The Standup with ThePrimeagen - Prime installs Arch?

Episode Date: May 19, 2025

The gang talks arch, linux, windows, and of course, your favorite goofs & gaffes. ssh terminal.shop, btw

That was one of the great things about streaming is I'd just be doing something and like, you know, Visual Studio would just stop working because it was like, oh, you got to renew your license. I'm like, what? I was in the middle of programming something or whatever, right? I was playing inscription and Windows Update, it just went blue. And it was like updating your system now. Nothing asked me. Didn't do anything, right? And so I just feel like streaming allows us to capture the fact that no, really reply people.

It doesn't work. It's unreliable. Everything breaks all the time. I don't know why, right? Like, I don't know why it can't be more reliable, but the first step to getting better would be to acknowledge the problem. Anyway, that's it.

Um, well... This is going well. Yeah, I mean, I'm glad that you're having a good time. No blockers on my side. I'm all set. No blockers on my side. Yeah, that's pretty cool. Well, uh, you know, it works this time.

That's good. Okay, well, I'm just doing a very, a very quick attack. at making this work out. No audio, Prime. I know. Hold, oh my. Oh, my. We're crushing.

I'm not going to say, okay, Chad, I'm not going to say mean things. Just, just hold on. I'm not going to use four-letter words right now. I'm trying my hardest. Eat the FaceTime your screen to TJ so he can just tell you what to click. Oh, that would make my life so much simpler, dude.

I feel like that's the solution. No, no, no, I am doing that. This is just, it's, this is a summary for the state of modern software. Like, this is, it. Today is modern software. Ladies and gentlemen. This is not modern software. We're doing performance art.

Dude, I actually press the power button on my streaming PC and then stop it from shutting down. So it's like in a halfway shut down state. Oh, no. And I just don't want the stream to restart. And so we're just, we're just holding. We're like hanging by a thread, literally.

The moment I press okay on OBS has crashed, OBS will crash. It's just there's this really weird timing issue where OBS won't crash until it knows that it needs to crash. I do admire the OBS devs for making OBS, getting OBS to the point

where it literally won't crash until you tell it it's okay. That's pretty good actually. We're just going to keep on yelling. They need to share some of that knowledge with like Microsoft driver Microsoft's driver's

team. I don't know anything about Microsoft's driver's team. I'm still not even sure how Microsoft works. All I know is there's a place called Com. And inside of Com, you've got to, there's like a lot of, there's like a lot of string names and values. And if you touch those, your computer breaks. I just meant because like basically the Microsoft driver team, well, there isn't a driver

team, right? There's teams that make the things for doing any particular type of driver. And then there's also people who are, you know, doing architecture kernel-wise. I'm just saying a lot of times any serious crash is in someone's, driver. So if the driver team, you know, they're constantly trying, actually, to make it so that if someone's driver crashes, you don't crash the computer, right? Oh, nice. You know what I mean? Like, because if you get a blue screen, it almost certainly was something hardware related, like, where a driver thought, you know, it was, there was some bugging a driver and the driver's

running at a sufficient privilege level where there's no real recovery. Like, we don't really know what it did because it could have, could have done anything. So we just got to stop, right? And so I just meant like whatever the OBS is doing, if they could share that with Microsoft's kernel team, they could just completely, they could completely solve the problem of like my audio driver blue screen to the machine, right? Okay, can I tell you guys something that's just really embarrassing right now? No. Thank you for the permission, T.J.

So I restarted my Linux laptop to try to boot from disk. And typically there's like a little menu that's like, hey, boot from disc. So I would just boot from disk. and instead of saying that, it said nothing. So I was like, huh, that's funny. So I pressed escape and it just said grub. And I don't know how to just go from grub to booting from USB, so I restarted it.

Then people in chat were like, just press F12. And then someone else was like, no, it's F3. Someone else said something else. And so I just held down function and pressed to each one of the buttons. All right. And now my laptop screen is completely black, and I don't know how to make it unblack. And so I can't figure out how to log in

properly. And I feel like an absolute idiot right now. It's absolute cinemas going on right now. Prime. Time. Think about it this way. I just realized. Time to get a laptop sponsor. I need a laptop sponsor immediately. We solved the problem. Who wants to send Prime to be the official laptop of the stream? Where's framework? Somebody call framework. I need framework right now. Yeah. I need them right now. Yeah, because I can see my laptop. Like, we're, oh, we're in the login menu. because my other screen lights up gray. That's how I know I'm in the login menu, but my screen's just black.

Can you switch consoles with control, the control alt shift F1, F2, F3, F4F5 to switch consoles? Can you use that still or not really? Yes, I can, but the problem is, is it, oh, actually, you know what, that's a good idea, so I can do a little control alt function F2. Yeah. And I believe that will actually mirror the display in both locations.

Oh, I saw it pop up for a second. Oh, my gosh, we're so back in. I got it. We're so back in. Oh, we're so back in. Keyboard doesn't work. Okay, anyways, I don't want to talk. Okay, we're going to quit talking about it. It's stand up. It's stand up. Show us. We're debugging Linux.

Yeah, can you hold that bad boy up? What are we looking at here, Prime? We're pair programming. Okay. Okay, TJ, can you please put up my tweet for a second? Me? Yeah, yes. There's a reason why I'm in this state. He can't do anything. He can't even touch OBS. How's he's going to put up a tweed?

I don't. Why are you asking him? Do things, Tege. Yeah, here, I can make this happen like this. Yeah, okay, that is what I'm streaming. That is my Windows experience right now. Okay, I cannot change anything. I touch anything, it's so over. Everything is broken.

The stream deck can do it for sure, dude. The stream deck can do it for sure. Stream deck just has the stream deck symbol on it, and that's it. Okay. This is amazing. I love this. I love it. I am hanging on by a thread, DJ.

Okay, I was, sorry, I was unfamiliar with your game. I apologize. Okay, okay, so I'm going to talk a little bit about my Linux experience. And so I would prefer it if you talked a lot about your Linux experience. Okay, okay, so I've always used Linux in a very specific way, which is that I use it as minimally as possible. I use it in such a way where all I want to do is open up I3 and touch nothing else and just have a terminal and a Chrome browser. Like, that's it. That's all I've ever done.

Today, I just, I tried to do more than that, okay? No more X-11. I'm just a normie Linux user because I really am just a NeoVim user That's all I really am is I'm a Tmux Neovim user. I'm not actually a Linux user. I just want I3

TMux and Vim. So now I'm playing around with Linux. I actually trying to get something to go. I have like fully bricked my machine. I'm not sure what I'm doing out here but it is bad. It's not looking good. Can I explain what happened?

Because it's very obvious to me. it's very obvious. I can tell what happened. What happened? You trusted 5,000 random people's advice to be one coherent storyline. You just copy and pasting commands from chat. People who have been arguing with each other for the last 3.5 hours. Literally like, no, don't use Ventoy.

If you use Ventoy, you're going to break your system. If you're not using DD, you're not a real. next user, do the arch installer. And then you're like, I'll try all three. You read like a random command and he tried to like pseudo-aft arch install like right after him just like what's happening? Well, I wanted to see if I did, because I just need the arch install utility. I'm not sure exactly if it's just something you run from while you already have Yuponchu

loaded. What is it? Anyway, so I got, I believe I deeded the arch ISO onto this USB. I think what I'm going to do is just download the arch ISO onto my. Windows machine and just use my Windows booter, my windows like flasher and just flash it from Windows and then try again. Because that worked with Ubuntu. I've installed Ubuntu quite a few times and it was just very, very simple. But this one, I have been doing it right. Okay, the reason why I decided to start Arch is that I could not get sway to seem to work correctly. And this is the

second time I've done this where I start using chat GPT or GROC to give me the commands I need the run. and every time I've done that, I've bricked my system in some horrible unknown way. The first time, I completely deleted my, like, I actually, there was no,

I had nothing to run. Like, I'd start up my system and they're like, there's no OS. And so like, well, I screwed that one up. That was,

whoopsies. And so this next time, uh, I tried to do a little bit of vibe, vying and it did not work either. So this is what they meant what the AI is going to take our jobs. Like literally we won't be able to do them.

Like there's not going to be any other computers. It makes so much sense now. Yeah. AI is going to take away the jobs. They're not going to do the jobs for us. They're just going to be gone, literally. We're grounded from them. We're put in time out.

We're not allowed to touch the computer again. It's not working. Dude, all this time, I thought Prime was a hardcore Linux user. No, I was so wrong. I was so wrong. I'm a softie. Like, I know, I know, like, permissions issues, user issues, basic, like, software stuff. But when it comes to like Linux, yeah, skill issues, very familiar with it.

But when it comes to actual like Linux stuff like, hey, let's, just to be real here, I'm going to say something. It's going to hurt a lot of people's feelings. I really don't understand the difference between what a desktop environment or a compositor is. And why do they call sway a compositor or not a desktop environment? I don't know. I don't know. I don't know why which one's which. Like, I just don't get it.

But this is my life. I don't know why people are surprised. We've literally been making fun of arch users for like five years. and intentionally saying, I don't know anything about this. I installed Neovim and got to work. I don't know anything else about this. Why is everyone expecting us to know what any of these commands are?

Yeah, because let's just face it, there's no such thing as Sway or Hyperland on a server. I just like, is server running? Server not running? I did bad. Is Prott up or down? Sway is not in the picture. Sway is not in the picture.

for this. It's been like so long since I've done any serious Linux programming that I actually I would have at this point asked the question so what is the taxonomy on Linux for you know the desktop but it sounds like no one here knows because because like so there you know X11 used to be the protocol for all the Windows stuff my understanding was they like very rockily sort of slowly uh you know trying to to fit like a thousand and gerbils through a very small pipe kind of thing, eventually moved everyone to Wayland. But now you're saying,

Wayland is not what they would call a compositor, because you'd assume that Wayland would be what you would call a compositor, because it's the thing that's... No, no, no, no, no, no, no. Swayland is the protocol. So what does compositor mean in this context, then? To composite D's nuts on your chin?

I honestly have no idea. I'll go read about it separately. Fair enough. But it's been a very long time. So I'm curious now. I'm like, so they have a three-layer system where they basically have like window manager, then compositor, then the actual like thing that does anything, right? Because the thing that actually is going to control the GPU to display these things, right?

The compositor handles the windows. Okay. So the compositor is the window manager. But where are the microplastic stored? Then why is it called a window manager? Why did they change to calling it a compositor? I, okay, first off, again, I'm like a script kidding. I should stop asking.

I should stop asking. I'll just go read it. No, no, no. No, no. Casey, wait. Prime, just answer the question. It doesn't matter if it's right or wrong. And then Casey, check the top comment of the video later.

It will explain everything for you. Six paragraphs. Good point. Historical citations. Perfect information. So, Prime, go ahead. Say what you think. Good point.

And we'll just wait for the top comment. Can you repeat the question? Can you repeat the question? The question was, question was, what is that actual taxonomy? So is it just like compositor is just a new name for window manager? So actually the taxonomy is exactly the same. So it's just window manager and then the thing underlying the window manager, which used to be X11, which is now Wayland. And then we have the graphics driver. No, no. You have it incorrect. So what it is is that a compositor is the

exact same thing as a desktop environment. And so what ends up happening is X11 starts Wayland and then Wayland starts like any of your desktop environments i.e. sway and that's really what's happening. So it goes sway Wayland X-11 kernel. Wait. Oh X-11 is all going over

my head. X-11 is just there for compat-you mean? Yeah, yeah. It's a compatibility thing. Okay. And chat is right now, I would love to show you chat, but I can't. Guys. It's just a whole of nose. Someone's solving this in the YouTube comments. Thank you, T.J. for it.

People keep saying X-11 and Wayland are competitors. No, we're saying compositors, guys, okay? Compositors. It is not competitors. That's ridiculous. Dude, I still haven't recovered from the composite these nuts. I'm like still, I'm still falling apart from that comment. You only had that on the mind because I did the inst DM.

It was very good. DJ, I hope you know I knew that was coming. No, it was so obvious. It was good. I couldn't figure out how to make Randall say inst, D.N, without spelling it out too obvious, because then I want to do install these nuts on your machine, obviously. But it was fine. The speech detects.

I need it like a Randall. You do commas. If you do a bunch of commas, it makes Randall pause for a second. So you can just like put in that space. So I go, well, and then it hits me with the D's nuts. So it's like, even if I know what's coming, you preemptively steal my thunder and then force me to get deep nuts. I'll all up my Randall game. Sorry. Sorry, chat. So, would it be fair to say that the story of the week is that Pooty Pie got 110 million people excited about Linux?

And then Prime immediately ruined the whole thing. Is that what basically happened? Is that the story of the week? It's basically like, you know how in the cooking shows where they like do, they do the like cooking and then they put it in the oven and then they pull out the nice one? That's PewDie Pye's video. You know what I'm saying? Where it's like, wow, it's amazing. Then they do Instagram versus reality. It's like, Prime's cooking in the kitchen.

Here we go. Oops, we bricked the oven. Our bad. So to be completely fair, though, the difference between me and PewDie Pye isn't that he's somehow a lot smarter than me. He has tens of millions of dollars and retired a long time ago, and he just decided the side quest for the last year getting his arch installed. He also has no experience with. programming or know anything about Linux.

I mean, it's like... Wait, did he actually install arch? Yeah, yeah, he's arching hard. He's arching hard. So instead of having a job or like meetings or whatever he wants to do, he's just like, I'm going to side quest for the next three weeks. He's got that deep arch. I think he's smarter. He did not listen to chat.

Like, I think there's... Or maybe wiser. Like, I don't know which one it is in this case. He definitely spent hours. It's actually mint. If you watch the whole video chat, dummies, it wasn't mint. It started with mint. and then he said, but my favorite one, and then he whips out Arch and Hyperland,

where he does everything and all that. The reality, like, if I were to do this the way I would want to do it, is that I would turn off stream and not talk to anybody for 10 hours and just read because that is really the only successful way to do this. It does take him that long. Yeah, no, it would take me that long. But instead, we're going to do both, and I'm going to listen to chat, and that was a bad mistake, DJ.

You were right. I'm going to go back to reading the Arch Wiki and just following it one step out of time. Bisco will be so. happy if you actually read the arch wiki. He was in shambles in chat. There was like zero thought going through Prime's brain. He wasn't even thinking. He was just copy and pasting and he was like, is my goal to

I don't know. To be fair, that's pretty close to what the experience is if you're naive and go to want to use Linux because what you're going to do is you're going to try to run it. You're going to get a terminal, you know, the terminal out's going to start and it's just going to have something where it's like you get an error message

and you have no, you're going to put that into Stack Overflow and you're going to cut and paste whatever the dude said, right? And you're going to hope that that, because there's no way you're coming up to speed on like, oh, let me go learn the 13 million line Linux kernel so that I'm going to know exactly what this line actually means in practice. Like, that's not happening. You're just going to Stack Overflow and hoping that somebody has the answer to your,

or maybe not even Stack Overflow, wherever it comes up, right? You're going to hope that they've got that thing for you. And you're going to hope that it's for your distribution or a distribution close enough to yours that it's right and all that. stuff. So cutting and pasting from chat is actually kind of a good way to simulate what will happen to a naive user, which is, you know, frankly, something that's worth checking. It's like, what will happen to some user? Not someone who wants to become an expert at Linux. What will happen to just a user, mildly knowledgeable user who knows how to use a terminal and knows how to

search the internet? What's going to happen? And the answer is, you know, 50% brick your machine. Roughly. Right? Installed sway minute-long start-up times. Not sure what I just did wrong, but here I am. Dude, a little quick command I learned from pooty pies video. Sorry, I should say PewDie Pie or whatever. We call them Pewty Pie sounds better to me. I've always said it that way.

Pootie pie. I just died when you said that the first time. Sorry. Okay, we call them peuds. You can just call them pews. That's way worth. Pooty pie. Pooty pie.

He's definitely going to mess that up, too. Like, there's a lot of other words close to Pudes. Okay, Pudes. Anyways, Pudes. I forgot where we're even going right now. I didn't forget who I remember what's happening. I was just trying to get trashy to do a spit take. Almost God.

I've been laughing this whole time. I just can't stop dying. Oh, man. People are attempting. Yeah, we did a little system D blame. I learned it from Pude's little video. And a little system D, whatever. It was analyzed.

I keep waiting for you to go system D's nuts. No, no. I was just being real here. Okay, no nuts at the end of this rainbow. And when I did a little system de-analyzed these nuts on your chin, what I did afterwards is I did a little blame. And it's literally a minute and a half in log control. I don't even know.

Or, sorry, journal control. I don't even know what it's doing. Dude, you got to spend time journaling every day if you want to be at P performance. That's why. You are not watching enough internet content prime You are unaware of the journaling life hacks Okay

Nice, dude Okay, that's true That's true Anyways, I'm four hours into this And I've gotten nowhere No, no, no, that's not true You've moved so far back from when you started You had a machine

That you could work on at the beginning of the day With Lennox It was already late The next set that you're getting it. On the fair, I still have that position. It just takes a minute and a half to start up now. Oh, this hurts.

Actually, you could So in the status report for this week, if you just use the word increase ambiguously, you could be like, increased startup times by a minute. It might sound

like that was good, right? Right. Yeah. But honestly, my stand-up, like kind of my stand-up status is a blocker, computer. That's currently my big blocker right now. It's got IT down here. Let's get you back up and running. So this is unfortunate because this is kind of throwing a little bit of an ice water bucket on the year of the Linux desktop, which I thought was going to be the topic today, which I was

excited to talk about. We're canceling it again. And it, like that was it. just got fleshed out of toilet. No, honestly, I think, to be completely fair, I would have approached this a lot different in a non-stream world. And so therefore, I think this would have been a lot better of an experience, done a little bit of lay of the land, market research, make sure everything is good, and then do this. But it is so much more fun just to try things than paste commands from chat. Because honestly, the worst thing that's going to happen is that I have to download Ubuntu again,

put it on a flash drive from Windows, plug it in, and have, my dot files just work on Ubuntu immediately. So it takes like 20 minutes for me to go from zero to 60. And so it's not a big deal. And so I'm just having fun, just trying things out. And I learned a lot of things.

Like one thing I learned is that a custom keyboard layout that's a software remap at the, like at the compositor level, sucks. That really sucks. My XKB map sucks. I still don't know how to fix it. I'm going to have to learn more about that.

This is also why no one can use your computer even when we hook a regular keyboard up to it. And it's very difficult to do anything in person with you. I know. I need to just go back to the default and just accept it. I just don't want to hurt my little pinky. Honestly, the reason why I switched and all that is because I had so much pain in my pinkies. Because so much of just your right pinky does all the symbols. And so it's either.

Yeah, my pinky actually really hurts for real. Yeah, yeah. No, this is a real problem for people, for elders. millennials is pinkie problems. Trash, you type for like three minutes a day, dude. What? You're on a podcast. Working here. What are you talking about? Can you guys elaborate on the pinky thing? What are you talking about? So on a standard quiety layout keyboard. Yeah. Your pinky controls like every opening and closing symbol.

Because of the shift key? Control key and shift. Control specifically kills my like, my poor little pinky. Yeah. That's why I've switched over to obviously to thumb clusters. Thumb clusters. Thumb clusters make life good, right? They prevent the whole control problem. But like you're holding shift with one side and then you're doing all of that with the other side. And that's like where all my wrist problems came from is just simply going to a thumb cluster and then moving my symbols onto my fingers. But I always did it from a software layout because I did originally this layout for my Mac OS. And so when I switched to Ubuntu, I just kept going to because I just used a laptop keyboard. There was no ZMK or anything. So I still don't have a ZMK keyboard. And I did

this one swapover. This is going to sound so stupid. I do. like, I forget what it is. I forget actually what it is. I think it's a percent sign and grave are on the same key. And it turns out with like ZMK, that's just the impossible combo. There's some combo with grave dollar sign tildy and percent sign are one of those that is just the impossible combo that you, that I cannot. I cannot.

I forget which one it is. But all I know is everywhere I could not get it to work. So this is kind of, this comes as a shock to me. This comes as a, well, I won't elaborate. But I thought, since you guys were all VIM users, which is that correct? Or at least, at least I know two of you are. I don't know if trash is. I am, of course.

I didn't know. I just assumed that since you were VIM users, there would be no modifier key finger stress. Because here's what happened to me. And I apologize to all the Ganyu Emacs fans out there. the audience. I used Gnu Emacs originally, like long. When I was very young, I was in high school, and I was switching from Amiga to PC. And I was like, I need an editor because like I don't know anything about this environment. It's DOS. I have literally no idea, like, what you even use to edit code. So, and I'm a kid, so like there's no money. I'm not going to buy a professional editor or

anything. I use Ganoo Emacs because it's free. It's the thing you can just get and use. So I started using that. I'd like to just interject for a moment. What you're referring to as Linux is actually Ganoon Linux, or as I've recently taken to call in it, Gnu Plus Linux. Linux is not an operating system, but rather another free component of a fully functioning Ganoo system made useful by the Ganoon Coyles show utilities and vital system cones comprising a full OS as if I by POSIX. I mean, I'm sorry that no one said that earlier. I apologize to chat for incorrectly saying things like Arch Linux instead of Arch Ganoo Linux

this entire time. The brand damage has been done. You will be hearing from the Ganoe Foundation's legal team. We now have two YouTube comments. No, but I used Gnu Emacs for a very long time until I was like, I don't know,

38, Earth 9 or something like that. Very, very long time. And I had horrible finger strain, like pinky strain that you're talking about. Yeah. So then one day I just like, I think it's just because EMAX makes you hold down the control key like 99% of the time, right? Yeah, yeah. And

or alt or whatever, like various keys. So I made a new thing, I made like an editor shim thing. I used an existing one and I made an airship thing that just doesn't have any modifier keys, right? It's just all regular. And, you know, I still use shift though. And all that went away. My hands have never had that problem again. So I'm just like, oh, VI users have never suffered this problem

because they weren't using Gnu Emacs. But now I'm finding out that's not true. Yeah, I mean, we don't suffer nearly as bad as, like, I mean, the whole joke is that my friend used Emacs, and then it's a guy with, like, two broken arms in the mess. Yeah, yeah. Right? Or, like, typical Emax user, which has, like, the hand blown in half, x-ray.

Yeah. Like, that's always it. I actually, in fact, fun side story. I have a co-worker who's like, or I had a co-worker when I was back at Netflix, by the way, if you didn't know. And his name, Anders was his name, and he used Emacs. He was a big Emacs guy, but he was like 45. And I never watched him type, but I was just like, oh, dude, you still use, like, don't you have like pinky problems or wrist problems? And he, unironically went, oh, no, I never did because I never learned how to type.

And I was like, what? He uses two fingers on each side and he hops all over the place. and his thumbs come out, and this is how he types. And he types so fast. He literally gets like 80, 90 words per minute, just tossing out four fingies max. Dude, trash, you are at Netflix. Next time you're up at Los Gatos, you've got to go.

I'm going there next week. I'm going to go find him. I'm like, hey. Yeah, be like, Anders. Let me see you. I got to see this. Dude, the guy's a wizard. Not only is he probably the best programmer I've ever met.

He's also like the fastest, like, typing programmer I've ever met, and he's just rocking four fingers and thumbs. that's where you got to be like chat there's no you guys have no excuse like you have all your fingers attached and you can use them like you guys still aren't typing 100 words per minute weak

forget about it what is stopping you from typing 100 words per minute yes apparently using all 10 fingers you need to minimize reduce all right well this is this has been very educational now I don't know why I maybe so is what happened

basically like using Ganoi Emacs for 20 or 30 years or whatever it ended up being was like straight like I ended up with like super pinky. So then when I went to something that's modal, it's like the shift key, that's all I have to press now. And so like it's like yeah, Ganoo EMAX is like it's like before you get up to bat in baseball, you put the donut, the like weight on the bat and you're swinging it so that when you come up after it's just this light thing. That's Gnu EMAX. We need a super cut of the rock leasing. but it's Casey dropping EMAX and now he's crushing all the parentheses and stuff and shift key, no problem. So I have a real question.

Okay. Back to the actual Linux topic. I've never actually been like an actual Linux user. I've tried it before. Never really got the appeal because this was kind of my journey. I used Windows to play video games back in the day, CounterStrike or something, StarCraft, whatever. Cool. I never really did anything crazy.

I wasn't programming back then. All I did was double-click a StarCraft icon. and go about my day, and then that's it. Right? And then somewhere along the line, it became a programmer, and then they handed me a MacBook, and I was like, cool, everything works fine. I never once in my life felt like I ever needed Linux.

One, because on Windows, again, I just play a game, and then I get off. Like, I don't try to do anything in a terminal. I don't try to do anything crazy. It was pretty fast, and then at work, I have a Mac. I can install my tools relatively easy. first like a Windows machine and then that was kind of like the end of my OS like

journey. So when I see people talk about like Linux they kind of one put me off because one like prime example is prime literally what just happened on stream one read that's like one of the main reasons why I never tried it like hardcore and then two

like almost every day there's like an audio issue like I'll just be talking to someone he's like oh hold on I got to restart and I'm like why would you do this to yourself? Like, why would you do that? I just, I don't understand. Now I'm at the point of my life where I just don't have time to do it anyways. But I just, I just, I just, though, it just seems like suffering.

And I just, like for me, like, I'm like, like, Prime said something that struck with me. Like, I'm like to just be in the terminal. All I need is like Neovim or something. And then I'll rice that out if I have to. Otherwise, rising a desktop to me is changing my background picture. I'm like, that's a nice background picture. And I'm like, that's a pretty good, that's a pretty good desktop. And then I'm done, right?

I need I need like reasons here well I mean I can at least speak for why we run some here which is that in the Mac world is like if you decide we're just we're just gonna let go it's kind of like the most positive way to do it to say it would be if you were going to compare it to Buddhism where you're like look

when a man enters a stream he must move with the water right he cannot He cannot move against the flow or whatever, right? Or something like this. I apologize to the Buddhist out there not knowing what the hell anything is about. But, you know, it's that kind of mindset where it's just like, look, you know, the ghost of Steve Jobs will guide my computer. And wherever that's going is where I'm going to go and be happy, right? And that does seem to work pretty well.

If you're in that mindset and you just go with it, then that's fine, right? And if they decide that, oh, you know what? We've just decided that you're not allowed to run a. any programs anymore that we don't approve. And you're just like, that's fine because I want all my programs approved by Steve Jobs. That's like, if you're in that headspace, you're going to have smooth sailing, right? Windows and Linux used to be ways, you know, if you weren't want that. Windows was like, I want control over my computer, but I want to pay somebody to make the sound work, right?

That was Windows. I don't want to pay somebody to make the sound work, and I'll just make the sound. I'm going to make a few hours a week. I don't want to pay someone to make it work and it won't work. And I'm going to fix it. I'm going to fix it. I'm going to fix it and then I'm going to get indignant when someone on the internet doesn't know how to fix it. Right.

That's the Linux way, right? Key feature is the indignity. And so those were, I mean, and that's sort of why, right? And that's why I was a Windows user as well. Like, I don't really like the Mac ecosystem all that much. I like sort of having this ability, or at least previously, having this ability to have more control over what's going on. I can send a program to somebody and they can run it. It's not going to come up with like gatekeeping software that's like, I don't know, Apple hasn't notarized this.

I think we better not, right, which has gotten increasingly sort of aggressive. So that's why I used to use Windows and was pretty happy with it. But recently, Windows has kind of been taking away both of those positives. They're becoming increasingly more. You don't control your machine. So the ads in the start menu, every time you run Windows Update, which are required to run,

it installs Cortana again, right? And you're just like, when I said I didn't want this on my machine, the first time, it wasn't like, oh, you know, we can still be friends, and maybe we'll date again in the future. Like, no, I meant,

I never want to see you again, okay? Right? Like, this was a very bad relationship that I'd just like to forget. And so it keeps becoming more maximum. like in that way. And the reliability kind of is going down, right? Now it's like, oh, yeah, well, the audio and Windows might not work all that reliably

anymore. So the value proposition goes down, and now you're just kind of paying the $200 for a Windows license and actually getting closer and closer to a Linux Mac experience, like the worst of both worlds. So at least for me, very long-witted explanation, as I always give, but that's the truth of my experience with it. Linux to me is now like, well, at some point there's going to be a crossover here. At some point, if I don't want to move to Mac, which I really kind of don't, I'd like to build my own machines, et cetera, et cetera.

I'm going to have to move to Linux because Windows is going to make it inhospitable. Like, it's going to be enough work that not only am I not going to want to do that work, but I'm not going to want to have to pay them $200 for the privilege of doing that work, right? So Linux looks more and more attractive all the time, and we're running two Linux machines here now. we still do most of our stuff on Windows, but, you know, that could, I'm looking to change that as pop,

as, as the ability arises to do so. And to be fair, Windows, or I mean, Linux has gotten a lot better with audio and video. Like the last, it's creepy.

It's vastly different from my 2016 experience versus my 2024 experience. Well, and it's on Steam Deck now, right? Which is a big boost because it means that now

there's like, there is a platform where Linux is kept running for gaming, which is obviously important to me because I do that kind of dev work. So, you know, like, there's positive signs on the Linux horizon.

I would say, too, the other thing is, like, there are viable, like, hardware vendors who sell with Linux ready for you. And then, like, that's all of, like, my desktop that I'm running right now. Like, I didn't install anything on it to get started. It came and I plugged it in the wall. and it's been my most reliable machine ever.

I've never had like an issue, audio, Wi-Fi, Bluetooth. Everything just works. It works just fine. And then like, I've had more problems with my old work Mac that I have where like you upgrade between some Mac version and then half of things uninstalled or don't work or whatever, blah, blah, blah. And so I do think, I think there is like a little bit different value prop today where you could be like, oh, if I want more of this like plug and play experience, like their system 76, framework,

like a bunch of these other guys where you can just be like, yes, they sell a limited set of hardware options. They make sure the sound card is compatible with their kernel. Sweet. And I've like upgraded several like LTSs basically like on on this one. And it's always just like run the command and then it'll install. So I do think there is something there too where like I think that value prop is getting quite a different than it was when it was like, take your old think pad and hope you bought the right

combo of hardware software. Oops, that Wi-Fi card doesn't work till you download the latest update. So you have to find an Ethernet cable that's going to work. Oh, and then, you know, like... And the power management was also messed up. So, like, your battery life was like half of what it was in Windows, right, and all that stuff. So there were a lot of downsides. So I used, my very first Linux machine was a Razor, 2016 Razor laptop for gaming and all that.

That's a nice laptop. That was back when those were good. It was very good laptop. But I could not take my Razor laptop to a meeting. An hour-long meeting, it would be dead before I got back out of the meeting. And I tried to install. This is back when Bumblebee was the switch between the two modes and Linux. Bumblebee never seemed to work, okay?

Bumblebee was just a drag. And it just was an awful experience. And I just remember attempting to make battery life work was 10% of my job at Netflix. was just like, okay, how can I improve battery life? And it just was so bad. I think I got it from like 15 minutes to 45 minutes, and that's as good as I got it, and then I gave up and got a think pad.

Yeah, I mean, I don't blame the Linux maintainers at all for that kind of stuff, because, you know, they are so, they have such a much harder job because, like, Nvidia doesn't want to really help them, right? Like, they don't want to... So, you know, Bumblebee is... That means you were running on an Optimus laptop, right? Which is Nvidia's kind of muxed version where they got the discrete GPU.

Yeah, you can switch between integrated and... Yeah. And so, like, you know, the poor Linux people, they just get that dumped in their lap, right? And V-Vidia won't open source any of the stuff for the actual, like, control binary blobs. And so they're just, like, half-reverse engineer things

and all this other stuff. And so, like, again, And then, just because this is a public thing, we're saying this, and it's, you know, it's a video that everyone will see. I don't think a lot of these things are the maintainer's fault either, even back in the day. It's just, from a user's perspective, they don't really care whose fault it is, right? It's like, when you're going to go use a laptop, all you care is whether the matter of life is good or not, right? And so it's like, yeah, you know, it's, a lot of that can be traced back to the fact that Windows just has this ecosystem advantage, and they also are not mandating. Like they don't make open source mandates for things.

So, you know, vendors are more willing to, like, have their secret sauce on there and all that sort of thing. And so, yeah, you do end up in that situation. Fortunately, like, because of, I guess, of competition in the marketplace, this worked out well. Other vendors did. So now you're just like, yeah, you don't, everyone knows you don't buy an Nvidia GPU if you're using Linux. You just buy an AMD one and we're good, right? And that actually does seem to hold true now. Like, I've built two Linux machines.

I just did AMD GPUs for both of them. no issues right everything runs exactly as i would expect it and so on uh and and and so you know i i do think there's there's an element of just like they they were dealt a losing hand during that period of time anyway well i hear it's a lot better and so once i can see my login screen again i'll tell you how good it is okay because uh you know i would like to get some of these things more set up and so i'm going to probably i would like to i mean all Ultimately, what I'd like to do is get this into a dual-boot mode where I can actually run both. But my guess is that I'll just go for it and just get it up and running and then spend the next four days trying to get it running.

I'm sorry, run both what? Ubuntu and Arch. Okay, so two linensies. Yeah. Lenoxes. Is it possible? I know I'm probably going to say something really stupid right now, but just want to ask. Is it possible to set up like sort of a, okay, we're going to put, like, we're going to put, like,

the home directory on a separate drive or a separate partition. And then I boot Arch and Ubuntu and I have the same, roughly the same state on both, like, overlaid? Or is it like, no, do not do that? Because the dot files will all be wrong and need the dispute is that. I see a wall of yeses. So I'm going to assume no. Which means that you have to.

When I see people so emphatically like, yes, that means no, it's very, very difficult. Okay. Yeah, understood. So if chat says yes, it means no. Yeah, if they're really confident, oh, I can show you how. Check out this six-part guide about how to set this up. And don't worry, you only have to reinstall three times,

and after you follow this, you're going to feel superior, too. Here's a script that creates the 637 different symbolic links you will need to make this work. Oh, don't install anything from Node. It's GGs after that. Love it. But okay, that's cool. That would be kind of fun. This is the problem.

That's why I just need the download the Arch ISO and just do the Windows laptop. You're going to one shot it once you do that. Honestly, like it's really easy. Stop trying to overlay your existing system on top of it. I know, I know. You're probably right. Oh, we can see your. Oh, crap.

You can see. Oh, yeah, I forgot. I'm using Riverside. I was just going to get this download. There you go. We're back. The pride is going to get it downloading in the past. right now so it's easy. I forgot.

Riverside won't give me the streams right now, so I have I'm stealing. I just love the first thing it shows on your thing, Netflix stock. That's what it shows in the preview. Oh, nice, it does. That's pretty sweet.

Netflix stock, that's pretty good. I like that. So, I will simply say in the year of the Linux desktop, which I had hoped would be the theme, but then kind of wasn't, I just did want to mention what we currently experience running Linux desktops here.

And that is that actually... Can you say here, by the way? Yes. Sorry, what? What place is here? Yeah, yeah. For those who don't know. Yeah, for those that don't know.

Oh, just at Molli Rocket. I mean, the place where I make it, if you read any of my content, I have to have a place to make that. There is a place where this has to occur. Yeah. And so we have machines. We use computers.

to do some of that work. But not everyone's familiar with Molly Rock and who you are. So that's why I was like, you know, give it like the one, the 30 seconds. No, no, no, no. We don't need to plug anything. We don't need to plug anything. So about computer enhance. No.

Computer Enhance.com with Casey, Molly Rocket, moratorium. Muratory, sorry. I said it wrong. I'm trying to make a very important point here. Hit us. Okay, okay, just computerenhanced.com. We don't do that at the stand-up. Good point.

I just wanted to say, weirdly, at least for me, Linux, the maintenance cost of Linux has actually shifted somewhat to being, it's almost like, my understanding, my limited understanding, and I don't know ornithology at all. But my limited understanding, exactly, my limited understanding is that like when two like bald eagles are going to like have sex, they like start really high up because they're going to just plummet to the ground in this like in this disgusting sex spiral until they almost hit the ground and pull out of it right what is that okay so that too far so far i'm tracking i'm with you that to me i don't even know we're talking about anymore this to me captures how i'm feeling about my linux and windows machines

now okay sex spiral guys they are in this but this spiral of this spiral of some kind of this spiral of some disgusting spiral that I'm not really, I'm like watching kind of horrified from the ground. And I'm like, I hope one of these pulls out in time to take back off again. Because basically what happens to me now is any time a machine updates. I don't care what machine it is. I don't care what it's a Windows machine or a Linux machine. Any time it updates, that's several hours of me having to do work now. So it's like, oh, the Linux machine updated.

And it's just, now it doesn't put anymore. Like, why doesn't it put anymore? Oh, because I go online and I read up, it turns out the people who maintain that distribution decided to change which servers it was on, and there's no way to redistribute which keys authenticate those servers. So you have to manually install the new keys to get the servers, then you do that.

And of course, by the time you do that, your packages behind now. And the new packages that install, they conflict. So now you have to manually disable a bunch of packages to run the install, then re-enable those packages to get them up and you're just like, that's your life now, right? Whereas Windows, it's like, okay, it decided to, it was going to do its update. Oh, now, like, brush tracking doesn't work on our artist machines because they changed the interaction like Photoshop updated.

We plugged the machine into the internet. That's when you know the day is going bad because it's not plugged in to the internet normally. We leave them unplugged. That's where the sex spiral comes in. You plug it in, the sex spiral starts. I can't. Yeah. The Xxbarrel starts

The artist machine doesn't work anymore The brush tracking doesn't work Because Photoshop updated Windows ink updated Now they're no longer compatible The Wackham driver Is crapping itself over the corner I've yet to get Wackham to work consistently anyway

It's a nightmare It's normal So it's like our machines work Because I've fixed them In between updates And then some bunch of people out in the internet Who I don't

What are you people doing When you make software This garbage comes down under the machine and nothing works for like three hours and I have to fix it all. It's disgusting. What is happening? That's a classic.

That's a classic spiral. That's the experience. I'm not an orthologist. But that's a sex spiral. Okay, so, what is a bald eagle sex spiral? It's a bald eagle sex spiral. It's a filthy, disgusting thing happening

and everyone, they're about to die if they don't get this done. The Google trends on that phrase is going to insane. We're going to be able to see the change in that phrase on Google Trends tomorrow. Yeah. Oh, this might have been my favorite episode of the stand-up.

This one was birthed out of pain and ends still in pain. Yeah. I had a good time. No blockers on my end. My computer's still working, so I'm blocked, well, I'm blocked on Prime's computer. He had the files. Yeah. I learned a lot today,

loved Galactus. Push us out two or three years. Yep. I love that we do that every single time. Trash on the day. Love Galactus. Yeah, yeah. There's so many funny moments. All right, well, let's cut the stream then.

Yeah, let's just cut it. Okay, so I don't want to press anything on this computer, so I'm probably just, I'm just going to have to like. Yeah, don't, I'm going to, prime. Goodbye, YouTube. I'm stopping the recording. Perfect ending. We'll see you next time on the stand-up.