, has anyone ever has anyone ever come up to him and been like, soldier, you need to shave. And you're like, shaving waiver. That's happened? All the time.

Wow. It happens at least once a week. Do you feel like a pussy when you say it? No. Hell no. You're like, I got a shaving waver, dude. And they're like, let me see it. Oh, really?

Yeah, I have to carry it with me. So I need to laminate it. I'll need a laminated copy. That's amazing. Yeah, dude. It's awesome Have you ever called some do you are you what are you? Are you like a do you have an e are you an e something? Yeah, I'm an e4. Are you allowed to ask one two threes if they're if you see them unshaved? I could but I mean, I don't care

Like if you're unshaved be like damn that sucks somebody's gonna be pissed at you It's not gonna be me though But but you could you could walk up to a dude and be like that, you know Is like an e1 and be like hey, what's up with your face, dude? Yeah, I could i've done that a few times just like Like we've been in a class setting and like an instructor like we have instructors and like they could fuck us up for it. So I'd be like, Hey, did you shave today?

And they'd be like, no, we like, all right, well you need to go do that or else everybody's going to get fucked. Oh, every, Oh,

everyone will. Oh, okay. Oh yeah. But if it's like, you're just like, I see you at work and you didn't shave. Yeah.

It's a commander walks by. It's not on me, dude. That's a, that's a you problem. What's that girl doing in your bed? I got a pussy waiver. Oh, that's right. Yeah. Let's not on me, dude. That's a you problem. What's that girl doing in your bed? I got a pussy waver. Oh, that's right.

Yeah. Let me, let me see it. All right. I'm off to surf camp. Sick. Um, thanks for coming on. Uh, what's today? Wednesday, Thursday, Thursday, actually, man, I have a crazy live calling show lined up.

I have so much crazy shit. When are we going to do one? I don't know. I'm excited. I'm looking at the calendar now. Oh, tomorrow. What's your schedule like tomorrow? Probably the same. I'll probably come on after like 45 minutes to an hour.

Okay, I'll try to do a really long show so we can hang out. All right. Let's do it. All right. Thanks. Everyone, I don't know what's going on today, but you should check it all all the All the cool shows Oh Trump Biden tonight. Are you gonna watch that? Yeah, dude. Hell yeah. I'm watching that Greg's having a party this house. Oh Excuse me house. Excuse me.

All right. I got to, I got to take the kids surf camp and then I'm going out on Greg's boat. I will, uh, talk to you soon. Everyone. Uh,

uh, after you talked about sharks yesterday, I'm a tick tock feed have been all sharks. Oh, all right. Love you guys. Bye. Bye. All right.