Wonderful! - Wonderful's ThirdLove Love-stravaganza!

Episode Date: March 26, 2021

In this very special bonus episode — brought to you by ThirdLove — we discuss the ins and outs of modern online dating with our guest, Romance Correspondent Anna Roch! Get some good bras with ThirdLove! https://www.thirdlove.com/pages/breakup Music: “Money Won’t Pay” by bo en and Augustus – https://open.spotify.com/album/7n6zRzTrGPIHt0kRvmWoya MaxFunDrive ends on March 29, 2024! Support our show now by becoming a member at maximumfun.org/join.

Hi, this is Rachel McElroy. Hello, this is Griffin McElroy. And this is wonderful. It's a very special episode. It's a very special episode just for you, the listener. We're going to talk about grown-up stuff like they do on TV. This very special episode is brought to you by Third Love. Third Love makes the good bras.

They make the bras that fit you just right. And they keep all the stuff where it's supposed to be, where you want it to be. And they help you figure out all that stuff. And they're great. You've heard us talk about Third Love a lot. lot yeah we are very fortunate that they approached us and they said you have the best podcast and we have the best bras and let's work together to put something magical into the world and we said okay yeah here we are so we we sort of took the idea of love and ran with it and we get a lot of people saying, Griffin, Rachel, you have the most pure love that anyone's had on the planet.

It's greater than Jack and Rose. It's greater than, you know, Brangelina. And that's the only two that I can think of. It's been about 20 years since you've had any access to television. To the media, yeah. And so so people say what's your romance secrets and we say we haven't done we haven't done dated in a very long time so we don't really know how what's going on out there even so we have tapped a very special romance correspondent uh our our friend fellow podcaster, and master of, it says here on her portfolio, master of love, Anna Roach.

Welcome to the show, Anna Roach. Hello. What an intro. Yeah. I'm so happy that you're here. We've been wanting to get you on the show for quite some time. We've never had a guest before but when we thought let's have a guest we thought number one anna i spring to mind i appreciate that so much

anna you you come to us in our friend group i feel like with some of the choicest nugs when it comes to dating and finding romance out on the high seas. Yes. And I guess we're just here to kind of find out what's going on out there. What's the scene like in, you know, without the weight of COVID hanging over it, but also what's that all about? And what do you, what's the secret? Well, and before you begin i want to give you a an intro a little bit uh and just say anna has been our friend for uh i mean my friend for over 10 years oh so it's gonna oh so it's gonna be like that and it's a friend

competition always if we did split up anna me and me and Rachel, that would never, ever happen. Wow. Who do you think you would take phone calls from? You don't have to answer this. I anticipated this question. I've been thinking about this a lot. Griffin, you know I love you dearly, but I am going to have to go with Rachel. Yeah, she saw you first. That's all there is to it. That's just how it is.

We share a love of poetry. It would have to be Rachel. And you recently started your own podcast with a couple of your friends called Stab in the Back. Stab in the Back. We decided, you know, there's a real void in the world of podcasting when it comes to true crime. We thought we really needed to help fill that void. So we took our love of campy television and decided to use that as a method to record and hear ourselves speak on it um well i mean knives out you know it's uh now we now we're

now we're competitors for people's mindshare and i don't even know that you thought about that i don't know how much audience overlap there is but probably more than we realize yeah yeah um it's it could be interesting we'll have to see it's a it's a delightful show even uh for someone like myself who doesn't care for hearing about murders so that's really saying something and you you were um rachel and i got together in 2011 and i feel like a lot of developments in dating technology came about since then. And I remember very distinctly, you sort of showing us like Tinder, like when that when that had just kind of started. So I think that's why you sprung to mind for for this very special episode. Can you talk a little bit about your sort of experience out there in the

field? Absolutely. I mean, I feel like what you said earlier about navigating the high seas is accurate. It's a very rocky ocean. I do consider myself a captain of sorts. It has been quite the journey. I feel like, you know, I've done some really hard work in this area, because online dating is always tricky. The past year has been especially so. I think that the apps are pretty horrible. There's a lot going on there that you have to navigate through all the time. One thing that I would recommend to everyone just hearing this right off the bat is that before you enter into that, you need to know romance as it's been sold to us is a little bit of a scam. Ooh, well, as as wow, as salespeople for that romance.

That's a tough pill to swallow. Now, tell me how you came to this realization, I guess, is what I want to know. I think the culture around online dating, the culture around dating is really, you know, from a very young age, and Rachel, you might identify with this as a woman, I felt like I was told from a very young age that the one is out there for me. He's waiting for me, I just have to find him. And so with apps, I felt like that it became this mission where the one is just a swipe away. I'm going to find him. He's one swipe away. Just keep going. That's, by the way, I don't know if that is a tagline that dating apps have used before, but the one is just a swipe away is pretty powerful. I mean, there it is, right?

And I just feel like that I've really had to change my entire mindset about how I approach that because you may in fact find a really successful relationship through those apps, but it's okay if it's not a forever situation. It's okay if it's not the one. You might have several ones throughout the course of this journey. And I think it's okay if you modify looking at this journey a little bit instead of such a long-term situation. It's okay maybe if I find a really healthy, happy, short-term situation, right? That I'm not so focused on the outcome anymore. It seems like from the outside looking in that these dating app platforms

seems like from the outside looking in that these dating app platforms have occasionally like strong starts where they are actually useful in some way and then they are slowly but surely eroded away by just real usually usually an influx of jagoffs who render the the who's so thoroughly seed the field with their with their awful awful ways uh like you say you saying i remember what everybody was up all about bumble for a bit because bumble what i something was different about bumble it puts the agency in the in the woman's corner woman that's right the woman has to reach out so you when you're swiping and you match with someone, the woman has to initiate contact within 24 hours or that match goes away. So it's a little bit, you know, Bumble is interesting because you do have to work at it a little bit more than a traditional app like a Tinder where you're just maybe or an OKCupid where you're getting a lot of contact all the time. You know, the messages are, at least in my case, they're flowing. Yeah, to go back to the first time that you showed us Tinder, I didn't know which way

swiping. Swiping left means you don't want them. Swiping right means you do like them, right? That is correct. OK, I got those. I did have those mixed up and did a switcheroo the first time you showed me the app. And I may have hooked you up with a gentleman who, and I'm not here to yuck any yums, but his yucks were yucky.

And he was putting it out there. I do have to say, we've got to put some respect on this guy's name because he's a legend, I feel like, in our friend group at this point. Absolutely. He put himself fully out there. He was not trying to be secretive about what he wanted and what he was looking for, which you have to respect. And what he wanted was your toenails. Needed them. Gotta have them.

For what purposes? Well, he was a toenail clipper, I believe enthusiast is the word he used. And I don't want to invoke that word. I know that's a sacred word here on Wonderful. But that is the language that he used. So can I ask, before we get too into the apps, did you do like the real like original like Match.com, eHarmony, OkCupid scene as well? How deep in the game are you?

I have. I've kind of done everything. I've paid for things through the years. I've done paid subscriptions. I've done three-month chunks because I just couldn't bring myself to do longer than that in some cases. I have done OKCupid.

I will say I have had many successful dates. I don't want to paint this like it's been a terrible journey the entire way. I have met some really nice people. I have had some really nice outings. But it just wasn't a romantic love connection for me most of the time. We would go out. I'd even had more than one date with some of these people.

But ultimately, I have never found an actual relationship through an app. it like been pretty much the same like can you like when you match with somebody are you like this is impressive or are you like oh we both you know put frazier in our bio and that's why they matched us why would you assume i have free that was extremely reductive you know come on i do want to say that i think sometimes um it is spot. Sometimes I get the feeling that people are being hidden from me purposefully because they want me to pay. So I do think there's a little bit of like, you know, there's different apps have different ways that you do this, but you can buy like roses on hinge and it'll give you like a chance to like offer a rose to someone and like you know really show that you extra like wait which i've yeah did you did you roses like yes did you rose okay they're

not real roses that like go to their apartment it's like oh i wish gosh that would be so nice an emoji rose that you have to pay for yes you have to pay for it and it's like a super like um so you really are communicating that you like that person a lot. I don't know what the response rate is on that for people. I've never received a rose. So I don't know if people are just mortified to pass out roses. Yeah, the message of I love you so much that I paid this company, you know, a buck 99 to be able to really put some stink behind it. I don't know about you, but I love when somebody says, I'm in love with you, but I've never met you. That's one of my favorite things to hear. That's a strong play.

It's from some of the stories you've told us. There's also, and quite frequently, and I assume this is, I mean, this is pretty universal. The problem hasn't been that the people that you've been matched up with have been, you know, complete jerks all the time. Sometimes it is a, you know, a lack of compatibility that maybe they don't pick up on and they go way too hard in the paint, like way too fast. way too hard in the paint, like way too fast. That is something that I run into quite frequently. And I think just the culture around app dating adds to this. I feel like that, you know, I've even shared with you two before, we've had this conversation about sort of a fantasy being created that I don't have anything to do with, right? So they see my profile. And I mean, I'm not going to lie to you, my profiles are top notch. And, you know, I put a lot of work into the profile, like I really

try to be, you know, funny, but also kind of lend it to question asking, so that there's things they could ask me about to get a conversation rolling. But I've noticed that we might be compatible, we might be vibing off of these shared interests that I've kind of tried to present through my profile and my bio. And it just feels like sometimes they start to run with it a little bit too hard. And I don't have any role in the in the fantasy, you know, that sort of being created around what's happening. And I can say this, y'all, because I did that too. At one point. Right.

You know, like, I'm very familiar with how that feels. Yeah, I look back, I did online dating for half a year, maybe less than that when I was living in Chicago. And I did match in OkCupid, which were kind of the only games in town back then, this would have been like 2010 uh and match you had to pay for okay cupid was free so okay cupid was very much the wild west and i was always too scared of it to like find a date on there but i remember like having a a couple of dates with someone and at the end of the second date being like that was really kind of weird and uncomfortable and then i was like wait a minute i think it's because i was like trying to like push it trying to treat it like a like a relationship

yeah thing even if and that's clearly like looking back clearly not what it is i just think that's a very easy mistake to make especially if i don't know there's circumstances where maybe you're just out of a long relationship and you don't like, you just don't know what the normal is. And that's happened to me where I hopped back online after a relationship ended and you're so desperately wanting to feel that feeling of having that true intimacy with someone that you will, you'll force it, you'll push it. And it's not, it's not right. It's too early. So I've definitely been on both ends of that. And I feel like lately, especially during COVID dating, you know, it's hard to date during a panini.

And I've definitely tried to be more aware of how a fantasy could be created and how to step back from that a little bit when I see that happening. Yeah, because I mean, you can already write that like origin story. I feel like it would be such a temptation every time of like, yeah, oh, gosh, well, how did I meet? How did I meet my husband? Well, there was a pandemic. And he wrote on his profile that he really liked Froot Loops. And that had been all I was eating during. And so I just thought, well, I don't know. Let's see how this goes. And here we are today, 10 years later.

Right. I mean, it's so intoxicating, right, to think we could have this really wonderful story of how we met. And we could bypass the horrific pieces of this app, and we could find each other, you know, it's, it's really lovely to think about. But I think that it's been really tough to peel back from realizing that what you put out there in your profile in your bio, and when you feel like you're really vibing with someone, it's so exciting. But that isn't real intimacy yet. You know, you're not vibing with real intimacy just because you both like this one picture of a monkey, right? Like you have to,

you have to go deeper. And that takes a lot of time, you know, that takes a lot of time and a lot of work. And it's harder to get there when you have sort of shot the cannon indoors, so to speak, from like date one, but laying it on a little bit too uh a little a little bit too thick so it can be a real a real problem when you find somebody but it just doesn't fit right and if only there was a way to have like a perfect fit finder quiz for a human being but that doesn't exist but it does exist for bras. And from what I understand, bras can really act up and be real stinkers sometimes. Yeah, so Third Love takes out some of the guesswork and makes it so that you don't have to stick with a bad bra. You know, I think when we are shopping for ourselves, we don't always kind of know what actual size we are, you know, and that obviously changes all the time.

And Third Love has kind of put together what they call a virtual fitting room that helps you address some of those issues. You said issues. You omitted the copy right here where they have written the words. Problems. Your problems. And that's super strong. I can't believe you robbed Anna of that experience of hearing that word said out loud.

So the Third Love's virtual fitting room is here to solve all of your problems. See, it's totally natural and it feels totally good. You can address any fit issues you're having uh any concerns you have about size or shape and your personal style and they will deliver you uh bra and underwear recommendations that are perfect for you i mean you can't get any better than that i want that for every facet of life. That's true. Like, I'm glad it starts here. You know, it's got to start somewhere. But just, you know, FitFind my, you know, what ply toilet paper am I supposed to be using?

I don't know. That's great. I don't know how you do a FitFind quiz for that. But 3rd Love has the technology and they're going to fix everything. How can our listeners join the 3rd Love family and get great savings because they're listening to this show? 3rd Love knows your one true fit is out there. So right now, they are offering our listeners 20% off your first order. Go to 3rdlove.com slash wonderful now to find your perfect fitting bra and get 20% off your first purchase.

That's 3rdlove.com slash wonderful for 20% off your first purchase. That's thirdlove.com slash wonderful for 20% off today. And I want to talk more about loving the time of COVID. I see what you did there. I wanted to circle back because I genuinely think this is a topic around dating that people don't talk about a lot. This is a topic around dating that people don't talk about a lot. What are the best practices, do you think, for avoiding that coming on too strong vibe? Because it's such a shitty thing to be enthusiastic about somebody and have that be the reason that you kind of spoil it. and have that be the reason that you kind of spoil it.

And I don't think I was online dating long enough or really genuinely dating long enough to kind of know how to temper that appropriately, if that makes sense. It does. And I think there's a lot of side work that is important to do first and to really know exactly what you are looking for before you enter into this scene. So you need to really be, I think, kind of comfortable with,

am I looking for a long-term relationship? Am I looking to casually date? And if a long-term relationship falls in my lap, let's roll with it. Am I looking to just maybe have some hookups? Let's roll with it. Am I looking to just maybe have some hookups? You know, kind of knowing what you're looking for is going to help with that a lot. Because then you're going to be able to make sure both of you are communicating boundaries and sticking to boundaries a lot better. One of the things I always look for is if somebody is willing to communicate with me kind of how they like to be communicated with. You know, like, I work all day. I'm available to text or FaceTime starting at da-da-da time, right, at 5 p.m. Because then I know, like, they're not ignoring me. They actually have a life, right? Like, this is,

I think it's really kind and helpful to communicate with somebody right away, like, I think it's really kind and helpful to communicate with somebody right away, like kind of what my life and communication can be. It really eliminates a lot of that stress and worry about like, am I communicating too much? Am I laying it on too thick? You know, like just kind of let somebody know, like, here's what my life looks like. How can we work together to talk you know and something you said too that i think really resonated was this idea that they are super invested before you have really given them anything to invest into and how that's always kind of a warning sign of like you're really into this and you do not know me like clearly this is a fantasy that you are putting together that i'm not even involved with

you know so it's like getting those sincere questions and curiosity like at the front before you start deciding that this is an incredible thing, you know? And it's been really hard with COVID because there's an element that's been kind of exciting with dating in COVID because you're sort of doing this like old timey courting that really like kind of went away. And it was just sort of like, I matched with you, let's meet up tomorrow. Maybe we hook up, maybe we don't, whatever. But there's always this like possibility to meet quickly. In COVID, you can't do that. I mean, if you're being safe, and you're really trying to practice protocol, you're probably not going to be meeting the very next day,

right? There's going to be more talking. There's going to be more FaceTiming, maybe a Zoom date. You're going to have a longer time span before you ever see this person in the flesh. And that's a really unique opportunity. But I do think that it, the kind of flip side of it, that it's escalated for people. It's like become this like, oh, I met this great person. I don't want to be alone. Like COVID has highlighted, at least for me, like we really want human connection. We want to be connected so badly. And that's okay. All humans want that. But I feel like because we've been alone, if you're single in this pandemic, you're really single. Just like if you're partnered, like you're really partnered. You know what I mean? Sure. that for people. And so I think it's been great to have more time to build. But the flip side has

been a little bit dangerous, because it's like, let's get married. And we've never even met. Well, and have you figured out the flip side of this? So one thing you had mentioned to us was that you've been ghosted or like unmatched a lot more than typical. And, and I feel like that is definitely related to the pandemic, although I can't really figure out how or why. Have you figured that out? I have given this some thought. And, you know, ghosting used to really just send me into like a secret garden, Colin in the bed, drapes are closed. When I would get ghosted, I was like, I can't, you know, I'm not going to be able to function for weeks. But I've really, you know, taken a turn on ghosting because I feel like, especially in COVID,

there is so much going on for every single person. We've all experienced this like collective depression, anxiety, grief over this past year. And it can have so much to do with what that person is experiencing. They could have social anxiety about reentering the world. You know, like, thinking of going to a restaurant and just seeing a person physically could send them into a spiral. And it could have nothing to do with me. And so I have to remember sometimes that when I'm ghosted, it very rarely is me personally, it has something to do with whatever's going on with that person. And that just helps me sort of remove myself from it a little bit. Now, that is a really good point. Because you are.

You're constantly like, I am weighing, should I get a haircut or not? There are certain risks associated with it. I can't imagine, should I start dating this person or not? Knowing that before you're going to have any chance of intimacy, like you're both going to need to be tested. Yeah. You know, like that in itself is like a huge barrier. And, you know, if people aren't willing to have that frank conversation with me about how they have lived during the time of COVID, then it's a kind of a deal breaker for me right now. a deal breaker for me right now. So, you know, I need to know that you wear masks, that you believe in masks, that you're safe, you know, that you still care about practicing social distancing

and things like that. Otherwise, it's a no-go for me. Is that going to get cloudier? Because there's not going to be a, and this is, I think, abundantly clear at this point there's not going to be a day there's not going to be a ball drop to we don't have to social distance and wear masks anymore you know what i mean it's it is going to be it is it is becoming a personal uh decision which don't get me don't get it twisted you should absolutely still be wearing a mask and social distancing but will people continue to be sort of you know forward at all with that stuff on dating apps when it's sort of more of a question mark in general are you wearing a mask right that'll be interesting if like one of your profile pics is like your vaccine card so it's like you and a dog, you know, like you on hiking on a

mountainside. And then here's my vaccine card with both my doses on it. It's really funny that you mentioned that because I've actually seen a few bios lately that have, I'm vaccinated. I'm fully vaccinated in their profile. They are saying it. So, you know, I think that when this started, we all started it together, right? Like, the lockdown started, we all went into this at the same time. And now people are vaccinated. Some people are fully vaccinated. We're all coming out of it at a different time. So it's going to be really interesting to see how we re-emerge because we're all on different levels of it you know yeah what do you i mean what do you think and we're getting into full-blown prognostication at this point but like obviously the the entire system of of dating has changed during covid but i also you know the optimist in me hopes that civilization changes a little bit coming out of COVID. And I wonder how that will affect the world of dating. Like, is there going to be a sort of Bacchanalian period where everyone's just like, getting it?

Or is it going to be more of a slow burn than that? You know, it's so it's interesting, because I do feel like if you look at history, right, like after Spanish flu of 1918, like we had the roaring 20s, people were out there, we had great Gatsby life. I could see I could see a little bit of that taking place where there's this excitement to be able to meet up, to not be scared to meet up. But I also feel very hopeful that this time spent alone, and this time spent for people that are single, like spent in solitude, really thinking about what you want out of this, you know, it's a lot harder, like I was saying before, just to go meet up with someone. So I've had to really

consider like, is this something that is going to work for me? I have to think about it like, what are they actually bringing to me that feels exciting? Instead of like me always being so worried about how I'm coming across, you know, like I do feel that has shifted for me during COVID. Like thinking, is this going to be worth it? Is this going to be be worth my time if I'm going to get out in the middle of a panorama am I excited about it you know do I want to go on a date it's not just like oh I have to date I have to go out it's a Friday night so I do think that people hopefully have taken this period to be a little bit reflective and maybe being alone during this period people have done some work and it's gonna be really interesting to see how we emerge from that.

I'm kind of excited. Yeah, that's true. I feel like we've seen you make that choice before where it's like somebody that you're not particularly excited about and maybe in a different circumstance you would have gone out with, but you've decided kind of,

no, you know what? Like I'm not even into this and I know already that I'm not into it. So why would I do this? Right, well, I mean, there's also an inverse to online dating which is and i think you mentioned something like this at the beginning of the of this very special episode brought to you by third love thank you third love is that it's a it's like something you have to work at like online dating and knowing how to do it well it is a social skill with like social norms that are constantly changing and

you need to it takes some amount of work to know that stuff and behave accordingly and you know to to um follow the rules and temper your expectations in the way that is healthy in situations like this. Like, and it's the kind of thing that maybe if you are not able to date as much and you're just coming out of a, you know, 20 year marriage or something like that, you're gonna be bad at it.

Like you're not going to be good at it. So hopefully, you know, once the world opens back up, you'll, you'll be able to get that, that experience that you need to no longer send 50 texts a day because you don't know any better. Yeah.

It's definitely going to be an interesting period. I think that there's a lot said about dating sometimes that you need to be fully comfortable with yourself and you need to have done all of this work on yourself before you can love anybody else. And I think there's an element of that that is absolutely true. But I also think that kind of this like Instagram toxic positivity that you see of like, you need to be right with yourself

before you can love anyone is kind of a scam too. Because you need to let people around you love you. A lot of the love that we have for ourselves is like defined by, well, first our, our very first caretakers, right? Like if you're, if you have that in your life and if you didn't have that, that's also a journey, but then the people in your life, you know, and you too, especially, I mean, we've had this conversation in the past year where it's like, I don't have a lack of love in my life, you know? And I have to let people that already love me, love me too.

And that helps me on my romantic journey in a way, because I know that I'm worth the love. I am lovable. I've got the love. And that kind of helps carry me through it. You know, it helps fuel me through all of the tough spots that I might encounter with some of this. That's very nice, Anna. That's very sweet. Yeah, it's true. It's true. I mean, you know, y'all being my friends and our connection, that helps me understand that there's lots of ways to be loved and carried through. And I just think

that it's okay to know what you want. You should absolutely think about what you want, what your desires are, what your motives are, but also let the people around you love you, you know, because that's going to help you a lot too. Yeah, I think everybody's kind of reevaluating that in the pandemic. Like we, our group of friends, you know, we've been friends for over a decade now, but we have sort of intermittently had periods where, you know, we hang been friends for over a decade now, but we have sort of intermittently had periods where, you know, we hang out a lot and then periods where, you know, we drop out a little bit. But we've been having this weekly call for, you know, an hour or two every Wednesday night

for the last year. We just had sort of our one-year anniversary of doing these calls. of doing these calls uh and it has i feel like taught me a little bit more about like what i need from like human connection like what i what i actually like uh what kind of friendships i'm looking for like what kind of like friendship i want to have with the people that i i love in my life and i think like a lot of people are having that and it's it's really interesting it goes beyond like are you an introvert or an extrovert you gotta be one of those two camps and here's a t-shirt that says which one you are on it uh it's it's uh there there's nuance to it that is hard to figure out by yourself but like god if there was ever a time to spend the time to work on it like this is it like we're in it right now you know invest

invest in your your your your invest in your love oh invest in your love very nice you should also invest in your bras with third rachel sees me pick up my phone with the coffee points on it and she knows that like a dope transition is about to come up. No, we're going to wrap on up here. But we did just want to say one last time, a big thank you to Third Love. They have been sponsors of ours for a very, very long time and have really supported us throughout the run of Wonderful. Yeah, and they're also products that I personally have invested in and continue to use

because they're perfect. They're top notch. Yeah. They're top flight. Yeah. Hey, Anna, thank you so much for joining us. Anna, before we let you go,

if you had to give like three things you've learned in the past year from just dating and relationships. I feel like you've probably already said some of these, but just to summarize. Rachel needs the sound bites. I can do this. I would say, number one, practice discernment.

Number two, communicate your boundaries. Don't be afraid to do that. And, communicate your boundaries. Don't be afraid to do that and stick to your boundaries. Um, and number three, I would say number three, don't be so worried about the outcome. It's okay sometimes to lean in and let yourself feel the joy of serotonin. Let your, to falling, to falling in love in love you know that's a wonderful feeling and don't be so attached to if it's the one if it's going to be your forever just let it happen let it be let let it be a one you know there you go that's right that helps a lot takes a lot of the pressure off. Yeah. Yeah. They would change the show, Are You the One, that we've talked about on this program dramatically if it was just, Are You a One?

And it's like, I like you. I like you too. All right. End of game. End of game, end of show. Anna, thank you so much. Everybody go check out Stab in the Back. What was that?

The Insta handle again? It is Stab in the back podcast on instagram it's a very it's a very delightful show even though you do hear about um i mean kills killing there's a little bit there's some kills but we try to present it stuff in there too there's a little yeah yeah um we seriously i know we've wanted to do a podcast thing with you for a while. And I'm glad that we've finally been able to have you on the show to ring from you every drop of dating expertise that you possess. And then we're feeding it like a mama bird into the mouths of our listeners. It's my dream come true.

My dream come true. Thank you so much. I love you both so much. We love you too. And we love you listeners. Thank you so much. love you both so much we love you too and we love you listeners thank you so much thank you Third Love and we'll be back

at some point with a regular episode depending on when this baby comes out it's a wild time y'all Bye. Hey!