The Uneducated PT Podcast - #47 Ceire Meagher Performance Nutritionist

Episode Date: September 5, 2024

In this episode of the Uneducated PT Podcast we speak to Ceire Meagher who's a nutritionist who helps athletes with their performance. Expect to learn the common mistakes Ceire sees athletes make with their food, how to get more calories into your body throughout the day and the cost benefit to losing weight while trying to perform.

Hello and welcome to the uneducated PT podcast with me, your host, Carlo Rourke. The goal of this podcast is to bring on interest and knowledgeable people from all walks of life, learn a little something from each conversation and for you, the listener, just learn something from each episode. So don't forget to subscribe to the channel, press the box below, show some support and I'll see you on the next episode. Can you tell the listeners a little bit about your background and what led you to the work that you're doing today?

Yeah, of course. So growing up, I'd always been really active in things. So to be honest, there was nothing that I wanted to do other than nutrition when it came to kind of what I wanted to do after school. So, yeah, I ended up doing a bachelor's in nutrition in UCC. And then while I was studying that, I did a PT course. And I'd always kind of had the idea that maybe I'd do dietetics and go down the clinical route. But yeah, after I did the PT course, I got really into that. I loved kind of the sports side of things.

And I did a bit of work experience in hospitals and with teams. I just loved kind of working with people on that level and like I kind of realized how much misinformation there was even among like high level athletes and stuff so and then I ended up doing a master's in London in sports nutrition and yeah that's kind of how I got to where I am. You said a lot of misinformation even with high level athletes. I think that's something that even a lot of coaches who might train like general pop and stuff like that will presume that athletes know what they're doing, especially when it comes to their nutrition and their recovery.

Yeah, I was actually shocked. And I think, like, a lot of it is because, like, say if an athlete is kind of moving up the ranks, there'll be a lot of people there that are doing their very best, but they're probably the funding isn't there. So they're not maybe talking to the right people. And then, like, you know, they might be talking to older athletes and, like, these kind of myths kind of just get passed down. But you'd be surprised, like, really high level athletes that are in unbelievable shape,

like basic things that you'd kind of assume that they'd know. Like it's not their own fault, but they're kind of getting them wrong. So, yeah, there's so much misinformation. And it just, you can kind of see as well the amount of potential that's there as well, if they can just change these few things, how much more their performance can improve. So I thought that was really interesting. And I just thought, oh my gosh, I never expected it to be that way. So, yeah, that's how I got down that route.

I don't think anyone expects it, but like, it does make sense. It's like why, why, like, they're training their whole life for a specific thing. Yeah. So why wouldn't they be like going down the route of understanding recovery or nutrition or strength and condition? Yeah. Yeah, you just kind of assume, but like, you know, they're not machines. They're like normal people with jobs and stuff. Like most of them like are doing full time work with it.

And like they're not getting lectures on nutrition the whole time. Like a lot of the time, there's very little funding there. So they're not getting huge amounts of support with their nutrition. as well. When I was doing my master's, I actually did my dissertation on eating disorders within sport. And I would have actually assumed that a lot of athletes would have been, there wouldn't have been many eating disorders within sport just because, you know, they're fueling for performance rather than their looks. But so many more athletes, a much higher percentage of athletes actually have disordered eating and things like that. So I was really interested in that side of things

as well. So that really opened my eyes as well. That's something that I'm only starting to kind of realise and understand now as well because I had two two lads on the podcast there a couple of weeks ago both of them with my Thai backgrounds and both of them said one of them said that himself that he suffered hugely with

body image issues and disorderly and and the other lad who actually is a nutritionist and helps my Thai at least which obviously there's no fun than that whatsoever it's prevalent in there is like 80% of the lads

there have disorder eating behaviours. Yeah, and especially with my thigh because that's like a weight class force. Yeah. So, you know, when they have to hit a certain number, like if they're like doing extreme cuts for their fight or whatever, they're not really given, like a lot of them might not be given the support they need and it might not be done like as in the healthiest way it can be. And then that then causes problems. And like then if there's a culture in a gym, it can kind of, you know, grow that way.

yeah like i would i would imagine even like whatever the sport is you're also kind of there paraded in front of lots exactly so like there is a there's a pressure to look a certain way and there's a pressure to um yeah yeah be in control of your food i suppose and and so on and so yeah yeah especially in fighting as well it's like you know you're kind of you're not wearing much clothes and like i suppose it's like if someone looks, you know, conventionally fit or that might kind of give them like a mental edge as well. So there's a lot to it, you know?

Yeah. You compete in powerlifting? Yes. Well, I say that now. I've done one novice competition, so I don't know. I was watching, I was watching your stories before he came on. I was like, this woman is it.

Yeah. Thank you. No, I've done that. When did, when did, so when did this passion for powerlifting begin? To be honest, I didn't even know what it was last year. I came to Australia and I was just doing, I just wanted to try a few gyms and like see what I liked. And there was this powerlifting gym that just had like a three day trial. So I just went in and I just knew straight away.

I was like, okay, I'm obsessed. Like I didn't even know what it was. But I think it was just the environment there. Like everyone was just so supportive. Everyone was so strong. And I just loved it. It wasn't even the power lifting itself. I think it was more so like the.

community there. And I never, I never, ever thought I would compete. Um, because I, I just never felt like I wanted to, my training to feel like a chore or feel like I had pressure on it. Um, but then, yeah, exactly. But then, yeah, about six months ago, I just decided to do a novice competition last minute and I actually loved it. So, um, yeah, I've another competition in about three weeks. So, um, that's a proper one out, um, in Cairn. So yeah, we'll see how that goes. Um, do you think, Claire, do you think that powerlifting would be like a more suitable sport for not exacerbating the problem of maybe disorderly and body image issues? Because the only reason I say that I just wanted to get your thoughts on it is because

it very much is solely focused on performance and how strong you can get versus how you look. But I know there is weight classes in that as well, isn't there? Yeah, I mean like it depends on the stuff. I think, like, I don't know the statistics now or anything, but, like, weight class sports tend to be a little bit. There's more of a risk there because if someone is putting for, like, a certain weight class, you know, there is always a bit of risk there because you have to focus on your body weight. You have to see how you focus on skills. Yeah, exactly. And, like, there has to be that conversation about, like, you are in a weight class. And, like, everyone knows what your, what weight class you're in and stuff.

but in terms of like aesthetics it's not the same as say like swimming where you're like in very little clothing and stuff now you're wearing like a suit and stuff but I don't know the exact numbers but I think it kind of depends on the individual as well um like if I um to be honest I feel like because I've like done so much like I've spent so many years like studying nutrition and things. I feel like I wouldn't have entered one if I felt like, oh God, I don't know will that, like, affect my relationship with food. I feel like if I felt like. Like, if I felt like, like, yeah, to know what the point. Yeah. Yeah. And I think I was so kind of slow about even entering a competition. Like, if I felt like it was impacting me, I just wouldn't bother competing. I would

just do it without competing. So I think as well, like, if you're someone that competes versus someone that just does it for fun, like there's also that difference. Like, if you're not competing, then you don't have the pressure of the weight classes. as well. So, yeah. Yeah, that's me in my time now. I'm literally just doing it purely as for fun and not even yeah. Or worrying about what my weight is or anything like that and enjoying it 10 times more because of that. Yeah, it just takes the pressure off. But I suppose like with the competitions, it's nice to kind of

have something to aim for and like, you know, it helps in that way. Yeah, everyone, everyone loves to see progress. Progress makes it. Yeah. And then having the date set, it's like, okay, I want to hit these numbers by this date and you know it's a it's a good motivator I think what so what type of clients do you work with at the moment do you work specifically with athletes do you work with gen pop what is it a mixture of both yeah it's kind of a mixture of both so um like the majority of my clients would be kind of like like your general gym goers so um like some some some these people are people that maybe like would have never trained in the gym before and just want to like kind of just learn a bit about food they've never really worked for the coach and stuff so um it kind of that would be like one sort of

clientele and then I've got other people that might like be trained for high rocks I feel like that's like blown up in the last while so people doing high rocks 10 ks half marathon things like that and then I have a few people that compete then so like Olympic weightlifting things like that so there's a bit of a range there but like the things that I'll be like whether you're a beginner or you know someone competing at a high level the principles are pretty much the same you know Yeah. So let's say, so a lot of them, let's say, are looking at performance in terms of maybe doing a high rocks, maybe doing other types of sports. What are some of the mistakes you see people make when it comes to performance in terms of nutrition? Yeah, I think a big one is that people focus so much on protein and they actually forget about carbs. Or like when it comes to performance, like people don't realize how many, like how important it is to have carbs or like even fueling around training. like they might train fast it because they read somewhere that, you know, that's the best way or like you'll burn more fat that way. And I think people don't realize that that can actually be a little bit dangerous like in terms of like your hormonal health. And just like even like just your performance alone, like how much better you can perform when you're properly fueled. Even if you end up eating say the same amount in a day or over a week, even just the timing of things can actually like make such a huge difference.

So that's probably the big thing, I would say, like, people like that are looking to fuel for performance specifically. But there's also like a lot of people, even like people that are very advanced, they kind of think, oh, this food is good, this food is bad. There's a lot of kind of black and white thinking or they think that if they're competing, they think, okay, I can't drink now at all. they kind of feel like it's either like oh I'm all in for this next performance for the next eight weeks and then afterwards they're you know they don't have that goal so they completely change so I would say to a lot of people like try and just like be in a routine so that it's not you're not on or off you kind of look at it like there's like a dimmer switch so like you might be a little bit more dialed in the few weeks before your competition or your 10k or whatever it is

and then you'd like you know dial it down a little bit if you're like on holidays or whatever it is, but like having completely different approaches, like, you're on or you're off is just really, like, not great for your overall, like, relationship with food or your performance or anything like that. Do you see that people will come in and they'll say, all right, I have this performance goal that I want to achieve? And then they'll do it by trying to just focus on a body composition way of eating. Yeah, yeah. I see a lot of people and they have, like, say they want to hit a certain time for hierarchy, but they're also trying to. to lose weight and they're also um like they might be super strict their approach and then like you'll

see them after the competition they feel kind of lost and they feel like they're gone completely in the other direction where all they're doing is drinking and like they kind of feel like you know that there's no sort of balance there like I would see that a little bit um so that's something that I just try and kind of that's why I like to work with people a good bit before they have a competition just so that we can like lay down the foundation so that they're not coming to me like okay I've got this thing in two weeks you know. it doesn't really work like that, you know. So if someone came to you and you noticed a pattern of maybe, okay, they might have a

poor relationship with food, they're kind of held onto this kind of restriction cycle. Do you find that like before they even go into kind of competitions and stuff like that, that's the area that you need to kind of work with them on? Yeah. So like when I work with anyone, the first thing I'll do is kind of do like a consultation and just make sure that kind of screening. for anything like that would be outside my scope. So like making sure that someone doesn't have like an eating disorder

or anything like that that, you know, I can't work with someone like that. I pass them on to a dietitian or something. So that's kind of like the first step, I'd say. And then the second thing, which just getting like a really detailed background of like getting a picture of like, you know,

who they are outside of like competitions and everything. Like, you know, even things like has their weight fluctuated hugely in the past. Like you'll kind of get a picture of, you know, what this person is. and like what their habits are. So you'll kind of be able to then predict how they will be like what you're kind of trying to see

as their patterns and predict what their challenges will be in the future. So you can kind of, I guess, prevent them from happening like any challenges that might come up. But like every person is different. You know, you can't assume either as well. Yeah.

Yeah. What advice would you have for someone who does have essentially two goals, right? They're trying to chase two rabbits. They're trying to, they're focusing on this performance goal, but they all. else I want to drop a bit of body fat and look a little bit better.

Yeah. What mistakes do you see people make in terms of that? Yeah. I guess what would the performance goal be? It would depend, I suppose, firstly, on what the performance goal is and secondly, where they are. Because for some people, dropping body weight will improve their performance. It's hard to kind of say, but I think for a lot of people, it's like, what is the number

one, like, what's the most important thing? Because sometimes you can do the two things at once because they'll actually help each other. so someone's maybe their goal is to run a marathon and they're very overweight. Losing weight will help them to improve. Lider on their fee. Yeah, exactly. And then other people, they actually better off to gain a bit of muscle to performance goal.

So it's very hard to kind of say exactly what's the right thing. Let's use me as an example, right? So I'm doing a high rock in Madrid in, I think it's at the end of October, right? So I'm already quite lean, right? What I would say I would struggle with, it wouldn't be my running. It would more be like, let's say, sled pushes, doing them in faster time,

having a bit more strength, having a bit more muscle behind me. What advice would you have is someone in my circumstances who wants to improve their high rock performance and probably needs to gain a little bit of muscle and gain a little bit of strength? Yeah. So first of all, I'd look at what you're already doing. Like, what are your habits already? Because there's no point in trying to me say, okay, here's a meal plan, do this. Like, what we need to do is look at exactly what are you doing already and see where we can make small changes. So like what's the biggest return for the smallest change, like the biggest positive impact for the smallest possible change. And I think people think that they need to be super extreme, change a load of things. But actually, if you just look at things logically and in a small, way like what's the the biggest return and investment almost you could say like what's the easy like

I guess the easiest way to make progress so for you that could be um you're just not eating carbs around your training or something so if you're looking to say gain muscle it's like right are you eating a calorie surplus if not how can we get in a few of extra calories or whatever that is and so that will look different to you from what it will to someone else so say if you're you know busy working in the gym or whatever like it might look like adding an extra snack or even just swapping a few like foods out. You might not even have to eat anything extra. It would just be like swapping like your low fat thing for a full fat something else.

So you're barely even noticing the changes, but you're making sure that you're going in the right direction. And then say with your training, the same thing. So like you might not have to increase your training volume. You could just change to you the exercises or change the order. And even things like looking at benchmarks. when you're training for a specific goal, you need to make sure that you're not doing like a generic plan. You need to look at what are your specific week points.

And even with high rocks, like you have to think of like the order that things are in. So for example, like you've got the wall balls at the very end. So you're going to be really fatigued when you're doing that. So you need to like factor that into your training. The sled pushes. I think they're kind of in the middle.

I can't remember. But like, you know, like seeing like, okay, let's test this. What's the benchmark? Where are you at now? and testing it kind of halfway along the program, are we going the right direction?

Do we need to pivot things? So I think it's really important to be specific to you rather than kind of thinking, oh, I saw this person on Instagram. They added this like protein shake. I'll do that, you know? Which is what happens to a lot of people. Yeah.

They say, oh, he's doing that. He looks like that. Or he's doing that and he performs like that. Or they'll even look at like a top athlete and they're doing something. Like I seen something in the Olympics. They were like some of the top. that least we're doing like some horrendous stuff with their training.

But then like that will fill their down to like all the kids. Exactly. Exactly. Like I think it's really important to look at what are your weak points and your strong points and then like adjusted to that. Like so you might be really good at like the I don't know the wall balls or whatever. So you might like focus your training more so on like the burpees or you know. So I think that's really important and it's not about trying to get really complex. It's just like doing the basics and then looking at what can you do consistently. So like, you know, on paper one thing might be optimal, but in reality, if you're not able to do that, like you can have the best program in the world, but if you can't stick to

that, it's no good. Whereas if you've something that's, you know, decent and you can stick to that consistently, like perfect. Yeah. I think that's a really good point. It's like try and not disrupt someone's day to day life as much as possible. Yeah. Yeah. Oh, absolutely. And I think when people maybe start with something, they think, oh, I don't feel like I'm doing anything much differently. But actually, that's exactly what it's supposed to feel like. If you find something hard to stick to for a week, like, good luck, sick and that for years, you know, it's not going to happen.

You basically touched all it there, even in what you were speaking about, even like changing from the low fat to high fat. But like, let's say someone needed to gain weight or wanted to gain weight weight and was struggling to increase their calories, whether that's for a power lift competition, whether that's to build muscle, or whatever it is. What are your main tips for someone who, let's say, is a picky eater, but needs to increase their calories for performance? Yeah. So again, it'll depend on the person. I'm going to probably say that for every answer, but it does depend on the person. But I think

you have to be logical about it. So I think the first thing with people is I might get someone that says, I can't gain weight. And that's like for some people, it's harder than others. Like, that's a given. But if we look at it logically, in order to gain weight, you know, you just need to be consuming more energy than what you're burning. So if you look at, like, you can do this on the calculator, figure out what are your maintenance calories, and then go a bit above that. And then you look at, okay, what are you actually eating?

How can we, what's the easiest way that we can bump up the calories for you without you feeling like you have to be sickly full or if you struggle with low appetite? So for a lot of people that maybe struggle to put on weight, liquid calories are going to be your best friend. so things like smoothies like you can easily make a smoothie like a thousand calories and you can drink it in five minutes like if you just add in things like peanut butter oats honey sauces oils and even things like processed foods like for some people that find it hard to get the calories in like adding in things

like sweets brownies and stuff like as long as you're getting most of your food from like whole like kind of what's the word like you know plant-based food what's i can't even think of the word like whole food food yeah i think that's the biggest mistake that people make isn't it isn't that they tried to you see me in quotations here clean it's tried to eat clean the whole time or tried to eat like whole meals throughout the day to increase their calories which is very difficult if you're just trying to eat protein and vegetables to increase your calories yeah i mean i think it definitely can be done but I think the where people go wrong is they they demonize maybe like some foods that are they label some foods as good and bad I think you know once you've got like I'm not telling anyone to

just eat like chocolate chocolate and whatever but you know like for some people that do find it hard to put on weight like things like brownies and stuff or like really a calorie dense foods that might not be as nutritionally dense can actually be really helpful as long as you are making sure that you're eating like your fruit and veg and being sensible with it. I think it's just a black and mine mindset around it. I think some people think I'm trying to put on weight, but I'm trying to be good and I don't want to eat these foods. And it's like, well, what's your overall diet?

You know, it's your overall goal. What's the easiest way to get you there? So yeah, it will depend on different people. And you can do it from like completely whole foods, but like you have to think of it on a practical level as well. Yeah, yeah. What are some of the mistakes people make in terms of recovery, think? I think the biggest thing is sleep and I know that sounds so boring but especially with people

that are a little bit more advanced like people will show up to their training like every day it's on the program stick to a to a tea same with their nutrition like a lot of people like at more advanced levels I've been nailing the basics but sleep is the one thing that they don't prioritize in the same way like if you had a training plan and it was for say five days a week and you went three days out of the five, you know, you wouldn't expect to get like amazing results or like what you expect to get if you train five days a week out like instead of three. So like if you look at sleep like you've got okay seven nights a week. If you're getting really bad sleep four nights out of the seven nights a week, your recovery is going to be down so much. And I think people really don't take it seriously,

as seriously as you should be. Or often they'll kind of nearly like be bragging about, you know, getting up at 6 a.m and only on four hours sleep and like oh this is because I work so hard and actually no that's not working hard that's being like that's just not working smart and so I think that's probably the number one thing. Then there's other things like just being sensible about like your rest days. People I think a lot of time like overtrain or they sort of stick to the program to the point where they're not listening to their bodies a lot or like you know if you're feeling physically fatigued. like your body can only keep up your training can only be as good as your recovery. So if you are over training, you might be, it might be less productive to actually do less

training sometimes. Even like little things like if you're finding yourself like low motivation, like poor mood, if you're having like getting sick a lot, things like that. Like these are all signs of like overtraining under fueling. So I think it's really important to like really be honest with yourself about where you're at and like take the time off if you need it because I do think a lot of people do like unintentionally overtrain and under recover. I would say even that that's my personality is like even if I have a program to follow and then I have like two days off I'm like all right what do I do with my two days off or go to the gym right? I think I think that's not a lot of people either I train at all or they're overtraining especially yeah yeah completely

and I think when, especially when you've got a program and you're like, I'm sticking to this to a T. But I think you just need to have that bit of flexibility. The same with your nutrition, like, and be willing to just pivot a bit. And if you are working with a coach, like, it's just so great to have someone to look at things logically because it's very hard to do that yourself. Like, even myself, like, I always have a coach when I'm training. Like, I have someone else doing my own programming. Just because if I have a really bad day at the gym or like I don't lift properly or whatever, I just, I send off the videos to my coach. he'll give the feedback. I don't have to worry about it because if I'm doing that myself, I'll be like,

oh God, did I, you know, you just be overthinking it. It's very hard to be logical with yourself. So to have someone to be accountable to is great in those cases. You could have all the knowledge, all the information, all the advice, but it's very hard to give that to yourself when you're so emotionally invested in your own results. Oh, completely. I just, I know I couldn't. I have to be accountable to someone. Even like showing up at the gym, like little things like, I know if I wasn't sending videos to my coach. Like I just wouldn't do all the sets. I wouldn't do all the training.

I'd just leave. You touched on the importance of sleep. What are some of the things that people can do or stop doing in order to improve the quality of their sleep and therefore improve the quality of their performance? I think the biggest thing and that people, like, I know I do this all the time, is like scrolling before bed. We all do it. I think like, you know, people get so important.

invested in things like technology and wearables and all these things. But actually, the thing I recommend most of people is to get an alarm clock and leave your phone outside of room. Like, that will just make so... I'm still telling myself that I'm going to do that. I know. Honestly, it's like the simplest little thing because, like, you've got the blue light. You'd be, like, if you're on TikTok, like, an hour can pass in five minutes, you know? So same thing when you wake up. like it's all just like really simple things. So like I would say that's probably the number one thing. Um,

is having like the phone outside your bedroom if you can. Um, now I know we're all human. So like, you know, it's literally, it's the ultimate discipline, as well? Yeah. And I like,

we all do it. Like I go on my phone and bed all the time. But like, you know, if we're being really, if you want to get like, um, really on top of your recovery,

that's probably the number one thing. Um, the second thing with sleep I'd say is, um, if you can try and have a, a consistent wake and sleep time, like over the week, especially, like, you know, with weekends and stuff, it can be harder. But if you can try and keep that within, like, the same, like, hour window, that's probably, like, the second biggest thing. Obviously, if you've kids and stuff,

it's a lot harder. And then the third thing I would say is to try and get some, like, sunlight and, like, before noon, even, like, 10, 15 minutes. Again, hard to do, depending on your job or work or the weather. So yeah, I'd say the number one thing is definitely try and keep the phone out of the bedroom. Yeah, yeah. I've started setting alarms to be like quarter to nine, remind myself, get into bed, get into bed.

Because if I know if I look at the bed, at least have the opportunity to fall asleep, even if I do start. Yeah. I don't stick to it all the time, but I've, instead of just setting the alarm to get up in the morning, I've started like reminding myself to go to bed as well.

I know, yeah. And it's just so basic, you know. So it's, but it's still. hard to do, you know. But isn't that the like that's why some athletes are like the 1%. It's because like it's not because of all these other things that do it's like they can do the basics and the mundane and the boring things really, really well. Yeah, if you can do the things that work really consistently like the basics really, really consistently like you're doing great. Like it's very rare that I'd recommend someone to like buy like one like expensive technology or

like a new supplement that's come out. Like you know, they they have. have their place and they are great sometimes for some people. But that's yeah, people don't want to hear the boring stuff. Like, you know, it's, it's so boring and it, you kind of like almost go deaf to it. You just want to see the next thing or see what, you know, the person with the six pack is using, you know. Yeah. What, um, what tips would you have for someone who just purely wants to get stronger? Let's say from like a training perspective like, uh, what are they making, what mistakes are they making in terms of their program and etc yeah so um i would say like for if you're someone that's like starting out and you you

don't know like kind of where to begin i would say the number one thing is to find something that you enjoy um so this doesn't have to look like the gym um if you don't enjoy the gym like if you can find something that you'll be able to be consistent at that it's very hard to be consistent at something that you don't enjoy. The second thing I would say is to, like, if your goal is like something to do at running, I would say, like, find a community that have that goal, that all have that goal. Like, so basically surround yourself with people where the goals that you want to achieve are the norm.

And then you'll just kind of fall into that pattern. So I know, like, run clubs are like exploding everywhere. Yeah. Yeah. So even if it's not. I was just about saying my head, I was like, you definitely won't have a problem trying to find somewhere. I know. I know. But whatever it is, you know, whether it's like, I don't know, powerlifting or climbing or whatever it is. Like I think that's like such a big part of it.

And I think like nutrition wise to get stronger, like the, I think people forget like you have to be eating enough. Like to build muscle. Ideally, you want to be eating in a calorie surplus. So more than what you're burning. And also you need to be doing resistance training consistently. So you need to be like you can if you're not doing both of those things consistently, it's going to be hard to do that. Like yes, you can build muscle in a calorie deficit, but it's a lot harder and it's not optimal. So if you can find some form of exercise you enjoy, resistance training that you enjoy that you can show up to consistently. And again, like remembering like yes, protein is important, but so are carbs for performance. People often just forget about carbs and just focus on protein.

you know you can't don't expect yourself to be building muscle quickly if you're not eating enough like it's not going to happen um from a woman's perspective have you found that hard in the past like from a psychological point of view to eat more in terms of performance because obviously you know I know there's going to be a lot of women listening to this who probably do want to put on muscle because they know it's going to improve their body composition or they just want to get stronger but it's very much being ingrained in the culture to eat less, not to eat more. Yeah, I think it's, it's, how do you think of how I'm going to answer this. I think like once you, with from like a woman's perspective,

I think there's a lot of like diet culture messages that are kind of we get probably more so than men. And I would say that that like goes a lot deeper than just. like, okay, this is going to stop be building muscle. It goes so much deeper like in terms of like your overall confidence, your body image. There's so much that it affects. So I think,

I would first of all try and like work on your relationship with food before you can kind of think about like muscle building because like that's just such a small. It's a small thing in comparison to like your overall well being. And then like I guess genetically as well like it is harder for women to build muscle compared to men, like we don't have the same testosterone levels, you know? But I guess the principles are the same for men and women. Like, you do need to be, like, I'm going to give the same advice to men and women, like,

in terms of, like, how to build muscle. But yeah, I do think, like, from a woman's perspective, and like, men as well, like, there's different kind of messages. Like, I think men have more pressure to kind of be big and bulky and stuff. But, yeah, I do think, like, from a woman's perspective, there's so much diet culture. things that you kind of have to unlearn or like, you know, maybe I noticed with girls that maybe like they get more comments on their body or, you know, things like that. So, yeah, I don't know does that answer your question? Yeah, absolutely. What do you think powerlifting has done for your

confidence? Oh, I think I've always had sort of, like I've been training for years, like, never really like I've never really put too much pressure on myself to hit certain numbers but I've always um like for years I've had this goal of like oh I want to deadlift 100 kilos or like squat whatever and it's always felt impossible like I always thought I'm never going to do that but I think it's just shown like if you um if you find someone like the right people to get you that result like you can do it and I think that kind of like it kind of gives you that confidence where like you think okay this result i thought was impossible but now i've achieved it and surpassed that and i guess that kind of goes into other areas of your life so for me like getting say a powerlifting

coach like that has helped me more like i would never have gotten the results i have now if i didn't have a power lifting coach and i think it's like similar to other things in life like whether it's business or whatever it is like if you have someone that knows exactly what they're doing if you have someone that is an expert in that field and they, you know, work with people similar to you and get them that result. Like if you just do the work and have someone like in your corner that knows what they're doing, I think you can get that result. So I think it's like, you know, you'd be surprised what you can achieve long term. So I think it has improved my confidence, I guess, because, you know, when you're, when you go from something being impossible to achieve and

beyond, I think that automatically like makes you kind of feel like, okay. what else can I apply this to? Do you think that's the importance of environment as well? Like if you want to achieve a goal, um, surrounding yourself with people who obviously can show you the way and also have been there and done it, that's probably the,

the first step in terms of achieving that is just finding the environment, finding the people that are going to be right for what you want. Yeah, absolutely. Like I think, um, even if that's not possible for you, like say for me, like I just happened to be living near a powerlifting gym. So that was great. But that's not always possible.

Like, say if you move somewhere else, like you're not going to be, like, say this is just powerlifting specifically now, but like say if you're living somewhere where there's not one. Like, it's still possible if you have like a coach like online now, like the possibilities are endless. So I think even if you can't put yourself in a situation where that environment is there, you can sort of find like an environment online or something and again kind of get your foot in that way.

And because it might, it might be out of reach for you to actually be, physically in that environment. But if you can, like, with online these days, you can find an online community so easily. So, but yeah, if you can be physically in that environment, it makes such a difference. Even with training and stuff, just being around people like that, like whether it's powerlifting or whatever goal it is, I think it just, it just makes such a difference. I can't really describe it, you know? That's funny that you were in doubt about doing a 90 kilo deadlift.

I was just looking at a video of you. and you pulled 130 and then someone had a comment under saying I think I forgot that Ed that we're done with the warm-ups. I know, I know that was my gym. That was, I did the novel competition. I was being so conservative because they didn't want to fail it and my gym, like, reposted it. It looked, like, you made it look effortless.

I don't know. I don't know why I didn't, but anyway. So do you have, do you take different approaches in terms of, even in terms of training, depending on whether there are a bit because like you said that you train you know people who are fresh to train having trained at all complete and all as trainers uh to advance athletes so is there any kind of different approaches that you take in terms of training with with different clients yeah i think um again like the principles are the same but i think it's about meeting people where they're at um like if someone doesn't want to train in the gym and they just want to do home training

or go to Pilates or whatever. I think it's looking at what their specific goals are. What are the challenges that they've had in the past? So whether that's like just showing up or like I've even worked with a few people that just come to me and they're like, I hate exercising full stop. I hate the gym. I hate this. I still make myself go.

I force myself to go because I know it's good for me. And I think it's, I would always say to someone if you hate going to this gym class, like why are you going? Like don't go. It's actually I would say like, argue it's healthier to stay at home. So I'd always like say for say like the very beginner like that might think they hate exercise. I'd always just ask them like okay, um like most kids are very active. Like you see a toddler like they can't stand still. So like what was a form of movement that

you enjoyed when you were younger? So I actually had a client and she, um, I know she won't mind me talking about this, but um, she said that when she was younger that she used to love gymnastics. So she went to a gymnastics class and it was like an hour and a half class and she loved it. And she said, oh, but that wasn't training. That was just me having fun. And I said, that's, you know, the penny is dropped. Like, that's what it is. So I think it's like being kind of maybe getting this idea of what training is and like being

a little bit more open minded with it. Like it doesn't have to be in the gym doing like a bodybuilding style workout. You know, I think as well, a lot of people. people I'll get and they say they hate the gym. And what they actually hate is going to the gym, not knowing what they're doing, not knowing how to use any equipment. And they hate feeling like that because of course you're going like that if you're going there and you don't know what you're doing.

So maybe like if you knew how to use equipment, you knew exactly what you were doing, that you actually would like the gym. It's just you don't like not knowing what you're doing. Sorry, I actually can't remember what the question was. You explained it. It was even about the difference between like, let's say, beginners. an advanced training program. Yeah.

Yeah. And then, so that's kind of like, I guess, the beginner side. So like meeting people where they're at, I think is really important. And like understanding what their specific goals are rather than what goal you want for them, I guess. Because I think especially like even when I'm, you know, powerlifting, I have to like remember like, okay, not everyone is a power lifter. Not everyone wants to like lift these weights or whatever. Remembering. Right.

Deadlift straight away. Yeah. Yeah. So I think just making sure that like you've got the client's goal in mind. So that would be like I guess how I approach things with beginners. And then like with more advanced athletes, it's looking at like what are they already doing and how they can improve it. So like with most people that are very active, like they love training.

And a lot of the time it's kind of like almost pairing things back and like, you know, like get there on the other end of the spectrum and it's like, okay, like take a chill bill. how can we make this the most productive so we can like get the result you want like you have to look at the bigger picture because like the last thing you want is an injury from over training or things like that so yeah I think

like the basic principles are the same but it's just meeting people where they're at seeing okay what specifically does this person needs and kind of going from there so it's hard to I guess give you one answer no but I think I think you've even said it in that it's like with more with people people that you know like absolutely love what they're doing and love yeah less less is going to be

more and you have to pull them back and then with maybe beginners or novice trainers it's like just trying to find some way of them you know compliant to whatever exercise routine yeah exactly and as well I think like looking at their goals it's kind of like helping and set like timelines and stuff like you might have someone with a specific goal and you have to be honest with them like okay the work you're doing now to get that goal you're it's not matter up. So I think like sometimes like you would be pulling people back, but other times you have to kind of say to people like, look, with the rate of work you're doing now, you're not going to get the result you want. So it's just like adjusting things and just being really honest with people

about it. And just like kind of giving them the choice like, okay, you can either keep going to where you're going and get this result or, you know, like meet in the middle somewhere, you know. So I think it's just helping people to kind of understand the work that's needed for the goal they want. I think that's a really good point as well that you mentioned even in terms of kind of novice trainers is that they think that they have to do a certain type of exercise. Like they look at personal trainers online who like are always trained and that they'll have these like motivational quotes of how they work so hard and they're grinding and out without knowing that that person actually loves going to the gym and has been going for years. So it's not even hard work for them.

And as well like PT's like it's such like now I'm generalising now but like like you're probably working in a gym, very easy access to a gym. You probably can train at the quiet times when no one else is there. Like you probably like, you know, a lot of PTs, like early 20s, no kids, you know. So I think it like you look at these people, but their circumstances are so different, like genetics as well. So you really need to look at your environment as well before you kind of be really hard on yourself. Like I always say that to people like you need to look at your whole lifestyle and like set

realistic goals, you know? Yeah. Looking back on your own fitness journey of all the, all the different things you've done types of training and you've done everything, what would you say are the most valuable lessons that you've learned along the way? I think we kind of touched on it earlier, but I'd say like the, I never realised like the confidence it would give you, you know? Like, I think when something goes from being impossible to like having kind of ticked it off,

like knowing that you can apply that same thing to any area of your life, I think it's such a huge thing. And I think as well, it's starting out, like, it sounds so boring, but, like, learning how to make, like, sustainable changes. Like, I think when I started out, I used to kind of, you know, I'd see a program online and I go hell for leather. And that's what I thought was hard work.

But actually, what hard work is, like, being sensible about it, like, having an approach that you can sustain for years. Like, if you find, if you're doing something and it's hard to stick to for a week, like I said, like look, stick into that long term. So, yeah, I think just the confidence that it would give you and also like just approaching things in like kind of a sensible way. I know that sounds so boring, but yeah. Well, I think it's important because like the boring advice is usually the right advice.

And if it's extreme, it probably is a fad that is probably going to die. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, exactly. Another question that I wanted to ask is so we would have like a lot of, personal trainers listening to this podcast actually have a client who has now done her PT and a nutrition course and stuff like that so and she's going to start coaching so um in terms of your own career and coaching what advice would you have for any kind of aspiring coaches who are starting off

in terms of kind of the ups and downs of your career yeah and probably navigating through this weird industry yeah um i'd say like it's really important to have like mentors um so like people that you look up to that you really respect, have integrity, I would say, like, people are so willing to help you, people that you might not expect that you think, oh, like they're not even going to see my message. Like, people are so, so helpful and they want to kind of give you a leg up. So if you can get like a mentor or like, you know, someone that you can like just ask to jump on a Zoom call.

Like I did that with so many people. I used to, when I was in college, I emailed so many people like, can you not jump on a Zoom call with me? Like, I just want advice or whatever. And you'd be shocked at how much. people are willing to give how happy they are to give you advice and things so like definitely like always like see if you can have a couple of people in your corner that you can you know if you get a question and you don't know the answer that you can say okay I don't know the answer but let me get back to you and I'll

you know ask someone that I can get reliable advice or can point me in the right direction and yeah like just not being afraid to be wrong or to not know I think one of the worst things you can do is kind of pretend that you know what you're talking about when you don't because people like people can pick up on that straight away and I think oftentimes if you say oh I actually don't have a clue people will have a lot more respect for that answer because they know you're being straight with them and I think another thing as well when you're like working with clients is always be open to feedback like if you're doing forms or anything always give like a feedback form like really listen to any feedback you get any questions you're getting from

clients like really listen to that and like use that to like improve your your services. As well, I would say, like, another thing, like, someone gave me a really good advice as well as to, like, never, never, like, call yourself an expert or, like, you know it all. I guess it's, like, kind of the same thing as I was saying, but, you know, like, always just remember that you're constantly learning. And as well, like, another boring one, but, like, to keep up with your, like, professional development. So, like, you know, little things, there's webinars or, you know, new research or, like, you know, just, kind of keeping on top of those little things.

Like you don't have to be that regimented, but, you know, like, keeping an eye out for, like, really, like, reliable information, like, knowing where to get the reliable information, who to kind of, even on Instagram, like, there's really good people to follow for, like, you know, free webinars or, like, free CPD, things like that. So, like, try and keep on top of them as well,

because it's something you can easily just forget to do. You're like, oh, yeah, I'm qualified job done, box tics. But, like, you need to kind of keep on top of that learning and never kind of feel like, okay, I'm done now. I'm an expert, you know. I think there's loads of advice in there. I think even picking up from the first thing you said was like being willing to ask for help. I think that's huge.

And I think that can go for a boat in your career and bow, you know, in your fitness journey as well. Like the quicker you are comfortable with asking people for help, like the quicker you're going to progress. Yeah, absolutely. And like, yeah, just asking for help. Like people are so like, I feel like often people, really flattered when you ask them for help. So like they'll give you so much honestly. And even like business wise, like you never know that could lead to clients or something. And, you know, like I think as well, like even with working with clients, if you can like, um, like kind of give things without

expecting things back, like whether it's on Instagram or whatever, like if you can like add value to people without kind of expecting something in return, like that's just a kind of a good way to go about things. Especially if you're like trying to get your first few clients or whatever. If you can, you know, help people for free. And if you can, you know, help people for free. And if you you make an impact on them, they'll pass that on. You know, that's kind of, I'd say, like, I'm no expert now, but, like, that's the best marketing you can do is if you make a positive impact on someone, they'll tell their friend. And, like, that's better than any sort of, you know, marketing that you can do, really. Yeah. And the, the thing about being able to say, I don't know, like, that shows

a degree of confidence in yourself as well. I know when I started off my PT back, like, eight years ago. Like I was terrified of not being able to give the right answer with someone asked a question whether it was like about a certain diet or whatever it is. And now I'm a comfortable if someone asked me something being like, I don't know the answer to that. And I think that comes with with confidence in yourself of yeah as well. Yeah, exactly. I think the more you know, the more you're kind of confidently able to say, oh, I don't know because, you know, it doesn't bother you. But yeah, I think that's like also like a good opportunity to look into that and research. and say, okay, well, now I do know I'm going to look into that.

So like just always expanding your knowledge. Yeah. All right. Two last questions for you. All right. One, how do you define success professionally? And two, how do you define success personally? I think professionally, like, you could kind of go down a rabbit hole and think, oh, like,

if I'm making X amount a month or whatever. But I think for me, the biggest thing is like the impacts that you have on people. and that might not be like hundreds or thousands of people but if you can make a positive impact on one person or you know if you get a client that says like you've you know like you've changed my life like that for me like is just like that's why I do what I do if someone says like oh my god I've changed this I never thought I could do this or you know like my confidence is so much higher like that for me is like professional success like making an impact on people and just improving people's lives and and I I think personally like I don't know I think personal success I think it's not like any big

goal I think it's you know waking up in the morning excited to like get up into your day or going to bed and thinking yeah that was a good day that's what I was going to ask yeah I was going to say all right what does your what does your perfect day look like what do you enjoy doing yeah yeah no I think like if you can go to bed and think, yeah, like maybe not like unbelievable. If you kind of think, yeah, like today was a good day and like I'm looking forward to doing that again tomorrow. I think that's like what success looks like to me. It's so simple. It is simple.

I always say that to clients as well. It's like, like you just want to make, you know, if you're a perfect day looks similar to what you do now, like you're winning. Yeah, exactly. I think when people actually go through it, like they realize that like a lot of the things that bring them the most joy are really like simple things like going for a while. enjoy work, go for a coffee, see their friends, whatever it is. Yeah, your cup of tea in the morning, whatever. Yeah, yeah. Look, this is being brilliant.

If people wanted to reach out for you in terms of help with their nutrition, they're training, and maybe they're prepping for a competition, where can they find you? How can they reach out to you? How can they work with you? Yeah, so the easiest place to get me is probably my Instagram. So it's Keir, the nutritionist. It's felt kind of funny.

So maybe just link you here in the show notes or something so people can click on it. Yeah, if they're not Irish, they're not going to understand. Yeah, even if you're Irish, you probably won't be able to spell it. Karen, this is being unbelievable. I really appreciate your time today. Thanks so much for having me. Thanks for watching. If you like that episode and you want to see more content like this, make sure you're subscribed and I'll see you on the next one.