Wonderful! - Wonderful! 429: The Silver Fox & The Pewter Hound

Episode Date: August 26, 2026

Rachel's favorite socially perceptive phenomenon! Griffin's favorite music that has a vast ocean of influence! Music: “Money Won’t Pay” by bo en and Augustus – https://open.spotify.com/album/7n6zRzTrGPIHt0kRvmWoya Native Women Lead: https://www.nativewomenlead.org/ Help support this show and unlock bonus content! Become a member at https://maximumfun.org/joinwonderful

Hi, this is Rachel McElroy. Hello, this is Griffin McElroy. And this is wonderful. Welcome to Wonderful. This is a podcast where we talk about the things that we like that's good that we're into. Used to be a show talking about people kissing on TV. And a bunch of people said, cool, but a bunch of people said, yuck. So instead, we do whatever the heck we want.

I think that's placing the responsibility on our listeners when ultimately it was us that decided it was too uncomfortable. Sure. To talk about these trouble. TV shows. The shows are troublesome. They're problematic in so many ways. I just am now kind of reflecting on the fact that we watch a lot of reality dating shows still, used to do a podcast exclusively about them. And yet, we don't like seeing people kiss. We don't like seeing people kiss. We don't like seeing people kiss. It's the Zoom in. It's the Zoom in. It's the industry standard zoom in on a reality program when people kiss. Yeah. And they want you to see exactly what they're

cows look like when they're together. Yeah. And I guess I didn't realize tongue kissing. Interesting. What's that? Tongue kissing? You mean lips kissing, right? That's the body part you use for kissing.

Sometimes when people are having a passionate kiss. What? They will open their mouths and they will allow their tongues to interact. Huh. And a lot of times when you are watching a reality dating program, they really get you in on the tongue and saliva that is exchanged. And, you know, the tongue is a muscle. Yeah.

And you really get a sense of that when you watch people kiss on TV. Yeah, a big, big, big, big slab of meat going in there. And I tell you, it's HD. It's the 16 by 9 expansion. And part of it is exposure, right? Because when you watch a scripted program, actors often have a kind of unspoken rule with each other where they might open their mouth. Yeah.

But they're not going to get their tongue involved out of respect for the other actor unless, you know, they've talked about it in advance, etc., etc. All of that means that when we watch movies and television, we don't see a lot of tongue. No. Whereas on a reality program, a lot of tongue. See, I'm suggesting that maybe, you know, back in old movies when like Carrie Grant would French Rosemary Clooney or whatever, we couldn't even tell because it wasn't. It was in low definition.

We didn't have the pixel density required to see. Gosh, yeah. Rosemary Clooney's tongue or Carrie Grant's tongue. And that is what you and I grew up watching. Sure. I don't know if those two were in a movie together. I don't really know. I don't think so.

I saw a lot of Carrie Grant films because I was charmed by him. Sure. I haven't seen so many of them. Catherine Hepburn, too. Oh, yeah. That was another. Bringing a baby. Yeah.

That's a good one. Sure. my pal's Davy Philadelphia stories another one I think that one has Jimmy Stewart in it too

Come on down to Utah More like because of that time period I imagine Utah was relatively new So it was like welcome to Utah Yeah it was like a promotional film for Utah starring I think Carrie Grant And Rosemary Clooney Yes

That was the one that they were in Yeah she's got Utah written all over Doesn't she though Do you have any small wonders before we really get into the meat of the topics today? Cool mornings. Cool fucking mornings, dude. It is still very warm here in the afternoon,

but just in time with school starting, we get that nice cool morning that lets you, like, walk your kid to school and debate. Should I wear sleeves or not? I've done sleeves all the mornings so far, and I've regretted it by the time we reach the top of the hill. This is a bigger problem,

I mean, this is a huge small wonder. This is like a jumbo-sized small wonder is that both our kids go to the same school now. So easy to get them there and back. Holy crap. Now that small son is in kindergarten, he is available for the school that Henry goes to. Now, they do have, you know, slightly different release times, which we're still figuring out. But, yeah, I mean, that's awesome. That's awesome.

They go to the same school. There's one building that we go to. now. Yeah. That's great. I used to have to go to two, like in my day-to-day life, I used to have to go to, I guess, three buildings, our house, one school, the other school. Now it's just our house and the school. And then I tell them, there is no need for it. A lot of people say, like, we are missing a third location. And it's like, that's just another place I got to go. Yeah, this is kind of revealing the level of isolation that you were in. I don't know what you're talking about. Day to day to day. I talk to people all the time on online. I talk to people. I have so. many friends. Yeah. And what are their usernames?

That's ice cold, you go first this week. What would you like to talk about? Mine actually kind of could be used in conversation about reality television. Amazing.

And that is something I just discovered, which is called the Michelangelo Effect. The Michelangelo Effect? Yes. Hmm, can I try and guess? Sure.

Is it when you see someone and they get silly eating a big pizza spinning around nunchucks. Was that Michelangelo? Was that Michael Angelou had the nunchucks, right? Leonardo had the katanas. Raff had the sigh.

Donatello had the staff. Had to be Michelangelo. Process of elimination. That one? No. Is it when you put your hand on your thing like this, like you're thinking? That's Rodin.

That's the thinker by Roden. By who? Roden. R-O-D-I-A. in? I'm not so sure about that. I think if one of us is going to know stuff about art history, I'm really good at identifying when Crazy Red, the raccoon or fox sneak thief from Animal Crossing tries to sell you fake art. I can always say, like, I'm pretty good at that. Oh, I'm not. Because I can go online. Oh, well, yeah. So I like know some stuff about art history. I was just thinking,

I mean, I'm really curious if you were like a high school or college student at the height of Ninja Turtles. Yeah. If your teachers really tried to capitalize on that. Oh, dude, for sure. I have to imagine they did. Like, hey, I've got some news for you guys. Do you know those turtles you love so much?

Their names align with this person. You're going to learn about today. We're going to start with Leonardo. Yeah. They kick in the door to their classroom like, pasta time, guys. No, man. No. Not quite.

That's when you were telling us about Andrew Garfield last week. Yeah, that was a different. I don't know why they're discussing Andrew Garfield. Me neither. But isn't that the name of also, or is that James Garfield? The president? Yeah. He didn't have a first name.

Oh. Yeah, it was cool. That's why people voted for him is like, people were out there and like, oh, I'm Martin Van Buren. James. I was right. It's James A Garfield. Oh. No, no, no.

James, comma. A Garfield. What's the Michelangelo effect? I'm on tinter hooks. Okay, so this is interesting. So the reason it is called that is that Michelangelo had the quote describing sculpture as, quote, a process whereby the artist released a hidden figure from the block of stone in which it slumbered. Interesting. So this idea that like every block of stone can be a sculpture.

Yeah, if you, you know, approach it correctly. The Michelangelo effect is the idea that when you are in a partnership with somebody, whether it's like romantic or friendship, your view of that person and your kind of energy impacts their energy or success. Okay. You know, that's kind of an abstract way to talk about it. But I will say what I found on Wikipedia, which is the Michelangelo. effect describes a three-step process where close partners shape each other so as to bring forth one another's ideal selves.

Okay. I'm loving the sound of this so far. So this is something I was thinking a lot about in regards to our reality shows because one of the things that happens in a lot of relationships is you are trying to shape the partner into who you think they should be. Right. Instead of accepting them. Right. That's a big recurring theme on this season of Married at First sight.

And when Griffin and I talk about our previous relationships, a big problem in most of them. Yeah. You know, of this idea of like, you see somebody in the way that you want to see them. Yeah. And then spend your whole relationship trying to make them that person. Right. Exactly. Yes. Which is never who they... That's what you do, right? That's not the fault.

Never who they, like, wanted to be. Right. Necessarily. So the three core parts of the Michael and. Angelo effect. Partner perceptual affirmation, partner behavioral affirmation, and self-movement toward the ideal self. Okay. I think those are pretty evident. They're pretty self-explanatory. But what's it mean? But what do they mean for like if someone was confused? So partner perceptual affirmation is whether the partner regards their match as the person they would like to be,

or has traits of the person they would like to be. That's interesting. Yeah. So you are seeing kind of that person and you are kind of affirming who they are because you kind of would like to be more like them. Or they have qualities that inspire you or you feel like are important or valuable. That's a concept in a lot of fiction writing, particularly like when you're writing romantic relationships is what is the thing that is missing that this person has that they have for

each other. I like that. This came up recently because when I talk about myself prior to meeting Griffin, I see myself as a more kind of sarcastic, cynical person. And it was not something I liked about myself. It was just something that had kind of happened over time. And then I saw Griffin as somebody who was very enthusiastic and positive, which may have... Hey, man, that makes me sound fucking great. Like, don't get me wrong. I didn't know you before I knew you. So maybe you were that way. I have trouble believing it. You've been a true ray of sunshine in my life. I seriously, talking to Griffin, I mean, it must have been like a few years into our

relationship when he was like, I have some issues with anxiety. And I was like, what? I was genuinely surprised. I did not see you as a remotely anxious person. Push it all the way down. Shout out to a lot of the administration over at Highlawn Baptist Church. taught me like, I mean, I hung with the best. And when you hang with the best, you learn from the best, you become the best at hiding.

At hiding. Your stuff. Anyway, now I don't see myself as that way at all. I've seen myself as a more enthusiastic, positive person. And I think a lot of that comes from our relationship. And so I don't know if that was always there, let's say. and I didn't really become aware of it. It sounds like the Michelangelo effect is suggesting that it was.

Yeah. Yeah, or that the act of that happening was the effect. Right, sure. Maybe not that it was always there, but that I wanted it to be bigger and it became bigger for our relationship. Partner behavioral affirmation, you can kind of expect what that is. It's how a partner acts in a way that aligns with the ideal self. So, for example, if a teacher's expectations of a student are higher is shown to improve their performance.

Okay, that's interesting. So if you see somebody is kind of capable of great things, they're more likely to kind of head that direction. Yeah, for sure. Yeah. I feel that one with you in a major way. Oh, thank you, honey. It's true. I do.

I feel, I do. I mean, it's true. I'm glad. Yeah. When I met you, you had just done your first live show in Chicago. That's right. Or no, I met you right before that because I remember you emailing me about it. Oh, that's right.

Yeah, because I came to South by Southwest and like during spring break or something. And I thought you were very funny. And I thought, you know what you guys really need to focus on is YouTube. Yeah, she said, listen. I said that. She said, have you guys considered pivoting to video? And I was like, what does that even mean? I've never heard those words strung together in that way.

It was pretty cool, actually, that you helped us out in that way. And I said, I don't know a lot about role-playing games, but I think there's a big future for you in that area. And then you were like cloud computing. And I was like, uh, I don't know about that one, babe. No, I'm just kidding. You never, you never cared about cloud computing. No, I still. I mean, is.

I'm me too, dude. I'm not a hundred. Is that when you save stuff in the cloud? I think that can mean that, but it can also mean like AI, like, AI compute power stuff. I think it's a blanket term. And that's not as cool. Yeah.

As the cloud. The last one, self-movement towards the ideal self describes how the distance between the self and ideal self closes. So this idea that you have this idea of kind of who you want to be and your partner

is kind of supporting you on that path. Yeah. One thing they said, and this is, what I was mentioning earlier, to avoid in that situation, to avoid the Pygmalion phenomenon. Ooh, God, we have so many good names for these things. Which is where partners foist their own ideals onto a spouse. So this is what I was talking about earlier.

I've never read Pygmalion. I don't know what happens. I had to look it up. And it's somebody kind of falls in love with a donkey? No, why would you think a donkey? I don't know. Maybe I'm thinking of a midsummer night's dream. So there's a Greek myth where a sculptor falls in love with his own creation.

Oh, wow. Weird science. Manikin. The 80s were a very... I don't think the person made mannequin. I don't think they made the mannequin and then fell in love with it, right? Anthony Michael Hall, I think. Maybe.

He was weird science. He was weird science where they, like, made the person. They made the lady. Weird. Anyway, so the pig million, the idea that you have kind of created a version of this person and you've fallen in love with that. There was also a play, which I have not seen by George Bernard Shaw. Okay. Maybe that's one.

Anyway, that's a Michelangelo effect. I felt like it was a really concise way to talk about like, oh, a good relationship. Yeah, basically is what it all kind of boils down to is not changing a person but sort of. Yeah, of seeing the best in them and kind of supporting them on their path. and kind of being a person that they can feel, you know, proud of. Yeah. I wish I'd like, this reminds me of like mirroring the concept and like relationships, which I feel like if someone had clued me into in 10th grade,

would have saved me a lot of time. Would it save me a lot of time in the heart? There's no avoiding that, though. Even people pick friends, like their best friends and they dress like them. Yeah, absolutely. Yeah, I know when I started wearing glasses and I have brown hair. hair. Everyone was like, oh, well, now you look like Griffin.

You and Griffin are indistinguishable. But now I have gray hair. And thicker glasses. Not as much as me. Not as much, though. You don't have, when people comment on the clips of wonderful, that get posted on social, they're always like, God, Rachel's such a babe. Babe, babe, babe, babe, babe, uh, babe, uh, Five Alarm Babe

Babe Fire. They say stuff like that. And then when I show up, they're like, when did this fucking dusty cryptkeeper? this dusty gray. They don't even call me a silver fox. They call me a pewter hound. I love that movie, by the way. The silver fox and the pewter hound.

That's what they call me. So it's not the same. It's not the same. Well, I mean, I don't think that's true, for one. I think also you have a lot more videos that they can say those things on. That's true. People don't have a lot of opportunity to comment on my appearance. Yeah.

Hey, can I steal you away? Yes. Cool. I'm going to talk about a band today, and it's a band I've wanted to talk about for a while, but I've been hesitant to do so because I thought it would be pretty hard to summarize what they're kind of all about. And also because I'm relatively new to my fandom of them, but it has become extremely powerful very quickly. And that band is Magdalena Bay. Yes, you've been playing some of them in the car.

I've been playing a lot of them in the car. So I actually found them like a track of theirs got served up to me on a, a Spotify recommended playlist before that algorithm got put in the fucking garbage can by like skibbitty toilet or whatever. Oh, so this was a long time ago. This was a long time ago. But I never really like dove in and like, you know, listen to their other songs. I was like, oh, this track is cool, but I didn't like go in further.

It wasn't until I was putting together the fuser set list for this year's Max Fun Drive like streams. And they had a bunch of tracks up that people had turned into fuser. tracks that I was like, oh, wait, these are all fucking great. What if I went and just listen to all of them? And I've been listening to them for months now, just kind of nonstop. They've become one of my favorite bands. They are Magdalena Bay is an indie alternative prog pop band sort of. I'm going to throw a lot of genre, like a lot of genre spaghetti in here because you kind of have to. They formed in 2016. Since then, they put out two studio albums, a bunch of singles and EPs and toured, pretty extensively. And again, the music is very difficult to describe due to the like vast ocean of

influences and genres that it incorporates. There's a lot of synth and like bubble gum pop stuff a la like Kara Caro Bonito. But then like mixed with psychedelic like 60s influence and disco and yacht rock grooves from the 70s and like classic pop sounds from the 80s and 90s. Their videos have a very retro quality. Very, yeah, a lot of Y2K era, like early internet aesthetic. So that's five decades that I just met. Like they're basically like if time travelers formed a band, like at the end of Bill and Ted's bogus journey.

And their music's just so weird and fascinating, but also like so expertly made and catchy. And I can't stop listening to it. I want to play my favorite song of theirs. It's a synth pop yacht rock song about online privacy. called Secrets Your Fire. So Magdalena Bay is made up of mostly two people. Matthew Lewin, who's sort of a multi-instrumentalist, and Micah Tenenbaum, who is the sort of singer,

guitarist that provides the sort of Kate Bush-esque, breathy vocals over all the songs. They met in high school, in addition to being longtime creative partners, they're also longtime romantic partners, which is fun. Oh, I love that. So they met in high school during an after-school music program in 2011. And after that, they formed a Prague rock band for a while called Tabula Rasa with their current touring drummer, Nick Villa. And then they went to different colleges.

They reconnected during a break from college and started to share their like newfound appreciation for a lot of alt-pop artists who were coming up like Grimes and Charlie X-C-X. And so inspired by that, they formed. Magdalena Bay, the name of which they got from a woman, an administrator at Lewin's IT job, whose name was Maggie Bay. They took this actual human beings name. And used it as the name of their band, Magdalena Bay. It is also, I think, a place in Mexico. So they moved to L.A. together in 2018. They started to release like a bunch of singles and mixed tapes as Magdalena Bay. And they also started to make these super DIY music videos in their apartment just with a green screen.

Wow. Yeah. So like, the music video as I sent you were from more recent sort of stuff. But if you go back and watch like the old ones, like it's so charming and so impressive, like the amount of stuff that they were able to do in this like home studio that they had set up. So they had plans to promote one of their new EPs on a tour with Caro Carabonito and an artist named Yumi Zuma. But that was waylaid by the pandemic, which, you know, obviously scrapped all all touring acts for a lot. long time. So they instead they went head down on their first like full-length studio album, which is called Mercurial World, which dropped in October 21, 2021 to critical acclaim. That song, Secrets Your Fire is off of that album. It's really, it's 14 tracks and each one fucking slaps in like so many different ways. Are both the songs you sent me from the same album? No, so the other song that came out is from their other full-length album, which came out in 2024 called Imaginaldisc. It is also a loose concept album about.

a character named True, who has a CD inserted into her forehead by some strange entity that's supposed to make her her ideal self, sort of Michelangelo effect style, but her body rejects it, and then she has to like learn how to be a human again. I didn't necessarily pick up on a lot of those themes because I listen to most albums kind of out of order and listen to tracks. But this past June, they debuted a film adaptation of the concept album, digital discs at Tribeca. That hasn't been released anywhere, like publicly. The disc in the forehead and everything, I'm assuming. A lot of their music videos that have come out of this album came from the movie. So the music video I sent you for the other song we're going to talk about today came from Imaginal Disc. And again, man, like, it's a big album and I think every song on it is fantastic.

It really swings between like these upbeat, like super catchy, very bubble-gummy, like pop, synth-forward dance jams to like these contemplative, sort of very lovely and sometimes menacing, ominous, like, songs about, like, identity and stuff. The influences they cite for this album include St. Vincent, Radiohead, Fiona, Apple, the Beatles, Bjork, and E-L-O, sort of all blended with a maximalist sort of production approach. Again, like, all that stuff on paper, I think sounds maybe like too many. cooks in the kitchen. Like if you said, yeah, there's a band and they do these 15 different

sort of things, it would sound like it would be maybe a little convoluted. Like on Top Chef, when people are like, yeah, and then I threw some crumbled up Doritos on there. And they're like, no, no, why did you put so much shit in there? But it's the result, I think, is really phenomenal. I think this album rules. You really sold me on it. The song I'm going to play here towards the end of the segment. It's called death and romance off a national disc. I think it can hang with some of the best pop songs ever recording. I think it fucking slaps. It's so good. When you sent it to me, I recognized it from in the car because I just felt like this, whenever the song comes on, I'm just in it. It has like nine different hooks that like have gotten stuck in my head.

And it's the density of that in one song is really kind of unheard of. Here is a little bit of death and romance. There's honestly so much to say about this band because what they're doing is so like immensely interesting. I think to take all of these different disparate like inspirations and influences and not just like make them work together but also evolve them so that it's not just a rehash of other people's stuff but is something that is like truly unique, a truly unique like sound that no one else is really making and you know making all these. like really rad DIY music videos for them. Like as someone who does creative stuff, like it is so inspiring. It is so, so, so inspiring.

And I think that's why I've been like really digging their music lately is because like I have been looking for stuff to get me energized for like, for like new stuff. And they give, they offer a lot, I will say, uh, in that sort of department.

So that's Magdalena Bay. Uh, they're, they're my favorite band right now. So the most recent album was 2024? Yes. They've released some like deluxe editions of their past stuff and continue to put out singles and EPs.

I don't know what the status of like their next thing is. They're also like they have a big online presence. They do like a lot of, you know, TikToks and Instagram reels and stuff about their music and like the music industry in general. Like really inviting people into like the production of their music. It's just, it's very cool stuff. That is cool. Do you want to know what our friends at home are talking about? Yes.

Jaden says, I love when a box of tissues makes the last few tissues a different color. so you know you're close to running out and can plan accordingly. I have never seen this before. Have you? I have noticed there's like a blue streak that will be. Really? Yeah. You haven't noticed that?

No. Yeah. I don't know what the brand is that does it, but you pull a tissue out and if it's got the blue streak on it, it means you're running low on tissues. Interesting. Keep an eye out. I wonder. Welcome to 99.9.9% invisible. I wonder if it has just so happened my entire life.

I have not been the person to pull out that tissue. Well, I will say that it's weird. behavior to pull out a tissue and then really look at it contemplate it? Well, I mean, it's a blue stripe. I feel like I'd notice. It would catch the eye. Gosh, you remember when they used to sell like tissues colored in different ways? You could buy like a

pink tissue box with pink tissues in it? I guess. This is like an 80s thing. Yeah, I don't know. I only have a vague memory of it. I don't remember blowing my nose in a pink tissue. It's like when you could buy colored toilet paper too. Well, I don't, I never did that. I'd remember that. I feel like this was a thing. I mean, it

was a very long time ago. Okay. Emma says my small wonder is the billboard I drive past every day on my commute to work. It's a giant hot dog with the words big glizzy over it and it never fails to make me smile. And this is a sheets, apparently a sheets of advertisers. Oh, okay. I would say, what would that be for? For sheets, hot dogs or big glissies, as I hope they call them in store.

I hope they have the courage of their convictions that the skew, the barcode above it reads Big Glizzy. Yeah. Gosh, I wonder if any of those hot dog forward companies have thought about putting that on the label just to see if the, you know, the Gen Z goes for it. I don't even know if Glizzy is Gin Alpha. Is Glizzy Gen Alpha? Like, I think Gen Alpha is out there making content now. Wow, really? I think so. Yeah. So like, maybe Glizzy is their thing. I'm not sure. It's one of the most delightful, I think, turns a phrase. I'm scared of it. Glizzy?

I'm scared of it. I've never heard you say it like out loud. No, I'm scared of it. Sometimes when people tell me what something means, well, besides it making me feel old, I feel like, is this real or is this a prank? And you just want all of us old people to say it. I will. I'll fall for it every time.

I think it's funny. Like I'm laughing with you at that point. Like they're saying glit. But I also don't want to ruin it. I'm very cognizant of my age. And I don't want to be, I don't want to. I don't want to unc out. Even me saying that feels like I'm on border line. I think that was cringe. That actually did hurt. I'm just trying to use the parlons. I know, but that one did hurt.

But I think that means you used it right. So that's commendable at least. I want to thank Bowen and Augustus for the use for our theme song Money Won't Pay. Find a link to that in the episode description. And thank you to Maximumfund.org. So many great programs over there at Maximum Fund. for you to check out and absolutely fall in love with. We have some merch in the merch store over at Macroymerch.com. A pewpating is always a bonus action shirt inspired by the Taz Royale finale. We've also got tickets for the Bessie's Live Show happening October 9th at the town hall in New York City. That's over at bit.ly slash bessies on Broadway.

And our merch is at Macroymerch.com, by the way. We stream also every day now, basically. over on our YouTube channel. So follow us there, the Macroy family on YouTube. Rachel and I did a stream where we played Metchocameleon. You can find that in the backlog. That's true. So check that out.

I think that's it. Oh, man, it's time to be real. Oh, it is? Yeah. I can't believe that timing. It hit right as I was saying, this is it. And so this is for wonderful. Thumbs up.

I'm Griffin. I'm Rachel. And you guys keep it. Be real. And that can be like, we do like a cross-promo thing with the... Oh, that would be amazing. I don't know anything about Be Reels. Maybe the people who run and are not good, but...

Probably. But think of the money. Maximum Fun. A Worker-Oad Network of Artist-owned shows. Supported directly by you.