The Wellness Scoop - Lifestyle Medicine

Episode Date: September 25, 2018

We hear from Dr Hazel Wallace, a doctor, personal trainer and campaigner for a holistic approach to our health. She talks about what prompted her to become a doctor, how to create a more holistic approach to medicine, how she's crafted a life totally unique to her passions and how to stay healthy when you’re busy. See acast.com/privacy for privacy and opt-out information. Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

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Matthew Mills. Hi, everyone. So today we're talking to Dr. Hazel Wallace, a qualified doctor and a personal trainer with a passion for a more holistic view of medicine. In light of some of the UK and the Western world's struggle with lifestyle related illnesses and the pressures coming on the NHS, we wanted to talk to Hazel today to delve a little deeper into this new way of doing things, looking more at healthcare rather than sick care, prevention not just cure. So Hazel, thank you so much for being here. Hazel's a big inspiration of mine. So I'm very excited to have you here. Thank you. And just to get us started, as I always say, I stalk all our guests. And I've stalked you for a while now. But I restalked you recently and just re-read. I can verify that. Yeah. Yeah, because I was talking a lot about how brilliant Hazel was.

And I reread some of your books and kind of refreshed your personal story, which is incredibly powerful as to how you started kind of your interest in medicine and the connection between food and medicine and illness. And if you wouldn't mind sharing some of that story with our listeners today, I think it would be really, really inspiring for them. Cool. Well, first of all, thank you guys for having me on. So, yes, I am a qualified doctor, but if you haven't picked up from my accent already, I grew up in Ireland. And when I was 18 years of age, I moved to Wales to study medical sciences, which was a three-year undergraduate degree. And the reason I did that was because I didn't get into medicine first time round as a student leaving school. And

I did well in that degree and moved on. And after that, studied medicine. And now I'm living in London. So it was a bit of a long journey through medicine. And the reason I was really passionate about becoming a doctor really stems from when I lost my dad when I was 14. And he died from a stroke. And prior to this, just a couple of weeks or maybe months before that, he'd been diagnosed with type 2 diabetes and high blood pressure, which are two high risk factors for having a stroke. And around that time, I remember him taking medication, but I don't really remember him having any advice on diet or exercise, which are other risk factors for having a stroke. And anyway, everything happened quite quickly. He had a small stroke at the dinner table on a Saturday afternoon. I remember exactly what we were eating at the time.

And a couple of days later, he had a really big stroke, which took his life. So our lives completely changed after that. And I don't think it really hit home when I was 14. But certainly, a couple of years later, I thought about it. And I, you know, I was thinking I was going to be an accountant like my dad. But I was like, I have to do medicine. I really want to be a doctor. I really want to change lives.

But also during that time, I was thinking, I wonder if our lives and how we live our lives impact our health. And I wonder if we could have prevented what had happened to dad. And although now that I've gone through medicine, I realize, you know, I can never pinpoint why he had that stroke. It could be, it's likely to be multiple, multiple things that have caused that stroke. But really, it set me on the path of lifestyle medicine, even in that early stage. And going through medical school, I was thinking, I cannot wait to learn all about food and exercise and actually going through university I myself lost I guess an interest in food and a connection with food and I was living off you know takeaways like you do at uni and I wasn't really cooking and I certainly wasn't

exercising and it got to the point that I thought well well, if I'm going to be a doctor, I don't want to be a doctor who can't run for a bus or who doesn't look healthy. And so I started my own research around food. And, you know, fast forward a couple of years now, I've been doing the Food Medic, which is my blog and also my books for six years. And that is really trying to connect the dots between medicine and food and how food interacts with our health and that really is my story in a nutshell it's it's incredible got a hundred questions on there but i'll start with one so because grief had a really big impact for you didn't it on your relationship with food and your kind of motivation in that space right

and didn't how could you tell us a little bit more about that because I think for lots of people kind of deep stress or difficult times does really impact on their view of it because they lose a bit of that kind of joy and excitement around things yeah absolutely it's really interesting because grief affects people in various different ways like stress and anxiety and depression does. There's no just one symptom or set of symptoms. Of course. And for me, I think I had delayed grief for about two years.

I was fine. I just ticked along. But I was young. And then when I was 16, it really hit me hard where I didn't want to eat. I didn't want to wash my hair. I didn't want to go to school. I didn't want to see my friends. I basically stopped looking after myself. And I couldn't really put my finger on why. I just didn't want to, and this sounds quite dramatic, but I didn't want to exist anymore. I didn't feel happy enough to exist. And I didn't feel like I, like my family life made sense anymore. I didn't feel like my

friendships made sense anymore. And I guess I was just a very lost young girl. And it kind of went on for a couple of months where I wasn't doing as well in school and not going to school as much. And I'm very academic, I always was. But I didn't feel like I had the energy to put into that anymore because I wasn't eating, I wasn't sleeping. And I was just very sad. And my mum turned around to me one day, really distraught and said, I can't see you like this and I can't carry on if you're not going to look after yourself. So seeing how sad she was, I said, well, can we go to see my GP? And it was between my mum and my GP and I that

we really worked on getting me better and working with a dietitian as well to get my weight back up, to focus on other things in my life. And as I started to eat again, I realized actually, food can be healing, and it's not always bad for us. Not like it was bad for my dad. And I got better quite quickly, but that was really coming towards my final exams in school, which is really why I didn't get into medicine because I hadn't been focusing on it and going through that process is really important for me because I now understand as a practitioner but also from a personal point of view how food can affect our bodies. So the other question I had kind of moving forward in the conversation as you said was you were really excited when you went to med school about learning all about the more lifestyle elements alongside this the kind of you know operations and all the rest of it

but you don't really learn that in medical right it's kind of is it am i right in saying it's about 10 to 15 hours or so yeah it varies and some medical schools it's five hours some it's 25 but you wouldn't you'd be lucky to get any more than that um so i mean in the grand scheme of things for most most medical degrees you're looking at five to six years. And if you're having that amount of nutrition, it's ridiculous. Yeah, less. And also you learn the basics of, I guess, macronutrients, carbs, fats, proteins, and the impact that they have on the body, maybe on a cellular level. But you don't know how to prescribe food or diet to patients, particularly to diet-related diseases that we see today.

And when I say that, I mean things like type 2 diabetes and heart disease, but also mental health conditions. We see a link between food and the brain and also digestive problems. Because one of the things I read when I was doing my restalking this weekend, which I thought was really powerful, and I can't remember which of your two books it was in, but you said that despite knowing we have the power to reduce all of these risk factors as individuals,

we don't really seem to have done anything about it in the last hundred years or so. In fact, lots of lifestyle related diseases are actually on the rise and I know again it's had you know about 25 percent of deaths in the UK from cardiovascular disease kind of one in every three minutes and that's really really frightening when we start to understand that we do have the capacity to look after ourselves and that holistic view sleep stress exercise the way we eat you know you're quite unusual it seems in your view as a doctor of this more kind of lifestyle approach and a more 360 holistic approach do you think that

is that the future of medicine or are people resistant to it how what's been your experience in terms of open-mindedness or actually kind of stick with the status quo? So as it stands, just for like a bit of context for people, 70% of the diseases that we die of now worldwide, not just here in the UK or in developed countries worldwide, are non-communicable diseases or NCDs. And what I mean by that are the diseases that you can't catch. So I can't give you diabetes or heart disease, they develop over time. And the major kind of diseases in that category are cancers, heart disease and stroke, type 2 diabetes and mental health conditions. And what we're seeing now is they're taking over the infectious diseases that we once used to die from. And the reason we're not dying from things like HIV anymore is because we've got

better diagnostic techniques, we've got medication that can stop that virus from replicating, and we've got better preventative measures. The thing is, that just shows us how great modern medicine is. But we're dealing with this new kind of cohort of conditions that can't be fixed with one pill or one surgery. And rather, they need to have kind of, again, this multifaceted holistic approach where we look at prevention. And when it does happen, we look at ways we can reduce that from progressing. So I always use type 2 diabetes as an example. I know it's thrown around quite a bit, but that develops over time. There's multiple risk factors for it. But that could be, you know, having a poor diet throughout your childhood and teen years.

It could be that you have, again, like there's things you can't change, like family history and ethnicity. But definitely diet and exercise are huge um and smoking we can't forget about smoking but i feel like everyone knows that but the fact that people aren't aware that actually eating more portions of fruits and vegetables can reduce your risk of having type 2 diabetes and even cancer um and improving your longevity there are things that we don't really talk about as much. And why not, right? Because that's what I want. We've been talking about this a lot in relation to lots of different issues.

We were talking a couple of weeks ago on the podcast about food waste. Totally different issue, but about how a third of the food we produce in the whole world gets thrown away. It's a trillion dollars worth. It's terrifying. 25 million slices of bread in the UK and we were talking about how what a powerful effect that has on climate change but we're not talking about it and it feels like this is a kind of thread that's going throughout is as you said like with smoking we all know right I think you know you've seen the number of people smoke go down it's so visually clear but it feels with this kind of information that it's

so confusing to people and therefore the conversation doesn't feel clear enough or the education isn't kind of concise enough that we don't seem to be changing these patterns what's your kind of thought on that i think so nutrition as a science is relatively new compared to the other sciences. And when you compare it to medical sciences, like looking at drugs and things like that, it doesn't really fit into niche trials. And so when you kind of the end result of the conclusion is always a bit, it's never like black and white. And that's what we look for as people.

We always want the answer. So we want regimes. We want clear answers. We want clear answers. We want clear answers, and we also want a magic bullet, and we want to know what fixes it. And actually, if you ask anyone who's educated in that field, they will say, there is no one diet that's the best diet. There is no one food that will cure anything.

And I think when it comes to doctors prescribing food or exercise or any kind of lifestyle approach, whether it's sleep, stress management, because we weren't thought it at medical school, they almost feel like, A, it's not my place, B, I don't have time, and C, I wouldn't really feel comfortable in doing that. And that's not saying every GP or every doctor isn't, but I would, majority of us aren't comfortable. And definitely when I go to speak at GP conferences, majority of doctors don't feel comfortable because they don't know what advice to be given and they're also confused. And so I think nutrition definitely should be on the top of the agenda for not just governments, but also in medical schools, even in at schools, like primary schools, we

should be making it a part of our curriculum, just like you learn math or English, like have it running through all the systems so that people reconnect with food and they understand food. And they can make educated choices. Yeah, absolutely. Because it is confusing. There's so many books out there. There's so much on the internet. Now we've got like information on our fingertips that even for people who are qualified in science or medicine, it can be quite confusing because you're like, who do I listen to?

What should I be doing? And like you said, it's not just what we eat or the impact of food on our health, but also the planet's health. And now we need to think about all these other things that are going on. And the other kind of big elephant in the room is inequality, which is the biggest risk factor for malnutrition as well. So I think because it's such a complex system, we're just trying to figure it out, but we're not working quick enough. And having these

kind of conversations and getting more people who are kind of at the top of the the kind of I guess policy change to to listen to us is what is what's going to make the the biggest difference but it definitely I think a grassroots level and getting more people talking about it is is one way of starting. You're absolutely brilliant which is in all the all the ways but it's one of the reasons i wanted to come you to come on today because i think you transmit this educate this very educational information in a very friendly open accessible way and i think one of the things that's always really challenging here is that balance right of as we're saying these choices do really matter because actually like not one choice in one day but across our

lifetime the way we eat the way we live the way we sleep stress does impact on our well-being so it does matter that we talk about it but how do you talk about it in a way that's not preachy that's not making people feel guilty that's not you know creating more stress and anxiety around these choices or making it obsessive? You know, how do you kind of cut through all this confusion and help kind of in a positive manner, start to help people make changes or kind of talk to their friends and family about making changes? Yeah, it's so difficult. It's really difficult. And I think, you know, there is social media has been incredible and sharing information and ideas and recipes and promoting health. But also, there's a small group of people who are also really affected by that because they will take that as gospel and they will think that that's instead of focusing on what we need to take away,

and I think that's why people get upset with government campaigns. It's always like we're taking away sugar, we're taking away advertisements. There was a big backlash against their campaign of 400, 600, 600. Exactly, for the 400 calories for breakfast, 600 for lunch, 600 for dinner. And that was met with quite a lot of resistance, it seems. And this week, also, they kind of spoke about mandatory calorie labeling in all restaurants and that also was kind of met with like a lot of backlash. The thing is when you're working at a high up level like a top-down approach you're always using a blunt

tool to try and make change and whether that's taxation or it's advertisement it's never going to be suitable for everyone. You just can't do that with a public health campaign. When you're talking to millions and millions of people and everyone's going to receive information very differently. Absolutely. So what they do when it comes to those kind of campaigns is what can we do to help the majority of people?

And when they talk about the majority of people, it's usually people who are low-income families. And with these campaigns like the 400 of people, it's usually people who are low-income families. And with these campaigns like the 400, 600, 600 rule, I can never say that. It's really hard. It's to target people who are eating out of home so that when they go pick up their meal deal at lunchtime, they know that they can grab a 400 calorie meal deal

without consuming a lot of calories. And while I disagree that calories are king when it comes to equating to health, because it's about nutrients and food as well, for certain individuals, that might be, it's not going to be optimal, but it's going to be better to choose say for example um a sandwich and a pack of popcorn and water as opposed to going like a double decker sandwich a bottle of and you know share a bag of crisps it's not it's not the best but for some people it's better and i think we need to think about our audiences and that's who Public Health England think about when they're kind of making these campaigns. But then going back to communicating messages on social media, I think if we take a step back from cutting things out and restricting people from certain things and focus on the positives and educating people, I think that would be a much more helpful kind of aspirational it has to be

making vegetables cool it's about it's not about making them right the kind of positive nutrition rather than taking things away you have to eat them but that you should eat they're delicious they're as good as anything else you can eat absolutely giving people nudges and making it accessible because not everyone is going to be able to cook three of their meals at home like ideally everyone would be cooking from scratch that's just not possible for a lot of people so it's like giving people like little nudges like what can you do today can you make a pot of like porridge this morning instead of like having a bowl of frosties like if you can do that for five days of the week this week you're doing incredible and like just giving people like little ideas but also making it accessible so it's not out of their budget and

also making it a bit more exciting and i think you know like like deliciously ella for example has made eating more vegetables more exciting um and it's no longer you know a limp salad that people kind of dread. Ella hates lettuce. I hate lettuce, my secret admission. I hate lettuce and I hate crudités, which I feel like is surprising. I think it's worth also pointing out that Hazel, you are the busiest person. I mean, you're still a best-selling author.

You're doing your master's in clinical nutrition. At the moment, you do shifts at the hospital you're a personal trainer I mean you are you're a pretty busy lady and you know you do long shifts at the hospital so I think it's important to kind of give within context and then I'm always saying you're doing your overnight oats and things like that so you are kind of a pro it feels like for fitting that all in yeah and I think that's that lends itself to the success of the food medic because people see like even when I was a student they were like oh actually she can do it and she's incredibly busy so I can do it too and I think everything you said there is really important so cooking from scratch where possible as much as you can and also buying in bulk or cooking in

bulk and things like that and I think we can break it up really into like what's in your kitchen, but also what habits you can build. So like, for example, like my overnight oats or cooking like a chili or the bolognese that we made together. Those are things that you can make bulk cook. You know, you make about four to six portions in one kind of pot. You can portion that out for like your lunches and your dinners. And it's easy and it's quite cheap as well. And it lasts long in the fridge, particularly if you're

cooking with just plants. And then overnight oats are a really good example. You can make it the night before and then you just pick it up in the morning. And it really does take two minutes, right? Absolutely. And if you've got time, then you can make warm oats or it's like little things like that, or just get some yogurt, put it in a bowl some granola and some some fruit like it doesn't have to be fancy it doesn't have to take a long time but if you have a couple of things in your back pocket that you can pull out like I know that for you know I can make my chickpea curry in like 10 minutes so if I get home tell us about your chickpea curry what's in it um so chickpeas obviously and then I like using carrots in my curry um and like a pepper so I'll use that I'll use coconut milk and curry

powder and it's really just that maybe a bit of turmeric whatever I have if I don't have carrots I'll chuck in peas from the freezer you know like having I know the kind of basis of my curry, so I can experiment. But what I say to people is when I first started uni, when I was 18, 19 years of age, I didn't cook. I didn't really know how to cook. I knew how to cook things that my mum taught me, like maybe an omelette, an apple crumble, but I couldn't cook, you know, day-to-day meals. Your everyday meals. So I started from scratch. And that's what I say to people.

You can and like you don't have to be a Michelin star chef. Cooking can be terrifying for people. I think, you know, and some people don't enjoy it. And I forget that. I forget that actually some people hate spending time in the kitchen. I personally love it. And I know you do too. So it's just kind of like...

Matt hates it. I like, yeah, I like sitting there eating it but I'm not much of a cook I must admit yeah but for people like you it's having really simple recipes that you don't have to spend a half even a half an hour it's 20 minutes um 15 minutes whatever it takes to just make something that's quite nutritious and actually it's such a good cycle cooking at home it does it just creates such a great cycle. Cooking at home, it does. It just creates such a great cycle. It means that you spend time together. You're probably eating better food for you. You probably eat less food than you do when you go out. And then you sit around and you actually properly spend real time together.

And it just creates this positive cycle. And as Ella alluded to earlier, it's just been this common thread throughout everything. And all the people we've talked to on our podcast so far has just been spending time at home, cooking, about the best thing that you can do for yourself, particularly if it's with more plants. Yeah, that's so grounding as well. Like it's so calming to spend that time just not rushing. And I think to add to that is also don't be afraid to take shortcuts. So like if you do need to, you know, buy the microwavable packs of lentils or, you know, use frozen fruits and vegetables,

they actually can be more nutritious than the ones you get on the shelves. Don't be afraid of tinned vegetables as well. You know, like I think we kind of demonize processed foods, but there's such a spectrum of processed foods, you know, like a Twinkies at one end and then like chopped carrot batons are at the other. it doesn't take a you know a scientist to figure out you know which one is is going to be bad for your health yeah absolutely in the grand scheme of

things yeah I think it's a really nice way of putting it because it's been a common thread as well this idea that it's not about shooting for perfection and as you said like it's about making small improvements or like little changes rather than the sense of and that's also taps into that social media idea that I think sometimes we see stuff online and we're like it has to be perfect you know the idea that like every bowl has to be so beautifully put together and curated and you know I'm sure I can say definitely for me like yes that's what we share online a lot to inspire people because it looks delicious and you eat with your eyes.

When you're eating breakfast at 5.30 in the morning before a busy day, like you don't lay it out like an Instagram picture. You don't either, right? No, definitely not. That's not what people at home should be feeling they have to do. Like everything isn't picture perfect. Yeah. So broad question, but NHS waiting lists are at a 10-year high. Where does this break?

When does it, at what point? Can you see an event happening or something happening where suddenly the system breaks and it's too late and we can't do it anymore? Or do you feel like this is just something that can, even if it's not ideal, just keep rumbling on? Or is there a break point in this? I think it's breaking from working within the NHS. I see the struggles firsthand. I see, you know, the queues in A&E.

I see the understaffing. But I see a huge, huge group, a very passionate community of doctors and nurses and all the healthcare professionals who work in the hospital who work to the bone to see that people are well and I think that's what keeps the NHS running is that like spirit behind it and like I grew up in Ireland where we have like a private healthcare system and I just think we're incredibly lucky to have the NHS here and we don't fully realize that sometimes but I do think that the way that things are going we're struggling but that's the same with every health care system across the world because

we have this kind of pandemic of chronic diseases that we aren't well equipped for for catering for but the world health organization is now labeled obesity a global epidemic. So is this different to any other epidemics we've faced before? Is this something that is actually going to make the system break? Or is this something that we can just kind of continue to navigate and manage as we go and be reactive to rather than the proactive nature of what we're talking about today? Well, it's's true there's two billion people worldwide who are overweight or obese but in tandem to that there's 800 million people who are um hungry so who go to bed hungry so we have this kind of um and as we learned about in our in our last podcast about 25 of the world's food waste um could feed all of those 800 million people, which is quite something.

I know it's really sad, but that's the reality. We have this double burden of malnutrition happening in tandem. So, you know, malnutrition is not just, you know, kids starving in Africa. It's obesity. It's also vitamin and mineral deficiencies. And also, you see that happening in the same households where you have children who are stunted because they're not getting enough nutrients, but then you can have parents who are overweight, or you could have a mom who's underweight and iron deficient. So we're just, you know, I think it's one in two people

across the world is malnourished in some way. So we're not doing very well when it comes to that. And I do think, you know, the NHS has a part to play in that, but I don't know if the answer is in secondary care. So within the hospitals, I think the answer lies within communities and primary care. So GP practices, I personally think is a way forward. And it's definitely there's movement happening, you know, this lifestyle medicine movement that we touched on. Will you give that a definition for us? Yeah, there's not really a definition for it. But what it is, essentially, is this kind of term that's been coined that looks at the different elements in our life that we can change to improve

our health. And that includes, but is not exclusive to diet, exercise, sleep, stress management, and really community. So relationships, they're the five kind of key areas. And there's a movement happening in the UK and also across the world amongst doctors who are interested in this field because they're clocking on to the fact that we can't fix everyone with pills and surgery. They 100% play a part, but they are not the be all and end all. And so we need to change the medical school curriculum. We need to change our mindset when it comes to treating conditions and see, hey, what can we do before this all becomes too much of a problem? And that's what I think will be the turning point when it comes to saving our health care system. Because if we have doctors who are at the forefront of health care and also are seeing these people come through the doors when they're at the very beginning, like my dad, who had just been diagnosed with high blood pressure. If they could sit those people down and say, you know what, you have

high blood pressure, it's creeping up, your blood sugars are creeping up also, but we're at a point where we don't need to prescribe medication just yet. And actually, if we give you six weeks, we're going to work on your diet, we're going to get you moving. You know, if there was a health coach or like a healthcare practitioner who was assigned to that in every GP practice, that was their kind of job and they were paid a salary for that. And they could work with those types of patients to almost motivate them and give them advice on what they can do. Then we may not have to go to medication or we may be able to reduce the amount of medication we're using. And that's the only way I feasibly see the way forward is going to be. So I think it's important that with this, this isn't about shaming anyone

or it's about hopefully just making small incremental changes that can hopefully make people's lives just slightly better and slightly healthier. What are the three things, if you were to provide something that works pretty generally, what are the three things that you would say are the best things you can do for your health, whether that be on a daily basis or if you're just looking over the course of a week? Yeah, that's, it's such an interesting question. but um and i think you have to meet the person where they're at so for like you and ella i know that you're getting your five a day but it might be that you're not getting enough sleep at night um or it might be that you're i'm sure you are but that you're not exercising enough so it really depends on the person

whereas sometimes for us i mean i think people look particularly to Ella as this, you know, does everything right. And it's not the case. It's not realistic. No, not at all. We were saying this week, like we've had this month, it's just been crazy busy. We've been traveling loads with the book tour and things like that. And like, you don't get, I can't figure out how to fit exercise in. And you're eating on the go and you're making the best of it.

And it's not, no one has this kind of completely you know perfect way of doing things all the time and I feel like that's where also things go wrong is you think that you're failing or if you're not doing it perfectly and it's not it's just about doing your best it's just about doing these little things just slightly better and if you do them they really add up yeah absolutely so just going back to the lifestyle kind of medicine, I guess, areas that we mentioned, like diet, exercise, sleep, stress management and your community. And I would say look at those five key areas and think to yourself, where do I feel like I'm just not doing great? There might be one that you're nailing. There might be just one that, you know, you're really struggling with. And that could be like exercise, you might have a desk job, and like, you're not really moving at all between going from the tube

to work or whatever it is. If that's the area that you feel like you could do the biggest improvement, focus on that area, and then move on to another area. So that could be, you know, if you're meeting 5000 steps a week, i think steps like i'm just using steps as an example i don't think it's the be all and end all but it's a good um target for people so say you're meeting 5 000 steps can you get that to 10 000 steps this week and then maybe can you add in a walk on the weekend and it's not just about moving more it's also about sitting less so if you are sitting down all day think about getting getting up and moving, you know, like drink loads of water so you have to keep going to the toilet. But just make movement, like have your phone calls on a walk, take your meetings for a walk.

Like instead of sitting down and having a coffee, grab a coffee to go and like go for a walk. It's about doing those little things. And I don't think people fully realize that actually, I think we throw around the phrase all the time, like get off the tubes two stops earlier and like take the stairs. But those things actually add up, like they make a difference. So I would say focus on the areas that you feel you fall down. If that's diet, then maybe like, can you try to nail five a day for this week? If you can get more in, incredible. Like it it really really depends because again like I always have to bring myself back to when I'm working in the NHS when some people can't meet one a day and I'm like okay so let's do you know let's get to two a day so it really depends on

where you are at and also baby steps right like the idea the idea is not to listen to this and be like the time is now I'm changing everything Right now I will meditate 20 minutes a day and I'll exercise half an hour a day and I'll walk 10,000 steps and I will get up every hour and, you know, drink all my water so I have to pee and I keep moving. And like, you know, the list is so long and that's scary and kind of overwhelming. But this is like, look at one thing, look at another thing over a year, two years, like over a year two years like over a lifetime that's the thing like and I'm you know like no one who starts on a health journey you know gets it done in a week it takes years like I feel like I really took control of my health seven six seven years ago and that's been such a slow process and like even when it comes to my fitness levels like I wasn't able to like lift the babiest weights. Whereas now like I lift weight with a passion.

I've competed in weightlifting. It's, you know, I never thought I'd be that person, but it took me years to get there. And it takes years to get anywhere. Like it takes years to study a degree, to build a business, anything. Totally. We were talking about that on our third episode.

It was about building a business and that idea that we all look at things and we think everyone's an overnight success. And someone would see you in the gym lifting your massive weights and think, hey, that's an overnight success. And actually, that's... Well, she's just thing as an overnight success. Or a shortcut. Exactly, or a shortcut. You just got to do all the little things repeatedly. And if you do the little things, the 1%, just do them slightly better than eventually, over a long period of time, that'll eventually add up. I think so.

And give yourself a break. Like you said, I don't think balance is like trying to squeeze everything into your day, like the gym cooking meditation catching up with friends yoga like doing everything's just going to stress you out and stress your body out and you're just going to put yourself back to where you started like just do it in a stepwise fashion give yourself a break if you didn't make the gym today don't don't kill yourself just you know tomorrow's a new day like it's just taking it time by time i think yeah i

think if there is a part of your life where of those five pillars that you talked about that you're falling short on find a way of really enjoying it to get into it so whether if you're not eating enough vegetables find some recipes or someone who that you follow that you really really like and go cook some of their recipes or if you find that you're not walking enough find a podcast to listen to find it for you yeah exactly listen to our next episode on your walk um or find a friend's dog to walk or something so you go to the park and you can yeah walk austin for us you can actually do that you can like yeah borrow my dog yeah he's so naughty you don't want to finding positive ways of the bits where you're not doing so well on,

just finding positive ways of... Fun ways. Yeah, and fun ways of doing them. It seems to be like such a great way of going around it. Yeah, I agree. So Hazel, we always wrap up with one question that we ask every guest, and that is, what's the one practice or mantra that you live by every day to something you come back to continuously

that just helps you kind of create a happier life? I think something you come back to continuously that just helps you kind of create a happier life? I think I always come back to the mantra like and this has stuck with me like since I was like really young and that is failure is not final I don't I feel like I'm the most imperfect person but I've somehow carved this career or this life that is almost like my vocation something I'm incredibly passionate about and I wouldn't have gotten here I wouldn't be I wouldn't have built the food medic or be a doctor if it wasn't because of all the little failures or they weren't really failures but I looked at them as failures the bumps in the road and I think that's what got me to where I am today

so always think about like if something doesn't work out it's not the end of the world I love that fantastic thank you so so much honestly Haz hazel can't thank you enough and if anyone has enjoyed the podcast please do um rate it review it means the world to us and we'll be back next tuesday thank you guys so much thanks guys you're a podcast listener and this is a podcast ad heard only in Canada. Reach great Canadian listeners like yourself with podcast advertising from Libsyn Ads. Choose from hundreds of top podcasts offering host endorsements or run a pre-produced ad like this one across thousands of shows to reach your target audience with Libsyn Ads. Email bob at libsyn.com to learn more. That's b-o-b at l-i-b-s-y-n dot com.