The Sevan Podcast - shut up and scribble / MOVEMENTS... training vs competition

Episode Date: June 11, 2024

special guest, Chase Ingraham Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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That's BetterHelp.com. meeting with friends before the show we can book your reservation and when you get to the main event skip to the good bit using the card member entrance let's go seize the night that's the powerful backing of american express visit amex.ca slash y amex benefits vary by card other conditions apply buddy this shirt is fully bought and paid for supporting ariel lowen and dylan and the rest of the squad for this shirt i tried to buy one before the west semi-final because i wanted to wear one and they were sold out i bought two i bought two but i didn't get them in time and let me just tell you uh i got an xl and it is an actual it's an american xl this is for an obese person this This is not for a big guy.

It's for an obese person. It's not a European large. Right. This is not a Euro large. This is very strongman-esque. So Bryson would be pleased with that if he bought that? Yeah, he'd be right at home. If he got a double XL, he would actually look like he's wearing a bed sheet probably.

He's wearing a bed sheet probably. So you guys are going to get me in probably not so rare form in a terrible mood after getting beaten by Jelly Hostie earlier. And that other dude who looked metrosexual. Oh, did another guy meet you? I just saw the – He looked like a Ken doll. Yeah, he looked like a Ken doll that was celebrating this month of June. Um, and that's no, and that's no knock on him. He was very attractive. I told him next time you should make yourself look a little uglier before you come on the show. It's one thing to get beat by someone fitter than you, or at least in that particular

workout, it's another to have someone better looking than you at the same time. Yeah. And also beat me. So that happened. Uh, we're going to talk about this is Jr. Has been edging this topic for the past, like six months. He's like, dude, we got to do a show on movements, competition versus training. Have I? Yeah, dude. This is like, or did I, or did I just text you this morning and say, we texted you this morning, but you've been texting me this exact topic for like six months. Don't tell me I'm wrong. You have been bro. You've been waiting for this day.

So Jr's probably got it all figured out. Chase and him are going to have a great discussion. And if you guys need a swear word every 30 or 45 seconds, that's what I'm here for. So, and what Taylor's going to do is give his opinion and me and chase are wrong regardless of if we agree or not hey i'm used to that wow so movements competition verse training what is appropriate to program for a competition um what's not appropriate to program for a competition what are movements that are only should be performed or

should be relegated only to your training um i don't know how i feel about this you've been that you've you've thought deeply on this i have not uh i think there's movements that you are very polarizing that you're either a hard yes or a hard no right until you they get brought up you probably haven't thought about them i I wish. I will say this. Before we start this conversation, I feel like I err on the side of anything goes in competition rather than not. I err on the side of if you do it during

training, that's a fine line. Functional movements. Functional movements that are executed at high intensity, I err on the side of you should put it in competition but i'm not i'm not saying oh a bulgarian split squat should be programmed in competition yeah that's right like not a bicep curl but like a compound functional movement um all right so

jr you lead the way lead from the front brother let's let's start with one that we've only really seen once in competition but uh based on a recent post that i saw is uh going to try to be replicated by the monster games i believe i saw chris ibarra and olivia kerstetter were testing out this workout and it is with an air rifle so let's start with shooting so So should shooting, whether it's archery, whether it's like an air rifle like Rogue did, should shooting. We can go down the rabbit hole of tangential physical skills with accuracy and blah, blah, blah. Good shooting at something for penalties, not for penalties, for a time deduction or add-on, should shooting or some kind of target be in a competition for cross? That's called CrossFit or that we would just say is CrossFit.

Like we're, I know tactical games is its own thing. Let's leave that out. But let's just say for a CrossFit competition at the games or, you know, at a big competition like Rogue rogue how do you guys feel about that i think i think wrestling one-on-one is way more functional and cooler than a than fucking shooting a bb gun dude let me just say this i love shooting i used to have two ar-15s daniel defense one was 300 blackout was five by six i only sold them because i never shot and i've killed a ton of wild pigs with those i love to shoot you got rid of them yeah yeah this was i know not a good decision what was it is and i'm i'm rich

now dude so i was like trust me i'm like looking at i'm on fucking palmetto state armory for like an hour a day right now just uh drooling i'm thinking i'm gonna get a 1911 um i've always wanted a really nice 1911 but i still have firearms i just got rid of those two because i never used them and i had like probably seven or eight grand wrapped up in um you know trigicon site an aimpoint site anyways go to a cheaper than dirt.com that's a great website yeah you know who i miss sorry jr uh the youtuber nut and fancy i used to watch nut and fancy he's like a gun gear knives reviewer i used to just watch him for like dude and kind of a weird guy but anyways if you want to like watch somebody just play with expensive shit that can kill people go go to his youtube um

i love shooting i don't think it's functional functional. I think having a bucket of stones the exact same size and shape and weight that you pick out of a bucket and throw at a target, like throwing an actual fucking rock, I think that would be a better test of physical fitness than shooting a gun. Dude, I'm just saying. Think about as primitive as it gets throwing a stone at a little bunny rabbit and killing a gun, dude, I'm just saying like, think about as primitive as it gets throwing a stone at a little bunny rabbit and killing that bunny, dude. I mean, guns are just so new and not, you don't, it's nothing physical about it other than squeezing your finger and lowering your heart rate. Chase, did you call that? Did you call that rogue invitational?

No, that was Sean and Bill. Okay. Do you remember that event specifically? Oh yeah. I remember when it was programmed. I remember when it came out. I remember the reactions to it. When it comes to testing accuracy, I think sometimes events will focus too much on the scientific definition of it and not what the accuracy should be displayed within a functional movement as taylor was talking about earlier right i want to see accuracy displayed in a snatch or accuracy displayed in uh if you want to get cute which i think shooting is a cute movement to put in

competition then something like a flying pull-up bar or, you know, monkey bars, maybe floating wall ball targets where you're, you know, we've talked about on Get With The Programming is I would love to see one day a five-level wall ball target that you have to go one, two, three, four, five, four, three, two, one everywhere. Oh, that would be so cool. Okay. Double unders are an accurate, like the accuracy component in the 10 general physical skills, I think should be displayed within the movements that you're doing, not a specific movement to

test accuracy itself. So handstand walks and obstacles are a test of accuracy. The parallel bars when you're walking across, the pivot on the raised parallel bars, that's an accuracy component. And to get very specific, like I did an event one time that had cornhole at the end of every round. Was it fun? Yes. If we want to do something local, something new, something fresh. Okay. Where it turns into where I question it when it's to say, qualify for something major, or there's a massive prize at the like prize purse. And like, for example, this type of accuracy testing has no bearing on fitness zero, unless it's demanding, right? Unless it's physically demanding. I don't think it should be at a test to find the fittest person at whatever

competition you do. So for examples, like say this is a bad example but say um rich was bad at shooting and this is 2013 and they're shooting at the cross at games or matt or tia in peak level and they lose the cross of games was that an appropriate way to test accuracy right in finding the fittest person person blank wherever. So that's where I think sometimes you'll see programmers try something new, maybe with good intention of, oh, let's put accuracy in there. And I think accuracy like coordination or balance on the more of the skill parts of the 10 general physical skills, those things are pieces of the puzzle. Whereas we can test power and we can test strength and we can test speed on one-offs.

Those neurological adaptations, I think are components of functional movements, not necessarily should be isolated as a test. Hickok45, another great gun and gear reviewer. What modality would shooting fall into? It would fall into Republicaner um what modality would shooting fall into it would fall into republican republican modality um and everyone else can kick rocks um so i would say i don't know how jr keeps his straight face he didn't he laughed for that one dude i got i got a little

giggle he had to look down into the left that was a down into the left that is that is jr laughing out loud um i think i honestly, for a CrossFit competition, as long as the goal of the competition isn't qualifying to quarterfinals, semifinals of the games, I think the way Rogue tested it was great because it was an Olympic event. It was, it was the biathlon, right? The ski shoot. Like I, I think that was cool.

I thought it was cool. Yeah. Right. I enjoyed that was cool. I thought it was cool. Yeah. Right? I enjoyed that. You know, people go back to the 2011 softball throw, and I would say of all the accuracy tests I've seen, that is actually the best one, even though. But it wasn't accuracy.

It was just distance. No, you had to keep it between in your lane though between between but how wide were the lanes like maybe 10 yards so so for anyone who's ever thrown a ball 100 feet plus there's a major accuracy component because if you're five degrees off this way and that's why i didn't like the rock thing right or a cornhole if i'm five degrees off in cornhole i'm still making it in if i'm cornhole, I'm still making it in. If I'm shooting free throws, I'm still making it from the distance. If I'm throwing 150 to 200 feet away, that is a massive accuracy component as well as the display of, say, power.

Yeah, my thoughts on it are if you're going to – like people who take risk and i like some innovation so people want to take a chance and try to do something that other people are maybe too afraid to do or that no one's tried to do before i'm already gonna kind of give them a thumbs up for that and then if it hits great if it falls apart hey probably shouldn't done it like i would say um using the uh using the you could just call it the adaptive rope. Um, right. In Madrid. Yeah.

Oh, the monorope. Using the monorope. Right. Like that, that was, that was just a, Hey, let's do this because no one else has done it before. And some people liked it. Some people didn't, but I can commend the, the attempt. So likewise, um, when I talked to one of the people involved with monster games they

said uh we released that we were doing it uh three months ago and we told them what gun we were using and we gave two of them away and i think that's the way to do it because i'm sure that there's some there's some sponsorship or partnership there you're giving the athletes that are going to qualify plenty of time to get the thing that they need. Just like, you know, Hey, you need to make sure you have a drag rope to bring with you. We're not going to supply them. So if you don't have a drag rope for the competition in October, make sure you get one. I think giving a heads up is always a plus. Um, but yeah, so kind of staying there, let's talk about throwing. We know it's in the pyramid. We know it's with weightlifting. We've seen it done a couple of times.

They did the med ball GHD toss, right? Like for distance, they did the softball toss for distance and accuracy. You could say, what place does throwing have? Do you think they could do something like that? We're not going to call a wall ball shot,

a throw. I think that's a little too much of a stretch, but like if they said, Hey, rogue makes this thing. It's going to kind of be like a hammer throw. We're going to a little too much of a stretch, but like if they said, Hey, rogue makes this thing, it's going to kind of be like a hammer throw. We're going to do it for distance. Hey, we're going to throw a javelin or we're going to, it can be things that are actually already like an Olympic sport or like, uh, the head of a dumbbell. We're just going to use it as a shot put, and we're going to see who can throw it the farthest, any kind of throwing though. How do you

guys feel about throwing? I think it would be cool if an event again cool not appropriate for maybe testing the fittest on earth but if an event like rogue in scotland did did a test where you had maybe seven to ten different implements all of them were like you know and each of the field gets three attempts at each implement and they're all scored equally for one 100 point test it's like you throw a stone here you throw the sandbag over the log scott you know strongman test here you uh do a shot put on the next whatever um all testing an element of throwing all testing, maybe some degree of accuracy, some testing accuracy, more strength,

power output more than others, but you kind of combine them into one global throwing accuracy, power test. I think that would be cool. I would like a test. And I think this is actually appropriate if we're say trying to find the fittest is that you give someone it's, it's a lot like – it's funny. I'm talking about events that I usually crap on.

But, like, the med ball tossed, like, there's a way to do that where it actually is a better display because it was tough. Like, they couldn't really measure the distance. It was supposed to be accurate, but it wasn't because the balls just went everywhere because some of them are uneven weighted. But what I love, say, if you pull from the strongman area, like the keg toss for height, right? That, I actually think, is a great way to display throwing that has, again, I go back to the accuracy isolation. It is part of a bigger test of speed, power, and strength when you throw vertically. Even if you throw horizontally, say it's like, hey, here are five different weighted bags and, or a, like I said, like, or a shot, right? And it's going to be total distance

combined for the five shots is your score. So it's a light one, it's a moderate right and it's going to be total distance combined for the five shots is your score so it's a light one it's a moderate and it gets to a heavy one and we just total your distance at you through um something i like that happened in the filthy 150 where it was handbag tosser or a distance uh there was a really old school workout back in the day where they went to a football field, and I think they were doing thrusters, but then it was like thruster throws with barbells. It was a... It demolished the field.

Yeah, the... You know what I'm talking about? Like, there are ways to... San Francisco CrossFit has a video called Throwing Grace, and Adrian Bosman is in the video. Yeah. Yeah, it's pretty cool. Even a high logs that they had muscle up logs. It was,

was that last year where the heights got higher and it got, the bags got heavier and like there's elements of that versus say like a softball throw where there's not as much focus on fitness. And I think a cool question I'd love y'all to brainstorm on this is we talked about accuracy and throwing what are some ideas you guys would have to maybe make an event that would do that and i was i was trying to get like a little i was thinking cornholes like man what like 50 pound med balls and a tire 20 feet away. And it was like, how many can you get in,

in three minutes, but at the squat throw, right? Like there are ways to make this happen. That is, that's still a little gimmicky because it's like, you could be the strongest thrower, but if you don't have accuracy within that,

um, what, what's some ideas that you guys would have to come up with um you want to address that yeah real quick taylor smith has been murdering the comment section asking for a kill taylor shirt they finally gave nine dollars 99 cents so i have to address it they're not for sale yet when they do become available don't worry We will shout it from the rooftops. I like the idea of a 50-pound med ball toss or a D ball toss into a tire. I think that's cool. And don't even make them. I say don't make them do any variation, dude.

I would be granny tossing. I would be granny shooting every single one. Anyway, how? Yeah, anyway. I'm a big fan of straights on certain things yeah right um so this is this is something i mean i think we did the game's prediction of course i went out on way far like limbs to try to figure some weird stuff out that they could do but especially since they're doing rogue in scotland i think about a couple different styles think about an elimination style event. And they have,

uh, we brought them up, right there. Like a sandbag with a handle attached to them. And they basically look like a kettlebell and you basically do like throws up and over something with it, right? You can fill them with different weights.

What if you had elimination style where there were like three of those sandbags with the handles and three different heights. The way they did it at the games with the sandbag over the yoke. Right. So you run to it in between the legs. That's basically, it's basically just a kettlebell swing, right? Let's just call it what it is. Like for us, throw it over, run to the next one, throw it over, run to the next one, throw it over. And you know, by the end it's heavy enough or it's tall enough to where some people fail.

So you have that style of event. It's like the swimming Pullers at Strongman. Yeah, I think they could do that. And I think they could do something like you said, like a ladder. Like they could just say, hey, the height is going to stay the same. The bag is going to keep getting heavier. We're just going to add a bag to the huge sandbag. Or the weight is going to stay at 70 pounds,

but we're going to keep going higher and higher until there's two people left. Like that would be super fun to watch. And it would not break the athletes down at all, but it would be really exerting. Cause it's a, I mean, it's like a snatch. It's super fast. Me and Bryson talked about doing this. Maybe it was even two days ago, um, doing sandbags over the pull-up bar, the same pull-up bar that you would use for a burpee pull-up in the open. So as long as you can walk underneath it, thumbs touching your fingertips, don't hit the bar, um, like a sandbag over the bar and burpee pull-up workout we were planning on doing sometime this week. I think that, I mean, we'll see how it goes. I've done it before. It's been

a long time, but I think that would be, so we set the yolks to six feet and we did like a hundred pound and 70 pound where you basically, you know, had to get it to your shoulder and shot. But it, dude, it's just, it is devastating for anyone short though. Like it's almost impossible for them to do it. Okay. I've got you guys talk for a second. I have to pee so badly. I'm sorry. Do you think they could take a 50 pound? I mean, I think a 50 pound 14 inch diameter d ball

to what you're saying whether they do it to a a circular target or they just are like hey you have a let's just say taylor hey you have a pull-up bar that's six feet off the ground or say it's eight feet off the ground you got to do 20 you got to do 20 ball over the over the bar so you can you can throw it granny style over your shoulder like you would do a like i think the army did like a standing throw where you have to do that with like a 30 pound ball yeah right so you do it like that i didn't have that in it really yeah yeah so like i i do think that there are some places you could probably place throwing and it'd be fun. But I also acknowledge that if Rogue does it and it looks really cool with Zeus, they can get away with things that maybe if other people do, they just get. Well, that's a great point because think how big Zeus is and how many things you could put along the front face of it.

It's like something is like, Hey, not only is it, there's an eight foot bar, 10 foot bar, 12 foot bar, and you have to throw it over the eight foot over the 10 foot over the 12 foot. But if you throw it too high, it's going to hit the 12 foot one or it's going to hit the 10 foot one. Like it, here's the thing. I think that the point here is like, there are ways you can actually test accuracy and test throwing and it still be a good test of fitness along the way other than just a skill based with no actual fatigue element to that. I think that's that's the line I draw as far as whether I personally think it should or shouldn't be in competition. If there's no element of a physical exertion that's going to fatigue someone into being poor at it other than the running they do to get there, I would like it. I think you can actually.

Yeah, for sure. I agree. To shift, one thing that I've always wanted to see more of is kind of like a Broken Skull Ranch style, physical 100 style, like one verse one physical challenge. Maybe you need Bill on the show for this one. I don't like wrestling, but I think if you had a like a eight foot rope lying down in the sand,

there's a center line on the rope. You guys start equal distances away. Three, two, one, go. Sprint to the rope. Whoever pulls the other person across the line first wins. Dude, I just think, one, that would be so fucking entertaining to watch. It is a challenge because depending on your opponent or competitor, like one person has an easier event than another and weight does

play um a point and i was trying to think about what how it would make sense to score something like that and i thought okay if you win your heat one verse one your score is ranked amongst the other winners on how long it took you obviously the faster the faster you were, the better you did. If you lost your heat, your score against the other losers would be how long you were able to fight off your opponent. The people who had the longest time were better. I don't know. I would like to see that.

Remember Beach Flags in that South African competition? Was it Australian? I thought it was Australian. I think it was Africa. Was it Australia? I thought it was one of the two Australian countries. I could be wrong. No,

I think it was in Australia, like the down under championship. And that was with a pet. What do they do in that competition? They basically line you up 10 yards from a row of PVC pipe pegs. And I think it was more of a, either you were the last one there or they do it like musical chair style. So there's nine pegs and 10 athletes.

Oh, wow. That's sick. Like something like that. I want to see again. Do you remember how I don't remember watching it? I don't know why I didn't watch it this year. I think it was the sanctionals year. Did the tug of war go over well or not at Rogue?

Dude, it actually went over awesome. It was sick. And it was the same year as the rifle. Again, I was like, I don't know about this because, but it ended up being actually pretty fantastic for teams. I think individuals, not as much. What about something? I mean, have you guys seen this as kind of a joke warmup thing, but they put two people on an echo bikes and then they put a foam roller in the middle and they battle it out

to put the form foam roller to the other bike, like a way to standardize something like that would be pretty sweet. I like, uh, any of those, but I, I also like the idea of like that peg game but maybe it's a medicine ball or some or a sandbag and it's in the center and you both start 15 yards away sprinting whoever takes it back to their side like oh i don't know i i mean yeah there's an element of you know physical you know one-on-one you want contact i want some fucking contact for sure, dude. Um, I think,

yeah, I just think it would be super cool. Um, about as functional as it gets. I mean, you're talking about, uh, as functional as, you know,

what do people train for life for? I mean, that's obviously to avoid chronic disease and to be able to get up off the couch and get up when you fall down. But in a sense of being physically prepared for anything that's like the thing every guy's like oh if he attacks me i'll fuck him up yeah but like what's the counterpart to that that is said a lot about what is one of the most basic principles that you should be able to do in fitness and that's to run and that's to fight right it's also known as the two most basic instincts every person has,

every animal on the planet is fight or flight. Yeah, that's sick. This is definitely a tangent from Taylor's question, but I think the echo bike foam roller thing just got me thinking about this. At the games only, and I want to preface that, at the games when there's going to be at least 12 events, do you think that they could do something like for for a power output test put every single every single athlete you could probably do it in two

heats to you know two heats of 20 take whatever machine you want and just tell them hey you give them a give them a power wattage number and just say hey whoever can hold above this for the longest wins. And that's it. So you're just like, three, two, one, go. And then let's just say the number is 500 watts on the Echo bike. So as soon as you hit 500, let's just say, hey, you have five seconds to get there. And as soon as you're there, the judge watches the screen. The second they see a four on the screen, that's your time. And we just see who can hold it the longest it can be on whatever machine you want but you think that would be a cool like

i think that would be a real it would be they can display it to watch probably not but yeah if they had a screen you could see hoppers at 5 30 adlers at 5 40 so-and-so's at 5 10 so-and-so's that oh they're dropping off they're dropping off i think they should do that at a track with a 400 meter split time that way you can see everyone running at a particular one 140 you make them run up ah fuck that's probably too slow a 130 or a 132 400 for men is the beep a 130 you know 130 is not let's say that's a six minute mile after four rounds right and that's what I mean. You don't want it to be, you don't want it to be more than a mile and a half or two miles of running for these guys maybe.

Um, and then on the last round, maybe on the sixth round, it's whoever finishes first wins. I think that would be sick. Oh bro. Yeah. Dude. Okay. Like, uh, Katie Henninger, Katie Henninger, fire, whoever you got. Eight laps, eight laps on the track, max, right?

1.30 pace, keep. And then after the seventh lap, it's the race to the finish. So maybe you can run a 12-minute two-mile. Because there are going to be guys who fail. One I've always wanted to see, and I called it king of the hill, is that you get all 40 athletes men out there in a rack with 225 on the bar the bar gets unracked on your back and there's a beep every 10 seconds oh wow squat wow beep squat you can't squat before you got to squat at least before the next 10

second beep it's sitting there holding the weight the whole time, but it's a square just like they did for semifinals this year. For number one, 10, 10 and 10, all just looking at each other. Beep. You can even make it a one 35 overhead squat. Some 35 95.

That would be so savage. And then it's right to that. Our smash, our smash. Yeah. We, we saw days week in review. He had the tape line of a lane in blue tape of what supposedly a box is going to be like at Dickies. Think about just doing a death by grace at 225.

And to your point, you just have a bunch of these squares. You have 225. And every 10 seconds, you have to do a clean and jerk. And you just go. And it's a true death by. And you just go until there's only one person left that's still going so that would that be counter to i know you've talked about this i'll mention this is like amraps and competition especially where it's like hey where you actually won but you did more like the top five end up doing 15 to 20 more squats at 225 or overhead squats.

I think they're being a detriment to be successful in that one. I think anything like that needs to be done as like a final or, or it needs to be done where the wear and tear isn't like, for instance, uh, uh, a sled push for distance. And you have someone that pushes, uh, a hundred feet longer than someone who pushes 50 or like in the first thing you're on a machine like if if you can hold a pace on a machine for 40 seconds longer than the other guy that's not going to beat you up that much for the next day i or i think another element you could play with in an event like that is a sliding scale for scoring so that you really punish athletes who do poorly and try to game it and you really reward

the athletes relative to the effort that they put. So an athlete that's just like, fuck it, I'm not going to try, they get negative points maybe even, and a person who just destroys everyone. Like you can get more than 100. Right. I think that would be appropriate. Where's Tyler?

We need a Z score. Yeah. I think that's an appropriate place to implement that style of scoring. Maybe nowhere else, but that would be cool and would make sense. I actually like that using a performance based scoring with niche ideas that we're talking about right now. Yes. Yeah,

that's cool. So a lot of, we talked about strongman stuff. We've talked about some monostructural stuff. We've talked about some physicality. Let's go to gymnastics because i think these are the these are the ones that get argued more than anything climbing should be at the games 100 fucking percent i don't think it's any more skill-based than i mean talk about

shooting if i'm i'm at the games i mean dude i don't know i just think climbing but not in a traditional rock climbing way maybe you'll have to find an element or a way to test it. It's not so niche to climbers, just like we don't go swim and do a 500 yard time trial or a 50 yard time trial because the swimmers would absolutely obliterate everyone, but find a way to implement a climbing course, a short bouldering course. That's the same for every athlete. You could set it up on a fucking high wall. You know, you set up footholds and handholds on a high wall. That's the same for everyone and put it in a workout, three climbs over the wall, something

else, two climbs over the wall, something else. I think that would be sick. I think I've seen it at, I've definitely seen it at Justin's gym at his house. And I think I pulled it up with seven when I did my prediction show for the games last year. Rogue makes these red holds that can go on the rig. So it would have to be done horizontally, and the event in Egypt did it a couple years ago where they did a horizontal pegboard, which I thought was pretty cool. So let's just say, to your point, they try to do that,

but everything is across, Taylor. So they go like 21 thrusters, thrusters one two three of going across these holds so you got to go one rep two rep three rep and then 15 two across and then nine one time across say the lane is 10 feet wide so it's about 10 feet of holds but they're all exactly the same i think that's the issue right could they do at least 10 athletes with a wall that has the holds in the exact same spot and and how high how high can it be to where it's not dangerous pegboard height you make a pegboard dude think about the o course 2017 o course 20 was it rescue randy was that 18 yeah some of those higher walls the 2017 o course like they're not low

and dude we have these massive fucking red pads that we use for pegboards and rope climbs at the games 100 you should put those in there and dude i don't know i think uh we have something temporary so i've always wanted to see a rock wall elimination style bracket dude yeah and the idea that i was looking at is like i was watching sean woodland call rock i mean it's going to be in the olympics this year speed right right you can get the they make these for like kids birthday parties but it's a four-sided rock wall column that has cables that just hook to your to a harness and if you fall it just lowers you down gently yeah yeah right and it's just all four and it's a race to a buzzer it's the same course they're easy to grab handholds so like

i don't want handholds that are specifically where like little horvath's gonna smash everybody because she knows how to grip a rock like this right right right it's just here right big ass fucking titty handholds yeah the most basic handhold foothold setup but it's just like again that is a speed accuracy component if you're racing up a rock wall especially hand eye hand foot while while racing and you can do a round robin like that and you can rent it for 500 bucks for a day right do you think they would ever fuck around with like increased diameter pegs like fat grip pegs for peg boards that seems like when they've done it with the ropes yeah they've done it i think we'll see chase has talked about it before especially when they did the deep

dive in the journal um you know people have trained it before getting ready for rogue, using the, using a, using a yoke for like the bar muscle ups. I think we'll see a rotating or a thick pull up bar, like pull up bar to just do whatever with regular pull ups, toes to bar, whatever, before they use like a thick peg. I think that, that it's more likely that they say okay you're doing your you know you're doing your pull-ups but you're doing them on the top of this yoke which is way way too wide for you would be so awesome not a fat bar a rotating bar i'm not as sold on it it's a it's a wrinkle all right so at the games when it's one of 15 events, I don't see that being like. But what are you doing on it? Pull-ups.

Just kipping pull-ups? What we called rotating Fran, right? You got like an axle bar for the thrusters at 115 and 85 or make it 135 and 95. And then in rotating bar pull-ups. The only reason I don't like that is because as a viewer what i have to what what i'm relying on or what i'm depending on is the announcers being able to create excitement over something that i can't necessarily see like seeing the difference between a static pull-up bar and one that's spinning a little bit is so hard as a viewer

especially someone who's not super familiar with crossfit like i would look at it and be like wow what they're doing is crazy that's hard as fuck but my mom watching would be like oh it just looks like fran but they're breaking the pull-ups up now why do they suck yeah right exactly have like camera angles on the bar and watch their hands grip and then slide underneath immediately they would fuck that up you can't depend on those fucking camera guys i want to give them the benefit of the doubt um No, we can't do that at this point. All right, so strict stuff. Let's go to strict, because that's something that gets argued about a lot.

Let's just put these out there. Strict pull-ups, any variation. L pull-up, that was supposed to be the pull-overs last year at the games. We already know that. It was? Yes, they decided not to do it because they couldn't decide on a standard.

Oh, my God. Strict ring muscle-ups. Let's just say strict pulling in general. Do you think it should only be used in training or do you think it can be used in competition? We're not talking about Legos rope one. They 100%. I wish that event would have been L pull-ups.

That's so cool. Find a way to standardize it. Right? Yes. I just don't think there's a single standard that will be upheld across 40 athletes and judges in any competition you do. I mean, we saw them do it at Wadapalooza, and look how that went. But I would love to. I just think this is, that's it.

This is actually a great question is I'm, I'm in camp. No for competition. But if you're not doing that in your training, like you are totally missing the boat on the adaptation you can get from things like that. And that goes with strict remuscle up to you think it should not be in competition. Yeah. Same. I mean, I think the old pull up, you could standardize it like this.

You jump up to the pull-up bar and establish the hang position. Everything's an extension. Then you establish your L position. Heels have to be above the crease of the hip or heels have to be above the bottom of your glute, whatever standard you want to go with there. That's easy to see as a judge. And in the bottom position, your elbows have to be extended and your shoulders have to be an extension. So your head's through. Once you establish the L position, you can begin your first L pull-up rep and your heels have to stay above that line for the duration of the rep. When you come back down and you reach extension, you can go into your next rep. But if you decide to break, you have to jump up, establish a hang, then establish an L position. Your judge has to say, go. Just like

when you perform an Olympic lift, when you finish it overhead, your judge says good at the games. I think, I think it could be done, especially at the games when you, for the most part do have an all-star team of judges. Um, I don't know. I would like to, I would like them to find a way to do that. I'm not saying I wouldn't like it, but that I'm always wary in competition, programming, any movement where it's totally dependent on how the judge sees it. Not like an air squat or a thruster. Like that is more just like them managing this.

But like in that scenario, the judge is controlling what you do. And depending on how they see it, they are allowing you to progress from the hang from the l set and then hopefully that you get to the bottom they don't think your toes dip to like the judge is basically controlling the the speed and execution of that entire movement and i try to stay away from movements like that in competition where people are racing as fast as they can um i would again i'm good with i'm good with strict pull-ups only if they're weighted and i don't think weighted pull-ups are used enough so i mean like like i don't really like the hold a dumbbell in between your feet or hold squeeze a dumbbell

between your thighs or whatever and take it over there and do dumbbell snatches with it but i think that something like they did in the skills something like they did for the age groups where your thighs or whatever and take it over there and do dumbbell snatches with it but i think that something like they did in the skills something like they did for the age groups where they did like a max front squat max cow bike erg and then a weighted pull-up i think weighted pulling in a strict form is the way they need to do strict um i would love for them to bring back strict ring muscle ups and be able to do it because i think it is a huge separator, especially in a games field. But what I think you're more likely to see and what I will predict that they will try to do since every Friday night at every new venue, they've done some variation of Amanda is I think since last year, they use the seated L ring muscle up strict to get into the

support position. I could see individuals doing that this year. Uh, this, no, no, good. And I think that takes away a lot of the judging part of it. This at first seemed like a sarcasm.

Um, but it's not. And let me just finish with this. We have issues every time we squat in competition of judges calling no reps on good reps and judges not seeing depth at fucking all. So if we're still, if we're going to allow hip crease below the knee as that is level of subjectivity and where the judge stands to judge that I don't see heel above the butt as any different.

I don't know. I mean the air squat or the squat is more common. Sure. But your ability to see those positions to me is not any uh harder on an l pull-up especially with how slow it is and i think that standard that you mentioned it could just be simply that and you don't have to you don't have to discuss anything else with the legs the legs don't have to be an extension they can be tucked it doesn't matter your knees can be bent as long as your heels stay above your butt you're good if they If they drop below, you're not good.

Push-ups. Push-ups. Nope. Cindy, out. Yeah. So what about, let's just say at the games this year, they've done Murph a couple times. Let's say Go Ruck's a big sponsor.

Let's say they do a ruck workout. And I think with a ruck a push-up is a lot better to judge i think that goes to in that space waiting the vest right so if they did a hand release with a ruck to where you all you're looking at your chest on the ground you're not having to look and see if the vest is on the ground or if it's clanking or not in push-ups at the games push-ups any kind ring, pushup, regular pushup, hand release, pushup. Do you think pushups should be in competition? No. Yeah, I agree. I don't think they should be.

I want them to be, I think they could be, I think they should be. Yeah. I think they should be. I think we're all in agreement there but when you put it in a competition for racing especially at the games or a high level competition it it's just messy like push-ups push-ups are actually one of the best exercises you can do for upper body strength stamina and endurance but like you put that in a competition and it just becomes a total disaster. Uh, maybe it's a, uh, maybe you program them in a format where the speed is less important than the stamina. So maybe a death by pushup format, potentially. I, I mean that the problem is really, really the true problem is we need trained and consistent judging, like professional judging.

Not my job is seminar staff or my job is fucking teaching at school. But on the weekends, I fly to Miami and I fly to crash and I fly to these competitions to judge. What we need is professional judging. And we're just not there yet. We don't have the money for it yet. Um, but to me right now, in terms of increasing the athlete experience or improving the athlete experience and creating, um, consistency across competitions, uh, trust in the competitive process, knowing that what you're doing, as long as it is to standard is right. Knowing that if your competitor is not moving to standard, you don't have to worry about that.

That's the biggest thing missing right now in, in semifinals, quarterfinals open games. So if we had, if we had trained professional judges i would trust a push up i mean if a trained eye as a trainer i can look and see if this fucking asshole is uh his hips and shoulders are moving together or if he's just touching the tip of his dick to the ground and freaking you know what i mean doing the work be just the elbow hinge at the hip press out that we see on like ring dips right perfect there we go there's my there's my next one dips dips any kind ring or bar at your at semi-finals the other year when they were programmed i watch more than 15 athletes just in the women's

field absolutely obliterate the standard like just completely piss all over it, defecate all over the standard, three inches between shoulder and the top of the ring. Judge is not calling it anywhere. I love dips in competition. Again, it's a judging issue. Well, when they brought the draft out at regionals, I thought was the best thing they ever did for the ring dip.

Right. And so there's three things to look for, is that the ring must touch the shoulder at the bottom the hips must descend below the rings right instead of the hinge like the hinge thing is where people keep their hips at ring level and they just hinge back up and down the hips must descend below contact must be made and then hit the strap at the top i thought that was one of the best things they did in competition i heard very very little blowback or complaining about that maybe just normal like there will always be something in there it's the they're human beings we're calling balls and strikes on a competition field i get it right but there are ways to manage that if you can

do that for a push-up right and if you can it, like you put someone in just like a level plate is like, hey, your chest must hit this button on the bottom in the top at here. And unless you're claustrophobic and you're doing something like that. But I think ring dips like that are much easier to do. Not strict, right? That's another thing. Unless again, J.R., what I like you said about weighted is that that can go for any movement, especially with the barbell. This is light thrusters in competition versus heavy thrusters in competition.

Adding the weight to slow people down versus the race being the range of motion and the speed at which you can blur the lines of range of motion and the standards i think in competition minimizing that with weight is a good way to go right um after so i mean obviously uh elizabeth elevated was the first time that we'd kind of seen like the dips used on bars and not on rings and then of course there's a trickle down everyone starts using them taylor did ring dips in this past year's Charlotte classic. I did parallel bar dips in the competition. He did at crescendo. Wadapalooza did P bar dips on their shortened P bars. Do you think dips with bars is just a better way to go?

And you just say, Hey, the standard is shoulder below elbow lockout at the top, start at the top end of the top. However you lockout at the top, start at the top, end at the top, however you get there in the middle. Because then we start getting to do hips need to descend? Can you hinge at the waist? Then we're getting into GHD, what's happening in the middle?

Is it not just pad to floor to pad? Or is it, no, where your hips are matters? Or if it's V up up if your knees bend during the process it's not hands on the ground feet on the ground and then hands to the toes that's where i'm going with the dip do you think it's better to just do hey the standard is just shoulder below elbow lock out at the top and that's the standard however you get there i don't care any way you don't have to dictate how the movement is executed is a really important thing to think about when programming movements in competition at all, right? So like you said, the V-up,

the V-up had, okay, knees must be straight, feet together. It was dictating how the movement was actually executed. When you look at a toes-to-bar, it's heels behind, toes touch the bar. How you get it done really is relevant. If you want to do it with bent arms and bent knees, by all means, go for it. But when you get into the realm of dictating how a movement is supposed to be done, I think that's where you add a much more unnecessary component to judging. Taylor, were you happy with the way that the dips went? And if you were not, would you have with the way that the dips went? And if you were not, would you have changed anything about the standard? Some people, the only thing I was unpleased with was some people who were doing good reps got called for no reps.

But no one who was doing bad reps got away with them. Or no one that I saw. And I was pretty, I was pretty, I was hammering people. And so are our judges, which was nice. Strict press and not in the CrossFit total. So let's say you're right. So, because no,

that movement does not produce power. And that's a, that's a fine line with a, well, it's definitional functional movement. Okay. movements aren't functional okay what's this how are they described as functional you know force distance time all that stuff but to me like in a metcon where a strict handstand push-up is welcomed where a deficit strict handstand push-up is welcomed anyone that would try to make someone do a strict press for a time or reps workout would get completely obliterated.

Yeah. Very interesting. And so this is the last one, at least that I have. And it is very like weird, but I have thought about it before and I've never found it on main site. And I'm curious of your thoughts because I want you to start by thinking about a hang clean and Taylor,

you have one 35 on the bar and you have to do hang cleans and you have to do 30 per time. You're going to do power or muscle clean. But if I tell you it's hang squat clean, you're like, OK, cool. It's hang squat clean. Got to pull under it. Fine. Do you think a squat jerk could ever be programmed for reps in a competition? So shoulder to overhead. It's not a strict press.

It's not a push press. It's not a push jerk. It's a squat jerk and it's 135 and it's testing for all the people that like to say, well, look what a pistol test, a test mobility, a test flexibility, a test some of these physical skills. A squat jerk would do exactly that. Is that just too gimmicky or could a squat jerk just like, well, yeah, I know you can push jerk it, but I want you to squat it just like a hang squat clean. Could that be a viable competition movement? Does are you dictating? Well, it's hard to go too wide. Yeah. Let's just say it's got to be the front rack so you can do as wide as you want yeah and and what if it's 185 you know whatever i'm just sure i'm i am really like digging now like is that a that's never to my knowledge it's never been programmed to competition but why hasn't it been because it's just making you drop lower under the

bar just like just like i'm making you squat i mean i would never do it yeah yeah how do you do it i'm just i'm just trying to visualize what it looks like and to me the argument as to why they've never done it is because it would look stupid i agree it's like way too many way too many hip opening hip closing people don't even stand up, hang movements all the way at the top as it is, much less if they were coming out of the bottom of the squat. So what about kettlebell swings, whether they're Russian or American? Do you think they should just never be in a competition? Taylor, I know feels pretty strongly about that. Well, how do I, how do you, what do you know?

I was going to say, Taylor's always said, well, if you can judge arms, cover, ears on another overhead movement, why can't you do it with your arms? The argument is if you can judge kipping handstand push-ups or push jerks, you should be able to judge a kettlebell swing. I think there is a way to. You actually have to put less standards on it. Bottom of the bell off your head. So above the brow at the games last year was good or bad

you remember that yeah so it was what handle it was handle of the kettlebell had to be above the eyebrow that was the standard which fine right that's one way maybe that was a little too much but i think you just watch the hands. Your hands have to clear the height of your head. It's like, okay, is the elbow thing a deal? Or are we going back to VF standardization? Does it get over your head? I like them.

I think you can program them in competition. I think that's also one of those things where at the proper loading, people have a harder time bastardizing as any sort of a standard. And if you just say, hey, at the bottom of the rep, like maybe no real standard at the bottom of the rep. I mean, what would it, I don't even know what it would be. even know what it would be just like arms arms have to be straight right arms have to be extended at the bottom of the rep in extension and at the top you just watch the hands from the side and the hands just have to go above the profile of your head like i would just think the hands break the plane of your head i don't know maybe people duck their heads down but yeah kettlebell swings i feel like is a huge one that people are either like no just do single arm kettlebell snatch or double arm kettlebell snatch kettlebell clean and jerk or whatever you just don't do swing i love kettlebell swings this is a movement in general but yes that's where i mean think of all the things we just like threw

out there of what could happen even if you were like oh well what if we do it like this like yeah but what if they do this i i think i think the easiest way to standardize the kettlebell swing is the american swing where the full the hip is in full extension knees are in full extension elbows are full extension and your fucking head is through at the top of your shoulder don't worry about the bell drooping or pointing towards the ceiling but just everything's an extension at the top like a push jerk right right it's literally exactly it's a push jerk it's a double knee bend to an arms extended hips knees extended overhead and so if you just say screw the bell right because like we we talked about knees bending on certain movements in the push jerk

your elbows have to be locked out yeah and so yes i think there is i and that's what i meant by lessening some of the strictness on what the bell is doing right just keep the standard of hips knees elbows extended arms over your head and call it a day and i think they absolutely can come back but i loop back again is that i do think the weight you pick matters and in competition anything a little bit heavier whether it's weighted on a gymnastics or a heavier weight on a thronster i think the same thing for a kettlebell swing, like 53 is getting a little light for games level athletes. So maybe it has to be 70 or 53. I think dude,

you can do, I mean, you could do 90, 105 pound kettlebell swings. Like I've done them with a hundred, like they are for short, like sets of 10 are doable. A 70.

I mean, dude, these guys can do 50 reps in a row with the 70 um if you guys saw like a 100 pound kettlebell i think 2011 or 12 sumo deadlift high pulls came back out would you would you be would that be fine yeah i think a sumo deadlift do you think a sumo deadlift high pull do you think a sumo deadlift high pull is better with a kettlebell than with a barbell? I think it's better with a kettlebell. It's such a devastating movement and it would be really cool if it was at least 100 pounds, like 170 with a handstand push-up or another. It could be with anything and I think it would be nasty. That's a movement you just don't see often.

It's a foundational movement it's been what it's it's in fight gone bad it was in that 50s chipper ish that one year with 135 but you just never see it you see it on main side all the time you see it in programming all the time but if we can if we can judge really light fast fast power cleans, elbow being in front of the bar at extension, why can't we tell that the barbell is at least at the collarbone? This is one of the best ideas I've ever heard. No, because they did that at regionals in 2014. Did they? What was the rule?

Oh, 10 no reps? Is that what he's saying? 10 no reps allowed? Yeah, so's saying? 10 no reps allowed? Yeah. So if you got 10, you're out. And so here's... That was a rule in 2014? So this was, yeah, it was on...

I don't know if it was for individuals, but it was 100% for teams that in an event, if an individual got three no reps in the event, you were capped right there. And what it did was it actually blunted the intensity of people actually doing the events and just made everybody like, oh, I don't want to get no rep on this one handstand pushup because I only have one life left. Like it totally ruined.

Oh, maybe this, maybe this is a better idea and and what would constitute a no rep a failed repetition or just one that uh skirted the standard that would be that you know it would have to it would have to take into account for that because you can't get punished for failing it blunts the intensity at a massive level that takes away from the competition i don't i don't think this would five numbers in a comment 20 maybe not the right maybe not the right uh point but here's the thing if i can beat you and i still did 30 no reps why am i getting penalized for that for being fitter than you and i moved worse like do you remember um it was second cut at the cross of games and i think like matt fraser like

42 no reps on the push press, and he still beat everybody's ass doing it? And so I'm going to take 50 points away from him because nobody – he was so fit that even with those amount of no reps, he'd still beat everybody, and I'm getting penalized for being that fit because I was just trying to go that fast. Yeah, let's hear it, Bryson and chad what are you gonna fucking say to that wasn't my idea these guys are stupid um but it's good like i like the conversation and i'm not

going as hard as taylor is on you but it's like we've seen it before plus we're now you're again this goes to dictating how a movement's done, dictating how people should compete, dictating the pace at which people should blur the line with. Imagine if the finale in event six and semifinals was if you got three no reps on the lunges, then you would get capped. Then everybody's like, well, I'm going to rest a minute before I pick up the dumbbell so I don't do that. Or if I do drop, I'm going to rest even more. It totally kills the spirit of competition. Yeah. And this is in that, like to that point, this is way more of a, just like a programming question and not movement selection. Yeah. But likewise to Jackie pro, if they said, Hey, the workouts, three rounds for time,

10 ring muscle-ups, 10 cleaning jerks, the muscle-ups have to be unbroken. The cleaning jerks have to be touch and go. If you break, you're done. Does, is that, are we then telling like, I love a dude. I love Bill's argument of don't tell me how to win. Like to my, to my argument, to my argument of saying that a box jump over step down is just a harder version of the movement. Like, like a strict gymnastics movement just makes the movement harder, but it's like,

Hey, don't tell me how to win. I want to race. Do you think having unbroken requirements like that is a good change up in a competition with the best in the world? Do you think it should only be used when it's the best in the world involved? Because what it does is it does blunt intensity. It does increase risk,

increase reward, but also you're not racing as much. I'm watching Taylor and saying, well, I know he're not racing as much. I'm watching Taylor and saying, well, I know he can do 10 muscle ups unbroken. I'm just going to have to wait here another 30 seconds. I think it depends on how it's applied. I wouldn't say is if you don't do it unbroken, you're out. You just have to sit there and wait till you can do it unbroken again. We did this strength event in a competition I programmed for, and we did Gwen. But we did Gwen, which is unbroken.

If you guys don't know, Glenn in the chat is 15, 12, 9, unbroken clean and jerks. But we did it for heaviest loading, and you got 15 minutes to accomplish it. So your score was just total weight lifted. But everything had to be unbroken, just like Glenn naturally is. Glenn, I say Glenn. I like that. I mean, it's not much different than not hitting a pace on Jackie Pro, right?

So it's... It would be like in quarterfinals workouts, too, that Taylor did. Yeah, it would just be like them saying, hey, on the wall balls, balls they have to be unbroken and then do what you want on the burpees but you have to do three sets of 50 unbroken i think if you pick something that everybody could do unless they screwed up something right it's an execution error which is okay to program depends on the number of events that you have and how much of an impact it does on the end of the competition. But I like that. Like kill a Taylor today. I loved, I absolutely loved that.

And that was cool to have in there as a wrinkle. I think there are particular movements that it makes sense to add that unbroken designation or standard of how you complete it. Others, not so much. The rope climb is cool because all you're doing there is basically making it a 30 foot legless rope climb a 20 foot legless rope climb and then a 10 foot um i think what i like less about uh maybe something like a a rope pace is like what bill said it's like don't don't tell me how to win you know i think on the rope climb thing, it's like, well, just imagine this rope was 30 feet and the next one was 20 and the next one

was 10 or you know, I don't know. A lot of this I think lends itself to the creativity of the programmer and them saying, I think this looks stupid. I think this will look great. I think I do want to thing in there would be cool depending on how it was applied what you used and how it's dictating the the event itself right i think um it's like the muscle-up biathlon was an absolutely beautiful event great i love that for sure so it wasn't necessarily you it was like you had to do these unbroken or there's a penalty so maybe if it's always you have to do this set unbroken however

if you break you have a detrimental penalty but you don't have to start over yeah and i think something like i mean i think wadapalooza did couple of years ago, but let's just say you take the workout, um, grace and then, uh, Sam. So you just go 30 cleaning jerks and a 30 ring muscle-ups per time. That's, that's the workout. And every break, every break on the cleaning jerk is a three to five bar facing burpee penalty. So if you choose to break cool, you just gotta do more burpees. Then when you choose to break, cool, you just got to do more burpees. Then when you get to the rings, every break is a three burpee box jump over penalty or whatever you want to make it.

But do you think if there's an unbroken requirement, there should be a penalty for choosing otherwise, not just you have to stand there and wait. I know it makes sense, Bryce, and that's why I fucking said it, bro. I like that better than, hey hey if you don't do 30 you just have to sit there and wait till you can um because then it's like but also don't then you have to make sure you program it that me doing actually three sets of 10 with the penalty is faster or better for the strategic part of me accomplishing this task.

You have to make sure that that penalty is like... Lofty. That people aren't going to choose it. Yeah. That 200-meter penalty was devastating if you were to break. Right? That's a minute at best that you lose on one break versus if it was like a 50 yard shuttle run. Oh,

I just like 10, a really cool callback. If he called that back at the games at Dickies. Well, I want to see it with Ed boards. Yeah, this is, this is stupid.

Sorry, Aaron, this is fucking dumb. Um, and what's also so stupid is that they're above reproach. They can't question a judge's call. We call it in every fucking professional sport. I'm going to yell right now because I'm fricking angry.

It gets me fired up. But Boz, if you're listening, I would never yell at you in person, Dave, you too, but I'm going to yell now because I'm behind a fucking camera. The fact that you can video review certain things, but not a judge's call is ridiculous. Oh my God, dude, I'm going to get a hemorrhoid. Well, there's,

Hey, you guys keep going. I got to take Lily to a dentist. I got to take Lily to a dentist. You guys keep going. See ya. All right. There's not a whole bunch of sports that allow for that to happen.

Right. NFL. Yeah, but yes, I think there's instances or certain movements that have to be put in place for that. So, for example, holding calls in the NFL are not reviewable. Balls and strikes in baseball are not reviewable. But you can ask the third baseline judge.

Well, that's more of a swing, right? So if you come around in a swing, right? Not balls and strikes. So maybe there is, Hey, you can video review this or you can't video. So like, I think the conversation there is warranted for sure, but there has to be certain instances and just like reviews in basketball, whether it's a actually, they, they do actually argue fouls, but you get two right at most there has to

be a way to so short answer yes but i think not everything should be up for review the ascent does make sense bryson it's 30 feet of ascending 20 feet of ascending 10 feet of ascending shut up just go just get out of here shut up um yes i think some things should be reviewable. They should at least come up with a list. Start a conversation. There are things that are too hard to review in competition. That's fine. But your hand stepping on a line during a handstand walk or your heels crossing a line in a line.

Or even the hip crease in some, like, touching a beam on a rope climb. I mean, there are... Yes, I think distances or, yeah, foot on a line in a sprint course which hurt some people back but i but i even would argue squat depth like if you get destroyed on a workout with 10 really heavy squats on depth and they were all to death i mean dude it's yeah well like i said it's like okay heavy where there's only a handful of them okay but if we're talking uh murph i don't think that's okay right i think right i agree murph is murph is irrelevant but maybe you you allot a time per repetition so if you give somebody a no rep how long does that take them to complete the next rep over a certain amount?

You can review it under a certain amount. You can't review it. Say it's like we did once in the two, two, two, three intervals with Kara Saunders, where she had done actually three reps less. And they added it to the finish line. did is they timed her previous three reps to that and the transition to the next square and then took that off which i thought is a exactly what you're talking about a great way to do that you can do the flip side to that is like hey exactly my last two reps of these 75s were no reps can we review that sure and but that's a pandora's box that we're going down or, or a rabbit hole. It's like, okay, well, how do you standardize time per rep?

Because an air squat time per rep versus a 225 pound thruster time per rep. Right. We'll finish with this Bryson. You're 100% wrong. Eat fucking crow. Stop trying to argue. Well, didn't you have a five foot line so every yeah scent was after the uh after the first initial 15 foot but even then if you jumped

up it's less than but still 10 feet you still call it 10 feet 30 feet 20 feet 10 feet bro just hop off the sack i'm not getting in the weeds yeah Yeah. Come on. All right. Um, sick show. Thank you for coming on chase. Yeah. Thanks. Back to back. We're out.