We Need To Talk with Paul C. Brunson - We're Talking CHEATING: Is Once A Cheat ALWAYS A Cheat? "I Had Death Threats After Cheating"

Episode Date: July 24, 2025

Paul responds to the viral Coldplay concert kiss cam moment and dives into one of the most controversial topics in relationships. In this week's episode, We’re Talking: Cheating.  We hear the unforgettable moments from guests who’ve faced infidelity in different ways: ◽️ Katie Price opens up about an ex’s shocking betrayal with her nanny, housekeeper and best friend - and answers the age old question: “once a cheater, always a cheater?” ◽️ Pete Wicks opens up about the intense aftermath of his own infidelity, from facing death threats to enduring public shaming: “I felt like a national hate figure” ◽️ Maura Higgins reveals how she confronted a cheating ex right before Love Island ◽️ Sadia Khan breaks down why people cheat and the red flags we miss (00:00) Intro (01:23) Katie Price (05:01) Pete Wicks (10:35) Maura Higgins (16:39) Sadia Khan Watch the full episodes here: Katie Price: https://g2ul0.app.link/8cjkBBX6eVb Pete Wicks: https://g2ul0.app.link/e4Sdod76eVb Maura Higgins: https://g2ul0.app.link/QDINQva7eVb Sadia Khan: https://g2ul0.app.link/kfw3lnd7eVb Learn more about your ad choices. Visit megaphone.fm/adchoices

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All right, guys, welcome to our very first episode of We're Talking. Every Thursday, we're dropping the most unforgettable moments from We Need to Talk that sparked debate, stopped you in your tracks, and lit up the group chat. This week's episode is inspired by one of the most talked about moments in my house, and that is the viral cold play clip where Chris Martin called out those two. You know exactly who I'm talking about. the two who were hugged up on each other, and then the moment that the camera panned to them, ducking like they had just seen a ghost.

Turns out they weren't just colleagues. Cheating is one of those topics that gets everyone talking, because we've all got different definitions of boundaries and beliefs around it, right? So if I were to ask you, is once a cheat, always a cheat? What would you say? Can you come back from betrayal? What are the boundaries around cheating and not cheating? This is why this particular conversation is so important.

So what we're going to do is bring you the best of conversations I've had with previous guests on cheating. So let's get into it. Today we're talking cheating. One question I have to ask you. So, Katie. Oh, no. Now what? No, no, this is good.

This is good. So the question is, is once a cheater, always a cheater. Now, I have to say, when someone cheats, then it can be in a spectrum of other things, because then they can say, well, I've got sex addiction, I've got this and that. This is what I've had to deal with with one of my relationships. He wasn't just a cheat. He did it with my best friend, two of my best friends for 25 years. Then it was the nanny.

Then it was the housekeeper. Then it's this person that all people I knew, because it's, it was easy for him to cheat. I think he must have a problem. And then other people, I think they cheat. This is what for men. I'm not saying women are any good because women are just as bad as men.

And I think alcohol is no excuse, but I think if people are out and alcohol and it's easy and it's the fuck it button. And then they'll probably regret it off. So there's so many situations why people cheat. Or if they're not happy in a relationship, They want the attention from someone else and get it. And then before you know it, you're enrolled in the conversation to the point you either meet or you don't, then you do and then you cheat.

I've seen so many spectrums of cheating and what I've been through as well. Can I say even from an academic standpoint? Yeah. You just said it perfectly. Oh, did I? There's four main categories of physical and emotional cheaters. Right. One is someone who's like a sex addict.

Yeah. It's repetition. People often remember sex addiction, they don't care who it is. It's to do with the adrenaline and they feel shit after. And the high of the rush and the worst situation it is, the more heightened it is, the better the thrill that they feel shit after. Okay. So you said one of your former partners? Yes.

Sex addict, right? So that's one category. Another category you just said, you said the alcohol, it's called situational. Yeah. A third category is conflict avoidant. Yes. There's conflict. They're trying to avoid potential conflict.

They're trying to get out of the relationship. Yeah. And then the last category is revenge. Yes. And for me, revenge. See, I'm not into one night stand. So I'm not a one night stand person. So when I hear of people who do the one night stand thing for revenge,

I'm like, it's not going to make you feel better. That's going to make you feel sick. So do you think, though, once a cheater, always a cheater? Right. So when I say if I cheated, it's been. at the end of a relationship, like my ex who cheated on me with everyone and like, yeah, I said I start getting attention and then I would go out and have dinner or meet them. Okay.

But it don't mean so I had sex with them. But that's still a cheating. That's what I'm saying. People have to remember sex doesn't mean it's cheating. Texting and you know it's wrong is cheating. If you know in your head, oh, I shouldn't be doing this. Think to yourself. Would you like your other partner to do it?

And if you're already questioned, is it right or wrong, you've crossed the line. There you go. So then I have to ask. So once a cheat, always the cheat. They've done it once. See, I've been burnt so bad with it. Depends why they cheated. But I would say if they've done it once, they're capable of doing it again.

Wow, look at that. Where romantic relationships played out across Towie. Fucking did they. Now, some people would ask, were those real? Mm-hmm. They were real? Yeah, of course they were. I mean, at the beginning, I didn't know what I was getting into, so I was just myself.

And I made a million mistakes, and they played out all across the UK for millions of people. You were a relationship with Megan in particular at that time. That's one of the first time, you know, people are seeing something like this ever in their lives. When the breakup happens, and I guess ultimately it was you completely, you cheated. Yeah. When that happened, what was the reaction to you in the public side of? I mean, I have never experienced, I mean, it's really hard when I look back on it to think about how bad it was because at the time, you're so caught up in. I was going through a breakup with Megan that everyone kind of knew the ins and outs of.

It was laid out there. was getting death threats daily. Death threats. I would just fully. Fully death threats. I had people spit at me in the streets. I have people send me videos of the dolls they'd made hanging from trees that they were burning, like burning effigies.

I had a lot at the time. It was, I felt like I was a national hate figure, like public enemy number one. But all I was bothered about was, was at the time was. was Megan and the fact that I'd kind of lost Megan and I'd upset her and and I'd felt so guilty so, so guilty. But with that on top, again, I was just, I was all over the shop. But that, you know, it is what is, and the annoying thing is is, is people say, you know, if you're in the public hire, you put yourself in for this sort of stuff and completely you, you put yourself in a position where you allow people to make judgment

and you allow people to have opinions but even I've just done strictly I was getting death threats through strictly for still being in the competition because there were better dancers leaving and it does get to the point where yeah of course you put yourself in the position for people to pass judgment

I don't think anyone really deserves death threats and all the rest of it. It does get a bit fucking silly but that was my first experience of it back then and then like now I kind of go and fucking was ridiculous but then yeah to get a death threat I mean, I've received a death threat. So I can I can empathize and sympathize with it the first time that it comes.

You're thinking, oh my guy, fucking hell, do you know what I mean? And don't get me wrong. I was in the role. I always held my hands up about that. But it's something that it was between kind of Megan and I. And obviously we were on a show, so then it became between Megyni and the UK. but I never meant to her and obviously I did but the death threats and everything else that comes from it

you know people go through breakups and people you know cheat and do whatever else and it's fucking horrible and there's no right or wrong for it but the the attention that that got the me and Megan kind of thing and what that brought with it I was just double-founded I just what the I didn't know what to do Yeah I can't imagine Because at this point

This is where you're you're you're You know Notoriety across the UK is I mean it's it's it's it's it's Everyone knows you right And you've now just broken up With with the UK's darling Yeah right

You're the bad guy Yeah So the press begins right The press begins And it's relentless How do you think that that has impacted your relationships since then. Oh, I think this made me very wary of the press.

I were of, fully of the press, but it's made me also kind of wary of people. It's made me more private with enough, and I know I've done reality TV, and, you know, but I've always, that's when I think from that point, I became kind of two Pete's. There's the Pete that is on TV, which is still Pete, and it's still me.

I've always done everything as me, right, wrong, or whatever else. But then there's the very private me that my friends know and the people who know me, not on a camera, no. And that is, I mean, really, the difference between those two people, despite the fact that they're kind of the same is that the one that is off-screen is softer shit. but the impression that I gave across well I was you know pretty hard miserable

it couldn't really affect me type thing because it became a lot easier for people to hate that person than it did for people to hate the kind of real me that was a bit more vulnerable so the real Pete is vulnerable fucker yeah so Topia 2 has come home to Disney Plus

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New habitats. Zootopia has a secret reptile population. You can watch the record-breaking phenomenon at home. You're clearly working it. Zootopia 2. Now available on Disney Plus rated PG. Starting a business can seem like a daunting task, unless you have a partner like Shopify.

They have the tools you need to start and grow your business. From designing a website to marketing to selling and beyond, Shopify can help with everything you need. There's a reason millions of companies like Mattel, Heinz, and all birds continue to trust and use them. With Shopify on your side, turn your big business idea into... Sign up for your $1 per month trial at Shopify.com slash special offer. Yeah. Are you feeling very alone at this point before Love Island? Yeah.

Yeah. Are you dating anyone? Are you seeing anyone? I was for a few years. And he cheated on me multiple times. I was contacted for Love Island like a couple of years in a row. And I always said, no, I really, really liked this guy. And they had came again this one year. And I was like, no, you know, I'm so happy.

And then I was like, I need to be. go through his phone. I just need to check. I just need to check. Which I know a lot of people don't agree on, whatever. But look, I'm glad I did now. Yes. Because I found more stuff than I ever thought I'd find. Like, multiple women.

It wasn't just one, two, three. Yeah, it was honestly, my heart was thumping. Jeez. Yeah. You know, when something like that happens, I know that there's also a debate of, okay, do I, do I tell them or not? Do I tell my partner or not? What did you do? Did you confront him?

No. You didn't? No, I was in his house in L.A. I called my girlfriend back in Ireland, told her everything. She was like, oh my God, you need to go up and kill him. And I went, no, no, no, no. I went, that's too easy.

It's too easy to just shout at him. What, and then that's it? Nah. Stayed in his house a few more days. Cuddled up to him. told him I loved him he went to the gym I called back Love Island

I was like I'll do the show then when I flew back I did all my interviews and picture things and everything for the show while still downed upon to him I love you miss you so much baby

it sounds psychotic but it was my way of dealing with it and I actually wanted to go into the show without telling him so I'd spoke to the producers and they were like, oh, how long have you been single? And I was like, I'm not. I'm actually not. And they were like, what? And I was like, well, the guy is cheating on me at the moment. So they were like, I just don't think you should do this because when you're in there,

he could say whatever he wants. And, you know, they were looking out for me. So I was like, okay. So I had to call him and I dumped him over the phone. I mean, he didn't deserve respect in my eyes. and then all of a sudden I think it was like very close to me going on love him like maybe a week before going on the show I get a message and he's in my hometown he flew the whole way from America and he wanted to meet me

I brought my girlfriend with me she sat there listening to the whole thing and I just said straight away I was like can I see your phone and he went sure and I just remembered one of the women and I said where's all your messages from her and he said

never even heard of that girl and lucky to God when I went through his phone I videoed everything on my phone did you? Yeah yeah am I crazy no no you know what I was going to come back but let's

let's just say that now is that the negative self-talk you have to stop right you've called yourself psychotic you've called yourself crazy you called yourself greedy all within this conversation oh my God yeah You have. I didn't realize that.

You have. Wow. You can't do that. Okay. You can't do that. Words are powerful. Yeah. They really are.

I think you're brilliant. I think what you're doing is all the right. That's right. Yeah. You're documenting evidence. Come on now. Yeah. That's what you're doing.

Right? Because otherwise, it sounds to me, at least from your story. Yeah. He's gaslighting you. That is, we often misuse words, but that's a gaslight right there. That's official dictionary. I've got the evidence. Like, come on.

Yeah. So the fact that you had the evidence, that's brilliant. But now, let me ask you, so he had flown there to win you back. Mm-hmm. Clearly, he doesn't win you back. No. Okay. So he goes back?

He asked me to go to Paris with him for the weekend just to talk. Just to talk. And I was like, absolutely not. Like, it's not happening. Okay. Because you're going to Love Island. Well, I'm going to love Ireland. So now...

And I just won't. Even if the show wasn't there, I will not forgive that. No, not at all. I'd never trust them again. I would always be watching my... I would... Just say for instance, he went out with his friends. I'd be thinking, what is he doing?

Why isn't he replied to me? I don't want to turn into that girl. I don't want to be that girl. But I just feel like, apart from my best friend, every guy has just let me down. So I kind of, I go into it, No one, well, I say no one, but I expect to be let down.

There you go. And you can never be in a healthy relationship. If I'm expecting to be let down. Yeah. You know it already. Yeah. So that's something that you have to work on for yourself. But it also could be about how you're choosing your partners and who you're.

Oh, I can choose them. You could choose them. Oh, yeah. Very badly. There you go. It's about who. who you're allowing in your life. I told Mammy the next one has to be a serial killer.

No, no, no, no. That's what I told her. She was like, what? I was like, Mammy, come on. No, not at all. What do you believe informed that behavior early on to always be looking for infidelity? I always just had male friends.

That was always who I connected with the most. I had female friends, but the problem I always felt is that they would always enter an element of competition. Not because I'm so fascinating or anything like that. It's just so happens that it would lead to that direction. And I blame myself. There must be something in my energy that causes people to start being a bit on their back foot. So unless the woman was really happily married, which I have really happily married friends,

when there was any element of them still on the market, anything like, it would always just turn a little bit negative. And I would always kind of lean into my male friends and be like, oh, I don't know what happened here and I don't know what happened there. And what would happen is because I felt a bit safer because I felt like there was no competition. and I don't care if somebody fancies me. It doesn't affect my... Because people are like,

oh, how can you be friends with boys? They're going to want you and they're going to want to be with you. So I don't care. That's their problem. So because I never let that bother me, I was totally vulnerable with them. I always felt like...

And they were vulnerable back. So what I would learn is all the tricks of cheating in the process. So they would be like, oh, yeah, yeah, sometimes just put my girl's picture on my WhatsApp picture so she doesn't get scared,

but I still message all the girls. Or sometimes I'll go to the club and I'll always tell my location on, but I still do what I want when I'm there. So I realized that, oh, they actually, they lie a lot. They lie a lot. And whereas with girls, they don't tell you if they're lying. Like, they would never expose that if they're having an affair.

Boys would tell you, oh, yeah, I went with this girl, and yesterday I went with that girl. So I learned this behavior that was like, oh, my God, is this what you guys do? And in that moment of realization, I thought, okay, I've got to be one step ahead of guys. And then also being young and then, you know, being around lots of men, what would happen is I would see them risk their eyes. own relationships to try and talk to me or their own relationships trying to be with me. So I learned that men are not as monogamous as you think and they're not as faithful as you think, particularly the men I affiliate with. I'm not saying all men, but I tend to go around men who are very confident, have a lot of access to women who, you know, don't struggle with women. I realize

that it's not that easy. They can be madly in love with you, but still sexually attracted to somebody else. And that realization was the opposite of what girls would always say. They say, oh, when he loves you, he'll never touch anybody else. I'm like, yeah, but when he's loves you. I mean, he's a good pair of tips who still might want something. People used to say, he would never cheat on you. You're amazing. And I was like, you can be amazing. But you might have one thing that they're missing or they really crave and they can go elsewhere. So I went in with that mentality like, oh, no, you're not going to trick me. I know the situation too well. And that's where it came from. Wow. You know what? That makes sense. Does it actually? I feel like I just went

on a roller coaster. No, no. I mean, for someone who has been researching it, right? Now I begin to better understand why you have certain positions. Yes. Right? As a result of your childhood, as a result of having many friends who were men, right? And then also having a husband who then changes your perspective, right?

I see that, you know, it's not black or white for you. You live in the gray. Yeah. Right, which I think we all should live in. Objectivity. What I've learned from these conversations and coaching. couples for years is that cheating isn't always the end of a relationship, but it's always a turning point. And if you want to hear the full unfiltered stories from today's guest, you can

check them out on the We Need to Talk page. Drop a like, leave a comment, and hit subscribe. That's it for this episode, and I want to leave you with my biggest takeaway. Just don't go to a Coldplay concert. See you next week.