The Sevan Podcast - How To Coach CrossFit EP. 1 // Introducing McCoy Turner CFL4

Episode Date: December 14, 2024

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Our guest is not here yet Let me see Damn dude, where are these videos? Well, trying to figure out where my Sentinel commercials at it's probably an SUAS. Let me see. Pull up. Here we go. Video.

Here we go. I wonder what that video is. I have no idea. Maybe it's under kill Taylor. Yeah, that's what it is. What's up you guys? chilling I'm hoping I get this over with before our guest shows up our guest our much anticipated guest

Should we play the exercise around oh Here we go Bam, my name is Taylor self and I programmed Sentinel training. I don't delegate. I don't farm it out. I write the workouts. I do the workouts. I use my seven years of experience coaching in an affiliate, along with my

deep and ever growing understanding of the methodology put together and always challenging and rewarding, often humbling program to make you better. I want to help people and nothing else. Help people move better, train better, compete better, live better. Legacy comes later. Live now. Live better. Train Sentinel. Awesome. All right. So, guys, a couple of things before

we get started on this. Oh, I better go back. First thing is for Sentinel training, best programming that you can possibly buy. Uh, fittest coaches on earth, me and Bryson, we just did a thousand burpees for time live on our YouTube channel. If you guys want to go check it out, I think Coach L is already programming that workout for all of his athletes and selling it for $375. Um, but nonetheless, great workout.

Our time was 48 47. We did 10, sorry, 50 rounds, 10 reps each. You go, I go. It was dope. Um, a couple of things, a couple of things for Sentinel to mention is in the month of January me and Bryson are doing basically a member video call every single day for the entire month. Or it's me and Bryson on Zoom for at least 30 minutes probably or Google meet for at

least 30 minutes answering any questions that our members have. And each call each day will have like a 30 member or 30 guest limit. So 30 times 30 is 900 people. So we have 900 available slots, which would be sick to get filled up. You have to be a member to do it. So if you guys go ahead and sign up before the month of January, we're dropping that link in the chat just about every single day for you guys to get signed up. The other thing is we will be closing up our Sentinel Scholarship applications on December

20th. That's eight more days before we announce who we're going to be giving away our free CrossFit Level 1 Seminar Scholarship to. This will be the second one we've given out, which we're pretty stoked about. I think we might be the only training program that does it. Vindicate does it too, which is sick. And then lastly, we'll announce this probably later on in the year, but we're going to be doing a massive giveaway. Hopefully sometime within the next year, we have a subscriber amount that we want to get to, to perform this giveaway. We're not going to make the

announcement on what those numbers are yet but we're getting extremely close and the giveaway is basically going to be two free level one scholarships I think. I wouldn't even call it a scholarship. They're going to be two free level ones. If you're already a level one and you get selected, we'll just give you a level two or whatever. If you're already a level two, we'll give you however much it costs to take your level three. If you fail it, we're not going to give you more money, but we'll be giving that away. And then like five, three years of Sentinel. So just some cool shit

going on. Um, and with that, what's up, man. Hey buddy. How are you dude? Good man. I'm doing great. Just, uh, I actually worked out in here like an hour ago. Me and Bryson did a thousand burpees for time as a team. Yeah. We live streamed it. It was fun. It's hard. Hell yeah. It's an old school Miko Salo. Yeah. Well, we didn't do a thousand each.

I just did 500 Bryson did 500. We did 500. We went, you go, I go. Ah, okay. Do you drink kombucha? Uh, not often, but, uh, it's big here in Bali. Everybody drinks that stuff. Yeah.

This has no added sugars nice, but it's good So what's your name man intra introduce yourself? So hey, my name is McCoy I'm crossfit coach. I've been a crossfit coach for Go on. I think I did my l1 2013. I've been doing CrossFit since 2009, I would say. CrossFit L4 seminar staff, Flowmaster, based in Bali, Indonesia. Been on seminar staff for the last 10 years, traveling around the world.

Coming up to 11 years soon, yeah. Traveling around the world the last 10 years, teaching level one, level two seminars. And yeah, fortunate enough to have the opportunity to go around coaching others, helping them. And then here in Bali in Indonesia, I have a small CrossFit affiliate called CrossFit Conscious. And yeah, just spreading the methodology.

What does that name mean to you? CrossFit Conscious. When I saw that, I was reading your bio on the L4 mentorship, or sorry, the CrossFit Mentorship Program page. And I saw that the CrossFit gym your bio on the L4 mentorship, or sorry, the CrossFit Mentorship Program page, and I saw that the CrossFit gym was called CrossFit Conscious, and I was very curious the story behind that name.

CrossFit Conscious, because I'm super woke, right? No. It's in relation to the four stages of learning, and it's something that I used to utilize prior to working full-time for CrossFit seminar staff. I was in the military and I learned this during my leadership courses and things in the military. We had four stages of learning and I think this comes from a guy called Martin Broadwell, I think his name was, he wrote something back in the 1960s, 1960 I think it was. Anyway, I digress. Four stages of learning. So we have unconscious

competence and then we have, sorry, unconscious incompetence. Then we have conscious incompetence, conscious competence, and then we have unconscious competence. And it's these four stages of learning. If I was to put this into like a coaching sort of scenario, it's like unconscious incompetence is we don't know what we don't know or what we're not good at or what we're not doing. And that's kind of what my role I feel as a mentor is just shining a light on, hey, this is what you're not doing as a coach.

Because for the other people, they don't even realize I didn't know that I wasn't coaching effectively. So then we shine a light on it and it's like, okay, now you're consciously incompetent. I know that I have deficiencies in this area and I want to get better. And then through my role as a coach then is bringing you into that level of conscious competence

where you become conscious. It's like, now I'm aware of how to coach effectively or if it's in the gym, like in my affiliate, I bring my athletes from coming to the gym for the first time, they don't know what they don't know. They get a rude awakening like, oh my God, my, and this is what happened to me when I started CrossFit, oh my God, I thought I was fit. And then I've just done a CrossFit workout, had my backside handed to me. I'm unconsciously incompetent. I did not know that I wasn't as fit as I thought I was. So now I have this conscious incompetence when I'm raising that level of awareness.

Okay, now I'm gonna go into the gym. I know that I can't perform snatches. I know that I'm not as fit as I should be. Through coaching, now I'm consciously confident I can start to snag 135, no problems, or I'm now getting fitter. And inevitably then the final stage, the pinnacle would be I don't even need to think about it now

and I can hit that snatch with hitting all those points before me so I can go in and I can coach at the highest level possible without even having to think about it. And that's an unconscious level of competence where it's just our second nature. The problem is that when we get to that unconscious level of competence, because we're an autopilot, that's when we can start to make

mistakes and we need to go back and just do some reflection, whether that's getting somebody else to come in and do some feedback, some observing to go, hey, these are your, where are my blind spots? What am I missing here? And I guess if you think of somebody who works in a factory for 30 years, and they've worked in a factory for 30 years, when they first get into that factory, they really struggle using the machinery and things that are unconsciously incompetent, when they first get into that factory, they really struggle using the machinery and things that are unconsciously incompetent, then they raise the level of ability, they're consciously competent. And then all of a sudden, they're doing it in autopilot unconsciously incompetent. But then it's like after 30 years, some reason they

chop a finger off and it's like, what happened? Because you missed your blind spots, you were unconsciously incompetent, competent with little mistakes you start taking shortcuts and these things can happen. So I hope that explains why I use calls. Absolutely I love that. Extra sloppy I think I have incontinence that's a different thing. Conscious incontinence is the worst. You guys are sick. I'm not even gonna swear on this show which is maybe someone in the comments will be able to get me to swear, but I'm going to try not to. So, okay. Where'd you grow up? You didn't grow up in Bali, right? You grew up in the UK?

No. So I grew up in the Northeast of Scotland, a little town called Lossy Mouth, not too far away from Aberdeen actually, but a friend of mine, Rob Lawson is, and they had the invitation recently. Cross for Aberdeen, give them a shout out. And also my hometown now, it's a really small hometown. It's like a little fishing village. And it's got an RAF base there, Royal Air Force base there. But now we actually have a CrossFit affiliate there called CrossFit Money, which is super cool. So I went home back to the UK, probably last year, and I went and dropped in and had a visit there, which was amazing to think, God, I grew up in this town, left it when I was 16 to join the military and then going

back now then they've got a little CrossFit gym which is super cool. So yeah, I grew up in the North East of Scotland. When I grew up, I was big into football. I think you guys would call it soccer. And that was my main dream. I thought I'm going to be a professional soccer player. That's what I wanted to do. And then the reality hit and I was like, man, I've not made it. So what do I do? And then at 16, I joined the Royal Navy. And my plan, my game plan was you kind of, when I grew up, you had, I thought you had two options. You either grow up and you become a fisherman or you go and work on the oil rigs in the North Sea and they get a little bit more money. So my plan was to go and work on the oil rigs in the North Sea, and they get a little bit more money. So my plan was to go and work on the oil rigs,

but you can't do that till you're 21. So leaving school at 16, hating school, I was like, how do I fill that gap? And I joined the Royal Navy to go and get a background in Marine engineering, thinking, okay, I'm going to do my engineering stuff, and then I can leave the military after my minimum of four years,

and that'll tie me over nicely to then join the oil rigs at 21, I can return back home. Long story short, I actually enjoyed the military, it was really good. And then there was an option to become a physical trainer in the Royal Navy. So at 21, I retrained and became a Royal Navy physical training instructor. And then I served for 17 years teaching fitness and exercise, actually specialized in exercise rehabilitation,

which was super cool. So I transferred across and we go and do some further training. And then my role then and responsibility was guys and girls that are getting injured, either in home port or on the front line. My role is then to try and get them back to fighting fitness as quickly as possible. So that required an in-depth sort of knowledge

of anatomy and physiology and contraindications to exercise in terms of rehabilitation setting, which gave me a really good eye, I think, set me up for success in CrossFit coaching because it gives you a better eye of really being specific about mechanics of movement. And then hopefully you're getting them back on the front line.

So that's my background, I guess guess during that journey around CrossFit. So I was in the military, I was pretty fit when I became a physical trainer, played sport, represented the military at several sports and I remember I went on a training course and one of the guys on this training course was like, dude you're super fit, you should try this workout. One of my guys in my gym has been talking about called the 300 workout. Do you remember 300, the film? Yes, I remember the film.

Oh yeah, classic. One of my favorite movies. Yes, classic. This is fun. I'm reading actually a book, I'm reading a book right now called it's the Long War series by Christian Cameron. And it's like maybe a six or nine book series I'm rereading it and it's based off the Peloponnesian

Wars the Greco-Persian Wars and this it's a fucking sick book if you guys like historical fiction Christian Cameron it's the shit all right anyways I'll write that down yeah so I, the guy told me about this 300 workout. He's like, dude, you gotta try this workout. I was like, okay, 300 workout. It was big at the time. It was in men's health and all that sort of stuff. So I was like, okay, let's check it out.

And it was, I get handed by my backside like nothing else before. I was like, oh my God. Prior to that, my training was do my strength training. And I played football, I played, well, soccer. I played rugby league. So I needed to go on size, I needed to be big and muscular. So I did the typical hypertrophy splits,

back and buys, chest and tries. But then I'd also throw in my cardio days and I'd do a bit of running here and there. And then I did this 300 workout and it smashed me like nothing I've seen before. And the way that I found the workout, I was like, what are these movements? I had movements in there like barbell wipers where you lie on the floor,

you've got the barbell extended, like you're almost like lying on your back position, bringing your feet up to touch wipers. Had 25 pull-ups at the start, 25 pull-ups at the end, which was an insane amount of volume for me back then. I'm like, how do you do this? So quick YouTube search and up pops CrossFit Central does 300. And I saw people like Jenny McTeel, who was it back then? Crystal McReynolds, these old school legends of the sport

doing this workout and they crushed it. So I go in the gym and it takes me twice as long as them. And I'm like, it takes me even longer to recover. And I'm like, oh my God, what the hell just happened to me? I'm like, okay, I'm gonna grab my buddies. Hey dude, you need to try this workout. And it had the same effect on everybody I knew. And I was like, man, this is crazy. How can this be bad?

Like so bad. How could I be so slow? Go back and watch the videos. Then I got stuck down the rabbit hole of CrossFit Central. Does this work at that workout, that workout? And a couple of weeks later, I'm looking at some tiny little guy called Chris Speeler crushing a workout called 50 50, filthy 50. And I'm like, this guy's tiny. There's no way that I can't beat him in this workout. I had a timer like 18 minutes or something, I can't remember his time.

But then I go, this one I can do, this one I'm gonna crush him in. It's got jumping pull-ups, I can do them, it's got box jumps, no problems at all. And then you finish off at the end and it's got that trio of ball balls and double unders and burpees. And I was thinking almost, I'm on for one breath,

I'm probably gonna crush this guy sub 15 minutes. And again, I'm like 25 minutes later, takes me another 25 minutes to recover. And I need to do more of this CrossFit stuff. So I guess that was my rude awakening to be like, you're consciously incompetent when you have to do cardio and weightlifting in the same session. You're ill prepared. So how many people do you, how many people do you think found CrossFit through YouTube like that?

So many, I think so many back, back in those days, cause there were no CrossFit affiliates near me then this was 2009, 2009, 2009 sort of time. Um, there were no CrossFit affiliates. So that was, and it was kind of this underground thing. I didn't know anybody else in the military that was doing it. Certainly not in the Royal Navy. So then 2010, I go down the rabbit hole and I start watching more and more videos

and I see the documentary where Miko Seylo wins the games. Iceland, Danny gets her first muscle up. Jason Kalipa collapses on the long run on the ranch and stuff. I'm like, this is awesome. I want to go to that competition. I think I'll crush that guy Kalipa in the run because I can run.

And I had no sort of real concept of how fit Mikko Salo was in those times and things. And so then 2010 comes along and they had, this was pre-open, they had sectionals and I was like, I'm gonna sign up for the sectionals. I'm gonna go and just meet other cross-fitters, find out what it's all about. And the same story happened.

I turned up to sectionals, first workout was a triplet of chest to bar pull-ups, GHD sit-ups, and empty barbell thrusters, three rounds. Can't remember the rep scheme, maybe 10, 15, 20 or something. It wasn't a hard workout now, but I did it back then and I'd never gone so hard in my life. Lay on the floor, I was like, I need to go for a little walk, I had a little spew, I met Pukey, came back, found this new level of intensity, had an awesome experience, but after that first workout I was like, I'm done, I think

I've found out enough about CrossFit. I wanna throw in the towel at the paddanaff. By the time I recovered, I came around, finished the weekend. I was fortunate enough to qualify for regionals. Then I went out to the European regionals in 2010. And it was just this real sort of raw underground life. You go back then, it's like old school UFC I'm like trying to relate it to is you had the long distance runner and you had the bodybuilder

and you had the sportsman who's coming across like the rugby player so on and so forth and everybody's wearing these crazy outfits. I was wearing like head to toe Austin Maliolo style skins. That's what we used to wear on rugby training. And I was like, give me my competitive edge and I'm going to go and crush it. And it was just, it was cool. It was really cool. 2011. So I finished the regionals and I was like, wow, these guys are really fit. And I watching Miko Salo turned up at the regionals and he did death by clean and jerk at 60 kilos 135 and just crushed it. And I saw what true intensity looked like when you're working out

and balancing that threshold training of mechanics, consistency, intensity. And I got the bug. I was like, man, I need to do more of this. This is awesome. Kind of dropped all other sports and I went all in like, man, I need to do more of this. This is awesome. Kind of dropped all other sports, and I went all in. In 2011, I deployed to Afghanistan. And I trained hard during Afghanistan and came back thinking 2012 was going to be my year.

But I hadn't done the L1. I had very limited knowledge. I was reading journal articles and interpreting them how I thought that Glassman originally wanted us to take on board and misapplied a lot of principles. I went for volume over intensity and so on and so forth. And then 2012 I came back and the standard has just raised so high. I was like, oh my goodness, what is happening? Like where have all these freaks come out of? And for me, it was a bit of a kick, kicking the nuts,

but it was also a great reality check. It was like, do you know what? Going into the gym every day and just working out and doing my best effort is the aim now. And I think what happened was around that time as well, a lot more, what would you call them? I guess local competitions started to pop up all over the place and people were getting this bug for, I want to go and train for this competition down the road here and I'm going

to be the fittest at such and such. And that's awesome. And it's great to have people to go and compete, like to work out for and compete for. But in my opinion, back then I was like, there's one competition and it's called the CrossFit Games. Right. And how old were you then at this point in time? 2012? 2012. work out for and compete for. But in my opinion, back then I was like, there's one competition and it's called the CrossFit games. Right. And how old were you then at this point in time, 2012, 2012, just coming up to 30 years ago, 30 years old, 30 years old.

Um, so yeah, I like my, my, I never got excited by all these people that would put on their Facebook profiles, but I don't think it's big back then. Like I'm the fittest in this tiny little competition here. It's like, guys, there's one competition. You go through the open, then you'll go to regionals. And if you go to regionals, you're a high level athlete. And if you're cream of the, like tip of the spear, you're gonna go to the games.

And I would find if I was training with a bunch of guys in the military, one of my friends went to regionals twice, a guy called Carl Thorpe, super fit dude. Training alongside him was all the competition I needed. I'm like I don't need to go to a lower level competition to get my feel of competition. However, I'd also played rugby league at the highest level I could do in the Navy. I played soccer at what I consider to be the highest level I could do in the Navy. I played soccer at what I consider to be the highest level I could be in the Navy.

I've seen this in other sports. I've done a little bit of boxing here. I've done some indoor rowing, went to crash bees out in Boston. So my competitive like fire had been done. And it was like, now I'm training to be fit in any environment for any

judation, uh, and that was enough for me. So yeah, that's, that's kind of my, my journey, my story. Um, how tall are you? Um, depends who's asking. I like to say six foot to the ladies, probably five, 11, six foot. What's your best two K you wrote? Was, did you ever do like a two K time trial for like rowing or I did. It's not that impressive.

It was six 39 was my best. Um, it's not unimpressive. Cool story with growing. I am, I started growing because so in 2005, I had a lateral menisectomy on my right knee, so the meniscus got taken out from a socket injury. And, um, after the, after the, did a little bit of rehab, and then I just went straight back to all my impact stuff, squatting, dead lifting.

And now it's been 20 years of just that bone on bone, and it's not the best. So I went through a phase where my knee was swelling up, it was a bit, probably just overuse. And then, so I started rowing. And we had the rowing team, or a few of the older boys would be part of the rowing squad And they were like hey if you can if you can row

There's like a bit of banter and they were like you you crossfit is you can't row so on and so forth so he's like if you think you can row turn up at the Navy rowing champs and then test yourselves against the Navy rowers and If you can get sub 7 that's pretty good and I was I was like, dude, I don't need to, I don't even, my big head, I was like, I don't even need to train to get a sub seven 2k. I'm like, cause I do CrossFit. And they were like, really? And I'm like, yeah, it's just a workout. And like they, they put a lot of pressure on it and it's this big event. It's, I'm like, it's only 2000 meters. Like in Jackie, if we do a 1000 meter just to go into the thrusters and the pull-ups, it's not a big deal.

So I turned up with zero training to the Navy rowing championships. And I think I pulled like a 6.54, 6.53. It's typical set off way too hard, crashed and burned, held on for dear life at the end. And the rowing coach came over and was like, mate, that's super impressive. But a little bit of training, if you can get a sub 6.45, I'll take you to Boston.

And Boston is where they have the crash bees. So I was like, okay, cool. My knee was playing up, so I didn't want to do as much heavy lifting, as much impact stuff. So I spent a little bit of time on the rower and I actually really enjoyed it going in and rowing training. I had all these other guys which were a lot older than me,

but we all just sit at the same stroke rate and you're all in sync and you're just rowing training. I had all these other guys which were a lot older than me, but we all just sit at the same stroke rate and you're all in sync and you're just rowing along. And then after a bit of training, I went in one day and I didn't really know what workout I was going to do. So I just went, hell, why not just stick on a 2K and give it a crack? And I pulled a 639 with no warmup. I'm one of the training crew there and are and he took a little screenshot sent to the rowing coach and before I'd got showered in chains and checked my phone, he'd go to the coach and message me, he was like, good job, you're coming to Boston. I was like, hell yeah. So I got a trip to Boston to go and do the World Indoor Rowing Champs, so the Crash

Bees as otherwise known. But yeah, 639 was my best. If I think about impressive rows, I remember we had some of our best in the Navy were pulling a 610, and then they'd been gassing it, or sub-610s, and they'd be on gas in the air at the end. They would give it their all. And I remember the year when they

announced that they were going to do the marathon row at the games, but the first 2K was going to be scored, and then they'd go into the remaining marathon row. I think Jason Kalipa pulled something like a 625. Then a little minutes rest and then he's like, and then I'm just going to sit at 145 for the remainder. I'm like, that's what we call about this broad, general, inclusive fitness. That's insane. That is insane. And he was meant to be the guy who everybody was worried about crashed and burned. Right. Videos were zooming in on him going, Oh no, what's Cleve going to do? He's famous for crashing and burning and yeah, he smoked it. So that's, I think that's the difference between that

speciality and then just being able to go and do anything. And yeah. I'm going to pull up the CrossFit Mentor page. So this is right now, you work on the CrossFit Mentor program. What's your role? Cool. Yeah. So I have two roles, I guess. One I'm in the CrossFit Mentor program. So our role is to, we have some that are just our business, business mentorships and I'm

solely just coaching mentorship. And our aim is to help develop, develop coaches or develop business and affiliate owners, whatever they need assistance with. And what the great thing about the mentorship is, is it's going to be completely customized to the individual. So if you were to reach out to me, we'd have a, we'd have a sort of like a SWOT analysis, look at your strengths and weaknesses, what opportunities you have for growth, are there any threats to you or your business, or if it's coaching, any threats to your coaching, such as

you know, how to expire or so on and so forth. And then from there, we can develop a plan to try and move you forward. And the other neat thing about this is it also gives you those continued education units. So as you know, because you're a CEU, you get three per session. So you can initially sign up for either one, three or five mentor packages or mentor sessions. And it's obviously going to give you three, nine or 15 15 credits So it's a nice way to boost up your credits if you need to get those CUs in the end whilst also developing your Yourabilities as a coach or an affiliate owner How long is a session an hour ish? every 16 minutes session and

Session and then outside of that. There'll be maybe some homework that the Candidate I'll have to the participant the participant will have to go and do. So for example, you'll be maybe reviewing, sorry, you might be sending me lesson plans or videoing classes, send them to me and then I'll be reviewing them behind the scenes and then when we get back together, we can really maximize that time and go, okay, let's look at this.

And I take it to the minute. Minute five here of the workout, you can see that you lost control, the members were all over the place and they really know what they were doing. This is a bit group management that we really need to start to refine and we can look at some tactics and some some strategies to help get better and whatever your the individuals blind spots are. So yeah, it's a really cool program. It's new online. We have I think around 25

coaches there. So you also get a choice of who do you want to work with? Oh, you choose. Yeah, the end of the thing you choose. So what happens is you'll sign up on the link there. And then you go through a big questionnaire and it'll really start to just narrow in what are what do you actually need assistance with as an individual. And then through there, you can go, okay, this is also I've looked through the bios and this is the person I would like to work with,

or this person's in my area. Or if you don't have any preferences, they'll just assign you somebody. And then if for some reason you don't click on that first session, or so, you can go and have a look in the bios and choose somebody else. But yeah, they've got a whole host of people there that you can get involved with. Sick.

So that's basically, I mean, the rest of this, we're just going to keep talking. I have some, I have some interesting questions. Um, but basically what me and you are doing, this is introducing you to the seven sphere, our audience. And after this, we're basically gonna do these sessions live. So all video, you'll tell me, hey, I want this video of this class, whatever, this segment, a whole class, whatever,

and then we're just gonna pull it up and you're gonna crush me live, which is gonna be great. I think it'll be amazing. One, just to show your expertise and like the holy cow, there's a different level. Two, it's a different level too. It's gonna help me a ton. But three, I think, you know, our aim more than anything

is just to give exposure to this completely, almost seemingly hidden world of, hey, we have to continue raising the bar for coaches, for CrossFit coaches. We have to continue raising the bar. That, for me, I guess, in my heart, I think of Matt Fraser on Joe Rogan talking about his first experience at a CrossFit gym and how the coaching wasn't good. That's what gets spread to the world. That's what you fight against. I hope that's something that I fight against because, that's something that I fight against because I mean, in reality, there is no better coaching that you can really get anywhere that's standardized to the extent that CrossFit coaches are.

Before CrossFit, who was even getting coached on a power clean or a snatch? People didn't have access to that. That was reserved only for an athlete that was training for the Olympics. No one you didn't just go somewhere and they taught you how to do a snatch or a rope climb or whatever. So I, you know, one, I just hate that sometimes we get this bad rap. And if we want to completely eliminate that or come as close as possible to eliminating that, we just have to continue raising the bar and that's our hope here.

And I'm trying to pass my level four evaluation. So McCoy is helping me. So that's critical, critical component there. So yeah, the CrossFit Coaches Mentor Program. So we're going to take everybody through kind of a journey of me being mentored by you and learning how to coach CrossFit. So you've been with CrossFit for 17 years. How many. How many seminars do you do a year, would you say? Sorry, so I was in the military for 17 years as a trainer, and I've been on seminar staff for over 10 years. I've probably done over those 10 years between 200 to 250 seminars.

20 a year. That's every other weekend. Well, I first started and I began in Europe. I was, um, in London based in London and travels a lot shorter as I'd be traveling, especially when I was more junior, almost every weekend for seminars. And, um, it's, it's the best job in the world. I love it. I get to meet awesome people from around the community, get to help them on their journey and like a force multiplier, they get to go back to their communities and spread this CrossFit message, which is super cool. And it's the best, really fortunate to have that role. So initially I was doing a lot of seminars, getting me up to skill and like what you were saying there, the development of our coaching, like I feel really fortunate that I am able to now mentor

and help other people, but it's only because I had been exposed to such amazing mentors through my journey. Like there's nothing, I feel almost like a fraud at times. There's nothing I'm gonna tell you, which is my own original thinking, I don't think. I've taken it from somewhere and I might sometimes forget the source,

but it's because I've had so many seminars, worked with so many people and I tried to have that unconscious incompetence mindset, okay, I didn't know this, now I can bring it into my conscious awareness, I'll start to share that with others and that phrase, I stand on the shoulders of giants, it's like, I really do, I've been fortunate to have my mentors when I first started as a guy called Yami Tikkonen. You know, Yami's worked with a lot of games athletes and still running the training plan. Then Matt Evans, who's a great educator, wrote our education course, which is available online. Currently I'm working with a guy called Brett Ford in Australia,

who is extremely intelligent and has a whole host of experience. I've worked with so many flow masters over this time, Joe DeGain, Denise Thomas, Cole Christensen, Steve Hayrock, Carl Stedman, the godfather of European CrossFit, all these people that have just been stealing a little bit of their knowledge. That's what I hope we should all be doing as coaches. I'm going to take that, that's going going to work for me but I'm going to discard this thing because I would never do it that way so I don't think you can really not have a learning experience whenever you go drop into another affiliate. I love the level

two seminar because we have a group of like coaches and affiliate owners from all over the place and inevitably you're all going to learn from each other and see that that person's present attitude is really cool, but that might not suit my personality or like the growth never stops. And once you get to whatever level you like, if you think that you're like, as I said, when you feel like you've mastered the basics, it's time to start all over again. Pay closer attention. It's like, where are my blind spots? And you can only do that either by self evaluation and reflection or by working with other people. How many level fours do you, you're a level four. Are you proud of that? Are you proud of that? Yeah, I'm extremely proud. I was there. Let me just turn on this.

It's getting hot here. Um, yeah, I went back to you. I think it is. Yeah. It's the pinnacle of what we have in the CrossFit world. And I think it's also, you know how difficult it was to pass the L3, right? Yeah. Um, it takes a lot of study and a lot of knowledge to get that L3. And then the practical application of that is the L4. And it's like putting that into practice on the short floor. And you get, I went back to London last year.

So it's, I've been waiting for years. Like I want to, I've got a growth mindset. I want to be the best coach that I can be. How many level fours exist? Not many. Do you think there's less L4s than there are people who have competed as an individual at the games? Oh, great question.

God, I... How many people do you think, if you had to put a number on how many L fours there are, what would the number be? You put him on the spot. I could be way off. I reckon. And let's not even count the old level fours, only the new ones. Oh, you're not counting the old level fours then.

Not many at all. I would say less than 50. Oof! Less than 50. Wow. So if you're an L3, you're a regional athlete coach. And if you're an L4, you're basically a games champion coach. And if you're an old L4, you're a games athlete. I don't know. I didn't do the old L4, but I've heard it was extremely challenging. It was a different process back then. Um, I think it was a lot more, a lot more crazy, less than less, definitely

less L4s than people I think have competed as an individual game. So that's incredibly prestigious. Damn. That's crazy. My experience with the L4. So I, I wanted to get the L4 as soon as it became available. I was like, I'm signing up. I want to get that done. And as you know, they sell out super quick. I was looking at trying to get back to the States. I was on the waiting list to go to CrossFit

Mafia, for one of them. But nobody's, if you booked it, nobody's dropping off unless you get nervous at the last minute. So that didn't come to fruition. But because I'm in Bali, I'm seven or eight hours ahead of the UK. And I remember I woke up one morning, I always wake up at 530. And I woke up, had my morning coffee, checked Instagram, and it said the L4 is coming to London. I was like, hell yeah.

Knowing in my mind, well, they've just posted this, which is like 10 o'clock at night for the UK. I'm like, people aren't gonna see this. So I can just jump on there now. And I can book before before they sell out. And I managed to book onto one. And I flew back to London to go and go and take the L4. And for those that don't know the L4, basically, you sit, you'll attend or you'll not attend, you'll do you'll teach two classes, and you'll turn up to this testing environment. They'll give you the workouts 48 hours in advance.

And then you'll, I just turn up to this affiliate in London that I've never been to before and say, okay, you're gonna get between seven and 15 of their usual class members that are gonna book in for the class and you need to deliver these two classes. First one, have a little break, come back and do the second one.

And you're gonna have our highest credentialed L4 coaches that we have, some of the longest serving coaches, most experienced coaches that we have. So I turned up and I had Carl Stedman and Nicole Christiansen there. And I know both, I've worked with both of them previously and I was like, so the pressure I felt personally was even higher. I was like, oh my God, these people know me. I hope this doesn't mean I'm a bad person, doesn't mean I'm a bad coach or I'm unsuccessful. And I remember I did my whiteboard brief in my first class and it's London, it's not even hot.

And before I finished doing the whiteboard brief, my name badge had peeled off because I'm sweating buckets, and it was horrendous. And then you just got to go in there and coach as you'd normally coach in your affiliate. Are you still there? It looks like you've frozen. My timer's still going on my site.

Ah. My timer's still going up on my site. Ah! Thank you. you you I'm sorry. Holy shit. Hey, buddy. Sorry about that. One sec. Alright. I go kick that. Yeah, I know. My Wi-Fi is so bad and we're moving in like three days. So holy cow, I'm glad people are still here. Alright. I go kick though. Yeah I know my wifi is so bad and we're moving in like three days so holy cow I'm glad people are still here.

All right, um, what are we talking about we're talking about how prestigious the level four was on my laptop now and connected to hotspot and I'm, I'm ready to, I just got to, oh man I want to yell the f word so badly. Um, all right. All right, we're talking about how prestigious the L4 was. There are maybe less than 200 total, maybe less than 50 who have done the current iteration and how prestigious that is. And what it was, you were talking about, it's basically you coached two classes. Yeah.

So, if you think about how many L3s they are, they still say less than 99% of CrossFit coaches have reached the L3. The L3 is extremely prestigious and then only the L3s with the relevant experience and confidence can go and take the L4. And the L4 is extremely hard, but it should be. It should be difficult because we're elevating the standard of CrossFit coaching and it should be the pinnacle of the coaching experience. And yeah, you'll turn up to a testing center

and affiliate essentially, and you'll teach two classes to a group of general public who would be usually attending that affiliate. And once you'll have two of our most experienced trainers, CrossFit seminar staff assessing you. And once you'll have two of our most experienced trainers, CrossFit seminar staff assessing you. And yeah, it's extremely nerve wracking. I remember in the first couple of minutes, my whiteboard read my name tag peeled off

because I'm sweating so much. And this is London, it's not hot. Just nerve wracking, just extremely nerve wracking. And you've got to try and coach the best that you can. And that's implementing all six of the criteria of effective coaching. So your ability to teach, see and correct your presence and attitude, group management

and demonstration. Application now, yeah. And application is what's tested on there. And in terms of application, what we're looking for is to scale everybody effectively so that they can achieve threshold training across a group of between seven to 15 participants. And Denise, Thomas, share some- So to customize, essentially, a workout to each member of your class.

Absolutely, yes. Individually. Fuck you, James Fitzgerald. Just saying. Crossfits individualized. Just when I had to say that. There was my one swear word. I'll probably give another.

And that's challenging and it's hard to do. And again, if people aren't being evaluated or evaluating their own performance regularly, I think that's what's setting, like limiting their growth. And Denise Thomas shared with me a concept which I think was really cool. And I definitely can relate that back to my military days where we have like three broad general sort of levels

of coaches. We have the people who can facilitate a class. That's a person who you can turn up, can read the whiteboard out to you. Guys go and get warmed up. It's like maybe you and Bryson work like working out together. It's like, hey, Bryson, we're going to do this. Let's get warmed up.

You'll do your own little warm up. And then it's like, let's get together. We'll start the clock, and you start three, two, one, off we go. And you kind of start the class on time, finish on time. Everybody works out, has fun, and people will get fitter. The next level is where we have the instructor. And this is very much sort of what I would do in the military.

And also part of my job in the military was, I was a training instructor, sorry, a training instructor, a staff instructor where we'd be, I was at the Navy training school and we would train other people to become physical trainers. And basically there we're teaching them how to either be a cheerleader or run around

and facilitate a class where everybody's moving to their sort of timing. So an old school thing that we used to do is these things called daily exercises. And every morning, and it's what we've done basic training, it's like, you tell them, oh, my command, you're going to move here. And they're all doing push ups to your commands. So one, two, three, four, and things like that. And that's where we'll see maybe coaches implement progressions but there's not really a purpose behind the progression it's just I'm gonna facilitate this time with these progressions and they're gonna get everybody to move to my timing so now it looks like I'm instructing them and I have more control. But within that period of time there's no purpose of

progression nobody's really getting any corrective coaching and getting them to move better. And then the final phase, I guess, is where we start to coach people effectively. And then we have effective teaching. So we're giving a purpose behind the progression. People know what they're aiming for in a progression that we're using.

For example, if that was, say, you're teaching push presses and we do the dip and hold. I know as a coach, the dip and hold, I'm looking for a vertical torso. I'm going to make sure my athletes understand, I'm looking for a vertical torso. I'm going to make sure my athletes understand that they're looking for a vertical torso. I teach them how to get that vertical torso. And then I'm going to go around,

I'm going to look for it. And so my seeing then improves. And if I see it's good, I can give them, hell yeah, that's awesome, keep doing that thing. But if I see there's a fault, I can make those corrections. And that's where my corrective strategies come in. I can either give them a verbal cue, a visual cue, a tactile cue,

get them to move better and then what I like to think about for my coaches is then once I go, if I do that effectively during my specific warm-up, I can almost then start to predict what's going to happen before we go into the workout. So it makes my seeing a lot more accurate, a lot more quick to be able to give those corrections in the moment because it's already like, I know this person is gonna have a forward inclination when they dip in the push press.

Like seen it in the warmup already and I've tried to correct it. So now when I add that intensity, it's probably gonna come back. This person is gonna press the bar out in front. This person is gonna have lazy elbows over top and so on and so forth. You already know it cause you've seen it.

And then I can make those corrections. So my eyes already know where I'm gonna look. Makes me able to use my corrective strategy for better. Next level up from that is even if I can remember as well, sorry, this person responded well to a verbal cue, this person responded well to a visual cue, this person needs a little bit more tactile feedback. I can then be even more effective in how I correct them.

And then implementing all that sort of stuff at the same time, whilst making sure that I have a good presence and attitude and they have a great experience and I'm managing threshold training across a group. And it's challenging, but also it's, if I can do it, it can't be that complex. And it's just, you've got to go in with like, with purposeful practice when you go in and coach.

And if we're going in and going, that was good class, nobody died. And you start on time, you finished on time, everybody kind of had fun. I'm great. And you never really have that reflective practice. Then we become unconsciously incompetent because we don't know where our blind spots are. We don't really know where I've been for growth. And that's where I fall into the trap in my earlier days as a coach. Before I got on seminar staff is I thought I was doing a great job because my colleagues, my friends, my family, my members, they all love me. They're not going to

tell me, hey dude, you could get better here. They're like, that was great, thank you so much. But then when you have somebody else who comes in with a more critical eye and is unafraid to give you that, sometimes harsh, sometimes friendly sort of feedback, like you need to do this, this and this better.

You can either take that one or two ways and like, no, I don't, I'm the best, I already are and I disagree. Or you can be, thank you so much for raising my awareness. Now I know where my room is for growth. And I use this analogy often, particularly on the level two, when I'm speaking to a bunch of coaches who all want to get better is,

you're an athlete, right, Taylor? If you wanted to, if I took a games athlete or I took yourself and was like, hey, what do you need to work on to get better on to be the fittest athlete in the world to win the CrossFit Games? You could probably give me a list as long as you're arm off, I need to get better at this, this, this, this, and this, because you're always reflecting and understanding where your blind spots are because you want to get better. It should be no different in the coaching realm is if you want to get better, you should understand I know where my room for improvement is and and then and then you should have a plan then to get better in those areas and if you don't have a plan

then you probably need a mentor or somebody to help you out and they can give you some assistance along that journey. Cole Turnbull I love you bro I think I think if the L1 wasn't fucking $1,000, there'd be so many more people trying to get it and try coaching, like why $1,000? First off, if you live in America, you have no fucking excuse not to spend $1,000 on your level one, because you probably got a free $1,000

twice during COVID for nothing. First off, second off, could you imagine how much people spend in college in America? I spent, well, my mom spent a lot of it, but I spent a lot of it too. And I didn't learn a fucking thing. And I probably learned more in the level one weekend in two days than I learned in three years or four years

of college that it took me to get a two year degree. And then I learned even more in my level too. It's just wild. $1,000 is an incredibly low barrier to entry to the most profound weekend that I've ever had in my entire life. So I get what you're saying, Cole, but that's also fucking bullshit. Save a dollar a day for three years and then you can get your level one maybe. What else? Let's see if I can pull up some comments. your level one maybe. What else? Let's see if I can pull up some comments. Okay cool. Do you think, have you, I mean you've been at CrossFit now for just over 10 years. Do

you think there has been a noticeable change since Glassman is left? Has the methodology changed? The methodology hasn't changed. No, absolutely not. The definition of CrossFit is still we do constantly varied functional movements executed at a high intensity. The material is still the same and it'll never change. It's a CrossFit definition. it's a CrossFit definition, it's CrossFit methodology. And our role, I think my role is to impart that CrossFit kernel on as many people as possible. That's my mission and purpose is to, it's life-changing stuff.

And I've seen it be effective with so many people so many times and you go around the world, doesn't matter where that I've done. I've been everywhere teaching CrossFit, not everywhere, but I've been a lot of places teaching CrossFit and it works. It doesn't matter whether it's delivered in whatever language it works.

And the methodology hasn't changed whatsoever. The L1 and the L2, we're always refining them based on the feedback from participants to try and give the best learning experience. But yeah, the methodology certainly hasn't changed. Do you think, okay, so the red shirts, the red shirts role and your guys kind of application or spreading of the methodology hasn't changed at all, you don't think? I would agree.

I feel like at least from my experience with Red Shirts and Seminars, do you think the, over your tenure, tenure, do you think you've seen a shift in programming, whether it's main site or CAP or both, do you think there's been a big change there? been a big change there? Not a big change. I don't think there's been a big change.

Certainly not. I follow CAP at my gym. It's amazing. What I see in CAP is generally with CAP, you're going to have a partner workout every week. And if you think about CAP, it's CrossFit Affiliate Programming. So it's, I guess, CrossFit.com is for anybody and everybody to implement,

but it's not the most practical because it's a three-on, one-off sort of program. And how many people do you know actually train three-on, one-off? Not many. So the CrossFit Affiliate Programming kind of makes it more applicable to a CrossFit affiliate, which is awesome. It has a partner workout generally

at the weekends and that's what we largely see around the community. There may be a couple of days in there once a week or maybe twice a week, but it might have a strength and a Metcon element, which typically you're not going to see on CrossFit.com. But other than that, I don't see, they still largely couplets and triplets, shorter workouts, complimentary movement patterns with you're not going to see on CrossFit.com. But other than that, I don't see, they still largely couplets and triplets, shorter workouts, complimentary movement patterns with high power, whole body compound movements that we utilize. And so the core CrossFit methodology,

CrossFit program, again, hasn't changed. If you took like the first ever workout programmed on CrossFit.com fast and heavy, um, you, if that was programmed again tomorrow, it wouldn't look out of place. You wouldn't, do you know what I mean? Oh, oh no, it would cause absolute destruction. There was another workout. It was a, I believe it was a row. Maybe it was just a row workout or it was a row and clean. I don't know. There were some very interesting formats in the old days. Do you think that CAP programs easier workouts than main site?

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No, God fucking damn it. We'll wait for him. He's coming back. Okay, I'm not frozen. I reloaded it just to see. I'm going to send him. Okay, let's see. Damn.

Taylor, you were fine. Negative Jeremy, maybe baking a weekend. You're good, Taylor. He froze. What are some questions you guys have for McCoy that you think that I could give a good answer to if I were McCoy? I'm going to give you McCoy's best answer. John Young doesn't need his, oh, here we go.

He's back. John Young doesn't need his L1. He needs to discover what cardio is. Six F words. Fuck you, Jonathan. All right, you're back. My question was, do you think tap programs easier workouts than main site? Because it's for affiliates.

Easier. Come on, come on. Like how do you mean easy? I don't think there's any such thing as an easy workout. It depends on your effort, right? It definitely depends on your effort, but if I went as fast as I could doing a hundred Ab-Math setups, it would not feel anywhere near what it would feel like if I went as fast as I could doing 100 GHD setups. Or if I went as fast as I could doing 100 dumbbell snatches, I think that would be a

lot harder than if I did 100 plate ground to overhead with a 55 pound plate. And I'm not just, I'm not saying that I don't like plate ground to overheads or add mat setups and maybe I haven't seen enough of cap, but I feel like I've seen some of it to be like, it feels like sometimes they're making workouts easier to fit affiliates. And that's my big gripe with most affiliate programs is in trying to cater to all affiliates. They reduce the potency sometimes. And do you get what I'm saying? I understand what you're saying, but I disagree with what you're saying.

Okay. That's fair. You can disagree. I haven't seen, I haven't seen CAP and Evergon. This is too easy and it's not hard enough. Okay. And the other cool thing that you have with CAP is one, it's got great lesson plans. Two, it's going to have lesson plans, which will help you as a coach. So it starts to tell you what these are things I'm going to look for. But if you feel like the programming is not enough,

there's a competitor's track in there as well, which has multiple elements, which is more like a 90 minute class. And then just generally for the affiliate, it has weaknesses. So you have a strength weakness, probably like five or six different weaknesses for the week. So it might have an endurance type piece, a strength piece,

a skill related piece. So if you're as an affiliate owner and you're a head coach or a programmer, a strength piece, a skill related piece. So if you're as an affiliate owner and you're a head coach or a programmer and you go today's is a 12 minute AMRAP, which I don't think is going to give them enough of a stimulus, well I would argue why not, you're going to need to get them to push to that threshold training. But secondly, if you need to add more volume, I guess, to that session, you have those weakness pieces in there as well, which are underneath where you could go, I'm going to add more volume, I guess, to that session. You have those weakness pieces in there as well, which are underneath, where you could go, I'm gonna add in as well this skill element,

where after the summa dedulphi pulls and push presses couple it, we're now gonna do some skill development and work on this, or we're gonna add an endurance piece. I think it's certainly enough. What I see digressing ever so slightly when you talk about affiliate programming, I don't know, I don't follow a lot of other ones. I think that when we do a, when we,

people are trying to sell large affiliate programming, they're trying to cater to everybody and their equipment types and things, which can make it a little bit more challenging. But I've certainly seen cat program things like GHT sit ups and even sandbag stuff and things like that, which might make it harder for affiliates. but then also you can alter that for them. Like you, it'll have a modification.

So if you don't have this, you can use this piece of equipment instead. Okay, stop selling it. We're good. Hey guys, McCoy likes cap. McCoy loves cap. All right, I'm not gonna disagree with you anymore. I don't hate it. I get what

you're saying. Do you think the games programming has gotten harder from 2007 to 2023 or four? To be honest, I wouldn't, I'm not the best person to ask. I'm not a games level athlete. So I don't know how hard it was then to now. And also I don't know what that volume feels like across the weekend. Cause I haven't ever done that much volume. Right, right. If you had to guess, using your best guess,

best inference, 2007 games workouts versus 2024, or maybe 2023 or 2022 even. Have they gotten harder? Have they gotten heavier? Have they gotten higher skill? Oh, absolutely. 2007 Games was a handful of workouts taken from the hop. So it's obviously got more difficult.

The athletes are much more fit as well. They're definitely fitter than they were. And when I started in 2009, 2010, everybody thought they were going to the CrossFit I started in 2009, 2010, everybody thought they were going to the CrossFit Games. But the problem was then everybody thought I need to have a special program to go to the CrossFit Games. I need to do more volume, I need to work on more skills and that was to the absence of intensity, was one of my mistakes. And then the best thing I thought was when the level of

athlete got so high where people were coming to the affiliates and were no longer going, I want to go to the CrossFit Games, I've just seen this awesome thing on Netflix. Get me there coach. Now it's like, hey, I just want to be able to play my grandkids or I just want to stay at the nursing home when I get older. When that mindset shift happened, I thought it was the best thing for us and leave the elite athletes to do the elite thing. Has it got more challenging? I would suggest so because the athletes have got fitter. But speaking to, you'd have to speak to one of the games athletes to tell you, hey, this is what it feels like then

to feel like then. And I guess relative to the individuals at the time, it probably felt just as challenging. I guess what I'm fishing for is to me programming from 07 to 2024 for sure harder. Athletes without a doubt fitter. I feel like main site has changed little to not at all maybe and maybe in some instances I feel like I've seen it and I'm like man this doesn't even like when I go look at main site I look at like 2008 to 2017 and I

just like it you could never get enough workouts from there and also that's kind of largely not true I've programmed like the first week of main site for Sentinel but I feel like the workouts if not have stayed the same maybe even in some ways have gotten less challenging. I mean, there used to be notes from Glassman like, hey, you're going to do 10 legless rope climbs or 10 rope climbs for time, use your hands. And if you have to use your feet, use your feet or whatever. And I just wonder if we can safely assume, not even assume, but if we have proof that

games athletes have gotten fitter over a 15 year period, do, is it even reasonable to assume that most CrossFitters have gotten fitter? Most people in most affiliates compared to 2010 compared to today, are they fitter? And should, I wonder, this is kind of, I'm not saying I have the answer to that. I maybe have an opinion, but I feel like should the programming evolve with maybe the population's evolution? I wonder that sometimes. And I'm not saying more volume, definitely not. If you're fitter, go faster, right?

It's not gonna hurt less. It's probably gonna hurt less. And like Chris Fieler famously said, the worst workout he ever did was Fran with the female weight. He's like, then you never have to stop. He's like, do you know how much that hurts? Like have to literally pull the bar down

and go to your next rep. Like go faster. And I think like Grace, for example, 30 clean and jerks with a 135 bar, that's still, it's, when I was one of the first workouts I did because I thought I'm strong and I'd be able to move it around. It took me like, not a bad time around five, I think it was 524, first time I ever did it with steel plates and it's like a deadlift reverse curl sort of thing. Now I'd be going sub three, but it would still like it still hurts so it feels

the same and then for anybody else new coming in it's like we could say well that's I started 15 years ago nearly should that should I now be doing it with 155 maybe but not if it's gonna take me seven eight minutes to do I still want to hit that stimulus and it should be a sub five minute workout for the most part so and that's where that understanding the stimulus and the only way that you can understand the stimulus is by doing a lot of CrossFit workouts. Looking at a lot of CrossFit programs, okay I can now understand what the stimulus is, how long should that take, how many reps and rounds, what should it feel like, should

it feel like a light, moderate, heavy load and then you can apply that effectively to others. I do love some of the old glassman stuff. And like you say, if you look at one of the old journal articles, Hila did a video on it about, I know what the next CrossFit Games is, it's gonna be these five workouts. And it was old school classic benchmarks. And it was really challenging.

But the other thing is they're not going in and holding an L-sit for three minutes or going in and doing slips. It's a lot harder to sell to your members when they're coming in. And they're maybe not doing the full program, hitting every day as if they were the perfect athlete and this was their priority every day. Maybe they miss a couple of days along the way. And it's like, okay, me coming in and doing this only for today isn't gonna, and then I'm gonna have another week off, which we need to make sure that they're hitting

that stimulus on multiple days. And has it got easier? I don't think it's got easier. I think you've got fitter and maybe it looks easier, but I've argued it for your average Joe, somebody like me coming into the gym, I never look at a workout and think this is gonna be too easy today and The shorter the workout

Generally the harder is gonna be the worst is gonna feel Maybe that was a bad choice of words because I don't think that I've looked at workouts and said That's too easy. I definitely have looked at work. I said like that's fucking dumb, but But I also am extremely opinionated. Do you think I have this opinion or perspective that CrossFit HQ really, not even preaches, but practices virtuosity of coaching, of adherence to kind of the methodology, so food intake, eating well. But I feel like my opinion or my perspective is that CrossFit used to be the gold standard of programming, main site especially, and I feel like now it's not. And should they go out and say, hey, we need, I don't know, to reclaim that position as the benchmark gold standard. And I guess if I'm CrossFit, there's no fucking way I want someone like Yami to exist outside

of my employees. Do you know what I mean? So I guess I'll throw that back at you. It's like, what is the gold standard? And I guess that's why we at the CrossFit Games is, cool, if you think you've got a better way, show me. Like, if you've, and is that gonna work for everybody? Right.

Matt Fraser, Rich Froening, the way that Miko Salo, Miko Salo was probably the first person, maybe not the first person, but his volume was insane. And it was like, cool, we've got a proven strategy. Miko Salo is working out multiple times a day. He's in his basement doing 10K rows in the morning. Matt Fraser is in his basement, crushing multiple sessions per day.

This looks like it's the formula to make you the most elite athlete in the world. Awesome. But can everybody do that? No. And it's like, so that isn't the pinnacle of programming, particularly not for the vast majority of people. Right, the pinnacle would be maybe minimum effective dose.

Yeah, I'd agree. Like the minimum effective dose to keep you coming back for more. And the programming is one aspect, but you can have the gold standard programming, but if you have ineffective coaching, it's not going to work. And you can have gold standard coaching, and you can have a subpar crossfit program. You could walk into any affiliate which the head coach is doing his own programming, thinks he's got this new secret, squid-o method of programming. And the app is going to get better,

but it doesn't mean it's the best level of programming. If the coaching is effective, people are going to get fitter. They're consistently turning up, and you're applying mechanics, consistency, intensity in your coaching. They're going to get better. I know that you've got a training program. You love programming. You specialize down there.

And I don't think there's a, I think it's awesome. And I used to be all about programming as well. I'm like, man, I want to find the secret. What's the fastest way? Back in the day, I remember when everybody was in outlaw and outlaw seemed to be the way we were cleaning and snatching everything. Everybody went to regionals twice by following outlaw and then that dropped by the wayside

and then it was we've got to do aerobic capacity then it was we've got to do X fill in the blank and outlaw away. I think it's cool and we could debate and argue about this forever but for the majority of people that are turning up on affiliate, CrossFit.com or Cap or, like I feel like that effective. I feel like. Definitely effective. My biggest, the thing I appreciate most of kind of the way Glassman wrote main site and how I saw main site

for the longest time is you looked at a workout and it made you want to do it. It made your eyes kind of get a little big and you're like oh damn that looks cool or I've never seen that before like for example a rowing workout where you have a set amount of pulls for max calories or I saw this format on MainSite maybe last year it was like a 25 minute EMOM and minute one was five reps of a push jerk maybe for max load minutes two and three were like 10 box jump overs and max calories on the rower and then minutes three and four or minutes three through five or four through five were rest. And

it was like the coolest EMOM format. I was like, Whoa, I've never seen that. I, that's my, I guess, pinnacle of programming is like what you said, minimum effective dose, but writing a workout that makes even people who don't really know much about CrossFit, but definitely people who have been coming around a little bit makes them want to do it. And a workout that leaves them feeling like, Whoa, I've never felt this way before. Kind of chasing a stimulus that they've never hit before. That's why I've always, that's why I fell in love with CrossFit. I did the same thing, bodybuilding splits.

And then I ran, swan, pull-ups, push-ups, and that's all I did. And I only squatted once a week and I was five by 10 every single week. And then I did CrossFit and it was like rope climbs and deadlifts. And then I was like, how can you do a bar muscle up? And, and then, uh, Laredo lunges air squats pushups and running and it was just so different every single day and that looking at a workout and being like damn that's so cool that's why that's what I care most about is make you know and obviously pairing that with it's intentionally varied you're not doing too much of this,

not doing too much of that. You're working your different time domains, et cetera, but. You there? McCoy, uh-oh. Beep beep. I got you. You and me. I think it was you. I got you. Yeah, I hear what you're saying.

For me, programming doesn't need to be sexy to be effective. And we can get and I'm not saying the original, obviously the original CrossFit and the glassman workout you're referring to are not overly sexy and ineffective by any means, but it can be the guys at CAP, James Hobart and the team there, they know what they're doing, they know what they're talking about. And yeah, I regularly go back and look at some of the old workouts

just for more inspiration, I'm like, cool, how can I put a cool twist on this? I saw, I remember I commented on some of these posts recently. I can't remember who this was. But like an old school thing that Glassman did was, like it was a 5K run. I think it was like the team's workout. And they had a series of programming workouts.

It's like, we're gonna do a 5K run on this day. And then now we're gonna record the scores. Then the next time we're gonna do it again in a week, or two weeks, or three weeks later, but we're gonna set everybody off in reverse order of their times. So now the slowest are now getting a chance to be chased by the fastest who are starting off last.

And they're like, oh, that's cool. And just cool little spins like that. You've got a lot of knowledge. It's like going back and looking at that stuff and seeing how you can implement it. For me, having done this for so long, I don't need, you give me a simple couplet and it's a 12 minute unwrap, I don't need anything else to be like,

oh, that makes it more fun and more sexy. And I've gone through that phase, but I did want to have that stuff and any workout with power cleansers. That's why everybody's probably working with DT. It's like, cause it's triplet, it's got a barbell, which is a manageable load, which we get to throw around and it's fun But not every workout is gonna reflect that because again if we if we have a blueprint for our programming

Then we're also setting the blueprint for our weaknesses will be What's your favorite workout? Probably DT. Probably DT. My one of my old workouts that I used to love but I used to do this a lot when I was in Afghan was small, hero workout. It's four movements. I think it's a 1K row, 50 burpees, 50 box jumps, and an 800 meter run. Something like that.

And it's just, I loved it because it's low skill. Anybody can do it. And you'd have people that are runners, people that are rowers that think they're fit and it's like, cool, we're gonna do this monostrutural workout. Well, obviously the two gymnastics movements being the burpee and the box jump. But it would again, would hand on the backside

but when you have to get outside of your specialty, it's about any weight because that was the argument I used to get back then was, oh, it's about any weight, because that was the argument I used to get back then was, you'd only beat me because you're stronger than me. And then it was, let's do this. And so that was one of my old school ones. And again, it was a humbling one. I remember Christian Clever crushing my time when I was in that, like, looking on main site when I was in Afghanistan, and going, man, how is she doing that so quick? But I thought that I was a pretty good runner and not a bad rower. Um, so yeah, a couple of my favorite workouts, I guess, from,

from, from old school ones. Did you see combat in Afghanistan? I wasn't, I won't. So my role was an exercise. We have instructor in combat, but something's gone drastically wrong. I forgot you mentioned that, but I wasn't sure if they like shifted your role or whatever. My guys that were getting injured out there on the front line, they would come back and if it was obviously not a significant injury, we kind of had a two week period where we

try and get them back on the front line. So I saw a lot of like lower back injuries because they're carrying so much load. A lot of people rolling alcohols and a lot of like those sort of injuries, dealing with people that have been in IDs and shrapnel blasts, it's like, okay, now whilst you're recovering from your shrapnel blast, we're gonna get you into some exercise. It was the greatest job I ever did in the military by far

because you're on the frontline actually helping people out, going around to their bases and dealing with like scenes going in, going, hey, what can we help out with? Doing some taping, strapping, giving them some rehab exercises to keep them out there, to keep the operational tempo high. So that was an awesome job. And I also got to train at CrossFit Leatherneck out there, which was one of the first affiliates I ever trained at, to be honest. There's on the US base, there was an affiliate called CrossFit Leatherneck and went there and

we had a competition which was super cool and did a bit of coaching there and so yeah that was good times. How many lives do you think CrossFit's impacted? I know Don has talked about his 30 million goal. I mean how many people do you think have done a CrossFit workout or have done... yeah let's go with that. How many people do you think have done a CrossFit workout or have done? Yeah, let's go with that. How many people do you think have done a CrossFit workout? I don't know. I don't know how you would measure that. What I would say now though is how many people are doing CrossFit workouts and

not even realizing the CrossFit workouts. And I heard Daniel Shafi say this. Gyms don't look like they used to look, but like when I started CrossFit, gyms looked like global gyms. Now you go in any global gym and it's got a rig, it's got a functional area. People are doing essentially CrossFit workouts. Like they'll have a clock

and they'll have whatever movements they'll be doing and they'll, they won't realize it is CrossFit or they'll call it something else, it's functional fitness. And one of my pet peeves is people go, they boot you and water it down and think it's this new special methodology. And it's like, it isn't this new special thing. You're misapplying CrossFit and you're doing it poorly and you're calling it something else. applying CrossFit and you're doing it poorly and you're calling it something else. And yeah, so yeah, I think lots, lots and lots and lots of people are doing it. And even like, it's hard to say what is a CrossFit workout? The most programmed workout.com is

5k run. Everybody's running now with the introduction of high rocks. So, and again, everybody gets excited about high rocks. Like I've seen these things come and go, but when I was in the military, we had a competition called ultra fit, which was like 10 exercises and you do, like it's just a long chipper, but it was, it was find out who was ultra fit. Um, it's just a workout, just another workout and it's not a training methodology. Do you think, how do you think we, I sent you this message on Instagram maybe a week ago or something, but I was, I had this stream of thought where I was wondering if it takes most people or at least now, and maybe most is a stretch, but if it takes some people

stepping into an affiliate for the first time to learn CrossFit. And you think about all of the other people who are just clicking that, oh, 30 day big butt or 30 day apps program on Instagram. How do you reach more people with CrossFit? How do you reach people who may never step into an affiliate? And is that worth doing? Are those that even people that you want to reach?

Do you think those people are capable of learning enough and making that leap eventually? Like, is it worth, is there being this introduction to CrossFit that someone can, do you get what I'm saying? Like, how do you reach the people that maybe at a glance want the easy way, fitness-wise? at a glance want the easy way fitness wise. So to summarize your question I guess is what you're asking is how do we reach more people? Yeah how do you reach more people? How do you reach more people?

That's a I guess I'm not I'm not the best person to speak to in terms of strategy. What's your A person and you know a lot about CrossFit. I actually had a chat with Matt Sousa yesterday to help me out with the marketing and branding and things. I'm going to start expanding my affiliate and we're moving, just purchased a piece of land up in the mountains, going to have a nonprofit up there to try and get Balinese people to do CrossFit because here in Bali, they can't afford it. It's geared towards tourism and we have these big affiliates which people pay the standard Westernized drop-in fee, which is awesome

and it's great and they have this cool holiday experience, but we are the local population, it makes it a lot more challenging for them to get CrossFit and they need to understand the CrossFit methodology. They also have really abysmal diets because they've been influenced by the Western nutritional practices and Coca-Cola and all these things have come in and it's like a sign of influence to be able to like, I can afford to eat McEdeas and I can afford to buy Coca-Cola's. So people are, they don't know better. They're unconsciously incompetent and they think it's a sign of wealth. So that's my plan is to try and get it

to the local population. On a broader scale across the world, I guess the more affiliates we have, I saw a post, I don't even know where it came from, but somebody said, like yesterday or the day before, if every affiliate in the world had 200 members, there would still be more people to go and save your competition isn't the affiliate down the road. Right. So can we ever like I would

love to have as many CrossFit affiliates as we have Starbucks coffee shops everywhere. And then everybody can drop in and work out because the coaching element is an important element. And that's where I really value my role is to help develop coaches to, to increase their reach to build that interpersonal relationship with their athletes. Because their ability to teach, see, and correct, and group management, present strategy and demonstration is one thing, but if they can't build a relationship and get people to stick in the affiliate, then they're doing themselves a disservice. Is the aim to get everybody to work out in their garage and would everybody get fitter?

If I worked out in my garage in the dark and never recorded my times or my scores, I would still get fitter and I'd still be doing CrossFit. But I guess that's not the aim. We have the CrossFit Games app, which posts CrossFit.com workout on it every day so people can start on there. It's got the modifications to use dumbbells. My girlfriend's sister is getting into CrossFit exercise. She's in Australia and she is a little bit afraid maybe

to go into a CrossFit affiliate just yet but. And also she's got a really busy schedule. They've got three kids. They've got their own small business to operate. So she's got a small set of dumbbells. And we sent her dumbbell variations of cat workouts. And if she's got any questions, she can reach out. She can also hop on YouTube and look at the movements. And then I guess when she gets a little bit more proficient

and builds her confidence, hopefully then we can get her to go into the CrossFit affiliate. She comes and trains with me and my affiliate when she gets here, bit more proficient and builds her confidence, hopefully then we can get her to go into the CrossFit affiliate. She comes and trains with me and my affiliate when she gets here, because I've got that relationship with her, because I've had that contact point where I'm going, hey, you're gonna be fine, get yourself in here, let's do it.

And she loves it, which is a challenge. Those people are out there, we just need to get out there and find them and get, like, drag them in, kicking or screaming and give them the best experience ever. And then we've been turning out. Do you think CrossFit would increase their ability to put people so more affiliates, you know, maybe not obvious, but feels obvious, getting more people in affiliates then but do you think it would increase cross? Do you think it would make

it easier to get more people into affiliates of CrossFit had a Learn CrossFit and a eight-week Learn CrossFit with a broomstick thing or, I mean, I guess a CrossFit equivalent to like the 30-day ad program. I guess I just have this idea that if someone who is scared to go on an affiliate had this, buy this for 20 bucks and I can learn CrossFit in four weeks, then in four weeks I can go into an affiliate and I'm not so scared anymore. I don't know.

I mean, I feel like I just have it in my head that that would have to put, make it more accessible to people. And in that book, you can say things like, hey, most CrossFit affiliates in your area or whatever, or like an average cost of a CrossFit membership is this. The average cost of someone eating out twice a week across a month is this.

Yes, it's an investment and an expense, but hey, if you stop going to Bucking Arby's three times a week or twice a week even, in a month, you can afford your CrossFit membership. And then you've given people the, you've taken away, I just feel like there has to be this manual, which the level one is, but who doesn't know what CrossFit is,

is going to one, take the level one or download the handbook, you know what I mean? You're preaching to the converted. I had this vision. I remember I did a level one. We were in Wales. I didn't know this. Yeah, there used to be an on-ramp on there. Like marketing and strategy and all that sort of stuff way above my pay grade. Like I focus on coaching and coaching really well. But I have this vision, this dream of like, imagine everybody in the world did CrossFit. It'd be phenomenal.

I had this vision that, I was doing a level one in Wales and at the same time we had a competition which Matt Evans actually started called Divider Re Refall and it's a team competition. So in this little town in Wales, I think it was Swansea, there was in my hotel we had all the seminar staff, there were 50 participants on the seminar, so it's a huge seminar and then everybody else were there to compete and it was like everywhere I looked there's just just full of people that are fit and able and CrossFit is like, man, this is like seeing

into the future, it's phenomenal. And this was going back, like going back 10 years or so. So like we, like Glassman said, it's a program for Navy SEALs, which we can scale down for our grandmothers. And he said at one point, like, we've got all the fit people. Now we need to try and get all the people that really need this help.

Along with that, we need the people who are obese, maybe slight, all these other subdomains or categories of people. It's like, OK, how do we get to them? How do we reach them? But yeah, I would love to everybody in the world to do CrossFit. And people are, you see more and more people do CrossFit.

I see HiRox as a great funnel system to get people into CrossFit. They're like, oh my god, these things got bobbles and running. Like, where did this idea come from? It's like, we've been doing it for the last 20 years, 20 plus years. So yeah, the guys are the.

Uh oh. Guys, comments? Is it me or McCoy? I think it's McCoy. Hello, Matt? Am I frozen or is McCoy frozen? Fucking balls. Dagger.

So yeah. I got your back. Booked my back. Do you think, I feel like I've seen, not I feel like, I've definitely seen a messaging shift or a branding shift from CrossFit. Maybe not even since Glass, I don't know, maybe it was when kind of Glassman left, but I, or even when he was still there,

I know they, you know, they were doing the things like the water jugs in the living room and the stand up from the couch. They were doing those videos trying to get to the aging population, but I didn't feel like the branding was gone was gone of, Hey, this is the hardest thing you're ever going to do, but anyone can do it. It's for anyone, but maybe not everyone.

I like that. I feel like that wasn't gone, but I definitely feel like that branding has. Maybe it was dormant for a while and it's maybe making resurgence. Do you think if you could, let me ask you this. If you had full control over the messaging, the CrossFit, um, doled out to the masses to try to get more people into affiliates. If you had full control over the CrossFit message to everyone, what would it be? What would, if you're standing on the corner, tell me you're asking the wrong person.

No, I'm not, dude. You own an affiliate. You're the right person. What would not, no, I'm not, dude. You own an affiliate. You're the right person. What would you, what would you tell people? When I started in CrossFit, people would ask me and I thought it was cool to like tell them, hey, basically your workout is my warmup. And it's like, we used to have that on t-shirts and stuff.

And like, I think the messaging depends on the individual. And as a brand, I don't know what that looks like. I haven't got metrics on bigger picture stuff. But if I'm talking to people to get them into my affiliate, if I'm talking to grandma, I'm gonna tell her how it's scalable and they can bring them in and I'm gonna make them feel safe. If I'm speaking to the MMA fighter who's a badass,

I'm gonna tell them this is the hardest thing. You think you're tough, come and try this workout. So it's an understanding mentality of who you're talking to I guess is gonna help get them in the door. As a brand, as a company, that's way above my skill, I don't know. I don't think it is though, because as a brand and as a company, what they are, the message that they have

is really the message that you as an affiliate owner has. I mean, what are they trying to do differently? They're trying to get more people into affiliates. Well, what are you trying to do as an affiliate owner? You're trying to get more people into your affiliate. I don't know. I guess I have this, again, I have this opinion and perception that cross-fit exploded. Every affiliate is different and I've got a different clientele. My affiliate, I do no more than six in a class. It's semi-private, private training, old school sort of glassman thing.

It's only word of mouth. I do no marketing, no messaging. I just, people I know. And it works at the moment until I expand and I move to a new location because I find a different sort of demographic I want to work with. Well, did you tell those people anything

to get them in the door or are those people who just knew you and said, Hey, I want to try this. Pretty much. Hey, I want to try this picture pants 1000 words and like inspired by example. And were you were you that you were that example or you were that inspiration? I think so. I don't know.

Um, yeah, like, well. Yeah, I guess I was. And it's, again, for me, having that mentality of, hey, what do you wanna do? Do you wanna go and climb a mountain, swim an ocean? I'm ready to rock and roll, but if we're going surfing, if we're going hiking, I'm ready. And I guess people kind of see that and go,

hey, you're fit and you'd always seem to be ready for everything, what do you do? But what appeals to that and go, hey, you're fit and you'd always seem to be ready for everything. I can like, what do you do? But what appeals to you and I, it appealed to me to be like, this is super hard and this is going to hand me on my backside and I like discomfort. I'm used to being out of my comfort zone and lying on the floor at the end of a workout not knowing whether I'm going to crap myself or whether I'm going to be sick and it's like, man, what the hell just happened? Like that appeals to me. But that messaging isn't gonna appeal to everybody. So yeah, as a company, marketing,

I just focus on, can I give the people that I get in contact with the best experience ever and let the powers, I control the controllables, I have control over what happens up or down the chain other than what I've got my hand on. What does that look like? What's the best class? Like what makes a perfect class?

Perfect classes, well like an end to end. If you are someone, if you are taking somebody's class and you leave leave and try to take off the L4 cap here because most people aren't and I and I say that in the sense of and put yourself in the average affiliate member shoes you go into a gym what's going to have you leaving being like holy fuck that was the best class I've ever taken. Simple things, starts on time, finishes on time, coaches in uniform, and he's given me his undivided attention.

As a coach, I like to think of, can I have three touch points with every individual in that class, ideally using their name as well? And it's like that combination of my knowledge and my application of that knowledge, applying threshold training is gonna give them the best experience possible. And I guess that's it.

And there's been classes where I've turned up, the coach isn't in uniform. There's been classes where he doesn't start on time, and classes where it runs over. We've all been there where you're over time and the next class comes in and it's like, hey guys, go and just hit me a quick 400 meters till I finish up with this one.

We all know that's not the best experience. And my presence and attitude, when somebody cares and is passionate about what they do, it's infectious. And it's like, man, I want to come back to this guy's class. If they spend the time in the meeting, like, hey, great job, McCoy. It was so good having you come in today. You look pretty proficient.

Have you done this stuff before? And I'm like, yeah, actually, I've been doing it for a little while now. Like, hey, that was awesome. Cool. Tomorrow we've got a cool class. I'd love to see you back again. And you're like, I like this.

I had a good experience going to come back. But if the coach isn't passionate, if they don't show that they care about you, then we have a saying of nobody cares what you know until they know that you care. And have you felt it from coaches? I mean I'm sure you've had to do this. I'm sure maybe most everyone who's coached across the class has done this where you are having not a great day and you have to pretend that you care. Do you, can you feel that from a coach if you take a class and you know that they're a good coach

or that they do care about, or maybe you don't, maybe you're new and it's your first class and you're being coached by someone who's pretending to care and maybe they're having a hard day. Can you feel that? Absolutely. Yeah. And like you can feel it as yourself as a coach. You've got to fake it till you make it.

And if you have a small affiliate and you have members that know you and you've got to fake it till you make it. And if you have a small affiliate and you have members that know you and you've got that relationship with everybody in the affiliate, then sometimes it's okay to be having a bad day and be like, hey guys, this is it. And you have your your ringleaders, if you would, in the affiliate that maybe pick up the slack. And it's not their role to, it's not their job to, but you understand, like, and then affiliate becomes like a close-knit family. And like we all go through ups and downs. So it's like for the most part, bringing it as best as you can.

And if you're going through some stuff and you're unable to bring it, then taking some time out and go, hey, let me get my shit together and come back and be able to provide that experience for my members. I feel like that's the best experience I've had with the best classes or the best coaches. You can feel so much like they care. And they're just not pretending.

Every ounce of fun and it just is pouring off them. And that's an awesome feeling. My first experience with that is Jeff Tintcher, if you know who that is, Maggie Tintcher. I'm sure you know who Maggie is, her husband. Yeah, Robert Moore, superstar. Dude, he just like, he could just make you feel the way you're talking about, just saying your name.

And you know, it's crazy. What do you think made, or this is an interesting question I had, can you coach CrossFit without coaching classes at an affiliate? Can you you coach process without coaching classes and necessarily? Can you coach crossfit without coaching classes and affiliate? Yeah Well, I don't mean legally. I'm not I don't mean legally. Sorry if that's what you're going. I mean like Can you coach CrossFit online? Can you coach CrossFit?

I've never been a fan of online coaching. Um, you can coach CrossFit in individual training. Like it's largely what I do. I do semi-personal, semi-private or private sessions. I use a CrossFit methodology. Um, it makes it a little easier to manage thresholds for that individual. Um, also makes it a lot easier to build a relationship because you understand what they like, what they dislike.

You build a more interpersonal relationship, start talking about their family, politics, whatever's going on. Maybe not politics, not my forte. But you can get into nitty-gritty and start to learn more about them than you can in 15 people in a 16 minute class. So you can develop your skills there,

but also understand your limitations. If you only coach PTs, when you then move to class, like coach 15 people, it's gonna be a struggle for you. If you always coach 15 or more, when you go down to these smaller groups, it's probably gonna be harder for you, and that's where people over-programming go, I don't know how to fill those void spots,

because I'm usually going around queuing and correcting 15 people, now I only have five to deal with. This makes it a lot more challenging. So now I'll just add an extra volume. Now we're gonna do strength A, B, followed by workout C, because now I can herd cats and check the time and cheerlead rather than have to actually coach.

So yeah, the path to virtuosity has no one set way, but the only way is to coach CrossFit. You can't not coach CrossFit and then expect to be a great CrossFit coach. And that's essentially it. Do you think CrossFit is the foundation or at least that methodology of training and living really, you know, eating is the foundation to human performance. Like it is the absolute method of living the longest and being the fittest person on the planet. Absolutely.

I haven't seen anything better. And as you already know, where it often goes wrong is people don't try to implement nutrition. And when I have ever implemented nutrition, it has been an absolute game changer. It's been a game changer. Eating meat and vegetables, nuts and seeds, some fruit, little starch, no sugar, keeping it to intake that supports exercise, not body fat, moves the needle more than anything else. I didn't need the special program.

It wasn't outlaw. It wasn't fill in the blank programming. It was getting my nutrition on track. And it isn't that hard to do. It isn't that hard to do. Simple, not easy. Matt, yes, you guys are gonna see a lot of me teaching and a lot of McCoy telling me how to teach better.

That's gonna be the whole series. If you had to give a coach one, or if you had to give one defining quality that would make a great coach, what would it be? Care. Care. Okay. Right.

Yeah. Glassman said it best. Care, care, care. I can teach anybody to be a good coach. I think anybody to be a good coach, but I can't teach you to give a shit. And that's under the individual. What do you think? A lot of affiliates is really like, employ coaches within their community already, people that

are just regular members, and they become coaches and their best because, because they already care, they already know the community, they care, and they give a shit about the people that are training that are around them. Rather than bringing this PhD professor who knows what's happening on a biological level, cellular level when you're working out, but actually doesn't care about the individuals they're working with. Taylor, I have to shoot, buddy. It's been an absolute pleasure. Taylor T, sorry for dragging you along. It's okay, dude. I'm looking forward to it. Thank you so much. I'm excited to get you on this journey. All right, bro.

We'll get you moving forward. Next week, Thursday, right? Thank you, yeah. Friday, Thursday, Thursday. All right, okay, see you, bro. Bye. Damn, that's crazy. He's a full, however long ahead.

Like it's Friday morning for him, Thursday evening for us. So next Thursday for anyone Eastern Standard Time, if you are aware, McCoy is in Bali. It'll be next Friday morning. It will be our first episode. I was going to ask him what makes a great athlete. I wonder if you guys have any ideas. What's your best guess? Like one defining quality that would make a great athlete? Maybe not a game champion, but just, Maybe not a game champion, but just, I don't know, the best athlete. What's one defining quality? I was, I was having some introspective questions to myself when I was thinking of what to ask McCoy.

Coachable. But what does that mean, Matt Burns? What does it mean to be coachable? Is that, is that the defining quality or is that a result of a different defining quality? Like, is that a result of caring? Maybe it's caring again. Just caring Coachability again, but again, is that a symptom of a defining quality or is that the defining quality? I Don't know I'm going live with JR in 25 minutes. I have to adjust this Shut up and scribble fuck. I forgot to ask

who inquisitive. Desire to learn more. I would maybe lump that in with caring about how you move. Humility and eagerness to learn. Interesting. Okay, guys, we're going to be back in 25 minutes on shut up and scribble and our topic today are the hardest workouts we've done all year. That was one I meant to ask McCoy with the hardest workout he's ever done. I had some other questions, but fuck, I fucked off on programming for too long. Should have expected that, but see you guys.