The Uneducated PT Podcast - Episode 155 | Grief With Leonie Larkin - Hard Conversations Ireland

Episode Date: May 6, 2026

In this episode of Hard Conversations Ireland, Leonie Larkin speaks openly about the loss of her brother to suicide, the reality of grief, and the impossible task of trying to make sense of something that often feels senseless.This conversation isn’t just about death — it’s about life. About who her brother was beyond the way he died. About remembering a person for how they lived, how they loved, the memories they left behind, and the impact they had on the people around them.Leonie shares the emotional complexity of grief: the confusion, anger, guilt, numbness, and the pressure people often feel to “move on” from something that changes them forever. We also speak about how grief affects identity, relationships, and everyday life, and how healing doesn’t always mean closure.This is an honest, vulnerable conversation about loss, love, memory, and learning to carry grief rather than outrun it.If this episode resonates with you, please consider sharing it with someone who may need it.

All right, first and foremost, thank you for doing this today. I wanted to start by just getting an idea of who Graham is. So can you just tell me who he was, what he was like, tell me all about his personality, everything. Okay, Graham was my brother. Yeah. He was an absolute joy to be around. He was one of those people that, like, he was such a big energy in a room. He had a laugh that was, like, so full of life and it, like, radiated onto other people's faces.

he was so driven he was so determined he was passionate about everything around him and he was the most innovative and creative person that I have ever met he was a friend he was a son he was a husband he was an incredible father and he was one of those people that just loved

and really lived life we lost Graham at 37 but I think in his really short 37 years he done and he achieved and he's seen more than like a lot of people do in 80. Like he packed so much into that time. He was just incredible.

He was the kind of person that left people better than he found them. Whether you knew him as well as I did and we're lucky to get so many amazing years with him or you only met him really briefly. Like he just, you were bettered because of him. So he was your older brother? Yeah.

What was that like grown up? Yeah, it's really cool. There's a big gap between us. So Graham and I have two other siblings, two older brothers Okay. Two older brothers again. And the three boys are really close in age.

Yeah. And then I come after 10 years. Okay, so there's a 10 year gap between you and Graham. There's a 10 year gap between us, but like we were really, really close. Like, Graham was like my first friend. And he like really took me under his wing. It's like my mum and dad, when they tell me stories of us grown up, they say like they had to do very little because he did so much.

But yeah, he was such a carer and that, like I really experienced that through like the time we had together and in being his little sister. Yeah. So you had three older brothers that were 10 years and so I'd say none of the lads got near you then with three older brothers. Very protective. Yeah. Yeah. That's kind of similar with my older sisters. I felt like my sisters nearly raised me as much as my mum and dad did. Yeah. Like Graham was like for me anyway, he was like the go-to person. Yeah. He was for all of us. my brothers as well even though they were older like if we had a problem or anything like graham was the person we called and he was like the fixer in our family like the solver yeah and yeah he

was the one that we went to for everything what uh what kind of relationship did the two you have extremely close like yeah told you they're everything um but that was really just the that was our whole family we're such a close family and like a really supportive family but like my problems were grains and vice versa and like we solved our problems together like we were so so close yeah what kind of memories come up when you think about fun ones

my favourite memories are ones of like him and his boys like he was such a he was such a good dad he has how many how many kids does he have two young boys two young boys so Adam who is five and Quinn who was three yeah and he was every bit like a mother to

his boys as their mom was and he was so hands-on. He always had one of the boys in his arms or a cup of tea in his hand, but he was at his happiest when he was with them. Yeah, yeah. What would you want people to know about him?

I think, like, I think a lot of people remember, like, Graham's death, and you often remember, like, how a person passed, but... Yeah. I think I want people to remember, like, the kind of person he was before that, like, the fulfilled and adventurous

and spontaneous life that he lived before it, Like he was so much more than just his death. Like he was a whole life ahead of it. And like he was just a joy to be around. Like he was the greatest person to be around. And I think it's so important to remember that, like those things. What are like some small or ordinary kind of moments that you miss about having him as your brother? His quick wit.

Like he was really quick with it. He was really funny. I miss his laugh a lot. And like we're so lucky that we have so many videos and stuff that he's laughing in. Like he was always laughing. He was always whistling at tune. And he was just so happy. Like he radiated life.

And I think like that's what I miss. Just it could be something as ordinary. He's just being in the kitchen when I'm drinking a cup of tea. But it was better because of his presence. Yeah. Yeah. What did he do?

What did he do for work and stuff like that? What was he interested in? He was a landscape gardener. So he had his own business. So he loved being outdoors. And he was really driven. Like he loved hike. And he was one of those people that could turn his hand on anything.

Like something happened. with my car, Graeme fixed it. If something happened in the house, Graeme fixed it. Like him and his wife, they bought a house in Wexford during the pandemic. And when they got at, their back garden was a field and the house was just like

walls. And now it's like the garden is such an oasis and the house was like, it's anyone's dream home. And that's, he did it all. Like, he could turn his hand on anything. He was so talented. Like, he was so innovative. He was the kind of person that, like, if he thought of an idea,

he could make it a reality in like a few days like he just he had such a head on his shoulders um i wanted to talk to you a little bit about grief itself so like what has grief looked like for you since his passing um extremely tough yeah um and i think we lost crime to suicide so i think like you have the initial shock of his death yeah but then and I'm not taken away from any other loss like every loss is tragic and every loss is really tough but I think with suicide you have like an added layer of like you've all these questions that you never get answers to

and I think for me I have found it really hard like everybody wants to heal but I have found it really hard to progress in my healing journey because we have no answers it's really hard to get closure if you don't have answers and it's really hard to heal if you don't have closure Yeah. And just, I don't know, like, Carl, if you had to ask me two weeks before he passed to list a thousand people that I thought would die by suicide, his name would have never crossed my mind.

I would have never considered him. So I think it still sometimes feels very surreal. How long ago was it? We're coming up to a second anniversary. So very, very short. Yeah, yeah. So his anniversary is the end of April. and it's weird because like

it feels like forever since I've seen them but it also feels like we've blinked and we're at two years it's so hard to navigate but yeah grief is tough it's not linear when do you think it hits you most is it random or is there

random moments yeah like I think you prepare for things like his birthday and his anniversary and you expect Christmas is to be tough and you expect the bigger moments to be tough. So when they come, you're somewhat prepared for them. And like it hits, but you get through it. But it's when you're driving in the car and you hear a song.

Or you smell something that reminds you of him. Or like, you glance at his boys and you just, like his youngest looks so like him. And you glance at him and you just see Graham all over his face. It's like it's those moments that are really tough. It's a small in-between moments that you don't prepare for. I feel like they're the one. that like knock me. Has it changed you?

Yeah, yeah, massively so. In what way? I think it's completely altered my whole family's life. You're so different after loss like that. I think it's bettered me maybe. I thought originally his debt would make me really cold. But I think it's made me more empathetic and kinder. But then I guess the con of it is like,

like you kind of live in a fear like it's... What kind of affair? Time is so precious now. Like, and I remember initially after he passed like, because I was with my mum that morning when she got the call. And I remember shortly for quite a while after like, things like answering a phone, like little things like that. Like, it's very easy to expect the worst now.

And, but it ultimately, makes you appreciate the time that you have for people like time feel so precious now I think you always think you have time but you don't like you think you've time to tell people how they feel and I think like especially in Ireland like we wait to tell people like we wait to say good things about people at funerals but they're the things we should say on like a random Tuesday or a random Saturday like tell people how you feel you always think you have time but you don't but I think I think it's, yeah, I think it's just really made me kinder.

Yeah. Yeah. Has it made it easier for you to have vulnerable conversations with your other siblings? Yeah, absolutely. Yeah. We would have always spoken very openly and openly in our house. Yeah. Yeah, like there was no conversation that we couldn't have in our house and like, and our parents really like, they made that clear from me very very, very,

made that clear from a very young age that you can talk to us about everything and anything and like that was really reflected in how we spoke to each other but I think it's made me like more empathetic to the smaller problems that people have as well like we didn't know graham was like struggling I don't even know for sure now that he was yeah and and I guess that's in having no answers like Graham had Graham left our house the Monday we celebrated his birthday the Monday and then we found him the Tuesday. Yeah. But he left his house on the Monday

with plans for the Wednesday and plans for the following week. Like, it was completely out of the blue. So I think it's made me check in more, especially with my siblings and my parents, and check in on friends more. And just because somebody looks okay, it doesn't mean that they are.

And I think it's really important that when you ask someone how they are, you really mean it. Not like surfing. level like oh how are you yeah but then you're as you're walking past them essentially yeah like yeah like now when I ask people how are you and they're like yeah I'm grand and I'm like okay but really how are you yeah yeah and then it gives people a place to open up yeah has as has anything about grief or about your grief surprised you not so much surprised me no but I think siblings

are sometimes like the forgotten mourners maybe that's something that did surprise me um I remember very early on, like, in the days leading up to the funeral when you have the wake. And, like, a lot of people, like, a lot of people were coming through the house. And I don't hold this against them at all. And I know they meant nothing by it. But there's a lot of, you have to be strong for your parents. And don't forget to mind your parents. And, like, I understand my parents' loss is huge.

No one should bury a child. but at the time when you're struggling and you're finding it really hard to be strong for yourself, that can be really hard to hear. And I think, like, a lot of people think of the parents and a lot of people think of, like, the wife and the children. But, like, your sibling is the only person that you go through every stage of your life with.

Like, you lose your parents too soon, and then you have your children late. But they go through everything with you. So to lose a sibling a lot early, than you should, that's really hard to navigate. Like, you're mourning a lot, like, you're mourning the past that you had with them. You're mourning them in the presence, but you're also warning the future that you thought you would have together. How can you explain to someone who doesn't have siblings what it's like to grow up with siblings?

Oh, like, it's the coolest thing ever. Like, it's someone that's always there that, like, they're the only people that really know absolutely everything about, like, the life you live. Like they understand it completely. It's like it's a bond that I think is like inexplainable to people. It's it's so pure and like it's the greatest thing. Like I think the best gift that your parents can give you is your siblings. And I was so lucky that like the ones I haven't had. Is there anything you think we get wrong about grief?

That there's a timeline on it. That I sometimes feel. we're coming up to two years now that people expect me to be okay. Like, it's the second year now. It's the second Christmas. It's the second birthday that, like, surely it's okay. But like, whether it's the second, the third, the 10th, the 12th, like, I have to go the rest of my life without him.

Without him, like, there's no way that's ever going to get easier. Like, at some point in my life, I'll have to miss him for longer than I had him. Yeah. and I think people think time heals wounds completely it definitely reshapes them

and it definitely alters them but it doesn't close them like we will miss him every day I will miss him every day and that doesn't get lighter I wanted to read you a quote of yours so one evening

he and I were sitting in the kitchen of our family home and the sun was setting I ran out to take a picture Graham laughed and he said If he went before me He'd send me a sunset The night he died The sun lit up the sky

The night of his birthday I sat at his grave And we watched the sunset together The week after his passing The Northern Lights lit up the sky Every sunset, every rainbow Every beautiful sky Feels like a nod sent from him

Do you believe In an afterlife Or anything like that Yeah I always have believed that this is just a step in our journey but I believe it's so much more now since he passed yeah absolutely I don't know if that comes from a place of just not being able to accept that his journey is completely over and I don't know if it makes his death somewhat easier

but yeah I believe he is somewhere better and I have no doubt that at some point I will see him again. Yeah, because everyone I've asked about grief, they always have a story about like some kind of freaky accident or reminder or something spiritual when someone passes. And I suppose it makes you more hyper aware of that when something like this happens. You also said, I hate the term committed suicide. Can you tell me a little bit about that, why you feel like that?

And, yeah, maybe just explain it a little bit. I think words carry so much power. And I think... I know in a past Ireland, suicide was recognised as a crime. But we have come so far in decriminalising it. But I don't think the way we speak about suicide reflects that. Yeah. I think we have so much empathy when we speak about other illnesses.

Like you would never say committed a heart attack or committed a stroke, but we say committed suicide. Like to commit something is to do something wrong. You commit a crime, you commit a murder, but like Graham didn't do anything wrong. I think there's so many other phrases that mean the exact same thing. Like for example, Graham took his life, Graham passed by suicide, Graham died by suicide.

They all mean the exact same thing as committed suicide, but they give Graham a lot more dignity. They are much kinder and they are much more empathetic. Like, Graham didn't do anything wrong. I don't know did he struggle or was it a spur of the moment decision, but whatever it was, he committed no crime and he done nothing wrong. And I think nothing changes if nothing changes. And I think that's why conversations like this are so important.

and like essentially they are what this series is called. They're hard conversations, but change doesn't happen unless we push for it and unless we actively make it happen. In what way do you still feel close to him? Definitely when I'm with his boys. Yeah. Like I feel like when you're holding them, you're holding such a physical part of him.

Like he left us the best parts of him. And music, Graham loves music. So like it's an easy way to feel close to him. but like although he's not with us physically anymore like he's still so much a part of our everyday life like we talk about him

and we share stories of him all the time and we laugh about him we cry about him but I think in keeping his memory alive it's a really easy way to feel close to him can you find meaning of his death in any way not yet no not yet

I definitely believe that when it's your time it's your time and I take some very small amount of comfort in knowing it must have been his time because if it wasn't something would have happened and he would still be here meaning in it no no not yet in what way do you

what's the best way to phrase this like what do you think there is any way in listening to the story about graham that you can give hope to people or is there even a is there something that you could take from graham's story for other people for them to learn a lesson i think you hear it all the time like suicide is such a permanent thing it's so so permanent thing it's so so And I just think it's something like for us anyway, it leaves families an absolute devastation and you're gone forever and no issue is so big that that needs to be the outcome. I believe our world was a better place because Graham was in it. And I believe whoever is struggling or going through whatever Graham was going through, their loved ones world is also a better place because they're in it.

Has your perspective on life changed? Yeah, I guess you go through something like that and it doesn't feel so secure anymore. Graeme was there the Monday and gone the Tuesday. It feels so easy that anyone can sit through your fingers like that. Yeah, I had a similar feeling as well when my mum passed that I looked at my family different than being like, all right, you could be gone tomorrow essentially. There was almost like a fear there then. I remember after Graham passed and for the first couple of months after he passed

I loved being around my family and I loved being able to see them because if I could see you, I knew you were okay and you were safe but it was when I wasn't with them that it was so easy to panic and yeah, that was a tough one to kind of navigate or like if I called them

and they didn't answer straight away I went to the worst place. Yeah. That was tough. Yeah, it was, for me, it was like, before, if I missed something, like, let's say, like a family gathering, it wasn't as big of a deal,

but after, it was like, I didn't miss them, family gatherings then. Or photos. Yeah, photos are huge. Yeah, yeah. Yeah, I always talk to myself then after I said, I didn't get enough photos with my mom.

Yeah, I feel the same. Like, I have, a lot of the time, I'm the person, like, behind, the camera like taking photos of him and the boys or whatever but take the photo even if you never posted even if you don't like how you look just take the photo like at some point that's all you leave people I've two more questions for you okay all right if you could say something to Graham now what would you say I think like of course you'd say like I love you and I miss you and all those things

but I think I really struggled with guilt after Graham past and what way guilt in the sense of like did I miss anything or could I have been more present or did I ask the wrong questions or like and I remember going through every conversation that we had had on WhatsApp and listening to every voice note and like looking at every picture and every video like just looking for some sort of sign and to see was there anything I missed I think I think I'd want to know why and I think I'd want to know could we have done something to help him. Last question I have for you. So what part of Graham still lives through you do you think?

I think Graham was so spontaneous. He was so driven. He was so like caring and I think like he bettered people and I think he's made me a better person like even in his death he bettered people. I really want to live a life like grain did like to the fullest and so full and are you spontaneous yeah I would say I'm quite spontaneous well spontaneous doing this yeah I would say so but

I think like two things can exist at once you can miss grey them every day and grieve him every day but you can also be really grateful for the life that you still have and the life that you still get to live and in the life that I still get to live I just want to be someone that like encompasses a lot of Graeme's Miles

and he was just really good and if I can live a life half like he did then like I'm doing pretty fucking good too he's yawning right there we're going first here we go this is it You know,