The Wellness Scoop - Can You Trust Your Hunger? Weight Loss Hype & BBQ Myths

Episode Date: August 13, 2026

Could wellness mushrooms transform your health, or are they simply an expensive trend? Can you really trust your hunger cues after years of dieting and food rules? And should we be worried about what happens when we fire up the barbecue? This week, we unpack the evidence behind medicinal mushrooms and berberine, explore how our childhood experiences can shape our relationship with food decades later, and separate fact from fiction when it comes to barbecues and cancer risk.  Plus, we discuss whether recipe boxes are really as healthy as home cooking, how to navigate different approaches to eating within the same family and why chasing the next health trend so often distracts us from the fundamentals The Way code: https://www.thewayapp.com/wellnessscoop Send your questions for our weekly Q&A to ⁠⁠[e-mail]⁠⁠ For more from Rhi and Ella:  Order your copy of Ella's new book: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠Quick Wins: Healthy Cooking for Busy Lives⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Order your copy of Rhi's new book: ⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠The Fibre Formula⁠⁠⁠⁠⁠ Sign up to ⁠Rhitrition+⁠ Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Hear that? It's your money calling. It wants a promotion. Elevate your savings with the Scotia high interest savings account. Always earn high regular interest rates that grow the more you save and invest. Conditions apply. Visit scotiabank.com slash h-I-SA to learn more. Scotia Bank. You're richer than you think. I am genuinely so excited about today's sponsor because it's the way. Honestly, if you you have listened to me any time over the last few months, you know I have become a little bit evangelical about this app and I honestly recommend it to everyone. My friends, my family, people on Instagram, everyone. And she recommended it to me so it's true. I've heard so much about

it. It's just because it has had such a big impact on me. I've meditated on and off for 15 years or so now. But using the way, it's honestly the first time we've become so consistent with this daily practice. And I've just seen the most unbelievable results as a result of that. The app is just incredible. And what I love is every day you open it and there's a meditation waiting for you. So you don't scroll that you don't have to choose between hundreds of options. There's no wondering what to do. It just takes you on a path. Well, I think that's why it works so well because, you know, most of us just don't need more big decisions every day to make, Ella. No, exactly that. We've got decision fatigue, haven't we? So this is so nice because you just follow this path of meditation, which is led by Henry, the founder, who's just the most amazing teacher. And he makes it seem somehow just incredibly simple, but exceptionally profound at the same time, which is a very rare skill. And I've been using it too. Yes, I've now finally begun a meditation journey and I've been doing some of the shorter practices on busy days because I completely understand why you talk about it so much, Ella, it really is.

nice intro in for me. Yeah, it is and I'm so glad anyway. It's helped me feel so much calm, less reactive, more present. It all sounds like huge claims, but I just say, please, please, please try it if you're struggling with stress or overwhelm. You just got to give it a go. And the lovely thing is that everyone listening can definitely try it themselves. Exactly. So you can get a 30-day free trial, so just try it every day for month. It'll change your life. All you do is head to theway app.com forward slash wellness. Scoop. Yeah, that's thewayapp.com forward slash wellness scoop. Welcome to the Wellness Scoop, your weekly dose of health and wellness inspiration.

And as always, we're both here as your host. I'm Ella Mills. And I'm Rihanna Lambert. And today we are breaking down some of the most interesting trends, taking your listener questions and discussing our recommendations. So let's go. Coming up in today's show, we're going to be talking about whether wellness mushrooms are worth the hype. The truth about burperine and various different weight loss supplements that are using it. Can you really trust your hunger cues? Should you be worried about BBQs? We're rhyming today accidentally. Raising healthy children when parents eat differently and whether recipe boxes, those at home cooking kits are as healthy as home cooking. Lots of different recommendations. Lots of recommendations from you.

We've got various different voice notes. We've got so much to talk about. So, Re, what have you got from us today? any updates, any recommendations, what do we need in our lives? I have loads of recommendations today for the first time in quite a long time. The first is I have been trying a few. So I went in a bit of a rabbit hole on toothpaste. Oh, I have done this a few times. And he's never really led me anywhere, so I really want to hear what you say. Well, I found the, and I realized it's the one that had been on Dragon's Den,

parlor, it's called, because when you're traveling, yeah, you can buy these are like chewing ones and they're plastic free and they're environmentally friendly. So that's what I'm currently trying out. I'll let you know my verdict when I get on. Ooh, chic design. Wow. So chic. So chic. So different to like your cold gaze. Yeah, parlor has been my new and I think I'm late to the game because they seem huge. They've got like amazing social media marketing and things. I feel like I am behind the game. But also it's founded by dentists and I like that because I know it still has a good level of fluoride, which I know is controversial. Apparently, fluoride is controversial and toothpaste.

Fluid is controversial and confusing. Yes. And actually, every dentist that ever spoke to says that good amounts of it are really essential for your teeth. So perhaps I should get a voice note from a dentist on that. But that's my first. Yes, that would be super helpful. And the thing that's also interesting actually as well, certainly that I have been curious

about and trying to learn more about and have understood. but again we'd love to hear more, is that as well, obviously, what we never talk about, I feel, is obviously we are all, I think, especially people listening to this podcast, aware of how important our gut microbiome is. But we never talk about, or I don't think anyone ever talks about the oral microbiome. You have a whole microbiome in your mouth. Yeah. And what I've heard so many people talk about recently, your dentist friend of mine, for example, is like how bad the kind of blasting mouthwashers are. Yeah, I don't use them now. Yeah, for your oral microbiome. And so that's one of the things that I'm really interested in. Anyway, I've never used parlor before, but now I'm on their website and they're talking about bio balance toothpaste. So I can see myself going down this. Yeah, I was on a roll. I'm going to get a voice note to learn more about oral microbiome and fluoride and all sorts of myths and misconceptions. Because this is a probiotic formula. This isn't sponsored, guys. This is sorry. I'm just that this has been a rabbit hole that I, it's one of the things that's sort of been most confusing to me. As I said, yeah, we don't use those kind of mouthwashes anymore because I have understood those really are not good for the oral microbiome,

which makes sense. I used to use Listerine. I'm just putting it out there. I used to use that huge company because I was like, oh, it feels really minty fresh. And then when I was pregnant with my first, I was told about the oral microbiome and how bad it is for me and I shouldn't be using it. A good dentist friend of mine who's interested in health was saying the exact same thing the other day. Okay. So that's my first one. My second is a reminder to everybody. No, you do not have to be pregnant to be told this and I've got a voice note for you to explain why we neglect our pelvic floor yes women particularly yeah you don't have to have had a baby to care about pelvic floor we should all care about pelvic floor as we get older right it impacts everything's let me just play

this voice note to you to explain why because I'm not a women's health physiotherapist but again I feel like it's an area with women's health that's evolving that lots of people are speaking about more so this is clairebourne she actually writes books on the subject and she is fully qualified as a woman's health physio. Here we go. So your amazing pelvic floor muscles are actually a group of little muscles that sit in the pelvic outlet. So at the bottom of our pelvis, there is a hole and the muscles sit and kind of fill the base of that hole. So they really do make up the floor of the pelvis, hence the name, the pelvic floor. And these muscles, along with these little synchre muscles, which are wrap around your urethra and around your anus, have some really important

roles in our lives. And that's true of all ages and actually for all genders. So they help to keep us continent of urine and feces and wind. They help to support your pelvic organs. So in the female body, this would be your bladder, your bowels and your womb. And they work with our other muscles of the core to support the spine. And they also contribute to our sexual pleasure. So though we hear about the pelvic floor muscles a lot in pregnancy and postpartum, because this is a time in our life when there's a lot more pressure put onto the pelvic floor. Actually, like all other skeletal muscles that we have, they do need support and TLC at all ages. And actually, symptoms relating to the pelvic floor are not exclusive to women who go through pregnancy and give birth. And they can actually appear

at any time of our lives. So symptoms that might relate to your pelvic floor, you might be experiencing, could relate to your bladder. It might be that you've noticed through movement or exercise that you leak some urine or when you cough or sneeze. Or you might be someone who's noticed that when you need a wee, it's incredibly urgent and you're rushing to the toilet or you're maybe leaking on the way to the toilet. You might notice that you struggle with your bowels. Maybe you're suffering with constipation. There can be an element of pelvic floor muscle involvement in this. Obviously, it's multifactorial constipation, but the pelvic floor muscles can be part of the story, especially when we're looking at the evacuation part of opening our bows. You might go the other way

and actually struggle with your bowel control, and that can be very, very limiting and make you feel very anxious to go out. You might be struggling with intercourse, maybe intercourse is painful, or you've actually lost pleasure from it. It can be lots of different things all relating to our pelvic floor.

And like all muscles, they can become weak, but they can also be kind of, have something weak or increased tones, actually struggle to relax. So you might feel that the muscles almost feel tight, so you're trying to squeeze it, but it's almost that you can't squeeze it. It's almost like the,

muscle is switched on all the time. So this is why regular pelvic exercises where we're just squeezing and relaxing may not be first-line treatment for everyone. And that's why people like me, pelvic health physiotherapists work alongside individuals to work out what their muscles are doing at the moment. How does this correlate and relate to their symptoms? And then we work together on a plan to help improve their symptoms and improve muscle function. So I hope that's helpful. and to anyone who wants to know more, then I really encourage you to maybe see a physio or try and get to know your poet for muscles a little bit better. They are a hard muscle group to engage with purely because we can't see them,

whereas you can see your arm moving, you can see your leg moving, we can understand those muscles a bit more easily. We rely a lot more on feel and visualization, and so it can be a little bit more difficult, but please know that for any of these symptoms, or if you're struggling, there absolutely is help. Thank you so much for bringing that to the show, both Claire and Ree. As you said, I think people are talking about it more, but probably nowhere near enough.

Nowhere near enough. And then my third recommendation, I told you, I'm like on a roll. She's on fire today. Some weeks we have nothing. But we discussed on Monday and Ella brought the positive vibe to the early harvest, the fact that all of these vegetables and fruits are growing very, very early. So perhaps what we all should be doing is harvesting as much as we can. and then freezing and saving and all those things.

Blackberries are never normally out this early July, August. I've been making BlackBee crumbles and heat waves, but actually I've been freezing quite a few things. And, I mean, my boys are Crumble-obsessed. I could sit and eat off. I am Crumble-obsessed. Out the oven, Ella. I could literally get my oven gloves and I could eat it straight away.

I'm just obsessed. Find your local hedgerows. I mean, they are everywhere. If you are lucky enough to live somewhere, that's a tiny bit more rural. You'll find them in London to get Blackberry-picking. give them a little rinse. I've been making crumble actually with one of the leftover deliciously Ella packs I had of

overnight oats or something. And I used to, I used that as the crumble topping. So I had tons of diversity in there. For fiber wins and plant points, crumbles are always a plus because you can add cheer seeds. You can add desiccated coconut to your mix. You could add ground almonds. You could add anything to your crumble topping. And then my final wreck.

Oh my God. She is actually on fire. I'm actually, number four. Sorry, I used to speed up, take up the whole podcast. Do not feel bad for not wanting to sit in the sun. Now, I used to be someone. I mean, I'm pretty pale, but I will go golden if I sit in the sun long enough. And I used to always sunbave.

Now, I think because of the heat wave, it suddenly hit me that I haven't actually sat outside in the sun nearly this whole summer. I'm only just starting to now as it's getting a bit cooler. And I am feeling it more, obviously, being pregnant. I'm really struggling with the heat. But my skin is an amazing nick now. I've got over the perioreal dermatitis I had that one week. And it's because I'm not sitting in the sun as much.

And I read that all you need is 10 minutes of sun exposure in the morning to get your vitamin D. So I do that. I try and do my 10 minutes on the camp drop off or nursery drop off. And then I apply my sunscreens when I get in. And I feel like perhaps I'm then getting my vitamin D store. for the day. My skin feels better for it and I'm not going to age as much, Ella, perhaps one day. Perhaps I'm anti-aging. Yeah, so don't feel like you have to go and sit in the sun. That's it from me. Over and out. That was a lot.

She's done. Should we mute the rest of the episode. Over to Ella, I'm on mute now. Well, I don't have four. I tell you that much. First of all, what I had been making, which I'm loving, I said on Monday, I have this abundance of cucumbers in my life. I have been giving them away to anyone I've seen, which is fun. Rie is coming over next week, so Rie will be leaving with a whole host of vegetables to take go. The boys are going to be so excited. It's so fun. But I've been pickling cucumbers. I actually have to say, I don't love a plain cucumber. Not my favourite flavour, but I love a pickled cucumber. So just do apple cider vinegar, sugar, salt, and then I do a quick salt rinse first. So I just

just leave them in the calendar for like 20 minutes with salt, just to leave the kind of excess water. So they stay a bit kind of crunchier. And then I literally just sat them. Yeah, cider vinegar, sugar and salt. You can add chili. You could add dill. You could have black pepper, etc. as well. But oh my gosh, they're so good and it's so crunchy and I keep them in the fridge. And I'm obsessed. So pickled cucumbers. So easy. Number one recommendation. But the other thing I just finished watching felt so nostalgic because I just loved the book so much. I finished, I think I said I started but I finished Little House on the Prairie. Oh my gosh, it's so good guys. I really recommend it. Well, that is going to be now the one that I will start watching because I needed to start.

Yeah, it's really nice. Honestly, it's such a good watch. It really is. Oh, I can't wait. I also want to re-watch Anne with an E in those old series I used to love. Oh, I just started. I'm halfway through the first episode and I'm also halfway through the Devil Wars Part of Two. I never managed to get to the cinema to watch. Oh, you're only halfway through. What do you think so far? Because I thought it was great. Oh my gosh, I'm loving it. Yeah, it's really good. Particularly Emily Blunt and Stanley Tucci. I think their characters are just absolute gold. Like, I was really laughing out loud. I just loving it. I really wanted to watch it all, but it was like midnight. Matt was like, we've got to go to sleep.

Anyway, loving it. I love when you get into something and that's the point it gets to you. Like it's interfering of your sleep. It shows it's that that addictive. So I have a kind of pick up, I suppose. She's got one more. Got one more for us. Got one more. I have been busy contacting experts and people that I know can get their view on things. So we discussed it in our last,

I believe it was our last extra scoop. Or was it the transsection on... It wasn't in this Monday's episode. It was in last Monday's episode, right? On women's health trackers and hormones. I promised you all I would get back to your what's currently going on in the women's health landscape. And on whether we had the four cycles versus eight, right?

Four phases versus eight. Nine. I think it was nine. and I had to speak to a few people. I just get a rounded approach. I spoke to a gynaecologist. I spoke to Dr. Helen O'Neill, who is the founder of Hurtility,

which is a credible, you know, evidence-based platform for women. We do not have nine phases of the menstrual cycle. And what's so, so interesting when she was discussing this, and I said, you need to give us a grounded voice note. I wanted to know what is going on in terms of women's health.

I know that lots of women's health tech companies recently went to Parliament because words in Parliament had potentially been shadow banned or something. If you mention the word ovary and, you know, we discussed that. So she fills us in on that. And then she's going to fill you in on what the current state is of women's health trackers. And sadly, I do think, I mean, I'll let you have a good listen. But at this point in time, they're definitely preying on our not vulnerability, but I'll want to try new things and explore. but we don't have the answers fully yet.

So I'll hand you over to her much more capable hands, Dr. Helen O'Neill. So I would love to have a really clear answer for why women's health is shadowband or suppressed on digital platforms. But the reality is actually it's a sad fact that in today's world there is no rational, logical or sensible reason for it. It actually just comes down to systemic bias. We're actually equivalent female and male health do not get. the same views. Anything to do with men's health or sexual wellness does not face this kind of algorithmic penalty whereby you see a downranking or filtering of content. And this really stems from number one, the over-sexualisation of female bodies, whereby anything to do with breasts,

vulvas, vaginas, or just female anatomy is deemed inappropriate or sexual. And number two, anything to do with menstruation or sexual health is deemed as still taboo. But what it's led to is that we have automated filters in many large tech companies, in fact, most, that are frequently filtering educational biological terms. And I mean things like vagina, periods, endometriosis, menopause. And they're being flagged as inappropriate adult or sexual material. It means that health platforms like fertility, who are conducting clinical trials, research, and really trying to educate women about symptoms regarding their menstrual health, physical and reproductive health. do not get to reach any audiences because our content gets shut down. So much so that we can't even advertise on meta.

So similar male testing companies do not face the same suppression. So it is really down to just systemic bias and just inappropriate use of filtering, especially in a world where really inappropriate use of AI can be used for all manner of really horrible things. This is not harmful content, but the blocking of this content is very harmful indeed. So I personally have never heard of there being nine stages to the menstrual cycle. We are educated that there are four. And while I will always hold space for us to be re-educated, especially when it comes to women's health where we have been so understudied,

I would love to have more information that is in depth around different aspects of the menstrual cycle. I'm sure that us simplifying into four phases where there are probably continuous changes throughout is exactly that as simplification. But unless and until we have the data to back up any of these kinds of claims, actually, then what we're doing is capitalizing on a lack of knowledge and therefore possibly lending to women wanting to find out more about these undefined nine other stages. I'm a big advocate for tech and I'm a big advocate for using technology. appropriately, but it also comes with a burden and a responsibility. If you are the tech company,

you have a responsibility to explain what everything is, what everything means, and what the impact of your findings or your data is, and it's something we've worked extremely hard at to do. Adertility is to publish all of our data, to publish all of our findings, and actually to work towards reclassifying the unknowns. So an example of that is we've just published the largest ever study undertaken to redefine female testosterone reference ranges because the current standard is actually using benchmarks for only 149 women. What we saw from this is that actually instead of there being that it's higher in life and then it falls off a cliff, there is no cliff during perimenopause for testosterone levels. In fact, actually every single year, our testosterone levels fall by about 1.4%

each year. So what we did is redefine the reference ranges in like an age, continuous statistical model. And I think the same could be true of the menstrual cycle where we see a time sensitive statistical model that could be built where you see the incremental changes of our hormones throughout. And that makes sense because nothing just shoots up and shoots down. There is an incremental change always. But again, until we have the data, I think we need to be really just appropriately labeling what the benefits are to women, especially women as consumers. Well, fantastic. Thank you, Helen. And also, again, thank you, Reeve, for really bringing us so much so you are on fire. Our first question today comes from Sonal, who said, I hope you're both

well. I love listening to your podcast. It has changed my way of cooking for my family. I'd love that. I would love your thoughts on wellness mushrooms, chargo, tremella, cordyceps. I bought a few from the dirty tea range after hearing your thoughts on green powders. I'm not sure though if this is a waste of my money. Really appreciate your thoughts. Ella, you've heard of these. I have heard of these and look, I'm never a fan of like bashing any one company or kind of any one thing as a general rule and we'll go into the science of medicinal mushrooms in

a second basically, but as a really top line, there is some interesting really. research on medicinal mushrooms. That's absolutely true. They could be incredibly powerful. There's definitely research to suggest that. The challenge is, we will talk about it more, I think, in a second. A, it's quite early stage a lot of the science, you know, probably as a general conclusion, need to know a little bit more. But I think where it's interesting, you're probably not getting quite enough in something like that as a product and probably to explore it where there is some interesting early research, you probably want to be taking a more specific higher dose versus mixed in with other things. Yeah, I have lots of thoughts to add to that. It's just giving me a

memory. When I worked with Rodney O'Sullivan back in 2000, I think 18 or 19, his dad was, I remember giving me these like jars of chaga black liquid and just, you know, he was very into all of that. And I think mushrooms have been around for thousands of years in terms of, you know, ancient Chinese medicine or different rituals. But like Ella said, we don't really know, but it's been something in the wellness industry in particular with these products. And one thing I'll first of all start by saying is that when you add hot water to anything, you technically denate your enzymes or you impact the availability of what's left once you've exposed it to something quite hot. So there's also that to consider. So these contain compounds, you know, these mushrooms, child

Chordyceps such as beta glucones, polysaccharides, so many different types of natural sugars and antioxidants. And in a lab setting, and in animal studies, we don't really have many human trials, maybe tiny, tiny ones at the moment, that they might have a positive impact so far on skin hydration is an area that has been found. But often these studies have like fewer than 100 people. short-term in a lab setting on animals, you just cannot directly apply that to humans. And what are they all studying different things? So let's just have a think about how this applies to the UK,

first of all. Rie, there are some studies, I think, that suggests it could be helpful for immune function as well. Yeah, but again, that is because of the interaction with the gut bugs, because mushrooms, and it's actually more, we think, scientists think, to do with the fibre in a mushroom and the fibre component rather than the individual beta-gluconsolid aspects of these mushrooms in particular. So research is still undecided, but we're kind of not sure here.

We know mushrooms are beneficial, and I don't think people eat to enough mushrooms. There's a very strange thing in the UK. I love them. See, I do. And in Italy, I used to love, I've only been to Italy like two or three times, so I used to love,

but I remember these beautiful porcini mushrooms. They're the really large, flat ones, that would be cooked as a dish on their own, you know, they're just, oh, divine. But we don't eat enough fibre in the UK. And we know perfectly well that mushrooms help contribute. And there could be a really interesting gut health impact here. We've got loads of robust evidence that the gut microbiome impacts our immune system and our heart function and our metabolic health.

So compared to a tea or a powder or a potion that claims, you know, for 30 or 40 pound a pack, you're still better off just trying to aim for 30 plants a week and getting more fiber to receive the same claims that a lot of these products are saying they give you because we have research that those claims can be met by simply eating your porridge bowl in the morning with some nice nuts and seeds. I think that's the perspective that I would put on it. But equally, there's not really any harm because like Ella said, the dose is so small. I know that there's a few researchers that are interested in the nose.

a row science aspect of these and let's just watch this space. I mean, I would love it if they, if they were beneficial for our brain health. Yeah, I definitely would say from my kind of research and speaking to people about these over the last few years, it's exactly that, which is that like, if they help you, this is not an area where it's like, please don't take them. Like, they're not going to be doing any harm. I think that's highly unlikely. And, you know, they may be, be helping you. As we said, there's very small early stage research that suggests they could be positive, but they are expensive. And so, you know, is it worth your money? I'm not sure. But if personally, if I was going to take these to support my own health, I would take a kind of specific

one in a higher concentration from a company that really specializes this. I don't think I would mix it into coffee or hot chocolate or match or something because as re-said I wouldn't add the hot water to it and I would have it where it's like just more specific personally because I think otherwise you can spend a lot of money on something that really is probably not going to do much at all the first ever BBC World interview I did when I was still at university was on a mushroom Guada Daman, I could never say it Gravius. It was a really famous mushroom. It was doing the rounds.

And there's a YouTube clip of me talking about the mushroom. It was very slowly and poorly, may I add. It was my first ever live TV interview. And it just happened to be global. And it was discussing mushrooms. And I think it's something that just has fascinated researchers for so long. And there was strong evidence for this particular study, I remember. But it's just in isolation.

And we have to remember we cannot apply studies in isolation to mass-produced products. Yeah, exactly. And then it's interesting, for example, like, you know, if you look at some reviews, for example, like the dirty coffee, if we're being specific about that one, which includes Lionsmane, for example, the dose of Lionsman used in it sits below the levels in most cited clinical research. So as we said, there's not loads of clinical research, but the clinical research there is does require you to take a higher dose than I think you're ever going to be able to get. when it's mixed in with other things. The reality is as well, it's probably not going to taste as nice as coffee. Yeah, exactly. So it's in like you're probably better to separate them and have something more specific personally.

Hear that? It's your money calling. It wants a promotion. Elevate your savings with the Scotia high interest savings account. Always earn high regular interest rates that grow the more you save and invest. Conditions apply. visit scotiabank.com slash h-i-sa to learn more scotia bank you're richer than you think question two is from ellie she said this might be common knowledge but not something i have thought about but as it's as ella

would like to say bbq season it's been brought to my attention that um they can that barbecue food can be dangerous is it true it could give me cancer and cooking over charcoal releases horrid toxins and chemicals on to my food. Is a barbecue safe or shall I avoid it? Thank you, Ellie. Okay, great question. We do see so much about barbecues at this time of year, don't we? And the kind of charing being inherently negative. Rhee, can you explain that for us? Yeah, also, I've been seeing a lot of those videos probably because of my overactive mind, but on tools that people are using on barbecue shedding metal bits that end up in the food as well. Oh, I keep saying that too. Yes, how good. It's not just me that gets these strange algorithm relations. But no, I wrote about this a lot in the science of nutrition. If anyone has

that encyclopedia, I've got a really good diagram explaining what HCA's are within the book. So the concern comes when we expose animal produce meat in particular to really high temperatures and we char food because two groups can be formed from this active type of cooking, and particularly known as heterocyclic amines, which form when the muscle in the meat and chicken are cooked at high temperatures, and then you get the polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons, the PHAs, which are produced from the fat dripping onto flames of the hot charcoal, and then the smoke carries those compounds back onto the food. But that is what gives barbecued meat, people that love barbecues, that distinct flavor.

That is what everyone I saw was on the Katie Price documentary I was watching, or it was on something, Peter Andre doing a barbecue and say, oh, that smell, you know, I can't wait to taste that food. I'm sure his wife Emily would know, but that's the HCA's and the PHAs that are actually really not good for your health. So in lab studies, we know that high doses of these two components have been linked to cancer. And some observational studies suggest that if you eat these in large amounts, charred, well-done meat, any kind of burned meat basically cooked really quickly or cooked in this style, particularly a link to colorectal cancer. So bowel cancers, we know, which are massively on the rise, but you've got to put it into perspective. Like a one-off summer barbecue

isn't going to be doing you any harm, but it's people that have these types of meats every single week or cook in this way. And I do believe it's a popular thing in the States and Australia. Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't it a weekly occurrence? And that's when it can definitely increase your risk. Is that right? Is that a thing, Ella? Definitely, I think in the more southern parts of the US, kind of, yeah, my husband used to live in Texas. I think kind of barbecue culture is huge there? Yeah, because you want to avoid letting your food become heavily blackened or burned. And I think that's part of the appeal, right, for people that consume these foods, do let us know. But also there's some things as well, like you want to trim the excess fat before you cook it.

And a lot of people don't do that. And that could reduce the formation as well. You want to marinate the meat beforehand because research does suggest that if you have herbs and spices and lemon juice or vinegar, it can reduce the formation of those HCA's. So there's things you can do, but ultimately, like me and Ella, always shout about a balanced plate and diet with fibre alongside your charred item once in a blue moon. It's totally fine. Yeah, it's like everything, isn't it? As we say, you know, I hate the word rule after it, but I do think the kind of general premise of the 80-20 rule is right. Like, think about 80% of your diet being grounded and, you know, potatoes and lentils and all sorts of healthy Mediterranean diet-style things

and 20% of your diet, being that delicious barbecue, being, you know, cocktails with your friends, being, you know, the sweets that you enjoy, whatever it is, being that part of balance and joy and fun things that you love. I do think it's a good rule for life. I 100% agree. So thank you for that question. We've now got one from Olivia.

I'm a 35-year-old woman who lifts weights three times a week and does some form of cardio-torty. week. Wow. That's already gosh, incredible. I eat relatively healthy and still find myself holding on to fat with a body fat percentage above normal range. I'm hearing a lot about Berberian recently and I'm wondering what your thoughts are on it. Thank you, Olivia. Okay, I love this question, Olivia. Thank you so, so much. This is the sort of thing that I think probably so many people can relate to in terms of I feel I'm trying to really look after myself and making quote unquote healthy choices. But I'm still not necessarily as comfortable or exactly where I want to be from an aesthetic perspective.

And I think that's a really important thing to say out loud because I think that is a shared view. We see it in the inbox. You are not alone in that in any shape or form. And that's when I think these kind of specific powders or supplements, a bit like we were talking about the kind of dirty powders a minute ago, they start to become quite appealing, whether it's for energy or weight or whatever it is. But, Rhee, can you talk to us a little bit about berberin? This is a component that's gone into quite a lot of sort of natural GLP1 type of products over the last few years I see. I think it has as well, and I see it in supplement form everywhere. First of all, I just want to touch on body fat percentage and just to throw a few caveats out there,

just so you're aware that, you know, not all these machines that measure body fat percentages are accurate. often they're based off male data, not female data. It doesn't show you what a healthy range is for your unique body based off the guidance that we know. So just take body fat percentage when you're measuring things in gym settings or anywhere with a pinch of salt, but it's totally valid to want to look at your body fat percentage. So onto Berberin. It's a naturally occurring plant compound. Again, links back to traditional medicine.

And like Ella said, I think people probably on TikTok are comparing it to a Zempex. and trends that are floating around. But the strongest evidence that has been studied so far, and it's similar to apple cider vinegar here where we have some evidence that it could help with type 2 diabetes or polycytic ovarian syndrome, but on its own, just because it helps with glucose and insulin sensitivity, so how our blood sugars release in our bloodstream, it doesn't mean that it's going to have that impact when you take it in a pill or miraculously do anything for weight. So when it comes to weight loss, I think the study, that are often pulled to promote these supplements to you guys.

There's a big one in 2022, a systematic review and metronalysis, taking all of them so far, the little studies that found that Berberin was associated with a small, I use the word small reduction in body weight and BMI. But to be honest with you, how we report that data, it wasn't fully concrete. It wasn't a very robust study. Then there was a 2023, what we call umbrella review. and that concluded that it might be beneficial for metabolic health, but the evidence is low and that, you know, we need larger trials. And most of these studies only lasted eight to 12 weeks.

So it's a really clever marketing example, again, of how these ingredients are pulled out in isolation, put into a supplement powder or formulation, and marketed everywhere. Because there's a few studies, like with our banana smoothie, Escapade, last week, you know, it doesn't make it factually applicable to you. And people will be selling it to you as a weight loss tool because of those small scale studies, but actually in relevance to your unique diet, I doubt it will have any impact. But this is where it's so clever because they can say there are meta-analyses to show the berberine supports reduction in body weight and BMI. And that's not a lie. It's just that if you look at that, the meta-analyses, the umbroseys,

review, all of this shows that it's a very modest impact and that much larger well-designed clinical trials are needed and that actually a lot of the studies that have been done had a moderate to high risk and bias involved. Just to add, before I forget, Ella, I'm so sorry to interrupt you because I know that's something you guys hate as well and I don't like doing it, but I have to remind you all that it's not safe during pregnancy, breastfeeding, it can cause gastro side effects and it can interfere with medication. So once again, and a lot of these herbal supplements might have a bigger impact than you think. Yeah, so well said.

And also, you know, not necessarily specifically for you, Olivia, but just in general, don't forget that like stress has a huge impact as well. You know, that could be something to look at. There are lots of things to look at, and unfortunately there is just so rarely a quick fix. And so, you know, the marketing for these things can be so compelling, but the reality is it's probably unlikely to have a huge impact. Okay.

Our fourth question comes from Pauline, who has said my question is about hunger cues and portion sizes. She's missed out the beginning of the question that says, I've been following Ella since the beginning, and I'm a big fan of what you feel. She doesn't like reading it about herself, which I totally get. But thank you for being amazing and the insightful content you put out there. So she lets to start with a little nice bit that Pauline added. Go on Ella. She's gone red. Oh, she's blushing. Okay. Thank you, Pauline. That's incredibly kind. Right. Pauline said, I grew up in a household with a brother who'd steal food off my plate, a clean your plate rule and a mother who modeled dieting as a normal part of life. I've done a lot of work on myself since then. A primarily Mediterranean diet, practice Pilates, meditation, run once a week and genuinely feel good in my body.

I love that. The one thing I can't seem to shake is overeating out of habit rather than hunger. I constantly put more on my plate than I need. Not because I'm especially hungry, but as a kind of insurance that I'll have enough. I'm not trying to lose weight at all. I just want to reconnect with my natural hunger cues and break a pattern that I know is rooted in childhood. What are the best tips for doing that? Deep psychological question. And it sounds like you're already halfway through doing that complex work on yourself with what you've said about your childhood. And obviously, it's very hard to infer exactly everything from one question on here, but you have recognised already that you're not eating out of an act of enjoyment, perhaps, in the

moment you're eating out of something else that's come up that is a lot stronger there. And I think our memories, our emotions, our family dynamics, always learned behaviors consistently follow through to adulthood. And actually, most people don't fully understand where their eating behaviors come from. And it takes a long time to unpick that in itself. So from a neuroscience perspective, your brain is incredibly good at creating shortcuts. Let's just remember that. If as a child your brain learned, I'd better take enough because someone else might, then it became an ingrained adaptive response. And it wasn't irrational. It was actually protective. And a lot of the things we do, we shouldn't beat ourselves up about them because it became a repeated safe

experience that we gradually build upon with patterns. And I think relationships of food often stem in this way. As something we do in clinic, a practical strategy is the pause delay tactic. I've mentioned it on here before, but creating a small pause before you're serving your meal and just asking yourself, how hungry am I right now? If I'm still hungry afterwards, I can always have more and say it out loud to yourself or write it on a piece of paper. And I know this sounds crazy and this is only if you want to embark upon this bit of work. And over time, you will actually break that cycle just by actively saying that out loud or writing it down. But a lot of the time, I mean, we're doing so much work on this on my Retrition Plus platform.

We've currently got a food freedom course. And this is why psychology is so interlinked with nutrition. Ultimately, you have to feel good in your body. So it's not going to happen in a few weeks. This is going a signal that we need to work on and override in several months. But it could also be something else, Ella. You know, I don't know you personally. That's just one theory.

It could be a multitude of things to explore. It's interesting though, isn't it? Like I remember having this conversation with a friend relatively recently. But oftentimes it's like when people go on a diet and you then become kind of not obsessed with food, but you overthink food. And I think it's quite common this idea of overthinking food. And I remember this friend saying to me, she's like, I'm really trying to teach myself that if I'm hungry, I can get something to eat. Like I'm very lucky. I can afford to do that.

You know, I live in the UK, there is food available. I don't need to always be like preparing for Armageddon, you know, like that is though I'm never going to eat again. And I think it's more common than you think. I don't think you're alone in that feeling at all. That was great advisory. It's very oversimplified, but everyone's got complex relationships of food. You're definitely not alone, as Ella said.

Our penultimate question today is from Olivia. She said, hi, Ella and Rie. Ella, she loves your new cookbook, and she's put in capital letters, it's phenomenal. She's officially, I love this, just finished cooking all the recipes. And he's ready to start over again. This is great. The mill plans help me so much, reducing the mental load about what to cook for lunch and dinner. It's so is about that mental load.

So she couldn't recommend it enough now for her question. I've been really enjoying the podcast and would love your perspective on something my partner and I are currently navigating. I'm a pescatarian where my partner eats meat. And since I'm the main cook in our household, we generally don't eat meat at home. And honestly, I'm quite comfortable with that, as meats always made me feel a little uneasy.

We now have a five-month-old son who'll be starting weaning soon, and it's brought up a lot in conversations between us about whether or not to include meat. My view is that when he's older and able to make informed choices for himself, he can decide what kind of diet he wants to follow. But my partner feels strongly,

that we shouldn't restrict any aspect of his diet, including meat, especially while he's too young to choose for himself. This is a big question, everyone, because there are two big sides to this already. Part of what I'm struggling with is wondering where the line is. For example, if we allow him to eat meat and we're out in restaurants or with family, will that naturally lead him to wanting or expecting meat at home too? I worry this could become confusing or create tension around food and meal times,

and then secondly, I feel really conflicted because ultimately I just want to, want to do what's best for my son, as does every parent. And at the same time, I can't help but feel that meat is not necessary to be the healthiest. She'd love to know our opinions on this, Ella, both nutritionally and emotionally. It's such a great question. And I think it applies so much more broadly. Obviously, this is specifically about the question of meat, but I think this also really applies to, like, treat items as well. And, you know, how you apply certain rules at home and out of the home and what decisions you put in your children's hands versus your hands. I think it's a really, really interesting question and something that a lot of people would relate to.

I can only speak about our personal experience in our house. I feel really strongly that there is no one way to do anything in life. You know, when we come to the nuances and like very specific nature of it, of course, there's a general rule for what healthy diets look like, as we all know. what we did personally is the girls were raised as vegetarians but I had always said to them it is your decision like it is your body it is your decision now of course when they're two they're not going to be making these decisions but as they got a little bit older especially as they start school and school meals I had always said to them like it is your decision

what was really important to me is that they like healthy food that they eat lots of nutritious food, that they eat pulses and the gooms and things like that. But what they add on to that, I do feel this decision. One of my children has now decided that she doesn't want to be a full vegetarian. And that is so fine. I couldn't be more respectful of her decision at school. She's not a vegetarian. But then equally it's interesting because if we're in a restaurant again, I completely respect her. But she will always choose the vegetarian option. And she's so grounded in that. That's obviously what she still eats at home, but I have just taken that flexible approach. I would say, as, you know, so far so good, but I would say it feels it's working really well.

I think they do feel they have autonomy and they do have this sense of control over their cells, their bodies. And as we see in our inbox, as we just said, like, you know, patterns from childhood do stay with us. And so kind of empowerment and autonomy around food has been something that was really important to me with my children. And it's the same with trees. You know, we were just on holiday.

We walked past loads of sweet shops. It's like this mega. It's called Captain Candy. I think that says all you need to know. And every day, can we go in there? Can we go in there? And I was like, you know what? Yeah, we can go in there.

And you can choose five things. And it's your choice how you eat the five things. If you want to eat them all in one go, you can eat them on one go. If you want to save them over the week, you can save them in over the week. We're not going to go back again. And that's how I've done it because I think that autonomy is really important. but that's just my personal experience. How about you, Ray?

Thank you for sharing that because I think it's really helpful for people to have personal experiences and just to hear, you know, outcomes of that. It's so interesting because making the choice of what diet your child has, I mean, there's the two arguments from people that don't eat meat.

They say it's the same argument for those that do, you know, give them the, you can flip it on its head both ways. which is so interesting, you know, you're not taking anything away from your child. I think the most important thing to remember is that you can get all the nutrients you need being pescatarian just as much as you can being a meat eater. It's a bit more tricky, not having any animal produce. You just have to know what you're doing, a bit more savvy about it.

But ultimately, you can be healthy for all three approaches. So first of all, remove that guilt from your head because whatever you go down, your child will get the nutrients they need to. The second thing to consider is that having more plant-based options at home opens up variety to your child, which will help with their taste preferences later in life. It will help them choose meals that contain more diversity in fibre and plants as they grow up. And that approach is one to be very serious about if you eat meat as well. You know, it really is about not making it the star of the meal and making sure those plants are the star still. because as a child, that is what's going to help your child.

The fish aspect as well, you know, add small amounts of it, but still make sure that what you're offering at home is colour, texture, diverse flavours, all sorts of things as they grow up. They're going to refuse food. It's normal. They're not going to want everything. But I think when it comes to shaping their nutritional preferences when they reach school age or beyond, things naturally adapt.

And that's when children do gain a sense of autonomy, because they're at school themselves without their parents, and they will choose if there's an option what they want on their plate. So what you do in those early years, really, as long as you've got the variety of colour and they're weaned correctly, you're eating more of a Mediterranean star dart, I think that's the most important thing, honestly, moving forward.

So that's a very, very big question. I know I could have gone into a lot more, but I'm very well we've also got our final question today as well, which links on, actually links on really nice. in terms of food prep at home. So Megan, Ella, has said, I'm thoroughly enjoying your insight and your discussions on the Wellness Scoot podcast. And I have to say that I think your positive, kind and balanced approach is refreshing and welcome. Thank you for that, Megan. It really helped me consider things in a different way that making small positive changes for myself and my family as

well can have big results. And something I've been wondering about is the recipe boxes. So let us know everyone listening, what do you get? So she's used examples like Gusto, Hello, Fresh. She said, I love to make meals from scratch, but I've found that planning and preparation is what takes up a lot of my admin time and stress. So when the recipe box delivers, it's been a lifesaver. I wanted to get your take on whether it's effectively the same as home cooking from scratch, or whether there is anything I should be aware of or cautious of with these types of services and what criteria I should be looking for to make them nutritious. And I'm going to hand that over to you, so you know a lot more about this whole industry,

I think than I. But there are so many companies out now, aren't there, that offer these services. There are so many. Like the big ones, like you mentioned, like Hello Fresh and Gusto. There's mindful chef. But then I know there's smaller ones. I haven't used them. But my brother and his wife loved one called Plant Hood, for example, and I've got some colleagues who use it. Anyway, so there's so many different things out there. I personally think they're amazing. We just talked about a second ago when we were talking about Quick Wins, my book, and those meal plans that one of the big challenges that we have, I think collectively is we're busy,

we're overwhelmed, we're stressed, we're time poor. And so things that take away the emotional, kind of mental load of eating well, of cooking in the evening, of making it fun by having a variety in our lives, being excited about what we're eating, any tool that helps you with that, I think is an absolute win.

So yes, it's more expensive kind of par gram than if you went to Tasco's, and did the same thing. But what it does is you get home for work and you're like, oh, great, this is what I'm making. I have all of the ingredients. I've never made this curry before. I've never made this type of dish before.

This is really cool. It probably often gets you eating things, as I said, that you're not normally eating. So I think it's amazing. I think if you're stuck in a food route, if you're feeling uninspired, if you want to cook at home more and you're just not doing it, something like this can be amazing.

As I said, generally, it's more expensive per, gram per meal than if you did the same thing, just going to buy the ingredients. But I think there's a massive kind of mental load that it removes. And you can often get really good deals on these things. So I, I think it's great. You know, is it perfect? Maybe not. But what is? Catch you cooking. And ultimately getting you cooking is great. And I think you also can learn loads of skills from doing those recipes or like my brother and his wife often have done lots of this. And then you go into their kitchen and they keep all of the meal cards. the recipe cards from all of it. And then they, you know, they go and buy the ingredients and they make them again. It's a really cool way of discovering new recipes, new ideas, new flavors,

new textures. You don't have food waste because you have the right amount. So I'm a huge fan. I think that's really cool. I agree. Way more pros than any cons, really, to these types of things if you could afford it. And I also love services like Oddbox that do the wonky veg. You know, it does save you from wasting vegetables and expose you to different types of recipes. Perhaps you wouldn't normally choose to cook yourself because the choice has already been made and prepared for you and it's taken away that additional admin. My only red flags are keto mills, high protein meals that perhaps don't provide you with the balance of fiber that you could definitely maximise on when you're getting a meal delivery service because you're so busy in the day,

you probably haven't had time to think about that. So if you are looking at a criteria, try and get more blood points in your mail delivery service and go for some cool mills. And then aside from that, yeah, I think therefore, Ella, I echo everything you've said, why not? If it takes away that admin each week, there's no food waste, you're cooking something you'd never try before with new flavours, keep the cards, I think it's a win-win. So, yeah, these have been some good questions today. We could have gone in a lot deeper on a lot of them, so please do let us know your feedback and keep popping those questions in our inbox. Yeah, we had such nice questions this week.

Yeah, anyone, any questions that you have that you want us to answer, it's just hello at wellness-scoop.com. Or if you have any good recommendations that you want to share with the community, please send them our way as well. We just absolutely love hearing from you guys and we so appreciate it. And otherwise, we will see you back here on Monday. Yeah, just thanks for being here. We love it.

Exactly. And we'll let you know and update you probably after the summer on what we organise for our Wellness Scoop get-together next year and what we choose to go with because there's, so many fun things that we can do. Have a lovely weekend. We'll see you on Monday. Bye.