The Wellness Scoop - Flu Season, Seed Oils, and Matcha v Coffee

Episode Date: January 27, 2025

This week, we’re diving into the wellness stories everyone’s talking about! Could flu season be worse than ever? Are seed oils really “toxic,” or is it time to set the record straight? And in the ultimate morning beverage battle, is matcha finally stealing coffee’s crown? We’re also unpacking the latest borecore trend, whether coffee is actually good for you, why sobriety is on the rise, and how LED masks became the new skincare obsession Recommendations This Week: The Postcard by Anne Berest LED Mask – the ultimate at-home skincare upgrade, Rhi uses the Omnilux mask Fussy deodorant Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

Oh, hi there! I'm Norma, the unofficial mayor of the Town of Destiny. Speaking of, FanDuel's Kick of Destiny 3 is happening live Super Bowl Sunday. You should watch. It's gonna be a hoot! While you're at it, download FanDuel, North America's number one sportsbook. You can bet on touchdowns, turnovers, heck, even total kicker points, don't you know? Anywho, enjoy your podcast or whatnot. Please play responsibly. 19 plus and physically located in Ontario. If you have questions or concerns about your gambling or the gambling of someone close to you, please go to connectsontario.ca.

Welcome to the Wellness Scoop, your weekly dose of health and wellness inspiration. And we are your hosts. I'm Ella Mills. And I'm Rhiannon Lambert. And after a decade in this wellness industry, we know how overwhelming and confusing health advice can be. And that's why we're here. We've created this podcast to cut through the noise and to make healthier living simple, fun, and personal. And can I just say, woohoo, we've had just shy of 300,000 downloads so far.

So that's obviously over a quarter of a million, which feels mega. So thank you guys for listening. It also feels kind of weirdly validating as well, because I think, as I've talked about this, I'm weirdly obsessed with it, but it's just how overwhelming the world of wellness has felt recently and how it feels like you just have to do 1 million, kajillion, trillion things every single day to stay well and stay up with the trends. And I just wondered if it was just me that was feeling a little bit disillusioned

by the trajectory of the industry. So to feel like it's resonating with you guys at home and that you're enjoying listening and loads of you sent us messages saying it feels like it's released the pressure, really, really feels like you can relate to it, that it feels just something that fits into your life is so phenomenal.

So thank you, thank you. Thank you. So please keep sharing it. Please keep feeding back. Please keep telling us what you like, what you want more of, any interesting trends, research, books, podcasts that you've seen, listened to, read, just share anything and everything, please. Absolutely. It's extremely overwhelming, but so phenomenally lovely to know that we're actually making a bit of a difference and the feedback has been incredible so ella what have we got coming up on today's show okay so coming up it is a jam-packed show as always we are talking about why being boring is now on trend which very much speaks to my soul what is going on with the flu this year? Seed oils, very controversial and complicated and dogmatic. Coffee versus matcha and alcohol, the growing trend of sobriety and LED masks. And because we have so much to discuss this week, we have decided that we're going to skip our guest

slot and we're going to move it into next week because otherwise you guys are going to be listening to us for the rest of eternity. It's been a busy week, Ella. What have you been up to? Well, I've just, as you know, I came in today. So to everyone listening, I came into the podcast studio and I was like, guys, I stink because I feel like I've been sat on stage all morning under the hot lights of the Royal Festival Hall, which was amazing. It was a complete imposter syndrome, Ella.

I know you've been in that situation a lot where you feel and identify with that. But I was giving a speech at the Royal Festival Hall for the Rampton graduates for their university graduation ceremony in a robe with one of those hats. I think I've still got line marks on my head. You do? I do, yeah. You look great. Thanks. I'm rocking it.

I thought, who cares? Get on the tube. Run. So I've come from there. And on Monday this week, this week's been a whirlwind because the projects I know I can share with you all in a few weeks are coming together. But what was game changing this week was really just getting down to basics. I think for me it was cooking with the children a lot more. Like I made more of a conscious effort than usual to get the kids in the kitchen with me because I know what a difference that makes. And just try a few earlier nights with my LED mask, which I know we're going to go into later this week. But yeah, the business side of things, Ella, I'm so grateful to have you as a friend to pick your brain on things because at Retrition Plus, we sold out of the kids vitamin D and I wasn't expecting to do it so early on in the year.

So there's lots of business things to navigate. But over to you, because I feel like your week has been equally crazy, but rewarding. A hundred percent. And on cooking with the kids, I couldn't agree with that more. I find it absolutely fascinating when the kids get involved, how much more willing they are to try new things. I was actually speaking to a friend yesterday and she was saying her son was having a moment of not loving veg, particularly things like carrots.

And he had in his design lesson at school, they were doing some work on cooking. And he's about seven and they made salad. And in the salad was raw carrot. And he came home and all he wanted was to do what he'd done at school and make his own salad. He made himself a little dressing. And she said he was just devouring this raw carrot something that he had kind of absolutely very definitively said there was no way he was going to eat and I see that with my girls all the time although May who's my youngest is now so obsessed with cooking and wants to do everything herself and two things from it first of all sometimes when you're like

rushing in the morning trying to get out sometimes when you're like rushing in the morning trying to get out the door you're like sweetheart I so want to encourage this independence but we are so late I don't really have time for you to necessarily do yourself but try and stop myself from saying that but I had I thought probably one of the most like on-brand cliched moments I kid you not I was at home with. Skye wasn't back from school yet and I was making us dinner and Skye had left in the morning. She was like, can we make pesto pasta? And when I do that, I just try and add a bit more to the pesto. We were talking about it the other week actually. So it's like peas, edamame, I had some Cavolo Nero in the

fridge that was going a bit off. So I was going to steam it and pop it in my pesto. Anyway, so popped it all on the blender, turned the blender on and it just went boink, broke. That was it. Luckily I had blended my pesto enough that the pasta did actually work, which was great. I was grateful for that. But May's obsessed with smoothies at the moment.

And so I was then trying to pour it in and finish the pasta and everything. And she was lying on the floor crying, like hitting the floor, hitting me being like, I need a smoothie. Mummy, I just need a smoothie. How long till I can have a smoothie? Oh my gosh this is so on brand. It is. It's future generation of tantrums right?

What have I done to my child that she's having a tantrum because she can't make herself a smoothie? But anyway so yes I'm so with you on cooking with the kids. I think I'm actually also so with you on those little habits. Gosh it's been a whirlwind start with the kids. I think I'm actually also so with you on those little habits. Gosh, it's been a whirlwind start to the year and I have not been taking the time to do things like exercise. And I came back to it this week and I went to a class on Monday and I thought, this is why I was snappy over this weekend. This is why I was grumpy.

I was desperately needing to move my body. And I'm such a chronic overthinker. It's definitely probably my worst habit. My brain just runs at a million miles an hour and something's very much in the wrong direction. Was feeling actually this week a lot of imposter syndrome as well. And I just made a bit of time for myself. For the first time in a long time, I exercised twice so far this week and it's only Thursday and I feel like a different woman.

My energy is so different. So that is my big thing. I'm so proud of you. Oh, thanks. I also had something to share with you, which I've been desperate to tell you for the last few days. So very sweetly, my dad's husband listened to our first episode, maybe now our second, but haven't seen him since. And he works in film. He's a cameraman. And he said, I was really interested on your part on phones and our addiction on phones. I had something in my industry recently that you'll be fascinated to hear, which is that at the streamers, particularly at Netflix, they have now specifically asked script writers to basically include in the script things that you would see on the screen. So instead of a visual

of, say, being in Egypt, so big pyramids, it's quite obvious, it's iconic where you are, like the Eiffel Tower or Big Ben. So things that could not be confused as being from another country, saying, look, here are the pyramids, we are in Egypt, or like, it's the Eiffel Tower, we're in Paris, because they know that people are on their phones and people aren't watching anymore. And so essentially you have to narrate it to facilitate the phone watching at the same time as watching the TV, which I just was fixated on and obsessed with. It's almost like as a society we're leaning in to the chronic distraction and overwhelm and the power of our phones as opposed to trying our hardest to make it difficult to do those two things at the same time it's like spoon feeding a baby isn't it it's like oh you know you

don't have the attention span so i'm going to describe every little detail exactly anyway and he was saying obviously there's some conflict because obviously lots of writers like but that's a terrible script. I mean, maybe it explains what the Christmas movies have turned into on Netflix. It's so funny. Oh, my God. I loved the Lindsay Lohan one. Me too.

It's probably embarrassing to me. I also love Love Island and the Kardashians, but we can move on quickly. Let's go on because I'll go into Christian Chenoweth. Let's not do it. Let's move on. Now, Ella, there was a feature in the stylist magazine and I loved it because it's called ball core right so ball core is all the rage at the moment I know this resonates with us so much so 29 dull but life-changing things that will genuinely make

you healthier that was the headline so in 2024 it's trendy to be boring. And this is the name that they dubbed it. And actually, I am delighted about this because I feel like my Borecore is 100% just staying in early, watching a film, putting something nice on music wise. And I don't like to go out in the winter. I have to really motivate myself to go out. So what would your Borkor trends be? First of all, when I was going through the script at the beginning of the week and you'd popped Borkor in, I was like, oh, what's that? Never heard of it. Went online, obviously looked it up. Realized it was this massive trend that had completely bypassed me that I was obsessed with. Actually, for so many reasons, there was a lot of ballcore in fashion which was leaning into like very much investing in things that you would wear forever classic jeans blazers t-shirts etc which I loved obviously I feel super super sustainable and loved that part of it but then in terms of like just celebrating not being shiny and trendy in our everyday lives and I think I don't know I love that idea about just celebrating

not wanting to go out or celebrating these simple things. Like I said that to my mum recently when she came over and I said, is it really sad that how much I love every evening once the kids have gone to bed, like going downstairs and laying out stuff for breakfast and the coffee cups ready to make coffee in the morning. it makes me feel so good maybe it's this like uber organized part of my personality but these little bits feel amazing but I also laughed because I last week was as I said it's been a very busy start to the year work-wise and I was feeling very very very overwhelmed last week and I was like I just need a minute I feel like I've put all myself on the

back burner and when I had a shower I did a face mask a hair mask exfoliated did the boring things like cut my nails and oh my gosh I just felt so good I'd given myself like half an hour of self care I felt totally different I did a 10 minute meditation I got into bed I watched Love Island which yes I'm sure lots of you are judging me for, but there we go. And I just felt amazing. And it was, it's that like ball core, those simple things that just make you feel so good. So I love it. I love that celebrating. I've got a friend called Dilly and years ago before it became a thing on TV, you know, professional organizing. Yep. Like Marie Kondo? Yes, yes. Love Marie Kondo.

She first introduced me to Marie Kondo and I met her back in like 2018, 17. And anyway, she came over, we were listening to Fanta by the Opera, she was helping me clean up my flat, you know, we were just cracking on. And Borkor, she was saying it's things like hoovering the house.

What I love doing is decanting cereal packets and things into jars. It's really basic, really therapeutic things. But she has a whole business just doing Borkor in people's houses, like organising things. And she gets such a kick out of it. I would get a kick out of that. Yeah, I know, right?

I feel like it's one of those things that we have to embrace. Now, we obviously want to create a complete hub of inspiration here. So are there any recommendations, Ella, that you want to speak about this week? Any books or things that you've read? Do you know what? Yeah, that was my other recommendation. I have been on a bit of, obviously, as you know,

trying to get rid of my phone. So I've been on a bit of a reading spree. I have read a lot of books recently, but I have one read. I have read one. I cannot get my words out today. It was absolutely phenomenal. It was called The Postcard.

It's by a French writer called Anne I really want to say her name correctly Barrest but I'm probably not pronouncing that right so I apologize and it is absolutely staggering it's a true story with a bit of imagined fiction coming into it where Anne's mother finds a postcard in their letterbox with their family home when she's a little bit younger and the postcard has the names of her mother's grandparents and her aunt and uncle on it who were all murdered at Auschwitz oh gosh and she has no idea who sent the postcard and whether or not it was done with malice, whether it was something to be intimidated by, had no idea where it had come from. Fast forward a decade or so later, the author decides to get to the bottom of the postcard and where it had come from. But also growing up, they actually didn't speak very much about all of her family who had died in World War Two in the various different concentration camps because it was more than just those four people.

It was very much the extended family as well, unfortunately. And she basically goes on the most extraordinary investigation, actually lots of it with her mother, although there's a lot of tension in that. So it's an interesting exploration of family relationships as well, to try and understand her family and who they were and what their lives were, where they lived, really reclaim that and equally understand where the postcard came from. And so it tells the real story of all of that. And they do find out where the postcard comes from. She finds out an extraordinary amount about their lives. But there's also lots of family dynamics. And then she also, using all of the information that she finds about her great grandparents' lives, she also writes parts of the story imagining their journey, for example,

before they arrived in France and putting it all together. And it's just one of the most staggering things I've read in ages. Does it make you feel happy? Because hearing that I'm such an empathetic person, I want to cry because it just takes me there. I feel flooded with emotion. Yeah, no, I sobbed very much. Yes. It's like self-inflicted sobbing. But it's so consuming, which is what I love about

reading. It's so consuming that it very much removes you from whatever's going on in your life and obviously also really puts your problems very much into, you know, pale insignificance to everything else happening in the world at the moment. So it's amazing. My favourite sort of story, that human exploration. Beautiful. That's my number one recommendation Ella that's gorgeous and you're right it definitely would take you away from any problems you have because we had one of those weeks I remember we were recording something earlier this week and I said to you I'm just having a bad mum day where I had oh guilt all day long and I couldn't shift it and actually reading a book like that probably would have really helped me in that moment rather than

what I did do which is is kind of wallowing it. I'm a terrible mother kind of day. But yes, I did go to the gym, actually, which was one good thing. But that's a good recommendation. So we have obviously got a very busy week of headlines, Ella. So, Ella, we had a lot to follow up on from last week, didn't we, with the red dye? We did. We had a few questions about red dye number three, which we spoke about last week, because we didn't clarify this. And there

were some questions of whether or not red dye number three, which just to recap, has just been banned by the FDA in the US. It's going to be out of market in a couple of years. It's used to create that bright red colour, particularly in things like sweets, and whether or not actually it is available in anything in the UK, in Europe. It has possible links to cancer, but also hyperactivity in children. So to answer that question, yes, but not in mass distribution. So 30 years ago, the EU Scientific Committee for Food recommended that we restrict the use of this dye, which is also known as E12127 in the UK and Europe. But it is, I'm going to say quite weirdly, and we'll come on to why I believe quite weirdly, permitted in

specific amounts for certain products, including preserved cherries, like glacier cherries, and other food items that actually contain those cherries. So like some scones and things like that, as well as pet food and medicine, including some very, very, very common medicines and toothpaste. And as I was going through this, I was like, I just don't understand the world, particularly of food, but of all of this, because why do cherries have to be that red? I mean, it's so odd. Now, I know that there is the research is in animal studies. I know that. I appreciate that. We don't have hard evidence to show that in humans, but it is a totally unnecessary ingredient. And why do those medicines, and I was looking at the specific medicines they're in there is no need for them to be luminous red like it's completely unnecessary like

who wants to buy a medicine because it's luminous red I know and I wonder I wonder if they did it because the actual original color was so vulgar people wouldn't dissect it but consume it rather I know what you mean it's almost like a weird dystopian kind of we need to all be in Charlie and the Chocolate Factory is what it made me think of. You know, the old classic film when you walk into the kind of bright red lollipops and sticks and all the things around. But you used a good example when we were discussing this. And you're in the food industry, Ella.

You must see it all the time because you specifically don't use a lot of additives. We don't use any additives and emulsifiers. And it's what I'm doing a lot of work on at the moment. But why? Like apricots? I know And it's what I'm doing a lot of work on at the moment. But why? Like apricots? I know. It's funny. I had sheer pudding this week in the car.

I know we talked about that last week. And on top of it, I had some dried apricots. And someone sent me a message on Instagram and she said, don't you mean dark chocolate? Those aren't apricots because they were the unsulfured ones, which are really dark brown. And it wasn't a close-up picture or anything. And I said, oh no, these are actually the unsulfured ones and they're much, much darker.

They taste better. They taste so much better, but they're unrecognizable from the really orange ones that you see all the time. And they're more expensive, actually. They are more expensive and they're harder to get.

But again, I was looking at it and again, went on a deep dive, like why are apricots sulfur? What is the point? And it can make them last a bit longer, but it's actually just for the color because apparently we want them to be bright orange. And also, you know, the ultra processed food ingredients have been shown to create sensitivities for people's gut health. There are people out there that can't have certain emulsifiers. They can't have certain additives to food.

And the more I delve into this, I've got this huge project, as you know, and it's on this subject particularly. And I feel like I'm almost becoming more and more aware of an area that should have been in my educational path. But because the science is so new, my degree didn't have anything about ultra processed foods within it. This is literally now that we're talking the science is emerging. So it makes sense that the ingredients are not going to suit everybody. It's just something to feed for thought there really. Exactly. And so why? Why? Why? And the interesting thing is, at the start of Delicious Yellow, this is now back in 2015, when we wanted to start making food products and obviously like matt and i never done this before super naive we're like asking these questions like we just don't understand

like why are these stabilizers emulsifiers preservatives flavorings in there and i mean no one would work with us basically to start with no manufacturers would work with us because they were all saying we have to use them you have to use them have to use them and apricots were a really good example it was almost impossible because we've got some products that use dried apricots it was almost impossible to get the unsulfured ones which is what we use because everyone was using the bright orange ones the ones with sulfur but having now not when has he done it i don't mean completed it but having now spent a decade doing this we've obviously got our own factory now so we do know know it's possible. And so I keep looking at

these things and thinking, I just don't understand. I don't understand the point of adding ingredients to things that aren't good for us, that don't need to be there. Like, why does a medicine need to be luminous red? Why do we need to make an apricot more orange? It's just so odd. I agree. But we're almost at the forefront of the change. And it's behavior of change is very difficult for people. And the food industry that are so set in their ways and also economically for money, you know, how to get their conveyor belt, producing things en masse. But that part I understand so much more. I understand why decades ago when we didn't understand the impact of ultra processed foods, how manufacturers can see it is so much cheaper and it is so much simpler to use, for example, an emulsifier. It's so much easier to make a

consistent product if you're using an emulsifier than if you're not. It's so much easier to have consistency if you use a flavoring. If you think like, let's use pesto because we talked about it earlier. If you make pesto at home, you can make it every day this week. It will taste different every day. you can use the same recipe but maybe you toast the pine nuts and you toast them for 30 seconds longer they will taste a little bit different maybe they're just slightly different in taste because they're from a different brand than the one you got yesterday your basil it's going to be a little bit sweeter it's going to be a little bit stronger it's going to vary because food does you know we all know

that you can eat an apple again every day and that apple will taste a little bit different every day. But people don't want that in the food industry. They want consistency. So using a flavouring to create the flavour in pasta is so much easier than just relying on basil because it will fluctuate. So I completely understand why decades ago, when we didn't realise that ultra processed foods weren't very good for us, why the food industry shifted to include them. It actually is highly logical to me because it's more efficient and it made food cheaper. And it's really palatable as we know those flavours, they're quite addictive. And so it all makes so much sense. The thing that defies logic to me is then adding additives for additive

sake to make it redder or more orange. It is so interesting when you break it all down, but obviously just so we're not scaring anyone listening, you know, you can have all of these things. It's just there's some research now and science is always evolving that if we consume these items in excess, potentially may not be the best thing for us long-term, but we should be questioning things.

We should be having our detective hat on. You should be aware of what's in your food. Read the back of packets, read labels, but you absolutely do not need to fear taking your medicine or having your favorite food so ella there was a very interesting headline this week let's talk about the flu oh my gosh everyone i know is it like everyone at the school gate you know it just but it's also slightly terrifying because you open the newspaper and it says there are two day waits at A&E. People are dying in corridors. And you just mentioned about kind of scaremongering and fear mongering.

And I think that's one of the things to take, hopefully, that people take from the show is I think headlines are really frightening. I think if you only read headlines and that was it, you'd slightly feel like everything you ate would kill you. And it would also kill you because you'd never managed to see a doctor at the moment. I know. And they called it a quaddemic, which is actually it is quite terrifying because they say in the press it's a combination of COVID, flu, RSV, respiratory illnesses, viruses and norovirus. And this originates from the US that saying quadd, and they thought it was coming here to the UK. So we've had, you know, record numbers in the NHS, just before Christmas, and there was a lot of panic around, but it seems to have consistently stayed the same in terms of the media messaging that's going on at the moment. But I will say Ella, that you've got people like Professor Andrew Pollard, who's from the Pandemic Sciences Institute at the University of Oxford.

And he said it just feels bad every year because we run the system to max capacity. There aren't enough beds. People are in corridors and it feels overwhelming. But actually, we are going to make it through and we do not have a quardemic. That's good to hear. I always find myself getting really nervous about it. I'm like, kids, don't get sick. I know. And you know, we've got data from the sense of disease control and prevention that I mean, they do show an increase in these three viruses. But ultimately, again, like you said, everything is okay, guys, we've just got an aging population. And that means we will have more of these types of illnesses emerging because as we get older, our immune systems are weakened. Also, we could question that we're not eating well.

And there is that headline to discuss as well. We're not getting the vitamins and minerals we need anymore. But ultimately, let's not panic on that one. I was relieved when I was doing some research on this that said we do not have another kind of repeat of COVID. I think everyone just doesn't want another lockdown. I think it's that, isn't it? It's that fear of any kind of COVID take two, that those headlines, certainly in me, it really triggers when you're like, no one get ill.

Well, especially when you're parents as well, and you think, I do not want my child to catch whatever this virus is going around, anti-back out now. I know, Skye came home, she was like, mummy, one of her friends wasn't very well. So my teacher said, could you look after her and take her up to the desk and call her mommy not not for my daughter's called mommy but to get the office to call her mommy I was like angel I am really proud of you it's

really responsible well done lovely teacher asked you but like did you get the job I've got a really busy week at work so let's try not to get that whenever my husband gets ill I'm like just don't breathe on me just don't come close to me because I've got to keep this family together and if I go down no one can do this oh my gosh I know well actually in COVID Matt got COVID very very badly ended up in hospital with it and had pneumonia and was basically off work for about eight weeks couldn't even walk up the stairs I mean it was awful but the kids both had it at the same time and this was pre any vaccinations or anything and so I was like kept talking to my mom she was like hope you don't get it yeah obviously the only one standing yeah quarantine and you know what I

think there's something psychological I do not this is not evidence-based but if you have no choice but to keep going I was saying this to my mum friend at pick up the other day because we haven't had touch wood in front of me right now my son starts school in September we haven't had a single illness come home and I haven't got anything oh my goodness I know but I think it's the I've got to keep going it's probably not healthy for sure and actually one question for you um with your nutritionist hat on before we move on to the next headline because I think think that you just picked up on, you know, obviously like a quarter of us also managing to get our five a day now in this country, really struggling with that intake of

fruits and veg. And you mentioned that being something that's obviously not necessarily helping our response to all these common illnesses. What is that top line link between our diet and the immune system? It's our gut health. And it's the vitamins and minerals. There's no denying the link between food and the immune system and the connection and the constant messaging that goes on because, you know, the gut trains the immune system, essentially. So if you have a healthier gut, and you're feeding your tummy the right foods and the right fibre and the right vitamins and minerals, your immune system is going to respond in a better way. And you are more likely to, I'm not going to say never get sick,

but when you get it, probably not as severely as someone else that perhaps didn't eat well. That is fact. Absolutely. 100%. What a good reason to eat some broccoli tonight. TD Direct Investing offers live support. So whether you're a newbie or a seasoned pro you can make your investing steps count and if you're like me and think a tfsa stands for total fun savings adventure maybe reach out to td direct investing this next it's not really a headline so much as so a constant conversation in the world of health and wellness and i think a serious point of confusion right now it's seed oils and i want

i actually hope you don't mind this is funny i keep talking about my mum if you're listening hi mum shout out camilla but she i spoke to her yesterday she listens to the show she actually was like in a few weeks she said maybe I can pop into your office and meet Rhiannon oh hi I'd love that you'd have to cook that day Ella you have to bring us all cheer puddings but she said basically like I feel like she had more confidence you should back yourselves you were clearly nervous to put forward your opinions with birthday cake and I know we were talking about that with ultra processed food as well and I know you had a very difficult time talking about seed oils on Fern Cotton's podcast

I was told Ella beyond belief yeah yeah and I wanted to talk a little bit before we go into seed oils because I think it's actually really interesting a your personal experience but b as well in reference to what you're talking about the other day about getting the title nutritionist protected is actually there's so many things as a nutritionist that you essentially not cannot say but a way in which you have to approach things where it isn't fear-mongering and it isn't creating tribalism or a deeply conflicting binary way of looking at health and wellness. As you said, there's so many pros and cons to almost everything. And you as nutritionists is very important. Take that health advocacy, education, public well-being approach. Hence, sometimes the nervousness to put forward an opinion. And I just wondered if you could explain that to people, because I think

it's actually really, really interesting and very important. And that experience you had, laying out the information on seed oils, I think speaks to that. Thank you for bringing it up. But also, I was absolutely terrified last week, because ultimately, I know we're all unique. And my job, the reason I got into being a nutritionist and studying, there was no social media, it wasn't for any gratification or accolade it was literally because I want to help people and I think the minute you become judgmental the minute you alienate or I mean there is no such thing as one size fits all there is no one perfect diet for everybody that is virtually impossible we do not have any research to say

that yet because everyone's unique. So I think people are very emotive about their food. We've all got such a personal relationship with it that my job as a health professional is just to try and help people do their best. It makes me quite emotional when I think about it because I think that's why I still have a career, you know, 10 years down the line. It was quite a big day for me today, guys, after this morning and that graduation ceremony. It's all a bit much. But I honestly think that we all can make a difference. But if you start believing these camps online that are so dogmatic with their approach, they fearmonger. And it's just wrong, Ella, because it puts people off food.

It takes the joy away. It terrifies them. And actually, like the headline we've got this week it can lead to really poor dietary choices and that's why a big red flag for anyone that's following a so-called nutritionist that isn't educated is that they are telling you there's one way for everybody even though I wrote a plant-based book I don't think everybody's going to thrive on a plant-based diet it just doesn't work that way I think that's so well said and I can't kind of's going to thrive on a plant-based diet. It just doesn't work that way. I think that's so well said. And I can't kind of say it enough, like take inspiration, take ideas.

But the idea that is why, and I know you're so anti it, but I'm not a big fan of things like what I eat in a day, because I think it's not just that our bodies are different, our lives are different, like our days are different, our months are different, our years are different. And what's plausible, possible for you, every single person listening, you will all be having such a different day. You and I have had such different days. You had this massive morning at Royal Festival Hall. I was at Maymays Nursery reading a book about a brave bunny.

Yay! Go brave bunny! Yes, the brave bunny conquered his fear of the outside to find his friend and fight off a wolf with chocolate chip biscuits. Wow, that is a book. It's actually really good. It's called A Little Bit Brave. Okay, right. Check that one out. Exactly. I love that. Tell us about the seed oil headlines that you brought up. Okay, everybody listening, I know you've seen different things online, but please bear with me.

So last week, Waitrose revealed that the sales of a block of butter has risen in the past year, with it now outselling alternative spreads by more than 20%. And by alternative spreads, I mean ones that have been designed with stanols, plant polyphenols, ideas that actually they do genuinely reduce cholesterol levels. So if anybody listening has a diet that's high in saturated fat, they're prone to heart disease, there's heart disease in their family, the last thing you probably want to go and do is buy a block of butter. But there's a trend. And I know it's not in the scripts. I am going off script here, but I cannot say it when you say blocks of butter. There is a trend online. And I am looking at you TikTok because I went on a deep dive of those about a month ago when someone told me about it.

It's called the carnival diet. You only eat meat, eggs and butter. And the snack is a stick of butter. And I don't say that with judgment of putting butter on your toast. I don't say that of putting butter in your cake. I mean, someone just literally for their snack, eating an entire stick of butter, whether or not it's good for you. It's the oddest thing I have seen in a long time in this space. Guys, look, I'm really conscious. As you say, I'm nervous because I've been trialled so much on this topic when I spoke to Fern about it. Look, the reason butter is very high in saturated fat, there is unequivocal evidence, hundreds, like more than 15 randomised control trials that we have that are considered the gold

standard that also say that C-dolls have no effect on inflammation. So saturated fat increases your risk of getting clogged arteries. And that starts when we're kids. Just to pause you there. The saturated fat is in the butter, not in the seed oil. Not in the seed oil. It's in coconut oil and it's in butter, which is also confusing because there was that craze years ago on coconut oil as well being used in everything so seed oils that people are now turning away from because of the fear-mongering around rapeseed oil in particular known as canola oil in america is believed to be inflammatory and that it has a high amount of what we call i'm not going to get too sciencey on here but omega-6 so generically speaking you want a lot of omega-3 in your diet you do need omega-6 but you probably don't need as much of it. But if you eat a diet that's really high in ultra

processed foods, you're automatically going to get a lot more omega six because they use a lot of these oils and other ingredients within them. But actually, rapeseed oil, this is what I got told for saying, has very similar properties to olive oil, if not when it's cold pressed, superior properties actually, and can be a very good oil to cook with. It's high in vitamin E. It's a natural antioxidant. And there's so much research that shows it actually lowers the bad cholesterol, which is LDL. So actually, if you're somebody that in your family history, like there's heart disease on my side of the family, I have high cholesterol, Ella, genetically speaking. But actually, my ratio is good so i've got more of the good cholesterol not the bad cholesterol but overall if i looked at the number i'd be told it was bad anyone listening please

please have a think about you as an individual are you somebody that can get away with eating that much saturated fat every single day not many people people can. Anyone fearing seed oils, just do not take the internet as your education source. Put your detective hat on. Are what they're saying, are they saying it in quite a fearful, powerful way? You're probably better off having those seed oils than having butter every morning. And I know that for a lot of people, that's going to be really confusing to hear. I do appreciate that completely but that's what the research says it's up to you. It's so interesting you said those 15 randomized control trials like there is this overwhelming body of evidence to show it and we have done loads of research into it with two nutritionists in the team with loads of food

scientists and again they're the exact same place like all of the evidence shows as of today there's no problem in it whatsoever now obviously if 100% of your diet is non-fruits and vegetables no fresh food never cooking at home that becomes a different story that becomes a different story for lots and lots and lots and lots of reasons. And so I do think that the conversation around sea dorsal has been quite extraordinary in terms of the fear. And I see it all the time where people are just so confused. And actually, I know I digressed into the sticks of butter conversation, but my understanding is that a lot of the fear of sea dorsal

and a lot of that original conversation came from this carnivore diet. Who I've also been trolled from. So, you know, they're another camp on the internet. And look, some people might do better on a carnivore diet by fluke, but actually it's what you don't see in 10 years' time and 20 years' time by the impact on your heart health. You're not measuring how clogged your arteries get by following this type of diet.

Also, the lack of fibre makes no sense for me as a scientist with the emerging research on how beneficial gut health is. So a carnivore diet or eating sticks of butter does absolutely nothing for your gut microbes so it doesn't really make any sense that it doesn't support your immune system or your mental health so all your joy all your joy and that was my thing when i was watching the sticks of butter and it was just i'd be sick at it i think i'd be sick yeah i almost i was just watching it and i just thought oh it just feels like a shame you know someone's just walking down the street literally eating a stick of butter

and that is it really it's the only thing that's their snack and I guess it's just yeah we always come back to the same thing it's the drive for the pursuit of health especially when you don't have a health condition that's prompting it. Because there is some research for the ketogenic diet I should throw out there so ketogenic diet is technically a carnivore diet because it's just based upon fats and very low amounts of carbohydrate. But it's higher proportion of fat to protein right when you're coming into the ketogenic diet? Technically yes and it can vary on your individual case but for children with epilepsy that's the only bit of concrete research we have for the ketogenic diet. And that's where the ketogenic diet

originated from, isn't it? It was that study in Australia with epileptic children. And you know, there's ongoing research on it on different conditions for the general public health messaging. Probably not the best idea, Ella. Yeah, because you're removing all the fiber.

But C. d'Oy is, I hope, which makes you feel a bit calmer. And I think it links back to what we were saying a moment ago when we were talking about red dye number three, which is just trying to find a semblance of balance in your life like you're all busy people everyone listening you've got a lot going on yes what you eat matters but don't need to get stressed about every single morsel like don't lose your joy and I think that was my thing watching the carnival diet was just where's

your joy it's just like our friend who's reverse aging um brian johnson our friend our friend i feel like i've just spent a lot of time with him we do because we've analyzed him so much um where he was saying you know you can go on a date and i was thinking about the sticks of butter it's just like the fun you have with friends and going and doing things and and food is a big part of culture just as much as a big part of health and I think that just gets lost so often in these kind of quite dogmatic debates. Life's too short, Diwali, Christmas, Easter, how do you do that eating butter? Yeah anyway let's move on to our next topic. Okay this one I am certainly very much looking forward to. Okay we are on coffee which I

think is a just about as important a topic as it comes because coffee is such a big part of so many people's lives but it is also something that I see people talking about all the time at the moment people giving up coffee or drinking loads of coffee because there's loads of evidence about it give us the lowdown on coffee today oh gosh right do you like coffee no um but i had it this morning so i when i first moved to london many a year ago as a singer i used to see everyone go to work you know the grind with a coffee cup and i was like oh what is this and because i didn't like the taste of coffee but i wanted to fit in before the nutrition days i used to get the syrup laden

coffees like i would all the chai latte things and I'd get everything on it to disguise the taste of the coffee. But I would buy a coffee. It was so pointless. I didn't have the money. I don't know what I was thinking. But can I just say I love that you admitted this to fit in. Because we've all done that so many times. Done things that we just don't really like.

You said wasting money, wasting time. Yeah. Just because we feel like it makes us cool. I do remember when Starbucks was the height of cool when I was a teenager and asking my dad when he was going to America to bring me back a Starbucks cup. Yeah. Yeah. Same. It was this because I came from the countryside. And when I came to London Paddington from my small town, Melksham, anyone listening in Melksham Wiltshire? Hi. And there were no back then Starbucks or prep wasn't even a thing when I came up to London. But the lowdown on coffee,

so I save it for day, Ella, when I'm really sleep deprived or I've been up all night like last night anxious about my speech today. So it's a psychoactive stimulant. It's the most commonly abused and used psychoactive stimulant in the world. It's even used for sports. It's an ergogenic aid, which means it can enhance sport performance. It can make you alert. It can be apparently beneficial and negative for your heart health, shown in the research. Could potentially lower your risk of type 2 diabetes, could be good for our gut health. However, on the flip side, we are unique. I come back to that. I know for me, it's not good because it can give me anxiety. If anyone has acid reflux, it's the worst thing in the world

you can consume because it makes your acid reflux worse. So anyone that's experiencing digestive discomfort, coffee is probably not a good idea. A lot of people in the clinic become reliant upon that morning cup of coffee to go to the toilet. They become reliant on to poo. Yeah, sorry. Yeah, to go have a poo. We're not shy on here. Yeah, they need it to go poo and they're used to that and they use it as a diuretic. But actually also can increase cortisol, weight gain and cause massive withdrawals. So there's the two approaches here to coffee is that for some people it could be great. But most people, Ella, have way more than the recommended coffee cup. Like they are drinking in the clinic.

We see six to seven cups of coffee all day long. They don't realize that it has a 12 hour shelf life. Six are really strong, you know, you'll really feel the effects. Then after six hours, it may peter off. But for some people, it's still present half shelf life after 12 hours. So it can negatively impact sleep. Right, I've got the numbers written down. So I thought I'd do a bit of stats for everybody. So in one small cup of coffee and remember every barista you go to is different and there was one study that showed that they could range from 50 milligrams to 200 in the same serving size cup so if anyone's pregnant listening please be aware of that. It's really risky. Yes you can have one cup of coffee a day but you don't know

how much caffeine you're getting. So an espresso, if you like it in Mediterranean style, if you're doing it properly, stood at the side of a bar, 240 to 720 milligrams of caffeine. And on the flip side, if you go over to an energy drink, only 70 to 160, but still quite a lot. A decaf will still have three to 12. So you're really looking at a vast range depending on what type of drink you drink. But I don't like it. Do you like coffee though? I love coffee. It's just a bit of a ritual for us every morning because as you know we try and get up before the kids, do some meditation, have our quiet coffee, read the paper And it's a real ritual for the two of us. And so I go down. I am such a good wife. I do this every day. Go downstairs, make us coffee, come up. I do really like the taste of it, but I think I really like the ritual of it actually more than I like the

flavor of it. But I wanted to ask you a question. So I think, A, coffee feels like the ultimate example for people to take away of this fact that you always say is that for almost everything, there's a pro and a con, which is like, yes, there's lots of health benefits to coffee. Yes, there's quite a lot of evidence showing that there can be lots of beneficial things. But it can also for people who might feel a bit anxious already or prone to anxiety, increase your anxiety, as you said, and have these negative bits. So it's like, we're so individual and there is no one size fits all. And coffee feels like just such a nice, simple representation of that, that it works on both sides. But I was also curious to get your thoughts on this. So I feel like for years, I used to see pieces in the papers saying, red wine's really, really good for you because it's packed with polyphenols and things.

And actually, my understanding is it's now been shown that obviously you would need to drink really quite a lot of red wine. And what type of red wine? Exactly, to reap those benefits. And also you can get a lot of the antioxidants, et cetera, by eating fruits, vegetables of dark colors. So it's almost like creating the headlines that we want to see. It's like when dark chocolate's really good for you. I mean, don't get me wrong, I love chocolate

and I also really enjoy a glass of red wine. So again, we're not demonising things, but what I am saying is I find it really interesting that the headlines and I think coffee, what I was going to ask my opinion on is if coffee is the same, because kind of like we all just want dark chocolate, red wine and coffee to be good for us. and so it feels like those are the things that you're seeing in

the press being like hooray coffee drinkers rejoice your morning drink is actually good for you a bit like your friday night glass of wine is good for you and don't you worry about that chocolate habit and obviously it's true dark chocolate has got benefits etc but i was just curious your thought you're right you are absolutely right it's what we want to hear it's totally what we want to hear because it's you can have too much of a good thing you know you shouldn't eat five avocados in a row but an avocado is good for you coffee okay one portion of coffee might be great for you but should you be having six or seven a day and then what's the knock-on effect on your sleep and then that's going to impact all the rest of your health and I know there are scientists out there at the moment who I deeply respect saying you know coffee's great for

gut health it's really good but actually it depends on you as an individual if it's good for you and I think a lot of people just want reassurance that their habit and I would almost go as far as saying it's close to an addiction like you said it's very ritualistic it's something that people if you feel you cannot get out of bed without coffee, that is a problem. Because you need to be able to get out of bed every day. And that has become a stimulant for you. And perhaps you would then get withdrawals when you tried to remove it, which indicates to us health professionals, you're probably not doing it in the right way. So test yourself, see how you go. What is it about coffee that's good for gut health?

It's the bean itself. And apparently there's some bacteria that only coffee drinkers have that's been found in their poo. A beneficial bacteria. Exactly. Which is really, really interesting to coffee drinkers and non-coffee drinkers. But I don't know if that's the differentiation between if you're a constant coffee drinker or you have one like me every now and again when you're desperate. I think I have a really good relationship with caffeine. I'm kind of celebrating that because I'm able to get up and not do it. But I love matcha. I know you do. And I really wanted to talk about matcha because it's having a moment and we love to talk about things that are having a moment. So I, because

you know, I love numbers and these sort of geeky things. I was obviously online looking at this. So UK sales have gone up of matcha 202%. The global matcha market is expected to grow from $2.3 billion, so that's about £1.8 billion in 2024, up to $2.9 billion, around £2.3 billion in 2028. So it is experiencing a big boom. But again, it's one of those ultimate examples of something where if you exist in the health and wellness world, you're like, this is everywhere. Everyone loves matcha. But actually, it's absolutely tiny because by comparison, the coffee market is $130 billion. So we got $2.3 billion in 2028 for matcha and $130 billion today for coffee. So it is growing fast and well

done matcha but brad pitt likes it brad pitt likes it i know i went down this rabbit hole reading this gq interview with brad pitt from like 2017 about how he taught a journalist to make matcha gales have just launched matcha which i'm sure you're thrilled about i was there and then i was like oh my gosh at the weekend with zachary i was like oh you sell matcha I'm such a cliche wellness person. But ultimately I know this is not judgment I think this says everything about the fact that matcha is niche to the wellness industry. A how small it is in terms of the kind of global caffeine market. B the fact that there's a big deal about gales making it. C that there was that massive trend for the blank street blueberry matcha this summer,

which again feels, you know, pretty wellness focused and pretty bougie to use that word. And then there was an article on Harper's Bazaar called, why are all the hot girlies obsessed with matcha? Oh my gosh. Oh, I'm embarrassed. Don't be embarrassed. But I guess it's to say like there's such an echo chamber. And I think that's the case in any industry you work in.

But match is big, but it's definitely a wellness specific, I feel. It is. It is. Now, fun fact, very quickly to round up the match conversation, because I don't want to bore all of our listeners with it. But actually, it's deep rooted, especially in Japanese culture. You know, it's ceremonial. They use it for specific tea ceremonies. And I know because when I was at university, I had an internship with Teapigs, the tea company, loved their tea and I loved everything they stood for. And I was responsible for going around all the shops and sampling their matcha. So I used to stand in Whole Foods at the

train station. I went to gyms around London and I would basically talk to people and give them this little shot that I've made and you know I had a little whisk but often it just sunk to the bottom it was really bad actually when I look back sorry tea pigs I did actually I think I did a good job just not to put myself down but um you are basically just a little fact for everyone when you have a tea bag of tea you're not absorbing or ingesting the leaf and the difference of matcha is that you've ground down a specific type of leaf that's grown in Japan in the dark. So the antioxidant capacity is huge compared to regular

tea. And you're actually drinking the whole leaf. So you are ingesting it, you're absorbing it and breaking it down, which is why it's really meant to be potentially good for you. And the caffeine in studies has been shown to release more slowly than the caffeine in coffee so instead of getting a hit it's kind of like a consistent feel and buddhist monks use matcha and they have done so it's almost a very ingrained part of a culture that's what i love about matcha i think it's quite cool anyway it's super cool and i would say actually last summer just personal anecdote was very stressful when we were going through the deal that we eventually completed to create the partnership with Delicious Yellow and the Hero Group, which was huge for us. And I was so stressed and I was like, okay, I'm not going to lean into my stress and try and make it better. I'm going to swap my coffee for matcha. And I

felt so good. I should have kept it up because I do feel better on matcha than coffee. I'm going to say it. Although I think it's so hit and miss, whereas I think I like an Americano and I feel like it's always good. Whereas with a matcha, it depends so much on the milk and a good matcha is so delicious and a bad matcha is pretty rank. I completely agree. And actually over in Japan, they don't have milk. They just have hot water. So you have to really like the taste. But a good milk makes it a real treat. Right. You know what we need to do after this one day? Shall we?

There is one of the best matcha places about two streets over. We'll do it. We've got to do that. We'll do it. We'll do it. Okay, so moving on to trends. We've just covered matcha, which is definitely a trend. But I know you've got another one you want to bring to the table today.

So, as you know, I arrived. Hopefully, I don't smell too bad. And you can't smell me smell me I can't smell her but I got out of my handbag I got this fussy deodorant you know one of the eco-friendly because very sadly since my mum has become very unwell and she's got cancer at the moment and I've wanted to go through my house and my beauty products you know and really look at what's in them I wanted a natural deodorant and anyway I got it on my handbag it's like guys I just need to go to toilet put some deodorant on Ella's like oh it's that fussy deodorant I was like yes she goes I've just bought it in lilac and mine's like hot pink I saw it on Dragon's Den oh is that what you saw it I I just want to say this is

absolutely not sponsored by fussy no it's not we should have thought about that maybe it will be in the future um but I was with a friend yesterday who works in natural makeup. She's an amazing makeup artist. And I was talking to her about deodorant. And I was saying it's one of the products I've struggled with the most to switch to something more natural. And finding something that actually works feels nigh on impossible. She recommended two. One called Nude but with two O's.

But it's a paste. The one that she said works really well i like that too but i wasn't such a fan of like putting on your finger anyway and then she said fussy and she was talking about her teenage son and she said that's the only one her teenage son will use and how good it is she sent me a 50 off link last night and i bought it so then when and i couldn't decide between hot pink and lilac so then when i saw you have it i was like yes we've got one each well we rocking both. I love a bit of natural product. We must go into those and more actually in the next few episodes.

But I bought my LED mask with me, Ella. I know. So curious to see it. I love it. So after we had Dr. Thithi on, it was the only piece of advice that's really grounded in research. Forget all the collagen. You know, the one thing she said that would really help the quality of your skin is a red light mask. So this was actually a Christmas present from my husband to me.

I wanted a red light mask. Oh, I know. Romance. I know. He got me something I can sit and look like a complete freak every Sunday night. This is what I do. So you first you wear it for a certain set time. I think it was like 20 minutes first.

And then you only do 10 minutes every week as like a top up. So just once a week? Once a week. You shouldn't overdo it. Yeah. And it says it gives you the instructions. Always obviously follow the instructions on whichever type of mask if you have one you have. And I have noticed such a difference in my pores, the quality of skin and I'm the type of person that when I have a breakout, I get one corker. But I've really, really noticed that the lines around under my eyes and this is obviously anecdotal. I am an evidence-based nutritionist, but when it comes to skin health, I'll try anything and I recommend it. I love it, Ella. Oh my gosh, I can't wait to try it. But I look like a horror movie. I will not lie. I look like some kind of terrifying red-eyed demon person.

Anyway, what's your recommendation? What's your trend? Everyone, be recommended a demon mask. It's funny. I think we should sell it as glowing skin versus demon. Yeah, let's sell it as glowing skin. Just don't wear it out in public. I love that.

No, I'm definitely influenced. As you said, we'll try anything for clear skin. But the one I wanted to bring to the table to say, mostly because I just love it, was the growing trend of sobriety. Yes. I completely gave up drinking. So back in 2011 when I got unwell until around like 2015, I didn't drink at all. And I found it so isolating. I don't drink a lot now, but I am

very basic. I love a spicy margarita, avocado toast, a blueberry matcha. Did you just say avocado toast? Oh, with your avocado toast. No, just like those are the sorts of things I love. What cocktail is that? I'm embarrassingly basic as a person, potentially, but I do love a spicy margarita. I do love a glass of wine, but I don't drink very much. I probably drink like twice a month. But when I was in my 20s,

I found not drinking very isolating. And I felt, I remember so clearly someone saying to me, like at dinner party of people who'd been, we'd been at uni together and someone's flat and they were like, sat down next to me. And someone's like, do you want wine? And I said, no. And the person next to me said,

oh my gosh, I'm sitting next to you this is gonna be so boring and I've carried that kind of fear of being boring because I'm not drinking with me I still it's still like my deepest beer now is being boring someone sent us an Instagram message and replied to the show being like you two are so funny and I was like no one's ever called me we were celebrating what was that my gosh I've been people normally laugh at me not with me thanks guys um anyway I just I felt so ostracized I just felt like such a loser and I then started pretending to drink so I would say like yes I'll have white wine or I'll have red wine and almost like semi drink it so then no one asked yeah no one questions. No, and I was lucky because at uni, I was a mature student anyway at 21, not really, but I was a singer.

So my excuse for not drinking, and it always was, was my voice and being a classical soprano. I noticed that. But I had no social life because half the time I didn't want to be out late because this ball core thing is great to me, this 2024 trend. That was me like 15 years ago um not drinking and staying in always my whole life but now it's cool Ella so look there's so many spirits that are alcohol free and I'm like you I love a glass of bubbly actually that's my one thing is I do love a Prosecco and I think this emergence of all these amazing brands like they've got Caruso I love that Stephanie Ellsworth created that brand Spencer Muff users got Clean Co yeah I tried one recently called Three Spirit that was

absolutely delicious yeah it was so good and Seedlips everywhere exactly so there's always different brands and didn't Millie McIntosh just released a book about being sober so it's cool now right I think that's it there was first of all there was a Vogue shared a piece this month so obviously being January on their 10 wellness trends to know for 2025 and that one of those was drinking less alcohol and then as you said Millie McIntosh has just brought out her book Bad Drunk and then there's the Molly May documentary have you seen it oh my goodness I watched it the minute it came out me too yeah um over the weekend and I really enjoyed it but again she was talking about how alcohol had had a really detrimental impact on their family so it just feels like a lot of younger people talking about not necessarily having an addiction issue to alcohol although that's of course a very important

topic but actually just being negative influence on their life so trying to drink much less and as you said as you know I love stat. And so Drink Aware have reported that as of 2021, so this is a couple of years out of day, 28% of young adults in the UK do not drink alcohol. 68% of consumers, this is of last year, had tried no or low alcohol alternatives. And 80% of people believe that those alternatives are now more socially acceptable than they were five years ago. So this is such a great trend and I wanted to celebrate it. It's so good. I was with the girls I sing with in our little quartet at the weekend

and we're of the generational, they are particularly as well, where a lot of musicians, believe it or not, drink a lot of alcohol. It's the same as doctors. It's this big kind of cultural way of winding down. But I think the new generations have cottoned on, hey, there's zero benefit to alcohol. It makes me feel rubbish. So well done, everybody, for actually doing a better job.

But you're right. It can be socially isolating, but... And that feels like that's shifting. And I just thought that was such a brilliant thing. And again, not to judge people for ever drinking, as I said, I love a spicy mug. But to drink less, that feels inherently very, very positive. Amazing.

So that's it. We tried to keep it to an hour. I think we've gone about two minutes over. It's almost impossible to pick it in. And we had to lose a few headlines along the way because there's so much to say. To say the one that we really need to do next week. Next week, we've got to talk about David Beckham. Yes, we do.

We always need to talk about David Beckham. We always need to talk about David Beckham. Yes, we do. We always need to talk about David Beckham. We always need to talk about David Beckham. He has launched a supplements line. But we've run out of time to talk about it because there is so much

to talk about because I think it's interesting with AG1 and all these massive companies. I am advertised to them every day online. And the TikTok ban in America. We'll go into all of this

next week. Yeah, so there is a lot to talk about. But if you have any interesting trends, topics, headlines, books, podcasts, anything, just share it with us. We really want to talk about it. This is just so great. It's so great. Thank you for listening, everyone. We're having a ball. We cannot wait to see you next week. And please keep sharing it, reviewing it, subscribing. It just, I think it's hard to overestimate what a massive impact it has. So thank you. Thank you. Thank you. And we can't wait to see you next Monday. Have a great day. like yourself with podcast advertising from Libsyn Ads. Choose from hundreds of top podcasts

offering host endorsements or run a pre-produced ad like this one across thousands of shows to reach your target audience with Libsyn Ads. Email bob at libsyn.com to learn more. That's b-o-b at l-i-b-s-y-n.com.