The Uneducated PT Podcast - Ep.160 The normal one - Conor Nolan

Episode Date: May 21, 2026

Episode 160 of the podcast features Conor Nolan for an open conversation around anxiety, depression, powerlifting, and mental health. We talk about the role training can play in managing stress, building confidence, and creating structure during difficult periods, while also discussing the realities of mental health struggles that many people face behind the scenes. Conor shares his experiences with powerlifting, mindset, discipline, and the importance of speaking honestly about mental health. A grounded conversation with real insight, perspective, and plenty of relatable moments throughout.

I'm busy talking about my life. Yeah, we're just talking about Chair has his own little, his own little team now to, you know, help him survive life. He has a nutritionist. He has a therapist. He has a PT. He has, you've a business coach as well, don't you? Oh, I have a business coach as well, yeah.

Fuck, geez, man. I have too many. I need all this just to keep me fucking level-headed. Do you know what we were talking about, Con? And you'll be the best man to ask about this, because I was looking at, I was looking at your lifts the other day were envy.

I was like, look at that man just benched 140 like it's nothing. I was like, oh, my God. Like, so Jair's thinking about signing up with, what's the, what's the reasoning behind signing up if you do, if you do get a,

well, big thing for me is, well, obviously the accountability, but more so I'm using my brain all the time that I just want to be told what to do. With your training? With my training.

It's a task I don't want to be focusing on, even though I said it to you. I enjoy doing the shit exercises that people hate. Like, we were talking about my seven, I have a call with him tonight. And he was like, you like Xerkers and Bulgarians. And I was like, yeah, give me all the awful stuff. But I just don't want to have to spend that time planning workouts. But do you want, do you want to like focus on still getting stronger? Yeah.

Like I want, like, you were talking about being envious. of Khan's bench. I was watching these fucking pull-ups and I was like, oh yeah, now that's nice. I want to be able to be...

How did you get so strong? Do you know what's funny, right? So, because like, I haven't competed in about two or three years and like, a lot of, would say,

people who started to follow me in that time, would say in the time since don't know that I have this like past life. And the amount of people who've been like, oh my God,

you're really strong. And I'm like, cheer you on really. I'm like, in my prime. I'll tell you what I used to play football and like was terrible at it

and I started like lift him when I was about 15 or 16 I was just like oh if I can be stronger I'll be a better player and then I got to like 17 and like I wasn't I would say I had caught up with everyone around me like size wise

but the time I was 17 I was mentioned 100 kilos and I realised by that point I was like football isn't for me I was like if I've got any kind of sporting talent it's clearly somewhere in the strength or bodybuilding kind of area and then I did like my first power lift to meet when I was 18 I remember I was 78 kilos

and I benched 135 so like I've been top heavy for a long time yeah yeah yeah 78 kilos in your bench and what were you benching what were you benching? So there's so what you're saying is that I still have hope there's still hope for me

that's what I am and I'm like I want to get to there but it's funny like it's It's funny because I hit like, I got to a, I did a competition two days before my 20th birthday, and I wanted to like, I wanted to bench press 150 and I wanted to delift 250 while I was still technically a teenager. And I got it. But like, my best since is 155.

Like, you taper off and like, I don't think I'll ever get to 160. It's just, it's like you hit this kind of. Yes. Barrier, you know what I mean? Like, to me, walking into the gym right now and benched 140 feels fine. But to hit 150, I'd have to like do six weeks of press. Joe, like, it's like a mental barrier there. But no, like, throughout college for a long time,

like when I was in college, my love to look back, I had no knowledge of nutrition. I had no knowledge of any of that. I just was like, oh, train hard and that'll do. And like I only got like a guy called Martin Reedy with my coach for a couple of years. Martin's incredible. And like I had him between, I'm 27 now.

So when I was between 23 and 25, I was with Martin. And that was the first time I probably started learning about nutrition. And that's what took me like, I got to like, we'd say nationals, the IP. and that kind of stuff. So it is like, for a long time, I thought, oh, it's just train hard. And then you begin to realize as you get older, like, no, the sleep and the diet is 90% of it.

And even at that, sleep was still my downfall because I'm a very active person mentally. I always have to be doing something. I found it so hard to just like stop and relax and let the body not be stressed. So that was kind of a downfall as well. But I think a lot of it is like, I was actually, I was in the gym with my brother yesterday. it and I was saying like in a bench press you know you bring the bar down to your like mid-chest and push back up I was like

if I just dropped the bar without even thinking about it it would land in the right place because you've done that many hundreds and thousands of reps it's become a habit so there's definitely a lot of that too like I hadn't deadlifted in about two years but you sort of click back into it it's like that thing a ride in a bicycle you kind of remember how to

do it and so yeah that's a very long way in the answer but yeah was there any was there you know like you said so if you want to get to them type of numbers you're basically your your whole life is surrounded by that like you're thinking about in terms of all right you're you're in you're doing your training sessions but then also you have to go home you have to think about your nutrition you have to think about sleep you have to have you know be on point with your lifestyle so it's not just the two hours in the gym

it's the it's everything outside what was there was there ever a point then when you kind of you you peaked in terms of the lifts that you were lifting and then obviously you pulled back It was a hard, is it hard to kind of sometimes get back going in terms of that. Like, I suppose it's, I suppose you, you don't train at that intensity now anymore anyway. You probably just train. No, no. Yeah. I just train enjoy it.

Yeah, like, I would say I used to train like four times a week. Like, say now when I was competing, I would say three years ago, training four times a week. Like, I remember, like, I remember the last bulking phase I was doing like 4,300 calories a day. And like, I was in the office and work bringing in, like, a bag of food with me. Everyone was dying laughing at this, this is mad to see, like, you know. And then even like, trying to eat that much, not only if you have your meal prep,

not only you have that kind of hassle, the body's also digesting a lot. So, like, that's tiring as well. And so there's a, what I think what happens with powerlifting or kind of stress sports in general, there's so much mental bandwidth that goes into it that's not seen.

So you've got your sleep, but you've also got that thing of like, if you're in a prep for competition and you're going into like a heavy bench press, you're thinking about that one lift all day. And then if that doesn't go to plan, you're then going to fucking agonize over it all night. So that, I think towards the end, that was what started to get to me.

Like, I began to realize I'm like, okay, there's a lot of effort required here to PB by like two and a half kilos. And I think I'm kind of getting to a, not a dead end, not a defeatist way, but I was like, I've gotten to the nation's level. To go to an international level is going to take so much out of me. I have other things I want to do. I think I'm just going to kind of kind of stop here. And it was like kind of like accepting kind of like, yeah, I'm going to just enjoy this now. And that was a lovely transition to like going to the gym and enjoy it rather than seeing it as like another job kind of thing. Yeah, that makes that makes perfect sense.

Also, it's like you said, you've other things that you want to do. It probably takes its toll in terms of you don't really have a life outside of that because that is the main priority on the goal. Exactly. That's the thing. And again, a lot of that is to do with like if you're trying to track all you're eating and do all this kind of stuff, you're kind of, you're held back from you can't just go here and go there and do things. off the cuff, whereas now, like, I train to enjoy, I eat as well as I can, but I have no problem, you know, I'll meet friends for dinner, I'll go here, I'll go there, whatever. I, I'm not,

excuse me, I'm not worried or panicking if I'm not hitting X amount of macros and, you know, I don't even think about that anymore. So definitely that's, I think there's a lot more enjoyment now in life in general. Don't get me wrong, I enjoyed the process completely, but you have to be, you're all in and that's it. Like that's, yeah, and you kind of have to accept that. And it does take away from your social life a bit. And that's something I've enjoyed getting back in some sense. Yeah, you can think about the nostalgia of the time of doing it and being really strong. But then if you really were like, oh, well, I give this another go, then you have to think actually, if I really think about it.

Because everyone thinks about the goal, but no one ever thinks about the sacrifices that surround the goal. 100%. And that's kind of, like, I still enjoy the gym, but I accept in my head that I'm never going to PB a 1 rep max ever again. I'm never going to squat 227 I'm never going to deadlift 260 I'm never going to bench press 155 that's happened that's gone that's it

Wait was your squat Was your squat heavier than your deadlift? No no 227 was my squat 262 was my deadlift Jesus Christ I love your talk about nostalgia of lifting being strong just casually going in doing 140

on the bench If no one's watched these kind of You're a secret oxman Like every time you go to the lift I'm like this fucker here It's so funny, isn't it? It's so funny because you love the kind of paradox. Well, maybe, well, kind of.

It's like, because, like, Connor talks all about mental health and emotions and feelings. And then you just don't expect then, boom, he just comes into the gym and just bench presses 140. Like, it's nothing. It's something, that's kind of a narrative that I've loved challenging is like, you know, a hill I'll die on is that there's nothing soft about mental wellbeing. That's a fucking, that's a. that's beyond my gravestone, like that kind of thing. So yeah, I've loved challenging that, absolutely.

Yeah, it's great. Right, tell us what's been going on in your life lately. Obviously, we'll go into mental health and we'll go into your past and stuff like that. But what's what's 2026 being like for Conor Nolan? Mad. Because it's funny, I remember I was chatting when I left my job last September. And best decision I ever met. And what was funny, like, I wasn't telling you this, actually.

Within two weeks. So, Jerry, your event was on the Saturday. I had left the job Friday. That was an amazing, what a way to cap off leaving the job. But I came home and I was like, there was no immediate clan. I knew I wanted to work in schools. I knew what I wanted to do. I had half an idea in my head of doing a PhD,

a few different things of this, but nothing was set in stone. And then I had done some work with BodyWise, with the Eat and Sort Association of Ireland, with say making a bit of like program content and that kind of stuff. And I was talking to Fiona and BodyWise, who's now my manager, I said to her, I was like, come here. If there's anything else going on like this, you know, let me know I'd love to be involved and trying to make this a full-time thing.

And then she said to me, she goes, well, look, we do workshops in schools. We've got quite a, it's quite in demand and we've waitless there. Would you like to give our workshops for us? And I was like, oh, this is fucking lined up very, very well. So that was within two weeks of leaving the job. Now, I couldn't start straight away, because you have your guard of Etton and so on. So I started there in January, and I've literally been on there. I've been in 43 schools.

since the new year. So like it's just been mad. I've done, I think I've done something like 30,000 kilometres around the country since, since January, and I have loved every bit of it. So I've just been in schools,

I've been giving presentations on body image, eating disorder awareness, all that kind of stuff. It's been madness. Loved it. What's the, what's the feedback being like

from the schools and what's, you know, in terms of the, what's the age category that you're talking to? So like we do all year groups. I find like, we'd say third year and up is the sweet spot.

You know, second year is grand, first year is go over their head a little bit. What we would do is we'd never, we wouldn't talk to first years unless they're in like the second term of the year or they're getting that bit older. But the feedback from teachers have been fantastic. The best bit of feedback I got, I was in a school in Kavan and these was these third year students. And these lads came in and they looked at like the title on the board and they saw the presentation. And they couldn't have looked less interested if they tried.

And I couldn't blame them because again, it's not for everyone. And they came in and they sat down and I gave the presentation and as they were leaving I just heard one day to the other he goes, that was actually quite good and then one of them shook my hand and I was like oh that's the best feedback I'm ever going to get because if you can get

I find because of the topic involved I feel that girls will kind of tune into it a bit more easily. You have to convince the lads that this applies to them too and that's a big part of the presentation. So like for me when lads that have no interest are leaving, haven't taken something from it, That for me is the pinnaker, I suppose.

Okay. So go ahead, Rob. From your talk in Limerick a little while back, I think what I picked up from that is, I'm not surprised that those boys were interested. I think a lot of the time, people that have come in historically in my schools that I've been, like, studied at,

people would come in and they'd be a bit hesitant and they wouldn't be that engaging. It would be like, right, we know medically, we need to mention this, this, this and this. And it's a bit of a tick box. whereas you came in enthusiastic you had your own stories

that linked really well to it you clearly had an enthusiasm about it and when guys see other guys opening up about vulnerable things but in a confident way I think guys are really like that's something

that we really hold on to I think 100% because it's one of those things like anyone can stand there and like you say they're rob tick boxes and you know talk about the statistics and the facts and so on

but like I'm a big fan of stand-up comedy because I think stand-up comedy is a good example of you can have a great joke but your delivery is what makes it and like I've been complimented on delivery thus far like you know you can have the best presentation in the world but if you can't deliver it right especially to a young audience it's it's not going to matter and I find funny like when you talk about public speaking you know a TED talk is considered the pinnacle but what I find funny like when you watch TED talks it's very very slow and precise and of course part of that is because you've got an international audience English isn't everyone's first language.

But if you took that style and went into a school in Longford with a load of 14 year olds with that kind of long pauses, you could fucking eat in the life. And I find like, again, the tension span, our attention span is bad enough. For kids it's even worse. And I find when I stop to sip water for three or four seconds,

by that fourth second, someone starting to fidget. So for the entire hour, you're nonstop. And that's why you're fucked after it, but you have to keep that pace going to keep them engaged. And I think they kind of, they definitely respect that because by the end they can see like whenever I do the last slide I kind of go

and they're all like oh yeah well done well done like you know what do you find that they're relating to most when you're given the presentation and actually just for the listeners like what are what are you speaking about because obviously we all know what we're what you're talking about but if the listeners won't so I'd be starting off as you're talking about would say

eating disorders so kind of the facts around that again the big misconceptions there's several different types of eating disorders it's not just anorexia it doesn't just involve weight loss excuse me the fact that you know, there's no one shape or size to an ekeness order. Every case can be different. So starting off with that.

And then within that, then, you know, I'd go into like, say, like body dysmorphia and the pressure on, we'd say, particularly young people around appearance, that pulls in a bit of social media, you know, so like for girls, I always give the example of, you know, the perfect body back in the 2000s was being as slim as possible. And then the perfect body in the 2010s was going to the gym and building muscle. And now you've got skinny talk. And I'm like, the perfect body keeps coming. and go, you know, this kind of stuff. So highlighting that kind of idea there,

kind of bring in more into body image then, and then within body image, I'd have a lot of stuff on social media. And that's what I find really draws everyone in because, you know, you're explaining to them, this whole thing that's like so much, so much of what you see isn't real. Because again, they don't realize that when they're young. And like, the best story I have for them is there was a podcast I was on in Dublin last year, and I won't give away names. But as I was walking into the studio, the previous guest was walking out. And I didn't know who he was, but he was some kind of a lifestyle influencer. And I was talking to the, to the guys who were hosting.

And they were like, geez, yeah, he was a, he was a disaster at interview. And I was like, what do you mean? And they were like, well, he kept stopping and stark and trying to give like perfect answers to every question. So like the audience here, this perfect like Aristotle interview. But in reality, he was stuttering his way to these answers. And then when I look this guy up, he had this like Kardashian style lifestyle. And I'm like, I'm after walking past a perfectly normal man in the hallway. This kind of thing of like, you can't believe everything you see.

And then the kind of thing of, you know, so much imagery you see online, it's, it's cameras, it's lighting angles, it's studio conditions, you know, all this kind of stuff. And again, like, I love the fitness industry, but this is something that young people have to be aware of. Like, if you stand in a poorly lit room and you're comparing yourself to someone's photo shoot pictures, that is not a realistic comparison. You know, so that, and I find that bit is what really draws everyone in. That kind of gets everyone towards the end, that kind of stuff. Do you find that with social media, like obviously you're speaking to a certain age category, right, turn years and up? But I suppose even some of the statistics I've seen where young girls and boys as well are suffering with body image issues younger and younger now. And I suppose, you know, everyone having the access to the entire world in their hand at a very young age is obviously contributing.

that. Yeah, like, like, I know it was the thing bought in there in Australia in recent months that they banned social media for under 16s. Like, I said this in the school the other day. I was like, it was a first year class. I was like, he's all going to hate me, but I'm going to say this. If they bring in that law in Ireland, I'm in favour of it. Because when I think back, like,

I was 12 or 13 getting diagnosed with anorexia. That was back in 2011. You know, Facebook was a thing, but smartphones weren't really in yet. And I look back and I'm like, thank God there was no Instagram then, because I'd have been fucking, I'd have been frazzled, there'd have been no hope at all. you know, I dread to think what that would have been like.

So it is, you've got this young impressionable audience and then you put, they've got the word in their hands. So a big thing I talk about there is like, well, I recommend they all watch that documentary, the social dilemma, because again, it's understanding how the algorithm works and so on. And then I show them like, you know, the different settings you have for, you know,

you can remove certain topics from your feed on Instagram, remove certain hashtags. Because at the end of the day, telling young people not to scroll, it's like telling water not to be witch. because if we scroll, they're going to scroll as well. So it's like, how can you scroll, keep what you enjoy, the funny stuff,

entertainment, whatever it is, but minimize the downside. So that's a big thing as well. And I feel like, the reaction from teachers there was mad. They were like, we never knew this was a thing. I'm like, I didn't know these tools existed until a year ago as well. So there's so much social literacy there that's missing for students, teachers, parents, all that kind of stuff. I think that's something that we need to improve on, you know,

as a nation 100%, because as I say, we have this very powerful tool. we have to know how to use it in the safest, most ethical way of possible. Absolutely. I also think your age with your level of experience in the eating disorder world is great to have coming into schools. Because we've all had different people come in when we were in school giving us talks. And generally they weren't under the age of 45.

Yeah, yeah. Having someone 27 coming in with your level of experience in that world is a huge thing. It makes it a lot easier for them to relate inside in the classroom, I'm listening to you. But that's something as well because again, whenever I get to the social media section, I always say, look, I'm like,

disclaimer, not going to start giving out about this because I know your parents are all used, you know, you hear that from parents, grandparents. I make the point that like my age group, a very particular position where we grew up without the internet, but then it all came in very quick. And I always say to like students, Ireland in 2007 or eight versus Ireland in 2015,

like that is two very different worlds. You went from the RTE guide to Netflix. You went from landline phones to smartphones. That was a rapid change. And so I'm like, the internet is good. We now have Spotify. We don't need CDs. We now have Netflix.

We don't need TVD players. I'm just old enough to remember like VCRs and videos and so on. Like that gets a good laugh in schools. Like, so we can't deny how convenient things have become. So like I'm in favour of the internet. Again, we're talking on a Zoom call here. We're in favour of all this. But being aware of the bad sides that are coming from social media or whatever it is.

So it's like starting off on the positive note of I'm a fan of all this, but there are downsides that. we have to be aware of. Yeah, I was just trying to look up that. I remember when I was talking about this myself in terms of like, young kids having so much access to content. And I remember I was touching on a girl, Molly Russell. She was only 14.

And yeah, and she was just constantly bombarded with, because you know the way with the algorithm, it's like if you, if you're intrigued in something and then the next month, minute it gets pushed at you more and more and more. And before you know it, you're down a rabbit hole. And she was down that rabbihole of looking at content about self harm and depression and all that stuff. And I think there was like a ridiculous amount of content that was pushed at her on

Instagram and Facebook, which obviously contributed to her taking her life of 14 when her dad found her in her room. And I'm like, yeah, they did like kids like at that, at 14 years of age, like you don't have the self-awareness to be like, this is not, this is not helping my mental health. And, you know, it's, it's probably just too, it's too powerful for them to, um, be trying to have their own personal responsibility to protect themselves from this. A hundred percent. And again, there's a couple things there, like, you know, like I'm 27 now, like that whole thing that your, your brain doesn't fully develop your 25. Yeah. And when I look back at being 23, 20, 18, I can

see like, steps of difference there, especially in terms of self-awareness. And I'm like, God, go back to 13, 14, like, personally, like, I don't know, was I was, I was, I was a very naive, like child, but like, no self-awareness at all. Like, I was one of those kids. My friends had internet and I didn't. And, like, there was double meanings and stuff that I didn't get and so on. So in some sense, it was almost like blissfully. But you're right. There's two things there.

Number one, there's, there's a thing there of anyone who creates content, whether it be in the fitness world or whatever it is, you have an obligation to your audience to be as transparent and as helpful and as ethical. and as ethical as possible. And of course, with that kind of content there, you know, that's far from it. And then also, I suppose it does stress, I know this is almost impossible. How do you moderate this kind of stuff? How do you, and I remember seeing

it was almost kind of like insider anonymous type shows on Snapchat. It was like someone who used to work as a Facebook moderator and, you know, would be deleting, you know, videos that couldn't go on the algorithm. And they were saying it was some of the most psychological, psychologically damaging work in the world because they were removing videos that were just awful, you know? So like, it's, it's a, I think the other problem there as well is

there's not enough repercussion for those that are posting harmful content. That's a big problem as well, you know, and not even would say just with that, even with let's say like, we all know the fair share of misleading information in the fitness industry. There's no repercussion there for people who are leading people Australia there for profit or whatever it is. So that's another problem as well. Yeah, and I think even the, the social media, companies themselves like a lot of like a lot of the stuff you see on social media now isn't even creators it's it's AI you see so many um like fake um videos going around now of like transformations of this person has become went from this to this and you know a certain amount of time and it's not

even a real person it's it's it's a fake AI and then they're selling programs and stuff on the back of that so just creates even more of an unrealistic expectation of what the body's supposed to look like and what the body can do and that obviously puts pressure on and everyone, especially kids. 100%. And it's funny, like, you know, we think back to, we'd say, just, we said pre-AI, where we were dealing with Photoshop and airbrush and so on.

And we were saying, geez, this is a fucking problem. And now we're like, God, that's a fucking, that's, that's, that's intermediate problem compared to what we have now. Isn't it funny how it just gets worse and worse the time goes on back? You know, we have our hands full. And what, so what do you think, in regards to, like, the kids that you're speaking to,

Do you get to have like conversations with them even after the talks or anything like that? Like does anyone reach out and say like, oh yeah, this is something that I'm relating to it? Like, do you get feedback from them in regards to especially the young boys? Because I know it would be hard to kind of get them to open up. I know it helps when you're being very transparent with them. And if you're relatable, they may, but also, you know, you know what young boys are like. Yeah. Yeah. So we'd always give like, for the first thing we'd always do is you give time for a Q&A, you know,

general. But again, it's, it's, it's, it's, there will be some students that will ask questions in front of everyone, but again, that is minimum. And then I always say at the ground of the door, I'm like, if you want to speak to me one to one on your way out, that's grand, you know, just a quick question. And I've had a lot of people come up to me there. I had one guy come up to me recently and he was saying that he was struggling with binge eating. He thanked me for the presentation and, you know, told me what he was doing. You know, another girl who came up to me, and she had a history with an eating disorder. And she said, you know, she said, I want to thank you. This is very, you deliver this very well. It's very trigger friendly. Like, I felt very

comfortable in this, you know, that kind of thing. And what we do then as well is like, you know, I'd always say to teachers, if students have, because students might think of a question there and then, but they might think of something three or four days later. And I always say, look, if students have follow-up questions, feel free to send them on, we can answer them, or it could also be something that we need to incorporate into the presentation in future. Like, it's mad. Like, I remember one of the questions I always ask the students, I say to them, like, you know, what factors do you think affect a young person's body image? So social media is a big one, bullying, all this goes on. And then a set.

second year student one day and this knocked me sideways. She says, oh, when adult actors are playing teenage characters in television and I was like, Bravo, I had never called that. That's a good one. That's a problem. Like an American, like your high school musical, your American TV, like you're, again, like Coach Carter. You've got 15, 16, 17 year old that's being played by Channing Tatum,

who I think was 26 in that film. Like that is ridiculous. Like that's, and you've got young lads 15, 16, comparing themselves to that. And I always say to young, lads, I'm like, don't dare compare yourself to, because again, there should be a disclaimer from Hollywood saying, oh yeah, by the way, yeah, this character is 17, but the actor playing them as a mortgage. Like, there's never that disclaimer, that kind of thing. And so I always say, the thing I really

lead with young men is I say, look, I'm a big fan of the Olympics, because the Olympics is a great example of, you've all these different sports, and every body type is different. So the ropey player, the javelin, the soccer player, every body type is different. And that thing of different sports require different attributes. They're all elite athletes, but they all look different. So say that to young men. I'm like,

if you play a sport, that's great. If you don't, that's 100%. The whole thing of everyone's different. The size of your shoulders or how much you can bench press or this kind of stuff,

it's not a defining element. Some people might be naturally stronger. Some people might play rugby or others play soccer. And it's that kind of thing of like, I suppose, being comfortable in your uniqueness. I think that's a very, very important thing

that young people need to hear. And again, I suppose I always say to them, I'm like, you know, having competed in powerlifting, and I have friends, who have never set foot in a gym in their lives. The social media idea is that, oh, that must make me a better man than them.

And I'm like, that's absolute bullshit. That's not true at all. But that's the idea you're given from social media that somehow what you can overhead press or what you can bench press, that's a defining element of you as a person and that couldn't be further from the truth. That's a real thing I stress with them as well, 100%.

Was it you who I was having this conversation about, even with young people in sports? And I suppose it's probably the same way, with adults as well is that a lot of them are struggling with eating disorders and body image issues and they feel confident in their bodies when they're

playing their sport but we talked about this we talked about that chair we talked with this on the pod that like your your comfort zone is when you're on the field I think I related it to swimming the moments of taking off your clothes on the side of the beach and walking to the

water as soon as you're in the water all those thoughts are gone but when you come back out of it that brain switch is on so like an athlete going out onto a field someone might call them a fat bastard down the road

and they'll get really upset someone calls them that in the field two seconds later they've run over them and they're still fucking running on high confidence yeah yeah it's a fantastic exactly thing I suppose when you're when you're in that arena where you feel best where you feel most confident and like

like for me there was a gym there was a gym there was called DGIM and it was known locally is like a real influencer type gym. And like, I would walk in there and like, you know that, you know the south part thinking your boy carrying his balls in the wheelbarrow.

Like you feel like that. But if I was to bump into, if I was to bump into some of like, particularly the girls, if I was to bump into them on a night out or in a pub, I fucking shit myself. Like, you know,

it's that kind of thing of, it's kind of like the thing of like, oh, well, we're in here. It's been like the judge in the courtroom. You're like, this is my arena and I feel best in here. You know, I feel at my most confident in here.

And like, you know, when matter what gym you're in, if you're hitting heavy 100 maxes, people will come over and say, oh, well done, or chat to you or whatever. And so you have that feeling of confidence. But then like that, the moment you walk out of it, if you bumped into them in a supermarket or in a pub or a social setting, you'd fucking crumble.

And like, again, there's been memes about this for years. It's like, you know, the sort of the highly athletic person, especially a male, but who still is socially anxious, socially awkward, or just, you know, they're a great meme. Let me share you. Let me share you this meme. It was like, I seen it literally the other day. Like, once I get, once my biceps are a little bit bigger, she'll come back to me.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Oh, man, man. No, I'm starting on, right? Like, there was a point years ago, like, there was someone I was dating. And we're, we're friends now, right? We've gotten past this. But, like, we went in a couple of dates. It didn't work out.

And I thought, literally, I was like, I bet she'd go off now with a guy who's bigger. Like, this kind, and it's like, it doesn't matter. No one cares. Do you know what I mean? like fuck me like she's about five foot three and like about 50 kilos i'm like she's not going no i need 90 plus not 83 no she's not saying that but you get it into your head it's like oh if i met five grand more or if i could bench press this much more then it would work out like no and that's that's a massive thing to learn i've learned that in this one's dating and so sudden said in the last few years

it's like who we are as people is what wins wins people over it's not it's not you're not you're not loved based on metrics if that makes sense but yeah that's that that's and i think that's a big thing that lads like when I was 15 16 it was like oh if I go to the gym now this will change everything because I was a very awkward enough child and you do that by the time I was age you know like the biggest lad in the year but still incredibly socially awkward still you know still very very not shy but like not comfort not as comfortable in myself as you would expect me to be if you saw me walking down the streets I think that's a big problem avoid between emotional comfort in yourself versus how comfortable you feel in the athletic arena, absolutely.

It's a hard one to navigate, isn't it? Oh, 100%. Oh, big time. Especially in secondary school as well, because obviously guys kind of, like when I was at secondary school, I think, so we were taller than the girls, and then like year, seven, year eight, all the girls just shot up, like, a foot taller than you. Welcome to my world, baby.

I was about to say, I don't experience that either. And, like, yes, the girls developed, and like you were saying about Channing Tatum, in Coach Carter, you expect yourself to look like that, and then you're just like, I'm so small in comparison. But then you kind of get a little bit taller. I assume you did a little bit, Cal. And like it just,

the belief around appearance and things like that in secondary school is a very vulnerable one, which I think that's great why you're great that you're going into schools and talking about that because your belief system is just getting, like, especially around the age of 13, 14, 15, your brain connections don't have a clue what they're doing.

So like getting some safe evidence and approval for one of a better word from people like yourself. I think that's a really good thing for... It's funny there because between, let's say, and I always give an example, like, thinking about that, between 13 and 16, like, puberty happens at different rates for

everyone. And it's a bit of a lottery. Like, if you end up five foot 10 10 at the age of 15, you're fucking winning. But like, it's out of your control. It's luck at the draw. And like, you know, like for me, like I was partially because of anorexia being underweight. My height was held back for quite

a while, like, you know, I didn't kind of sprout up. I went from 5'3 to 5.9, like, but you know, that didn't happen until I was about maybe 16 or 70. So there is that kind of thing of like you are in that almost like lottery, but that's one thing I know, there's a phrase I love, our appearance is the least

interesting thing about us. And that's, I love that phrase and I think young people have to hear that. Honour, did you ever read the game by Neil Strauss? No, no. It's a great book. It's quite an old book, but it kind of, now I'm not saying for a young person to go read the game. It's basically about a pickup artist to, you know, goes around sleeping with every, every beautiful woman on the planet.

But his name's Neil Strauss and he's short. He's probably shorter than me. He's bald. He's skinny. For every kind of metric of like attractiveness that you would, you know, put on a man and all the things like, oh, that that lad's taller than me. That's why he has that girl and I don't. Oh, that's bigger than me.

He has all these muscles and I don't. Oh, that lot has a full head of hair. Whatever it is. Like, he breaks down all them, you know, them barriers to entry to, to, to talk to women because he is this, you know, person that you would never, you would never associate with, like that this is the,

the ultimate player or the ultimate man who can get on the planet. And yet he does that. And it's, it's, yeah, he's, and he's really, obviously he, he, he, he obviously walked away from that life and he knew that he was just trying to fill a voyage for the emptiness and so on and so forth. And he writes like really, really interesting books now and he's just a great writer. But yeah, it goes to, it breaks down all them kind of them limiting beliefs that you have about yourself that, oh, you know, you're not loved because you're too short or you're too skinny or you're not smart enough or whatever, whatever the story is that you're telling yourself. no 100%

because one thing there I know the dating world gets a bad rap and we could talk about that for hours but one thing that relationships do very well if you've got anything

you're struggling with mentally and a relationship is going to expose it and there's a woman who I'm a big fan of Sadia can and I think she's phenomenal I think every man and woman should give her a listen because like I didn't realize and it wasn't like I started listening to her

and it wasn't like I wanted to get better at dating I was like I wanted to learn more about patterns here. I was noticing like similar things happen in relationships. And I began to realize like, oh my God, low self-esteem plays a massive role in a relationship. That whole thing of like boundary setting and valuing yourself and all that kind of stuff. And it was broken down kind of like so simply. And I was like, okay, this makes sense. If you're not valuing yourself first, well then whether it's whether it's work colleagues or relationships, you know, you have to value yourself first in order for others to do the same. That whole thing of like you can't be loving as you love yourself first.

And that kind of thing was so helpful to learn. It's like how our mental health or self-perception affects every relationship and bond that we have 100% like. Yeah. Well, that's the thing, isn't it, in relations, if you have any, like, real insecurity, like, let's say, all right, you're, you're, you feel like you're too skinny or whatever. And you're in a relationship with someone and you're walking down the road with that girl. And, you know, some lad who's in great shape walks past. And then your head will go straight to, oh, my girlfriend fancies him because he's bigger. and me and then you can create conflict

true then that's just a pattern in your head that, you know, it didn't need to be there. Yeah, yeah, you're creating scenes in your head that Quentin Tarantino will be proud of like, you know, it's your, you're just, it goes from zero to 100 and like, you know, and your partner is there unaware of this, completely

unbeknown, and like, it's funny then, because when that's not funny, it's, it's gas how it happens, it's like, you know, something bubbles up in someone's head and the other person is completely unaware, and then it boils over and they're like, oh my God, I had no idea this was going on. And again, the right person would reassured there

and do all those lovely things. But it is, it's crazy how we can create narratives and scenarios in our own, our own heads. I know it was it, I know because Carol Angier, you both share those kind of memes. It's like, oh, I can't, I'm busy today. I'm imagining how things could go wrong. Or it was a meme like that, you know, that kind of thing.

But we do. And it burns, it takes so much out of us, like, it really does. Yeah. Catastrophising, man. It's my favourite thing to do. Oh, man, I'm telling you. I planned every scenario that will go over. wrong. So it can only get better.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. I've seen what hell looks like. I can only go up from here. Rock bottom has a basement. Yeah, yeah. You're the young Mr. Burns, he's like, I had to start from the bottom, but to get to the bottom, I had to work my way up

for moves. God, you said about basically, you know, we're eating disorders, it doesn't have a certain look. Well, I know we're a lot of kind of in the personal training space, a lot of people will say things like, um, you know, focusing on what your body can do and not what your body looks like and focus on performance over appearance. And obviously that can be very helpful for people a lot of time.

But you, you were even doing that in powerlifting and then you were still going through these struggles with, with an eating disorder. Can you kind of explain them to kind of that conflicting information. Yeah. So there's a couple of things there. So first of all, I think a lot of people, I remember talking to a fellow once, and I was on a cut, right?

And again, talk about someone sneaking in with a great story. He, like, I had, I was cut and I lost about three kilos. And he was like, oh, I didn't have a cut myself last year. I was like, oh, what did you lose? He's like, I lost about 40 kilos. I was like, man, that's not a cut. That's a fucking transformation. And he was around 85 kilos. He lost a lot of weight.

And he was like, he was like yeah I realized it was a bit like that kind of thing he was like I realize I have no hope in dating unless I get in shape whatever and but like so that was kind of his starting motivation and then I said how do you feel now

he's like man I feel incredible like health wise energy wise he was like I might have started losing weight for appearance related reasons but I'm keeping this life still up because of how I feel I think so many people start a fitness journal they want to look better on their wedding day

or that kind of thing so they start for those kind of aesthetic goals and then they keep it going because they're like oh my God I feel incredible. And like, that's definitely where I'm at now, like, lifting, lifting and eating well to feel well. Because, like, one thing about it would say public speaking, it's so demanding, like, physically, you're fucked at the end of the day. So, like, you have to eat well to keep the energy levels up and all that kind of stuff. So I, I, that's my main goal now. And I'm lucky in the

sense that, like, I lost a lot of way when I was 13 with anorexia first hitch. I recovered very quickly. Thankfully, I didn't delve back into that kind of area any time since. I had other problems with anxiety. But like when I look at say between the ages of 18 and 25, they're competing in powerlifting. Objectively speaking, I was in great Nick. And on a conscious level, I knew that. I'm like, okay, I'm in very good shape. And especially like when I did a cut when I was 23 and I got down. I don't know what body fat percentage I was, probably not far off, maybe 12%. And I was like, objectively speaking, I was like, I'm in a great physical position here. But there was elements of, I wouldn't, I wouldn't say poor body image.

because I knew looking at the mirror, like, I know I'm in good condition. I think low self-esteem was a big thing that was at play there. And I think, like, low self-esteem is known as a risk factor for an eating disorder. But I think, especially among males, I think it plays a bigger role than people realize. And, like, one thing I have learned is that with low self-esteem, when I was younger, it was all about when I was, you know, oh, lose as much weight as possible. And then as I got about older, it was like, okay, now bench press as much as possible. And then it became, okay, how much money on my head?

making. And there was always a number or a metric or something. And it was like, I have to measure myself against something, be it some number or some measurement of some kind. And so something I've really had to challenge my own narrative on is, okay, I'm good enough the way I am. I can try and get better. That's fantastic. But I'm good enough the way I am. And I think one of the problems with low self-esteem is it looks like ambition. And the difference is the ambitious person wants more, but they can be content where they are. The person with low self-esteem, wants more, but they feel like they can't exist where they are. And it's that whole thing of you achieve something, you don't feel euphoria, you feel relief. And that's a massive, massive thing.

And so, yeah, I think like, there's a photo I always look back to, would say, about two and a half years ago, I was 87 kilos. I was the biggest and strongest I've ever been. I took this, like, selfie in a mirror and my quads were massive. And at the time, I was thinking, have to get bigger, have to squat 250, have to squat more, this isn't good enough. In my head, I was completely overlooking the fact that I had come 10th or 11th in my weight class in the country and I was like no top three goes to world championships until I'm there it's not good enough and on the outside looking in that's kind of like the all the kind of Kobe Bryant man the mentality great but when you can't sleep at night because you're like I'm not good enough until this happens that's extremely toxic like I always give

the example of on my 24th birthday I was in a graduate program as a software engineer and I had a 640 power lifting totally but if you ask me if you said to me Connor do you think you're smart and you you're strong, I would have said, no, I'm not smart until I make X amount of money a year, and I'm not strong until I lift for a hour at the world championships. And it's great to have those goals, but if you can't sit with yourself in the meantime, that's a disaster. And I think that's one thing I've realized in my own journey with an eating disorder and body image, self-esteem and how I view myself has played a massive role. So again, it's that thing of, you can objectively be in great shape or be strong, but what's happening in here is what makes

the difference because I'm not near as strong now as I was three years ago, but I feel far better in myself when I look in the mirror. I feel far better in myself when I'm going to bed at night. So it's that thing of like what's happening internally? What's the inner voice saying? And again, that's where the idea of George came from. You know, what's that inner dialogue looking like. And if you can get that in order, things will go a lot better because if you can get that in order, you're much less perturbed by what's happening externally, by what you're achieving and what you're doing, you know that kind of stuff. Yeah, you don't feel euphoria,

you feel relief. That is very, that is very good. I think that that's probably like a lot of people that you look at and you think, well, they're really high performers. You know,

they're really motivated. They're really ambitious. And a lot of people don't realize that. Actually, it's just, it's just fear driving them forward. 100%. The best example I can give, I, when I was a software engineer,

I did a graduate program. So you committed an interleven salary. You'd do two years, then you get a big fuck-off period. eyes overnight. And like when I got that, he had to submit X amount of course work and do whatever. When I got that pay rise, I took the day off six, I was burnt out. And I had this feeling of euphoria as like, I'm 24 and making this amount of year, I feel fantastic. And that feeling lasted exactly three days. I got the raise on a Tuesday and by Saturday, I was back to square one.

Because I was like, when my boss is a senior engineer or my colleague is this level and he's same age as me and he's at this level. So that, so no. And I was like, oh my God, we're straight back. to square woman. And I was kind of like, Jesus, no one can live like this because this is fucking exhausting. And you might end up 30 years of age making great money, but like no one can live like this. This is fucking, this isn't worth living. This is madness.

And so that was a real kick in the teeth of, I have to look at what's happening in here from an inner dialogue perspective. What is my idea of happiness? What is my idea of a life well lived, this kind of stuff? and like I'm in a position now where I'm like I'm doing the work I love and every single day

I get the chance to go out and have an impact and I'm not it doesn't matter how many students I speak to whether it's 10 or 110 or 510 I'm going out and I'm having an impact and I'm happy in the work I'm doing that so like that's been a big step forward Do you have any advice for anyone who is probably in that situation right now where they're pursuing goals whether that's a weight loss goal or a performance goal or a career goal

but they might be doing it from a place of fear rather than you know enjoyment yeah there was a phrase I heard recently which was if you ask why three times you get to the root of whatever the thing is so someone it was a

excuse me it was a person to train at home with this and he says you know someone could say I want to have a six pack why because I want to look good why and they says by the end you get to the third why you're getting to the root of it. And he said that in some cases for a felon, it could be all, I want to,

you know, go out in the poll. So, no, that's fine. If that's your, if that's your, if that's your, um,

motivation for wanting to look better, that's 100% as long as you're aware of it. And so, like, what's, my counsellor, right? This, this is scary stuff, right?

Four years ago, about, yeah, on the bottom four years ago. I was in my first year of my job. And I had started doing the mental health work kind of on the side, but I was in my software engineering job. And she said to me, she says,

in all therapy we've done, you've never mentioned your work. And I said, well, no, I really enjoy my job. And she goes, do you? I said, yeah. And she kind of looked at me, kind of smirk. And she went, Connor, she says, she was whatever you're doing with computers. I don't understand this. She was, whatever you're doing with computers, she says, I think you're trying to prove something to yourself.

And once you've proved it, you're going to hate that job. And I was like, no, no, no, no, no, I love the corporate world. And literally three years later, I was like, fuck, Denise was right. Because I was like, she was right. I got to whatever title it was, ever while, and then I realized, oh this doesn't this doesn't matter the work I should be doing has been out on the road and being in schools and so on and I text her when I quit the job I was like I was like have you a crystal of all like or what she's like no it was obvious she says it was clear that you she goes oh you were motivated but again it's that question of why the mental health and so on so I would encourage that question of why are you doing what you're doing and keep asking yourself that and again a really important thing here is some people would hear this and go oh that's um

that's a low achiever mentality. Someone who achieves a lot, just pushes and pushes and pushes. And it's like, no, no, no. If you love what you're doing, you'll do fantastic things

because it knows that phrase. If it's play to you and work to them, you'll fly. And so you have to keep back. Like, one of the reasons why I quit powerlifting was, I got to a stage where every competitor with me was a powerlifting coach.

And I was like, I'm a software engineer who moonlights is a fucking mental health public speaker. My career path isn't in this. For other competitors, for them doing well in a competition. was almost like an advertisement, whereas for me it was purely a hobby. And I'm like, I'm at a point now where not that I'm competing with professionals, but I'm competing

with people who this is a part of their business and so on. So my business of what I want to do is separate from this. So it was that thing of, I can keep powerlifting, but it's a lot of effort for a very, very small return, whereas the same amount of effort into public speaking and working in mental health would yield a far greater return and would feel far better for me. So that was example there of once I ask myself why I realized okay no my my path is is something different you know so I would say keep questioning question your motives and then kind of follow within that your gut will let you know the rest that's it I know that doesn't sound very scientific but I'm a big believer in like your gut will let you know because this whole last year since leaving the job I've been following the gut a hundred percent and it's

it's it's gone very well 100 percent what would you say to someone that says my gut's keep my gut keeps changing like one day it's this one day it's that or one year it's this and then next year it's that there's a bit there Sylvia Plath is a great poem I don't know what it's called but it's that thing of like it was about like there's a tree and there's all these plants on it and it's like it's like when you've got several potential roots and you have to pick one because if you don't pick one then the fruit will rot and there'll be no path for you so I think there's part of it there is especially if someone is I suppose capable in a few different areas. That's right. That's Rob.

You should be listening to that. This is why he's asked the question. It's partly why I'm asking it. It was for others as well, but partly for me. No, if you are, if you've got a couple of potential routes, that's kind of, it's tough because I go, well, I could do this well or I could do this well, but I have to pick something because there's a phrase,

you know, you've only got one hour so you can't ride two horses. And like for me, like I was trying to, I love that one. I was trying to, like three years ago, I was trying to be a software engineer, be a high level athlete, and be a mental ed public speaker. I was getting six hours sleep a night

and I was fucking burnt out. You know, it's that thing if you can't do everything. And like that was my realization 12 months ago of, I can keep being a software engineer and keep trying to be a public speaker, but if this goes on for 12 more months,

one is going to take away from the other and something has to happen now. So where do you think that in the size of miss comes from for some people? For me, for me, for example, with leaving the job, a lot of it was like that kind of Irish mentality of, oh, if I have a good job,

now you can't pack it in. You can't throw away the pension and so on. And what it took for me to leave the job at the end was I went to a conference in Finland, lovely country, lovely people. But I met so many like-minded people. And when I came back, I was like, something happened in my head.

I was like, no, there's only one way this is going to go. And like I handed my notice two days later. So some of it can be, some of it goes down to fear some of it goes down to what's the sensible thing to do like the sensible thing wasn't leaving the job the sensible thing was stay there and you know keep making your money and so on but it's that thing of like to what end like i suppose i had to ask myself what's more important the salary and the security or doing the work i love like there was a few months there of having zero income at all but that had to be done to kind of carve the path i'm on now so some of it can be you're trying to think what's the most sensible thing to do and then part of that can be down to like maybe a bit of social expectation. Like for me, leaving my job last year, I said to my friends,

I was like, I went from being in a relationship, having a full-time job and having my own place, to being single, unemployed and living at home. And that's a, that feels like a serious step down when you're an adult. But that had to be done to go on to the next step,

those three very uncomfortable things. And so, so part of it can be fear because of, you're wondering what's best and you're wondering what's expected of you. I would say what's expected of you, park that because you have to make yourself happy first and foremost. In terms of what's the sensible thing to do, it's like, well, okay, what's your definition of sensible? Is it what's a secure job or what's the work that fulfills me?

And so, and then there's the example of if you're picking between two things, I don't you've heard this thing of if you flip a coin, but don't let the coin fall. Because when the coin's in the air, if you know heads is one thing and tails another, you will know when the coins in the air, which one you want the coin to fall on. And that's kind of there. Don't let the coin fall. You know which one you want from that, from the throw itself. I know it's a long wind of an answer, but that's the best I can do there. That's good. Yeah, I like that.

You'll probably know these statistics better than I will con, but from aware among adults in Ireland age 25 to 34, anxiety, anxiety diagnosis rates rose to roughly 25%. Can you tell me a little bit about your own experience with anxiety and maybe give some advice to people who may be suffering with it, regardless of where they are on that spectrum. 100%. So, I would say, well, first of all, it's a term, it's a term

that gets dismissed because there's being anxious and then there's having anxiety. And people confuse being anxious of being nervous. And I'm like, no, that's comparing, you know, fear and getting bitten by a dog versus being in a den with a tiger. Like, it's two very fucking different things like, you know, like I had a friend when I was in college

who, through no fault of his own, had no concept of what depression was. And he's like, oh, it's just being sad. I'm like, no, that's not it. It's a much more, it's low dopamine. It's much more, we'll say, not permanent, but it's much more immovable than just sad. Sadness can come and go. Depression is a much more heavy thing to live with. So my experience of anxiety was, when I left college, one of the things I've learned is that in the anorexic mind, periods of change don't go well because there's a feeling of loss of control. control and so on. And so, because I always say my mental health fried me on three occasions,

leaving school, leaving college, sorry, leaving primary school, second school and leaving college. And when I left college, there was no problems with food or body image or would say your typical anorexia problems of what you'd associate with it. But there was serious problems with anxiety. And I remember, like, I was 23 and I had like, this is, and again, this school showed the, the unseen impacts of anxiety. I went to the doctor because I was, I was, I had what seemed to be like a really stubborn blabber infection. With the doctor, he was like, well, yeah, give you tablets. Nothing happened.

And then I made the mistake of Googling what causes bladder infections in a young man that I got its prostate problems. I was like, oh my God, I'm going to die. I'm 23 and I'm going to die. So I ended up like having to get a scope of my bladder, which is when a camera goes down, as you can imagine where. That's the like the closest thing a man would experience being in labour. Had all these things done, there was no, nothing physically

wrong. And I ended up realising the more I went to counselling, the more these painful problems went away. But they didn't fully go away. So I found like anxiety was causing physical problems in the body. It was causing pains in the stomach. It was causing like an overactive

bladder. It was causing like just all these kind of inconvenient things. Like I was 24, 25 years at age waking up in the middle of the night to piss. All these kind of things which are like problems you associate with older men. And I was again, Googling all these things being like oh my god I'm 25 with fucking prostate cancer

and I went to the doctor again I'm like this what is happening and he was like how is your history with your mental health and I was like oh it wouldn't be great like and he was like you may have generalised anxiety disorder and he was like he always says dealing with anxiety takes five things your diet your sleep your exercise

keeping stimulants under control so alcohol caffeine and so on and your workload or your stress and I had all five of them pretty well ticked off and he said if somebody has all five of those was in order and they're still feeling the symptoms of chronic anxiety, pains in the body or shortness of breath or whatever it is,

the next step would be medication. He's like, you open to medication. I'm like, if you're telling me medication we'll get rid of this problem, no problem, then yeah, perfect. I started on anxiety medication and it was life changing. But the very important thing there I always say, because people say, oh, medication for your mental health

is a cop-out. I'm like, no, no, no, no. Medication allowed me to get on level, level playing field for everyone else. If I don't get enough sleep and if I don't eat right, I'm going to go downhill big time. The tablets give me a fighting chance. And like, there's stigma around with say psychiatric medication, I couldn't give a fuck. I'm like, these things for me were a lifesaver. And my friends have the least stigma you can imagine around mental health. Like it became this thing of like,

just how are the tablets going? And I remember the like six months after going on them, I had an encounter with a guard in a traffic jam. And I spoke very confidently like, he was like, pulled in here. I'm like, no, I didn't. I'm going this way. And I fucking gave it to him like. And I, you know, that was grand. And my friends were like, oh my God, those tablets are class. They were like, if this was 12 months ago, you'd have fucking crumbled. I'm like, yeah. So what I, what I realized what the medication helped me do was the, the, oh, fuck thoughts would come in, but it was easier to pull them back down. But if I don't look after myself and don't sleep enough and don't eat right, the frequency of those, oh, fuck thoughts will increase. So it's like

the medication is a help. And if I'm on it for life, that's 100%. But I'm very aware that my lifestyle and all that plays a massive impact. So anyone who's struggling with anxiety or, you know, high levels of stress, the first thing I would say is how's your sleeping patterns? You know, because that's the first thing, like, getting enough sleep is a paramount importance. And then something as simple as like, excuse me, are you relying on coffee all the time or caffeine? Because caffeine does not sit well.

Like, I love a can of monster. I fucking love it. But I know if I have one. it's a bit like when someone lactose intolerance has an ice cream. They're like, yeah, I'm going to enjoy this, but I'm going to fucking suffer afterwards. You know, so like that's the kind of price I pay there. Like, I enjoy going for a drink,

but I know the day after I'm going to be suffering. So it's kind of like there's that thing of no one knows your own body better than you. So having your lifestyle as in check, the great thing there is what's good for the body is good for the mind. So movement, plenty of water, easy on the caffeine, plenty of sleep. If you can start with that, because again, we all struggle with those things. if you can get that right, that's a big, big step. But sometimes then as well, like,

it could be something underneath that's causing these chronic, this chronic stress. Again, therapy is needed there. One of the reasons why I went for the medication route is because I was already in therapy and I'm working extensively on that. And I was like, right, I'm doing all these things. There must be something else.

So I would say, look into those avenues first. Look after your health, speak to a therapist. And like with the therapy route, you've no idea what you're going to uncover. you've no idea what small thing that you've dismissed in life could be causing you chronic stress or these kind of mental difficulties. That's a big thing as well.

Yeah, it seems like on social media that there's a lot of arguments about medication and about lifestyle. And it's just this kind of dichotomous thinking that it's one or the other where in reality it's going to come down to the individual because I know you obviously know, Kirsty who's done thoughts for me as well.

And, you know, she's obviously a big advocate of, you know, medication didn't work for her, but what worked for her was Brett work and stuff like that. And obviously, rumination is obviously a big thing in regards to this as well and over thinking. And you probably have a, there's probably a lot of people in society now, instead of going out for that hour walk at nighttime, they're probably just sitting at home scrolling on their phone or, you know, over thinking. And like obviously in terms of, you know, sleeping well, getting enough exercise,

eating the right nutrients, knowing your, knowing your body, a lot of people aren't there yet. they'll go straight to medication. Yeah. And then then you'll have this kind of argument online of people being like, oh, people are just going straight for medication and it's about lifestyle. When, you know, you're saying not the opposite thing to that, but it's like, okay, I've, I've ticked off all these other boxes and yet the medication was still there to help

me when I needed it. Yeah. So like as someone said once, it was a mental health profession, they said, they said, I believe in medication, but I believe in it. as a last resort. And I said, yeah, I agree with that too in the sense that there's so many other things you can do. Because at the end of the day, if you can do without medication of any kind, you're better off, not on it. Like, that's the same with anything. Funny enough, I used to be asthmatic, and the more I worked on my anxiety, I no longer needed an inhaler. So another great example of how

anxiety affects the body. But yeah, so I would fully agree. I'm like, work on your physical health and your lifestyle first and foremost. And then you'd see, you know, if you are, if you are feeling very anxious, you know, speak to a therapist, you know, even just do a couple of sessions because you've no idea what could pop up there. And, you know, down the line, once you look at these avenues, medication is there then as an option, but absolutely not as a crutch, not as an all-around solution, but as something that can be there as somewhat of a safety net once other avenues have been investigated, 100%. Because the reality is, if someone goes straight to the medication, it's not going to work properly for them. Because again, with myself,

if I don't sleep well, eat well, do all those things, I might as well be on no fucking medication, but it's not going to work. It's a bit like, it's a bit like, it's a bit like foam rolling in recovery. If you haven't got enough sleep

and have enough protein, the foam rolling won't do fuck all for you. So it's like that little last thing, your massage going, your foam roller, your ice bath, whatever you want to call it, it's that final 5%, which you've a lot of other stuff to do first, but we all jump to the last 5% thinking that's the solution.

Like, no, it's not. There's a lot of simple stuff first that comes first, which is much more, boring much harder to sell. That has to be done first. And then the last thing comes in there. From looking at them stats around Ireland, why do you think and what would be your kind of analysis

on why anxiety seems to be on the rise? Is it just a... Well, a big thing there... Yeah, go ahead. You said about ruminating. That's a big thing. Like, I was on a podcast yesterday with a guy who's an Irish guy who's based in Brazil.

And he was saying, like, what shocked him was the culture is way more social than it is now in Ireland. and like all the people in the neighborhood are all chatting in the evenings, the kids were all out playing football. Like we would have been 20, 25 years ago, like kind of like a dying art. And so I think part of that problem is rumination.

It's like you're sitting on your own, your escapism from the realities of life is maybe TikTok or Instagram or a scroll or maybe it's alcohol or drugs or whatever it is. Whereas you always talk about social health, that's a big thing. Like if we have more connection after work in the evenings and weekends,

We are, we're not sitting ruminating for so long. The other kind of thing. The one good thing that comes from that bit of rumination, I find is that when you sit on your own, if there is something pressing on you that needs to be worked on, that's when it will pop up. That's the good side of it. But the problem is you don't want to be ruminating about every small thing.

And that's where I find your social connection comes in. You're getting, you know, even if you do want to talk about something, you're getting that external perspective from someone. Like I'm a big believer in that. Like, I'm a very social person. If I'm on my own too long, things don't go. well. But I understand that a bit of time on my own is good

to recharge a social battery, but also kind of take stock. The way you know, the way you know, you journal and all that kind of stuff, you can't journal in a loud room, you journal on your own to see what's happening with your thoughts. But I think, yeah, I think social media plays a role. I think the sort of lack of social

health connection plays a role. I think there could be elements there maybe as well I would say the worries coming with cost of living and that kind of stuff that would play a role as well. Again, it's a very multi- factor thing. It's not going to be one answer as we all know. But I definitely think the sort of social health thing

is a big thing. One problem I think we have in our is we're seeing a decline in people with they drink and alcohol, but we don't have another, I suppose, social outlet there. And this is the importance of your fitness clubs and we see more people doing the high rocks and so on. I think we need to work on

having more social spaces which don't involve alcohol. Like a friend of mine who loves to travel. He's like he's like out of Japan and Korea. and they've all these late night coffee bars and so on. You know, you don't have that now. You don't have that kind of social space to sit in at seven o'clock in the evening to chat with something.

Especially in rural Ireland as well. Yes. I was looking up even the statistics around that. Like rural Ireland, it was all about everyone went to the local pub and, you know, you'd sit there and you'd talk to your neighbour and you'd talk to whoever. And like the percentage of rural pubs that have closed down, which, like, I don't really care about that whether, like, like people drink unless it's great

but there's no there's no replacement for that third space for them people. Yeah third space, exactly, yeah. Exactly. Like it is that thing. It's like where do you go and stay? And again, the problem you have in Ireland is

you've got a serious lack of social resource like that in rural Ireland and then for so many people moving to a city is too expensive. So you've got that kind of fucked if you do and fuck if you don't care of thing. So I think yeah, I think that's something we need to work on. your man Sean Casey. He had a thing there. He was like trying to get more sawn as he called it. He called it. Like that kind of thing. Those kind of, would say, non-party type social settings. That's a big thing. But you know what? Again, a hill I'll die on. One of the great sides are on social media. Like for me meeting yourselves. Like I met you, Karate 18 months ago. And the amount of people I met then through you in this kind of like-minded area, that's the side of social media I love, that you can find your people all.

all around the country and beyond, in a way that you couldn't before. I think that's fantastic. Like I've made friends of people now who are across Europe, who are across the UK through health, fitness and mental health space and social media,

that wouldn't happen in your pre-smartphone era. So that's a good side of it there because again, yes, it's digital, it's not face to face, but it is that bit of extra social connection, which I personally need a lot of. So yeah, that's a good side of it as well, I think. Lads, do you have any questions?

I think he's answered all of them. Anything that I think of mind has gone over all pretty good. You know what I, do you know what? I really agree with you. And I think a lot of people misconstrued these two things is like the difference between like isolation and solitude. And when you're talking with, sometimes you need to be on your own so you can kind of take stock. That's why I love going out like, let's say I am overtinking. And I have a little bit of anxiety or whatever it is.

I love to go out. because even though I talk about social health and community and all them things and you know making the efforts to be around people even when it's inconvenient I also really really enjoy my own time by myself yeah to go for like a hike by myself where I can just walk in nature and just think about the things that I need to think about and I'll always feel better for doing it but if I like if I was to just go straight home and just think about the things that I'm worried about and does that great

there's that great quote that I heard. I heard on Modern Wisdom, what Chris didn't say. Someone else said it was like, trying to tink your way out of a thinking problem is like trying to like sniff your way out of a cocaine problem. Yeah, yeah, yeah. And it's like sometimes you need to use the body in order to help the mind.

And I love going out for like if I'm really over tinkin and I don't want to be around people, but you know, if I go out for a walk in nature, I feel 10 times 10 times better rather than just ruminating over the problem. I think, like going for a walk, like I know it's such simple advice,

but it's actually so beneficial. And it's like, it sounds so often. No, but the problem there is, right? Like, I know I've said you four, right? I'm a massive fan of Roy Sutherland. And he's a great guy for the whole thing of like, if these complex problems, but they can have very simple solutions.

Like one of the bits of advice I give to young people about feeling better on a bad day is get out, get into the fresh air. And I'm like, I know this sounds so cliche, but it actually has to be said because it's a bit like, in Gaelic fuckball. You have to learn how to solo a ball before you can do anything else. It's like it's such a simple thing that gets overlooked. And if you overlook

this, like as somebody who works from home for a long time, I was working from the laptop, the shopping is done, you might go outside the door for two days. It doesn't take long to get cooped up in the same air all the time. So it is, it's those simple things. I agree to the air on the whole solitude thing. Like after a day of giving talks in the school,

my social battery is fucking flatlined. And I could have a two hours right home. And I love that because I'm like just two hours in silence. And as I often to friends, I'm like, my ideal scenario is living on my own, but having friends nearby, having a space of my own, but at the drop of a hat, I can go into the pub, I can go into the cafe, talk to people, all that kind of stuff. I like the idea of having social connection, but the ability to go away on my own, if needs be. It's a bit like sneaking off at the bathroom on a night out, like,

you know, so again, like, look in the mirror, it's wrong. It's like, oh, yeah, having a great time. It's that thing of, like, having social connection, but then being able to step off on your own. But yeah, 100% like COVID was a great example. That was isolation, not solitude. It might have been solitude for the first couple of days, but after fucking two years of it, we were all feeling the effects of it.

And it is we need that because one of the things I find is like, I'll go down rabbit holes of overthinking and I'll start thinking very nangedly and then I've talked to a friend and within 30 seconds, they're like, they've given me a new sense of perspective. They're pointing at something I've missed

and I'm like, there's no way on my own I would have found this. There's no amount of like, you know, that meme of the guy with all the detective. about all the stuff on the board. I'm like, there's no way I would have found this on my own. I think that's, the phrase I love is,

and what is it? The whole is always greater than the sum of the parents. The thing that we're better when we're together. We do better when we all collaborate. Because each person sees stuff that the other person doesn't see. I think that's, we'll say, the impact the therapy has. That's the impact the social connection has. That we can be pulled out of these,

would say bad perspectives and negative head spaces with the help of others. So yeah, that's a, that's a big thing. And like, again, yeah, in terms of going forward, I think that's something that definitely your 20s or 30s, your 40s in Ireland, that bit of social connection in your, we'll say, non-pub spaces, that's going to be a very, very important thing. Yeah.

As someone who's done a lot of work on themselves over the years, forced to do to work on yourself, what does peace look like for you now in your day-to-day? Oh, great question. I have realized I'm very easily pleased in terms of like peace to me is you know like I always say to friends

I don't mind being stressed when it's the stress I choose I don't mind being stressed in my work because I love that I'm doing meaningful work I don't like unnecessary stress that comes from a bad environment or having bad people around me or whatever it is so for me like I've realized like you know a friend of mine said this greatly

he said you know in your mid-20s you get very much pulling to that thing of, oh, I must travel the world. And I very quickly went, I couldn't give a fuck about that. I like going around to different conferences and so on, but like my travelling tales will be, you know, going to every corner of Ireland talking in schools. That's my version

of going to fucking Thailand or whatever it is. And so I had a moment last year, and this is going to sound so fucking performative, but this is, oh God's on truth, I had a moment last year where I was in the car, I stopped to get diesel and I got coffee or whatever it is. And I just sat in the car and the whiff of the coffee hit me. And I just went,

oh this is class. I was on the way for talk and I was like, I love doing my work, I love coffee and I love driving. And I'm like, that's what my whole life revolves around now. That to me is, that to me is peaceful. Do you ever heard Nvalval's quote on or no? No, go on, go on.

Val says, if you can't be happy with a cup of coffee, you'll never be happy on a yacht. I like that. I fucking, yeah, yeah, that's very true. It's like that, like, you know, when it comes to the whole travel, I know my tangent here now, but this, this is what I do.

When it comes to the whole travel, traveling thing, right? Like, I've gone to conferences all around Europe. If you took those, the conference I went to in Finland before I quit my job, if I took that same group of people and we had that conference in fucking Kinigat, it would have been equally as good crack. Like, it's nice going to see somewhere new, but if I've learned anything, it's, it's the people there that make a great crack. I've had as much crack with friends playing poker in a student accommodation when I was in college as I would have out in fucking Bali. So I'm a big believer in, it's the people not the place, that kind of thing. And so yeah, a big believer in that. If you can

find enjoyment in the smallest things like I enjoy cooking, I enjoy coffee, I enjoy reading a book. As a friend of mine said, he was like, reading a book in a cafe is the most pretentious thing in the world. I'm like, that's all it's great crap, you know what I don't care what it looks like, I'm enjoying myself. That to me,

you know, and I think that there's a big thing there of, well, I think back to being 20 or 21, you want to do everything. And then very, very quickly for me, I became, I was like, no, no, no, no, no. I'm happy enough just having a quiet life. I like going here and there. but like a cup of coffee and reading a book

and watching a bit of YouTube that for me is peaceful and I see nothing wrong with it. So yeah, and I think only what your version of peace is and not getting sucked into what someone else is it's, that's a big thing as well.

You know, you're justifying my whole existence because that's... All I do is, all I do now is watch YouTube and go to cafes and read her, right? But like I would 100% agree with that because I think I fell into that trap of thinking that, oh, to make myself interesting, I need to have, you know, experienced the whole.

Yeah, yeah. There was a guy I knew in college. And like, if you asked him where he was from, his mother was from one place, his father's from another. He was born in Dubai. It was a fucking 45 second long answer, right? But he was one of these people.

That was the only interesting thing about it was that he had been to a lot of places. And like, I remember we were at house party one night and a friend of mine was a DJ and he was showing me something on his laptop. And I heard a girl and said to this guy, where are you from? And we both went, oh, here we fucking go. like, you know, if you've got great tales of being abroad, that's fantastic, yeah.

But don't have it be the only fucking interesting about you. And a friend of mine said, like, he was out of his mind when he said this, but one of the wisest things I ever heard. He said, Joe Connor, as someone I went to school and had a picture up, that they were over in Thailand with the elephants, you know. And I said to my girlfriend and said, God, I feel like I'm missing out. And she just looked and went, when have you ever wanted to go to fucking Thailand? Never.

And she goes, if you could go anywhere in the morning where would you go? And he said, I'd have to go back to Anfield. And she says, we'll fucking go to Anfield next month. If you want to go to Thailand, we'll go to Thailand. But do you really want to fucking go to Thailand? And he was like, no, I don't really care. And she goes, there you go. And I'm like, now that is the travel dilemma sort of for a lot of people.

It's like, again, the three whys, why do you want to go there? If you, if you are in growth and other cultures, that's fantastic. Yeah. But if you're going to Thailand for the Instagram post, forget about it. Well, I think that's a lot of, that's a lot of, that's a lot of, that's a lot of travel travel influencers these days

anyway, it's like they just have all the flags of all the places they've been to in the world and they're essentially just ticking off a box

rather than experience because they want to say that they've been so many places but you know do you have any actual good stories about

But you what I'm going to do there I'm going to have a cat with me leeks from Fremanna and I'm going to all the counties in my life as I'm going to do

now wherever I've been oh yeah I've been everywhere yeah I've been fucking everywhere um a lads any last questions for Connor what's next for you more of the same more of the same i'm telling you now i am like again even since

leaving the job i was applying i applied for funding for a PhD starting september and i was like oh this is the next step now and that fell through and literally on the same day it fell through like a full-time position in body-wise came up and i was like oh this is this is i've learned to recognize serendipity when it happens and i'm like no this is to to keep doing what i'm doing keeping on the road i'm like yeah this is, I have this theory that if there is such thing as past lives, in a past life, I must have been a travelling preacher of some kind, because it very much suits me. Do you know, so more of the same. I do hope to write another book one day about anorexia specifically.

I hope to have it more research-based. I do want to do a maths at some point. I do want to do a PhD at some point. But for now, more of the same. We never got to talk about his book. Oh, I would plug that. yeah no like definitely i want to do another one like my book is all about kind of like personal experience

but i do want to write another one that's more do you think from the from the book that you wrote it's called normal isn't it or the normal one normal yeah i think the jozai the normal yeah yeah yeah yeah um has your perspective on anything changed from when you wrote the book to your experience now in terms of of even modern society

talking to more young people. Do the principles still apply? Is your experience still relevant to your advice? Great, quick question. First thing I'd say is when you say my perspective is changing, I met a promise to myself that my book came out

when I was 21 and I met a promise that I'd never drink, I'd never drink cheap vodka again after the book came out. So I was like, I graduated from Tomobo. burn off. But no, like, because a lot of the, like, again, I wrote the book in 2020, but like a lot of the stuff there around, Ireland's a very different

country now at what it was 10 years ago in terms of mental health, and I'm delighted at that kind of lunge forward. A lot of I talk about in the book is say around stigma, particularly around rural Ireland, we were making progress there. I've seen a massive difference even in my own hometown and how people look at health and wellness

and all that kind of stuff and I'm like, this is fucking fantastic. There's still a long way to go. especially among men I think especially among older men and there could be a bit there of you know you can't teach an old dog new tricks but I think we have come a long way in Ireland in terms of the stigma around mental health we have a long way to go but I think

I actually as bad as COVID was I think COVID was fantastic for it forced us to recognise mental health as being important because like that we all felt such isolation for two years and yeah like I think yeah the biggest thing in the book would say I talked about anorexia in depth

A lot of what I talk about is kind of like, say, the inspiration of where the George character comes from now in my content. But a lot of the stuff I say around, like stigma around, let's say, alcohol, you know, lads only talk about the problems with when they're drunk. We still see that. And my whole thing is if lads can talk when they're sober in as much of an open way as they can when they have a few drinks in them, that's a big hallmark of progress. If we can keep, you know, the guy I was talking yesterday, he was saying that a friend of his opened up to him when they were having a few drinks. and then when he tried to have the same conversation again over a coffee, it was completely pushed aside. I think that's the next step as males.

How do we push to bring those conversations that we have and we blame on drink? How do we bring those into a sober space where they can properly be? So I think that the role of alcohol in mental health is something that still plays a constant role. That's one thing that hasn't changed in the last few years. I think we've a lot of work to do there, big time. Last question, and we'll leave it there.

If there's a young lad listening to this now who would have been in a similar situation to you in regards to struggling with body, struggling with food, struggling with anxiety, what do you think the first step would be for them? What would your advice be for them? The first thing I would say is,

and I always say the problem we have with mental health is, I think I said this in the talk and your event year was when we talk about physical health, we say, oh yeah, I broke my arm, I'm in a cast and I'm getting sorted now in the next few weeks. When we talk about our mental health, we say, oh yeah, I'm quite anxious. That's just the way I am.

And we talk about our mental health. We completely dismiss the concept of neuroplasticity. We dismiss how our brains can change and adapt. And we think, oh, this is the way I am. There's no change in that. And I still have that. I still face that problem now with, let's say, low self-esteem. I get pulled into that, oh, this is, this is deep rooted from whatever.

No, no, no, no. Don't think like that. With enough work, you can change this. With enough, you've changed X amount of narratives and how you look at yourself thus far. that trajectory can keep going. So the first thing, and quite frankly, this is the only thing that the person takes away, knowing that whatever's happening up here

can change and improve and adapt. Because if you don't believe that, well, then it's not going to happen. And that's a very, very dark place of, if you're in a bad headspace and you believe it can't change, that does not end well. So understanding that whatever's happening mentally,

yes, it might be a long road to improve things, Jesus, for me it has been, but there's a light at the end of the tunnel and it is, it's fucking sunshine. And I, you know, I don't want to sit here at the kind of cliche way of like, oh, I push through and I, and my life is great now. Still fucking bad days. I still probably have worse mental health than the average person. But my God, it's oceans better than what it was. And it's an ongoing process, but like, you get, you learn so much about yourself. You see the progress you're making. and that gives you encouragement to implement similar progress

in other areas of life so I would say yeah understand that they understand that changes can happen never overlook the power of social connection never overlooked the power of speaking to a therapist the old one phrase I always say AI can take over the world but one thing that will never change

is a problem share it would always be a problem I have don't fucking share it with chat TBD share it with a real human being whether that be a therapist a friend a family member because that is like as Roy Southerton says we have hundreds and thousands of years of experience of talking to one another. And that's something that will never change.

We need that. And the kind of social health thing. So understanding that the moment you speak about a problem, you're pointing at it, you're making it smaller. You're making it real. You're making it much more, we'll say, it's no longer ethereal.

It becomes real and it becomes something you can work through. So that's a big, big thing. But the big thing I would say is change can happen. change can happen and within that it can happen in ways that you never could have imagined you know and again i like when you're 15 16 17 17 you're trying imagine your life in 10 years time not in a million guess is what i'd imagine this but jesus christ this is better than what anything i could have imagined so that idea that life can really go anywhere if you keep putting one foot forward that would be my final remark on that yeah well said where can people follow up with your work instagram be the best place connor underscore n7 that's kind of the central thing for everything and all, we'll say, relevant links and all that are there. So Instagram is the best place, yeah. All right, Connor, till the next time.