The Wellness Scoop - Ozempic, The Size Zero Comeback & (More) Protein Hype

Episode Date: March 10, 2025

Are we heading back to the size zero era? With Hollywood’s red carpets filled with ultra-thin bodies, speculation about weight-loss drugs like Ozempic is everywhere. As the conversation around health shifts back to extreme weight loss, we examine the impact of Ozempic-fueled diet culture and the resurgence of toxic beauty standards. Protein obsession isn’t slowing down—from powders to high-protein snacks, demand is booming. But do we really need more? We break down the science, the hidden risks in protein powders, and whether meat snacks are a gym-goer’s dream or just another processed food trap. Stress isn’t just in your head—it’s in your body. Hair loss, gut issues, and unexplained breakouts could all be signs of silent stress. We reveal seven warning signals of chronic stress and the small, science-backed ways to break the cycle before it takes a toll. Plus, nature vs. nurture—how much of our health is genetics versus lifestyle? A major new study suggests we have far more control over our long-term well-being than we think. Recommendations This Week Saliha Mahmood-Ahmed’s new book: The 20-Minute Gut Health Fix (@salihacooks) Rhi’s music pick: Ludovico Einaudi Jamelia: The Dark Side of Being A SUPERSTAR on We Need To Talk with Paul C. Brunson Learn more about your ad choices. Visit podcastchoices.com/adchoices

The truth is, no one does it alone. And why would you want to? We all need someone to make us believe. Hashtag, you got this. The wait is over. The NBA season is here and FanDuel is the place to bet on all the action. I'm talking everything from

point spreads to money lines to player props. You can even pick who's going to win it all. Whether you're betting on a breakout performance or an underdog victory, tip off the season right with North America's number one sportsbook. Just download the app and bet on the NBA all season long. Please play responsibly. 19 plus and physically located in Ontario. If you have questions or concerns about your gambling or the gambling of someone close

to you, please go to connectsontario.ca. Welcome to The Wellness Scoop, your weekly dose of health and wellness inspiration, and we are your hosts. I'm Ella Males. And I'm Rhiannon Lambert, and after a decade in the wellness industry, we know how overwhelming and confusing health advice can be.

So that's why we've created this podcast to cut through the noise and make healthier living simple, fun and personal. And the sun is shining. It's been shining all week. It kind of feels pretty glorious, doesn't it? I cannot even tell you. Now we're so British. Can we just say to anyone listening abroad in the UK, when you get consistent sunshine, I don't just mean like a day. I mean, it has to be two or three days in a row,

your mood is just 10 times better. We see a lot of gray. We see a lot of gray. This is day four of sunshine, and I feel like you can feel the whole country's spirits lifting. Yeah, every morning is so much better. Like any task is way more manageable when I'm happy

and the sun is shining through the windows. And also we've got a big week. We've got a big week and it's International Women's Day this week. I know most of our listeners are women. Everyone's obviously so welcome here, but just wanting to give a massive shout out,

pat on the back. Congratulations to all of you because I feel like everyone listening, really myself, I think we can all say it, like everyone's doing their best and I think we should all be really proud of ourselves. And International Women's Day is always a nice moment for reflection.

A thousand percent Ella because we've had so many lovely comments as well from you and we're loving the community, the support, the fact that you are actually actively giving us ideas every week. We're so grateful. Ella do you want to read that comment that we've got here it's so nice. I was just thinking exactly that Ria. I think there's something, it's definitely what I'm enjoying most about the show is this sense of community that we're building and togetherness. So if anyone's new, welcome to the community, welcome to the show. This is exactly how I hope you feel at the end of it. This lovely listener said, I'm loving your podcast. It literally makes my Monday morning. Thank you. Staying motivated to keep on eating healthy

as well as not getting too overwhelmed by perfectionism is my struggle so it feels like I have two new mates who have my back and that is exactly what we want to do. We want to inspire you to keep up healthy habits but not being overwhelmed by doing it all, feeling like you have to be perfect because perfect is an illusion. No one's perfect, it's impossible. This is exactly it and it's such a pleasure for us to bring the headlines every week to dissect everything and talking of community, we are going to deliver something very special in person. So Ella, we've got to save the date for the calendars, haven't we?

We do. Save the date in your diaries, June the 14th. We are going to be doing the Wellness Scoop Live. Woohoo! It's going to be a big live show. It's going to be in central show. It's gonna be in central London. It'll be amazing. Tickets will be available at the end of this month

and we are so excited and it coincides with Ree's new book. Which by the way, I thought I'd have finished writing by now. I just found one more study last week to chuck in. So it's going to be a really good live show. We're gonna have the latest up-to-date headlines, facts, studies, and we're going to get to meet you all. I know. We're so excited.

So June the 14th, save the date. This is going to be amazing. But Reed, tell us, what do we got coming up in today's show? Oh, it's such a meaty show. We have the return of size zero. So why Hollywood's red carpets are looking ultra thin again and what it means for body image. We also have protein powders. Are they

actually beneficial or just another wellness marketing trap? Plus what to look for and the hidden risks you need to know. The rise of meat snacks, so why they're booming in popularity and the hidden health risks that nobody's talking about. The seven physical signs of stress you shouldn't ignore. Now I'm really looking forward to delving into that one with Ella because how burnout shows up in our bodies is obviously unique to us and what we can do about it. Then we have nature versus nurture, always a good one. How much of your health is really in your control? A major new study breaks it down. And the power

of nuts and seeds. Why they're one of the simplest and tastiest ways to boost brain health, heart health and longevity. Before we get started, how are you? What have you been up to this week? Well, we've mentioned the sun, obviously, big factor of my week. It just makes such difference and I'm trying to be an earth hero more with my son so on days when I don't have to catch a train into London I can afford to walk to school and nursery drop and I've been loving it because I take the pram my littlest is only two and a half so he wouldn't quite make the walk around the whole block so we do that

with the pram and it's made such a difference to my mood. Like I said, another study came out last week, which I had to tell the publishers we have to put it in the book because it's really, really interesting when it comes to emulsifiers and the link on gut health again. Any spoilers you can give us? Oh, for wellness scoop listeners, always something tiny, but it's not looking positive for ultra processed foods at the moment is what I will say. and I break it all down in the unprocessed plates. So obviously you can pre-order that, but we'll chat through in the live show, Ella, because... We will, that's going to be a big component.

We're going to be deep diving into Ree's new book on ultra-processed food. Obviously, as you said, it's evolving all the time. As per this new study that's just come out in emulsifiers, it's not looking good, but it's also incredibly overwhelming. It's incredibly overwhelming and I do feel like talking of overwhelming, February for me Ella was just mad. The first quarter of the year as a nutritionist is always insane because all the fad diets start in January, all the events of wellness events kick off from January to February.

And to be honest, I'm relieved now that I'm kind of back to being a normal football mom on the side of the pitch and then trying to juggle my working hours and loving the podcast. January is funny though, isn't it? Like we see this every year, kind of from say like early to mid November, we lose all relevance, just no one cares. It's really sad. It's the same story over here. It's tumbleweeds. And then around the kind of 27th of December, boom, we couldn't be more popular for about three or four weeks. And it feels like everything we do, people are engaging with. And it's such a cliche, the first of January. But I have to say, 13 years into Delicious Ciela, it's true every single year.

And if that is you who thinks, I'm going to change everything on the 1st of January, I hope you go easy on yourself. And instead of feeling you have to change everything on the 1st of January, how about changing a couple of small things slowly? I think that's really good advice. It's a great time to make changes. But let's be realistic. Ella, I'm sure you're all book as well. What is going on?

I am all book as well. I think that's the best way to sum me up at the moment. I am on quite a tight deadline for my next cookbook and I feel like I'm working at double speed, triple speed, probably should be quadruple speed on it. And so I'm trying to feed everybody I know, get rid of an extraordinary amount of food. Because you have to test stuff kind of three or four times. And because it's quite a tight deadline, that's often in a row. And so obviously, by the time you've

made the same recipe four times in 24 hours, your desire to eat it, let's be honest, is quite slim. You feel over that recipe once you've had it for breakfast, lunch and dinner. And so yes, anyone I know, I'm like, would you like to take this away with you? Yeah, and it's exhausting because when you're in the kitchen recipe testing, you're on your feet all day, you're by the hot oven. This must be how chefs feel when they're working in a kitchen.

Amazing. And it's just the smallest things, you know, when you're cooking a recipe, 10 extra mils of liquid, for example, you're trying it without that. What happens if you do it 10 degrees hotter in the oven, etc. So it becomes all about the details, but they're obviously critical to whether the recipe is great or whether the recipe is okay. And obviously I want everything that we deliver to be absolutely great. So, yes, I am super, super deep into recipes. And then whenever my husband or my kids say,

I want this for dinner, I'm like, well, you're not having it. You're not having what's on my testing list. And that's about it. But it's fun and I'm excited. We're gonna start shooting it the end of April into May. So that's all to come. Crack it in before the Easter holidays.

Well, yeah, hopefully. But have you got any recommendations for us? Ella, yes, I do. But I do want to touch on something, if you're happy with it, that you had the most incredible feature in the Times. And I think you should be proud of it, because we are going to own it.

You are doing an amazing job. And how incredible is it to be front page of the Times feature? It's really surreal. Honestly, I went and got a copy of the paper with May, my youngest, and I was in the newsagents by her nursery and I was like, sweetheart, who's that in the corner of the front page of that whole paper and like this massive picture? And she was like, that's my mummy. I thought, that is quite odd, isn't it? And it does, it feels surreal and I feel incredibly lucky.

And actually, I was really, I get very nervous to read interviews back, and I often get Matt, my husband, to read them first and say, is that okay, is that okay? Because you never really know. But as you said, in the spirit of owning it and being more confident, I am a big believer in that. And we were kind of swapping notes on this yesterday, but I definitely had a moment sort of around 2020,

yes, exactly, the beginning of COVID, where I stopped for the first time since I started my career. And to be honest, I'd had a lot of trolling, a lot of criticism, it's part of the job, again, as you and I were talking about yesterday. But obviously, once my kids were born It's quite a big decision to kind of put yourself out there in the world

I certainly felt more at that point and also All the time I was spending away from them and things that I was missing and milestones to be honest I wasn't there for particularly when they were younger and I really reflected on it and I thought is it is it worth it? And do I really want this for my life and actually, or am I just sick of being criticized for trying to get people to eat healthily? And as I said at the top of this episode, you know, you guys probably don't think that much about sending us a message saying you enjoyed that episode, but it means everything. It honestly, it doesn't it,

it makes our jobs so worthwhile. We had a really lovely, just to echo what you just said, I read the reviews, you know, the Spotify reviews, I think it was one on there. And they said, I really appreciate Ella and Rhiannon putting themselves out there because they're mothers with young children. It is hard to have an opinion. And I really valued that comment. I was like, thank you so much, because it is nerve wracking. It does put you on edge. So Ella, it was fantastic. Thank you. But yeah, that was my big decision. I was like, you know what, if it does help people and my work and now our work together in this show, like if this genuinely helps people, like the message, you know, people find that right balance between eating well

but not putting too much pressure on themselves, then it is so worth it and the trolling is so worth it. So it was really nice to have a conversation. The trolling is so worth it and the trolling is so worth it. So it was really nice to have a conversation. The trolling is so worth it. The trolling is so worth it. To help you, the trolling is so worth it. It's such a great byproduct and I'm happy to accept it. But it was really nice to have an interview to talk about what we are so passionate about. And we don't get much trolling actually.

I'd say the feedback is just overwhelmingly positive. It is. But this idea that kind of we need to bring a bit more sanity to wellness to get that message across, it was great. So yeah, I was really pleased with that actually. Well done you. So our recommendations this week, I'll start by saying the first one is an amazing cookbook. And I wanted to just mention this because I think she won MasterChef as well.

Dr. Salia, is it Mahmood Ahmed? She is incredible and her Instagram is Salia Cooks. And I just love the look of all the food like she's got so many amazing flavors that are good for gut health. She utilizes you know herbs and spices and pulls in obviously different cultural inspirations and I just thought her new book looked amazing so that would be my first recommendation and then number two is music. Now you know I'm ex-soprano, so music for me is a big deal. But if you really want to relax at home,

I cannot recommend Ion Aldi enough. And I know that Ion Aldi is a really, really well-known and respected composer now. And I remember listening to him years and years ago. And I think he's even had an episode on Fern Cotten's Happy Place because he's just such a huge figure now. But I cannot recommend enough listening to his compositions while you're cooking. Obviously listen to the Wellness Scoop but also...

Once you finish the episode. Once you finish put on some Iron Audi. It's really chilled. And then for a different perspective and I think this is really interesting. I listened to Paul Brunson's We Need to Talk podcast and he's the guy from First Dates, that TV show, he's got the most soothing kind of cool voice but he had the pop star Jamelia on and she did that song years and years ago for anyone listening that knows, superstar I'm not gonna sing it but do you know what I mean?

I was like, no I'm not gonna sing as a song! I'm not gonna come out with a song! But honestly, and she talks about the fact that at the height of her fame, when everything looked like perfect, behind the scenes she had her brothers in jail, relationship breakdowns at home, she was in an abusive relationship, she just wanted to be a mum to her, I think she's now got four children, she fostered her brother's kids, she was going through so much and she was asked the question by him, if you could choose again to take that career with you and she said no. And I was just blown away because when you're growing up and you look at these people that are, you know, Sabrina Carpenter performing at the

Brits or you know, you look at these big names for me, it was Britney Spears and you know, Sabrina Carpenter performing at the Brits or, you know, you look at these big names, for me it was Britney Spears and, you know, back in the day and actually The Grass is Not Greener and I thought it was really interesting and such a wonderful, honest, raw, brave interview that she'd done so give it a listen. That sounds like such a great recommendation on Britney Spears there was that brilliant series wasn't there that Pandora Sykes did? High Life. Six months ago or so, last year, if you haven't listened to it, it's amazing. It wasn't, unfortunately, an interview with Britney, but I think it was summarised in the same point, is that so often we look at other people, and obviously social media amplifies

this to the kind of most extraordinary degree, and we think their life is perfect, and so often the reality is so completely different and it's really interesting when people then able to reflect back on that to get that perspective. Absolutely. So yeah, definitely good to give it a listen just to put everything into perspective and Ella, what recommendations do you have? Do you know what? I'm quite short on recommendations this week so thanks for bringing three.

No, go for it. What do you have? No, I've started watching The New White Lotus, which I think other people generally are saying they're not enjoying as much as the other two seasons, but I am obsessed. I'm living for it on a countdown for Mondays. I haven't started yet.

It's the one with the really famous actress that I love, cannot get enough of. Is she in it, the blonde one, with the amazing like, ooh-shoe-shoe-shoe kind of voice. Do you know what I mean? Like, what's her name? What's her name?

Jennifer Coogan, Jennifer? Oh no, she's not back in this season. Oh. But it's, she was so fab before, but no, it's so good. I'm loving it. Set in Thailand, we were in Thailand over Christmas. I'm like really, reliving it.

But no, it was just absolutely amazing. And I'm currently obsessed with facial massage as well. Thea Sha thing it's all I see on my Instagram algorithm at the moment which is obviously quite positive for you feed but just five minutes in the morning. Can you send it to me because I want to get into this habit? Who knows it makes any difference to how you look but there's something about that active self-care that I think is so powerful it's why I really believe in any semblance of a morning routine. I think it's setting a tone for your day.

When you wake up in the morning, be that five minutes meditation, be that a quiet coffee, be that making yourself a healthy breakfast, five minutes of facial massage, whatever it is that resonates with you. I think there is something about getting up in the morning and saying to yourself, I care about you, and I'm gonna look after you today,

and I'm gonna do my best. Yeah, I yourself, I care about you. Yeah. And I'm going to look after you today and I'm going to do my best. Yeah. I know. I think that's fantastic. And when we started recording this podcast, I made a conscious effort and I now get up 15 to 20 minutes before the kids, which for me is a big deal because Ella, my goodness, do I need probably more sleep than the average person? And I make it, I get up in the morning and it means I actually have time to sit, to have

a shower. Then I get into bed with my elders and have a cuddle before, you know, I can wake him up nicely rather than being in a rush. Yeah. Even that is life changing. That's it, small habits, they add up, they change your life. So let's move on to the headlines for this week.

Okay, so the first headline, it's kind of my big fear because I feel like I have always been very stressed out Ella as an individual. I think because I'm always doing, I'm a doer and I know that my coping strategy with life is to throw myself into work. Ever since I was a teenager that's what I've kind of done to make it through into the singing industry, the music industry, motherhood and now as as a result, I have breathing pattern disorder. So it's when you get intermittent feelings that you can't breathe quite a lot,

like frequently every day and you're like, am I getting a full breath? I can't quite do it. Apparently it's a thing. It took me ages to get diagnosed with this. I had lung scans, I had everything over the past two years. And finally I got the answer, which was really reassuring.

But the headline today from the Telegraph is, is stress silently affecting your body? So Ella, do you want to kick off this headline, the fact that it's so important because stress is obviously key to how we age, how we live well? Yeah, and thank you so much for that vulnerability there because I think it's, as we said at the top,

not always easy, but it's so important. What you see isn't always the full picture. It's the beauty of podcasts, I think, because you get nuance. And chronic stress is such a challenge, but just like it is for you, it has been for me. I mean, it has been for so many of us, but it can be very, very invisible. And you sent me this. It was from the Telegraph, wasn't it?

This is stress silently affecting your body. And I think it's so powerful because so much of what we talk about in wellness, whether you're exercising or not, whether you're eating your five a day or not, it's quite obvious. And actually that chronic stress isn't normally as obvious. You all probably know this, but just kind of a top line

is that chronic stress does come with its own set of problems. And as we said, they can go quite unnoticed for a while until they become serious and they're easy to kind of put to one side in favor of hustle culture. But when you're stressed, your body can go into fight or flight mode, which is a very evolutionary response designed

to keep you safe. Your sympathetic nervous system kicks in and it floods your body with stress hormones like cortisol and adrenaline. In short bursts, this is normal, you know, there's nothing to be worried about. But when it becomes this long-term chronic state where ultimately you're essentially sitting in stress most of the time, that is what can wreak havoc on your health. And obviously, again, some stress is totally unavoidable, but how we manage that chronic stress, that's what's so important. And choosing to actively close that stress cycle, whether that's deep breathing, meditation,

movement, mindful hobbies, you know, something as simple as just stepping away, you need to do things that activate your parasympathetic, your rest and digest nervous system. But what was interesting is these seven signs of the chronic stress and Rhi, will you talk us through them? Absolutely, because I can really, I only had the first one last week. Eye twitches, that annoying blink you can't control. You know when you're with people

and you're like, I've got an eye twitch, can you see it? And often they're like, no, it's really, but you are so aware of it when you've got this going on. And if you've ever had that tiny persistent twitch in your eyelid that just won't stop, this is because stress hormones can over-stimulate your nervous system. So it causes those tiny muscle spasms, especially when paired with a lack of sleep or too much caffeine,

which is what I think most people in this country probably have a lack of sleep and too much caffeine. I wish we could do like a hands up as we're going through these like hands up. Listen, if you've had that one, I've had eye twitches definitely. We'll do it on the live show we'll do a whole stress meter. Yeah exactly. Who's stressed today? We'll measure. We're all in it together guys. Okay what's number two? Number two this was really interesting the mystery of tinnitus so that ringing in your ears. If you've ever experienced an unexplained ringing buzzing or humming sound in your ears, it could be stress.

So stress heightens sensory perception, which makes your brain more sensitive to normal bodily sounds, which I had no idea. And it also explains the hypervigilance in terms of this heightened sensory perception. I know for me, chronic stress, the biggest challenge I had was this sense of hypervigilance, which essentially manifests as like never-ending anxiety where you're suddenly, anything that could possibly be perceived as a danger becomes terrifying. I've talked about it before, like lifts, you know, suddenly a lift is terrifying, you're going to get stuck in a lift

or the lift's going to fall down the lift shaft and you're definitely going to die. Stand back from the lift, kids, every time I get near a lift. Exactly. But it's, it is that heightened perception that becomes yeah can quite overwhelming. Yeah and the next one as well which I think everybody listening I would say everyone listening has probably experienced this in some shape or form because we see it in the clinic all the time I know I have stomach pains and gut woes because that gnawing stomach pain you know bloating and issues, it's not just what you eat when we discuss gut health,

it's exactly the fact that your brain is linked and it's got this lovely feedback loop. So stress can disrupt your digestion and even trigger IBS. So Irritable Bile Syndrome, anything that brings blood flow away from your stomach means you're not digesting well. And this happens to us all when we get nervous. You know, at school, if you look back when we were doing GCSEs or are they even called GCSEs now?

I think so. Are they still there? It's good. You know exam names change like oh my up to date. Yeah I'm sure we all felt something like that when we were doing exams. And there's a lot of research isn't there to show that managing stress can be almost as helpful in managing IBS as looking at diet, which I think again is not something to the point we were making at the top of this, like it's so easy with stress to kind of ignore it, say it's normal, move on from it and not necessarily put things in place to

actively try and manage it, hard as that can be, but actually something like doing active breathing, meditation, things that really get you into a mindful state can be so powerful for supporting your good gut health. Just stopping 80% lifestyle symptoms. And then the next one is cold sores. So assign your immune systems down. So if you're someone that's prone to cold sores, you'll probably notice that they flare up when you're under pressure.

And that's because stress weakens our immune system, which allows that herpes simplex virus to reactivate. So I know that that's really common because I remember speaking to Dr. Philippa Kay about cold sores and it's something she used to see in her GP clinic all the time. And then the next one, hair loss. So it's a delayed stress reaction. So have you ever noticed that your hair in your brush

or shower drain is more than usual? And it's because stress can trigger a condition called, and I hope I say this correctly, Telogen effluvium? Effluvium. Effluvium, sounding like a Harry Potter spy. I was thinking the same thing. But no, while I laugh, it is obviously serious

and where hair prematurely shifts into a resting phase, which does cause shedding. So sometimes, again, it's not taking a supplement that's going to heal this, it's stress. That's such an important point as we talk about every week, all these trends and these kind of quick fixes and the idea that they can solve all our problems and they'll give us glowing skin and bouncy hair and no bloating etc. But if you're chronically stressed, you're not looking after yourself, you're not moving your body, you're not eating your five a day etc. etc. Those quick fixes, those supplements, they just can't do anything.

Like you're just wasting your money, go back to the root. I know and it's really hard because how do you identify your stress which is why we're discussing some of these symptoms but I think... And it's easier, look it's easier to take a supplement than it is to do things every day to actively manage stress like there's no two ways around that. Yeah because to manage stress you actually have to change something in your lifestyle actively so yeah to take a pill seems far more comfortable and the next one I remember a friend going through this, mouth ulcers, tiny sores, big discomfort so that that's also a stressed induced, you know, immune

suppression. So when your immune system's overworked, it can struggle to heal small injuries and wounds. And it does lead to things like ulcers more frequently. And the final symptom I've got here, Ella, is skin rashes or hives. Now this is fascinating because I don't know, have your kids ever had those viral rashes and things? Yeah. And sometimes I wonder, because children can't always tell you what's wrong. And they often say when a rash comes up,

they're fighting something. But for us as adults, our skin is a direct reflection of our internal state. And I often say this with gut health. But if you suddenly develop like an itchy rash or something or worsening eczema, then stress-induced inflammation might, I say might, because we're not GPs here, we're just discussing the headline but it might be the cause.

Exactly and as you said might comes into all of these, they're not exclusively linked to stress, of course they're not, but I just think it's this again to me this was such an important headline to reflect on this week because I think it's such a great example of how actually stress is one of the most, I think, biggest issues in the health and wellness world that we don't talk about enough in terms of what on earth can we do in our busy lives to try and manage stress and the temptation is to take a pill or to take a supplement sold to you online etc etc because it is so much simpler than getting to the bottom of it and I'm 100% one of those people that

I've had that, you know, I definitely had it last year and I was so overwhelmed and I wasn't actively managing my stress but I was thought, oh I'll take that supplement that will solve it. The ashwagandha. My ashwagandha and ultimately it's kind of absurd, you know, not to do anything to actively manage it but hope a pill takes it away. I mean, Ella, I've got breathing pattern disorder and I'm an ex-soprano, so I should know how to diaphragmatic breathe. And in nutritionists, and I think it just shows, you know, we all struggle with these things, but I think try and listen to your body and try to

actively manage your stress where you can. And as I said, again, it's really interesting when you look at the research, just five or 10 minutes of mindful breathing, for example, can make a huge difference is proven to really, really help manage stress. It doesn't need to be lengthy. We're not suggesting you quit your job and move to the middle of nowhere and kind of live a completely nomadic lifestyle. Like that's not feasible.

There's got to be small things that fit into your life. But if you are struggling, give them a try. Yeah, Ella's got a few here written down, which I think were really good. And it's obviously stepping away was one of them. So taking like even a five minute break can help reset your nervous system. I added fresh air because I read somewhere

that if you look at things in nature, and it's really hard when you're in the city, but looking at a tree or a plant, apparently they're things called fractiles, which instantly tap into your parasympathetic nervous system. Anyone listening, if you know anything on that, please let us know because I don't want to be just spreading misinformation on this podcast,

but I'm pretty sure that's a thing. And Ellie, you had some other ones on there, didn't you? Yeah, it's just, you know, deep breathing, meditation, breath work can be for some people, and that is proven to stimulate your parasympathetic nervous system, get you into that rest and digest state, but mindful hobbies do the same thing,

and that can be painting, it can be gardening, it can be journaling, it could be pottery. You know, there's so many different things, whatever works, you don't need to just sit and meditate, but you do need to do things that get your mind into that calm state of flow. So if something like that appeals to you, gardening is a double whammy,

because you also get the nature. That's so true. Do you know last night, because when you're putting two kids to bed, you have to kind of distract one at one point so you can manage the other. And I gave my eldest a colouring book with pencils and then once I'd put my youngest to bed, I really enjoyed spending five minutes colouring a load of ice creams on a page. Oh me too, mindful colouring. So lots of things you can do but just be aware of your stress and what an important foundation of your health it is. Let's do an extra scoop.

Definitely. I think there's about eight extra scoops in stress and the various different effects that it has. But that moves us on I think actually very nicely to our second headline which is the whole never-ending topic of nature versus nurture and what really shapes your health. Okay, so this is one of the biggest questions, I think, in health. I feel like it has been for a very long time how much of our well-being is determined by genetics, the way that we're born, things that are outside of our control, and how much is shaped by a lifestyle, our environment, things that sit more within our control. We often hear people say, oh, it's my genes, when they're talking about the risk of developing certain diseases. But there is a new study published in Nature Medicine, and it suggests

that our daily habits and surroundings have an infinitely bigger influence on our long-term health than our genetic makeup. Absolutely. And the research here was on nearly half a million again from Ella's Mum is part of this the UK Biobank the participants looking at 164 environmental factors and genetic components across 22 major diseases and the results showed that lifestyle and environmental factors account for about 17% of the risk of premature death while genetics contribute to just 2% so I think it really does go to show that things like smoking, of course, which alone is linked to 21 different diseases, or socioeconomic factors, which really are not fair, things like household income.

I think finances is such a big thing that is so stressful. Home ownership, employment status, these were all associated with 19 diseases. There really is so much isn't there Ella, stark findings that show that the exposure you've got maybe to pollution, what your body weight is at age 10 and whether a mother smoked during pregnancy which of course isn't recommended but can influence aging and disease risk 30 to 80 years later. So it's what you do across the course of your life, which we discuss on the wellness scoop,

and how that impacts that old lady that Jimmy led, Jemma, was speaking about in last week's episode. It is, and I think it's really staggering because it's not easy. And the impact of the socioeconomic factors is incredibly challenging. And obviously we were talking about

the broken plate report a couple of weeks ago. If you missed that episode, definitely go back and have a listen because it really highlights the discrepancy in health in this country. But it's very reflective of a lot of particularly the Western world where, in reality, choosing to eat healthily is just fundamentally too expensive now.

And there's too many people to whom it's completely not accessible, which is just wrong on every level especially when you look at what huge outcome it has on health but I think this is just a very interesting point the extent to which our day-to-day habits are actually playing into our risk factor for disease and premature death which much is that's a really difficult thing to talk about our lifestyle and environmental factors accounting for 17% and genetic components, just 2%.

It is a fundamental difference and it just shows how much is in our hands. And I'm not saying it's easy to take all that responsibility, as we were saying a second ago, it's much easier to want to take a pill than it is to actively manage stress, find time to exercise, bother to make a stir fry. Good sleep. Sometimes we don't always get it. No, but it's so worth trying. Yeah, agree. And there's a quote here that we've got from Dr. Stephen Burgess, the group leader at MRC Biostatistics Unit at the University of Cambridge. And he basically said,

genetics can load the dice, but it's up to us how we play our hand. I thought it was such an impactful quote. Genetics can load the dice, but it's up to us how we play our hand. I thought it was such an impactful quote. Genetics can load the dice, but it's up to us to play our hand. You know, actually, so much of our health sits within our hands. And I know that's not the easiest thing to hear. And when there are socioeconomic factors, particularly at play, I appreciate that's not something that everybody can change today. And we're not trying to overly simplify it.

But equally, I just think it's a powerful reminder that at the end of the day, you might think, oh, I can't be bothered to cook, but it's worth making the time and finding the time if you can. Keep the conversation going. I think the more we speak about it and maybe we can, you know, the happiness extra scoop we had about kind deeds for one another and supporting one another. If we can all become happier, maybe instilling these habits is just going to be a bit easier as well. But it takes a community, not just an emphasis on

an individual. And I think that's so important to, you know, discuss. It really is. And you know, there's so much around, you know, the sort of five people or so that you spend the most time with having such a fundamental impact on your life. And I think that comes to your health and wellness as well. If the people that you're spending the most time with are also invested in looking after themselves and those around them, it makes it a lot easier for you to make healthy choices.

I'm not saying to cut people out of your life, but I just think it's worth finding people who you're spending time with that are also really encouraging of, let's go for a walk together, let's cook a nice healthy dinner together, you together, colleagues that you can make lunch with, choose a healthy lunch with, support each other with. I do think it's worth actively trying to find those friends that help in a really positive way keep you accountable and you can swap tips

and tricks, ideas, recipes, et cetera. And this podcast, so say, little personal note, my dad, I encouraged him to listen because my dad won't mind me saying, he has sleep apnea because he's managing his weight at the moment and he wants to obviously look after himself more. And he said, I was listening to you both

and I decided to go out for a walk and have a listen to see what you're up to. And I was like, yes dad. A hot dad walk. Oh God, let's not go there. Let's not go there. This is so funny. Yeah, he'll laugh at this bit.

Sorry, dad, I shouldn't have brought you into the conversation. But yes, everyone, little moments to walk. But it does segue us on, doesn't it, to diet? To diet. And Rhi was part of a great piece this week on nuts and seeds. And I thought, please, can you just bring that with some to the Wellness Scoop listeners? Because again, it's just this nice reminder. We talked about walnuts last week and about how brain boosting they can be, obviously

packed with omega-3s, et cetera. But all nuts are actually so good for us. And just a nice example of taking the time to include these simple ingredients in granola, in snacks, in energy balls, salad toppers etc because they make the world of difference. They're small but they're mighty. And to make it accessible. So let me just tell a quick little story. I was doing a radio interview on the nuts feature before it came out at the weekend with someone from Times Radio. I finished the interview, I was talking about walnuts, I was talking about walnuts, I was talking about the walnut study,

and she said, oh, what about the salted versions of the nuts? I was like, well, obviously, no, this research is just on the plain nuts that's probably a bit high in salt, and she goes, oh, you're so bar-humbug. I said, oh, well, I'm just doing my job. As a nutritionist, I can't really tell everyone

to eat a load of salted, sugared nuts every single day. But that messaging, because obviously she's doing it as her job as a radio host to make it accessible and a bit humorous, but it doesn't help the wider message. It doesn't help encourage people still to eat nuts and seeds. I know it's shaking up this viewpoint that kind of health, wellbeing, etc. is boring and you're a bit of a loser for engaging in it. Yes, which basically made me feel like I was an absolute loser. I don't think you're a loser.

Thanks Ella, thanks. And to everyone listening, thank you. I've got a few tips. So here's a breakdown of some of the nuts. We discussed the omega-3 in walnuts last week and we know that that's important for supporting our memory and our brain health when consumed regularly is the caveat in the research here. So to get the benefit out of nuts and seeds, you kind of want to be mixing up a small portion each day

or frequently throughout the week. I mean, as Ella said, cooking tips there, chuck it in loads of things. So let's start with, do you say almond or almond? I say almond, but I think you say almond. I go almond. I know everyone's- So we're covering all bases for how our listeners like it.

I think it's because I used to work with this American Almond company. They'd be like, almonds, so we're here today. And I was just, it's always stuck in my head. But if you go for almonds, they're high in vitamin E and they support our skin health. And did you know that as much as they're linked to gut functionality, there's also some ongoing research

at the moment that hasn't come out and has tiny bits on wrinkle severity. So for anti-aging instead of collagen, if you have a handful of almonds a day, that might help with the appearance of wrinkles and fine lines. Ooh, love it. I know, I know. I didn't actually write that in the feature,

but ongoing, watch this space. Pecans contain antioxidants that support heart, brain, and immune health. Brazil nuts now, I think everyone, most people know they're a good source of selenium and they support thyroid function but they also support male fertility and all you need is three a day to get your whole day's worth, you know, three of those nuts a day and that's the entire allowance a day of selenium so it's definitely worth it. And then I think we're going to do an extra scoop on fertility aren't we but pistachios if we move on to my son's favorites they're a complete protein they've got all of those

nine essential amino acids in them and they're beneficial for eye health and immune support. It's just so nice because when you're out and about and you eat some almonds or there's some almonds in a recipe or on a salad for example you don't necessarily think that much of it but but then when you come back to this, you remember there's so much good stuff in these simple, simple, simple things. So pack them in, make yourself your own little homemade trail mix,

sprinkle it on salads, et cetera. Super delicious, crunchy, but packed with goodness. And what about some of our key seeds? Oh yeah, the seeds. So remember also, like Ella said, chuck the seeds on everything, mix them into porridge. I make porridge sometimes with chia seeds and flax seeds. Now I realise, and this is actually a message we had from one listener, that different tastes and textures can also be very difficult for some people, especially if you're a sen parent or you struggle

yourself with introducing new textures. So just a warning or a word of kind of we understand, we hear you and there are ways of getting these in that don't result in such a kind of grainy texture because you can really blend things down can't you Ella and you can mix them into pancake batters and things. Exactly. So there are ways of putting those in but chia seeds, classic, loaded with fiber and calcium, omega-3 is good for bone health. Sunflower seeds, love these, these are also really good for vitamin E and selenium. Again guys this is really good for your skin and things that are full of these what we

call antioxidants which help fight off free radicals in the body. Flax seeds which are high in the vegetarian omega so ALA we call it, alpha-linoic acid and they can help prevent diabetes and reduce LDL cholesterol levels. And then pumpkin seeds, high in protein and zinc. So what I want to caveat by saying is when we discuss an individual food, you can't just say just by having a small sprinkle of sunflower seeds, you're going to be reducing your risk of XYZ. It's when it's incorporated in a healthy balanced diet. Exactly, but these are their like USPs.

Yeah, oh yeah, these are seed and nut USPs, Ella. I mean, living our best lives. Yeah, we can work in nut branding. But as I said, I think for me, it's just a really nice example of the fact these small things like a little sunflower seed, it doesn't look like much, looks pretty humble, but actually they're really powerful.

And again- They're so humble. So humble, but in the spirit of kind of all the things that are being marketed to us all day, every day, all these various different powders, supplements, quick fixes, I promise I will solve all your problems in 10 seconds. Just buy me. Actually, when you strip it back, these simple ingredients you can buy in bulk, you can do a lot with, they're probably more powerful and cheaper long term. Exactly. So just try and fit them in when you can but as reset as well, it is all about including everything.

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Rise to it with the BMO Eclipse Rise Visa Card. The credit card that rewards your good financial habits. Earn points for paying your credit card bill in full and on time every month. Level up from bill payer to reward slayer. Terms and conditions apply. Okay so moving into our third headline which it comes at quite an interesting moment because last week was eating disorder awareness week and this week we've got world obesity day and it does feel like Ella says we've got two polar opposite issues at the moment that are both rising fast and on world on World Obesity Day last Tuesday, we had so many headlines.

There are a lot of headlines. And as we said, like we, we go into this knowing there is so much nuance on both topics, but equally, we're here to talk about what you're seeing, what you're reading, what you're feeling in the world of health and wellness. And I think we can't avoid the fact that as you're saying, there are these two real polar opposite issues at play here in the world of health and wellness. And I think we can't avoid the fact that, as you're saying, there are these two real polar opposite issues at play here, the rise of eating disorders and a very, very thin aesthetic, which is in oftentimes at the moment now being linked, particularly in kind of a celebrity culture to weight loss drugs.

And then on the other side, we have a growing weight issue around obesity. And as you said, that was what a lot of the headlines last Tuesday on World Obesity Day were talking about. So there was a new report that came out and it was saying that by 2050 it's anticipated that in the UK approximately 77% of adults will be overweight or obese. And that does indicate a faster spread of the obesity epidemic in this country than was previously thought and unfortunately that relates to our children as well so the prevalence of obesity among children aged between five and fourteen

is also expected to rise and that's going from 12 percent in 2021 to 18.4 percent by 2050 for girls and 9.9 percent to 15.5 percent for boys again by 2050. So some really startling stats there. And obviously these increasing rates of obesity are projected to escalate health care costs significantly with the NHS potentially facing an annual expenditure of 10 billion by 2050 to address obesity related to health issues. So what I think we really wanted to bring to you guys today is that I'm sure it's exactly what you've seen. On the one hand, we had that and all of those headlines, which were very, very important and making waves. On the other hand, we're obviously being in awards season, Oscars, Golden Globes, et cetera. And there's a lot of conversation around celebrity.

And there's a lot of headlines around this was something called the return of lollipop bodies, but essentially a return to size zero. And I was just very, very struck by the dichotomy between, on the one hand, the return to size zero and a lot of headlines on that, which is very difficult and the rising eating disorders and conversations around body image in that vein.

And then on the other hand, this escalating healthcare crisis that we have with a growing issue in a UK population, but not just the UK, of people being overweight and obese. I think we just both felt very sombre. It's just stark and it's also, it's very worrying, it's scary. It's like we're going backwards. It's like we're going backwards. It's like we're going a thousand steps backwards rather than taking one step forward at the moment. I think we just need to start the segment both of us acknowledging that, you know, we're both really reluctant to pass judgment on women's bodies. I mean, we've been there. It's just it's never really okay. And we did actually debate, didn't we, whether to include this topic at all. Completely, and this isn't about, we don't want to single out any person's body in this,

but the reality is we're all seeing these images and they really influence us. And we know that, we talked about that a few weeks ago, what we see has a massive impact on us. And right now there's this huge shift happening in celebrity culture that feels impossible to ignore. And it's moving us from slim to super super slim. It's bringing back the size zero aesthetic that I think we all

thought and hoped we'd left behind five ten years ago. You know you've got headlines like is a Zempik killing body positivity? What the hell happened to body positivity? And we're just seeing this wave of ultra ultra thin celebrities rapid weight loss transformations. And I just find it really worrying because it feels like this extreme body ideal that was very reminiscent of the early noughties and it's coming back and it's everywhere. We're seeing sternums, we're seeing a lot of bones. There was an article from Suzanne Moore in The Telegraph this week and it was talking

about this lollipop body where your head is a lot bigger than your body. And she was talking about lollipop bodies being paraded on the red carpet again, asking what's going on. And I felt that she was really putting into words a lot of what we probably have seen. And she said, "'When I see red carpets full of skeletal women

with pronounced collarbones, no hips or breasts,' for example, at yesterday's Screen Actors Guild, the SAG Awards, I really wonder what's going on. And that's certainly what I'm feeling. And I said, I find it very, very worrying because I think five, ten years ago, it felt like we were moving to this world of body positivity, the strong, not skinny, really encouraging health, not weight. And it feels like we're having a reverse of that, but sitting so at odds with the other end of the spectrum

worth growing rates of obesity. It's hard because body positivity is its own entity. So it's a movement for plus-size women, for women in larger bodies to embrace, to be powerful. That is their special community area. And it's a wonderful movement for them. And then I feel for people that are obviously also naturally slim, that perhaps have fallen into this bracket, but you cannot deny, like Ella said,

that perhaps these weight loss drugs are not going to the people that need it and are going around in this circle of celebrity. I don't know. It's really, really difficult to discuss and I don't want to pull out like the journalist said about their breasts or their hips. I just want to say look, what is going on with health and why? Why on earth is this drug available to so many people on the black market? To me as a health professional I cannot bear that because it is literally bringing down the positive image that people had had and I understand a place for this drug it can be life-changing it's a lifesaver for so many people but the Hollywood effect Ella there's 2025 Oscars and the other one

you can't ignore it can you? No and I'm seeing it everywhere and I was looking yesterday on Instagram and I was actually quite deep in the comment section because I was so curious about it and it was a lot of, as I said, it was just very skeletal to be totally frank and then you read the comment section and people are horrified and I think the reason I want to talk about it is I find it really concerning as we said we're so aware of the fact that the images we see around us impact us. And it makes me very, very, very, very nervous that we're going back to something which is ultimately not a healthy

pursuit for the vast majority of people who are not naturally quite that thin. And we're going back to seeing it everywhere. And I feel very concerned that we're going back and then seeing a healthy weight as actually not the ideal anymore. And that makes me so nervous because I felt that we had moved away from that. I think we all did. And seeing these images absolutely everywhere of people that is very looked up to, that this kind of Hollywood aesthetic and to go back to thinking that that size zero is normal. When fundamentally, like as you know, as a health professional, you know, that's not normal for most people.

I mean, there are open endorsements. That's also terrifying to me. You've got high profile figures like Sharon Osborne, Elon Musk, they've openly spoken about using medications for weight loss. And there are also side effects that have to be mentioned here. You know, what about nausea, muscle loss, disordered eating patterns, there's some severe psychological side effects of using these types of drugs. And the accessibility and the influence is really important. But I've got a voice note from Giles, and I think that's going to help us put things into perspective. Yeah, please play it. Okay, so Giles Yeoh, Professor Giles Yeoh is a professor at Cambridge Uni. He does a lot of work on OpsiGenetics. We had him on episode one, Ella, didn't we?

He's amazing. So I reached out to him once we were decided we were going to discuss this feature. Let's just get Giles to give us a voice of reason. Let's play this for you all now. Hi, my name is Professor Giles Yeoh, and I'm based at the University of Cambridge, where I study obesity.

And that means many people want to know my opinion on these new anti-obesity drugs, Ozempic, Mojaro, you know, how do they work? Are they good for you? Look, these drugs are powerful, they work and they're broadly safe. They are modified versions of natural gut hormones that actually are released in ourselves. So they're natural hormones. The secret power that these drug companies have done is to decorate them so that they actually last longer in the bloodstream. And so what happens is they signal to the pancreas in order to enhance insulin secretion, which is why they're a type 2 diabetes drug, but

crucially they also signal to the brain to make you feel fuller. You feel fuller, you eat less, you eat less, you lose weight. Now the thing about these drugs is that they are drugs, which means that they only work when you stay on them and they also have to be treated like drugs. They're so powerful they will work whether or not you are a 350 pound man looking to lose a hundred pounds or a 50 pound 16 year old girl. And so they do need to be treated like drugs and only prescribed. The other thing is that while these drugs will get you to eat less, they won't improve your diet.

So what you need to do is you also need to consider improving your diet, even whilst on these drugs, so that you can lose weight healthily and hopefully sustainably. And finally, these are drugs they treat disease, they do not prevent disease. So these drugs are designed to treat obesity, not prevent obesity. Ultimately, in order to prevent obesity, we will need policy changes and that requires the government. So use a screwdriver for a screw and a hammer for a nail, the right tool for the job. These drugs to treat obesity policies to prevent obesity. So I think the real thing to recap on what Giles has said is that with a rising obesity numbers in

this country going up, of course this drug is going to help so many people but it's got into the hands of people that don't need it and not prescribed. That's it. And I think it's, as I said, I wanted to bring this to our attention to say, I know it's a difficult topic, but it makes me nervous. The subconscious impact of a new thin ideal is worrying. And I think lots of us makes it hit today. And we say, yes, we don't actively aspire to those body types, but we're seeing them

again and again and again. And that can fundamentally, we know, shift our perception of what's normal, what's desirable. And that shift isn't just about being slim and healthy and toned at the moment in what we're seeing on red carpets, for example. It's about being the slimmest. And celebrities who are already thin are getting thinner and thinner. And I think that pressure trickles down. And I think it's just important in any conversation around health and wellness to acknowledge that and I think certainly I find it difficult to see it,

you know, when you keep seeing this you think well is this what's normal now? Is that what's desirable? No, it fills me with sadness. I see the impact that eating disorders have in our clinic, you know, people can die from this but it's really serious, Ala. You know, long term bone health issues, stress on the body, cancer risk goes up, risks of organ failure, hospitalisation, mental health conditions associated with it. The list goes on and on and on as to why this thin ideal is not healthy for us. It's not. And I just think to try and zone it out as much as possible, it's difficult. It really is difficult. But I think let's just to try and zone it out as much as possible, it's difficult, it really is difficult. But I think let's just all try and have

as many conversations we can about idealizing strong and fit and energized and feeling good in ourselves every day. It was Millie, there was someone in the press today, Millie Bobby Brown? Yes, from Stranger Things. And she spoke out and said, I will not conform to this image that she,

if they're talking about it, these celebrities out loud, obviously it is really a conscious thought that they've all got at the moment. She said, I think somebody had criticized her appearance. She said, no, I stand up for how I look. I like my curves. I like who I am and I will not conform to this. And I thought, yes, go you. By all accounts, she's also very slim. She is. And so the fact that she's saying something like that really, I think, kind of epitomizes the challenge that we're having where slim and well is being sidestepped in this industry for super, super thin.

And I think we all, I'm sure lots of our listeners are similar age to us. And we kind of very much remember that heat era, circling of cellulite, those circles of shame, the kind of the special K diets, that size theory aesthetic that was so prevalent in the noughties and how unhealthy it was and none of us want to go back there so we think we just need to collectively make that known. Let's be kind to each other, let's remember and I know Ella and I are living in slim bodies as well ourselves so we aren't that's why we debated even discussing this topic. We don't want to come across as not

understanding that this issue is complex. It's so complicated. It's not again it's not fair. It's not just there's a lot going on. But if we can just be kind to one another and let's stand up against this I think we can get past it. And it's like anything let's try and find as much as we can this middle ground. It's just the same with like complicated supplements versus eating more almonds in so many ways. It's an industry where it feels like we're living in extremes and let's just try and find this middle ground of looking after ourselves in a reasonable and balanced way that makes taking care of your body and your mind as enjoyable and joyful as possible.

Let's dance in the kitchen and eat more nuts and seeds. Yeah, exactly. What else is trending in wellness, Rui? You've been talking about protein powder on the BBC this week. I know, again, it's really interesting. It's so cool that you're here with us. You're like, I get here, there and everywhere, giving the nation advice on all these headlines

and we get to get all of your inside scoop. Dude, it's coming quite handy, but it is because it's been January and February. Like I say, I doubt I'll be getting as many calls from the BBC and over the next, as we go into Easter and chocolate era. But no, in all seriousness, a recent national survey of UK adults revealed

that almost half have actively increased their protein intake in the past year and notably among 16 to 34 year olds this figure has risen by two-thirds. So the interest is really interesting, Ella, because you've got stats from Macado as well, haven't you? Yes, we're back to protein obsession basically and as we said it's really trickling through. Like I was really taken aback by the fact that almost half of adults are really actively increasing their protein intake. And then again, we're just seeing that in data everywhere.

So Ocado, for example, which is an online retailer in the UK, they've reported seeing searches on their website for high protein foods doubling since 2023. And then things like cottage cheese, for example, which has gone quite viral. I know you've had some viral cottage cheese recipes in terms of a great ingredient for upping your protein intake, but it has been a very uncool ingredient until quite recently. Demand for cottage cheese,

that low fat, high protein product, which is made from curdled milk, has increased by 97%. It's because it was a diet product. It used to be the era of size zero. It used to be that product and now it is the viral addition to recipes online. Exactly. Package spread.

Yeah, I feel like cottage cheese is going in everything and it is. It's part of this protein obsession which is being so driven by social media. And in that protein powder, surprise, surprise, it's booming. And that's the first thing we wanted to cover in our transaction today. So we want to get into everything you talked to the BBC about, but just to give you guys a bit of context because you guys know I love these stats. The global protein powder industry

is one of many industries in wellness that is booming. In 2024, the market was valued about $24.6 billion. It's projected to reach about $46.2 billion by 2034. We do love protein. Ree, give us the lowdown on protein powders. I just want to remind everybody that you don't need to be excessively consuming protein. And especially I think… Can you say that about 800 times?

I know. But I'm also seeing recipe creators and influencers online and even some nutritionists that do not choose to be registered, by the way, so they cannot be held accountable for what they're saying, saying that, you know, I'm making these 30 gram protein meals, but you do not need... That's more, like, 20 to 30 grams is a great estimate. Not everybody has to be aiming for that number. I'm seeing kind of 60 grams in a meal now. I mean, aiming for about 150 grams a day.

And I get messages from people often being like, just to clarify, how do I get 150 grams of protein a day and I'm thinking what lifestyle are you leading? Because again, if you're back to leading I say quote-unquote normal lifestyle in the sense of you have a quite a seditory job office based You're getting some exercise in the gym or dancing in your kitchen, but you don't have a kind of not an athlete No, you don't need to have 150 grams. And we're all unique and we're back to a numbers game. You know, calories are now not seen as accurate, which is great.

But why is everybody now taking macro counting as an accurate measure? This is no way every human being can have the same macronutrient requirement of protein. So the British Dietetic Association, the BDA, say high levels of additional protein can cause side effects and that can include nausea, kidney and liver damage, could affect long-term bone health. There's lots of things to consider. So on the BBC, we were discussing how they're marketed as well, you know, like really snazzily, like, oh, it's natural or high biological or low biological value, complete, incomplete, you know, all these different words, organic, you know, no added sugar,

you name it. There's health claims jumping out your ears with these, like, you know, all these different words, organic, you know, no added sugar, you name it. There's health claims jumping out your ears with these like every single day. And what we have to remember is that you don't need to get all of those essential amino acids in one hit, in one sitting. Unless you are on a sports nutrition plan. Sports nutrition is methodical calculated for performance by an athlete. It's very different to everyday consumers that don't need to be that methodical calculated for performance by an athlete. It's very different to everyday consumers that don't need to be that methodical with their diet. So studies have repeatedly shown that a plant-based diet purely meets all the energy requirements

with all essential amino acids. So don't worry if you're a plant-based eater as well. There's no need to compliment plant protein foods at every meal. And the nitrogen balance you need to get across the day so basically having protein at breakfast lunch and dinner and snacks is fine you don't need to have it in one hit in a protein shake and it's almost like going back to those days where people used to add protein powder and we discussed this in porridge and they used to be like always recipes

and I know I remember trying some but there's hidden risks. So I think my job here just comes in to remind you that 1 to 1.2 grams per kilogram is kind of a rough ideal and if you're an elderly adult you want to be aiming probably for around yeah 30 grams minimum and for elderly even higher but for most people you just don't need to be overthinking it and And it's the hidden stuff. So a report by the Clean Label Project, a consumer safety nonprofit tested 116 protein powder products from 70 top selling brands and found that 47% contained unsafe levels of heavy metals such as lead, cadmium, arsenic and mercury, which is absolutely insane, Ella.

It really is. Just to say that again, because I think it's such an important thing to take in, of the 760 products, the 70 top selling brands and almost half contained unsafe levels of heavy metals. And again, completely discounting athletes and people with very, very specific requirements in their diets. I think it comes back to what we say all day, every day, which is that you just don't need to be spending your money on these things, spend it on those almonds,

spend it on those walnuts, spend it on your sunflower seeds, and include protein in its kind of simplest form. And to your point, if you need sort of 20, 25, maybe 30 grams in a meal, but if you weigh 60 kilos or so, you're gonna need 60 grams a day. So 20 grams in a meal, it's not very difficult when you actually start looking at how much is in

that sprinkling of sunflower seeds, pumpkin seeds, some lentils, and you get all sorts of different protein sources in. Again, when you're coming back to having a balanced diet, you won't find it that difficult. And then you think, oh, but I need to buy X, Y or Z because this influences us, I need to get 50 grams in a meal. And then you look at the reality and the reality is that these powders aren't necessarily that good for you.

They're not these magic answers. No, this is just it. They're not magic answers. And I actually have a whole page in the new book on protein powders, for example, because they're an ultra processed food, Ella. They're full of artificial sweeteners, lots of them, flavourings, loads of different preservatives, emulsifiers, and there's a danger as well of added fortification. So people might think this protein powder is good for me because it's got added vitamins and minerals. Whereas

actually, if you're already taking a supplement at home and then you're overdosing by taking that protein powder with those vitamins and minerals, that is not a good idea and it might claim to be natural. There's nothing remotely natural about protein powder in the first place. And there's differences in it. So for instance, for an athlete, if they're doing a long endurance race, we'd recommend concentrate because it releases more slowly. It's a different part of the way to isolate which we'd associate more with muscle building very fast to get the replenishment after a workout but this is complex science I'm discussing. Most people don't need to know if they're having Isola or concentrate or if they're having hemp or whey or rice. There are options for everybody out there and they can be very conveniently useful but for so many of us I'd say the money that you spent on that would be

better going on your nuts and seeds. Or some frozen peas. Yes! But jokes aside. You know my friend has a phobia of peas. It was very strange I was yeah anyway this is total bias. But yeah what a phobia to have of peas. I don't know why I brought that up. I'd love to know a bit more about the psychology of it. Yeah, we all have things we don't like. But it's just when you start to think about it, there are so many simple things you can do. And ultimately, it's so much better for your wellbeing

because to your point about the nuts and seeds, for example, they contain all these other beneficial nutrients, which most of us don't get enough of. So really, I think going back to whole foods is really the simplest thing, isn't it? Whole food ingredients is the best option. And for those of you that do want to add it to your diet, because it can be convenient.

I'm not just brushing over the facts. Some people, it can be useful. Research the brands. Look for transparency. Look where they manufacture. Look at all of that on the ingredients list. Check for certifications tested by organizations like the USP, Consumer Lab or NSF.

And natural is really difficult as a word and a claim, but really know what your source is. Are you going for a dairy or are you going for a vegan protein powder? And when possible, just try and get it from your food. That's what we can say. Oh my gosh, is natural a difficult one? We have seen it, goodness knows, how many times across our time at Delicacy Ella where you see it in other brands and obviously what we're looking at are kind of competitive set and it will say natural and you turn over the back of the packet and you're like, there's

nothing natural in here. I know, I know. It's a very clever and you know it's nearly always picked up by ASA, isn't it? It's one of those claims on packets. It's naturally this that you've got to be really aware of. But yeah, I think it moves us on to trend number two, which is also protein based. Yes, we thought why not since we're everyone still obsessed with protein, let's keep it together. And it's the rise of meat snacks, which I think is a bigger thing in the US than the UK, but it's really catching on here.

Kind of taking over gyms, supermarket shelves, even office snack drawers, and you've got things like beef jerky, bill tong, these protein packed meat sticks. The high protein bites, they're kind of becoming quite go to for fitness enthusiasts. Ultimately, again, they're often ultra processed. And I think we were just curious about what's fueling this carnivorous craze. I know we talked about the carnivore diet again a few weeks ago but we are the hidden health risks we should be talking about when again our listeners are seeing this everywhere. Should they be jumping on this train or going back

to simpler sources? Oh of course there's health risks. It's just not a good meat. Processed meat risks again they are the I hope you've ever anyone listening will know by now that they are the only food to be classified as a class one carcinogen. So studies show that regular consumption of processed meats increases the risk of high blood pressure, heart disease and cancer. They contain high amounts of sodium,

so salt and preservatives, because it sits for a long time. I mean, as a kid, I used to eat that pepperoni stuff in the sticks, I used to really like that as a child, I remember that. I've changed really like that as a child, I remember that. I've changed, my palates changed now, but those meat sticks pack in more salt than a bag of chips, you know, or crisps in the UK.

We'd say they contain nitrates, they are linked to the cancerous. The saturated fat is huge in these things as well. And some of them contain more saturated fat or the same as a fast food burger. So the area to look at if you're interested is the IRAC and they're the company, the resource that classify things as carcinogens or not. So to give you the breakdown, carcinogens including heterocyclic aromatic amines and polycyclic aromatic hydrocarbons, That's the sciencey words for what's produced

when you cook meat. And the bits that make the meat that increase the risk of cancer when you cook them at high temperatures by pan frying them, grilling or barbecuing them, curing them, smoking them, basically all the things you do to these meats to put them in that packet

is what links them to increased cancer risk. So no, Ella, it's not good. Yeah. That's a nice answer. And again, it's this whole point, isn't it? It's not about perfectionism. So if you really like those and you enjoy them every now and again, that's okay.

But don't be turning to them for your health foods, which is how they're being targeted, I think, to us all as these are health foods. Choose this instead of fruit. And we're gonna go on to our listener question about fruit, which I think is the perfect example is that it's being heralded. Yeah, choose a kind of a build-on or a beef jerky.

Every now and again, but not every day. Yes, but as a health choice. And then we're demonizing fruit because fruit has sugar. And again, to me, that's where claims have gone mad and we're losing the plot to some extent. But there's been a 38% increase in UK sales of processed meat snacks, which is really interesting. The meat stick industry,

I don't think I'd ever say that. It's worth about three billion in the US and huge projected growth in both countries. So they're becoming really popular. I'm seeing them everywhere. Do you think it's because in the olden days, the olden days, in the olden days, in the olden days, they did preserve meats. You know, that was probably like a delicacy, right? A bit of meat on a stick. For sure. And again, we're just eating it in such different

quantities. And again, consuming it within, I think we always have to look at the context in which we eat things, don't we? Like if we're eating whole food based, very healthy diet, and then you're having these things on occasion, as we always say, that's just not where the problem sits. The problem sits with the fact that most of us are chronically stressed, under slept, not exercising, you know, only a quarter of us getting our five a day, 90% of us not getting enough fiber. Not sleeping.

It's so, so yeah, not sleeping. And then we're at, you know, one in five of us getting 80% of our calories from ultra processed food, like that's the challenge. And then we're seeing something like know, one in five of us getting 80% or so of our calories from ultra processed food. Like that's the challenge. And then we're seeing something like these meat sticks marketed to us as, oh, well that's the quick health choice. And when you add up all of those issues together- And the confusion around healthy items, which is our listener question, makes no sense.

Exactly. So just go back to your basics, focus on whole foods essentially, and managing your stress, sleeping a bit more. It's all the basics. Eat those nuts and seeds. But to me, I think the listener question is really interesting in this context because I think it summarizes the confusion where we're demonizing fruit and celebrating processed meat, which is just so confusing. It's just so wild. So this week's listener question, I would love to hear your thoughts on sugar from fruit.

Should we limit it to two to three portions a day or we can eat more? I'm confused about natural sugars. I mean, it makes so much sense to be confused, doesn't it? Because you've got people on the internet saying that fruit's not real and doesn't exist in nature. So you know, I'm not surprised that it's very confusing. But basically, if you've got a ratio each day, it can be unique to you because some countries say you've got to get 10 a day.

This country, five a day, still we don't meet that. It's around 27%, 28% of us that do. So basically, have more veg to the ratio of fruit each day. Fruit isn't bad. You know, the fructose, the natural sugar in fruit, gets metabolized very slowly in the liver. It gets there really slowly. It's not like a huge blood sugar spike.

And we're unique as well in the way we respond to blood sugars when we eat fruits. Some fruits will have a higher load than others when it comes to sugars. For instance, berries are quite low, whereas if you ate a tropical fruit like mango, you'd probably get a faster hit of fructose. But they contain vitamins, minerals, fiber,

you even get calcium in oranges. I should have said that last week on the sources of calcium episode, because fruit contains so much more than just sugar. It is so delicious and it keeps you well and it supports your immune system and we just are not eating enough of it. So I really don't like demonising fruit. I think demonising fruit summarises all that's wrong in this industry, actually. I think in terms of like the overwhelming confusion, all the influx of marketing, the

various different potions, powders, quick fixes, gadgets, gizmos that were being sold, and then we're scared of fruit. It says everything. And I think if we leave listeners with one idea at the end of this, it's kind of like forget all of it and just go back to the basics. Yeah, I mean, you can have too much of a good thing. Obviously, if you're eating like 100 oranges a day, that's not good. Well, yes, there was a trend for wasn't it? Like a raw fruit diet. Yes, I remember that quite early on in my career. Yeah, and people would eat maybe like 30 bananas in one go. So I'm not necessarily recommending that as so much as like grabbing an apple on the go today. But I think it's like everything just going back to okay, it's so easy to say go back to a sensible, moderate balanced approach.

And as we said the other day, balance is so overused. But when we just come back to it, it is back to basics, isn't it? We're so lucky in this country to have access, I say this all the time, to what a variety of fruit and vegetables. We're so lucky yet we don't utilize it. So enjoy your fruit. Don't worry about it. Get your nuts and seeds this week.

And we look forward to hearing your feedback on today's episode. Particularly I think around the body image Ella, because I'm fascinated by that. I hope we delivered it in a okay way. Me too. I would love to get you guys thoughts on that and how you're feeling. As I said, to me, I really struggle when I look at the dichotomy and it just felt really deeply contrasting this week when you had the lollipop conversation and the ultra thin conversation going on

at the same time as those stats about the faster rise for obesity than was expected. Maybe we should get another extra scoop on Body Image, but we hope you enjoyed the extra scoop this week as well. And we can't believe we're now able to bring you Mondays and Thursdays. I know, we just love hanging out with you guys and save your diary, 14th of June, it's coming.

We cannot wait to see more of you in real life Diary 14th of June, it's coming. We cannot wait to see more of you in real life. Just have a great day guys. Bye!