The Wellness Scoop - How to Build a Brand

Episode Date: October 23, 2018

How to build a strong, consistent brand; the importance of brand in building a business; why women need to support women and why we all need to find joy in life’s simple pleasures with Chrissie Rucker, founder of The White Company.  See acast.com/privacy for privacy and opt-out information. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

TD Direct Investing offers live support, so whether you're a newbie or a seasoned pro, you can make your investing steps count. And if you're like me and think a TFSA stands for Total Fund Savings Adventure, maybe reach out to TD Direct Investing. Hi everyone, welcome back to the Deliciously Ella podcast with me, Ella Mills, and my husband and business partner, Matthew Mills. Hi everyone. So today we're joined by an incredibly inspiring woman, so we're very excited about this. We have Chrissy Rucker here, who founded The White Company in her 20s and in the last 25 years has built up into one of the

most beautiful, well-known and well-loved brands in the UK. And as we build Delicious Yellow, and I know lots of our audience are looking to do something similar, we're really fascinated by how other people like Chrissy have created so much magic and how much we can learn from their stories. So Chrissy, thank you so much for joining us today. For anyone who doesn't know your story, could you just tell us how and why you started The White Company? Well, it's hard to believe, but it was actually nearly 25 years ago. And back then, I was working as a journalist. And it all happened a bit by mistake, my boyfriend Nick had bought his first flat. He had the most appalling taste. He sort of lived with burgundy duvet covers and highly patterned mugs, none of which matched, in an attempt to show him that really I was excellent

wife material. I went off and went shopping for him. What I found was that actually kitting out your first flat is an incredibly daunting task. And I had a total confidence crisis and I didn't really know how to tackle it. So I just thought, I'm just going to buy white. I'm going to get white sheets, white towels, white china, white napkins, etc. Anyway, what I found was it was incredibly hard to do and that there were very two clear ends of the scale. So you either had the big department stores, beautiful designer brands, very expensive, but lovely. Or you had high street, which was cheap, poor quality um and not very well designed and there was really sort of nothing in the middle so that was the sort of light bulb moment and then the

real the turning point was when i sort of did my first investigations going and looking for factories is that i found a lot of the factories that supplied all of the big designer brands and realised that actually if I could supply them directly to the customer, I could bring them over to this country and sell them for a much lower price, same quality than the designer labels. So that's how it all started. Wow. That reminds me a bit when I went to matt's house the first time

we met and i said should we just cook dinner and he said yeah great and i said do you have everything you need he said yeah yeah yeah so when bought ingredients came back and i was like do you have a chopping board he was like no yeah i was it was kind of embarrassing ella still is in charge of cooking in our house i'm definitely not much of a cook um so 25 years on uh the white company still seems incredibly focused most of what you sell is still white and it feels as though the products have just gently evolved rather than seeing the constant chase of innovation and new lines every week that you see in a lot of other retailers how have you managed that that focus I mean, I think brand is

something that we put very much at the heart of the business. And, you know, when I set out to create the business, I really wanted it to be different and special. And I wanted it to be, if nothing else, that company that everybody remembered as a company that just sold white things because that differentiation piece I've always felt is incredibly important. So we do an enormous amount of work in the business on brand. There are definitely times when I felt that the company has gone off track a bit and it's gone off brand a bit. And too much colour has started to sneak in. So, you know, we worked really hard to rein that back in.

And now, actually, every three to four years, we do a full brand audit of the business to check, you know, what we're doing. Are we on track? Are we staying true to our regional brand identity parameters? And I think, you know, when you're growing a business, being absolutely clear about what your brand isn't is as important as what your brand is. How did you go about making those first steps happen? So when you had the idea that you wanted to create a company selling beautiful sheets and towels in white, what were the steps you went through to actually make that dream a reality? I think, did your business start as a male-ordered business initially and then went into retail?

Can you tell us a bit about that process? I mean, actually, I was just enormously inspired by Nick. And I remember... And Nick is your now husband. He's now my husband, yeah. I finally got him to marry me after I filled his house with white sheets. But I was enormously inspired by him. So when, you know,

we used to go on holiday together, and we'd come back, and he would get off, get off the plane and go back to the office. And he'd be really excited. And he couldn't wait to find out what had happened. And he just had this phenomenal passion for what he was doing. And he was selling shirts in a tiny little basement or just off Portobello Road. But it was his absolute passion. And I wanted to feel like that. And so my starting point was I looked at the trade shows. And I went to the Birmingham NEC for a home textiles trade fair. And that's, you know, I literally sort of trawled around there for two days

looking at lots of different suppliers. And I just quietly started to find my first suppliers. You know, it didn't happen very quickly. You know, the first year was very slow um and you know in my first week I probably did five orders in the first week but the other thing how were you doing those orders uh was it through um was it just through a catalog that people were ordering these or is it through how were people yes so so I think because I I think because I had a magazine background and that was a world I loved and learnt so much in,

that was a fantastic experience to have. So I got on, I shot the first brochure, which was the only way I was ever going to become an editor, I think, because I really wasn't a very good journalist. We shot the first brochure and then I basically sent it out to friends and friends of friends and anyone who would give me an address that I was sending it to. And then the other thing I did is I really focused on doing a PR campaign. So I wrote to all of the journalists in all the papers and all the magazines and sent them a copy of the brochure. And was the company just all you at this stage?

Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. No, it was just me. Sort of two phones, a fax machine back then. Yeah. And a lot of boxes. Yeah.

A lot of boxes. Yeah. A lot of boxes, yeah. So has a lot of your business now transitioned to online away from your stores, or is the bulk of what you do still through your shops? So today we are exactly 50-50. Really? Wow. Yeah. So we have 60 stores in the UK. With that, will you plan on opening more shops,

or do you feel like basically all retail is just moving online now and you'll have more focus on that side of the sales? I think, I mean, retail for us is extremely important and we are lucky enough to have had a fantastic year in retail this year. I think, you know, when you look at all of the noise about what's going on on the high street, I mean, I don't believe for a minute it's the end of the high street. I think it's just, this is just a time when quite a lot of change will take place. And I think, you know... And what do you see that change being? Firstly, I mean, the brands that sit on the high street and the brands that are thriving and doing well

are the brands that have a really clear brand proposition and they have a reason to be there and a reason to go there and you know they they're doing a really good job with their products and they're passionate about their products and and you know they're they continue to do well um i think you know perhaps over the years you know there have become quite a lot lot of retailers who end up selling the same thing. So it becomes, you know, as a customer, then you can sort of buy it from lots of different places. And you can also go online and buy it from lots of different places online. So that makes it quite hard, I think.

So clear brand differentiation is really important um a great brand experience um personal service i mean i think when people come into stores um you know they want someone who is there to help them if they want it's knowledgeable about it yeah i think there's nothing more frustrating than going into a store and asking someone about a product and they have no idea and um i know from our reading that we're doing before this episode you have a huge emphasis on training for staff in stores so they really really know a lot about the product and that's a reason to believe for people to go into a store rather than buying it online and on that for someone who is wanting to create something and is in the early stages of it what obviously i think one things we're most inspired by with the white company um for

delicious yellow is that sense of such strong brand identity and we've just done a really long project actually on our branding and things like that to really solidify and make it very very clear because it was clear to us that whilst it was very we knew exactly what we stood for did everyone know exactly what we stood for and just how important that is to cut through all the confusion out there and so for someone who's kind of in the early stages or just kind of thinking about it what would be your kind of number one pieces of advice of creating a brand that does have that reason for being that's so clear to the customer what they stand for and therefore why they are different to everyone else out there

I mean I think that is just working through you know what your key brand values are and and that sort of absolute clarity of what you are and what you aren't. You need to sort of, you know, do your axis map. Yeah. And you plot, you know, the other brands that you feel are in the same sort of space as you. And then you need to see exactly where you sit within the other brands and then work out what makes you different and what makes you special. And create something that you can then stick with for yes decades rather than something that's popular today yeah and i and i think it's

just you know trying to sort of you know create these clear brand parameters that you stick to and um you know obviously they will evolve a little bit over time but you know our brand values today are still the same brand values the key brand values are still the same key brand values that we started with really that was one of the big um projects when we were doing we've just as ella alluded to we've just done this big project uh to create a new visual identity for delicious yellow that really unites everything from the books to the delis to the food products that we sell. And one of the things that we most wanted to clarify through that

were actually what were the values that we want to guide us and guide any other team member who comes on over the next 50 years that we hope to get to run this thing that will keep us all honest and as hopefully we're able to grow and hire more people and maybe have less of a direct relationship with all the people who are in the business, what can we give them is just really simple guidelines so that they always know what's important to us

and how we believe Delicious Yellow can best stay focused on all the values that we have. And solidifying those was the hardest part of the process, more so than I think the visual piece that we did. Because it is something, it becomes your compass, and it becomes something that you are wed to and tied to, we hope, for a very, very long time. And getting those right and really getting everyone signed up to those feels like the most important thing we now do in delicious yellow we've just had two

new team members join us and the first thing we wanted to do with them when when they joined was just to really really embed them within the values and that's i feel like now almost the most important process that we go through and in anything in any work that we do absolutely and then the other absolutely crucial piece is is the understanding of your customer yeah so really really understanding what your customer wants from you as a brand and and and which bits of that are right for the brand to do where it becomes confusing actually as you go along and you grow and we've definitely experienced this is that um you know and when you're in on your mission of keeping your bad your brand intact i always give the blue shirt example you know we we sometimes

do some of our shirts in a light blue color as well as a white color. And the blue shirt will often, sadly, sell more than the white shirt. That's quite the conundrum. So then you have this challenge. And this is, I think this is a really common challenge for brands, is that, you know, obviously your merchandising team are trying to do a brilliant job for you and they want to sell as much as possible and they want to you know make as much money for you as possible and so they will be telling you sell more blue shirts sell more blue shirts but that is not the right thing to do for the brand but will they be then saying to you we're selling a lot of light blue shirts can we sell lots of light pink shirts or light yellow shirts oh yes they'll try green shirts instead and then where does it stop at

that point yeah but um but part part of being the brand guardian and i think you know probably i mean that's very much yeah probably what you and i do uh is that um you know that's where you say no yeah we're going to stick with you know selling um yeah because you want to be known for something right for the brand rather than just becoming a seller because that's how that's how a brand and a product range can get become eroded and lose its original identity quite quickly but that again comes back to that's you looking at the long term isn't it rather than the short term and I think that's in the way that we live today in everything I think we're very much conditioned to look at today tomorrow next you know maybe next week but we're not brilliant now at long-term visions and you know it seems like you know the trend of today

is start a company and sell it within five years rather than start a company and slowly build something that feels right and sustainable. And therefore making the decisions, not what's going to make us more money in the next 12 months, but what's going to make sure that we're still here, we're still relevant 12 years later. And that's, I think, always a really tricky conundrum and I can imagine as the kind of founder and that guardian of the brand that's a challenging moment of saying I know we'd make more money if we did this but we can't do that I mean we've um we've always tried to work I mean I think when the business was very small we had a three-year plan and we always had tried to have a clear vision of what the business would look like in three years time and as as we've sort of progressed along the way we started to have a longer term view so we always try and have

a broad 10-year vision of what we want the brand to look like then we have a sort of five-year plan that leads up to that and with me because the business is always going to remain privately owned. I mean, my motto growing the business has always been strong and safe. Yeah. And retaining very strong brand identity. Yeah. And your one thing that Ella and I were laughing about last night is we obviously work together and run it as a family business and we in the first two years that I started working with Ella in mid-2015 in the

first two years of working together we had to cancel six holidays because work commitments came up that we just couldn't get out of and we joked how it was so fortunate that we were doing it together because it was just one of us who had to cancel six holidays because of work commitments. The other person would have got pretty fed up with them pretty quickly. Your husband is incredibly successful in his own right as well and is the founder of Charles Tyrwhitt Menswear. How on earth have you been able to both balance growing such amazing companies at the same time and retained uh your family i think you have four four children is that right how have you been able to to manage that balance between family and growing such amazing businesses at the same time

i think sometimes it goes well and sometimes it doesn't go well at all probably um i think the wonderful thing about both having our own businesses is we understand the problems and the challenges and you know we we understand uh you know i i suppose we understand the the rhythm of of what you go through when you're building a business. In the early years, it was fantastic to have someone who's, he was sort of three years ahead of me building his business. So he had always some wise advice to give. What was his wisest bit of advice? In a funny way, one of the strongest bits of advice he'll always give me is just be focused. And he'll always say, do five things really well rather than 20 things badly. Pick off your five things for this year and go after those and do them 100%. Yeah.

But actually, he was brilliant because he made me believe in myself. And he just sort of said, you know, you can absolutely do this. And sometimes you just need to have that person saying, you know, yes, this is a great idea. Just go for it. I think I rode competitively as a child when I was growing up. Rode horses. Yeah. And I think horses are. Rode horses? Yeah. And I think horses are a great leveller.

Yeah. And you learn to fail spectacularly. I mean, I found you sort of fail much more than you succeed. And, you know, that's a great life experience to have because it takes away the fear of failure. And I think it's really important not to be afraid of failing. And, you know, if you have a bad day and things go wrong, I always just sort of think, well, try and understand what happened and what went wrong. If it involves a customer, apologize as fast and as honestly as possible and do everything you can to put it right. And then just, you know, tomorrow is another day.

Get up, you know, don't look back, look forward. And, you know, understand what went wrong and then try to do it better next time. You know, and it is as simple as that, actually. And I think you just got to keep putting one foot in front of the other and of course you're going to have bad days and stressful days and stressful times when things go wrong then when you have children of course that brings um a whole new dimension um we've got four and um they're all quite old now so i'm obviously getting very old um it was you know when they were little it was really tough um it was really tough because

you have lots of phases where you feel like you're doing everything badly feel like you're doing a bad job at work you feel like come home and you're not being a good enough mum um because it just feels like there simply aren't enough hours in the day but you gradually you work you gradually work out how to make it work and um you know now i mean you know my diary is is run on a spreadsheet. And I have six columns for each member of the family. And so my year is planned. The kids things go in first. You know, kids things go in first. Then the business things go in.

And then, you know, around that, everything else has to happen. I remember when, you know, probably about 15 years ago, I remember I felt like I was doing everything really badly. And so I said... But it's interesting to hear that because you obviously weren't you know that's what I think is powerful to listen to definitely for me is that you know you felt you were doing it badly and yet look what you created during that time yeah and I think I remember having this moment where I just said that's it I'm going to sell the business I can't cope and um and one of the children said to me no mummy you can't and I think they actually might have said we don't want you to stay at home

but one of them said no mummy we're really proud of what you do. And I think that was the, and actually now one of my daughters is working in the business at the moment. And so I'm very happy that I didn't and I carried on. And would you like them to come work in the business long term? Well, I mean, it would be lovely if one of them wanted to. But I'm a great believer in they should just, you know, they need to find their own passion and follow their own dreams. So one question I had and you said, you know, you felt like you were doing everything wrong. And, you know, the end of the kind of difficult days, Nick would be there with your stiff G&T. And first of all, that sense of support, which I know for us has been invaluable. Like there's no way on earth that we would still be here today able to run the business without the support we've had from our families.

I mean, they've really got us through the most difficult times that we've had with our business. I think and each other as well. I mean, having each other when it's going wrong or something's really, really bad. We handle pretty different things within the business but we have obviously a deep understanding of what the other does and just having that complete and utter understanding for the other person to know how difficult it is and the understanding and counsel that they can give you because they have such a deep knowledge of it has been completely invaluable to both of us but on that have you had any moments of kind of particular challenge moments where you think

you know I don't know if we're still going to be open tomorrow and how do you how have you kind of managed to navigate through those because I think what from the outside we always see is how successful something is and you don't course, get those kind of inside looks at the fact that actually the road to that success is very, very bumpy. I mean, I think, you know, I mean, we've encountered, you know, so many, you know, lots of little problems constantly along the way. And I think that's just where that resilience piece comes in and you just sort of have to sort of you just take every day as it comes and you just kind of work out you know well you know what is actually going on here and how am I going to fix that and then

you know you get on and you fix it and you move forward and it's also terribly terribly important to celebrate the highlights and the good moments because it's funny isn't it I think when we're business owners we tend to remember more the things that went wrong have felt tough yeah when actually there have been so many moments to really celebrate as well so it's really important with your team to celebrate those moments as much as possible yeah i like that i think that's so true and actually something that we probably don't do enough because the problems always seem like priorities because they have to get dealt with and fixed and sorted now in order for things to be viable tomorrow whereas the you

always kind of put off the celebrations because they don't they don't have to happen today but actually they do because you need that morale that sense of achievement and that excitement to kind of carry you on to the next phase so what would be and I know it's always a difficult question but what would be your kind of number one pieces of advice to anyone getting started on their own entrepreneurial journey or starting to think about it? Number one is the brand piece. You know, really know, you know, be absolutely crystal clear about what your brand is and be really clear about what it isn't.

And, you know, really put your brand at the heart of everything you do. I think when you're first starting out, I think you've just, you know, you've just sort of got to go for it. You just do it. Don't be afraid of things that go wrong. It's just taking that leap, isn't it? Yeah. And we constantly, even today, 25 years later,

we're constantly looking at what works and what doesn't work. And we just keep building on it quietly just keep putting one foot in front of the other yeah when things go wrong understand them and you know try and try and do it better next time and move forward and don't dwell on it yeah but also i think accepting that things will go wrong they go wrong for everyone and that that's really just not the end of the world. So if that's your greatest fear about starting is that it's not going to go right, then it's not going to go right. Know that it doesn't go right for anyone. But as you said, just acknowledge why it didn't go right and then remedy it, put the next foot in front and get on with the next step. And I think that sense of fear of the unknown, of all the possible issues that may arise, is something that really, really makes you nervous. Like, I know we were talking about expanding internationally,

as Matt said, and I said to Matt, I said, what happens if it doesn't work? And he said, well, there's really only one way to know if it's going to work, and that's to do it. I was like, oh, yeah, you're probably right. I think the other thing is is is don't be afraid to ask for help you know I mean throughout my whole journey you know I've I've I've sometimes um you know I've I've often approached people who I really admire and just say you know would

would you have a coffee or and it's amazing how generous people can be and how how they'll you know just talking to people and uh asking questions can be really helpful as well absolutely um so chrissy one thing um we do with every guest that we have on is ask them about a mantra or practice a saying that they live by or do every day well i've got this funny little poster on my wall in the office which says um i like things to happen and if they don't happen i like to make them happen i love that um i'm not sure i'm always 100% successful, but that's always quite a fun thing. I think it's just really important every day to just get up every day and enjoy the day and make the most of the day and celebrate the successes that come during the day. And we talk a lot in the business about simple pleasures.

And we talk about things should be used and loved every day and not saved for best. And I think it's that thing of if you have lovely things, you know, use them every day, enjoy them every day. And that simple pleasures are there to be cherished every day. So that could just be, you know, a great cup of coffee in a lovely mug, you know, sitting down with a girlfriend and having a chat. Yeah.

Or it could be just a catch-up with one of your children at the end of the day as you're cooking supper or it could be having a bath at the end of the day. Just really enjoying and actually genuinely taking a minute to appreciate those really nice moments because every day has those nice moments and it's easy to let them go by. You open the front door and you take the dog out for a walk in the morning and it's cold but the sun's shining and it's crisp and beautiful. And that's amazing. I urge people to, you know, unplug and, you know, just enjoy the day as much as they can.

Yeah, I love that. So I know one of the things that you've always been really passionate about is women in business and women supporting women. And you've done a lot of work with the princess trust as well on that and i'd love to just understand a little bit more about that kind of how you came to it and what it is that about it that kind of spurs you on so much that's got you so passionate um so yeah so it's really exciting so we're just starting a very exciting new project for the Princess Trust. It's going to school, going to college, you know, starting my first job and eventually starting my business. I just feel incredibly lucky to have had the love and support of so many incredible people throughout my life, from my parents and family to people that I know well

to people that I don't know very well. And they've all been there and given me moments of support and encouragement. And I suppose, you know, the point is that they help you grow and they help you to believe in yourself. And this project that we're doing for the Prince's Trust, we are specifically helping disadvantaged young women. And they're women who have had incredibly tough starts in life. And I was truly horrified to discover that actually 270,000 women are unemployed currently. And also the really shocking fact that hit home very hard with me is that currently we have 92, uh young women who are sort of

dropping out of school or dropping out of education every year and that is up from 70 000 last year oh my gosh so it is dramatically increasing the self-harm rates are increasing dramatically the nhs are seeing many more additions of young girls suffering from self-harm um mental health issues obviously becoming you know that that's a very growing absolutely topic um so and basically what what we are doing with women supporting women is that we um we are setting out on a mission to try and raise 10 million pounds. And we are hoping to sponsor as many young women as we can through the Princess Trust. They have some truly amazing, life-changing programs. Well, Chrissie, thank you so much for joining us today.

It's been fascinating hearing your story I know you're an enormous inspiration and the White Company as a brand is enormous inspiration to to Ella and I so thank you so so much for coming in and sharing all of your incredible wisdom and knowledge with us. And if you have any feedback on this episode we would love to hear it so please do review it please do rate it and share any of that feedback with us. And otherwise, I hope you can tune in for our next episode and definitely subscribe. There'll be a new episode coming out for you every Tuesday. Thanks so much, everyone. You're a podcast listener, and this is a podcast ad heard only in Canada. Reach great Canadian listeners like yourself with podcast advertising from Libsyn ads. Choose from hundreds of top podcasts offering host endorsements or run a pre-produced ad like this one across thousands of shows to reach your target audience with Libsyn ads.

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