The Uneducated PT Podcast - #21 Claire Dunn - A Runners Mindset

Episode Date: March 15, 2024

In this episode we speak to Claire Dunn about all things running, body image and why you would or wouldn't pick up running.

Hello and welcome to the uneducated PT podcast with me, your host, Carlo Rourke. The goal of this podcast is to bring on interest and knowledgeable people from all walks of life, learn a little something from each conversation. And for you, the listener, just learn something from each episode. So don't forget to subscribe to the channel, press the box below, show some support, and I'll see you on the next episode. So yeah, so I'm from Aberdeen, which is North East Scotland. It's basically freezing all the time up there.

and I'm a coach and a nutritionist and a runner and a mum and all these other labels that we put on ourselves and what do I do? I work with runners because naturally as a runner we're just subtract runners. It's just what happened. And I really work with runners specifically, the ones that want to perform their best and enjoy their life, but they struggle to maintain like a kind of well-balanced diet. They tend to feel guilty if they go off track, off track of anything really, to be fair. And massively overly self-critical and that confidence in themselves, especially in their running abilities.

and I help them with that really. What else do you want me to say anything else about me? No, don't worry. I don't worry. I've plenty of questions to ask you. By the way, do you know Roy Ritchie? Yeah, so he's one of my really good friends. And Roy, yeah, so he helped massively help me

when I first got into the industry. And actually, we worked together before when we were both in the oil industry. So it's like so weird. but yeah we're very good friends yeah because he was on the program two weeks ago and i just i just got the link there between the aberdean as well um okay and so how long have you been working in the industry um so it's seven years that i've been in the industry as such um but it's been five year or coming up to five years that i've had my business so started off um teaching fitness classes when my oldest daughter was really little.

And it was just like a few classes here and there. And then as she got a little bit older, I was like, do you know what? I'm going to put my big girl pants on. And I'm just going to get out my own way. And I'm just going to go for it. And yeah, that's what's the link between you coach and runners and then field and body images?

That's something that obviously you've been a runner your whole life, have you? So I did run at school but nothing major and then you know became a teenager and drank and got up to all sorts. And so it's probably about 19 years that I've been consistently running. Yeah. And then what about and then what about the relationship with field and body image? How does that tie into it? So when I first started in the industry like most people, I didn't really, I don't really know what I was doing. I was just wanted to help people.

Do you know what I mean? I just was like, I just want to help people. I'm into fitness. It just made sense at the time. I actually wanted to be a PT way before I did it, but I was living in London and I just didn't really know how much money I was going to earn and all that kind of usual stuff that holds you back.

But the more, the more kind of started to like, my eyes were open to a lot of things. I started to become aware of relationships. with food and I actually started to think, oh, I actually need to work on my relationship with food. So I was like not, I wasn't really aware of anything like that before. Like I never knew, I never knew anything about like relationship with food, body image, and exercise dependency, all these things. And I was like seeing all these red flags. I hate saying these red flags, but I was seeing all these things to me. And I was thinking, oh my God, I'm, I actually was

scared that I was just going to fuck up everybody. I was like, oh man, I am going to, I haven't got my own shit together. I said, I need to go and sort myself out. And it just ended up, I opened up one box and it just felt like a never-ending thing that I was unpacked. I was like, oh my God, so it's, so it's not this. So does that mean it's this? And I was like, I just went, it went on and on. I went on quite a journey as such. And then, by doing that I was like seeing a lot of common themes that were coming up in my clients

that even though I wasn't working with them on stuff like that because I wasn't in a first of all I wasn't educated enough to help other people of it and I'm sorting my own shit out but I could just see things were common themes and I was like I need to sort my own shit and I need to educate myself

because my journey is just me it's just one person and then I need to figure out what all this stuff is and I just got, I'm very curious person which gets me in trouble sometimes and I'm like,

oh, what's this? So before I know it, I'm knee deep in like six programs about something that it's got actually I don't want to do it. But yeah, so that's how it all kind of evolved

and then the more I started working with people, the more I guess braver I was about starting to talk about it and now I'm just like this year I'm I just like fuck it right I'm going all in and I'm just this is what I do and I know that this is what I can help people with yeah I think I I would probably relate to that coming from a similar situation where I think I started in the industry about eight years ago and I was all about okay oh yeah I'm going to help you to lose weight I'm going to help you to lose body fat calorie deficit calorie deficit calorie deficit and then obviously

the more experienced I got and the more I started to work with more and more people, then I started to realize, well, well, this common team keeps coming up and this keeps coming up. And then you start to realize that, well, I mean, weight loss is a part of it, but it's only the crux of what are the real issues with most people. It can be, can it be difficult for you with your clients to find that relationship or that balance between, you know, helping them improve the relationship with food, improving their body image, but also giving them what they want, which might be like body composition changes or so on and so forth. Yeah.

I think majority of my clients aren't necessarily looking for body composition changes. What are they looking for? Performance. Yeah. Even though they maybe not say that, I'm just going to say that. They're saying they want to become a better runner. But they wouldn't say I want a performance. They wouldn't say I've got performance.

performance school, but it is a performance school. But I feel like they just they want to be faster, fitter, that kind of thing. It's probably them in their agenda. That's what they want. So can I ask you a question then because sometimes a lot of the ways that I try to help people improve their body image is to actually do the opposite of what your clients probably come into. It's like they come in with an aesthetical and it's trying to convince them that, you know, an aesthetic goal, although like that's fine, you can have whatever goals you want, but maybe focus some of your areas on a performance-based goal and focusing on what your body can do versus, you know, what your body looks like. But do you find that a lot of the runners that come in,

to work with you who are coming in for a performance-based goal that they suffer with body image issues? Yeah. And I would say they're maybe not fully aware. they're not, they, I say they don't come in with a body composition. They do because they do say, I want to lose weight, I want to sort my diet or get more control around my diet. So they do, but they don't. It's quite, it can be quite complex because actually when we start, if we were to start with a fat loss goal or something,

then it very quickly turns out to be, no, that's not what I'm wanting to do. and it brings up a lot of more of the that it brings up more of a feeling of out of control around food and stuff like that so they they kind of like oh no they switch it they'll say like no I don't I don't actually want that I just want to like learn how it fuel my running

yeah and so I think they know that there's a problem with they know that there's a not able to maintain a diet that it's very on or off we're very erratic, but they're not aware of what actually is going on. That makes sense. Just switching from essentially body image and relationship food and that for the time being, just because I have a lot of clients on the program here. And there is a couple of them who have just either entered like a 10-kilometer run for

the first time or their first half marathon and stuff like that. So do you have any tips or advice for anyone who's just starting off their running journey? maybe they've never ran a race before or they're literally just, you know, at the very beginning of starting to run. Yeah. I would say, just take it easy. Like, you don't need to be absolutely battering yourself and every single run and breathing out your arms.

That's not where running is. Save that for when, like, you're doing like an actual interval session. So you don't even doing that to yourself. I'd be saying that because you're not going to enjoy it. Like, nobody enjoys that. unless you're like I mean there might there will be somebody that enjoys that but I just think it's try and make it enjoyable you know

go go to places you want to go try not put the pressure on yourself so much and also I would say try not fix it on the numbers because focusing on like the outcome you just it's it's kind of backwards if you focus on turning up as consistent as you can. All those numbers will happen in due course. But yeah, I think we put a lot of pressure

on ourselves to be like hitting these numbers. We should be these targets. We should be hitting this and we should be doing X, Y, Z that we take the enjoyment away from like the, from just the enjoyment of actually like getting out the house, getting some fresh here, maybe escaping from our kids for a little while, whatever it is that you're wanting to run away from. You know, it's just, you know and and yeah definitely just you don't need to be breathing out your arse like that yeah i think the when i've enjoyed running the most is when i'm doing it literally just to okay if i've been on the desk all day it's like oh i just need to get out and get some fresh air and that's when it's most enjoyable i think when i started it was just going from zero to a hundred and trying to run as fast as you can and not

even understanding what what pacing was or or anything like that it was just like get there get there get there done as quick as you can. Yeah, like, I need to get this over and done with, like, pronto. It's like, no, you're making it really hard for yourself. Do you think that people do that because they have an insecurity that, oh, you know, I won't be doing this in a fast enough time or I won't be actually, you know, consistently jog and I might have to jog, walk,

jog, walk, and they don't think that that counts. Yeah, of course. And, I mean, I'll just say that right now, I walk all time. I'm 19 years of running. I still walk. I love a walk. There's nothing wrong with that, right?

There's nothing wrong with that. And it's, yeah, we can get caught up and what we perceive is a good runner. Or we've maybe got people who work with and they say, oh, I do a 5K in, whatever amazing time that they do it in or whatever. but you don't know anything about their history in running as well as sometimes to think about is got no idea you know some people are just naturally like fast and some people are better

at just running longer we all have our own thing that we can take from running so it's it's very individual just trying to just keep the blinkers on and about other people's numbers and yeah and if you do run walk you still are a runner i'm just going to say that right now if you run walk you're still a runner and and other than other than the actual uh consistency of of running itself do you have any other advice that would help um in terms of you know helping them to you know improve as much as possible for a race day do strength work yeah do you play metrics these are all part of a runner's training like it's part of it. Like there's a lot of, like,

there's a trend at the moment. It's like high hybrid training or something. That's a good. That's going to, yeah. And I'm like, no, it's just part of a running training, like that you do your strength training. And it doesn't need to be,

you know, it doesn't need to be like you need to be in the gym four days a week or anything like excessive, but just adding in some strength training and to just keep you, you want to, if you think about it, like running is high impact.

Yeah. And you want to be looking after your body and keeping it nice and strong so that you, you can't take away the fact that you might get injured, but you want to be reducing the likelihoods of injury as much as you can. And I guess if you're starting out new, it's it, and you're trying to juggle, like, which, which one you like as well. Like, don't overreact. complicated. If you don't want to add the strength training right now and you're not picking up

injuries, you know, you mean, you could take that bit of advice out. But if you want, if you do enjoy strength training or you are prone to injuries, get that in. So yeah. What advice would you, what, what advice, even from for myself in general in terms of program for clients, what would your advice be in terms of like a good balance of running to strength training? Just doing, yeah, go ahead. Lots of single leg work. Because you're, you are, it's a single, you know, your own single leg.

And so, yeah, lots of single leg and core work, side to side stuff. A lot of people like the lateral movements. And that's something that generally, if people are Googling something online, like for strength trainer or whatever, that's it, that'll be the one. are probably most likely missed out.

So because you are kind of move, even though you are moving forwards, you are moving around as side to side as well. And so you want to be keeping your hips nice and strong, core nice and strong, handstrings, glutes. Glutes are a big one, are glutes, single leg. And some upper body as well.

But I would be saying only a small proportion of your upper body. Unless you absolutely love being, you know, unless you love doing upper body. But if you're like time poor, everyone's in no, then you're, you know,

put your focus where it needs to go. Yeah, I'd say, because a lot of the people on this program, obviously they're trying to implement that they're running as well as, you know, full-time job looking after the kids,

whatever it is. So I suppose the amount of total volume throughout the week is going to be important and making sure that they're not kind of overtrain and then that, you know, just just a little bit every week is going to be more than enough. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. If you're time poor, you know, something is better than nothing. You don't need to be in the gym four days a week to stay strong to be a runner. Do you find because it's runners that come to you, so they're already essentially training and

already enjoy exercise that they have a tendency to to overtrain? Oh, yeah. Yeah, that's our their speciality. Yeah, overtraining is super common in runners, especially in the early stages. Like, I mean, if I look at my training now compared to before, I like do half of the training I did.

I was absolutely trashed all the time. Probably get better results now as well. Yeah, I do. I'm absolutely smashing it. And it's like, oh my God, I wasted all that time doing that when I couldn't do another. things. But yeah, it's a super common thing. And I think it's for different, for different reasons behind it. You know, we all have different motivators for why we're doing these things that are unhelpful.

And sometimes it's just like they just think that they have to be doing that volume because that's all they've ever done. And then sometimes it's a little bit more darker reasons why they're overtraining. So it's just trying to understand why you're doing it. Yeah, I think that second reason where, you know, people are over-training and are running themselves into the ground because, you know, lack of self-worth or self-esteem and like that probably correlates to the body image issue that you work with with your clients. Yeah.

Yeah, definitely. Like, I mean, overtraining, if you're overtraining, for example, if you're needing, for example, if you're needing to burn calories, like if you're running specifically to burn off calories because you've overate something and you feel like it's coming from guilt, right? It's driven from guilt or shame or anything negatively. Then it's understanding why. Why? So the way I kind of like think about it is like taking it back to like the thinking.

Like you've got this behavior and you've got this feeling. But like where is it all coming from? It's kind of like taking a step back. and figuring it out, which is, it's not a great journey. But understanding it can really help you to understand why you're doing the things that are actually preventing you from doing, getting the outcome that you want. Yeah. Like the actions and behaviours can be exactly the same from two people.

Two people go out for a run. But the perception or the mindset behind it is completely different. Someone's going out for a run because they enjoy exercise. they enjoyed that it de-stresses them from a long day's work and it actually fills up their cup versus someone going out for a run because they're trying to run themselves into the ground because they hate how they look and they want to change from a place of guilt and shame like both going out to do a 5k but the the impend behind it is completely different yeah and it's so important to understand the difference um in that and

yeah and when you do when you do start to understand it all. It can be, it, it brings back your power in a way that you're trying to actually gain because you're like, oh, I'm trying to stay in control of all of this, but you're actually not in control. And then when you understand what's going on, it gives you back that. I think that's what, that's how I can see it. Well, you need to, you need to create that awareness first before you can make them changes, don't you? And like, that's the whole thing. It's like, when everyone's trying to go on a on a quick fix whether they're trying to do like a four week you know shred or something like that it's like they're they're not really understanding what

the actual problem is because the actual problems or issues are internal and that that journey takes a lot longer than you know trying to lose 5k as quick as you can yeah yeah and it when you like understand that like i remember like when i was having to to look back at all the things that I've done. I'm thinking, God, it's taking me all this time to get here. I could have spent like this pretty rough time doing this. But that's also, that's also a good reminder for everyone on the program. Like, let's say they feel like they're not making the results that they want yet

or they feel like it's taking them longer than it's supposed to in order to get the result. It's that like it's supposed to take this long and it's supposed, you're supposed to make mistakes and feel frustrated. and because you can't you can't learn anything if you just get the results straight away if you just flick your fingers and you are where you want to be. Oh, I mean,

if it was as simple as that, like, yeah, it's not, it's not reality. I just wanted, before I jump in and let the clients ask some questions if they want to ask, of course, I just wanted to go through some of my favourite quotes that you said

and get you to kind of dissect them a little bit. So one thing, I read you say was self-care isn't selfish. What do you mean by that? Well, I think that there's a lot of selfless people, people pleasers who are very kind of people. However, they are not taking care of their own basic needs as a human. Like we're talking basic, going to bed, eating, drinking, moving your body. And we, yeah, we feel like selfish or bad or anything negative if we even like look after ourselves because we're so busy making sure that everybody else is okay.

And the way that I see this is like self-care is like it's kind of like parenting yourself. It is knowing that you are worth taking care of. And I wish that more people didn't feel guilty about taking care of themselves. So yeah, that's what I meant by that. Yeah. And I think a lot of the, a lot of the group are moms and stuff like that. And they're probably the biggest guilty parties in terms of doing that.

And I think that's a really good way to frame it is like to parent yourself because, you know, they'd make sure that the kids go to bed on time. They'd make sure that they'd have breakfast. They'd make sure that they do, you know, X, Y, and Z. but then when it comes to themselves, now I'll skip breakfast, now I'll stay up and scroll on my phone for a couple more hours, now I'll go to bed a little bit later, and then that has a knock-on effect for the next day,

and then you're literally running off steam. Yeah, and it is hard, and it is hard as a mom, and there's just a million things are going at a million speeds, and you're trying to juggle everything, and it's, it is difficult, like it's easy to say it, and it is difficult. You know, I catch myself sometimes, too and it's I really have to try and make an effort saying no that person can wait for that thing

because I have to go to bed because if I don't go to bed that's tomorrow totally fucked and you know we'll be lucky if we're all fed tomorrow morning if I don't do it so it is just it's hard it is it's hard thing to do and but it's it's that constant reminder and the way that I say like parent yourself is it's my own personal reminder to myself it's the thing I say like would you do that which, you know, I have to do what I'm doing for others to me because we're all worth it. Yeah. And it is, because it is them little small things that you will just let bypass throughout the day, like, like an example of, of me encouraging everyone on this group to just eat breakfast, just have something that's going to keep you satiated throughout the day.

And like, it's something that seems so small and basic and simple advice that it doesn't seem like it's important, but like it's, it can be everything. yeah and like oh if i don't if i don't get the breakfast my breakfast nailed at that it's like the day is just like it's not it's not going good um but yeah it's all it's all them little things isn't it even like just going to bed an hour earlier even though you know you you you want to stay up and watch a bit of tell you because you want to de-stress or whatever even though you'd probably have more energy the next day if you went to bed a little bit earlier or if you stayed hydrated and all these little small things that compound over the day.

Yeah, yeah, definitely. It all adds up. I mean, it's got to the stage with my bedtime routine being super like, I'm on it, that now my friends actually take the piss if they message me. Like, I go to bed at the same time pretty much every night. And if they message me after, like, oh, we'll get a reply because it's like, no, you won't. You know how I roll.

That's when I'm feeling. Lights out. No. Why are you up? You should be able to. what you're a bed too. Well that like when people hear about self-care they hear about like having a fucking bubble bat or whatever but it really is it's like doing the training session that's going to make you feel better after you know eating the meal and going to bed early all them things that

like it's just your responsibility to you. Yeah like self-care like is your basic needs to me like bubble bath is not going to cut it if I've if I've had like a stressful day with kids work and all that stuff. I need my bed. A bubble bath. But I do like a bubble bath. You know, it's nice as well. But I'm not doing some bubble bats. I'm just saying you're probably getting the diet on order first. Another one that you said, so your training diet are there to enhance your life not to make it a misery to the point that you're not functioning. What do you mean by that? Um, I mean that is, so I'm an endurance runner and there is points where in your training that you are taking yourself to this kind of like I call it an imaginary line that you're taking it to the line but you're going to be

pushing a little bit over the line but you don't want to be like shooting way across that you're like a dead person walking around in the world it's it's understanding that there's certain points where you just have to realize that it's going to be taking you away from your family from your job like your brain capacity for your job and like having a call with your mates if you're like unable to like function properly because you're eating super low calories and you're exercising exhausted

it's not it's not helpful it's it's actually hindering you in thriving in in life it's not health seeking it's gone beyond health seeking yeah you're missing the forest for the trees because the reason you started this was because you wanted to be healthier and happier but now you're miserable and feel like shape because you're underfed and overtrained. Yeah and that is a common

like I would say that that is a common thing for when it's like and they don't it's maybe it's a thing that you don't really recognize when you're in it as well like I've got no energy I've got shit chat and zero sex drive. I just can't be arse going out to meet anybody and you just think you're just you're just tired but actually it's you're over training and you're under eating and you need to just get a bit of a life back. There's more to life than eating as little as possible and training as much as possible. Yeah. And I think that's, like you said, it's very hard to have that perspective when it's you

and you're in an emotional state of it being something that you want. And that's whether it's like you having a coach or you've been able to journal about or just create some sort of perspective around what's actually going on. It can be really difficult for people and that's how they end up. in these situations. It is really difficult, especially if you have a performance goal. And I see this more so in like endurance, like long endurance stuff. Like, which I don't tend to work too much with like ultra lot.

There's a couple. But the thing I say to myself is like my daily journaling, check yourself before you wreck yourself. It's like a daily, because I can, I am very prone to missing. those signs in myself because I am like I am after this goal and I'm going to do this thing and I am like shooting for this thing that I'm like oh oh what I've totally burnt myself out so I have to I think it's just that self-awareness if you're prone to if you're prone to that is putting in some kind of system that is going to catch that as soon as possible so that you can

see all the the signs and you can make some choice. that's going to pull you out of that. It's that balance between like self-development and self-destruction. It's like, okay, you want to achieve this goal and it's really important to you, but like are you going to destroy yourself in the process of it? No. I mean, yeah, no, it's not worth it if it's going to be taking you away from, especially like if you're a mom and you've got your kids and yeah.

And maybe that's why it was really bad before I was. Yeah. Well, speaking of you before, I wanted to go through this one, much as well. So for years I told myself I didn't have a runner's body. Even at my slimest, I told myself I needed to be smaller to be better. Do you find that that's something that you have to coach out of a lot of clients is that like they value their self worth by how thin they are or how light they are in the scales? Yeah. And I think that is as runners, you know, if you look at like professional athletes, they're a jet.

generally speaking very lean. You know, there is an aspect of performance and to do with our body fat, composition, all that kind of stuff. And I think if you've maybe perhaps come into running from, and with a lot of disordered eating behaviours or thinking or body image, then it heightens that thing of like,

well, if I'm, I need to be as slim as possible to be good at this. and it's not always helpful. No. Another one that probably ties into that because a lot of people who probably fall for this and I don't know if you remember even saying this which you said this on a podcast that I found

because I'm very good at my research. You go the healthier option. No, it's okay. You got a healthier option for some people is choosing the more calorie dense option. Do you find that when clients are kind of going on some sort of like a weight loss or a fat loss or need that they can get tricked into thinking that the healthier option is always the low calorie option because, you know, if they're lighter

or if they lose weight, then, you know, they're healthier. They're a better person, etc., etc. Yeah. And I think, yeah, because we've maybe grown up around the lower calories, like lower calorie bars and stuff like that, that's healthier. That's a healthier option. But actually, it's not always. I actually think for especially like more like half marathon marathon, you actually need to be eating more calorie dense foods because not being funny, that'd be a lot of freaking chicken and rice and stuff to try and get pack in some calories. Like you need to be eating a bit more calorie dense foods. And then if you have, have that perception that that is unhealthy, it's going to be quite tricky to keep to maintain

your calories. God, when did I say that? I'm curious. I think it was, I think it was. I'd be to stand by that. Yeah, yeah. Well, I agree with it. So I must have said it. I'm like that also even like ties into even just your enjoyment of life. Like if you're going out for a meal with your family or your friends and you know, you want the pasta Carbara, but that's, you know, more calories there's. you know, the chicken and rice and broccoli, like, like, first of all, it's not necessary not to have it. Like, you can still have that plus see the results you want. But second, like, it takes all the enjoyment out of what you're doing and why you're doing it. Yeah, definitely.

And I think it's, it is difficult to break these thinking patterns and these things, these beliefs that you've had for so long. But once you do and allow some flexibility in, it's so bloody free freeing. Like you can go for a meal. You could go and have that carbonara with your friends and actually be able to like listen to what they're saying instead of thinking, oh fuck this diet right up.

You know, you're more present. That's living. That's thriving. Yeah. And that's why that's what, well, I know for everyone in this program anyway because from talking to each, every single one of them,

The whole reason they joined this program is because they wanted a better quality of life. They wanted to enjoy nights out or dinners out and be more present and not feel insecure and not be kind of wrapped up in their head. And like if you're going out and you're still wrapped up in your head and what the low calorie option is because you want to lose weight, then again, you've missed the forest for the trees. Yeah. Yeah. Definitely. I think giving yourself unconditional permission to you. at the first at the start feels like absolutely no fucking way can i do that you don't trust yourself i like how can i'm going to absolutely like there's going to be absolutely no food around and then you're like you start to to do it you start to to do it and you learn how to trust yourself you learn how to trust food and you and everything and it just becomes

much more freeing. I mean, I definitely say like you still get these unhelpful thoughts every now and again. They do still come, but it's understanding that if you have the tools in place to support you in ways, then you will keep going with it all. And I think that's a misconception that people make as well thinking that, okay, it's like, oh, my relationship with field is fixed or, you know, my body image is fixed or like it's not an off or on switch. It's like, even if you have done the work, like you're still going to have them days. Oh, yeah. I, I call it, well, it's my inner critic.

A nameer, I'd be like, Nancy, what is it here after today? I don't really know if I like your chat today. I just have these little conversations with her. And I'm just like, what is it you're needing for me today? Because I'm just not up for this. Shit. Both off, Nancy. Yeah, fuck off.

Let me just eat this biscuit with my tea. What we're going to do with now is we're going to open up the floor and let a few clients ask some questions if they want to. Lisa, as an overtrainer yourself, do you want to ask a question? Sorry, that was a little bit of a dick. I'm only joking. No, I actually don't have a question. I just have, I'm just really interested about your gunning style

and how you're able to feel yourself. because I have like I love hate relationship with winning I actually love doing it but the thoughts of actually going out and doing the running I'm like I don't want to go but I know I'm going to enjoy it but it's just how do you fuel yourself for winning like I just don't know what food

because I remember I went for a big long run and I felt so sick I was cramping up my stomach was on cramps and I was like I need to stop now and just walking the rest of it like what's the best food before I went but do you eat before we're not like yeah well so i i do endurance events so i actually eat when

i'm running i saw solid food that's like you know not the advice that i would give um but i would say it would be looking at what you actually are eating before you're going running like if you're eating like loads of um potentially like high fiber high fat protein like if there's if there's lots of that like strip not long before you go out for a run that can sometimes upset your tummy um carb carbs is really your friend and simple kind of carbs as well like even so like a crumpet a bagel white um bread you know because that can be much more easier for your stomach to digest um it does take a little bit of adjustment as well like I think so what kind distance do you do? I do just like 5k but then I also like I go to the gym and then we'd all just

go out and do 5k straight after the gym and the gym is like it's a high intense like string training and we're kind of all training for the high rocks in November I think it is and so all doing the heavy lifting the heavy push and then straight out to do the run so it's probably not ideal but I know for the high rocks you kind of have to do it. like that. So what do you have, do you have anything to eat before? The last time

thought I felt really unwell, I know I shouldn't have had, but I had like a big chicken, like chicken, lice and veg. And then I went out and I was like, okay, I'm going to be sick along this one. Yeah, yeah, that might be a bit much. So like something, even like a banana, a banana, a bagel, a crumpet,

something super simple. pull and yeah definitely not yeah yeah you're gonna be so you're gonna feel a bit sick and and and try trial around with it as well try different things start small and yeah stick to one thing at a time so those little like pre-workout shots i was like this i need to go i need to find a album like it was actually gross i was like it just went straight through me like those little shots yeah no i wouldn't yeah probably probably wouldn't advise that either. Yeah. So yeah, just something nice and simple, like a banana, trumpet, fagal.

Thank you. No worries, that's fine. I hope that helps because there's nothing more. Thank you. Yeah. And yeah, you might find that that is going to be the answer that it'll make you feel like you're looking forward to doing it because you're not dreading, feeling like that. Yeah. Yeah.

Thank you. And also, if you're going to do high rocks or something, something you'll probably have a little bit of nerves beforehand. Anyway, so you probably won't even feel hungry enough to have a big meal like that. I always just have something like Coca-pops or something before I go do a training session. Yeah.

Lucy, sorry, Lisa. Lucy, do you have a question you want to ask? Do you know what, Carl? I actually have several questions. But I'll change. But I'll stick to one. And if you need more help later and I can just come back and ask some more. when you said earlier about for years I thought I didn't have a runner's body

yeah I'm 46 and I have believed I don't have a runner's body my entire life I've got flat feet I've got big boobs I've got a wobbly stomach I've got a nose which I can't breathe through very well partly because of genetics partly because of stuff I put up it in my 20s I don't like running I don't like the thought of pain Is there any point someone would actually want to like start

running? Have you ever met anyone that really fundamentally didn't like the thought of running and actually began to like it? Yes, really? Okay. Yeah, my husband, but I don't know if he's lying to me so there's a good point. I wouldn't say he loves it but he likes it.

Okay. What advice would you give to someone? An absolute rookie beginner because I can't even run for the bus. Can I jump in on that and ask Claire a question on the back of that? Do you think that a lot of you find a lot of people who have this

you know the way you can kind of self-identify what you are so I am not a runner, therefore I don't run. I am a runner so therefore for I run. Do you find that that is a mindset that people fall into the trap of? Yeah, definitely. If you're like saying you're not a runner, you're kind of setting yourself up to say, this is going to be shit as well. Like, you know, I see that. I do see that quite a lot and especially like runners who are starting out. It's like, oh, I'm not a real runner. I'm not a real runner. and it's like

and they are at the edge yeah generally yeah I've got a few friends that are in that stage and they say they hate running but they still go out and do it and then they like it when they're doing it

yeah but I do think it is that identity thing if you're starting off saying like I'm not a runner I don't like running I think it's asking yourself do you really not like running because if you don't like running

you don't have to run. And I don't, to be fair, I haven't actually done a run since literally since about 2008. Like, I think my friend was like, let's go jogging in, you know, a lunch hour one day. And I, and I was like, this is, this is rubbish. And also, the harder it is, Lucy, the harder it is, the less you're going to enjoy it, especially if you're new to it. Like, that's a, that's a big thing you have to remember as well. You know what I'm driving before? When I'm driving my four before down the road, Sunday and I see some man breathing out of his ass like in the rain and I said honestly I think what what joy are you getting out of this this does that just looks hideous to me do you know what I mean

it's like taking an ice bath or something I like comfort do you know what I mean and I just don't get the appeal but I would love to be someone who could do you know what I mean like some of my friends like oh it's just amazing when you hit the wall and I'm like I don't think I could ever get to that but Yeah, did you have, where would someone start? I've got mixed feelings about this, to be honest, because there's like part of me that's like, it sounds like you're not really actually wanting to do it. So I wouldn't feel like encouraging somebody to do something

that they felt like it wasn't appealing. Like, yeah, I feel a bit mixed about this. But then at the same time, I'm like, there's obviously something in you to think that you maybe, there's something that you would maybe want to get out of it. What is it you think runners get out of running that you're like, oh, I really want to try that. I guess it's like you people feel that say they feel exhilarated and, you know, that they can achieve something and they can increase their stamina and, and, you know, that kind of thing. But you know what, you're probably right.

Maybe it is something that I've said on the WhatsApp group before, I'm probably like your absolute nightmare because it's like the worst client ever, I think, when it comes to running. but yeah I just thought I'd ask that but could I ask one more slightly more practical question which at the moment I'm really suffering with plantar fasciitis you know like you know in your archfalls it's really like it really is actually hurting me to walk at the moment like from a practical level have you got would any with either of you have any advice on how to to work around that or anything I could do to improve it. on for that one. I probably would say go to physio

because you don't know what potentially is going on there. It's your foot as well. Like you're on your feet. You need your, I wouldn't be wanting to give any advice. It would be unhelpful.

And that would probably be the advice that I would tell any of my clients, to be fair, is go and see a physio. Yeah, because sometimes it might not even be like in, it doesn't eat, sometimes it doesn't even come from your foot, doesn't it? It could be like tight hips or anything that could be covered in comfort for you to actually

walk a certain way. Is anything like helps me use it off? Because things like ice as well. So one good thing actually for if you're looking to ice it and you're finding it hard is freeze a water bottle, like a small water bottle. And then you can roll your arch your foot on it. I mean, if I'm thinking about the things I do before I go to physio is I would probably do that. I'd probably take ibuprofen.

But again, I'm not going to give you like, don't, I'm not saying definitely go and do that. That's what I would probably do. No, no, I appreciate that. Thank you. Thank you. Right. I'll let someone ask a question now. I thought that first one was a good question, to be fair, Lucy, because it is a thing.

Oh, good. Well, it's probably my best one to date because normally I sound like, all right, Dave. I was like, yeah. It is an important conversation to have. It's like, do you not like something because you feel uncomfortable doing it? Or do you not like it because you just don't like it? And sometimes it's really hard to tell because you don't enjoy something until, you know, you can, you know, it's almost that mastery of it. Like, I enjoy the gym a lot more than you do because I probably have been going a lot longer and I feel comfortable in there.

It's like you don't feel comfortable in the gym. Obviously, you're not going to enjoy it. So sometimes you have to go past that before you actually understand. understand whether it is something that you like or not. So it's a it's a it's a it's a difficult question to answer. Um, uh, Kristen, because I have you out running all the time because you do a mixture of running and a string training. Do you have any questions you want to ask? No, you don't have me running out all the time. You put me on a limit. Yeah, I have back. Two to three times a week. I can't do it any longer. Um, so I, I guess endurance, um, is a thing is I am going to,

to attempt a half marathon when I go to Ireland in June. But I don't know how to like build my endurance if I'm only running two to three times a week. I do also go to the gym two times a week because Carl says I have to. So what do you do you think that you need to be running more days to get to be able to run the half marathon or what is that you you feel you need to do? Um, I have no idea. Do you feel like you have to do more days to be able to do a half marathon? Um, so I'm limited. I can only run on my treadmill because of like time schedule and where I live.

People like to fly down the road. Uh, and people have been hit by cars before. So I don't want to do that. Um, so I didn't know if like I should focus on building endurance the, um, the days that I do run instead of like, like trying to run more days, if that makes sense? It depends. Really be looking at what you can do. So if you could do it either way, really, I mean, in building endurance, it doesn't matter too much where you do it. It's more about your lifestyle.

Like, if you don't have the capacity to do any more days, like you're like absolutely swamped the other days, then it's going to be really hard for you to build that consistency if it is something you can't actually do. But if you can run a little bit longer on the days that you're already running, then that might be an easier way to make it work. Because the thing about endurance is consistency, which doesn't mean it has to be perfect, but it is just slowly adding on that bit more, a bit more, a bit more, a bit more

so that your body is prepared for that half marathon. Yeah, and obviously I didn't know that you're doing one in June. So thanks for telling me that. But we can... I told you. I told you. Well, we...

That's the whole reason I was going to Ireland. What I would say is that obviously, like, the whole point is that, you know, if we're trying in four days a week or whatever, it's you're building up that endurance to that. So what is the, Kirsten, what is the longest that you have, have run before? Or what can you consistently do at the moment, do you think? What's your ability at the moment? So the longest I've run. before was nine miles, but that was two years ago.

What's nine, what's nine miles in kilometers? I don't know. It is nine miles. Would that be 15 or 14 points something? A half marathon is 13.1 miles. So I don't know like how that, like what you guys consider a half marathon. Many one guy, yeah. Okay.

I talk, I talk in miles, but I can talk in kilometers. as well, don't we? Okay. Okay. So currently I run four miles every time that I run. I've been bumping it up a little bit. And are you confident enough at the moment that, you know, you'll be able to do 21K, 13 miles, which is everywhere you want to say 21K?

I feel like, you know, the answer to the confidence thing. No, I'm not confident because it's me. But it's definitely something I want to try. Like, even if I don't make it. the full run, like I still want to try. Blair, what advice would you have for? I would say that if you've committed to sign up to erase, there is a part of you that believes that you can do it.

So I would be honing in on that and reminding yourself that you would never sign up for something that you thought you could never do. so every time you go on the treadmill I would be getting your head in the I can do this because I signed up for it instead of saying that you think that you might as long as you'll try and do as much as you can

or make that commitment because you've already made that commitment you've paid for it I mean that's all the thing I say in runs even in the run when you have because you've already made that will be times that'll be hard. It's like, God, I paid for this. I actually paid money for this. So I must have thought I was worth putting some money down. It's like kind of like paying, like playing a game at a casino. It's like I'm putting the money down. I'm committing and we're going

for it. So I would be trying to work on the way that you're talking to yourself every single run that you do until your base is what I would advise. Yeah, and it's micro progressions the whole way, just like in the gym as well. It's like you're slow, you're not going from, you know, 50 kilos to 100 kilos squat in one week. You're just slowly pushing the boundaries every time you go in there, whether it's extra reps or just a little bit more weight. You can do the exact same thing what you're running.

And I think one thing that really helped me when I did my first half, Marathon was just embrace and slowing down to go a little bit further as well. Yeah. Yeah, you don't need to be going out like an absolute, you know, which everybody does at the start. And yeah, just be okay with just slowing it down a little bit at the start. And you will be able to endure it as well. Chloe, do you have a question that you want to ask? I actually don't.

You kind of answered it because I am an absolute total new beginner. like I have literally only started running on the treadmill and the gym like walk and running kind of thing. So I was just going to ask for if you had any tips for like an absolute beginner, but I think you've already answered it. What kind of tips would you be? What is the things that you find in heart? I don't like I'm finding like pace myself first of all. Like I don't even know how to go about that. Second of all, breeding like I'm finding myself like, like I mean, I'm finding myself like I mean,

hunting. But like I'm enjoying, I'm really enjoying it and like when I finish it, I can't wait to do it again the next day but it's just I see everybody else on the treadmills and they look like it's just a breath of fresh air to them. But yeah, I don't know if that's just me being self-conscious as well though because I am quite self-conscious about basically everything. Yeah, so there's a few things there is like

the other people that are around you, you don't know how long that they've been running for. Like, they could be running for years and they've been where you have been and that's just not where they are now. And it does take a bit of time to kind of

learn. You're kind of continually learning. And it sounds like from what you're saying if you're run walking, that you will learn how, if you're walking it that that means that you're knowing that you're breathing too much and that you're going too fast that you need to slow it down. So it sounds like you're already doing it. The breathing thing,

I think we can overcomplicate it sometimes. Like I've seen like TikToks and stuff about breathing and running and stuff. And as weird as it's science, it's easy just to say, I don't think about it. But that would be the least thing I would. would be thinking about. Because when we're trying to like learn something and learn what our pace is and then we're trying to like, oh, am I breathing through my nose or am I heavy breathing or am I doing this? It's just another thing to think about. You are going to breathe.

Yeah. Whether you, whatever you do. So your body is going to sort that. Continue doing what you're doing, the run walking. And then like if you're feeling like you're going to, you're going to, you're. breathing too heavily, just try and see if you can just take the pace down just a fraction. Yeah. And even just like a light jog and then try and maintain that as long as possible.

Once you've got that stage, it's then, then it's like, okay, how much of the walk can I reduce now? Okay. And how much more of the running can I add. And the breathing part will all come as well. Yeah, it will come. Just not hold my breath. It will. Yeah, don't hold your breath.

No. You know what you're passing out of the treadmill? Gosh. Thank you. Thank you. I have a question for you to finish off. And it goes back to conversation that me and Chloe had only last week. And just she was having kind of a down day in terms of body image and probably correlated to fact that she wasn't able to train because she was sick and so on and so forth.

And obviously, Chloe, we were talking. She's had a good week of training. and she feels a lot better and so on and so forth. But do you have any advice on, you know, someone who's struggling with a bad body image day or things that you do when you're almost, when you're struggling? Yeah, I think understanding what is actually going to be helpful for you,

which will look different for different people. And also even on different days as well, like sometimes, like I have a list of things. It's like my little toolbox. of things that I have just tried out, like wearing comfy clothes, you know, not wearing restrictive clothes, just getting my comfy clothes on. Listen to certain songs, I've got a couple of songs that are like, they're my go-toes because they'll just remind me like, you're a badass, you don't need to be thinking about this, just rein it in. And it's like an automatic. So,

if you're into music, like have a little. playlist of things that are your go they're going to kind of change things for you and I think writing down actually things that you are calming as well like things that are that you like to do like for me I like to sometimes just draw it's just not necessarily it's nothing pretty but it's just it's calming for me and for some client or moving your body like as well like going getting some fresh air and sometimes if I'm if I'm actually having a really poor body image day to the point where I'm like I'm not going out for a run I feel really really shit in my body then I'll do a strength session because it's just it gives me like this kind of like

oh this is wrong and then I'm like right I didn't do my run but I moved my body in a way that was supportive for me today and that is that is supporting me so that's helpful and for me and it looks different there's lots of different there's loads of other things that you could do and but even just trying out some things jotting down this was helpful when I felt this way and then build from that you'll start to get you'll start to build it in your own way yeah it's really trying to change your meal isn't it which is going to be the most difficult thing to do when you're in it. Oh yeah. Like if you're yeah, if it's if it's kind of gone to the point where you know, you can't challenge that thought and you know you can't just say like oh there you are.

You're having that thought. You have this thought that's okay. You know, it's going to be okay. If it's kind of gone past that stage and you're like, oh, then it is like, okay, what is going to bring me more emotionally regulated? What am I going to what is going to make me feel good? And then just do now. Hema, any final thoughts or questions that you want to ask? Any. Oh, sorry, I've muted. You're trying to unmute you.

Hold on. There we go. Do it again. There you go. Yeah, thanks, Claire. The conversations have been really good. So just a personal reflection. And I'm thinking maybe of Lucy mostly

because I kind of identified with so much of what she said. So I'm not currently a run. or I've got some fucked up knees. But all of the things that she said about body and how that feels when you're pulling that weight along is part of the suck of the run. Like that was where I found the greatest challenge in running. But it wasn't a challenge to get started, which is interesting because I think about the environment.

So things that you've been talking about, Claire, with respect to the right playlist. And the mindset, like those are environments. The third thing and one that really pulled me in it, because I did used to run for several years. Run, right? Yes, I'm going to call myself a runner, but I did a lot of walking in there, right? But I did race.

I did do plenty of races and that kind of thing. And it was never about timing. It was about getting it done, right? So this goes back to something that Kirster. was saying about pulling out a 21 when her highest is 14.4. It's about getting it done, right? So I'm pulling all of those experiences of the right playlist, the mindset. And the third thing for me was actually like the actual physical environment.

I'd never fucking run on a treadmill. Like no gosh darn way you will ever catch me doing that ever again in my life. It's the most fucking boring thing ever. but put me out in the woods, soft ground. It's so nice on the knees. And it's like if you run out of that playlist or you decide, you know what, I'm just going to take in the sounds for a moment. It's a really nice sound versus the pavement and the strike of the heel.

Like it's, I think it's why I didn't enjoy running competitively, which was only just to say I did a race. I wasn't racing. It was just that I was going to do a race. That's a very different thing. A lot of people were, my, you know, my colleagues, friends, whatever, were running because they're runners.

I was running to challenge myself. But what I realized is that's not for me. Like it's the pavement thing. We know, we did what was called a lucky seven. I called it a sucky seven. The whole thing, it was seven, three times around. this 7K race to finish a half marathon, right? And every seven, I was like, fuck, this is the suckiest seven. But I could do that in the woods. So maybe it's a little bit of finding the right place,

too. Now, I don't know if we'll ever, ever, ever get back there, but I just was feeling Lucy a lot because I've put on a lot of weight again. But when I started running, I was this weight, maybe 10 pounds less. But when I started running, I was this weight. And the escape with the headphones and just leaving was a nice, a nice feel. And at the end of it, it was, oh, you know what, I did that. Even if I had to stop at two neighbors, and I'm not lying, two neighbors to have a pee, two on the road. So just a positive kind of reflection on it, right? It's not, it's not my current thing but I did enjoy it at the time for the accomplishment of it. Yeah, I think that's, I think that's great. And I think that like running doesn't have to be, it can be whatever

you want it to be. And if that's what brings you joy, like, and I can totally get that as well. like I like to be up a hill or in the woods. I don't. The treadmill is like if everything is frozen and I can't actually get out, then it's like, okay, I'll give this thing a go. And it is finding out like if it brings you joy, where it brings you joy, and you don't have to race and you can race if you want. It just can be so many different varieties of things.

And I think that's really nice that you can note. what part of running you enjoyed, like when you did it. Well, I think that comes full circle to the literally the first thing that you said, Claire, was when I asked, you know, any advice for anyone who's going to start running, it's that like not to put any pressure on yourself in terms of times or anything like that. And, you know, do it for the sake that you're actually enjoying it and just getting out and experiencing being in the run. So I think that's a really important thing.

obviously, you know, you will enjoy it if you put that pressure off yourself and be able to not worry about whether you're walking, jogging, running times and so on and so forth. And being able to, like hema said, just be in the environment and to almost be, just be essentially present in where you are. Yeah. Okay. So we'll wrap it up here. But Claire, first of all, thank you very much for that.

That was just unbelievable. And we really appreciate your time. If any of the clients want to follow you and follow along with your work or anyone listen back to this wants to follow along and see what you do or reach out to you or anything like that, where could they find you? Probably best on Instagram, I would say. So yeah, coached by Claire official because coached by Claire was taken and I just thought, you know what, I'm going to go all out and go official. That's steady. Look, I'll leave all the information for them. follow along with your work. And again, I really appreciate your time and I know all the clients

do as well. And thanks everyone for sharing as well and for asking questions and for being here today.