The Uneducated PT Podcast - Rob Carry Jai Sua Muay Thai

Episode Date: August 2, 2023

In this episode we speak to Muay Thai Coach Rob Carry about how he went from being a travel journalist to owning his own gym.

Take me back to your first experience in my Thai? Well, my first experience is kind of indirect. The first time I heard of the spot, it was practically unknown until... What age were you when you first heard of it? Well, the first time I heard of it, I was probably about eight. When I seen that,

John Claude Van Damme will be kickboxer. You see it of it? It's fucking quality. But it's basically the story of this dude who, he's like an American kickboxer, he goes over, his brother gets battered by your toy. So he goes over, then, you know, kind of trains up as in the top.

style to fight the guy as like revenge but that was the first time I heard about I'd never heard of prior to that you know isn't the game Street Fighter based on that film I think that's true there's one character in it and saga and he's based on a real toy boxer he's an actual guy oh yeah you play that game all yeah I was obsessed of that as well yeah it's fucking quality actually I remember fucking the mate of mine got a PlayStation for Christmas right and it was underneath the tree yeah this is before Christmas sitting there and we used to go on the hop sneak back to his cap unwrapped the fucking thing played all day We had it in the Nintendo.

It was a little square yoke like that. You just put it in and you play it. Yeah, yeah, it was deadly. Yeah, it was class. But yeah, so I kind of heard of the sport, sort of, you know what I mean, through films, through that game, obviously. But first time I got the experience it was when, I made him, well, he's, he made him right now, but my first coach, Mike Dockery,

he set up a club literally five minutes walk away from where I was living. Now it was in me early to mid-20s at the time, probably about 23. And... Twenty-three, still kind of quite old in terms of... of starting exactly yeah like you kind of had to be realistic about it if you're gonna start in your mid to late mid 20s even early 20s you're probably not gonna be world champ no you know I mean you have to be realistic about it but at the same time I just fucking loved it totally found over there and another great thing about it was that

all my ice joint yeah so it wasn't like um it wasn't like you know you're kind of in there trying to know people and stuff like that it was straight away being all the lads you were comfortable in your environment because your mates were there as well exactly yeah and in fairness yeah man mic is just such a sound guy lovely dude and you couldn't ask for a better coach he was real, real supportive, you know what I mean? Isn't it, like, if you think back on that, like, it's very important

that you actually had somewhere to go at that stage. Do you know what I mean? Where, like, if you think about, like, obviously you're providing this facility for kids that, like, if they live around the corner, they're getting introduced to a sport that they never would have been introduced to otherwise. Yeah, yeah, and it's interesting the way

it's just kind of like all links in the chain, you know what I mean? Where, like, and I spoke to Mike about it, and he told me the reason why he set up the club He was obviously a toy boxer, but he set up because he was in work one day, and somebody said something to him that pissed him off, and he was in a real bad mood about it, and he was like, instead of like, you know, letting his around me day, I'm going to do something positive, I'm going to channel this energy into something positive.

And he fucking set up a toy boxing club. And it's not only that, like I'm in. Now I'm a coach, obviously, one of my best mates Tau. He has his own club who joined at the same time. King Cowley now runs Warriors. He joined around the same time. And it was just all based on this one decision, you know what I mean? But yeah, it was quality that he, yeah, he's just a great guy, you know,

he was kind of typical if you knew him that would be the type of thing you do you know real positive have you took a lot of lessons from him and implemented them into your style of training with the kids and stuff like that yeah well i mean he totally coached me on the on the bread and butter of the sport you know what I mean and obviously I always try and encourage if I see one lad coming in and be like I should get your mates gone to see if you can pull them in and it's not from my bin of it necessarily like it's more because you'll keep lads at the spot that they know a few people you know what I mean yeah and it's not just about the sport itself it's about the kind of community you build around your club and that's what that's what holds people that's what keeps people

coming back you know well like that's the thing isn't it that obviously you probably want you know your athletes to be fighting at the highest level they can stuff like that but like at that early age it is about them actually having fun and getting in there and doing something they enjoy with with their mates yeah absolutely yeah it's i mean we kind of have this view on my toy like obviously it's an extremely difficult sport very very demanding at the highest level like it's um you have to be obsessed with it we are gonna if you're gonna compete even at an amateur level never mind at a pro never mind that a class never mind competing for titles but at the same time it's there's something about it it's it's like it's addictive it's and I

think practically anybody has something to gain from it but you're a kid like we have women only classes with women in the 50s who train we have lads coming in and you know their 60s that'll do a bit you know what I mean we have we coach a special needs adults group like it's it's literally for everyone you know I mean it's there is something it is a very special spot and it can't benefit literally anyone like so because it can kind of benefit anyone and everyone but is there different approaches you take in terms of your training sessions your style of coaching when it comes to maybe you know training the moment 50 who just wants

to get fit versus the young kid who just want some somewhere channel their energy versus you know there may be 14 15 year old who has potential to take the sport yeah yeah I mean like you kind of you'll start off at the same type of approach with everybody you know what I mean whereby you want to just get them getting comfortable. And it's almost like you have to kind of explain to people, look, you have to be patient with yourself. You have to allow yourself to be a beginner. Like this isn't a fucking spin class where you can jump on the bike and pedal and you're going to do fine. That's something even with that, because I know when I came in, you're like, oh, you can do

your first class free if you want to join in. And I think to myself, I'm not going to join in there. I get the head boxed off. And that's the, like, not allowing myself to be shit at something to be good at it. Yeah, yeah, exactly. Like, people have that perception of it. And it's not like that we don't throw lads in at the deep end because there's no benefit there's no benefit to the person who's beating up some beginner there's no benefit to the beginner there's no benefit to the beginner there's no benefit from me I'm gonna lose a student yeah it's stupid you know I mean so you have to kind of take care of people at the early stage yeah and just like I said explain to them that you're gonna be you're new to it's gonna take you well be patient

with yourself you know what I mean we're all here to help that's the only reason we're here you know yeah but then yeah it kind of it once you see kind of potential in lads and you see that I'm motivated to compete then you take a very different approach it's like you know often at the end of a session you get a lad's gone you're trying to fucking kill me and I'm like I'm not trying to kill you I'm trying to make a strong on me that's the whole point but you know what I mean

that's just the way it works it's extremely demanding like it's you know you're half grinding these lads you know what I mean and it has to be done and like you get lads saying oh I think I'm over training and it's like nah you try four times this week you know if you were in Thailand you'd be trying twice a fucking day you'd be doing a 5kai

rung first thing in the morning you'd be doing two sessions a day you'd be doing that five days a week and then one session on a Saturday you know what I mean different fucking stories. Talk me through the differences in terms of the approach to fighters in Thailand compared to here or anywhere in Europe. What's the difference? Well, I think it's changing now to a degree. You have lads now that are training full-time as Thai boxers in Europe. Yeah. You know what I mean? Even in Ireland you have lads. There's some high-level lads that their job is in Wai to their only job is in Wai Thai. Yeah.

And they're doing the best to get to the top, like, and they're feeling far between. But, um, 90% of people do it as a hobby, you know? But in Thailand it's different because, like, in all my time in Thailand, like I spent a year over there, living over there, and I probably visited and trained, maybe 20 other occasions, you know what I mean? So you've been there a lot, like?

I spent a lot of time there, but I've never met anybody in Thailand, a Thai person who did it as a hobby. Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. Why the fuck would you wanna do this shit as a hobby, man? You fucking nuts, like, the only, it's like, it's a game that, like, often's getting into because they've no other option,

you know what I mean? And they get raised in the gym. It's like, people who have no money. money it's like it's kind of like a no I don't mean in a bad way but like a hillbilly spot yeah it's kind of like from the kind of rural area that's where the heartlands are you know what I mean it's the kind of this hard kind of like I suppose an equivalent might be the GAA lads but like if you think like what poverty thrown in yeah they're doing it because they're doing it for a living you know I mean that they're

because in a lot of cases they've know what our option now it's probably modernising over the years now you know what I mean and that is changing I'm sure and there is people who getting into it from more affluent backgrounds and they're getting into it as a choice but the kind of traditionally it's always something that um you know people got into out of necessity as a way to like that like fighting to make money to make a living you know I mean because they don't really feel like they have another option you know yeah well like that that that would show the differences in level and performance the fact that like they're doing this since they're literally

toddlers you know and it's an everyday thing like it's ingrained of them and the thing about it is like we talked about you and joining when you're 23 very hard to catch up with that very hard very hard and even like it's it's they're striding at the deep end A lot of these is James operate almost as an orphanage, you know, or else they'll have a lot of lads coming from the local area, the local village or whatever. And the coaches don't accept everyone. They'll throw a couple of them in for a session

and they'll be like, okay, this lad is good heart, I'm going to hang on to him. The rest of them will be like say later. So they're throwing in at the deep end, man. They're absolutely like horse. Like they're trying elbows them with our little kids, you know what I'm, no head guards, no nothing. Like in junior, my time, in Ireland,

no head shots to your 14. You wear a body protector, you wear shin pads, you know what I mean? I don't think there's a pair of shimp ads in the whole of Thailand, you know what I mean? They just literally go for it, man. So, yeah, completely different. And at the higher end of the sport, like, there's lads that go over, like, from Europe.

And a lot of times they do well, but, you know, like, you're fighting against lads who've had 100 fights, 200 fights, 200 fights, 150 fights, whereas here it's more like 6, 10, 50 and 20, you know, that type of thing, you know. I experienced I went to, when I was in Thailand, I was in Bangkok and we went to, I think it was there at the main stadium that they had. Probably Lompini or Rajanam there. I can't remember. name of a big huge cage and all the out lads out in the corner and they all have their

piece of paper they're all gambling and they'll scream at each other yeah man yeah atmosphere and then you know 14 year olds 13 year olds coming in and killing each other and yeah animals like getting knocked out and there just be huge side bets going on as well like i mean if if uh jim has a fight lined up against you know they have a kid and they're fighting a kid from another village like people from the village will get together put money into a pot right and then they'll go we're gonna do a side bet Air kid's gonna beat your kid and it could be five grand 10 grand like people who are proud trauma and then there's this little fucking nine-year-all-all going in you know what I mean the whole fight of the village is on my shower is here you know what I have to do a job like

but how funny because they're tiny they're skinny but they're animals like yeah yeah but yeah I just remembered them all with their with their tickets fucking shaking and stuff like that and I was like this was this sports fucking mental it's like a fucking cauldron those that's what it was yeah it was crazy I didn't know what I was getting into when I went um Speaking more about your time in Thailand, talking to me about the first time you went over, your first experience. You were living over there for a year, was it?

That's right, yeah. I'd been trying to Muay Thai about two years in Ireland at the time, but I didn't really have much of an interest in fighting, but when I went over there, I was working as a journalist at the time. Yeah, because I would, when I look at you, I would never think that. But that's because I see as Rob, the Maitai coach. Yeah, but it's funny, like, people used to always say to me,

you don't look like a journalist, but now people say, you don't look like a Muay Thai coach. What the fuck do I look like? You know what the fuck do I look like? But yeah, I did the normal route. I did an undergrad degree, did a master's. And is there any reason in particular that brought you down that power or was it just like, I don't know what I'm doing,

so I'm gonna do this? Yeah, well kind of, like I'm in, it's not an easy game to get into. Journalism is very competitive, very, very competitive. So I was kind of committed to you. I just had a knack for writing. I was good in English and stuff like that, you know? So I felt like I should go for it, you know? Yeah.

yeah it was a long road it was like four years studying it's probably another year doing internships and then finally started to get work like yeah what kind of work would you've been down yeah did you ever hear to joe dot oh yeah I used to write for them for a couple of years yeah yeah yeah then I did um I worked for um international living which was like I used to do a lot of travel journalism and overseas living related stuff like that was that was kind of kill you know jet around the world and somebody else is you or oh yeah that was deadly that was about it yeah but uh in and I did a lot of property that's what I was down in Thailand I worked in Australia as well for a year down journalism but in Thailand I was

there for a year writing for a property magazine English language property magazine but the expats saying in Thailand is like just the session you know what I mean it's grant yeah I was there I was there for the first month when I arrived and Jesus Christ man I was drinking rings around myself like like I was on a holiday on the bucket yeah but then I was getting up the next morning I'm like I've got sitting in office like you know what I mean in rag order so obviously I was kind of like this is not sustainable you know so it wasn't the only reason though obviously I was in Thailand I love my Thai I wanted to

trying but that just kind of pushed me forward or into it and I was like right this is gonna be my focus while I'm here I'm gonna just trying away and and get a fighter to you while I'm here you know what I mean so yeah my first fight was a mad one I was training away and and the coach that I was training with like I used to kind of were you were you training were you based in Pouquet at the time or yeah ended up with Bangkok I did a little bit of training in in Pouquet and then I went up to Bangkok and I was in an hour gym there and I was kind of doing my run in the morning yeah and then I do

my first morning training session and then I got to work all day. And then I'd finish work and go back and do my evening session. So it was full on, man. I was just like, I was out. And what about the Thai fighters in there? Would they, would their structure be same or would it be just purely just training and fighting? They kind of, um, they tend to train, um, they'll up their training when they have a fight coming up. Yeah.

Um, but the training even is different to what you get here. Like the sparring is quite light, which surprises people a lot of the time. But the reason being is that like they kind of look at it like there's no money to be won in the gym and the spar I'm not going to get paid And also you could fucking injure me Yeah, which means I'm not going to get paid when I do fight you know the risk for them to be injured Yeah, it's like much higher much higher like so they kind of because they fight so regularly they'll stay sharp way though through their fights rather and through their sparring you know Yeah, so I kind of was like having been used to sparring every day over here I was like when I'm sparing you know this type of thing you know what I mean now when they would spend when you when you did sparring you kind of

You get a clip it's swinging you around the place Yeah Yeah that was kind of the way it went And how did the fights go? How many fights did you have while you were over there? I had two. I won the both of them actually. The first one was an interesting one. I was told by the coach like,

oh, there's a Japanese guy that you can fight in a stadium up country. Like I was saying, this is like in a Muay Thai heartland, like up towards the Utah outside Bangkok. And I was like, oh, great grand. And I went up with a mate of mine and we got there and there was now Japanese, lad. It was literally, there was no white people. It was the absolute back arse. It was just all toys in the stadium.

And my coach rang me and he's like, yeah, I don't know if you should do this. And I was like, what the fuck, man? I'm trying for him once. I'm not gonna fucking pull out. I don't care if I get swung around if I get stopped in the first round. At least I could say, I did it, man.

I'm not there trying and putting all this work in. So, went in anyway, like, sorry, he just happened to have a toy lad that was ready to go, just to do a game with me, you know what I mean? So I got in anyway and the fucking cunt slap me around the first round. Absolutely killed me, man. I mean, got me around the back of the head and just,

whoo-o-o-o-o-o-o-sword of the ring to the other, you know, it was bad, like, but kind of hung in there and fucking kind of got the grips on them to the later part of the fight started landing a few hands and won the fight. So, kind of, that was it, like, it was, it was, it was dead timing as well because I was about to go home then, like, so, yeah, got the fight done, kind of rounded off me at my time there and went to head it off back home. Ended up going back over and fighting over there, you know, but, like. You probably got the bug for it then, that's when you could get to go on.

Yeah, yeah, kind of came back here and had a few. I ended up moving to Waterford and I was trying in another gym down there with John Walsh another really good coach and had a few fights for him in Waterford and Cock

in Belfast but yeah kind of pushed off from there but at the same time it was always the case that I go so far in the spot you're starting your 20s you know what I mean as much as I loved I was kind of I was aware of that you know but I did have goals like one of my main goals

was the fight A class, I wanted to fight pro. I wanted to fight in Thailand, I wanted to win in Thailand, and I kind of ticked those boxes, and then when I came back, I had a couple more fights after that after I got back from Waterford. Does it feel like a regression down after being on that high from Thailand and then coming back to fight? It was like, what happened?

Not really, you know, because the standard is good here, you know what I mean? It wasn't the case that I was like, oh, he fought in Thailand, I've done all I needed, it wasn't like that at all, man, you know what I mean? There's some of my eyesing fighters in Ireland, and I'm sure there's 90 that would have slapped me around. But like, I mean, when you went over, it wasn't the norm. It seems like now, like the world feels a little bit smaller where everyone can go.

Yeah, like this was in 2000 and, oh, yeah, really well, what? 2007. Yeah. Like, that's a long time ago, you know what I mean? I think it was John Cove, Landham and then me. No, I only meant, it was, there was plenty of lads who did it, but it's not like it is now. It's almost like a ride of passage for a toy boxer. So it was unusual.

Yeah. It wasn't unheard of at all. There was lads that went over and some really good Irish lads went over and got some big wins over there and some of the big stadiums. But, um, yeah. It wasn't as routine as it is now. Well, even you being so involved in the sport, like, I presume the popularity now is probably a lot bigger than it was back then even you starting at 23

in your local gym. Yeah, I mean, there's a lot of factors that have kind of brought it to the fore. Yeah, what is that? That's what I was going to ask you. What are the contributing factors that have made it? Because it seems like nearly every town has a MIT high gym now. Yeah, which is great. They used to be few and far between when I started that anyway.

And like I said, it was something that we barely heard of when Mike opened up to Jim Lockingham. So it's kind of like, I think one thing is like social media, everybody knows a little bit about everything now, you know what I mean? If you hear the word Muay Thai and go, I thought it looks deadly or if you see a film about it and Google it and find out more, you know what I mean, and trigger our interest and might push it towards it.

Then martial arts in general, and you have to kind of say it, like the McGregor effect was a real thing, it did happen even though it was a sport. For jihitsy as well as Mai Tai and everything else, It's kind of blown up. Yeah, yeah. Like everybody who knows what MMA is, kind of now knows what Maitai is

because it's so kind of, it's an effective fight form. You know what I mean? It's a non-traditional. Well, it's traditional in some ways, but it's an effective form of fighting. Like, it's a competitive fight form. And it's utilized by MMA, guys, you know?

So anybody with even a passing interest in MMA now knows what Mait is. But then there's other things as well that are kind of in the last year, that are pushing a fodder. One of them is that it's been accepted into the Olympics as a demonstration sport. wasn't in the Olympics before. It's never been in the Olympics before.

So it looks, normally what happens is it goes demonstration sport and the following Olympics it will be a full competition spot. So that's going to really push it on further and I think a few people have started to notice that. The other thing is a big promotion called One Championship is after kind of raising its head and it's, they promote MMA K1 or Muay Thai but all the best fights are Muay Thai. When you watch it you go now they're the ones to watch and there's now big porces. It was like an Irish guy Craig Coughley fought in an eight-man tournament and there was a six-figure contract with one championship that he won.

Which is probably unheard of before. Yeah, you want to go way, way back into the golden area in my toy in the 90s when you get a fight push like that in the stadiums of Mike. That was kind of saying it's the pinnacle of it, fighting in the big stadiums in Thailand, like the one that you went to. That's where the elite went. So a world title is great and all, but like the really hard titles to get with the stadium titles. And there was money involved in that, you know, back in the day, but it dropped off. But like to get out 100 grand. contract is fucking brilliant and in fairness he deserved these he's a class act yeah and there

was also another tournament that one championship held and he had a million euro prize money for yeah so that was that was one heard of like now people are looking at it you can actually get a fucking few quid out of this now it's only the very elite the very top level the one but at the same time there's something it filters down a little bit as well does it I mean yeah but it's even like you can look at it now and go like what was the goal for lads who are who are wanting to get into moitoy where did they want to go to it were they going to be happy with fighting in GALs. Are they going to maybe go and fight in the stadium in Thailand once or twice and then come home? But now it's like the goal is I want to fight on one

championship. I want to get a one championship contract like the UFC like trying to get into the UFC. Yeah. That's type of thing you know. There's more that they can see a clearer path that you can make something out of this at home rather than going to Thailand. To a degree yeah, yeah, because as far as I know Craig Hockley's had to get in that contract, I don't know how much time he spent in Thailand. I'm sure he's been over but like he he fights out with DCI in Dublin and that that's his kind of home gym yeah so he hasn't had to base himself abroad in order to get that contract you know do you have many um athletes or that come from an MMA background into your gym to to help them skill up in

my tie or is it the opposite way do do athletes train in Maitai and then transfer over to MMA we've actually had a bit of boat and I've had some Kowlads getting touching me about about me coaching Maitai like you know Johnny Walker he's a UFC heavy-like guy he I was coaching him for a while man I was an experience he was fucking years man he's like six four six four five and just like a brick shit house like he be hauling the pads for him and he's just like and I was kind of wondering oh this is great that he's at the rasker video I was like I'd say he just ran out of Padman who's

Padman yeah yeah yeah yeah he had their parents meet yeah yeah yeah that was cool to couch somebody at that sort of elite level somebody who's fighting regular than you're saying yeah but that's not your self-focused really is it is your self-focused development for the kids really purely my time Already my toy, like that's my thing, you know what I mean. I'm more than happy to share what I know with these lads when they come in, but no, it's my toy all the way for me.

And going back on, even you touched on GAA clubs and stuff like that, putting on fight shows. Yeah. Tell me about how that works. Do you organize them, do other people organize them? What's the ins and outs of that, the difficulties, the effort? Yeah, I have to say, like putting on a fight event is so difficult.

I was, that's what I was imagining. It is fucking mad. There's so many moving parts to be. Yeah. And it all has to happen, everything has to happen at the right time in order. And there's, there's so many crucial components. And if one person doesn't do what they're supposed to do, the whole arse can fall over, you know what I mean?

And I've seen that happen, you know what I'm? What would, what could be, what would happen in terms of just becoming an absolute failure? Well, one thing that happened to us was that we had our ambulance cancel at the last minute. And so we know ambulance cover. And you need to have that. You can't have a show, you can't have a lad's elbow in the head obie to her and there's not fucking ambulance there, you know what I mean? So you have a doctor at ring, so you're not in time. You need an ambulance.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. They'll just throw you in a bag of a tuck-tuck up going to go. But now you need, you need, obviously you need an ambulance there, you know, so it was fucking, it was fucking, it was fucking pull it. And there was like three months of work went into this. Now that's just for me, there was all the fighters who were trying to fucking arse off. And all make them waiting? Yeah, exactly.

They're all made waiting on, you know what do I do I do here? Do I pull it? Do I push it back a week? do I keep trying to find another ambulance? Are we going to get one? But yeah, that type of thing. And then you also have to find a venue for this to take place? That can be a really big challenge for people who promote shows.

Like I've been promoting jobs pretty much since I started coaching. A lot of the time it's just to help keep your ads active. There's not really money in it. You get a grand or two, but for the hours you put into it, it's not. It doesn't justify it. No. So, now, I haven't been known as many because I've been running the gym. I've been like a bit more on my plate so I've been running as many shows yeah but uh

calvid would probably stop this as well we had a really good show we were the first show um after calv it's the first my to toy show after covids that we did in the talba hotel that was a brilliant one really good show with it was a good high standard high production like how can how do you how do you is how do you's able to find for that that goes tickets from the yeah the ticket sales the way works is like um if you're promoting your show you'll send out to the fighters of each gym then try and shift a few tickets you're all your own lads of a few you'll sell a few in the gym it's really a team effort then you really kind of need it really is yeah you kind of because like if lads don't sell ticket look at nobody wants to

do it they want to fight and they want to fight and they want the ready-made audience to be there chair and their name but the reality of it is that you don't get many people going to a my to show because it's a might-toy show you get people going because their mates fighting so they kind of have to sort of pull their weight a little bit on that you know yeah now look you don't kind of say oh you don't sell tickets you're not going on my show you wouldn't do that But at the same time you do kind of have to nudge them to make sure that the show kind of wipes its own arson that it's going to be viable. So tell me about the transition from, well, coaching Mai Tai to now owning your own facility and also owning the gym as well. Yeah, well, what I kind of had to do first was jettison the journalism, you know what I mean?

Like I was running the gym. It was really busy. How long were you, did you keep the journalism up? until you parted ways with that? I was a journalist for 10 years, pretty much. I was kind of freelancing towards the end of it. Yeah, I wasn't a staff journalist. Yeah.

I think I graduated in 2004, and I set up the gym in 2014. Yeah, okay. So, yeah, I kind of did both for about eight months, but I felt like I wasn't doing neither than well. Yeah, I was just too busy. Had your hand in too many pots? Yeah, like I was flying,

like I was doing travel journalists and things for a while, and it sounds great on paper, and it is great. you know what I mean but at the same time it's like it's kind of a young man's game I think yeah you mean like what's all the life can you have if you're traveling every week yeah it needs to be the like it needs to be the only um hobby or thing that you want to do then is to travel because if you want to do other things you probably won't be able to do them if you're on the go and playing every yeah like it wasn't it was difficult to train it was difficult to fight it was

difficult you know what I mean certainly difficult to coach but what happened was a cousin of mine owns a gym not far from here and he got a kind of purpose built martial arts facility built onto the side of it. And he was in touch with me going like, yeah, what way should I kid this out? And I was like, who's going to be coaching there? And he's like, oh, a couple of people who are interested? I was like, oh, they were, I was fucking do it.

I was like, give it to me, man. This sounds fucking deadly. Like, so it kind of in a way fell on my lap, but I kind of jumped on it when the opportunity came past. But you were ready for the opportunity when it came because we've had all this experience. Yeah, like I mean, I didn't exactly have a fucking clitter and fight career, you know what I mean?

Like, but at the same time, I'd been involved in the sport for a long time and I worked under some brilliant coaches like I worked with Don Notton in Galway as well I was out there for a year and like I said John Walsh in Waterford and yeah Mike Dockery was my first coach and yeah I'd got a lot out of my time of Warriors when King Cowdy took over from from Mike so yeah I felt like I was still learning I didn't know an awful lot about it but I'd spent a long time in Thailand and competed over there and like I said I worked under some good coaches I was like fuck I'm gonna go for it yeah so um yeah that kind of after a while it was just it was

it was doing well it was getting busy and I just felt like I wasn't really giving enough my time to it because I was I was traveling around a lot right and so I just kind of sat down with myself and said right well which one are you enjoying like which one do you get the most out of yeah it's just fuck it I was getting rid of joy and that was it and then um wait where was that other gym the one that was attached to it's in shoreline that was shoreline bray yeah yeah and how long were you in shoreline for years right away from 2014 up until COVID yeah so when COVID happened um we were kind of of like it's a council all building up there so remember to kind of indoor restrictions on you can have this amount of people indoors or whatever it basically rolled us completely out because even

when the gym was able to reopen it was like no group train and pods a tree all this sort of shit we just they just couldn't accommodate us up there it was and at the time we didn't know how long didn't know how long it's going to go on for we didn't know it was ever going to come back what farm would have come back you know what I mean it was out basically by two years like we are trying it in a fucking failed when we could you know what I mean and then And yeah, it was just like touching go, like is this still going to be a thing, you know? Yeah, it was a rough kind of time, but then we ended up finding our way into this place. We started off at a little corner and kind of went there.

And then you started off here, but then you ended up taking over the whole premises itself. Yeah, yeah, we started off at like basically this little section where we're in now in the ring. Yeah, it was the rest of the unit was being used as a gym. Oh, it was all the gym dother. Yeah, yeah. So, but the things weren't going too well on the gym side of things. The guy was kind of struggling a little bit with it. yeah and so we were like our customers are starting to filter back you know yeah so um we

kind of started off with this little section but we were kind of like Israel we kept like kind of kind of just taking another little bit of land taking another little bit of land then we built up this big fucking wall you know what I mean you'll be down to Aldi next yeah yeah we kind of we went on the lease got half got half to the de owner yeah and then things still weren't picking up for the other guy so he by agreement like it was all cool like we um decided to take over the opposite side yeah but the facility we have here the my toy facility is huge it's it's um serious like so we didn't need any more space no so i kind of meant like there's no point to me making a whole place a fucking motoy gym it's as big as it needs to be um so i'm gonna have a go of running a fucking gym you know

and it wasn't something that i was eyeball and really as like oh yeah i want to do that i want to be a gym owner it was more like i want to protect the my toy facility because i was like if something somebody else comes in and takes that or if he goes out of business well then he might pull we might lose the least we might get kicked out yeah yeah and I kind of didn't know there's an unknown if somebody else is gonna come in and run it it was like who the fuck you're gonna get you know you know you know so I was like fuck it I'll just do it you know yeah you kind of need one person there as the as the focal point as the leader of and then yeah yeah because like there is share facilities here and stuff

like that and that can kind of over time cause problems with people if they have their own interests and they're not they don't give a fuck about what you're doing their focus on what they're doing so it was just a case of biting the bullet and gone for it in them so how have you found it how have you found probably something obviously that you never expected to be a gym owner but how have you found that on top of obviously running this facility and and all the fighters involved yeah well the obvious thing is that it's busy you know it takes a lot of your time like any new business like you have to absolutely paw yourself into it if you want to make it work especially the early the early months and early years like and like there's a lot of work that needed

to be doing in here like we are changing like replacing shower replacing toilets like repainting the place and like I was in here to fucking two three four in the morning working like trying to sort the place out like we had to get in all new machines and just refitting the place out and then it was all like rebrand and remark it and trying to get some fucking members in you know we had to set up the website we had to set up the booking systems it was amazing amount of work amazing amount of work now it was brilliant that like because we got the club here we saw many of the lads involved there was a lot of

lads that were kind of offering their time to help out you know what I mean so that was great like everybody kind of rallied around and kind of saw what we were trying to do and we're like yeah this this is going to be really something fucking, something special if we can pull it off, you know? So, yeah, with a lot of help from a lot of people, like it's really come together now, yeah. Well, that is essentially it.

When it comes to running the business, it's like you can't do everything yourself and that you need to be able to, even you delegate in classes to, you know, fighters who have probably been working with you for a long time, them kind of doing shifts in the gym and stuff like that. Yeah, yeah, that's it. Like, the lads have been brilliant.

Like, we've a decent crew with ads. Now, we actually, we lost a lot around the same, time a lot of them emigrated like half a fucking fight team just bounce to australia you know i mean yeah the half the country exactly with the rest of the fucking country but um yeah like they're over there living the life you know what i mean but um fair play to them but at the same time it's a big loss to the club you know what i mean um but we did have a few lads there that really helped out the likes of um we have craig there um mcaddam he's he's been brilliant with us and we've tern and bandy mulligan there's a lot of our lads that have kind of been there

done that that have been helping the new crop trail because we've had a deadly crop of young lads that come in through over last few months and they're so it's it's brilliant to say yeah like as much as I miss the lads that left like it's this new crop is coming in and that we've refocused on them yeah so we're pushing them forward we're doing in interclub now in them two weeks time a lot of them are gonna have that first fight the first demo but it's deadly they're all saw them out about it it's like a lot of them same story like when i join they all hang around with each other a lot of them yeah so it's this crew of mates and they're all pushing each other on you know I mean it's just deadly that you're literally watching what happened

TEO? Yeah, man. It's, it's, fucking deadly and it's like, yeah, it's just the energy and the kind of positivity and yeah, it's just the ambition of them all is, it's just fucking great, you know what I mean? They're all, I'm going to do this and I'm going to do that and all. It's deadly, you know what I mean? You just stand behind and then and kind of help them forward. It's like you even said there earlier, it's about building a community, which is exactly what you're doing. Yeah, yeah, that's it, man, it's, it kind of, it's just, like I said, there's something special about the sport, you know what I mean? And people who get involved in it, like, um, you don't get as much of the kind of shit talk that you get in them

May people tend to be a bit more respectful towards each other even opponents there's always respect among opponents and I think that kind of carries down like that like all the coaches like in Ireland like they're all decent people you know what I mean they're all you know what I mean they're in a spot for the love of it you know what I mean there's nobody who's going to be like retiring on the fucking what they're going to make out of like two or three fighters in in my toilet it's not about that you know it's everybody's trying to spread the benefits of the spot everyone you know are you purposeful when you know obviously you're building this community and you're trying to

and all these fighters and all these kind of young athletes, are you purposeful when, you know, you ingrain that in them about respect? Yeah, I think... Or that's something that just comes naturally from the environment of... Yeah, I don't over stress it, you know what I mean? I don't kind of...

Because as much as people say, Muay is about respect. My toy isn't necessarily about respect. It just... I mean, it's... In Thailand especially, like I said, it's pretty cut-trout. Yeah.

Like, there's lads over there who get bought and sold by their james, you know what I mean? Lads who are basically adopted by their James and then they get fucking sold to, there's that type of thing goes on. There's lads who get the fucking shit kicked out because they lost. Like the we had a couch over here from Thailand

for about a year, this guy showed. And he was a top level toy fighter, but he didn't have a half of time off the coaches that he dealt with. So there's no respect there, you know? But between the opponents, you get respect. You know what I mean? That's something that's kind of unique to the sport. And I think people just kind of,

I think a lot of appeals to people when they say it, when they watch fights, they go like, oh, the lads are kind of getting into the ring and they're bound to the judges. and then after the fight, they're bound to each other, and they're hugging each other, they're not talking shit online before the fight. And the culture of the sport kind of seeps down.

And I think you don't have to over stress it. You don't have to be in here fucking bowedier sense that you shit like that. You know what I mean? People just kind of pick up the bits of it that are useful and kind of, you know, help keep a positive atmosphere in the sport. Yeah.

Talk to me about that transition, if we went back, that transition from even going from a fighter to a coach. Because like you said, you know, you stepped forward when the opportunity came. but you didn't know if you were really ready for it like what does do you necessarily have to be a good fighter to be a good coach um well I don't think I was a shit fighter I was all right you know I was okay but at the same time like I didn't

I wasn't massively experienced well well even sorry just to put it a different way like not all great fighters translate into great coaches that's true yeah I mean like I think um there is certainly some lads that were amazing fighters that I've turned into really good coaches. But I think there is a big mentality shift that needs to take place if you're going to move from coaching, move from being focused entirely on yourself as a fighter

and being single-minded about your goals in relation to yourself, you know? Like you need to be totally obsessed with the spot if you want to compete in it, you know what I mean? You need to only think about your needs. You need to, your family needs to kind of like, not to take a step back, but they need to kind of recognise that

you're going to be a selfish passive when you're cutting weight, you're going to be cranky. Is that what you were like for a fight for? Yeah, I was a fucking prick man. I remember my Mark and I were to see me in Thailand and she was like, I thought, I'd be like, near you, man, I'm, what the fuck is wrong with you? Like, and I was just like, I'm hungry. I'm fucking trying two hours this morning.

I woke to all day, they're doing another round I have to save them. And then it was get me 5K in, you know what I mean? And I'm not allowed to, you know what I mean? Like this type of shit, like, so, look, you do have to, if you're going to put yourself through all that, you have to really kind of focus on, like, making it, well, you have to kind of make yourself as comfortable in that as you can, you know what I mean? And there's not a lot of room for,

you know outside noise yeah outside noise exactly so you need to just be super focused on yourself and when you're making that transition like to being a coach you have to kind of completely flip it the other way around and that's not that's not always easy for for for for lads you know there's some people guys lads who are super strict and super obsessed and super focused on themselves they make the best fighters but then at the same time if you can't flip it around and start making your your students your self-focused and making them your obsession like well then yeah you might not you may not make it as a coach

How did you do that then? Or was something that just came over time? I think it was probably something that came over time. I think the way I coach has changed a lot, I'd say. I think I was lucky that I had good coaches and had a good knowledge base of the sport. But then you've to apply that. Yeah, you have to apply out.

I think I kind of enjoyed sharing my knowledge of it, you know what I mean? And I think I personally did get a lot out of it. As much as I'm saying, you have to be focused on helping other people, those benefits to me and that I was doing something that I enjoy, you know what I mean? The alternative was like, I know I was getting the travel with the travel joiners and thing but like a lot of that's just sit in front of a fucking laptop clicking buttons. Like now I was in a gym in a busy, fun, positive environment, you know what I mean? Even though I wasn't like fucking being totally focused on myself and doing my own thing,

like sharing this information is fucking great, you know what I mean? Coaching is a brilliant job and it's really enjoyable, you know? So yeah, I think that's probably the direction it went in like. Do you have any difficult moments or experiences that stand up? for you as a coach. Yeah, I think what really bothers me is when you'll prepare somebody for a fight you know what I mean and they'd be getting ready and you'd be talking

about it and you'd be amping them up about it and you know, the two years are working hard and they're making all these sacrifices and you know, you can feel like you're leading them to the top of a hill, you know what I mean? And it's a tough climb for them and they get to the top and they get into the ring and they fight and then you're looking at it and you go on here, he's at the win on that. And then your lad's hand gets raised and you're like that's bullocks. And I find that

I find that very hard to deal with. Does that happen a lot? Yeah. It can happen a lot. Now, I don't think it's necessarily, like, it's not corruption because it's fuck all money and that sort of level, but at the same time, there's people fucking, you know,

they'll have their favourite games or whatever, you know what I mean? Now, sometimes it can be, sometimes the judge would just make a bad call. We all make mistakes, you know what I mean? So it can stem from that. But then there's other times where you just feel like, you're watching a fine there. No, no, man, you're heads over your ass like.

Yeah. I mean, but you know, the judges don't exactly deal because they're making lots of money over there, or they're volunteering their time. Like, so it's kind of like I'm talking shit about referees or something, you know what I mean? But at the same time, the outcome is like these lads, you feel like they've done all the things that you ask them to do,

they've done them all the right way and they didn't get the reward for it, you know? So that could be tough. Now, when I say it happens a lot, it might happen twice a year. Yeah, you know what I mean? You might have 50 fights that year. Maybe that's not a lot, is it?

Well, no, that's a very percentage, but if you're at the pick something that bulls you, If you pick something that bugs me about the fight game, it's when that does happen. If it happens once in a blow me on it, it'd still be the one thing I hate, you know what I mean? Yeah. And how do you pick up a fighter from a loss like that, or do you? Well, I think what happens after a loss is that it's just the case of,

you're going to have to, like, people have just spin the fight over in their head and over and over and eventually they'll come to terms with it. They'll process it and assess it in a way that they can move on from, you know? So really All you can kind of do is just trying to tell them that it's look, I know you feel like shit about it now but it's temporary. You know, it's not going to be forever.

Like it's just one more fight on your journey like I mean and you can obviously encourage and then try to get back to training early, you know? Try getting thinking about the next fight early because that'll kind of refocus them. But yeah, it's like, it is tough for lads and it's not like losing a football match. It's different.

The football match has come around every fucking week. Yeah, it doesn't take three months of sacrifice and stuff but there's also, there's nowhere at the whole. there's no there's no finger to point that a player on your team that was playing shoy or anything like that is you're literally putting yourself out there in a pair of little shiny satin shorts covering baby oil I'm from the a higher mate screaming and shouting locked you know I mean it's that's a fucking challenge man you know what I mean and it's it's it's kind of like your abilities lay bare there's no ball there's no racket

there's no fucking teammates there's no nothing you're just in there competing against some lad and see who's the better man on the day you know so it's that can really affect lads because it's it's it's it's it's It's something really kind of almost defining about them, you know what I mean? If you feel like you've lost a fight. Because if you lose a football match, you'd still fucking knock you out. You can't do that after, we've got baddards, you know what? Yeah, yeah, when you're lying there on the floor, you've had to.

Exactly, yeah, where do you go from that? You know what I'm at fairness, you know, you kind of have to take it on the chain. Is there, have you noticed that you would have fighters in the club that would react better to loss and others? And I suppose what I mean by that is like, is it better to, you know, to kind of be obsessed about the loss in terms of thinking about it and thinking what you could have done better or would it be better to just be able to quickly move on from that loss? I think there tends to be lessons in every loss for people so you do need to look at it and try and prove on it but at the same time can't it consume you.

Yeah you can't let it consume you and you definitely can't let it knock you off your journey like if you have a goal well then a loss shouldn't push it off that no you know what I mean but some people take you all right some people take the lot of it. losses better than others I've seen lads like there's a young lad that I have here like Sean O'Brien he's ultra talented like he's a really good kid like he plays football and stuff like that will play football at a high level and he started an MMI recently and within six months he makes the Irish MMA team he's one of these like freaking out lads good at everything good at everything but I remember I'm getting a draw in one of his

my toy fights man and days kid was fucking inconsolable live it could he could not get all over it man he was just fucking freaking out like and in a way you're kind of looking at it gone that's a big part of why he is successful at what he does you know what I mean and that's what's pushing him you know what I mean he does not have any room and his headspace for a loss yeah he is just he's just gone forward end the story like yeah so now it doesn't it doesn't push him off track but fucking hell you could tell or hurt them you know I mean and I mean in certain people of a certain personality type like that can that can benefit them yeah yeah yeah if your self-focused is winning and all you want to do is win yeah exactly you can't do win

Exactly, exactly, yeah. Whereas other people would be like, ah, it is what it is. Yeah, yeah, don't know if you want, that's a bit of a flaky personality. That's not a great, that's not a great fighter. Yeah. Attitude to have, like, if the, if a loss isn't going to hurt you,

like, what the fuck you're doing? Yeah, yeah. I mean, I know there's coaches that say, oh, look, the winning isn't everything. Yeah. It's not everything, but at the same time, have a conversation with the lad who lost and then have a conversation with the lad who won

and tell me that winning isn't important. Yeah. You know what I mean, it is, like, yeah. You even spoke there about, having you know someone in the club who's really talented but and plays multiple sports is if you have like a kid in the kid in the club and you know you know he's going to be a bit of a diamond he's going to be talented he could like a far as i'd give him a little nudge to be like yeah this is the sport that he should be playing yeah look i i i never really kind of um tried to say

ah damn i wouldn't do that like but at the same time like um i have had situations where lads were involved in other sports and stuff like that and and I'd be like, no, like, this kid's really good. And, you know, and maybe their parents wouldn't be aware of it or whatever. So then I'd, like, I've done that before. I've reached out to parents. Such and such, hasn't been training in a while. But they're really fucking talented.

I was like, I've no shortage of kids up here, but your child stands out. That's somebody who could really do something in the spot. And I don't know if they're still interested, but if they want to come back up, like, I'd love to try and really kind of push them forward and see where they can go with it. You know, I've done that a few times. And the response is always good, I'm noticed. Is there a point maybe at a certain age

where they have to like they can do multiple sports but then they have to kind of decide on this is what I'm going to put all my effort and focus on to yeah I think that kind of naturally happens doesn't it

I mean you can only I mean if you are trying in JA twice a week and then you're doing my toy twice a week that's grand when you're a teen or whatever but like well even younger than a teen but once you get into your kind of mid-tains yeah when the demands of the sports

that your reign starts to increase and you know doing the guy twice a week isn't got to cut it or the football twice a week isn't going to cut it then you kind of it's it's kind of judgment time you know what I mean make a call on it like you start getting to 16 17 your muscle start to take a little bit more yeah yeah like if now in fairness I believe like that kids who play different sports coming up it's really good in terms of injury prevention and stuff like that and so it is a good thing when when kids are involved in a variety of sports and but yeah I think it's kind of the mid-tain mark

that they have to start making a call if they want to really go somewhere with it. Last question I'm going to ask you and then we'll finish up. So are you excited about the future of Mai Tai and your involvement in the sport in Ireland but specifically in Bray?

What does that look like for you for the next 10 years? Yeah, I mean I think the facility we have now is a big part of it. The last place we have was good but it was tiny and I think with the new facility the community in Bray has really responded like the numbers have never ever been as high as the air like we have beginner classes that have 20 30 people we'd be 24 people tone up for a beginners class there last week there was 40

in a class the week before they'll file out and we get 25 in the fighter class come in yeah like it's it's like a fucking army you know what I mean so I've never been never been happier now I fucking tawny calf muscle last week and I'm got I'm supposed to be getting all these lads ready for the first fight the first demo in three weeks so I'm just wandering around pointing a fucking crutch at them you know what I'm uses the tits on an own but like well this is all the rest of the team is coming in to help you help out you know this is where you have in your team and having other people helping out yeah and the team have been fucking brilliant like straight away they're like oh no like we look at this way we look

at that I feel lads are volunteering that time to come in and help the lads get ready you know what I mean and like there's probably no better town to be couching a fight spot in the Bray like this is a fighting town you know I mean it's obviously with Kitey and stuff like that leading the way and that was a unbelievable role model for everyone in the town everyone in the country like all over the world yeah so when you're couching in the town like this like people respond to it you know what I mean people are aware of fight spots and they know they don't necessarily have a negative view of them sometimes you know some people have this kind of like kind of rough scummy fucking fight spot thing like nobody has that

at a cheer towards it in bray you know because they see what katie's like you know what i mean and how cool she is and you know and what a role model she is you know so there's no kind of dodgy aspect of fight sports and bray there's no view of it in that way you know so it's obviously really real positive look on it like yeah just to plug the the gym as we finish up so if if someone wanted to maybe give mytai a go for the first time and they're in the surrounding area what's the what's the strategy what do they do yeah first thing to do if you want to get involved in mytai and bray is jump onto the website joy sue at mytoy.com or else just put in mytoy bray and we'll come up and if you have any questions you all the contact

details are there just give us a show and we'll get you up and one yeah