We Need To Talk with Paul C. Brunson - Born With No Limbs: I Didn't Want To Be Their Poster Child! Briel Adams-Wheatley

Episode Date: June 23, 2026

Briel Adams-Wheatley, content creator and advocate, opens up about being born with no arms and no legs, being left in hospital by her birth mother, and growing up in a large Mormon family where her story was often treated as a miracle. She reflects on the pressure to be strong from a young age, being bullied, pushed harder than her siblings, and learning to perform happiness while privately struggling. Briel also shares how she was set up to inspire others through public speaking, even when the words she delivered were written by someone else. In this conversation, Briel speaks candidly about coming out, feeling used by the church, the conflict between faith and identity, and the moment she told her family: “You’re not God, you don’t get to damn me.” She also opens up about dating after trauma, finding safety with her husband Adam, and why they are getting married again after her transition. Honest, emotional and deeply human, this is Briel Adams-Wheatley like you’ve never seen her before. Briel Adams-Wheatley, We Need To Talk This conversation includes discussion of sexual assault. Please take care while watching. We’ve included links to support resources below: MIND:  https://linkly.link/2dx8b    The Survivor’s Trust: https://linkly.link/2kE8q    Follow us here: https://www.instagram.com/needtotalk   https://www.tiktok.com/@weneedtotalkpod   Sign up to our newsletter https://linkly.link/2eXHX Follow Briel here: https://www.instagram.com/no_limbs_ https://www.tiktok.com/@no_limbs_ (00:00) Intro (01:46) Briel’s Birth and Adoption (04:39) Statistics Around Hand Heart Syndrome (10:49) Forced To Be Independent (14:26) Bullying At Home And School (21:29) “I Think I Like Boys” (25:42) Raised To Be The Mormon Miracle (28:17) The Good Parts of Briel’s Childhood (30:06) How Briel’s Parents Taught Her to Swim (32:34) How Briel Got Into Dancing (35:47) Briel’s Relationship With Her Mother Today (37:04) Paul Surprises Briel With A Letter (40:23) Huel Ad (41:34) Coming Out To Everyone At Once (47:18) Briel’s Experience Giving Motivational Speeches (54:07) How Makeup Changed Everything (58:43) Shopify Ad (59:54) Coming Out as Trans (01:06:01) Briel’s Dating History (01:10:47) The First Relationship That Felt Safe (01:18:25) Adam’s Letter To Briel (01:22:49) Why Briel Stepped Away From Mormonism (01:23:57) What Briel Wants Next (01:25:47) Being Trans In America Today (01:28:41) Advice For Anyone Questioning Their Gender Identity (01:30:57) Most Memorable Conversation (01:34:37) Paul’s Takeaways Huel - Try Huel Lite Ramen - the new lighter instant noodle. Under 230 calories, 25g protein, ready in 5 minutes.Use code WNTT for £10 off at https://www.uk.huel.com/wnttNew customers only. Minimum spend required. Offer valid until 30 days after June 30th. Shopify: www.shopify.co.uk/needtotalk Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

When my mom found out that I had norms and legs, she just left me in the hospital. And I went on this lane with this adoption lady, hoping that they would find a family for me. Can you let us in to your mind and to your thoughts? Real Adam Wheatley, truly an inspiration. I was being set up to be the face for the Mormon church and share my story of how inspiring in the miracles.

Did you feel used? I started to realize that I was not only physically different, but also I was feeling trans. But then I remember telling my two older sisters, I think I like boys, and they both were just like, well, duh, but you can't do anything because the parents aren't okay with that. So I was like, no, I'm not playing this game.

You're not God. You don't get to damn me anywhere. He will do that at my last days, not you. I was sexually assaulted and it happened several other times with other people. I'm like already wanting to cry. It really wasn't until when I first had met my husband, I met my husband, and I realized there are good people out there.

Being a trans woman in the United States of America today, do you have hope about the future? All right, before we again, hit follow and tap the bell icon. It allows us to continue bringing you this show that we all love. We can go anywhere in the world right now. I'm in L.A. And we'll bring you the most phenomenal guess. And the only thing it cost you is to hit follow and tap the bell icon. Can we begin?

Yeah. In Brazil. Okay. So this is where you're born. Yeah. All right. Now, tell me about what you know about your birth parents and family. So I don't know a whole lot.

What I do know is that my mom was not expecting to have me. She had already had four other kids before. me. I was 13 years later down the road as a surprise and then found out that my birth dad also had another family off to the side. Oh my goodness. And so she's like, what do I do? Then when she found out that I had norms and legs, she just left me in the hospital because there was nothing else that she really could do at that time, at least in her mind. And so, and there was a family in Utah that was adopting another girl from Brazil, but we were both coming on the same plane with the same adoption lady hoping that they would find a family for me. And so my adopted mom's like, oh my gosh,

I would take that little boy in a second, not even knowing what that was all going to entail. And then she went home and she just couldn't get me out of her head. And then she brought it up to my adopted dad. And my dad was like, no, are you crazy? Like sit down. You're nine months pregnant with your 11th child on a seminary teacher's income. There's no way that we can afford to adopt. let alone one with a physical disability. Like, what are we supposed to do for that little boy? And she's like, I don't know. I just feel like you need to pray about it also.

And he's like, okay, so he went to the Mormon church, went to the Mormon temple, and he had a vision of me and the baby that my adoptive mom was, my adoptive mom was pregnant with, and us growing up being best friends and him always being by my side to make sure that I would always have help if I ever needed anything. So then he came home and he's like,

okay, let's get this little boy. So they called the adoption, And the adoption agency just laughed at her on the phone. They're like, I'm sorry, Ms. Adams. That's not happening. Like, you have 11 children and you're on a sonar teacher income. Right. No.

So the following week, they had a meeting with board members, and they just stopped for a second, and their whole room went silent. And someone's just like, no, like, this is the perfect family for this little boy. They already have 11 children and two loving parents that are wanting to be in this child's life and willing to do whatever it takes. This little boy has been in the hospital for the last nine months with only attention from the nurses and doctors. He needs all the stimulation that he can get. This family's perfect. Let's figure out a way to make it work.

Wow, look at that. So everything was falling into place. Can we unpack? There's a lot to unpacking that. And that is incredible. And some, I think, would say that that's a miracle. Definitely. That happened.

Do you consider that to be a miracle? Oh, 100%. When you were born, you were born. Is it Hanheart syndrome? Yep. Okay. So what is Hanheart syndrome? So Hanheart syndrome is a birth defect that affects one in one million people,

especially here in the United States. It's very, very, very uncommon. but it's a defect in the body where it can affect either the limbs or fingers or toes or sometimes the jaw. And for my case, it affect all four limbs. Okay. All right. And I didn't realize that Hanhart could also impact your jaw. Okay.

So do you have any impact in your jaw? I had a cliff pellet and that was the only thing. Okay. All right. So there was some impact. So one is it's rare. to your point. There was some research that I was doing and I saw that there's there were only 30 incidents, only 30 incidents of Hanheart syndrome between mid-1930s all the way through to the 1990s.

And so you could see how rare it is. Okay. All I do know is that also when she found out that I was getting adopted, she chose to make it a closed adoption. So I have no idea who she actually is. And I've tried doing the test and everything to see if I could find. any sort of answer, but I haven't gotten super close yet. Okay. The closest I've gotten is just those nurses that held me as a baby and have the photos of me, but then holding me to the point where my head was starting to miss shape because I was only getting attention when they'd come in to do their rounds.

And there was a window outside my door is what we've been told. There was a window that would face the hallway, and I would be facing that way just watching the nurses and the doctors and people walk down the hallway. And that's why my head was starting to get super weirdly deformed. Okay, because you kept focus there because I would imagine you knew that when someone was coming in, you'd get some attention. Right. And that's what we're all looking for as a child. For you to be able to go back and meet your birth mother, what do you believe the first thing you would tell her or ask her?

I don't know. I've thought about that question a lot. Especially as of lately in my life. I think I would have to pause and just take it in for a few minutes and just stare at each other. And then I would just have to say to her, I forgive her. And thank you, honestly, because I have had a much better life than I think I would have ever had if I would have stayed in Brazil. Okay. Okay. The family of adoption, they had how many children?

They went on to have 13 biological children of their own. 13 biological children. Okay. They were busy. Yeah. Busy. That's two decades of being busy. Every other year she was pregnant, popping out one.

Wow. Okay. Do they go to Brazil? No, so that's the other crazy thing. So since the story did break national television and everything, the American Airlines heard about the story, and they just told my parents that they would fly me or my parents anywhere in the world to bring us together as a family.

So my parents didn't even have to leave the United States to get me. I was already brought to them. Wow. Do they talk about when they first saw you and was able to hold you what that experience was like? Yeah, that's even televised too. It was brought on by the news. The news came in and filmed it. And they had all my aunts and uncles there.

My grandparents from both sides of the family were there. All my siblings were there. And you can just see my mom starting to. to run up to the lady that had brought me to the United States to get ready to hold me. And she was already crying and just so excited to hold me. Wow. Okay. Okay.

So you then entered an incredibly loving family. Their surname was, or last name was the Adams. Yeah. So the Adams family, which is interesting. Don't give me a start. Oh, my gosh. Okay. So the Adams family, right?

If it wasn't for the Adams family, though, what do you suspect would have happened to you? I honestly don't know because nobody's built. Like my mom, she saw a life for me that I couldn't even see for myself for the longest time. And we bumped heads for so many years because of it because she wanted me to be so independent that I was like, are you crazy?

Like, no, I have norms and legs. Why do I need to do this? And she's like, that's why? you need to learn how to do it because there's not always going to be someone in the room to do it for you. And I don't want you to have to just sit around waiting for someone to do it for you. You should be able to just do it yourself. Even if it takes you an extra five minutes to the point where now I go to her house and I try to do something. And she's like, do you want me to just do it for you?

I'm like, no, you're the one that told me to do it myself. Right. Right. Right. So you become so independent. Mm-hmm. All right. So now let's, there are a few things that I'm going to surprise you with.

Okay. This is the first one. Okay. All right, get ready. Okay. So I'm going to hold this. I want you to tell me if you could recall what is happening in this. Yeah, that's our cute little photo from a family union.

We just got done riding motorcycles. My uncle had held me, I think, on his lap with the helmet on and everything. And my mom was just waiting for us to be done. When we had just gotten done, she took the photo with me. Okay. So this is, so how old are you in this? Oh, I want to say I'm probably six or seven. Okay.

You're six or seven. All right. So at six or seven, we can begin to remember and recollect certain things that are happening. So when you think back to that time, you're now living in Salt Lake City, Utah. Can you describe what you remember that life to feel like and be like? at a younger age, I was always struggling with the fact that I was being pushed harder than all my other siblings to do things to make sure that I would be able to be independent. And there was always that very tough love pressure to make sure that I was still putting in the work and doing what needed to be done to be able to be independently successful at the end of the day before I could lay my head down. So even at six or seven, you felt a pressure.

from your parents. So what was that pressure? What was, what were they pushing you to do? I think the biggest pressure was just to be physically independent for the most part. So every day we would wake up as a family at 5 or 6 a.m. And we would read the scriptures. And then it was time to do our chores before we'd go to school and before we'd have breakfast. And my chore was to go up and down the stairs 20 times.

in 20 minutes. And if I didn't, then I would get a lecture. And the whole reason why I had to do this was because that was my way of giving back to my family of making sure that I was staying physically in shape for them, for when they'd have to lift me and everything. And then also being able to just go into the next level of the home by myself as well. Wow. I would imagine you struggled quite a bit. Definitely. Doing that. So how? How? Were you able to do that? So I would lay down on my stomach to go down the stairs originally because I was too scared to go on my back down the stairs and see what was in front of me for some reason. I always had a big fear and that's what my mom and I would fight about was how I was going to go down the stairs and not get scared or fall or anything.

And so when I first started going down, I would go down on my stomach and I would just slide down the stairs. and then I'd be able to stop myself with my butt depending on how I would angle it around the edge of the stair for the next stair to drop. And then to go up the stairs, I'd go up with, she'd make me do both sides.

So for 10th stairs, I would go up on the left side. For the other 10th sides, I'd go on the right side. So it sounds like you would often not be able to do it within the 20 minutes. And I would imagine you would fall quite a few times.

times in there. So when that would happen, what was the consequence? It was the lecture. There was always a lecture, but also I need to take accountability for some of my own part in it too, because I hated it so much that I would lie and say, because there were times that she wouldn't watch me do it, and those would be my holiday moments because then I could just lie and say that I did do it. But then she'd like, well, yesterday, you were under two minutes, So how did you do it today? And you're over two minutes. I'd be like, I don't know.

And so then I get myself into even more trouble. I see it. I see it. Okay. Okay. I would have done the same thing, though. Yeah, because if, you know, to not have to be able to do it. So the, the, if you got into trouble, it was a lecture.

And the lecture was, was what? I don't even know. I honestly feel like I've blocked out a lot of those memories just because I, really did not like my parents at that time. What were you going through emotionally because I would imagine your thought was this is unfair? Right? So how were you feeling at that age?

I think mentally and emotionally, I think that's around the age that I started to realize that I was not only physically different, but also I was adopted and I was. and I wasn't like their other kids. I didn't look like them. I didn't talk like them. I wasn't the same color as them.

And so all of that started coming in, but then you're also in school. So I'd have to go to school and hear all the things that people would say about me. So if it wasn't coming from my brothers, it was coming from someone at school saying something to me that would also get in my head. Okay, okay.

Are you open to talking about what you were hearing? I mean, my brothers are brothers, and they would just tease me all the time and be like, you know you're adopted, right? And I'm like, obviously, yeah. But then they would just make horrible jokes about my birth mom. And then they'd be like, and that's why mom and dad had to get you. I'm like, well, that's not true. But as a little kid, you eternalize that and you think that it is true. And then at school, was it similar, different?

I would get made fun of for either having a big, fat wheelchair, or I would get made fun of for wearing the same because everybody thought that I wore the same black pants to school. But at the start of the school year, we'd go to the DIY, the thrift store, and we would buy all the black soccer pants that came in from last season and just buy them all because they were the only pants

that I could actually put on by myself because they had the elastic waist to them. And since I was walking around at recess, I'd rip holes in them super fast. And so since they were only $2,000, a pair. I was like, okay, buy 20 of them. And then rip as many holes as you want, but people at school would just see it as just the same block pair and be like, you know, that's so gross that you wear the same black pair. I'm like, it's not the same. So then finally, I think in the fifth

or sixth grade, we started adding like colors of red and blue into the shorts. Okay, okay. To me, it's so, I've talked to so many guests here who, who will recollect being bullied in school. And the reasons vary, but it's always the most ridiculous things. Who could you talk to about these things? I honestly don't think I ever talked to anyone about it, really. I honestly internalized it all

and kept it more to myself just because we had a big family. And I felt like I was already taking so much of my parents' time for them to make sure that I was physically independent. that I felt guilty trying to go to them or anybody else about my mental or emotional state of mind of what was going on, that I just, I feel like I would just talk to myself, even just going up down the stairs,

I'd have full on conversations with my head about where I was at and then getting ready and have conversations with myself in the mirror. Wow, well, can you let us in to your mind and to your thoughts? So during that time, What were those conversations that you were having with yourself? A lot of them weren't nice.

I think a lot of them were just me saying, I hate my parents so much. I don't understand why they're so hard on me. I don't get why they push me harder than they push any of their own kids. I just don't understand it. I don't feel like this is fair. But then it wasn't until the seventh and eighth grade that I was like, oh, no, I actually don't want my mom with me in the bathroom. and I don't want my brother in the bathroom with me. I want to be able to go to the bathroom by myself.

Now when you reflect back, right, because you're in such a, I feel healthy state right now, is how do you believe not having a safe space emotionally? How do you believe that impacted you as a child? I think it heavily impacted me. I remember being, I think it was sixth grade. We had the counselor come in, I think, every other Friday, and they would do classes with the sixth grade. And one day it was a writing prompt to write about what would happen if you went missing.

Who do you think would find you first or who would be the most worried? And in my head, since there was so much going on at home with being physically independent and then myself, and everything that they were doing, I wrote in my journal, I don't think anyone would be nervous or anybody would be worried. And then I remember my counselor, I think, he saw it. And he pulled me out of class one day. And he's like, are you okay? And I was like, yeah, I'm fine.

Why? And he's like, well, what you wrote in your book? I just don't know if that's true. And I was like, well, that's how I feel and that's how I see the world right now. And he's like, well, is there anything that I can do? Like, what's going on? And even then, I still didn't feel comfortable opening up and just brushed it off. No, I'm fine, I'm fine, I'm fine.

How long do you believe you were living through that level of trauma? I'd say probably until I was 23, which is when I came out as trams. That long? Yeah. Okay. I didn't think you were going to say that. Okay. I think just because of the way that I grew up within the religion

and the pressure of my parents, it wasn't just the pressure of the independence from my parents either. It was the pressure to be great anywhere and everywhere that I was because I was a prime example of what an inspirational story should be. And so my parents always wanted me whenever I left the home to make sure that I was a prime example of being copying and putting on a front of being a child of God and being a good example for the church

and my younger siblings and la-da-da-da-da. And so also fighting the internal of being gay or feeling trans and suppressing those feelings for so many years, it wasn't until I was 23 that I finally just said I'm done. Goodness, goodness. So then we have to talk about, you know, years seven through through 23. When, because I feel like you're coming out was this process, right? And it started with sexuality.

Roughly, what age was it for you? I knew in the second grade. You knew in the second grade. You were early. Yeah. Early, early early on that year. God. Okay.

So second grade, you're, how old in second grade? You're eight years old. Eight years old. Okay. Okay, okay, all right, okay, I get it. So what did you know in the second grade? I always loved being around my sisters because it was feminine and it felt safe. Or with my brothers, it was tough and there were problems and it was chaos.

And I couldn't stand that with them. And I never connected with them or wanted to do anything that they were doing. I always wanted to be with my younger sisters doing what they were doing because I felt more connected and relatable to them. And so even at school, I was always friends with girls. I maybe had like two guy friends, if that. I remember having conversations with my two older sisters at one point and just telling them, I think I like boys. And they both were just like, well, duh. But then they're right, but you can't do anything because the parents aren't okay with that. I'd be like, well, yeah, no duh. I'm just going to have to keep the secret.

And so I'd always confide in them in like my little crushes that I had, but I would never get to fully dive into it the way that my other sisters would get to or my other brothers would get to with their straight, hetero relationships and everything. Okay. Your family were Mormon. Yes. Right. So this is Church of Latter-day Saints. What would you say the position was, though, of the religion for queer religious? relationships, gay relationships. What was the church's stance? Because I never fully, I've heard

many things, but what was their stance? It was, you're damning yourself to hell. And anyone you bring into that, you're also damning into hell is what my parents taught me. And my dad would always say to me, it's Adam and Eve, not Adam and Steve. But now it's Adam and Briel. So try again. It sure is, Avidrio, yeah. And so because you were told this, you were very,

I would imagine you were fearful. I don't want to put words in your mouth, but were you scared to talk to them about it? I don't think I was really ever scared because I feel like within our home, it really wasn't a secret. I think if anything, they tried so hard

to be oblivious to it and not believe it themselves. But all my siblings knew that I was gay or that I was trans. They would always call me a girl. They would always call me gay. They would always talk about my relationships that I had had undercover and everything. It was mainly my parents that just, they knew, but they didn't want to know. And they didn't want me acting on it, especially if I was going to be living in their home. Okay. Now, you said that they were aware of relationships. So you were having relationships with men that they were aware of.

Yeah, I got caught, I think, in seventh grade, having a boyfriend. And my parents, no, no, no, no, no. Okay. Okay. You got a lecture. Oh, yeah. Okay. But what about the community? Because it's predominantly Mormon. is the community. For the most part, I kept it under wraps with my community. I would do things in the dark, so to speak, where people outside weren't going to see it unless someone knew the person that I was dating, then they would know.

But it's not like I was out fleeing my relationship openly and proudly. Okay, okay. I feel like for the longest time I was being set up to be the face for the Mormon church, they'd have me go to all the youth camps, all the firesides, all the young men, young women's things, release society, things, and be a speaker and share my story of how inspiring and the miracles. Not to say that none of that's true or anything, but as a kid, it's a lot to put that pressure on, but then I have to go back to school and still be bullied for just being different.

and by my own siblings in the same home that also are like, you're not that special. You're just like everybody else. So you can get up on that stage, you can do your whole feel. But when you come home, you're just like us. So don't think that you're above us or anything because you're not, which I never really thought I was either. Right, right.

But as a kid, it's a lot of pressure to be put on a stage on a pedestal publicly, but then to go home and still deal with things. it's a tremendous amount. And I didn't even realize that at that young age that you were, you know, put on a speaking circuit, so to speak, I have to ask, I hope this is not offensive. But did you feel used? Young. I mean, do you want to speak on that?

because the way that I'm hearing the story is you were being used to showcase the goodwill of the church in essence. And I don't want to be disrespectful to the Mormon church or to my parents because honestly, they're a big reason of who I am today. And I am very thankful for both of them. and those things. But I feel like they did a lot of damage to behind the scenes that a lot of people don't see or understand. There's nothing inspiring about me. This is just my life.

It just happens to be different. And yes, there are really inspiring parts. And yes, there are a lot of miracles and everything. And I do see that and I do feel that. But I just don't see myself that way. We've talked about some of the bad, right, in terms of how you felt your, you're, your identity. What was the good that that was happening to you during that time?

I had a lot of really cool experiences that I am really grateful for because of having a disability. It gave me a lot of chances to do things that kids my age or my siblings didn't get to do. I was constantly getting free gifts. I was constantly getting invited to events for free. I was constantly getting invited to front row. things. And I mean, sometimes my siblings were reaping the rewards of that. Also, which was nice because then we could share those experiences. Yes. And they didn't feel as left out. But I know for my brother who's the same age as Maine, for the longest time, he felt like he was living within my shadow. And I, for the longest time, I mean, even still to the day, I feel bad about that.

Because he really was a really, really, really good brother to me. And he was the only brother that would stand up for me and he was the only brother that was there when other kids were being mean to me or he'd go to party so that I could go to the parties and not feel left out. And so there were a lot of really good things despite things that I was feeling mentally and emotionally internally going on. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah, I could see that there was a real love, you know, that you had for your brother.

and I can see the light in the shade, right, that they came with early life for you. I'm curious about, because I was reading about even you learning to swim. And I was, a matter of fact, I'll tell you what was happening. He says, I was reading about you learning to swim. And I was sitting next to my wife. And my wife said, If I was her mother, she probably never would have learned to swim. And that's why I was saying there's nobody built like my mom,

because she saw what I was physically, mentally, emotionally, spiritually capable of doing, despite what everyone said to her and the things that were said or the feelings that were said towards her and how she treated me. She still made sure that I am, the person I am today. Yeah, yeah. So how did your parents teach you to swim? Honestly, we showed up the pool one day, and my dad just threw me in. And he's like, okay, swim.

And I just sank to the bottom. And then finally after a minute he jumps in after me, he's like, okay, well, if you want to go to the pool, you're going to have to learn how to swim. And so we spent probably two and a half years going to the pool every summer. And we started with learning how to float and making sure that I could roll myself over underwater and everything, or when I would jump in the water, I'd have to make sure that I was ready to come up with my face first instead of my butt first so that then I could get air. And then we learned how to propel myself through the water. And so my dad just taught me how to

swim, kind of like a dolphin, just up and down, up and down, up and down. Yeah. I mean, that's tough love in action. You know, I honestly, Really? I don't know how I feel about that. It's one of those, and I'm saying it where I see the result of it. Maybe I'm just not built that way as a parent to just throw my child in the water knowing they're going to sink. But I can see your appreciation for it. And at the end of this conversation, my wife then pulls up a video of you swimming. Honestly, you're a better swimmer than me, you know, a much better swimmer.

And so the result is there. You know, the result is there. During this time period, I understand that you were a dancer. Yes. Okay, all right. So tell me about you and becoming a dancer. So it all started in the seventh grade. I was, once again, just trying to find my own independence, my own voice.

And so one day I saw a flyer of them promoting that there was a talent show audition. And I was like, I'll do the talent show audition. And then in my head, because I used to talk to myself all the time, I was like, but what am I going to do for the talent show? And I was like, oh, I'll just dance. And so then I choreographed a dance in my head to, What's home was it? Apologize. Okay. Okay.

Yeah. And I had my cousin go with me, and I did the audition, and then I got done, and I went home, and I told my mom, and she's like, what did you do? And I was like, I danced, and she's like, no, really, what did you do, though? And I was like, I danced, and she's like, okay, show me this dance then. So I show her the day. and she's just sitting there and like, oh, what? And she's like, that was the worst thing I've ever seen. Wow.

And I was like, what? Really? And she's like, yeah, we need to clean this up now. And I was like, oh, okay. But it's because my mom had a background to dance too. So she definitely knew what she was talking about. Okay. And it really was not the greatest dance.

All right. So she would tell them the truth. Yeah, she was telling the truth. That's the one thing that I do love about my mom. She said to me, you don't want people to applaud you. just because you're handicapped. You want them to stand up and applaud you because you actually put in the effort

and it's good. You should never just get a stand innovation because you're disabled. That's ridiculous. And I was like, okay, you're right. I don't want to be applauded just because I'm disabled. That's not what I want.

And so we chore off a whole new dance to Cody Simpson, unfriend you. Oh, no, it was Grace and Chance, actually. I had a crush on Cody Simpson Oh, you did? At the time, yes. You know, so you know, Cody said in that exact...

I know, I saw you had him on that. He was in that exact chair right there. I had the fattest crush on Cody Simpson. I mean, I still do, sorry to my husband, but I do. But it was to Grosse and Chance unfriend you. Okay. And I get done with the dance, and I had gotten a standing ovation from everyone. All my siblings were there.

My parents were there. And you can see in the YouTube video at the very start, my mom knowing that I had really bad stage fright and then I was super scared to go out and that I was probably going to forget the dance. And so you can see my mom running to the front of all the kids and everything to make sure that she's right there in the very, very front sitting on the ground. And you can kind of see her head doing the dance with me to make sure that I don't miss anything. And when I got it done, just seeing her face made everything worth it to me because in that moment, I knew that she was proud of me because I actually put in the work like she said. Wow. When you think about the relationship with your mom, how would you define it now? You know, especially reflecting back.

I think now she is honestly one of the best people on this earth. regardless all of her tough love and everything she as a person to let alone have 13 biological children of her own and to have an adopted one with a disability and a husband that didn't make that much money she somehow made it work and made every child feel loved and same in some sort of way capacity

and what do you believe your mother thinks of you I don't know I hope she's proud of me because I do feel like I did go off the beaten path of what they really wanted for me because I know that they really, really, really wanted me to be that spokesperson and then for me to go against stands for it all the way to do what I wanted, I think was a huge slap in the face for them at some point. You know how we could find out what your mom thinks? I have right here a letter

that I have not yet read that is written by your mom Q, okay. Can I read it to you? Yeah. Okay. We're going to discover this right now. Okay.

Together. I'm like already wanting to cry. Okay. Dear Breel, even before you came, to be part of our family, God began to whisper to me of the things that you could accomplish. I know that he wanted you to become the very best that you could be, and he did not want you limited by what I thought you could be. As always, God is far wiser than any human, and I am

thankful for the gift God gave me of allowing me to be part of your life. Even with all of the whisperings and ideas that came to me over the years of how to help you, you have blown my expectations out of the water. You've created a beautiful life full of love and happiness and continued growth. You are so inspiring to me. You don't let anyone or anything hold you back. If you think you can do it, then you do. You don't give up. You just keep trying until you reach your goal. You can do more without arms and legs that many people in this world can do with them. But I think my favorite thing about you is how you handle the constant criticism you face. You see what others do not. You are willing to look past that criticism to see the pain,

the hurt, and the suffering that others are going through or have gone through in their lives as a reason for their lashing out. And you are generally. generous in your forgiveness. Breel, you are brave, brave enough to face it head on and keep going when people judge you harshly. I know that this too was a journey of overcoming both mentally and emotionally. And your attitude has been the same with these challenges as it has been with your physical ones.

If you think you can do it, you do. You just keep trying until you succeed. I had no idea that social media was even going to be a thing when you came to me and only eight months old. I had no idea that millions of people would watch you, be inspired by you, and learn from you every single day. Keep working at becoming the very best you can be. Keep helping the world to be a better place. Keep inspiring me. I love you.

Goodness. That's cute. Yeah. That was, that was beautiful. You know, it was beautiful. And to me, it articulates very well how much you mean to her. Our sponsor, Hewle sent me something new to try. They're light ramen noodles.

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Okay. So even that decision, can we talk about that? That must have been challenging. You were also a practicing Mormon at that time. How were you able to get to that place where you were able to come out? Well, Flash Lord, a year before that, when I was. 19, I was still going to church because I was living with my parents. And the way that the church was working when I was still going, you would have Sunday school and then you'd have a fast and testimony

meeting in sacrament. And then you would have young men's, young women's release society. But I had just gone to my two classes. I had already gone to Sunday school and I had already gone to sacrament meeting. Okay. So for me, I was like, I've done my time. It's time for me to go because if I go into young men's, they're trying to tell me I need to go serve a mission or I need to get ready to go to the young single adult's ward

and find me a wife and get married. And I knew that's not what I wanted. That's not what I was going to do. I wasn't going to trap someone into a marriage, let alone have a family with them and create even more problems, not only for myself, but for them, let alone children. So I was like, no, I'm not playing this game. I'll go do my time and then I'm leaving. Well, my mom, she sees me leaving and she's like, where are you going?

And I was like, home. And she gets up close and she whispers in my ear and she's like, well, I think you should pray about it. And I lost it. I still left. And then on my way home, I sent her a text and I was like, I'm gay. I've always been gay. You know I've been gay. I'm done hiding it. If you want relationship with me after I move out, that is up to you. But hear from this moment on, if we don't have a relationship, it's because you chose not to have them with me because you don't like that I'm gay. You taught me my entire life to be myself and to be true to myself. But the second I try and do that, you try to double down and tell me that I'm damning myself to hell. Also, you're not God. You don't get to damn me anywhere. He will do that at my last days, not you. live, laugh, love you.

And I go home, and it's tense in the house, and she comes home, she's sobbing, and next morning she comes into my room, and she's still been sobbing, and she says, can we talk? I was like, yeah, sure. And she's like, I just want to say, I'm sorry. And I was like, it's okay, and she's like, no, it's not okay. I don't know how I could have been so oblivious to the way that I had been making you feel all these years putting this pressure on you to be someone that you're not. I want you to know that if you decide to marry a man, I want to be at your wedding. If you decide to have a family with a man,

I want to be the grandmother of those children. If you decide to live your life gay and proud, I still want to be in your life. Please do not kick me out. I love you and I'm sorry. Clean slate from then on. My dad comes in 10 to 15 minutes later, pretty much the same thing. spiel that from my dad, he doesn't understand it, but he wants to understand me moving forward. He gave a speech at my wedding. It drove half of my siblings crazy because they're like, how was he giving a speech at your wedding when for so long he was so against you being gay? And I was like, it's not about that.

It's a fact that he was even willing to come to the wedding, let alone speak at the wedding. What do you think caused your parents to make such a quick U-turn on their stance? I think a part of them was probably worried that I was going to get onto some stage and say that my parents no longer support me and that that would crush and ruin the whole image and everything that we had built all these years. That's so incredibly sad to me because what I hear you saying is that they it was a performative

acknowledgement of your identity and maybe it wasn't I don't know true but that's how it came off true I mean this is your story real you know and it's it's what you remember through your experience and that's that to me is what

it that that's that's what I'm feeling you know In the moment, is that how you felt in the moment? Definitely in the moment. Now, no. Okay. Now I know 100%. They fully loved me.

They accept me. They loved my marriage and they love where I'm at in life regardless, the stage, the publicity and the social media. They could care less. They just want to see me happy. But now with you then telling them, then was it a year later? that you then publicly came out, okay? And you came out on, was it, you said Facebook? Where?

Everything. Every, oh, across social media. Okay. So I know a concern that your parents had, at least, is that if you were to come out, it would negatively impact your motivational speaking career. Did it? No, I was still fine.

It was up until Colorado. Okay. One thing that is really sitting with me is earlier in the conversation, you said, I don't even consider myself motivational. So you were giving these motivational talks, but you didn't believe that you yourself were motivational. I would black out the second the curtains would open or I'd have to go out on stage and I would just do what I was trained to do. and then I would get off the stage and I would start hyperventilating but then I'd have to turn it right back on

to do the meet and greets and there was one time I was here in California and San Diego with my dad and we just got done doing a big conference it was in front of 10,000 people and I was doing my meet and greet

and this guy comes up to me and he whispers in my ear and he says I feel like there's something you're not being honest about. And I was like, what do you mean? Okay. And then he's like, I just don't feel like you're being yourself.

And I feel like you're lying about something. Wow. And I was like, the mask is slipping. They know, they know. And that was before I had even come out publicly. Right. Right. So that incident right there had already ruined public speaking for me.

because I was like, my mask is already slipping. It's only a matter of time before they actually seen. Yeah, yeah. What also, too, is, so this was, you said that happened when you were, what, 18, 19. So that's before you've come out. So also, before you come out, what do you consider your identity to be? Because I say that our identity is the story that we tell about ourselves. And I feel like many of us right around that 18, 19, which were really,

trying to figure that out. What was your identity at that age? Who were you? If I were to meet you at 18, tell me, who are you? What would you have said? I probably would have given you the fakes persona of myself I possibly could to protect myself at that time and made you believe the whole story and I for the longest time would look at myself in the mirror at the end of the day and not even know who I was looking at because I didn't even like who I was putting on to be. I don't even know what I was putting on at that time because I just didn't even know. I just was doing what I was told and what I was trained to do. I saw photos of you roughly at that age and you always had a massive smile on your face.

So was that a lie? Yeah. And my brother Landon would call me out for it all the time and be like, your smile is so fake. You look so fake when you smile. But it's because I was performing. Yeah. And you said what you were trained to do. So who was it that had trained you?

It was what between, was it your parents and the church? Mm-hmm. Okay. All right. And then also, and I'm sorry. I'm just so fascinated by the motivational speaking, and you not believing you're motivational. What were you saying on stage?

What was your spiel? I would tell my beginning story, and I would come out on stage. In the very beginning, I'd come out, and I'd fall over on stage, and the audience would be like, oh, my gosh. And then I would say, sometimes in life, we fall down, but we have to decide to get back up,

and then I would stand up, and then the audience would. Oh my gosh. And then I'd go into my story of how my mom got me. And then I would talk about the bullying in junior high and that in life it's hard, but we've got to figure out who we are. And that's where dance came in for me. And then I would do a dance.

But my talk was written for me by some of my talk. somebody else too. Wow. And you gave the same talk over and over and over. How many times you think you gave that talk? Dozen, million times. Yeah. Like if I really sit down, I could literally do it off the top of my butt I had right now.

I do. See, he said it was written for you. Did your father write that for you? My dad wrote it with another person. I see it. And now I understand even more when you said that you would block out because you, you you know you're getting ready to go into this spiel that you don't want to give, that you have to give.

I didn't even realize that you're dancing on stage. Did it feel humiliating at all to go through that? The talking part, yes. Doing the dance, no, because that was 100% mean. And that's what I loved and that's what I wanted at the time. and I fought to get that into the speech and everything and make it more engaging and a chance for me to kind of take a break from being at the pulpit

and do something that I can actually speak to, but through movement. I see. And that allows you to tap into a passion. So you were dancing in front of thousands. Yeah. And I really, really thought that I was going to be doing it until the day I died.

Pretty much. I'd watch 65-year-old. men get out on stage and do their spiel. And I would see them two months before and it was the same speech. I'm like, is this really what I have to live for? I don't want to keep doing this. Please, please, something, take this out so I don't have to keep doing it. And then the pandemic happened.

And I was like, perfect. Let's find something else for me to do. But then, oddly enough, I did get on social media and it wasn't to be motivational. and prove anything or do anything. It was literally just having fun. Okay. I never wanted to be an influencer. I still don't claim myself as an influencer.

It was literally just pulling on my phone one day. My sister had been hounding me. And this was back when TikTok was called Music, L. Wine. And so I was like, yeah, I'll post some stupid video on there, I guess. So I posted one. It was Halloween night. And then I think by midnight the video had had a, million views. And I was like, wow, that's weird. That's crazy. Wow. Yeah. And so then I was like,

let's keep doing the dancing videos. So I kept doing dancing videos. And then I had met my husband. And so I did little cringy content with him when we were dating. And then I decided, I love makeup. I started doing makeup for dance. Why don't I just do a little get ready with me video and I would only show from the chest up in these get ready to me videos you would have to watch my other video to know that I have no arm's legs but if you're just seeing this one get ready with me video I don't show at the very beginning that I had no arms and legs intentionally just randomly just randomly okay because that's what all these other influencers were doing was just going straight into the makeup they didn't have like a hook or a grab or

anything at the time I see and so I just went into doing it and all the comments were like why aren't you using your hands why aren't you using your hands and I'm like, oh, it's because I didn't show in the beginning that I don't have hands or feet. So why don't we try doing that with the video? I do that and it took off. I mean, Breel, you should brag on this because it really has taken off to a whole other level. So how, in terms of viewership and following and reach, what are your, what's your content getting now? I now have 9 million followers across all social media platforms.

I get videos well over a million. I just did one for a brand and I got over 130 million views, which is insane. It's insane. Absolutely insane. And it's just a video of me washing my hair. I'm not trying to be motivational or inspiring, but people just see it and they find it motivating and inspiring, which is nice because I'm. In a way, I guess I am still a motivational speaker in a way, but I'm doing it on my terms and in my way.

And I'm not having to do all the speaking and telling a story that was written by somebody else for myself. There you go. There you go. You've written the story now, right? How does it feel to know that your content is resonating and connecting with so many people? Honestly, that's why I keep doing it. I love the messages that I get from other people within the disability community or the LGBTQ plus community or parents of a child within one of those communities wanting to understand and finding acceptance for their child or within themselves later on in life. for me that's what pushes me to keep making the content that I make no matter how crungy or how funny or stupid it may be and I love doing that type of content because it's resonating with those people yeah so so I would imagine Breyo there must be a makeup line in this

no no no no I feel like the makeup community is so oversaturated Okay. That what is there that I'm going to come out with that's so unique and amazing. A lot of people say, well, why don't you come out with something for accessibility? I could do that, but that would only fit a very small, small, small market. And what I may find accessible for me isn't accessible for the next person. So I don't know. What I would love is a makeup collaboration where I come out with like a power.

or a lip shade or an eyelash and have my name tied to something like that or be the face of a beauty campaign. There you go. That's my end goal. There you go. There you go. All right. That's it. Let's put that on the vision board.

Yes. All right. I believe that's going to happen. I hope so. Literally be a dream come true. I put it on my vision board every year. Oh, do you? I do.

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Because from what I understand is that the process was you first identifying by being gay. Then it moved. So it was a slower process. Then it was non-binary. right but can you walk me through that process but in particular how your family and community responded to you in each of those steps I always knew I was some form of a girl I'm not saying God made a mistake on my body I'm not saying any of that because I don't believe that for myself I think he put me in a body and purposely knowing the trials and tribulations that I'd go to to make me

stronger for where I am today. That being said, I knew that for those around me, they didn't think or feel that way about gay people, non-binary people, or trans people. So for me, in my way, I had to tell myself, if I'm going to be myself at some point, I have to string all these people along for these different stages so they can get used to and ready for me to be my actual self. Wow. Okay. So you methodically took everyone on this, all those in your community on this journey with you.

Okay. Okay. And what was the reaction at each phase of that, at each stop of the journey? Coming out as gay with my parents was rough because I first came out to them. when I was 13, and I had gotten caught having a boyfriend. And then it was being told to keep it hush, I stopped acting on it. And then it was coming out as non-binary as 22.

And then at 23, I fully came out as trans. And I had already come out to my husband before we had even gotten married and telling him that I had feelings, that I was trans and everything, but making sure that he was okay with it and he didn't feel like he was getting trapped because a lot of people online like to speculate

and think that it was after the fact that I waited until we got married, that then I could just trap him and pull the wool over his eyes, but that's not what happened. And that's the dumb thing about session media is that people think that they know everything. And so for my husband,

he was calling me she or her at home, but then in public and around other family members, he was still calling me, he, him, and all this other stuff. So it was kind of a mind trick on him sometimes to be like, wait, where am I, who am I around? Interesting. So he was doing that to protect you among your family and friends. So he knew.

So he knew. So then how did fully, when you said, look, I'm a trans woman to your parents. who had such a difficult time with you coming out as gay. What was their reaction? Funny thing is, is that when I came out as trans, like I said, I had told Adam the year before. But when it came to telling everyone, I ripped that Band-Aid off so quick,

and I did everyone at once. And so I made a post on Instagram, TikTok, and it was some sound that was going viral at the time. And it was like, this is the story of a boy. And then the sound like scratches out. And then it's like, this is the story of a girl. And then it's me transitioning. And it blew up instantly within my family group chat and publicly.

My DMs, news articles had already started posting about it like 10 minutes after I had posted. I was like, whoa, I was not expecting that. But okay. And honestly, I think since I had cured everyone up for that moment, they'd already seen my content leading up to it. I was already wearing wigs and dresses. It was just a matter of time for me to just state the obvious of what's actually there. Having that reaction, that's much different than the reaction that you got earlier in life. So that was, that was welcomed. Yeah. Everybody was more so wondering what I was going to do with my body if I was going to going to get surgeries done, if I was going to start hormones, if I was going to grow my hair out,

if I was going to do this or this. Now, I've been on hormones for almost three years, and I will say being on those has cleared my mind in a way that I can't even explain. Oh, wow. Like I feel so more myself confidently. It's insane. And when I don't take it, I go right back into feeling the way that I did before I ever came out as trans. And how would you describe the difference of a feeling for you? When I'm on it, I'm so much more happier. I'm more cool, calm collective. I feel safe.

I feel confident. When I'm off of it, I get stuck in my head really easily. I get more depressed, more angry, and more sad. Mm, okay, okay. So hormones have been a life changer for you. Okay, okay. Just a heads up, this next part includes discussion of sexual assault. If you or someone you know need support, we've included resources in the show notes.

Please take care while watching. Can we talk about your dating history? Yeah. because it's uh one is you're smiling i'm like my husband he's still wait which is yeah i mean this is this is where we have to tread carefully uh your husband is in the building right so um but if we could go back to the very beginning when you began to date right when you began to, you know, we all experiment when we're younger. What was that like for you?

In the seventh grade, I had a boyfriend and was he the great one? No. But then I went from that boyfriend, then another boyfriend. And then I realized I don't want a boyfriend in person because I'm nervous about being hurt physically. I'd rather be hurt mentally and emotionally by them. rather than physically. Can you expand on that? Yeah.

So I had been sexually abused before in my life, and I told myself I never wanted it to happen again. And so that's why I moved to dating online exclusively and only online. I've heard you talk about an assault that happened. Was the assault that you're talking about, that happened in the seventh or eighth grade, or this is a different assault. Different time.

This is a different. So I didn't realize that you were assaulted in a young age. Okay. So when you moved online, is this one another, this is when you met up with someone, is this one, when this particular, so you moved online to be safe and you weren't safe at all? Are you open to talking about that moment? I mean, you don't have to give us the details, but just what happened in terms of how you went from having a relationship with someone online to so quickly being within physical proximity to them? So I had made my relationships online after being sexually assaulted in the seventh grade by one of my friends. at their house.

And so after that moment, I was like, yeah, I don't ever want to be anywhere near a man physically again. And so I moved everything to online. We were getting ready to move to St. George. I was a junior in high school. Looking more back at this story, it definitely was an appropriate relationship. This man was a little bit older. and I had just thought it was going to be an online relationship.

So I was like, it's fine, it's cool. When he found out that I was moving to a city, he's like, we should meet up. And I was like, no, I don't think so. And then he's like, no, we should. And I was stupid and naive, and I went and met up with him, and that's when it all happened again. And then it wasn't the last time. It happened several other times with other people. And so I was always on and off again with online relationships.

I mean, that's why I met my husband through Tinder. It was because I was doing on and off again relationships with people online to try and protect myself. Okay. When these assaults that happened, and I didn't realize this has happened multiple times to you, did you talk to anyone? Did you confide in anyone? Yeah, I would either call, like, one of my first. friends or talk to one of my sisters about it, but then I would swear them to secrecy and be like,

you can't tell anyone. But the one that you heard about on a different podcast, I told my mom about, I think a few months after it happened. And I even told her, like, you can't say or do anything. Like, what's been done is done. I just want to move past it. And she's like, okay. Okay. Okay. Those assaults that I can see how that level of trauma then would push you far away from any type of dating, any type of relationship. What would then made you go back on, because it was a dating app, right? What made you then go back on to the dating app? Maybe it's just the search for love. Honestly, I was just searching for someone different and that was going to treat me different. And it really wasn't until I had gone on my first date with my husband that I realized that there are good people out there.

And so when I first had met my husband, it was hard for me to accept his kindness and his patience and his love. to the point where after two weeks of dating each other consistently, I was the one where I was like, I need a break from you. Oh, wow. And he's like, what? Did I do something wrong? I was like, no, it's not you, it's me. I need to go do some soul searching with myself

and why I have a problem with you treating me so kindly because I'm so used to guys being so disrespectful and disgusting and rude to me that I just don't know how to process this right now. And then what did you do? Did you just give it space with him? I tried to give it space, but then I had told my mom and my sister-in-law that I had done that. And they both were like, are you stupid? You finally have a man that wants to be around you, and you're going to tell him you want space.

No, he's coming over to dinner tonight. And I was like, oh, okay. And so then he was there. What was it about what he was saying or doing that made you? made you feel like green light, no red light. You know, oh, this is good. Oh, no, no, this is not good. For starters, it was the fact that he wanted to take me on an actual date.

Other men would want to, they would say it was a date, but it was really just a ride in their car and then try and get freaky-diki in the backseat or the front seat of their car. Where with Adam, it was, no, let's go get coffee out in public in the open, like, I want people to see that I'm on a date with you. And then we can see what happens after that. So I was thinking it was just going to be coffee. But then he's like, no, I'm like, I'd love to be more of your family since I was living with my brother, my sister-in-law, and all their kids. And then my sister-in-law was like, you should stay over for dinner. And so I was like,

you don't want to do that to him. Please stop. No, don't scare him away yet. Wow. But he was like, yeah, no, I'd love to. And so then he came in, and he was already playing with my nieces and nephews, which was big to me. But most of these people you were dating previously, they wouldn't even want to go on a date, right? Do you think that there was a level of fetishizing? Definitely. Yeah, yeah.

How soon did you believe you were in love with Adam? I think I said I loved him after three or four months of dating. Okay, okay. Had you ever experienced a love like, that before in your life? No. So I think also for me to really truly love him probably took a year, but I knew that I was in love with him by four months. Okay. At what point did the relationship progress to talk of marriage? I think it was probably seven months in, and it was more me, but it's because it's Utah.

Everybody's married around our age. I mean, Adam was 27 when we got married. So for him, in Utah standards, he was a very, very, very late bloomer. We got engaged nine months. In nine months, okay, yeah. For anyone watching who has gone through severe trauma in previous relationships,

and they feel as if they can't trust It's something that they cannot do. What was it about Adam in your relationship with Adam that allowed you to trust again? What's the lesson that you have there? I think for instance, I started wearing makeup a lot more when Adam and I started dating. And one day I had done like a really bold look. And Adam straight up said to me, I don't like that look. And I was like, oh, well, that's too bad because this is my.

makeup and this is my face and my body and I'm going to do my makeup how I want not to please you. And then he goes, oh, yeah, you're right. If that's what makes you feel happy and confident, then I'm okay with that. Right there in that moment, I knew that he was going to always have my back. Even if he didn't agree with me in the moment, he would somehow get on board with me. Yeah. It's a great story, Brio. Because it also tells me, too, about his willingness to adapt and adjust and listen all in that one moment. Definitely. I mean, even from our first date, when we had gotten to the coffee shop, it was a coffee shop

where you play games. And he just instantly said, I'm not going to do anything for you. You just tell me what you need so that you're comfortable. And I was like, perfect. I don't want you to just do it for me. So I love that. And he had already come pre-thought, pre-aware, pre-ready. Yes.

Sometimes people say their wedding day is one of the greatest days of their life. How was it for you? I'm not going to lie. I kind of blocked out halfway through the wedding. Not because I was drunk or anything. I didn't drink anything. I didn't take anything either. I was sober.

But I blocked out on just being so nervous that the day was going to go well. And it went perfectly well. You and Adam, you've been together for how long now? We've been together for six years coming up on five years of marriage. All right, coming up on five years of marriage. And I understand that there could be another wedding in the carts. Yes, we're actually doing another one in three weeks. Okay, so you're doing another wedding in three weeks.

And why are you doing another wedding? We are doing one because I transitioned two years into our other marriage. I should say it. Yes. So, yeah, so what are you going to call it? Was it your other marriage or no? Not even our other marriage. But the first time we got married, I hadn't become my full self to where I am now.

Okay. And so we had always talked about redoing our wedding photos and we kind of were just going to do it just the two of us super low key. But then I had said something online and someone's like, no. And someone's like, no, you've got to do like the whole thing. We want to see everything. Like you need to walk down the aisle again. You need to get your necklace. So, yeah.

So you're getting it all again? So we're doing it all again. All right. I like it. All the, you're inviting everyone else back? Yep. Everyone's coming back? Yep.

Everyone's coming back. Okay. All right. I love it. It's literally going to be deja vu, but me and a dress this time. I love it. And it sounds like you probably won't black out this time. No.

Now this time, everything's going to go smoothly that I don't even need to worry. Yes, yes. Do you know what I have for you? Another letter or a photo. I have. You ready for this? Yes. I have another letter.

Oh, yay. And this is a letter from Adam. Perfect. And I have not read this letter yet. Okay. So we are going to hear about it together. Cute. It's like the color of my office that he painted.

Oh, well, look at that. Look at that. All right, Breel, here we go. Okay. Brielle, falling in love with you was the best experience of my life. The second best has been watching the world fall in love with you too. I'm so lucky to be part of your life and feel even luckier to spend the rest of it together. You've changed my life simply by showing me what. real strength looks like. Not the loud kind, but the everyday kind. The strength to be vulnerable, to reinvent yourself, to keep loving people after being misunderstood, and to walk into rooms exactly as you are without apologizing for it. I think one of the most beautiful things about you is that through your actions, the social media posts, you give people permission to believe there's still space for them in this world. Whether they're different and secure, struggling,

or trying to figure themselves out, they see you and feel. Just imagine how much more strongly you've done that for me in person as your husband. I've watched you choose courage over fear again and again and I've been part of the hardest moments you didn't share with the world. You taught me what authenticity

really looks like and that changing your mind and growing isn't abandoning or rejecting your past. It's accepting it as a part of who you are. I'm endlessly proud of the life you've built and the impact you've had on so many people, but more than anything, I'm grateful that I get to experience those quieter moments with you. The laughter at home, the late night reality TV, the bored, daily routines nobody else sees, those are my favorite parts of you. The impact you've had on my life is impossible to fully explain. You've made me a better partner, a better listener, and a better person. You've taught me to laugh louder, care less about what other people think, and live

more honestly. I'm endlessly proud of you. And no matter how many people know your name, I'll always feel lucky that I have the whole you. I love you, rat boy. That's his nickname. Did you give that to him? I did it. How did he come up with Rat Boy? Because I call our dogs Rat Girls,

and he's always with them. So I'd always say Rat Girls and Rat Boy, and he's just my rat boy. He's just your rap boy. Yeah. All right. What did you think of that letter? It was really cute.

I love them so much. Yes. Yes. I see, it's interesting, he mentioned there how many people you touch in the world, right? Do you feel like this is what you were put on earth to do? Definitely. I mean, going back to the Mormon church, we get a thing called a patriarchal blessing. it's something that you have to be somewhat worthy to receive and wanting and willing to receive

and you go and get it by a man you've never met he doesn't know you you don't know him and he lays his hands on your head and says a blessing that comes straight from God and in mine within the first few paragraphs it says that I full willing to be able to knowing what life I had signed up for before I came down to this earth, knowing all of the things that I would have to deal with in this body. And I still said yes because I was willing. So currently, are you a practicing Mormon? No. No. I feel like church is wherever you are and whatever you make church to be. At what point in your life? life, do you then walk away from Mormon faith?

I walked away at 19. I'll still go if my parents are giving a talk or a niece or a nephew is getting baptized or if there's a wedding. It's not that I have a problem with the church. I feel like the church has a problem with me. And so I have just distanced my self for my safety and for my own standpoint. point that it doesn't create conflict. Okay.

You live in Salt Lake City currently. And you, I mean, you know, you're everywhere in terms of social media. What do you aspire for the next chapter of your life? I would love to be a parent at some point. It's my dream. I would also love to write a book by the time I'm 30. Okay. 27 right now.

So time is ticking. Yes. Yeah, I know I say I don't like being a motivational speaker, but I do want to keep being visible enough that people are still learning and seeing and feeling something when they see me so that then when maybe someone else who looks like me comes into their path, they can be a more thoughtful. So here's what I find to be so interesting about your story, right, in you, is that you are someone who, the world, I feel, as if the world has its currently structured, it's not structured for. Definitely not. Right. And you've come in and you've said, you know what? I'm going to make a way.

I'm going to create a way, right? And by creating a way, you've become incredibly inspiring to many people. Do you see that then as motivational? Definitely, yeah. Okay. So you do see. I definitely see it. I just don't want to believe it sometimes for myself.

Why is that? I don't know. I think it's just because to me it's just. my life. I feel like I'm just doing what anybody else hopefully would do if they were in my situation. I've, you know, I've been outside of the States now for the U.S. for eight years, but, I mean, I was born here. I'm family here. I keep coming back. When you think about even the political climate now, being a trans woman in the United States of America today, right? What do you believe tomorrow will look like for you?

Honestly, that's a really scary question because I don't know. I just have to have faith in knowing that there's people around me that are willing to help stand up and what's right. Because what's going on in the world is not right for anyone. No matter what community you're in, it's not right for anyone. It's not safe. It's not enjoyable. nobody is winning and everyone is suffering and together we have to stand up together no matter what you believe about the other person we all need to step in together otherwise nobody's going to win

yeah i remember growing up in in new york and i remember being in fear of different things and it was when we moved from the city of New York to Long Island was when I was first confronted with what I would call a very severe level of racism. And it was the first time that I became fearful of being somewhere because of my race, right? And as I got older, I thought, you know what? That's the past. That won't happen. Things will just get better, right? And for a while, it felt to me, felt like things were getting better.

And if I could go back and tell myself of what today, the day and age that we live in, what people are experiencing, I wouldn't have believed it. Because to me, it feels like not only have we not progressed, but we have regressed in so many areas. And so do you have any level of hope about the future? Yeah. Definitely. I feel like any time in life you have to hit rock bottom in order to go up. And I feel like right now in society, we're hitting rock bottom. So I think it's just a matter of time before things hope.

Hopefully start going back up. Okay, okay. I hope so because I want to bring children into this world and I don't want to bring them into something that's going on right now. Okay, okay. What would you say to anyone who is currently struggling with gender identity? I would just say I hope you have someone around you that you can confide in because it's not something you should take on your own and it's not something you should have to ever

go through alone either. And if not, that there are places out there that are willing and accepting and ready to hear what you have to say and what you're going through and be there for you. So it's about who you're surrounding yourself with, who you feel I was emotionally safe with. And you're not alone. I know you get in your head and you think that you're the only one that feels this way, but you're not. There's so many other people who have or will.

or did feel the way that you have felt in this very moment and that there are people around ready to help. You just have to look and find. Okay. And do you feel like you are now becoming a voice or you have already become a voice, but almost a voice of refuge and safety for many? I hope so.

My DMs are always open too. So if you ever want to reach out to me personally, please. Yeah. Reach out. Right. So you're responding to them all? Yeah. I try to it for the most part.

Oh my gosh. Oh, my gosh. I would imagine that feels incredibly rewarding to know that you are a source that people do reach out to you, where they may not be able to reach out to anyone. one else. The last question, everyone gets this one, is you think about how many incredible conversations you've had in your life. Which conversation stands out the most? Who was it with? And what did you learn? I probably have to say with my husband. I feel like we have lots of good conversations because we spend so much time together. But I think one of our most for

recent ones that has been really eye-opening for me would probably be the one that we have pretty often, actually. And that's what we always talk about if one of us dies. What would we do? And I think my favorite thing that he says that he would do if I were to die before him is he would turn me into a necklace and into a diamond necklace and wear me with him every day of his life moving forward. I think my lesson would probably be just keep living a powerful relationship with him

where our love never fades and moments never go dull and we keep having hard conversations even when we don't want to because in the end it just makes us stronger. Yeah, yeah. I think that's a great lesson. You know, it's one of those where I have and I've written about how, the tough conversations help to increase the quality of our life. And I believe it's because of what you just said. And I always look at the strength of a relationship based on the couple's willingness

to have hard conversations. And almost always, the couples who are able to have harder conversations are stronger. And I can see that you and Adam, you have, I mean, clearly, you have some very challenging conversations and that shows me why your relationship is so strong and your love is so strong. Yeah. I will end on the one note that you probably don't want me to say it all. And that is how inspiring you are. Thank you.

Yeah. And I think that as you said, deep down, you know it, you feel it, but you just don't want to acknowledge it. but I think it's important for you to acknowledge it because in that way you walk in your truth and I think that your just mere presence changes lives and I my hope for you is that you're able to have that conversation with your birth mom right and you're able to extend her that grace that I that that you you open this conversation with and and to me immediately when you said that it showed me your level of maturity because I think some people could look at that and say you know I would I would tell her A B see whatever it may be but the fact that you would immediately tell her

not only do I forgive you but but I'm appreciative I'm thankful shows you how evolved you are right So you're incredibly, incredibly special. Thank you. And you have to continue to, I think, share your voice and your presence with the world. For sure. Yeah. Brela, thanks so much. Thank you.

For being here. Yeah. I've learned quite a bit. Thanks. Quite a bit. One of the things I've learned is I need to learn to swim better. Like, you don't want to see me swimming. I'm like, yeah, you don't want to see it.

Brio, incredible, incredible human being. I know she doesn't want to be titled as inspirational or motivational or aspirational or aspirational or instructional. But I see her as all of the above and more. And I think it goes back to the conversation we had with Dr. Amir Levine, where he talked about attachment style and how secure parts. heal us. I can see that's, you know, I would suspect a lot of that happened with Breel's relationship with Adam, where she was healed through his love. And when I say his love, like his consistency, he drove her from Salt Lake City, 10 hours here specifically for this

conversation. They're about to jump in a car tomorrow and drive 10 hours back. He did that for her. Love is an action. I would only hook up with married straight men. I had a folder of boobs on my phone because it was the only way to protect myself. I didn't want to be gay by any means. You go from the NFL to the Bachelorette. How does that happen?

Please welcome, Colton Underwood. I always joke that I was bread not born. Like my mom was an All-American volleyball player. My dad was an All-American football player, but the NFL want to talk about their wins. They want to talk about stats. They want to talk about Jersey sales. Like, they don't want to talk about somebody's sexuality. All of the coaches in my life.

at some point said something homophobic. Was your father one of those people? Oh, yeah, I was. But The Bachelor was at like an all-time high. I was so naive of like what this show was gonna do to my life. I just needed to get out of there. What happened?

The scary part is I had somebody following me and taking pictures, and then that's when the blackmail happened. So it became much easier for me to take more pills to not have to look that direction. Was it abusing painkiller drugs? Every day, I was taking Xanax during breakfast, lunch, and dinner. Meeting Jordan, getting married, having a kid, all of those things change you. But you were on Celebrity Traders.

Yes. And what I understand is that you literally received death threats. What I would say is that is 15 versions of me ago. These blatant lies have to stop. Would you do another reality TV show?