Under the Influence with Terry O'Reilly - S8E25 - Ask Terry 2019

Episode Date: June 20, 2019

This week, it’s the final episode of our 2019 season: Ask Terry. And as we do every year, we’re turning this show over to you, our listeners, and answering your questions on the air. From whether subliminal advertising exists, to if my career has made me a cynical consumer, to which of the Beatles was the best marketer, this year’s questions were fun and insightful. Oh - and you’ll get a chance to meet the team, too. Hope you’ll join us.  Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Hi, it's Terry O'Reilly. As you may know, we've been producing a lot of bonus episodes while under the influences on hiatus. They're called the Beatleology Interviews, where I talk to people who knew the Beatles, work with them, love them, and the authors who write about them. Well, the Beatleology Interviews have become a hit, so we are spinning it out to be a standalone podcast series. You've already heard conversations with people like actors Mark Hamill, Malcolm McDowell, and Beatles confidant Astrid Kershaw. But coming up, I talk to May Pang, who dated John Lennon in the mid-70s. I talk to double fantasy guitarist Earl Slick, Apple Records creative director John Kosh. I'll be talking to Jan Hayworth,

who designed the Sgt. Pepper album cover. Very cool. And I'll talk to singer Dion, who is one of only five people still alive who were on the Sgt. Pepper cover. And two of those people were Beatles. The stories they tell are amazing. So thank you for making this series such a success. And please do me a favor, follow the Beatleology interviews on your podcast app. You don't even have to be a huge Beatles fan. You just have to love storytelling. Subscribe now and don't miss a single beat. new year new me season is here and honestly we're already over it enter felix the health care company helping canadians take a different approach to weight loss this year weight loss is more than just diet and exercise it can be about tackling genetics hormones metabolism felix

gets it they connect you with licensed healthcare practitioners online who'll create a personalized treatment plan that pairs your healthy lifestyle with a little help and a little extra support. Start your visit today at felix.ca. That's F-E-L-I-X.ca. Whether you're in your running era, Pilates era, or yoga era, dive into Peloton workouts that work with you. From meditating at your kid's game to mastering a strength program, they've got everything you need to keep knocking down your goals. No pressure to be who you're not. Just workouts and classes to strengthen who you are.

So no matter your era, make it your best with Peloton. Find your push. Find your power. Peloton. Visit Peloton at with Peloton. Find your push. Find your power. Peloton. Visit Peloton at onepeloton.ca. From the Under the Influence digital box set, this episode is from Season 8, 2019. You're so king in it You're a good hand With all the people Get out of here when you're hungry. You're a good hand with a heart. You're under the influence with Terry O'Reilly. Well, it's that time of the year already. Welcome to our final episode of the 2019 season.

This was a big year for us. We crossed the 300-episode mark. We released our archives for free for the first time, we launched a book club, and next year we begin our 15th season. And being that this is the season finale, we do what we always do. We put the show in the hands of our listeners. We ask for questions, and we receive the most responses ever. And may I say, the questions are so good. So instead of opening with a story as we usually do, we're going to get right to it so we can squeeze as many questions in as we can.

And by the way, you're going to meet the entire Under the Influence team today while we're at it. You're under the influence. Okay, let's get started. Meet Abby Forsyth. Hi, everybody. Abby is one of our amazing researchers who originally hails from the great city of Kenora, Ontario. Yes, it is a beautiful place. Actually, almost every time I'm home, someone stops me to tell me that they're an under the influence listener, which is pretty cool. Love Kenora. Great town. And Abby is going to read the very first question.

Speaking of geography. Yes. Marcus Woolsey emails to ask, do people listen to your show outside of Canada? Absolutely. We air in the United States and thanks to podcasting, we have listeners in Australia, New Zealand, China, Japan, Mexico, South America and throughout Europe. We get emails from people from all around the world and we love it. Marcus also asked if we ever run out of episode ideas. Ha! Well, the answer is no.

This is the last episode of our 14th season, and we had over 70 episode ideas we didn't even get to, many of which were suggested by listeners. The great thing about the marketing industry is that it generates news stories every day. And it has a very rich history to mine. Folks, meet Jillian Gora. Hey, everyone.

Jillian is another one of our amazing researchers on the show. So, Jillian, what have you got there? Okay. On Facebook, Randy Knight says he's loving the release of our digital box set of archives. Glad you're enjoying them, Randy. He goes on to ask if there is a plan to release the Age of Persuasion archives and even the O'Reilly on advertising episodes. Well, there are no plans to release the Age of Persuasion at this time, Randy. With the exception of the very last season of AOP, we never produced podcast versions, mostly because podcasting wasn't around then. As for O'Reilly on Advertising, it predates Age of Persuasion,

so no podcast versions existed then either. But believe it or not, we did produce a few limited edition CD box sets of the 10 most listened to episodes from our very first season in 2005. You can find more information about them on my website, terryoreilly.ca. To read the next question, meet Mr. Ari Posner. About time you had me on the show, Terry. Ari is a Juno Award-winning music composer, and he happened to co-write our Under the Influence theme music. Fire away, Ari.

On Facebook, Kim Gibson-God asks a very interesting question. Are subliminal messages fact or myth? Well, Kim, I've toyed with doing an episode on subliminal advertising, except I have one problem with it. I don't believe it ever existed. So it's difficult to do a program on the subject. Two reasons why. The book called Subliminal Seduction, written by Wilson Brian Key in the 70s,

which ignited the interest in subliminal advertising, was sensationalist and his stories have been proven to be false over time. But more importantly, in my nearly 40 years in advertising, I never heard the subject of subliminal advertising being discussed. Ever.

No one brought it up, no one asked for it, no one ever suggested it. I've personally produced close to 15,000 commercials in my career, and I've been in thousands of meetings with major brands on both sides of the border, and it has never even been whispered. Has some unscrupulous advertiser somewhere in the margins of the ad business tried subliminal advertising? Probably. But as a mainstream advertising strategy, in my experience,

not a thing. Next up, meet Sydney O'Reilly. Well, hello there. Sydney wears a lot of hats on this show, but she primarily co-writes the episodes with me and is our digital content producer. So what have you got there, Sid? Linnell Vonkerman asks this question on Facebook. Yep. Have you been turned into a skeptical consumer

after doing this show for so long? Well, I think there's nothing wrong with being skeptical, by the way. Why not question anything you're not sure about? I'm wondering if you really mean has it turned me into a cynical consumer? The answer is absolutely not. As I mentioned earlier, advertising has been my career.

If I was going to be cynical about advertising, it would have happened a long time ago. I feel today the way I've always felt. Good marketers produce good advertising. Bad marketers produce bad advertising. And I wish people would stop spending money with bad advertisers. Vote with your wallet, folks. Meet Allison Pinches. Hi, everyone.

Allison is also one of our remarkable and resourceful researchers on the show, and it's the research that really makes this show. So what have you got there, Allison? It's from Twitter. Okay. Chris Brasher asks, why would a company negatively advertise its own product? Interesting question.

For starters, there is a rich history of negative advertising strategy. The Volkswagen advertising of the 1960s, which I've mentioned often, was firmly rooted in the negative. The ad said the VW Beetle was ugly. They said it was slow. They said it was too small.

They said it was uncomfortable in the back seat. There was an honesty about the advertising. But more than that, it was endearing. No other car marketer had ever taken pot shots at its own vehicle. But by doing that, Volkswagen became the most beloved car in history. No other car marketer had ever taken pot shots at its own vehicle. But by doing that, Volkswagen became the most beloved car in history. Avis celebrated the fact it was number two in the car rental business. Being number two was seen as a negative in marketing terms. Nobody ever boasted about being second best.

But Avis turned that negative into a positive by saying, because they were number two, they tried harder than number one. It was powerful marketing. That campaign made Avis profitable for the first time in a decade. There's a funny commercial airing right now for Nes Tea here in Canada. It shows a shy teenager trying to work up the nerve to talk to a girl at school. So, he scared. Let's be real, it's fancy and it's refreshing and flavoring. Nestea can help you find your flavoring. Nestea, keeping it real since forever. Ha, you could consider that a negative. Most brands would have used the cliche hero moment, sip some courage from a leading brand, ask the girl out. But Nestea was honest, saying, it's refreshing, but it won't change your life. Good for you, Nestea.

Time to introduce the executive producer of our show. Meet Debbie O'Reilly. Hi. Under the Influence has about 100 moving pieces at any given time. We produce three versions of every episode that air in two different countries. There are research assignments, recording schedules, music reporting forms, weekly promotional requirements, and more. And Debbie keeps this entire speeding locomotive on the tracks. She also happens to be my wife, so she keeps our entire

family on the tracks too. She's amazing. So what's the next question, Deb? On Twitter, Notorious Vic wants to know about one of your favorite advertising legends. She asks, was there something you think David Ogilvie was wrong about? David Ogilvie was definitely a legend in the advertising world. When he died in 1999, his obit ran on the front page of the New York Times. I don't think another ad person will ever get that kind of coverage. Ogilvie not only founded Ogilvie & Mather, one of the most substantial and influential advertising agencies of all time, at the age of 38, wow, but he was also a prolific book writer and listed his many rules for advertising. He was a compulsive list maker, by the way. When he proposed to his wife,

he gave her a huge list of reasons why she should marry him. But the one rule I think Ogilvy was wrong about was when he said humor doesn't sell. His competitor, Bill Burnback, founder of Doyle Dane Burnback, proved him wrong on that count, starting with those very funny VW ads Burnback did. As someone once noted, Ogilvy is a legend, but Burnback has all the disciples. Okay, Keith, you're up.

Ready. Keith, as you all know, is our fantastic sound engineer, and he's been with us since we started 14 years ago. Fire away. Ola Sal asks this on Twitter. When will you give us some bloopers and funny moments from your show? Ha, there's an idea. We never thought to collect them. I've been collecting them. Really? Uh-oh. And there's been a lot of them, too.

Now that you've brought it up, Bo, I guess we'll have to air a few of those next season. Looking forward to it. Yeah, I bet. Okay, got another question there, Mr. Ullman? Yep. Robert Stewart asks, did you ever have to work with a client you couldn't stand? Yes, sir. There were a handful of clients who were very difficult to work with.

They were rude and uncaring and treated us and their own staff terribly, and I hated working for them. Many of those occasions were when I was employed by advertising agencies and I had no say in which clients we worked with. You just had to grin and bear it. But when I started my own company, we could pick and choose. If people were rude or treated our staff badly, we walked away. But I have to say, most of the clients I worked for were decent folks who I enjoyed. Time to meet Callie Rae O'Reilly. Hi.

Callie designs all our very creative episode graphics. Thank you. And edits the Sirius satellite version of our show. What you got, Cal? Sean from Hampton, Ontario is asking about the history and marketing strategy around arena or stadium naming rights. Which one was the first to be branded? And

is there an expected return on investment attached to the strategy? First, a brief history. It appears the very first stadium to be named after a company was Boston's Fenway Park in 1912. The stadium owner had a real estate company called Fenway Realty and wanted to promote his firm. Then in 1926, the Wrigley Chewing Gum Company bought the Chicago Cubs and renamed its facility Wrigley Stadium. If you are a loyal Under the Influence listener, you'll remember who suggested that stadium name to William Wrigley.

It was none other than Albert Lasker, who we featured in the Most Interesting Adman in the World episode, Season 6, Episode 20. In 1953, August Bush II wanted to name the St. Louis Cardinals ballpark Budweiser Stadium, but Major League Baseball wouldn't allow a stadium to be named after alcohol. But the league did allow him to christen the park after the family name, so it became Bush Stadium. Stadium naming rights do not come cheap. Metropolitan Life

Insurance paid around $500 million for naming rights to the MetLife Stadium, home to two NFL teams, the New York Jets and the Giants. Citibank paid $400 million to name a ballpark city field where the New York Mets play. And Mercedes-Benz paid over $300 million to name the stadium the Atlanta Falcons call home. But can you guess which company paid the most ever to name a stadium? The answer? Scotiabank. It reportedly paid $800 million Canadian,

or just north of $600 million American, to rename the Air Canada Centre the Scotiabank Arena, which is substantially more than the $30 million Air Canada spent for the previous 20-year contract. By the way, when Air Canada owned those rights and the stadium was short-formed down to the ACC, I thought that abbreviation hurt the airline's investment. The words Air Canada were rarely used. Which brings us to return on investment. It comes down to three things. Goodwill, media visibility, and strategy. Sporting events are communal gatherings,

almost tribal. When that congregation gathers under one roof, that roof slowly builds up goodwill. It's a drip strategy and it takes a while. Many of us still call the Rogers Center Sky Dome and it's been 14 years. Drip, drip. Another aspect is media visibility. Scotiabank will get thousands of mentions across television, radio, newspaper, and online reports. That is worth a lot of money. Third, hockey is a core part of Scotiabank's strategy. It supports over 8,000 community hockey teams across the country. The bank says research shows people who are aware of its financial support for hockey are three and a half times more likely to consider using its services. So, it's not just that Scotiabank has associated itself with the sport Canadians are so passionate about.

It's also a solid business strategy that pays dividends. Which brings us to another perplexing question. Is there any return on investment on those crazy Matthew McConaughey Lincoln commercials? And we'll be right back after this message. If you're enjoying this episode, why not dip into our archives? Available wherever you download your pods. Go to terryoreilly.ca for a master episode list. Okay, time to meet the other co-writer of our wonderful theme music, Ian Lefevre. Hello, Under the Influence listeners.

Ian is a fantastic musician, record producer, and songwriter. And together with Ari Posner, he wrote our theme song. Still love that tune. Me too. What's the next question? You're going to like this one, Terry. On Instagram, at Coolwood2002Framing asks,

which Beatle was the best marketer and why? Ah, a question aimed right at my heart. Well done. Without question, the best Beatle marketer was John Lennon. For starters, Lennon liked advertising, or adverts as he called them, and said so on several occasions.

His Good Morning, Good Morning song on Sgt. Pepper was inspired by a Kellogg's Corn Flakes commercial, by the way. But Lennon not only liked commercials, he actually employed advertising. When he was staging his bed-ins for peace, he advertised extensively. It's a very good idea to advertise for peace or against racism or whatever it is. You must advertise. That's what everybody else does.

Lennon told the Montreal Star in 1969 that he wanted to sell peace like a product, that he wanted to use advertising tactics to convince people they could demand peace. So, he distributed over 2,000 War Is Over If You Want It posters, hired advertising agencies, and put up War Is Over billboards in cities around the world. Of course, in Amsterdam, Tokyo, New York, L.A., Montreal, Toronto, Berlin, Rome, Paris, Amsterdam, Athens,

London. I think that's it. Eleven places altogether. So my vote for best Fab Four marketer is definitely Mr. Lennon. One more. At Coolwood 2002 Framing also asks, Am I missing something with the Matthew McConaughey Lincoln commercials? The only thing that

makes them memorable to me is how bad they are. You have no idea how often I'm asked that question. It's always fascinating when a commercial you think is bad actually sells a ton of product. This is one of those stories. If you remember, McConaughey was in a movie called Lincoln Lawyer back in 2011. In that film, McConaughey plays a lawyer who actually uses his Lincoln automobile as an office. So, there may have been an original spark of an idea there. Lincoln as a car brand was losing its luster.

As a matter of fact, Lincoln hit a 32-year sales low in 2013. That's a deep valley to try and crawl out of. The brand needed a revival. The first step was to introduce a new model, the MKC. It was a compact premium crossover vehicle that launched in 2014. The key to reviving Lincoln was to attract younger buyers. That's when talk turned to maybe employing a celebrity spokesperson. But the Lincoln marketing team didn't just want a celebrity face. They wanted someone who believed in the brand, someone they could collaborate with. They had heard through the grapevine that Matthew McConaughey had driven Lincolns throughout his life. A tentative call was placed to the actor's office, and they were told

McConaughey didn't traditionally work with brands, but he was a Lincoln fan, and if they were truly interested, he was open to talking about it. McConaughey was a hot commodity at the time, as he was just coming off an Oscar win. Neither Lincoln nor McConaughey wanted this partnership to be a one-off deal. Both sides wanted a real relationship. So, a deal was struck. Because he was attaching his name to the brand, McConaughey insisted on going to Lincoln's plant in Dearborn, Michigan. He spent time with Lincoln's design people, took the vehicles on test tracks, and met with all the senior brand managers.

Next, McConaughey sat down with Lincoln's advertising agency. The campaign idea was to stand out by being quiet, to attract attention in a noisy category by being understated. McConaughey loved that approach. Here is the launch commercial. I've been driving a Lincoln since long before anybody paid me to drive one. I didn't do it to be cool. I didn't do it to make a statement.

I just liked it. That ad generated 18,000 tweets. Working with the director and the advertising agency, the McConaughey commercials always had a starting point, but were largely unscripted. Some ads went beyond understated. One just showed McConaughey sitting in a cafe with his Lincoln parked outside. He just wordlessly sips a coffee

waiting for the rain to end. When it does, he gets into his car, opens the sunroof, and drives off. In another ad, McConaughey just sits in the back seat. I mean, you may never even sit in the back seat. That'd be a shame. In a Lincoln Navigator commercial, McConaughey taps out a rhythm on the steering wheel while a train passes by. That commercial alone has nearly 18 million views.

It also has 16,000 dislikes, but that's just a tiny percentage of overall viewings. Needless to say, the campaign also launched numerous parodies. Conan O'Brien spoofed it. So did South Park. Jim Carrey did a hilarious one on Saturday Night Live. Sometimes you gotta go back to actually move forward.

And I don't mean go back and reminisce or chase ghosts. I mean take a big step back. Like go from winning an Oscar to doing a car commercial. My agent was like, I could understand if you did this right after the Lincoln lawyer. That would have made sense.

That spoof was viewed more than 7 million times on YouTube. McConaughey got over 3 million views for a commercial where he just sat in the car staring at an 1,800-pound bull standing in the middle of the road. That's a big bull. I think that's old Cyrus. Which prompted Ellen DeGeneres to do a parody. Oh, now I see it. Hello, Cyrus.

Maybe we should ask him to move. Move it along. All that spoofing blazed its way across the internet. But here's the important part. In 2013, sales were at a 32-year low. In 2014, when the McConaughey campaign broke, sales jumped 16%. Lincoln hit 10% market share by the fourth quarter, doubling its average. Its website traffic tripled. Two years later, sales jumped 25%. In March of 2018, the Lincoln Navigator smashed records with a 101.6% sales increase year over year.

Lincoln had to boost production at its assembly plant to keep up with demand. Many dealerships reported that people came into their showrooms asking to see the car that was spoofed by Jim Carrey on Saturday Night Live, meaning even the spoofs sold cars. There you have it. Matthew McConaughey is selling Lincolns. The commercials are weirdly unusual in the automotive industry.

They are beautifully shot. They are quiet in a noisy category. They gain a lot of attention because of McConaughey. And they generate a ton of spoofs, which is media gold. So, if you've been wondering why the commercials you love to hate have been running for four straight years, now you know. Well, that wraps up our 14th season.

Hope you enjoyed it. Thanks again to our incredible Under the Influence team. They work their hearts out to bring you this show every week. We also want to thank the Executive Director of CBC Radio and Audio, Susan Margetti, for all her support, as well as the wonderful Leslie Peck and Barb Dickey. Most importantly, thank you to all our listeners here and around the world.

Thanks for sticking with us and for sending us all those positive messages and episode ideas. And we're happy to say we'll be back next year. Have a safe and happy summer. I'm Terry O'Reilly. This episode was recorded in the TerraStream Mobile Recording Studio.

Producer, Debbie O'Reilly. Sound Engineer, Keith Ullman. Theme music by Ari Posner and Ian Lefevre. Digital Content Producer, Sydney O'Reilly. Sound engineer, Keith Oman. Theme music by Ari Posner and Ian Lefevre. Digital content producer, Sidney O'Reilly. If you liked this episode, you might also enjoy past Ask Terry episodes. You'll find them free in our archives wherever you download your podcasts. See you in January. Under the influence.

All right, all right, all right. Um, do you wear clothes when you listen to our show? If so, have we got a t-shirt for you. Go to terryoreilly.ca slash shop. New year, new me. Season is here and honestly, we're already over it. Enter Felix, the healthcare company helping Canadians take a different approach to weight loss this year.

Weight loss is more than just diet and exercise. It can be about tackling genetics, hormones, metabolism. Felix gets it. They connect you with licensed healthcare practitioners online who'll create a personalized treatment plan that pairs your healthy lifestyle with a little help and a little extra support. Start your visit today at felix.ca. That's F-E-L-I-X dot C-A. Whether you're in your running era, Pilates era, or yoga era, dive into Peloton workouts that work with you.

From meditating at your kid's game to mastering a strength program, they've got everything you need to keep knocking down your goals. No pressure to be who you're not. Just workouts and classes to strengthen who you are. So no matter your era, make it your best with Peloton. Find your push. Find your power. Peloton.

Visit Peloton at onepeloton.ca.