Under the Influence with Terry O'Reilly - The Beatlology Interviews: Actor Mark Hamill

Episode Date: September 21, 2024

Mark Hamill not only owns collectibles, he is a collectible. Mark talks to us about his first blush with the Beatles, how he began collecting Beatles memorabilia, that time he met George Harrison on a plane, and whether or not he let his kids play with Star Wars toys. Hosted on Acast. See acast.com/privacy for more information.

Hi, it's Terry O'Reilly. As you may know, we've been producing a lot of bonus episodes while under the influences on hiatus. They're called the Beatleology Interviews, where I talk to people who knew the Beatles, work with them, love them, and the authors who write about them. Well, the Beatleology Interviews have become a hit, so we are spinning it out to be a standalone podcast series. You've already heard conversations with people like actors Mark Hamill, Malcolm McDowell, and Beatles confidant Astrid Kershaw. But coming up, I talk to May Pang, who dated John Lennon in the mid-70s. I talk to double fantasy guitarist Earl Slick, Apple Records creative director John Kosh. I'll be talking to Jan Hayworth,

who designed the Sgt. Pepper album cover. Very cool. And I'll talk to singer Dion, who is one of only five people still alive who were on the Sgt. Pepper cover. And two of those people were Beatles. The stories they tell are amazing. So thank you for making this series such a success. And please, do me a favor, follow the Beatleology interviews on your podcast app. You don't even have to be a huge Beatles fan, you just have to love storytelling.

Subscribe now, and don't miss a single beat. This is an apostrophe podcast production. This is an apostrophe podcast production. Beatleology. I hear the beat I hear the beat I hear the beat I hear the beat I hear the beat I hear the beat I hear the beat I hear the beat I hear the beat I hear the beat I hear the beat I hear the beat I hear the beat I hear the beat I hear the beat I hear the beat I hear the beat I hear the beat I hear the beat I hear the beat I hear the beat I hear the beat I hear the beat I hear the beat I hear the beat I hear the beat

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I hear the beat I hear the beat I hear the beat I hear the beat I hear the beat I hear the beat I hear the beat I hear the beat We talked to top collectors around the world in auction houses, as well as celebrity collectors and people who knew and worked with the Beatles.

Those interviews stayed in my office drawer for 25 years. So we thought it would be interesting to dust them off. Actor Mark Hamill was an army brat. His dad was a U.S. Navy captain, so the Hamill family moved around a lot. One of seven children, Mark was born in Oakland, California in 1951. His family then moved from California to New York, back to California, then to Pennsylvania, then Virginia, and then Mark finished his high school in Yokohama, Japan. His first acting credit was for the Soap Opera General Hospital when he was only 12 years old. He went on to have guest roles on shows in the 70s like The Partridge Family, Room 222, and One Day at a Time.

Then in 1977, he landed a role in a movie that nobody had high hopes for. As a matter of fact, the studio had to package that movie with another film titled The Other Side of Midnight just so that the theaters would take it. They would be glad they did. That movie was Star Wars.

Mark's portrayal of Luke Skywalker would become legendary. The movie would spawn all kinds of toys and memorabilia. Mark Hamill is a collectible, so it's interesting that he also collects memorabilia, specifically Beatles memorabilia. Back in 1999, I had directed Mark in a couple of radio commercials, and between takes we realized we were both big Beatles fans. So we arranged to talk to Mark about the Beatles

and his collection. I can tell you one thing, he knows his Beatles collectibles, and he has some great stories about the Beatles he has they hit the stage on the Ed Sullivan show in 1964. He initially thought they were a novelty act. You know, even before they were on Ed Sullivan, it took me a while to put it all together, but there was a girl up the street, and we all had singles, and I bought my sister's singles, and we were playing these singles back and forth. And she played for me in the summer of 63, From Me to You by The Beatles. And I remember there was no picture sleeve or anything. And I thought the harmonies were reminiscent of Buddy Holly and the Everly Brothers, I thought. It sounds kind of like the Everly Brothers,

but they sound beed up or something. It wasn't later until I Want to Hold Your Hand came out and they were just gigantic out of nowhere in February of 64 that I said, hey, wait a minute. Those are those same guys. I thought they were like a novelty group like the Chipmunks. You know what I mean? I didn't have a visual. I didn't look at a picture sleeve and know who they were. It said The Beatles, and it reminded me of the Crickets. And I thought it was some kind of novelty group. I remember really liking that song, but I didn't pursue it. I didn't go and try and find more songs by The Beatles. I mean, it was one in a whole stack of records. But when I was thinking about doing this interview, I was thinking, when was the first time I heard them? And for the most part, it was everybody heard them on the Ed Sullivan show. But I remember even back then, it clicked. I went back to her house. What was her name? Nancy Maher,

I think her name was. And I said, wow, you know, we heard the Beatles six months before anybody else. We had no idea they were a huge hit in England already. Mark was 18 when he started collecting Beatles memorabilia, again, courtesy of a neighbor up the street. I'm the middle of seven children, so I was really sort of predisposed to be really ready for the Beatles arrival, because my older brothers and sisters listened, obviously, to popular music, and I was able to hear wildly diverse groups from the Shirelles to the Kingston Trio to James Brown. We all watched American Bandstand and whatnot. So when the Beatles really hit big, which I remember as being early 1964, February, being on Ed Sullivan and whatnot. They just knocked me out. I mean, I've always loved the music. Hard Day's Night was a movie that I think people that even weren't receptive to their music loved as a great film.

And to me, that will always be on my top ten favorite movies ever. But it was always the music. I mean, obviously, they were intriguing from the way they looked and their accents and being from a culture that I wasn't familiar with all were part of it, but the music was the thing that I loved so much. Ironically, at first, future collector Mark thought all the Beatles' merchandising was goofy. So I sort of laughed at the merchandising aspect of things.

I mean, it seemed to me that the magazines and the little Beatle dolls and coloring books or whatever that was out there was silly. And I didn't have enough disposable income to get into that anyway i mean it was enough to try and get everybody to get the latest release record was but very simply what happened was in 1970 the fact that they were breaking up came as a great shock i mean no one had seen had seen, or I hadn't seen, Let It Be, where they weren't really getting along very well and having troubles. It was just a tremendous shock. And that combined with the fact that a friend of a friend said to me that he knew this girl down the street that was going to college, she needed some quick cash, and she was selling her Beatles memorabilia collection which like I

say up until that time I had never really thought of in terms of following the group and following their music and watching their movies and seeing them on on Ed Sullivan whatnot you know I grew the day that I passed up the Beatles flip your wig game for a dollar ninety99 down at Penny's. When I heard that she was selling her whole collection, it suddenly had a different meaning to me, because now the group was not going to be together anymore. They weren't going to be recording together

anymore, and it just seemed to me that it would be fun to, and this was already in retrospect, because it was 1970, so these were items that already, even then, were sort of like keach or, you know, sort of fond memories of being 11, 12, 13 years old when they first came out. So I asked her, what do you think it's worth? And she said, oh, I don't know, like $100? And I said, you know what? I'll give

you, I remember the number was, yeah, I have $118. I'll give you that. And she was happy and I was happy. And now I look back on it. It's like an incredible, I mean, I wasn't really trying to finesse some sweet deal for myself, but it was both lunchboxes, the yellow submarine lunchbox, the blue lunchbox that had their foreheads on it, all four bobbing head dolls, the Coke tray, a tea towel, I think it was. I don't know how many pieces exactly, but I do know that even five years later, when Beatles collecting sort of was coming into its own, I knew I'd done well by myself, and almost by accident. I'd never really collected anything before, and I got a terrific starter set with that one collection.

And I continued to collect, oh, I don't know, I guess I really stopped in the late 80s, when it was really getting precious. The prices and so forth were the kind of things where it had leapt. I remember the last couple of things I bought wincing when I paid for the Revell model kit. I bought all four of those and I thought they were way overpriced and I sort of bit the bullet because I really wanted them. Yeah, I'm always sorry I didn't buy an extra set of those Revell kits and build them

too. They're not shrink-wrapped. I mean, they're all open and you open the box and they're in the plastic bag. But it's funny because, I mean, I did such a turnabout because I sort of ridiculed that kind of stuff when it was current. I'd go into the stores and go, can you believe this? A flip your wig game. What kind of dork would play this? I was saving up that $3.98 to get the Help soundtrack or whatever. And all the I Love Paul magazines or Love Beads and stickers and all that,

I didn't really do that. I just thought that was kind of a girl thing. And now they have just such a quaint appeal and just brings back memories of such simpler and happier times. I really love my Beatles collection. I would never sell it. I'm just glad I was able to see at the time. I mean, 1970, it seemed to me, wow, that's true.

I was coming to terms with them not recording again. And I thought, I want some physical memories other than the vinyl albums, to remember them in their heyday. Mr. Hamill also added a few items to his collection when he was up here in Canada, in Gastown, Vancouver, to be exact. And I came upon this store, and I thought, again, the prices were higher than obviously when I started collecting, but much more reasonable than some of the places,

obviously, in New York and in California. I remember really wanting that Beatles talc in the blue metal tin sink at Hidey Ho. They wanted $750 for it. And I thought, you know, I guess I could have done it, but that's not the way to get these things. I think the most satisfying finds are the garage sale sort of finds or finding things in your attic. I was interested to know if Luke Skywalker can casually shop at garage sales. Well, that's another thing. Not so much in terms of the Beatles collecting.

When I would go to comic book conventions and ask a price of a certain book, I'd get a quote, and I'd send a friend back to ask about the same book, and they were always lower for them than they were for me. Yeah, I think people just assume that money is no object for me, and that's not true. I mean, even someone that's wealthy, I think, would want to maximize their buying power, not just going to go out and waste their money. I mean, that's part of the fun of collecting, I think, is the search and then getting it for something that's not so exorbitant, you know?

John Lennon often complained, later in life, that people always jacked up the prices on things when they knew he was interested in buying. Even when he was purchasing a car, he would send his assistant to buy it anonymously. It's one of the downsides of celebrity life that often they have to buy things through a second party. Well, it's something certainly you have to be aware of, yeah, because it's supply and

demand. And I have a problem with that. And when I do signatures for Star Wars fans, because I'm happy to personalize it, it makes me a little nervous when people say, well, don't put it to anyone specifically. I don't know who I'm going to give it to. And you know that that's going to be resold. So I've tried to not gouge the fans, if at all possible. You know, I make exceptions.

I don't have a hard and fast rule. But for the most part, I'd much rather personalize. And you know right away if they are fans. Because they say, oh, yeah, put it to Jim. And they have no problem with that. You know, the ones that squirm and say, can you sign nine things and don't put it to anyone? Well, you know that you're just sort of enabling dealers. They have a right to do what they do,

but especially since I have some experience being a collector, I try and be mindful of the fans that are going to eventually want to buy something. So do you do most of your collecting, Mark, as you travel doing the business you do? For example, you'll just be in a town like Vancouver and you'll just kind of search out if you have a free afternoon. Is that how you do your collecting? Yeah, it is exactly how I do it. In fact, some of the best things I've ever come across were

because I was in a place I wouldn't ordinarily have been on location or so forth. And we'll rent a car and drive across. I find a lot of times you can find like these five and dime type stores in, let's say, Tallahassee or somewhere in the deep South and not just Beatles, but you'll find things that are appealing to you. Let's say, you know, there are people that will pay $100,000 for a mint or near mint copy of Action One. But, you know, my dad would say, hey, it says 10 cents. Why do you want to charge me all of that? You know, I mean, it's whatever it's worth to you.

I was interested to know, conversely, if there were avenues open to celebrities that wouldn't be open to the rest of us when it comes to collecting. Because there must be connections to connections that could give a celebrity access to some very interesting items. You know, it hasn't happened to me really. I haven't had that happen where someone says, I know somebody at Capitol Records and they're clearing out their file cabinets or whatever. That hasn't really happened. And you know know, it's funny, too, because one of my favorite bands was the Kinks. And over the years, you know, I've become friends with Dave Davies and to a certain extent with Ray. And, you know, I've gone to their homes and seen things that you go, oh, my gosh, that'd be great. I'd love to have that. But, you know, it's not something I really have asked or posed upon them or said, hey, can you guys get into the Reprise Library or whatever?

I mean, I don't think I've ever really taken advantage of the fact that I've known people. So, no, I don't think so. I mean, like I say, I haven't really collected that much in the last, I mean, I've really tapered off. I feel like I have a really nice collection, and there's obviously, there's always things that you don't have that would be nice to have. What's your most cherished piece of your collection, would you say? Oh, let's see. Let me think of the things that I like. Because I think the sillier, the better.

I mean, I love the Beatles hose. You know, with the little, I think there's little guitars and little mop top heads woven through them. You know, I mean, I obviously haven't had my wife put them on, but they're that black lace sort of. I love the Wing Ding tennis shoes. I have those in a box. And again, I mean, I'm going back to when I think I paid $25 for them. I don't know what they're worth now, but then again, I'm not somebody who has ever sold a piece.

Answer? The Wing Ding Beetle sneakers in nice condition are worth around $1,500 US or $2,000 Canadian. The box they came in alone is worth $500 now. No kidding. Now, see, now, I would never really sell these things. And, you know, I have three children. I'm always telling them, when I'm gone, make sure you know the value of these things. I mean, for someone that's not really Beatles-oriented, or whether it's Golden Age comic books or

whatever, I mean, because I sort of have an eclectic collection of board games and puppets. That's one of the things I did buy at Gastown, too, was I think it was an unauthorized Beatles marionette. And that's another fun thing for Beatles collectors, too, because there's a world of non-licensed or unauthorized toys out there, whether they're the cake decorations or, you know, the bugs, the Beatles, B-E-E-T-L-E-S. You know, there's lots of stuff out there. Mark has been lucky enough to meet a couple of Beatles in his travels through the galaxy.

I met Ringo and I met George on an airplane. I sent a little note over. He was across from me and I didn't want to bother him, but I gave the stewardess a note and just said, you know, dear George, you know, thanks for the music and being so much a part of my life. And when she gave the note, you know, she said, well, he said, you'd like to say hi. So, you know, I rushed over, you know, and I basically repeated what I said in the note, which was that, you know, their music had meant so much to me in my life

and it's music that I've, you know, shared with my children and that I still treasure so much. It was around the time of his 33 and a third album, and I, at that time, really was a big booster of the album, thinking that it was my favorite of his solo projects up until that time, because it had such a whimsical air to it, sort of light on the Hare Krishna aspects of things.

I didn't tell him that. I just said, you know, it's really fun and great, and I love Cracker Barrel's Palace and all that. It was weird because I got a lump in my throat talking to him, almost like I was in the principal's office. You want to talk, but you're starting getting overwhelmed with emotions, which shows me what a fan I am. I just didn't know what to say.

I just said, you know, just thanks so much. I just think you're so great. And he looked up and he said, you're not so bad yourself. I could have just fallen over. You know, it was just great. And Ringo, I just bumped into at a club in London. They had told us where to sit. You see, now I wasn't a member or anything.

I was sort of like getting comped because of my, you know, sort of dubious celebrity quality. So they sat us in this one area and the next thing I know, Ringo came over and sat down.

And I said, Ringo, Ringo Starr, I'm Mark Hamill. Oh, it's so great to meet you. And I hugged him

and he winced in severe pain. I had no idea that he had had some kind of accident in Italy in a car. Turns out his ribs were taped. So here I was doing the last thing you would ever want to do to someone that you admire so much, physically hurt the man. You know, he couldn't have been nicer. I mean, he didn't curse me out or anything. And, you know, I'm not a huggy kind of guy, believe me. I don't, you know, kiss and hug and do all this, but I just lost it. It was a different situation than the airplane. I mean, it was like a social situation and we had been partying and dancing and it was, I don't know, two in the

morning and it just seemed the right thing to do at the time. It was wrong. Mark brings up a very interesting point. May Pang, who dated Lennon in the mid-70s when he had separated from Yoko, wrote a book about those days. In it, May recounts a time when she and Lennon went to a party in New York. There were all sorts of rock and roll stars there, like David Bowie and Lou Reed.

John and Mae stayed for a little while, but nobody was coming up to talk to John. So they eventually left. On the way home, John looked sad and Mae said, what's wrong? John said, I don't think they like me. And Mae turned to him and said, are you kidding?

They're totally in awe of you. They say there are rock stars and then there are Beatles. And it's interesting that Mark had that same kind of reaction to George. Celebrities are always surrounded by other celebrities, but there are still people that even make celebrities nervous. You know, I've seen John in New York at least twice, once with Yoko and once just by himself. One time on Columbus Avenue when I was on foot and I walked by and I knew who it was

and I turned around and watched him walk off. But one of the things that had made an impact on me was the fact that he had sort of praised New York as being a place where he could walk down the street and not be accosted. So I made a real effort not to turn into Mr. Fanboy. And I saw him again with Yoko in Central Park. And again, I looked at them and realized who it was, but made a conscious effort not to ask them a question or cost them in any way. I just, you know, thought, wow, isn't that great?

There they are, and here I am in New York, and there they are in New York. One of the ironic things was that Sean had gone to my oldest son's school, Ethical Culture. Nathan was going to school there. And he said, who is your favorite Beatle? I'd have to say John, although I love them all. When we heard that Sean had seen Empire Strikes Back or something, he must have been just a little kid then. It's a terrible story, really, because I heard from my people that they wanted me to come by and see Sean, you know, and bring him a picture

or whatever. And I was really excited. Are you kidding? I get to go to the Dakota and meet them and everything. And it was around, I think, towards the end of November. And I said, you know what, with all that's going on with the holidays and everything, why don't we just wait until after Christmas, first or second week in January, we'll work it all out. And of course, you know, that horrible day in December. So, I mean, it was really my fault if I acted on it immediately. But, you know, that's selfish, too. I mean, to me, that still strikes me as really the worst of the assassinations in this country or anywhere, because it was the first one that wasn't political, that it was entertainment related. To this day, it's just so tragic. John Lennon's assassination had a very specific impact on other celebrities, especially ones that have a fanatical following.

Mark is one of those celebrities because Star Wars fans can be intense. Not long after John's death, Mark was appearing on Broadway starring in The Elephant Man. I would not try to pretend that I had any kind of impact that he had. I don't want to compare myself in any way to his impact on pop culture or the art scene or anything else.

All I'm saying is that I was doing a play at the time and everyone got very nervous and the producers of The Elephant Man assigned me a bodyguard, which I'd never had before, nor had I ever thought of one. And he'd pick me up at my apartment, and each night,

he would drop me off and pick me up at a different place. I mean, it was really covert CIA kind of nonsense, where you would get a little slip of paper where you would know where to be picked up, and they were dropping me off at theaters. Did you know that all the theaters in New York are connected underground? It's the turn of the century. They move furniture and scenery that way. No kidding. But you can, like, enter at the Belasco and go through these underground quarters and come up at the Court Theater.

It's really strange. I mean, so we're in these underground labyrinths and walking by and say, hey, there's Jason Troward. He's going to his show and I'm going to my show. It got a little weird. I mean, eventually I just said, you know what? I can't deal with this. I mean, it's too spooky in a way because he was like an ex-Green Beret, this guy.

And he started making me really nervous about just living. And again, I mean, I wouldn't guess that I would be the focus of it, but you never know. When you tap into people's fantasies and into their, I don't know, into their subconscious, I mean, we have people calling up and saying, well, you know, Darth Vader is the Antichrist and you're blocking his re-entry into the world. I mean, you get letters that get marked by the FBI and stuff, and they turn them over to you if there's threats and so forth. So it's a little bit scary. For the most part, not had any problems whatsoever, but it is a little scary.

Side note, I had seen The Elephant Man on Broadway in 1980 when David Bowie was in the starring role. In a subsequent interview, Bowie said that on the December 9th performance, there were three empty seats in the front rows. Two of them were to be for John and Yoko, but the third was purchased by Mark David Chapman, Lennon's killer. Knowing that,

Bowie said he almost didn't make it through the performance. On a less scary note, we asked Mark what his go-to Beatle album was. Oh, wow, that'd be a good one. Oh, boy, that's really tough. I'd have probably, I would say, Rubber Soul. I love that album. I mean, it's so hard for you guys to pin me down, you know,

because as soon as I say Rubber Soul, I go, well, but what about Revolver? Rubber Soul was a real transition album out of the mop top era, and that makes it an interesting choice. It's a transition album. That's my problem. The Beatles, if people remember, never appear the same way twice. They were the mop tops, and they were never exactly the same twice. And even at the time, there was sort of regret of leaving the mop top era behind and getting into

the more cerebral stuff that sort of culminated or peaked with Sgt. Pepper. But I sort of regretted losing the happy-go-lucky hard days, nights, because they were funny. I mean, this is a rock group that was really funny. As they got more serious and we were all growing up, I remember the first time we put the needle down on Rubber Soul and were just stunned by Norwegian Wood saying, what's that twangy guitar? What's that weird twangy?

I mean, they were just amazing. I don't think there's any more magical entity that has ever been in showbiz, not in my lifetime. You know, my mom, maybe it was Frank Sinatra and maybe my older brother Elvis. But for me personally, there was no more magical entity that ever graced this planet and the Beatles. Because Mark is a Beatles collector, well, we just had to ask him if he collected Star Wars memorabilia. No, I don't. As a matter of fact, I said to George,

could you make sure that I get one of everything? I thought there's going to be a soundtrack album, there'll be a t-shirt. I knew there was going to be a comic book. I never foresaw electric toothbrushes, wallpaper, and all of it. But once they started sending me these big brown mailing boxes filled with this stuff, all it said on the side was Kenner, you see. And my son was, by the time of the last picture, Jedi, he was very into this. You know, he loved the Muppets and he loved Star Wars.

And I remember thinking at the time, well, this all will be collectible. But what kind of dad would I be to not let him play with this stuff and put it up on a shelf? Because to me, I've never been a dealer. He never said, oh, you're going to get two of these and hold on to one and sell the other one. It's just, to me, you buy what you like, you buy what pleases you, you buy what sort of brings back pleasant memories of childhood. But I'm not into that dealer mindset. So I let him have everything. You know, I just let him open it up. And then his brother came along. And of course, now they're looking through price guides saying, why did you let me play with Princess Leia?

Give her that Sinead O'Connor haircut, you know. Or, you know, her head is on the end of a pencil in their toy box with just dots for hair. And, you know, they see in the box it's worth, you know, whatever it's worth. But you can't win because if I had put everything away, the only thing I did actually put away were the toys that came from Japan. They were like die-cast metal, and they shot little discs and little projectiles and whatever. So I said, ew, I mean, they're great toys, don't get me wrong, but that C-3PO is a great bludgeon as well as a great toy. And it's got all this intricate die-cast metal. So I put those away.

I put those up in the attic. And now, of course, they're all up in the box. The only thing I've kept nice are the Japanese toys. Trivia question. What Star Wars actor appeared in a music video with Ringo? Answer after this. in a music video with Ringo? After this Actor Carrie Fisher appeared in the music video for Ringo's hit, You're Sixteen, You're Beautiful and You're Mine. She played Ringo's love interest. While Mark owns Beatles collectibles, he is also a collectible himself. Star Wars memorabilia is big, big business. We wondered if it was an odd feeling knowing that people collected him.

Yeah, well, you know, that's probably why it was fun for me. I think I got a kick out of all the pop aspects of being made into dolls and bubblegum cards and comics because I had experienced before. When you find it particularly trying in terms of fans scrambling for minutia and picking up things you threw away and so forth, what puts it in perspective, because I said, oh, this is nutty. Why would they care?

I think having been a Beatles fan, I understand it in a way because I was someone who was very interested in everything they did and said. You know what I mean? It kind of puts it in perspective. Because my wife will point that out. You know, like, you think that's wacky.

What about when you paid $140 for the Beetle shampoo or whatever? The Soakies. The two Soakies. I got the Ringo and Paul Soakies. In the early days of Beatlemania, Colgate made Beatle bubble bath dolls called Sokeys. But they only made Paul and Ringo dolls

because they were the most popular Beatles at that time. They are worth about $1,000 U.S. today. John and George Sokeys were never issued. I mentioned to Mark that I own the publishing contract for the song Helter Skelter, signed by John Lennon.

It's a notorious song because it had that weird connection to Charles Manson. That comes from the White Album, where I remember thinking in high school, this almost is like a solo album. Or you could tell who wrote the main part of it, whoever took lead or so forth. But there were definite John songs, there were definite George songs, there were definite Paul songs or Ringo songs for that matter. But it seemed to me that they were headed in that direction. And in retrospect, it's a shame that they couldn't have gone off and done solo turns and let George do All Things Must Pass and let McCartney do McCartney and let Johns do Plastic Ono Band, but then come back together.

And my daughter was asking me, you know, she's really kind of concerned in the time frame of things, you know, like, how old were you in the 50s and how old were you in the 60s and all that? What's your favorite era? And I said, oh, no doubt, the 60s. And to me, there's two parts to the 60s. There's pre-Beatles and post-Beatles because for us, from 64 on, it was like an embarrassment of riches. I mean, when I look at what's on the top 10 back in 1966, as opposed to what my younger brother had,

when he was in high school, the village people were the number one group in America. That's right. And I'm thinking, boy, it's really sad, because not only do we have all of the British invasion, but the San Francisco band and Motown and Stax and Chess Records. You know, I guess you only appreciate things when they're gone. We had read somewhere that while George Lucas was planning Star Wars, he was influenced

by the cover of Rubber Soul. That the look the Beatles were sporting on that album in the high-neck jackets influenced the Harrison Ford hand-solo leather jacket look. Not sure, but I do know that when I came back to do the last one, my idea for Luke in the last one, I told him my idea and he had this look on his face like, are you insane? Because I thought, I said, Luke should come back really sort of hard and gnarled. He should have sort of like a crew cut and a eagle's claw earring and a big scar across his cheek, and bandoliers. But I wanted to go for this really different look.

And I mean, to answer your question about whether it was influenced by Rebel Soul, I don't know that to be true, but I do know that he was more adamant about Luke having that same haircut in the third one as he did in the first. And I really sort of fought against it because I felt like he's changed in these three movies and he's got to evolve and he's got to come back and be a really badass Jedi now. And he was a little more accommodating with some of the more peripheral characters, but he was really strongly against my idea. And as you see, I had that same haircut in the third one as I did in the first but

you know people have sort of hypothesized that Luke is sort of a George surrogate you know that he is more opinionated about my character than anybody else's because that's the one that sort of stands in for him but in terms of the look of the pictures I mean I think it's really smart to make it look really well used and lived in and beat up and gnarled and dented rather than the sort of pristine, antiseptic look of a 2001, which, again, works perfectly well in that picture, but wasn't meant to be what we were after. But that's interesting. No, I'd never heard that before. Mark not only collected Beatles memorabilia, he was also an avid comic book collector.

Also, too, there's overlaps, because, I mean, being a comic book collector, there are a lot of Beatles crossovers in comic books. Some of the romance comic books had Beatles covers or stories. There's the Beatles life story, and I have two copies of that. I never got a copy that had the poster. And what was in the Yellow Submarine comic? So I have that, but I don't have the pullout. The pullout is gone.

We mentioned to Mark that Beatleology magazine had a rare home movie of John Lennon at the Record Plant recording studio in New York, and he's sitting around watching The Empire Strikes Back. That gives me the chills, but he liked that, watching you. One of the biggest regrets of my life is my mom said to me, you can either go to the concert, this was in Washington, D.C., that one where they had to turn, where Ringo had to turn his own drum kit around, and she said, you can go to that, or I'll give you the money

to buy their new album. And at the time, I thought I made a really, the best choice, because I said, well, I don't want to go. There'll be all those girls screaming. You won't be able to hear them. It did make me a little uncomfortable, you know, the whole Beatlemania aspect of it. Because, I mean, I was not moved to get hysterical, you know.

I just loved their music. And it kills me, because, you know, I thought I was so smart. And I said, yeah, and a record lasts forever. The Beatles not only brought their music to North America, they also brought aspects of British life with them. It was the first time we really came in contact with British culture. I mean, my mom was a big Alec Guinness fan, so she took us to see Alec Guinness movies, and we were big Peter Sellers fans.

But before the Beatles, I mean, we really didn't know that much about that whole culture. And I mean, I became a big Anglophile. I mean, we all loved Monty Python. But, you know, that was part of the fun of going to make the Star Wars movies because they were made in England. I was picking up all those Beatles monthlies like in 1976 in used bookstores and they were really affordable, $3 and $4 a piece. And you know, that's the wonderful thing about Beatles memorabilia is that there's endless product out there. I don't know who has the best collection in the world, but whoever does probably doesn't have everything. I mean, I just got a, not too long ago, a blue meanie,

what is it? It's a Halloween costume. Again, I had no idea that existed. I don't know where I was. It was 69, 70 when the Elephant Marine came Again, I had no idea that existed. I don't know where I was. It was 69, 70 when the Elephant Marine came out. I think some of that merchandise is the hardest to find. That blue meanie Halloween costume is worth more than a thousand bucks today. Yeah, I'm sure. Based on what I paid for my blue meanie costume. My gosh. And of course, it still has the sticker on it. It's like 298. For someone who has experienced a lot of fame, we wondered what Mark's take was on what the Beatles had been

subjected to. In Anthology, George said the Beatles gave up their nervous systems. And later in life, George's wife Olivia said he couldn't deal with loud sounds. Lennon was most paranoid when he was in a car in New York and stopped at a red light. He was afraid fans might swarm the car, like they did back in the Beatlemania days.

He couldn't shake that fear. It was almost PTSD. Yeah, well, it's nutty, isn't it? We started the tour before the movie came out, and then it came out while we were on tour, and we landed in Chicago, and there were all these mobs of people. I turned to Harrison, and I went, wow, there must be somebody famous on this plane, you know,

thinking it was like Ted Kennedy or something. And then we realized, hey, look, there's somebody dressed like Carrie. There's somebody dressed like Luke. I mean, it's fun to have had the precedence of the Beatles. And again, it was nowhere near, and I don't want to indicate that I'm comparing us in any way, but in terms of just pop culture, I mean, there were moments where you thought this must have been what it was like for them all the time. There was one time where we got, I guess it was the opening of Empire in New York, and

we were at the Astor Plaza, and there was such a mob in the lobby, we got separated from the guys that were sort of like hustling us through. We ducked out a side door, and people were actually chasing us down the street, I mean, running. I mean, we were running. I thought, what would happen if they caught us? It's silly, isn't it? But we were

grown-ups running full speed down the street looking for our car to jump into, and when we eventually found it, we jumped in the car, and he pulled away. There were people, like, throwing themselves over the front of the car and stuff, and I thought, wow, that's about as close to Beatlemania as you'll ever get, but you just put put in perspective and try and keep your sanity but again like i say it must have been tenfold for those guys i mean you couldn't go anywhere i don't think and you never realize how much you prize anonymity until it's completely gone i mean you strive for fame i mean you're not really striving for fame. You're striving for success. And with success becomes this sort of notoriety. And then you realize, gee, that's one of the things you like to do as an actor.

You like to observe people. And it's hard to observe people if they're observing you. You know, it's a mixed blessing. And people say, oh, boo-hoo, it's so sad for you. You know, you're famous when you hear actors complain about that. But I understand it because here they were all striving for recognition and to be a successful band. And they got it in spades. And I don't think there's anything comparable to the kind of impact they had.

And, you know, it must have been manifested in their lives. They couldn't go anywhere, could they? They couldn't go just pop off and go see a movie or whatever. When you talk about the Beatles, it's not just the albums, and it's not just the music, it's not just the number of records sold, and it's not just the style trends they set. It's everything. They were a cultural phenomenon. I mean, call me an old fogey, but I have never seen anything that comes close to the kind of impact on so many levels

that the Beatles had. You know, the way all things came together. I mean, people hypothesized that it was looking for something in the Depression after losing JFK and this and that and the other thing. When you look at their history and you see the way history conspired to make them make, even their impact on England. I mean, we all look to the Ed Sullivan broadcast,

but that Saturday that they appeared on some British television show, and it just happened to fall on a day when it was like one of the worst blizzards in the history of England, and it was a one of the worst blizzards in the history of England and it was a slow news week. I think like 85% of the population saw them on whatever it was. I think it was pre-Top of the Pops, but it's fun. I mean, it's fun reading about their history and I really enjoyed Backbeat as well of acknowledging that sort of leather jacketed, greased pompadour. I just loved everything Beatles, and that's why I loved your magazine.

And, I mean, they'll never be replaced. I mean, they're the greatest. Many thanks to the wonderful Mark Hamill. As I write this, Mark is here in Toronto at TIFF, premiering not one, but two films, The Wild Robot and a Stephen King adaptation titled The Life of Chuck. It's Mark's 61st year on screen. He began acting the year he first heard The Beatles, way back in 1963.

I'm Terry O'Reilly. This special bonus episode was recorded in the Terrastream Mobile Recording Studio. Director, Callie O'Reilly. Producer, Debbie O'Reilly. Chief Sound Engineer, Jeff Devine. Tunes provided by APM Music. Follow me on social at Terry O'Influence. This podcast is powered by ACAST.

And stay tuned for more Beatles interviews coming up. There you are, alone in your car, waiting at a red light. Suddenly, there she is, pressed against your window, holding a homemade cardboard sign. Can you really tell what it says about her? Don't let homelessness assumptions get in the way of homelessness solutions. Go to CanadaCanDoIt.ca. Help the Canadian Alliance to end homelessness.