The Ultimate Human with Gary Brecka - 150. Alex Tarnova: Unlocking Longevity with Hydrogen Water - Anti-Aging, Increased Energy & Reducing Inflammation

Starting point is 00:00:00 Our last universal common ancestor, the single cell organism that spawned all life on this planet actually consumed hydrogen as its fuel source. When I talk about hydrogen in the water, their reaction is, well doesn't the gas just flow to the top, go out into the atmosphere? How are you able to ingest the hydrogen gas and have it create its therapeutic effect in the body? Hydrogen water gets into the gut a lot better than inhalation. They elevate different tissues in different capacities. It's better for a lot of these metabolic conditions. There is a significant improvement in mental alertness. Almost replaced caffeine with hydrogen.

Starting point is 00:00:32 I feel the difference. You don't feel stimulated, but you just feel more clean and clear in the wake. There are a lot of people that popoo the hydrogen tablets as a therapeutic measure for reducing inflammation. Hydrogen is in fact a weak antioxidant in vitro, and it's only driving towards homeostasis. And this is actually critically important because...

Starting point is 00:00:50 Hey guys, welcome back to the Ultimate Human Podcast. I'm your host, human biologist, Gary Brekka, where we go down the road of everything, anti-aging, biohacking, longevity, and everything in between. And as most of you guys know, I am way down the rabbit hole and a big, big proponent of hydrogen gas, hydrogen water, as a way to reduce inflammation, improve our circulation, as a way to actually just make this a part of our health and wellness journey. And I am so excited for today's guests because we are going to go deep down the rabbit hole of the science behind hydrogen gas and how this gas, this simple gas can change the trajectory of your health journey.

Starting point is 00:01:42 And I've been using hydrogen water for years now. I was a big proponent of using it for exercise, for improving performance. But now we have the scientifically validated research to really support some of the claims. And we probably have the world's most renowned expert on the podcast today developed and patented the first clinically valid hydrogen tablet, which use every day H2 tabs but I really want to go down the

Starting point is 00:02:10 the rabbit hole of the research into how can hydrogen gas be simply incorporated into your life and make a major improvement on your health journey so welcome to the podcast Alex Tarnova. Tarnova! You know, there's a common theme and my viewers hear me talk about this all the time that runs through most of my podcasts. And that is that I feel like the people that are the most passionate, the most purpose driven, that are making the biggest change in the world are people that have solved the problem in their life. And you have a really interesting story about what led you to hyper focus on hydrogen gas and elemental magnesium I wonder if you might share that story and then let's get into the science. Yeah

Starting point is 00:02:53 Absolutely. So I'll be as brief as possible so you can focus on the good stuff But as we were talking about earlier, I mean up until this event in my life I would research learn about something for a few months, and then get bored and move on. And so I was kind of a generalist. I had an encyclopedia of knowledge on a million different things, but wasn't really close to an expert on anything.

Starting point is 00:03:15 And fast forward to when I was 29, and I was running a successful business in a completely different industry on an innovation I'd had there. But that business was giving me a lot of free time I was on the road a month like a week out of the month and when I was at home I was working like an hour a day two hours a day so I was basically training as if I was a professional athlete even though I wasn't I was training four to six hours

Starting point is 00:03:43 a day five days a week six days a week and having an active recovery day once or twice and it was like Muay Thai jiu-jitsu Yeah, various martial arts crossfit. I did some crossfit competitions at the time too, and I was in by far the best shape of my life, right and All of a sudden I got really sick and they never were able to figure out what happened but it's most probable I had some sort of virus that caused an autoimmune reaction. So basically overnight I developed sudden onset narcolepsy. You know, if I sit down and wasn't engaged for a minute or two I'd'd fall asleep. Wow I was sleeping like 16 hours a day I had crushing fatigue. Yeah crushing fatigue. I had also central nervous system fatigue. So basically I

Starting point is 00:04:36 went from being able to do like 20 bar muscle-ups unbroken to I couldn't do a chest bar or 54 inch plyometric box jump to I couldn't get air time. I couldn't jump an inch off the ground with both feet. Wow. And I couldn't sprint, do anything that was explosive and reactive. But my slower movements, like my deadlift, my squat, my bench press, were completely unaffected.

Starting point is 00:04:59 My strength was normal. Wow. Right? In addition, I had very high markers of inflammation So my C reactive protein my C reactive proteins were about a hundred and hundred times abnormal while or you know 34 milligrams a liter wow speak so By the way C reactive protein should be less than three that should technically be less than one Yeah, if you're gonna have a really low risk of cardiomyopathy.

Starting point is 00:05:27 Yeah, I mean, usually you might spike to, yeah, one to three when you're sick, when you have a cold or the flu or something. Most healthy people are below 0.5, right? Like if you're metabolically healthy. You know, if you have chronic inflammation, you start trending up. But for 29-year-olds in the shape I was in, I should have been below 0.5 below 0.3 even people that are not familiar with C-reactive protein it's a non-specific marker of inflammation doesn't tell you exactly what's causing it but it tells you that something is going on in your

Starting point is 00:05:54 body the liver is reacting creating this protein that is an indicator of inflammation could be in the brain could be the liver the lungs the pancreas the kidneys and the blood could be coming from just about anywhere but when when it gets really, really high, like what you're explaining, this is cause for investigation. So you have this elevated C-reactive protein, you know, you're crushing fatigue, which is by the way, classic viral. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. And my roommate got really sick at the time too. And it hit him different. He actually had to go to the hospital a couple of times different. He actually had to go to the hospital a couple times with pneumonia. Right and this was a guy who was you know top three-ing in triathlons and Spartan races so again he was a super fit healthy 29 year old that got

Starting point is 00:06:34 taken out by whatever hit us. It's just he didn't get the autoimmune response like I did. Right. But this lasted a couple months and when the dust settled I was left with polyarthritis. So I developed osteoarthritis in 11 joints, the worst of which is my left shoulder, which this is as high as it goes now, it's bone on bone. But also my hip was quite bad, my hands and, you know, basically anywhere I'd had an injury in sports throughout

Starting point is 00:07:01 my long life of contact and combat sports. Wow. I was told I had to quit working out, right? Period. You cannot exercise more. You can't lift weights, just walk, right? Maybe do like some swimming just like with, you know, breaststroke or something that doesn't need the shoulder.

Starting point is 00:07:19 And they put me on a thousand milligrams of naproxen a day. So I think like super alleviate like a leave is naproxen, but you might get 200 milligrams. So I was on five times that dose and I was taking cortisone injections. Okay. And I just knew that none of this was how I wanted the rest of my life to go.

Starting point is 00:07:38 And it wasn't a long term solution. It was going to lead to long term side effects. So the time I'd spent exercising, I just dove into PubMed, and I just started reading any study I could find on regulating inflammatory response and any sort of therapeutic. Started a ton of different biohacks

Starting point is 00:07:58 from going to cryosanas and normal saunas and, you know... Just trying to get this out of you whatever it was. Just trying to get it and at the time I found some research on hydrogen water and this the industry was very nascent at the time there was only you know 40-50 studies but I found a couple clinical trials and I bought a machine for like five thousand dollars this water and hydrogen gas. for like $5,000 this water and oxygen gas. Purportedly. OK, so I went on my merry way and didn't know what if anything was working because I was still

Starting point is 00:08:32 taking the naproxen and the cortisone injections and trying to get back into exercise. And eight or nine months later, I fainted a few times in the gym. So I developed multiple ulcers from the naproxen and I had to abruptly stop. Right? So basically as I stopped the naproxen and I hadn't had a cortisone shot in a while, all my joints froze within a few days. Wow. So I realized that nothing I was doing was really

Starting point is 00:09:01 helping. Like going to the sauna in the cryo, it would help for a few hours or the rest of the day, but then I'd wake up rough again. And you just- Stiff as a board. Exactly, right? I couldn't put on socks without sitting down or lying down. I couldn't put on jackets and some shirts. Like it was rough.

Starting point is 00:09:20 And I went back to PubMed and I just started reading more and more. And in this nine month period, I found some new research on hydrogen water. And at first it pissed me off because I had this $5,000 paperweight that wasn't helping. But then it just dawned on me. I took the salesman's word for it, that this made hydrogen water. How do I know there's hydrogen gas in here and what dose is needed? So I started buying the full studies to read the material and methods And I found that not a single one of them at the time were using a machine like what I'd bought

Starting point is 00:09:56 They were making the hydrogen water in labs in various ways like bubbling gas or using magnesium under pressure So then I found a reagent to test for hydrogen gas in water, and I ordered it, and the first test, it detected no hydrogen. I had to over-triple the input to reduce a single drop, putting it at... Is that the methylene blue test? Yeah, yeah.

Starting point is 00:10:19 Putting it at like 0.03 parts per million, which is well below the lowest ever observed, you know, any kind of therapeutic dose, any type of physiological effect on the body, like, you know, one one thirtieth of the lowest observed minimum threshold to do anything. Right. Right. So that gave me a bit of hope. And I went about trying to source magnesium,

Starting point is 00:10:46 which was gonna be the easiest way for me to do it. And first I sourced some rods, and then I had some concerns that with magnesium rods, I don't know how much magnesium I'm getting, and I didn't want to get hypermagnesia. And so then I was sort of thinking, I need a powder so I can control the dose. Quickly realized it's very hard to get

Starting point is 00:11:06 elemental magnesium powder. Like in the United States, it's controlled by the State Department and DOD. You have to go through background checks and everything. So I sourced some from Eastern Europe and some from China at first, and they arrived saying like silver paint coloring. It's like powder.

Starting point is 00:11:23 I'm like, okay, this is a little bit sketchy, but I tried anyways Um, I figured the powder floats so I wasn't able to make the hydrogen water and I'm gonna need to compress this So that's where the tablet idea. Okay. I'm actually compressing you eventually ended up patting this Because I mean I take your tabs your h2 tabs Every day I travel with them now They're super easy to use. You know, I either use the hydrogen water bottle or use these tablets and interestingly You know a lot of my audience is like listen I don't have 250 bucks or 275 bucks for a hydrogen water bottle, but these tablets are inexpensive But the elemental magnesium is this what's effervescing into the hydrogen gas?

Starting point is 00:12:04 Yeah so basically the elemental magnesium and the organic acids we're using are reacting with the water and it's breaking that bond between the H2 and the oxygen, right? And that's what creates these small nanobubbles that you see in the water so you can drink down the hydrogen water. Now basically the magnesium in a couple complex reactions goes from the elemental magnesium to just free magnesium ions, MG2 plus, which is exactly what our body needs.

Starting point is 00:12:31 So it doubles as a highly bioavailable magnesium supplement. Wow. And so many of us are so deficient in this like essential metal. We really are. Yeah, no, we are like I think 80 to 90% of the people sleep I think but overnight by adding, you know magnesium and you you you likely know there's there's big bio availability concerns with a lot of the magnesium supplements on the market. So I go by magnesium oxide

Starting point is 00:12:57 that's on average four or five percent bio available. Right. So we're delivering it in the exact form your body needs. Your stomach doesn't have to liberate it off of another compound. It just freely goes into your system. Yeah. So it's completely bioavailable because of the way we're delivering it. But so yeah, when I started developing these tablets, I quickly sort of feeling better. Now, were you drinking them? Were you bathing them? I was drinking. So I was drinking several liters a day And I was getting at first to about three parts per million you know sealing them under pressure and my joints loosened

Starting point is 00:13:34 I felt better. I'm like wow there's something here But then I had a bit of a sober second thought I didn't want to win a Darwin award Yeah, you know like blow yourself up blow myself up in my kitchen with hydrogen gas And by the way, elemental magnesium is flammable and it burns at a very high Temperature fifty eight hundred degrees Fahrenheit, right? It's the white and fireworks Yeah, right, which is why it's so so tightly controlled and I had to go through background checks and everything like that But also to like I wanted to test for heavy metals and the contaminants and is there any dangerous side reaction that's happening? Like I understood enough about the basic chemistry, but I'm not a chemist, right? Right. So I found my

Starting point is 00:14:13 founding partner You know, dr. Richard Holland. He's a PhD in organic chemistry. He works in the pharmaceutical industry So he designed small molecules for different therapeutic topic targets. And I found him, he was doing consulting work offering it. And I told him about my project and he said, this is the worst pseudoscience I've ever heard in my life. Not what you wanted to hear. Yeah. Well, he gave me a list of reasons why it wouldn't work. Why you like hydrogen has no role in the body.

Starting point is 00:14:46 And even if it did, you should inhale it and not drink it because of the low saturation point. And if you'd like, we can get into that later. The pharmacokinetics of inhalation and water are actually completely different. So they hit different organs in different ways. But because I'd read every study to date on hydrogen as a therapeutic, like at that time, I was able to rebut all of his responses with peer-reviewed evidence. And he came back to me and said, like, I'm actually in shock, right? I still don't really believe it, but there's enough that I can help you out.

Starting point is 00:15:20 Sure. Right. So he starts tweaking my formula. I'm sending him a new publication every day just to pique his interest, because I'm really excited about the project. And he calls me for lunch. And serendipitously, I sent him this clinical trial

Starting point is 00:15:36 on a certain disease state. And it was a decent size. And it was using a high concentration at the time, about five parts per million, over a liter a day. And it found pretty good results in this group, in this population. And I was not aware but his current job was developing small molecules for this exact disease. And he said, you know, with the other studies you've sent, I'm not a subject matter expert,

Starting point is 00:16:04 right? So I just have to trust the findings, look at the, you know, methodology, and trust the researchers. But with this, I am. And unless this is fraud, this works. And it works better than the molecules I'm developing, right? Are you interested in commercializing this? Right?

Starting point is 00:16:23 So I thought long and hard about it. I had no expertise in this area. And I was just doing this as a do it yourself project for my own health. But I figured, why not? What do I have to lose? I can learn as I go. Let's do this. Right. So I proceeded forward and. It only took a few weeks to refine.

Starting point is 00:16:43 There wasn't much changes to my formulation to get to work in a mortar and pestle. But then the hard work started. We quickly realized that doing this in mass, making millions of tablets at high speed is dramatically different for safety, for getting the reaction right, everything, than making 20 in a mortar and pestle,

Starting point is 00:17:02 mixing by hand and then hand pressing. It took us a year, over 2,000 iterative adjustments and 15 failed scale up attempts at manufacturing to get our first production ready tablet. Wow. Since then, we've stopped counting at version 5,000, but we're probably at 10,000 iterative adjustments in the R&D process to get to where we are.

Starting point is 00:17:23 To where you can take elemental magnesium, compress it, have it sink to the bottom of a glass and ever vest into the water and get in in this open cup And get these small nano bubbles in the 10 to 30 nanometer in range Which is critically important so that in in say half a liter of water or 16.8 ounces We're getting over 12 parts per million. That's incredible. I mean, that's really incredible And I think a lot of people, when I talk about hydrogen gas in the water, their first reaction is, well, doesn't the gas just float to the top and then go out into the atmosphere?

Starting point is 00:17:56 How are you able to ingest the hydrogen gas and create its therapeutic effect in the body? I can tell you that I feel the difference. I've almost replaced caffeine with hydrogen. And I know I told you we have a couple of clinical trials head to head against caffeine after acute sleep deprivation. Really?

Starting point is 00:18:15 In the first study, we showed equivalent improvement in the attention network test to caffeine, but they affected different domains of attention. Right? Caffeine affects alerting and the hydrogen affected orienting. Right? So we did a bigger, better controlled study with four groups and it was a, you know, crossover design also.

Starting point is 00:18:36 Okay. So everyone did all therapies. So it was a quadruple crossover. So crazy design. So there was placebo, placebo, hydrogen, placebo, caffeine, placebo, and caffeine plus hydrogen. And it found that the hydrogen groups, with or without caffeine,

Starting point is 00:18:53 had a substantially more robust improvement in brain metabolism. So according to creatine ratios in the brain, then the caffeine alone. So hydrogen was, basically it's's as your brain metabolism slows due to the acute stress of sleep deprivation hydrogen is temporarily restoring it back to proper function. I've noticed that truly when I travel and sometimes I do my best to schedule meetings and travel around sleep and exercise but sometimes flights happen when flights happen, meetings

Starting point is 00:19:24 happen when they happen, or you're just in a different time zone. And there is a significant improvement, I notice, in mental alertness. And just my general sense of, I would say, cognitive energy, right? You don't feel stimulated, but you just feel more clean and clear and awake and focused. Interestingly, I read a study, I think it was actually with your tablets, and I'll put the links in the study notes below, it was in the Journal of Experimental Gerontology, and it was in November of 2021. And what I found really fascinating, because I've been not down the road of developing hydrogen tablets or hydrogen water bottles but of researching the

Starting point is 00:20:05 hydrogen gas because I think it's one of those things that in my opinion will be as common as a multivitamin in 10 years because the evidence is so strong. I think so yeah. But what I read in this journal of experimental gerontology was that they were 70 year olds and older. 70 and up. Yes I think 77 or 70. Was it? Yeah. Okay so then you're obviously very familiar with it and I might paraphrase it wrong, but They this was a six month study and it was it was double blind. It was placebo controlled and So one group was drinking hydrogen water Have forget what the parts per million where the other group not, but they measured telomere lengths, which improved. They measured cognitive scoring. Yeah, they got measured cognitive scoring, which improved. They measured sleep.

Starting point is 00:20:52 So they actually were looking at stages of sleep, deep REM sleep. They measured their sit-stand ratio, which I thought was really interesting. I mean that there might be some effect on sarcopenia, like age-related muscle wasting. They measured different factors in the frontal lobe of the brain, their reaction times, and across the board, all of these metrics improved. They even used a marker, TET2, I think. TET2. So that's linked to...

Starting point is 00:21:23 To measure the methylation. Well, that's linked to young blood. So anyone who's seen the research where they take an aged mouse, and they take the blood of a young mouse and, you know, swap it out like an oil change and it revitalizes the old mouse, the skeletal tissue anyways, that's linked to Tet two. So we doubled that in the blood. I saw that. Which it's also a marker of methylation, which I'm very interested in,

Starting point is 00:21:47 because I think that when the body's able to take compounds and convert them into the usable form, you're improving the cellular metabolism and you're making that cell less susceptible to all forms of disease and sickness because it can eliminate waste and it can repair, it can detoxify, it can regenerate. But I thought it was fascinating that they actually were measuring

Starting point is 00:22:07 markers of methylation in 70 plus year olds. So Tet-2 was my idea. Was it? Actually in that study. So that's it can bring it in. Like research is very important to me. When I decided to go down this road, as we all know, there's so many snake oil salesmen in the health industry and supplements.

Starting point is 00:22:27 I wanted to do something that I could look at myself in the mirror and go to bed happy and feel like I'm having a purpose in life and I'm doing something good, not just out there to make money. So as we were getting ready to launch, I did a bunch of research on what the regulatory requirements are. So we have a grass status and new dietary ingredient status with the FDA. Actually, now we have 21 validated structure function claims to FTC standards through an expert panel that reviewed all our research.

Starting point is 00:22:59 But I wanted to make sure that my hunch that the higher concentration and dose we were delivering was actually going to have an effect and wasn't going to have a harm because that's I wanted to make sure that my hunch that the higher concentration and dose we were delivering was actually going to have an effect and wasn't going to have a harm. Because that's very important with any molecule. Every molecule works on a dose dependent and sometimes concentration dependent response. And increasing the dose can increase efficacy, but there could be side effects. And I really wanted to explore this to make sure I was delivering something that was safe and effective for people.

Starting point is 00:23:29 So before we launched as we were doing our first production run, I emailed every single first and corresponding author on every single clinical trial on hydrogen and preclinical in mice. Okay. And I offered free product, free placebo and to donate funds, no questions asked. So I don't believe in silencing science. If something... Oh, so if the research came out...

Starting point is 00:23:56 Negative. ...not in favor of what you were doing, you still wanted them to publish it. Okay. Exactly. Love that. We cannot understand this world better if we're not publishing negative data Wow as we've talked about before that the big problem there is law passed in the 1920s called shareholders supremacy so

Starting point is 00:24:13 Corporations have to do what's best for their shareholders and if they don't they're breaking the law and can be sued, right? So that's why I've kept my company private so that I can make my own decisions Right and be like this is what is true and ethical and moral Right. This is how I'm gonna do and that's why I've resisted all You know venture capitalists who have tried to invest right in my companies So I got some bites and that's why now just in the last six seven years since we've been doing research We actually have more clinical and preclinical research than all other commercial hydrogen water products combined.

Starting point is 00:24:50 Wow. Right? So, and we have way more that's, you know, we have like over 20 human studies now. We have- I've read a lot of them. We have ankle injuries, CTEs, traumatic brain injuries, inflammatory compounds. I actually want to do that. I want to go down sort of the road of hydrogen gas

Starting point is 00:25:11 and its implication in a bunch of different categories. We can actually even talk about it from the very beginning, why it's important from evolution and why we're not getting it. Yeah, let's do that. So what we're realizing is, first we realize that hydrogen is having this impact on the body, right? Then the question is, what's the mechanism?

Starting point is 00:25:33 How is it having this impact? And we've now been able to identify there's a few different mechanisms that's working. So throughout the whole body, it's acting as something called the mitohormetic effector. So that's hormesis of the mitochondria. Right. So hormesis is anything like a stress that's mild enough that we get stronger from and adapt. Right. So exercise, cold exposure, sauna, sunlight, even radiation in certain amounts like sunlight, even ethanol at the right dose right and timing it's just with hormetic agents They all operate on like a reverse you or a reverse J when you don't get it at all you start here If you get the right dose and timing you improve your health and then if you go too high

Starting point is 00:26:20 It goes either back to baseline or a lot worse like with alcohol. It's a very tight reverse chain which is why we can't really recommend alcohol for anyone at any dose because every person would find a benefit at a different dose and Every day so we just don't have the science there to make advice but So we're we're acting kind of like exercise for the mitochondria Which is improving the health and the number of the mitochondria. In addition, hydrogen is interacting with our microbiome. It's improving gut health and in a yet to be fully understood mechanism,

Starting point is 00:26:57 we know we're partially metabolizing it in the liver and it's driving liver homeostasis. So there's a few ways that hydrogen is helping. And now why is hydrogen doing this in our body? What role did it have? We actually have to go back to the very beginning of evolution. So our last universal common ancestor, the single cell organism that spawned all life on this planet, actually consumed hydrogen as its fuel source. And then our first mitochondria came from eukaryotes. And those eukaryotes was a symbiotic relationship between organelle, one of which expelled hydrogen

Starting point is 00:27:33 as a waste product. Right. And now we've actually carried that throughout all of evolution. And there's other factors too. At times in evolution, a couple billion years ago, there was a lot more hydrogen in the air and water. So we've had a lot of exposure to hydrogen gas. And obviously, it's a necessary element

Starting point is 00:27:46 but I mean the you know I would say that what are we 60 or 67 percent water by weight? Yeah. So obviously we have a lot of hydrogen. Molecular hydrogen is the first molecule in the universe too right so it seems obvious in retrospect that it has a role in our life and our body. And we actually, we evolved to produce a tremendous amount of hydrogen gas internally and dodging us. We do this by fermenting fiber. The big problem here is throughout the majority of human evolution, we were consuming 100

Starting point is 00:28:18 to 150 grams of dietary fiber a day. Now the average person in the Western world consumes 10 to 15 grams of dietary fiber a day. Now, the average person in the Western world consumes 10 to 15 grams of dietary fiber a day, but the average person on a standard American diet is only consuming one to three grams of fiber a day. Wow. So we're not getting the fuel to produce hydrogen. And the bacteria that are breaking down fiber in this process and releasing H2 gas,

Starting point is 00:28:42 they're like any living thing. If you stop feeding them, they die. And that is one of the reasons we're getting this dysbiosis of the microbiome. These hydrogen producing bacteria are dying out. They're being replaced by methane producing bacteria. So actually when we do studies, we can look at a high percentage of middle-aged

Starting point is 00:29:03 and older metabolic impairedimpaired people, we give them a hydrogen breath test after lactulose, and they produce more methane than hydrogen or no hydrogen at all. And this is critically important because we know that methane is strongly correlated with basically every disease outcome. It's correlated with mortality. And we also know that hydrogen is correlated with longevity. So a study in centenarians, so people over a hundred in Okinawa, found that these centenarians had higher breath hydrogen than the

Starting point is 00:29:36 average young person. Wow. So their lifestyle had carried it through. Which meant they had the healthy microbiome to produce the hydrogen gas. Yeah. And as we know with a lot of the gut despiosis, some of the bacteria doesn't come back. Right. So for a lot of people that have not lived a perfect lifestyle, who has, you can maybe only get your hydrogen at the right dose exogenously through hydrogen water or hydrogen inhalation or asing gas.

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Starting point is 00:30:50 Head to theultimatehuman.com forward slash VIP. That's theultimatehuman.com forward slash VIP right now to become one of my ultimate human VIPs. This is your fast pass to better health, So don't miss it. Now let's get back to the ultimate human podcast. It's fascinating to me because I think it has so many implications. You know, it's a part of my daily life. But there are a lot of people that put poo the hydrogen water bottles or purpoo hydrogen tablets or just hydrogen gas as a as a therapeutic measure for reducing inflammation for improving circulation.

Starting point is 00:31:27 We now have clinical evidence to support that. But I wanna kind of break down the different categories because there's several areas where I'm hyper interested in what hydrogen gas can do for sports performance, what it can do for cognitive function. Both my parents drinking hydrogen gas water, you know, every day, I can tell you, I have emphatically noticed the difference in their acuteness. And their memory, their recall,

Starting point is 00:31:55 my father says it about my mother all the time. So let's just break down once once we get this hydrogen gas into the body. First of all, how is it getting through the stomach? Once it gets to the stomach and enters the small intestine or perfuses through the blood brain barrier, what is it doing? How is it, how is hydrogen gas an anti-inflammatory? You know, we can measure it's ORP.

Starting point is 00:32:18 I've got an ORP meter right here. We can measure its oxidative reduction potential. It's highly negative, which is great. But explain that mechanism. This is actually where it gets kind of interesting and makes hydrogen a lot more profound than just a standard anti-inflammatory or an antioxidant. So hydrogen is in fact a weak antioxidant in vitro. OK, right. So outside of a living body in a test tube or a cell culture, which is why we can get a

Starting point is 00:32:43 So outside of a living body in a test tube or a cell culture, which is why we can get a negative ORP from it. But how it's actually working as an antioxidant in vivo is similar to how exercise works. It's actually acutely an oxidative stress in the mitochondria. That's what's actually triggering Nrf2 reaction, you know, activation. Nrf2. Which exactly, which we produce more glutathione catalyst superoxide dismutase So we're producing more of our endogenous antioxidants and it's only driving towards homeostasis

Starting point is 00:33:13 and this is actually critically important because There are a lot of deleterious effects from taking too high of antioxidants, right? Right? You can go into reductive stress which is as harmful as being oxidative. Yes. So hydrogen just drives towards redox homeostasis. It's getting this harmony back. Between the yang and yang of our reductive molecules and because you're behind the body's physiologic process to create homeostasis rather than imposing it upon the body. Exactly and it's doing the same thing with inflammation so it can actually acutely spike inflammation just like exercise. Exercise will release interleukin 6 which is one

Starting point is 00:33:55 of the nastiest pro-inflammatory cytokines but it's such a low amount from skeletal tissue that it's a myokine roll and hydrogen does the same thing which drives this harmonious inflammatory response and a lot of people just think of inflammation as a bad word. Yes. It's only bad when it's not behaving how it's supposed to. Inflammation is critically important to our physiology. It's part of our, exactly. Yeah. And... Nothing in the body would heal without the inflammatory response.

Starting point is 00:34:28 Exactly. It's part of our immune system to fight off viruses. Actually, that was one of the biggest issues with COVID-19. There's a lot of people's bodies weren't recognizing it was a threat. So they didn't have sufficient inflammatory response at the beginning. And then once the virus started taking over,

Starting point is 00:34:44 their body would panic and they go into cytokine storm. Having this healthy, harmonious, inflammatory response is incredibly important and hydrogen drives that. And it does that for a lot of other processes too, like autophagy. It's all the rage and anti-aging with autophagy. And a lot of people think, oh, I want to always be activating autophagy. But no, you want to intermittently activate autophagy and then a lot of research hydrogen has shown to actually activate autophagy But in some important studies it's shown to inhibit autophagy

Starting point is 00:35:14 Like after heart failure and drowning resuscitation when you absolutely don't want that to happen, right? So in a way it can it's kind of will explain hydrogen kind of like a supervisor in our cell. It's sort of a selective antioxidant, if you will, meaning that, you know, it's, if we could get behind our own cellular physiology, our own cellular biology to create homeostasis, reduce the inflammatory response when it's not needed, and not inhibit the inflammatory response where it is. Like I've started taking it before hyperbaric sessions because I know that these oxidative species,

Starting point is 00:35:50 high amounts of oxygen under pressure can actually have negative effects, like positive effects. And I can mitigate some of those by taking the hydrogen gas. But actually, it can sheet the stress acutely. And we've talked about this before. So there's really cool research on hydrogen with other hormetic stresses, you know, whether it be heat exposure, cold exposure, or exercise,

Starting point is 00:36:10 that acutely hydrogen is actually increasing the stress response. But then after the stress finishes, it's driving back to homeostasis faster. So like with exercise, that's as if you worked out harder and recovered quicker. Yeah. Because it's spiking the inflammation and oxidative stress higher and then dropping back down to homeostasis faster. Yeah. And you know, I noticed in athletes, I've introduced several very dominant athletes

Starting point is 00:36:37 like Michael Chandler or John Jones, other athletes that I can't name because they're not public about their work with me. When I introduce hydrogen water, it seems to close that last five yards for them. It reduces the amount of pain that they wake up in in the morning, like knees, hips, shoulders, rotator cuff. I've seen firsthand what happens to people when I put them in a hydrogen bath.

Starting point is 00:37:02 I was getting ready to invest almost $100,000 in this electrolysis unit that made oxygen water. And I got this hydrogen generating machine and started to use it in my bathtub. And what I've seen get in and out of that bathtub is nothing short of miraculous. I don't even talk about it online because so many people would say you're a charlatan

Starting point is 00:37:23 because you can't put somebody in a hydrogen bath that has Crippled with arthritis and then they just walk out of your unit like they won the lottery, but I've seen it We have a couple of clinical trials using you know, I can't wait for those do you do it? Yeah, these h2 tabs, you know in bathing. Yeah, and anecdotally like As we talked about I love martial arts. I'm a lifetime martial artist and a buddy of mine was a former UFC fighter. And during one of his camps, he cracked his rip, right? Like, and he was a I gave him a ton of H2 tabs, right?

Starting point is 00:37:59 And he was taking daily baths and he was able to continue training every day and make his fight six weeks later when he'd cracked his rib. So really cool anecdotes like that. Well, I read this study that you published on, it was a lateral ankle injury and it was recovery after, you know, acute injury. And what I thought was fascinating was it reduced the inflammatory process, but didn't reduce the inflammation

Starting point is 00:38:26 And I know that sounds like an oxymoron But you know ice creates this vasoconstriction and what you were doing was comparing the rice method You know rest rest ice compressed elevate To the use of hydrogen and then hydrogen wasn't creating this constrictive effect Which was reducing the presence of inflammation. It was actually reducing the inflammatory response, but improving the circulation. So there's cool research on that, that, you know, cold exposure reduces blood plasma flow. Right.

Starting point is 00:38:57 So you're not getting healing to where you've injured. Right. Because the plasma has the platelets and the platelets carry the growth factors, which causes the healing. Hydrogen is regulating the inflammatory response but it's actually increasing blood plasmaphobe so this was an acute study and I wish we'd recruited more people I think it was only like 12 participants right and we were equivalent to Rice Protocol but in four very important markers we were had strong trends to be better after this single session than Rice Protocol.

Starting point is 00:39:28 I think the professor told me if we'd recruited like three more people, it would have been significantly better than Rice Protocol in lowering inflammation, in improving range of motion, in decreasing the visual analog score for pain. And there was another I can't... Oh, circumference. Yeah, I read another one of your studies. I've read a lot of your studies, by the way.

Starting point is 00:39:56 You know, that was looking at CTE and traumatic brain injury and immediately post-concussion using H2 tabs in the buccal fold, just putting it there and letting high amounts of hydrogen gas get into the body so that you can reduce the inflammatory response post concussion. I don't want to misquote it because it was your study, but I want to say that the way that concussions are evaluated, you use the standard concussion evaluation protocol. And there are a number of categories that qualify you for having a discussion, having a concussion.

Starting point is 00:40:31 And he had, I want to say 13 of 24. The next day that was cut in half. And then the severity score, how they rate the severity of these different measurements was also cut in half. In fact, it was cut by more than 70%. I remember reading it, I was so blown away that I was like, why not immediately after concussion? Are we not just giving hydrogen gas?

Starting point is 00:40:55 I think in the future we might. And we have a rat study that came out of the Stony Brook in New York for post-stroke recovery that found some synergy between hydrogen and minocycline, right, to improve the post-stroke recovery. And Stony Brook actually has a clinical trial underway on post-stroke recovery. Wow.

Starting point is 00:41:19 So there's a lot of cool research that's coming down the pipe here. As I mentioned, we've got over 20 human studies. I think we have five more that are either finishing up peer review or in press that are about to publish, and 15, 20 more that are in the planning stages underway. So the research isn't stopping. And actually, because of my devotion

Starting point is 00:41:40 to advancing the research on hydrogen therapy, the Dr. LeBaron from the Molecular Hydrogen Institute just invited me and I accepted to be a... The smartest guy I've ever spoken to about hydrogen. That guy will spin your beanie. If we're going to go into, say, the biochemistry of hydrogen, he is the top in the world. He understands, you know, the biochemistry of what hydrogen does in the top in the world. He understands the biochemistry of what hydrogen does

Starting point is 00:42:06 in the water better than anyone. Where the only thing I'd say that I have an advantage of him on is I have a better memory and I've read more papers than him. So. It's not a contest, sorry, Tyler. No, no, no, but I mean, he's exponentially more knowledgeable than me in the biochemistry, like exponentially, right?

Starting point is 00:42:25 So I'm taking a sliver here, but he's invited me to be the first chairman of the hydrogen research committee under the MHI. So it's a volunteer position. And basically what I'll be doing is I'll be working with the MHI and working with the public in industry. So Dr. LeBaron has hired another PhD, Dr. Grace Russell from the UK who's published a lot of research on hydrogen and I know her personally. She's gonna be helping research teams fill in NIH grants to get more funding for hydrogen research in the United States.

Starting point is 00:43:02 And I'm gonna be working with the public in industry to get more funding, to fund this research, in addition to supplement the NIH grants, and also to do outreach with the universities. Because that was one of the first things I did. I emailed, like I said, every first and corresponding author on every study that I could find. So we're going to be doing that and

Starting point is 00:43:25 saying, hey, this is where the evidence is. We can help these NIH grants. We can connect with industry to get future, like further funding. And then at the end of the day, once we get partners that have all agreed, Dr. LeBaron and I are going to review the protocols to make sure that the targets make sense, the methodology makes sense, the dosing makes sense. This is amazing. I mean, you know, first of all, I think it's an area that's vastly understudied. And I think it's also because of the trouble that industry has with, you know, patent protection and copyright protection, trademark protection around this, you know, element, which you've patented, but around this element and its impact on physiology. I want to bring this down to a practical standpoint like some actionable steps that people

Starting point is 00:44:12 that are watching this podcast might take away. How do they incorporate hydrogen gas into their daily routine and why would they want to do, and what can they expect in terms of absorption for their vitamins, minerals, amino acids, nutrients, gut health? I think we should touch on a few areas. We can touch on metabolic, the anti-aging aspect. You know, they estimate as high as 80% of Americans have some form of metabolic syndrome.

Starting point is 00:44:40 And we've reversed metabolic syndrome, you know, in a double-blind placebo controlled trial with 60 people over six months We were like I'm gonna link all these studies into the show notes I think it was 21 of 23 measured outcomes We had a significant clinical and statistically significant impact just by adding h2 tabs to it was three h2 tabs a day in 12 ounces of water and these people a middle-aged and older, with metabolic impairment. So that would cost you less than three bucks. Yeah.

Starting point is 00:45:07 So we reverse metabolic syndrome. We've shown weight loss in... Weight loss or improved body comp in, I think, it's six studies now. Now, how would the gas improve body composition or weight loss? So it could improve muscle mass by improving exercise recovery and energy output and everything like that. And we're actually finding some cool research. Some of this is not published yet, but I have an author on some of it. I'll touch on it briefly. But we're regulating appetite. So GLP-1.

Starting point is 00:45:37 GLP-1. So we do have a study in my center peer review right now that we regulated GLP-1. We had an effect and we have a clinical study, a 12-week, I think it was, NF40-40 participant double-blend placebo control in obese, metabolically impaired people, where we increased GLP-1. Right? In addition, we regulated ghrelin already in a clinical trial on overweight people.

Starting point is 00:46:02 And ghrelin is often called in pop culture like the the hunger hormone yeah but it actually has a lot of other roles it regulates our insulin response glucose homeostasis it has a lot of neuroprotective effects and what is poorly understood by the general population and even some physicians is that we actually want a peak in value of ghrelin even some physicians is that we actually want a peak and valley of ghrelin so we want ghrelin to be very high when we're on an empty stomach and crash to nothing right and in obese people it becomes impaired so there's no peaks and valleys it's just kind of in the middle all the time which is why they're always snacking they're never really hungry but hungry yeah and hungry but also they're

Starting point is 00:46:45 never really as hungry as a healthy person they're just right kind of hungry and snacky all the time so we actually show to restore that fasting peak and valley and we're working on some more research in there and we had another study where we improved modulated the brain chemistry involved in satiety. So there's some interesting stuff there. We are actually planning several other large clinical trials on metabolic outcomes with hydrogen. Some of them are currently enrolling, others are in the planning stages, set to kick off

Starting point is 00:47:22 in March. We're doing two of them in Serbia, one in Russia, and one in Australia right now. It's safe to say that right now molecular hydrogen, hydrogen gas has a positive effect on metabolism. And when we say metabolism, somewhere we throw that word around a lot. A metabolic syndrome is a complex

Starting point is 00:47:41 of a bunch of different variables that probably the most impactful would be insulin resistance. That is the root of a lot of evils, but also elevated triglycerides, hypertriglyceridemia, hypertension, abdominal fat, elevated cholesterol, and restoring homeostasis and restoring the the gut barrier that that single cell barrier that protects our inside world from our outside world you know if I had a penny for every ailment that was a byproduct of gut dysbiosis I would be a very wealthy man and I have in the last 10 years become very interested and fascinated by ways that we can properly heal and seal

Starting point is 00:48:28 and restore function to the gut, because the genesis of a lot of autoimmune, if not all autoimmune disease, it's the genesis of a lot of pro inflammatory conditions, not the least of which is elevated C-reactive protein. There's just so many downsides to not having a properly regulated gut. And very often, it's not just a matter of taking probiotics or even in some cases, eating, you know, switching your diet to eat the right foods.

Starting point is 00:48:57 Because if you wipe these bacteria out, you need to restore the gas that the bacteria that are now gone would have otherwise produced. That's very important because there are certain bacteria that can come back within a few days or a week. There's others that might take months or years and there's bacteria strains that we've identified by looking at like tribal peoples that we've discovered in the Amazon or South Asia where could be generational, right? They might never come back once we've lost them.

Starting point is 00:49:24 Now in that same study where we regulated ghrelin, we reduced calprotectin, so a marker of inflammation in the stomach, and we improved a couple of short-chain fatty acids, propionic and butyric acid. Oh, wow. Okay. So there's some definite gut links, and actually hydrogen water uniquely gets into the gut a lot better than inhalation, obviously, it's going to your lungs. and actually hydrogen water uniquely gets into the gut

Starting point is 00:49:45 a lot better than inhalation, obviously, is going to your lungs. So that's why I was mentioning hydrogen water and hydrogen inhalation have different pharmacokinetics. They elevate different tissues in different capacities. So hydrogen water interacts with the gut better. It gets to the liver at a higher concentration in some of the internal organs,

Starting point is 00:50:03 which is why it's perhaps better for a lot of these metabolic conditions. Whereas inhalation, it's getting obviously to your lungs better, it's getting to your muscles at a higher amount than drinking hydrogen water. So a lot of musculoskeletal issues, maybe inhalation will be better for athletes, maybe you want to do both. And it's getting, both are getting to the brain, inhalation a little bit higher than hydrogen water, but hydrogen water also has the gut brain connection. And it's getting both are getting to the brain inhalation a little bit higher than hydrogen

Starting point is 00:50:25 water. But hydrogen water also has the gut brain connection. It's improving your gut. So it's improving your brain. So I think the future we're going to be doing several modalities of hydrogen therapy. People are going to be doing drinking high concentration hydrogen water doing inhalation in a proper and safe way bathing in hydrogen water, doing inhalation in a proper and safe way, bathing in hydrogen water. You know, there's hydrogen saline, like IVs, right, for purposes in the hospital. So, you know, I'm interested in about how could somebody incorporate these H2 tabs,

Starting point is 00:50:55 which is the elemental magnesium that effervesces into hydrogen gas. How does someone that's watching this podcast that's interested in getting hydrogen gas into their daily routine, maybe doesn't have the money for, you know, a hydrogen bottle, you know, what's the dosage? How do they take it? So our studies range from one to well, five tablets a day, but most of them one to three tablets a day and various volumes of water. I'm taking like five to eight. I take five personally, but I've got a lot of damage. Yeah, so first thing on an empty stomach is important. So the right, the perfect volume of water is different for every person

Starting point is 00:51:30 because it's the volume that you can chug, drink rapidly. Right, at a room temperature. So because hydrogen is this stress, like H2 is this stress like exercise, you don't wanna be sipping on it all day long. Right. That would be like you want to get the dosage. You want a high dose intermittently because you want the stress and the. So let's say 750 milliliters like a, you know, Mountain Valley spring water.

Starting point is 00:51:57 Yeah, you can drop a couple of tablets in there. I personally drink to effervesce and then you want. So exactly. Exactly. I do a liter, right? But most people can't chug a liter. So most of our research on aphids uses half a liter, or 16.8 ounces. Our research on metabolic paired middle-aged people

Starting point is 00:52:15 usually uses about 12 ounces, 333 times a day. And on the elderly, we used a cup. So we used 250 milliliters, or eight ounces because the point is any amount helps. But for somebody to say, OK, I'm going to put this into my daily routine. I'm going to take a room temperature glass bottle of water, drop a tablet or two in it and then walk it as fast as you can. And it's really important. You want to drink it on an empty stomach.

Starting point is 00:52:41 Right. So a lot of companies in hydrogen water don't actually talk about this because they don't understand it very well. But one, say you are producing a bit of hydrogen from consuming fiber, you don't want to be competing with that. Right? Right? You want that separately. But two, one of my patents involves I've turned hydrogen water and various fibers into dense foams and gels. It stabilizes. So if you eat it at a time where you've just had some fiber, you might not be getting rapid uptake into your system, which can affect the therapeutic value. So what we're learning right now in the hydrogen research, we haven't found a plateau yet.

Starting point is 00:53:21 Right? For most indications. So some indications we need vastly higher amounts of hydrogen that then we can reasonably, reasonably. Tense exercise, severe metabolic syndrome, liver inflammation. For instance, liver health, we need 10 times more exercise to start seeing an effect. So dose and concentration is critically important. You wanna get the dosing right

Starting point is 00:53:44 to have a better effect on the body. But for the average person that's listening to this podcast, it says I'm sold one to three times a day. One to three times a day. One to three times a day. The most water that you can comfortably chug down in one to three gulps within 15 to 30 seconds and on an empty stomach.

Starting point is 00:54:02 Not empty stomach. So sometimes I like is in the morning or right before you exercise. Yeah, you know, that's what I do or middle middle of the afternoon or right before dinner. Like you can eat five ten minutes after you drink the hydrogen water. Just don't drink it after you eat. Yeah. And you know what I find is that if I do the hydrogen first, I really don't want caffeine. I'm just, you know, I'm more wide awake,

Starting point is 00:54:28 more focused, more clear. And then I mix it with an amino acid product, you know, it's just essential amino acids. And then I just go in and hit the gym. And I'm always looking for ways that we can kind of bio-stack things, take something like, you know, the fluid that's going to hydrate you and make it anti-inflammatory by lowering its ORP, which it clearly does.

Starting point is 00:54:50 But then also there must be some effect on on the lactate threshold, because I noticed that if I do what I've affectionately called hydrogen bomb, I'll put five of these in a, know in about 750 ml's and when it effervesces whack it back I can absolutely tell that my workouts can be more intense with less muscle burn. A hundred percent and actually there's a systematic review and meta analysis showing an anti-fatigue effect with hydrogen water and we have a couple of really cool studies that I know I briefly told you about

Starting point is 00:55:25 that are in press right now on the H2 tabs, right? Showing remarkable benefits. So in the first, and they were in completely different study populations. So the first one was a shorter-term study. I think it was four weeks. It was in Olympic athletes, and it was done in Russia. And they were taking two tablets in 16.8 ounces or 500 milliliters a day,

Starting point is 00:55:48 you know, before and after training. And we improved body composition in these Olympic athletes. Even Olympic athletes, huh? Which was incredible. But we also improved their peak torque on leg extension at the end of the trial. And more significantly after they'd exercised and warmed up showing the anti-fatigue effect. So they took it during exercise? Right

Starting point is 00:56:10 before and right after. Right before and right after. And we have another trial in the opposite study population and this was a 50 plus group and I was actually just, I was one of the authors on both of these but I was just in Milan, Italy at ESPIN at a conference presenting this study you know with the corresponding author and so these 50 plus people who had no adult experience with exercise they were very out of shape so much so that they were starting doctor guided exercise protocols to try and turn their lives around. There's a huge deconditioned population right now. Exactly.

Starting point is 00:56:49 And this was off memory, I think it was six weeks, six or eight weeks. I can't quite remember, but it was again, double blind placebo controlled. And in the placebo group, we actually saw some very concerning things. They were borderline rhabdomyolysis. So the stress from the exercise dysregulated their cortisol response. It increased myoglobin by 1100%, right? So 11 times, it increased creatine kinase by like seven times, 700%.

Starting point is 00:57:21 They had serious damage. That's where they get to kidney issues with Rabdo. Exactly. Oh and with the hydrogen group and we actually we saw this too in the Olympians it didn't raise the creatine kinase at all. No significant rise. So we had no significant rise in creatine kinase or myoglobin. We regulated the cortisol response. We improved DHEA and free testosterone. Wow. And we improved sleep outcomes specifically in females. So we're actually seeing a potential gender response. My female audience is gonna love you man. There's a few studies now both in press and

Starting point is 00:57:57 one published where we had stronger results in females and males. Yeah. So it could be mediated by estrogen. We're still trying to figure this out. Yeah. Well, Alex, I want to follow this research that you're doing. I'm going to put links to all of the study notes to all of the research you published so far and links to other research on hydrogen gas and the H2 tabs, this elemental magnesium. I'll even put some information on how people can find the H2 tabs if they're interested in adding these what I like is That now you know under a dollar a day for people to incorporate hydrogen gas into their into their lifestyle instead of you know Several hundred dollars and to consistent dose Yeah, and it consists of all machines start breaking down over time, but the tablets you're getting this high dose every time

Starting point is 00:58:41 Yeah, right unless you have a lab to test the machine, you don't know when it starts to deteriorate. Right. But those tablets, you're getting a safe, consistent dose every time. And in fact, I'd love to even do another podcast on women's health, because I've noticed again, anecdotally, when my wife has really bad menstrual cramps, that it seems to mitigate the intensity of those cramps, too.

Starting point is 00:59:03 So I'd love to go down the rabbit hole with you on that. We're diving deeper. Like, we actually have a few studies underway that are separating gender to look deeper into these gender-based responses. And we're starting, I've just signed off on the protocol, we're starting the very first responder study on on hydrogen, you know looking at People's endogenous breath hydrogen production over some time to establish the difference in effect of people with

Starting point is 00:59:34 Low breath hydrogen versus high breath hydrogen. So we can really start narrowing in on the research. That's amazing, man Well, I end every podcast by asking all my guests the same question and there's no right or wrong answer to this But it is what does it mean to you to be an ultimate human? I think just constantly the pursuit to improve right? Not perfection, right? It's just growing and learning and I think that that a philosophy behind and learning. And I think that a philosophy behind maintaining is accepting that you're going to respond to things after it's broken.

Starting point is 01:00:09 That's what it implies. So the only way we can stay satisfied is by always trying to move forward. So my philosophy in life is always forward. And forward in as many ways as you can, trying to improve your health, trying to improve your purpose, your business, your family life, right? Everything, just always be trying to make small improvements.

Starting point is 01:00:34 Most people want to say with money, go to bed poor and wake up rich without having to do any work. And, you know, it's an age-old saying, but Rome wasn't built in a day. And the only way we can continue moving forward and achieve what we dream to achieve is by taking one step at a time. One small improvement.

Starting point is 01:00:54 Yeah, one small improvement. Man, I really appreciate you coming on. Guys, I hope that this has given you the depth that you need to maybe incorporate hydrogen gas into your daily routine. It's one of those I think must have biohacks that's affordable for the masses. I'm going to stay very close to the research on hydrogen gas, hydrogen water, hydrogen inhalation because I'm absolutely fascinated by it. I will link all of Alex's studies in the study notes below as well

Starting point is 01:01:20 as a link to some other studies that are not Alex's but will give you further background if you really want to go down the hydrogen rabbit hole. And as always, till next time, that's just science.

The Ultimate Human with Gary Brecka - 150. Alex Tarnova: Unlocking Longevity with Hydrogen Water - Anti-Aging, Increased Energy & Reducing Inflammation

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